June 15, 2026 • 33 mins
Colin talks to FOX Sports Soccer Analyst Alexi Lalas about the World Cup including Team USA's win 4-1 win over Paraguay
Colin talks about which team could be the next NBA dynasty, and how well run the Knicks have been recently
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
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Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
This segment is brought to you by Haleyon, official partner
of US Soccer and the maker of Censindi, Toms voltairean
Advilain Centrum, the brands behind your everyday wellness wins because
every goal starts with an assist on and off the field.
Learn more at Hailey Unassist dot com. Slash iHeart Alexi Lawless,
(00:46):
fox Sports Soccer analyst, is joining us. I mean anything
can happen. At the World Cup. Spain has a twenty
seven to six shot advantage. I was saying about the
United States men's national team. He had sixteen shots on
goal poolisk had none. If you'd have told me that
number going into Paraguay, I'm like, oh, we didn't score.
(01:08):
I think that's what impressed me most was the depth
of our creativity in our playmaking.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Your thoughts.
Speaker 4 (01:14):
Yeah, I think you did a good job of outlying
why this was so monumental, and it was monumental.
Speaker 5 (01:20):
It was historic.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
As you heard me say, I it's the best performance
I've seen from a US team at a World Cup
and group stage in history. And certainly that first half
was you know, put it in, put it in a museum.
The way in which this team played was something as
you said, that American soccer fans and Americans in general
do not associate with the men's team, and in that,
(01:46):
you know, kind of our insecurity because I've heard a
lot of well, you know, it's it's Paraguay and everything.
And you know, I was talking to this latan Ibrahimovitch
who we've been working with, and he made a point
of saying, no, you you made them look bad by
what you did, and so don't let anybody try to
dismiss this performance relative to the opponent. And I know
(02:09):
we sometimes do that, but this was the culmination of
a lot of years and wrapped up in a package
that people, whether you follow soccer or not, could appreciate
the amount of chances that we took, what we created,
the amount of possession that we had, and not just possession,
that possession, but possession with purpose. It all clicked and
(02:30):
so even in days after, I'm still buzzing.
Speaker 5 (02:33):
I'm still proud of.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
That performance, and I'm also very very excited, and hopefully
they can harness all of that good and go forward
because there's another team coming and they will have seen
that performance. And this team's in the form of Australia,
also won their first game, and you better not piss
this goodwill away because there's a lot of people that
have come into this tent and now are saying, yeah,
(02:56):
you have excited me with what you did in that
first game. So I hope Marici will put your tea on.
I'm sure he is is making sure that you take
the good, but you also recognize you got to follow
it up. And that's what good teams do, is follow
up and use that performance we.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Had won previously. You and I discussed this. We were
more set pieces, more of.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
A rock fight.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
If we scored early, we scaled back Poachattino's game plan
even after goals was hyper aggressive, and I wonder the
message this sends to the world's best teams. I noticed
this in the German game, is that after we that
great goal and that we still were aggressive. We weren't settling,
(03:42):
but I wonder if Germany was a bit less aggressive offensively.
And my take is when a fighter is truly dangerous,
I don't care if it's UFC or boxing the opponent,
regardless if you have a good chin or not, you
just tread lightly into certain spaces. I wonder if we
and a message to the Spains and the other teams
(04:02):
when they look at this. I mean, Germany knows they
played a Senegal nos, but when you have that dominating
a performance, it does make everybody's going to look at
that film that faces the United States and what will
that message be to other top teams?
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Does it matter at all? I think it matters. Are
you know Spain in France? Is it keeping them up
at night? What the US is?
Speaker 1 (04:25):
No?
Speaker 4 (04:26):
Not even with this performance, but it's almost as if
it's it's much more important internally domestically to kind of
sound that siren that hey, this is something different, this
is something that you can get behind. And there will
be ups and downs as this team goes through this tournament.
You're not going to be able to sustain that. But
you know, you mentioned something that I think is part
(04:47):
of sports, right, A ruthlessness, going for the jugglar, taking
your foot off the pedal all, you know, with all
these different phrases that we have, but the recognition in
the moment that there is opportunity and not letting anybody
take it away from you and pushing to do that.
You saw that consistently consistently with this team, and that's
a characteristic and that's a behavior that we haven't always
(05:09):
had as a team. And so I think that message
will have gone out to others that say, you know,
this is a team that if you give them opportunities,
they are going to exploit it and by the time
you figure it out, it could be too late.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Baligan's an interesting player. He played at the youth level
for US in England. He was a striker. He was
a goal scorer for Monaco. He chose US and the
story I've heard is that he could play a more
central role in being our dominant striker. Were you surprised
had you seen this? I mean, he I always feel
with great athletes it looks a little easier. They don't
(05:45):
labor over when they get when there's a small crevice,
they take advantage of it.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
It's an opening.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
And it's like they always say about great hitters in baseball,
you know, they they just need a little angular, gradular
mistake to get a hit. What do you make of
Balligan his talent? Did you expect this?
Speaker 5 (06:06):
Well?
Speaker 4 (06:06):
So, first off, let's talk about the dual Nationals. That's
something that's been in play now for a long time
from the US perspective and all teams. And there's almost
a you know, a college recruiting type of thing where
you have to go out there and you have to,
you know, put out your your best foot and appeal
to players that have multiple options here. And you also
(06:27):
have to be careful that it's not a mercenary type
of thing, and I don't think that that's the case
at all when it comes to Balligan. But he also
also looked at his opportunities, and I think US Soccer
sold him on this is where you're going to get
opportunities not just to play, but to be part of something.
And you know, the the interesting you know, all these
(06:48):
different characters kind of coming together mirrors our society, mirrors
our culture and our and our country and ultimately working together.
But there was a recruiting process there continues to be
a recruiting process. But I think ultimately when they hear
that national anthem, when they go out there in the red,
white and blue, and they when they represent this country
despite all their incredibly diverse backgrounds, they have a unity
(07:11):
and a sense of responsibility. And I think they've also
recognized what is in the offing this summer and that opportunity.
So a balligan right here for him individually.
Speaker 5 (07:21):
This is great.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
His value just keeps skyrocketing, and I think it affirms
that choice that he made to come and play for
the United States and as a team, more and more
people coming into this tent, more and more people are.
Speaker 5 (07:32):
Watching you again.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
I hope that they I hope that they follow it
up with a performance. Doesn't have to be the same performance,
and as a matter of fact, it's probably going.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
To be different against Australia.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
But ultimately Get's got those wins because that's what Americans
love the most.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
So they Polisic got some heat ac Milan. He didn't
score a lot of goals, but he was third in
that league and assists, And as I watched him in
this opener, is that we are better when he scores.
But he feels more Magic Johnson that he does Larry Bird.
He's more set up and can finish than known as
just you know, like like like just a great finish.
(08:08):
Some guys are just great scorers, and he can do that.
But I do feel like Baaligan is a perfect recipe
for Polisic's natural game because to me, he feels more
playmaker than score. And I could be a mile off
on that. I don't know, but that's what it feels
like to me.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
Yeah, that Christian didn't score, like you said, I think
is a good thing.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
He's fine. Christian Polistic is going to be fine.
Speaker 6 (08:35):
I know.
Speaker 4 (08:36):
You know, we all watch what he does at acmon
or wasn't doing at AC Milan, and we were worried.
But the national team is just a very very different
environment and sometimes that door closes on that plane. When
these guys leave their current situation from a club perspective
and show up with this team, a very different player emerges.
And I'm happy to say that is what has happened
(08:57):
with Christian Politic. Whether he scores or not, he takes,
he draws defenders, he draws attention, He can assist and
when you're talking about ballying up there. Even his two goals,
if you look at the different way in which they came.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
He's ruthless in the box.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
And so as Christian Polisic is beating players, he is
where he needs to be in order to finish plays.
And you look at his other goal where he made
a wonderful, wonderful run and you got to find him
with that ball. But he can create things alone also,
so I think there's a good understanding. I think there's
a mutual respect. And I think Christian Polisic when he
is dribbling, when he is taking players on, once he
(09:34):
breaks through, he's got to have somebody to put the
ball on the net or to drop.
Speaker 5 (09:38):
O the other players.
Speaker 4 (09:38):
So I'm not worried about Christian Policic, and I like
the partnership that they're developing up top.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Yeah, Carmelo Anthony can get you a bucket. Brunson can
get you one, but can also set up others and
draw attention. There's different ways to do it. Alexi Lalas
Vox Sports. You're doing a great job. Television's on in
the house everywhere we go. It's great seeing you, ma man.
Speaker 5 (09:57):
I love it. I love it. Let's go Friday against Australia.
Come on, come on back, It's gonna be fun.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
America, all right, thanks man?
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Oh we do have Oh, Spain, number one team in
the world played Cape Verde. I don't know a ton
about Cape Verde, small country, six hundred and twelve thousand people.
This is this some of the video Spain had a
draw and now they had dominant time of possession almost
seventy five percent. Okay, alexis still with us, Alexi, what
(10:25):
do you make of this outcome?
Speaker 4 (10:27):
This is amazing. This is historic. As we know, this
is the largest World Cup in history. On to forty
eight teams. There was a lot of you know, grumps
out there who are worried about allowing teams like a
Cape Verdy in this is if this is going to
be our first zero zero and it is of the
World Cup, let it be historic. And this is historic
(10:48):
from the Blue Sharks of Cape Verity. Incredible, incredible scenes
on the field. I'm sure there's incredible scenes in Cape
Verdy and with the Cape Verdeans all over the United
States and all.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Over the world having shots and you can see as
we show you this video, several of them.
Speaker 5 (11:05):
Ben but don't break my man.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
You know, you know soccer, you can you don't even
have to have the ball, and you can find.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
A way to get a result. And they did. It
was valiant in terms of the effort.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
All right, great stuff, Oh it's wild.
Speaker 5 (11:17):
All right.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Live in Chicago, it's.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
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Speaker 7 (11:28):
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Speaker 3 (12:35):
I wish we played Australia tomorrow. Would that be great?
Maybe tonight?
Speaker 4 (12:40):
What's the need to.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
Have all these days off? Let's just get right to it.
J Mack with a news.
Speaker 5 (12:48):
Turn on the news. This is the Herdline News.
Speaker 9 (12:52):
All right, let's get started with Team USA and the
World Cup and the Christian polistic injury Tot.
Speaker 10 (12:57):
I really cannot find the video he got kicked in
the calf.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Yeah, I can't find that either.
Speaker 5 (13:02):
I look weird.
Speaker 9 (13:03):
None of the internet flutes can find it. So I
don't think this is gamesmanship. But we have an interview
with Polisic and Tom Rinaldi right after the match where
he talked about the injury.
Speaker 6 (13:14):
Great half from US. I got a bit of a
kick to the back of my calf, but I'm hoping
it's not serious at all. So yeah, I'll do everything.
I'll be back for the next film. I'm going to
give everything I can to be back.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
That's for sure.
Speaker 6 (13:25):
So I'm not going to give you a hundred percent,
but yeah, I'll be there.
Speaker 9 (13:29):
So the very latest, seven minutes ago, they're talking about
Christian Poulis is doing a modified training session today.
Speaker 10 (13:37):
I don't know what that means. Maybe going half.
Speaker 9 (13:39):
Speed could just be a bruise. It's really unclear. It's
like college football. You don't know the injury until kickoff.
Really is it possible? I'm reading a report here before Paraguay.
Oh shoot practice interesting, Well, listen, if you're up through
nothing at the half, I don't have a major issue.
(13:59):
Like when they initially pulled him, it's like, okay, we're
up three nothing, no big deal.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
No, I don't either a move.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
We didn't we we had a kind of a different
in the second half. I thought we were, you know,
after they scored, we were a little more, a little
more conservative eating the clock.
Speaker 10 (14:13):
You know, talk about this.
Speaker 9 (14:14):
If it were one nothing at half, do we pull him?
Speaker 6 (14:16):
No?
Speaker 9 (14:16):
Probably not right? Yeah, I don't think they do. So
that leads me to believe it's good, you know, a
kick as opposed to a strain, which everybody, you know,
nobody wants the best round with the.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Cafe po Chattino said it happened before the game. So
because I was like you when I read about it,
I went to YouTube.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
I looked it up. It was like, I don't see it.
Speaker 10 (14:34):
Yeah, no, he seemed to be moving fine.
Speaker 9 (14:37):
He was destroying the Paraguay defenders in an exceptional performance.
All right, let's go to a match that happened yesterday
colin Japan Netherlands. So I had a buddy at this
game and at halftime zero zero, he's like, this is
kind of a snoozer. The second half was electrifying.
Speaker 10 (14:53):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 9 (14:53):
Netherlands takes a one nothing lead to fan tize it
then to to one. Here in the eighty ninth minute,
Darren Fletcher with the call on Fox of the game
time goal by Japan.
Speaker 8 (15:06):
Seanan, I gonna go shut try and play the way
in Do you watch those score from this well?
Speaker 10 (15:12):
Now, oh they have us.
Speaker 8 (15:18):
I call them astonishing too too.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Watch a moment for Japan.
Speaker 8 (15:23):
Didn't you just know that's gonna happen. It's Cooco Okawa
with a massive goal for Japan off the bench too too,
and we're leving a caning talents.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Wow, that's great.
Speaker 9 (15:35):
I love the calls from these announcers, so many good
ones now, Colin, A A result just finished. Spain drew
a zero zero against Cape Verde, who I never heard of.
This is their first World Cup ever. It just came
out of nowhere, Colin. This we've seen some craziness, Okay,
Switzerland Qatar was one one on a guitar goal like
(15:55):
the ninety fourth minute or something crazy. Colin, I'm just
telling you, I thought unders would be the play. The
gambling has been all over the place because there's so
many new teams and a lot of folks are doing
this low block defense or the we don't want to lose.
We just want to play for the tie, survive in
advance in the group stage because if you lose like
Tunisia did last night. I don't know if you saw
(16:17):
they lose to Sweden five to one. They fired their
manager today after the first game of the World Cup. Again,
you can't just show up and get destroyed.
Speaker 10 (16:25):
You got to hang tough.
Speaker 5 (16:26):
Here.
Speaker 9 (16:26):
Some of the Spain highlights. Jamal came on I think
about it the seventieth minute and was spicy.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
The keeper for.
Speaker 9 (16:35):
Kept denying Spain. It was an unbelievable game. Every game
is great Belgium. Egypt is coming up right after us.
Let's go to the final story, Colin, let's go to
the NBA.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
Keep your eye on Belgium. By the way, we could
eventually play them.
Speaker 10 (16:48):
Keep your Belgium, Belgium very good. Interesting.
Speaker 9 (16:51):
So the odds after the finals were done come out
for next season. The Spurs are the favorites to win
the finals. The Knicks have the fourth best odds next season,
behind the Celtics.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, that one I don't get.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
I do get, okay, see, because Jadu would be healthy.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
It's hard to repeat. I get that.
Speaker 9 (17:11):
But I think this narrative that you got to latch onto,
you know, as a small guard myself, I've had a
lot of doubters, Colin. The doubt for Jalen Brunson and
these Knicks is staggering. So Brunson was asked about it.
I remember Becky Hammond made these comments blasting him.
Speaker 10 (17:25):
He can't win a championship, He's not.
Speaker 5 (17:26):
A one a.
Speaker 9 (17:27):
Did you hear what Brunson said afterward? Here's when the
media asked him about it.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
What's your message for people saying that you're not a
one A guy?
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I didn't respond them, and then I'm damn sure, I'm
not going to respond them.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Now.
Speaker 10 (17:43):
That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 9 (17:44):
So this guy won at the high school level as
an undersized guard, goes to Villanova, wins championships, goes to
the Mavericks. They didn't want to offer him a fifty
five million dollars one.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Years of them five three of the four years he
was there they had a winning record.
Speaker 9 (17:59):
And then he go to the Knicks and now wins
a championship. Colin, can we bury this narrative about Jalen Brunson.
Speaker 10 (18:05):
You know, he wasn't a first round pick.
Speaker 9 (18:06):
He's got six five, He's not you can't jump out
of the gym.
Speaker 11 (18:09):
I don't.
Speaker 9 (18:09):
I don't know how many dunks he had this season,
but it's got to be like under Joe.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
He reminds me of a little bit like Nash where
Nash two time MVP just sort of befuddled people. He
did that one handed move to the basket, could always
get his shot wh or without a screen. I think
sometimes Jason, people don't understand how few players in the
NBA can get a good look consistently without a pick,
(18:34):
without a screen, and Brunson's one of those guys is
a He's like Phil Mickelson. He's a tough shot maker.
He makes some and takes some really tough shots. But
I also think we underscore sort of his durability. He's
a thick He's a thick athlete. I said this about
Russell Wilson, is that they were both sort of overlooked,
(18:54):
both thick, both just didn't get hurt. He's playing seventy
plus games, much bigger athlete. Luca feels constantly dinged up.
Austin reeves constantly dinged. So Brunson brings a lot of
things to the table. You know, I think you and
I talked about this during the NBA season. You know,
you and I grew up with doctor Jay's an amazing athlete,
(19:17):
and and Jordan's amazing athlete. But when you really look
at the NBA as it's become more international, the best player,
I mean relative to being you know, Michael Jordan, but
I mean, like Brun's aunt is a great athlete, but
like a lot of the international guys are highly skilled,
they're not great athletes.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
So that's kind of what I see in the NBA
right now. Now.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
Tatum is very, very athletic, but a lot of the
better players are. They bring more to the table than
a vertical jump and a cone drill, and they're just
they're fundamentally very smart, skilled players who are durable and
play well with others. And I think that's Brunson.
Speaker 9 (19:57):
Yeah, it's really incredible what he's accomplished with these Nicks.
But I do think Colin, if you build correctly around
a small guard, of course you can win a title.
Speaker 10 (20:06):
Now and let me ask you this, this is crazy.
Speaker 9 (20:08):
So the Mavericks had Luca and Brunson had them both.
Speaker 10 (20:13):
They let Brunson go and traded Luca.
Speaker 9 (20:14):
Do you think if they kept those two together they
would have been able to win a championship?
Speaker 3 (20:19):
No?
Speaker 1 (20:20):
Because I don't think they play well off each other.
I mean, when you have a Bronson, you needed Josh Hart,
you know what I mean. Like they're an OG that
doesn't need the ball to score, Like OG isn't demanding
the ball. You have the average twenty one game in
this series, and I think with Luca he just takes
away opportunities. The downside to ball centric high usage players
(20:42):
is that in a way it plays to Brunson's favor
that they don't really have another natural score. I mean,
I guess kat is, but they don't really. You find
very rarely, like the Warriors were very unique where they
had two absolutely natural scores and then they had to
catch and shoot Guy in Clay. But I think Brunson
and Luca weren't built to play together, like I don't
(21:05):
think James Harden and Donovan Mitchell are necessarily built to
play together. They're so gifted they can win a bunch
of games. Luke and Brunson are so good they could
have a winning record. But ideally most championship teams there
are pieces and elements to them that they fit.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
They're collaborative. It works together.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
That's really what we have in the NBA now, collaboration champions.
Speaker 9 (21:27):
Not the individual superstar final question, Colin, more likely to
get to the finals next year in your opinion?
Speaker 10 (21:33):
Now win it? Just get to the finals. Knicks out
of the East or Spurs out of the West.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Spurs, that's a good question. I think it's similar. I
think they should be favored. But Okay, Seal come roaring back?
You sure, yeah, because I mean JDub was hurt, Holmgun
was overwhelmed. The question with them is do they keep
Hart and Steam, or they let them go and use
draft picks to move up and get Mara.
Speaker 10 (21:57):
It's weird.
Speaker 9 (21:57):
I just don't think they're a good matchup for the Spurs,
but they don't match up well with the Spurs. The
Knicks are a great matchup for the Spurs as we saw.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Oh no that I but we said this before this.
Yere OKC was a better matchup against the Knicks. I mean,
the great youthfulness of san Antonio was clearly just in
the first game.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
In the fourth quarter.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
You're like, remember after the first game, I came on
the air and I said, if you're going to beat
the Nick san Antonio, you cannot be tied in the
fourth You have got to have leads. And I also
think Dylan Harper will develop an outside shot, like they
too often their guards pass up good mid range jumpers
like Castle and Harper should actually settle for more eighteen
(22:41):
footers than threes. I think they drive the basket too often.
I think you lose track of how good defensively the
Knicks are.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
With O G.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Robinson cat size and Josh Hart plays way bigger than
six to five, way bigger.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
J Mack with the News, Well that's the news and
thanks for stopping by The Herd Life.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
News Live in Chicago. It's the Herd.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter not a em Pacific.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
You know, it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
I was just looking at a list after the Kadie Warriors,
remember they won back to back from the year after
that Toronto. That one year with Kawhi won the title.
Nobody thought that was going to be a dominant team.
That was kind of a one off. We all understood it.
Lakers then won the COVID title and again it looked
(23:38):
really really good, but it was hard to like, really
truly embrace it, though it should be noted they were
a very good team that year pre pandemic. Then the
Bucks won and it was interesting.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
Day won. You knew Jiannis was.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Going to be great, but it wasn't a great supporting cast.
Chris Middleton's your two. And then Golden State won and
they felt like they were old. They were a three seed.
We never thought they were the best team. I got
fooled by Denver. I thought Denver was gonna be I
said at the time, I think they're gonna be San Antonio.
They got their Duncan Jamal Murray wasn't great, but he
was really really good, never been an All Star at
(24:12):
the time. But they you know, they lost guys on
the margins, and then over the course of time they
got a GM and then the coach and the GM,
and they lost guys on the margins. They become very
very Yokic dominant. Aaron Gordon also now Michael Porter's very expensive,
bad contract. Gordon starts suffering little injuries. He plays so hard.
(24:35):
They're just a team now. After that the Celtics. The
Celtics were good, but didn't we always ask ourselves, can
you really see a dynasty with Tatum? Oklahoma City again
felt very strong, but I said, coming into this year,
I've got the archive tape to prove it. I didn't
think they'd win this year. You know, SGA's not Jordan,
and then the Knicks win the only one like I
(24:57):
don't think. Denver felt very very repeatable, and the team
that hasn't won a title, Stan Antonio, feels very potentially repeatable.
But I think the Knicks are situationally excellent.
Speaker 3 (25:11):
The East was weak.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
They faced three teams coming out of a seven game series,
OG who had some injuries in Toronto was healthy, and
they ended up facing a team in the finals that
is the youngest team in the finals since like the
Portland Trailblazers in the mid to late seventies.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
So stuff added up.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
I do think with the confidence of a champion that
they'll be a good team next year. Detroit's going to
be better, Indiana's back, Boston should be better when Tatum's healthy.
The East will be better next year, so they may
be once again just a three seed. Also, once you
win a title, I think there's history that shows you
tend to give your stars more nights off. You know,
(25:52):
once you get that w your fans aren't going to
be happy just getting to a conference final, so you
tend to kind of build that for the postseason. Knicks
could rest some starters. I could see that, but I mean, listen,
this is the NBA that Adam Silver wanted, which was
not stockpiling talent. He was turned off by the KD Warriors,
(26:13):
and so what you're getting are now. I will say,
of the last eight champions, the Golden State Championship I
think galvanized the country because it was Steph.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
They were older.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
The Celtics were a big brand that felt big, that
felt like the NBA Hair steph another title that felt big.
I would say the Knicks Championship feels like the second
biggest championship or maybe even surpasses.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
It in terms of rating.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
It does because the rating system has been tweaked, but
the Knicks feels big, long suffering fan base, controversial kind
of medaling owner. They fire TIBs, a lovable star, and
the games were fun. I mean the games in these
finals for a five game series, it was the most
dramatic five game series of my life. The games were
(26:59):
all sided late, so and and Wemby wouldn't be shocked
if they met again. But I do think you'll get
a better, more refined Wemby. Here's former NBA Brian Scalabrini
on his growth.
Speaker 11 (27:15):
He's not going to turn into Kareema bou Jabbar No.
But you remember that we believe Warriors beat Dirk Davitski,
who won the MVP that year. Like Dirk was really good,
but he was guardable. And then he came back and
when they beat Miami in the finals, he was unguardable.
No one could guard He just went through in the
entire roster so I do think like with Wemby in
(27:37):
his mindset, and he's only in his third year. He
hasn't even made it to the playoffs before this year.
He hasn't even finished a complete season. I guess his
rookie year he did. So it's like there's there's a
lot to grow with a guy like Wemby.
Speaker 1 (27:50):
The other thing we talked about is that what makes
the Knicks really special is how good they've been. You
noted this we did in the fourth quarter. The Celtics
are not this good in the fourth because Jalen Brown's
not that efficient of a player. So what really makes
the Knicks fascinating. Their best quarter easily is the fourth.
(28:13):
They're not a great first quarter team, they're a great
fourth quarter team. And that's something we've always looked at
with the Celtics. And and in fairness, this is not
a shot at Tatum, but he can be passive. I mean,
they moved off Marcus Smart because Marcus was taking shots
from him, And now there's rumors they would move off
a really good player Jalen Brown, because they're not he's
(28:33):
taking shots from him. Nobody doubts who's taking the shot
with the Knicks. Like it is Brunson's offense. So here
here is. I also think smart teams and smart people
in life. Adjust Scalabriney talked about this. New York did
it multiple times throughout the series.
Speaker 11 (28:53):
When you play a certain style and coaches a certain way,
you know, I would just like to see, like with
the Knicks, things weren't going one way, they just adapted
to a different way. Finding a guy that's going to
make a play, and that play doesn't have to be
a three, doesn't have to be a layup. It could
be a driving kick and you know two or three times,
or coming up with a big defensive stop or taking
your charge. Those are in the finals where the margins
(29:16):
are tight, or even in the Eastern Conference finals where
the margins are tight. You know, those little plays make
a big difference.
Speaker 6 (29:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
No, I think it's a good point. So we can
put it up again. You after the Warriors dynasty, we've gone.
I mean, really, this is what Adam Silver was seeking
a Canadian team. The Raptors, big brand Lakers, small market Milwaukee,
old Steph wins one. Here come the Nuggets, big brand Celtics,
(29:44):
small market Oklahoma City and a fifty three year drought
ends with New York. I mean we have seen you know,
J Mac, You and I. I don't read a lot
of stuff on the internet, Like I try to stay
off at as much as I can. If I have
more than two and a half hours a day on it,
it's like, okay, get a life. For years in the
NBA is rig I got news for you, folks. They
(30:06):
would not have picked the Raptors, the Bucks, Denver, okc.
If it's rigged, why did they wait fifty three years
for the Knicks? You see the city erupt is that
you know that this has always been the league that
has struggled with officiating. I would argue that, and this
is what I think Tim Legler had said this, that
(30:28):
there were moments in this series I thought the games
were under officiated.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
It was so physical and the first.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
Quarter of Game one, you're like, guys, nobody's gonna last,
Like this is brutal. For all that it's rigged, crowd
and they're all zeros. But eight years, eight titles, small market,
big market, none of them predictable. Even the Warriors Championship,
you remember this, they were trailing in the series. They
(30:54):
go to Boston and we thought it was over, like
there was a bad matchup, and then you're like Andrew
Wiggins remember that delivers, and you're like, they're gonna steal
this thing from the favored Celtics.
Speaker 5 (31:05):
You Mike done.
Speaker 9 (31:06):
Yeah, if you've typed on the internet, this NBA is rigged.
Just go outside and touch grass, get let the sun
hit your face.
Speaker 10 (31:14):
Just relax, Colin.
Speaker 9 (31:15):
I want to ask you about Jaylen Brunson because I'm
getting in arguments with people online. Yes, I'm a moron
this whole stuff. So SGA had Game seven at home
against the Spurs. He had four points in the fourth quarter,
could not do it. Okay, he's a two time MVP.
The media loves him.
Speaker 10 (31:30):
Jalen Brunson on the road.
Speaker 9 (31:33):
Game five has a ten nothing run by himself to
get a league.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
With Wemby on the floor, the best defensive player ever.
Speaker 9 (31:39):
You have fifteen points in the fourth quarter and a
close out game finished with forty five. Michael Jordan was
the last guy to do that. Why does the media
continue to bowl wash SGA? He's the greatest two time MVP.
Speaker 10 (31:50):
He's not.
Speaker 9 (31:51):
He's just on a really good team. Jalen Brunson to me,
if you ask me now, J Mac, who you want
in a playoff series, Brunson or Sga.
Speaker 10 (31:59):
It's Brunson, Colin. He's just way more clutch. I don't know.
Speaker 9 (32:03):
Maybe I'm going crazy here, but you watched Brunson against
the Spurs.
Speaker 10 (32:07):
Listen everything SGA could not.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
If you gave me the next ten years, oh well
of Kid, Cunningham and Brunson. I would take Kid because
he's a bigger, stronger athlete. If you're asking me right now,
thirty seconds left game seven of the finals, Caid Cunningham
and Brunson, I would take Brunch. I've said this about
MJ and Lebron. Say what you want about Lebron's career.
If you're giving me thirty seconds in the ball, I'm
(32:31):
taking MJ. Like In, Brunson has got that sort of
stroke and that confidence and that repertoire of isolation moves.
He is a great confident closer. And the other thing
is he's smart.
Speaker 9 (32:45):
He's just a smart, tough player, man, makes all the
right plays. He's diminutive, gets in the lane. I just
don't know why people don't love him more like he
I don't know. If I look Colin, I don't think
he's had an MVP vote. Your guy just sent me.
One of your producers sent me a text. Last two years,
Jalen Brunson has one dunk. The NBA glamorizes some goofy stuff.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Well, right, I also think we are seeing a historic
run by Brunson. He is Russell Wilson. Right, He's Russell Wilson.
He goes and wins in college, doesn't go in the
first round. He's a little undersized. His style. Lebron this
weekend was talking about his style, and he's like, he's
so herky jerky, it's hard to time him.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
He's hard to defend. He's really different.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
That was very much Steve Nash, you know, and never
gets hurt, totally durable team leader. And the country never
quite embraced Russell Wilson and they struggle with Brunson. I
think Brunson's loved by the smart people, like I think
New York loves him, and basketball people love him.
Thanks for listening to The Herd podcast. Be sure to
catch us live every weekday on Fox Sports Radio in
noon to three Eastern nine am to noon Pacific. Find
your local station for The Herd at Fox Sports Radio
dot com, or stream us live every day on the
iHeartRadio app by searching Fox Sports Radio or FSR.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
This segment is brought to you by Haleyon, official partner
of US Soccer and the maker of Censindi, Toms voltairean
Advilain Centrum, the brands behind your everyday wellness wins because
every goal starts with an assist on and off the field.
Learn more at Hailey Unassist dot com. Slash iHeart Alexi Lawless,
(00:46):
fox Sports Soccer analyst, is joining us. I mean anything
can happen. At the World Cup. Spain has a twenty
seven to six shot advantage. I was saying about the
United States men's national team. He had sixteen shots on
goal poolisk had none. If you'd have told me that
number going into Paraguay, I'm like, oh, we didn't score.
(01:08):
I think that's what impressed me most was the depth
of our creativity in our playmaking.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
Your thoughts.
Speaker 4 (01:14):
Yeah, I think you did a good job of outlying
why this was so monumental, and it was monumental.
Speaker 5 (01:20):
It was historic.
Speaker 4 (01:21):
As you heard me say, I it's the best performance
I've seen from a US team at a World Cup
and group stage in history. And certainly that first half
was you know, put it in, put it in a museum.
The way in which this team played was something as
you said, that American soccer fans and Americans in general
do not associate with the men's team, and in that,
(01:46):
you know, kind of our insecurity because I've heard a
lot of well, you know, it's it's Paraguay and everything.
And you know, I was talking to this latan Ibrahimovitch
who we've been working with, and he made a point
of saying, no, you you made them look bad by
what you did, and so don't let anybody try to
dismiss this performance relative to the opponent. And I know
(02:09):
we sometimes do that, but this was the culmination of
a lot of years and wrapped up in a package
that people, whether you follow soccer or not, could appreciate
the amount of chances that we took, what we created,
the amount of possession that we had, and not just possession,
that possession, but possession with purpose. It all clicked and
(02:30):
so even in days after, I'm still buzzing.
Speaker 5 (02:33):
I'm still proud of.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
That performance, and I'm also very very excited, and hopefully
they can harness all of that good and go forward
because there's another team coming and they will have seen
that performance. And this team's in the form of Australia,
also won their first game, and you better not piss
this goodwill away because there's a lot of people that
have come into this tent and now are saying, yeah,
(02:56):
you have excited me with what you did in that
first game. So I hope Marici will put your tea on.
I'm sure he is is making sure that you take
the good, but you also recognize you got to follow
it up. And that's what good teams do, is follow
up and use that performance we.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Had won previously. You and I discussed this. We were
more set pieces, more of.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
A rock fight.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
If we scored early, we scaled back Poachattino's game plan
even after goals was hyper aggressive, and I wonder the
message this sends to the world's best teams. I noticed
this in the German game, is that after we that
great goal and that we still were aggressive. We weren't settling,
(03:42):
but I wonder if Germany was a bit less aggressive offensively.
And my take is when a fighter is truly dangerous,
I don't care if it's UFC or boxing the opponent,
regardless if you have a good chin or not, you
just tread lightly into certain spaces. I wonder if we
and a message to the Spains and the other teams
(04:02):
when they look at this. I mean, Germany knows they
played a Senegal nos, but when you have that dominating
a performance, it does make everybody's going to look at
that film that faces the United States and what will
that message be to other top teams?
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Does it matter at all? I think it matters. Are
you know Spain in France? Is it keeping them up
at night? What the US is?
Speaker 1 (04:25):
No?
Speaker 4 (04:26):
Not even with this performance, but it's almost as if
it's it's much more important internally domestically to kind of
sound that siren that hey, this is something different, this
is something that you can get behind. And there will
be ups and downs as this team goes through this tournament.
You're not going to be able to sustain that. But
you know, you mentioned something that I think is part
(04:47):
of sports, right, A ruthlessness, going for the jugglar, taking
your foot off the pedal all, you know, with all
these different phrases that we have, but the recognition in
the moment that there is opportunity and not letting anybody
take it away from you and pushing to do that.
You saw that consistently consistently with this team, and that's
a characteristic and that's a behavior that we haven't always
(05:09):
had as a team. And so I think that message
will have gone out to others that say, you know,
this is a team that if you give them opportunities,
they are going to exploit it and by the time
you figure it out, it could be too late.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Baligan's an interesting player. He played at the youth level
for US in England. He was a striker. He was
a goal scorer for Monaco. He chose US and the
story I've heard is that he could play a more
central role in being our dominant striker. Were you surprised
had you seen this? I mean, he I always feel
with great athletes it looks a little easier. They don't
(05:45):
labor over when they get when there's a small crevice,
they take advantage of it.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
It's an opening.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
And it's like they always say about great hitters in baseball,
you know, they they just need a little angular, gradular
mistake to get a hit. What do you make of
Balligan his talent? Did you expect this?
Speaker 5 (06:06):
Well?
Speaker 4 (06:06):
So, first off, let's talk about the dual Nationals. That's
something that's been in play now for a long time
from the US perspective and all teams. And there's almost
a you know, a college recruiting type of thing where
you have to go out there and you have to,
you know, put out your your best foot and appeal
to players that have multiple options here. And you also
(06:27):
have to be careful that it's not a mercenary type
of thing, and I don't think that that's the case
at all when it comes to Balligan. But he also
also looked at his opportunities, and I think US Soccer
sold him on this is where you're going to get
opportunities not just to play, but to be part of something.
And you know, the the interesting you know, all these
(06:48):
different characters kind of coming together mirrors our society, mirrors
our culture and our and our country and ultimately working together.
But there was a recruiting process there continues to be
a recruiting process. But I think ultimately when they hear
that national anthem, when they go out there in the red,
white and blue, and they when they represent this country
despite all their incredibly diverse backgrounds, they have a unity
(07:11):
and a sense of responsibility. And I think they've also
recognized what is in the offing this summer and that opportunity.
So a balligan right here for him individually.
Speaker 5 (07:21):
This is great.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
His value just keeps skyrocketing, and I think it affirms
that choice that he made to come and play for
the United States and as a team, more and more
people coming into this tent, more and more people are.
Speaker 5 (07:32):
Watching you again.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
I hope that they I hope that they follow it
up with a performance. Doesn't have to be the same performance,
and as a matter of fact, it's probably going.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
To be different against Australia.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
But ultimately Get's got those wins because that's what Americans
love the most.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
So they Polisic got some heat ac Milan. He didn't
score a lot of goals, but he was third in
that league and assists, And as I watched him in
this opener, is that we are better when he scores.
But he feels more Magic Johnson that he does Larry Bird.
He's more set up and can finish than known as
just you know, like like like just a great finish.
(08:08):
Some guys are just great scorers, and he can do that.
But I do feel like Baaligan is a perfect recipe
for Polisic's natural game because to me, he feels more
playmaker than score. And I could be a mile off
on that. I don't know, but that's what it feels
like to me.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
Yeah, that Christian didn't score, like you said, I think
is a good thing.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
He's fine. Christian Polistic is going to be fine.
Speaker 6 (08:35):
I know.
Speaker 4 (08:36):
You know, we all watch what he does at acmon
or wasn't doing at AC Milan, and we were worried.
But the national team is just a very very different
environment and sometimes that door closes on that plane. When
these guys leave their current situation from a club perspective
and show up with this team, a very different player emerges.
And I'm happy to say that is what has happened
(08:57):
with Christian Politic. Whether he scores or not, he takes,
he draws defenders, he draws attention, He can assist and
when you're talking about ballying up there. Even his two goals,
if you look at the different way in which they came.
Speaker 5 (09:09):
He's ruthless in the box.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
And so as Christian Polisic is beating players, he is
where he needs to be in order to finish plays.
And you look at his other goal where he made
a wonderful, wonderful run and you got to find him
with that ball. But he can create things alone also,
so I think there's a good understanding. I think there's
a mutual respect. And I think Christian Polisic when he
is dribbling, when he is taking players on, once he
(09:34):
breaks through, he's got to have somebody to put the
ball on the net or to drop.
Speaker 5 (09:38):
O the other players.
Speaker 4 (09:38):
So I'm not worried about Christian Policic, and I like
the partnership that they're developing up top.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Yeah, Carmelo Anthony can get you a bucket. Brunson can
get you one, but can also set up others and
draw attention. There's different ways to do it. Alexi Lalas
Vox Sports. You're doing a great job. Television's on in
the house everywhere we go. It's great seeing you, ma man.
Speaker 5 (09:57):
I love it. I love it. Let's go Friday against Australia.
Come on, come on back, It's gonna be fun.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
America, all right, thanks man?
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Oh we do have Oh, Spain, number one team in
the world played Cape Verde. I don't know a ton
about Cape Verde, small country, six hundred and twelve thousand people.
This is this some of the video Spain had a
draw and now they had dominant time of possession almost
seventy five percent. Okay, alexis still with us, Alexi, what
(10:25):
do you make of this outcome?
Speaker 4 (10:27):
This is amazing. This is historic. As we know, this
is the largest World Cup in history. On to forty
eight teams. There was a lot of you know, grumps
out there who are worried about allowing teams like a
Cape Verdy in this is if this is going to
be our first zero zero and it is of the
World Cup, let it be historic. And this is historic
(10:48):
from the Blue Sharks of Cape Verity. Incredible, incredible scenes
on the field. I'm sure there's incredible scenes in Cape
Verdy and with the Cape Verdeans all over the United
States and all.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Over the world having shots and you can see as
we show you this video, several of them.
Speaker 5 (11:05):
Ben but don't break my man.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
You know, you know soccer, you can you don't even
have to have the ball, and you can find.
Speaker 5 (11:10):
A way to get a result. And they did. It
was valiant in terms of the effort.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
All right, great stuff, Oh it's wild.
Speaker 5 (11:17):
All right.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Live in Chicago, it's.
Speaker 2 (11:19):
Thet Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd
weekdays and noon eastern non am Pacific on Fox Sports
Radio FS one and the iHeartRadio.
Speaker 7 (11:28):
App so that gots here. I have a podcast empire.
It continues to grow, and I have brought it here
to iHeart. I'm also doing a live radio show from
three to five pm Eastern because my wife wanted to
kick me out of the house. It's called Stegatzi Company Live,
which is available in podcast form right when the show
(11:48):
finishes every single day. Some of the biggest names in sports.
A lot of phone calls.
Speaker 8 (11:55):
I love you on your show.
Speaker 5 (11:56):
It's one of my favorite.
Speaker 7 (11:57):
A lot of interact shit guys not taking them so
elves too seriously.
Speaker 5 (12:01):
Those are just some of.
Speaker 7 (12:02):
The things that you could expect from Stu Gotson Company
and Steve Gotson Company Live. So listen to stew Godson
Company Live and our original podcast. Please subscribe, rate and
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check all of those out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple
(12:24):
Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
I wish we played Australia tomorrow. Would that be great?
Maybe tonight?
Speaker 4 (12:40):
What's the need to.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
Have all these days off? Let's just get right to it.
J Mack with a news.
Speaker 5 (12:48):
Turn on the news. This is the Herdline News.
Speaker 9 (12:52):
All right, let's get started with Team USA and the
World Cup and the Christian polistic injury Tot.
Speaker 10 (12:57):
I really cannot find the video he got kicked in
the calf.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
Yeah, I can't find that either.
Speaker 5 (13:02):
I look weird.
Speaker 9 (13:03):
None of the internet flutes can find it. So I
don't think this is gamesmanship. But we have an interview
with Polisic and Tom Rinaldi right after the match where
he talked about the injury.
Speaker 6 (13:14):
Great half from US. I got a bit of a
kick to the back of my calf, but I'm hoping
it's not serious at all. So yeah, I'll do everything.
I'll be back for the next film. I'm going to
give everything I can to be back.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
That's for sure.
Speaker 6 (13:25):
So I'm not going to give you a hundred percent,
but yeah, I'll be there.
Speaker 9 (13:29):
So the very latest, seven minutes ago, they're talking about
Christian Poulis is doing a modified training session today.
Speaker 10 (13:37):
I don't know what that means. Maybe going half.
Speaker 9 (13:39):
Speed could just be a bruise. It's really unclear. It's
like college football. You don't know the injury until kickoff.
Really is it possible? I'm reading a report here before Paraguay.
Oh shoot practice interesting, Well, listen, if you're up through
nothing at the half, I don't have a major issue.
(13:59):
Like when they initially pulled him, it's like, okay, we're
up three nothing, no big deal.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
No, I don't either a move.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
We didn't we we had a kind of a different
in the second half. I thought we were, you know,
after they scored, we were a little more, a little
more conservative eating the clock.
Speaker 10 (14:13):
You know, talk about this.
Speaker 9 (14:14):
If it were one nothing at half, do we pull him?
Speaker 6 (14:16):
No?
Speaker 9 (14:16):
Probably not right? Yeah, I don't think they do. So
that leads me to believe it's good, you know, a
kick as opposed to a strain, which everybody, you know,
nobody wants the best round with the.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
Cafe po Chattino said it happened before the game. So
because I was like you when I read about it,
I went to YouTube.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
I looked it up. It was like, I don't see it.
Speaker 10 (14:34):
Yeah, no, he seemed to be moving fine.
Speaker 9 (14:37):
He was destroying the Paraguay defenders in an exceptional performance.
All right, let's go to a match that happened yesterday
colin Japan Netherlands. So I had a buddy at this
game and at halftime zero zero, he's like, this is
kind of a snoozer. The second half was electrifying.
Speaker 10 (14:53):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 9 (14:53):
Netherlands takes a one nothing lead to fan tize it
then to to one. Here in the eighty ninth minute,
Darren Fletcher with the call on Fox of the game
time goal by Japan.
Speaker 8 (15:06):
Seanan, I gonna go shut try and play the way
in Do you watch those score from this well?
Speaker 10 (15:12):
Now, oh they have us.
Speaker 8 (15:18):
I call them astonishing too too.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
Watch a moment for Japan.
Speaker 8 (15:23):
Didn't you just know that's gonna happen. It's Cooco Okawa
with a massive goal for Japan off the bench too too,
and we're leving a caning talents.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
Wow, that's great.
Speaker 9 (15:35):
I love the calls from these announcers, so many good
ones now, Colin, A A result just finished. Spain drew
a zero zero against Cape Verde, who I never heard of.
This is their first World Cup ever. It just came
out of nowhere, Colin. This we've seen some craziness, Okay,
Switzerland Qatar was one one on a guitar goal like
(15:55):
the ninety fourth minute or something crazy. Colin, I'm just
telling you, I thought unders would be the play. The
gambling has been all over the place because there's so
many new teams and a lot of folks are doing
this low block defense or the we don't want to lose.
We just want to play for the tie, survive in
advance in the group stage because if you lose like
Tunisia did last night. I don't know if you saw
(16:17):
they lose to Sweden five to one. They fired their
manager today after the first game of the World Cup. Again,
you can't just show up and get destroyed.
Speaker 10 (16:25):
You got to hang tough.
Speaker 5 (16:26):
Here.
Speaker 9 (16:26):
Some of the Spain highlights. Jamal came on I think
about it the seventieth minute and was spicy.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
The keeper for.
Speaker 9 (16:35):
Kept denying Spain. It was an unbelievable game. Every game
is great Belgium. Egypt is coming up right after us.
Let's go to the final story, Colin, let's go to
the NBA.
Speaker 3 (16:45):
Keep your eye on Belgium. By the way, we could
eventually play them.
Speaker 10 (16:48):
Keep your Belgium, Belgium very good. Interesting.
Speaker 9 (16:51):
So the odds after the finals were done come out
for next season. The Spurs are the favorites to win
the finals. The Knicks have the fourth best odds next season,
behind the Celtics.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Yeah, that one I don't get.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
I do get, okay, see, because Jadu would be healthy.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
It's hard to repeat. I get that.
Speaker 9 (17:11):
But I think this narrative that you got to latch onto,
you know, as a small guard myself, I've had a
lot of doubters, Colin. The doubt for Jalen Brunson and
these Knicks is staggering. So Brunson was asked about it.
I remember Becky Hammond made these comments blasting him.
Speaker 10 (17:25):
He can't win a championship, He's not.
Speaker 5 (17:26):
A one a.
Speaker 9 (17:27):
Did you hear what Brunson said afterward? Here's when the
media asked him about it.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
What's your message for people saying that you're not a
one A guy?
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I didn't respond them, and then I'm damn sure, I'm
not going to respond them.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Now.
Speaker 10 (17:43):
That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 9 (17:44):
So this guy won at the high school level as
an undersized guard, goes to Villanova, wins championships, goes to
the Mavericks. They didn't want to offer him a fifty
five million dollars one.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Years of them five three of the four years he
was there they had a winning record.
Speaker 9 (17:59):
And then he go to the Knicks and now wins
a championship. Colin, can we bury this narrative about Jalen Brunson.
Speaker 10 (18:05):
You know, he wasn't a first round pick.
Speaker 9 (18:06):
He's got six five, He's not you can't jump out
of the gym.
Speaker 11 (18:09):
I don't.
Speaker 9 (18:09):
I don't know how many dunks he had this season,
but it's got to be like under Joe.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
He reminds me of a little bit like Nash where
Nash two time MVP just sort of befuddled people. He
did that one handed move to the basket, could always
get his shot wh or without a screen. I think
sometimes Jason, people don't understand how few players in the
NBA can get a good look consistently without a pick,
(18:34):
without a screen, and Brunson's one of those guys is
a He's like Phil Mickelson. He's a tough shot maker.
He makes some and takes some really tough shots. But
I also think we underscore sort of his durability. He's
a thick He's a thick athlete. I said this about
Russell Wilson, is that they were both sort of overlooked,
(18:54):
both thick, both just didn't get hurt. He's playing seventy
plus games, much bigger athlete. Luca feels constantly dinged up.
Austin reeves constantly dinged. So Brunson brings a lot of
things to the table. You know, I think you and
I talked about this during the NBA season. You know,
you and I grew up with doctor Jay's an amazing athlete,
(19:17):
and and Jordan's amazing athlete. But when you really look
at the NBA as it's become more international, the best player,
I mean relative to being you know, Michael Jordan, but
I mean, like Brun's aunt is a great athlete, but
like a lot of the international guys are highly skilled,
they're not great athletes.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
So that's kind of what I see in the NBA
right now. Now.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
Tatum is very, very athletic, but a lot of the
better players are. They bring more to the table than
a vertical jump and a cone drill, and they're just
they're fundamentally very smart, skilled players who are durable and
play well with others. And I think that's Brunson.
Speaker 9 (19:57):
Yeah, it's really incredible what he's accomplished with these Nicks.
But I do think Colin, if you build correctly around
a small guard, of course you can win a title.
Speaker 10 (20:06):
Now and let me ask you this, this is crazy.
Speaker 9 (20:08):
So the Mavericks had Luca and Brunson had them both.
Speaker 10 (20:13):
They let Brunson go and traded Luca.
Speaker 9 (20:14):
Do you think if they kept those two together they
would have been able to win a championship?
Speaker 3 (20:19):
No?
Speaker 1 (20:20):
Because I don't think they play well off each other.
I mean, when you have a Bronson, you needed Josh Hart,
you know what I mean. Like they're an OG that
doesn't need the ball to score, Like OG isn't demanding
the ball. You have the average twenty one game in
this series, and I think with Luca he just takes
away opportunities. The downside to ball centric high usage players
(20:42):
is that in a way it plays to Brunson's favor
that they don't really have another natural score. I mean,
I guess kat is, but they don't really. You find
very rarely, like the Warriors were very unique where they
had two absolutely natural scores and then they had to
catch and shoot Guy in Clay. But I think Brunson
and Luca weren't built to play together, like I don't
(21:05):
think James Harden and Donovan Mitchell are necessarily built to
play together. They're so gifted they can win a bunch
of games. Luke and Brunson are so good they could
have a winning record. But ideally most championship teams there
are pieces and elements to them that they fit.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
They're collaborative. It works together.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
That's really what we have in the NBA now, collaboration champions.
Speaker 9 (21:27):
Not the individual superstar final question, Colin, more likely to
get to the finals next year in your opinion?
Speaker 10 (21:33):
Now win it? Just get to the finals. Knicks out
of the East or Spurs out of the West.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
Spurs, that's a good question. I think it's similar. I
think they should be favored. But Okay, Seal come roaring back?
You sure, yeah, because I mean JDub was hurt, Holmgun
was overwhelmed. The question with them is do they keep
Hart and Steam, or they let them go and use
draft picks to move up and get Mara.
Speaker 10 (21:57):
It's weird.
Speaker 9 (21:57):
I just don't think they're a good matchup for the Spurs,
but they don't match up well with the Spurs. The
Knicks are a great matchup for the Spurs as we saw.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Oh no that I but we said this before this.
Yere OKC was a better matchup against the Knicks. I mean,
the great youthfulness of san Antonio was clearly just in
the first game.
Speaker 3 (22:17):
In the fourth quarter.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
You're like, remember after the first game, I came on
the air and I said, if you're going to beat
the Nick san Antonio, you cannot be tied in the
fourth You have got to have leads. And I also
think Dylan Harper will develop an outside shot, like they
too often their guards pass up good mid range jumpers
like Castle and Harper should actually settle for more eighteen
(22:41):
footers than threes. I think they drive the basket too often.
I think you lose track of how good defensively the
Knicks are.
Speaker 3 (22:47):
With O G.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Robinson cat size and Josh Hart plays way bigger than
six to five, way bigger.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
J Mack with the News, Well that's the news and
thanks for stopping by The Herd Life.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
News Live in Chicago. It's the Herd.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Be sure to catch live editions of The Herd weekdays
and noon Easter not a em Pacific.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
You know, it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
I was just looking at a list after the Kadie Warriors,
remember they won back to back from the year after
that Toronto. That one year with Kawhi won the title.
Nobody thought that was going to be a dominant team.
That was kind of a one off. We all understood it.
Lakers then won the COVID title and again it looked
(23:38):
really really good, but it was hard to like, really
truly embrace it, though it should be noted they were
a very good team that year pre pandemic. Then the
Bucks won and it was interesting.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
Day won. You knew Jiannis was.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
Going to be great, but it wasn't a great supporting cast.
Chris Middleton's your two. And then Golden State won and
they felt like they were old. They were a three seed.
We never thought they were the best team. I got
fooled by Denver. I thought Denver was gonna be I
said at the time, I think they're gonna be San Antonio.
They got their Duncan Jamal Murray wasn't great, but he
was really really good, never been an All Star at
(24:12):
the time. But they you know, they lost guys on
the margins, and then over the course of time they
got a GM and then the coach and the GM,
and they lost guys on the margins. They become very
very Yokic dominant. Aaron Gordon also now Michael Porter's very expensive,
bad contract. Gordon starts suffering little injuries. He plays so hard.
(24:35):
They're just a team now. After that the Celtics. The
Celtics were good, but didn't we always ask ourselves, can
you really see a dynasty with Tatum? Oklahoma City again
felt very strong, but I said, coming into this year,
I've got the archive tape to prove it. I didn't
think they'd win this year. You know, SGA's not Jordan,
and then the Knicks win the only one like I
(24:57):
don't think. Denver felt very very repeatable, and the team
that hasn't won a title, Stan Antonio, feels very potentially repeatable.
But I think the Knicks are situationally excellent.
Speaker 3 (25:11):
The East was weak.
Speaker 1 (25:12):
They faced three teams coming out of a seven game series,
OG who had some injuries in Toronto was healthy, and
they ended up facing a team in the finals that
is the youngest team in the finals since like the
Portland Trailblazers in the mid to late seventies.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
So stuff added up.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
I do think with the confidence of a champion that
they'll be a good team next year. Detroit's going to
be better, Indiana's back, Boston should be better when Tatum's healthy.
The East will be better next year, so they may
be once again just a three seed. Also, once you
win a title, I think there's history that shows you
tend to give your stars more nights off. You know,
(25:52):
once you get that w your fans aren't going to
be happy just getting to a conference final, so you
tend to kind of build that for the postseason. Knicks
could rest some starters. I could see that, but I mean, listen,
this is the NBA that Adam Silver wanted, which was
not stockpiling talent. He was turned off by the KD Warriors,
(26:13):
and so what you're getting are now. I will say,
of the last eight champions, the Golden State Championship I
think galvanized the country because it was Steph.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
They were older.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
The Celtics were a big brand that felt big, that
felt like the NBA Hair steph another title that felt big.
I would say the Knicks Championship feels like the second
biggest championship or maybe even surpasses.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
It in terms of rating.
Speaker 1 (26:39):
It does because the rating system has been tweaked, but
the Knicks feels big, long suffering fan base, controversial kind
of medaling owner. They fire TIBs, a lovable star, and
the games were fun. I mean the games in these
finals for a five game series, it was the most
dramatic five game series of my life. The games were
(26:59):
all sided late, so and and Wemby wouldn't be shocked
if they met again. But I do think you'll get
a better, more refined Wemby. Here's former NBA Brian Scalabrini
on his growth.
Speaker 11 (27:15):
He's not going to turn into Kareema bou Jabbar No.
But you remember that we believe Warriors beat Dirk Davitski,
who won the MVP that year. Like Dirk was really good,
but he was guardable. And then he came back and
when they beat Miami in the finals, he was unguardable.
No one could guard He just went through in the
entire roster so I do think like with Wemby in
(27:37):
his mindset, and he's only in his third year. He
hasn't even made it to the playoffs before this year.
He hasn't even finished a complete season. I guess his
rookie year he did. So it's like there's there's a
lot to grow with a guy like Wemby.
Speaker 1 (27:50):
The other thing we talked about is that what makes
the Knicks really special is how good they've been. You
noted this we did in the fourth quarter. The Celtics
are not this good in the fourth because Jalen Brown's
not that efficient of a player. So what really makes
the Knicks fascinating. Their best quarter easily is the fourth.
(28:13):
They're not a great first quarter team, they're a great
fourth quarter team. And that's something we've always looked at
with the Celtics. And and in fairness, this is not
a shot at Tatum, but he can be passive. I mean,
they moved off Marcus Smart because Marcus was taking shots
from him, And now there's rumors they would move off
a really good player Jalen Brown, because they're not he's
(28:33):
taking shots from him. Nobody doubts who's taking the shot
with the Knicks. Like it is Brunson's offense. So here
here is. I also think smart teams and smart people
in life. Adjust Scalabriney talked about this. New York did
it multiple times throughout the series.
Speaker 11 (28:53):
When you play a certain style and coaches a certain way,
you know, I would just like to see, like with
the Knicks, things weren't going one way, they just adapted
to a different way. Finding a guy that's going to
make a play, and that play doesn't have to be
a three, doesn't have to be a layup. It could
be a driving kick and you know two or three times,
or coming up with a big defensive stop or taking
your charge. Those are in the finals where the margins
(29:16):
are tight, or even in the Eastern Conference finals where
the margins are tight. You know, those little plays make
a big difference.
Speaker 6 (29:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
No, I think it's a good point. So we can
put it up again. You after the Warriors dynasty, we've gone.
I mean, really, this is what Adam Silver was seeking
a Canadian team. The Raptors, big brand Lakers, small market Milwaukee,
old Steph wins one. Here come the Nuggets, big brand Celtics,
(29:44):
small market Oklahoma City and a fifty three year drought
ends with New York. I mean we have seen you know,
J Mac, You and I. I don't read a lot
of stuff on the internet, Like I try to stay
off at as much as I can. If I have
more than two and a half hours a day on it,
it's like, okay, get a life. For years in the
NBA is rig I got news for you, folks. They
(30:06):
would not have picked the Raptors, the Bucks, Denver, okc.
If it's rigged, why did they wait fifty three years
for the Knicks? You see the city erupt is that
you know that this has always been the league that
has struggled with officiating. I would argue that, and this
is what I think Tim Legler had said this, that
(30:28):
there were moments in this series I thought the games
were under officiated.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
It was so physical and the first.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
Quarter of Game one, you're like, guys, nobody's gonna last,
Like this is brutal. For all that it's rigged, crowd
and they're all zeros. But eight years, eight titles, small market,
big market, none of them predictable. Even the Warriors Championship,
you remember this, they were trailing in the series. They
(30:54):
go to Boston and we thought it was over, like
there was a bad matchup, and then you're like Andrew
Wiggins remember that delivers, and you're like, they're gonna steal
this thing from the favored Celtics.
Speaker 5 (31:05):
You Mike done.
Speaker 9 (31:06):
Yeah, if you've typed on the internet, this NBA is rigged.
Just go outside and touch grass, get let the sun
hit your face.
Speaker 10 (31:14):
Just relax, Colin.
Speaker 9 (31:15):
I want to ask you about Jaylen Brunson because I'm
getting in arguments with people online. Yes, I'm a moron
this whole stuff. So SGA had Game seven at home
against the Spurs. He had four points in the fourth quarter,
could not do it. Okay, he's a two time MVP.
The media loves him.
Speaker 10 (31:30):
Jalen Brunson on the road.
Speaker 9 (31:33):
Game five has a ten nothing run by himself to
get a league.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
With Wemby on the floor, the best defensive player ever.
Speaker 9 (31:39):
You have fifteen points in the fourth quarter and a
close out game finished with forty five. Michael Jordan was
the last guy to do that. Why does the media
continue to bowl wash SGA? He's the greatest two time MVP.
Speaker 10 (31:50):
He's not.
Speaker 9 (31:51):
He's just on a really good team. Jalen Brunson to me,
if you ask me now, J Mac, who you want
in a playoff series, Brunson or Sga.
Speaker 10 (31:59):
It's Brunson, Colin. He's just way more clutch. I don't know.
Speaker 9 (32:03):
Maybe I'm going crazy here, but you watched Brunson against
the Spurs.
Speaker 10 (32:07):
Listen everything SGA could not.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
If you gave me the next ten years, oh well
of Kid, Cunningham and Brunson. I would take Kid because
he's a bigger, stronger athlete. If you're asking me right now,
thirty seconds left game seven of the finals, Caid Cunningham
and Brunson, I would take Brunch. I've said this about
MJ and Lebron. Say what you want about Lebron's career.
If you're giving me thirty seconds in the ball, I'm
(32:31):
taking MJ. Like In, Brunson has got that sort of
stroke and that confidence and that repertoire of isolation moves.
He is a great confident closer. And the other thing
is he's smart.
Speaker 9 (32:45):
He's just a smart, tough player, man, makes all the
right plays. He's diminutive, gets in the lane. I just
don't know why people don't love him more like he
I don't know. If I look Colin, I don't think
he's had an MVP vote. Your guy just sent me.
One of your producers sent me a text. Last two years,
Jalen Brunson has one dunk. The NBA glamorizes some goofy stuff.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Well, right, I also think we are seeing a historic
run by Brunson. He is Russell Wilson. Right, He's Russell Wilson.
He goes and wins in college, doesn't go in the
first round. He's a little undersized. His style. Lebron this
weekend was talking about his style, and he's like, he's
so herky jerky, it's hard to time him.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
He's hard to defend. He's really different.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
That was very much Steve Nash, you know, and never
gets hurt, totally durable team leader. And the country never
quite embraced Russell Wilson and they struggle with Brunson. I
think Brunson's loved by the smart people, like I think
New York loves him, and basketball people love him.
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Colin Cowherd
Jason McIntyre
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