April 8, 2026 • 44 mins
Hosts Joe Maddon and Tom Verducci know it's early in the season, but how many 'good' teams have ever had terrible starts? The Red Sox stumbled out of the gate, but can they turn it around? Tom notes the incident with Wilson Contreras and the Brewers and what happens next. Tropicana Field is open once again and Joe recalls his time in Tampa and the stadium. We're starting to see injuries pop up and Joe talks about managing things early so they don't become a season-long issue. Plus, Tom and Joe bid farewell to the legendary 'Dark Horse' in Boulder, Colorado.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hey thereon Welcome Back.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
It's The Book of Joe Podcast with Me, Tom Berducci
and of course Joe Madden and Joe was a momentous
day in humankind.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
It took fifty three years, but what.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Pink Floyd called the Dark Side of the Moon, we
now have seen Artemis forty minutes of touring the Dark
Side of the Moon out of pocket with Houston on
their own. I can only imagine what that must have
been like with no radio communication. But yeah, Pink Floyd
called it first, but we finally got there. The Dark
Side of the Moon has been seen.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Yeah, I saw the photographs in the New York Post today.
Missed it last would actually occurred. But it is pretty phenomenal.
And you're right, it's got to be unsettling, right, I
mean everybody, not just probably the least unsettling for the
actual astronauts because they're fine. It's everybody else that are
trying to stay in contact with them. Probably we freaked
out a little bit more than they do. They're professionals,
(01:15):
they're trained to do it. Then they put their eyeballs
on it for the first time. That's you know, they
talk about may all your surrealisms come true. That's the
prime example right there.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
You sound a little different this week, Joe. Are you
up in Artemis as well, Claiose.
Speaker 4 (01:29):
If you look out the window, it looks like I'm
in Artemis at artist We can't we don't have video,
but I am in my RV on Beverly Beach, right
near Flagler Beach by the way. We had a great
dinner last night at a place called The Next Door.
I walk in there and not obviously but never fails.
The GM there is from Chicago, so we had a
(01:50):
great conversation. Bought us a nice bottle of duck corn
cab when he was there. My brother and his wife, Mary,
cousin Joe and Sally, his wife, and of course my nephew.
It's a beautiful setting. But to have you the RV
this this particular place that's called Beverly Beach RB Resort.
You literally parked the nose of your vehicle right on
the water, by the way.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
I'm guessing you remember distinctly when Dark Side of the
Moon came out Pink Floyd's album nineteen seventy three, a
concept album. I don't even know if such things are
made anymore, Joe, But back in the seventies, that was
a thing, and that was at the height of it.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
You big Dark Side of the Moon fan.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Yes, huge Pink Floyd fan. How could you not be
a huge Pink Floyd fan? And for these astronauts to
actually experienced the other side the dark side of the moon,
when my thought was, may all your surrealisms come true?
I mean, I would think that the people on the ground,
that people in charge of their safety, probably a lot
more nervous about that downtime than the actual astronauts. I
(02:49):
would imagine they were so excited about what they were saying.
For the first time for anybody had to exceed any
kind of consternation on their parts. Brother, It's just it's
incredible that we're able to do these kind of things.
It's kind of neat that we're going back, turning back
to clock and really recreating all of these moments that
I think was sixty nine. Right when the landing occurred,
(03:12):
I was I think I was sitting with my pop
in his living room watching a late night TV show,
What have Been Johnny Carson. I'm not sure what time
of the day it was, Yeah, it's pretty neat that
this happens. In a tribute to Pink Flay for pointing
this out years ago.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Well, we need to talk about a baseball team that
seems to be lost, if you will, on the dark
side of baseball's moon, and that is the Boston Red Sox.
I know, Joe, everybody likes to say it's early, it's early,
and it certainly is. I mean, we have such a
small sample side size to go with here, but the
(03:46):
Boston Red Sox are off to a two and eight start.
Now we know the season is one hundred and sixty
two games, so it's really early. But the fact is,
you won't find many good teams that start two and eight.
In fact, in the history of baseball, in full seasons,
no half seasons, or truncated seasons, there have been only
(04:10):
nine teams that started two and eight and made the playoffs.
And the last of those nine teams was your twenty
eleven Tampa Bay Rays started two and eight, wound up
winning ninety one games and going to the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
So listen, you.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
Can tell me that the ninety one Twins, the seventy
seven Yankees, the thirty five Tigers, the nineteen fourteen Miracle
Braves all won the World Series. After starting two and eight.
The season far from over for the Red Sox. But
the fact is, Joe, that's a small group of teams.
Only nine teams made the playoffs after starting two and eight.
(04:49):
Early indications are right now, the Boston Red Sox are
not a very good team. Tell me what you see.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
Yeah, I mean I was paying. We're all shocked by that.
It's just like they've been sloppy. You know, it's like
it's incredible. You would think that this and Alex theair,
that they're going to be on top of their game
all the time. And you said it's early, and it's
just they're just not playing up to the standards that
we thought they're going to. And I still believe that
they're going to now I could just speak for the
(05:17):
Rays of yesteryear. I remember that and we've talked about it.
That we were flying in Chicago and I had a
toast on the airplane. I went up front, I took
the microphone away, and I announced, and I put everybody's
shot at shar Bay Whiskey walked around, and then I.
Speaker 5 (05:34):
Saluted the.
Speaker 4 (05:36):
Best one in seven or two and I think it
was one and seven at that time team in the
history of a Major League baseball That was my toast
because I thought we were a lot better than that.
I thought, you know, we're actually pretty good eventually. That's
that trip we were playing Chicago. It's if you remember
the catch Sam Fold made in a right field corner
at that Chemiski Park whatever they were calling it at
that time, was one of the most fabulous catches you
(05:59):
ever want to see. But that kind of a play
got us inspired. I thought might even have been the
time when I kicked out all the umpiring crew. I
don't even know if that was or not, but yes,
it happens, man, and I've been part of some dramatic
comebacks with the Rays when we were down like what seven,
eight or nine games in September and caught the Red Sox,
(06:19):
passed the Red Sox and one on that the most
faithful night in history of Major League Baseball. So stuff
could be done. I know it's unusual, but the Red
Sox have the talent pool to pull this off. I
believe they have the right manager to do it with. Also,
even regardless of history and how vague it is and
normally doesn't happen. I still believe they have an opportunity
(06:41):
to come back from this. There's no doubt about that.
I agree with you. Listen early on. They've actually hit okay.
I wouldn't say they've hit great. They're sort of in
the middle of the pack offensively. You do have some guys,
as happens slow out of the gate, Story.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Mayor Durban, all under two hundred.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
My concern with Boston Joe would be that I look
at their lineup. I see a lot of complimentary type hitters.
I don't see those aircraft carriers. I don't see the
thirty to forty home run dude in the middle of
the order. You know, Roman Anthony is a terrific offensive player.
He is He's the focal point. He's the leadoff hitter
(07:20):
for the team. He's the best hitter of the team.
He's hitting leadoff. So I think there's some questions about
how much right handed power they have specifically, and how
many runs they can produce. And I look at the rotation.
Garrett Crochet is the dude's an ace. He's a workhorse.
He's a cy young winner waiting to happen. But you
tell me who's their number two between you know, Sonny Gray,
(07:42):
Brian Bao, you know Oviedo just went on the il
Ranger Suarez, you know, good pitchers, But again, where is
the high end talent. I think it's a group that
alex Core is going to have to melt together to
get the best out of them.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
But I don't see a lot of those elite players
in the rotation or in the lineup.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
Isn't that intention though? I mean they're of the ILK.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
Yeah, you know that they like the platoon advantage kind
of stuff, so they do, like, I believe, complimentary players,
even though obviously they do have a lot of dough
up there, and you would think they could go out
there and buy the people that they want. I think
they did buy the people that they want. I think
they like it this way. I don't know exactly what's
going on in their minor league system, but platoon advantage
(08:27):
is one of the buzz phrases that goes throughout major
league front offices these days, and they really want that
on it. It's a less expensive way of building a team,
and they do like the idea that let these primarily
more than anything. Again, I just have to be patient,
but I think it's an intentional build the way it's
setting up for them, and I'll just I need to
(08:48):
start looking more closely. But I do is I watch
the videos in the morning, and you know, you can't
really ascertain a whole lot from that. However, you do
see some stuff, Like I said, the biggest thing, I
saw some sloppy stuff. They had a nice lead I
can't remember against too, and then just gave it up
through some just bad execution offensively and defensively. Totally, but
just give him a little time. But I think everything
(09:09):
they do is intentional, regardless of how the amount of
money that they have.
Speaker 5 (09:12):
I think they prefer the ability to.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
Tink on a daily basis and attempt to gain a
platoon advantage.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Well, you know how things work in Boston too, you know,
narratives can build. You know they're chanting sell the team
and a loss of the padres on Sunday. It's important
for that team a little more than most teams to
get off to a good start and to sort of
end the negativity around the team.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Because that can build so quickly. In Boston.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
One of the guys who I think has been miscast
a little bit when I talked about complimentary players having
to pick up bigger roles. Is Wilson Contreras. You had
him with the Cubs. He's a very good offensive player.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
We know that.
Speaker 3 (09:49):
Is he a middle of the order run producer? I
think ideally probably not. He's probably a five or six
hole hitter and do his thing that way. But they're
very interesting. The other night against Milwaukee where he's hit
by Brandon Woodruff. Now he's been going at it against
the Brewers for years, and he took exception to a
pitch that they needed replay to confirm, and they actually
(10:10):
didn't confirm. They just had the call stand to see
if the ball actually hit his hand or not. So
it wasn't like he was really plunked, and if you
look at the pitch, it was pretty darn close to
the strike zone actually, you know, he likes to get
on top of the plate and dive into the ball,
and the Brewers loved to move him off the plate,
but he after the game, he complained this was the
(10:31):
twenty fourth time he's been hit by Brewers pitching. Again,
he plays in the Division, has been for years. Sees
them a lot, and teams do want to move him
off the plate, and he said, next time he's gonna
take somebody out. He was very hot after the game.
You know, that's the way he plays. He plays with
a chip on his shoulder. It brings out the best
in him. But man, I know he's frustrated. But that
(10:53):
pitch was barely barely nicking him and barely inside. So
keep an eye on that for the rest of this
series between Milwaukee and Boston.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
But Contres does give you that fire, you know that.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Joe again, I just I'm not sure whether he's the
guy you want hitting in the middle of the lineup.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
I think your evaluation is really good.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
And on top of that, his brother's with Milwaukee, right,
So what's going on with all of that?
Speaker 2 (11:16):
I thought he liked, Yeah, he's behind the plate, brother
is right.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Yeah, yeah, his brother's actually keeping him from getting after
Brandon Woodruff.
Speaker 5 (11:24):
It's kind of interesting.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
First of all, you're right, I mean, I Wilson and
I had a great relationship. I really did. I gave
him a big hug before every game. I would reinforce
him what I thought of him. Really, my plan with
him was not to catch him more than three days
in a row until the end of the year like
August and we went up to four days in row
and critical series. That's the part that I still I
don't quite get the fact that he was forced out
(11:47):
from behind the plate. You know, I still think his
greatest start. I don't even know if he would ever
want to again. I don't even know if his body
would have held up. But I liked him behind the plate.
I know there's issues with you know, the frame world,
but this guy can really throw.
Speaker 5 (11:59):
He is a rock.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
He's aggressive, he's very sturdy, and then if you at
that offense behind the plate as opposed to first base,
it's even more attractive. But he's not You're right, there's times,
you know, I hit him middle of the order like that,
maybe like you're saying five six, I actually let him
off a couple of times to try to get him going,
or if he was in a nice streak getting on base.
Sin is is he's the fireburns hot within him. He's
(12:27):
quite a competitor. He does love to win. He's a
tond of guy man that you got to get in
front of. Like if you see things are going a
little bit sideways, he's getting too emotional, you got to
get in there and and really try to bring him
back on board. It's just listen, the guy grew up
in Caracas. I mean, he's just you know. Part of
that is being a product of your environment, how you
grew up in which you grew up around. And there's
(12:48):
there's guys in the States that have grown up in
difficult situations that reflect that also. So I've always respected
and admired him just where he came from and how
he got where he's at. And when you just sit down,
like you've talked to him, really respectful young man. When
you sit down have a good conversation with him, he
becomes very logical and you're able to reason with them,
and it's good. But then you go to this emotional
(13:10):
side of his being, which, again, like I said, it's
in brand and there's nothing all he can do about it,
and it's probably why he's a major League baseball player.
So yeah, it'll be interesting to see if I'm the
bruised he heads up, unless they do want a good
old fashioned brawl, because if he said he's gonna do it,
I don't doubt that he will if in fact they
do hit him again.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
Well he did later on the games slid at the
second base on a double play with his spikes high
and actually got a piece of Hamilton at second base
lamp on the leg toward the uniform, probably broke some
skin as well. So it's not over. We'll see. But
I do think Joe, that sometimes you have to cast
aside its early narrative and talk about some urgency in April.
(13:50):
Nobody wants to play with urgency in April, but you know,
I look at the way the Braves last year started
zero to seven, the way the Baltimore Orioles were pretty
much out of it by the end of the month.
Good teams are teams that we think are supposed to
be good. I think they do face a little more
urgency in April when they get off to these slow starts,
and the Red Sox later on this month will close
the month with night straight games against the Yankees, the Orioles, and.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
The Blue Jays.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
It suddenly has become an important month for Boston, and
not so much that they have to go on some
kind of a run, but you have to avoid that
really bad month where you.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Lose the margin for error.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Every team, I think has an one month where they
can be under five hundred and survive it.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
But if that month is.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
April, you lose your margin of error and playing uphill,
and especially in that American League East, We're not there yet.
But I would say, Joe, I don't want to get
your take on this. For a team like Red Sox.
Like the Red Sox, we do have high expectations. How
important is it for them there to nip this thing
in the bud quickly?
Speaker 4 (14:51):
But the Jogi segets you can get late early something
like that. Wasn't that accurate? And yeah, they do need
to nip it in the butt list And we've talked
about this.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
You say, left field at the Yankee Stadium, it gets
late early.
Speaker 5 (15:03):
Late early.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
It also applies to a major league season. Yeah, they
it's it's so nice to get off to a decent
start so that you can absorb the bad moments. It's
not as obvious when you're as a hitter. You go like,
some guys have one for twenty two's or you know,
one for twenty fives early in the season. My god,
you look up at the board and you always see
(15:24):
a bad number. Relief pitchers have one or two bad
outings early on My gother all for the first half
of the season, they try to bring that back down
to respectable numbers. And then with the team that starts
out like that. As from a standing perspective, I would
always try to in my mind's eyes the manager, I
want to gain one game per week, getting back towards
five hundred and then eventually getting over it. And it's
(15:46):
a real mindset. It's it's a mind trick. You got
to you actually have to pretty much trick yourself into.
It's got to be bought into by the whole group.
Otherwise it gets it does fester, and it gets worse.
But I always I did the one game a week plan.
What I used to do. I would keep track of
our record on a weekly basis. That would be important
to me. What's our record for the week, just as
(16:06):
a benchmark. And then absolutely at the end of this month,
I want do we have a winning month?
Speaker 5 (16:11):
And by how many? You're right?
Speaker 4 (16:13):
When you get below five hundred during the month, it's
really a bad thought and feeling. So I would try
to break things down for me and then you know,
emphasize wise without really being signing any alarms with the team,
with the players, I would just try to, you know,
maybe apply a little bit more whatever thought or urgency
(16:34):
in a sense conversationally without being too obvious, because we
really need to get back on track. This can go
sideway to the point where it is difficult. It's easier
to absorb that two and eight moment during the middle
of the season after a good start, as opposed at
the beginning of the season. Psychologically again, you look at
the darn scoreboard, man, and it's there right.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
In front of your face.
Speaker 4 (16:55):
You don't like anything about it, and that's where guys
start to press.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
We're going to take a quick break on the Book
of Joe. When we get back. I've got some new
for you, Joe on two of your old haunts. One
is good news, one is bad news. We'll get to
those right after this. On the Book of Joe.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Welcome back to the Book of Joe.
Speaker 3 (17:29):
The Trump is open, mister Madden Trump A cannon Field
back in business, Tampa Bay Rays after playing last year
in Tampa at George Emsteinbrenner Field, a minor league ballpark
which really I thought hurt their pitching staff more than
anything else. It played small, a lot of wind, a
lot of carrying the balls in the air going out
(17:51):
of the ballpark where obviously that wasn't happening at the Trup.
But the Trup is back open. The damage has all
been fixed. Actually a lot of renovations to the ballpark.
They use it as an opportunity to fix a lot
of things, updated lot of things.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
So they opened at Home with wind.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
By the way, it was the first game ever on
a local broadcast where they used a drone inside a dome.
Pretty cool. And how about this about the new roof
they have, Joe. Remember the park was open, literally open
with no roof because of the damage there for fifteen months.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
So the new roof was installed.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
It was manufactured in Germany and then it was sent
to China for assembly.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
It's got twenty four panels.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Each panel weighs five thousand pounds and this one now
has a thicker, more resilient fiberglass membrane for better durability
to hold up under conditions. So the drop is open.
I've always thought I had a bad wrap, Joe. Actually
I never mind a ballpark in there. Yeah, it's quirky.
You got those you know, the scaffolding up top when
(18:57):
the ball can hit it at times. But I you know,
I always liked a game in there it fell co
what's your thought on the trap back in business.
Speaker 4 (19:07):
Well, it definitely was a home court advantage. When I
got there, I gamed at the pit and I felt
for us to be successful, we really had to take
advantage of the quirkiness and the sight lines and the
roof itself and not missing any fly balls because of
the roof and just the depth perception. Really everything is
(19:28):
skewed when you walk in there after having played outside.
So from that perspective it did boat as well. I
think we won fifty five games there one season, something
to that effect. So it did play as a home
court advantage. On the other hand, when you go when
you leave the building and go to a quote unquote
a real major league ballpark, was kind of discouraging because
part of the lack of allure there was the fact
(19:48):
that the fan base, I mean great fan base. Everybody's
watching on TV, but very few went to the ballpark.
Is going over the Gandy Bridge or the Howard Franklin
Bridge or the Courtney Campbell all these different ways to
get there becomes problematic at that time of the day
because I come back from Saint Pete golf Course at
(20:09):
about four or five o'clock in the afternoon heading back
up to Tampa, and the Gayety Bridge is like a
parking lot coming over it coming back towards Saint Pete
at that time. And so my point is that traffic wise,
location wise, all that stuff really makes it more difficult
to want to go there on a consistent basis. That's
really what it comes down to. In the city of
Saint Pete. They've done a wonderful job. It's beautiful down there,
(20:32):
and there's a lot to like about it. But to
support a major league city, it's as a major league team,
it's difficult just because of the number of folks there.
And again the traffic is the traffic and traffic patterns
are kind of tough. So having said all that, I
was not a big fan of the trop other than
the fact that we hit play well there and it
was air condition That part of it was good. Our
(20:54):
clubhouse was great, clubhouse attendants were great. When Westy ran
it and Guy Gallagher ran it on the other.
Speaker 5 (21:00):
Side was great.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
We had a lot of little infrastructure stuff that was
above average. It really was, but the building itself not
so cool. And again, the fans, in spite of the
fact that there's many in their rabbit.
Speaker 5 (21:13):
It just didn't show up all the time.
Speaker 4 (21:15):
We clinched the Al East in front of ten thousand
fans one night, one year, and that's that's kind of discouraging.
There's so many different things to evaluate with this. I
happened to watch the beginning last night or yesterday the
new scoreboard. Oh my god, it's like wraps around that
right field area looks pretty good, and the surface itself
looked pretty spectacular. However, I mean, that's like a three
(21:35):
year deal on this, right. I mean, I'm just wondering
that they spent a lot of money, and from what
I understand, it's going to be torn down eventually when
the new ballpark is built, and that's kind of crazy.
But I do believe a lot of insurance money was
involved in the remake there after the hurricane, so maybe
it's going to be a push for the city.
Speaker 5 (21:54):
I don't know. I don't know enough.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I was a fan from the perspective of home court advantage,
the roof of ball shit, the ceiling, and you know,
of course we took advantage of it sometimes sometimes the
other team did. I just preferred neutral in a sense
where if you played better baseball that night. No quirkiness
was going to get in the way of you winning
or losing. That kind of a thing, So long answer, Yes,
(22:17):
it was a great home court advantage, but from the
as a baseball purist perspective, there was a lot that
I did not like about it.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
Yeah, well you mentioned that new scoreboard. There's a new
ribbon board around the ballpark as well, the lighting, a
lot of renovations both clubhouses, by the way, the home
end visiting clubhouses have been fully renovated, larger gym area,
larger lockers. Believe it or not, the place is always
done well in the opinion of players as far as
(22:48):
how they're treated in the both home and visiting clubhouses,
the amenities there.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
The staff always ranks very high.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
So now they have the facilities to match the services
that they've had. They also added, I think it's the
first I've heard of a ballpark having on a speaker
easy speakeasy featuring cocktails, craft cocktails, and a lounge. And
also you probably would like this, Joe. The speakeasy has
a new specialty candy room with nostalgic curated treats for
(23:20):
fans of all ages. So if you like your toutsy
rolls and your Mary Jane's. I guess that's that's where
you hang out, you.
Speaker 5 (23:27):
Said Mary Jane, I was going to go right there. Yes.
Speaker 4 (23:30):
And also was it the Beaman's gum? What was all
the other different little tree kind of stuff?
Speaker 5 (23:34):
Milk dues? There was a big milk dud guy.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
I mean even the Three musketar I used to love
frozen Three Musketeers, frozen Milky Ways, frozen snicker bars. Up
at third base, we always put those candy bars in
the ice cream freezer, so you just reach in there
and get a frozen candy boy. Now, those to me
are still the best. I love it when you almost
broke your teeth eating them. That didn't quite do it.
(23:57):
But frozen candy bars from the past didn't even have
to be on a stick, not even It's just those treesome.
It's not part of my diet these days, however.
Speaker 5 (24:08):
It's like the.
Speaker 4 (24:09):
Frozen chocolate covered banana with and some peanuts on it.
I don't know if there's anything. I used to go
down to the I used to ride my bike through
Newport Beach and they had a frozen chocolate covered banana
stand and so I start up in Long Beach and
that's a pretty good ride. But I felt like I
earned it because I also had a drive back. But
those are the kind of amenities not really expensive in
(24:30):
a sense, actually kind of normal to me. This still
would be the most if you start freezing candy bars
and ballparks and selling them that way, then you'd really
arrived for me.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Dude, you can't be telling me that you like Mary Jane's.
I mean, I go back to when I was a kid.
Oh my goodness, I don't know how. When I was
a kid, of course, you'd go trick or treating, you'd
come home.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
I've got older brothers and younger brothers and.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
Sisters, and we used to trade candies, right and my
older ones, taking advantage of you know, birth order, would
dump all their Mary Janes on me and like grab
my Reese's peanut butter cups. That's like the worst trade
since Brock for Brigolio. So that's that's that's Mary James
for me is like, I don't want these, Why are
(25:15):
you sticking them with me?
Speaker 2 (25:16):
And you're telling me you actually like them?
Speaker 4 (25:18):
Well, yeah, I just you just put them in your
mouth to let them kind of dissolve, no question. Now,
lesten go back to the Reese's stuff, of course, but
recently you've been reading all about the fact that Hershey's
bringing back I guess the original recipes. One of the
Reese family members from the past was complaining about the
fact that they were kind of deluding the recipe and
(25:41):
the result wasn't nearly as good of a product. And
now all of a sudden, they're kind of reverting back.
I guess, so that's a good thing. But yes, that's
another thing. Frozen peanut butter cups, tasty cakes, frozen tasty cakes.
If you really want to make all this stuff taste better,
put it in the freezer first.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Sounds like good advice.
Speaker 5 (25:58):
I like that.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
Let's move on to injuries, Joe, because it again it's
early in the season, but man, I'm especially looking at
some big names.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
Juan Soto goes on the ILF, and that's with a
cap injury.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
They're hoping that's only two or three weeks. The same
with Mookie Betts and his oblique with the Dodgers. They're
hoping that's not an extended period. You've got Justin Verlander,
who's all set to make his Tiger's re debut.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
He's out with a hip injury. Again. They hope that's
something that's not big.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
Starting pitchers, you've got Matthew Boyd left by step strain.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
I mentioned, Johann Oviedo right elbow strain.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
He's going to see doctor Keith Meister, which is you know,
like when you get a piece of mail from the irs,
you know before you open it up, you're like, this
is not good. But the big one for me is
Hunter Brown, who you know could win a cy Young
certainly was in the running last year and was been
lights out his first two starts this year.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
He's getting his shoulder checked out.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
Of all those injuries, Joe, I think that's the most
significant one because I still like this Houston team, but
without the ace front that rotation, I think they look
a lot different.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Give me your take on some of these injuries.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
You can pick anyone you want that may stand out
this early, that may have a big effect.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
Two things, I really believe all teams should avoid any
timeline when they speak about an injury, they try to
soften it up. We'd expected to be two or three
weeks whenever I had to reveal an injury would say,
there's no finish there's no finish line here. Okay, when
when the guy's well, when biology takes place, then then
we'll be back on the field.
Speaker 5 (27:32):
He's going to be fine.
Speaker 4 (27:33):
So whenever I hear timelines being given, I always cringe
just a little bit because some many times it doesn't
work out that way. Calf Soto calf like Trout a
couple of years ago, had that calf that kept him out.
I mean, my god, he was kind of like half walking.
I mean when I say jogging, that's like an overstatement.
It was primarily a fast walk going from second to
(27:55):
third to hand his helmet to butter Brian Butterfield at
third base, and all of a sudden, man, he grabbed
his leg and it was his calf, and that thing
went on forever. The calves can be really tricky, man.
And of course the shoulder with Brown's got to be
something to be concerned about. Your right opening up that
irs piece of mail always concerning. But I'm miss thinking
(28:15):
with these calves and legs stuff. Man, I've you know,
been my meager existence. You know, I've had leg problems
and they get they become chronic. And he's getting he's
not old, but he's gotten older. He plays a lot.
So out of everything I heard, the one I'm paying
attention to it would be would be Soto in his calf.
I just think that sometimes those can be lingering and
(28:38):
they really can't afford to luci him for a long
period of time. You know, Brown's good and everything. I
get all that, but I still believe, you know, the
Calvary could come in there and hold on to Fort
for a bit. I don't know anybody could hold down
the Mets Fort if he's not present in that lineup.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
So that would be the one to me that I.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Hope they're right that it's a two to three week gig.
But my advice is always never put a finish line.
Never never give the press, the media, the fan base
any kind of time frame, because when it's not met,
then it really becomes kind of difficult having to explain
it constantly, and that's where expectations and disappointment set in.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
I like that.
Speaker 3 (29:16):
That's a great point and a good point on Soto
as well.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
I do agree with you on those calf injuries.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
They don't sound like a big deal, but they certainly
can be. And I know guys if they've had calf
problems in the past, then you start worrying about scar
tissue there. It tends to be an injury that repeats itself,
that can jump back again. I don't know what your
experience has been with those calf injuries, Joe, but I
(29:42):
think we tended to dismiss them. They can wind up
being more lingering than some of the other injuries. I
should have mentioned as well too. Alejandra Kirk, the catcher
for the Blue Jays. He's having thumb surgery. Not sure
yet if he needs a pin in that thumb or not,
but you're looking anywhere between four to eight weeks.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
That is huge.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Just I think he's so important both receiving and especially
on the offensive side.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
You mentioned earlier.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
If you can get offense out of the catching position
and they have, that's a bonus PLA Jay is definitely
gonna miss Alejandro Kirk.
Speaker 5 (30:15):
Yeah, I love this guy.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
Thought he's so he's the ampathetical looking athlete, right, that's
no slam. I mean, I've had some really good players
that in our body beautiful, like Benji Molina was in
that category. Benji was a very good offensive catcher as
he grew into that position as he got his opportunities,
and Kirk is the same way. The guy's as big
(30:40):
with the bat.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
I mean he did.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
Anybody makes adjustment. Benja Milino was one of the best
low ball hitters I've ever seen. I just used to
yelling and from the dug got down where you're good,
down where you're good, really looked down whenever he took
a pitch for it that was a called a low strike, and.
Speaker 5 (30:55):
He would upset, be upset me. I would get upset.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
It's like, listen, man's that's down in the middle for you.
Speaker 5 (31:00):
I don't want to go off on.
Speaker 4 (31:01):
A tangent, but yeah, there's guys like Kirk and the
Benji Molina. Benji was as important to the Angels winning
the World Series as anybody in two thousand and two.
So guys like this, it's hard when you miss those
kind of dudes right there. That's the kind of stuff
that'll sneak up on you all of a sudden. The record,
all of a sudden takes a little bit of a tumble.
They're hard to replace. Catching position is a hard one replacement.
(31:24):
You got multiple good catchers. You're really fortunate. So yeah,
I would really watch that one to and see what
that does with the blue Jays in the short term.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Well, Joe, I mentioned I had some news for you
about a couple of your old haunts I mentioned in
the trop Back in business and then take a quick break.
But I'm gonna have to break some bad news to
you as well about another one of your old haunts.
So buckle up, the bad news is about to come
right after this. Welcome back to the Book of Joe. Joe,
(32:05):
I'm not sure if you saw this news. It happened
just last month, only a few weeks ago. Boulder, Colorado.
The dark Horse is closed. Yes, you saw that. I
was actually interviewed. Because of that.
Speaker 4 (32:19):
My cousin at least lives there in Boulder at last,
Rick and back. I used to hang out at her
house with my uncle Rick and Ted.
Speaker 5 (32:26):
Beck in the day.
Speaker 4 (32:28):
She contacted me because she knew this young gal that
was doing a story on it. So I'm quoted extensively
in the story about the dark Horse. Yes, it's upsetting,
it's wrong. It's one of the finest institutions. I've ever
hung out two o'clock in the morning and would listen
to funeral for a friend come on about one forty
(32:49):
five every night. I mean, great sound system blasting Manny
crestbo sitting up on a barber's chair on this little stage.
Yet with this paraphernalia, they're like one of the first
places that would hang everything from the ceiling, like sleds,
like Santa Claus sleds, traffic lights, all kinds of stuff
were suspended from the ceiling.
Speaker 5 (33:08):
I mean you'd walk to the.
Speaker 4 (33:09):
Bathroom and there'd be a finger on the girl's door
pointing towards the man's room, and you'd get confused, like,
which is the right where am I supposed to go?
Because after a couple Chevis regals for sixty nine sets
of pop, you'd choose the wrong door sometimes. But it
was the coolest place. Man Love the Horse. That is very,
very sad.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
They had people lined up for like forty five minutes
to an hour, almost like a viewing at a funeral,
to just say goodbye to the Dark Horse. Once word
went out that it is closing, it's going to be demolished,
going to build a mixed use specificity with some housing
and entertainment and whatnot. But it certainly meant a lot
(33:51):
to a lot of people over many years. I guess, Joey,
you did a really good job describing the inside.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
It was very welcoming, Homie.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
I guess a lot of memories for people, you know,
the way that it touches people.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
And I guess they did have at one point twenty
five cent beers. Is that right?
Speaker 4 (34:10):
That they had sixty nights Well six sixty nine cent
well drinks and it was all high end a well drinks.
Like I said, Chevis Frigal was the Scotch of choice.
And at that time was I twenty one years old.
I think, having just gotten out of lot Yette and
Joe Namat had such an influence on me.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
I was still into the Scotch world.
Speaker 4 (34:27):
I was kind of like Joe was a Johnny Walker
red guy think and I was into doors. But then
eventually got out there and for sixty nine cents, bring
on the Chevis.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
Wow, it was around for fifty one years. Oh my god,
that's pretty amazing. And March fourteenth was the time it
closed for the last time. The dark Horse of Boulder,
Colorado is no more. That was on Was that on
Baseline Road?
Speaker 5 (34:53):
Yeah? And that was yes?
Speaker 4 (34:54):
And now I Wayne Cret Chickie and myself, Stan Jakobowski,
all these guys.
Speaker 5 (34:59):
We would go down there. That's such a great group, man.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
That was a that was we won a national championship
and nineteen seventy five George.
Speaker 5 (35:06):
Fraser was on that team as a pitcher, played west Lake,
played first base. It was.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
It was a wonderful group of guys and I was
a starting catcher. I ended up being a starting catcher
on the team. We beat either Fairbanks or they was Fairbanks.
We beat Floyde Banister and Fairbanks in the NBC World
Series in which it taught Kansas that summer. But that
was our regular hangout. And then Jackabowski and I and
then Rod Boxwaterburger Brad Boksburger's dad. Rod was at USC
(35:33):
at the time. We were in charge of taking care
of the field there. It was called University of called
about a baseball field. They disbanded the program right after that.
I think Herb Brown was the baseball coach there at
the time, But we were in charge of the field
and god.
Speaker 5 (35:46):
Like did they only knew man?
Speaker 4 (35:48):
But you'd be out all night and then you do
that you have a game later that day. God, I
missed summer baseball that's the thing that these guys don't.
These leagues really aren't as prominent as they once were.
You played in Boulder, you played up and down the
slopes there of the Rockies down to twelve Blows, Colorado
Springs up to Boulder into Denver area, all the way
up to Greely, and it was wonderful. Then you go
(36:10):
over to Wichita, you go over to Kansas, you play
Liberal Kansas, Dodge City. Eventually you'd get over to Wichita. God,
I mean you talk about and then at Grand Junction
was also in the group. It was just like, that's
the way to be raised in the game. I really
wish that kids today because you also had a job.
You didn't just go out there and play baseball. You
(36:31):
had to work. Like even Clay Westley, Clay was on
the course truck during the day. He could deliver a
course beard during the day. And then one year we
put up a dog kennel in Arvada and Spike One
was on that group with me. Al Newman was on
that group with me. I'm in charge of this group
of guys putting up this metal building which could have
cut your finger off at any second in Arvada, California
(36:54):
and our paychecks bounced every week. It was wonderful experience.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
So you were in Boulder in nineteen seventy five, because
I think that was the first year the dark Horse opened.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
That's correct, That's correct. We ambushed that place. Man and
Manny Crespall. Like I said, Manny was a guy that
had played in the minor leagues with the Red Sox.
I don't think you made it the big leagues, but
Manny came back because Baldy loved Manny because he had
played there before. It's a place where Bert Hooton pitched
and Jim Gideon pitched. And if you look at the
if you look at the alumni, Eddie Baine of the
(37:26):
Boulder Collegiates, just check out that alumni list, Bobby Horner,
it was it's pretty spectacular group.
Speaker 5 (37:32):
I mean, Tony Gwinny eventually played there.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
Joe Carter we All and I went back to in
nineteen eighty and I was a player coach there with
Jim Deets, who was the head coach at San Diego State,
and I was a player coach on that team.
Speaker 5 (37:43):
We lost.
Speaker 4 (37:43):
Mark Langston was on that I caught Langley that summer.
I mean I have such great memories of that area. Boulder,
Colorado one of my favorite places on Earth. It's a
place that really created life for me. Regarding getting into
professional baseball. I signed her at seventy five, eventually got released,
went back to nineteen eighty, and then got signed again
(38:05):
as a minor league manager and scout, et cetera. So yeah,
whenever you say Boulder Man, my my interior just lights up.
Speaker 5 (38:12):
It was the best I think.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
Did Terry francona play for the Collisians as well?
Speaker 5 (38:16):
I don't know did he? I don't know if Terry dude,
I don't know that. But I'll also tell you this.
Speaker 4 (38:20):
I had of nineteen sixty nine Vobil there for one winter.
It would not go in reverse. So you drive, You
try to drive around Boulder, Colorado in a winter time
with the car that were not going reverse.
Speaker 5 (38:30):
It was very challenging.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
It takes a lot of planning. I would imagine now.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
When you take a date out and you have to
explain it to her. My god not through.
Speaker 3 (38:37):
On the day they closed the Dark Horse and people
were out waiting in line, someone brought a case of
beer and left it outside for people who you know,
could partake of their refreshment since they weren't selling any
more inside. So it's always been that neighborhood place lost
a little bit of history with the close of the
dark Horse. So condolences to the dark Horse. The memories
(39:00):
will always last, Joe. But that brings us to the
close of this episode. Now, this is not the end
of our podcast, just the end of this episode. So
what kind of final words do you have for us today?
Speaker 4 (39:13):
I got two things real quick because I still had
dinner with my brother. My brother Marx has made Easter pie.
I don't know if everybody's aware of Easter pie, but
that's obviously during Easter. The Italian part of my family
than my mom polish, we make Easter pie of ham, sausage,
hard boiled eggs, ricotta, cheese, romano cheese, egg whites, egg yolks,
black pepper, and parson. It is outstanding. It's in the fridge.
(39:34):
I'm looking at it right now. That's going to be
my breakfast. And then if you want more information about that,
right in and we'll get you the exact recipe how
to do it.
Speaker 5 (39:41):
It is.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
It's an acquired taste, but it's the best. And then
moving on from there, just to the thought of the day.
My thoughts were really centered around conviction and maybe, like
right now with the red sauce and whatever your belief
system is to not you always have to remain flexible,
but you have to be convicted to your beliefs. And
I just got that this was pretty good and it
(40:04):
kind of goes in a little bit of a nut circle,
but it takes a different path and I kind of
liked it. Regarding conviction, conviction charisma has nothing to do
with energy. Charisma has nothing to do with energy. It
comes from a clarity of why God that I love that.
It comes from absolute conviction and an ideal bigger than oneself.
(40:24):
It comes from absolute conviction and an ideal bigger than oneself.
I'm just just thinking about things in general, because you know,
even like with social media, people can get knocked off
their ideals ideas because they get land basted with negative
feedback clicks, you know, a negative click as opposed to
positive click. And I think, you know, when it comes
(40:45):
down to conviction, really believing in what you believe in
and being able to explain it plainly and lucively. I
think that's really important. And like I said, sometimes maybe
your convictions are off. I mean, my belief system might
be off, but I got to stay with that while
remaining flexible. Absolute conviction is an idea bigger than one self.
(41:06):
I was just thinking about that today, just looking at
a lot of things, reading a lot of things, a
lot of things going on in the world. Think for yourself,
I guess, is what I'm saying. Think for yourself, Remain flexible,
but know what you believe. And I love that chrisma
has nothing to do with energy, and you know, you
think about that, the charismatic like I was always talk
about the twenty sixteen cubs of being charismatic. But then
(41:26):
the next sentense, it comes from a clarity of why
and the way was we were together there in order
to you know, break the curse, break that one hundred
and eight year old curse, and we did so. I
mean a little bit over the map today starts with
easter pie goes to conviction. But I thought your topics
are great today. So you have me all over the
map and I'm in an RV that's being shaken by
(41:47):
this fifty mine hour wind on the Eastern Atlantic coast
here in Beverly, beach and loving every second of.
Speaker 3 (41:55):
I told you do sound like you're in the artimist,
but I'm glad to hear you're still earth bound for
now anyway.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
But I love that word job. I'm glad you brought
up conviction. It's so important.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
I hear it a lot with pitching, where a pitcher
has to be convicted with a pitch before you throw it.
Speaker 5 (42:09):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (42:09):
But I think especially and I love your reference to
the Red Sox because it's especially important this time of
year for teams that really don't know who they are.
Like I thought, you're sixteen Cubs. You knew exactly who
you were in spring training based on how well the
fifteen season went and that run in the postseason. I
like teams that are convicted. They know who they are,
they know what they are as a team. They're not
(42:31):
trying to establish something. And you know, the Phillies are
a convicted team. The Dodgers, of course, convicted team. The
Yankees are a convicted team. Don't see that yet with
a team like the Red Sox, Oh man, it's a
very valuable thing in any sport. I mean, you know,
Joe and golf, it's huge to be convicted to a shot,
convicted to your putt line. And I think right now
(42:52):
the Red Sox are not a convicted team. They need
to get there pretty quickly. So very appropriate word today.
Speaker 5 (42:58):
And use the word flexible too.
Speaker 4 (43:00):
I mean, I've always thought, like the better teams I've
been affiliate it with going into spring training, it pretty
much knew how this was going to shake out, like
you know, people being in line for a job in
order to make the team or stick with the team.
I've always thought if there was like one, maybe two
real Oak job openings, that would be a lot on
a good team. And that's part of conviction of an
(43:22):
off season. I think you should be able to do
that annually.
Speaker 5 (43:25):
When you have too many.
Speaker 4 (43:26):
Cattle calls or job opportunities in spring training, normally you're
not a really good team. That's my opinion. So while
you're doing all this stuff though, too, you're convicted this
is our team. We like this, we put it together
in November, December, January, whatever, But always remain flexible. The
ability to say I might have been wrong is really important,
(43:49):
and so it's yeah, be convicted in what you're doing.
I want my team to be kind of made up
before I get there. But always that flexibility has to
remain because when you get there, all of a sudden
something might not just smell quite right, and you might
have to literally shift gears.
Speaker 3 (44:05):
Joe, great job and congratulations on living large. Easter pie
for breakfasts in an RV that's right next to the
Atlantic Ocean. Doesn't get any better than that, not even
on the dark side of the moon.
Speaker 4 (44:18):
If we could just post I mean, it almost looks
like the dark side of the moon, if we could
actually post a picture, this would be so cold.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
I'm gonna take a picture.
Speaker 4 (44:24):
I'll send it the Bence and if anybody wants to
see what we but this looks like it is that spectacular.
Speaker 5 (44:30):
It truly is.
Speaker 2 (44:31):
See you next time, See your brother.
Speaker 5 (44:32):
Bye.
Speaker 1 (44:41):
The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Hey thereon Welcome Back.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
It's The Book of Joe Podcast with Me, Tom Berducci
and of course Joe Madden and Joe was a momentous
day in humankind.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
It took fifty three years, but what.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
Pink Floyd called the Dark Side of the Moon, we
now have seen Artemis forty minutes of touring the Dark
Side of the Moon out of pocket with Houston on
their own. I can only imagine what that must have
been like with no radio communication. But yeah, Pink Floyd
called it first, but we finally got there. The Dark
Side of the Moon has been seen.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Yeah, I saw the photographs in the New York Post today.
Missed it last would actually occurred. But it is pretty phenomenal.
And you're right, it's got to be unsettling, right, I
mean everybody, not just probably the least unsettling for the
actual astronauts because they're fine. It's everybody else that are
trying to stay in contact with them. Probably we freaked
out a little bit more than they do. They're professionals,
(01:15):
they're trained to do it. Then they put their eyeballs
on it for the first time. That's you know, they
talk about may all your surrealisms come true. That's the
prime example right there.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
You sound a little different this week, Joe. Are you
up in Artemis as well, Claiose.
Speaker 4 (01:29):
If you look out the window, it looks like I'm
in Artemis at artist We can't we don't have video,
but I am in my RV on Beverly Beach, right
near Flagler Beach by the way. We had a great
dinner last night at a place called The Next Door.
I walk in there and not obviously but never fails.
The GM there is from Chicago, so we had a
(01:50):
great conversation. Bought us a nice bottle of duck corn
cab when he was there. My brother and his wife, Mary,
cousin Joe and Sally, his wife, and of course my nephew.
It's a beautiful setting. But to have you the RV
this this particular place that's called Beverly Beach RB Resort.
You literally parked the nose of your vehicle right on
the water, by the way.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
I'm guessing you remember distinctly when Dark Side of the
Moon came out Pink Floyd's album nineteen seventy three, a
concept album. I don't even know if such things are
made anymore, Joe, But back in the seventies, that was
a thing, and that was at the height of it.
Speaker 2 (02:26):
You big Dark Side of the Moon fan.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Yes, huge Pink Floyd fan. How could you not be
a huge Pink Floyd fan? And for these astronauts to
actually experienced the other side the dark side of the moon,
when my thought was, may all your surrealisms come true?
I mean, I would think that the people on the ground,
that people in charge of their safety, probably a lot
more nervous about that downtime than the actual astronauts. I
(02:49):
would imagine they were so excited about what they were saying.
For the first time for anybody had to exceed any
kind of consternation on their parts. Brother, It's just it's
incredible that we're able to do these kind of things.
It's kind of neat that we're going back, turning back
to clock and really recreating all of these moments that
I think was sixty nine. Right when the landing occurred,
(03:12):
I was I think I was sitting with my pop
in his living room watching a late night TV show,
What have Been Johnny Carson. I'm not sure what time
of the day it was, Yeah, it's pretty neat that
this happens. In a tribute to Pink Flay for pointing
this out years ago.
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Well, we need to talk about a baseball team that
seems to be lost, if you will, on the dark
side of baseball's moon, and that is the Boston Red Sox.
I know, Joe, everybody likes to say it's early, it's early,
and it certainly is. I mean, we have such a
small sample side size to go with here, but the
(03:46):
Boston Red Sox are off to a two and eight start.
Now we know the season is one hundred and sixty
two games, so it's really early. But the fact is,
you won't find many good teams that start two and eight.
In fact, in the history of baseball, in full seasons,
no half seasons, or truncated seasons, there have been only
(04:10):
nine teams that started two and eight and made the playoffs.
And the last of those nine teams was your twenty
eleven Tampa Bay Rays started two and eight, wound up
winning ninety one games and going to the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
So listen, you.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
Can tell me that the ninety one Twins, the seventy
seven Yankees, the thirty five Tigers, the nineteen fourteen Miracle
Braves all won the World Series. After starting two and eight.
The season far from over for the Red Sox. But
the fact is, Joe, that's a small group of teams.
Only nine teams made the playoffs after starting two and eight.
(04:49):
Early indications are right now, the Boston Red Sox are
not a very good team. Tell me what you see.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
Yeah, I mean I was paying. We're all shocked by that.
It's just like they've been sloppy. You know, it's like
it's incredible. You would think that this and Alex theair,
that they're going to be on top of their game
all the time. And you said it's early, and it's
just they're just not playing up to the standards that
we thought they're going to. And I still believe that
they're going to now I could just speak for the
(05:17):
Rays of yesteryear. I remember that and we've talked about it.
That we were flying in Chicago and I had a
toast on the airplane. I went up front, I took
the microphone away, and I announced, and I put everybody's
shot at shar Bay Whiskey walked around, and then I.
Speaker 5 (05:34):
Saluted the.
Speaker 4 (05:36):
Best one in seven or two and I think it
was one and seven at that time team in the
history of a Major League baseball That was my toast
because I thought we were a lot better than that.
I thought, you know, we're actually pretty good eventually. That's
that trip we were playing Chicago. It's if you remember
the catch Sam Fold made in a right field corner
at that Chemiski Park whatever they were calling it at
that time, was one of the most fabulous catches you
(05:59):
ever want to see. But that kind of a play
got us inspired. I thought might even have been the
time when I kicked out all the umpiring crew. I
don't even know if that was or not, but yes,
it happens, man, and I've been part of some dramatic
comebacks with the Rays when we were down like what seven,
eight or nine games in September and caught the Red Sox,
(06:19):
passed the Red Sox and one on that the most
faithful night in history of Major League Baseball. So stuff
could be done. I know it's unusual, but the Red
Sox have the talent pool to pull this off. I
believe they have the right manager to do it with. Also,
even regardless of history and how vague it is and
normally doesn't happen. I still believe they have an opportunity
(06:41):
to come back from this. There's no doubt about that.
I agree with you. Listen early on. They've actually hit okay.
I wouldn't say they've hit great. They're sort of in
the middle of the pack offensively. You do have some guys,
as happens slow out of the gate, Story.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Mayor Durban, all under two hundred.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
My concern with Boston Joe would be that I look
at their lineup. I see a lot of complimentary type hitters.
I don't see those aircraft carriers. I don't see the
thirty to forty home run dude in the middle of
the order. You know, Roman Anthony is a terrific offensive player.
He is He's the focal point. He's the leadoff hitter
(07:20):
for the team. He's the best hitter of the team.
He's hitting leadoff. So I think there's some questions about
how much right handed power they have specifically, and how
many runs they can produce. And I look at the rotation.
Garrett Crochet is the dude's an ace. He's a workhorse.
He's a cy young winner waiting to happen. But you
tell me who's their number two between you know, Sonny Gray,
(07:42):
Brian Bao, you know Oviedo just went on the il
Ranger Suarez, you know, good pitchers, But again, where is
the high end talent. I think it's a group that
alex Core is going to have to melt together to
get the best out of them.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
But I don't see a lot of those elite players
in the rotation or in the lineup.
Speaker 5 (08:03):
Isn't that intention though? I mean they're of the ILK.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
Yeah, you know that they like the platoon advantage kind
of stuff, so they do, like, I believe, complimentary players,
even though obviously they do have a lot of dough
up there, and you would think they could go out
there and buy the people that they want. I think
they did buy the people that they want. I think
they like it this way. I don't know exactly what's
going on in their minor league system, but platoon advantage
(08:27):
is one of the buzz phrases that goes throughout major
league front offices these days, and they really want that
on it. It's a less expensive way of building a team,
and they do like the idea that let these primarily
more than anything. Again, I just have to be patient,
but I think it's an intentional build the way it's
setting up for them, and I'll just I need to
(08:48):
start looking more closely. But I do is I watch
the videos in the morning, and you know, you can't
really ascertain a whole lot from that. However, you do
see some stuff, Like I said, the biggest thing, I
saw some sloppy stuff. They had a nice lead I
can't remember against too, and then just gave it up
through some just bad execution offensively and defensively. Totally, but
just give him a little time. But I think everything
(09:09):
they do is intentional, regardless of how the amount of
money that they have.
Speaker 5 (09:12):
I think they prefer the ability to.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
Tink on a daily basis and attempt to gain a
platoon advantage.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Well, you know how things work in Boston too, you know,
narratives can build. You know they're chanting sell the team
and a loss of the padres on Sunday. It's important
for that team a little more than most teams to
get off to a good start and to sort of
end the negativity around the team.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Because that can build so quickly. In Boston.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
One of the guys who I think has been miscast
a little bit when I talked about complimentary players having
to pick up bigger roles. Is Wilson Contreras. You had
him with the Cubs. He's a very good offensive player.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
We know that.
Speaker 3 (09:49):
Is he a middle of the order run producer? I
think ideally probably not. He's probably a five or six
hole hitter and do his thing that way. But they're
very interesting. The other night against Milwaukee where he's hit
by Brandon Woodruff. Now he's been going at it against
the Brewers for years, and he took exception to a
pitch that they needed replay to confirm, and they actually
(10:10):
didn't confirm. They just had the call stand to see
if the ball actually hit his hand or not. So
it wasn't like he was really plunked, and if you
look at the pitch, it was pretty darn close to
the strike zone actually, you know, he likes to get
on top of the plate and dive into the ball,
and the Brewers loved to move him off the plate,
but he after the game, he complained this was the
(10:31):
twenty fourth time he's been hit by Brewers pitching. Again,
he plays in the Division, has been for years. Sees
them a lot, and teams do want to move him
off the plate, and he said, next time he's gonna
take somebody out. He was very hot after the game.
You know, that's the way he plays. He plays with
a chip on his shoulder. It brings out the best
in him. But man, I know he's frustrated. But that
(10:53):
pitch was barely barely nicking him and barely inside. So
keep an eye on that for the rest of this
series between Milwaukee and Boston.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
But Contres does give you that fire, you know that.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Joe again, I just I'm not sure whether he's the
guy you want hitting in the middle of the lineup.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
I think your evaluation is really good.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
And on top of that, his brother's with Milwaukee, right,
So what's going on with all of that?
Speaker 2 (11:16):
I thought he liked, Yeah, he's behind the plate, brother
is right.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Yeah, yeah, his brother's actually keeping him from getting after
Brandon Woodruff.
Speaker 5 (11:24):
It's kind of interesting.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
First of all, you're right, I mean, I Wilson and
I had a great relationship. I really did. I gave
him a big hug before every game. I would reinforce
him what I thought of him. Really, my plan with
him was not to catch him more than three days
in a row until the end of the year like
August and we went up to four days in row
and critical series. That's the part that I still I
don't quite get the fact that he was forced out
(11:47):
from behind the plate. You know, I still think his
greatest start. I don't even know if he would ever
want to again. I don't even know if his body
would have held up. But I liked him behind the plate.
I know there's issues with you know, the frame world,
but this guy can really throw.
Speaker 5 (11:59):
He is a rock.
Speaker 4 (12:00):
He's aggressive, he's very sturdy, and then if you at
that offense behind the plate as opposed to first base,
it's even more attractive. But he's not You're right, there's times,
you know, I hit him middle of the order like that,
maybe like you're saying five six, I actually let him
off a couple of times to try to get him going,
or if he was in a nice streak getting on base.
Sin is is he's the fireburns hot within him. He's
(12:27):
quite a competitor. He does love to win. He's a
tond of guy man that you got to get in
front of. Like if you see things are going a
little bit sideways, he's getting too emotional, you got to
get in there and and really try to bring him
back on board. It's just listen, the guy grew up
in Caracas. I mean, he's just you know. Part of
that is being a product of your environment, how you
grew up in which you grew up around. And there's
(12:48):
there's guys in the States that have grown up in
difficult situations that reflect that also. So I've always respected
and admired him just where he came from and how
he got where he's at. And when you just sit down,
like you've talked to him, really respectful young man. When
you sit down have a good conversation with him, he
becomes very logical and you're able to reason with them,
and it's good. But then you go to this emotional
(13:10):
side of his being, which, again, like I said, it's
in brand and there's nothing all he can do about it,
and it's probably why he's a major League baseball player.
So yeah, it'll be interesting to see if I'm the
bruised he heads up, unless they do want a good
old fashioned brawl, because if he said he's gonna do it,
I don't doubt that he will if in fact they
do hit him again.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
Well he did later on the games slid at the
second base on a double play with his spikes high
and actually got a piece of Hamilton at second base
lamp on the leg toward the uniform, probably broke some
skin as well. So it's not over. We'll see. But
I do think Joe, that sometimes you have to cast
aside its early narrative and talk about some urgency in April.
(13:50):
Nobody wants to play with urgency in April, but you know,
I look at the way the Braves last year started
zero to seven, the way the Baltimore Orioles were pretty
much out of it by the end of the month.
Good teams are teams that we think are supposed to
be good. I think they do face a little more
urgency in April when they get off to these slow starts,
and the Red Sox later on this month will close
the month with night straight games against the Yankees, the Orioles, and.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
The Blue Jays.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
It suddenly has become an important month for Boston, and
not so much that they have to go on some
kind of a run, but you have to avoid that
really bad month where you.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Lose the margin for error.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Every team, I think has an one month where they
can be under five hundred and survive it.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
But if that month is.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
April, you lose your margin of error and playing uphill,
and especially in that American League East, We're not there yet.
But I would say, Joe, I don't want to get
your take on this. For a team like Red Sox.
Like the Red Sox, we do have high expectations. How
important is it for them there to nip this thing
in the bud quickly?
Speaker 4 (14:51):
But the Jogi segets you can get late early something
like that. Wasn't that accurate? And yeah, they do need
to nip it in the butt list And we've talked
about this.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
You say, left field at the Yankee Stadium, it gets
late early.
Speaker 5 (15:03):
Late early.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
It also applies to a major league season. Yeah, they
it's it's so nice to get off to a decent
start so that you can absorb the bad moments. It's
not as obvious when you're as a hitter. You go like,
some guys have one for twenty two's or you know,
one for twenty fives early in the season. My god,
you look up at the board and you always see
(15:24):
a bad number. Relief pitchers have one or two bad
outings early on My gother all for the first half
of the season, they try to bring that back down
to respectable numbers. And then with the team that starts
out like that. As from a standing perspective, I would
always try to in my mind's eyes the manager, I
want to gain one game per week, getting back towards
five hundred and then eventually getting over it. And it's
(15:46):
a real mindset. It's it's a mind trick. You got
to you actually have to pretty much trick yourself into.
It's got to be bought into by the whole group.
Otherwise it gets it does fester, and it gets worse.
But I always I did the one game a week plan.
What I used to do. I would keep track of
our record on a weekly basis. That would be important
to me. What's our record for the week, just as
(16:06):
a benchmark. And then absolutely at the end of this month,
I want do we have a winning month?
Speaker 5 (16:11):
And by how many? You're right?
Speaker 4 (16:13):
When you get below five hundred during the month, it's
really a bad thought and feeling. So I would try
to break things down for me and then you know,
emphasize wise without really being signing any alarms with the team,
with the players, I would just try to, you know,
maybe apply a little bit more whatever thought or urgency
(16:34):
in a sense conversationally without being too obvious, because we
really need to get back on track. This can go
sideway to the point where it is difficult. It's easier
to absorb that two and eight moment during the middle
of the season after a good start, as opposed at
the beginning of the season. Psychologically again, you look at
the darn scoreboard, man, and it's there right.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
In front of your face.
Speaker 4 (16:55):
You don't like anything about it, and that's where guys
start to press.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
We're going to take a quick break on the Book
of Joe. When we get back. I've got some new
for you, Joe on two of your old haunts. One
is good news, one is bad news. We'll get to
those right after this. On the Book of Joe.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
Welcome back to the Book of Joe.
Speaker 3 (17:29):
The Trump is open, mister Madden Trump A cannon Field
back in business, Tampa Bay Rays after playing last year
in Tampa at George Emsteinbrenner Field, a minor league ballpark
which really I thought hurt their pitching staff more than
anything else. It played small, a lot of wind, a
lot of carrying the balls in the air going out
(17:51):
of the ballpark where obviously that wasn't happening at the Trup.
But the Trup is back open. The damage has all
been fixed. Actually a lot of renovations to the ballpark.
They use it as an opportunity to fix a lot
of things, updated lot of things.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
So they opened at Home with wind.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
By the way, it was the first game ever on
a local broadcast where they used a drone inside a dome.
Pretty cool. And how about this about the new roof
they have, Joe. Remember the park was open, literally open
with no roof because of the damage there for fifteen months.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
So the new roof was installed.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
It was manufactured in Germany and then it was sent
to China for assembly.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
It's got twenty four panels.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
Each panel weighs five thousand pounds and this one now
has a thicker, more resilient fiberglass membrane for better durability
to hold up under conditions. So the drop is open.
I've always thought I had a bad wrap, Joe. Actually
I never mind a ballpark in there. Yeah, it's quirky.
You got those you know, the scaffolding up top when
(18:57):
the ball can hit it at times. But I you know,
I always liked a game in there it fell co
what's your thought on the trap back in business.
Speaker 4 (19:07):
Well, it definitely was a home court advantage. When I
got there, I gamed at the pit and I felt
for us to be successful, we really had to take
advantage of the quirkiness and the sight lines and the
roof itself and not missing any fly balls because of
the roof and just the depth perception. Really everything is
(19:28):
skewed when you walk in there after having played outside.
So from that perspective it did boat as well. I
think we won fifty five games there one season, something
to that effect. So it did play as a home
court advantage. On the other hand, when you go when
you leave the building and go to a quote unquote
a real major league ballpark, was kind of discouraging because
part of the lack of allure there was the fact
(19:48):
that the fan base, I mean great fan base. Everybody's
watching on TV, but very few went to the ballpark.
Is going over the Gandy Bridge or the Howard Franklin
Bridge or the Courtney Campbell all these different ways to
get there becomes problematic at that time of the day
because I come back from Saint Pete golf Course at
(20:09):
about four or five o'clock in the afternoon heading back
up to Tampa, and the Gayety Bridge is like a
parking lot coming over it coming back towards Saint Pete
at that time. And so my point is that traffic wise,
location wise, all that stuff really makes it more difficult
to want to go there on a consistent basis. That's
really what it comes down to. In the city of
Saint Pete. They've done a wonderful job. It's beautiful down there,
(20:32):
and there's a lot to like about it. But to
support a major league city, it's as a major league team,
it's difficult just because of the number of folks there.
And again the traffic is the traffic and traffic patterns
are kind of tough. So having said all that, I
was not a big fan of the trop other than
the fact that we hit play well there and it
was air condition That part of it was good. Our
(20:54):
clubhouse was great, clubhouse attendants were great. When Westy ran
it and Guy Gallagher ran it on the other.
Speaker 5 (21:00):
Side was great.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
We had a lot of little infrastructure stuff that was
above average. It really was, but the building itself not
so cool. And again, the fans, in spite of the
fact that there's many in their rabbit.
Speaker 5 (21:13):
It just didn't show up all the time.
Speaker 4 (21:15):
We clinched the Al East in front of ten thousand
fans one night, one year, and that's that's kind of discouraging.
There's so many different things to evaluate with this. I
happened to watch the beginning last night or yesterday the
new scoreboard. Oh my god, it's like wraps around that
right field area looks pretty good, and the surface itself
looked pretty spectacular. However, I mean, that's like a three
(21:35):
year deal on this, right. I mean, I'm just wondering
that they spent a lot of money, and from what
I understand, it's going to be torn down eventually when
the new ballpark is built, and that's kind of crazy.
But I do believe a lot of insurance money was
involved in the remake there after the hurricane, so maybe
it's going to be a push for the city.
Speaker 5 (21:54):
I don't know. I don't know enough.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I was a fan from the perspective of home court advantage,
the roof of ball shit, the ceiling, and you know,
of course we took advantage of it sometimes sometimes the
other team did. I just preferred neutral in a sense
where if you played better baseball that night. No quirkiness
was going to get in the way of you winning
or losing. That kind of a thing, So long answer, Yes,
(22:17):
it was a great home court advantage, but from the
as a baseball purist perspective, there was a lot that
I did not like about it.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
Yeah, well you mentioned that new scoreboard. There's a new
ribbon board around the ballpark as well, the lighting, a
lot of renovations both clubhouses, by the way, the home
end visiting clubhouses have been fully renovated, larger gym area,
larger lockers. Believe it or not, the place is always
done well in the opinion of players as far as
(22:48):
how they're treated in the both home and visiting clubhouses,
the amenities there.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
The staff always ranks very high.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
So now they have the facilities to match the services
that they've had. They also added, I think it's the
first I've heard of a ballpark having on a speaker
easy speakeasy featuring cocktails, craft cocktails, and a lounge. And
also you probably would like this, Joe. The speakeasy has
a new specialty candy room with nostalgic curated treats for
(23:20):
fans of all ages. So if you like your toutsy
rolls and your Mary Jane's. I guess that's that's where
you hang out, you.
Speaker 5 (23:27):
Said Mary Jane, I was going to go right there. Yes.
Speaker 4 (23:30):
And also was it the Beaman's gum? What was all
the other different little tree kind of stuff?
Speaker 5 (23:34):
Milk dues? There was a big milk dud guy.
Speaker 4 (23:36):
I mean even the Three musketar I used to love
frozen Three Musketeers, frozen Milky Ways, frozen snicker bars. Up
at third base, we always put those candy bars in
the ice cream freezer, so you just reach in there
and get a frozen candy boy. Now, those to me
are still the best. I love it when you almost
broke your teeth eating them. That didn't quite do it.
(23:57):
But frozen candy bars from the past didn't even have
to be on a stick, not even It's just those treesome.
It's not part of my diet these days, however.
Speaker 5 (24:08):
It's like the.
Speaker 4 (24:09):
Frozen chocolate covered banana with and some peanuts on it.
I don't know if there's anything. I used to go
down to the I used to ride my bike through
Newport Beach and they had a frozen chocolate covered banana
stand and so I start up in Long Beach and
that's a pretty good ride. But I felt like I
earned it because I also had a drive back. But
those are the kind of amenities not really expensive in
(24:30):
a sense, actually kind of normal to me. This still
would be the most if you start freezing candy bars
and ballparks and selling them that way, then you'd really
arrived for me.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Dude, you can't be telling me that you like Mary Jane's.
I mean, I go back to when I was a kid.
Oh my goodness, I don't know how. When I was
a kid, of course, you'd go trick or treating, you'd
come home.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
I've got older brothers and younger brothers and.
Speaker 3 (24:53):
Sisters, and we used to trade candies, right and my
older ones, taking advantage of you know, birth order, would
dump all their Mary Janes on me and like grab
my Reese's peanut butter cups. That's like the worst trade
since Brock for Brigolio. So that's that's that's Mary James
for me is like, I don't want these, Why are
(25:15):
you sticking them with me?
Speaker 2 (25:16):
And you're telling me you actually like them?
Speaker 4 (25:18):
Well, yeah, I just you just put them in your
mouth to let them kind of dissolve, no question. Now,
lesten go back to the Reese's stuff, of course, but
recently you've been reading all about the fact that Hershey's
bringing back I guess the original recipes. One of the
Reese family members from the past was complaining about the
fact that they were kind of deluding the recipe and
(25:41):
the result wasn't nearly as good of a product. And
now all of a sudden, they're kind of reverting back.
I guess, so that's a good thing. But yes, that's
another thing. Frozen peanut butter cups, tasty cakes, frozen tasty cakes.
If you really want to make all this stuff taste better,
put it in the freezer first.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
Sounds like good advice.
Speaker 5 (25:58):
I like that.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
Let's move on to injuries, Joe, because it again it's
early in the season, but man, I'm especially looking at
some big names.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
Juan Soto goes on the ILF, and that's with a
cap injury.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
They're hoping that's only two or three weeks. The same
with Mookie Betts and his oblique with the Dodgers. They're
hoping that's not an extended period. You've got Justin Verlander,
who's all set to make his Tiger's re debut.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
He's out with a hip injury. Again. They hope that's
something that's not big.
Speaker 3 (26:27):
Starting pitchers, you've got Matthew Boyd left by step strain.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
I mentioned, Johann Oviedo right elbow strain.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
He's going to see doctor Keith Meister, which is you know,
like when you get a piece of mail from the irs,
you know before you open it up, you're like, this
is not good. But the big one for me is
Hunter Brown, who you know could win a cy Young
certainly was in the running last year and was been
lights out his first two starts this year.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
He's getting his shoulder checked out.
Speaker 3 (26:56):
Of all those injuries, Joe, I think that's the most
significant one because I still like this Houston team, but
without the ace front that rotation, I think they look
a lot different.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Give me your take on some of these injuries.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
You can pick anyone you want that may stand out
this early, that may have a big effect.
Speaker 4 (27:14):
Two things, I really believe all teams should avoid any
timeline when they speak about an injury, they try to
soften it up. We'd expected to be two or three
weeks whenever I had to reveal an injury would say,
there's no finish there's no finish line here. Okay, when
when the guy's well, when biology takes place, then then
we'll be back on the field.
Speaker 5 (27:32):
He's going to be fine.
Speaker 4 (27:33):
So whenever I hear timelines being given, I always cringe
just a little bit because some many times it doesn't
work out that way. Calf Soto calf like Trout a
couple of years ago, had that calf that kept him out.
I mean, my god, he was kind of like half walking.
I mean when I say jogging, that's like an overstatement.
It was primarily a fast walk going from second to
(27:55):
third to hand his helmet to butter Brian Butterfield at
third base, and all of a sudden, man, he grabbed
his leg and it was his calf, and that thing
went on forever. The calves can be really tricky, man.
And of course the shoulder with Brown's got to be
something to be concerned about. Your right opening up that
irs piece of mail always concerning. But I'm miss thinking
(28:15):
with these calves and legs stuff. Man, I've you know,
been my meager existence. You know, I've had leg problems
and they get they become chronic. And he's getting he's
not old, but he's gotten older. He plays a lot.
So out of everything I heard, the one I'm paying
attention to it would be would be Soto in his calf.
I just think that sometimes those can be lingering and
(28:38):
they really can't afford to luci him for a long
period of time. You know, Brown's good and everything. I
get all that, but I still believe, you know, the
Calvary could come in there and hold on to Fort
for a bit. I don't know anybody could hold down
the Mets Fort if he's not present in that lineup.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
So that would be the one to me that I.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Hope they're right that it's a two to three week gig.
But my advice is always never put a finish line.
Never never give the press, the media, the fan base
any kind of time frame, because when it's not met,
then it really becomes kind of difficult having to explain
it constantly, and that's where expectations and disappointment set in.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
I like that.
Speaker 3 (29:16):
That's a great point and a good point on Soto
as well.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
I do agree with you on those calf injuries.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
They don't sound like a big deal, but they certainly
can be. And I know guys if they've had calf
problems in the past, then you start worrying about scar
tissue there. It tends to be an injury that repeats itself,
that can jump back again. I don't know what your
experience has been with those calf injuries, Joe, but I
(29:42):
think we tended to dismiss them. They can wind up
being more lingering than some of the other injuries. I
should have mentioned as well too. Alejandra Kirk, the catcher
for the Blue Jays. He's having thumb surgery. Not sure
yet if he needs a pin in that thumb or not,
but you're looking anywhere between four to eight weeks.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
That is huge.
Speaker 3 (30:04):
Just I think he's so important both receiving and especially
on the offensive side.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
You mentioned earlier.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
If you can get offense out of the catching position
and they have, that's a bonus PLA Jay is definitely
gonna miss Alejandro Kirk.
Speaker 5 (30:15):
Yeah, I love this guy.
Speaker 4 (30:17):
Thought he's so he's the ampathetical looking athlete, right, that's
no slam. I mean, I've had some really good players
that in our body beautiful, like Benji Molina was in
that category. Benji was a very good offensive catcher as
he grew into that position as he got his opportunities,
and Kirk is the same way. The guy's as big
(30:40):
with the bat.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
I mean he did.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
Anybody makes adjustment. Benja Milino was one of the best
low ball hitters I've ever seen. I just used to
yelling and from the dug got down where you're good,
down where you're good, really looked down whenever he took
a pitch for it that was a called a low strike, and.
Speaker 5 (30:55):
He would upset, be upset me. I would get upset.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
It's like, listen, man's that's down in the middle for you.
Speaker 5 (31:00):
I don't want to go off on.
Speaker 4 (31:01):
A tangent, but yeah, there's guys like Kirk and the
Benji Molina. Benji was as important to the Angels winning
the World Series as anybody in two thousand and two.
So guys like this, it's hard when you miss those
kind of dudes right there. That's the kind of stuff
that'll sneak up on you all of a sudden. The record,
all of a sudden takes a little bit of a tumble.
They're hard to replace. Catching position is a hard one replacement.
(31:24):
You got multiple good catchers. You're really fortunate. So yeah,
I would really watch that one to and see what
that does with the blue Jays in the short term.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
Well, Joe, I mentioned I had some news for you
about a couple of your old haunts I mentioned in
the trop Back in business and then take a quick break.
But I'm gonna have to break some bad news to
you as well about another one of your old haunts.
So buckle up, the bad news is about to come
right after this. Welcome back to the Book of Joe. Joe,
(32:05):
I'm not sure if you saw this news. It happened
just last month, only a few weeks ago. Boulder, Colorado.
The dark Horse is closed. Yes, you saw that. I
was actually interviewed. Because of that.
Speaker 4 (32:19):
My cousin at least lives there in Boulder at last,
Rick and back. I used to hang out at her
house with my uncle Rick and Ted.
Speaker 5 (32:26):
Beck in the day.
Speaker 4 (32:28):
She contacted me because she knew this young gal that
was doing a story on it. So I'm quoted extensively
in the story about the dark Horse. Yes, it's upsetting,
it's wrong. It's one of the finest institutions. I've ever
hung out two o'clock in the morning and would listen
to funeral for a friend come on about one forty
(32:49):
five every night. I mean, great sound system blasting Manny
crestbo sitting up on a barber's chair on this little stage.
Yet with this paraphernalia, they're like one of the first
places that would hang everything from the ceiling, like sleds,
like Santa Claus sleds, traffic lights, all kinds of stuff
were suspended from the ceiling.
Speaker 5 (33:08):
I mean you'd walk to the.
Speaker 4 (33:09):
Bathroom and there'd be a finger on the girl's door
pointing towards the man's room, and you'd get confused, like,
which is the right where am I supposed to go?
Because after a couple Chevis regals for sixty nine sets
of pop, you'd choose the wrong door sometimes. But it
was the coolest place. Man Love the Horse. That is very,
very sad.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
They had people lined up for like forty five minutes
to an hour, almost like a viewing at a funeral,
to just say goodbye to the Dark Horse. Once word
went out that it is closing, it's going to be demolished,
going to build a mixed use specificity with some housing
and entertainment and whatnot. But it certainly meant a lot
(33:51):
to a lot of people over many years. I guess, Joey,
you did a really good job describing the inside.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
It was very welcoming, Homie.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
I guess a lot of memories for people, you know,
the way that it touches people.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
And I guess they did have at one point twenty
five cent beers. Is that right?
Speaker 4 (34:10):
That they had sixty nights Well six sixty nine cent
well drinks and it was all high end a well drinks.
Like I said, Chevis Frigal was the Scotch of choice.
And at that time was I twenty one years old.
I think, having just gotten out of lot Yette and
Joe Namat had such an influence on me.
Speaker 5 (34:25):
I was still into the Scotch world.
Speaker 4 (34:27):
I was kind of like Joe was a Johnny Walker
red guy think and I was into doors. But then
eventually got out there and for sixty nine cents, bring
on the Chevis.
Speaker 3 (34:36):
Wow, it was around for fifty one years. Oh my god,
that's pretty amazing. And March fourteenth was the time it
closed for the last time. The dark Horse of Boulder,
Colorado is no more. That was on Was that on
Baseline Road?
Speaker 5 (34:53):
Yeah? And that was yes?
Speaker 4 (34:54):
And now I Wayne Cret Chickie and myself, Stan Jakobowski,
all these guys.
Speaker 5 (34:59):
We would go down there. That's such a great group, man.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
That was a that was we won a national championship
and nineteen seventy five George.
Speaker 5 (35:06):
Fraser was on that team as a pitcher, played west Lake,
played first base. It was.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
It was a wonderful group of guys and I was
a starting catcher. I ended up being a starting catcher
on the team. We beat either Fairbanks or they was Fairbanks.
We beat Floyde Banister and Fairbanks in the NBC World
Series in which it taught Kansas that summer. But that
was our regular hangout. And then Jackabowski and I and
then Rod Boxwaterburger Brad Boksburger's dad. Rod was at USC
(35:33):
at the time. We were in charge of taking care
of the field there. It was called University of called
about a baseball field. They disbanded the program right after that.
I think Herb Brown was the baseball coach there at
the time, But we were in charge of the field
and god.
Speaker 5 (35:46):
Like did they only knew man?
Speaker 4 (35:48):
But you'd be out all night and then you do
that you have a game later that day. God, I
missed summer baseball that's the thing that these guys don't.
These leagues really aren't as prominent as they once were.
You played in Boulder, you played up and down the
slopes there of the Rockies down to twelve Blows, Colorado
Springs up to Boulder into Denver area, all the way
up to Greely, and it was wonderful. Then you go
(36:10):
over to Wichita, you go over to Kansas, you play
Liberal Kansas, Dodge City. Eventually you'd get over to Wichita. God,
I mean you talk about and then at Grand Junction
was also in the group. It was just like, that's
the way to be raised in the game. I really
wish that kids today because you also had a job.
You didn't just go out there and play baseball. You
(36:31):
had to work. Like even Clay Westley, Clay was on
the course truck during the day. He could deliver a
course beard during the day. And then one year we
put up a dog kennel in Arvada and Spike One
was on that group with me. Al Newman was on
that group with me. I'm in charge of this group
of guys putting up this metal building which could have
cut your finger off at any second in Arvada, California
(36:54):
and our paychecks bounced every week. It was wonderful experience.
Speaker 3 (36:58):
So you were in Boulder in nineteen seventy five, because
I think that was the first year the dark Horse opened.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
That's correct, That's correct. We ambushed that place. Man and
Manny Crespall. Like I said, Manny was a guy that
had played in the minor leagues with the Red Sox.
I don't think you made it the big leagues, but
Manny came back because Baldy loved Manny because he had
played there before. It's a place where Bert Hooton pitched
and Jim Gideon pitched. And if you look at the
if you look at the alumni, Eddie Baine of the
(37:26):
Boulder Collegiates, just check out that alumni list, Bobby Horner,
it was it's pretty spectacular group.
Speaker 5 (37:32):
I mean, Tony Gwinny eventually played there.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
Joe Carter we All and I went back to in
nineteen eighty and I was a player coach there with
Jim Deets, who was the head coach at San Diego State,
and I was a player coach on that team.
Speaker 5 (37:43):
We lost.
Speaker 4 (37:43):
Mark Langston was on that I caught Langley that summer.
I mean I have such great memories of that area. Boulder,
Colorado one of my favorite places on Earth. It's a
place that really created life for me. Regarding getting into
professional baseball. I signed her at seventy five, eventually got released,
went back to nineteen eighty, and then got signed again
(38:05):
as a minor league manager and scout, et cetera. So yeah,
whenever you say Boulder Man, my my interior just lights up.
Speaker 5 (38:12):
It was the best I think.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
Did Terry francona play for the Collisians as well?
Speaker 5 (38:16):
I don't know did he? I don't know if Terry dude,
I don't know that. But I'll also tell you this.
Speaker 4 (38:20):
I had of nineteen sixty nine Vobil there for one winter.
It would not go in reverse. So you drive, You
try to drive around Boulder, Colorado in a winter time
with the car that were not going reverse.
Speaker 5 (38:30):
It was very challenging.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
It takes a lot of planning. I would imagine now.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
When you take a date out and you have to
explain it to her. My god not through.
Speaker 3 (38:37):
On the day they closed the Dark Horse and people
were out waiting in line, someone brought a case of
beer and left it outside for people who you know,
could partake of their refreshment since they weren't selling any
more inside. So it's always been that neighborhood place lost
a little bit of history with the close of the
dark Horse. So condolences to the dark Horse. The memories
(39:00):
will always last, Joe. But that brings us to the
close of this episode. Now, this is not the end
of our podcast, just the end of this episode. So
what kind of final words do you have for us today?
Speaker 4 (39:13):
I got two things real quick because I still had
dinner with my brother. My brother Marx has made Easter pie.
I don't know if everybody's aware of Easter pie, but
that's obviously during Easter. The Italian part of my family
than my mom polish, we make Easter pie of ham, sausage,
hard boiled eggs, ricotta, cheese, romano cheese, egg whites, egg yolks,
black pepper, and parson. It is outstanding. It's in the fridge.
(39:34):
I'm looking at it right now. That's going to be
my breakfast. And then if you want more information about that,
right in and we'll get you the exact recipe how
to do it.
Speaker 5 (39:41):
It is.
Speaker 4 (39:42):
It's an acquired taste, but it's the best. And then
moving on from there, just to the thought of the day.
My thoughts were really centered around conviction and maybe, like
right now with the red sauce and whatever your belief
system is to not you always have to remain flexible,
but you have to be convicted to your beliefs. And
I just got that this was pretty good and it
(40:04):
kind of goes in a little bit of a nut circle,
but it takes a different path and I kind of
liked it. Regarding conviction, conviction charisma has nothing to do
with energy. Charisma has nothing to do with energy. It
comes from a clarity of why God that I love that.
It comes from absolute conviction and an ideal bigger than oneself.
(40:24):
It comes from absolute conviction and an ideal bigger than oneself.
I'm just just thinking about things in general, because you know,
even like with social media, people can get knocked off
their ideals ideas because they get land basted with negative
feedback clicks, you know, a negative click as opposed to
positive click. And I think, you know, when it comes
(40:45):
down to conviction, really believing in what you believe in
and being able to explain it plainly and lucively. I
think that's really important. And like I said, sometimes maybe
your convictions are off. I mean, my belief system might
be off, but I got to stay with that while
remaining flexible. Absolute conviction is an idea bigger than one self.
(41:06):
I was just thinking about that today, just looking at
a lot of things, reading a lot of things, a
lot of things going on in the world. Think for yourself,
I guess, is what I'm saying. Think for yourself, Remain flexible,
but know what you believe. And I love that chrisma
has nothing to do with energy, and you know, you
think about that, the charismatic like I was always talk
about the twenty sixteen cubs of being charismatic. But then
(41:26):
the next sentense, it comes from a clarity of why
and the way was we were together there in order
to you know, break the curse, break that one hundred
and eight year old curse, and we did so. I
mean a little bit over the map today starts with
easter pie goes to conviction. But I thought your topics
are great today. So you have me all over the
map and I'm in an RV that's being shaken by
(41:47):
this fifty mine hour wind on the Eastern Atlantic coast
here in Beverly, beach and loving every second of.
Speaker 3 (41:55):
I told you do sound like you're in the artimist,
but I'm glad to hear you're still earth bound for
now anyway.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
But I love that word job. I'm glad you brought
up conviction. It's so important.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
I hear it a lot with pitching, where a pitcher
has to be convicted with a pitch before you throw it.
Speaker 5 (42:09):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (42:09):
But I think especially and I love your reference to
the Red Sox because it's especially important this time of
year for teams that really don't know who they are.
Like I thought, you're sixteen Cubs. You knew exactly who
you were in spring training based on how well the
fifteen season went and that run in the postseason. I
like teams that are convicted. They know who they are,
they know what they are as a team. They're not
(42:31):
trying to establish something. And you know, the Phillies are
a convicted team. The Dodgers, of course, convicted team. The
Yankees are a convicted team. Don't see that yet with
a team like the Red Sox, Oh man, it's a
very valuable thing in any sport. I mean, you know,
Joe and golf, it's huge to be convicted to a shot,
convicted to your putt line. And I think right now
(42:52):
the Red Sox are not a convicted team. They need
to get there pretty quickly. So very appropriate word today.
Speaker 5 (42:58):
And use the word flexible too.
Speaker 4 (43:00):
I mean, I've always thought, like the better teams I've
been affiliate it with going into spring training, it pretty
much knew how this was going to shake out, like
you know, people being in line for a job in
order to make the team or stick with the team.
I've always thought if there was like one, maybe two
real Oak job openings, that would be a lot on
a good team. And that's part of conviction of an
(43:22):
off season. I think you should be able to do
that annually.
Speaker 5 (43:25):
When you have too many.
Speaker 4 (43:26):
Cattle calls or job opportunities in spring training, normally you're
not a really good team. That's my opinion. So while
you're doing all this stuff though, too, you're convicted this
is our team. We like this, we put it together
in November, December, January, whatever, But always remain flexible. The
ability to say I might have been wrong is really important,
(43:49):
and so it's yeah, be convicted in what you're doing.
I want my team to be kind of made up
before I get there. But always that flexibility has to
remain because when you get there, all of a sudden
something might not just smell quite right, and you might
have to literally shift gears.
Speaker 3 (44:05):
Joe, great job and congratulations on living large. Easter pie
for breakfasts in an RV that's right next to the
Atlantic Ocean. Doesn't get any better than that, not even
on the dark side of the moon.
Speaker 4 (44:18):
If we could just post I mean, it almost looks
like the dark side of the moon, if we could
actually post a picture, this would be so cold.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
I'm gonna take a picture.
Speaker 4 (44:24):
I'll send it the Bence and if anybody wants to
see what we but this looks like it is that spectacular.
Speaker 5 (44:30):
It truly is.
Speaker 2 (44:31):
See you next time, See your brother.
Speaker 5 (44:32):
Bye.
Speaker 1 (44:41):
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