Rams Chiefs makes MASSIVE trade, Latest with Max Crosby, Lou Holtz passes away

John opens the show breaking down a massive shake-up in the NFL as the Rams and Chiefs pull off a blockbuster trade that could shift the balance of power in the AFC and NFC. Who won the deal? Who’s taking the bigger risk? And what does it mean heading into the season?

We also dive into the latest drama surrounding Maxx Crosby and the Raiders.

Plus, John mentions the news of Stefon Diggs being released by the Patriots.

And finally, we take a moment to reflect on the passing of Lou Holtz — honoring the legacy, impact, and unforgettable moments from one of football’s most iconic voices.

Follow John on Twitter, and Instagram for the latest. 

All lines provided by Hard Rock Bet

Check out Gametime - the fastest growing ticketing app in the US, and the official ticketing app of 3 & Out and GoLow -  for tickets to all of your favorite NFL, NBA, NHL, NCAA teams. Concert and comedy show tickets, too. Go to Gametime now to create an account, download the app and use code JOHN for $20 off your first purchase. #Volume #Herd

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
The volume. What is going on everybody? How are we doing?
John Middlecoff three now podcasts? Hopefully everyone is doing well.

(00:22):
And we had a massive trade today. The Chiefs traded
Trent McDuffie to the Rams for a first round pick,
and I said, you know what, feel a little under
the weather, but I gotta do something. So we fired
out a podcast reaction to the trade. Some other stuff
going on. Mike Silver wrote a big article about Max
Crosby and Lou Holtz passed away at eighty nine years old,

(00:46):
the legendary Notre Dame football coach, So we will dive
into that today. I'll probably do a pretty big mail
bag tomorrow. Hopefully there's another trade at John Middlecoff. At
John Middlecoff is the Instagram. Fire in those dms to
get involved on the show. And you guys know the druve.
If you listen on Collins feed, make sure you're describe

(01:07):
with three and out. We're on Netflix, so you never
miss an episode. You can listen to on your phone.
Put it in your pocket. I do it all the time,
not to myself but to other people, So go check
that out as well. So let's just dive in. I
mentioned this to Howie is that when I first started
working with the Eagles, he was kind of on the
forefront of thinking much more like a basketball or a

(01:29):
baseball general manager, where major players get traded all the time.
And when I was a kid in the NBA and
the Jordan Aarrow was thriving, and obviously baseball was America's pastime.
I know, technically, I don't know if it's lost that
kind of that label in terms of they still consider
themselves that, but clearly football is America's sport. But one

(01:52):
thing that happened in those two sports constantly were star
players getting traded year round the in season. It just
didn't happen as much in football. Obviously in season, football
coaches always pushed back, it's not a plug and play league. Right.
If I trade for a third baseman right now, in
spring training or in the middle of the season, I

(02:13):
just put him at third base, and if he's a
good hitter, I put him at Now. They bat the
guy to lead off for second potentially three or four,
and we just roll in a weird way. It's a
team sport that's kind of an individual sport morphed into one.
Basketball has always had this middle ground where you need
these great individuals, but it's definitely more of a team
concept to win championships and be you know, win a

(02:35):
lot of games, much closer to footballs where chemistry, cohesion,
some of the intangible stuff really really matters. But they've
always been willing to make trades for star players. I mean,
some of the biggest names in the history of the sport,
at least in my lifetime, have been traded in season, offseason.
It just happened, and in football it was way less
likely up until the last ten years. And I think

(02:58):
we have really benefited obviously some of the talks about
the sport, but people that consume the sport is if
I would have told you two days ago there was
gonna be a massive trade on Wednesday morning, I would
have said universally, people you know, not necessarily quote unquote casuals,
but people that fall football really closely would have said, oh,

(03:19):
where did Max Crosby get traded? I wonder who landed
AJ Brown? And that's not what took place. Trent McDuffie
was traded for a first round pick from the Chiefs
to the Rams, which this is out of nowhere because
Trent McDuffie had been rumored like the Chiefs were gonna
give him one hundred million dollar contract. They weren't gonna

(03:40):
pay him thirty million dollars a year. And we'll dive
into all the different angles there, but it was it
was kind of well known he was available. Now they
weren't just gonna give him away that you had to
pay a lot I either, rams, but these teams and listen,
and he's made a lot of trades. Obviously less snead
have made a lot of trades. You go, yeah, John,
these two teams are outliers. I think all these teams now,

(04:01):
especially the good ones, are more than willing to wheel
and deal, Like we have a league full of Howie
Roseman John Schneider types who are willing to do aggressive
things that historically football, especially you know, seventies, eighties, nineties,
was much more of a conservative league. Let's just see

(04:21):
what we got, let's just play this out, let's just
keep our picks. I think it's much less likely like
that now. Obviously, the boom of the cash that is involved,
the pressure on a year to year basis. It was
reported yesterday that's Steven Ross the Miami Dolphins who. I
don't think I have won a playoff game. I don't
even know if they've won a playoff game in the

(04:42):
Internet era. It's been a long long time. Don't quote me.
I don't want to piss off Miami Dolphins fans, but
it's definitely been over twenty plus years since the Miami
Dolphins have won a playoff game. Maybe even longer, maybe
since the nineties. And they've sold one percent of the
franchise and he got a hunt earn twenty five million dollars.
You know why, because they valued the franchise at twelve

(05:05):
point five billion dollars. Now, there are some franchises that
are worth more than others. But this is why I
always push back on the mindset of people like the
Cincinnati Bengals, people like the Arizona Cardinals. Yeah, your franchise
might be worth in theory way less than that, but
your franchise is still worth billions of dollars. You have
the cash flow from the league. You should be overly

(05:27):
aggressive spending money. You're not gonna go broke. This isn't
the seventies or the eighties. You're not dependent on people
showing up to your stadium. That is just extra cash.
That is just money to fill your back pockets. And
those type guys, unlike some of these franchises don't have
a lot of other businesses that they need to worry about.
I do understand some of these teams that go, well,

(05:49):
we got a EPL team, we got three other businesses,
we got a lot of hands in different cookie jars, right, Okay,
so some years we're gonna be more aggressive than others.
That is not the case for some of the poor teams. Now,
you're not poor because you have the NFL for you
have the NFL valuation of your franchise. And I just
appreciate teams that are aggressive. I appreciate all these gms

(06:11):
in the league making this kind of reality television show
much more entertaining. You could tell me right now there
is another massive trade on Thursday or Friday of this week,
and it does not include either one of the guys
that we think are gonna get traded in Max and
AJ and that that's what's cool about the off season now,

(06:32):
because let's face it, you look at the free agent list,
it's not great, it's not name It's like no one's
you know, gonna break Internet records. Talking about Tyler Lindenbaum's pay,
you know, getting paid twenty million dollars signing with somebody, Right,
But these trades, these maneuvers, these really good teams being
overly aggressive. What does everyone say, like Max Crosby, Howie

(06:55):
Rosen's gonna be in the mix, Howie Rosmin's gonna be
in the mix. The Bears right now are currently the
betting favorite to land Max Crosby. The Tampa Bay Bucks
are going to be overly aggressive to get them. The
Detroit Lions, I'm sure, are going to have long discussions
in regards to Crosby, and I think we all benefit
from that. And it makes you know, an off season,
which I would say used to be a little slower,

(07:18):
especially twenty thirty years ago, much more of just fireworks
can go off at any moment. And these trades, not
just now, but in training camp and in the season,
you got to buckle up because they could come at
any moment. That just wasn't the case in generations past.
So props to these young guys, Props to these gms
like less Need and bred Veach and Howie and John

(07:40):
Schneider that are just fucking willing to wheel and deal.
We all that follow the sport and love the you know,
the business of football, truly appreciate you because you make
this the whole thing much more entertaining in the middle
of March when it could could have been a little slower.
So let's talk about the trade now. I did some digging,

(08:01):
and I've done digging on this guy for a long time.
The Chiefs really like Trent McDuffie. I won't go as
far as love Trent McDuffie because they traded him, but
he was not poorly thought of in the building. He has,
from what I've been told, elite football character and just
a high end character guy. So in terms of the intangibles,

(08:24):
he's a high end human being, the type guy that
you want in your building. Good example comes to the Chiefs,
they immediately go to several Super Bowls and he's one
of the key guys on defense. He is a winning player.
I think the issue they had is the business element
of this sport is he's a fantastic nickel corner. You

(08:46):
could argue he's one of, if not the best nickel
corners in the NFL. The guy that plays the slot. Right,
you got your outside guys like Richard Truman, Darrell Reeves,
Patrick Tretan, and then you got guys like Trent McDuffie
who throws inside and when you put him outside, he's
a good player. But no one would, you know, get

(09:09):
him confused for some Hall of Famer outside. And if
you're going to pay a guy thirty plus million dollars
a year, which I would guess whenever the contract comes
out that the Rams eventually give him, it's going to
be an astronomical number. And I think they were uncomfortable
giving the amount of money to a guy who thrives

(09:29):
doing certain stuff. Again, they love the guy and the
intangible stuff, but given that some of their other financial situations,
given that they're paying their quarterback a lot, and ideally
he comes back healthy and you know he will keep
getting revisions to his contract and be one of the
highest paid guys in the league for the rest of
his career, as long as he's on the Chiefs and
Andy's there that you got to make these tough decisions.

(09:50):
You know, when they traded Tyreek several years ago, it
wasn't football because Tyreek then was in the peak of
his powers and one of the greatest football players we
ever seen. You can't. You can't say that about Trent McDuffie.
You could say that about Tyreek Hill. And then he
went to the Dolphins and had like historic seasons. He
was an elite, but they were just uncomfortable. Obviously, there's

(10:10):
a lot of noise off the field, and they just
made as much of a business decision as like a
personal decision. Can we invest in this guy at this number?
And we can't, And we punted with the McDuffie thing.
It was more is he good enough? Because Tyreek was
good enough for whatever you're gonna pay him. It's like,

(10:30):
can you trust the guy? You can trust McDuffie, but
can you trust him on the outside against Jamar Chase
in the second round? And the answer, I think clearly
they said no, not When I'm paying you is what
you will become the second highest paid player on the team.
So I don't think this was an easy decision for
the Chiefs. And let's face it, they extended George Karlofftis

(10:52):
last year and by all accounts, he had an underwhelming season,
So there's gonna be a lot of emphasis for him,
I'm sure, from the coaching from Beach, from everyone in
that organization of like, listen, we've invested in you, we
need to get what we saw early on. We need
you to be, you know, an above average player. And
I think they just kind of went through that that

(11:14):
it was like WHOA carloftis was never gonna be Max
Crosby was never gonna be some high end one of
the best players in the league. But they felt good
about his trajectory. And let's face it, I would imagine
a year and they probably have some regrets of doing
that contract and they didn't want to be in the
same position with McDuffie. And like McDuffie, carloftis elite football character.

(11:34):
So they have no problem with the guy or the person.
It's just the play, and they're in the business. It's
all about the play. We're the only team in the
league really that it's like super Bowl bust every single year.
I mean, we went to you know whatever five or
six Super Bowls and it felt underwhelming, like we thought
we should have been it had more success, and that's

(11:55):
pretty rare in a league built on parody. Here's the
other thing in the Andy era, because Beach hasn't been
the GM the whole time, even though he's been with
him the whole time. He came over with him from
Philly and then became the GM. I forget the exact year,
seventeen or eighteen, whenever they drafted Mahomes, he wasn't technically
the GM yet, even though he was obviously one of

(12:17):
his biggest supporters in the building and the guy pushing
him from day one. They've won a lot of big trades.
I would say there are four pivotal trades in the
Andy Reid era. We don't have the results of this one.
We will find out over the next several years, but
the previous three we couldn't have gone much better. The

(12:39):
first one I'm not going to call the home run,
but when they traded for Alex Smith Andy Reid's first year,
it solidified a position that the Chiefs had been disaster
at at quarterback. They were the worst team in the
league the previous year they had the number one overall pick,
and getting Alex Smith, they went to five playoff games

(12:59):
in six years. Like so, they immediately stabilized their franchise
and became a real factor in the NFL. Not a
Super Bowl factor, but a real factor on a yearly basis.
In a league still with Brady, with Manning Philip Rivers
in his prime, like, they became a real team and
they gave up a second round pick for him, and
they clearly did not regret that one at all. Their

(13:22):
next massive trade, obviously, was trading up for Patrick Mahomes.
They were coming from the twenties and they got him,
and it clearly will go down as one of the
greatest trades in the history of sports. Right It's netted
them a bunch of Super Bowls. He's a Hall of
Fame quarterback and he will go down as one of
the greatest players in the history of the sport. And
it all came back to Draft night when they knew
that the Saints and Sean Payton liked them, and they

(13:43):
maneuvered them and came over them. So those are you know,
Mahomes is a walkoff Grand Slam Alex Smith, when you
factor in the context of what that team was, I mean,
is that minimum like I mean a double off the wall,
maybe like a stand up triple. That was a fantastic trade.
The other trade, which was pretty polarizing, back to the
Tyreek thing, which is ironic because they traded Tyreek to

(14:06):
the Dolphins, and then they used that pick to take
Trent McDuffie, who then became a key player for a
team that went to three straight Super Bowls. I remember
talking to each a couple of years ago. He's like
they had been back to back champs, and Brett was like,
you know, the crazy part is George carloftis at Trent McDuffie,
who were drafted in the same draft, right in the
first round. All those two guys knew going to the

(14:28):
Super Bowl. That's not the league. I mean, obviously they
got a little humble pie this year going six and eleven,
But that trade is listen. I don't know where it
goes on the list of all time great trades, but
when you factor in getting rid of the money, changing
your defense, and then winning back to back Super Bowls,
it's clearly one of the defining moments in the Andy

(14:48):
Reid era. Now this trade is yet to ride itself,
but anytime that you could get a first round pick
for a player that you were not gonna pay who
you drafted in the first round a little higher pick
twenty two, you get picked twenty nine. But over the
course of four years, not only has he held his value,
and he's not viewed as like, you know, sometimes these

(15:09):
guys get traded, like Jalen Ramsey, you know, Khalil Mack
got traded, but those guys reviewed as like Hall of
Fame players. Trey McDuffie's not viewed as a Hall of
Fame player. But he's a really good player that you
can get a first round pick and then the following
year get a third round pick. I know there are
other picks involved. I don't really care about those, but
the pick twenty nine for a team that needs some younger,

(15:31):
cheap assets and talented players. Think about this. The Chiefs
got their starting left tackle last year at the end
of the first round pick thirty one, so this is
technically a better pick, you know, so I this is
this is one of the rare trades. And someone with
the Chiefs texting with him today said this is a
win win, Like, this is a good trade for the

(15:52):
Rams too. This is not one of those trades like
when the Dolphins traded for Tyreek Hill. It went does
this make that much sense? Like, is is this what
you want to do? And there was a business element
to this, you know from the Dolphin standpoint that they
got to the playoffs. He was great. It's not like
it was a disaster for them. But you're gonna trade

(16:12):
for a wide receiver, you better be damn sure, right
The Raiders has traded for Davante. DeVante's a Hall of
Fame level guy. It was a disaster the Eagles, who
were much better equipped to handle it, trade for aj Brown,
And while it might end this week, it was a
really successful marriage making that move. So Trady McDuffie is
much more of a plug and play player because of

(16:34):
his versatility, and you immediately know he can play in
the slot. And then you're in a division where you
know JSN you the forty nine ers are gonna have reinforcements,
I'm sure on offense obviously, the NFC in general with
Ben Johnson, the Lions got a bunch of talent, The
Eagles got a bunch of talent. The Cowboys have a
really good offense. You know, I think the South is
kind of under the radar right now. The Giants are
definitely on the come. I mean, jayde Daniel's gonna be healthy.

(16:56):
The NFC, I don't think we quite talk about sometimes
with the AFC because of Mahomes, Josh Lamar Burrow Herbert.
But from a team standpoint, it's really good and really deep.
So I think when you're looking the Chiefs, the key
now is to hit on these players. And you know,
the best thing that ever happened to him. They lost

(17:17):
his last couple of games. They have the ninth overall pick.
They should get a impact player that helps reset the franchise,
like they have a chance to get the equivalent of
you know, a Travis kelce a Chris Jones, the guy
that you can look back in seven eight years that
have been to five Pro Bowls. And I don't mean
the guy like a Shador Sanders Pro Bowl or you
know Mac Jones Pro Bowl. I mean the Pro Bowl.

(17:39):
You know what I mean, one of the best players
in the league at his position. You know, a guy
that's whether he's an All Pro or like a fringe
All Pro, but a guy that every team would want.
And Chris Jones and Travis Kelcey are all pro level guys.
But you know what I mean, And whether that's Ruben Bain,
whether that's you know, I don't think they're gonna take
Jeremi Love because I don't think you'll be there, But
you know, one of these offensive linemen, whoever it may be.

(18:01):
I think it'll be alignment. But you have a chance
to get a core guy for this reset, and then
with twenty nine you can do a couple things, like
you could move up into the high twenties. Right, you
got that extra third. Next year you can get aggressive
because you're kind of like the Rams. The Chiefs are
all in on this year that they're gonna try one
to be back, to be a division champ, to be

(18:23):
hosting playoff games. They will be aggressive in this draft.
I promise you that, and I think now they are very,
very equipped to do that. Today's show is brought to
you by a presenting sponsor, hard Rock Bay, Florida's sportsbook
March is here. That means College of Basketball takes center stage.

(18:46):
Stakes are rising, and the shots are falling. Get it
all your action you need on hard Rock back Hoops
is on every night. That means you can get same
game parlays going every night of the week. When you
sign up today and double your winning on your first
ten bets max fifty, that's right. If you would have
won one hundred bucks on your same game parlay, make

(19:08):
that two hundred bucks. The hard Rock Bet sportsbook app
is the only legal sportsbook for whatever you're in Florida.
It's also live in Arizona, Ohio, New Jersey, Indiana, Tennessee, Virginia, Illinois, Colorado,
and Michigan. Plus hard Rock Bet. They offer new promos
every single day, so whenever you're listening, just open up

(19:31):
the app and check out what you've got to any
day of the week. Down's a hard rock bet today
and make your first deposit payable and bonus bets not
a cash offer. Offered by Seminal Tribe of Florida. In Florida,
offered by Seminal hard Rock Digital LLC and all other states.
You must be twenty one plus and physically present in Arizona, Colorado, Florida, Illinois, Indiana, Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee,

(19:55):
and Virginia to play. Terms and conditions apply. Concerned about
gambling Florida, call one eight three three play Wise in Indiana.
If you were someone you know has a gambling problem
and wants help, call one eight hundred and nine with it.
Gambling problem call Winne Hunter Gambler Arizona, Colorado, Illinois, New Jersey, Ohio, Tennessee,

(20:18):
Virginia on the Rams side. Clearly they have been really
close to these last couple of years. I mean they
are was it a Jalen Carter pass rush two years
ago against the Eagles from upsetting the Eagles and I

(20:39):
think they probably go on to win the Super Bowl
that year. This year it was clear the Super Bowl
was the NFC championship, and I think that their downfall
this year was pretty clear. Their secondary wasn't that good
and it's been well, I guess it's been put out
there by different reporters like they had had a desire

(21:00):
to add a high end secondary player and they've done
it before and it really worked. Now, Jalen Ramsey at
the same age is a better player than Trent McDuffie. Right,
if you could say, hey, you get every GM in
the league at whatever old trend is twenty five, twenty six,
you get both players, same age, every single GMS taking
Jalen Ramsey and that helped change. They gave up more.

(21:21):
Remember they gave up multiple first round picks, so you
didn't have to give up as much. But I think
there weren't many Trent McDuffie types available, Like most teams
aren't willing to trade high end corners and high end
dbs when they have Super Bowl aspirations, like the Jets

(21:43):
traded Sauce Gardner because they were going nowhere. Hell, they
were going backwards. So the Chiefs because of their financial situation,
like we're willing to talk now. There were also rumors
that the Giants were involved, but the Giants would never
give up their what do they have the fifth pick
in the draft? You know that that's not an option,
So I would imagine their offer might have included, like, hey,

(22:05):
we'll give you like a three and a four this
year and a one next year or whatever it may be,
but it would they would have to kind of get
creative because the top five pick is not an option.
Where the Rams, this trade is probably the easiest one
they've ever made. It truly is because I could be wrong,
but all the years that they traded their first round picks,

(22:27):
going way back to the Sammy Watkins, to the Brandon Cooks,
Marcus Peters, obviously Jalen multiple first round picks, I mean,
Matt Stafford, they usually only had one pick. Right this
year because of the trade they made, you know, essentially
ten months ago, this pick was like listen, we talk

(22:49):
about this all the time. There aren't thirty two guys
that you will have graded in the first round. There
is not a player. Now, this might not be the
case in five years, but as we sit here, Sean
McVeigh and less need in their offices wherever in some
beautiful area in Los Angeles, where you go, we're gonna
get a guy who's gonna be as good as Trent
McDuffie for the next couple of years. Not only could

(23:11):
you not say that, more than likely, it's a fifty proposition.
This guy is decent, this guy's a starter. And because
we have the thirteenth pick in the draft, because we
made one of the craziest trades in the history of
the league. There's no one's disputes that James Pierce can play, right,
he had whatever double digit sacks this year, but he
might spend the next however many years in jail. Right,

(23:34):
So not Matt Ryan or Ian Cunningham or any of
those guys. Fault is a previous regime, But that will
go down of taking a character risk that high and
mortgaging a first round pick to pick a guy in
the twenties. Why is he there in the twenties because
he's got the biggest red flag behind him you've ever seen,
and obviously he lived up to that. This offseason. It's

(23:55):
a fucking disaster for the Falcons. And then you go
eight to nine. It's not like, well, you made the playoffs,
you won, you got to the second round. You give
the Rams the thirteenth overall pick, which enables them they
can move up a couple spots. If they like a guy,
they can move back a couple of spots and add
more picks, so it gives them flexibility. When's the last
time the Rams drafted this high. Well, I'll tell you

(24:16):
the last time was, you know, four or five years ago.
The problem was the Lions had their pick and use
that to maneuver and get Jamiir Gibbs and say Laporta.
So I think the Rams they had to view that
pick as just little house money. Listen, we all do this.
Anyone that's hit a big bet, you know, online, and

(24:37):
you see that number in your account, you go, this
is just found money. And that's not always the right
way to look at it. But sometimes you're like, hey,
I'll make a bet that I might not make because
I just hit this parlay for a couple grand and
I think the Rams looked at it that way, and
I don't think they're wrong too to be aggressive with
that pick, utilize that pick because they have one goal

(24:58):
and one goal only that to me is to be
playing at home in the Super Bowl. And they have
been really really close the last couple of years. And
from their front, their front's good, the landman's a stud,
their defensive coordinator is good, but their secondary was just
not trustworthy. And I would imagine, you know, if Caleb
Downs is potentially available at thirteen, they will add more

(25:18):
secondary help by one issue with this move for them,
which it's and this is kind of a hypothetical because
we don't know how this is all going to play out.
One thing Belichick really thrived at over the course of
their dynasty was he was always hesitant in free agency
or trading back in the draft because he never wanted

(25:40):
guys in his locker room who hadn't done anything for
the Patriots to be making more money than a lot
of his core guys who were winning in winning Super
Bowls and going to Pro Bowls. And he was always
very cognizant of that fact until the end when he
got desperate and obviously a couple of years later it
cost him his job. Kokinnakua has been one of the

(26:01):
best players in the league for the last several years,
and last year he was an unstoppable force. In those
games against Seattle, he looked like Jerry Rice meets Calvin Johnson.
I mean, I just don't think I've ever seen anyone
quite play like that. There was like a trell Owens
element to it. Was a monster. And he's contract eligible.
And this is a major conversation around the league. Like

(26:24):
we see these numbers. Brandon Ayuk was catching seventy five
balls a year and got a contract with seventy five
million dollars guaranteed two years ago. Think about that two
years ago. So a guy like Puka, you start looking around, Well,
who you're looking at. You're looking at the Ceede Lambs,
You're looking at the Jumar Chases, You're looking at the

(26:46):
Justin Jeffersons. So you start talking one hundred and twenty
one hundred and thirty million dollars. Now I'm talking guaranteed money. Now,
I don't think Trent McDuffie is gonna get near that
much money. But if you do break Trent McDuffie off
give him seventy eight eighty whatever guaranteed ninety. I don't
know what the contract is gonna eventually be. Puka goes well,

(27:07):
I've been in the trenches with all these guys these
last couple of years when we've been on the precipice
of jumping over that line and getting right there with
the Eagles going toe to toe with Seattle in the
NFC Championship. I wish your fucking road, Doug. I'm a
winning player. We can, you know, nitpick some of the
maturity stuff of the off the field, but there is
no disputing his just elite nature on the field, which

(27:31):
the end of the day, there is a production business,
and I think that is going to complicate things a
little bit. If in the next couple of days Trent
McDuffie gets a huge contract, I think that will only
emphasize what are they gonna do with Puka? They got it.
This is not gonna be something they can just kind
of go into training camp with. It's gonna be probably
something in the off season that you're gonna have to

(27:53):
solidify and kind of put you know, pen to paper
and get a deal done. And if you're not move
on from because he would have a ton of value
and I don't think they're gonna move on fromhim. I
would expect Pooka nakou to get a big contract. But
if you tell me Pooka Nikoua doesn't have a contract
by OTAs and Trent McDuffie has a big contract when
he's never played a snap for the Rams, I would
expect Pooka Nakoua not to be around and then that

(28:14):
becomes a big thing. And he's already a polarizing player.
So I mean, it's part of doing business in the NFL.
A lot of variables, a lot of moving parts, a
lot of people have opinions, a lot of egos, a
lot of you know, people get offended quick with money
because money's all relative, right, and you know how much
everyone else is making. So that's something just to keep

(28:35):
an eye on the contract situation, how they handle McDuffie.
And remember when they traded for Jalen Ramsey years ago,
they didn't immediately sign a new extension. It took a
little time. And remember Jalen was cool with it because
Jalen's like, I'm like best player in the league. I'm
gonna get an astronomical amount of money, and he eventually
did so. I appreciate the Rams they are that trade

(28:58):
with the Falcons and the domino effects in which it
had in a positive nature for their franchise led right
up to today, because without that, I think it makes
it a little more complicated. Now they still might do
this deal. Let's just say, if you know they had
just taken a player at pick twenty six and there
was no crazy trade available from the Falcons, maybe they

(29:19):
do this deal. At anyway, I think it became way
easier to be like, yeah, take twenty nine, we gotta
pick thirteen and props the Rams, and props to the
NFC West, which is gonna just it's gonna be fireworks
because if they can solidify that defensive backfield DeVante Puca,
you know, Stafford, I think they by the time we

(29:43):
get you know, to training camp. Would not shock me
at all. If the Rams are the betting favorite to
win the Super Bowl. Now that doesn't you know, the
Ravens and the Bills going into last season, I think
we're both like three or four to one to be
to win the Super Bowl. They had better odds in
the Chiefs and the Ravens that he make the playoffs
part of it. The guy missed field goal, but still

(30:04):
they weren't gonna win the Super Bowl this year. Coach
got fired, immediately hired, got one hundred million dollars. So
it's not like his life sucks. But you know what
I mean. So just awesome trade, awesome, A lot of
moving parts here, and like I said, very very appreciative
to these type guys that just make moves and give
us something to talk about. Okay, a couple other quick stories.

(30:25):
Mike Silver, who I was with last week at the
Athletic who is just one thing I appreciate about a
lot of people in the NFL. And I can't speak
to the journals in other sports, but I think what
makes a great reporter in the NFL are guys that
have in the NFL is probably easier to develop relationships

(30:47):
with the coaches in the personnel department than maybe some
other sports. Could be wrong, but Adam Schefterer knows every
coach in the NFL rap sheet knows every coach in GM.
In the NFL, Diana Russini was fucking everybody. Mike Silver
has been at this for decades. He goes back with
the Walsh and Al Davis and Mike Shanahan days when

(31:08):
he knew those guys well. But this guy's ability to
get people's phone numbers, talk to people and get information
is just it's a skilly has now. The one thing
with Mike that he's really good at is, you know,
I don't know what Mike is late fifties. He can
booze and hang so like he is a fun hang.
He can go out with these guys, you know, whether

(31:31):
he he can just relate to people. He's really good
at just he's a fun hang and when he writes
something like he gets good information. He was the guy
that broke the story about Brandon Ayuk and Mike Silver
was once famously banned from the Raiders facility. I think
him and Al Davis used to butt heads, and he
reported today about the Max Crosby situation. And I think

(31:54):
at this point in time it's pretty well established that
Max is ready, and I think the Raiders are okay
and ready to They do just want to drive up
the price, like they don't just plan on giving Max away,
like for a Trent McDuffie package. And I think that
is spy Tech's biggest hang up here, Like we're not

(32:14):
just gonna give him away for a first and a third.
This is not only one of the best players in
the league like a McDuffie, he's like the highest character.
His off the field in tangibles are off the charts.
And he's not a slot corner. He's a pass rusher,
an every down player who plays as hard maybe as

(32:35):
anyone in the NFL. He might be the hardest player
in the NFL in terms of effort for about seven
straight years that guy. There have been a couple guys
at least over my time doing this, and it was
JJ Watt and Aaron Donald. And what made them Hall
of Fame players is they were more talented than everybody
and they played harder. I wouldn't say Max has the

(32:57):
most talent, Like I don't think he has like Myles
Garrett physical traits. I wouldn't compare him to like von
Miller bend. But what he lacks maybe of, like if
those guys are at ten and he's at like an eight,
he makes up for of, like he never taking a playoff.
Someone in the NFL this year sent me a clip
late in the season the Raiders were terrible. They're playing

(33:19):
the Texans, who have won a bunch of games straight
and one of the hottest teams in the league. Max
played that game like someone told him, this is a
last football game you'll ever play in your life. And
I was texting with Andy Reid a couple of weeks
ago when I was asking him to come on the
podcast at the Combine, and then he told me he
had knee surgery wasn't gonna be there. When we started texting,
I just said, what do you think about He loves

(33:41):
Max Crosby just like every coach in the league. I
think if you went around, especially to offensive coaches, the
first guy and obviously the Raiders would never trade Max
to the Chiefs. But my point of saying that is
the reverence these coaches have for Max Crosby couldn't be
any higher, the respect in the way he approaches the game.

(34:02):
And because think about coaches, they spend ninety to one
hundred hours a week. They have no lives. Mike McDonald
says he sees his kid for thirty minutes on a Thursday,
so they're just all football. And you see this guy
who just is on a shit team for years disastrous situation.
Every single year he's got a new coach and new
coordinator and he's just playing like his life depends on it.

(34:24):
When all any coach wants back to high school, let
alone the NFL, especially the good ones, guys that really
give a shit. And the number one thing you'd say
about Max Crosby, I just don't think he could give
a shit anymore. Like his care level is like one
hundred out of one hundred. And obviously his production and
his play speak for itself. So I've been saying this

(34:46):
for a while. I saw Albert Briers say today that
more than a quarter of the league is gonna want
or be very interested in Max, if not more. Well,
how does a price go from hey, a first, a third,
and a player too? All of a sudden, we got
multiple ones for Max Crosby. When you have people bidding

(35:06):
against themselves, it's just basic, you know, it's a basic
economic transaction. If I threw out a car for fifty grand,
and one person is willing to pay me forty grand.
If I want to sell the car, I'm gonna get
forty grand. But at that same car for fifty grand.
If I have seven people standing there and three of
them are desperate to get that car. Maybe I could

(35:27):
end up getting sixty grand for the car. So if
you got people lined up to trade for him, you
can start playing them off each other. And it's pretty
rare that you get in these situations. Like Trent McDuffie
on the open market. His market was probably a little unique,
right there. Weren't that many teams lined up to give
a first and a third round pick for Trent McDuffie

(35:47):
and then pay him however much money these teams. Think
of the teams that are interested in Max Crosby, the Rams,
the Niners, the Bears, the Lions, the Eagle, I'm sure
the Ravens Tampa, Well you start bidding, Hey, they've offered
me a one and a three. This happened. I remember

(36:08):
when the forty nine ers mid season traded for Christian McCaffrey.
There were two teams willing to trade for Originally the
Rams offered a two and a four, or maybe it
was a three and a four. So you know what
the forty nine ers had to do. They had to
offer a two, a three and a four, and the
Rams are like, that's a little rich for our taste.
So what happened. The Niners got them, they had to
pay more than the rams. Well, and that was just

(36:29):
two teams. So when you have let's just say it
comes down to let's say ten teams initially are talking,
and then as the price kind of gets established, half
of them drop out, and then when you really coming
down the stretch you get three teams that are very interested.
I just don't see how you don't get multiple ones
for Max Crossby, not when there's a bidding process, which

(36:51):
they're clearly is going to be in this situation. The
other part of that story was the Alex Guerrero Tom
Brady's guy influence in the building. And I don't never
met Alex. I can't speak to it. Clearly, he enabled
Tom to play till he was like forty five, and
he probably could have kept planned, so I can't argue

(37:13):
that he doesn't know what he's doing. I do think
anytime you get into a situation where someone is viewed
as like, I don't even want to say a tattletale,
but just is this guy if I say the wrong
thing in front of him, will it get back? One time?
In radio, I'll give you an example. You know, in radio,

(37:36):
you have all these different program directors, right, so if
you're at a station, or if you're in a conglomerate
and they got six stations, when you go to the office,
there's the program director for the rock station, there's one
for the conservative news station, there's one for the country station,
there's one for the sports station. And they're all kind
of together, and you get to know them all. And

(37:57):
we have this new program director for R station, and
he's the biggest bozo idiot I've ever been around in
my entire professional life. I mean, I got dumber every
day that I was around the guy. I mean, it
was It's an experience that I will never forget. If
you remember Howard Stern used to call his program director
pig vomit that we used to have a We used

(38:19):
to call him vegetable lasagna. You can google that. In
the Seinfeld episode, this guy was just a moron. I mean,
I couldn't believe, like this is my life. And I
remember badmouthing him to another program director, but I didn't
realize that like that guy immediately went and told him
what I said, but I didn't realize the connection. It
turns out that they were golfing buddies in this situation,

(38:43):
like all the players know that is Tom's guy, and
my only issue like I don't, I don't. If I
was Tom, I'd fucking own this team too. If I
was Tom, I'd live in Florida and play at Baker's
Bay and hang out at Grove twenty three with MJ
and live that life. It so I just build one
hundred million dollar compound. Don't blame at all, do exactly
what he's doing. But if you want to kind of
run the football thing, and this is what it makes

(39:04):
it hard. Like even in that article, like Max likes
John Spytech, how could you not? John spy Tech is
very impressive. John Spitik's a stud, Tom's stud. But you
can't be in on football and making decisions if you're
not around because there's just like a bunker mentality. And
I listen, I've never been in the military, but I've
read enough military books. My dad was in it, heard

(39:26):
him talk. You kind of become bonded with the guy
next to you because you're just fighting the good fight, right,
whether it's basic training, whether it's just when you you know,
fly around the world doing whatever you're doing, and there's
an element to that with football because you're just always together.
You spend so much time together. It's like, why is

(39:47):
your relationship with your brothers and sisters can change you
get a little older for where things happen. For the
most part, ideally you have a good relationship with them
as you get older. Why because even if one's older
you by a couple of years, you spend a lot
of time together in your formative years when you were young, right,
And in football is the same thing. It's why these
guys are bonded for life because even if you only

(40:09):
play together for three or four years, the amount of
hours you spend is more than you would spend in
that same period of time, like with your significant other.
And part of football is John Elway did this, Hey,
I'm gonna be the GM. And being the GM is
different being a minority owner. But John Alway moved to
Denver or I guess he might have been already living there,
but he was in the office every day. He was
a part of the team. Right, So if you're gonna

(40:32):
do that, like your presence being around really matters. And
I listen, I do think if Tom's right now, is
trying to have his cake and eat it too, which
is under I think a lot of us would in
his spot. I do think one day he will, if
he's truly gonna play this role and kind of be
what Mark Davis has done seated power to him. I

(40:55):
do think it would help to be in the facility more.
I really do, because the Guerrero thing. I think it's
understandable to go. Yeah, players a little uncomfortable because they
know if they say the wrong thing, it just goes
back up the chain. And it's one thing. Hey, if
I say something wrong to my GM or my coach,
like I'm with him every day, we can discuss it.
I've seen it for years, like with the forty nine

(41:17):
ers when deebo would ask for trays and Kyle's like,
I fucking I've been around Deebou every day for five years.
So or Trent, I've known him for fifteen years. Yeah,
it's business, but our relationship we're gonna be okay, We'll
talk like grown men. We know each other really well.
How did well do the players on the Raiders know
Tom Brady? How could they know him that well? He's

(41:38):
never around. So I think that it's just a weird
dynamic that they're battling, which I've always commended Mark Davis,
like there are medaling owners like Jerry, who's obviously always
around the Cowboys, but it's always hit about him. He's
making the moves, he's doing whatever. Mark Daves like, Listen,

(41:59):
I don't pretend to be my dad. I'm not Al Davis.
I don't want to pick the players. I don't want
to run the draft meetings. I want my This is
why he gave John gruen On a hundred million dollars.
Is why you paid Josh McDaniel's a bunch of money.
It's why he went to Tom Brady and says, I
want you to own some of this so you can
run part of it. I think his heart was in
the right place, but I think in a perfect world,
even markets, I wish he was around more right to

(42:21):
really kind of solidify and get the back of my
coach and GM and the kind of the the heart
and soul of the facility. It's just difficult when you're
when you're gone, you know, it's be no different. As
a parent, I see some of these guys, if you
got like six or seven kids, some of these players
like six or seven kids with like five different women, like,
you're just you're never gonna see these kids. How the

(42:42):
fuck are you gonna raise these guys? It's impossible, you know,
you're just out of side, out of mind, show up
sometimes and then FaceTime like I ain't gonna work. You know,
fucking if my dad would have never been around, I
would have gotten so much goddamn trouble. When that comment came, well,
your dad's coming home, I was like, buckle up, boy,
and I listen. I'm not saying that Brady has to

(43:04):
be like the you know, the Belichick force of being
the guy dropping the hammer, but I do think his
presence would go a long way of just being around,
and it doesn't feel like that's gonna happen anytime soon.
I don't really have much say on the Stefan Diggs situation.
My overall take, I do think there was just too
much noise because it does feel like verybel liked him,

(43:25):
and I know the playing time he has some big
game for him. Sometimes he wouldn't play. He obviously made
some huge moments for them throughout the course of the season.
I just think the off the field stuff throughout the
course was just it ain't worth it, and Mike is
much more personable than Bill, but I think they're cut
from the same cloth of like, yeah, this is this
is not worth the headache. And last but not least,

(44:01):
Lou Holtz TODA eighty nine passed away and I was
born in nineteen eighty four. He became the head coach
I think in eighty six. I don't really remember Lou
Holtz maybe right at the end being the head coach
at Notre Dame. I remember, actually little Lou Holtz being
the head coach of South Carolina and obviously a media
figure who I think he's one of the rare guys

(44:23):
you know that John Madden, John Gruden, you know, just
guys that are just all time football guys that just
the love they had for football was just something that
you can't fake. Who was I talking to this about
at the combine? You can't someone that had worked with
John Gruden. It's like you can't fake what he brings

(44:44):
to the table, you know, like his personality, the way
he is. Derek mentioned it. I was never round John Madden,
but he's just these guys are one of once. Lou
Holtz was a one of one. Now obviously the lisp.
He was a tiny little guy and he swung a
bit stick. And football has never been more popular. The
sport has never made more money. It's never been more

(45:07):
important to the cultural fabric of society, right down from
high school to college to the pros. And there are
guys back in the day that this and the one
thing with football it used to be like this. In basketball,
it's less important now, Like I couldn't point the Oka
See coach out of the lineup. I have no fucking
clue who the Spurs coach is now that they used

(45:29):
to really matter, you know, Phil Jackson's pat Riley types
does feel like that's kind of coming to an end. Baseball,
I mean managers making like eight hundred k. I mean
the running back coach at Florida makes eight hundred k.
So it shows you the financial you get what you
pay for, Like the GM's run the sport. In football,
the coaches have always mattered and they still really matter,
and there are certain individuals in that spot that just

(45:51):
kind of break through. And the amount of money and
notoriety and popularity now that comes with being a football
coach in college or the pros has It's never been
like this, it's never been bigger. But the sport was
built on the backs of guys like Lou Holtz. Because

(46:12):
one he's just you hear him talk, you know exactly
who it is. Like you close your eyes. I could
put in your phone into your ear and I could
play you a ten second sound bite and I'd say,
who said that? And whether you're twenty five and you
fall football and definitely older than thirty to eighty years old,
you would know exactly that is Lou Holtz. And I

(46:35):
obviously he had been sick. He's old. I mean he's
eighty nine years old. But I think he's one of
the most important figures in the history of the sport
when you just factor in the personality. He went one
hundred and thirty and two at Notre Dame, and the
Notre Dame he took over was not like the Notre
Dame Marcus Freeman took over when Brian Kelly left. We
can agree Brian Kelly's an asshole and mailed the n

(46:58):
at LSU. He did a really good job at Notre
he had not only had them relevant, like they were
one of the better programs in the country. And Marcus
Freeman it looks like it's taken to the next level.
Lou Holtz took over a disaster and within a couple
of years they won the national championship again. He won
over seventy percent of his games, and even he went
to South Carolina, who was in shambles at the time,
within a couple of years they went nine to three.

(47:20):
And I just think that it's a sad day for football,
but I also think it's a day for football where
you can smile because we wouldn't be here. You know.
There are these clips going around some of the legendary
games and the thirty for thirty was Notre Dame against Miami, right,
was Notre Dame playing these teams back in the eighties.

(47:41):
Some of these historic players like Rocket Ishmael, Jerome Bettis,
some of these guys that he had and they were
just I can't speak to what they were way back
in the day, like Joe Montana Route. They've always been
a huge brand, but there's a reason that they have.
They don't join a conference as a ball program and

(48:01):
just get a massive deal from NBC because if Jerry
Jones could do the same, he would and he would
get an enormous amount of money, and he would do
enormous television ratings. That's exactly what Notre dame does and
a huge part of Notre Dame's lore and popularity and passion.
Even long after Lou Holtz was done coaching Notre Dame,

(48:23):
it felt the passion and love he had for that
program was like part of him. It was deep in
his soul. And I watched some of the day that
he got the job in Minnesota in like nineteen eighty four,
and within a couple of years he had turned around
that program and he had a clause in there because
it was different times, playoffs didn't exist, that if they

(48:44):
made a bowl game, because you had to accept a
bull offer, he could bolt for one school and one
school only. He would only leave the program if one
school called, and that was Notre Dame. And within a
couple of years, Notre Dame called and I think he
was the coach. Within two days, They's offer him job.
And obviously the rest speaks for itself, and I would
imagine he became you know, definitely in the nineties and

(49:06):
two thousands. I mean, he's one of the most famous
football guys in America, and it's just a sad day,
and I would imagine the respect being played by his
former players the football community. He's just a unique character
and one thing sports is always going to need because
this is entertainment. Our characters are people to entertain. And

(49:29):
Lou Holtz was a great football coach and he was
also a great entertainer. And I guess we'll end on that.
Ri Ip Lou Holtz The Volume