3 & Out - Can't miss prospects in the draft, Draft prep, Woody Johnson on Aaron Glenn

John opens the week talking about the difference between the NBA draft and the NFL draft and how the NBA tends to have "can't miss" players in the draft, but the NFL is a lot more of a crapshoot. Next, John continues the conversation with the NFL draft and discusses all of the prep that goes into trying to learn about the players as people before the day of the draft.

Lastly, John answers your questions during this episode's mailbag segment.

5:44 - Can't miss prospects

25:08 - Woody Johnson on Aaron Glenn

32:44 - Mailbag

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. What is going on everybody? How are we doing?
I'm John this three and Now podcast, and we're here
to talk a little football, and that is what we

(00:22):
will do. Because the draft is now eighteen days away.
We got two full weeks this week and next week,
and then the following week is the draft Thursday of
the twenty fourth, the first round. Very very exciting. It's
obviously a huge, huge weekend for the National Football League
for all your teams, because nothing creates more hope than

(00:43):
drafting players. Is exciting, it's fun to talk about, and
it's not far away. So one thing we will try
to do over the next couple weeks is do a
draft related topic every single day, and that's what we
will do. So obviously the Masters this week we will
dive in either tomorrow or the next day, Big Big
Master's podcast Gambling Heavy might do Wednesday, or yeah, record

(01:10):
on Tuesday for Wednesday, just so we had some of
the press conferences the next couple days. I've already dove
pretty I mean, I get very aggressive gambling on this
golf tournament, so we will dive into that from a
draftking standpoint. We will also do a mail bag today
at John middlecoff firing those dms, and you guys know
the drill. Other than that, any any master's questions for

(01:34):
later this week at golopod firing those dms. I have
a separate instagram for golf only. And obviously this is
just a huge week, biggest golf tournament of the year,
and kind of a slower NFL week with everyone kind
of just bunkering down draft meetings and it kind of
quiets here for a couple of weeks before the tornado

(01:57):
of the draft. So I'm excited it's about that time
of year to make some picks. But you guys know
the drill. If you listen on Collins Feed, subscribe to
the podcast. We got a YouTube channel, bunch of content
up there as well. And you know, I got to
tell you about my friends, my partners in the official
ticketing app of this podcast. You know what's funny. I

(02:20):
saw Alexandrovetchkin broke Wayne Gretzky's goal record in the NHL.
I've been to one NHL game in my life. It
was because of my friends at game time. I went
to a game here at Arizona when they used to
have a hockey team before Utah stole them. And the
arena was at the Club Hockey Arena, so it was
like forty five hundred people. That's where the NHL team played.

(02:41):
And I saw the Washington Capitals. I saw Alexandrovtchkin. He
didn't score that night, but the Capitals killed him. But
I remember thinking, hockey is an incredible in person experience
if you ever have the chance. I've been told this
forever and I finally did it. I was like, this
is sweet, and I planned on going to more than
they moved. But if you want to go to an
NHL game, the playoffs are right around the corner. The

(03:02):
Capitals are actually incredible this year. I think they compete
to be the number one seed. Obviously, baseball in full swing.
With the NBA playoffs right around the corner. You got
concert season. You know, concert season is great, nothing like
in the spring of the summer going to a concert
on like a Friday or Saturday night. Comedy shows. They
got you covered. Best ticketing app I've ever used, by

(03:24):
a country mile. So take the guests. We're out of
buying tickets with game Time. Download the game Time app,
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minute tickets, lowest price is guaranteed. Had a pretty good

(03:45):
day Saturday, played golf, got home, turned on Duke Houston,
watched that Bad Boy, an all time meltdown. But like
anyone who's a sucker for players in college, whether it's
basketball obviously football, I love watching elite prospects. Right, and
Cooper Flagg looks like a can't miss player. Now, there

(04:09):
is no such thing. I say this all the time
in the NFL as can't miss, But I think in
the NBA it's pretty clear, Like worst case scenario, this
guy's going to be really good. Like there's obviously a
big difference between like Lebron James and John Wall, but
like John Wall is pretty good in the NBA until
he started getting banged up, you know, Derek Rose, Anthony Davis,

(04:32):
Kyrie Irving, Like it's pretty clear like this guy, I
don't know if he's All of Famer or like a
ten time All Star, but more likely he's going to
be a really good player in the NFL. It's very difficult.
I mean, we heard about Trevor Lawrence for multiple years.
He's the greatest prospect since Andrew Lucke and Peyton Manning
and one of the best prospects of all time. And
I'm not trying to like play Monday Morning quarterback here,

(04:54):
but I remember thinking like, it's really talented player, obviously
an excellent prospect. I don't know, is he gonna be
like some all time great player. I'm not just saying
that now. I remember thinking there was like this guy's
just a can't miss and then all my friends in
the NFL is like best prospect I've ever evaluated, and
you see it's like hasn't gone well. Now there's a
big difference, Like Cooper Flag could go to whatever team

(05:18):
in the NBA. In basketball, because there's only five guys
on a court. One individual if he's a great player,
Steph Curry, Joker, Giannis, whoever, can have a huge impact
and dictate the terms. In football, especially as a quarterback,
you know there's a lot of variables. You don't pick

(05:38):
the players in the NBA. If you want to, you
get to do that. You definitely don't call the plays
the coordinator does that who a lot of times is
now your head coach. You're very dependent on who your
skilled guys are, how good your defense is. Like that,
there are way more variables in football, but like usually
the cream rises and it's clear these guys are really good.

(06:01):
These guys are kind of questionable, and you're watching Cooper
Flag You're like, got this guy. All there's a lot
of hype justified baller. Now you know, I'm not a
Duke hater, but didn't mind the meltdown though I kind
of wish on Monday night they were in this game
it would make it a little more interesting. But props
to Houston. It got me thinking, like in this draft,

(06:22):
which I would say has a I don't want to
say a negative cloud over it, but there is a
hype on a draft when you have great players near
the top, and usually that's quarterbacks. I would say last
year's draft is one of the more hype drafts of
this century. Why because it was discussed that, you know,

(06:43):
I think we were all kind of blown away that
six guys ended up going, but it was pretty clear
like four or five guys were probably going near the
top fifteen. And then it'sad a record six guys went
in the top twelve and quarterbacks drive the day, like
I would be. I think most people, if you pulled
around the NFL, you go Travis Hunter and abdual Carter.

(07:03):
It's gonna be hard for them not to be good players, right,
And I would agree, like I have a hard time
seeing a guy that can bend like abdual Carter can.
Again obviously assuming health in Travis Hunter with his skill
set of being able to do multiple things, of not
just being able to figure it out and be a
high level starter in the NFL. Now there's a big

(07:24):
difference of like, we feel really good about this guy
as a starter, and over the course of six seven
years he makes a Pro Bowl or two. And I'm
not talking about the fake Pro Bowl when half the thing,
half the people drop out. I'm talking about like, no,
you were one of the best players at your position.
You're a no brainer, and just like, yeah, this guy
was a really good starter and he made a Pro Bowl,
Like that's always on the table with NFL draft picks

(07:45):
like Abdual Carter. There are some people think like not
quite physical enough, not what I saw. But I know
that has been debated in some draft rooms. One thing
you hear with Travis Hunter is like, god, he's pretty skinny.
And there was this viral video of him at the
at the sh I like prime calling it the showcase
of him running this route, Like, yeah, he's got skinny Eagles.
But here's what I'd say. It's like number one prospect

(08:07):
went to college. I watched him ball. He's gonna be good. Now,
how good if he does become a wide receiver, which
is very possible. Who knows how this is all gonna
shake out. It's hard to be one of the best
wide receivers in the NFL. Why because it is a
star studded group and at corner it's just a tough
position to play. We have seen a lot of guys

(08:28):
that have focused on that position that we thought were
like can't miss high level prospects, you know, struggle. It's
it's difficult one. You're covering star players every single week,
and it's just a naturally a hard position to play. So,
you know, the draft this year, because of cam Ward
and now Travis Hunter after the Colorado Showcase, is the

(08:49):
betting favorite to be the number two overall pick. So
that by all signs, I mean cam Ward is going
to Tennessee. I don't know, you know, whether it's going
to be Travis Hunter. Maybe they were a little nervous
with the Abdual Carter injury. But if Travis Hunter goes too,
I think that brings into questions like what are the
Giants going to do? Would they take Abdual Carter? I mean,

(09:10):
they're pretty heavily invested in the defensive line position. That
would be a huge win for the Patriots if I
have dual carter Field in them. But what would they
do if they don't take a quarterback at three? Do
they take Shador? And that's where these questions kind of
are happening all around the NFL. And it's the one
cool part about being in these drafting rooms, and every
team does it a little bit differently. I mean heavily,

(09:33):
all thirty two teams over the next couple of weeks
will be meeting. Now, not all meetings look the same,
you know, Like I know the Chiefs, as I was
told over Super Bowl Week when I was hanging out
with some of them, that there's not a team in
the league that watches more tape as a group getting
ready over the course of the spring than us, Like
they spend a lot of time as a scouting staff

(09:54):
watching tape together and their coaches get intermixed in and out.
But it is you know, it is veach and the
scouting staff really driving and dictating the terms when it
comes to picking the players. And some teams are very
very coach dependent, right, The coaches have a lot of juice,
and the assistant coaches, obviously the coordinators and the position

(10:15):
coaches have gotten heavily involved in this process over the
last month, and they are coming in with opinions that
might differ from the scouting department. Like think about it,
if you have like the if you're a college scouting
director and you have loved like ten different guys all
season long, and you have been evaluating them. You've gone

(10:36):
into their schools, You've met with the players at the
Senior Bowls, at the All Star Games, at the Combine,
You've spent a lot of time. The coach is kind
of helicopter in at the Combine kind of, but they
haven't really watched any of these players. The big misconception
head coaches, you know, like Andy Reid is pretty dialed on,

(10:56):
dialed into what's going on in the college landscape. He
just games are on constantly. You could convince me that
half the coaches in the NFL during the fall don't
really know at all what's going on in college football
beside like a couple of the best teams and watching
a game here or there. So when and if I'm

(11:16):
saying that about the head coaches, think about the coordinators
who are just deep into not just their position coaches
or groups, but their units. The pressure of calling plays
and then the little time they do have Thursday, Friday, Saturday,
assuming they're at home, like you kind of got to
spend it with the wife. And if you got kids,
and most of them, you know, if they're under fifty

(11:36):
years old, the kids are going to be relatively young, Like,
you're not that locked into college football. So they come
in and who are a lot of their friends other coaches?
You got to be very careful. And I've been asked
this for a long time, like who's the least trustworthy
person in a college building? Well, it's not even an argument,
it's the head coach. Well why is that? Well, because

(11:59):
if I'm a head coach coach, what do I benefit
from the more guys get drafted high as possible. You
get a lot more credit as a head coach than like, well,
he had a great team full of high character guys,
but two guys got drafted, one in the sixth round,
the other guy in the seventh round. Or it's like, yeah,
kind of a questionable squad, guys got in trouble. Not

(12:19):
sure you know who's who you trust, but four guys
in the top fifty. What's the better headline for that
university to tweet out and instagram out? So they push
heavily on leaning on the glass half full side with guys.
That's why you got to be very careful about the
offseason because what's going on, Well, the players are out

(12:41):
of their building. They're not dealing with them on a
daily basis. Plus they're not playing in any games, so
emotionally they're a little more i would say calm, and
you are less likely to get the truth and more
of a positive spin where some of your best information comes.
And this is where the coach have nothing to do
with it because their own folks on their own team

(13:03):
is during the season when they just had a two
game losing streak and you run into the coordinator or
the head coach on like a Tuesday or Wednesday in
their building. They're gonna shoot it to you straight, like, yeah,
this guy won't listen, he's showing up late, he's not
working hard. We thought the last couple of games he's
been turned it down then and then you get him
right now in April. It's like, I'm telling you, man,

(13:24):
this guy hasn't even scratched the surface. I know there
were some buzz about him not being that tough bs
he was dealing with a knee injury. It's like, well,
you didn't tell me that. When I talked to you
in October after you had just got rolled two weeks
in a row on ESPN Saturday Night Primetime, you told
me you can't win with this guy. You don't trust

(13:46):
this guy. So this is where, in going on the
pot with Colin last week, he said, what are you
really doing over the course of the next couple of weeks,
Like do guys rise and fall? And rising up and
falling to me has always been a little bullshit because
like you rise and fall during the season, right, you're

(14:07):
playing well, you're moving up, you're playing bad. You're either
stagnant because we still love your upside, or you're falling right.
But once the season ends, most of these teams don't
allow you to change your grade. So whatever the date is,
let's say January fifteenth or January thirtieth or January twentieth,

(14:27):
you're great on the player is set why they're not
playing any more games. Now, where you can change stuff
is like, hey, we've got more character information, we've done
some more digging, we've heard this, that and the other,
and then that can affect like, yeah, we don't really
trust this guy, but it's not based on because yeah,
we don't think he can play, like we all watched them,
and we don't trust some other stuff. Now, where it

(14:49):
gets weird is when the assistant coach, the quarterback coach,
and the coordinator start ganging up on the scouting staff like, yeah,
we disagree with this, we love this guy. Sometimes it works.
You know who banged the table for Brock Purty, Brian
Greasy who actually just quit football because he was tired
of grinding so much. Don't blame him already, Rich, I mean,
to work ninety hour work weeks is insane when you know,

(15:12):
get into it, like in your fifties, Like, so I
get a lot of respect for him to even attempting it.
But like, I don't think Perty. I think there's a
decent chance Perty's not drafted if the coaching staff doesn't
get super involved. And the forty nine ers are a very,
very coach influenced team. Kyle Shanahan and his group have
a lot of juice. So like obviously last pick in

(15:33):
the draft, it's not the end all be all either way.
But you know, I just think all these teams are
trying to figure that out. And the other thing you're
going to hear a lot about is these thirty visits.
Some people call him top thirty visits. That would obviously
insinuate that these are your top players, and people in
the NFL often push back against that because it's not

(15:54):
your top thirty players. You just are allotted as an
NFL team, thirty prospects are allowed to come to your
building and spend When I worked in the NFL, is
twenty four hours. Maybe it's a little more now, but
you basically spend the day. Maybe you fly in at night,
you stay at the hotel. A guy like me, someone
on the scouting staff, or maybe a coaching staff picks

(16:16):
the guy up from the hotel let's say six point
thirty seven in the morning, come to the building, and
you basically spend all day with the squad. You are
meeting with the coaches, the head coach, the coordinators, the
position coach, probably the GM, the scouting staff, the trainers,
maybe the weight room staff, and depending on like i
could bring a six round pick because I got question

(16:39):
marks on their character and we really like the player,
or I'm definitely bringing some guys that I plan on
drafting in the top couple rounds. In my experience, the
owner meets with that guy. I know. Sometimes you read
owners are at the combine when out with the Eagles.
I've never seen that. I know, Jeffrey went I think
when they were going after Carson Wentz. But for the

(17:00):
most part, you know most you know, Jed York's the kronkeys, Like,
these guys aren't going to the combine. But if they're,
they have an office at the building and it's like, yeah,
we're bringing the guy that we might draft with a
fourteenth overall pick. I think it would be kind of
gross negligence for that guy not at least to talk
with him. And again, they're not breaking down like you
know what coverage were you doing on this play? It's

(17:22):
more just probably talking to him as a guy, and
then any troubled player you really want to get to
know him. Now. I do think this is where you know,
having a good feel for the youth, because I'll never
forget like when I did it, and I used to
for a couple of years, Like I was a big
part of picking guys up, bringing him around, walking them

(17:43):
around the building. You just spend a lot of time
with them and take them from spot to spot, and
then you know, go to lunch or dinner with them
in the in the in the city with some of
your coaches and get a free meal, which you know,
when you're making forty grand, it's like you'd never complain about.
But I do think that you gotta be care. Bobby

(18:05):
Wagner was a guy obviously a big time player in college,
but he's at Utah State and he came in on
a visit. I remember he had a Ninja turtle backpack
and I remember thinking like this, this guy's gonna put
this next ray Lewis you think ray lewis rocking a
Ninja turtle backpack to an NFL team, And you gotta
be careful about certain like obviously didn't matter at all.

(18:26):
I mean sometimes young people that are just not quote
unquote your generation or whatever. Not that my thought on
that had any impact on him as a guy, But
I just remember thinking that, and I remember after like
a couple years later, it's like, hey, he's one of
the best players in the NFL. H some dudes just
like different shit. Uh So you gotta be the one

(18:47):
thing that's a tell all to me always is and
you don't know like as fans, but for coaches and
for staff. When you've been like to me, if I'm
Travis Hunter, I'm clearly have no red flags, right, I'm
just a good guy, high character, like great player. I
can show up to your facility. Let's say the Giants

(19:09):
bring me in or the Browns like. I can wear
whatever I want, sweats, normal clothes, Colorado gear, like, it
doesn't matter. But whenever there's a guy that has like
off the field questions like red flags and he shows
up in a suit, You're like, that's kind of a problem,
Like what are you trying to hide here, buddy? And

(19:30):
they're on their best behavior, It's like, bro, just just
admit or be honest about whatever happened. And I remember
Lombardi used to say this all the time back when
he was a podcaster, like we already have all the
answers to the tests, so you just we're not looking
for your opinion on it, like when we asked you
a question, like we already know what the answer is.

(19:50):
It's just gonna be interesting which route you go. Now,
it does feel like, at least near the near high
in this draft, there aren't a lot of question marks
the field with I mean, Shadur Cam pretty open book,
Abdul Carter, Travis Hunter, Will Campbell, Genty, Mason Graham. You know,

(20:11):
every once in a while you had a class with like, yeah,
three of the top ten prospects from major question marks,
and that you know a couple of years ago, Jalen Carter.
You bring him in like there's not much to figure
out as a player, like, yeah, he's fucking awesome. It's
like you're just spending all the time to get to
know the guy. And with a quarterback like the one

(20:31):
thing with Cam, Shador and even the rest of the crew,
intelligence and football intelligence and comprehending football is really really important.
Now you do hear these stories of like I remember
Mahomes with the Chiefs. There was another guy recently god
I forget who it was, but like he got asked

(20:51):
a bunch of those questions with an assistant coach or no,
the head coach is peppering him with questions about what
you know or what you don't know, and they give you, like,
you know, six or seven plays and expect you to
regurgitate it. It's basically impossible. Where Like there have been
stories I remember Matt and Aggie did this with Mahomes

(21:13):
where you gave him the answers before, so even when
they threw them off. But there was another quarterback too.
I don't know if it was Josh Allen, but it
was someone like that. But like that type of stuff's funny,
but for the most part, these are pretty serious. So yeah,
I mean when you see these Top thirty visits, sometimes
people have said that, like sometimes you bring in guys
that you're not interested in to throw people off the scent.

(21:36):
I don't think with only having thirty the ability to
talk to thirty people, you can really afford to do that, Like,
if you're bringing in a guy, you're interested in them. Now,
maybe there are individual examples on a yearly basis where
a team brought a guy in and they weren't interested
in them. It was like to make a team think
you wanted them so they would jump them so they

(21:58):
could take some other player. I think that would be
pretty complicated to try to execute because you would also
have to assume you know what these other teams are thinking,
and it's pretty secretive time of year. But what I
think a lot of times happened is maybe you bring
a guy in that you're interested in, and then when
they leave, you're like, yeah, we're not as interested anymore.

(22:19):
And that's Isn't that just natural business? I mean, I'm
sure a lot of people listening. If you have different
roles and whatever company you work for, maybe you run
your own company, maybe you're in a hiring position at
a company, like you meet with people and you go, yeah,
pretty likable guys. Don't think it's gonna fit here. Doesn't
mean you're right, and maybe that guy would have fit.
But if you're in a position where you can dictate

(22:41):
whether they come or not, you're like, yeah, I don't
I don't see this one working well. I don't think
you're incapable. I think you can go on to have
a good career with some other company, but it's probably
not gonna work here. I think that happens a lot
in football once the coaches and the GM and the
owner really meet with the guy, Like, yeah, I don't
really see it. And obviously anytime the owner either wants

(23:01):
a guy or is out on a guy doesn't really
matter what the team thinks. And speaking of an owner
that you know clearly is very involved, is Woody Johnson.
I mean the pushback on the NFLPA grades, which honestly
I don't even have the energy to quite figure out,
Like I don't even care, you know, to get to

(23:21):
give an owner an f I think for these players,
like how often are they really around them? I think
it's more just like the vibe in the place. But
when Woody Johnson is quoted at the owners meetings saying
that Justin Fields is a winner, which in college that's true.
Obviously in the NFL that's untrue. But looking back on

(23:44):
his draft, I might be screwing this up a little bit,
but it was basically it was clear that Trevor Lawrence
and him were the top two guys and they were
the best two prospects in that draft, it's like, bro,
your team draft at Zach Wilson. Now he was, you know,
not around as much. His brother was involved. But Dan

(24:06):
Campbell had some comments which I think at this point
in time, like when Dan talks, it's crazy how you
can go from I don't want to say laughingstock, but
let's face it. I mean early on, a lot of
people made fun of Dan Campbell. And I think a
lot of times too, you know, the media over educated
group or places a huge, huge emphasis on like do

(24:27):
you feel like a highly educated individual, super intellectual? Like
they lean toward those guys. That's why they love Brandon Staley.
Early on, they're like, this guy's so smart. It's like, yeah,
he can't coach his way out of a wet paper bag.
I don't give a fuck how much he knows. To
send the limo to that to that guy's house on
game day because I want to make sure that he's
there so we can kick his ass. And the Dan

(24:48):
Campbell types are usually not going to be like you know,
immediately the media's favor they lean toward like nerdy guys.
And I would say several years later now I would
say Campbell's respect level just with everyone around the NFL
is pretty high. So like when he talks and I've
watched a lot of his press conferences, like Dan Campbell's

(25:09):
a really really high level guy, and it's it's pretty obvious,
like his whole thing isn't just out toughing you, even
though it's a huge part of his coaching ability. It's
no different like the Hardball Brothers, like toughness, toughness, toughness,
Like these guys are sharp, man, they kind of know
what they're doing. They might do it in a little
different way, but I don't sleep on them. And he

(25:30):
had some comments that basically Aaron Glenn's guy that if
Aaron Glenn can't turn around the Jets, no one can't.
And I totally like understand back in your guy and
believing in your guy. And clearly Aaron Glenn's a really
impressive coordinator. I mean what he did down the stretch
with me and you playing defense was awesome. Hard to

(25:51):
not root for Aaron Glenn, But like, let's look at
the Lion situation. When those guys got to take over,
it doesn't really look like the Ford family was dictating
everything they do, and it's like telling them to do
this or not do that, and so Aaron Glenn and
his coaching staff could be awesome. It's really hard to
overcome Woody Jones and he's not going away. When you

(26:14):
think meddling owners, I would just say like he's kind
of feels a little I'm not saying this is purely
apple or apples to apples here, but does feel like
there's some Dan Snyder stuff going on, like just a
little too involved and knows fucking nothing about anything when
it comes to football. So if Aaron Glenn can turn

(26:35):
this thing around, it would be an incredible accomplishment. It
really would, because it's not just building a football team,
it's overcoming the owner. And if the Jets are kind
of the new Washington football team commanders because of ownership,
Like I don't think it's random. These last fifteen years
have been pretty ugly because you don't overcome that guy

(26:57):
because he's just always involved. He's always giving you football opinions,
which it's his team, it's his progative. He can do
whatever he wants. But like you see this guy's quotes,
it's like, brow, let's just just stay on the sideline,
my man, collect the checks and enjoy the Fight for

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Speaker 1 (28:44):
Okay, let's get to a little thing we like to
call the middle cough mail bag at John Middlecoff. At
John Middlecoff is the Instagram fire in those dms and
get your questions answered here on the show. Let's roll baby.
Can you explain why Burrow is viewed in higher regard

(29:05):
than Stafford in terms of being in the top three
to seven quarterbacks outside of mobility? It seems from a
casual eye that Stafford is better at almost everything than Burrow.
Yet Stafford has always talked about closer to like the
top five or seven guy, and Burrow has always talked
about as like a top two or four guy. Yet

(29:25):
arm strength, touch, accuracy, IQ, pocket awareness, manipulation of coverages.
I've never watched the two play and thought Burrow was
even ninety percent of the quarterback Stafford is. I've never
heard this discuss on a pod or major TV channel.
I think you got a factor in age, so like
there's like a ten year age gap, so Stafford is

(29:46):
on whole seventeen or eighteen of his career. I mean, hell,
he's like going year to year literally right now. And
I think if Stafford was at his same age they
were both you know, twenty seven, twenty eight years old,
twenty nine, in the prime of their career, playing for
the Rams and playing for the Bengals, I think we
would talk Stafford differently. I think part of the way

(30:09):
we discussed Stafford is like he's the old guy who's
not going to play much longer. So I think we're
discriminating him because of his age, and rightfully so right
because in the prime of his career he was on
a dogshit team and it was difficult to evaluate him
as some great talent or great player. We knew he
was a great talent, but the Lions were not the

(30:30):
Dan Campbell Lions at the time. They were a joke.
And now we get to see him in his latter
years on a really good team with a good organization
and team's really good and he's really good, so I
would push back, Like, obviously Stafford is one of the
great arms of all time. Just watch the throw. Go
to Instagram and watch the throw he made with Bryson

(30:51):
d Chambeau. They played a golf thing that Bryson does
for his YouTube channel. I mean, it looks like he's
throwing one hundred and fifty miles an hour. I mean
bright since luckily lucky it didn't come at his face,
it came off his chest. But I mean it was
like Stafford's arms elite but like Burrows doesn't have I
would say an elite arm, but accuracy, football IQ, pocket manipulation.

(31:14):
I mean, he's a great player, great player, and they're
different type players. But I think it just gets back
to the to the age. It just gets back to
the age plus a couple of years ago. Like Stafford
led the league in picks, he just throw. He throws
a lot of interceptions, which again you're gonna throw touchdowns.
I don't care like Burrow into like this last year

(31:37):
two thousand and the fall of twenty twenty four, brow
was a better player. I would I don't even think
would Stafford debate that Brown's take Travis at two, then
trade up with someone later for the door pick. I
would be very hesitant, and I get very uncomfortable when

(31:58):
people go the They just extended Geno out on quarterbacks.
The Seattle Seahawks no drafting of quarterbacks. The Giants they
gave Russell Wilson and uh Jamis Winston money. No quarterbacks.
Like guys, we see this every year. Man We've seen

(32:20):
him forever. It's like Kirk Cousins ninety million dollars pick eight,
Michael Pennix Junior, how Pete Carroll did it once upon
a time with Matt Flint. They paid him a bunch
of money. Then they drafted Russell Wilson. That was in
the third round. But I think we got to be
very careful about just because a free agent move happens,
that we're not going to draft a quarterback. So I

(32:42):
guess in theory, Shador could quote unquote fall on draft night,
but he also could get picked thirty. He col get
picked six. Who knows, but to me, if he is falling,
then yeah, I could see someone trade up to get him.
And that could also include good teams like this, you know,
playoff teams Steelers the Rams I mean Amsar team again,
he's going year to year. Question, with your background as

(33:05):
a scout and seemingly every major college football program now
having a GM position, would you ever consider interviewing for
said position for the right team? You know, I get
asked iterations of this question. The simple answer is, like,
I've been doing this now for a long time. You know,
I worked in football for like six years and it

(33:28):
was an incredible time in my twenties to my late twenties.
But like I was meant to do this and things
have gone well, and I'm not a guy that's ever
looked to get back in. I've put all my chips
in the middle of the table on this and it's
it's taking time over you know, a decade, but it's
worked out and if anything, it's expanding time. It's time

(33:50):
to build a bigger operation. It's time to you know,
add more things to the table. So I have no
desire to ever do anything football wise, besides maybe like
one day if I have a kid who's probably won't
be good at football, but maybe we'll play like a
flag football when he's a kid, like go to be
a coach or something. I have a lot of friends

(34:14):
that have interviewed for these jobs and hearing what they offered.
I mean, some of them are paying, you know, a
million bucks. But I and I hope those guys take
those jobs, get those jobs, and enjoy it. But that
is not for me. And I'm not one of those guys.
You know, some people you see like go back and
forth like I'm a talking guy, like I'm a podcaster,

(34:38):
like that's that's what I do. I'm not like one
of those guys that comes to podcasting and then goes
back to football and then goes back to like, no,
this is this is it? Not that I'd even It's
not like I'm getting offered to get these jobs and
I won't. But if I did, which slim to none
won't happen, it would be I wouldn't even entertain in

(35:00):
with them. Longtime listener, first time writer. I really appreciate
your perspective on life in general, personal finance, and I'm
hoping to get your thoughts on big decision I'm currently facing.
I'm in my mid thirties, I'm married and have three kids.
I've also been operating a construction company with two partners
for the past four years. Recently we received serious interest

(35:22):
from potential buyers and now have a formal offer on
the table for nine million dollars after taxes, fees, other expenses.
My personal share would be approximately one point nine million.
That said, I'm in a great position. I pay myself
very well, enjoy strong owner benefits, vehicles, fuel business paid trips,

(35:45):
and have a great quality of life. But there will
always be a certain level of stress as an owner.
I love to get your take on what factors I
should be considering when deciding whether to move forward with
the sale. Well, I just want to say congratulations. I mean,
you guys built a company over you know, in less

(36:06):
short period of time and turn this thing into i
mean pretty closely to not far away from making it
an uh an eight figure operation. That's that's fucking awesome.
So so congrats to you. Someone asked me a very
serious question, not for the mailbag. I don't honestly, I
don't even know if I was supposed to read that.
I didn't say your name, but someone had asked me

(36:29):
a very serious question. They were a younger person, and
I've used this to anyone that's anytime that asks you know,
some like hardcore advice I'm a huge believer in this,
and I was telling Maria this the other day, Like
you can tell and go to people like what should
I do? No One, even your partners, know better because

(36:52):
they don't know like truly like your home situation, you
know your kids, What you truly like means everything to
you is like your gut, and I think your gut
feeling and I would imagine asking this question, you're leaning
one way and nothing, to me is more powerful than
your gut. And every big decision I've ever made in

(37:15):
forty plus years, whether it be professionally or personally, and
I've made pretty big ones. Moved across the country, just
got married, just moved a state pretty recently within the
last three or four years. Listen, we've all made big
decisions relative to ourselves as we get older. I think
your gut is by far the best determining factor, and

(37:39):
sometimes your head can come into it. And which is
which is healthy? In fight and make you, you know,
really kind of battle, what that decision is? Well? Is
this the right decision? And let's face it, part of
what makes this world we live in, in this life
we lead so fascinating is when we make a big decision,
whether it's in our personal life, for our professional life,

(38:01):
whether it's for millions of dollars, or whether it's not.
We don't know the outcome. We do not know what
is going to transpire over the next five, ten, twenty years.
We have no fucking clue. We're not we get all
drop dead in a week, you know, or we can
live another if we're thirty four years old, another who
knows with technology and health benefits, live another seventy eighty years,

(38:24):
which would be a long time. You'd be over one hundred.
But you know what I mean, I do think it'd
be way over one hundred actually, But there is a
benefit to owning your own company that once you receive
that after taxes, and you're in your mid thirty so
you have a lot of life to live now. I
don't know if you have, like another passion, you're going

(38:44):
to try to pursue something you like more. Let's just
assume that you like the construction business. You're clearly pretty
good at it, whatever your role is in the operation.
Like you guys are all crushing it's like one point
nine after taxes is a lot of money. There is
no our doing that. But like what are you just
going to live off that one point nine for the

(39:05):
rest of your life? Are you going to just retire
at thirty four years old? Like I honestly, the word
retirement sounds like you like what you do. Retirement's always
given me the he b gbs, Like I love golf.
I can play like two straight days, and then it's
like I want to do other stuff, Like I like
to work, I really do, and I don't plan, like

(39:26):
I hate that word. I really do, mainly because a
lot of people that I've admired in my life like
kind of just they love what they do and they
work well into their seventies, and I think they like
doing it now. There's some of these people are business
owners like yourself, not like W two employees like my
mom worked for the government, retired at sixty four years old.

(39:48):
Obviously there are certain jobs you're going to retire, but like,
you need other things to fulfill your life, and I
just my thing would be the benefits of owning a
company are pretty for and not even just what your
company's worth, but the way you live your life now,
the stress aspect of it, that's a huge element. Like

(40:08):
if it's something that's driving you nuts, then I think
you got to factor that in. If it's having an
impact on your personal life with your family, then I
think you got to factor that in. But I think
it's fair to say the company you're operating, I think
if I took an educated guess, you're probably paying yourself
hundreds of thousands of dollars. You're living pretty well and
benefiting from the equity of the company, and like you said,

(40:30):
living through the company as you should. You guys took
all the fucking rests I would I would recommend keep
ripping and rolling it. Now I saw, you know, Buzz Williams,
the coach formerly of Texas A and M, just took
the Maryland job. And he's had like seven jobs. He
goes to Marquette, then he goes to Virginia Tech, then

(40:50):
he goes to Texa, A and M. Now he goes
to Maryland. And this guy was being interviewed and I
didn't even know who he was, but he said he
was friends with Buzz. And Buzz essentially treats these jobs
like a stock. He gets in low when they're shitty,
he builds them up and makes them good, but then
never stays around for like the second iteration of like, Okay,

(41:12):
let's take the next step and let's maintain this for
twenty years. That don't always work, and then you get
fired and then he just leaves and he just capitalizes
on it. And it's like if you knew that your company,
it's like this is peaked, Like we got to get out,
then obviously it's a no brainer. But if you go
wherever you live, whatever the market conditions, you're like, listen,
I might go through some ups and downs, but this

(41:33):
is going to be a pretty good, fruitful business moving forward.
ID hold on. That'd be if you can handle the stress. Again,
I'm not saying like from a greedy standpoint, but and again,
if you think this is as good as its gonna get,
then obviously. But you know, like I don't know any
of those answers, just like most people when you ask
others for advice, like what should I do to get

(41:56):
involved with a football team? Like I can give you
the basic things, you know, hey, knock on people's doors,
shoot people, email, try, but it's like you kind of
just got to figure it out by yourself at a
certain point, and your kind of gut kind of leads
you that way. Like my dad. I didn't have family
or anyone that like football coaches or NFL scouts, Like fuck,

(42:18):
you just kind of got to figure it out and
you gotta trust your gut. And usually if you're a
smart guy and you sound like one, I think you'll
be okay. So good luck. That's it's tough decision, and
no doubt about that. But I think you already know
the answer to what you're leaning toward. Business alum from
cal Poly, you're always talking about life as a road warrior.

(42:39):
When you were scouting. Are you a big credit card guy?
If so, what's your go to bank for points? We actually,
you know, speaking of what's the best sandwich in San
Luis obispo hotly debated amongst the boys group chat the
other day. Well, obviously, when you're traveling a lot, and
most people, if you're listening to this business, travel a lot,

(43:00):
you're gonna do something that involves an airline or a hotel.
So when I was scouting, I did the Marriott points
and I've done that forever and we recently it should
be announced here relatively soon. Got actually a credit card
company with some points that actually I think is gonna
be I just started using it the points thing in theory,

(43:23):
it sounds great, but I started thinking the other day
with how much money I spent on a credit card
on a yearly basis and what I get at it
from the Marriott points, Like Okay, you got a free
two nights JW for the Super Bowl. It's like, okay, great,
I spent six figures on my fucking credit card bill
this year. It's like, that's all I'm getting here. And
it feels good when you get a free night hotel,

(43:44):
but it's like, are they taking advantage of me? So
I've made it a little pivot here recently, and we'll
be talking about that here in the near future. But
I think most guys in the scouting circles they spent
so many nights in Marriott's that it's like negligent and
not just be a maryad guy because you get so
many benefits. Best sandwich, I mean, it'd have to be

(44:05):
the try Tip at Firestone, which some would argue is
the best try tip in America, which is crazy to
think that in Central California try tip sandwich. There's gotta
be places, and like where barbecue is hot doesn't get
any better, And I'd put Firestone Fries, Tri Tip fries Elite.
If you're just talking normal sandwich, you know I haven't
lived there in I'm forty years old, so I haven't

(44:27):
lived there in eighteen plus years. Probably High Street Deli
that was big when I was there, had a pretty
good deli sandwich. Question for the mailbag, do you think

(44:51):
Jordan Love is good enough to win a Super Bowl
with the Packers. I've seen flashes of excellence in the
second half of his first season as a starter, as
well as the playoff win versus Cowboys. He dealt with
the injuries last season, so I think that's why he
had a bit of a down last year. Also, where
would you rank him as a quarterback? Would you love
to know your thoughts. I think he's tough to rank.

(45:14):
He's I would say, a really you know, I used
to get this sometimes in school, like a incomplete I
n C. They even I mean some of your kids
probably going to school so they don't even give out grades.
We got grades, and if they weren't high enough. I
came from a generation where you got your ass kicked,
but those days are long gone. But I did get
my fair share of I n c's so I think

(45:36):
it's fair to do incomplete. He's really talented guy, a
lot of unknown. Last year was pretty bumpy, obviously the injuries.
His high end his first year starting was pretty good.
But I I would go in complete. Is he good
enough to win a Super Bowl with? I would also
say complete. Yeah, I would say based on what we

(45:58):
saw the flashes two years years ago? Yeah, but was
that a flash in the pan? I don't know. Time
will tell the nosewipe to wipe a guy's nose because
they banned it the other day from the NFL means
you get whacked mob style, a rap reference used mostly
by Atlanta rappers Slim them Out, also refers to the

(46:22):
same thing. Got to show you how to touch him.
I didn't know any of that, okay, I mean if
that's if it's referring to I just put a hit
on that corner and I just score a touchdown. I
get it. I get it. I can see John Morant.
You know what's funny is I kind of appreciate John
Morant doing the double guns even though it's like it's

(46:44):
not a true double guns kind of a week, Like
that's really what he's getting fined for after Adam Silver
told him specifically not to do it shows you how
little he respects the commissioner, how just irrelevant he thinks
that individual is. He literally called him and said, you
get here's a warning. You can't do that anymore. You've
already been in trouble somehow. You got suspended for like

(47:08):
forty games or twenty five games for brandishing a legal
weapon that you owned legally. But Adam Silver is like,
you cannot do that anymore. And John's like, yeah, fucking
do it. Five minutes into the next game. What are
you gonna do about it? I'm gonna find you seventy
five grand. Joe's like, I make thirty five million dollars.
I appreciate that move by Jaw. I mean, it's crazy

(47:30):
how little these players they are, like, we love Adam Silver.
None of you guys listen to anything he says. I
love him too. It's like I love my substitute teacher.
Didn't make us do anything. Do you think the increase
in trades and player movement in general in American sports
is now similar to what we see in soccer? Do
you think American sports will fall suit with more coaches

(47:52):
being signed from other teams, like what happened in soccer,
I didn't Can you just buy a coach like you
can buy a player in soccer? I would say that
is never going to take place here. If you get
a good coach in basketball, football, you know, baseball, none
of the managers make any money. I can't really speak
to hockey, but in basketball and football, he's never gonna

(48:13):
be available like that. Sean Payton quit on the Saints
like they didn't plan on trading him to the Broncos.
He literally is like, yeah, I think we're fucked here.
I'm out. It's like, gee, Shawn so two years ago.
That's why they kind of, you know, held it over
to the Broncos because they're like, we didn't want to
get rid of this guy. Very rare, the John Gruden situation,

(48:35):
and it just doesn't I think those days are done.
It's why it's so stupid when Jay Glazer reports like, yeah,
teams are going to try to trade for Kevin O'Connell's Like,
the Vikings are never trading you Kevin O'Connell. It's never happening,
and every team knows it. That's why they report, like,
come on, what do you think's going on here, trying
to get the guy some money rightfully, so good negotiating.

(48:56):
I think player movement, like, there's kind of always been
player movement. I mean maybe the NFL trades more, but
I mean I think we've seen guys moving teams my
entire life, so I think that's probably a little overblown
now the way they do it. Let's say, like I'm

(49:16):
the Cowboys and I want trying to pick a player.
I want Miles Garrett. Could I just buy Miles Garrett
from the Browns. Let's say I take his hundred million
dollars salary or contract and I pay the Browns like
fifty million dollars. The NFL would never allow that, so

(49:38):
I would lean though, how much longer do you think
party contract negotiation will take. I think they should pay
him as long as it's less than Josh Allen by
some degree, by some degree, Josh Allen's got two hundred
fifty million dollars guaranteed. I mean, by some degree, Josh Allen. Listen,
this is not shitting on Party. I like and respect
Party a lot, and it clearly you can win with them.

(50:00):
Josh Allen's in a different stratosphere, so I don't know
how long this would take. These negotiations complicated, But to me,
Josh Allen and brock Perdy are not in the same conversation,
Like they don't. It's like, it's like, shouldn't even put
those two names in the same world. Like the company

(50:23):
guy that emailed me. There are certain companies like my
company's worth nine ten million dollars, and then there's another
company that's worth five hundred million dollars. They both do
the same thing, like hey, we both build apartment complexes,
but they're not the same. And to me, Josh Allen,
I mean, to me, the the initial offer from the

(50:43):
forty nine er should be like one hundred and twenty
million dollars. The Bills gave Josh Allen a two hundred
fifty million dollars guaranteed extension. He just got extended two
years ago. I mean, they're just because he's that good
longtime Chiefs fan. Since Joe Montana took us the AFC
Championship Game, why do many people believe the Chargers will
win the division over the Chiefs. With Rashi Rice and

(51:05):
Xavier Worthy as more developed wide receivers and with a
serviceable all line, Jalen Moore back up to Trent Williams.
I know he is, uh what, we'll see what position?
I mean, could he play right tackle, left tackle, Kingsley Sumada,
left guard Creed Humphrey, Trace Smith, and Jawan Taylor. Plus
they made multiple key additions to the defense. Yeah. I

(51:28):
just think that the Patriots, it felt like, won the
division nineteen of twenty years, right the years they will
winning the division. I mean, the Jets made the two
championship games. I think as a wild card, the one
year when Brady tore his ACL and eight and Castle started,
they didn't win the division. But I'm pretty sure beside

(51:51):
the eight season that the Patriots, let's go, I'm just
gonna use them as an example. So the Patriot It's divisions.
Basically from two thousand and three two thousand and one,
they won the division. Next year they finished second, they
didn't make the playoffs. But from three till twenty nineteen,

(52:17):
the Patriots won the division every single year, beside the
one Brady towards ACL. The Bills I think are on
a plane to do something like that. If you tell
me they win the division, they've won it five straight years.
Let's say they win it. You know eleven of the
next twelve. I don't mean moving forward. I just mean
over the next seven. Maybe the Patriots win it once,

(52:41):
but if you tell me they do it all the time,
maybe a couple times. Because the variable and the Patriots
be pretty good, but you're dealing with Harbaugh and Sean
Payton and Pete Carroll. Like the division is dramatically better
than it was a couple of years ago. A couple
of years ago it was Josh McDaniels, Brandon Staley and
Nate Hackett. So it's like you think Andy Reid is

(53:03):
gonna listen to he wouldn't like he does have to. Obviously,
Andy just won fifteen games. He's an all time great coach.
But he'd be the first to tell you, like, this
is hard, this is really really hard. So there is
gonna be a year over the next couple where it's
like they might lose a division that they're still gonna
make the playoffs. But yeah, I think the Charge is

(53:25):
gonna be pretty good. I think Denver is gonna be
pretty good. It's going to be hard, It's gonna be hard.
The Patriots really benefited, Like most of that time, the
Bills were a joke. The Dolphins always sucked. The Jets
are the Jets, and he owned the Jets, so it's
like it's it's I mean, the Chiefs could have lost

(53:47):
that game to the Broncos this year when he missed
the field goaler you gotta blocked. It's hard. The Raiders,
for whatever reason, they've occasionally beat him over the years.
But I think you can hold the Chiefs in really,
really high regard. They're one of the great teams we've
ever seen. So are the Bulls and they got pushed.

(54:10):
You know. It's like, doesn't mean you always win the division,
so you can still win the Super Bowl. Help the
Chiefs one year might win the Super Bowl as a wildcard.
We will end on this. This is this question. I
saw this before. I I've lately been taking screenshots so
it's easier than scrolling on Instagram. I just take you know,

(54:31):
like ten screenshots and reabount. But my question is anyone
that read Bill Simmons, Like fifteen years ago, he used
to end his columns with like these are my listeners
or these are my readers, And that's what I would
say here, these are my listeners. Hypothetical question, Say you

(54:52):
went out to dinner Andy Reid, Vince will Fork, and
Vida Veya at a brand new Indian me Mexican fusion
restaurant known for its exotic and spicy dishes. After dinner,
you find yourself in a situation where you need to
desperately use the bathroom and only three small, single person

(55:16):
unventilated bathrooms are available, and you were beaten to them
by all three who are having the same emergency. No
other bathroom is in within range, so you are forced
to wait for them to be done, and amazingly, after
what feels like an eternity, they are all done at
the same time. The question is which bathroom do you

(55:39):
choose to go to and why? That's a great question
and anyone that's ever had those moments. I vividly remember
having one of those moments driving from Cowpaly to Fresno
in California. You know, it's basically middle of nowhere part
of the drive and a disaster struke different than this situation,

(56:02):
but just had to pull over side of the road,
you know, middle of nowhere. I might have used like
my T shirt to wipe, but in this situation, I
think you don't even care. Yeah, at that point, in time,
it does not matter. The no ventilation thing is just
probably the most underrated part about this, right courtesy. Flushes

(56:24):
with no ventilation don't have the same power when there
is a fan. I used to remember when I moved
to San Francisco, a lot of the apartments slash condos,
whatever you consider them, are old, so you would be
with other people, especially if you're a single guy or

(56:46):
single girl dating, and a lot of their bathroom situations
and maybe if you listen live in big city like
New York, you can relate to this. Some of the
bathrooms just don't have a fan. And to me, the
no ventilation, no fan means if you have thin walls,
you can kind of hear what's going on there. So
it's not even just the smell, which in this situation

(57:09):
would not be great. It's the sounds, right. It's why
sometimes if you're in that situation, you turn on the
sink or something, maybe the shower, so no one hears
you listen. I'm obviously in an emergency situation. You know,
bakers can't be choosers here. You just kind of gotta

(57:29):
do what you gotta do. But I'm kind of like
a shit or elitist. I don't like sitting next to
people in public restroom. Not that I won't use a
public restroom, have no problem with doing that, but I'm
a big believer, like I don't if I see stalls
to say, there's four of them, I would never sit
next to another guy. And when another person comes in

(57:50):
when I'm in one, I get very like, I don't
like that feeling. That's a very I just I'm an
isolationist when it comes to that. I remember when I
was at cal Pauly. By the time I was like
my senior year, I had three or four bathrooms throughout
campus that were like high end deans, you know, bathroom

(58:13):
that they used that no one really knew existed. That
I would hit like, I would never use the other bathrooms.
A hack for travelers if you're ever in a predicament,
especially in an area that you don't know, go to
a hotel, Like, don't pull into the McDonald's or the
Jack in the Box or Chevron, go to like the
local Marriott or Hyatt or whatever. Just walk right in

(58:35):
and just go to the bathroom. They were always nice
and taking care of and then you just walk right out.
It's not like they question you. They don't know who's
coming in and out. That's always been a hack. But
to your question, in those situations it's out of your control.
You just go to the first door you see and
you just deal with it. Yeah, I appreciate the question, though,

(58:57):
I really do the volume