September 12, 2026 • 36 mins
Colin’s top takes of the week.
He gives his reaction to the Seahawks come from behind win over the Patriots, Sam Darnold’s injury and Drake Maye’s ugly performance (2:00)
Then, Colin is joined by Sophie Cunningham, WNBA star and host of the “No Hesitation” podcast on The Volume to discuss her new podcast, playing with superstar Caitlin Clark and more (20:30)
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Very excited to say that Bud Light is the title
sponsor of the Colin Coward podcast this NFL season. This
podcast presented by Bud Light. Easy to drink, easy to enjoy. Well,
it was a pretty ugly and discouraging first half with
(00:23):
Sam Darnold getting hurt. But Seattle, in a really, really
sloppy 13-10 win, their talent just overwhelms you. And that's
one of the great things about the NFL is if
you draft well, Philadelphia, Seattle, Detroit Lions, you can overcome injuries.
(00:45):
You can overcome losses. And, I mean, that's Seattle defense.
I mean, Drake May on that final drive had three
great plays. He twice ran for a first down, once
on fourth, once on third. Had a big, big completion
to the veteran, Mack Hollins. He throws this inexplicable interception
in the end zone. It's like, Drake, he's still a kid.
(01:10):
You know, you forget that. Like, this is year three.
This is the first game of year three, you know,
and he's still raw. He still makes bad decisions. And
we knew that coming out of Carolina. He was raw.
So this game has so many things to talk about.
First of all, the Sam Darnold injury reminded me of
(01:31):
a Ryan Fitzpatrick injury years ago where he jammed his
knee into the turf. and ended up pulling his hip,
and they thought it would be a six- to eight-week injury,
and he had to have a surgery, and he was
out for the season. You cross your fingers. Darnold has
played hurt. He's been beat up. A lot of those
(01:52):
games in New York, he is tough. I mean, Darnold
is like a Herbert or a Josh Allen or Patrick
Mahomes or Jalen Hurts, he just plays hurt. And so,
I mean, you really have to force Sam Darnold out.
He's got to be in real pain to leave. I'm
not a huge Drew Locke fan. He reminds me a
(02:14):
little bit of Will Levis. Will Levis, you know, both
Southern guys, good looking, confident, good arms. Don't love their judgment,
make weird throws. But, I mean, they're talented. I mean,
Drew Locke has a good arm. Will Levis has a
good arm. They're not dumb guys. They're kind of... Sometimes
overly confident, a little too cool for school. Don't make
(02:36):
me love Drew Locke, but I thought he was good enough, right?
Not a very good red zone series, couple of penalties.
But again, he's a backup thrust into a starting role
against a very well-coached New England defense and a very
good New England team. You know, I look at Brian Fleury.
This was my big concern. So, and I've said this before,
(02:58):
in creative spaces, music, art, comedy, acting, and offensive football,
the creative side of football, you can spot talent really early.
It separates. Now, Samuel L. Jackson or Rodney Dangerfield develop later.
It happens, obviously. But the Spielbergs and the Eddie Murphys
(03:22):
and the Sean McVeigh's, And, you know, Richard Pryor's. You
just see in the creative fields, it pops early. And
a lot of these guys, the Ben Olsons and the
Shane Steikens and the McVeighs and the Shanahan's and the
Sean Paytons, you know, late 20s, you know, that hot
zones like 33 years old and the world goes crazy.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Who is this?
Speaker 1 (03:46):
So a 47-year-old former defensive coach who gets his first
OC job at 47. Yeah, worries me. Not that he
couldn't be capable. But he wouldn't be special, and he
replaced Clint Kubiak, who looks like he's really, really special.
And I've said this before. When a great offensive coach leaves,
(04:08):
like a Kyle Shanahan or a Ben Johnson leaves, I mean,
good luck replacing him. Liam Cohen leaves Tampa. They've never
quite looked the same. Good luck replacing him. So we'll
see how Brian Fleury looks. Really choppy. A lot of
offensive penalties. Again, how much is the first-time OC? How
(04:31):
much is Drew Locke? Now, let's be honest about Drew Locke.
This is not a rookie. It's not a second-year guy.
He's been in the league forever. So I, I think
a lot of the penalties, we can always blame the player.
We always love to blame the player. I didn't think
they looked terribly dialed up in this game. I just,
I just didn't, but it's game one. Let's not overreact.
(04:52):
Last year, the Patriots lost game one of the Raiders
and went to the Superbowl. Don't overreact. Um, two overwhelming takes, uh,
Drake may had some really bad picks late in the game. Um,
Drake May, three picks in the fourth quarter, only had
one of those in the fourth all of last season.
So that's discouraging. And again, A.J. Brown got hurt. So
(05:18):
he gets thrust into a weird situation where, okay, now
Romeo Dobbs is my number one. Romeo Dobbs has a
drop problem. That's why Green Bay bailed on him. By
the way, that game could have been sealed earlier. Romeo
Dobbs drops a ball out in the flat. That's the
ball game, potentially. That is potentially the ball game. Drake
May would have been free and clear. They could have
been more conservative. Instead, they had to go back again
(05:42):
and Drake May throws a pick. And again, it's Seattle.
It's on the road. I don't think Drake May is
going to have three fourth quarter picks the rest of
the season. Seattle is, I mean, they're just, they got
talent everywhere. I mean, last year, week seven against the Texans,
the Seahawks had four turnovers and 13 penalties and beat
(06:03):
playoff Houston. Week 11 against the Rams, they missed the
game-winning field goal as time expired. Against the Rams, they
had four turnovers. Week 16 against the Rams, they trailed 30-14,
eight penalties, three turnovers. They beat the Rams. So, I mean,
Seattle's just got so much talent that they, you know,
(06:26):
that's why when they went clean in the playoffs, they
won the Super Bowl. They just didn't make any mistakes. So,
I mean, Seattle last year, Rams, Texans, tonight. Seattle was sloppy.
They have a backup quarterback, but they have just hit
on so many draft picks, and they just have enough.
Their veterans are really quality guys like Leonard Williams. They're
(06:50):
just such great guys. One of the best USC players ever.
Big personality. People love him. Team guy. I mean, they
signed him, even at his age, to an extension. They
paid him big money. He's great in the room. Super,
super smart football player. So I just look at Seattle,
and it's like, yeah, they're missing Nick Amonwuri, and yeah,
(07:11):
they're missing Sam Darnold, but you still watch their speed.
They're everywhere.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
This game just had so much. Like if Seattle loses,
and they could have without that great interception in the
end zone, if Seattle loses this game, what would we
be saying? Oh, brutal. Red zone series. Flurry drew lock. Brutal.
What was it? Five tries from the four-yard line settled
for a field goal. That's your ball game. But Seattle's
(07:42):
talent overcomes it. We could have said multiple times. I mean,
Drake May was unbelievable. Yeah, he made mistakes, but he
ran for two first downs. He finds the receiver on
a third, fourth, and fourth and nine. Like this game
is a game of inches, not feet. Is that Drake May?
Let's give New England credit on the road in Seattle,
(08:04):
all these turnovers. And they should have won that game.
I mean, once Drake may on a third down scrambled
for a first down and Chris Collins was like, Oh,
all the, all the advantage goes to new England. That's
why when he threw the pick, you're like, what are
you doing? If you're going to throw that ball, you know,
you got to throw it long. You have to give
(08:25):
the defender no chance to make that cash. So on
almost uninteresting first half, fascinating fourth quarter with plays everywhere. And, um,
You know, one of the things, yeah, I'm looking at
this right here. I'll say this about Sam Darnall. You
know I love Darnall. But, you know, he leaves Carolina.
(08:49):
They're worse. He leaves Minnesota. They win five fewer games.
You know, he leaves Seattle in this game. And, I mean,
they didn't score in the first half. Like, it was
pretty rough. But I do think the advantage of having, like,
Drew Locke. Drew Locke, this is his second stint with Seattle.
And this happens in the NFL where you bring a
guy back. He kind of understands the culture of the team.
(09:10):
He gets the room. People in the room like him
and know him. Drew Locke's not a threat to Sam Darnold.
But what is a backup quarterback? A backup quarterback is
what Drew Locke did. Drew played pretty well. He made
two or three really big throws. I mean, he had
one to Cooper Cup called back because of an offensive penalty.
(09:30):
But a backup quarterback, I've said this for years, if
your starter goes out two games, they can win one
of them. If your starter goes out four games, they
can win two of them. But don't expect long winning streaks.
That's not what a backup quarterback or they'd be a starter.
if you have to start up six games, they may
not go three and three, they may go two and four.
(09:54):
But two, four game sample, can they win every other game?
And I thought Drew Locke made enough good plays. Again,
he's got talent. He's no dummy. He's been around the league.
The Seahawks are a great organization with a great culture.
They brought him back again, so they obviously like him.
And he shined in a couple of big moments. So,
(10:16):
you know, Seattle did what Seattle does. Sloppy turnovers, penalties, wins. And,
I mean, that game was getting to a point before
that JSN touchdown where I text Josh, my producer. Hi, Josh.
I said, if they don't score on this drive, do
(10:38):
you want to do this 10 minutes early? He's like,
I got a feeling. Well, what do you know? JSN
changed it. JSN is such a unique talent. He is such–
I remember when Emmett Smith played for the Cowboys and
one of the knocks on Emmett Smith was he didn't
have breakaway speed, yet nobody ever caught him. And JSN's
(11:00):
one of those guys, nobody's like, oh, he's a burner.
Jamar Chase is like this. When Jamar Chase came out,
his speed's okay. Nobody ever catches Jamar Chase. Nobody ever
catches JSN. It's just deceptive speed. Ended up being a
wildly entertaining football game. So what are the big headlines?
Darn old future. I mean, tomorrow we're waiting for the
(11:27):
results of, what do they do? Do they do, do
you do an MRI? I'm not sure what you do.
I'm not, I'm not going to play a doctor on TV.
Basically tomorrow, the story is, is Darnold okay? Because again,
Drew Locke can win. Okay. Remember, New England didn't play
(11:48):
any of their starters in the preseason. And I think, um,
I don't know if it was Mike Tirico or Collinsworth,
I thought, accurately pointed out, I thought it was really
good broadcasting, pointed out, these guys look tired. I thought
New England looked really, really tired. Of course, they had
the cross-country trip. I didn't think Seattle looked tired. I
(12:10):
thought New England looked tired. And I was wondering, I
was thinking about this, if you're Josh McDaniel and Vrabel,
you're like, okay, we're in Seattle. We didn't play our
starters in the preseason. Do we just go for it?
We go for the win. That's the one thing about
that interception. I can see the New England staff saying,
the Super Bowl champs, their roster's deeper. We got them
(12:33):
where we want them. Let's not play for the tight.
You're on the road. Let's go for the win. Because
I thought Seattle was.
They were as fast late as they were early. They
were making plays all over the field defensively. I thought
New England looked a little gassed. So, I mean, maybe
it's not that inexplicable. Maybe it's a go for it.
(12:57):
If we can get out of here with a win,
let's not play for overtime. I don't like our chances
in that space. And I don't think that's wrong on
New England's part. I don't think that's crazy. I mean,
maybe I'm wrong here, but I thought Seattle, they have
a deeper roster. I didn't think they looked, I thought
they looked fast on the final interception. I mean, I
(13:17):
didn't think that was an issue. New England, you looked
at the body language, you looked at the sidelines, they
look tired. Seattle will do that to you. If you're
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about three months ago, I called Logan Swaim, and Logan
runs our content for the volume. And I was checking,
(16:23):
and I call Logan every week and just kind of
update me on the gripes, positive, negative. And I asked him, hey,
how's Sophie and Wes doing on the podcast? And this
was probably... three months, maybe two and a half, maybe
three and a half. And he said, I think Sophie
(16:47):
wants to talk more basketball. She loves Wes. You guys
are still close, but she wants to talk more basketball
because the WNBA is getting really popular and she plays
with the superstar in the league. And so When you guys,
your podcast took a hiatus, there was a lot of
(17:07):
speculation on the interweb about what it was. And I,
as somebody who's founded the volume, I get a kick
out of speculation. And so I just let things play
out because actually it's good for our business when people
are talking about the volume. And so what Sophie was
(17:28):
doing was rebuilding her podcast, which is now called No Hesitation.
And her co-host is Drew Hanlon, her shooting coach, very well-known,
very highly regarded. So when you were hearing, Sophie, you're
rolling your eyes. When you were hearing, oh, it was controversial.
(17:50):
My reaction was, oh, God, this is funny. In fact,
I had texted you. But what was your reaction to it?
Speaker 2 (17:56):
It's just dumb. Like, it's just dumb.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
And, like, I think, you know, before you kind of
have this platform and before you're kind of in the spotlight,
you know, maybe I would have believed some of those
stories or, like, would have got caught up in the gossip.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
But now that I'm on this side of it, I'm like...
all these news outlets are just fake. They're all fraud.
Nothing is real.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
And I think honestly, that is why I wanted to
kind of, first of all, I thought of a, you know,
this WNBA great business opportunity. Like there is no really
good WNBA, NBA podcast, really WNBA that strictly talk about
basketball and like all the great things that it has
in the WNBA. And so I was like, why are
(18:37):
we not talking more like this? And so, um, Um,
I loved West. I think we had a really fun
time together. I know that he's off doing great things too,
but you know, he was going through some stuff. Then
I was going through some stuff. Everything was very, you know,
main media for both of us for a little bit.
So I think a lot of people thought that we
were going at it. We've really weren't, we were just rebranding.
He was going to do his own thing. The volume
was going to take care of him. I wanted to
(18:58):
go more basketball. And so when I first thought, I
was like, this is so goofy. And like, we sent
stuff back and forth. Me and West were like, these
people are just dumb.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
So, um, it was fun. I still love West to
death and I had a great time with him.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Well, I mean, let's just say this was the NBA
and Caitlin Clark came into the league and I've compared
her to Michael Jordan, where she literally changed the direction
of the league. You would think it would make sense
to talk about Michael Jordan then or Caitlin Clark. Now
you play with the league superstar. You know what? You know,
(19:30):
I've said she has a Jordan quality where she literally
changes the ratings, but She has a Steph Curry quality
in that she shoots like we've never seen in her sport.
She also has a Larry Bird quality, which is she's
kind of gets pissy and she's physical and she's pissy.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
And there's.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
A Midwest toughness to her. And I think you can
rub people, including WNBA rivals the wrong way. I look
at her and I think she's got Jordan's Ascension Curry's
game and Larry Bird's personality. Am I wrong?
Speaker 2 (20:05):
Yeah. No, I don't think you are.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
I think that Larry Bird, honestly, might have a little
bit more sass and a little bit like more like
Caitlin is just her own, her own personality, like especially
off the court. Like she is strictly basketball. She loves
to sit on the couch. She loves to watch TV.
She's very simple. I don't know Larry Bird, but I
doubt that. I bet he was a little bit more
fun off the court.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
I don't know if you know that. I don't know.
They called him the hick from French lick. So I
think he was basically all basketball, too.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
But but, you know, I think it's like it's been
a blessing that she has been in our league. I
think the talent has always been there in our league.
But just like the eyes and the platform and how
she's transforming our game. Like we can be thankful for
the people who came before us. But you can also
witness greatness and say that she is great and she
has done so much for our sport right now.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
And I don't know why people are so. reluctant to
give her her flowers.
Speaker 3 (20:59):
And maybe it is that Midwest mentality that people don't like,
but shit, I love it.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I'm from Missouri. So I'm like, Hey, bring it on sister.
So I'm a big fan.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
You know, I, I said this about Kathy Engelbert. I said,
I've worked in broadcasting for 40 years. I've been very lucky.
I've had very, very good bosses, but not all my
bosses have been great. And I said, and you were
publicly critical of Kathy Engelbert. And my take was when
the league wasn't making money, And it was growing, but slowly,
(21:27):
kind of methodically, she was fine. And then literally in
15 to 18 months, the league exploded. It's beating hockey.
It's beating baseball. And now we need a new commissioner.
And that's not that she's not capable, but it's just like-
I mean, Kathy, it's the volume slowly grew. If the
(21:50):
volume went from what it was the first week to
Spotify in a month, we would be over our skis.
And I think part of what Kathy struggled with, the
league is so popular, so big, so many eyes. It
needs fresh management and fresh leadership. Is that that feels fair?
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I think it's very fair. And truly, I hate to
be critical because I know that job is so tough.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
And anyone who's in that position, you're going to get
loved and you're going to get hated. And so you
need someone who has a backbone, who is bold, who
is courageous, who is going to try to unify. I
think the WNBA is such a spot where it's really
easy to be diverse. But you need a leader who's
going to come in here and give us a common
goal and unite people. And I think our biggest thing
(22:40):
as players, I'll just say myself, I don't want to
speak for other players, but I do know this is
the conversations we've had is we want a commissioner who,
first of all, wants to engage in our engage in
our players like we need to have a conversation. I'm
telling you, like if we were in a room and
she walked in. She wouldn't even say hi to us.
She would just go do her own thing. It's like,
this is a player's league. So have a relationship with
(23:02):
your players being communication. Like, yes, you will like work
for the owners, but at the same time, we're both
trying to grow this league and make it bigger and
better than ever. And so, you know, I think you're right.
I think when she first came in the league, she
was doing an okay job. She'd made some good business
decisions for us. But once we exploded, I just don't
think that she was ready for it. I don't know
if anyone would have been ready for it. But I
(23:23):
think our biggest thing is we want a commissioner who
is going to fight for us, who's going to have
a relationship with us, who is going to listen to
us so we can work and work together. And I
just don't think that we have that relationship whatsoever with Kathy.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Well, I think I don't know how many people know
this during covid. Adam Silver was on the phone with
LeBron James every other day. So Adam Silver has always
leaned on his star players for guidance. Remember, during COVID,
there were players, Dwight Howard, Kyrie Irving, that were saying,
shut it down. And Adam would listen. But he really
(23:58):
listened to LeBron James.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
And I think that and I don't think that's a
I don't think that is a I don't think that's
a weakness. Rob Manfred. Oh, I think Rob Manfred, the
baseball commissioner, really wants to raise the floor of salaries
for Not necessarily cap them at the high end as
much as raise the floor. He wants players to make money.
(24:23):
He just doesn't, he doesn't want one payroll to be
80 million and one to be 450 million. So I
don't know. I Roger, I've seen Roger Goodell with players
like they're close. Roger calls and talks to star players
all the time. The it is, it is interesting. And
I'm going to throw this at you. I'm asking, I mean,
I'm close with my sister. I have my daughter and
(24:48):
two stepdaughters. I was closer to my mom than my dad,
although I love my dad, but I was closer to
my mom. So I've always felt the volume. We have
a lot of women in management. And so I think
I sort of get sometimes the sensibility of women, right?
My wife's very strong, very opinionated. But this question's different.
(25:09):
And if you're offended, you can virally smack me. When
you are kind of viewed a little bit, and I
don't know any other term, a little bit as the.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
League's... Just say it. I don't care.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Sex symbol.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Is that fair? Oh, hey, that is way better.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
I thought you were going to go somewhere completely different
with this, so I'll take it.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
But my take is you lean into it a little bit.
You're an interesting contradiction. You're tough. You'll fight anybody. You'll
taunt anybody. But you'll make sure coming into the arena,
I look good and I want you to know I
look good. Tell me how you view that. Are you
conflicted or is that is that just like, hey, it's
(25:56):
I mean, Dennis Rodman was wearing a dress. It was
good for everybody. Right. How do you and I don't
know if that's semi offensive, but how.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Do you view that? It's not. It's not for me.
Maybe some people take it. I don't.
Speaker 3 (26:10):
And I think for me, the reason why I really
lean into that is, first of all, I have always
been super girly.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Since a little girl. I've always loved to dress up.
I love dresses. I love high heels. I love all
of that.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
And for some reason, our society, if you play basketball,
you can't dress that way.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
You can't be girly.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
No one's ever said it, but it's like the kind
of feel that you can't be both.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
Screw all that. Yes, you can.
Speaker 3 (26:35):
You can be girly and you can go out and
kick someone's ass. Like, I love that combination. And I'm
not just going to say that. I also think on
the other side, you can go and dress a little
more masculine and go out there and still kick ass.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Like, there's not one way to do it right.
Speaker 3 (26:48):
And so for me, I just I know my lane.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
I'm going to stay in my lane.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
But I also know that I have a lot of
young girls who are girly, who are raised like I was.
who have aspirations to be where I'm at that they're like, Oh, well,
can I, can I do both? Can I still be
girly and get my nails done and have my hair
done and dress up and, you know, kind of look
real hot coming into a game and then go be
sweaty and work hard.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Yes, you can.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
And so I feel like that I am just showing
that you can have both. And for girls who are
wavering in, in their confidence, first of all, if you
look good, you.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Play good typically is how it goes.
Speaker 3 (27:22):
And so I will also say when I first got
into the league, like I, Totally.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Like we weren't dressing up. I was literally wearing kind
of what I wore to bed. Like you were just
rolling up.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
In sweats and like sweatshirts, like pajamas.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
Like, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (27:35):
But now that we have so many eyes on everything
that we do, why would I not, you know, maximize
my opportunity?
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Because if people are seeing how I dress, well, guess what?
That's business.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
Now clothing brands are coming in and sending me clothes
and wanting to work with me. And so I have
a very kind of business mindset at times, but at
the end of the day, I also just like to
be a girl and I like to dress up and
I like to look a certain way. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
By the way, I had a, um, a coworker probably
five years ago, um, um, beautiful person and, and, and
they were getting makeup on and we were, we were
talking about this and I said, there is a reason
Tom Brady wears beautiful suits and has his hair styled
(28:19):
and looks, it looks like a model when he's on
the air. It's okay for both sexes to want to
look good. You're a public figure. I'm in TV. I
wear makeup. Otherwise I'd be hideous to look at. I
get my hair fixed, right? Like, so my take is
people shouldn't be offended by that. You guys are brands, right?
Speaker 2 (28:38):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
OK, when they do cereal commercials, that's not milk that
they're trying to make that. You know what I mean?
Like they're trying to make that look as white as possible. And,
you know, like putting glue in it. It's like, guys,
this is all about marketing and branding outside of just
the strict basketball. Years ago, James Harden, I forget what
the team was. Maybe it was the Rockets. They had
(29:01):
a runway and the guys all came out.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Who gives a shit? I think it's fun. No, exactly.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
And at the end of the day, you said it perfectly.
All my friends and family, that is like game days.
And like when I have to be on TV or
when I have to do photo shoots or stuff for sponsors,
that is the best that I will look. Otherwise, I literally...
damn near look homeless. And I barely wear makeup. I
barely brush my hair. And so those are my days
to have my shit together. And so I I'm right
(29:27):
there with you, but I do think it's fun. And
I think the males like it. I think as females
really like it. And so, um, I think it's just
the fun part of sport that you get to see
kind of our style and what we like outside of
the field, outside of the court, and the fans love it.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
So why would we not do it?
Speaker 1 (29:41):
You've been in the league, how many years, six years,
seven years, seven.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Oh God, I'm getting old. Yeah. Seven.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
So I've said this on the air outside of baseball,
you guys run sort of unopposed in the summer. And
when I fly around and grab the clicker, I think
your sport is very clicky. I think it's very sticky
that I probably two dozen times during the summer landed
on a WNBA game. And I've said this, the quality
(30:07):
of play is so much better. The passing is The
ball handling, it's more of a vertical sport than it
was 10 years ago. Go to your first year and
go to now. What part of the basketball to you
is like significantly better? Because I still hate the officiating,
but what part of the basketball to you is next
(30:30):
level compared to even seven years ago?
Speaker 2 (30:33):
Yeah. Um, the girls are just so athletic.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Like you would have, I feel like the women's basketball,
you've always had to have pretty much a very, um,
high IQ fundamental. Um, yes, you still have to be
athletic and you're probably more athletic than your average, but the,
the girls nowadays, and like, I say this in like
the most respect, this is like probably the highest compliment
you can get.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Like there are girls coming out of college who play
like dudes.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
And just the way they move, the way they are
quick with the ball, their skill set.
Speaker 1 (31:04):
And me, I'm like, oh, shit.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
I got to guard that. I just like staying around
the three-point line and then shoot my shot. Someone else
guard that. But you really see the athleticism really changing.
People can dunk. People are fast as hell. And it's
like Olivia Miles.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
She is a rookie. Oh, my God.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
She's killing it. And she literally plays like a dude.
And that is no disrespect.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
That is one of the highest compliments you could ever get.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
And so... Um, you just see more and more girls
like that.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
The, um, Sophie, when, when we, uh, hired you at
the volume and in my take was, um, the league,
the quality of play was good and getting better, but it,
there is something to be said about being a provocateur
and many times the best players aren't Rodman wasn't, um,
(31:54):
but he knew what he was. Um, When you pointed
the finger and did that gesture, I thought it was hilarious.
The amazing thing, it became like this massive meme. Did
you ever just sit and go... I mean, I don't
know if you had... Was that spontaneous?
Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yes. I am just....
Speaker 3 (32:16):
I am just sassy and I don't give a flying F.
I just, I just, just who I am. And so
I've kind of mastered it getting in people's heads and
I get it. I've had teammates who I played against.
They're like, we freaking hated you. But then once I'm
on the same team, people are like, oh, you're actually
so cool.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
And we love you. Like, we love you as a team.
I'm like, yeah, duh. Like, it's just who I am.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
And so when that happened, you know, I just got
in the other girl's head and she got mad that
I was pointing a finger and she got like mad mad.
And so I was like, shouldn't have done that. Like,
once I saw I gotcha, I gotcha. And so then
I just kept it there. And so it did go viral.
It was like all over the world.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
For two weeks.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Oh, yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
And I walk around now. And like when people ask
for photos, like last year was like, hey, can you
put me in a headlock? And now this year it's like, hey,
can you point at me?
Speaker 2 (33:01):
And I'm like, what am I doing? Stick with basketball.
But it's part of the game. So who cares.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
If the fever is. offensively you're the best team in
the league, but if the fever play their very best
brand of basketball, can they win the title? I think
you have the fifth best record or fourth right now.
I think we're at fifth.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Is there, what, what is missing to be the first?
Speaker 2 (33:30):
I think consistency.
Speaker 3 (33:31):
And I think us as a team, we know that
when we are clicking, I don't think anyone can beat us,
but are you going to, are you going to get
that version of us that night? And I also think
defensively we struggle. I think we're at like 11th or
10th and that is, that's not good whatsoever. And yes,
we're able to outscore opponents, but playoffs are a different
(33:51):
ball game. It's a different type of beast and you
got to shore up on your defense and Um, I
know in the W, uh, the last, I'm pretty sure
like six teams who have won it, they've all been
top three or four, um, maybe besides one in, in
defense and the.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Ratings of defense. And we're just not there.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
And so, um, during this break, we're on a two
week break because people are playing in, uh, the, the
FIFA stuff going on.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yeah. FIBA.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
FIBA. Yeah. Right.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
Yes. Clearly I'm not over there, but we're, we're working
on our defense and we're shoring up on that. And
so I think if we can just get a little,
a little bit better defensively, then yeah. I mean, I
wouldn't want to play us in, in the playoffs and
we have the experience. We, we definitely have all the
offensive threats you could ask for. And so we're a
(34:34):
dangerous team, but again, there's a lot of dangerous teams.
So it's, it's the little, the little details.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
You do understand, though, that getting booed and getting catcalls
is actually great. Like, outside of Jordan, most of the
best players in my life in sports... were hated in
every arena except their own. So when you get, like,
I don't know. I think Draymond Green lives for it.
(35:02):
I mean, I've talked to pro athletes my whole life.
They're like, I'd never say this publicly. I love winning
on the road more than at home.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
It's the best.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
And they'll never say it because they don't want to
tick off the fans. But my take is when you
go into a rival arena and they give you shit,
it must be unbelievable to walk out with a W.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
Oh, it's so fun.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
I think both sides when we're here at game bridge,
it's so much fun because our fans are awesome that like,
you know, you just feel leaving good and that you
put on a good show for them. But there is
something special about, especially this year going into a different
arena and like, everyone knows it. I get booed 24 seven.
If I touch the ball, I get booed. Like it's,
(35:44):
it's just what it is. And the thing is, I
fucking love that shit.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
I love it. Like bring it on.
Speaker 3 (35:49):
And I think people don't know that people don't know
that I love that.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
And I thrive off of that.
Speaker 3 (35:52):
And so there is a extra good feeling about everyone
hating you.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
And then you guys walking out.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
With a, with a dub and like smiling and having
fun and getting on the bus and going home or
going to the next game.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
So it's a good feeling.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
No hesitation, Sophie Cunningham. We love her at The Volume,
and it's great to finally talk to you.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Yes, it's been a minute. We need to do this
more often. We love you.
Speaker 1 (36:16):
The Volume. This podcast presented by Bud Light. Easy to drink,
easy to enjoy.
Very excited to say that Bud Light is the title
sponsor of the Colin Coward podcast this NFL season. This
podcast presented by Bud Light. Easy to drink, easy to enjoy. Well,
it was a pretty ugly and discouraging first half with
(00:23):
Sam Darnold getting hurt. But Seattle, in a really, really
sloppy 13-10 win, their talent just overwhelms you. And that's
one of the great things about the NFL is if
you draft well, Philadelphia, Seattle, Detroit Lions, you can overcome injuries.
(00:45):
You can overcome losses. And, I mean, that's Seattle defense.
I mean, Drake May on that final drive had three
great plays. He twice ran for a first down, once
on fourth, once on third. Had a big, big completion
to the veteran, Mack Hollins. He throws this inexplicable interception
in the end zone. It's like, Drake, he's still a kid.
(01:10):
You know, you forget that. Like, this is year three.
This is the first game of year three, you know,
and he's still raw. He still makes bad decisions. And
we knew that coming out of Carolina. He was raw.
So this game has so many things to talk about.
First of all, the Sam Darnold injury reminded me of
(01:31):
a Ryan Fitzpatrick injury years ago where he jammed his
knee into the turf. and ended up pulling his hip,
and they thought it would be a six- to eight-week injury,
and he had to have a surgery, and he was
out for the season. You cross your fingers. Darnold has
played hurt. He's been beat up. A lot of those
(01:52):
games in New York, he is tough. I mean, Darnold
is like a Herbert or a Josh Allen or Patrick
Mahomes or Jalen Hurts, he just plays hurt. And so,
I mean, you really have to force Sam Darnold out.
He's got to be in real pain to leave. I'm
not a huge Drew Locke fan. He reminds me a
(02:14):
little bit of Will Levis. Will Levis, you know, both
Southern guys, good looking, confident, good arms. Don't love their judgment,
make weird throws. But, I mean, they're talented. I mean,
Drew Locke has a good arm. Will Levis has a
good arm. They're not dumb guys. They're kind of... Sometimes
overly confident, a little too cool for school. Don't make
(02:36):
me love Drew Locke, but I thought he was good enough, right?
Not a very good red zone series, couple of penalties.
But again, he's a backup thrust into a starting role
against a very well-coached New England defense and a very
good New England team. You know, I look at Brian Fleury.
This was my big concern. So, and I've said this before,
(02:58):
in creative spaces, music, art, comedy, acting, and offensive football,
the creative side of football, you can spot talent really early.
It separates. Now, Samuel L. Jackson or Rodney Dangerfield develop later.
It happens, obviously. But the Spielbergs and the Eddie Murphys
(03:22):
and the Sean McVeigh's, And, you know, Richard Pryor's. You
just see in the creative fields, it pops early. And
a lot of these guys, the Ben Olsons and the
Shane Steikens and the McVeighs and the Shanahan's and the
Sean Paytons, you know, late 20s, you know, that hot
zones like 33 years old and the world goes crazy.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Who is this?
Speaker 1 (03:46):
So a 47-year-old former defensive coach who gets his first
OC job at 47. Yeah, worries me. Not that he
couldn't be capable. But he wouldn't be special, and he
replaced Clint Kubiak, who looks like he's really, really special.
And I've said this before. When a great offensive coach leaves,
(04:08):
like a Kyle Shanahan or a Ben Johnson leaves, I mean,
good luck replacing him. Liam Cohen leaves Tampa. They've never
quite looked the same. Good luck replacing him. So we'll
see how Brian Fleury looks. Really choppy. A lot of
offensive penalties. Again, how much is the first-time OC? How
(04:31):
much is Drew Locke? Now, let's be honest about Drew Locke.
This is not a rookie. It's not a second-year guy.
He's been in the league forever. So I, I think
a lot of the penalties, we can always blame the player.
We always love to blame the player. I didn't think
they looked terribly dialed up in this game. I just,
I just didn't, but it's game one. Let's not overreact.
(04:52):
Last year, the Patriots lost game one of the Raiders
and went to the Superbowl. Don't overreact. Um, two overwhelming takes, uh,
Drake may had some really bad picks late in the game. Um,
Drake May, three picks in the fourth quarter, only had
one of those in the fourth all of last season.
So that's discouraging. And again, A.J. Brown got hurt. So
(05:18):
he gets thrust into a weird situation where, okay, now
Romeo Dobbs is my number one. Romeo Dobbs has a
drop problem. That's why Green Bay bailed on him. By
the way, that game could have been sealed earlier. Romeo
Dobbs drops a ball out in the flat. That's the
ball game, potentially. That is potentially the ball game. Drake
May would have been free and clear. They could have
been more conservative. Instead, they had to go back again
(05:42):
and Drake May throws a pick. And again, it's Seattle.
It's on the road. I don't think Drake May is
going to have three fourth quarter picks the rest of
the season. Seattle is, I mean, they're just, they got
talent everywhere. I mean, last year, week seven against the Texans,
the Seahawks had four turnovers and 13 penalties and beat
(06:03):
playoff Houston. Week 11 against the Rams, they missed the
game-winning field goal as time expired. Against the Rams, they
had four turnovers. Week 16 against the Rams, they trailed 30-14,
eight penalties, three turnovers. They beat the Rams. So, I mean,
Seattle's just got so much talent that they, you know,
(06:26):
that's why when they went clean in the playoffs, they
won the Super Bowl. They just didn't make any mistakes. So,
I mean, Seattle last year, Rams, Texans, tonight. Seattle was sloppy.
They have a backup quarterback, but they have just hit
on so many draft picks, and they just have enough.
Their veterans are really quality guys like Leonard Williams. They're
(06:50):
just such great guys. One of the best USC players ever.
Big personality. People love him. Team guy. I mean, they
signed him, even at his age, to an extension. They
paid him big money. He's great in the room. Super,
super smart football player. So I just look at Seattle,
and it's like, yeah, they're missing Nick Amonwuri, and yeah,
(07:11):
they're missing Sam Darnold, but you still watch their speed.
They're everywhere.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
This game just had so much. Like if Seattle loses,
and they could have without that great interception in the
end zone, if Seattle loses this game, what would we
be saying? Oh, brutal. Red zone series. Flurry drew lock. Brutal.
What was it? Five tries from the four-yard line settled
for a field goal. That's your ball game. But Seattle's
(07:42):
talent overcomes it. We could have said multiple times. I mean,
Drake May was unbelievable. Yeah, he made mistakes, but he
ran for two first downs. He finds the receiver on
a third, fourth, and fourth and nine. Like this game
is a game of inches, not feet. Is that Drake May?
Let's give New England credit on the road in Seattle,
(08:04):
all these turnovers. And they should have won that game.
I mean, once Drake may on a third down scrambled
for a first down and Chris Collins was like, Oh,
all the, all the advantage goes to new England. That's
why when he threw the pick, you're like, what are
you doing? If you're going to throw that ball, you know,
you got to throw it long. You have to give
(08:25):
the defender no chance to make that cash. So on
almost uninteresting first half, fascinating fourth quarter with plays everywhere. And, um,
You know, one of the things, yeah, I'm looking at
this right here. I'll say this about Sam Darnall. You
know I love Darnall. But, you know, he leaves Carolina.
(08:49):
They're worse. He leaves Minnesota. They win five fewer games.
You know, he leaves Seattle in this game. And, I mean,
they didn't score in the first half. Like, it was
pretty rough. But I do think the advantage of having, like,
Drew Locke. Drew Locke, this is his second stint with Seattle.
And this happens in the NFL where you bring a
guy back. He kind of understands the culture of the team.
(09:10):
He gets the room. People in the room like him
and know him. Drew Locke's not a threat to Sam Darnold.
But what is a backup quarterback? A backup quarterback is
what Drew Locke did. Drew played pretty well. He made
two or three really big throws. I mean, he had
one to Cooper Cup called back because of an offensive penalty.
(09:30):
But a backup quarterback, I've said this for years, if
your starter goes out two games, they can win one
of them. If your starter goes out four games, they
can win two of them. But don't expect long winning streaks.
That's not what a backup quarterback or they'd be a starter.
if you have to start up six games, they may
not go three and three, they may go two and four.
(09:54):
But two, four game sample, can they win every other game?
And I thought Drew Locke made enough good plays. Again,
he's got talent. He's no dummy. He's been around the league.
The Seahawks are a great organization with a great culture.
They brought him back again, so they obviously like him.
And he shined in a couple of big moments. So,
(10:16):
you know, Seattle did what Seattle does. Sloppy turnovers, penalties, wins. And,
I mean, that game was getting to a point before
that JSN touchdown where I text Josh, my producer. Hi, Josh.
I said, if they don't score on this drive, do
(10:38):
you want to do this 10 minutes early? He's like,
I got a feeling. Well, what do you know? JSN
changed it. JSN is such a unique talent. He is such–
I remember when Emmett Smith played for the Cowboys and
one of the knocks on Emmett Smith was he didn't
have breakaway speed, yet nobody ever caught him. And JSN's
(11:00):
one of those guys, nobody's like, oh, he's a burner.
Jamar Chase is like this. When Jamar Chase came out,
his speed's okay. Nobody ever catches Jamar Chase. Nobody ever
catches JSN. It's just deceptive speed. Ended up being a
wildly entertaining football game. So what are the big headlines?
Darn old future. I mean, tomorrow we're waiting for the
(11:27):
results of, what do they do? Do they do, do
you do an MRI? I'm not sure what you do.
I'm not, I'm not going to play a doctor on TV.
Basically tomorrow, the story is, is Darnold okay? Because again,
Drew Locke can win. Okay. Remember, New England didn't play
(11:48):
any of their starters in the preseason. And I think, um,
I don't know if it was Mike Tirico or Collinsworth,
I thought, accurately pointed out, I thought it was really
good broadcasting, pointed out, these guys look tired. I thought
New England looked really, really tired. Of course, they had
the cross-country trip. I didn't think Seattle looked tired. I
(12:10):
thought New England looked tired. And I was wondering, I
was thinking about this, if you're Josh McDaniel and Vrabel,
you're like, okay, we're in Seattle. We didn't play our
starters in the preseason. Do we just go for it?
We go for the win. That's the one thing about
that interception. I can see the New England staff saying,
the Super Bowl champs, their roster's deeper. We got them
(12:33):
where we want them. Let's not play for the tight.
You're on the road. Let's go for the win. Because
I thought Seattle was.
They were as fast late as they were early. They
were making plays all over the field defensively. I thought
New England looked a little gassed. So, I mean, maybe
it's not that inexplicable. Maybe it's a go for it.
(12:57):
If we can get out of here with a win,
let's not play for overtime. I don't like our chances
in that space. And I don't think that's wrong on
New England's part. I don't think that's crazy. I mean,
maybe I'm wrong here, but I thought Seattle, they have
a deeper roster. I didn't think they looked, I thought
they looked fast on the final interception. I mean, I
(13:17):
didn't think that was an issue. New England, you looked
at the body language, you looked at the sidelines, they
look tired. Seattle will do that to you. If you're
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Polymarket Clearing, the CFTC-regulated exchange and clearing organization. All right,
about three months ago, I called Logan Swaim, and Logan
runs our content for the volume. And I was checking,
(16:23):
and I call Logan every week and just kind of
update me on the gripes, positive, negative. And I asked him, hey,
how's Sophie and Wes doing on the podcast? And this
was probably... three months, maybe two and a half, maybe
three and a half. And he said, I think Sophie
(16:47):
wants to talk more basketball. She loves Wes. You guys
are still close, but she wants to talk more basketball
because the WNBA is getting really popular and she plays
with the superstar in the league. And so When you guys,
your podcast took a hiatus, there was a lot of
(17:07):
speculation on the interweb about what it was. And I,
as somebody who's founded the volume, I get a kick
out of speculation. And so I just let things play
out because actually it's good for our business when people
are talking about the volume. And so what Sophie was
(17:28):
doing was rebuilding her podcast, which is now called No Hesitation.
And her co-host is Drew Hanlon, her shooting coach, very well-known,
very highly regarded. So when you were hearing, Sophie, you're
rolling your eyes. When you were hearing, oh, it was controversial.
(17:50):
My reaction was, oh, God, this is funny. In fact,
I had texted you. But what was your reaction to it?
Speaker 2 (17:56):
It's just dumb. Like, it's just dumb.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
And, like, I think, you know, before you kind of
have this platform and before you're kind of in the spotlight,
you know, maybe I would have believed some of those
stories or, like, would have got caught up in the gossip.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
But now that I'm on this side of it, I'm like...
all these news outlets are just fake. They're all fraud.
Nothing is real.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
And I think honestly, that is why I wanted to
kind of, first of all, I thought of a, you know,
this WNBA great business opportunity. Like there is no really
good WNBA, NBA podcast, really WNBA that strictly talk about
basketball and like all the great things that it has
in the WNBA. And so I was like, why are
(18:37):
we not talking more like this? And so, um, Um,
I loved West. I think we had a really fun
time together. I know that he's off doing great things too,
but you know, he was going through some stuff. Then
I was going through some stuff. Everything was very, you know,
main media for both of us for a little bit.
So I think a lot of people thought that we
were going at it. We've really weren't, we were just rebranding.
He was going to do his own thing. The volume
was going to take care of him. I wanted to
(18:58):
go more basketball. And so when I first thought, I
was like, this is so goofy. And like, we sent
stuff back and forth. Me and West were like, these
people are just dumb.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
So, um, it was fun. I still love West to
death and I had a great time with him.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Well, I mean, let's just say this was the NBA
and Caitlin Clark came into the league and I've compared
her to Michael Jordan, where she literally changed the direction
of the league. You would think it would make sense
to talk about Michael Jordan then or Caitlin Clark. Now
you play with the league superstar. You know what? You know,
(19:30):
I've said she has a Jordan quality where she literally
changes the ratings, but She has a Steph Curry quality
in that she shoots like we've never seen in her sport.
She also has a Larry Bird quality, which is she's
kind of gets pissy and she's physical and she's pissy.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
And there's.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
A Midwest toughness to her. And I think you can
rub people, including WNBA rivals the wrong way. I look
at her and I think she's got Jordan's Ascension Curry's
game and Larry Bird's personality. Am I wrong?
Speaker 2 (20:05):
Yeah. No, I don't think you are.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
I think that Larry Bird, honestly, might have a little
bit more sass and a little bit like more like
Caitlin is just her own, her own personality, like especially
off the court. Like she is strictly basketball. She loves
to sit on the couch. She loves to watch TV.
She's very simple. I don't know Larry Bird, but I
doubt that. I bet he was a little bit more
fun off the court.
Speaker 1 (20:27):
I don't know if you know that. I don't know.
They called him the hick from French lick. So I
think he was basically all basketball, too.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (20:36):
But but, you know, I think it's like it's been
a blessing that she has been in our league. I
think the talent has always been there in our league.
But just like the eyes and the platform and how
she's transforming our game. Like we can be thankful for
the people who came before us. But you can also
witness greatness and say that she is great and she
has done so much for our sport right now.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
And I don't know why people are so. reluctant to
give her her flowers.
Speaker 3 (20:59):
And maybe it is that Midwest mentality that people don't like,
but shit, I love it.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I'm from Missouri. So I'm like, Hey, bring it on sister.
So I'm a big fan.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
You know, I, I said this about Kathy Engelbert. I said,
I've worked in broadcasting for 40 years. I've been very lucky.
I've had very, very good bosses, but not all my
bosses have been great. And I said, and you were
publicly critical of Kathy Engelbert. And my take was when
the league wasn't making money, And it was growing, but slowly,
(21:27):
kind of methodically, she was fine. And then literally in
15 to 18 months, the league exploded. It's beating hockey.
It's beating baseball. And now we need a new commissioner.
And that's not that she's not capable, but it's just like-
I mean, Kathy, it's the volume slowly grew. If the
(21:50):
volume went from what it was the first week to
Spotify in a month, we would be over our skis.
And I think part of what Kathy struggled with, the
league is so popular, so big, so many eyes. It
needs fresh management and fresh leadership. Is that that feels fair?
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I think it's very fair. And truly, I hate to
be critical because I know that job is so tough.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
And anyone who's in that position, you're going to get
loved and you're going to get hated. And so you
need someone who has a backbone, who is bold, who
is courageous, who is going to try to unify. I
think the WNBA is such a spot where it's really
easy to be diverse. But you need a leader who's
going to come in here and give us a common
goal and unite people. And I think our biggest thing
(22:40):
as players, I'll just say myself, I don't want to
speak for other players, but I do know this is
the conversations we've had is we want a commissioner who,
first of all, wants to engage in our engage in
our players like we need to have a conversation. I'm
telling you, like if we were in a room and
she walked in. She wouldn't even say hi to us.
She would just go do her own thing. It's like,
this is a player's league. So have a relationship with
(23:02):
your players being communication. Like, yes, you will like work
for the owners, but at the same time, we're both
trying to grow this league and make it bigger and
better than ever. And so, you know, I think you're right.
I think when she first came in the league, she
was doing an okay job. She'd made some good business
decisions for us. But once we exploded, I just don't
think that she was ready for it. I don't know
if anyone would have been ready for it. But I
(23:23):
think our biggest thing is we want a commissioner who
is going to fight for us, who's going to have
a relationship with us, who is going to listen to
us so we can work and work together. And I
just don't think that we have that relationship whatsoever with Kathy.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Well, I think I don't know how many people know
this during covid. Adam Silver was on the phone with
LeBron James every other day. So Adam Silver has always
leaned on his star players for guidance. Remember, during COVID,
there were players, Dwight Howard, Kyrie Irving, that were saying,
shut it down. And Adam would listen. But he really
(23:58):
listened to LeBron James.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
And I think that and I don't think that's a
I don't think that is a I don't think that's
a weakness. Rob Manfred. Oh, I think Rob Manfred, the
baseball commissioner, really wants to raise the floor of salaries
for Not necessarily cap them at the high end as
much as raise the floor. He wants players to make money.
(24:23):
He just doesn't, he doesn't want one payroll to be
80 million and one to be 450 million. So I
don't know. I Roger, I've seen Roger Goodell with players
like they're close. Roger calls and talks to star players
all the time. The it is, it is interesting. And
I'm going to throw this at you. I'm asking, I mean,
I'm close with my sister. I have my daughter and
(24:48):
two stepdaughters. I was closer to my mom than my dad,
although I love my dad, but I was closer to
my mom. So I've always felt the volume. We have
a lot of women in management. And so I think
I sort of get sometimes the sensibility of women, right?
My wife's very strong, very opinionated. But this question's different.
(25:09):
And if you're offended, you can virally smack me. When
you are kind of viewed a little bit, and I
don't know any other term, a little bit as the.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
League's... Just say it. I don't care.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Sex symbol.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
Is that fair? Oh, hey, that is way better.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
I thought you were going to go somewhere completely different
with this, so I'll take it.
Speaker 1 (25:34):
But my take is you lean into it a little bit.
You're an interesting contradiction. You're tough. You'll fight anybody. You'll
taunt anybody. But you'll make sure coming into the arena,
I look good and I want you to know I
look good. Tell me how you view that. Are you
conflicted or is that is that just like, hey, it's
(25:56):
I mean, Dennis Rodman was wearing a dress. It was
good for everybody. Right. How do you and I don't
know if that's semi offensive, but how.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Do you view that? It's not. It's not for me.
Maybe some people take it. I don't.
Speaker 3 (26:10):
And I think for me, the reason why I really
lean into that is, first of all, I have always
been super girly.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Since a little girl. I've always loved to dress up.
I love dresses. I love high heels. I love all
of that.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
And for some reason, our society, if you play basketball,
you can't dress that way.
Speaker 2 (26:28):
You can't be girly.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
No one's ever said it, but it's like the kind
of feel that you can't be both.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
Screw all that. Yes, you can.
Speaker 3 (26:35):
You can be girly and you can go out and
kick someone's ass. Like, I love that combination. And I'm
not just going to say that. I also think on
the other side, you can go and dress a little
more masculine and go out there and still kick ass.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Like, there's not one way to do it right.
Speaker 3 (26:48):
And so for me, I just I know my lane.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
I'm going to stay in my lane.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
But I also know that I have a lot of
young girls who are girly, who are raised like I was.
who have aspirations to be where I'm at that they're like, Oh, well,
can I, can I do both? Can I still be
girly and get my nails done and have my hair
done and dress up and, you know, kind of look
real hot coming into a game and then go be
sweaty and work hard.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
Yes, you can.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
And so I feel like that I am just showing
that you can have both. And for girls who are
wavering in, in their confidence, first of all, if you
look good, you.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
Play good typically is how it goes.
Speaker 3 (27:22):
And so I will also say when I first got
into the league, like I, Totally.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Like we weren't dressing up. I was literally wearing kind
of what I wore to bed. Like you were just
rolling up.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
In sweats and like sweatshirts, like pajamas.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
Like, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (27:35):
But now that we have so many eyes on everything
that we do, why would I not, you know, maximize
my opportunity?
Speaker 2 (27:42):
Because if people are seeing how I dress, well, guess what?
That's business.
Speaker 3 (27:45):
Now clothing brands are coming in and sending me clothes
and wanting to work with me. And so I have
a very kind of business mindset at times, but at
the end of the day, I also just like to
be a girl and I like to dress up and
I like to look a certain way. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
By the way, I had a, um, a coworker probably
five years ago, um, um, beautiful person and, and, and
they were getting makeup on and we were, we were
talking about this and I said, there is a reason
Tom Brady wears beautiful suits and has his hair styled
(28:19):
and looks, it looks like a model when he's on
the air. It's okay for both sexes to want to
look good. You're a public figure. I'm in TV. I
wear makeup. Otherwise I'd be hideous to look at. I
get my hair fixed, right? Like, so my take is
people shouldn't be offended by that. You guys are brands, right?
Speaker 2 (28:38):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
OK, when they do cereal commercials, that's not milk that
they're trying to make that. You know what I mean?
Like they're trying to make that look as white as possible. And,
you know, like putting glue in it. It's like, guys,
this is all about marketing and branding outside of just
the strict basketball. Years ago, James Harden, I forget what
the team was. Maybe it was the Rockets. They had
(29:01):
a runway and the guys all came out.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
Who gives a shit? I think it's fun. No, exactly.
Speaker 3 (29:06):
And at the end of the day, you said it perfectly.
All my friends and family, that is like game days.
And like when I have to be on TV or
when I have to do photo shoots or stuff for sponsors,
that is the best that I will look. Otherwise, I literally...
damn near look homeless. And I barely wear makeup. I
barely brush my hair. And so those are my days
to have my shit together. And so I I'm right
(29:27):
there with you, but I do think it's fun. And
I think the males like it. I think as females
really like it. And so, um, I think it's just
the fun part of sport that you get to see
kind of our style and what we like outside of
the field, outside of the court, and the fans love it.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
So why would we not do it?
Speaker 1 (29:41):
You've been in the league, how many years, six years,
seven years, seven.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Oh God, I'm getting old. Yeah. Seven.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
So I've said this on the air outside of baseball,
you guys run sort of unopposed in the summer. And
when I fly around and grab the clicker, I think
your sport is very clicky. I think it's very sticky
that I probably two dozen times during the summer landed
on a WNBA game. And I've said this, the quality
(30:07):
of play is so much better. The passing is The
ball handling, it's more of a vertical sport than it
was 10 years ago. Go to your first year and
go to now. What part of the basketball to you
is like significantly better? Because I still hate the officiating,
but what part of the basketball to you is next
(30:30):
level compared to even seven years ago?
Speaker 2 (30:33):
Yeah. Um, the girls are just so athletic.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Like you would have, I feel like the women's basketball,
you've always had to have pretty much a very, um,
high IQ fundamental. Um, yes, you still have to be
athletic and you're probably more athletic than your average, but the,
the girls nowadays, and like, I say this in like
the most respect, this is like probably the highest compliment
you can get.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
Like there are girls coming out of college who play
like dudes.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
And just the way they move, the way they are
quick with the ball, their skill set.
Speaker 1 (31:04):
And me, I'm like, oh, shit.
Speaker 2 (31:07):
I got to guard that. I just like staying around
the three-point line and then shoot my shot. Someone else
guard that. But you really see the athleticism really changing.
People can dunk. People are fast as hell. And it's
like Olivia Miles.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
She is a rookie. Oh, my God.
Speaker 2 (31:22):
She's killing it. And she literally plays like a dude.
And that is no disrespect.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
That is one of the highest compliments you could ever get.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
And so... Um, you just see more and more girls
like that.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
The, um, Sophie, when, when we, uh, hired you at
the volume and in my take was, um, the league,
the quality of play was good and getting better, but it,
there is something to be said about being a provocateur
and many times the best players aren't Rodman wasn't, um,
(31:54):
but he knew what he was. Um, When you pointed
the finger and did that gesture, I thought it was hilarious.
The amazing thing, it became like this massive meme. Did
you ever just sit and go... I mean, I don't
know if you had... Was that spontaneous?
Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yes. I am just....
Speaker 3 (32:16):
I am just sassy and I don't give a flying F.
I just, I just, just who I am. And so
I've kind of mastered it getting in people's heads and
I get it. I've had teammates who I played against.
They're like, we freaking hated you. But then once I'm
on the same team, people are like, oh, you're actually
so cool.
Speaker 2 (32:34):
And we love you. Like, we love you as a team.
I'm like, yeah, duh. Like, it's just who I am.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
And so when that happened, you know, I just got
in the other girl's head and she got mad that
I was pointing a finger and she got like mad mad.
And so I was like, shouldn't have done that. Like,
once I saw I gotcha, I gotcha. And so then
I just kept it there. And so it did go viral.
It was like all over the world.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
For two weeks.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Oh, yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
And I walk around now. And like when people ask
for photos, like last year was like, hey, can you
put me in a headlock? And now this year it's like, hey,
can you point at me?
Speaker 2 (33:01):
And I'm like, what am I doing? Stick with basketball.
But it's part of the game. So who cares.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
If the fever is. offensively you're the best team in
the league, but if the fever play their very best
brand of basketball, can they win the title? I think
you have the fifth best record or fourth right now.
I think we're at fifth.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Is there, what, what is missing to be the first?
Speaker 2 (33:30):
I think consistency.
Speaker 3 (33:31):
And I think us as a team, we know that
when we are clicking, I don't think anyone can beat us,
but are you going to, are you going to get
that version of us that night? And I also think
defensively we struggle. I think we're at like 11th or
10th and that is, that's not good whatsoever. And yes,
we're able to outscore opponents, but playoffs are a different
(33:51):
ball game. It's a different type of beast and you
got to shore up on your defense and Um, I
know in the W, uh, the last, I'm pretty sure
like six teams who have won it, they've all been
top three or four, um, maybe besides one in, in
defense and the.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Ratings of defense. And we're just not there.
Speaker 3 (34:06):
And so, um, during this break, we're on a two
week break because people are playing in, uh, the, the
FIFA stuff going on.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yeah. FIBA.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
FIBA. Yeah. Right.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
Yes. Clearly I'm not over there, but we're, we're working
on our defense and we're shoring up on that. And
so I think if we can just get a little,
a little bit better defensively, then yeah. I mean, I
wouldn't want to play us in, in the playoffs and
we have the experience. We, we definitely have all the
offensive threats you could ask for. And so we're a
(34:34):
dangerous team, but again, there's a lot of dangerous teams.
So it's, it's the little, the little details.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
You do understand, though, that getting booed and getting catcalls
is actually great. Like, outside of Jordan, most of the
best players in my life in sports... were hated in
every arena except their own. So when you get, like,
I don't know. I think Draymond Green lives for it.
(35:02):
I mean, I've talked to pro athletes my whole life.
They're like, I'd never say this publicly. I love winning
on the road more than at home.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
It's the best.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
And they'll never say it because they don't want to
tick off the fans. But my take is when you
go into a rival arena and they give you shit,
it must be unbelievable to walk out with a W.
Speaker 2 (35:22):
Oh, it's so fun.
Speaker 3 (35:23):
I think both sides when we're here at game bridge,
it's so much fun because our fans are awesome that like,
you know, you just feel leaving good and that you
put on a good show for them. But there is
something special about, especially this year going into a different
arena and like, everyone knows it. I get booed 24 seven.
If I touch the ball, I get booed. Like it's,
(35:44):
it's just what it is. And the thing is, I
fucking love that shit.
Speaker 2 (35:47):
I love it. Like bring it on.
Speaker 3 (35:49):
And I think people don't know that people don't know
that I love that.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
And I thrive off of that.
Speaker 3 (35:52):
And so there is a extra good feeling about everyone
hating you.
Speaker 2 (35:58):
And then you guys walking out.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
With a, with a dub and like smiling and having
fun and getting on the bus and going home or
going to the next game.
Speaker 2 (36:04):
So it's a good feeling.
Speaker 1 (36:06):
No hesitation, Sophie Cunningham. We love her at The Volume,
and it's great to finally talk to you.
Speaker 2 (36:13):
Yes, it's been a minute. We need to do this
more often. We love you.
Speaker 1 (36:16):
The Volume. This podcast presented by Bud Light. Easy to drink,
easy to enjoy.
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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