Colin’s top takes of the week.
First, he’s joined by NBA legend Julius Irving to discuss his new documentary Soul Power: The Legend of the American Basketball Association (2:30).
Then, he’s joined by Danny Parkins, host of “First Things First” on FS1.
They discuss the absurd posturing over the Chicago Bears and the potential threat to move their new stadium across state lines to Hammond, Indiana (25:00).
They also break down why LeBron means far more to the NBA than he does to the Lakers (34:15), and Colin explains why he’s OUT on the NFL Draft Combine as a TV product (39:30).
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
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Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well, like the rest of you, I love a good
sports documentary, and when I heard there was a doc
on Amazon Prime about the ABA, for many reasons, I
was fascinated. It's called soul Power, the Legends of the ABA.
So I've said many times on my show The Herd
ten times, fifteen times. The first basketball player I fell
(01:24):
in love with was Julius Irving. But I was born
in nineteen sixty four, as Julius now joins us, and
I didn't watch sports until nineteen seventy two. I remember
it clearly. On a black and white TV, Julius, I
watched the Miami Dolphins at the time Washington Redskins Super Bowl.
Dolphins won fourteen to seven. It was about that time.
(01:47):
You know, I'm six years old, seven years old, I'm
getting into sports. So my mom bought me a subscription
to Sports Illustrated so I could watch baseball as the
national pastime on TV. College football. College basketball was big,
But like anything else in life, the one thing I
couldn't get was the ABA. So I had to rely
(02:11):
on the Sporting News, which actually did ABA guides, and
Sports Illustrated twice put you on the cover. I remember this.
So I'm in my formative years and I'm like, Who's
doctor J. Nobody's called doctor J. So because I didn't
get you didn't have a TV contract, because I didn't
(02:32):
get ABA games.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
As a Seattle kid, my.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Parents bought me an ABA ball, So it's fascinating to me.
So let's go back. And I've always felt that the
NBA should include ABA numbers and stats. And the reason
I do is something I think you'll believe in that
I didn't know this about the ABA, Julius. I knew
(02:59):
about the Nuggets and the Spurs. I knew about you,
I knew about how many good players there were. I
did not know much about the exhibition games with the NBA,
in which the ABA teams clabbered them regularly. So let
so let's let's talk. Let's let's start with that. The
(03:22):
NBA in the seventies was considered a little white and overcoached,
and the ABA was more stylistic. It was more fun,
it was more fashionable, it was a little rowdy when
you matched up against those NBA teams.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Was there a chip on you on your.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
League's shoulder, facing like the adult the parent league that
you knew in many instances you were superior to.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Yeah, I played in two of those games.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
And ABA versus NBA, and the excitement surrounding it was
unbelievable because it was just the exhibition season and you know,
we had training camp, play exhibition games, and then play
the regular season, so everyone always look forward to the
regular season in the playoffs, and that was the big
deal with these exhibition games against the NBA. You know,
(04:17):
became a big deal more so for the ABA than
the NBA because the ABA was the league that was
trying to establish itself, also trying to prove it itself
worthy and you know, wanted to have some bragging rights.
So you beat an NBA team, Uh, they're going to
make excuses. They're going to say, well, our guys aren't
in shape and it's only it's only a practice game
(04:41):
or whatever. But you know, the ABA guys who were
probably younger and more excitable, kind of like the young
NBA players are now, you know, looking forward to having
the chip on their shoulder and all of that good stuff.
So so so winning those games, especially if you're playing
on your on your home court, because the city that
you're in, you know, would always stick a chest out
(05:03):
a little bit and say, hey, yeah, you know, you know,
we knock those guys off, and you know, the league's
been around longer, and you know, those names are known.
People know Oscar Robinson's name, Clyde Frasier, Wilt Chamberlain, you
know west Unsel, They know those guys' names, and you
know we took them down.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Those are the same guys.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
You know what, guys, if they cut, they bleed just
like we do. The elbow they've been over, they act
like they're hurt just like we do or whatever. So
you know, we're all human beings. And because you wear
a title and you're you're you wear a moniker or whatever,
that's not gonna make you different.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
That's gonna necessarily make you greater. Uh So, so it
was a.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Good confidence boosted for us, and you know a lot
of people who went to those games alive became believers.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
And also you know that served to feed the cause.
Speaker 4 (05:59):
And the cause was, you know, we had seen the
AFL and the NFL, you know, Merchant some one league,
so we had witnessed that, and globally the same type
of thing was happening. It was happening in soccer, and
it was happening in other sports that have played universally
not necessarily in the United States, so that became a
(06:21):
mission for the ownership the players. You know, my opinion was,
I came out of school after my junior year. I
had played two varsity seasons and our team had been
invited to the n I t Even though our record
was good enough to be invited to the NCAA tournament,
(06:44):
we weren't and it felt like we were snubbed.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
And after that, after.
Speaker 4 (06:50):
My junior year, I got approached by an agent, and
the numbers that they started talking about, you know, were
comparable to the best player in the NBA, and they
were said, this is going to go away.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I mean, if the lead folds, it's going to go away.
Speaker 4 (07:07):
And if the NBA continues to you know, maybe put
you out of business or you know, maintains a superiority.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Complex, then those numbers are going to go away.
Speaker 4 (07:19):
And you know, one hundred thousand is going to turn
into twenty five, thirty thousand or whatever.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So you know, I took the deal. I took the deal.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
It cost me a lot because I was I had
to forego being an Olympian and I had played in
the Olympic Development program and you know, at my size
and with my game, I was the leading scorer and
rebounder in the Olympic development program. We went over to Russia,
Poland and Finland and played, and you know, I was
(07:53):
a shoe to make the team. But that that era
of the representing your country and playing for the United
States of America in nineteen seventy seventy one seventy two
was not the most popular thing to do.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
It's not like we were just dying to do it.
So I chose. I chose the pro pro route.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
And at that time, you know, this is twenty years
before pros were allowed to play in the Olympics, so
you had to be an amateur to play.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
And you know, sorry about you know, getting off.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
The subject, but I'm just kind of this fill space
is very very important in terms of the ABA story,
in the ABA Hockey series, because there's so much to
it beyond just basketball.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
You know, there's the culture you know that we have.
Speaker 4 (08:42):
There's the racial tension you know that was evident, and
and then there's you know, just the global situation where
you know, we're still learning things and there are a
lot of things that have gone on for hundreds of
years that haven't been fixed yet. So who's going to
(09:04):
fix this? Who's going to fix this? So basketball couldn't
be the most important thing for me in my life,
but it was.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
It was. It was the path that I needed to take. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
Yeah, what's interesting because I grew up in the seventies.
You know, the NBA was not a rich league in
the seventies. In fact, I can remember the NBA Finals
being on tape delay after the eleven o'clock news and
young fans now that can watch every game every night,
(09:38):
So I remember NBA teams at that time. Julius traveled
on commercial first flight out of town, out of sea, traveled,
so what right, that's right? So what was travel like? Hotels?
Travel in the ABA, which was financially in a tougher
spot than even the NBA in the early seventh.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Yeah, so so you know, we didn't have the uh,
top notch hotels. We had what was available to us.
We had roommates. You know, everybody had to pick a roommate,
so those single rooms. I didn't experience a single room
until I got in the NBA and I was in
Philadelphia and I didn't want a single room. Actually, Steve
(10:21):
Mixed was my roommate for five seasons. And that was
my boy and I learned a lot from him, and
he learned a lot from me. So yeah, the accommodation piece,
I don't know. You know, if you if your college team,
you know, was in the Big Ten or maybe you
know out there in the at Pac twelve or whatever,
(10:43):
you know, maybe the travel was a little better, maybe
the hotel accommodations were a little better, you know. But
you know, I played in with the Minute Men, uh
formally the UMass red Men, and we were in the
Yankee Conference, right, So our travel, our travel with was
a lot bout bus. I mean, we bussed over to Buffalo,
and we bussed down to Penn Pennsylvania to play Penn
(11:05):
and then all throughout New England we played Vermont, Maine,
New Hampshire, you know, all of those schools.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
And you were built for it and we took buses.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
So the move to the ABA was actually a step
up in terms of traveling and in terms of hotel accommodation.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
So I'm from Seattle. So another player who was groundbreaking
was Spencer Haywood, So I yeah, so you know, I
grew up not only with the downtown Freddie Brown, DJ
Gus Williams, Jack Sikmasonics. I grew up with Spencer Haywood,
John Brisker, the young teams. And I tell people this
because for young fans the ABA. This is why I
(11:45):
supported the live tour to the PGA. My takeaway is, folks,
watch what Lyft and Uber did the taxis you need
disruptors in society, and the ABA was really the one
of the first disruptors in sports in this country. And
when I mean, you were a nine time All Star,
five in the NBA, four in the ABA, you were
(12:07):
a three time, you were a four.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
Times, sixteen time All Star, so you were six.
Speaker 4 (12:14):
I was an All Star every season, but in terms
of all pro that was that was five in the
NBA and four first team in Yeah, I already played
there five years, so I was second team the other year.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
So in the history of American basketball, professional basketball, there's
a real argument that the most unrewarded overlooked player is you.
That you were. You spent probably forty percent of your
best days. You know, you're in your athletic prime in
the ABA. Have you ever thought about, I mean, do
(12:50):
you regret that decision?
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Have you ever thought?
Speaker 5 (12:52):
Man?
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Because the Olympics back in seventy two wasn't what they
are now. We watched for gymnastics, we watched for a
lot of things. The dream Team kind of made the
Olympic Basketball. It's a showcase. But when I look at you,
I think of all the great players, you probably have
(13:14):
been overlooked more than any great player, because I remember
in the seventies turning on the TV I grew up
the Pacific Northwest and watching you against the Blazers and
thinking what am I watching? Have you ever thought about that?
Have you ever had regrets about your journey?
Speaker 4 (13:33):
It's an excellent question, and I kind of stand on
the ground that the journey that I took, the path
that I took, made who I am today. You know,
never wan to ego trip and feel like I deserve
(13:53):
more than I've received. I'm more sensitive to the guys
who didn't recognition. I at least get some recognition. I
was on eight covers of Sports Illustrated and multiple colors
of Sports Magazine, and uh, you know, participated in a
lot of charitable endeavors which led to endorsements.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Yeah, shooting Converse, Yeah, my.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
Shoe deal with Converse, and it's Balding and you know,
my invitation to become a Coca Cola butler with Bruce Llewellen,
and so so there were things that happened. I've had
a good life. I've had had a very very good life.
And could it be better?
Speaker 1 (14:38):
I don't know. It could be different, It could be different.
But my my my empathy.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
Goes, you know, to the guys who have passed on,
don't have the recognition their families, They don't have the
financial support you know of pensions and and gifting and
uh so that the sort of things that are more
important than my ego. And I think that my statistics
(15:08):
can be matched with anybody's. I mean, you know, the
guys who came after me and played better in the
NBA than they played in the ABA. And my stats
in the ABA were probably a little better than the NBA.
But I was playing with a different team. I came
a whole career with the Philadelphia seventy six ers. The
first day I got there, the general manager came in
(15:30):
and said, look, we got George McGinnis here, we got
Doug Collins or whatever, so we don't need you to
score thirty points a game. And I've never experienced that
where I've gone and the coaches told me to tone
it down, or general manager, I said tone it down.
And so they were bursts in which, you know, the
(15:53):
doctor j of the ABA came out. But most of
the time it was as you said about the NBA,
you know, to slow down, structure, structure, playing, playing a
certain type of game. So I was encouraged to play
that type of game, although inside of me, you know,
(16:13):
there was always that ability to do more.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
And who who asked an athlete to do less? Nobody?
It's kind of crazy.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Well, it's interesting because there's so much your journey is
fascinating and and uh, the aforementioned Philadelphia seventy six ers
is one of the first teams I loved, and they
had Steve mix a b a U ab A, George
McGinnis a b A, Bobby Jones a B A. It
was an ABA All Star Jones, Calill Jones. So essentially
(16:47):
that seventy six ers team was an ABA team. Winning
the NBA Finals, was it not?
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Absolutely?
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Going and losing to Portland and winning ultimately in eighty
three against the Lakers. We had met much ABA representation there,
and plus you know, the guys who didn't get the
ABA experience. I always, you know, taught them things that
I brought over from the ABA, you know. And I
(17:16):
used to tell Andrew Tony. I'd say, you know, George
Gervin came in my second year in Virginia and the
practice was over and he wanted to go home, and
I was like, gee, we got work to do.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
You're over here over time.
Speaker 4 (17:36):
So we would stay in the gym and it was
at this Jewish community center. We would stay in the
gym and we played one on one and uh, you know,
maybe put in the extra hour, extra hour and a
half and go home exhausted. And when Andrew Toni came in,
it was the same thing with him. I said, look,
you know you're gonna be my new iceman, Gervon, because
because you're really good, and I could use the work myself,
(18:00):
so you know, I would keep him afterwards. And that
was something that Ray Scott showed me in the ABA about,
you know, stand after putting in the extra time and
you know, really the other things about taking care of
yourself and then the other things about just some fundamental
things that you need to do during the course of
the game. You don't have to always jump as high
(18:21):
as you possibly can. And you see it in today's
game where guys they step back and shoot set shots.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
Whatever, So the jump shot, you know, is a little
bit overstated because you know, the true jump shot where
you go to your pinnacle and your peak and then
you let it go, you don't have to do it,
actually takes more energy and it's actually a risk reward
shot because you probably, if you probably would shoot less
(18:53):
of a percentage from shooting that way as opposed to
stepping back and.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
Shooting set shot.
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Danny Parkins my guy FS one formerly Chicago Radio icon.
This is the slowest three weeks of the year. As
you well know, is that football season ends. We don't
take any days off for six months. Nobody cares. It's lightlifting.
Then you get about four days after the Super Bowl
to chop it up, and then there's like a three
week stretch until NFL Free agency, and you know college
(20:58):
basketball it's into March badness where it's pretty dead. But
I wanted to start today. I was watching JB. Pritzker
as the governor of Illinois. It's for the uninitiated here.
He's one of the richest, one of the richest families
in America. He is the Pritzker family. It's probably the
top four or five richest families in America. A lot
of their you know, net worth was in the highatt
(21:18):
chain and hotels, and in fact, I have a place
in downtown Chicago and JB. Pritzker, somebody's grandfather has a
plaque on the Wall. I see it every time I
go out the door. So and he is the governor.
I think he's a Northwestern duke guy, very very smart guy.
And you know, so the mccaskey's when you hear these
threats by Kevin Warren and the mccaskeys of moving you know,
(21:42):
the Bear Stadium. Good luck negotiating against J. B. Pritzker,
who's a very very sharp guy. He was a businessman,
very successful before he was the governor of the state.
And I think he would run circles around the McCaskey family.
But what is so insane to me? Like I hear
the stories. First of all, Kago is a blue blood
American sports market. It's in the Boston, Philly, Chicago. You
(22:06):
could end the list there. I've always said, people think
New York City is a great sports city, but yet
thirty percent of the people are from you know, Europe, Russia.
I've seen the Rose Bowl ratings in Chicago, and I've
seen them in New York. You know, New York likes
New York. Chicago watches everything college football, bowling, NASCAR, NBA.
(22:30):
Chicago watches everything. It's a great maybe the best American
sports down and the idea that you pull a stadium
out and put it in northern Indiana. And again for
people that don't know what's in northern Indiana, the answer
is nothing. South Bend, Gary Hammond, Fort Wayne's probably got
three hundred thousand people. The people in Indiana would have
(22:51):
to pay for the stadium. There'd be taxes obviously assessed
to build a two and a half billion dollar stadium.
So I look at it and I think this is nonsense.
Speaker 1 (22:59):
JB.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Pritz door, it's going to run circles around the McCaskey
family and all the kids. How do you view it
as somebody that worked here and is a Bears fan.
Speaker 5 (23:07):
Well, so, first of all, I find this story to
be joyless because and so when I get when I
go on the score and you know, I still follow
all those people on social media and they're they're all
my friends and colleagues in Chicago media. I hate how
much they feel like they have to talk about it,
because yes, it is like it matters where the Bears
(23:30):
play football. But this is this is a story of
billionaires trying to get a better tax rate for a
stadium to make them, yes, like they're going to be
the Chicago Bears, whether they're on the lake Front, Northwest
Indiana or Arlington Heights, they will be the Chicago Bears,
just like they are the New York Giants, even though
they play in Jersey. They're the Dallas Cowboys even though
(23:51):
they play in Arlington. And so this is this is
just about a family, the mccaskeys, who inherited a football team.
They are not wealthy like the Pritzkers from High End
or some of the poorest mens among the poorest owners.
Their wealth is a team in which they inherited. And
there's a ton of kids, some of whom want to
(24:11):
sell the team and cash in, others of whom feel
an obligation to keep it in the family. And it
seems like they're going to. But they don't have, you know,
millions and billions of dollars of their own outside of
outside of football. And they've played in Soldier Field, small
stadium in the NFL, and they didn't own they didn't
own it. Like I remember, Kanye West had a concert
(24:34):
the weekend of a Bears game where he brought his
childhood home onto Soldier Field and lit it on fire.
And so the Bears then played a game like eighteen
hours later with just a patch of dead grass.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
In the middle.
Speaker 5 (24:49):
Because they didn't own the stadium, high school kids would
play soccer tournaments and yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
So it was just it's been known as the worst
surface in the league parks and rec and Chicago, and
it's atrocious.
Speaker 5 (25:01):
Correct, And it's finally gotten better recently after like literally
decades of being the worst. But so the point is
it's impossible to get in and out of. Uh, the
renovation was pretty ugly. The field was terrible, and it
wasn't big enough to host a super Bowl and it
didn't have a roof so you can host the Final four.
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Other than that, they nailed it.
Speaker 5 (25:21):
And so then now it's like, Okay, so the mccaski's
want to own their stadium, fine, but they don't have
the money to do it.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well. JB.
Speaker 5 (25:28):
Pritzker, as you mentioned, smart business guy, Illinois, blue state,
it's not very politically popular too to have publicly funded stadiums, right.
You saw what happened with the chiefs in Missouri and Kansas,
a couple of red states, and they are gonna they're
(25:49):
getting laughed at for how much public funding they're planning
going to pony up for the new Chief Stadium. So
Indiana red state, they're going to do it, or they're
going to offer to do it. But my gut tells
me they go to Arlington Heights. I don't think George
McCaskey has it in them to have the Bears leave
the state of Illinois when he inherited it from you know,
(26:10):
Virginia McCaskey marriage. George allis the whole thing. Like I
just they bought Arlington Racetrack. They spent three hundred million dollars,
or they spent more than that. It's three hundred and
twenty acres of land for however many hundreds and millions
of dollars they bought it for. They're not real estate developers,
like they bought that land for a reason.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
So this is all just a game of chicken.
Speaker 5 (26:33):
It's all just to get Arlington Heights to lower their
property tax rate. And so I find the story to
be joyless because it's literally just about ken the mccaskey's
increase their net worth by building an entertainment complex around
the new stadium that they will finally own. I just
don't care about it that much to he totally can't
it just who cares? Who cares they're gonna be the
(26:56):
Kayleb Williams is gonna be the quarterback of the Chicago Bears.
Call it with Ben Johnson along the plays. Whether it's
an Arlington, Arlington Heights or Northwest Indiana, I honestly don't
care very much.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
Yeah, Arlington Heights is close to my house, so I'm
obviously don't feel like going to Hammond, Indiana.
Speaker 5 (27:14):
Can I tell you one thing about ham in Indiana.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
It's where the casinos And there's probably only one thing
about ham in Indiana.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Okay, Well, so it's where I would gamble because that's
where you get That's where there were casinos. So it's
right over the border, like it's Northwest Siana is Chicago Land.
Speaker 3 (27:35):
It's the real thing called the region.
Speaker 5 (27:37):
Like I had radio partners, you know, who lived there
because of the taxes and it was so much. You
could work in Chicago, pay the nine dollars toll and
then pay way fewer taxes in Indiana.
Speaker 3 (27:48):
But I would.
Speaker 5 (27:49):
I would live in Wrigleyville and drive there every day
and play poker when I was twenty two years old,
because that's where all of the casinos were now.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
It's disgusting.
Speaker 5 (27:58):
It's it's gary, it's bad, it's smoke stacks, it's prison,
it's terrible. But you know, cheap land and property taxes.
So maybe they'll build a stad in there. I doubt it.
I doubt it.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Where do you think they're going to go? Arlington Heights.
I don't buy it at all. This is a blue
but I mean the Niners play out in Santa Clara,
So California is such a massive state, but.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
There's nothing in Indiana.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Even Indianapolis is a snooze. I mean, you know a
state's a bad food state when you say where do
you go to eat in Indianapolis and everybody gives you
one restaurant, Saint Elmots.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Yeah, it's just And there's nothing against Indiana, but I
mean it's the state's not wealthy the states. It's just
not a place that local taxpayers in Indiana don't care
about the Bears. They love the Colts. You know what
the best part about Indiana is Bloomington. That is a
great town. Bloomington's a great college town.
Speaker 5 (28:51):
Sure and listen, and I've had plenty of good times
in South Bend going to football games. It's just I don't.
They hired Kevin Warren to get this thing done because
he helped spearhead the stadium for the Vikings, which is arguably
the best stadium in the NFL. And he just came
in with a lot of bluster, being like we're going
(29:13):
to get shovels in the ground. He promised shovels in
the ground in twenty twenty five. We're recording this on
March first of twenty twenty six, and we're still playing
one state against another and three different locations against each other,
and there's no shovels in the ground happening anytime soon.
So it's just it's a manipulative story. The Bears are
(29:35):
leaking a ton of stuff to a ton of local Yeah,
that's eating it up, which drives me insane, Like this
is just a game of political chicken and just let
it play out.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
They'll end up in Arlington Heights and everything will be fine.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
It's interesting with Lebron. You know the Dodgers owners now
on the Lakers, and you know they let go of
Cody Bellinger and Scott Sager and Trey Turner on the
batting title and Manny Machado in his Prime, which I
was surprised with Zach Grinky.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
They don't don't let go of people.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
And by the way, all the analytics tell you that
Luke and Lebron on the floor don't work because and
for obvious reasons. One they both need the ball. Two
both are I mean, Lebron is now the second slowest
player in the league. So like the tandem of Luke
and Lebron is like it's a disaster on the floor.
But not to include myself in this, but I saw
(30:26):
this week like Chris Berman announced his retirement and it'll
be like in a year and he'll have worked like
fifty years at ESPN. And that's Jeter, that's Kobe. When
you play for one team, that's Dan Marino, right, So
there's this love. You know, I've bounced around in different
companies beyond I've been a bit of a mercenary. You know,
have microphone, will travel, what's the best offer, what's the
(30:48):
best commerce. That was best for my family. That's why
I did it. I could have stayed everywhere if things
worked out. But the downside of being a mercenary in
basketball and broadcasting, in politics, the downside to being a
mercenary is there's not a lot of romanticism about it, right, Like, like, so, Lebron,
you can show him the door tomorrow. Magic Johnson walks
(31:10):
into that arena. He's still more beloved than Lebron, like
to this day. He walks into the Staples, and it's
fascinating to watch the crowd stands. It's like, oh, there's Magic.
You've never seen him your all season to get holders.
So my take is the advantage the Dodgers have is
you can let Lebron go and people will be like, well,
I'll building a statue and I don't think like like,
(31:32):
it's not Jordan, it's not No, it's it's not the
eighty five Bears.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
It's well.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
And I defended Lebron's mobility, but like La is distracted,
like nobody's gonna care.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
No, So a couple of things.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
First of all, we will romanticize you, Colin whenever you
want to hang it up. I promise you, I promise you.
We will give you your flowers. No, don't don't worry.
You're very important to all of us at the blah
blah blah and the volume. So yeah, you are. You
are the son of which we all know. So don't,
(32:06):
So don't worry. You'll get You'll get your flowers, and
you're goodbye to her. But you're you're not You're not
going anywhere anytime soon. Lebron means more to the NBA
than he means to the Lakers.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
I totally agree.
Speaker 5 (32:19):
But you know, like that, I wouldn't worry if I
were if I owned the Lakers about saying goodbye to Lebron,
But I would worry if I was Adam Silver about
saying goodbye to Lebron. Lebron still matters. He is still interesting.
People still care about him. I went to the Bulls
game with Lebron. He was the most popular player.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
I mean, of course he was the most popular. He's
one of the most famous people in the world. He's
maybe one.
Speaker 5 (32:46):
Of the most famous. He's one of the greatest athletes
ever any sport. He's it's either remarkable. It's remarkable, like
he he's taking up golf and I can't get enough
of it. Like I like watching the clips of Lebron
trying to learn golf because it's like, oh, man, Lebron,
he's just like me. He's yeah, duffing it out of
(33:06):
the rough like he's I would imagine, like, obviously, I
have no idea what it's like to be Lebron, obviously.
Speaker 4 (33:15):
But.
Speaker 5 (33:17):
I gotta think if I was Himmer in his camp,
there would be a sinister part of me that when
he retires would wonder what shows like ours on both
networks would talk about we've spent I mean, you've been
at this long than me. I've been doing National TV
for a year and a half. How many thousands of
(33:39):
hours between the two networks do you think Lebron has programmed?
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Oh, I said fifty. I said this to a baseball
executive ten years ago. I was about a year before
I left ESPN, and I told this baseball executive. It
was at some it was in Connecticut, and there were
a bunch of baseball people there. I said, do you
understand nobody talks about your sport? And you may look
(34:03):
at first take and you may you know, my show
wasn't a thing at FS one yet or but I
mentioned four or five popular hosts, and Tony and Mike
and all them, you know get I don't even think
Get Up was a show yet. But I said, you know,
Mike and Mike I think was Mike, And I said,
nobody talks baseball. I said, do you understand how many
free hours the NFL and the NBA get on these networks.
(34:23):
It's insane. Now baseball, Oh, Taani the dog. That's why
the Dodgers, You and I have said this, They're great
for baseball. They got a villain again for the first
time in twenty years. Like they need a villain, they
need a bad guy. So yeah, no, I think there
isn't really. In fact, I've noticed Danny when I talk
NBA now, I talk Nicks. I don't talk players. I
(34:45):
talk Nicks, I talk Oh, I don't talk Warriors. I
would say Celtics, Knicks, Lakers. I don't really talk a player.
I really don't. And I think that's that's one of
the challenges the NBA had, because it's always been its
most popular when there's a galvanizing or polarizing figure to
(35:06):
lead the way NFL combine is something. And I think
I we touched on this earlier. I I it EBB
and flows on what I talked about college football got
too regional.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
I stopped talking about it to a large degree. Now
it's back.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Jim Harborough brought it back. The Big Ten brought it back.
Now I talk about it all the time, the NFL combine.
I am out on. I am out on the NFL
the last two years, and I.
Speaker 3 (35:33):
Yes, you were.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah, I think, I think probe. I think for a
long time it was just NFL and I loved I like.
I like the convergence of college and pro I love
the draft. I love the combine that makes sense, but
it's so rehearsed. Many of the stars don't show up.
I don't care about people's hand size.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
I really don't care.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
And the truth is, I think one of the things
that's really smart. One of the reasons I love the
way the la Rams do business is they're not They're
willing to say things and do things that other people won't.
They just said several years ago, we're not going that.
We do our own homework. We have tape, we can
go to the Senior Bowl. We're not doing a quick
fifteen minute interview where Johnny Manzel had NFL teams believing
(36:15):
he was Peyton Manning.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
It's like, let's ride I never want.
Speaker 2 (36:19):
It's a bullshit seminar and it's just polished visa. The agents.
These guys come in with talking points. They train in Phoenix,
you know, everybody runs their fastest forty. Everybody's got abs.
You know, it's like everybody has their best vertical. It's football.
By October twelfth, nobody runs a four to three. Not
(36:40):
even the four to three guys. They've got a bad hip,
they've got an ankle spring like like the whole league's
beat up by week six. It's just it's a sport
of attrition. You're just trying to get your best players available,
like down the stretch. So I find myself, like, we
know who's going.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
To go number one? Is there anything that you have
moved out of? Like, I'm just not.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
I was never a home run derby guy, for instance.
I was never so that I was never in. I
didn't leave it.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
Pro Bowl.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
I've joked, I've never watched four plays. I think the
last time I watched the Pro Bowl. Walter Abercrombie was
a running back for the Baylor Bears and the Steelers briefly.
I don't even know where he played, Like I remember
watching it.
Speaker 3 (37:17):
He had a big run.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
I think it was him, So I don't. I don't
watch that combine I used to. I'm it doesn't do
a thing for me now it turned it on for
twenty minutes today and I moved over to the NBA
and said more interested.
Speaker 5 (37:30):
Yeah, So the combine like that was one that I
always I I understood it because the NFL is just
the cash cow and it's the thing that makes the
whole business go. But like, man, these networks really invested
in their combine coverage. They're they're on live for the
whole time that you know, rich Eisen is running the
(37:51):
forty like he's participating running like you know what I mean.
Like they made it into like big business in big TV.
And the whole time, I was like, this is the
underwear Olympics for a that like I'm not sure we
like should be having. And it's just like they it's
between all the college football tape and the in person
interviews and the pro days and like the number one
(38:11):
pick never throws, like it's just like it's just go
get your height and your weight measured basically. Like So
I just I never was that enthralled by it and
was kind of amazed that these networks could get yeah,
eight hours a day of televised content out of it.
So I've never been a huge combine guy. Regular season
(38:34):
college basketball is something that I very much used to love.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
And now yeah, really I think America did.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
Yeah, I used to love it, and part of it,
part of was age too, To be honest with you, like,
just like I went to Syracuse that that program mattered.
Then I worked in Kansas City, so I was around
KU that program mattered. Good college basketball markets. But then,
like you, you grow further, you grow up, you grew
further away from your alma mater, you moved to a
(39:02):
pro sport market. You realize that, like you know, it
doesn't matter, like you doesn't. You can go they're ten
and eight in the Big Ten and make the tournament
and then make a run. So like one game doesn't
mean all that much. So you have regular season college
basketball has lost me tremendously.
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Speaker 2 (01:01):
Well, like the rest of you, I love a good
sports documentary, and when I heard there was a doc
on Amazon Prime about the ABA, for many reasons, I
was fascinated. It's called soul Power, the Legends of the ABA.
So I've said many times on my show The Herd
ten times, fifteen times. The first basketball player I fell
(01:24):
in love with was Julius Irving. But I was born
in nineteen sixty four, as Julius now joins us, and
I didn't watch sports until nineteen seventy two. I remember
it clearly. On a black and white TV, Julius, I
watched the Miami Dolphins at the time Washington Redskins Super Bowl.
Dolphins won fourteen to seven. It was about that time.
(01:47):
You know, I'm six years old, seven years old, I'm
getting into sports. So my mom bought me a subscription
to Sports Illustrated so I could watch baseball as the
national pastime on TV. College football. College basketball was big,
But like anything else in life, the one thing I
couldn't get was the ABA. So I had to rely
(02:11):
on the Sporting News, which actually did ABA guides, and
Sports Illustrated twice put you on the cover. I remember this.
So I'm in my formative years and I'm like, Who's
doctor J. Nobody's called doctor J. So because I didn't
get you didn't have a TV contract, because I didn't
(02:32):
get ABA games.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
As a Seattle kid, my.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Parents bought me an ABA ball, So it's fascinating to me.
So let's go back. And I've always felt that the
NBA should include ABA numbers and stats. And the reason
I do is something I think you'll believe in that
I didn't know this about the ABA, Julius. I knew
(02:59):
about the Nuggets and the Spurs. I knew about you,
I knew about how many good players there were. I
did not know much about the exhibition games with the NBA,
in which the ABA teams clabbered them regularly. So let
so let's let's talk. Let's let's start with that. The
(03:22):
NBA in the seventies was considered a little white and overcoached,
and the ABA was more stylistic. It was more fun,
it was more fashionable, it was a little rowdy when
you matched up against those NBA teams.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Was there a chip on you on your.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
League's shoulder, facing like the adult the parent league that
you knew in many instances you were superior to.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Yeah, I played in two of those games.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
And ABA versus NBA, and the excitement surrounding it was
unbelievable because it was just the exhibition season and you know,
we had training camp, play exhibition games, and then play
the regular season, so everyone always look forward to the
regular season in the playoffs, and that was the big
deal with these exhibition games against the NBA. You know,
(04:17):
became a big deal more so for the ABA than
the NBA because the ABA was the league that was
trying to establish itself, also trying to prove it itself
worthy and you know, wanted to have some bragging rights.
So you beat an NBA team, Uh, they're going to
make excuses. They're going to say, well, our guys aren't
in shape and it's only it's only a practice game
(04:41):
or whatever. But you know, the ABA guys who were
probably younger and more excitable, kind of like the young
NBA players are now, you know, looking forward to having
the chip on their shoulder and all of that good stuff.
So so so winning those games, especially if you're playing
on your on your home court, because the city that
you're in, you know, would always stick a chest out
(05:03):
a little bit and say, hey, yeah, you know, you know,
we knock those guys off, and you know, the league's
been around longer, and you know, those names are known.
People know Oscar Robinson's name, Clyde Frasier, Wilt Chamberlain, you
know west Unsel, They know those guys' names, and you
know we took them down.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
Those are the same guys.
Speaker 4 (05:21):
You know what, guys, if they cut, they bleed just
like we do. The elbow they've been over, they act
like they're hurt just like we do or whatever. So
you know, we're all human beings. And because you wear
a title and you're you're you wear a moniker or whatever,
that's not gonna make you different.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
That's gonna necessarily make you greater. Uh So, so it
was a.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Good confidence boosted for us, and you know a lot
of people who went to those games alive became believers.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
And also you know that served to feed the cause.
Speaker 4 (05:59):
And the cause was, you know, we had seen the
AFL and the NFL, you know, Merchant some one league,
so we had witnessed that, and globally the same type
of thing was happening. It was happening in soccer, and
it was happening in other sports that have played universally
not necessarily in the United States, so that became a
(06:21):
mission for the ownership the players. You know, my opinion was,
I came out of school after my junior year. I
had played two varsity seasons and our team had been
invited to the n I t Even though our record
was good enough to be invited to the NCAA tournament,
(06:44):
we weren't and it felt like we were snubbed.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
And after that, after.
Speaker 4 (06:50):
My junior year, I got approached by an agent, and
the numbers that they started talking about, you know, were
comparable to the best player in the NBA, and they
were said, this is going to go away.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I mean, if the lead folds, it's going to go away.
Speaker 4 (07:07):
And if the NBA continues to you know, maybe put
you out of business or you know, maintains a superiority.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Complex, then those numbers are going to go away.
Speaker 4 (07:19):
And you know, one hundred thousand is going to turn
into twenty five, thirty thousand or whatever.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So you know, I took the deal. I took the deal.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
It cost me a lot because I was I had
to forego being an Olympian and I had played in
the Olympic Development program and you know, at my size
and with my game, I was the leading scorer and
rebounder in the Olympic development program. We went over to Russia,
Poland and Finland and played, and you know, I was
(07:53):
a shoe to make the team. But that that era
of the representing your country and playing for the United
States of America in nineteen seventy seventy one seventy two
was not the most popular thing to do.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
It's not like we were just dying to do it.
So I chose. I chose the pro pro route.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
And at that time, you know, this is twenty years
before pros were allowed to play in the Olympics, so
you had to be an amateur to play.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
And you know, sorry about you know, getting off.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
The subject, but I'm just kind of this fill space
is very very important in terms of the ABA story,
in the ABA Hockey series, because there's so much to
it beyond just basketball.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
You know, there's the culture you know that we have.
Speaker 4 (08:42):
There's the racial tension you know that was evident, and
and then there's you know, just the global situation where
you know, we're still learning things and there are a
lot of things that have gone on for hundreds of
years that haven't been fixed yet. So who's going to
(09:04):
fix this? Who's going to fix this? So basketball couldn't
be the most important thing for me in my life,
but it was.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
It was. It was the path that I needed to take. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
Yeah, what's interesting because I grew up in the seventies.
You know, the NBA was not a rich league in
the seventies. In fact, I can remember the NBA Finals
being on tape delay after the eleven o'clock news and
young fans now that can watch every game every night,
(09:38):
So I remember NBA teams at that time. Julius traveled
on commercial first flight out of town, out of sea, traveled,
so what right, that's right? So what was travel like? Hotels?
Travel in the ABA, which was financially in a tougher
spot than even the NBA in the early seventh.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Yeah, so so you know, we didn't have the uh,
top notch hotels. We had what was available to us.
We had roommates. You know, everybody had to pick a roommate,
so those single rooms. I didn't experience a single room
until I got in the NBA and I was in
Philadelphia and I didn't want a single room. Actually, Steve
(10:21):
Mixed was my roommate for five seasons. And that was
my boy and I learned a lot from him, and
he learned a lot from me. So yeah, the accommodation piece,
I don't know. You know, if you if your college team,
you know, was in the Big Ten or maybe you
know out there in the at Pac twelve or whatever,
(10:43):
you know, maybe the travel was a little better, maybe
the hotel accommodations were a little better, you know. But
you know, I played in with the Minute Men, uh
formally the UMass red Men, and we were in the
Yankee Conference, right, So our travel, our travel with was
a lot bout bus. I mean, we bussed over to Buffalo,
and we bussed down to Penn Pennsylvania to play Penn
(11:05):
and then all throughout New England we played Vermont, Maine,
New Hampshire, you know, all of those schools.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
And you were built for it and we took buses.
Speaker 4 (11:15):
So the move to the ABA was actually a step
up in terms of traveling and in terms of hotel accommodation.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
So I'm from Seattle. So another player who was groundbreaking
was Spencer Haywood, So I yeah, so you know, I
grew up not only with the downtown Freddie Brown, DJ
Gus Williams, Jack Sikmasonics. I grew up with Spencer Haywood,
John Brisker, the young teams. And I tell people this
because for young fans the ABA. This is why I
(11:45):
supported the live tour to the PGA. My takeaway is, folks,
watch what Lyft and Uber did the taxis you need
disruptors in society, and the ABA was really the one
of the first disruptors in sports in this country. And
when I mean, you were a nine time All Star,
five in the NBA, four in the ABA, you were
(12:07):
a three time, you were a four.
Speaker 1 (12:10):
Times, sixteen time All Star, so you were six.
Speaker 4 (12:14):
I was an All Star every season, but in terms
of all pro that was that was five in the
NBA and four first team in Yeah, I already played
there five years, so I was second team the other year.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
So in the history of American basketball, professional basketball, there's
a real argument that the most unrewarded overlooked player is you.
That you were. You spent probably forty percent of your
best days. You know, you're in your athletic prime in
the ABA. Have you ever thought about, I mean, do
(12:50):
you regret that decision?
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Have you ever thought?
Speaker 5 (12:52):
Man?
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Because the Olympics back in seventy two wasn't what they
are now. We watched for gymnastics, we watched for a
lot of things. The dream Team kind of made the
Olympic Basketball. It's a showcase. But when I look at you,
I think of all the great players, you probably have
(13:14):
been overlooked more than any great player, because I remember
in the seventies turning on the TV I grew up
the Pacific Northwest and watching you against the Blazers and
thinking what am I watching? Have you ever thought about that?
Have you ever had regrets about your journey?
Speaker 4 (13:33):
It's an excellent question, and I kind of stand on
the ground that the journey that I took, the path
that I took, made who I am today. You know,
never wan to ego trip and feel like I deserve
(13:53):
more than I've received. I'm more sensitive to the guys
who didn't recognition. I at least get some recognition. I
was on eight covers of Sports Illustrated and multiple colors
of Sports Magazine, and uh, you know, participated in a
lot of charitable endeavors which led to endorsements.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
Yeah, shooting Converse, Yeah, my.
Speaker 4 (14:19):
Shoe deal with Converse, and it's Balding and you know,
my invitation to become a Coca Cola butler with Bruce Llewellen,
and so so there were things that happened. I've had
a good life. I've had had a very very good life.
And could it be better?
Speaker 1 (14:38):
I don't know. It could be different, It could be different.
But my my my empathy.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
Goes, you know, to the guys who have passed on,
don't have the recognition their families, They don't have the
financial support you know of pensions and and gifting and
uh so that the sort of things that are more
important than my ego. And I think that my statistics
(15:08):
can be matched with anybody's. I mean, you know, the
guys who came after me and played better in the
NBA than they played in the ABA. And my stats
in the ABA were probably a little better than the NBA.
But I was playing with a different team. I came
a whole career with the Philadelphia seventy six ers. The
first day I got there, the general manager came in
(15:30):
and said, look, we got George McGinnis here, we got
Doug Collins or whatever, so we don't need you to
score thirty points a game. And I've never experienced that
where I've gone and the coaches told me to tone
it down, or general manager, I said tone it down.
And so they were bursts in which, you know, the
(15:53):
doctor j of the ABA came out. But most of
the time it was as you said about the NBA,
you know, to slow down, structure, structure, playing, playing a
certain type of game. So I was encouraged to play
that type of game, although inside of me, you know,
(16:13):
there was always that ability to do more.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
And who who asked an athlete to do less? Nobody?
It's kind of crazy.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Well, it's interesting because there's so much your journey is
fascinating and and uh, the aforementioned Philadelphia seventy six ers
is one of the first teams I loved, and they
had Steve mix a b a U ab A, George
McGinnis a b A, Bobby Jones a B A. It
was an ABA All Star Jones, Calill Jones. So essentially
(16:47):
that seventy six ers team was an ABA team. Winning
the NBA Finals, was it not?
Speaker 1 (16:54):
Absolutely?
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Going and losing to Portland and winning ultimately in eighty
three against the Lakers. We had met much ABA representation there,
and plus you know, the guys who didn't get the
ABA experience. I always, you know, taught them things that
I brought over from the ABA, you know. And I
(17:16):
used to tell Andrew Tony. I'd say, you know, George
Gervin came in my second year in Virginia and the
practice was over and he wanted to go home, and
I was like, gee, we got work to do.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
You're over here over time.
Speaker 4 (17:36):
So we would stay in the gym and it was
at this Jewish community center. We would stay in the
gym and we played one on one and uh, you know,
maybe put in the extra hour, extra hour and a
half and go home exhausted. And when Andrew Toni came in,
it was the same thing with him. I said, look,
you know you're gonna be my new iceman, Gervon, because
because you're really good, and I could use the work myself,
(18:00):
so you know, I would keep him afterwards. And that
was something that Ray Scott showed me in the ABA about,
you know, stand after putting in the extra time and
you know, really the other things about taking care of
yourself and then the other things about just some fundamental
things that you need to do during the course of
the game. You don't have to always jump as high
(18:21):
as you possibly can. And you see it in today's
game where guys they step back and shoot set shots.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
Whatever, So the jump shot, you know, is a little
bit overstated because you know, the true jump shot where
you go to your pinnacle and your peak and then
you let it go, you don't have to do it,
actually takes more energy and it's actually a risk reward
shot because you probably, if you probably would shoot less
(18:53):
of a percentage from shooting that way as opposed to
stepping back and.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
Shooting set shot.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
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(20:35):
Danny Parkins my guy FS one formerly Chicago Radio icon.
This is the slowest three weeks of the year. As
you well know, is that football season ends. We don't
take any days off for six months. Nobody cares. It's lightlifting.
Then you get about four days after the Super Bowl
to chop it up, and then there's like a three
week stretch until NFL Free agency, and you know college
(20:58):
basketball it's into March badness where it's pretty dead. But
I wanted to start today. I was watching JB. Pritzker
as the governor of Illinois. It's for the uninitiated here.
He's one of the richest, one of the richest families
in America. He is the Pritzker family. It's probably the
top four or five richest families in America. A lot
of their you know, net worth was in the highatt
(21:18):
chain and hotels, and in fact, I have a place
in downtown Chicago and JB. Pritzker, somebody's grandfather has a
plaque on the Wall. I see it every time I
go out the door. So and he is the governor.
I think he's a Northwestern duke guy, very very smart guy.
And you know, so the mccaskey's when you hear these
threats by Kevin Warren and the mccaskeys of moving you know,
(21:42):
the Bear Stadium. Good luck negotiating against J. B. Pritzker,
who's a very very sharp guy. He was a businessman,
very successful before he was the governor of the state.
And I think he would run circles around the McCaskey family.
But what is so insane to me? Like I hear
the stories. First of all, Kago is a blue blood
American sports market. It's in the Boston, Philly, Chicago. You
(22:06):
could end the list there. I've always said, people think
New York City is a great sports city, but yet
thirty percent of the people are from you know, Europe, Russia.
I've seen the Rose Bowl ratings in Chicago, and I've
seen them in New York. You know, New York likes
New York. Chicago watches everything college football, bowling, NASCAR, NBA.
(22:30):
Chicago watches everything. It's a great maybe the best American
sports down and the idea that you pull a stadium
out and put it in northern Indiana. And again for
people that don't know what's in northern Indiana, the answer
is nothing. South Bend, Gary Hammond, Fort Wayne's probably got
three hundred thousand people. The people in Indiana would have
(22:51):
to pay for the stadium. There'd be taxes obviously assessed
to build a two and a half billion dollar stadium.
So I look at it and I think this is nonsense.
Speaker 1 (22:59):
JB.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Pritz door, it's going to run circles around the McCaskey
family and all the kids. How do you view it
as somebody that worked here and is a Bears fan.
Speaker 5 (23:07):
Well, so, first of all, I find this story to
be joyless because and so when I get when I
go on the score and you know, I still follow
all those people on social media and they're they're all
my friends and colleagues in Chicago media. I hate how
much they feel like they have to talk about it,
because yes, it is like it matters where the Bears
(23:30):
play football. But this is this is a story of
billionaires trying to get a better tax rate for a
stadium to make them, yes, like they're going to be
the Chicago Bears, whether they're on the lake Front, Northwest
Indiana or Arlington Heights, they will be the Chicago Bears,
just like they are the New York Giants, even though
they play in Jersey. They're the Dallas Cowboys even though
(23:51):
they play in Arlington. And so this is this is
just about a family, the mccaskeys, who inherited a football team.
They are not wealthy like the Pritzkers from High End
or some of the poorest mens among the poorest owners.
Their wealth is a team in which they inherited. And
there's a ton of kids, some of whom want to
(24:11):
sell the team and cash in, others of whom feel
an obligation to keep it in the family. And it
seems like they're going to. But they don't have, you know,
millions and billions of dollars of their own outside of
outside of football. And they've played in Soldier Field, small
stadium in the NFL, and they didn't own they didn't
own it. Like I remember, Kanye West had a concert
(24:34):
the weekend of a Bears game where he brought his
childhood home onto Soldier Field and lit it on fire.
And so the Bears then played a game like eighteen
hours later with just a patch of dead grass.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
In the middle.
Speaker 5 (24:49):
Because they didn't own the stadium, high school kids would
play soccer tournaments and yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
So it was just it's been known as the worst
surface in the league parks and rec and Chicago, and
it's atrocious.
Speaker 5 (25:01):
Correct, And it's finally gotten better recently after like literally
decades of being the worst. But so the point is
it's impossible to get in and out of. Uh, the
renovation was pretty ugly. The field was terrible, and it
wasn't big enough to host a super Bowl and it
didn't have a roof so you can host the Final four.
Speaker 3 (25:18):
Other than that, they nailed it.
Speaker 5 (25:21):
And so then now it's like, Okay, so the mccaski's
want to own their stadium, fine, but they don't have
the money to do it.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well. JB.
Speaker 5 (25:28):
Pritzker, as you mentioned, smart business guy, Illinois, blue state,
it's not very politically popular too to have publicly funded stadiums, right.
You saw what happened with the chiefs in Missouri and Kansas,
a couple of red states, and they are gonna they're
(25:49):
getting laughed at for how much public funding they're planning
going to pony up for the new Chief Stadium. So
Indiana red state, they're going to do it, or they're
going to offer to do it. But my gut tells
me they go to Arlington Heights. I don't think George
McCaskey has it in them to have the Bears leave
the state of Illinois when he inherited it from you know,
(26:10):
Virginia McCaskey marriage. George allis the whole thing. Like I
just they bought Arlington Racetrack. They spent three hundred million dollars,
or they spent more than that. It's three hundred and
twenty acres of land for however many hundreds and millions
of dollars they bought it for. They're not real estate developers,
like they bought that land for a reason.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
So this is all just a game of chicken.
Speaker 5 (26:33):
It's all just to get Arlington Heights to lower their
property tax rate. And so I find the story to
be joyless because it's literally just about ken the mccaskey's
increase their net worth by building an entertainment complex around
the new stadium that they will finally own. I just
don't care about it that much to he totally can't
it just who cares? Who cares they're gonna be the
(26:56):
Kayleb Williams is gonna be the quarterback of the Chicago Bears.
Call it with Ben Johnson along the plays. Whether it's
an Arlington, Arlington Heights or Northwest Indiana, I honestly don't
care very much.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
Yeah, Arlington Heights is close to my house, so I'm
obviously don't feel like going to Hammond, Indiana.
Speaker 5 (27:14):
Can I tell you one thing about ham in Indiana.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
It's where the casinos And there's probably only one thing
about ham in Indiana.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Okay, Well, so it's where I would gamble because that's
where you get That's where there were casinos. So it's
right over the border, like it's Northwest Siana is Chicago Land.
Speaker 3 (27:35):
It's the real thing called the region.
Speaker 5 (27:37):
Like I had radio partners, you know, who lived there
because of the taxes and it was so much. You
could work in Chicago, pay the nine dollars toll and
then pay way fewer taxes in Indiana.
Speaker 3 (27:48):
But I would.
Speaker 5 (27:49):
I would live in Wrigleyville and drive there every day
and play poker when I was twenty two years old,
because that's where all of the casinos were now.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
It's disgusting.
Speaker 5 (27:58):
It's it's gary, it's bad, it's smoke stacks, it's prison,
it's terrible. But you know, cheap land and property taxes.
So maybe they'll build a stad in there. I doubt it.
I doubt it.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
Where do you think they're going to go? Arlington Heights.
I don't buy it at all. This is a blue
but I mean the Niners play out in Santa Clara,
So California is such a massive state, but.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
There's nothing in Indiana.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Even Indianapolis is a snooze. I mean, you know a
state's a bad food state when you say where do
you go to eat in Indianapolis and everybody gives you
one restaurant, Saint Elmots.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Yeah, it's just And there's nothing against Indiana, but I
mean it's the state's not wealthy the states. It's just
not a place that local taxpayers in Indiana don't care
about the Bears. They love the Colts. You know what
the best part about Indiana is Bloomington. That is a
great town. Bloomington's a great college town.
Speaker 5 (28:51):
Sure and listen, and I've had plenty of good times
in South Bend going to football games. It's just I don't.
They hired Kevin Warren to get this thing done because
he helped spearhead the stadium for the Vikings, which is arguably
the best stadium in the NFL. And he just came
in with a lot of bluster, being like we're going
(29:13):
to get shovels in the ground. He promised shovels in
the ground in twenty twenty five. We're recording this on
March first of twenty twenty six, and we're still playing
one state against another and three different locations against each other,
and there's no shovels in the ground happening anytime soon.
So it's just it's a manipulative story. The Bears are
(29:35):
leaking a ton of stuff to a ton of local Yeah,
that's eating it up, which drives me insane, Like this
is just a game of political chicken and just let
it play out.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
They'll end up in Arlington Heights and everything will be fine.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
It's interesting with Lebron. You know the Dodgers owners now
on the Lakers, and you know they let go of
Cody Bellinger and Scott Sager and Trey Turner on the
batting title and Manny Machado in his Prime, which I
was surprised with Zach Grinky.
Speaker 3 (30:02):
They don't don't let go of people.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
And by the way, all the analytics tell you that
Luke and Lebron on the floor don't work because and
for obvious reasons. One they both need the ball. Two
both are I mean, Lebron is now the second slowest
player in the league. So like the tandem of Luke
and Lebron is like it's a disaster on the floor.
But not to include myself in this, but I saw
(30:26):
this week like Chris Berman announced his retirement and it'll
be like in a year and he'll have worked like
fifty years at ESPN. And that's Jeter, that's Kobe. When
you play for one team, that's Dan Marino, right, So
there's this love. You know, I've bounced around in different
companies beyond I've been a bit of a mercenary. You know,
have microphone, will travel, what's the best offer, what's the
(30:48):
best commerce. That was best for my family. That's why
I did it. I could have stayed everywhere if things
worked out. But the downside of being a mercenary in
basketball and broadcasting, in politics, the downside to being a
mercenary is there's not a lot of romanticism about it, right, Like, like, so, Lebron,
you can show him the door tomorrow. Magic Johnson walks
(31:10):
into that arena. He's still more beloved than Lebron, like
to this day. He walks into the Staples, and it's
fascinating to watch the crowd stands. It's like, oh, there's Magic.
You've never seen him your all season to get holders.
So my take is the advantage the Dodgers have is
you can let Lebron go and people will be like, well,
I'll building a statue and I don't think like like,
(31:32):
it's not Jordan, it's not No, it's it's not the
eighty five Bears.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
It's well.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
And I defended Lebron's mobility, but like La is distracted,
like nobody's gonna care.
Speaker 3 (31:43):
No, So a couple of things.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
First of all, we will romanticize you, Colin whenever you
want to hang it up. I promise you, I promise you.
We will give you your flowers. No, don't don't worry.
You're very important to all of us at the blah
blah blah and the volume. So yeah, you are. You
are the son of which we all know. So don't,
(32:06):
So don't worry. You'll get You'll get your flowers, and
you're goodbye to her. But you're you're not You're not
going anywhere anytime soon. Lebron means more to the NBA
than he means to the Lakers.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
I totally agree.
Speaker 5 (32:19):
But you know, like that, I wouldn't worry if I
were if I owned the Lakers about saying goodbye to Lebron,
But I would worry if I was Adam Silver about
saying goodbye to Lebron. Lebron still matters. He is still interesting.
People still care about him. I went to the Bulls
game with Lebron. He was the most popular player.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
I mean, of course he was the most popular. He's
one of the most famous people in the world. He's
maybe one.
Speaker 5 (32:46):
Of the most famous. He's one of the greatest athletes
ever any sport. He's it's either remarkable. It's remarkable, like
he he's taking up golf and I can't get enough
of it. Like I like watching the clips of Lebron
trying to learn golf because it's like, oh, man, Lebron,
he's just like me. He's yeah, duffing it out of
(33:06):
the rough like he's I would imagine, like, obviously, I
have no idea what it's like to be Lebron, obviously.
Speaker 4 (33:15):
But.
Speaker 5 (33:17):
I gotta think if I was Himmer in his camp,
there would be a sinister part of me that when
he retires would wonder what shows like ours on both
networks would talk about we've spent I mean, you've been
at this long than me. I've been doing National TV
for a year and a half. How many thousands of
(33:39):
hours between the two networks do you think Lebron has programmed?
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Oh, I said fifty. I said this to a baseball
executive ten years ago. I was about a year before
I left ESPN, and I told this baseball executive. It
was at some it was in Connecticut, and there were
a bunch of baseball people there. I said, do you
understand nobody talks about your sport? And you may look
(34:03):
at first take and you may you know, my show
wasn't a thing at FS one yet or but I
mentioned four or five popular hosts, and Tony and Mike
and all them, you know get I don't even think
Get Up was a show yet. But I said, you know,
Mike and Mike I think was Mike, And I said,
nobody talks baseball. I said, do you understand how many
free hours the NFL and the NBA get on these networks.
(34:23):
It's insane. Now baseball, Oh, Taani the dog. That's why
the Dodgers, You and I have said this, They're great
for baseball. They got a villain again for the first
time in twenty years. Like they need a villain, they
need a bad guy. So yeah, no, I think there
isn't really. In fact, I've noticed Danny when I talk
NBA now, I talk Nicks. I don't talk players. I
(34:45):
talk Nicks, I talk Oh, I don't talk Warriors. I
would say Celtics, Knicks, Lakers. I don't really talk a player.
I really don't. And I think that's that's one of
the challenges the NBA had, because it's always been its
most popular when there's a galvanizing or polarizing figure to
(35:06):
lead the way NFL combine is something. And I think
I we touched on this earlier. I I it EBB
and flows on what I talked about college football got
too regional.
Speaker 3 (35:16):
I stopped talking about it to a large degree. Now
it's back.
Speaker 2 (35:18):
Jim Harborough brought it back. The Big Ten brought it back.
Now I talk about it all the time, the NFL combine.
I am out on. I am out on the NFL
the last two years, and I.
Speaker 3 (35:33):
Yes, you were.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah, I think, I think probe. I think for a
long time it was just NFL and I loved I like.
I like the convergence of college and pro I love
the draft. I love the combine that makes sense, but
it's so rehearsed. Many of the stars don't show up.
I don't care about people's hand size.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
I really don't care.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
And the truth is, I think one of the things
that's really smart. One of the reasons I love the
way the la Rams do business is they're not They're
willing to say things and do things that other people won't.
They just said several years ago, we're not going that.
We do our own homework. We have tape, we can
go to the Senior Bowl. We're not doing a quick
fifteen minute interview where Johnny Manzel had NFL teams believing
(36:15):
he was Peyton Manning.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
It's like, let's ride I never want.
Speaker 2 (36:19):
It's a bullshit seminar and it's just polished visa. The agents.
These guys come in with talking points. They train in Phoenix,
you know, everybody runs their fastest forty. Everybody's got abs.
You know, it's like everybody has their best vertical. It's football.
By October twelfth, nobody runs a four to three. Not
(36:40):
even the four to three guys. They've got a bad hip,
they've got an ankle spring like like the whole league's
beat up by week six. It's just it's a sport
of attrition. You're just trying to get your best players available,
like down the stretch. So I find myself, like, we
know who's going.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
To go number one? Is there anything that you have
moved out of? Like, I'm just not.
Speaker 2 (36:59):
I was never a home run derby guy, for instance.
I was never so that I was never in. I
didn't leave it.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
Pro Bowl.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
I've joked, I've never watched four plays. I think the
last time I watched the Pro Bowl. Walter Abercrombie was
a running back for the Baylor Bears and the Steelers briefly.
I don't even know where he played, Like I remember
watching it.
Speaker 3 (37:17):
He had a big run.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
I think it was him, So I don't. I don't
watch that combine I used to. I'm it doesn't do
a thing for me now it turned it on for
twenty minutes today and I moved over to the NBA
and said more interested.
Speaker 5 (37:30):
Yeah, So the combine like that was one that I
always I I understood it because the NFL is just
the cash cow and it's the thing that makes the
whole business go. But like, man, these networks really invested
in their combine coverage. They're they're on live for the
whole time that you know, rich Eisen is running the
(37:51):
forty like he's participating running like you know what I mean.
Like they made it into like big business in big TV.
And the whole time, I was like, this is the
underwear Olympics for a that like I'm not sure we
like should be having. And it's just like they it's
between all the college football tape and the in person
interviews and the pro days and like the number one
(38:11):
pick never throws, like it's just like it's just go
get your height and your weight measured basically. Like So
I just I never was that enthralled by it and
was kind of amazed that these networks could get yeah,
eight hours a day of televised content out of it.
So I've never been a huge combine guy. Regular season
(38:34):
college basketball is something that I very much used to love.
Speaker 3 (38:39):
And now yeah, really I think America did.
Speaker 5 (38:41):
Yeah, I used to love it, and part of it,
part of was age too, To be honest with you, like,
just like I went to Syracuse that that program mattered.
Then I worked in Kansas City, so I was around
KU that program mattered. Good college basketball markets. But then,
like you, you grow further, you grow up, you grew
further away from your alma mater, you moved to a
(39:02):
pro sport market. You realize that, like you know, it
doesn't matter, like you doesn't. You can go they're ten
and eight in the Big Ten and make the tournament
and then make a run. So like one game doesn't
mean all that much. So you have regular season college
basketball has lost me tremendously.
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