March 31, 2025 • 40 mins
We kicked off the program with four news stories and different guests on the stories we think you need to know about!
Steph Solis – Axios Boston Reporter with what to know before Karen Read's retrial kicks off…
Are We Creating A Jobless Society? According to Bill Gates, within 10 years humans won't be needed 'for most things'. Faisal Hoque - AI Innovator & Technologist & author of Transcend: Unlocking Humanity in the Age of AI joined Dan to discuss.
European Green Crabs are invasive species inhabiting and destroying MA coasts – St. Ours Clam Broth found a way to eliminate their threat by eating them! Sharon St. Ours – Runs the Family Business & Created the new dehydrated crab broth from the invasive European Green Crabs joined Dan.
Jury Selection for Karen Read’s Retrial. Phil Tracy – Criminal defense attorney checked in with Dan.
Listen to WBZ NewsRadio on the NEW iHeart Radio app and be sure to set WBZ NewsRadio as your #1 preset!
Steph Solis – Axios Boston Reporter with what to know before Karen Read's retrial kicks off…
Are We Creating A Jobless Society? According to Bill Gates, within 10 years humans won't be needed 'for most things'. Faisal Hoque - AI Innovator & Technologist & author of Transcend: Unlocking Humanity in the Age of AI joined Dan to discuss.
European Green Crabs are invasive species inhabiting and destroying MA coasts – St. Ours Clam Broth found a way to eliminate their threat by eating them! Sharon St. Ours – Runs the Family Business & Created the new dehydrated crab broth from the invasive European Green Crabs joined Dan.
Jury Selection for Karen Read’s Retrial. Phil Tracy – Criminal defense attorney checked in with Dan.
Listen to WBZ NewsRadio on the NEW iHeart Radio app and be sure to set WBZ NewsRadio as your #1 preset!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
It's night Side with Dan Ray onbs Boston Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Karen, I don't know about you, but I'm a little
worried right now. Okay, this is getting me a little bit.
One and four to start the season. I don't know
what's going on, but I watched that game this afternoon
and there was it was a nice little comeback at
the end, but too little, too late. I'm I'm a
(00:27):
little worried. I'm a little worried. My name is Dan Ray.
I'm the host of Nightside here every Monday through Friday
night from eight until midnight. When I'm not worrying about
belove at Boston Red Sox. Man, that was rough today. Well,
tomorrow's though. They don't play tomorrow, so they gotta gotta
wait till Wednesday for the for the next Red Sox win. Okay,
(00:49):
it's an off day tomorrow. That's good. No loss, no
loss tomorrow. As you can tell, it bothers me. It
bothers me a great deal. But I have to I
have to buckle down and I have to focus on Nightside,
which I am gonna do for the next four hours.
And I will take you from March thirty first all
the way up to April first. I know it's April
(01:10):
Fool's Day, but that's the truth. We only have a
little less than four hours left in the month of March.
Once March is by, I feel winter's gone. Why don't
you get a blizzard later this week. My name is
Dan Ray and I'm kind of going on here a
little bit. But that's what happens when the Red Sox lose. Anyway,
put that out of your mind. We can't be thinking
about the Red Sox, gonna be thinking about Nightside. Rob
(01:33):
Brooks is back at the control room. He is all set.
All of New England is thinking about the Red Sox,
but all of New England is also thinking about Nightside,
and that's my responsibility. So we have four very interesting
guests coming up this hour tonight, at like nine o'clock.
We're going to talk about social security because I think
it's important to get maybe take the temperature down a
little bit on that and it's important to folks who
(01:55):
are unsocial security right now, but also folks who are
paying into social security and make sure that those people
who are just entering social security understand that the system
has worked for a long time. Tomorrow night, we're going
to be joined. We were supposed to be joined tonight
by Jim Roosevelt, Boston lawyer, grandson of Franklin Delano Roosevelt,
who of course actually signed the Social Security Law back
(02:19):
in nineteen thirty five. There's also a great article in
Today's Boston Globe by Sean Murphy that I would commend
to you highly. And then later on I'm going to
criticize ICE a little bit. I think that they are
a little out over their skis here, and I think
it is not a good look to arrest people while
you're wearing, you know, undercovered garments. You're not in uniform
(02:42):
streak clothes as it were, you're handcuffing thirty year old
toughs university student. I have no idea what the allegations
are specifically, and we'll talk about that beginning sometime later tonight,
probably at ten o'clock. But first I want to welcome
back to night's side, Steph Solace of Axio's Boston Xio's
Boston reporter. Hi, Steph, welcome back. How are you?
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Thank you very much? I'm good. How about yourself?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Well, other than the Red Sox, it's been a really
nice day. I mean it wasn't nice weather wise, it
really was horrible. And the Red Sox game was even
worse than the weather, and I watched it, and as
you can tell, it has had an impact on me.
I assume you're a Red Sox.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
I would say as a transplant, I am based agnostic.
But I understand that.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
So you're not suffering.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Man, it's to be masochistic in some way.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
You Well, no, we had we had four very good
years two thousand and four, two thousand and seven, twenty thirteen.
In twenty fourteen, I think we have more Major League
Baseball World Championships this century than any other team in baseball.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
So that's how the years in between that caused so
much pain.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
It looks like, well, I know, but we've gotten over that.
We we just we just don't want to go back.
We cannot go back to another drought like that. And
I thank you for giving me some counseling as well
as being available as a guest to talk about the
Karen Reed trial or Karen Reed Trial number two, which
(04:13):
starts tomorrow. I know you're all over this, but and
later on this hour, we're going to talk about the
first part of the trial, which is jury selection with
my friend Phil Tracy, Boston attorney. We'll talk about that,
but let's talk about how wild a scene do you
think we're going to see tomorrow. I guess they have
moved back the areas where people can gather further and
(04:38):
further away from the courthouse. Do you think that's going
to defuse some of the passion and the tension that's
out there stuff?
Speaker 3 (04:46):
I mean, it'll at least contain it a little farther
from the courthouse, but it's definitely not going to diffuse
the passion that's existed. I mean, either are folks from
across New England coming down to you know, protest this
retrial or at least protest the prosecution of Karen Reid.
And you know, this is the second time around. This
(05:09):
is years, a year's long process, you know, the investigation
and prosecution here, and to see so many people still
coming out that, if anything, is an indication of just
how much tension and how much attention has been given
to this case.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
What's crazy about the trial is not only did it
appear to me that the jury did not understand the
judge's instructions or the judge did not offer clear instructions
to the jury, and that's why we had that whole
hullabaloo of the last few months about whether or not
the jury had or had not agreed that she should
(05:48):
be acquitted on charges one and three, And of course
the courts have not given her any leeway there, so
she's going to face retrial on all three charges. Today
the judge apparently decided that some of the defense strategies
would be permitted, some wouldn't be permitted. It seems to
me this is a pretty heavy involvement by a judge
(06:11):
in this trial, and I would have been tempted if
I were her defensal attorney. And maybe they still will
ask this judge to recuse herself. She has a good reputation,
but she's become so embroiled in all of these questions
about her judgment. I hope she's able to conduct the
(06:32):
trial fairly Trial number two. Do you have any thoughts
on that idea?
Speaker 3 (06:38):
So, if anything's different, I think it's that she will
at least make sure that jury instructions are clear when
it comes to deliberating a verdict at the end. Because
Consid's twenty twenty, and whether or not it was her
fault or some of the jury's misunderstanding and the failure
of consensus on all three counts, all three charges, no
(07:00):
matter who's the blame, if anyone, that's something that I'll
be taken care of. I can't speak to the rest
of that, but you know, I'm.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Sure not trying to put I have a little more
flexibility here, so I didn't mean to put you on
the spot. It just seems to me that that that
I would not be surprised. I don't know if the
defense lawyers might at some point ask her to recuse herself.
Now maybe they figured that that's only that's not gonna
(07:28):
win any any favor from her, But it's it is.
It's been one of those trials that, for some reason,
and it has elements obviously it's a police officer who
sadly has lost his life, would not exactly beyond a
reasonable doubt as to what caused it. Was it Karen
Reid backing up? Was it something that happened after she left?
(07:51):
That's obviously for the For the second set of jurors.
The other thing that's interesting, and I'm sure you can
comment on this. One of the alternate jurors who was
not involved in the deliberations, but sat there through the
entire trial. They did not dismiss the alternate jurors until
they reduced it from sixteen to twelve. She's now part
(08:11):
of the defense team. This alternate jurist happen to be
a lawyer. Lawyer can lawyers, can appear for a jury
duty and can be placed on juries. And that is
another twist that I've never seen in my experiences here
in Boston, which adds another interesting element to this second trial.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
This trial has just been full of twists and turns,
and you know, depending on where you stand on everything,
it's a spectacle that has just become increasingly dramatic or
can be seen as a series of distractions. Whether it's
(08:53):
Victoria George joining the defense team, whether it's the alleged
witness intimidate or involvement related to Aiden Kearney, the blogger,
or the situation with the state trooper Michael Proctor who's
now no longer employed by the State Police. There's just
so many things that almost seem ancillary or tangential to
(09:18):
the crux of this, which is whether or not Karen
Reid is at fault for the killing of John O'Keefe,
and it's I think that just adds to a lot
of the speculation about what really happened.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Yeah, and I'll tell you And as sad as this
is to say, if there's not a movie made of this,
and again we cannot forget that a person lost his life,
but if there's not some sort of made for TV
movie or some other movie made this story, I will
be very surprised. Steph Solis, Axio's Boston reporter, thank you
(09:53):
so much for commiserating me with me as much as
you could about the Red Sox now one in four.
Do appreciate whatever limited support you were able to give
me emotionally, But I was very helpful. Well, that's that's
how that's helpful too. That's another we kind of Yeah,
there is still one hundred and fifty seven games left
(10:14):
in the season. Absolutely, Steph, thanks so much. You're good sport.
We'll talk soon.
Speaker 3 (10:18):
Okay, thanks taking you're welcome.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
Well, we come back when we talk about a prediction
that Bill Gatesman. He said within ten years, humans won't
be needed for most things. Boy does that sound dystopian.
We're going to talk to an AI inventor and technologist
and author of a book called Transcend Unlocking Humanity in
the Age of AI. Coming back on Nightside. This is
(10:43):
a Nightside with Dan Ray that you're listening to WBZ
ten thirty and your AM dial. And by the way,
you can always download We're an iHeart radio station. You
can download the iHeart app very easily from whatever play
store you frequent, put it on your your device, your
smart device, and you can make us your first preset
(11:04):
WBZ in Boston, So we will always be just a
fingertip away from you anywhere in the world. You'll be
able to listen to Nightside of BZ during the day.
Twenty four seven, three sixty five. That's my suggestion for
the night. I don't have some other suggestions as well,
but there's nothing better than the one I just made.
We'll be back on Nightside right after this.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
You're on night Side with Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's
news radio.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
You know, I am not a big fan of Bill Gates,
and he has just dropped down in my book a
little bit because he is. He apparently has stated on
on a comedy a nighttime comedy show. So it wasn't
what you what you'd call a scholar's a meeting, a
mensa meeting that ten years from now, within ten years,
(11:52):
humans won't be needed for most things. That's not hell,
that's not good with me? Is Faisal Hawk Fisal an
AI innovator and a technologist. He's off. He's also the
author of a book called Transgend Transcend Unlocking Humanity in
the Age of Ai. Faisel, Welcome to nightside. How are
(12:12):
you doing well?
Speaker 4 (12:14):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
I've never been a big fan of Bill Gates. To
be really honest with you, I'm not not my my
cup of tea. But when he makes this prediction humans
won't be needed for most things, I think, and I
know nothing about AI, you do, but I think he
is what what what do you think of that? Am
(12:38):
I off? Beat? Here? Off? You know? Off? Am I
so far out of reality that that that Gates has
nailed it?
Speaker 1 (12:47):
Well?
Speaker 4 (12:47):
Look, I mean it's already happening, whether we like it
or not. So if you're in the community un following,
you can see how gradually it has taken over in
terms of the decision you make to see a particular
show or food you order, or you know, the things
you read. And now there are these humanoid robots that
(13:11):
are being built by Nvidia and Tesla and others that
will be that will be able to do work in
a physical form like a restaurant. You know, in restaurant,
it'll be able to cook food for you, serve food
for you, self driving cars, and obviously there's all sorts
of research assistant that are basically AI persona when in
(13:35):
software that helps you to do that. So once you
add all that up, many of the many of the
jobs as we know today is no longer going to
be the same. And within ten, fifteen, twenty years, I
don't know whether it's ten years or whether it's fifteen years.
He's kind of right in the sense that a lot
of the stuff that we do, whether that's physical, you know,
(13:58):
physical labor or intellectual labor, is going to be gone.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Well, let me let me discuss it with you then,
fazl Okay, I've been in you know, I've rode in
one of the driving cars in in in San Francisco.
I understand that. But and you go through grocery stores
and now it's all automatic checkout lines, okay, or mostly
(14:27):
automatic checkout lines, which I refuse to go through. Uh
to be honest with you because I like to actually
deal with a clerk and maybe sometimes ask questions. Uh.
And I know that people will argue that, well, we
won't have any need for mail anymore, so therefore the
post officers. But we're always going to need teachers. As
far as I'm concerned, I don't want my kid or
(14:49):
my grandchild to be taught by a robot. We're going
to need, you know, professional sports. I don't want to
go watch a basketball game at Madison Square Garden between
two teams, the robots and the audit autumn on's. I
just think this is over sold. I remember watching cartoons
(15:09):
as a kid that you know, the Jetsons, and I'm
sure you're younger than I am because everybody is well,
you know, thirty years from now, people will be flying,
they'll be flying cars to work. How did that work out?
It didn't. So I'm just fighting this trend a little bit.
I understand AI has has value, but who's going to
take care of people in nursing homes. Who's when when
(15:31):
Who's going to take the places of nurses and doctors?
I mean, you're gonna send it sit with a robot.
Who's gonna tell you do you do you really see
that as the future?
Speaker 4 (15:43):
Well, let me let me, let me put it.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Go ahead. I'm not trying to pick a fight with you,
because you know more than I do. But I wanted
to throw my a couple of punches your way. Go ahead.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
No, I'm glad you're you're doing that because you know
the book I just finished writing after three years of
research and thinking and and you know, doing the work
is that, you know, I kind of come in the
middle of the road. I am super optimistic about future,
but I'm also very cautious about future because you know,
(16:12):
here's a way to look at it. I mean, you know,
I mean, we've been talking about a lot of these
technology for a long time, but now it's finally reaching
at a critical factor. And you know, and there's also
a generational change that's happening. So for example, you know
you're talking about you don't like self driving car? Neither
do I. I still like my state ship, you know,
(16:34):
the convertible decity in my coupe. Turn that out because
it's my freedom and it's my love or whatever. Right,
But if you look at the next generation, they have
grown up with technology and they're more used they're more
comfortable dealing with technology, and that acceleration of technology is
kind of being now driven by them, also adopted by them,
(16:57):
et cetera, et cetera. So and the fact is that
a lot of these technology is already here, right. So,
and if you look at there's a couple of factors
that will change how fast and how critically it gets accepted. So,
for example, it's the profit margin of corporations, because corporations
(17:17):
are there to make money, so they will do anything
and everything to optimize and be more efficient and ultimately
gener more profit. So that's one driver. Second driver is
that adoption. You are mean may not like sitting in
the back of a self driving car. I'd rather drive
my own car. I mean, I experienced driving in Germany
(17:40):
where I had like a semi automatic car and it's
constantly correcting, you know, with the lain correction and how
fast I'm going and telling you that I should have
a coffee paste.
Speaker 5 (17:50):
Right.
Speaker 4 (17:52):
But so there's that generational change. And the third element
is that we have never had any kind of technology
in human history which can actually think for itself and
had the ability to create a collective intelligence base. That's
much more you know, intelligence than you are me as
(18:14):
an individual. Right, So when you add all those three factors, uh,
there are things that's going to be dramatically changed. You
mentioned this not you know that who's going to take
care of our parents and in nursing home and doctors
and whatnot. So let me give you a very personal experience.
Just recently lost my mother who was in nursing home
(18:37):
thank you, who was in a nursing home and she
suffered from you know, the dementia and tail end of
her life. I was very much wishing there was a
companion that's not going to react, just calm her down,
rather than the nursing uh, you know, nursing home staff
(18:58):
who were you know, it was very it's very difficult
to deal with that kind of patient because you know,
it takes a different kind of patient's label level and whatnot.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Right.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
So I'm you know, an unemotional companion would in many
cases would have been much better for her. Another example,
you know, my son is a cancer survivor. Uh, and
you know we are pushing you know, the oncology community
is pushing the research boundary, utilizing a large scale, a
(19:29):
large language model, and other other competing model to figure
out what's the predictive nature of the the disease and
what's the best uh you know path for uh you know,
the treatment that is very individualistic rather than you know,
one formal applies for everybody.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Yeah. No, Look, I agree with you. There's there's a
lot of progress in a lot of areas. I should
have you backfires because I've got three guests, four guests,
and I got to get to my next guest unfortunates.
But I'd love to have you back because you're an
interesting guy and you and you come back with some
pretty good arguments, and I think we could have a
(20:10):
really good hour if we incorporate phone callers. So I'm
going to let my producer getting back. In the meantime,
I just want to mention your book again. It is
called transcend Unlocking Humanity in the Age of Ai. Uh.
I'm looking forward to it. We'll have a really good hour,
incorporate some phone callers as well. Thank you so much
(20:32):
for being with us tonight. In the Thank you, my friend.
We'll talk soon. Okay, we get back. We're going to
talk about an invasive species along the Massachusetts coast. You've
probably never heard of these green crabs. Way do you
hear what someone has come up with to eliminate this threat?
(20:54):
This is amazing. Stay with us right back right after
the news.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Well, I had never heard of this, and I try
to keep up on things, but European green crabs sounds painful.
Are an invasive species inhabiting and destroying Massachusetts coasts. Why
didn't I know about this? With us is my guest
(21:27):
Sharon saint Ours, who runs a family business and has
created a new dehydrated crab broth from these invasive European
green crabs? How long have these green crabs been on
our shoreline? Sharon? How are you? How are you tonight?
Speaker 6 (21:45):
Good? Dan? Hi, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Thank god you guys have come up with a solution.
By the way, let me first of all, thank you
for that. How long have these little devils been out there?
Speaker 6 (21:56):
They've been around for a couple of hundred years. Actually
they we think they came over on the ballast of
ships in the early to mid eighteen hundreds, So waste.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
How come no one ever told me about this? I've
never heard. When did you first hear about these little critters?
Speaker 6 (22:17):
Well, I've seen them around, you know, for a very
long time. If you wade into I grew up on
a river, if you wade out into the river on
the coastline, they're always crawling around your feet. So they've
been around for a while.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
How bigger? How big are they?
Speaker 5 (22:33):
How big are They're small?
Speaker 6 (22:35):
They're small. They they're carapists or their body grows to
about three inches across and that's as about as because
they get three inches, Yeah, just three inches.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
That's pretty good size. Do they have the landing like
little antennae? Are we sure they're not like alien creatures?
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (22:54):
Well from Europe?
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Well that's pretty ailing to me, I'll tell you that's
for sure. So they've been around for a long time.
I must be honest with you. I haven't been around since.
Would you say the eighteen hundreds?
Speaker 6 (23:08):
Right? Right?
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Okay? All roomors to the contrary. I never lived during
the eighteen hundreds. I did live Durund the nineteen hundreds,
and no one ever warned me about green crabs. When
did you first learn about them?
Speaker 6 (23:24):
I went to I go to these speeches at the
North or South River Watershed Association, and then back in
twenty seventeen, I went to a lecture series and they
were discussing, you know what problems they've created that because
(23:46):
they're becoming so abundant right now, they're not dying off
in the numbers that they used to do. They hibernate
in the winter time, they borrow into the marshes, and
a lot of them, a large number of them used
to die off in the winter in the cold. But
now they're just not being eliminated like they were before.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
So are we talking I'm being very serious now, are
we talking about tens of thousands or are we talking
about millions of green crabs? Oh?
Speaker 6 (24:22):
I don't I don't actually know that number.
Speaker 5 (24:24):
But at least there are thousands.
Speaker 6 (24:25):
I mean, there are thousands of them that you can
pull out in during a season, like just with a
few traps that they're really easy to catch, their inshore crabs,
so you don't have to, you know, take your boat
out the ocean of very deep water. And they're they're
(24:46):
very voracious. They eat everything, they eat native species. So
they're becoming a real problem.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
But they but they only grow to three three inches
and you said in with.
Speaker 6 (24:55):
Or length in with like across there there body. And
that's the biggest size I've ever seen.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
How long?
Speaker 6 (25:04):
Very small?
Speaker 2 (25:06):
If they're three inches in width, how long are these
dewt These little.
Speaker 6 (25:09):
Guys, they're about you know, an inch and a half
by about three inches their legs. They don't have a
lot of leg or claw meat like a lot of
the crabs that we like to eat, like the Jonah crab.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Right, Okay, okay, So you got a plan which is
to basically wipe these this invasive species out, and you
have come up with a way to make clam broth.
And it's it's your company. It's Saint Saint Ours Clambroth.
Speaker 6 (25:42):
Right. So our company has been around since nineteen seventy nine.
My father started the company, and we're taking sort of
the byproduct of the fishing industry in this case. In
the what he originally started the company with was utilizing
the cookwater of clams and dehydrating it, making it into
(26:04):
broth powder, which has a long shelf life. It's great
in soups and you know, particularly New England clam chowder,
which we all love around here. So I've applied the
same sort of thinking to this problem and have made
a dehydrated green crab broth powder.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Okay, So now my question is if it's a dehydrated
clam broth powder, is it on the market at this point?
Speaker 6 (26:35):
We just announced it at the recent Seafood Expo at
the Boston Convention.
Speaker 2 (26:40):
Center and recently how recently.
Speaker 6 (26:45):
This was around Saint Patrick's Day.
Speaker 2 (26:49):
Oh, that's really recent. That's really recent. Okay, So where
can people purchase the product? Do they either get it
through Amazon through you or is it at retail store?
Speaker 6 (27:01):
Right now, just directly through us, and we're selling a
food service size container of it to restaurants and we
are also will be coming out with a retail product.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Okay, So what the big question is, I know what
clam chowder tastes, like, what do you do with Saint
Ours clam broth, which is, well, it's that's your company.
What do you do with with this green crab broth?
I assume that are you going to label it that?
Speaker 6 (27:34):
Are you going to Yes, we're calling it, we're calling
it crab broth, but you know we have the little
green crab on there, so you know it's the green
crab and it's actually really delicious. It's the broth. Is
it has a sweetness that comes out of these crabs.
They're very sweet in flavor and you know, a little
(27:58):
bit herbasious like you know, it has a little bit
of a salinity, a seaweedy flavor as well, and they're
used widely in Europe. They make an excellent stock, so
you can use it as you would any any kind
of fish stock or shell fish stock, and it makes
a delicious like a chiappino or a bullia base. We
(28:24):
were at a restaurant show today and I watched chef
David Standridge of the Shipwright's daughter from Connecticut make a
lovely bullyabase out of the green crabs.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Okay, Okay, So if if folks would like, if the
people who are going to the restaurant, you're initially going
to start with restaurants, and so you might see it
on a menu somewhere, which is okay. And if there
are people out there who are just dying to test
it out in their own case, can they contact you directly.
(29:02):
I don't want to have imposed a thousand people looking
for some green crab. You know, if you don't have it,
but you tell me what works for you. Since you
were kind enough to undergo my inquisition, here about the
derivation and the size of green crabs. Go ahead, you
better go.
Speaker 6 (29:18):
Were Oh, thank you and thanks for talking to me too.
They can be we can be reached through our website
www dot Saint ours dot com and it's spelled out
s A I n T O u r s.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
And they don't Yeah, they don't need the w w W.
We can eliminate that. That's a I N T like
the word Saint Ours. Oh u r s dot com?
Speaker 5 (29:48):
Correct?
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Yeah, what's of Saint Ours? I thought I knew all
the saints. I don't know any Saint Ours.
Speaker 6 (29:54):
What's it's it's a French name. Yeah, we hail from Canada.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
And so was there a saint? Was there a saint
whose name was actually ours? Or no? I mean I know,
I know? Okay, okay, good enough. So that's s A
I n T O U r s dot com. If
(30:21):
you want to get some green crab broth, and hey,
I hope it's the next biggest thing, and maybe we'll
have you back at some point and talk about how
it's going through the roof for you.
Speaker 6 (30:33):
Oh, that that would be great.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
The only the only little critters that I know of.
I live in a fairly old house. And in the
summertime we get these these green they almost look like crickets.
They're called stink bugs. Do you know what I mean.
Speaker 6 (30:47):
By yes, get them to Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Well sure, they're very evasive and when you crush them
with you know, piece of toilet paper, it's not an
overwhelming but it's not a pleasant smell, you know, and
it's like, oh man, you know, that's that's what I
was thinking of. Hopefully, Sharon, you a great sport. Thank
(31:15):
you for your time tonight, and we'll check back with you, okay,
let us know how you're doing. Thank you, Thank you
very much, and thank you for talking to me. My pleasure.
When we get back on to talk with old friend
Phil Tracy, attorney, and we're going to talk about how
difficult it is going to be to select a jury
in the the Karen Read trial number two. Coming back
on night Side right after.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
This Night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
My next guest is well known Boston criminal defense attorney
Phil Tracy, a friend of mine for many many years.
Speaker 5 (31:51):
Phil.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
Welcome back to Nightside.
Speaker 5 (31:53):
How are you, Thanks Dan, Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
So we are talking. We talked about the Karen read
Trial at eight oh five with Steph Sallace or the
Axios Reporter Axios Boston Reporter. Tomorrow, the trial, I guess
doesn't technically start because the jury still has not been impaneled,
and I think it's going to take a while for
them to find a jury in this case. So let's
(32:20):
do jury selection one oh one, which I think we
both have such a sense of explain to the audience
that you could become a juror even if you know
about the trial, and I guess everybody in Massachusetts, if
not the country, knows about the trial. What's the standard
for a juror to be selected.
Speaker 5 (32:41):
Well, you want a juror who's honest with the judge
when she asks have you read heard do you know
anything about this case? And of course if a juror says, oh,
I never heard of it, that's a telltale sign that
that person is trying to get on the jury for
(33:01):
whatever reason, for the government or for the defendant. So
you want jurors that say, I can keep an open mind,
I will listen to both the prosecution and the defense,
and I'll make my determination based solely on what I
receive in the court from the evidence, from the exhibits,
(33:24):
and I will follow the judge's instruction. And that's a
pretty simple thing. I think if you have intelligent people,
they're going to say, yes, I've heard of it, and
I can keep an open mind. And even if I
had a feeling about it before, I understand now I
(33:45):
must put that feeling out of my head and I
should absolutely just listen to both sides and make my
determination on proof beyond a reasonable doubt. Now this case
has it's a lot of doubt. Whether it's reasonable or not,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Okay, so let's let's talk about this. The jury pool
is probably the largest jury pool that has ever been
summoned in the history of Norfolk County. I think I
read the number the other day. It was an astonishing
jury pool. Yeah, I think the I think it took
them six weeks. If I'm not mistaken to seat a
(34:27):
jury in the first trial, I kind of assume it's
going to take them at least at and maybe longer
to seat a solid jury. What's your thought on that.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
My thought is there is a juxtaposition here. The first
jury probably had heard or read something about the case,
but the case now has been pried, it's been appealed,
It's in the news constantly, both in print and on
the TV and on your show. So I think you
(35:01):
might get some people to say, I want to do
my civic duty. I want to go in there and
keep an open mind. Now, remember years ago they used
to sequest the juries, they would actually take them. Yeah. So,
and though that was very uncomfortable in a long case
(35:22):
for anybody, but it did happen. And then they just
in the age of of so much electronics, media everything,
it's it's it's impossible to uh, you don't need to
lock them up. Now, what they did the last time
is they the jurors would be bust in from a
location to keep their anonymity sacred. And that is something
(35:47):
very important that they not be bothered for their decision,
whatever that decision is going to be. And you know,
now in this case, the first case, the jurors, some
jurors came forward because they I think were certainly leaning
towards her.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Let me let me come back to sequestration. What do
you think the chances are this jury will be so
questioned and what do you think the chances are either
the defense or more likely the prosecution will follow motion
or change your venue.
Speaker 5 (36:24):
Well that's another thing too. I don't think you can
get out of the venue of a disc of a
superior court in Massachusetts. Let's say you go out to Pittsfield.
You're just people are going to know about this case
and their local papers and on their television. So a
federal case can be moved to another state. But you know,
(36:49):
as you can go back to O. J. Simpson, Whitey, Belosia.
People know about these kind of cases. They're familiar with them.
Some people live to to follow things, as we know
the people that are outside uh rotesting and shouting, you know,
So I mean people live for that kind of thing. Sometimes,
(37:12):
as I am with twelve angry men with Henry Varda,
I thought that was a grateful.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Okay, now I'm going to roll a hand grenade across
the floor to you. Okay, you're a defense Okay. I
would be if I was on the read team, I
would be mightily uh debating in my mind whether they
would ask this judge, after all that's gone on to
accuse herself, what's your thought on that?
Speaker 5 (37:43):
Well, I think she's handled herself magnificently. She tried a
very tough case. Twice.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
She didn't do a great kill. She didn't do she
didn't do a great job on the instructions.
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Well that that let me get to that, but on
them because she knows how to keep I think she
knows how to keep a wildly impulsive case, something that
could blow up at any time. She's been able to
keep keep it calm throughout the first trial and throw
out the post trial motions. Now we know every judge
(38:19):
in the Superior will always in the future be saying
to the jury, well, have you voted on one.
Speaker 6 (38:26):
Or the other?
Speaker 2 (38:28):
I give you.
Speaker 5 (38:30):
Cocain.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
But come back to the recusal. It was if any
you file emotion to recuse, she denies it, you got
an appeal, another repealable issue potentially. And also I think
you're guaranteed she's going to probably maybe have to give
you a little bit of a break when it's a
close call. I think that would be a brilliant move
by the defense. Of course I came up with it,
(38:51):
so why why wouldn't I think it was a brilliant move.
Speaker 7 (38:55):
Yeah, Well, let me say this, Uh, she's rolled and
there favor or a lot of different things that I
thought she would she would not allow them to claim
that their theory of another person killed.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Well, she not know. She knocked out a couple of
those theories today and she allowed a couple to a
couple to come in. So it was kind of a
son mask ruling.
Speaker 4 (39:24):
You know.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
I just think it's interesting and I think a fresh
set of eyes in this case might be one that
would be that would be beneficial to call. Well, I'm
not going to be practicing in front of hers, so
I can say what I want. Yeah, And I believe that,
I really believe that. I think that at a certain
point in time, a judge becomes so familiar with the
(39:46):
case and so you know, involved almost more than they
should be, that it sometimes it's time for a judge
to say, guess what, I did my best job on this,
but I'm going to pass it on to someone else.
Speaker 5 (39:58):
They're not going it can happen. But let me say
one thing. You say, a new pair of eyes, I'm
talking about twenty four eyes twelve you'rors those eyes of
the guys that will decide the laws, guided.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Guided by a judge. Judge will anyway, Phil, I'll let
you run as always. Thanks much. I enjoyed so much.
Speaker 5 (40:20):
Thank you, Dan, I'll talk to you soon be well.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
All right, you too. When we get back, we're going
to talk about social Security. We had a guest schedule.
We're going to have that guest tomorrow night. I'll explain
it all. And I want to talk to you about this, okay,
because I think it's really important and i'd like to
kind of tamp down some of the apprehension that people have.
I can understand why. That's what we'll talk about on
the other side of the nine o'clock News
It's night Side with Dan Ray onbs Boston Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Karen, I don't know about you, but I'm a little
worried right now. Okay, this is getting me a little bit.
One and four to start the season. I don't know
what's going on, but I watched that game this afternoon
and there was it was a nice little comeback at
the end, but too little, too late. I'm I'm a
(00:27):
little worried. I'm a little worried. My name is Dan Ray.
I'm the host of Nightside here every Monday through Friday
night from eight until midnight. When I'm not worrying about
belove at Boston Red Sox. Man, that was rough today. Well,
tomorrow's though. They don't play tomorrow, so they gotta gotta
wait till Wednesday for the for the next Red Sox win. Okay,
(00:49):
it's an off day tomorrow. That's good. No loss, no
loss tomorrow. As you can tell, it bothers me. It
bothers me a great deal. But I have to I
have to buckle down and I have to focus on Nightside,
which I am gonna do for the next four hours.
And I will take you from March thirty first all
the way up to April first. I know it's April
(01:10):
Fool's Day, but that's the truth. We only have a
little less than four hours left in the month of March.
Once March is by, I feel winter's gone. Why don't
you get a blizzard later this week. My name is
Dan Ray and I'm kind of going on here a
little bit. But that's what happens when the Red Sox lose. Anyway,
put that out of your mind. We can't be thinking
about the Red Sox, gonna be thinking about Nightside. Rob
(01:33):
Brooks is back at the control room. He is all set.
All of New England is thinking about the Red Sox,
but all of New England is also thinking about Nightside,
and that's my responsibility. So we have four very interesting
guests coming up this hour tonight, at like nine o'clock.
We're going to talk about social security because I think
it's important to get maybe take the temperature down a
little bit on that and it's important to folks who
(01:55):
are unsocial security right now, but also folks who are
paying into social security and make sure that those people
who are just entering social security understand that the system
has worked for a long time. Tomorrow night, we're going
to be joined. We were supposed to be joined tonight
by Jim Roosevelt, Boston lawyer, grandson of Franklin Delano Roosevelt,
who of course actually signed the Social Security Law back
(02:19):
in nineteen thirty five. There's also a great article in
Today's Boston Globe by Sean Murphy that I would commend
to you highly. And then later on I'm going to
criticize ICE a little bit. I think that they are
a little out over their skis here, and I think
it is not a good look to arrest people while
you're wearing, you know, undercovered garments. You're not in uniform
(02:42):
streak clothes as it were, you're handcuffing thirty year old
toughs university student. I have no idea what the allegations
are specifically, and we'll talk about that beginning sometime later tonight,
probably at ten o'clock. But first I want to welcome
back to night's side, Steph Solace of Axio's Boston Xio's
Boston reporter. Hi, Steph, welcome back. How are you?
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Thank you very much? I'm good. How about yourself?
Speaker 2 (03:07):
Well, other than the Red Sox, it's been a really
nice day. I mean it wasn't nice weather wise, it
really was horrible. And the Red Sox game was even
worse than the weather, and I watched it, and as
you can tell, it has had an impact on me.
I assume you're a Red Sox.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
I would say as a transplant, I am based agnostic.
But I understand that.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
So you're not suffering.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Man, it's to be masochistic in some way.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
You Well, no, we had we had four very good
years two thousand and four, two thousand and seven, twenty thirteen.
In twenty fourteen, I think we have more Major League
Baseball World Championships this century than any other team in baseball.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
So that's how the years in between that caused so
much pain.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
It looks like, well, I know, but we've gotten over that.
We we just we just don't want to go back.
We cannot go back to another drought like that. And
I thank you for giving me some counseling as well
as being available as a guest to talk about the
Karen Reed trial or Karen Reed Trial number two, which
(04:13):
starts tomorrow. I know you're all over this, but and
later on this hour, we're going to talk about the
first part of the trial, which is jury selection with
my friend Phil Tracy, Boston attorney. We'll talk about that,
but let's talk about how wild a scene do you
think we're going to see tomorrow. I guess they have
moved back the areas where people can gather further and
(04:38):
further away from the courthouse. Do you think that's going
to defuse some of the passion and the tension that's
out there stuff?
Speaker 3 (04:46):
I mean, it'll at least contain it a little farther
from the courthouse, but it's definitely not going to diffuse
the passion that's existed. I mean, either are folks from
across New England coming down to you know, protest this
retrial or at least protest the prosecution of Karen Reid.
And you know, this is the second time around. This
(05:09):
is years, a year's long process, you know, the investigation
and prosecution here, and to see so many people still
coming out that, if anything, is an indication of just
how much tension and how much attention has been given
to this case.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
What's crazy about the trial is not only did it
appear to me that the jury did not understand the
judge's instructions or the judge did not offer clear instructions
to the jury, and that's why we had that whole
hullabaloo of the last few months about whether or not
the jury had or had not agreed that she should
(05:48):
be acquitted on charges one and three, And of course
the courts have not given her any leeway there, so
she's going to face retrial on all three charges. Today
the judge apparently decided that some of the defense strategies
would be permitted, some wouldn't be permitted. It seems to
me this is a pretty heavy involvement by a judge
(06:11):
in this trial, and I would have been tempted if
I were her defensal attorney. And maybe they still will
ask this judge to recuse herself. She has a good reputation,
but she's become so embroiled in all of these questions
about her judgment. I hope she's able to conduct the
(06:32):
trial fairly Trial number two. Do you have any thoughts
on that idea?
Speaker 3 (06:38):
So, if anything's different, I think it's that she will
at least make sure that jury instructions are clear when
it comes to deliberating a verdict at the end. Because
Consid's twenty twenty, and whether or not it was her
fault or some of the jury's misunderstanding and the failure
of consensus on all three counts, all three charges, no
(07:00):
matter who's the blame, if anyone, that's something that I'll
be taken care of. I can't speak to the rest
of that, but you know, I'm.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Sure not trying to put I have a little more
flexibility here, so I didn't mean to put you on
the spot. It just seems to me that that that
I would not be surprised. I don't know if the
defense lawyers might at some point ask her to recuse herself.
Now maybe they figured that that's only that's not gonna
(07:28):
win any any favor from her, But it's it is.
It's been one of those trials that, for some reason,
and it has elements obviously it's a police officer who
sadly has lost his life, would not exactly beyond a
reasonable doubt as to what caused it. Was it Karen
Reid backing up? Was it something that happened after she left?
(07:51):
That's obviously for the For the second set of jurors.
The other thing that's interesting, and I'm sure you can
comment on this. One of the alternate jurors who was
not involved in the deliberations, but sat there through the
entire trial. They did not dismiss the alternate jurors until
they reduced it from sixteen to twelve. She's now part
(08:11):
of the defense team. This alternate jurist happen to be
a lawyer. Lawyer can lawyers, can appear for a jury
duty and can be placed on juries. And that is
another twist that I've never seen in my experiences here
in Boston, which adds another interesting element to this second trial.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
This trial has just been full of twists and turns,
and you know, depending on where you stand on everything,
it's a spectacle that has just become increasingly dramatic or
can be seen as a series of distractions. Whether it's
(08:53):
Victoria George joining the defense team, whether it's the alleged
witness intimidate or involvement related to Aiden Kearney, the blogger,
or the situation with the state trooper Michael Proctor who's
now no longer employed by the State Police. There's just
so many things that almost seem ancillary or tangential to
(09:18):
the crux of this, which is whether or not Karen
Reid is at fault for the killing of John O'Keefe,
and it's I think that just adds to a lot
of the speculation about what really happened.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Yeah, and I'll tell you And as sad as this
is to say, if there's not a movie made of this,
and again we cannot forget that a person lost his life,
but if there's not some sort of made for TV
movie or some other movie made this story, I will
be very surprised. Steph Solis, Axio's Boston reporter, thank you
(09:53):
so much for commiserating me with me as much as
you could about the Red Sox now one in four.
Do appreciate whatever limited support you were able to give
me emotionally, But I was very helpful. Well, that's that's
how that's helpful too. That's another we kind of Yeah,
there is still one hundred and fifty seven games left
(10:14):
in the season. Absolutely, Steph, thanks so much. You're good sport.
We'll talk soon.
Speaker 3 (10:18):
Okay, thanks taking you're welcome.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
Well, we come back when we talk about a prediction
that Bill Gatesman. He said within ten years, humans won't
be needed for most things. Boy does that sound dystopian.
We're going to talk to an AI inventor and technologist
and author of a book called Transcend Unlocking Humanity in
the Age of AI. Coming back on Nightside. This is
(10:43):
a Nightside with Dan Ray that you're listening to WBZ
ten thirty and your AM dial. And by the way,
you can always download We're an iHeart radio station. You
can download the iHeart app very easily from whatever play
store you frequent, put it on your your device, your
smart device, and you can make us your first preset
(11:04):
WBZ in Boston, So we will always be just a
fingertip away from you anywhere in the world. You'll be
able to listen to Nightside of BZ during the day.
Twenty four seven, three sixty five. That's my suggestion for
the night. I don't have some other suggestions as well,
but there's nothing better than the one I just made.
We'll be back on Nightside right after this.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
You're on night Side with Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's
news radio.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
You know, I am not a big fan of Bill Gates,
and he has just dropped down in my book a
little bit because he is. He apparently has stated on
on a comedy a nighttime comedy show. So it wasn't
what you what you'd call a scholar's a meeting, a
mensa meeting that ten years from now, within ten years,
(11:52):
humans won't be needed for most things. That's not hell,
that's not good with me? Is Faisal Hawk Fisal an
AI innovator and a technologist. He's off. He's also the
author of a book called Transgend Transcend Unlocking Humanity in
the Age of Ai. Faisel, Welcome to nightside. How are
(12:12):
you doing well?
Speaker 4 (12:14):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
I've never been a big fan of Bill Gates. To
be really honest with you, I'm not not my my
cup of tea. But when he makes this prediction humans
won't be needed for most things, I think, and I
know nothing about AI, you do, but I think he
is what what what do you think of that? Am
(12:38):
I off? Beat? Here? Off? You know? Off? Am I
so far out of reality that that that Gates has
nailed it?
Speaker 1 (12:47):
Well?
Speaker 4 (12:47):
Look, I mean it's already happening, whether we like it
or not. So if you're in the community un following,
you can see how gradually it has taken over in
terms of the decision you make to see a particular
show or food you order, or you know, the things
you read. And now there are these humanoid robots that
(13:11):
are being built by Nvidia and Tesla and others that
will be that will be able to do work in
a physical form like a restaurant. You know, in restaurant,
it'll be able to cook food for you, serve food
for you, self driving cars, and obviously there's all sorts
of research assistant that are basically AI persona when in
(13:35):
software that helps you to do that. So once you
add all that up, many of the many of the
jobs as we know today is no longer going to
be the same. And within ten, fifteen, twenty years, I
don't know whether it's ten years or whether it's fifteen years.
He's kind of right in the sense that a lot
of the stuff that we do, whether that's physical, you know,
(13:58):
physical labor or intellectual labor, is going to be gone.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Well, let me let me discuss it with you then,
fazl Okay, I've been in you know, I've rode in
one of the driving cars in in in San Francisco.
I understand that. But and you go through grocery stores
and now it's all automatic checkout lines, okay, or mostly
(14:27):
automatic checkout lines, which I refuse to go through. Uh
to be honest with you because I like to actually
deal with a clerk and maybe sometimes ask questions. Uh.
And I know that people will argue that, well, we
won't have any need for mail anymore, so therefore the
post officers. But we're always going to need teachers. As
far as I'm concerned, I don't want my kid or
(14:49):
my grandchild to be taught by a robot. We're going
to need, you know, professional sports. I don't want to
go watch a basketball game at Madison Square Garden between
two teams, the robots and the audit autumn on's. I
just think this is over sold. I remember watching cartoons
(15:09):
as a kid that you know, the Jetsons, and I'm
sure you're younger than I am because everybody is well,
you know, thirty years from now, people will be flying,
they'll be flying cars to work. How did that work out?
It didn't. So I'm just fighting this trend a little bit.
I understand AI has has value, but who's going to
take care of people in nursing homes. Who's when when
(15:31):
Who's going to take the places of nurses and doctors?
I mean, you're gonna send it sit with a robot.
Who's gonna tell you do you do you really see
that as the future?
Speaker 4 (15:43):
Well, let me let me, let me put it.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Go ahead. I'm not trying to pick a fight with you,
because you know more than I do. But I wanted
to throw my a couple of punches your way. Go ahead.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
No, I'm glad you're you're doing that because you know
the book I just finished writing after three years of
research and thinking and and you know, doing the work
is that, you know, I kind of come in the
middle of the road. I am super optimistic about future,
but I'm also very cautious about future because you know,
(16:12):
here's a way to look at it. I mean, you know,
I mean, we've been talking about a lot of these
technology for a long time, but now it's finally reaching
at a critical factor. And you know, and there's also
a generational change that's happening. So for example, you know
you're talking about you don't like self driving car? Neither
do I. I still like my state ship, you know,
(16:34):
the convertible decity in my coupe. Turn that out because
it's my freedom and it's my love or whatever. Right,
But if you look at the next generation, they have
grown up with technology and they're more used they're more
comfortable dealing with technology, and that acceleration of technology is
kind of being now driven by them, also adopted by them,
(16:57):
et cetera, et cetera. So and the fact is that
a lot of these technology is already here, right. So,
and if you look at there's a couple of factors
that will change how fast and how critically it gets accepted. So,
for example, it's the profit margin of corporations, because corporations
(17:17):
are there to make money, so they will do anything
and everything to optimize and be more efficient and ultimately
gener more profit. So that's one driver. Second driver is
that adoption. You are mean may not like sitting in
the back of a self driving car. I'd rather drive
my own car. I mean, I experienced driving in Germany
(17:40):
where I had like a semi automatic car and it's
constantly correcting, you know, with the lain correction and how
fast I'm going and telling you that I should have
a coffee paste.
Speaker 5 (17:50):
Right.
Speaker 4 (17:52):
But so there's that generational change. And the third element
is that we have never had any kind of technology
in human history which can actually think for itself and
had the ability to create a collective intelligence base. That's
much more you know, intelligence than you are me as
(18:14):
an individual. Right, So when you add all those three factors, uh,
there are things that's going to be dramatically changed. You
mentioned this not you know that who's going to take
care of our parents and in nursing home and doctors
and whatnot. So let me give you a very personal experience.
Just recently lost my mother who was in nursing home
(18:37):
thank you, who was in a nursing home and she
suffered from you know, the dementia and tail end of
her life. I was very much wishing there was a
companion that's not going to react, just calm her down,
rather than the nursing uh, you know, nursing home staff
(18:58):
who were you know, it was very it's very difficult
to deal with that kind of patient because you know,
it takes a different kind of patient's label level and whatnot.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
Right.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
So I'm you know, an unemotional companion would in many
cases would have been much better for her. Another example,
you know, my son is a cancer survivor. Uh, and
you know we are pushing you know, the oncology community
is pushing the research boundary, utilizing a large scale, a
(19:29):
large language model, and other other competing model to figure
out what's the predictive nature of the the disease and
what's the best uh you know path for uh you know,
the treatment that is very individualistic rather than you know,
one formal applies for everybody.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Yeah. No, Look, I agree with you. There's there's a
lot of progress in a lot of areas. I should
have you backfires because I've got three guests, four guests,
and I got to get to my next guest unfortunates.
But I'd love to have you back because you're an
interesting guy and you and you come back with some
pretty good arguments, and I think we could have a
(20:10):
really good hour if we incorporate phone callers. So I'm
going to let my producer getting back. In the meantime,
I just want to mention your book again. It is
called transcend Unlocking Humanity in the Age of Ai. Uh.
I'm looking forward to it. We'll have a really good hour,
incorporate some phone callers as well. Thank you so much
(20:32):
for being with us tonight. In the Thank you, my friend.
We'll talk soon. Okay, we get back. We're going to
talk about an invasive species along the Massachusetts coast. You've
probably never heard of these green crabs. Way do you
hear what someone has come up with to eliminate this threat?
(20:54):
This is amazing. Stay with us right back right after
the news.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Dan Ray on WBZ, Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Well, I had never heard of this, and I try
to keep up on things, but European green crabs sounds painful.
Are an invasive species inhabiting and destroying Massachusetts coasts. Why
didn't I know about this? With us is my guest
(21:27):
Sharon saint Ours, who runs a family business and has
created a new dehydrated crab broth from these invasive European
green crabs? How long have these green crabs been on
our shoreline? Sharon? How are you? How are you tonight?
Speaker 6 (21:45):
Good? Dan? Hi, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Thank god you guys have come up with a solution.
By the way, let me first of all, thank you
for that. How long have these little devils been out there?
Speaker 6 (21:56):
They've been around for a couple of hundred years. Actually
they we think they came over on the ballast of
ships in the early to mid eighteen hundreds, So waste.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
How come no one ever told me about this? I've
never heard. When did you first hear about these little critters?
Speaker 6 (22:17):
Well, I've seen them around, you know, for a very
long time. If you wade into I grew up on
a river, if you wade out into the river on
the coastline, they're always crawling around your feet. So they've
been around for a while.
Speaker 2 (22:31):
How bigger? How big are they?
Speaker 5 (22:33):
How big are They're small?
Speaker 6 (22:35):
They're small. They they're carapists or their body grows to
about three inches across and that's as about as because
they get three inches, Yeah, just three inches.
Speaker 2 (22:47):
That's pretty good size. Do they have the landing like
little antennae? Are we sure they're not like alien creatures?
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (22:54):
Well from Europe?
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Well that's pretty ailing to me, I'll tell you that's
for sure. So they've been around for a long time.
I must be honest with you. I haven't been around since.
Would you say the eighteen hundreds?
Speaker 6 (23:08):
Right? Right?
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Okay? All roomors to the contrary. I never lived during
the eighteen hundreds. I did live Durund the nineteen hundreds,
and no one ever warned me about green crabs. When
did you first learn about them?
Speaker 6 (23:24):
I went to I go to these speeches at the
North or South River Watershed Association, and then back in
twenty seventeen, I went to a lecture series and they
were discussing, you know what problems they've created that because
(23:46):
they're becoming so abundant right now, they're not dying off
in the numbers that they used to do. They hibernate
in the winter time, they borrow into the marshes, and
a lot of them, a large number of them used
to die off in the winter in the cold. But
now they're just not being eliminated like they were before.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
So are we talking I'm being very serious now, are
we talking about tens of thousands or are we talking
about millions of green crabs? Oh?
Speaker 6 (24:22):
I don't I don't actually know that number.
Speaker 5 (24:24):
But at least there are thousands.
Speaker 6 (24:25):
I mean, there are thousands of them that you can
pull out in during a season, like just with a
few traps that they're really easy to catch, their inshore crabs,
so you don't have to, you know, take your boat
out the ocean of very deep water. And they're they're
(24:46):
very voracious. They eat everything, they eat native species. So
they're becoming a real problem.
Speaker 2 (24:52):
But they but they only grow to three three inches
and you said in with.
Speaker 6 (24:55):
Or length in with like across there there body. And
that's the biggest size I've ever seen.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
How long?
Speaker 6 (25:04):
Very small?
Speaker 2 (25:06):
If they're three inches in width, how long are these
dewt These little.
Speaker 6 (25:09):
Guys, they're about you know, an inch and a half
by about three inches their legs. They don't have a
lot of leg or claw meat like a lot of
the crabs that we like to eat, like the Jonah crab.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Right, Okay, okay, So you got a plan which is
to basically wipe these this invasive species out, and you
have come up with a way to make clam broth.
And it's it's your company. It's Saint Saint Ours Clambroth.
Speaker 6 (25:42):
Right. So our company has been around since nineteen seventy nine.
My father started the company, and we're taking sort of
the byproduct of the fishing industry in this case. In
the what he originally started the company with was utilizing
the cookwater of clams and dehydrating it, making it into
(26:04):
broth powder, which has a long shelf life. It's great
in soups and you know, particularly New England clam chowder,
which we all love around here. So I've applied the
same sort of thinking to this problem and have made
a dehydrated green crab broth powder.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Okay, So now my question is if it's a dehydrated
clam broth powder, is it on the market at this point?
Speaker 6 (26:35):
We just announced it at the recent Seafood Expo at
the Boston Convention.
Speaker 2 (26:40):
Center and recently how recently.
Speaker 6 (26:45):
This was around Saint Patrick's Day.
Speaker 2 (26:49):
Oh, that's really recent. That's really recent. Okay, So where
can people purchase the product? Do they either get it
through Amazon through you or is it at retail store?
Speaker 6 (27:01):
Right now, just directly through us, and we're selling a
food service size container of it to restaurants and we
are also will be coming out with a retail product.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Okay, So what the big question is, I know what
clam chowder tastes, like, what do you do with Saint
Ours clam broth, which is, well, it's that's your company.
What do you do with with this green crab broth?
I assume that are you going to label it that?
Speaker 6 (27:34):
Are you going to Yes, we're calling it, we're calling
it crab broth, but you know we have the little
green crab on there, so you know it's the green
crab and it's actually really delicious. It's the broth. Is
it has a sweetness that comes out of these crabs.
They're very sweet in flavor and you know, a little
(27:58):
bit herbasious like you know, it has a little bit
of a salinity, a seaweedy flavor as well, and they're
used widely in Europe. They make an excellent stock, so
you can use it as you would any any kind
of fish stock or shell fish stock, and it makes
a delicious like a chiappino or a bullia base. We
(28:24):
were at a restaurant show today and I watched chef
David Standridge of the Shipwright's daughter from Connecticut make a
lovely bullyabase out of the green crabs.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Okay, Okay, So if if folks would like, if the
people who are going to the restaurant, you're initially going
to start with restaurants, and so you might see it
on a menu somewhere, which is okay. And if there
are people out there who are just dying to test
it out in their own case, can they contact you directly.
(29:02):
I don't want to have imposed a thousand people looking
for some green crab. You know, if you don't have it,
but you tell me what works for you. Since you
were kind enough to undergo my inquisition, here about the
derivation and the size of green crabs. Go ahead, you
better go.
Speaker 6 (29:18):
Were Oh, thank you and thanks for talking to me too.
They can be we can be reached through our website
www dot Saint ours dot com and it's spelled out
s A I n T O u r s.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
And they don't Yeah, they don't need the w w W.
We can eliminate that. That's a I N T like
the word Saint Ours. Oh u r s dot com?
Speaker 5 (29:48):
Correct?
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Yeah, what's of Saint Ours? I thought I knew all
the saints. I don't know any Saint Ours.
Speaker 6 (29:54):
What's it's it's a French name. Yeah, we hail from Canada.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
And so was there a saint? Was there a saint
whose name was actually ours? Or no? I mean I know,
I know? Okay, okay, good enough. So that's s A
I n T O U r s dot com. If
(30:21):
you want to get some green crab broth, and hey,
I hope it's the next biggest thing, and maybe we'll
have you back at some point and talk about how
it's going through the roof for you.
Speaker 6 (30:33):
Oh, that that would be great.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
The only the only little critters that I know of.
I live in a fairly old house. And in the
summertime we get these these green they almost look like crickets.
They're called stink bugs. Do you know what I mean.
Speaker 6 (30:47):
By yes, get them to Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Well sure, they're very evasive and when you crush them
with you know, piece of toilet paper, it's not an
overwhelming but it's not a pleasant smell, you know, and
it's like, oh man, you know, that's that's what I
was thinking of. Hopefully, Sharon, you a great sport. Thank
(31:15):
you for your time tonight, and we'll check back with you, okay,
let us know how you're doing. Thank you, Thank you
very much, and thank you for talking to me. My pleasure.
When we get back on to talk with old friend
Phil Tracy, attorney, and we're going to talk about how
difficult it is going to be to select a jury
in the the Karen Read trial number two. Coming back
on night Side right after.
Speaker 1 (31:36):
This Night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's news radio.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
My next guest is well known Boston criminal defense attorney
Phil Tracy, a friend of mine for many many years.
Speaker 5 (31:51):
Phil.
Speaker 2 (31:52):
Welcome back to Nightside.
Speaker 5 (31:53):
How are you, Thanks Dan, Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
So we are talking. We talked about the Karen read
Trial at eight oh five with Steph Sallace or the
Axios Reporter Axios Boston Reporter. Tomorrow, the trial, I guess
doesn't technically start because the jury still has not been impaneled,
and I think it's going to take a while for
them to find a jury in this case. So let's
(32:20):
do jury selection one oh one, which I think we
both have such a sense of explain to the audience
that you could become a juror even if you know
about the trial, and I guess everybody in Massachusetts, if
not the country, knows about the trial. What's the standard
for a juror to be selected.
Speaker 5 (32:41):
Well, you want a juror who's honest with the judge
when she asks have you read heard do you know
anything about this case? And of course if a juror says, oh,
I never heard of it, that's a telltale sign that
that person is trying to get on the jury for
(33:01):
whatever reason, for the government or for the defendant. So
you want jurors that say, I can keep an open mind,
I will listen to both the prosecution and the defense,
and I'll make my determination based solely on what I
receive in the court from the evidence, from the exhibits,
(33:24):
and I will follow the judge's instruction. And that's a
pretty simple thing. I think if you have intelligent people,
they're going to say, yes, I've heard of it, and
I can keep an open mind. And even if I
had a feeling about it before, I understand now I
(33:45):
must put that feeling out of my head and I
should absolutely just listen to both sides and make my
determination on proof beyond a reasonable doubt. Now this case
has it's a lot of doubt. Whether it's reasonable or not,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
Okay, so let's let's talk about this. The jury pool
is probably the largest jury pool that has ever been
summoned in the history of Norfolk County. I think I
read the number the other day. It was an astonishing
jury pool. Yeah, I think the I think it took
them six weeks. If I'm not mistaken to seat a
(34:27):
jury in the first trial, I kind of assume it's
going to take them at least at and maybe longer
to seat a solid jury. What's your thought on that.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
My thought is there is a juxtaposition here. The first
jury probably had heard or read something about the case,
but the case now has been pried, it's been appealed,
It's in the news constantly, both in print and on
the TV and on your show. So I think you
(35:01):
might get some people to say, I want to do
my civic duty. I want to go in there and
keep an open mind. Now, remember years ago they used
to sequest the juries, they would actually take them. Yeah. So,
and though that was very uncomfortable in a long case
(35:22):
for anybody, but it did happen. And then they just
in the age of of so much electronics, media everything,
it's it's it's impossible to uh, you don't need to
lock them up. Now, what they did the last time
is they the jurors would be bust in from a
location to keep their anonymity sacred. And that is something
(35:47):
very important that they not be bothered for their decision,
whatever that decision is going to be. And you know,
now in this case, the first case, the jurors, some
jurors came forward because they I think were certainly leaning
towards her.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Let me let me come back to sequestration. What do
you think the chances are this jury will be so
questioned and what do you think the chances are either
the defense or more likely the prosecution will follow motion
or change your venue.
Speaker 5 (36:24):
Well that's another thing too. I don't think you can
get out of the venue of a disc of a
superior court in Massachusetts. Let's say you go out to Pittsfield.
You're just people are going to know about this case
and their local papers and on their television. So a
federal case can be moved to another state. But you know,
(36:49):
as you can go back to O. J. Simpson, Whitey, Belosia.
People know about these kind of cases. They're familiar with them.
Some people live to to follow things, as we know
the people that are outside uh rotesting and shouting, you know,
So I mean people live for that kind of thing. Sometimes,
(37:12):
as I am with twelve angry men with Henry Varda,
I thought that was a grateful.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Okay, now I'm going to roll a hand grenade across
the floor to you. Okay, you're a defense Okay. I
would be if I was on the read team, I
would be mightily uh debating in my mind whether they
would ask this judge, after all that's gone on to
accuse herself, what's your thought on that?
Speaker 5 (37:43):
Well, I think she's handled herself magnificently. She tried a
very tough case. Twice.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
She didn't do a great kill. She didn't do she
didn't do a great job on the instructions.
Speaker 5 (37:55):
Well that that let me get to that, but on
them because she knows how to keep I think she
knows how to keep a wildly impulsive case, something that
could blow up at any time. She's been able to
keep keep it calm throughout the first trial and throw
out the post trial motions. Now we know every judge
(38:19):
in the Superior will always in the future be saying
to the jury, well, have you voted on one.
Speaker 6 (38:26):
Or the other?
Speaker 2 (38:28):
I give you.
Speaker 5 (38:30):
Cocain.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
But come back to the recusal. It was if any
you file emotion to recuse, she denies it, you got
an appeal, another repealable issue potentially. And also I think
you're guaranteed she's going to probably maybe have to give
you a little bit of a break when it's a
close call. I think that would be a brilliant move
by the defense. Of course I came up with it,
(38:51):
so why why wouldn't I think it was a brilliant move.
Speaker 7 (38:55):
Yeah, Well, let me say this, Uh, she's rolled and
there favor or a lot of different things that I
thought she would she would not allow them to claim
that their theory of another person killed.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Well, she not know. She knocked out a couple of
those theories today and she allowed a couple to a
couple to come in. So it was kind of a
son mask ruling.
Speaker 4 (39:24):
You know.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
I just think it's interesting and I think a fresh
set of eyes in this case might be one that
would be that would be beneficial to call. Well, I'm
not going to be practicing in front of hers, so
I can say what I want. Yeah, And I believe that,
I really believe that. I think that at a certain
point in time, a judge becomes so familiar with the
(39:46):
case and so you know, involved almost more than they
should be, that it sometimes it's time for a judge
to say, guess what, I did my best job on this,
but I'm going to pass it on to someone else.
Speaker 5 (39:58):
They're not going it can happen. But let me say
one thing. You say, a new pair of eyes, I'm
talking about twenty four eyes twelve you'rors those eyes of
the guys that will decide the laws, guided.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
Guided by a judge. Judge will anyway, Phil, I'll let
you run as always. Thanks much. I enjoyed so much.
Speaker 5 (40:20):
Thank you, Dan, I'll talk to you soon be well.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
All right, you too. When we get back, we're going
to talk about social Security. We had a guest schedule.
We're going to have that guest tomorrow night. I'll explain
it all. And I want to talk to you about this, okay,
because I think it's really important and i'd like to
kind of tamp down some of the apprehension that people have.
I can understand why. That's what we'll talk about on
the other side of the nine o'clock News
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.