January 14, 2026 • 41 mins
Colin Cowherd reacts to Mike Tomlin stepping down as head coach of the Steelers after 19 seasons. He discusses what the Steelers should consider when replacing him and why sitting out a season is a good thing for Tomlin before he returns to coaching.
Colin also explains what this means for Aaron Rodgers at 42 years old and if it’s time to retire.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
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Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go, ready to roll, and it's a Wednesday.
We're live in Stowey, Chicago. It's the Herd wherever you
may be, however you may be listening. Thanks for making
us part of your day. Former Steeler great tenure a
decade with the Steelers. Jerome bettis next hour. So I
(00:51):
was thinking about the Pittsburgh Steelers job opening last hour
of our show. Mike Tomlin stepped down. And there's a
lot of things. They don't have a head coach, a
quarterback for the future. The defense is old, the defense
is expensive, their money's on the wrong side of the ball.
But what the Ravens and the Steelers have that the
(01:12):
other seven job openings and seven franchises don't. Ravens and
the Steelers don't fire coaches. Harbaugh got eighteen years, Tomlin
got nineteen years, and so you could go to a
Kevin Stefanski in Pittsburgh and say, listen, we're gonna bought
him out. Our scouting department doesn't like Ty Simpson until
the third round. Second round, You're gonna win three games,
(01:34):
and Stefanski knows I'm not gonna get fired. In Pittsburgh,
they don't fire coaches. Tomlin in the end walked away,
and that's at the core of what the Steelers are
really uncomfortable with, and they need to get over it.
This no losing seasons thing. Being awful got the Patriots.
(01:55):
Drake May being awful got the Bears. Caleb Williams. You
know what, being mid got the Steelers, Kenny Pickett. Folks,
the richest people in the world carry debt to acquire assets.
To get wealthy, you got to carry debt, Okay, Mark
Zuckerberg has mortgages to a dozen homes. He could own
(02:18):
every city block in Silicon Valley. He takes out mortgages.
You've got If you want to get wealthy in the NFL,
you got to be able to take a big swing
and not worry about having the cleanest books for a year.
And my takeaway, you got an old roster, expensive, you
(02:40):
don't have a quarterback, you don't have a coach. The
one thing and the one box. The Steelers check his stability.
You're great at stability, but so is Baltimore and they
have Lamar Jackson. So how do you get the best
candidate because Baltimore's got Lamar, You got nothing. And the
way to do it is you go to us defans
and say you can be terrible next year and we're
(03:02):
not gonna fire you. We think next year we can
get archs manning and win three games, load your roster up,
win three or four games. I think you have to
have the conversation in Pittsburgh, and it gets very uncomfortable
for people in Pittsburgh of just resetting the franchise, going
the opposite of Tomlin. We're gonna go a young offensive
(03:25):
coach and we're gonna bought him out because you know
what quicksand is in the NBA, in the NFL, the eighteenth,
the twentieth pick. That's where pittsburghs feels like they're at
the twentieth pick. The only way you want to be
at the twentieth pick. Is if you have Josh Allen
and you can't get up. Go look at Tomlin seven quarterbacks.
Where's the one where a Hoysted trophies Big Ben. The
(03:48):
rest of it's guys. Now, Aaron Rodgers at thirty two
wasn't just a guy. He was the guy. Maybe, But
go look at the Tomlin era. Seven straight seasons, seven
straight seasons, bottom ten in offensive spending. It's time you
can respect somebody like Mike Tomlin and think it's time
(04:08):
to do the opposite of Mike Tomlin offensive coach money
all on offense, not old and experienced on defense, young
and cheap and aggressive. Because the quarterbacks in the AFC
now Mahomes and Allen and Lamar and Burrow and Herbert
and bow Nicks and Trevor Lawrence and CJ. Stroud here
(04:30):
they come waves of it. Justin Herbert can win a
playoff game. So you got to do the Zuckerberg. Take
on some debt for a year, get uncomfortable trying to
salvage next season. You've been doing that for years, seven
straight years, bottom ten and offensive spending. I can respect
the hell out of Mike Tomlin, but want to do
(04:51):
the opposite going forward. To Mike Tomlin, I want a
very current, very young offensive coach who spends all his
money on a because I just feel like, year after
year after year, this team's not viable. This team is
not a viable franchise. It's not insulting. If I buy
(05:13):
your house and think your house is charming, I just
want to redo it in my style and the style
Pittsburgh has to acquire with a little debt, be awful
next year, and start over. The athletics Robert May says
it may not take very long to look completely different.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
They have seven picks in the top four rounds this
year and five picks in the top one hundred already.
On offense, they have one of the youngest offensive lines
in the league. And on defense, there are a lot
of guys that I do not think will be back
next year if you are kind of transitioning to a
different version of the team.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
They were one of the oldest teams in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
I expect them when we wake up in the middle
of next season and you look at the ages of
these rosters, to be.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
One of the youngest teams in the NFL. Aaron Rodgers
now had a good year. I thought he should be
called comeback Player of the Year. I stand by that
it's probably over for him in Pittsburgh. I would guess
unless the Vikings call and they talked about it this week,
they'd like competition for JJ McCarthy, Aaron Rodgers would take
that job and win that job. In my opinion, where
(06:19):
do we stand on Aaron Rodgers because he may retire,
what do we think of him? And the way I
look at Aaron Rodgers is you can't tell the story
of the NFL without Aaron Rodgers. In any profession, we
can argue best, worst mid you can't argue mattered, great talent, little, prickly, unbelievable,
(06:43):
first ballot Hall of Fame. I remember fifteen years ago
when everybody was treating him like Archbishop Aaron. Everybody in
the media worshiped him, even insisting he was better than Brady,
and I kept saying bad body language. Sometimes he's a
sometimes he's a Baylor, He's passive, aggressive. I think he's
(07:04):
really really talented. I don't think he's going to end
up being close to like a Manninger a Brady in
the trophy category. And I stand by that I said
at fifteen years ago ah there's things I don't love,
love his talent, leadership, forgetting a bad interception and moving on.
Thought he was a little safe in big games, whatever,
(07:26):
But even on draft night, Aaron created drama in his profession.
He mattered. And let's face it, very few quarterbacks, most
quarterbacks in the end, leave it up to interpretation. Montana
didn't four rings, Brady didn't seven rings. But most quarterbacks
are closer. The great ones are closer to Like Marino Man,
(07:50):
he was great. I can't believe he didn't win a
super Bowl. Farvn Rogers Man, they were great, they only
won one. Very few quarterbacks Mahomes has now become one
Brady Montana. They don't leave anything on the cutting room floor.
They get every trophy they get close to. But I
look at Aaron as one of those fifteen guys all
(08:14):
time that you can't write the story of the NFL
without that quarterback. It doesn't matter if you have all
the hardware like Spielberg, or you have less hardware one
oscar like Scorsese. You can't argue toe to toe, completely
inarguably transformative. And that's why I look at Aaron the
(08:36):
rest of it. Almost all quarterbacks we can debate third best,
eighth best, ninth best, sixteenth best. Aaron mattered. You can't
write the story of the league without him. Who cares?
If he's prickly pushback on the media and whatever I mean,
Brady Mahomes probably manning Montana. The titles they should have won,
(08:57):
they won the years they were great, they hoisted something,
even the other fifteen great quarterbacks of all time. It's interpretation.
Here's Aaron Monday about his future.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
And I'm not going to make any emotional decisions. Disappointed,
you know, obviously in such a fun.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Year way again, you wanted to be here.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
I'm not going to talk about that.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
Eric Hunt, do you approach just what you decide to
do next?
Speaker 4 (09:27):
Just get away and then then have the right conversations.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Listen, I had said before Pittsburgh I would take the
vikings gig or retired. I think Aaron made the most
of it. I think he's a little trickly. What apps
who cares? In your industry, in your space? Do you matter?
That's indisputable, that's inarguable. Even the years he didn't start.
(09:57):
Go read the Jeff Pearlman book Gunslinger. In that building,
he was poking Brett fav in the Ribs Draft Night drama.
He wasn't even a packer officially yet had never gone
a uniform, and we were talking about him and that
says a lot. J Mac Mike Tomlin's walking away. We
got nine openings. That is that is so crazy. Now
(10:19):
there's a sense there aren't nine good candidates. I'm gonna
push back on that. We also will present a Super
Bowl bubble today of the eight remaining teams, four in,
four out and the outs. There'll be some dispute on that,
but four in four out, we'll talk about that. Yeah.
Speaker 6 (10:35):
Wow, So you think maybe there are some good candidates,
because that's a bit of a surprise to me when
I hear some of these guys who are interviewing Colin
like some of these swoof.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
Well, just because just because you're interviewing doesn't mean you're
a candidate. It's fair. I mean, you know, these owners
aren't going to interview one two people. They want to
interview eight and so a lot of times, and this
is very clear, the way that works with agents is
a lot of time I'm an agent will get somebody
an interview knowing he's not going to be a head
coaching job, but he wants him to get the interview
(11:07):
with the owner to impress him. So if that guy
gets fired. So a lot of the people interviewing for
jobs are not truly head coaching candidates, but the agents
are getting of interviews, so they just you know, like
McVeigh was rare his first year of interviewing, he got
the Rams job. Generally there's a McVeigh out there. Mike
McDonald's another guy. The minute we talked about him as
(11:28):
a head coach, he walked into Seattle's building. John Snyder's like,
don't let him leave.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
The other thing.
Speaker 6 (11:33):
Yeah, you're right, because as soon as the agent gets
you in for an interview, what happens next right to
the media.
Speaker 5 (11:39):
Everybody fans it out.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
Joe Smith interviewed with the Patriots and next thing you know,
oh Joe Smith. He's in high demand. So you create
this artificial market that maybe really isn't there. But I
do think Mike McDaniel is soaring up the charts. If
I don't know, if you've following some of this closely,
he's he might be like a top three or four
guy on the market right now. Colin, I know you
have a big affinity for Mike McDaniel.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
We'll see he is one of the people being talked about.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
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hit that thumbs up icon and comment away. Albert Breer
Top of the Hour nine Job Openings Baltimore with Lamar Jackson.
Great ownership probably number one, I think in my opinion.
(12:56):
The New York Giants are number two, Steeler's three, Atlanta four.
Somebody's gonna get Fernando Mendoza Raiders. That's pretty good. Here's
the thing with Mike Tomlin, He's an incredibly prideful guy.
Once those fire Tomlin chants came down from the rafters,
he's probably done. He made up his mind. People make
up their mind long before they do things. I think
he made up his mind several weeks ago. I think
(13:19):
he could do television and be great. He's certainly great
at the podium. He's the best I've ever heard. Everything's
a nine second SoundBite. He'd be great. But he's not
a TV guy. He reminds me of Mike Vrabel. Vrabel
could do TV. He's not a TV guy. It's like
I always said, park cities of you. It's in Utah.
It's not really of Utah. It's a party town, Austin, Texas.
(13:43):
It's in Texas. It's not of Texas. It's way left.
Mike Tomlin could do TV, and so could Rabel. They're
not of TV. It's not their thing. Sean Payton I
worked with him for a year at Fox. He was
going back to coaching. So there's a lot of times
I've been critical of Tomlin. But leadership iq EQ, motivator,
culture creator, he's great. He's great. I think he needs
(14:06):
to modernize a little bit. I would I would give
you this as an example, you know, Tomlin's got an
iPhone like the rest of us, and it keeps asking
him to install now the new software, and he's for
the last seven years pushed remind me later, it's time
to install now, take a year off, modernize, reflect. His
(14:32):
coaching tree is a cactus. He didn't have anybody since
Bruce Arians. He's had four oz c's, none have done anything. Dude,
go to a mixer, wear a name tag, meet some
offensive young coaches, modernize, stay current, leadership, smarts, toughness, alpha,
culture creator and on TV for a year. All great,
(14:54):
but he does feel like he's got to push install now,
remind me later. On offense, I really think he needs
to modernize. Robert Mays of The Athletic talked about this yesterday.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
If I'm Mike Tomlin, I want to take a step
back and for a year just visit with people around
the league. Talk to people who should I be seeking out?
What should my offense look like? Who are the people
that I should build my staff with. Just take yourself
out of that small kind of insulated world when you're
the head coach and your head is down all the time,
and just think about how you need to build things
(15:29):
moving forward for you to be successful, because I think
if he surrounds himself with the right ideas, he is
such a good coach and a good motivator that that
overall construction and that overall model that would be appealing
to me if I were an owner trying to fill
one of these jobs.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
Like Nick Saban was a defensive coach, but he hired
I mean, Jim Mcelwaine, Doug Nussmeyer, Lane Kiffen Sark. I mean,
he was really good at finding offensive coaches, really good,
not all defensive guys. Now, Belichick had to keep going
back to Josh McDaniels. The minute he was left to
(16:08):
his own devices, he moved Matt Patricia to an OC. Okay,
So Tomlin maybe one of those defensive guys like Vrabel.
Vrabel's got Josh McDaniel. He gets it. Some of these
defensive guys are really good finding offensive guys. Some of
the old school guys are not. So I don't know
(16:29):
what Tomlin is, but I feel like a year reflect
do TV, make some money, have some fun, he would be.
I mean, I'm not going to give away any inside
stuff that I am aware of currently, but Tomlin's gonna
get jobs multiple I think you put him in a studio,
I think he'd be a home run. I think he'd
(16:50):
be just major energy. I mean, I honestly am rooting
for him to go to Fox because I think it'd
be a great watch. And that way, if he goes
to Fox, which has more NFC games than AFC games,
he may not have to criticize contemporaries he coached against
a lot. He can go over and talk about the
Niners and the Eagles and the Rams who didn't have
(17:11):
to face as much. He didn't want to be critical
of the guys on his side of the ledger. But
I'm selfishly I would love if he was a Fox guy.
I think he's going to be so good. But he
feels very much like Vrabel to me. Could do TV,
but not a TV guy. That's not his DNA. He
has referred to television as the dark side a couple
(17:34):
times in his career. Jmack with the news, No no turns.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
This is the herd Line.
Speaker 6 (17:41):
News, all right, Colin, I got a surprise for you
to start Herdline, and that is one Brock Perty. A
big game from Perty on Sunday against the Eagles, another
fourth quarter comeback in the playoffs for Brouck Perty Colin.
Speaker 5 (17:55):
Wouldn't you know it?
Speaker 6 (17:56):
He is now five and one in his career in
the playoffs. Yes, Colin, that's more wins than Lamar Jackson
and Cam Newton in the postseason.
Speaker 5 (18:05):
I know Cam Newton's not gonna take that well.
Speaker 6 (18:07):
Also, his five wins tied Jared Goff, Rivers and Burrow
You third all time, sorry in forty nine ers playoff
history in terms of wins, go ahead.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
The one thing I'll say about Perty, whereas Lamar Jackson,
there are times he visually looks tight in the playoffs.
I feel like Brock Pretty Week two, Brock Pretty Week eleven,
Brock Pretty playoffs, I get the same guy. He's not
affected by the scenario like I always feel with Brock Purty.
He's always been a guy that's gonna let it rip.
(18:40):
He's gonna have some ugly picks. They all stick to Darnold.
They don't stick to Pretty because party's had more playoff success.
But Brock will let it rip. He's not a guy.
One of my favorite qualities, in fact, my favorite quality.
I've told this story about Andrew Luck when he was
at Stanford. I went to the coliseum. I'm sitting there,
pretty good seats US season a shootout with Andrew looking
(19:00):
Stanford and luck is unbelievable. And then he fills a
pick six. It is an awful pick six to get
the Trojans back into it. I remember that, and he smiles.
He puts his hand on his helmet. He's like, oh,
stupid goes out. He's slinging the ball down the field.
A huge part of brock Pretty's success is he's not affected.
I never watched Purty and think, oh, he's tight. He
(19:23):
just you know, it could be good parenting, it could
be confidence, whatever it is. The kid likes to let
it rip. That's one of the Donald quotes. Donald's always like,
hey man, you do your prep, you let it rip.
And that's what I totally respect about Brock.
Speaker 5 (19:37):
So it's interesting. A lot of people are going to say, well.
Speaker 6 (19:40):
Wait a second, Jay, you're forgetting Brock had a second
loss against the Eagles. That's not technically a loss. Remember
he got injured with the shoulder in the first quarter.
That doesn't count as a loss on your ledger. The
one loss is the Super Bowl. Yeah, and he didn't
lose that he drove them down the field in overtime
for points. I mean, at some point we got to
start giving brock Pertty his flowers. I know everybody loves
(20:01):
Dak Prescott, and Dak is a top five tep ten.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
I think got two playoff wins. He hasn't done much.
Rock Purty is consistently praised. You're you're sensitive to it.
Brock Purty is considered exactly where he should be considered.
A gamer that gets banged up. He's not a Josh
Allen Talon No, but he's gonna win playoff games. I
think he is appropriately discussed. I don't think everybody thinks
(20:27):
he's way up here, but everybody like if you told
me him or Jalen Hurtz, I would take brock Purdy.
He's better from the pub.
Speaker 5 (20:33):
Oh okay.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
In terms of a pocket passer with mobility, party's a
good player.
Speaker 8 (20:39):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Can I ask you a couple more because you like
this game? Rock Purty or Jordan Love. Jordan Love is
a bigger, stronger quarterback. Both get hurt more than I'd like.
But I think he's a bigger, taller guy with a
little better arm. I think they're both talented, but you know,
I like traits. I'm loyal to size, I'm loyal to
arm I'm loyal to mobility. I would take love over
Brock Purty, rock Perty or Bonnicks. Bonicks doesn't get hurt
(21:04):
like ever, like ever, He's on a very team friendly
deal for the next several years, and he's a tremendous
fourth quarter quarterback.
Speaker 5 (21:13):
And because I have to do it, Jared Goff or Brockberdy.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Jared Goff is a better pocket quarterback, but again, doesn't
ago Jared. If Jared Goff doesn't get hurt, I mean
Bonicks and Jared Goff, both guys from the PAC twelve
that got you know, tossed around a lot of starts
every Sunday. They're ready to play.
Speaker 5 (21:34):
Now listen, I don't expect him to go to Seattle
and win.
Speaker 6 (21:37):
That lines up to seven and a half in some
places seven where we have Colin. If he does pull
this off as a big underdog, oh, Monday is going
to be fun. Yeah, just filing that one away. All right,
Let's move to the Rams. They are out here in
warm southern California seventy eight degrees yesterday, Colin, it'll be
seventy nine today. It's lovely, but they're playing in rigid
(22:00):
temps Sunday in Chicago. They're calling for a high of
twenty one with a low of eight colin eight degrees.
That's insanity. Matt Stafford, he says he don't care about
no elements.
Speaker 8 (22:12):
As far as the wind goes. You're right, it is
always winny in Chicago. I played, you know, a handful
of games there throughout the years. The good thing for
us is it was windy this past week in Carolina.
And when it goes to cold weather. We played the
Jets last year and what was I think it was
like twelve degrees, you know at kickoff, and you just
adjust to whatever the game, you know, whatever the weather
allows you to do. And I think if it's just
(22:34):
cold with a little bit of win, we go play.
Speaker 4 (22:36):
You know.
Speaker 8 (22:36):
I love that kind of stuff. I mean, that's that's
playoff football, right, cold weather in Chicago, windy day. There's
nothing better than that in my mind. So I'm excited
for it.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Yeah, that's right. There's never been a warm weather dynasty.
If you can't if you can't handle twenty seven degrees,
you're not built for this stuff. I mean I Caleb
Williams in the fourth quarter. Caleb played at USC Oklahoma.
He looked fine to me in the fourth quarter. If
you've got a strong arm, the issue with cold weather
is armstrength, two struggles and wind. Stafford doesn't, Caleb doesn't.
(23:11):
Some would argue Lamar's got an average arm. You know
who doesn't, Josh Allen Mahomes. So if your arm is strong,
bad weather Brady. I thought Brady was the best cold
weather crappy weather thrower I've ever sit because of his
hip torque Brady was an And did Brady have the
biggest arm in the league. No, he was a great
cold weather quarterback.
Speaker 8 (23:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (23:30):
A lot of cold weather guys on the Rams.
Speaker 6 (23:33):
I mean Stafford played for years in that division, outdoor
games in Green Bay, Chicago. DeVante Adams played for years
in Green Bay. Kyron Williams went to Notre Dame playing
in the Midwest. I don't I think the cold is
a little bit of an overblown narrative here and Colin,
I haven't officially fired on this game, but I think
I'm on the rams here. I know the Bears have
delivered to charm life. But the more you look at
(23:54):
the number the same.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
I'm the same. I think. I really when you lose
Edwards the linebacker, that really makes it because by the
way that linebacker, with those Ram tight ends and that
Ram run game, you can live with a backup left tackle. Again,
if you speed up getting rid of the ball to
your tight ends, you can speed things up. But I'd
see the Bears defense having a lot of trouble stopping
(24:18):
Ram drives. I think the Rams, even if they don't score,
are gonna get field goals and are gonna win field
possession for a big chunk of this game. And that's
why I like the Rams.
Speaker 5 (24:28):
Yeah, total agreement, Colin. Let's go.
Speaker 6 (24:30):
Final story. One of your favorites, Sean Payton. He was
fun when he was working here. Man, that guy has
stories for days. Well, he's got a super Bowl team
on his hands right now. They're preparing for the game
against Josh Allen. Obviously Denver had to buy and Sean
says he wants to see his offense be more aggressive
when it needs to be do I.
Speaker 9 (24:51):
Think he needs to be more aggressive going down to
the field, going downfield in the playoffs. A lot of
that would be based on who we're playing. We want
to be aggressive. We obviously want to, you know, and
we will take our shots, but a lot of it
like tell me the opponent and then then it's like, right,
how's that got to be done? You know? Are they
(25:12):
an eyes in team or are they a man team?
And we'll definitely stretch the ball down the field. We
feel like we've got some guys that can go down
and get it.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Yeah, if you play Houston, you can't be as aggressive
because of their pass rush. If you play the Bills,
you can be more aggressive. They don't have the pass rush.
So again, it's dictated on your game plan is largely
dictated on who are you playing. If you have a
the Bears have a backup left tackle, They're gonna want
Caleb Williams to get rid of the ball quickly. Now,
(25:41):
I guarantee it. That's part of Ben Johnson's game plan.
We're not sitting back in the pocket. They've got They've
got young and Verse coming on the edges. They got
Kobe Turner poon it forward in the middle. It'll by
the way, we're missing our left tackle. Like you can
tell what you're going to do going into it. Chicago,
I don't think it's going to be one of those
deep ball games. You're gonna want to get that thing
out two and a half three seconds, get it out
(26:03):
of Caleb's hands, because I do think for pass protection
for the Bears could be challenged.
Speaker 6 (26:08):
Yeah, I do wonder this Bill's defense was kind of
sort of solid against Trevor Lawrence, like Trevor Lawrence was
good for Davius White with a crazy turn back to
clock game. It's like, well, where did that guy come from?
I just don't know if Buffalo can duplicate that in
back to back weeks. And I do think the Rest
is probably underrated. Right, you get a whole week off.
I know the Rest versus Rust, but I think Denver's
(26:30):
gonna be ready.
Speaker 5 (26:30):
I I'm I don't know, Colin. I wait for your
blazon four on Friday on this.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
One, right.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Jmack with the news.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
herd line.
Speaker 6 (26:43):
It is.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
It is crazy that there's nine job openings. The average
has been like six or seven, it seems like forever.
So you start asking yourself, are there are there nine
good candidates? I think it's a better candidate year suddenly
than people think it is. So let's talk about very
good candidates, people that win double digit games and have
(27:06):
proven this time and time again. I think there are
four candidates that I would put in the good candidate
if they want to coach list, and I think we
can put it up on the screen. I think John Harbaugh,
Kevin Stefanski, Mike Tomlin, and Mike McCarthy. Those are very
good candidates. Those are proven head coach of the year,
(27:27):
double digit wins, can win a playoff game. I think
Robert Sala, Brian Floores, and Brian Dabele absolutely I would
be comfortable giving them a second chance. I think, you know,
Daboll got Daniel Jones a playoff win. Brian Flores that
thing unraveled, but I think he's arguably the best defensive
coordinator with Jesse Mencher in the sport, and Robert Sala
(27:47):
could have been the assistant of the year. And the
minute the Jets fired him, they from that minute on
have circled the toilet. They were at least viable. They
were going to go to Buffalo if they won, they
were going to be tied for first. They let him go.
They've been a has Matt spill since and then I
think Jesse min er, Clint Kubiak, Jeff Hafley. Again, if
(28:11):
they were there and they were my best options, I'd
have no problem hiring them. My takeaway is there's two
candidates out there. Cliff Kingsbury is one of them. I
don't think he's a head coach personality. I don't think
he is comfortable with conflict. I think in college and
pro football, as teams get loose, players have a bit
too much control. And I think he got to be
(28:32):
a front and center guy and be willing to deal
with conflict and conflict resolution. And I don't think that's
Cliff's personality. I think he's a great OC. A prime example,
why is he leaving Washington. He's got a conflict with
Adam Peters and he don't want to deal with it.
So I was like, I'm out of here. Once again,
that's who he is. It's fine. Mike McDaniel Miami, I
(28:54):
don't think he's a head coach. I think he's a
brilliant coach. But I think he's a VP, not a president.
I think he's a VP. So again I think those
are I think those are very That's nine guys I
would hire and two guys I'd hire in a second
to be coordinator. The key in this is being decisive,
(29:17):
because if the New York Giants, Giants sit on their
hands and of the fifth team to hire a coach,
not only do you get the fifth best coach, it's
bread crumbs on the staff. If I was the New
York Giants, I'd make a move now. Whether it's Stefanski
or Harball, I would make a move now because you're
also going to have a better opportunity to get a
(29:39):
McDaniel or Cliff Kingsbury as a coordinator. So you've got
to be decisive. Here's Steve Bushatti, Raven's owner, on their
head coach opening. Where we are.
Speaker 10 (29:51):
I could say I'm disqualifying coaches with losing records, but
I think you have to remember that they were the
hottest coaches in their cycle and they got jobs, and
they got tough jobs, and I don't think we have
a tough job. We created the best opening in this cycle.
(30:12):
And so that was the one category that I didn't
want to ignore because the first thing you all are
going to say is my got he went thirty eight
and forty eight in his last job and they're hiring him.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Yeah, I think I think that's fair because I do
think if you're the guy, you'll have a winning record.
The greatest example is Sean Payton. He inherited a team
and Russell Wilson didn't fit his offense, and they're still
this year paying off the Russell Wilson dead cap, and
he's made the playoffs back to back. Here with a
(30:47):
quarterback most of you don't like. Okay, so I don't
want to hear, but you can figure it out. There's
no excuses. There really isn't. This is why I tend
to lean offensive guy over defense guy. But it should
be noted of the eight remaining coaches, four offense, four defense,
So Baltimore is the best job. I would argue. Number
(31:10):
two is the Giants. That's what I would argue in
a perfect world, if I was the Giants, I'd offer
it to John Harbaught today, if I was Baltimore, if
he didn't want a losing record. That hurts Kevin Stefanski.
I think you have to contextualize Kevin Stefanski's career. He
coached for Cleveland. In my opinion, you have to qualify
(31:36):
certain things, not many things, but certain things. In Chicago
it's the hurd.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 5 (31:50):
Saturday on Fox.
Speaker 6 (31:51):
After dethroning the defending champs, Christian McCaffrey leads the Niners
against Sam Darnold in the top seeded Seahawks the Divisional
Round Playoffs, presented by Intuit TurboTax Saturday, seven thirty Eastern,
four thirty Pacific on Fox.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Well Darnold against Purty. Clearly, whoever wins is the better quarterback.
What a division rams Niners Seahawks. You talk about a
power group out west. So Art Rooney spoke this morning
on Mike Tomlin after nineteen years stepping away and that
(32:31):
the presumption is, and I think it's a reasonable presumption,
is you know, Tomlin, if you're in a job for
nineteen years and you're on that treadmill, I think it's
great to just take a step back and reflect. Here's
Rooney on Mike's plans going forward.
Speaker 4 (32:46):
Mike indicated that he did not anticipate coaching at least
you know, in the near future. I think he wants
to spend time with his family and do some of
the kinds of things he hasn't been able to do
for the last you know, many many years, and so
you know, if something like that comes up, we'll deal
with it when it comes up. But right now that
doesn't seem to be on his radar.
Speaker 9 (33:07):
You know.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
One of the things that's really great about the NFL,
and the Patriots are a great example. Denver is a
great example. You get the coach in the quarterback right,
you can just go from doghouse to penthouse fast. And
that's not the way it is in the NBA. I've
never understood this. The NBA makes it hard to trade.
It's like, well, yeah, yeah, the salaries have to come
(33:29):
within and you got all these aprons. Now, it's like
hard to make trades. So if you're in the downside
of that. The NBA is so paralyzed about dynasties. Your
ratings are better with dynasties. Stop worrying about it. I mean,
the KD Steph Clay Draymond team was fascinating, the Heatles
were fascinating. Seven champs in seven years isn't fascinating. But
(33:50):
the NBA makes it hard to trade. Football's like trade
whoever you want. Also, in the NFL, you can cut
whoever you want. You may have to eat some salary,
but you can also work contracts constantly. You know, to me,
you could do two things. I would bought him out
and go get an offensive guy. Or I could also say, well,
(34:11):
we've got a first, a second, three threes and two fours,
give up a third and a fourth, couple six is
the following year, give up a bunch of picks and
get to like eighth in the draft and go get
Ty Simpson. If it works great, If it doesn't, go
draft another quarterback. The Steelers have three third round picks
and two fours, so you can keep a third and
a fourth and move off two thirds and a fourth
(34:33):
and move up and get Simpson. Give up, give up
good picks. Try it. He is viewed, I'm told, as
a late first round quarterback, But so what, that's the
one position. It's okay you can overdraft a guy. Don't
overdraft by a round. But if you overdraft by nine
to eleven spots to get your quarterback, it's fine. And
(34:53):
if it works great, If it doesn't, move him, and
get the guy the following year and a better quarterback draft.
There's a lot of option here for Pittsburgh like a
lot of good options, and or you could just say, listen,
Kevin Stefanski, we don't care, don't we know you've been
losing a lot. We don't fire coaches here. You got
(35:14):
a first, a second, three threes, two fours. We're gonna
stack the roster. We're gonna move the old guys. On defense,
We're gonna give you a young, twitchy, athletic, inexpensive defense.
And the following year we're not gonna be very good
this year. Following year you can pick the quarterback that's
very attractive, but doing the mid stuff again, you gotta
(35:35):
get terrible, at least for a year to get Drake
Man Caleb Williams. If you're drafting twentieth, you get Kenny Pickett.
Like you said, wow, what about Lamar? Not a lot
of late first round Lamar Jackson's And even when he
came out there, you know you trust the Ravens because
the Ravens have drafted so well for so long, especially
on their early picks. But the other story I saw
(35:57):
this morning is everything I have always said this. Men
are great at starting things, we're terrible at ending things. Wars, relationships, conflicts,
We're great starters. Maybe it's guys or hunters. We're good
at chasing stuff down, we're bad at breaking up. And
Lebron has been this mobile guy. His career is so redeemable.
(36:20):
This ending in la is weird. So apparently his agent
who represents him, Rich Paul, has a podcast with Max Killerman.
Two good guys like both, and apparently it's ruffling feathers
inside the Lakers organization. They're talking about stuff they'd rather
not be privy to. So and Lebron said yesterday, Hey,
(36:43):
Rich Paul's comments on the podcast are not a reflection
of me. Well, Rich Paul's job as Lebron's agent is
to speak for Lebron when Lebron's not in the room.
And so Rich Paul goes on his podcast and talks
about be very careful about re signing Austin Reeves. You
may want to trade Austin Reives.
Speaker 11 (37:05):
Here it is I love him as a Laker, but
if that is a situation where we get we get
in balanced because if you put if you put all
the money into just the backcourt, and then you're and
then you're you're kind of like your flexibility is restricted
going forward to fill out the rest of the team.
Speaker 5 (37:28):
Then that's kind of like.
Speaker 11 (37:31):
Riding u uh uh. You know when you when you
just have the training wheels on your bike, but the
one training wheel is off and it kind of leans.
Speaker 5 (37:38):
That's kind of like.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
That Lebron is distancing himself. Rich Paul doesn't speak for me. Well,
if my agent was talking about certain things publicly, he
kind of probably would have passed it by me first,
you think maybe not. The question now is are the
Lakers becoming more spectacle than spectacular? So here's the thing
(37:59):
about Lebron. His mobility has been great for titles, viability, earnings, relevance,
but it has not endeared him. I mean, the guy
bailed on Ohio twice and he's from there. It's not
endeared him like a Jeter or a Magic or a Kobe.
Like the Dodgers, there's made men, kershaw kofax made men right.
(38:20):
Freddie Freeman's just a great Dodger. Mooky Beck's a great Dodger.
That's kind of Lebron. So he's not. He's not as
popular as Magic or Kobe. Now, Shaq moved around, but
his personality made him beloved. So Lebron's got a no
trade clause. But I always say this when anybody asks
me those, well, what do you think they'll do with Lebron?
It My take is, it's not what they'll do with Lebron.
(38:42):
It's what the fans would say if they did move
off Lebron. And you know what Laker fans would say
if they moved him at the trade deadline? What did
we get for him? You know what Laker fans would
say if he walked away at the end of the season, Oh, wow,
with all that money, we got to go get good
young players. They wouldn't have said that with Magic. That's
that's not when when Shack got traded and they chose
(39:06):
Shack over Kobe and Kobe was still a Laker, a
lot of people didn't like it. A lot of them
preferred Shack over Kobe, and they still had Kobe at
the time. So Lebron's mobility. That's the downside of mobility
is you give up loyalty. And I mean, you're you're
never going to trade Steph Curry. You wouldn't, you know,
trade Derek Jeter. I mean that just it It doesn't
(39:30):
even sound right. But if you moved off Lebron or
you just ended it, and this new Dodger group would
do that. That's how they've They've let again, They've let
Trade Turner, Corey Seeger, Cody Bellinger, Manny Machado. I mean
they let you know, Zach Grinky like like, there's a
lot of names that wanted to be Dodgers. They could
have afforded them, and they just said no either had
(39:53):
them let them go, said no, not interested. I mean
that's just what the Dodgers in this group do. That's
the way to do it. Fall in like with your athletes, right,
fall in love with your kids. So I do think
the downside to Lebron's mobility. And I've tried not to
be a hypocrite because I've bounced around and that's the
way I've done it. What's home? Where's home? And I
(40:16):
think Lebron's home is Lebron's inner circle, Maverick Carter and
his guys, Rich Paul, that's home. They're just a company
willing to move, a production company willing to move. There
is no one place. So it's I just when I'm
watching this Rich Paul stuff and the comments he's making,
it's tough because and I really believe this the future
(40:37):
of the Lakers is JJ Reddick and Luca and Rob Polenka.
Austin Reeves is his guy. That's going to be hard
to separate. You can get him, but you better give
us great stuff. And I do think Austin Reeves. I
think the fans love him in LA. I think he's
an excellent offensive player. I think you have to consider
that lucas not an elite defender. Austin works hard, but
(40:58):
isn't either. That has to be considered. But if you've
got a rim protector, a really good in a wing,
then you could keep Austin Reeves. And Austin's not a
guy that's, you know, enamored with just getting the most.
But I think Austin Reeves loves being a Laker, and
I think there are benefits to playing with Luken being
a Laker. All right, good stuff, all right, Albert Breer,
(41:19):
we got nine coaching openings. How long are the New
York Giants gonna last? Why do not I just go
for get the get the top candidate and fill out
your staff. Hour two next
Thanks for listening to the Best of the Herd podcast.
Be sure to catch us live every weekday on Fox
Sports Radio in noon to three Eastern nine am to
noon Pacific. Find your local station for The Herd at
Fox Sports Radio dot com, or stream us live every
day on the iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio
or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
This is the Best of the Herd with Colin Cowver
on Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here we go, ready to roll, and it's a Wednesday.
We're live in Stowey, Chicago. It's the Herd wherever you
may be, however you may be listening. Thanks for making
us part of your day. Former Steeler great tenure a
decade with the Steelers. Jerome bettis next hour. So I
(00:51):
was thinking about the Pittsburgh Steelers job opening last hour
of our show. Mike Tomlin stepped down. And there's a
lot of things. They don't have a head coach, a
quarterback for the future. The defense is old, the defense
is expensive, their money's on the wrong side of the ball.
But what the Ravens and the Steelers have that the
(01:12):
other seven job openings and seven franchises don't. Ravens and
the Steelers don't fire coaches. Harbaugh got eighteen years, Tomlin
got nineteen years, and so you could go to a
Kevin Stefanski in Pittsburgh and say, listen, we're gonna bought
him out. Our scouting department doesn't like Ty Simpson until
the third round. Second round, You're gonna win three games,
(01:34):
and Stefanski knows I'm not gonna get fired. In Pittsburgh,
they don't fire coaches. Tomlin in the end walked away,
and that's at the core of what the Steelers are
really uncomfortable with, and they need to get over it.
This no losing seasons thing. Being awful got the Patriots.
(01:55):
Drake May being awful got the Bears. Caleb Williams. You
know what, being mid got the Steelers, Kenny Pickett. Folks,
the richest people in the world carry debt to acquire assets.
To get wealthy, you got to carry debt, Okay, Mark
Zuckerberg has mortgages to a dozen homes. He could own
(02:18):
every city block in Silicon Valley. He takes out mortgages.
You've got If you want to get wealthy in the NFL,
you got to be able to take a big swing
and not worry about having the cleanest books for a year.
And my takeaway, you got an old roster, expensive, you
(02:40):
don't have a quarterback, you don't have a coach. The
one thing and the one box. The Steelers check his stability.
You're great at stability, but so is Baltimore and they
have Lamar Jackson. So how do you get the best
candidate because Baltimore's got Lamar, You got nothing. And the
way to do it is you go to us defans
and say you can be terrible next year and we're
(03:02):
not gonna fire you. We think next year we can
get archs manning and win three games, load your roster up,
win three or four games. I think you have to
have the conversation in Pittsburgh, and it gets very uncomfortable
for people in Pittsburgh of just resetting the franchise, going
the opposite of Tomlin. We're gonna go a young offensive
(03:25):
coach and we're gonna bought him out because you know
what quicksand is in the NBA, in the NFL, the eighteenth,
the twentieth pick. That's where pittsburghs feels like they're at
the twentieth pick. The only way you want to be
at the twentieth pick. Is if you have Josh Allen
and you can't get up. Go look at Tomlin seven quarterbacks.
Where's the one where a Hoysted trophies Big Ben. The
(03:48):
rest of it's guys. Now, Aaron Rodgers at thirty two
wasn't just a guy. He was the guy. Maybe, But
go look at the Tomlin era. Seven straight seasons, seven
straight seasons, bottom ten in offensive spending. It's time you
can respect somebody like Mike Tomlin and think it's time
(04:08):
to do the opposite of Mike Tomlin offensive coach money
all on offense, not old and experienced on defense, young
and cheap and aggressive. Because the quarterbacks in the AFC
now Mahomes and Allen and Lamar and Burrow and Herbert
and bow Nicks and Trevor Lawrence and CJ. Stroud here
(04:30):
they come waves of it. Justin Herbert can win a
playoff game. So you got to do the Zuckerberg. Take
on some debt for a year, get uncomfortable trying to
salvage next season. You've been doing that for years, seven
straight years, bottom ten and offensive spending. I can respect
the hell out of Mike Tomlin, but want to do
(04:51):
the opposite going forward. To Mike Tomlin, I want a
very current, very young offensive coach who spends all his
money on a because I just feel like, year after
year after year, this team's not viable. This team is
not a viable franchise. It's not insulting. If I buy
(05:13):
your house and think your house is charming, I just
want to redo it in my style and the style
Pittsburgh has to acquire with a little debt, be awful
next year, and start over. The athletics Robert May says
it may not take very long to look completely different.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
They have seven picks in the top four rounds this
year and five picks in the top one hundred already.
On offense, they have one of the youngest offensive lines
in the league. And on defense, there are a lot
of guys that I do not think will be back
next year if you are kind of transitioning to a
different version of the team.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
They were one of the oldest teams in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
I expect them when we wake up in the middle
of next season and you look at the ages of
these rosters, to be.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
One of the youngest teams in the NFL. Aaron Rodgers
now had a good year. I thought he should be
called comeback Player of the Year. I stand by that
it's probably over for him in Pittsburgh. I would guess
unless the Vikings call and they talked about it this week,
they'd like competition for JJ McCarthy, Aaron Rodgers would take
that job and win that job. In my opinion, where
(06:19):
do we stand on Aaron Rodgers because he may retire,
what do we think of him? And the way I
look at Aaron Rodgers is you can't tell the story
of the NFL without Aaron Rodgers. In any profession, we
can argue best, worst mid you can't argue mattered, great talent, little, prickly, unbelievable,
(06:43):
first ballot Hall of Fame. I remember fifteen years ago
when everybody was treating him like Archbishop Aaron. Everybody in
the media worshiped him, even insisting he was better than Brady,
and I kept saying bad body language. Sometimes he's a
sometimes he's a Baylor, He's passive, aggressive. I think he's
(07:04):
really really talented. I don't think he's going to end
up being close to like a Manninger a Brady in
the trophy category. And I stand by that I said
at fifteen years ago ah there's things I don't love,
love his talent, leadership, forgetting a bad interception and moving on.
Thought he was a little safe in big games, whatever,
(07:26):
But even on draft night, Aaron created drama in his profession.
He mattered. And let's face it, very few quarterbacks, most
quarterbacks in the end, leave it up to interpretation. Montana
didn't four rings, Brady didn't seven rings. But most quarterbacks
are closer. The great ones are closer to Like Marino Man,
(07:50):
he was great. I can't believe he didn't win a
super Bowl. Farvn Rogers Man, they were great, they only
won one. Very few quarterbacks Mahomes has now become one
Brady Montana. They don't leave anything on the cutting room floor.
They get every trophy they get close to. But I
look at Aaron as one of those fifteen guys all
(08:14):
time that you can't write the story of the NFL
without that quarterback. It doesn't matter if you have all
the hardware like Spielberg, or you have less hardware one
oscar like Scorsese. You can't argue toe to toe, completely
inarguably transformative. And that's why I look at Aaron the
(08:36):
rest of it. Almost all quarterbacks we can debate third best,
eighth best, ninth best, sixteenth best. Aaron mattered. You can't
write the story of the league without him. Who cares?
If he's prickly pushback on the media and whatever I mean,
Brady Mahomes probably manning Montana. The titles they should have won,
(08:57):
they won the years they were great, they hoisted something,
even the other fifteen great quarterbacks of all time. It's interpretation.
Here's Aaron Monday about his future.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
And I'm not going to make any emotional decisions. Disappointed,
you know, obviously in such a fun.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Year way again, you wanted to be here.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
I'm not going to talk about that.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
Eric Hunt, do you approach just what you decide to
do next?
Speaker 4 (09:27):
Just get away and then then have the right conversations.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Listen, I had said before Pittsburgh I would take the
vikings gig or retired. I think Aaron made the most
of it. I think he's a little trickly. What apps
who cares? In your industry, in your space? Do you matter?
That's indisputable, that's inarguable. Even the years he didn't start.
(09:57):
Go read the Jeff Pearlman book Gunslinger. In that building,
he was poking Brett fav in the Ribs Draft Night drama.
He wasn't even a packer officially yet had never gone
a uniform, and we were talking about him and that
says a lot. J Mac Mike Tomlin's walking away. We
got nine openings. That is that is so crazy. Now
(10:19):
there's a sense there aren't nine good candidates. I'm gonna
push back on that. We also will present a Super
Bowl bubble today of the eight remaining teams, four in,
four out and the outs. There'll be some dispute on that,
but four in four out, we'll talk about that. Yeah.
Speaker 6 (10:35):
Wow, So you think maybe there are some good candidates,
because that's a bit of a surprise to me when
I hear some of these guys who are interviewing Colin
like some of these swoof.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
Well, just because just because you're interviewing doesn't mean you're
a candidate. It's fair. I mean, you know, these owners
aren't going to interview one two people. They want to
interview eight and so a lot of times, and this
is very clear, the way that works with agents is
a lot of time I'm an agent will get somebody
an interview knowing he's not going to be a head
coaching job, but he wants him to get the interview
(11:07):
with the owner to impress him. So if that guy
gets fired. So a lot of the people interviewing for
jobs are not truly head coaching candidates, but the agents
are getting of interviews, so they just you know, like
McVeigh was rare his first year of interviewing, he got
the Rams job. Generally there's a McVeigh out there. Mike
McDonald's another guy. The minute we talked about him as
(11:28):
a head coach, he walked into Seattle's building. John Snyder's like,
don't let him leave.
Speaker 5 (11:32):
The other thing.
Speaker 6 (11:33):
Yeah, you're right, because as soon as the agent gets
you in for an interview, what happens next right to
the media.
Speaker 5 (11:39):
Everybody fans it out.
Speaker 6 (11:40):
Joe Smith interviewed with the Patriots and next thing you know,
oh Joe Smith. He's in high demand. So you create
this artificial market that maybe really isn't there. But I
do think Mike McDaniel is soaring up the charts. If
I don't know, if you've following some of this closely,
he's he might be like a top three or four
guy on the market right now. Colin, I know you
have a big affinity for Mike McDaniel.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
We'll see he is one of the people being talked about.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
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hit that thumbs up icon and comment away. Albert Breer
Top of the Hour nine Job Openings Baltimore with Lamar Jackson.
Great ownership probably number one, I think in my opinion.
(12:56):
The New York Giants are number two, Steeler's three, Atlanta four.
Somebody's gonna get Fernando Mendoza Raiders. That's pretty good. Here's
the thing with Mike Tomlin, He's an incredibly prideful guy.
Once those fire Tomlin chants came down from the rafters,
he's probably done. He made up his mind. People make
up their mind long before they do things. I think
he made up his mind several weeks ago. I think
(13:19):
he could do television and be great. He's certainly great
at the podium. He's the best I've ever heard. Everything's
a nine second SoundBite. He'd be great. But he's not
a TV guy. He reminds me of Mike Vrabel. Vrabel
could do TV. He's not a TV guy. It's like
I always said, park cities of you. It's in Utah.
It's not really of Utah. It's a party town, Austin, Texas.
(13:43):
It's in Texas. It's not of Texas. It's way left.
Mike Tomlin could do TV, and so could Rabel. They're
not of TV. It's not their thing. Sean Payton I
worked with him for a year at Fox. He was
going back to coaching. So there's a lot of times
I've been critical of Tomlin. But leadership iq EQ, motivator,
culture creator, he's great. He's great. I think he needs
(14:06):
to modernize a little bit. I would I would give
you this as an example, you know, Tomlin's got an
iPhone like the rest of us, and it keeps asking
him to install now the new software, and he's for
the last seven years pushed remind me later, it's time
to install now, take a year off, modernize, reflect. His
(14:32):
coaching tree is a cactus. He didn't have anybody since
Bruce Arians. He's had four oz c's, none have done anything. Dude,
go to a mixer, wear a name tag, meet some
offensive young coaches, modernize, stay current, leadership, smarts, toughness, alpha,
culture creator and on TV for a year. All great,
(14:54):
but he does feel like he's got to push install now,
remind me later. On offense, I really think he needs
to modernize. Robert Mays of The Athletic talked about this yesterday.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
If I'm Mike Tomlin, I want to take a step
back and for a year just visit with people around
the league. Talk to people who should I be seeking out?
What should my offense look like? Who are the people
that I should build my staff with. Just take yourself
out of that small kind of insulated world when you're
the head coach and your head is down all the time,
and just think about how you need to build things
(15:29):
moving forward for you to be successful, because I think
if he surrounds himself with the right ideas, he is
such a good coach and a good motivator that that
overall construction and that overall model that would be appealing
to me if I were an owner trying to fill
one of these jobs.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
Like Nick Saban was a defensive coach, but he hired
I mean, Jim Mcelwaine, Doug Nussmeyer, Lane Kiffen Sark. I mean,
he was really good at finding offensive coaches, really good,
not all defensive guys. Now, Belichick had to keep going
back to Josh McDaniels. The minute he was left to
(16:08):
his own devices, he moved Matt Patricia to an OC. Okay,
So Tomlin maybe one of those defensive guys like Vrabel.
Vrabel's got Josh McDaniel. He gets it. Some of these
defensive guys are really good finding offensive guys. Some of
the old school guys are not. So I don't know
(16:29):
what Tomlin is, but I feel like a year reflect
do TV, make some money, have some fun, he would be.
I mean, I'm not going to give away any inside
stuff that I am aware of currently, but Tomlin's gonna
get jobs multiple I think you put him in a studio,
I think he'd be a home run. I think he'd
(16:50):
be just major energy. I mean, I honestly am rooting
for him to go to Fox because I think it'd
be a great watch. And that way, if he goes
to Fox, which has more NFC games than AFC games,
he may not have to criticize contemporaries he coached against
a lot. He can go over and talk about the
Niners and the Eagles and the Rams who didn't have
(17:11):
to face as much. He didn't want to be critical
of the guys on his side of the ledger. But
I'm selfishly I would love if he was a Fox guy.
I think he's going to be so good. But he
feels very much like Vrabel to me. Could do TV,
but not a TV guy. That's not his DNA. He
has referred to television as the dark side a couple
(17:34):
times in his career. Jmack with the news, No no turns.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
This is the herd Line.
Speaker 6 (17:41):
News, all right, Colin, I got a surprise for you
to start Herdline, and that is one Brock Perty. A
big game from Perty on Sunday against the Eagles, another
fourth quarter comeback in the playoffs for Brouck Perty Colin.
Speaker 5 (17:55):
Wouldn't you know it?
Speaker 6 (17:56):
He is now five and one in his career in
the playoffs. Yes, Colin, that's more wins than Lamar Jackson
and Cam Newton in the postseason.
Speaker 5 (18:05):
I know Cam Newton's not gonna take that well.
Speaker 6 (18:07):
Also, his five wins tied Jared Goff, Rivers and Burrow
You third all time, sorry in forty nine ers playoff
history in terms of wins, go ahead.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
The one thing I'll say about Perty, whereas Lamar Jackson,
there are times he visually looks tight in the playoffs.
I feel like Brock Pretty Week two, Brock Pretty Week eleven,
Brock Pretty playoffs, I get the same guy. He's not
affected by the scenario like I always feel with Brock Purty.
He's always been a guy that's gonna let it rip.
(18:40):
He's gonna have some ugly picks. They all stick to Darnold.
They don't stick to Pretty because party's had more playoff success.
But Brock will let it rip. He's not a guy.
One of my favorite qualities, in fact, my favorite quality.
I've told this story about Andrew Luck when he was
at Stanford. I went to the coliseum. I'm sitting there,
pretty good seats US season a shootout with Andrew looking
(19:00):
Stanford and luck is unbelievable. And then he fills a
pick six. It is an awful pick six to get
the Trojans back into it. I remember that, and he smiles.
He puts his hand on his helmet. He's like, oh,
stupid goes out. He's slinging the ball down the field.
A huge part of brock Pretty's success is he's not affected.
I never watched Purty and think, oh, he's tight. He
(19:23):
just you know, it could be good parenting, it could
be confidence, whatever it is. The kid likes to let
it rip. That's one of the Donald quotes. Donald's always like,
hey man, you do your prep, you let it rip.
And that's what I totally respect about Brock.
Speaker 5 (19:37):
So it's interesting. A lot of people are going to say, well.
Speaker 6 (19:40):
Wait a second, Jay, you're forgetting Brock had a second
loss against the Eagles. That's not technically a loss. Remember
he got injured with the shoulder in the first quarter.
That doesn't count as a loss on your ledger. The
one loss is the Super Bowl. Yeah, and he didn't
lose that he drove them down the field in overtime
for points. I mean, at some point we got to
start giving brock Pertty his flowers. I know everybody loves
(20:01):
Dak Prescott, and Dak is a top five tep ten.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
I think got two playoff wins. He hasn't done much.
Rock Purty is consistently praised. You're you're sensitive to it.
Brock Purty is considered exactly where he should be considered.
A gamer that gets banged up. He's not a Josh
Allen Talon No, but he's gonna win playoff games. I
think he is appropriately discussed. I don't think everybody thinks
(20:27):
he's way up here, but everybody like if you told
me him or Jalen Hurtz, I would take brock Purdy.
He's better from the pub.
Speaker 5 (20:33):
Oh okay.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
In terms of a pocket passer with mobility, party's a
good player.
Speaker 8 (20:39):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Can I ask you a couple more because you like
this game? Rock Purty or Jordan Love. Jordan Love is
a bigger, stronger quarterback. Both get hurt more than I'd like.
But I think he's a bigger, taller guy with a
little better arm. I think they're both talented, but you know,
I like traits. I'm loyal to size, I'm loyal to
arm I'm loyal to mobility. I would take love over
Brock Purty, rock Perty or Bonnicks. Bonicks doesn't get hurt
(21:04):
like ever, like ever, He's on a very team friendly
deal for the next several years, and he's a tremendous
fourth quarter quarterback.
Speaker 5 (21:13):
And because I have to do it, Jared Goff or Brockberdy.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Jared Goff is a better pocket quarterback, but again, doesn't
ago Jared. If Jared Goff doesn't get hurt, I mean
Bonicks and Jared Goff, both guys from the PAC twelve
that got you know, tossed around a lot of starts
every Sunday. They're ready to play.
Speaker 5 (21:34):
Now listen, I don't expect him to go to Seattle
and win.
Speaker 6 (21:37):
That lines up to seven and a half in some
places seven where we have Colin. If he does pull
this off as a big underdog, oh, Monday is going
to be fun. Yeah, just filing that one away. All right,
Let's move to the Rams. They are out here in
warm southern California seventy eight degrees yesterday, Colin, it'll be
seventy nine today. It's lovely, but they're playing in rigid
(22:00):
temps Sunday in Chicago. They're calling for a high of
twenty one with a low of eight colin eight degrees.
That's insanity. Matt Stafford, he says he don't care about
no elements.
Speaker 8 (22:12):
As far as the wind goes. You're right, it is
always winny in Chicago. I played, you know, a handful
of games there throughout the years. The good thing for
us is it was windy this past week in Carolina.
And when it goes to cold weather. We played the
Jets last year and what was I think it was
like twelve degrees, you know at kickoff, and you just
adjust to whatever the game, you know, whatever the weather
allows you to do. And I think if it's just
(22:34):
cold with a little bit of win, we go play.
Speaker 4 (22:36):
You know.
Speaker 8 (22:36):
I love that kind of stuff. I mean, that's that's
playoff football, right, cold weather in Chicago, windy day. There's
nothing better than that in my mind. So I'm excited
for it.
Speaker 1 (22:46):
Yeah, that's right. There's never been a warm weather dynasty.
If you can't if you can't handle twenty seven degrees,
you're not built for this stuff. I mean I Caleb
Williams in the fourth quarter. Caleb played at USC Oklahoma.
He looked fine to me in the fourth quarter. If
you've got a strong arm, the issue with cold weather
is armstrength, two struggles and wind. Stafford doesn't, Caleb doesn't.
(23:11):
Some would argue Lamar's got an average arm. You know
who doesn't, Josh Allen Mahomes. So if your arm is strong,
bad weather Brady. I thought Brady was the best cold
weather crappy weather thrower I've ever sit because of his
hip torque Brady was an And did Brady have the
biggest arm in the league. No, he was a great
cold weather quarterback.
Speaker 8 (23:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (23:30):
A lot of cold weather guys on the Rams.
Speaker 6 (23:33):
I mean Stafford played for years in that division, outdoor
games in Green Bay, Chicago. DeVante Adams played for years
in Green Bay. Kyron Williams went to Notre Dame playing
in the Midwest. I don't I think the cold is
a little bit of an overblown narrative here and Colin,
I haven't officially fired on this game, but I think
I'm on the rams here. I know the Bears have
delivered to charm life. But the more you look at
(23:54):
the number the same.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
I'm the same. I think. I really when you lose
Edwards the linebacker, that really makes it because by the
way that linebacker, with those Ram tight ends and that
Ram run game, you can live with a backup left tackle. Again,
if you speed up getting rid of the ball to
your tight ends, you can speed things up. But I'd
see the Bears defense having a lot of trouble stopping
(24:18):
Ram drives. I think the Rams, even if they don't score,
are gonna get field goals and are gonna win field
possession for a big chunk of this game. And that's
why I like the Rams.
Speaker 5 (24:28):
Yeah, total agreement, Colin. Let's go.
Speaker 6 (24:30):
Final story. One of your favorites, Sean Payton. He was
fun when he was working here. Man, that guy has
stories for days. Well, he's got a super Bowl team
on his hands right now. They're preparing for the game
against Josh Allen. Obviously Denver had to buy and Sean
says he wants to see his offense be more aggressive
when it needs to be do I.
Speaker 9 (24:51):
Think he needs to be more aggressive going down to
the field, going downfield in the playoffs. A lot of
that would be based on who we're playing. We want
to be aggressive. We obviously want to, you know, and
we will take our shots, but a lot of it
like tell me the opponent and then then it's like, right,
how's that got to be done? You know? Are they
(25:12):
an eyes in team or are they a man team?
And we'll definitely stretch the ball down the field. We
feel like we've got some guys that can go down
and get it.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Yeah, if you play Houston, you can't be as aggressive
because of their pass rush. If you play the Bills,
you can be more aggressive. They don't have the pass rush.
So again, it's dictated on your game plan is largely
dictated on who are you playing. If you have a
the Bears have a backup left tackle, They're gonna want
Caleb Williams to get rid of the ball quickly. Now,
(25:41):
I guarantee it. That's part of Ben Johnson's game plan.
We're not sitting back in the pocket. They've got They've
got young and Verse coming on the edges. They got
Kobe Turner poon it forward in the middle. It'll by
the way, we're missing our left tackle. Like you can
tell what you're going to do going into it. Chicago,
I don't think it's going to be one of those
deep ball games. You're gonna want to get that thing
out two and a half three seconds, get it out
(26:03):
of Caleb's hands, because I do think for pass protection
for the Bears could be challenged.
Speaker 6 (26:08):
Yeah, I do wonder this Bill's defense was kind of
sort of solid against Trevor Lawrence, like Trevor Lawrence was
good for Davius White with a crazy turn back to
clock game. It's like, well, where did that guy come from?
I just don't know if Buffalo can duplicate that in
back to back weeks. And I do think the Rest
is probably underrated. Right, you get a whole week off.
I know the Rest versus Rust, but I think Denver's
(26:30):
gonna be ready.
Speaker 5 (26:30):
I I'm I don't know, Colin. I wait for your
blazon four on Friday on this.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
One, right.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Jmack with the news.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
Well that's the news, and thanks for stopping by the
herd line.
Speaker 6 (26:43):
It is.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
It is crazy that there's nine job openings. The average
has been like six or seven, it seems like forever.
So you start asking yourself, are there are there nine
good candidates? I think it's a better candidate year suddenly
than people think it is. So let's talk about very
good candidates, people that win double digit games and have
(27:06):
proven this time and time again. I think there are
four candidates that I would put in the good candidate
if they want to coach list, and I think we
can put it up on the screen. I think John Harbaugh,
Kevin Stefanski, Mike Tomlin, and Mike McCarthy. Those are very
good candidates. Those are proven head coach of the year,
(27:27):
double digit wins, can win a playoff game. I think
Robert Sala, Brian Floores, and Brian Dabele absolutely I would
be comfortable giving them a second chance. I think, you know,
Daboll got Daniel Jones a playoff win. Brian Flores that
thing unraveled, but I think he's arguably the best defensive
coordinator with Jesse Mencher in the sport, and Robert Sala
(27:47):
could have been the assistant of the year. And the
minute the Jets fired him, they from that minute on
have circled the toilet. They were at least viable. They
were going to go to Buffalo if they won, they
were going to be tied for first. They let him go.
They've been a has Matt spill since and then I
think Jesse min er, Clint Kubiak, Jeff Hafley. Again, if
(28:11):
they were there and they were my best options, I'd
have no problem hiring them. My takeaway is there's two
candidates out there. Cliff Kingsbury is one of them. I
don't think he's a head coach personality. I don't think
he is comfortable with conflict. I think in college and
pro football, as teams get loose, players have a bit
too much control. And I think he got to be
(28:32):
a front and center guy and be willing to deal
with conflict and conflict resolution. And I don't think that's
Cliff's personality. I think he's a great OC. A prime example,
why is he leaving Washington. He's got a conflict with
Adam Peters and he don't want to deal with it.
So I was like, I'm out of here. Once again,
that's who he is. It's fine. Mike McDaniel Miami, I
(28:54):
don't think he's a head coach. I think he's a
brilliant coach. But I think he's a VP, not a president.
I think he's a VP. So again I think those
are I think those are very That's nine guys I
would hire and two guys I'd hire in a second
to be coordinator. The key in this is being decisive,
(29:17):
because if the New York Giants, Giants sit on their
hands and of the fifth team to hire a coach,
not only do you get the fifth best coach, it's
bread crumbs on the staff. If I was the New
York Giants, I'd make a move now. Whether it's Stefanski
or Harball, I would make a move now because you're
also going to have a better opportunity to get a
(29:39):
McDaniel or Cliff Kingsbury as a coordinator. So you've got
to be decisive. Here's Steve Bushatti, Raven's owner, on their
head coach opening. Where we are.
Speaker 10 (29:51):
I could say I'm disqualifying coaches with losing records, but
I think you have to remember that they were the
hottest coaches in their cycle and they got jobs, and
they got tough jobs, and I don't think we have
a tough job. We created the best opening in this cycle.
(30:12):
And so that was the one category that I didn't
want to ignore because the first thing you all are
going to say is my got he went thirty eight
and forty eight in his last job and they're hiring him.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Yeah, I think I think that's fair because I do
think if you're the guy, you'll have a winning record.
The greatest example is Sean Payton. He inherited a team
and Russell Wilson didn't fit his offense, and they're still
this year paying off the Russell Wilson dead cap, and
he's made the playoffs back to back. Here with a
(30:47):
quarterback most of you don't like. Okay, so I don't
want to hear, but you can figure it out. There's
no excuses. There really isn't. This is why I tend
to lean offensive guy over defense guy. But it should
be noted of the eight remaining coaches, four offense, four defense,
So Baltimore is the best job. I would argue. Number
(31:10):
two is the Giants. That's what I would argue in
a perfect world, if I was the Giants, I'd offer
it to John Harbaught today, if I was Baltimore, if
he didn't want a losing record. That hurts Kevin Stefanski.
I think you have to contextualize Kevin Stefanski's career. He
coached for Cleveland. In my opinion, you have to qualify
(31:36):
certain things, not many things, but certain things. In Chicago
it's the hurd.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and Noon Easter not a Empacific.
Speaker 5 (31:50):
Saturday on Fox.
Speaker 6 (31:51):
After dethroning the defending champs, Christian McCaffrey leads the Niners
against Sam Darnold in the top seeded Seahawks the Divisional
Round Playoffs, presented by Intuit TurboTax Saturday, seven thirty Eastern,
four thirty Pacific on Fox.
Speaker 1 (32:08):
Well Darnold against Purty. Clearly, whoever wins is the better quarterback.
What a division rams Niners Seahawks. You talk about a
power group out west. So Art Rooney spoke this morning
on Mike Tomlin after nineteen years stepping away and that
(32:31):
the presumption is, and I think it's a reasonable presumption,
is you know, Tomlin, if you're in a job for
nineteen years and you're on that treadmill, I think it's
great to just take a step back and reflect. Here's
Rooney on Mike's plans going forward.
Speaker 4 (32:46):
Mike indicated that he did not anticipate coaching at least
you know, in the near future. I think he wants
to spend time with his family and do some of
the kinds of things he hasn't been able to do
for the last you know, many many years, and so
you know, if something like that comes up, we'll deal
with it when it comes up. But right now that
doesn't seem to be on his radar.
Speaker 9 (33:07):
You know.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
One of the things that's really great about the NFL,
and the Patriots are a great example. Denver is a
great example. You get the coach in the quarterback right,
you can just go from doghouse to penthouse fast. And
that's not the way it is in the NBA. I've
never understood this. The NBA makes it hard to trade.
It's like, well, yeah, yeah, the salaries have to come
(33:29):
within and you got all these aprons. Now, it's like
hard to make trades. So if you're in the downside
of that. The NBA is so paralyzed about dynasties. Your
ratings are better with dynasties. Stop worrying about it. I mean,
the KD Steph Clay Draymond team was fascinating, the Heatles
were fascinating. Seven champs in seven years isn't fascinating. But
(33:50):
the NBA makes it hard to trade. Football's like trade
whoever you want. Also, in the NFL, you can cut
whoever you want. You may have to eat some salary,
but you can also work contracts constantly. You know, to me,
you could do two things. I would bought him out
and go get an offensive guy. Or I could also say, well,
(34:11):
we've got a first, a second, three threes and two fours,
give up a third and a fourth, couple six is
the following year, give up a bunch of picks and
get to like eighth in the draft and go get
Ty Simpson. If it works great, If it doesn't, go
draft another quarterback. The Steelers have three third round picks
and two fours, so you can keep a third and
a fourth and move off two thirds and a fourth
(34:33):
and move up and get Simpson. Give up, give up
good picks. Try it. He is viewed, I'm told, as
a late first round quarterback, But so what, that's the
one position. It's okay you can overdraft a guy. Don't
overdraft by a round. But if you overdraft by nine
to eleven spots to get your quarterback, it's fine. And
(34:53):
if it works great, If it doesn't, move him, and
get the guy the following year and a better quarterback draft.
There's a lot of option here for Pittsburgh like a
lot of good options, and or you could just say, listen,
Kevin Stefanski, we don't care, don't we know you've been
losing a lot. We don't fire coaches here. You got
(35:14):
a first, a second, three threes, two fours. We're gonna
stack the roster. We're gonna move the old guys. On defense,
We're gonna give you a young, twitchy, athletic, inexpensive defense.
And the following year we're not gonna be very good
this year. Following year you can pick the quarterback that's
very attractive, but doing the mid stuff again, you gotta
(35:35):
get terrible, at least for a year to get Drake
Man Caleb Williams. If you're drafting twentieth, you get Kenny Pickett.
Like you said, wow, what about Lamar? Not a lot
of late first round Lamar Jackson's And even when he
came out there, you know you trust the Ravens because
the Ravens have drafted so well for so long, especially
on their early picks. But the other story I saw
(35:57):
this morning is everything I have always said this. Men
are great at starting things, we're terrible at ending things. Wars, relationships, conflicts,
We're great starters. Maybe it's guys or hunters. We're good
at chasing stuff down, we're bad at breaking up. And
Lebron has been this mobile guy. His career is so redeemable.
(36:20):
This ending in la is weird. So apparently his agent
who represents him, Rich Paul, has a podcast with Max Killerman.
Two good guys like both, and apparently it's ruffling feathers
inside the Lakers organization. They're talking about stuff they'd rather
not be privy to. So and Lebron said yesterday, Hey,
(36:43):
Rich Paul's comments on the podcast are not a reflection
of me. Well, Rich Paul's job as Lebron's agent is
to speak for Lebron when Lebron's not in the room.
And so Rich Paul goes on his podcast and talks
about be very careful about re signing Austin Reeves. You
may want to trade Austin Reives.
Speaker 11 (37:05):
Here it is I love him as a Laker, but
if that is a situation where we get we get
in balanced because if you put if you put all
the money into just the backcourt, and then you're and
then you're you're kind of like your flexibility is restricted
going forward to fill out the rest of the team.
Speaker 5 (37:28):
Then that's kind of like.
Speaker 11 (37:31):
Riding u uh uh. You know when you when you
just have the training wheels on your bike, but the
one training wheel is off and it kind of leans.
Speaker 5 (37:38):
That's kind of like.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
That Lebron is distancing himself. Rich Paul doesn't speak for me. Well,
if my agent was talking about certain things publicly, he
kind of probably would have passed it by me first,
you think maybe not. The question now is are the
Lakers becoming more spectacle than spectacular? So here's the thing
(37:59):
about Lebron. His mobility has been great for titles, viability, earnings, relevance,
but it has not endeared him. I mean, the guy
bailed on Ohio twice and he's from there. It's not
endeared him like a Jeter or a Magic or a Kobe.
Like the Dodgers, there's made men, kershaw kofax made men right.
(38:20):
Freddie Freeman's just a great Dodger. Mooky Beck's a great Dodger.
That's kind of Lebron. So he's not. He's not as
popular as Magic or Kobe. Now, Shaq moved around, but
his personality made him beloved. So Lebron's got a no
trade clause. But I always say this when anybody asks
me those, well, what do you think they'll do with Lebron?
It My take is, it's not what they'll do with Lebron.
(38:42):
It's what the fans would say if they did move
off Lebron. And you know what Laker fans would say
if they moved him at the trade deadline? What did
we get for him? You know what Laker fans would
say if he walked away at the end of the season, Oh, wow,
with all that money, we got to go get good
young players. They wouldn't have said that with Magic. That's
that's not when when Shack got traded and they chose
(39:06):
Shack over Kobe and Kobe was still a Laker, a
lot of people didn't like it. A lot of them
preferred Shack over Kobe, and they still had Kobe at
the time. So Lebron's mobility. That's the downside of mobility
is you give up loyalty. And I mean, you're you're
never going to trade Steph Curry. You wouldn't, you know,
trade Derek Jeter. I mean that just it It doesn't
(39:30):
even sound right. But if you moved off Lebron or
you just ended it, and this new Dodger group would
do that. That's how they've They've let again, They've let
Trade Turner, Corey Seeger, Cody Bellinger, Manny Machado. I mean
they let you know, Zach Grinky like like, there's a
lot of names that wanted to be Dodgers. They could
have afforded them, and they just said no either had
(39:53):
them let them go, said no, not interested. I mean
that's just what the Dodgers in this group do. That's
the way to do it. Fall in like with your athletes, right,
fall in love with your kids. So I do think
the downside to Lebron's mobility. And I've tried not to
be a hypocrite because I've bounced around and that's the
way I've done it. What's home? Where's home? And I
(40:16):
think Lebron's home is Lebron's inner circle, Maverick Carter and
his guys, Rich Paul, that's home. They're just a company
willing to move, a production company willing to move. There
is no one place. So it's I just when I'm
watching this Rich Paul stuff and the comments he's making,
it's tough because and I really believe this the future
(40:37):
of the Lakers is JJ Reddick and Luca and Rob Polenka.
Austin Reeves is his guy. That's going to be hard
to separate. You can get him, but you better give
us great stuff. And I do think Austin Reeves. I
think the fans love him in LA. I think he's
an excellent offensive player. I think you have to consider
that lucas not an elite defender. Austin works hard, but
(40:58):
isn't either. That has to be considered. But if you've
got a rim protector, a really good in a wing,
then you could keep Austin Reeves. And Austin's not a
guy that's, you know, enamored with just getting the most.
But I think Austin Reeves loves being a Laker, and
I think there are benefits to playing with Luken being
a Laker. All right, good stuff, all right, Albert Breer,
(41:19):
we got nine coaching openings. How long are the New
York Giants gonna last? Why do not I just go
for get the get the top candidate and fill out
your staff. Hour two next
Hosts And Creators
Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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