In a new episode of Project NIL with Anthony Gargano & William Penn Charter School Director of Athletics Danny DiBerardinis discuss kids leaving High School early and giving up spring sports to get to campus early. You have to go early to get spots. They also discuss how some college coaches won't go recruit high school kids and strictly get guys from the transfer portal. Bucknell Associate HC Matt Griffin joins the show to discuss the NIL era and being a smaller school in this era. Griffin also discussed how bigger schools that play them try to recruit guys from their team if they have a good game against them. Anthony and Danny end the show talking about how seniors are losing the 2nd half of their senior year to compete for college spots early.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
You don't listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Well, good morning, good morning, good morning. This is Project
and I L. Danny D, the A D, Daniel D, Bernarddinas,
athletic director Panchotnam, Anthony Garganta, well, the Fellas and uh
residents sports Dad, this is Project ni L.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Good morning Danny D.
Speaker 4 (00:30):
What's going on? Cause how are we doing over there?
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Uh? We are great. It's coop season and uh, I go.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
You know we saw last night North Carolina beat Kansas
and in a really good game, and uh it's there.
This is the week of basketball, and you know, we've
been doing a lot of football, as you can well imagine,
and some fall sports. Uh it's time this morning to
dive into the round ball. And you've already saw it.
(01:00):
With a lot of the colleges, it's all portal. I mean,
teams are completely different. I look at some rosters, some
starting fives, and they're all different from a year ago.
Speaker 5 (01:12):
It's just wild. It's crazy. I have a good friend
who prides himself on knowing where people went to college,
and he's losing it. He can't, he can't do it anymore.
You could give him random NBA or NFL players and
now it's so difficult with the portal.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
He was always so proud of it.
Speaker 5 (01:29):
My buddy Chuck Bernard, now he's really struggling with this
new age of.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
Uh, I feel Chuck man. I was the same way.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Yeah, Like you name a guy and he always Dames College,
like with great Ky basketball football, it was the greatest
and now party trick. Now it's like, you know, there's
taking them three four schools.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
Yeah, it's difficult. It's definitely tough to keep up with.
I did, I wouldn't.
Speaker 5 (01:54):
I was pretty good at it, but uh there's people
that love it. You know, it's a good conversation starter,
but now you got to really really study.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
It's now you can't casually watch or just be locked.
Speaker 5 (02:04):
Into the sports because the rosters are changing every week.
So it's it's not even you know through a season.
You know, they change throughout the season. So it's really
difficult to stay on top of it and to really
know know they had to have information anymore.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Well, let's let's kind of dive into basketball specifically this morning,
because you know what we saw portal wise football, it
kind of mimics the NFL a little bit NFL free
agency where you know, teams go into the portal to
get need like I, you know, I have I have
(02:41):
a shortage of receivers, or I need a corner or
a right tackle, and they'll go in the in the
portal and look at those positions. With basketball, it's just
completely different. It's makeover. There's really no rhyme or reason.
It's like, let me just collect as many players as possible.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
And in football, you'll still get.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
The three year guys who stay there, right, because you
have to be there for three years. It's super super
rare now that you find a basketball player that's at
a place and is productive for four years, and that's
and to me, that's a shame, right. I mean, I
love college basketball. It's you know, March Madness is my
favorite time of year. I mean, this probably is my
favorite time of year when football is overlapping and basketball starting.
(03:26):
It can't get any better for me. But it's really
difficult to navigate, and it's and it's hard for these
you know, these colleges to keep these kids for multiple years.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Yeah, and I think you're seeing it really play out
in basketball where.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Lower tier D one, D two, D three.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Those teams are are just gonna look, it's all about
climbing the ladder in basketball.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Yep, you do your job, you find you know, you
find that diamond in the rough, and then he does
really well and then he has to leave. It's really
difficult for these teams to hold on to these players
once they kind of blow up onto the scene because
you know, again, to make it to that next level
from college is super rare. So you can't blame someone
for trying to get some a financial head start. And
(04:17):
when teams are thrown out four, five, six hundred thousand dollars,
it's difficult to say no. And a lot of these
lower programs struggle to maintain and hold on to these
to these kids as they move through their college careers.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
So I know what, we're gonna take this down, and
you're gonna give us the preseason top high school teams,
which I'm looking forward to, and some of the names
that we should know of kids. I gotta tell you
a story because we always take this to the youth
level on up right, So.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
You know it's basketball.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
We just got done fall baseball, right and.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
This week and you know we're in the teeth of football.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
We still have three games left for the playoffs, including
one today, and we basketball tryouts are at our local school.
My little one goes to Saint Margaret's and I, in fact,
I coached jvate the sixth and seventh grade or the
fifth against I guess sixth and then and then they
(05:24):
had the varsity, right, So that's the I'm sorry, fifth
and sixth grade I coached, and then the varsity seventh
and eighth, so I coached them after coached my monsmo
the last four years at that school, and now they
have a paid coach. So it's funny. They it was
(05:45):
tryouts and you know, of course we're at football practice
and tryouts are right after, so I got to rush
from football practice to the gym. He brings his stuff,
so we you know, we have the tryouts and he
does well, and you know it's i mean, it's suburban
(06:05):
New Jersey, right, so you know, it's not like a
hotbed of hoops, all right, so you know he does
really well. And and not to say there's our players,
but in my area at that school, you're not. There's
not you know, prospects walking around those hallways. So you know,
he does really well, right, and code's like, you know,
(06:28):
guess him up. And my first reaction is, oh, because
right away he's talking about his game and he loves basketball,
because kids love basketball, because I love basketball.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Basketball's fun.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
I was a much better baseball football player than I
was a basketball player back when I was a kid,
when when I was younger, but all I wanted to
do was play basketball. And and you know, like there's limitations,
like you know, yeah, you can shoot your good for
your little level, but once you get to the big pond, right,
(07:06):
you're you got no shot. And that's the and that's
the curse of basketball.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
Yeah, it gets tough. I understand that, right.
Speaker 5 (07:16):
I mean, it's super it's it's difficult to navigate, and
it's a sport where you know, you need to kind
of grow and develop.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
It's hard to really be elite size.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
You need size.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
I mean, unless you're a freakish athlete guard with a
ridiculous handle.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
You gotta be you got.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
You need a legitimate six five six six six seven,
you got.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
I see, that's the truth of the matter.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Yeah, for sure, No, I agree, it's tough.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
So what's your advice as the A D like I oh,
like again, I've said this before and people think I'm nuts.
I'm like, I'm not trying to, but I go, dude,
you're probably gonna top out if you get lucky. And
I he's he's on his way to six three rights
all boys.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
He's got some good size to him for his seventh grader.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Yeah, but I mean, you know, he's not freakishly tall,
so you know, put down the basketball.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
And I don't say that because it's like I.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Don't want you to. I don't want I wanted to
enjoy himself and go play and have fun, so I don't.
I don't say that, but I won't focus. I don't
make it focus about the like his game like I
do with baseball or football.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
Yeah, I understand that, but I also, like I talked
to you before, I love the dual sport athlete. I
think it really helps you gain strength, and you know,
it helps you get better at your your main sport.
Right his base baseball might be his main sport, football
might be his main sport, but I think basketball really
ties in. I mean story last night, I was at
the Hall of Fame induction for Penn Charter and and
(08:56):
McGlinchey gets in right NFL offensive lineman starting to right
tackle for dever Broncos.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
I love this story that he flies in He's got
a game Thursday night against the Raiders, and he flies
into town yesterday.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
Yeah, so he's gonna be in town for today and
for yesterday and today because it's PCGA Day, the longest
rivalry in the country, one hundred and thirty nine years
of playing sports.
Speaker 4 (09:19):
So he'll be there as well today and then he'll
fly out this afternoon. But they talked about his.
Speaker 5 (09:23):
High school career, right, he was All league in basketball, football,
and he threw the he threw for a track and field,
so he's a three sport guy. And he got up
last night and talked about trying different things and how
track helped him, you know, throwing the javelin in the
discuss really helped him with football, and basketball really helped
him with football.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
Right, that helped him with his footwork.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
So I think if he likes it and he's passionate
about it, something will translate over that will help him
succeed in another sport.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yeah, And I get that. I get that.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I just I see a lot of parents going all
in with training and spending real money and real dollars
and and I hate to say, because I love the sport,
right and I want kids to play the sport. But
I think it's you got to have a sense of
(10:17):
you need a realistic approach. It's not like the other
sports with training and like if you're going to invest
in your kids athletic career, let's call it. Because there's
a professionalization of youth sports that's going on. My only
point is there's other investments with soccer, baseball, football, Like
(10:41):
there's other investments that have a chance to pay off
because of their size.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
Yep, No, I understand completely agree. Basketball is a little different, right,
and then there's not as I also I understand like
it's a smaller roster, right, so there's less opportunities as well.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
So yeah, and and my only point is let smaller
roster and body type because it's a genetic lottery when
when you have that kind of size.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Yeah, at the highest level, for sure, I agree with that.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
I mean, I mean we're talking about college, so you know,
obviously it's not the NBA the pools. The pools is
a little wider, but are a little deeper, but not much.
I mean it's you know, if you're gonna play, if
you're playing at any kind of D one school, you
you know, you're you need your body type.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
No, I agree for sure.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
So it's definitely something that you know, definitely plays a
part in it and how you're going to progress it.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
You gotta play. There's a lot of factors that going
to play with it.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
What have you at your stops where?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
And you and you were the president of the Catholic
League in Philadelphia, right, so you ran, you ran, And
you're talking a lot of D one kids that you've
kind of presided over.
Speaker 5 (12:01):
Yeah, every year about twenty some some pros, right. Jalen Duran,
who's having a hell of a season right now currently. O.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (12:10):
So I was at Roman prior to Saint Jose Prep,
and at Roman Catholic we had him and you know,
some guys you just see it. I knew it was
an eighth grader. I was like, he's going to be
a pro one day. And he is absolutely dominating right
now and having a great season. And he's a great kid,
but incredibly hard worker. So in the Catholic League in Philadelphia,
every year you're probably seeing fifteen to twenty Division one
(12:30):
players come through the league, which is it's one of
the top leagues in the country. But uh yeah, you
see it. You see the twitch, you see the speed,
you see the size. You know, it's it's very distinguished
and you can kind of tell who has the ability to,
you know, continue to play on at the highest level.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
Wow, bit Jalen Towns, what a year he is. You're right, man.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
The other night I was watching him, and I mean
he just was vacuumate boards and he's got a he's
got a great little touch around the back as well.
Speaker 5 (13:01):
Yeah, and big time motor, big time odor. I mean
that's you kind of separated him. I saw as a
young kid, like he was super raw, but just big
time odor. I mean this year he's averaging eighteen points,
eleven and a half rebounds, and he's shooting sixty two percent,
you know, shooting sixty.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
The field twenty one years old.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
To be twenty two. He's not even twenty two yet.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
That's awesome.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
Great kid too, great great guy, great person, incredibly hard worker,
and you know, all the stuff's paying off. You know,
last night he had thirty and eleven.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Damn thirty and eleven. Why yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah,
he's playing he's playing some great ball. Bring it back
to Kyles for a second, because it's so much fun, Like,
you know, this time, this time of the year, you're
right the intersection of it. And you get a game
mic last night with Carolina and Kansas, and what's the
(13:57):
impact with like some of the blue bloods, Like what
do you foresee the college landscape kind of turn it
into It's.
Speaker 5 (14:08):
Hard to say, and because it's so evolving, right, it's
still we don't know, Like, so there's a you know,
today we might touch on some of the top teams
in the country and some of the top players in
the high school And interesting enough, like and football people commit, right,
you usually commit around the top guys are committing around
their late junior year, early senior years.
Speaker 4 (14:26):
It's usually done.
Speaker 5 (14:28):
The top ten are we have a top ten list
that will drop either this week or next week. The
top pen list only has two to three guys who've committed.
So basketball really drives it. So it's really crazy to
think about this late in the game, and there's still
seven of the top ten guys in the country who
still haven't committed to a college.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
For next year.
Speaker 5 (14:47):
And they're and part of it is they're waiting to
see how these teams are playing right now. They're waiting
to see early on how these guys are performing. They
want to come on the court and play right away.
So it's crazy, and they're waiting to see how much
money I can get right they're holding out to see
if a team starts slow, Hey we really got invested
next year, we might have to give this kid a
little extra money to get this done.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
And then I wow, Wow, that's what's wild byproduct where
you're like, you're right with football. Listen, we taught you
and I were having this conversation yesterday where a lot
of a lot of football players aren't actually graduating with
their class like they're they're they're leaving early to get
(15:30):
the springball right from your senior year so they can
get to college for spring. So they leave after Christmas break.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
Yep, and they're up there.
Speaker 5 (15:41):
They start college when this second semester starts in January,
mid January or January.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
And then they're there for springball.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
They try to get acclimated and and try to get on,
you know, try to.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
Get that fight for that roster spot. It gives you
a little bit more incentives.
Speaker 5 (15:54):
And then again with the transfer portal, if you come
in and play, you're gonna get paid more.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
I mean, you're in a spot you get.
Speaker 5 (16:01):
Money to kind of go to these schools, and then
if you earn that starting spot, that's when you kind
of can renegotiate and try to get some more money.
And basketball and football, you know, it's interesting, like I know,
a top like in basketball, if you're like the ninetieth
prospect in the country, you're getting about five hundred thousand,
six hundred thousand. If you're a lower end prospect, a
four star, three star. In football, the main guys really
(16:24):
get paid and then it's it drops off a good
bit from the three and four stars until you prove yourself.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
But you look drops off.
Speaker 5 (16:30):
I mean, you're still getting three hundred thousand dollars, right,
It's not like you're not getting a ton of money.
Not trying to downplay how much money it is, but
there's you know, there's these different tiers.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
And how it's kind of shaken out again.
Speaker 5 (16:42):
It's changing all the time to see how these how
these guys are getting paid into what level and what
what these benchmarks are.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
So I guess, I guess it does make sense that
if you're you're gonna wait. In basketball, you want to
see how it all plays out, right, So when you
foresee a lot of the dominoes start to fall, would
it be in the tournament? And you know you had
(17:15):
you had guys like Patino talking about you know, had
when I'm not even gonna recruit high school kids.
Speaker 5 (17:24):
Yeah, I mean he came out and said it, right.
I mean we've talked about it at college football, where
some schools used to offer, you know, try to take
twenty to twenty five freshmen or taking eight to ten,
you know, basketball, same thing. These top programs might take
one or two. They're trying to get a couple of
kids in the top fifty in the country. And if
you're missing on that, you're saying, hey, we're going to
look into the portal.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
But for these kids, yeah, I'm interested to see. It's
getting later and later.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
So I mean, we're learning as it goes because it's
it's again we always talk about it.
Speaker 4 (17:51):
It's ever changing, and it's you know, this new landscape.
Speaker 5 (17:54):
I'm shocked at this late, but I would think by
January February most of these teams commit, you kind of
can get more of most of these kids committed. You
get more of uh an overall look at the landscape
of these programs you're really looking at and then also.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
Like what the dollars look like?
Speaker 5 (18:09):
Right, I had to cut backfire on you, right, he
could backfire, But that's the game that they're playing right now.
But yeah, it's a wild, wild situation. And again, have
you know we do our project and il list. To
have seven guys not committed in the top ten is wild.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Yeah, it's it's great, It's happened in real time. It's nuts.
All right, we'll talk more about this and the basketball
landscape with Matt Griffin, associated head coach at Buck.
Speaker 3 (18:39):
Now who's uh, who's gonna join us? Coming up next?
Speaker 2 (18:42):
And I'm curious Danny to get Matt's take on the
on the whole landscape.
Speaker 5 (18:47):
Yeah, Matt is a phenomenal coach and we'll get into
it when after the break. But great guy, great coach,
and just full of knowledge.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Stay tuned. That's next.
As uh, Danny and I were diving the hoops, basketballs,
round ball season. It is great, man, it really is.
This is Project nil right here on Fox Sports.
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(19:50):
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as we dive in, as we dive into basketball. And
you know we've been doing a lot on this show
about football and the fall sports.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
Well, this week is the transition week in the hoops.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
We saw it with college and joining us right now
to talk about the ever changing landscape of college sports,
the associate head coach of buck Mel Matt Griffin coach, Good.
Speaker 6 (20:25):
Morning, Hey, good morning, good morning.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Great to hear your voice, pal, Great.
Speaker 6 (20:33):
Excited to be here. Thank you so much for the
opportunity and hop long.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
So coach uh Danny and I were just talking about
this landscape which is completely wild. So can you shed
some like just general light on how you guys are
dealing with it, like, you know, what what your strategy is.
You know, we'll get into advice for players and kids
(20:58):
and parents, but right now, what's your strategy.
Speaker 6 (21:03):
There's there's so much that goes into it. I hear
number one, I'll say, I coach at Bucknell University, and
we just played an exhibition game, uh two games ago
against Louisville. So Louisville probably in totality they pay over
(21:28):
twelve million dollars for their roster. We we we don't
we we uh. But what I'll say is, and you know,
for for all the time, Bucknell has never competed with
Louisville for recruiting. For you know, Louisville has always attracted
(21:52):
a higher level player because of you know, being in
a higher level league. So regardless of N I L,
it's always been buck Nell being the little guy versus
the kind of the giant. So that hasn't changed. What
has changed is that the teams like Louisville, if they
(22:15):
play you and they see on your roster that you
have somebody pretty good, they're now recruiting from your roster them.
Oh you know, And I was the head coach at
Roman Catholic High School shout out brought in Vine shout
(22:35):
out Danny Deeverdenis. But it feels like when I was
the head coach at Roman Catholic and we were, you know,
competing against you know, anybody in the country with two
basketball hoops on the third floor of a gym in
Center City. That the kind of the bigger prep schools
(22:57):
in the country. We're trying to recruit our players away
from our team if we had good players. It's very
similar in that way and what it's done in college
sports now, it's just become professional. We kind of have
to shift our way of thinking of college sports and
that it's professional sports now, and not only players are
(23:20):
held accountable to that standard, but certainly coaches. And you
can see that the expectation for winning is much higher.
The time frame that you had as a coach to
develop your program, to build your program has shortened. From
an administrative standpoint, they do not really think that you
(23:41):
need to have four years to develop a program because
of this type of environment where if you recruit an older,
experienced player in the transfer portal, you can flip your
roster in one season. And a great example of this
is Will Wage, who is now at NC State. He
(24:03):
came to mcniche State and in just one season completely
changed that program with bringing in the right transfers in
this nil landscape because he was able to attract players
that normally they couldn't, but they had money and they
were able to say, hey, come here for a year,
(24:27):
we'll pay you well and compete at this level and
it's an attractive sell. So they did for two years.
And now Will Wade goes to NC State with his
level of successful I think it's just completely transformed. How
you know, you can look at college sports. It's professional
now and certainly you can see all over, not only
(24:47):
in basketball, with football if it's changed.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Sure.
Speaker 5 (24:50):
And so for Matt, first of all, congratulations on be
in two. And oh the Bison starting the season night
they will have big win last night.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
So they're two. And oh let's give the Bison some flowers. Man, Yeah,
let's go so too.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
No, but also so, like Matt was talking about, like
they played Louisville, So these smaller teams have to play
these games because they get paid to play these games.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Right.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
So, but now it's double edged sword.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
Right, You're getting paid to you know, be a game
for a bigger school Louisville, Kentucky.
Speaker 4 (25:16):
Right, a duke.
Speaker 5 (25:18):
But you're also now you have to worry about like
the second the season ends, these guys are you're you're
you're paying them, but also they're paying you. But then
also they're they're going to try to play play your
best players.
Speaker 6 (25:28):
Absolutely, we have a we have a player, he's a
young player and in that game versus Louisville, he makes
one move from the top of the key where he
goes through his legs, he splits two defenders and he
makes a lab and we're sitting there as a staff
jokingly but also with oh no, we're like that, Well,
(25:49):
we won't have him for very long, you know, like, yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
Oh man, that's so tough.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Yeah, you know, coach, it's I guess it's with every level.
It becomes just the reality of it right where you
know the kids are, you know, you're you're kind of
running these kids for a year.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
How do you how do you teach?
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Like, how do you go about practice and player development
knowing that you know you may lose a handful of kids.
Speaker 6 (26:23):
Well, Fran Dumphy, who I love your friend mentor obviously
Hall of Fame coach, He said, it the best. I
think when he retired from sal this past year and
he said, see the best you can with what you
have where you are, and that is always the mindset
(26:44):
you You pour in everything you have as a coach
into the player and the person. It's not you can't
control these things. What you can control as a coach
is how you help a player become a better you know,
from a skills standpoint, and how you help them become
(27:05):
a better from a player development standpoint, how they approach
the game, how they see the game, and you let
the ships fall where they may at the end. You
never know what the future brings. And so I think
that's number one. Number two. Uh. Something that's a little
unique is that, like buck Nell's in a higher academic conference.
(27:29):
So the Patriot League and the Patriot League is a
parallel with the IVY. Both conferences have the highest level
of retention in the country. So a lot of the
players that we have, it's not a guarantee that they'll leave.
Certainly there are there are attractive offers out there. I'll
(27:53):
give you an example in our league. There was a
young player who was very talented, produced very well in
our league, and he goes from Holy Cross to Northwestern,
So you could argue that the academics are similar with us.
It's a great school and he can get nil money.
So that's the competition there. But because of that, the
(28:19):
other thing I'll say is a lot of the players
that we recruit are interested in there. If they lead
the conversation with hey, what's your nil package, we know
it's not the right fit, and they they quickly find
out that it's not the right fit either.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Yeah, budget budget wise, I mean, you guys aren't North
Caroline and so I mean I think that's got to
be an obvious kind of conversation, right.
Speaker 6 (28:46):
Absolutely, absolutely. It's the higher level that you recruit at,
the more transparency you have early on in those type
of conversations. You know, if you're talking about your recruiting
at University of Miami, the first conversation you might have
in this day and ages, what's your budget? You if
(29:09):
you don't have a bottom line of this amount of money,
Let's not waste each other's time. For us, we lead with, hey,
we're school. You can get a well rounded experience will
help develop you as a player. Certainly, there's players that
come to Bucknell who have been professional. We have eight
players playing currently professionally, two who are in the EuroLeague,
(29:32):
one who just retired from the NBA, one who's chieved.
So and you get a great education and you can develop,
you know, in the in the social setting, so in
the alumni that all these things that we're once attractive
I think still applies now. And those are the players
that we want and really like, are really excited about
(29:53):
the opportunity. But as you get higher up, like the Louisville's,
the Dukes are North Carolina's. Uh, that's more. Hey, here's
the bottom line of what we can pay you. Here's
your nil opportunity. Obviously where's it? Uh tell you. But
here's the last part.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
We're talking to Bucknell Head associated head coach Matt Griffin
on Project Dot. I L Davey g Murda, Dinas, I'm
Anthony Gargatta. We're right here on Fox Sports Radio. I'm sorry, coach,
go ahead.
Speaker 6 (30:26):
Yeah, it is that players are making far more money
in college now than they will than they are even
in the NBA. Like it's and it could be five
times six times you know what they're what they would
actually be projected to make in the NBA. So think
(30:46):
about that, you grow up playing the game of basketball. OK,
all I want to do is make the NBA. Now, Like,
even as you're at the Atlantic ten level, you can
make a million dollars playing and being starting at the
A ten and then you can go to the NBA,
be a second round draft pick and be making half
(31:09):
of that, you know, a quarter of that. So uh,
it's really interesting that you'll see a higher level talents
want to stay in college sports even though they might
balance around schools, but it's actually financially more responsible for
them to stay because their game probably doesn't translate to
(31:31):
the NBA.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Coach, we got like.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Time for one more, and I need to ask this question.
How do you approach high school kids? Like, you know,
I've saw the Rick Patino thing where you know he's
not recruiting high schools at all. How do you, guys,
how do you see it in the big picture for
high school kids.
Speaker 6 (31:54):
I think you there's a balance. I think you need
a balance of recruiting that there are some really good
young players who can contribute at right away, but I
think it's really helpful and tactful to get older players
to come in as well, who are more college ready
(32:15):
on and off the court. It has forced teams like
us to to do that to compete consistently year and
you're out because if you have all young guys, you're
not going to have all those young guys to the
end of their career. So it actually puts you at
a disadvantage in my opinion, if you just do it
(32:36):
the way that everybody else did it back in the day.
So you have to adapt to the times and certainly
get some older players from the transfer portal, but not
completely turned a blind eye to the high school kids.
There's a lot of high school kids who can contribute
right away, and so we do. We really work hard
and finding that striking that balance, and that is the game.
That's the game. That's why it's really tough, but it
(32:58):
certainly presents a ton of opportunity unity to keep your
team and your program in the right spot for as
long as you need to coach.
Speaker 3 (33:06):
You are fantastic. We got to do this again.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
You know, we're working Damie and I are working on
the podcast, so uh we need to sit with you
and pick your brain. You're terrific and uh listen, great,
good luck, all right, t it up.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
Bison.
Speaker 5 (33:23):
Matt's one of the best coaches in the country, developer
of the game, but also people, Matt is an elite,
elite coach and if anyone's out there and the thing
about buck Now, he's the guy.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
And let's go buy some baby.
Speaker 6 (33:37):
Thank you so much of what an honor and it
was to be on the show with you guys. Thank
you so much. And uh, I just uh really appreciate it.
Awesome show. I love it and uh, thank you guys.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Thanks coach, appreciated pal.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Here he is Matt Griffin, associated coach at buck Now
as we talk about basketball, Baby, Mike, God, this this
hour flies by.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
We got to take a quick time out. We'll come
right back.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Project Din, I L Danny D and the A D
Man and from the fellas as we in sports Dad,
as we hang out on a Fox don't.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
Listening to Fox Sports Radio Radio.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
And I coach too fast, Danny D so fast because
two fast and you know we're talking to Matt Griffin.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Do you associate head coach at buck Now?
Speaker 2 (34:30):
And I had a million questions for him, man, because
when you look at and I meant to ask him
what his budget would be like. In fact, we have
a great listener Southside Chuck who is from Kentucky, and
he was talking about the University of Kentucky. They're nil budget.
(34:53):
It's like twenty million, right Louisville. Louisville's probably you know,
I mean we're between you know, fifteen to eighteen million,
like right around the same number. How much do you
think buck Nell is like at school? Like buck Nell
probably be budget.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
A million, and like I know, like like I'm close
with the guys at FGC.
Speaker 5 (35:16):
He're doing a great job out there, and like patch
kind of thing was like he'll pay you try to
get the top guy's money, but he just pays everyone
because you can't pay everyone so much.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
So he tried to give everyone.
Speaker 5 (35:25):
Like when they first started out, every kid on the
roster was getting ten grand minimum. Right, you try to
start off with things like that when you don't have
enough to spread.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
It out to everybody. Uh, try to build an equity
like that and try to make everyone feel to love.
Speaker 5 (35:38):
But a prime example of buck Nell is you know,
two years ago when Matt and his brother John got there,
and you know, I watched them closely. They had a
kid from like Lithuania or something. Coen walking chew Gum.
They develop him. He becomes last year Player of the Year.
He's at He's at Alabama.
Speaker 3 (35:55):
Right, Like, you got to be kidding me.
Speaker 4 (35:57):
He got there. I could I lie to you not.
Speaker 5 (35:59):
I went to a game where he went one for
ten and didn't look like he could make a layup
his first year. His second year, because of their development
skills and how great of coaches they are, he's Player
of the Year.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
And then you know he had to hit the portal.
Speaker 5 (36:12):
And you can't blame him if he's gonna go get
a million or two million dollars, right, and I'm sure
they can all fer him one hundred thousand, right, So
it's it's very difficult.
Speaker 4 (36:21):
But again, you know, they do a really good job
of the balance of the young and old.
Speaker 5 (36:26):
I think they do a really good job of player development.
And like he said, they have high level education. And
I tell parents all the time, it's great to get
some money, right, to get a couple hundred thousand dollars,
but one percent of one percent make it to the NBA.
Speaker 4 (36:39):
You have to hit the lottery. So you really need
to fall back on.
Speaker 5 (36:42):
That education and that network and sticking it out of
some of these schools, you know, might be the play
opposed to chasing that short term money. But you know,
every situation is different, and you know, I want people
to get paid and chase their dreams. So if there
is that life change of money or money that you
know can help their family, you know, you gotta do
what you gotta do and do what's best for you.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Yeah, you know, I think one of the things that's
fascinating to me with a situation like a buck now
and a lot of those smaller D one schools is
I didn't even think about this, but like these games
are like scouting missions.
Speaker 5 (37:22):
Right, it wasn't so much because if you transferred, you
had to sit out right, so they weren't.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
Really Yeah, they weren't looking at you, right. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (37:29):
Now it's like you all right, they might pay you
a million dollars to go play down in Kentucky for
like a by game, right. But also like he said,
he said, oh man, this young kid he made a move,
and we turned to ourselves and said, oh.
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Man, yeah, that's that's like we're gonna lose that because
when you see that, like it's such an inexact science
you brought to you and I were talking off the
air about these rankings, right, and we're gonna get into
that next week.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
We'll we'll lead the show with them and kind of
do a deep dive.
Speaker 4 (37:59):
We got the top ten for the teams and the
top ten for the players, so.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (38:03):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
And then we'll do our rule. Also we need to
recap our football and everything else. But you know what's
interesting is the rankings are so inexact, oh right, like
you know, so you know, it's so hard to kind
of pay them slop them in because you don't know.
(38:24):
And then you get a kid that comes in and
they may be a little bit of a late bloomer,
and all of a sudden, you go, oh my god,
we've got to dive into a rough, which is like
a curse.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
Yeah, it's a gift and a curse. You get it both, right.
Speaker 5 (38:36):
It's it's like great for the year, and you're developing
them and you're you know, they're helping you win and
you know you're pushing through.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
But at the end of the day, it's like, yep,
we have them for six more months and we're going
to have to, you know, move on.
Speaker 5 (38:47):
So again, I just try to, you know, caution parents
to see the big picture as best they can and
always you know, it's not always greener either, Right, So
let's let's be patient.
Speaker 4 (38:57):
Let's think about all the you know, everything that goes
into it and what what could be next.
Speaker 5 (39:02):
Right, Don't just don't be in, don't be a product
at the moment, right, try to think about the future
and how this plays out.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Yeah, and you know, it's it's I think about this
a lot, right, because it's a little bit of a
shame that they're gonna. Kids are gonna their experiences are
are different. It's not a four year or five year
kind of I'm in I'm in school, same school or
just two schools.
Speaker 3 (39:29):
You're just constantly moving.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
Like and we talked about graduating high school earlier or
leaving high school at Christmas break, and they kind of
get robbed of that, you know, senior year.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
Yeah, it's tough.
Speaker 5 (39:43):
It's a really tough balance. And you know, I've seen
kids leave early and it might have helped them long term,
but none of them played right away. You know, that's
the reason why you leave really is to play right away.
I've never seen it where a kid, at least with
me directly where they've been able to play right away,
but thanks so much to Matt, great guy.
Speaker 4 (40:00):
I already talked to him. We're gonna get them back
in a month or so.
Speaker 5 (40:02):
Check in and continue perfect dive into these questions of
the ever changing landscape.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
All Right, I love it. That's gonna do it for us.
The Fellas coming up next.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Hey, it's Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington from The Odd
Couple on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 7 (40:19):
And in addition to hearing us live weeknights from seven
to ten pm Eastern on Fox Sports Radio, we are excited.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
To announce brand new YouTube channel for the show.
Speaker 4 (40:28):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
You can now watch The Odd Couple live on YouTube
every day.
Speaker 7 (40:34):
All you gotta do search Odd Couple FSR on YouTube.
Again YouTube, Just search Odd Couple FSR. Check us out
on YouTube and subscribe
You don't listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Well, good morning, good morning, good morning. This is Project
and I L. Danny D, the A D, Daniel D, Bernarddinas,
athletic director Panchotnam, Anthony Garganta, well, the Fellas and uh
residents sports Dad, this is Project ni L.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
Good morning Danny D.
Speaker 4 (00:30):
What's going on? Cause how are we doing over there?
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Uh? We are great. It's coop season and uh, I go.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
You know we saw last night North Carolina beat Kansas
and in a really good game, and uh it's there.
This is the week of basketball, and you know, we've
been doing a lot of football, as you can well imagine,
and some fall sports. Uh it's time this morning to
dive into the round ball. And you've already saw it.
(01:00):
With a lot of the colleges, it's all portal. I mean,
teams are completely different. I look at some rosters, some
starting fives, and they're all different from a year ago.
Speaker 5 (01:12):
It's just wild. It's crazy. I have a good friend
who prides himself on knowing where people went to college,
and he's losing it. He can't, he can't do it anymore.
You could give him random NBA or NFL players and
now it's so difficult with the portal.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
He was always so proud of it.
Speaker 5 (01:29):
My buddy Chuck Bernard, now he's really struggling with this
new age of.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
Uh, I feel Chuck man. I was the same way.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
Yeah, Like you name a guy and he always Dames College,
like with great Ky basketball football, it was the greatest
and now party trick. Now it's like, you know, there's
taking them three four schools.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
Yeah, it's difficult. It's definitely tough to keep up with.
I did, I wouldn't.
Speaker 5 (01:54):
I was pretty good at it, but uh there's people
that love it. You know, it's a good conversation starter,
but now you got to really really study.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
It's now you can't casually watch or just be locked.
Speaker 5 (02:04):
Into the sports because the rosters are changing every week.
So it's it's not even you know through a season.
You know, they change throughout the season. So it's really
difficult to stay on top of it and to really
know know they had to have information anymore.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
Well, let's let's kind of dive into basketball specifically this morning,
because you know what we saw portal wise football, it
kind of mimics the NFL a little bit NFL free
agency where you know, teams go into the portal to
get need like I, you know, I have I have
(02:41):
a shortage of receivers, or I need a corner or
a right tackle, and they'll go in the in the
portal and look at those positions. With basketball, it's just
completely different. It's makeover. There's really no rhyme or reason.
It's like, let me just collect as many players as possible.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:02):
And in football, you'll still get.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
The three year guys who stay there, right, because you
have to be there for three years. It's super super
rare now that you find a basketball player that's at
a place and is productive for four years, and that's
and to me, that's a shame, right. I mean, I
love college basketball. It's you know, March Madness is my
favorite time of year. I mean, this probably is my
favorite time of year when football is overlapping and basketball starting.
(03:26):
It can't get any better for me. But it's really
difficult to navigate, and it's and it's hard for these
you know, these colleges to keep these kids for multiple years.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Yeah, and I think you're seeing it really play out
in basketball where.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Lower tier D one, D two, D three.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
Those teams are are just gonna look, it's all about
climbing the ladder in basketball.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Yep, you do your job, you find you know, you
find that diamond in the rough, and then he does
really well and then he has to leave. It's really
difficult for these teams to hold on to these players
once they kind of blow up onto the scene because
you know, again, to make it to that next level
from college is super rare. So you can't blame someone
for trying to get some a financial head start. And
(04:17):
when teams are thrown out four, five, six hundred thousand dollars,
it's difficult to say no. And a lot of these
lower programs struggle to maintain and hold on to these
to these kids as they move through their college careers.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
So I know what, we're gonna take this down, and
you're gonna give us the preseason top high school teams,
which I'm looking forward to, and some of the names
that we should know of kids. I gotta tell you
a story because we always take this to the youth
level on up right, So.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
You know it's basketball.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
We just got done fall baseball, right and.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
This week and you know we're in the teeth of football.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
We still have three games left for the playoffs, including
one today, and we basketball tryouts are at our local school.
My little one goes to Saint Margaret's and I, in fact,
I coached jvate the sixth and seventh grade or the
fifth against I guess sixth and then and then they
(05:24):
had the varsity, right, So that's the I'm sorry, fifth
and sixth grade I coached, and then the varsity seventh
and eighth, so I coached them after coached my monsmo
the last four years at that school, and now they
have a paid coach. So it's funny. They it was
(05:45):
tryouts and you know, of course we're at football practice
and tryouts are right after, so I got to rush
from football practice to the gym. He brings his stuff,
so we you know, we have the tryouts and he
does well, and you know it's i mean, it's suburban
(06:05):
New Jersey, right, so you know, it's not like a
hotbed of hoops, all right, so you know he does
really well. And and not to say there's our players,
but in my area at that school, you're not. There's
not you know, prospects walking around those hallways. So you know,
he does really well, right, and code's like, you know,
(06:28):
guess him up. And my first reaction is, oh, because
right away he's talking about his game and he loves basketball,
because kids love basketball, because I love basketball.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
Basketball's fun.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
I was a much better baseball football player than I
was a basketball player back when I was a kid,
when when I was younger, but all I wanted to
do was play basketball. And and you know, like there's limitations,
like you know, yeah, you can shoot your good for
your little level, but once you get to the big pond, right,
(07:06):
you're you got no shot. And that's the and that's
the curse of basketball.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
Yeah, it gets tough. I understand that, right.
Speaker 5 (07:16):
I mean, it's super it's it's difficult to navigate, and
it's a sport where you know, you need to kind
of grow and develop.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
It's hard to really be elite size.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
You need size.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
I mean, unless you're a freakish athlete guard with a
ridiculous handle.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
You gotta be you got.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
You need a legitimate six five six six six seven,
you got.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
I see, that's the truth of the matter.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Yeah, for sure, No, I agree, it's tough.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
So what's your advice as the A D like I oh,
like again, I've said this before and people think I'm nuts.
I'm like, I'm not trying to, but I go, dude,
you're probably gonna top out if you get lucky. And
I he's he's on his way to six three rights
all boys.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
He's got some good size to him for his seventh grader.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Yeah, but I mean, you know, he's not freakishly tall,
so you know, put down the basketball.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
And I don't say that because it's like I.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
Don't want you to. I don't want I wanted to
enjoy himself and go play and have fun, so I don't.
I don't say that, but I won't focus. I don't
make it focus about the like his game like I
do with baseball or football.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
Yeah, I understand that, but I also, like I talked
to you before, I love the dual sport athlete. I
think it really helps you gain strength, and you know,
it helps you get better at your your main sport.
Right his base baseball might be his main sport, football
might be his main sport, but I think basketball really
ties in. I mean story last night, I was at
the Hall of Fame induction for Penn Charter and and
(08:56):
McGlinchey gets in right NFL offensive lineman starting to right
tackle for dever Broncos.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
I love this story that he flies in He's got
a game Thursday night against the Raiders, and he flies
into town yesterday.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
Yeah, so he's gonna be in town for today and
for yesterday and today because it's PCGA Day, the longest
rivalry in the country, one hundred and thirty nine years
of playing sports.
Speaker 4 (09:19):
So he'll be there as well today and then he'll
fly out this afternoon. But they talked about his.
Speaker 5 (09:23):
High school career, right, he was All league in basketball, football,
and he threw the he threw for a track and field,
so he's a three sport guy. And he got up
last night and talked about trying different things and how
track helped him, you know, throwing the javelin in the
discuss really helped him with football, and basketball really helped
him with football.
Speaker 4 (09:43):
Right, that helped him with his footwork.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
So I think if he likes it and he's passionate
about it, something will translate over that will help him
succeed in another sport.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yeah, And I get that. I get that.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I just I see a lot of parents going all
in with training and spending real money and real dollars
and and I hate to say, because I love the sport,
right and I want kids to play the sport. But
I think it's you got to have a sense of
(10:17):
you need a realistic approach. It's not like the other
sports with training and like if you're going to invest
in your kids athletic career, let's call it. Because there's
a professionalization of youth sports that's going on. My only
point is there's other investments with soccer, baseball, football, Like
(10:41):
there's other investments that have a chance to pay off
because of their size.
Speaker 5 (10:47):
Yep, No, I understand completely agree. Basketball is a little different, right,
and then there's not as I also I understand like
it's a smaller roster, right, so there's less opportunities as well.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
So yeah, and and my only point is let smaller
roster and body type because it's a genetic lottery when
when you have that kind of size.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
Yeah, at the highest level, for sure, I agree with that.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
I mean, I mean we're talking about college, so you know,
obviously it's not the NBA the pools. The pools is
a little wider, but are a little deeper, but not much.
I mean it's you know, if you're gonna play, if
you're playing at any kind of D one school, you
you know, you're you need your body type.
Speaker 4 (11:35):
No, I agree for sure.
Speaker 5 (11:37):
So it's definitely something that you know, definitely plays a
part in it and how you're going to progress it.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
You gotta play. There's a lot of factors that going
to play with it.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
What have you at your stops where?
Speaker 2 (11:50):
And you and you were the president of the Catholic
League in Philadelphia, right, so you ran, you ran, And
you're talking a lot of D one kids that you've
kind of presided over.
Speaker 5 (12:01):
Yeah, every year about twenty some some pros, right. Jalen Duran,
who's having a hell of a season right now currently. O.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (12:10):
So I was at Roman prior to Saint Jose Prep,
and at Roman Catholic we had him and you know,
some guys you just see it. I knew it was
an eighth grader. I was like, he's going to be
a pro one day. And he is absolutely dominating right
now and having a great season. And he's a great kid,
but incredibly hard worker. So in the Catholic League in Philadelphia,
every year you're probably seeing fifteen to twenty Division one
(12:30):
players come through the league, which is it's one of
the top leagues in the country. But uh yeah, you
see it. You see the twitch, you see the speed,
you see the size. You know, it's it's very distinguished
and you can kind of tell who has the ability to,
you know, continue to play on at the highest level.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
Wow, bit Jalen Towns, what a year he is. You're right, man.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
The other night I was watching him, and I mean
he just was vacuumate boards and he's got a he's
got a great little touch around the back as well.
Speaker 5 (13:01):
Yeah, and big time motor, big time odor. I mean
that's you kind of separated him. I saw as a
young kid, like he was super raw, but just big
time odor. I mean this year he's averaging eighteen points,
eleven and a half rebounds, and he's shooting sixty two percent,
you know, shooting sixty.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
The field twenty one years old.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
To be twenty two. He's not even twenty two yet.
Speaker 3 (13:22):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (13:24):
That's awesome.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
Great kid too, great great guy, great person, incredibly hard worker,
and you know, all the stuff's paying off. You know,
last night he had thirty and eleven.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Damn thirty and eleven. Why yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah,
he's playing he's playing some great ball. Bring it back
to Kyles for a second, because it's so much fun, Like,
you know, this time, this time of the year, you're
right the intersection of it. And you get a game
mic last night with Carolina and Kansas, and what's the
(13:57):
impact with like some of the blue bloods, Like what
do you foresee the college landscape kind of turn it
into It's.
Speaker 5 (14:08):
Hard to say, and because it's so evolving, right, it's
still we don't know, Like, so there's a you know,
today we might touch on some of the top teams
in the country and some of the top players in
the high school And interesting enough, like and football people commit, right,
you usually commit around the top guys are committing around
their late junior year, early senior years.
Speaker 4 (14:26):
It's usually done.
Speaker 5 (14:28):
The top ten are we have a top ten list
that will drop either this week or next week. The
top pen list only has two to three guys who've committed.
So basketball really drives it. So it's really crazy to
think about this late in the game, and there's still
seven of the top ten guys in the country who
still haven't committed to a college.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
For next year.
Speaker 5 (14:47):
And they're and part of it is they're waiting to
see how these teams are playing right now. They're waiting
to see early on how these guys are performing. They
want to come on the court and play right away.
So it's crazy, and they're waiting to see how much
money I can get right they're holding out to see
if a team starts slow, Hey we really got invested
next year, we might have to give this kid a
little extra money to get this done.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
And then I wow, Wow, that's what's wild byproduct where
you're like, you're right with football. Listen, we taught you
and I were having this conversation yesterday where a lot
of a lot of football players aren't actually graduating with
their class like they're they're they're leaving early to get
(15:30):
the springball right from your senior year so they can
get to college for spring. So they leave after Christmas break.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
Yep, and they're up there.
Speaker 5 (15:41):
They start college when this second semester starts in January,
mid January or January.
Speaker 4 (15:46):
And then they're there for springball.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
They try to get acclimated and and try to get on,
you know, try to.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
Get that fight for that roster spot. It gives you
a little bit more incentives.
Speaker 5 (15:54):
And then again with the transfer portal, if you come
in and play, you're gonna get paid more.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
I mean, you're in a spot you get.
Speaker 5 (16:01):
Money to kind of go to these schools, and then
if you earn that starting spot, that's when you kind
of can renegotiate and try to get some more money.
And basketball and football, you know, it's interesting, like I know,
a top like in basketball, if you're like the ninetieth
prospect in the country, you're getting about five hundred thousand,
six hundred thousand. If you're a lower end prospect, a
four star, three star. In football, the main guys really
(16:24):
get paid and then it's it drops off a good
bit from the three and four stars until you prove yourself.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
But you look drops off.
Speaker 5 (16:30):
I mean, you're still getting three hundred thousand dollars, right,
It's not like you're not getting a ton of money.
Not trying to downplay how much money it is, but
there's you know, there's these different tiers.
Speaker 4 (16:40):
And how it's kind of shaken out again.
Speaker 5 (16:42):
It's changing all the time to see how these how
these guys are getting paid into what level and what
what these benchmarks are.
Speaker 2 (16:51):
So I guess, I guess it does make sense that
if you're you're gonna wait. In basketball, you want to
see how it all plays out, right, So when you
foresee a lot of the dominoes start to fall, would
it be in the tournament? And you know you had
(17:15):
you had guys like Patino talking about you know, had
when I'm not even gonna recruit high school kids.
Speaker 5 (17:24):
Yeah, I mean he came out and said it, right.
I mean we've talked about it at college football, where
some schools used to offer, you know, try to take
twenty to twenty five freshmen or taking eight to ten,
you know, basketball, same thing. These top programs might take
one or two. They're trying to get a couple of
kids in the top fifty in the country. And if
you're missing on that, you're saying, hey, we're going to
look into the portal.
Speaker 4 (17:44):
But for these kids, yeah, I'm interested to see. It's
getting later and later.
Speaker 5 (17:47):
So I mean, we're learning as it goes because it's
it's again we always talk about it.
Speaker 4 (17:51):
It's ever changing, and it's you know, this new landscape.
Speaker 5 (17:54):
I'm shocked at this late, but I would think by
January February most of these teams commit, you kind of
can get more of most of these kids committed. You
get more of uh an overall look at the landscape
of these programs you're really looking at and then also.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
Like what the dollars look like?
Speaker 5 (18:09):
Right, I had to cut backfire on you, right, he
could backfire, But that's the game that they're playing right now.
But yeah, it's a wild, wild situation. And again, have
you know we do our project and il list. To
have seven guys not committed in the top ten is wild.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Yeah, it's it's great, It's happened in real time. It's nuts.
All right, we'll talk more about this and the basketball
landscape with Matt Griffin, associated head coach at Buck.
Speaker 3 (18:39):
Now who's uh, who's gonna join us? Coming up next?
Speaker 2 (18:42):
And I'm curious Danny to get Matt's take on the
on the whole landscape.
Speaker 5 (18:47):
Yeah, Matt is a phenomenal coach and we'll get into
it when after the break. But great guy, great coach,
and just full of knowledge.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Stay tuned. That's next.
As uh, Danny and I were diving the hoops, basketballs,
round ball season. It is great, man, it really is.
This is Project nil right here on Fox Sports.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
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listen live.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
All right, welcome back, This is Project ni L. Hey,
don't forget the Fox Sports Radio YouTube channel. Just search
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(19:50):
know what takes you like, those you don't like, Just
search Fox Sports Radio on YouTube and subscribe. All right, U,
as we dive in, as we dive into basketball. And
you know we've been doing a lot on this show
about football and the fall sports.
Speaker 3 (20:10):
Well, this week is the transition week in the hoops.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
We saw it with college and joining us right now
to talk about the ever changing landscape of college sports,
the associate head coach of buck Mel Matt Griffin coach, Good.
Speaker 6 (20:25):
Morning, Hey, good morning, good morning.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Great to hear your voice, pal, Great.
Speaker 6 (20:33):
Excited to be here. Thank you so much for the
opportunity and hop long.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
So coach uh Danny and I were just talking about
this landscape which is completely wild. So can you shed
some like just general light on how you guys are
dealing with it, like, you know, what what your strategy is.
You know, we'll get into advice for players and kids
(20:58):
and parents, but right now, what's your strategy.
Speaker 6 (21:03):
There's there's so much that goes into it. I hear
number one, I'll say, I coach at Bucknell University, and
we just played an exhibition game, uh two games ago
against Louisville. So Louisville probably in totality they pay over
(21:28):
twelve million dollars for their roster. We we we don't
we we uh. But what I'll say is, and you know,
for for all the time, Bucknell has never competed with
Louisville for recruiting. For you know, Louisville has always attracted
(21:52):
a higher level player because of you know, being in
a higher level league. So regardless of N I L,
it's always been buck Nell being the little guy versus
the kind of the giant. So that hasn't changed. What
has changed is that the teams like Louisville, if they
(22:15):
play you and they see on your roster that you
have somebody pretty good, they're now recruiting from your roster them.
Oh you know, And I was the head coach at
Roman Catholic High School shout out brought in Vine shout
(22:35):
out Danny Deeverdenis. But it feels like when I was
the head coach at Roman Catholic and we were, you know,
competing against you know, anybody in the country with two
basketball hoops on the third floor of a gym in
Center City. That the kind of the bigger prep schools
(22:57):
in the country. We're trying to recruit our players away
from our team if we had good players. It's very
similar in that way and what it's done in college
sports now, it's just become professional. We kind of have
to shift our way of thinking of college sports and
that it's professional sports now, and not only players are
(23:20):
held accountable to that standard, but certainly coaches. And you
can see that the expectation for winning is much higher.
The time frame that you had as a coach to
develop your program, to build your program has shortened. From
an administrative standpoint, they do not really think that you
(23:41):
need to have four years to develop a program because
of this type of environment where if you recruit an older,
experienced player in the transfer portal, you can flip your
roster in one season. And a great example of this
is Will Wage, who is now at NC State. He
(24:03):
came to mcniche State and in just one season completely
changed that program with bringing in the right transfers in
this nil landscape because he was able to attract players
that normally they couldn't, but they had money and they
were able to say, hey, come here for a year,
(24:27):
we'll pay you well and compete at this level and
it's an attractive sell. So they did for two years.
And now Will Wade goes to NC State with his
level of successful I think it's just completely transformed. How
you know, you can look at college sports. It's professional
now and certainly you can see all over, not only
(24:47):
in basketball, with football if it's changed.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Sure.
Speaker 5 (24:50):
And so for Matt, first of all, congratulations on be
in two. And oh the Bison starting the season night
they will have big win last night.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
So they're two. And oh let's give the Bison some flowers. Man, Yeah,
let's go so too.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
No, but also so, like Matt was talking about, like
they played Louisville, So these smaller teams have to play
these games because they get paid to play these games.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
Right.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
So, but now it's double edged sword.
Speaker 5 (25:11):
Right, You're getting paid to you know, be a game
for a bigger school Louisville, Kentucky.
Speaker 4 (25:16):
Right, a duke.
Speaker 5 (25:18):
But you're also now you have to worry about like
the second the season ends, these guys are you're you're
you're paying them, but also they're paying you. But then
also they're they're going to try to play play your
best players.
Speaker 6 (25:28):
Absolutely, we have a we have a player, he's a
young player and in that game versus Louisville, he makes
one move from the top of the key where he
goes through his legs, he splits two defenders and he
makes a lab and we're sitting there as a staff
jokingly but also with oh no, we're like that, Well,
(25:49):
we won't have him for very long, you know, like, yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
Oh man, that's so tough.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Yeah, you know, coach, it's I guess it's with every level.
It becomes just the reality of it right where you
know the kids are, you know, you're you're kind of
running these kids for a year.
Speaker 3 (26:11):
How do you how do you teach?
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Like, how do you go about practice and player development
knowing that you know you may lose a handful of kids.
Speaker 6 (26:23):
Well, Fran Dumphy, who I love your friend mentor obviously
Hall of Fame coach, He said, it the best. I
think when he retired from sal this past year and
he said, see the best you can with what you
have where you are, and that is always the mindset
(26:44):
you You pour in everything you have as a coach
into the player and the person. It's not you can't
control these things. What you can control as a coach
is how you help a player become a better you know,
from a skills standpoint, and how you help them become
(27:05):
a better from a player development standpoint, how they approach
the game, how they see the game, and you let
the ships fall where they may at the end. You
never know what the future brings. And so I think
that's number one. Number two. Uh. Something that's a little
unique is that, like buck Nell's in a higher academic conference.
(27:29):
So the Patriot League and the Patriot League is a
parallel with the IVY. Both conferences have the highest level
of retention in the country. So a lot of the
players that we have, it's not a guarantee that they'll leave.
Certainly there are there are attractive offers out there. I'll
(27:53):
give you an example in our league. There was a
young player who was very talented, produced very well in
our league, and he goes from Holy Cross to Northwestern,
So you could argue that the academics are similar with us.
It's a great school and he can get nil money.
So that's the competition there. But because of that, the
(28:19):
other thing I'll say is a lot of the players
that we recruit are interested in there. If they lead
the conversation with hey, what's your nil package, we know
it's not the right fit, and they they quickly find
out that it's not the right fit either.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Yeah, budget budget wise, I mean, you guys aren't North
Caroline and so I mean I think that's got to
be an obvious kind of conversation, right.
Speaker 6 (28:46):
Absolutely, absolutely. It's the higher level that you recruit at,
the more transparency you have early on in those type
of conversations. You know, if you're talking about your recruiting
at University of Miami, the first conversation you might have
in this day and ages, what's your budget? You if
(29:09):
you don't have a bottom line of this amount of money,
Let's not waste each other's time. For us, we lead with, hey,
we're school. You can get a well rounded experience will
help develop you as a player. Certainly, there's players that
come to Bucknell who have been professional. We have eight
players playing currently professionally, two who are in the EuroLeague,
(29:32):
one who just retired from the NBA, one who's chieved.
So and you get a great education and you can develop,
you know, in the in the social setting, so in
the alumni that all these things that we're once attractive
I think still applies now. And those are the players
that we want and really like, are really excited about
(29:53):
the opportunity. But as you get higher up, like the Louisville's,
the Dukes are North Carolina's. Uh, that's more. Hey, here's
the bottom line of what we can pay you. Here's
your nil opportunity. Obviously where's it? Uh tell you. But
here's the last part.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
We're talking to Bucknell Head associated head coach Matt Griffin
on Project Dot. I L Davey g Murda, Dinas, I'm
Anthony Gargatta. We're right here on Fox Sports Radio. I'm sorry, coach,
go ahead.
Speaker 6 (30:26):
Yeah, it is that players are making far more money
in college now than they will than they are even
in the NBA. Like it's and it could be five
times six times you know what they're what they would
actually be projected to make in the NBA. So think
(30:46):
about that, you grow up playing the game of basketball. OK,
all I want to do is make the NBA. Now, Like,
even as you're at the Atlantic ten level, you can
make a million dollars playing and being starting at the
A ten and then you can go to the NBA,
be a second round draft pick and be making half
(31:09):
of that, you know, a quarter of that. So uh,
it's really interesting that you'll see a higher level talents
want to stay in college sports even though they might
balance around schools, but it's actually financially more responsible for
them to stay because their game probably doesn't translate to
(31:31):
the NBA.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Coach, we got like.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Time for one more, and I need to ask this question.
How do you approach high school kids? Like, you know,
I've saw the Rick Patino thing where you know he's
not recruiting high schools at all. How do you, guys,
how do you see it in the big picture for
high school kids.
Speaker 6 (31:54):
I think you there's a balance. I think you need
a balance of recruiting that there are some really good
young players who can contribute at right away, but I
think it's really helpful and tactful to get older players
to come in as well, who are more college ready
(32:15):
on and off the court. It has forced teams like
us to to do that to compete consistently year and
you're out because if you have all young guys, you're
not going to have all those young guys to the
end of their career. So it actually puts you at
a disadvantage in my opinion, if you just do it
(32:36):
the way that everybody else did it back in the day.
So you have to adapt to the times and certainly
get some older players from the transfer portal, but not
completely turned a blind eye to the high school kids.
There's a lot of high school kids who can contribute
right away, and so we do. We really work hard
and finding that striking that balance, and that is the game.
That's the game. That's why it's really tough, but it
(32:58):
certainly presents a ton of opportunity unity to keep your
team and your program in the right spot for as
long as you need to coach.
Speaker 3 (33:06):
You are fantastic. We got to do this again.
Speaker 2 (33:10):
You know, we're working Damie and I are working on
the podcast, so uh we need to sit with you
and pick your brain. You're terrific and uh listen, great,
good luck, all right, t it up.
Speaker 4 (33:22):
Bison.
Speaker 5 (33:23):
Matt's one of the best coaches in the country, developer
of the game, but also people, Matt is an elite,
elite coach and if anyone's out there and the thing
about buck Now, he's the guy.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
And let's go buy some baby.
Speaker 6 (33:37):
Thank you so much of what an honor and it
was to be on the show with you guys. Thank
you so much. And uh, I just uh really appreciate it.
Awesome show. I love it and uh, thank you guys.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Thanks coach, appreciated pal.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Here he is Matt Griffin, associated coach at buck Now
as we talk about basketball, Baby, Mike, God, this this
hour flies by.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
We got to take a quick time out. We'll come
right back.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Project Din, I L Danny D and the A D
Man and from the fellas as we in sports Dad,
as we hang out on a Fox don't.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
Listening to Fox Sports Radio Radio.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
And I coach too fast, Danny D so fast because
two fast and you know we're talking to Matt Griffin.
Speaker 3 (34:28):
Do you associate head coach at buck Now?
Speaker 2 (34:30):
And I had a million questions for him, man, because
when you look at and I meant to ask him
what his budget would be like. In fact, we have
a great listener Southside Chuck who is from Kentucky, and
he was talking about the University of Kentucky. They're nil budget.
(34:53):
It's like twenty million, right Louisville. Louisville's probably you know,
I mean we're between you know, fifteen to eighteen million,
like right around the same number. How much do you
think buck Nell is like at school? Like buck Nell
probably be budget.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
A million, and like I know, like like I'm close
with the guys at FGC.
Speaker 5 (35:16):
He're doing a great job out there, and like patch
kind of thing was like he'll pay you try to
get the top guy's money, but he just pays everyone
because you can't pay everyone so much.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
So he tried to give everyone.
Speaker 5 (35:25):
Like when they first started out, every kid on the
roster was getting ten grand minimum. Right, you try to
start off with things like that when you don't have
enough to spread.
Speaker 4 (35:32):
It out to everybody. Uh, try to build an equity
like that and try to make everyone feel to love.
Speaker 5 (35:38):
But a prime example of buck Nell is you know,
two years ago when Matt and his brother John got there,
and you know, I watched them closely. They had a
kid from like Lithuania or something. Coen walking chew Gum.
They develop him. He becomes last year Player of the Year.
He's at He's at Alabama.
Speaker 3 (35:55):
Right, Like, you got to be kidding me.
Speaker 4 (35:57):
He got there. I could I lie to you not.
Speaker 5 (35:59):
I went to a game where he went one for
ten and didn't look like he could make a layup
his first year. His second year, because of their development
skills and how great of coaches they are, he's Player
of the Year.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
And then you know he had to hit the portal.
Speaker 5 (36:12):
And you can't blame him if he's gonna go get
a million or two million dollars, right, and I'm sure
they can all fer him one hundred thousand, right, So
it's it's very difficult.
Speaker 4 (36:21):
But again, you know, they do a really good job
of the balance of the young and old.
Speaker 5 (36:26):
I think they do a really good job of player development.
And like he said, they have high level education. And
I tell parents all the time, it's great to get
some money, right, to get a couple hundred thousand dollars,
but one percent of one percent make it to the NBA.
Speaker 4 (36:39):
You have to hit the lottery. So you really need
to fall back on.
Speaker 5 (36:42):
That education and that network and sticking it out of
some of these schools, you know, might be the play
opposed to chasing that short term money. But you know,
every situation is different, and you know, I want people
to get paid and chase their dreams. So if there
is that life change of money or money that you
know can help their family, you know, you gotta do
what you gotta do and do what's best for you.
Speaker 2 (37:04):
Yeah, you know, I think one of the things that's
fascinating to me with a situation like a buck now
and a lot of those smaller D one schools is
I didn't even think about this, but like these games
are like scouting missions.
Speaker 5 (37:22):
Right, it wasn't so much because if you transferred, you
had to sit out right, so they weren't.
Speaker 2 (37:26):
Really Yeah, they weren't looking at you, right. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (37:29):
Now it's like you all right, they might pay you
a million dollars to go play down in Kentucky for
like a by game, right. But also like he said,
he said, oh man, this young kid he made a move,
and we turned to ourselves and said, oh.
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Man, yeah, that's that's like we're gonna lose that because
when you see that, like it's such an inexact science
you brought to you and I were talking off the
air about these rankings, right, and we're gonna get into
that next week.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
We'll we'll lead the show with them and kind of
do a deep dive.
Speaker 4 (37:59):
We got the top ten for the teams and the
top ten for the players, so.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (38:03):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
And then we'll do our rule. Also we need to
recap our football and everything else. But you know what's
interesting is the rankings are so inexact, oh right, like
you know, so you know, it's so hard to kind
of pay them slop them in because you don't know.
(38:24):
And then you get a kid that comes in and
they may be a little bit of a late bloomer,
and all of a sudden, you go, oh my god,
we've got to dive into a rough, which is like
a curse.
Speaker 4 (38:33):
Yeah, it's a gift and a curse. You get it both, right.
Speaker 5 (38:36):
It's it's like great for the year, and you're developing
them and you're you know, they're helping you win and
you know you're pushing through.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
But at the end of the day, it's like, yep,
we have them for six more months and we're going
to have to, you know, move on.
Speaker 5 (38:47):
So again, I just try to, you know, caution parents
to see the big picture as best they can and
always you know, it's not always greener either, Right, So
let's let's be patient.
Speaker 4 (38:57):
Let's think about all the you know, everything that goes
into it and what what could be next.
Speaker 5 (39:02):
Right, Don't just don't be in, don't be a product
at the moment, right, try to think about the future
and how this plays out.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Yeah, and you know, it's it's I think about this
a lot, right, because it's a little bit of a
shame that they're gonna. Kids are gonna their experiences are
are different. It's not a four year or five year
kind of I'm in I'm in school, same school or
just two schools.
Speaker 3 (39:29):
You're just constantly moving.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
Like and we talked about graduating high school earlier or
leaving high school at Christmas break, and they kind of
get robbed of that, you know, senior year.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
Yeah, it's tough.
Speaker 5 (39:43):
It's a really tough balance. And you know, I've seen
kids leave early and it might have helped them long term,
but none of them played right away. You know, that's
the reason why you leave really is to play right away.
I've never seen it where a kid, at least with
me directly where they've been able to play right away,
but thanks so much to Matt, great guy.
Speaker 4 (40:00):
I already talked to him. We're gonna get them back
in a month or so.
Speaker 5 (40:02):
Check in and continue perfect dive into these questions of
the ever changing landscape.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
All Right, I love it. That's gonna do it for us.
The Fellas coming up next.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Hey, it's Rob Parker and Kelvin Washington from The Odd
Couple on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 7 (40:19):
And in addition to hearing us live weeknights from seven
to ten pm Eastern on Fox Sports Radio, we are excited.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
To announce brand new YouTube channel for the show.
Speaker 4 (40:28):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
You can now watch The Odd Couple live on YouTube
every day.
Speaker 7 (40:34):
All you gotta do search Odd Couple FSR on YouTube.
Again YouTube, Just search Odd Couple FSR. Check us out
on YouTube and subscribe
Fox Sports Radio News
Host
Jonas Knox
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