On today’s MKD, we start the week off discussing Robert Carradine’s wrongful death lawsuit, a toddler killed by a kitchen playset, a dad who lured his daughter’s rapist to their home, Gen Z’s take on smoking, and what a “Gooneral” is.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Mother Knows Death starring Nicole and Jemmy and Maria qk.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Hi. Everyone welcome The Mother Knows Death. On today's episode,
we're going to talk about a lawsuit involving actor Robert
Carodine's death. Remember he played Lewis in Revenge of the
Nerds movies. Then we're going to talk about a tragic
freak accident involving a toddler. In crime news, we'll talk
about the rise in gooner assaults at Dollar Tree stores
(00:43):
and a dad who got creative and lured his daughter's
rapist to his house. Then we'll finish up with the
latest trend among gen zers, which is apparently smoking cigarettes
are cool again. I told you, Maria, and that plus
your comments, questions, emails, all that and more on today's episode.
(01:03):
All right, so we did talk about Robert Carodine when
he died. If you guys remember he's seventy one years old,
had bipolar disorder, was not diagnosed until he was fifty
years old, which is unusual because it's most commonly diagnosed
between eighteen and twenty five years old. So he likely
(01:24):
was showing symptoms his entire life, but just didn't get
a formal diagnosis until he was fifty. So there's different
forms of bipolar, but it's usually a mixture of manic
episodes followed by episodes of severe depression. And I guess
you know what we talked about last time is that
(01:46):
when bipolar, people just have a really high increase of
suicides compared to the normal population. So twenty to fifty
percent of people with bipolar have a ten did suicide
at least once in their life, and ten to twenty
percent will die from it. So it's it's a thing.
(02:07):
So so what happened was we reported back in I
forget what it was.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
It was back in February. We reported on the death,
but we didn't have many details. All we knew was
that he died by suicide, but they didn't really reveal
anything else. They did mention the bipolar initially the family,
but so we knew that.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
So so now you know, why don't you say what
this lawsuit is?
Speaker 1 (02:34):
Yeah, so now his family has filed a lawsuit against
UCLA hospital leadership for wrongful death and other abuse. So
they're saying in this lawsuit that he was admitted to
UCLA's locked psychiatric unit and was hopeful it would quote
reduce his anxiety, but they broke two very important protocols
within the unit, which was allowing him to have a
(02:56):
belt and having a rolling bedside table. So because this
slipped through the cracks, he was able to attempt suicide
within nineteen hours of being in the psychiatric unit, and
this eventually led to his death.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah, so imagine the guy was having suicidal thoughts and
admitted himself to a place so he would be safe.
That's what he did. And instead of staying at home
and letting his family watch over him and things like that,
he was like, I'm going to go into a place
where professionals are watching me. And he still died by
(03:33):
suicide there anyway, which is just kind of unbelievable. They
had put mentioned in the lawsuit that they weren't checking
on him as often as they should have been. And
obviously I don't even understand how the table did. They
say how the table played a role in his death.
I mean, if that's a situation with people who were
(03:53):
on suicide watch, I don't even understand why they would
be in the rooms.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Well, I would say the table probably played a part because,
not to be graphic, but this is how I'm assuming
it's going down because we don't have any specifics, but
he might have used the belt to hang himself from
like something on the ceiling and then kick the table away,
you know, so you don't you don't know, but like,
they shouldn't have things like that that people go. People
(04:18):
that are going there are in this mentality of doing
something like this, so they shouldn't have anything like that
in there that they have access to achieve that if
they're trying to actively get help.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I mean, I think the ceiling method is unlikely just
given a hospital room, it was probably just like Robin
Williams's style with a bathroom door or something like that.
Or I mean, people can do anything. If you want
to do it, you're gonna do.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Definitely bringing up the ceiling method because they specifically noted
this roll away table, which why would that have any
importance if it wasn't used in the attempt.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Yeah, I'm not exactly sure.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
It's like it is really sad for the family because
he was seventy one, which I consider to still be
you know' that's my magic age seventy that I'm like, Okay,
if you made it to seventy, you lived a pretty
decent life, but you should still live past seventy one.
It's still pretty young to die, especially when his body
(05:20):
was relatively healthy and it just was his mind that
needed help. And God, I mean, just so many stories
are coming to light this year focusing on mental health
treatment in this country, and it's really opening a lot
of people's eyes. Between this and the Lindsey Clancy case,
Perez Hilton, like, just within the past couple of months,
(05:43):
You're just like, this needs to be talked about.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Well, not for nothing, but did we not learn anything
with the Epstein case where they alleged they weren't checking
on him for long periods of time? I mean at
the psychiatric unit. According to this lawsuit, the policy was
they were supposed to be checking on him every fifteen minutes,
but they were letting him go longer periods of time
allowed him to accomplish this. So if he was there
and realized like, oh, they're not checking on me for
one to two hours at a time, people that are
(06:07):
desperate to do something like this are able to figure
out how to get it done.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
So, I mean, I'm not like a huge sue everybody person.
We have a lot of cases this week in particular,
that we're going to be talking about that it's totally justified,
I feel like in this particular situation, because he specifically
went to a place that was supposed to be saving
his life. It's just kind of it's kind of outrageous
(06:36):
that it still happened, and they should really, I mean,
they haven't commented yet on it, obviously because it's an
active lawsuit. But the thing is is that and it's
the same we could talk about with the Lindsey Clancy
case and stuff. It's like, there's so many regular people
every day that are victims of these types of things
and it's never talked about, Like just us talking right
(06:58):
now with our very relatively small number of listeners. I'm
sure somebody will send us an email and say, oh,
I know someone that the same thing happened. But they're
just like a regular person that lives in the city
or lives in the burbs, and nobody cares about them.
And the only reason we're talking about this now is
because it's an actor and it's in every newspaper right now.
But like something, something needs to be done because it's
(07:21):
just it's just kind of unacceptable.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yeah, So basically they're saying from that suicide attempt, he
never regained consciousness, he suffered, he suffered in an oxic
brain injury, and spent the next five weeks in the
intensive care unit. He never recovered, and then subsequently died
on February twenty third, twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
So yeah, I mean, and they're like the worst cases ever.
If somebody doesn't die instantaneously and just are on machines
and you're just hoping for a miracle over five like five.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Weeks, it's just that's torture. The whole thing is tortures
because it's upsetting that the attempt happened, and then obviously
it wasn't successful immediately, so then it's like you have
to deal with the trauma of somebody doing it. Then
you have to wait out the five week period hoping
they'll recover and they don't. So like at the end
of the day, it still ended up being successful. But
it's just terrible and unnecessary suffering for all parties.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah, it's it really is. It's just so sad too,
And being from the family's perspective, don't don't you think
if this similar situation happened with us, that we would
constantly be like, oh, if only a nurse went in
five minutes before, he could have still been alive, Like
stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
You just keep going over and over in your head.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
You can but at this, if only, if only, At
the same time, though, it's like I've learned this year
and specifically, like people are struggling with things very they're
very good but keeping it behind closed doors and keeping
it to themselves. And at the end of the day,
if that's what they wanted to do, like you can
give them all the assets they want to try to
help them. But if somebody has made up their mind
(08:55):
that they've made up their mind that you can't always
you can't always prevent. So like you could say, well,
what if the nurse went in, what if?
Speaker 3 (09:02):
What if? What if? Like, yeah, but it happened. I
disagree with that though.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
If you're in a place that treats patients with that
that died by suicide, you know all of the different
things that they do.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
I mean, if you put them.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
In a white room with with minimal clothing on and
stuff that there's no sheets that they could that they
could hang with or anything like there's no belt, there's
no window, they could jump out of there's I mean,
no for sure, but the only thing they could do
is sit there and hold their breath, or there's no
sharp objects in the room and stuff like if a
(09:37):
person is like going in and saying I'm going to
kill myself and you're supposed to be stopping that from happening,
it's just unacceptable that it happened, regardless of how bad
he wanted.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
No, for sure, I'm saying more with the checking, Like,
I think the bigger problem here is like how did
you how did they not realize he had a belt?
I mean, come on, that is It's not like he
got creative with something in the room and did it like.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
It's a it's listen again the protocol I one hundred
percent can guarantee that a small portion of this has
to do with the fact that he's a celebrity. I like,
I mean, I just you know, submitted my first draft
of my Celebrity death book. It's just like, there's all
of these situations that happened that I think that people
(10:21):
that work in the hospital get starstrucked and.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
They just act like idiots. Like that's all I could say.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
They just you know, they think that sometimes a celebrity
is like a superior being and oh yeah you could
have that or whatever, you know, just like blowing off
little things here and there, and that's where it landed us.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yeah, it's just it's ridiculous. I think they have a
good I think they have a lawsuit on their hands
because they clearly violated protocol. It's not like he went
in there and got creative or something like that. You
can see three violations off the top, like letting him
have the belt, having the roll away table, whether that
played a role or not, because it just shouldn't be
in there for other people's cases, and then just not
(11:01):
checking on him as often as they should have. So like, yeah,
they have a lawsuit because they violated all their standard
protocol and it was not a safe environment for him.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Yeah, all right.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
A three year old girl has died after she got
her head stuck in a kitchen placet and became unresponsive.
I am like, based on this picture, I'm having a
very hard time understanding where her head got stuck.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Well, the story is just like a lot deeper than
this too, because apparently this mom dropped her kids off
to a babysitter's house and then the babysitter went out,
and the babysitter's husband was in charge of watching the children,
and he was upstairs the whole time and periodically checking
(11:46):
on the children to give them snacks and to make
sure they were okay.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
The child that died was.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Only three, So right there, we know that a three
year old should never be unattended. The child's sibling. We
don't know how old the child's sibling was, and the
child's sibling was old enough to tell police that their
sister had gone into put their head into this thing
looking for toys that were stuck or or whatever the
(12:13):
kid was doing in there. That's like a normal thing.
Whenever you think of these places at kitchens, there's like
the cabinets that open that are kind of like the
oven portion of the kitchen, right, and little kids are
always trying to climb in those holes. Like that's a
normal thing. So, but that doesn't mean anything. I mean,
regardless if the kid was four enable to talk, or
(12:37):
the kid was eight.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
And able to talk.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
I mean, like, with the exception of the kid being
a teenager and able to watch a three year old,
the three year old should have never been left unattended
for when the caregiver was on another floor. So that's
what caused this child's death. I wouldn't say it was
this particular thing. So they find in this place that kitchen,
(13:02):
and the police obviously are asking them, like, where did
you get this? It looks like it looks kind of old.
It looks like it might be from another country, or
it's just an older model, it.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Might be homemade. But I just don't think that's what
the problem is.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Because they were trying to look for for a brand
name to see if it was recalled or this or that,
because they did get it off the marketplace, And honestly,
that is a concern that we could even talk about.
It's just people buying baby stuff off of the marketplace
or place is like once upon a Child or something
like that, because things do get recalled a well, I
(13:40):
don't think.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
I think from what I've heard that Once upon a
Child's actually pretty strict. They don't sell things at.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yeah, they have, they like go on some kind of
website and figure out if things are up to date.
So don't yes one in general, like when you when
I just got you this wing, I just got you
the swing that was from one of these websites that
does like refurbished.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
I don't know if it's.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Whatever it was or out of the box or whatever
it was. It just like wasn't from Target, let's say. So,
it's just like you constantly have to like make sure
that what you're buying is a current item that has
not been recalled. A lot of people don't realize that,
you know, especially because car seats cost so much, and
sometimes maybe a grandparent might say, hey, I want to
(14:27):
go on Facebook marketplace and buy a car seat, so
I have one in my car for my grandchild, but
they don't know that that car seat might have been
in a car accident. And once a car seat is
in a car accident, it should be thrown in the
trash immediately. A lot of people just don't know that.
Or sometimes people put it out to their curb and
then a person picks it up off the curb and
(14:47):
doesn't realize that it's been in a car accident, which
is why they recommend you cut the straps before you
put it out to the curb, just to kind of
alert people like, hey, don't take this it it can't
be used. So whatever the case is, and especially because
it was the babysitter's house. That's exactly what happened. The
babysitter was probably like, let me get some toys for
the kid here. I'll get it real cheap off of
(15:09):
the marketplace. But the real problem was that somebody wasn't
watching the kid.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Well, yeah, but I'm saying regardless, obviously the fact that
the kid wasn't being watched led to the child's death.
But I'm still having a hard time understanding how the
place had caused the child's death. I'm looking at this thing,
and it's just to describe it for you, guys. It's
like a small little countertop with a little sink, a
fake sink on the top of it, which doesn't look
like a kid's head could get stuck in. And then
there's two cabinets on the bottom, which also don't look
(15:35):
like a kid's head could get stuck in. This episode
is brought to you by the Grosser Room.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Guys, as we were talking about in this week's high
profile death dissection, we talk about Uncle Eddie. Anyone from Philly,
at least of my age or older, will definitely remember
about this guy, Eddie Savitz. I'm just going to read
you a quote from our post and then hopefully it
(16:09):
will intrigue you to want to read it. He's a
Philadelphia legend, all right. By the mid seventies, rumors started
going around that young men, mostly teens, could make some
quick cash if they visited a man named Uncle Eddie.
According to local lore, ed would pay boys in cash,
concert tickets and or football tickets in exchange for their
(16:32):
dirty underwear and even their feces. Reportedly, he told the
boys to eat cheese so the feces would taste better
and keep their poop in pizza boxes. So, yeah, that's
what we're talking about right now, and that really happened,
and it actually got way worse than that. I saw
one of our members was just like I never heard, Yeah,
(16:57):
exactly right, Like I think I would have been better
off not reading about that. Thanks if Youneral of Friday
this week was really interesting. We were talking about viewing
people who die in your life that are decomposed and
some of the limitations that there are with that, and
just really crazy picture of a person that was severely
(17:20):
decomposed and had an open casket and looks surprisingly really good.
I don't know how they controlled the smell, but that's
a whole other topic. We have YouTube live and our
book club is live now right, so we have listed
our first book that we're going to do for book
club this month, and I think the most popular post
(17:43):
this week is called skull Soup, and that's what happens.
I think a lot of people were shocked what happens
when you decompose and what happens to your brain? And
I mean you could go from the title what you
think it might look like, but it's really disturbing some people.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
So check that out.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Head over to the grosser room dot com now to
sign up.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Well, the cabinet doors aren't open, so you don't know
what's on the inside. And the child's head got stuck,
but the cause of death was positional as fixid, which
means that the child's head was stuck and the child
was not able to pull their head back out. But
the real cause of death was because of a chest
or a neck compression that caused them to stop having
(18:26):
oxygen exchange, So it wasn't the death wasn't caused by
the actual head like a trauma to the head. It
was caused by the position that the child was not
able to get out of. Once their head got stuck.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
Yeah, I understand it. I'm just having a hard time
visualizing it. But obviously like this they said they're still
investigating it, So I wonder if negligence charges are going
to come forward or if they're going to play this
off as a pure freak accident.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Because it's likely like when that oven part door opened.
Because the doors aren't open, so we don't know what
the inside looks like, it's likely that there's some kind
of on the inside to maybe store toys when the
kids aren't playing with them, and maybe the kids had
got like lodged underneath of one of those shelves in there,
and they were twisted up in there not able to
get out. I mean, the whole thing is weird because
(19:15):
like if that would take some time to happen, that
wouldn't be an instantaneous death. So if the other child
was sitting there and was able to tell police like, yeah,
my sibling was in there and got stuck because she
was trying to get something out, like she just sat
there and watched the kid die, essentially, I mean you
(19:38):
could think like it's probably it's probably like another really
little kid that's four years old or something, or five.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
That's just like, yeah, they don't know what's going on too, and.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
We don't know if maybe there was a a you know,
the kid stopped moving and then the other child did
call the adult upstairs and say, like, something's wrong, and
that's why he came back down. Like I don't I
don't know exactly like what the interval was for that
and how long it took them to find the kid.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
I think to it must be hard for the parents
because you think you're leaving your kid under the supervision
of somebody that you know in trust, not their spouse.
Maybe they did no intrust their spouse, but that's not
the way the articles are being written. Is that it
wasn't supposed to be going down like that, And to
think your kid lost their life under the supervision of
somebody you might not even know is terrible.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Uh yeah, it is. It really is. And you like
you could just you could.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
It's really unfortunate because you could just see how it
could kind of happen, you know, I mean, you don't know.
They're saying it's the babysitter. The babysitter might be eighty
years old and her husband might be eighty years old. Too,
and she might have had to like run out to
a doctor's appointment and like there's this old guy that
doesn't know what to do with kids, and she's like,
I have to leave right.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
Now, you know.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Like yeah, I mean like it's it's it sucks and
it's not cool, but like it it could it could
be something that's not just like straight up intentional like
loser negligence stuff for sure.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
All Right, gooner assaults are on the rise at dollar
trees around the country. So first of all, let's get
into the word gooner. So I look this up because
I'm like, I've heard this term before. I know we've
covered cases like this, but I just need the exact definition. So,
according to Google, the word gooner has two very different meanings.
Depending on the context. It either refers to a loyal
(21:27):
fan of the English soccer team Arsenal, or it is
an explicit Internet slang for someone who engages in prolonged,
obsessive sexual arousal. I think these soccer fans need to
change their fan club name because I don't think you
want to be associated with guys that jerk off and
ejaculate a women in public.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Well, I don't know that the term gooner means that
all people who are gooners do that. That's not like
the definition is what you just said. It's like pro longed,
it's it's almost But do you.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Want to be associated with that as a fan of
a soccer club?
Speaker 3 (22:06):
That's the point I'm trying to make.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
But like, I think people who are considered gooners, though,
are not always like doing this like sexual deviant behavior
and committing crimes. It's it's just like it's people who
just like like to jerk off a lot and watch
porn or but like percessive about It's not just yeah,
(22:29):
but that's that's not a crime.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
So it's not. But still do you want to be
associated with that in terms of soccer?
Speaker 3 (22:35):
I you wouldn't with soccer absolutely.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
So this article is actually awful because it's meaning. It's
very well written, but just the details they describe are
show awful. So it discusses a woman who was at
a Dollar Tree buying decorations for a photo shoot for
her pet business. She said, this guy kept getting close
to her and she was like, get away from me,
freaking like it just kept moving around the store and
then she was waiting in line. He was once again
(22:58):
standing really close to her. Finally, she leaves the store
and it's cold outside and she feels something. I guess
when the wind hit the back of her leggings, it
realized it was seemen. Like this guy ejaculated on her.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I'm sorry, this is like the like one of the
worst things that could happen. I mean, even though it's
like in theory, it's it's it's like nothing. Really, she's
not physically her No, this is a form of sexual assault,
for sure.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
No, it is.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
It is.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
It's just so disturbing and disgusting.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Like so, she said, I didn't know how to react.
I wanted to kill this man, and I'd have to agree.
How could you not want to end somebody's life that's
just ejaculated on new in public. I mean, this is
this is so violating on so many levels.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
I can't imagine if something like this happened to me.
I just really I can't.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
I can't either, because.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
I don't think I'd be able to control myself in
this situation, and then especially like coming home and telling
my husband. I don't know how I would control that either.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
I don't know either.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
It's it's just like.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
It's just so it's so gross, and I guess, I
guess one of the points that we should make with
this is that there's been multiple reports of assaults like
this in dollar trees, and these men are recording it
and posting it to porn sites because people are like
getting off on this stuff. So not only that, like
(24:23):
I don't want to be in a porn video either
that I didn't consent to being.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
Like like, look's like that secretly recorded porn we were
talking about. Yeah, I don't. I don't even understand how
that's a lot. I mean, it must violate terms to
some capacity, and maybe it's like unless you get caught,
it doesn't get taken down. Because they're saying some people
are uploading it to OnlyFans, some are uploading them to
like more shady amateur porn sites or like dark web
(24:51):
stuff from Ember when Lillian googled what is the dark web?
Speaker 3 (24:54):
Never forget that.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Well, so remember we had that case of that fire
fighter last year that was oh yes, at the firehouse
and doing shit like that and posting it on only fans.
It's so it's so like gross and invasive to do
stuff like that. Remember, he was like sticking people's like
chapsticks in his asshole and.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
Stuff that was off.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Dude, it's so disgusting and disturbing and like peeing in
the food and and everything. But it is like a
whole whatever you call subreddit of stuff and there. I
guess it doesn't get blocked on porn websites too, because
there are a lot of people that kind of like
reenact those videos for sure, so like it's not really happening,
(25:42):
So how could you prove that it was really happening
versus not really happening kind of a thing. But still
like so so like what happened in that case?
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Did she?
Speaker 1 (25:54):
So she went She ended up going back to the
store and told and she I guess the people working
there didn't realize she spoke Spanish and the one employee
yelled in Spanish to another. We got another one, meaning
that they were aware this had been happening there. So
(26:15):
as of when this article is posted, like she's found
no justice, Like they have no idea the guy that
did this to her. I believe she filed a lawsuit
against Dollar Tree, but I have to say that's kind
of a stretch, because like what is dollar tree gonna do.
I understand they have a lack of security and everything,
but I was thinking about this writing the notes, Like,
even if this happened at Target and they have a
(26:36):
security guard right by the front door and you screamed,
that guy just ejaculated on me, I understand they'll get him,
but like, it's still happened to you, Like you can't
have a security guard prevented from happening.
Speaker 3 (26:48):
And she had already left. She had already left the store.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
Yeah, so she left and went home. So like what
I'm getting at is I think she should totally tell
them it happened and file her police report, try to
go after the guy, but I think suing dollar she's
kind of stretched. But this is actually pretty involved. So
like you're saying, this is like a whole pocket of
the internet, they say master beating in public and ejaculating
(27:14):
of random women, known as tagging or sharking, or even
come sharking. Online forums praise perpetrators for being quote low
in ambition, and users contributing to the discussion said they
wish they could summon the same fearlessness in themselves. So
it's often tied to the inceell movement, but also not
exclusive to them. So what really bothered me is it
(27:36):
said some victims were out shopping with their young children.
One perpetrator was a freshly hired sheriff's deputy and another
was a Dollar Tree employee. So to think somebody's working
there and doing this is even more disgusting.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
So this term, you are.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Not even gonna believe this.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
They said.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
One guy was caught on video he was in a
drive through at a coffee shop. I'm gonna say, like
a Starbucks, a duncan something like that, doing it in
his car to the woman, Like he was jerking off
while the woman serving him through the windows could see him. Right,
So they share a video of this guy and he
ends up killing himself, saying he couldn't face his family.
(28:17):
So then other gooners went to the coffee shop and
throw a protest, saying he was publicly shamed, and then
they called the event a gooneral.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
Oh my god, what the fuck is going on in
the world?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
You show your face in public in defense of a
public masturbator.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
I just can't believe this.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Everything is so backwards. Like if you told me this
story even in twenty eighteen, I would have said that
didn't happen. I would just be like, there's absolutely no
way that this is getting reversed to be like the
fault of the victim.
Speaker 3 (28:59):
And now it's like it's just so.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Christ I couldn't. I I was so horrified by this story.
And then I got to the word goonirl and I
was just sitting there. I mean, I'm deliriously tired in
the newborn trend of stuff. I was literally laughing to
myself for five minutes.
Speaker 3 (29:17):
I not this term goonerl.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
I think we know with the title of this episode, obviously,
what is a gooneral?
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Anyway? You know what's funny?
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Yesterday when I was doing Monday's Morbid Minute, I was,
you know, I do that by myself at like and
I did it at it like eleven o'clock at night, right,
I was by myself. Everybody was like upstairs asleep whatever,
And I'm reading this story that I had written up
about this woman that was naked and stealing the ambulance,
(29:58):
and I just like, wait, actually, I'm gonna pull it
up right now because I just I just want, like
I want to read the exact line that I just
I just like completely lost it. I don't know why,
you know, when you get like the giggles, and then
I started thinking about you. But I was in the
middle of recording and I didn't want there to be
(30:19):
any edits, so I just kept like trying to keep
my shit together, so I wasn't laughing, but I feel
like it was like, all right, so this, this is
what really threw me off. So it was like police
first located her around two am. But when an officer
approached her, now remember that she's naked and driving an ambulance.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
Okay, it says she asked, are you following me? Or
am I following you? Like I don't know why.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
That shit just like made me like fall over the edge,
like and and and you could probably hear my voice
cracking because I was trying so hard not to laugh,
but and like I was crying, like my tears coming
out of my eyes because I was holding it in
so much.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
It was just so off.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
Last I mean, we've had incidents on here where we've
laughed pretty hard and we've had to edit it out
because we're laughing for like five minutes. But the last
time I remember is when you were talking about Jonathan Taylor.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
Tops and you called him Jonnifer.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
I don't know why he's so irrelevant in my life
and his name comes up so often when I'm talking
to people, you always think about Jonnifer. It's so dum
oh my god, I'm crying.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well now you've got gooner role. I can't listen. And
why why? Like I why Dollar Tree?
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Though, Like, well this isn't really good for so like
we go to Dollar Tree we get stuff for parties
and sometimes I just like to go there and buy snacks.
And I'm like, I'm not going there any time soon.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
If this is happening.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
It's kind of got like a gross vibe there, like
there is like a you know, yesterday I went to
five Below because the kids wanted to look for some
school solies and.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
It's just got I guess the lighting there is better.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
I mean, it's still kind of the same vibe of
a store. They have a little bit of better quality
stuff because it's like five dollars instead of one dollar
or whatever, but like it just feels a little bit
more like comfortable, but it's kind of the same kind
of store. Like why is it not happening there?
Speaker 1 (32:19):
I don't know, And like I don't while I don't
think they should be sued for it happening. I think
they kind of have a pr crisis on their hands
and they need to get this under control.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
Like I feel like Dollar Tree has good stuff sometimes
I have great stuff they like a lot of times,
and I like that there's all of these social media
accounts of people buying stuff there and like making cool
crafts and stuff out of them or whatever. But but
like the school, like I'm I kind of just the
way that the one is near my house anyway, there's
(32:50):
actually two near my house.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
One isn't awful, but.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Even the one that's like in a better area is
still kind of awful. Like like I would I one
hundred percent and could picture it happening at either of
those locations, just because it's There's just like there's something
about the store that just like gives me like a vibe,
you know.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
Yeah, I mean they do need to get this under control,
because like I go there frequently, and I don't want
to go there anymore if this is a potential not
that this couldn't happen anywhere, but.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
You don't want to get gooned on. Well yeah, and
that's the thing, like I don't think that this is
a lawsuit worthy for Dollar Tree. I am curious if
they have, because I do think that they probably have
security cameras in the parking lot, and I wonder if
they're able to pinpoint it to that guy, see him
going to his car, look at his license plate number,
and things like that, because for our Dollar Tree, like
(33:41):
the way the cars park, you would be able to
see the license plates, but sometimes if it was a
sideways parking spot, you might not depending on the angle
of the camera.
Speaker 1 (33:50):
Didn't we cover the incident that happened at the Philly
Dollar Tree on YouTube Live where the lady took a
video of the guy running out of the store and.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Said he nutted on my leg.
Speaker 1 (34:01):
I feel like we had that on YouTube Live.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Oh yeah we did, so it was oh yeah, because
it did it? Had it did happen?
Speaker 1 (34:07):
I'm pretty sure this was like part of this whole thing,
but it's becoming a serious problem.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
I guess the yeah, I mean the thing is is
that I mean, maybe she's saying because when she went
into the Dollar Tree, she said something to the employees
and they had said it happened before, So maybe she's saying, like,
you know, people that come to the store should know
that that's happening.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
Are you going to do? It could happen in two seconds, yeah,
and it could happen any It could happen.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
In the stores. Like what did How are they possibly
going to control this? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Like what are they gonna you know how?
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Like all of these stores like put up signs that
the employees right with like marker and tape it on
the wall, Like what are they going to do that
you might heade on your leg?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
Like I don't what are they possibly good to do?
Like seriously, oh god, that is it's so disgusting.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
We live in the most disturbing time ever right now
thinking about this. And then it's not even like a
one off thing. It's like a whole network of men
talking about how amazing it is and how they're like
jealous of each other and throwing each other goonerols in defense.
Can you imagine these men showing up and showing their
faces in defense of a public masturbader.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
Plus, like any guy that's doing this is like not
hot even a little bit, right, They're all like losories,
Like you don't know that that just makes it even
more gross, right, Like it's no, I do know that
I doubt that there's any person that's that's anywhere near attractive.
I mean, listen, mentally, you are physically doing stuff like this.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Predators are always on my mind because that's the way
I live, since you let me watch To Catch Your
Predator when I was young. Speaking of I'm very excited
for that movie coming out soon with Robert Pattinson. But
also because over the weekend, we were hanging out with
some friends by the pool and we were just talking
about crazy stuff and then that guy we wrote about
in the Gross Room, Ed Savats, came up, and it
was just funny because everybody was like, oh, yeah, our
(36:10):
guy friends. Sometimes you bet our boyfriends would go to
this guy and poop in a pizza box and he
would pay them. And then I was provided of the
Swiss cheese perpt, which I feel like we're gonna have
to cover as a part two to Ed Savots because
that also happened in Philly. Yeah, there are just terrible
things happening, especially in Philadelphia. I don't know, all right,
(36:33):
a father used his daughter's TikTok to lure her rapist
to the family's home and shot him.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
So this is really an interesting story because it has
multiple layers. So first, it seems that this mother was
looking at her child's phone, who is eleven, which I
would argue with an eleven year old shitn't even have
a phone to begin with. Is looking at the child's
phone and see his videos on the phone of her
(37:00):
child getting raped by an adult. So her father somehow
figures out who the guy is, goes on the daughter's
TikTok account, sees they've been talking on TikTok, pretends he's
the daughter, lures the guy to the house, pretending to
(37:21):
be the eleven year old. The guy shows up at
the house, he's twenty years old by the way, twenty,
and he confronts him and one thing, I guess he
said that he was just going to confront him, but
like something, one thing led to another and he ended.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
Up weapon out so that he ended up shooting him.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
So he ended up shooting him. Right now, in my opinion,
the father's one hundred percent justified for this. I also
think that like the parents are kind of responsible for
this at the same time, because like I know, I
get yelled at for victim blaming all the time, but like, sorry,
don't have your kids on TikTok and have a phone
and have them like this never would have happened if
the kid wasn't on TikTok at least in this particular situation.
Speaker 3 (38:04):
So so like, but still it did happen.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
So now the father reacts and shoots the guy, which
I would I would too, right, Like, that's that's what
I would do, And this is what happened. Like he's
in a lot of trouble. Now the dad is in
a lot of trouble. The guy, actually, the guy that
he shot, was found guilty of doing this and got
(38:29):
arrested for doing this. He was charged with two counts
of rape and one count of obstruction obstructing official business.
So like, the police looked at these videos and was like, yes,
he is raping a child. So the father was one
hundred percent right. He caught the right guy. He he
he just took he was doing like a vigilante thing
(38:50):
which is not allowed, and he might be going to
jail for up to eighteen years.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
Okay, So that's interesting because I didn't see that the
dad was getting in trouble. So it's interesting, you said,
because I was to bring up like, why is that
other mother going to they're facing murder charges for shooting
that guy that was hiding under her teenage daughter's bed,
and then this guy might not be getting introable.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
He got charged with felony assault, and then prosecutors added
an additional charge of having a weapon while under disability.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
So I guess I don't know exactly.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
No, it's not, it's not. It's not that I think
that he was told he was not allowed to have
a weapon because he had a previous robbery attempt or conviction. Actually,
so he was not allowed to possess a firearm. So
I guess they're like they disabled his ability to have
a firearm, so he had a firearm when he shouldn't
(39:45):
have had one, and then he took the law on
his own hands, which like, okay, fine, but like who cares,
Just like be a normal person and brush that under
the rug. In this case, Seriously, this guy twenty years
old having sex with an eleven year old and like
the kid's eleven, Like Lucia is eleven.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
That's fucking n But.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
Then think about Celeste Reevas and David I do, and
that's also disgusting. It's just like this is like people
don't understand, like when your kids are on like social
media like that, they just they find people, and like
that girl doesn't know she's eleven. She just doesn't know.
And the fact that they were even allowed to meet
(40:26):
up is just it's just so I don't even understand
how that happened and where the sex happened. But apparently
the guy. I don't know if the guy knew where
the house was or the dad was like, here's my address,
but like had absolutely no problem having sex with an
eleven year old trying to do it again.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
At the same time, we know that like sex predators
barely go to jail, so this guy's gonna probably get
out in the next like five to ten years. And
then let's say that dad might be facing a longer
sentence for shooting him, and then they have now the
predator has your address to go seek revenge on you.
Oh h.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
I actually would guarantee that in this case that even
though this guy was like on video having sex with like,
it wasn't even you know how there's like sometimes lesser
charges if the kid's like sixteen or seventeen versus yeah,
like eleven is like really young. I feel like you
(41:23):
could almost guarantee that if they pull all these charges
on this guy. I just can't imagine, honestly, if this
guy ends up going to trial to say what he did,
I can't imagine draw ours being like, yeah, you know what,
he should go to jail for eighteen years for this.
Speaker 3 (41:39):
Like, I can't imagine one of them would even would
even give him anything. I just can't. Regardless if he
was breaking.
Speaker 1 (41:45):
There's always one so ridiculous. All right, gen Z says,
smoking's back. How do you feel about it?
Speaker 3 (41:52):
I feel vindicated.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
I think I argue before that smoking never went out
because I worked the rest I'm smoking at every day
and everybody always smoked, so like I've always been around
it smoking.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
Like statistically, smoking is still out. It's still way way
lower than it has been in the past. So it
definitely went out, but it was it was frowned upon
for a while, and people were not doing it in
public or hiding it, and it wasn't glamorized as to
what I said in when we were talking about the
(42:29):
Kylie Jenny Jenner photo shoot, and now we're just talking
like you've just been seeing an increase of it in
every single magazine it's just like cool again.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
And I feel like this video was trying to say
it started with Sean Penn chain ripping cigarettes at the
Golden Globes, and of like, first of all, why would
we pinpointed to that specific event.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Especially Sean Penn is one that never stopped smoking, probably
and he isn't he like an extra chain smoker. I
feel like we've talked about this before that he smokes
like two or three packs a day or something and
just like doesn't give Yeah, so like and also like
he's old, right, he was cool in the eighties as
(43:12):
far as like people like looking up to and admiring him, right,
Like we're talking about what is gen z that's like
below you? Right?
Speaker 3 (43:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Well, I think what they're trying to argue is that
so they said in twenty twenty three, there was a
seventy percent increase of tobacco, you said, shown in films.
So they're trying to cite, you know, all these kids
going back and watching older shows like mad Men and
Sopranos where everybody's just smoking all of the time. But
then they're also saying that newer shows like Love Story
(43:42):
and shows showing the nineties culture. So in general, I
feel for gen Z nineties culture as a whole, fashion, etiquette, smoking,
everything is coming back, so that's just wrapped into that.
So then when they're showing like Carolyn Bissett chain smoking
cigarettes and love story, it's just adding to that cool
factor of it. And they're calling it a drunk sig,
(44:02):
so they say they always have drunk SIGs with a
cocktail or something. But other people are arguing, like this
professor that was interviewed said, instead of her kids going
out and running and getting a coffee or something in
the middle of a break, they all go outside and
chain smoke cigarettes. But I want to say that was
a person I believe that was working at Parsons, which
is like school of design. I went to art school
(44:23):
and so many people smoked there, So.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Yeah, and I feel like it.
Speaker 2 (44:27):
It's like people who work at bars and artists and stuff,
like lots of tattooers and stuff like that do that.
I mean, this is what I think happened personally. I
think that, you know, the anti tobacco campaign started working
because a lot of information was exposed from the big
tobacco companies that they were hiding all of this information
(44:47):
as far as like how bad cigarettes actually were, not
just for cancer, but for all other sorts of pathological
processes that you know, your your blood vessels just all
sort in multiple organs, it's COPD things like that. So
this huge campaign went out and then people really started it.
(45:09):
I feel like it worked because people were that were
my age and teenagers were seeing their grandparents die of it,
like people who smoked their whole life. You also, but
there was also always people that smoked their whole life
that were totally fine. So like I always said that
the tobacco thing is not just tobacco, but it's tobacco
and genetics as well. So but a lot the smoking
(45:31):
declined big time, and then big Tobacco started losing money,
so they were like, how are we gonna pull kids
in again. Oh, let's start introducing these vape things and
we're gonna say that they're safer than cigarettes.
Speaker 3 (45:41):
And this and that.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
So then you get a whole new generation of kids
like addicted to nicotine in a different kind of way.
But like, smoking a vappen is kind of corny looking
like you like, if you want to look cool, like
you smoke a cigarette like a vape like, and people
are probably just like who cares, what's the difference, because
like I I personally don't think that there's any difference
(46:03):
between the two. They're equally as harmful. There's other things
that have happened over the past couple of years that
we could say. So I like that you cited that
article in twenty twenty three that there was like a
seventy percent increase in cigarette use in movies and stuff,
because like that goes along exactly what I was saying that,
like it's increasing, Yeah, as far as that goes.
Speaker 1 (46:27):
I also said that recent steties have shown that ninety
percent of social posts by tobacco companies are violating the
federal regulations for youth marketing, So like that's obviously a problem,
and then why are they not being checked?
Speaker 2 (46:49):
Well, I don't know, but like I don't know what
the rules are now, because there a lot of rules
went down because of like remember with like Joe Camel
and all that stuff that you can't show this, you
can't show that. So but they get around it because
there's loopholes in everything in life, right, So I think
that the biggest increase is the vapes people are smoking
(47:14):
weed now, So like just the smoking could lead to
smoking because weed's like so huge now people vape weed,
people might vape tobacco. People might just decide to smoke
weed out of a joint. People might decide to smoke
a cigarette because they're used to smoking when more people
are smoking weed than ever have. Right, the biggest thing
(47:38):
is is that people don't trust what they're told from
the government. So like there's skepticism about COVID, the whole
response to that vaccine stuff like that, So people are
just like, well, why should we trust that they're telling
us the truth about anything, which is going to be
a huge problem for public health. And then finally, like
(47:58):
we were talking about this weekend, like people are just
like I don't give a fuck about anything anymore, Like
shit's really bad and I just don't care.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
Yeah, that is a huge component of it, for sure. Yeah,
so it is very interesting to think about. I don't know,
it's just crazy how certain things will skip like a
whole generation. I certainly know millennials that smoke, but definitely
not as much.
Speaker 3 (48:21):
But seeing that.
Speaker 1 (48:24):
All these younger kids literally having the total wealth of
knowledge we have on how bad this is and choosing
to do it anyway, is kind of shocking.
Speaker 3 (48:32):
Yeah, exactly, all right.
Speaker 1 (48:33):
Onto your questions and emails. If you have stories or
questions for us, please submit them to stories at mothernosdeath
dot com. First, it's from Amanda. Doctor Kumar, who is
the doctor who reused the medical equipment that we talked
about last week, is a creep. I looked up his
federal court documents. Basically he was performing unnecessary procedures on
women and documenting symptoms they didn't have. Apparently you could
(48:55):
reuse some of the instruments if you get approval and
notified patients. But this guy was so discussing and he
would have them place various devices in the same solution
and only have his staff change the solution every two weeks.
Speaker 3 (49:07):
Oh that's so great.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
It is disgusting, and like you really shouldn't be allowed
to reuse them even with approval.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
Well, uh, there's definitely tools.
Speaker 2 (49:16):
That get reused all the time, Like in your surgery,
every surgery, there's tools that are reused. There's equipment, autoclaves
that clean things that sterilize them. I mean they can't
they can't get you know, one time used tools for
every single patient, for every procedure. That would just not
be cost effective even a little bit.
Speaker 3 (49:37):
So I mean, like one.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
Time I had one of the nurses come down to
the floor to me when I had a patient for
autopsy because they had left this chest retractor inside of
the patient. And normally, if I would have gotten a
tool like that, I probably would have just like saved
it aside in the morgan until somebody came and got
it if they really wanted it or whatever. But like
(50:02):
I would just put it down there and be like,
I don't know, maybe we could because we always do
have some like Rando surgical tools down there. And then
she was like, no, I gotta take this back. They're
gonna kill me. This thing is thousands of dollars and stuff,
and it's just like it's just like a metal thing.
But like, medical equipment is just really really really expensive,
(50:22):
so if they had to use something like that for
every single patient, it just like wouldn't make any sense.
So they have to They just put it, you know,
and it came from the morgue. It was in a
dead person, and they bring it upstairs and put it
in the autoclave and take it out and then it's fine.
Speaker 3 (50:35):
To use again.
Speaker 1 (50:37):
But like.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
I think, like things that are designated for one time
use are Think about this, Like you ever go to
the to like get takeout, and you get like really
good plastic forks and spoons, not just like the flimsy ones,
but like really good ones, right to the point where
you're like, oh, I could probably rinse these off and
use them again, cause they're like kind of hearty good.
Speaker 3 (51:00):
It's probably more like that. It's not.
Speaker 2 (51:04):
No like this the spoons you get from the even
the spoons you get from the pliable place, they're pretty good.
Like I'm like, oh, you could use these again. They're
not like flimsy shitty spoons, Like you could use them
again if you want to do.
Speaker 3 (51:17):
Like I'm just.
Speaker 2 (51:18):
Saying, like between like think about that compared to the
ones you get for like a party, those white ones
that like if you stick the fork in it like breaks,
you know, like it's real bendy.
Speaker 3 (51:27):
So it's just like it's.
Speaker 2 (51:29):
Probably like a high quality reusable or a one time
use thing, and that's why they're able to use it again,
but like they weren't supposed to, and probably it has
components that can't go into an autocleave, which is why
they're putting it in a solution versus an autoclave.
Speaker 1 (51:45):
They can't change the solution.
Speaker 3 (51:46):
It would now you can't change the solution once.
Speaker 2 (51:50):
It's just gross, Like even if I'm not even sure
that they're I mean, there might be like approved things
or whatever, but like I just wouldn't be okay with it.
And yeah, the two weeks thing is discussed.
Speaker 3 (52:01):
So we clipped that.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
Story for Instagram, and so many people in their comments
were victims of this person and said it's actually so
much worse than the media was portraying.
Speaker 3 (52:10):
Yeah, oh, I'm sure it's just horrible.
Speaker 1 (52:12):
All right, let me switch these next two around because
I feel like the middle one's gonna elicit a longer answer,
so all right. Next to is from Crystal. Last month,
an eight year old boy got legs amputated below the
knee by a vehicle toe strap. The notes said his
parents were towing a vehicle and the child's legs got
stuck in the strap and when they tried to pull
him out, his quote legs fell off completely amputated at
(52:35):
both his knees. That's all the info I know, and
I doubt there will be any coverage on it, but
figured this was you guys, who would be the ones
to find it. I haven't seen anything about this, have you?
Speaker 2 (52:44):
So so I haven't seen anything about this. But the
whole entire time I was reading this, I was like,
I swear to God, we talked about this story before,
Like it just sounded familiar to me. So I'm reading
and I'm like, okay, like this is just by reading
this comment, it's two options to me. Number one, it's
like you're reading some kind of patient notes that you
(53:08):
got this information from. Or you know, sometimes we find
stories that are like on Facebook and they're faith they're
like literally fake. So I guess there's a possibility that
you were reading a post like that that it's just
not real either. But regardless, I didn't find anything like that.
But I seriously spent a half hour of my life
(53:28):
today searching all of my notes because I was like,
we talked about this before, Like you don't remember that.
Speaker 1 (53:35):
I believe this account was from a police report.
Speaker 2 (53:38):
Okay, so back, So this is what I found which
made me think of this, which isn't the same story,
but it's a similar kind of story. In May of
twenty twenty three, there was a six year old girl
that was writing in a pickup truck and they were
playing with a ratchet tie down strap, which is one
of those ones you would use to like stretch down
(54:00):
something on a truck or something, and it was in
the car, attached to something, I guess, and then it
went out the window and it got caught around the
wheel well and it cut her foot like straight off. God,
So that was do you remember we talked about that
back then. That was the case that I was thinking of. So,
so yeah, like amputated like the same kind of thing,
(54:23):
like a rope, like a rope or a strap amputation.
So it's the same mechanism. But as far as the
particular case that you're talking about right now, I'm actually
surprised that that hasn't hit the news. But I mean,
I guess I don't know if people don't want to
report it. It's kind of private health information at that point, right.
Speaker 1 (54:44):
Yeah, And you know, it always reminds me of the
worst accident I ever think of, which is at six
Flags when that cable snapped on that like Superman drop
ride and cut that girl's feet off. Remember, Oh yeah, Yeah,
that was an awful story. Yeah, that is awful, all right.
Last is from Jenna Nicole, I'm interested in knowing your
thoughts on Patrick Clancy as the Lindsay Clancy trial goes on.
(55:06):
I've been following closely, and maybe I'm falling for the
social media nonsense, but he's giving Chris Watts vibes.
Speaker 2 (55:14):
Guys, I really don't know where to go with this case.
I've been following very very closely too, so actually Gandhia
texted me yesterday and asked me what I thought about
it too, because now it's like going viral that everyone
thinks that the husband was now the one that did
(55:36):
this right. Yes, so I guess I'll say exactly what
I said to her, which is like, I still think
at the root cause of it, this has to do
with her having this medical condition and her getting these medications,
and that's really what I believe happened in this case.
(55:58):
But I also can't ignore some parts of the of
the evidence that's being presented, especially if I don't know
if it's true. I guess that's what you're saying because
it's not presented in court a lot of it.
Speaker 1 (56:15):
I think people are misunderstanding things presented in court and
putting them on TikTok inaccurately.
Speaker 2 (56:22):
Which is which is happening for sure? So I think,
like especially just watching the testimony and stuff yesterday from
which this this this is from Monday.
Speaker 1 (56:35):
Yeah, so you're right, we're recording to Yeah, so this
episode comes out tomorrow. So yeah.
Speaker 2 (56:39):
So from all I saw was the testimony with uh
the or the defense UH examining Jennifer Jennifer Toffs I
believe her name is that the the visit one of
the psychiatrists that was prescribing her all these medications, and
like I'm just sitting there and and then like also
seeing all these comments on social media because like I
(57:02):
was a victim of that system, and like all of
these other especially women, are just like the same thing
happened to me, The same thing happened to me, like meds, meds,
meds going crazy, not getting you know, and and like
we know, none of that's getting reported to anybody. These
medications are ruining people's lives, ruining relationships with people, ruining marriages,
(57:24):
that people are losing jobs over this, and none of
that stuff gets reported, and all you hear is the
talking line of they're safe and effective, safe and effective,
and it's like people are just getting tired of that, right,
So that's like one whole component. But then Maria and
I have been talking about since the very beginning, you know,
with the husband and everything. So in one sense, I
(57:48):
feel like, if you believe the story that's presented and
what's what's happening in court right now, you would say, like, Wow,
he really believed that she is this ill and he
feels really terrible for being a part of it and
maybe not doing enough. And it's really cool of him
actually to be testifying at this trial and like supporting
(58:13):
her because she killed his three children essentially and like
really ruined a portion of his life if that's what
actually happened. So it like he doesn't have to be
supportive of her anymore. They're not married, they're not together.
He's married to someone else and apparently expecting another baby.
(58:35):
So Maria and I have been talking about how, you know,
there's there's some parts of it that are a little
bit unusual as far as how he met this this
new woman and everything, and how quickly he got remarried.
(58:56):
So I could go back and forth with that because
we have we have a close friend that died years
ago and and her husband ended up getting with another
woman shortly thereafter, and I always I didn't have a
problem with it because I knew that he was such
a good husband to my friend. And I think that
the death of my friend was so devastating to her
(59:19):
that or to him that he had to like find
someone else right away because he just couldn't live without
having that like other half. Like I never frowned upon
it on him because I just feel like it was
just such a great loss for him. So and you
hear about that, like a lot of times men get
remarried right away, like after they get divorced or after
(59:42):
especially when they're a widow because or a widow or whatever, because.
Speaker 3 (59:47):
They they just.
Speaker 2 (59:50):
Especially with men, right like sometimes a lot of men,
like my husbands used to like me cooking for him
every day and stuff like that, Like sometimes guys just
like need that, you know. So I don't necessarily think
that that is weird. Except this, this isn't a death right,
and this isn't a divorce. This isn't a typical divorce.
(01:00:10):
I am curious as to why, like if they were
married and happy and all this went down, like why
they did get divorced. It's very bizarre that because apparently
they were married and happy when this happened, and then
within days, I mean I did see this in court.
Within days, she had her power of attorney or the
(01:00:32):
person making her medical decisions changed from him to her parents.
And I just think and like, you could look at
it like, Okay, she killed three of his kids. That's
why they're getting divorced. I mean, it could be as
simple as that. But like, I couldn't just turn off
my feelings for Gabe right now. If something tragic happened,
it wouldn't be that cut and dry as far as
(01:00:54):
that goes, especially because it wasn't like especially if he
was sick and it happened because he was sick.
Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
You know.
Speaker 2 (01:01:02):
So there's that portion of it that that makes me think, like, Okay,
that's a little unusual that she had her the power
of attorney changed to her parents. And now you know,
everybody's going with it on social media, but some of
the stuff that people are saying is like legitimately concerned.
I sent one to Maria last night of a woman
who made a video that was showing his LinkedIn right.
Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Yeah, So what I wanted to say in terms of this,
because I've used LinkedIn before, and I don't think you've
ever had to use it for your jobs. So somebody's
pointing out that he accepted a job in New York
City a couple months before the murders, and that it
should it's showing that he worked in New York, right,
(01:01:46):
So Like my thought behind that is like, yeah, totally.
I've heard too that he was looking for an apartment
or something, which I don't know is true because I'm
not following this close issue because it's it's too upsetting
for me being as freshly posed part of Azam. So
let's say he got a job at his company. I
think he worked for Microsoft, right, So I'm trying to
come at it with Devil's advocate, Like, let's say he
(01:02:07):
accepted that position, and then because of all the children's deaths,
he then moved to New York in the same position.
So if he was in that position for a certain
amount of time, it might just say New York City
as the location for the whole stint, even though he
might have worked part of it in Massachusetts and then
part of it in New York. So like, let's just
say that, because you can't put multiple locations on LinkedIn
(01:02:28):
for the same job position. But I've heard also he
accepted that job and was looking for an apartment while
she was dealing with all of this stuff, And many
people like we have a cousin whose husband worked in
New York City while she lived here. You know, like,
that's not.
Speaker 2 (01:02:43):
I think that a lot of people that work, like
big jobs that make a lot of money might have
an apartment that they stay at during the week and
then come home.
Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
So but if your wife is going through all these problems,
maybe it's not ideal to accept a job in another city,
and then it certainly doesn't look good when you then
meet another woman in that city and you get married.
But at the same time, let's say he did take
that job and then after the murders of his kids,
he moved there because he was like, well, all my
(01:03:15):
children are dead and my wife is in jail. I
just want to start fresh. Like, yeah, the timing doesn't
look great. I think it's bizarre that he got married
too quick, But I also think people.
Speaker 3 (01:03:25):
That are grieving do things like that.
Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
So yeah, you could really just look at it both
sides for anything.
Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Yeah, So I mean that there's that stuff there's a
lot of stuff being said about where he was and
emails being sent and this and that.
Speaker 3 (01:03:39):
Like I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
I mean, there's like medical things that I'm actually going
to write a post about it in the gross room
sometime this week, especially in regards to her having the
eighty some degree temperature hypothermia. I have concerns about that.
You talked its Yeah, it relates to another case that happened,
(01:04:06):
you know, in the same state with the Karen Reid trial.
So I've researched that heavily for that trial. So we're
I'll talk about it in this case too this week
in the gross room. But just I don't know, like
I did. I did hear in the trial that she
had a crushed diyroid cartilage. That's still concerning me. I
(01:04:28):
want to know more about like all that I haven't
dug deep into those particular injuries that she got, like
how they think she fell out, how she was found.
There's there's other people who are bringing up a good
point that you know, he went up to her and said,
what did you do? And then she said, I tried
to kill myself And then he said where are the kids?
(01:04:50):
And she said in the basement. But then you know,
the paramedics are being and the first responders are being interviewed,
saying that she couldn't talk. She was like semi conscious,
So how did she talk to him? You know, I
don't know any of that stuff, Like like I would
have to sit there for for like eight hours and
(01:05:11):
go through it, like to give my own opinion on it.
But I am like at this point, I'm open to anything.
And in these particular situations, it would definitely be more
common for the husband to kill to do the murder
than the wife. But we have cases of like Andrea
Yates and who was the other one, like Susan Smith,
(01:05:32):
like people.
Speaker 3 (01:05:32):
Killed their child. Well, I keep it's a thing.
Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
I keep seeing something floating around that It's like nothing's
more dangerous than a man seeking a new life in
reference to him potentially having an affair before this happened,
or looking to take a new job and move to
New York. So if you want to think about that,
like we think about Scott Peterson having an affair and
that awful case, and there's many many others.
Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
But the thing is is that like I understand and
can respect all of those opinions but like when they
do an investigation like this, a lot of people are
just saying like, oh, they just listened to Patrick and
believed him, And I'm like, I don't know that that's true.
I'm sure that they looked extensively into his text messages,
(01:06:12):
his emails, like like maybe all that stuff hasn't come
out yet, but like they would if he was having
some kind of an affair with someone. I'm sure there
would be some kind of evidence of it of twenty
twenty six, that he was having phone calls or conversations
with someone repeatedly, and like it's very hot hard to
(01:06:34):
hide that kind of stuff nowadays, between all of your
social media's and your IP addresses and your Google maps
and everything.
Speaker 1 (01:06:42):
Like well, I've seen criticisms and i don't know if
this is true because I'm not so familiar with the
intimate details of this case that it was kind of
like an Ellen Greenberg situation where they walked in the
scene they thought it was cut and dry, like she
killed them, she tried to kill herself, and it wasn't
very thoroughly investigated as alternative solution. But I don't know
(01:07:02):
if you're trying, but we don't We haven't heard everything
yet though, so we don't know exactly.
Speaker 3 (01:07:07):
So I don't know that for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:07:08):
That's a criticism I'm seeing. But at the same time, like,
are they building this up to drop this giant bomb
that they have so much evidence that the husband did it.
Speaker 3 (01:07:17):
We don't know.
Speaker 1 (01:07:18):
This trial is still going on.
Speaker 3 (01:07:20):
There are certainly.
Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
Things he does that are weird, but also you didn't
play it off as other things like we were talking
about on YouTube live, like when he made the phone call.
Speaker 3 (01:07:29):
He worded it weird.
Speaker 1 (01:07:31):
But I hate to criticize that because I don't speak
correctly ever, so I don't want somebody micromanaging the.
Speaker 3 (01:07:37):
Sentence I said.
Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
I have terrible set in structure.
Speaker 2 (01:07:41):
It's just it's just like listen, if you if you
walked in the house and saw your children dead, you
would you would almost be you wouldn't believe it. You
would be like trying to like shake their body and
be like no, no, no, like I don't know, just
instead of being like she killed the fucking kids, like
(01:08:04):
I understand. But at the same time, he, you know,
everything starts clicking back in his mind because she had
told him that she wanted to hurt them, right so
so it's like it's just everything coming like a full
circle moment and stuff, like it's just a very complex case.
And regardless even regardless if if whatever happened there with
(01:08:27):
who actually killed the children and stuff, It's like it
is very it's really bringing a highlight to the mental
health treatment in this country. And like these people are
I keep saying, they're like the sacrificial lamps that they
had to deal with this horrible tragedy whatever went down
with it, and because they're victims of this of this
(01:08:50):
particular system, which is terrible. When you were listening to
doctor Tuff's testimony at least on Monday, and god knows
what's going to happen after we're recording today and tomorrow too.
Like I'm listening to a person that is just checking boxes.
I don't know that she's necessarily like the asshole here,
because all she's doing is what she was taught and
(01:09:12):
what she was told going down the list of like
this is the first line of defense, then we use
this one, then we use this one. It's like, in
my personal opinion, like if a person has anxiety and
depression like a little bit, they're kind of like I
feel really anxious and stuff.
Speaker 3 (01:09:28):
What do they do?
Speaker 2 (01:09:29):
They go to their family doctor or their doctor gives
them like lexapro or zoloft and they take it and
they're like, Okay, I feel better and that's it. Right,
you don't hear anything else.
Speaker 3 (01:09:38):
They take it. They're on it for five or ten years.
That's like a normal anxiety depression, low grade thing.
Speaker 2 (01:09:44):
Right. You have a woman who is who thought that
it was too bad that she should go to an
actual psychiatrist. She's going to a psychiatrist like every week
to see the actual medical doctor. On top of have
some therapy sessions. It's given the first line of defense.
It doesn't work, the next one, the next one, the
(01:10:06):
next one. Not only is it not working, but now
she's like, I'm still having anxiety. Now I'm not sleeping.
And then add on to it, not sleeping multiple nights
in a row will make you literally crazy as well.
And at one point it's just kind of like, let's
just keep going through this checklist instead of being like, Okay,
this is not normal, like something's up here. It's the
(01:10:30):
same thing if a patient had an upper respiratory infection
and you gave them antibiotics, right, most people. You call
the doctor, You go to the doctor. They say, here,
take this antibiotic. You take it, and it goes away,
and you never hear from them again about that, right
they what if they take it and come back and say,
my nose is still running, I'm still stuffy, I'm still
(01:10:50):
sneezing all the time, i still feel like all this
pressure in my head. Give them another antibiotic doesn't work.
Give them another antibiotic doesn't work. Like the doctor normally
they would be like, we need to work this up.
Something is going on. We need to do a biopsy,
we need to do a scope, We need to further
look into this to figure out exactly what is going
on with this patient, because they're not responding to typical treatment.
(01:11:15):
So when that woman sits there and says, oh, she
had anxiety and depression, it's just kind of like, nah, dude,
she was way beyond that and you missed it.
Speaker 1 (01:11:23):
Yeah, I mean that's really concerning.
Speaker 3 (01:11:25):
And she's she is a nurse, right, so like.
Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
Number one, she knows what happens when you sit there
and say that you feel like killing yourself and you
feel like killing your children. She knows what's gonna happen,
they're gonna take her kids away from her, or they're
going to take her away from her kids. Number Two,
she's a nurse. She's going to sit there and say,
I want to hurt my children and hurt myself. Don't
you think that she's scared to death? She's never gonna
get her job back as a labor and delivery nurse
(01:11:51):
when that's on the permanent record.
Speaker 3 (01:11:53):
Like, you can't. You can't like who.
Speaker 2 (01:11:56):
Says that shit out loud when they're having those thoughts.
It's it's very hard for a person to say that
out loud, especially a normal person, to just admit that
that's all that's it's it's hard to.
Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
Do that for sure, because like, all right, so right now,
like anytime I was going for my postpartum checkups, or
when I even go to the baby's like monthly appointments,
like his checkups, they give you that questionnaire, right, And
I straight up asked my midwife office. I was like,
are people honest on this postpartum depression screening? Because I
just feel like most people would probably lie. And they said,
(01:12:29):
since they started handing out the papers, more people have
been honest than when they're asked face to face. Yeah,
that's interesting, which I think is interesting because I'm like,
I'm sitting there thinking if I was experiencing this, would
I be honest because I don't want a whole thing, right,
Like some people don't want them.
Speaker 3 (01:12:47):
They'll be like, well, what do you mean? What do
you mean?
Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
I feel like I would be honest because I'm so
scared to death, especially when we're covering this.
Speaker 3 (01:12:56):
Well, I have like mouth diarrhea.
Speaker 1 (01:12:59):
Just say everything my mind. So yeah, but yeah, they
said they started doing the papers because they saw that
so many more people were upfront about it, which is
really interesting.
Speaker 3 (01:13:09):
Yeah, it is. So we'll stay up to date on it.
I mean, like I don't know when the trial is
going to be over, we'll like we'll be.
Speaker 2 (01:13:17):
Covered more for sure, and like look in the gross
room too, because I'm going to write about some of
the medical stuff this week, and.
Speaker 1 (01:13:22):
We talk about updates on YouTube Life, so you don't
want to miss it.
Speaker 2 (01:13:26):
Yeah, I mean we did talk about a lot of
this on YouTube Live last week.
Speaker 1 (01:13:29):
All right, guys, please head over to applers, Spotify, leave
us five star review, submit your stories of stories at
mothernowsdeth dot com and don't forget to subscribe to our
YouTube channel.
Speaker 2 (01:13:38):
Thank you for listening to Mother Knows Death. As a reminder,
my training is as a pathologists assistant. I have a
master's level education and specialize in anatomy and pathology education.
I am not a doctor and I have not diagnosed
or treated anyone dead or alive without the assistance of
a licensed medical doctor. This show, my website, and social
(01:14:02):
media accounts are designed to educate and inform people based
on my experience working in pathology, so they can make
healthier decisions regarding their life and well being. Always remember
that science is changing every day and the opinions expressed
in this episode are based on my knowledge of those
subjects at the time of publication. If you are having
(01:14:24):
a medical problem, have a medical question, or having a
medical emergency, please contact your physician or visit an urgent
care center, emergency room.
Speaker 3 (01:14:35):
Or hospital.
Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
Please rate, review, and subscribe to Mother Knows Death on Apple, Spotify, YouTube,
or anywhere you get podcasts.
Speaker 1 (01:14:44):
Thanks
Mother Knows Death starring Nicole and Jemmy and Maria qk.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Hi. Everyone welcome The Mother Knows Death. On today's episode,
we're going to talk about a lawsuit involving actor Robert
Carodine's death. Remember he played Lewis in Revenge of the
Nerds movies. Then we're going to talk about a tragic
freak accident involving a toddler. In crime news, we'll talk
about the rise in gooner assaults at Dollar Tree stores
(00:43):
and a dad who got creative and lured his daughter's
rapist to his house. Then we'll finish up with the
latest trend among gen zers, which is apparently smoking cigarettes
are cool again. I told you, Maria, and that plus
your comments, questions, emails, all that and more on today's episode.
(01:03):
All right, so we did talk about Robert Carodine when
he died. If you guys remember he's seventy one years old,
had bipolar disorder, was not diagnosed until he was fifty
years old, which is unusual because it's most commonly diagnosed
between eighteen and twenty five years old. So he likely
(01:24):
was showing symptoms his entire life, but just didn't get
a formal diagnosis until he was fifty. So there's different
forms of bipolar, but it's usually a mixture of manic
episodes followed by episodes of severe depression. And I guess
you know what we talked about last time is that
(01:46):
when bipolar, people just have a really high increase of
suicides compared to the normal population. So twenty to fifty
percent of people with bipolar have a ten did suicide
at least once in their life, and ten to twenty
percent will die from it. So it's it's a thing.
(02:07):
So so what happened was we reported back in I
forget what it was.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
It was back in February. We reported on the death,
but we didn't have many details. All we knew was
that he died by suicide, but they didn't really reveal
anything else. They did mention the bipolar initially the family,
but so we knew that.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
So so now you know, why don't you say what
this lawsuit is?
Speaker 1 (02:34):
Yeah, so now his family has filed a lawsuit against
UCLA hospital leadership for wrongful death and other abuse. So
they're saying in this lawsuit that he was admitted to
UCLA's locked psychiatric unit and was hopeful it would quote
reduce his anxiety, but they broke two very important protocols
within the unit, which was allowing him to have a
(02:56):
belt and having a rolling bedside table. So because this
slipped through the cracks, he was able to attempt suicide
within nineteen hours of being in the psychiatric unit, and
this eventually led to his death.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Yeah, so imagine the guy was having suicidal thoughts and
admitted himself to a place so he would be safe.
That's what he did. And instead of staying at home
and letting his family watch over him and things like that,
he was like, I'm going to go into a place
where professionals are watching me. And he still died by
(03:33):
suicide there anyway, which is just kind of unbelievable. They
had put mentioned in the lawsuit that they weren't checking
on him as often as they should have been. And
obviously I don't even understand how the table did. They
say how the table played a role in his death.
I mean, if that's a situation with people who were
(03:53):
on suicide watch, I don't even understand why they would
be in the rooms.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Well, I would say the table probably played a part because,
not to be graphic, but this is how I'm assuming
it's going down because we don't have any specifics, but
he might have used the belt to hang himself from
like something on the ceiling and then kick the table away,
you know, so you don't you don't know, but like,
they shouldn't have things like that that people go. People
(04:18):
that are going there are in this mentality of doing
something like this, so they shouldn't have anything like that
in there that they have access to achieve that if
they're trying to actively get help.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
I mean, I think the ceiling method is unlikely just
given a hospital room, it was probably just like Robin
Williams's style with a bathroom door or something like that.
Or I mean, people can do anything. If you want
to do it, you're gonna do.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Definitely bringing up the ceiling method because they specifically noted
this roll away table, which why would that have any
importance if it wasn't used in the attempt.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Yeah, I'm not exactly sure.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
It's like it is really sad for the family because
he was seventy one, which I consider to still be
you know' that's my magic age seventy that I'm like, Okay,
if you made it to seventy, you lived a pretty
decent life, but you should still live past seventy one.
It's still pretty young to die, especially when his body
(05:20):
was relatively healthy and it just was his mind that
needed help. And God, I mean, just so many stories
are coming to light this year focusing on mental health
treatment in this country, and it's really opening a lot
of people's eyes. Between this and the Lindsey Clancy case,
Perez Hilton, like, just within the past couple of months,
(05:43):
You're just like, this needs to be talked about.
Speaker 1 (05:46):
Well, not for nothing, but did we not learn anything
with the Epstein case where they alleged they weren't checking
on him for long periods of time? I mean at
the psychiatric unit. According to this lawsuit, the policy was
they were supposed to be checking on him every fifteen minutes,
but they were letting him go longer periods of time
allowed him to accomplish this. So if he was there
and realized like, oh, they're not checking on me for
one to two hours at a time, people that are
(06:07):
desperate to do something like this are able to figure
out how to get it done.
Speaker 3 (06:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:13):
So, I mean, I'm not like a huge sue everybody person.
We have a lot of cases this week in particular,
that we're going to be talking about that it's totally justified,
I feel like in this particular situation, because he specifically
went to a place that was supposed to be saving
his life. It's just kind of it's kind of outrageous
(06:36):
that it still happened, and they should really, I mean,
they haven't commented yet on it, obviously because it's an
active lawsuit. But the thing is is that and it's
the same we could talk about with the Lindsey Clancy
case and stuff. It's like, there's so many regular people
every day that are victims of these types of things
and it's never talked about, Like just us talking right
(06:58):
now with our very relatively small number of listeners. I'm
sure somebody will send us an email and say, oh,
I know someone that the same thing happened. But they're
just like a regular person that lives in the city
or lives in the burbs, and nobody cares about them.
And the only reason we're talking about this now is
because it's an actor and it's in every newspaper right now.
But like something, something needs to be done because it's
(07:21):
just it's just kind of unacceptable.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
Yeah, So basically they're saying from that suicide attempt, he
never regained consciousness, he suffered, he suffered in an oxic
brain injury, and spent the next five weeks in the
intensive care unit. He never recovered, and then subsequently died
on February twenty third, twenty twenty six.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
So yeah, I mean, and they're like the worst cases ever.
If somebody doesn't die instantaneously and just are on machines
and you're just hoping for a miracle over five like five.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Weeks, it's just that's torture. The whole thing is tortures
because it's upsetting that the attempt happened, and then obviously
it wasn't successful immediately, so then it's like you have
to deal with the trauma of somebody doing it. Then
you have to wait out the five week period hoping
they'll recover and they don't. So like at the end
of the day, it still ended up being successful. But
it's just terrible and unnecessary suffering for all parties.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah, it's it really is. It's just so sad too,
And being from the family's perspective, don't don't you think
if this similar situation happened with us, that we would
constantly be like, oh, if only a nurse went in
five minutes before, he could have still been alive, Like
stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
You just keep going over and over in your head.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
You can but at this, if only, if only, At
the same time, though, it's like I've learned this year
and specifically, like people are struggling with things very they're
very good but keeping it behind closed doors and keeping
it to themselves. And at the end of the day,
if that's what they wanted to do, like you can
give them all the assets they want to try to
help them. But if somebody has made up their mind
(08:55):
that they've made up their mind that you can't always
you can't always prevent. So like you could say, well,
what if the nurse went in, what if?
Speaker 3 (09:02):
What if? What if? Like, yeah, but it happened. I
disagree with that though.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
If you're in a place that treats patients with that
that died by suicide, you know all of the different
things that they do.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
I mean, if you put them.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
In a white room with with minimal clothing on and
stuff that there's no sheets that they could that they
could hang with or anything like there's no belt, there's
no window, they could jump out of there's I mean,
no for sure, but the only thing they could do
is sit there and hold their breath, or there's no
sharp objects in the room and stuff like if a
(09:37):
person is like going in and saying I'm going to
kill myself and you're supposed to be stopping that from happening,
it's just unacceptable that it happened, regardless of how bad
he wanted.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
No, for sure, I'm saying more with the checking, Like,
I think the bigger problem here is like how did
you how did they not realize he had a belt?
I mean, come on, that is It's not like he
got creative with something in the room and did it like.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
It's a it's listen again the protocol I one hundred
percent can guarantee that a small portion of this has
to do with the fact that he's a celebrity. I like,
I mean, I just you know, submitted my first draft
of my Celebrity death book. It's just like, there's all
of these situations that happened that I think that people
(10:21):
that work in the hospital get starstrucked and.
Speaker 3 (10:24):
They just act like idiots. Like that's all I could say.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
They just you know, they think that sometimes a celebrity
is like a superior being and oh yeah you could
have that or whatever, you know, just like blowing off
little things here and there, and that's where it landed us.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yeah, it's just it's ridiculous. I think they have a
good I think they have a lawsuit on their hands
because they clearly violated protocol. It's not like he went
in there and got creative or something like that. You
can see three violations off the top, like letting him
have the belt, having the roll away table, whether that
played a role or not, because it just shouldn't be
in there for other people's cases, and then just not
(11:01):
checking on him as often as they should have. So like, yeah,
they have a lawsuit because they violated all their standard
protocol and it was not a safe environment for him.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Yeah, all right.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
A three year old girl has died after she got
her head stuck in a kitchen placet and became unresponsive.
I am like, based on this picture, I'm having a
very hard time understanding where her head got stuck.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Well, the story is just like a lot deeper than
this too, because apparently this mom dropped her kids off
to a babysitter's house and then the babysitter went out,
and the babysitter's husband was in charge of watching the children,
and he was upstairs the whole time and periodically checking
(11:46):
on the children to give them snacks and to make
sure they were okay.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
The child that died was.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Only three, So right there, we know that a three
year old should never be unattended. The child's sibling. We
don't know how old the child's sibling was, and the
child's sibling was old enough to tell police that their
sister had gone into put their head into this thing
looking for toys that were stuck or or whatever the
(12:13):
kid was doing in there. That's like a normal thing.
Whenever you think of these places at kitchens, there's like
the cabinets that open that are kind of like the
oven portion of the kitchen, right, and little kids are
always trying to climb in those holes. Like that's a
normal thing. So, but that doesn't mean anything. I mean,
regardless if the kid was four enable to talk, or
(12:37):
the kid was eight.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
And able to talk.
Speaker 2 (12:39):
I mean, like, with the exception of the kid being
a teenager and able to watch a three year old,
the three year old should have never been left unattended
for when the caregiver was on another floor. So that's
what caused this child's death. I wouldn't say it was
this particular thing. So they find in this place that kitchen,
(13:02):
and the police obviously are asking them, like, where did
you get this? It looks like it looks kind of old.
It looks like it might be from another country, or
it's just an older model, it.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
Might be homemade. But I just don't think that's what
the problem is.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Because they were trying to look for for a brand
name to see if it was recalled or this or that,
because they did get it off the marketplace, And honestly,
that is a concern that we could even talk about.
It's just people buying baby stuff off of the marketplace
or place is like once upon a Child or something
like that, because things do get recalled a well, I
(13:40):
don't think.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
I think from what I've heard that Once upon a
Child's actually pretty strict. They don't sell things at.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yeah, they have, they like go on some kind of
website and figure out if things are up to date.
So don't yes one in general, like when you when
I just got you this wing, I just got you
the swing that was from one of these websites that
does like refurbished.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
I don't know if it's.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Whatever it was or out of the box or whatever
it was. It just like wasn't from Target, let's say. So,
it's just like you constantly have to like make sure
that what you're buying is a current item that has
not been recalled. A lot of people don't realize that,
you know, especially because car seats cost so much, and
sometimes maybe a grandparent might say, hey, I want to
(14:27):
go on Facebook marketplace and buy a car seat, so
I have one in my car for my grandchild, but
they don't know that that car seat might have been
in a car accident. And once a car seat is
in a car accident, it should be thrown in the
trash immediately. A lot of people just don't know that.
Or sometimes people put it out to their curb and
then a person picks it up off the curb and
(14:47):
doesn't realize that it's been in a car accident, which
is why they recommend you cut the straps before you
put it out to the curb, just to kind of
alert people like, hey, don't take this it it can't
be used. So whatever the case is, and especially because
it was the babysitter's house. That's exactly what happened. The
babysitter was probably like, let me get some toys for
the kid here. I'll get it real cheap off of
(15:09):
the marketplace. But the real problem was that somebody wasn't
watching the kid.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Well, yeah, but I'm saying regardless, obviously the fact that
the kid wasn't being watched led to the child's death.
But I'm still having a hard time understanding how the
place had caused the child's death. I'm looking at this thing,
and it's just to describe it for you, guys. It's
like a small little countertop with a little sink, a
fake sink on the top of it, which doesn't look
like a kid's head could get stuck in. And then
there's two cabinets on the bottom, which also don't look
(15:35):
like a kid's head could get stuck in. This episode
is brought to you by the Grosser Room.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Guys, as we were talking about in this week's high
profile death dissection, we talk about Uncle Eddie. Anyone from Philly,
at least of my age or older, will definitely remember
about this guy, Eddie Savitz. I'm just going to read
you a quote from our post and then hopefully it
(16:09):
will intrigue you to want to read it. He's a
Philadelphia legend, all right. By the mid seventies, rumors started
going around that young men, mostly teens, could make some
quick cash if they visited a man named Uncle Eddie.
According to local lore, ed would pay boys in cash,
concert tickets and or football tickets in exchange for their
(16:32):
dirty underwear and even their feces. Reportedly, he told the
boys to eat cheese so the feces would taste better
and keep their poop in pizza boxes. So, yeah, that's
what we're talking about right now, and that really happened,
and it actually got way worse than that. I saw
one of our members was just like I never heard, Yeah,
(16:57):
exactly right, Like I think I would have been better
off not reading about that. Thanks if Youneral of Friday
this week was really interesting. We were talking about viewing
people who die in your life that are decomposed and
some of the limitations that there are with that, and
just really crazy picture of a person that was severely
(17:20):
decomposed and had an open casket and looks surprisingly really good.
I don't know how they controlled the smell, but that's
a whole other topic. We have YouTube live and our
book club is live now right, so we have listed
our first book that we're going to do for book
club this month, and I think the most popular post
(17:43):
this week is called skull Soup, and that's what happens.
I think a lot of people were shocked what happens
when you decompose and what happens to your brain? And
I mean you could go from the title what you
think it might look like, but it's really disturbing some people.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
So check that out.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Head over to the grosser room dot com now to
sign up.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Well, the cabinet doors aren't open, so you don't know
what's on the inside. And the child's head got stuck,
but the cause of death was positional as fixid, which
means that the child's head was stuck and the child
was not able to pull their head back out. But
the real cause of death was because of a chest
or a neck compression that caused them to stop having
(18:26):
oxygen exchange, So it wasn't the death wasn't caused by
the actual head like a trauma to the head. It
was caused by the position that the child was not
able to get out of. Once their head got stuck.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
Yeah, I understand it. I'm just having a hard time
visualizing it. But obviously like this they said they're still
investigating it, So I wonder if negligence charges are going
to come forward or if they're going to play this
off as a pure freak accident.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Because it's likely like when that oven part door opened.
Because the doors aren't open, so we don't know what
the inside looks like, it's likely that there's some kind
of on the inside to maybe store toys when the
kids aren't playing with them, and maybe the kids had
got like lodged underneath of one of those shelves in there,
and they were twisted up in there not able to
get out. I mean, the whole thing is weird because
(19:15):
like if that would take some time to happen, that
wouldn't be an instantaneous death. So if the other child
was sitting there and was able to tell police like, yeah,
my sibling was in there and got stuck because she
was trying to get something out, like she just sat
there and watched the kid die, essentially, I mean you
(19:38):
could think like it's probably it's probably like another really
little kid that's four years old or something, or five.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
That's just like, yeah, they don't know what's going on too, and.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
We don't know if maybe there was a a you know,
the kid stopped moving and then the other child did
call the adult upstairs and say, like, something's wrong, and
that's why he came back down. Like I don't I
don't know exactly like what the interval was for that
and how long it took them to find the kid.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
I think to it must be hard for the parents
because you think you're leaving your kid under the supervision
of somebody that you know in trust, not their spouse.
Maybe they did no intrust their spouse, but that's not
the way the articles are being written. Is that it
wasn't supposed to be going down like that, And to
think your kid lost their life under the supervision of
somebody you might not even know is terrible.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Uh yeah, it is. It really is. And you like
you could just you could.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
It's really unfortunate because you could just see how it
could kind of happen, you know, I mean, you don't know.
They're saying it's the babysitter. The babysitter might be eighty
years old and her husband might be eighty years old. Too,
and she might have had to like run out to
a doctor's appointment and like there's this old guy that
doesn't know what to do with kids, and she's like,
I have to leave right.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
Now, you know.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Like yeah, I mean like it's it's it sucks and
it's not cool, but like it it could it could
be something that's not just like straight up intentional like
loser negligence stuff for sure.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
All Right, gooner assaults are on the rise at dollar
trees around the country. So first of all, let's get
into the word gooner. So I look this up because
I'm like, I've heard this term before. I know we've
covered cases like this, but I just need the exact definition. So,
according to Google, the word gooner has two very different meanings.
Depending on the context. It either refers to a loyal
(21:27):
fan of the English soccer team Arsenal, or it is
an explicit Internet slang for someone who engages in prolonged,
obsessive sexual arousal. I think these soccer fans need to
change their fan club name because I don't think you
want to be associated with guys that jerk off and
ejaculate a women in public.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Well, I don't know that the term gooner means that
all people who are gooners do that. That's not like
the definition is what you just said. It's like pro longed,
it's it's almost But do you.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Want to be associated with that as a fan of
a soccer club?
Speaker 3 (22:06):
That's the point I'm trying to make.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
But like, I think people who are considered gooners, though,
are not always like doing this like sexual deviant behavior
and committing crimes. It's it's just like it's people who
just like like to jerk off a lot and watch
porn or but like percessive about It's not just yeah,
(22:29):
but that's that's not a crime.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
So it's not. But still do you want to be
associated with that in terms of soccer?
Speaker 3 (22:35):
I you wouldn't with soccer absolutely.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
So this article is actually awful because it's meaning. It's
very well written, but just the details they describe are
show awful. So it discusses a woman who was at
a Dollar Tree buying decorations for a photo shoot for
her pet business. She said, this guy kept getting close
to her and she was like, get away from me,
freaking like it just kept moving around the store and
then she was waiting in line. He was once again
(22:58):
standing really close to her. Finally, she leaves the store
and it's cold outside and she feels something. I guess
when the wind hit the back of her leggings, it
realized it was seemen. Like this guy ejaculated on her.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
I'm sorry, this is like the like one of the
worst things that could happen. I mean, even though it's
like in theory, it's it's it's like nothing. Really, she's
not physically her No, this is a form of sexual assault,
for sure.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
No, it is.
Speaker 1 (23:26):
It is.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
It's just so disturbing and disgusting.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Like so, she said, I didn't know how to react.
I wanted to kill this man, and I'd have to agree.
How could you not want to end somebody's life that's
just ejaculated on new in public. I mean, this is
this is so violating on so many levels.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
I can't imagine if something like this happened to me.
I just really I can't.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
I can't either, because.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
I don't think I'd be able to control myself in
this situation, and then especially like coming home and telling
my husband. I don't know how I would control that either.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
I don't know either.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
It's it's just like.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
It's just so it's so gross, and I guess, I
guess one of the points that we should make with
this is that there's been multiple reports of assaults like
this in dollar trees, and these men are recording it
and posting it to porn sites because people are like
getting off on this stuff. So not only that, like
(24:23):
I don't want to be in a porn video either
that I didn't consent to being.
Speaker 1 (24:30):
Like like, look's like that secretly recorded porn we were
talking about. Yeah, I don't. I don't even understand how
that's a lot. I mean, it must violate terms to
some capacity, and maybe it's like unless you get caught,
it doesn't get taken down. Because they're saying some people
are uploading it to OnlyFans, some are uploading them to
like more shady amateur porn sites or like dark web
(24:51):
stuff from Ember when Lillian googled what is the dark web?
Speaker 3 (24:54):
Never forget that.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Well, so remember we had that case of that fire
fighter last year that was oh yes, at the firehouse
and doing shit like that and posting it on only fans.
It's so it's so like gross and invasive to do
stuff like that. Remember, he was like sticking people's like
chapsticks in his asshole and.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
Stuff that was off.
Speaker 2 (25:16):
Dude, it's so disgusting and disturbing and like peeing in
the food and and everything. But it is like a
whole whatever you call subreddit of stuff and there. I
guess it doesn't get blocked on porn websites too, because
there are a lot of people that kind of like
reenact those videos for sure, so like it's not really happening,
(25:42):
So how could you prove that it was really happening
versus not really happening kind of a thing. But still
like so so like what happened in that case?
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Did she?
Speaker 1 (25:54):
So she went She ended up going back to the
store and told and she I guess the people working
there didn't realize she spoke Spanish and the one employee
yelled in Spanish to another. We got another one, meaning
that they were aware this had been happening there. So
(26:15):
as of when this article is posted, like she's found
no justice, Like they have no idea the guy that
did this to her. I believe she filed a lawsuit
against Dollar Tree, but I have to say that's kind
of a stretch, because like what is dollar tree gonna do.
I understand they have a lack of security and everything,
but I was thinking about this writing the notes, Like,
even if this happened at Target and they have a
(26:36):
security guard right by the front door and you screamed,
that guy just ejaculated on me, I understand they'll get him,
but like, it's still happened to you, Like you can't
have a security guard prevented from happening.
Speaker 3 (26:48):
And she had already left. She had already left the store.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
Yeah, so she left and went home. So like what
I'm getting at is I think she should totally tell
them it happened and file her police report, try to
go after the guy, but I think suing dollar she's
kind of stretched. But this is actually pretty involved. So
like you're saying, this is like a whole pocket of
the internet, they say master beating in public and ejaculating
(27:14):
of random women, known as tagging or sharking, or even
come sharking. Online forums praise perpetrators for being quote low
in ambition, and users contributing to the discussion said they
wish they could summon the same fearlessness in themselves. So
it's often tied to the inceell movement, but also not
exclusive to them. So what really bothered me is it
(27:36):
said some victims were out shopping with their young children.
One perpetrator was a freshly hired sheriff's deputy and another
was a Dollar Tree employee. So to think somebody's working
there and doing this is even more disgusting.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
So this term, you are.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
Not even gonna believe this.
Speaker 3 (27:54):
They said.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
One guy was caught on video he was in a
drive through at a coffee shop. I'm gonna say, like
a Starbucks, a duncan something like that, doing it in
his car to the woman, Like he was jerking off
while the woman serving him through the windows could see him. Right,
So they share a video of this guy and he
ends up killing himself, saying he couldn't face his family.
(28:17):
So then other gooners went to the coffee shop and
throw a protest, saying he was publicly shamed, and then
they called the event a gooneral.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
Oh my god, what the fuck is going on in
the world?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
You show your face in public in defense of a
public masturbator.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
I just can't believe this.
Speaker 2 (28:39):
Everything is so backwards. Like if you told me this
story even in twenty eighteen, I would have said that
didn't happen. I would just be like, there's absolutely no
way that this is getting reversed to be like the
fault of the victim.
Speaker 3 (28:59):
And now it's like it's just so.
Speaker 1 (29:00):
Christ I couldn't. I I was so horrified by this story.
And then I got to the word goonirl and I
was just sitting there. I mean, I'm deliriously tired in
the newborn trend of stuff. I was literally laughing to
myself for five minutes.
Speaker 3 (29:17):
I not this term goonerl.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
I think we know with the title of this episode, obviously,
what is a gooneral?
Speaker 3 (29:24):
Anyway? You know what's funny?
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Yesterday when I was doing Monday's Morbid Minute, I was,
you know, I do that by myself at like and
I did it at it like eleven o'clock at night, right,
I was by myself. Everybody was like upstairs asleep whatever,
And I'm reading this story that I had written up
about this woman that was naked and stealing the ambulance,
(29:58):
and I just like, wait, actually, I'm gonna pull it
up right now because I just I just want, like
I want to read the exact line that I just
I just like completely lost it. I don't know why,
you know, when you get like the giggles, and then
I started thinking about you. But I was in the
middle of recording and I didn't want there to be
(30:19):
any edits, so I just kept like trying to keep
my shit together, so I wasn't laughing, but I feel
like it was like, all right, so this, this is
what really threw me off. So it was like police
first located her around two am. But when an officer
approached her, now remember that she's naked and driving an ambulance.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
Okay, it says she asked, are you following me? Or
am I following you? Like I don't know why.
Speaker 2 (30:44):
That shit just like made me like fall over the edge,
like and and and you could probably hear my voice
cracking because I was trying so hard not to laugh,
but and like I was crying, like my tears coming
out of my eyes because I was holding it in
so much.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
It was just so off.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
Last I mean, we've had incidents on here where we've
laughed pretty hard and we've had to edit it out
because we're laughing for like five minutes. But the last
time I remember is when you were talking about Jonathan Taylor.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
Tops and you called him Jonnifer.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
I don't know why he's so irrelevant in my life
and his name comes up so often when I'm talking
to people, you always think about Jonnifer. It's so dum
oh my god, I'm crying.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well now you've got gooner role. I can't listen. And
why why? Like I why Dollar Tree?
Speaker 1 (31:41):
Though, Like, well this isn't really good for so like
we go to Dollar Tree we get stuff for parties
and sometimes I just like to go there and buy snacks.
And I'm like, I'm not going there any time soon.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
If this is happening.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
It's kind of got like a gross vibe there, like
there is like a you know, yesterday I went to
five Below because the kids wanted to look for some
school solies and.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
It's just got I guess the lighting there is better.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
I mean, it's still kind of the same vibe of
a store. They have a little bit of better quality
stuff because it's like five dollars instead of one dollar
or whatever, but like it just feels a little bit
more like comfortable, but it's kind of the same kind
of store. Like why is it not happening there?
Speaker 1 (32:19):
I don't know, And like I don't while I don't
think they should be sued for it happening. I think
they kind of have a pr crisis on their hands
and they need to get this under control.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
Like I feel like Dollar Tree has good stuff sometimes
I have great stuff they like a lot of times,
and I like that there's all of these social media
accounts of people buying stuff there and like making cool
crafts and stuff out of them or whatever. But but
like the school, like I'm I kind of just the
way that the one is near my house anyway, there's
(32:50):
actually two near my house.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
One isn't awful, but.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Even the one that's like in a better area is
still kind of awful. Like like I would I one
hundred percent and could picture it happening at either of
those locations, just because it's There's just like there's something
about the store that just like gives me like a vibe,
you know.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
Yeah, I mean they do need to get this under control,
because like I go there frequently, and I don't want
to go there anymore if this is a potential not
that this couldn't happen anywhere, but.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
You don't want to get gooned on. Well yeah, and
that's the thing, like I don't think that this is
a lawsuit worthy for Dollar Tree. I am curious if
they have, because I do think that they probably have
security cameras in the parking lot, and I wonder if
they're able to pinpoint it to that guy, see him
going to his car, look at his license plate number,
and things like that, because for our Dollar Tree, like
(33:41):
the way the cars park, you would be able to
see the license plates, but sometimes if it was a
sideways parking spot, you might not depending on the angle
of the camera.
Speaker 1 (33:50):
Didn't we cover the incident that happened at the Philly
Dollar Tree on YouTube Live where the lady took a
video of the guy running out of the store and.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Said he nutted on my leg.
Speaker 1 (34:01):
I feel like we had that on YouTube Live.
Speaker 2 (34:03):
Oh yeah we did, so it was oh yeah, because
it did it? Had it did happen?
Speaker 1 (34:07):
I'm pretty sure this was like part of this whole thing,
but it's becoming a serious problem.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
I guess the yeah, I mean the thing is is
that I mean, maybe she's saying because when she went
into the Dollar Tree, she said something to the employees
and they had said it happened before, So maybe she's saying, like,
you know, people that come to the store should know
that that's happening.
Speaker 3 (34:31):
Are you going to do? It could happen in two seconds, yeah,
and it could happen any It could happen.
Speaker 1 (34:39):
In the stores. Like what did How are they possibly
going to control this? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Like what are they gonna you know how?
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Like all of these stores like put up signs that
the employees right with like marker and tape it on
the wall, Like what are they going to do that
you might heade on your leg?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
Like I don't what are they possibly good to do?
Like seriously, oh god, that is it's so disgusting.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
We live in the most disturbing time ever right now
thinking about this. And then it's not even like a
one off thing. It's like a whole network of men
talking about how amazing it is and how they're like
jealous of each other and throwing each other goonerols in defense.
Can you imagine these men showing up and showing their
faces in defense of a public masturbader.
Speaker 2 (35:27):
Plus, like any guy that's doing this is like not
hot even a little bit, right, They're all like losories,
Like you don't know that that just makes it even
more gross, right, Like it's no, I do know that
I doubt that there's any person that's that's anywhere near attractive.
I mean, listen, mentally, you are physically doing stuff like this.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
Predators are always on my mind because that's the way
I live, since you let me watch To Catch Your
Predator when I was young. Speaking of I'm very excited
for that movie coming out soon with Robert Pattinson. But
also because over the weekend, we were hanging out with
some friends by the pool and we were just talking
about crazy stuff and then that guy we wrote about
in the Gross Room, Ed Savats, came up, and it
was just funny because everybody was like, oh, yeah, our
(36:10):
guy friends. Sometimes you bet our boyfriends would go to
this guy and poop in a pizza box and he
would pay them. And then I was provided of the
Swiss cheese perpt, which I feel like we're gonna have
to cover as a part two to Ed Savots because
that also happened in Philly. Yeah, there are just terrible
things happening, especially in Philadelphia. I don't know, all right,
(36:33):
a father used his daughter's TikTok to lure her rapist
to the family's home and shot him.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
So this is really an interesting story because it has
multiple layers. So first, it seems that this mother was
looking at her child's phone, who is eleven, which I
would argue with an eleven year old shitn't even have
a phone to begin with. Is looking at the child's
phone and see his videos on the phone of her
(37:00):
child getting raped by an adult. So her father somehow
figures out who the guy is, goes on the daughter's
TikTok account, sees they've been talking on TikTok, pretends he's
the daughter, lures the guy to the house, pretending to
(37:21):
be the eleven year old. The guy shows up at
the house, he's twenty years old by the way, twenty,
and he confronts him and one thing, I guess he
said that he was just going to confront him, but
like something, one thing led to another and he ended.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
Up weapon out so that he ended up shooting him.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
So he ended up shooting him. Right now, in my opinion,
the father's one hundred percent justified for this. I also
think that like the parents are kind of responsible for
this at the same time, because like I know, I
get yelled at for victim blaming all the time, but like, sorry,
don't have your kids on TikTok and have a phone
and have them like this never would have happened if
the kid wasn't on TikTok at least in this particular situation.
Speaker 3 (38:04):
So so like, but still it did happen.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
So now the father reacts and shoots the guy, which
I would I would too, right, Like, that's that's what
I would do, And this is what happened. Like he's
in a lot of trouble. Now the dad is in
a lot of trouble. The guy, actually, the guy that
he shot, was found guilty of doing this and got
(38:29):
arrested for doing this. He was charged with two counts
of rape and one count of obstruction obstructing official business.
So like, the police looked at these videos and was like, yes,
he is raping a child. So the father was one
hundred percent right. He caught the right guy. He he
he just took he was doing like a vigilante thing
(38:50):
which is not allowed, and he might be going to
jail for up to eighteen years.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
Okay, So that's interesting because I didn't see that the
dad was getting in trouble. So it's interesting, you said,
because I was to bring up like, why is that
other mother going to they're facing murder charges for shooting
that guy that was hiding under her teenage daughter's bed,
and then this guy might not be getting introable.
Speaker 2 (39:11):
He got charged with felony assault, and then prosecutors added
an additional charge of having a weapon while under disability.
Speaker 3 (39:20):
So I guess I don't know exactly.
Speaker 2 (39:23):
No, it's not, it's not. It's not that I think
that he was told he was not allowed to have
a weapon because he had a previous robbery attempt or conviction. Actually,
so he was not allowed to possess a firearm. So
I guess they're like they disabled his ability to have
a firearm, so he had a firearm when he shouldn't
(39:45):
have had one, and then he took the law on
his own hands, which like, okay, fine, but like who cares,
Just like be a normal person and brush that under
the rug. In this case, Seriously, this guy twenty years
old having sex with an eleven year old and like
the kid's eleven, Like Lucia is eleven.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
That's fucking n But.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
Then think about Celeste Reevas and David I do, and
that's also disgusting. It's just like this is like people
don't understand, like when your kids are on like social
media like that, they just they find people, and like
that girl doesn't know she's eleven. She just doesn't know.
And the fact that they were even allowed to meet
(40:26):
up is just it's just so I don't even understand
how that happened and where the sex happened. But apparently
the guy. I don't know if the guy knew where
the house was or the dad was like, here's my address,
but like had absolutely no problem having sex with an
eleven year old trying to do it again.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
At the same time, we know that like sex predators
barely go to jail, so this guy's gonna probably get
out in the next like five to ten years. And
then let's say that dad might be facing a longer
sentence for shooting him, and then they have now the
predator has your address to go seek revenge on you.
Oh h.
Speaker 2 (41:01):
I actually would guarantee that in this case that even
though this guy was like on video having sex with like,
it wasn't even you know how there's like sometimes lesser
charges if the kid's like sixteen or seventeen versus yeah,
like eleven is like really young. I feel like you
(41:23):
could almost guarantee that if they pull all these charges
on this guy. I just can't imagine, honestly, if this
guy ends up going to trial to say what he did,
I can't imagine draw ours being like, yeah, you know what,
he should go to jail for eighteen years for this.
Speaker 3 (41:39):
Like, I can't imagine one of them would even would
even give him anything. I just can't. Regardless if he
was breaking.
Speaker 1 (41:45):
There's always one so ridiculous. All right, gen Z says,
smoking's back. How do you feel about it?
Speaker 3 (41:52):
I feel vindicated.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
I think I argue before that smoking never went out
because I worked the rest I'm smoking at every day
and everybody always smoked, so like I've always been around
it smoking.
Speaker 2 (42:06):
Like statistically, smoking is still out. It's still way way
lower than it has been in the past. So it
definitely went out, but it was it was frowned upon
for a while, and people were not doing it in
public or hiding it, and it wasn't glamorized as to
what I said in when we were talking about the
(42:29):
Kylie Jenny Jenner photo shoot, and now we're just talking
like you've just been seeing an increase of it in
every single magazine it's just like cool again.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
And I feel like this video was trying to say
it started with Sean Penn chain ripping cigarettes at the
Golden Globes, and of like, first of all, why would
we pinpointed to that specific event.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Especially Sean Penn is one that never stopped smoking, probably
and he isn't he like an extra chain smoker. I
feel like we've talked about this before that he smokes
like two or three packs a day or something and
just like doesn't give Yeah, so like and also like
he's old, right, he was cool in the eighties as
(43:12):
far as like people like looking up to and admiring him, right,
Like we're talking about what is gen z that's like
below you? Right?
Speaker 3 (43:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Well, I think what they're trying to argue is that
so they said in twenty twenty three, there was a
seventy percent increase of tobacco, you said, shown in films.
So they're trying to cite, you know, all these kids
going back and watching older shows like mad Men and
Sopranos where everybody's just smoking all of the time. But
then they're also saying that newer shows like Love Story
(43:42):
and shows showing the nineties culture. So in general, I
feel for gen Z nineties culture as a whole, fashion, etiquette, smoking,
everything is coming back, so that's just wrapped into that.
So then when they're showing like Carolyn Bissett chain smoking
cigarettes and love story, it's just adding to that cool
factor of it. And they're calling it a drunk sig,
(44:02):
so they say they always have drunk SIGs with a
cocktail or something. But other people are arguing, like this
professor that was interviewed said, instead of her kids going
out and running and getting a coffee or something in
the middle of a break, they all go outside and
chain smoke cigarettes. But I want to say that was
a person I believe that was working at Parsons, which
is like school of design. I went to art school
(44:23):
and so many people smoked there, So.
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Yeah, and I feel like it.
Speaker 2 (44:27):
It's like people who work at bars and artists and stuff,
like lots of tattooers and stuff like that do that.
I mean, this is what I think happened personally. I
think that, you know, the anti tobacco campaign started working
because a lot of information was exposed from the big
tobacco companies that they were hiding all of this information
(44:47):
as far as like how bad cigarettes actually were, not
just for cancer, but for all other sorts of pathological
processes that you know, your your blood vessels just all
sort in multiple organs, it's COPD things like that. So
this huge campaign went out and then people really started it.
(45:09):
I feel like it worked because people were that were
my age and teenagers were seeing their grandparents die of it,
like people who smoked their whole life. You also, but
there was also always people that smoked their whole life
that were totally fine. So like I always said that
the tobacco thing is not just tobacco, but it's tobacco
and genetics as well. So but a lot the smoking
(45:31):
declined big time, and then big Tobacco started losing money,
so they were like, how are we gonna pull kids
in again. Oh, let's start introducing these vape things and
we're gonna say that they're safer than cigarettes.
Speaker 3 (45:41):
And this and that.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
So then you get a whole new generation of kids
like addicted to nicotine in a different kind of way.
But like, smoking a vappen is kind of corny looking
like you like, if you want to look cool, like
you smoke a cigarette like a vape like, and people
are probably just like who cares, what's the difference, because
like I I personally don't think that there's any difference
(46:03):
between the two. They're equally as harmful. There's other things
that have happened over the past couple of years that
we could say. So I like that you cited that
article in twenty twenty three that there was like a
seventy percent increase in cigarette use in movies and stuff,
because like that goes along exactly what I was saying that,
like it's increasing, Yeah, as far as that goes.
Speaker 1 (46:27):
I also said that recent steties have shown that ninety
percent of social posts by tobacco companies are violating the
federal regulations for youth marketing, So like that's obviously a problem,
and then why are they not being checked?
Speaker 2 (46:49):
Well, I don't know, but like I don't know what
the rules are now, because there a lot of rules
went down because of like remember with like Joe Camel
and all that stuff that you can't show this, you
can't show that. So but they get around it because
there's loopholes in everything in life, right, So I think
that the biggest increase is the vapes people are smoking
(47:14):
weed now, So like just the smoking could lead to
smoking because weed's like so huge now people vape weed,
people might vape tobacco. People might just decide to smoke
weed out of a joint. People might decide to smoke
a cigarette because they're used to smoking when more people
are smoking weed than ever have. Right, the biggest thing
(47:38):
is is that people don't trust what they're told from
the government. So like there's skepticism about COVID, the whole
response to that vaccine stuff like that, So people are
just like, well, why should we trust that they're telling
us the truth about anything, which is going to be
a huge problem for public health. And then finally, like
(47:58):
we were talking about this weekend, like people are just
like I don't give a fuck about anything anymore, Like
shit's really bad and I just don't care.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
Yeah, that is a huge component of it, for sure. Yeah,
so it is very interesting to think about. I don't know,
it's just crazy how certain things will skip like a
whole generation. I certainly know millennials that smoke, but definitely
not as much.
Speaker 3 (48:21):
But seeing that.
Speaker 1 (48:24):
All these younger kids literally having the total wealth of
knowledge we have on how bad this is and choosing
to do it anyway, is kind of shocking.
Speaker 3 (48:32):
Yeah, exactly, all right.
Speaker 1 (48:33):
Onto your questions and emails. If you have stories or
questions for us, please submit them to stories at mothernosdeath
dot com. First, it's from Amanda. Doctor Kumar, who is
the doctor who reused the medical equipment that we talked
about last week, is a creep. I looked up his
federal court documents. Basically he was performing unnecessary procedures on
women and documenting symptoms they didn't have. Apparently you could
(48:55):
reuse some of the instruments if you get approval and
notified patients. But this guy was so discussing and he
would have them place various devices in the same solution
and only have his staff change the solution every two weeks.
Speaker 3 (49:07):
Oh that's so great.
Speaker 1 (49:08):
It is disgusting, and like you really shouldn't be allowed
to reuse them even with approval.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
Well, uh, there's definitely tools.
Speaker 2 (49:16):
That get reused all the time, Like in your surgery,
every surgery, there's tools that are reused. There's equipment, autoclaves
that clean things that sterilize them. I mean they can't
they can't get you know, one time used tools for
every single patient, for every procedure. That would just not
be cost effective even a little bit.
Speaker 3 (49:37):
So I mean, like one.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
Time I had one of the nurses come down to
the floor to me when I had a patient for
autopsy because they had left this chest retractor inside of
the patient. And normally, if I would have gotten a
tool like that, I probably would have just like saved
it aside in the morgan until somebody came and got
it if they really wanted it or whatever. But like
(50:02):
I would just put it down there and be like,
I don't know, maybe we could because we always do
have some like Rando surgical tools down there. And then
she was like, no, I gotta take this back. They're
gonna kill me. This thing is thousands of dollars and stuff,
and it's just like it's just like a metal thing.
But like, medical equipment is just really really really expensive,
(50:22):
so if they had to use something like that for
every single patient, it just like wouldn't make any sense.
So they have to They just put it, you know,
and it came from the morgue. It was in a
dead person, and they bring it upstairs and put it
in the autoclave and take it out and then it's fine.
Speaker 3 (50:35):
To use again.
Speaker 1 (50:37):
But like.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
I think, like things that are designated for one time
use are Think about this, Like you ever go to
the to like get takeout, and you get like really
good plastic forks and spoons, not just like the flimsy ones,
but like really good ones, right to the point where
you're like, oh, I could probably rinse these off and
use them again, cause they're like kind of hearty good.
Speaker 3 (51:00):
It's probably more like that. It's not.
Speaker 2 (51:04):
No like this the spoons you get from the even
the spoons you get from the pliable place, they're pretty good.
Like I'm like, oh, you could use these again. They're
not like flimsy shitty spoons, Like you could use them
again if you want to do.
Speaker 3 (51:17):
Like I'm just.
Speaker 2 (51:18):
Saying, like between like think about that compared to the
ones you get for like a party, those white ones
that like if you stick the fork in it like breaks,
you know, like it's real bendy.
Speaker 3 (51:27):
So it's just like it's.
Speaker 2 (51:29):
Probably like a high quality reusable or a one time
use thing, and that's why they're able to use it again,
but like they weren't supposed to, and probably it has
components that can't go into an autocleave, which is why
they're putting it in a solution versus an autoclave.
Speaker 1 (51:45):
They can't change the solution.
Speaker 3 (51:46):
It would now you can't change the solution once.
Speaker 2 (51:50):
It's just gross, Like even if I'm not even sure
that they're I mean, there might be like approved things
or whatever, but like I just wouldn't be okay with it.
And yeah, the two weeks thing is discussed.
Speaker 3 (52:01):
So we clipped that.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
Story for Instagram, and so many people in their comments
were victims of this person and said it's actually so
much worse than the media was portraying.
Speaker 3 (52:10):
Yeah, oh, I'm sure it's just horrible.
Speaker 1 (52:12):
All right, let me switch these next two around because
I feel like the middle one's gonna elicit a longer answer,
so all right. Next to is from Crystal. Last month,
an eight year old boy got legs amputated below the
knee by a vehicle toe strap. The notes said his
parents were towing a vehicle and the child's legs got
stuck in the strap and when they tried to pull
him out, his quote legs fell off completely amputated at
(52:35):
both his knees. That's all the info I know, and
I doubt there will be any coverage on it, but
figured this was you guys, who would be the ones
to find it. I haven't seen anything about this, have you?
Speaker 2 (52:44):
So so I haven't seen anything about this. But the
whole entire time I was reading this, I was like,
I swear to God, we talked about this story before,
Like it just sounded familiar to me. So I'm reading
and I'm like, okay, like this is just by reading
this comment, it's two options to me. Number one, it's
like you're reading some kind of patient notes that you
(53:08):
got this information from. Or you know, sometimes we find
stories that are like on Facebook and they're faith they're
like literally fake. So I guess there's a possibility that
you were reading a post like that that it's just
not real either. But regardless, I didn't find anything like that.
But I seriously spent a half hour of my life
(53:28):
today searching all of my notes because I was like,
we talked about this before, Like you don't remember that.
Speaker 1 (53:35):
I believe this account was from a police report.
Speaker 2 (53:38):
Okay, so back, So this is what I found which
made me think of this, which isn't the same story,
but it's a similar kind of story. In May of
twenty twenty three, there was a six year old girl
that was writing in a pickup truck and they were
playing with a ratchet tie down strap, which is one
of those ones you would use to like stretch down
(54:00):
something on a truck or something, and it was in
the car, attached to something, I guess, and then it
went out the window and it got caught around the
wheel well and it cut her foot like straight off. God,
So that was do you remember we talked about that
back then. That was the case that I was thinking of. So,
so yeah, like amputated like the same kind of thing,
(54:23):
like a rope, like a rope or a strap amputation.
So it's the same mechanism. But as far as the
particular case that you're talking about right now, I'm actually
surprised that that hasn't hit the news. But I mean,
I guess I don't know if people don't want to
report it. It's kind of private health information at that point, right.
Speaker 1 (54:44):
Yeah, And you know, it always reminds me of the
worst accident I ever think of, which is at six
Flags when that cable snapped on that like Superman drop
ride and cut that girl's feet off. Remember, Oh yeah, Yeah,
that was an awful story. Yeah, that is awful, all right.
Last is from Jenna Nicole, I'm interested in knowing your
thoughts on Patrick Clancy as the Lindsay Clancy trial goes on.
(55:06):
I've been following closely, and maybe I'm falling for the
social media nonsense, but he's giving Chris Watts vibes.
Speaker 2 (55:14):
Guys, I really don't know where to go with this case.
I've been following very very closely too, so actually Gandhia
texted me yesterday and asked me what I thought about
it too, because now it's like going viral that everyone
thinks that the husband was now the one that did
(55:36):
this right. Yes, so I guess I'll say exactly what
I said to her, which is like, I still think
at the root cause of it, this has to do
with her having this medical condition and her getting these medications,
and that's really what I believe happened in this case.
(55:58):
But I also can't ignore some parts of the of
the evidence that's being presented, especially if I don't know
if it's true. I guess that's what you're saying because
it's not presented in court a lot of it.
Speaker 1 (56:15):
I think people are misunderstanding things presented in court and
putting them on TikTok inaccurately.
Speaker 2 (56:22):
Which is which is happening for sure? So I think,
like especially just watching the testimony and stuff yesterday from
which this this this is from Monday.
Speaker 1 (56:35):
Yeah, so you're right, we're recording to Yeah, so this
episode comes out tomorrow. So yeah.
Speaker 2 (56:39):
So from all I saw was the testimony with uh
the or the defense UH examining Jennifer Jennifer Toffs I
believe her name is that the the visit one of
the psychiatrists that was prescribing her all these medications, and
like I'm just sitting there and and then like also
seeing all these comments on social media because like I
(57:02):
was a victim of that system, and like all of
these other especially women, are just like the same thing
happened to me, The same thing happened to me, like meds, meds,
meds going crazy, not getting you know, and and like
we know, none of that's getting reported to anybody. These
medications are ruining people's lives, ruining relationships with people, ruining marriages,
(57:24):
that people are losing jobs over this, and none of
that stuff gets reported, and all you hear is the
talking line of they're safe and effective, safe and effective,
and it's like people are just getting tired of that, right,
So that's like one whole component. But then Maria and
I have been talking about since the very beginning, you know,
with the husband and everything. So in one sense, I
(57:48):
feel like, if you believe the story that's presented and
what's what's happening in court right now, you would say, like, Wow,
he really believed that she is this ill and he
feels really terrible for being a part of it and
maybe not doing enough. And it's really cool of him
actually to be testifying at this trial and like supporting
(58:13):
her because she killed his three children essentially and like
really ruined a portion of his life if that's what
actually happened. So it like he doesn't have to be
supportive of her anymore. They're not married, they're not together.
He's married to someone else and apparently expecting another baby.
(58:35):
So Maria and I have been talking about how, you know,
there's there's some parts of it that are a little
bit unusual as far as how he met this this
new woman and everything, and how quickly he got remarried.
(58:56):
So I could go back and forth with that because
we have we have a close friend that died years
ago and and her husband ended up getting with another
woman shortly thereafter, and I always I didn't have a
problem with it because I knew that he was such
a good husband to my friend. And I think that
the death of my friend was so devastating to her
(59:19):
that or to him that he had to like find
someone else right away because he just couldn't live without
having that like other half. Like I never frowned upon
it on him because I just feel like it was
just such a great loss for him. So and you
hear about that, like a lot of times men get
remarried right away, like after they get divorced or after
(59:42):
especially when they're a widow because or a widow or whatever, because.
Speaker 3 (59:47):
They they just.
Speaker 2 (59:50):
Especially with men, right like sometimes a lot of men,
like my husbands used to like me cooking for him
every day and stuff like that, Like sometimes guys just
like need that, you know. So I don't necessarily think
that that is weird. Except this, this isn't a death right,
and this isn't a divorce. This isn't a typical divorce.
(01:00:10):
I am curious as to why, like if they were
married and happy and all this went down, like why
they did get divorced. It's very bizarre that because apparently
they were married and happy when this happened, and then
within days, I mean I did see this in court.
Within days, she had her power of attorney or the
(01:00:32):
person making her medical decisions changed from him to her parents.
And I just think and like, you could look at
it like, Okay, she killed three of his kids. That's
why they're getting divorced. I mean, it could be as
simple as that. But like, I couldn't just turn off
my feelings for Gabe right now. If something tragic happened,
it wouldn't be that cut and dry as far as
(01:00:54):
that goes, especially because it wasn't like especially if he
was sick and it happened because he was sick.
Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
You know.
Speaker 2 (01:01:02):
So there's that portion of it that that makes me think, like, Okay,
that's a little unusual that she had her the power
of attorney changed to her parents. And now you know,
everybody's going with it on social media, but some of
the stuff that people are saying is like legitimately concerned.
I sent one to Maria last night of a woman
who made a video that was showing his LinkedIn right.
Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Yeah, So what I wanted to say in terms of this,
because I've used LinkedIn before, and I don't think you've
ever had to use it for your jobs. So somebody's
pointing out that he accepted a job in New York
City a couple months before the murders, and that it
should it's showing that he worked in New York, right,
(01:01:46):
So Like my thought behind that is like, yeah, totally.
I've heard too that he was looking for an apartment
or something, which I don't know is true because I'm
not following this close issue because it's it's too upsetting
for me being as freshly posed part of Azam. So
let's say he got a job at his company. I
think he worked for Microsoft, right, So I'm trying to
come at it with Devil's advocate, Like, let's say he
(01:02:07):
accepted that position, and then because of all the children's deaths,
he then moved to New York in the same position.
So if he was in that position for a certain
amount of time, it might just say New York City
as the location for the whole stint, even though he
might have worked part of it in Massachusetts and then
part of it in New York. So like, let's just
say that, because you can't put multiple locations on LinkedIn
(01:02:28):
for the same job position. But I've heard also he
accepted that job and was looking for an apartment while
she was dealing with all of this stuff, And many
people like we have a cousin whose husband worked in
New York City while she lived here. You know, like,
that's not.
Speaker 2 (01:02:43):
I think that a lot of people that work, like
big jobs that make a lot of money might have
an apartment that they stay at during the week and
then come home.
Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
So but if your wife is going through all these problems,
maybe it's not ideal to accept a job in another city,
and then it certainly doesn't look good when you then
meet another woman in that city and you get married.
But at the same time, let's say he did take
that job and then after the murders of his kids,
he moved there because he was like, well, all my
(01:03:15):
children are dead and my wife is in jail. I
just want to start fresh. Like, yeah, the timing doesn't
look great. I think it's bizarre that he got married
too quick, But I also think people.
Speaker 3 (01:03:25):
That are grieving do things like that.
Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
So yeah, you could really just look at it both
sides for anything.
Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Yeah, So I mean that there's that stuff there's a
lot of stuff being said about where he was and
emails being sent and this and that.
Speaker 3 (01:03:39):
Like I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
I mean, there's like medical things that I'm actually going
to write a post about it in the gross room
sometime this week, especially in regards to her having the
eighty some degree temperature hypothermia. I have concerns about that.
You talked its Yeah, it relates to another case that happened,
(01:04:06):
you know, in the same state with the Karen Reid trial.
So I've researched that heavily for that trial. So we're
I'll talk about it in this case too this week
in the gross room. But just I don't know, like
I did. I did hear in the trial that she
had a crushed diyroid cartilage. That's still concerning me. I
(01:04:28):
want to know more about like all that I haven't
dug deep into those particular injuries that she got, like
how they think she fell out, how she was found.
There's there's other people who are bringing up a good
point that you know, he went up to her and said,
what did you do? And then she said, I tried
to kill myself And then he said where are the kids?
(01:04:50):
And she said in the basement. But then you know,
the paramedics are being and the first responders are being interviewed,
saying that she couldn't talk. She was like semi conscious,
So how did she talk to him? You know, I
don't know any of that stuff, Like like I would
have to sit there for for like eight hours and
(01:05:11):
go through it, like to give my own opinion on it.
But I am like at this point, I'm open to anything.
And in these particular situations, it would definitely be more
common for the husband to kill to do the murder
than the wife. But we have cases of like Andrea
Yates and who was the other one, like Susan Smith,
(01:05:32):
like people.
Speaker 3 (01:05:32):
Killed their child. Well, I keep it's a thing.
Speaker 1 (01:05:34):
I keep seeing something floating around that It's like nothing's
more dangerous than a man seeking a new life in
reference to him potentially having an affair before this happened,
or looking to take a new job and move to
New York. So if you want to think about that,
like we think about Scott Peterson having an affair and
that awful case, and there's many many others.
Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
But the thing is is that like I understand and
can respect all of those opinions but like when they
do an investigation like this, a lot of people are
just saying like, oh, they just listened to Patrick and
believed him, And I'm like, I don't know that that's true.
I'm sure that they looked extensively into his text messages,
(01:06:12):
his emails, like like maybe all that stuff hasn't come
out yet, but like they would if he was having
some kind of an affair with someone. I'm sure there
would be some kind of evidence of it of twenty
twenty six, that he was having phone calls or conversations
with someone repeatedly, and like it's very hot hard to
(01:06:34):
hide that kind of stuff nowadays, between all of your
social media's and your IP addresses and your Google maps
and everything.
Speaker 1 (01:06:42):
Like well, I've seen criticisms and i don't know if
this is true because I'm not so familiar with the
intimate details of this case that it was kind of
like an Ellen Greenberg situation where they walked in the
scene they thought it was cut and dry, like she
killed them, she tried to kill herself, and it wasn't
very thoroughly investigated as alternative solution. But I don't know
(01:07:02):
if you're trying, but we don't We haven't heard everything
yet though, so we don't know exactly.
Speaker 3 (01:07:07):
So I don't know that for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:07:08):
That's a criticism I'm seeing. But at the same time, like,
are they building this up to drop this giant bomb
that they have so much evidence that the husband did it.
Speaker 3 (01:07:17):
We don't know.
Speaker 1 (01:07:18):
This trial is still going on.
Speaker 3 (01:07:20):
There are certainly.
Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
Things he does that are weird, but also you didn't
play it off as other things like we were talking
about on YouTube live, like when he made the phone call.
Speaker 3 (01:07:29):
He worded it weird.
Speaker 1 (01:07:31):
But I hate to criticize that because I don't speak
correctly ever, so I don't want somebody micromanaging the.
Speaker 3 (01:07:37):
Sentence I said.
Speaker 1 (01:07:38):
I have terrible set in structure.
Speaker 2 (01:07:41):
It's just it's just like listen, if you if you
walked in the house and saw your children dead, you
would you would almost be you wouldn't believe it. You
would be like trying to like shake their body and
be like no, no, no, like I don't know, just
instead of being like she killed the fucking kids, like
(01:08:04):
I understand. But at the same time, he, you know,
everything starts clicking back in his mind because she had
told him that she wanted to hurt them, right so
so it's like it's just everything coming like a full
circle moment and stuff, like it's just a very complex case.
And regardless even regardless if if whatever happened there with
(01:08:27):
who actually killed the children and stuff, It's like it
is very it's really bringing a highlight to the mental
health treatment in this country. And like these people are
I keep saying, they're like the sacrificial lamps that they
had to deal with this horrible tragedy whatever went down
with it, and because they're victims of this of this
(01:08:50):
particular system, which is terrible. When you were listening to
doctor Tuff's testimony at least on Monday, and god knows
what's going to happen after we're recording today and tomorrow too.
Like I'm listening to a person that is just checking boxes.
I don't know that she's necessarily like the asshole here,
because all she's doing is what she was taught and
(01:09:12):
what she was told going down the list of like
this is the first line of defense, then we use
this one, then we use this one. It's like, in
my personal opinion, like if a person has anxiety and
depression like a little bit, they're kind of like I
feel really anxious and stuff.
Speaker 3 (01:09:28):
What do they do?
Speaker 2 (01:09:29):
They go to their family doctor or their doctor gives
them like lexapro or zoloft and they take it and
they're like, Okay, I feel better and that's it. Right,
you don't hear anything else.
Speaker 3 (01:09:38):
They take it. They're on it for five or ten years.
That's like a normal anxiety depression, low grade thing.
Speaker 2 (01:09:44):
Right. You have a woman who is who thought that
it was too bad that she should go to an
actual psychiatrist. She's going to a psychiatrist like every week
to see the actual medical doctor. On top of have
some therapy sessions. It's given the first line of defense.
It doesn't work, the next one, the next one, the
(01:10:06):
next one. Not only is it not working, but now
she's like, I'm still having anxiety. Now I'm not sleeping.
And then add on to it, not sleeping multiple nights
in a row will make you literally crazy as well.
And at one point it's just kind of like, let's
just keep going through this checklist instead of being like, Okay,
this is not normal, like something's up here. It's the
(01:10:30):
same thing if a patient had an upper respiratory infection
and you gave them antibiotics, right, most people. You call
the doctor, You go to the doctor. They say, here,
take this antibiotic. You take it, and it goes away,
and you never hear from them again about that, right
they what if they take it and come back and say,
my nose is still running, I'm still stuffy, I'm still
(01:10:50):
sneezing all the time, i still feel like all this
pressure in my head. Give them another antibiotic doesn't work.
Give them another antibiotic doesn't work. Like the doctor normally
they would be like, we need to work this up.
Something is going on. We need to do a biopsy,
we need to do a scope, We need to further
look into this to figure out exactly what is going
on with this patient, because they're not responding to typical treatment.
(01:11:15):
So when that woman sits there and says, oh, she
had anxiety and depression, it's just kind of like, nah, dude,
she was way beyond that and you missed it.
Speaker 1 (01:11:23):
Yeah, I mean that's really concerning.
Speaker 3 (01:11:25):
And she's she is a nurse, right, so like.
Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
Number one, she knows what happens when you sit there
and say that you feel like killing yourself and you
feel like killing your children. She knows what's gonna happen,
they're gonna take her kids away from her, or they're
going to take her away from her kids. Number Two,
she's a nurse. She's going to sit there and say,
I want to hurt my children and hurt myself. Don't
you think that she's scared to death? She's never gonna
get her job back as a labor and delivery nurse
(01:11:51):
when that's on the permanent record.
Speaker 3 (01:11:53):
Like, you can't. You can't like who.
Speaker 2 (01:11:56):
Says that shit out loud when they're having those thoughts.
It's it's very hard for a person to say that
out loud, especially a normal person, to just admit that
that's all that's it's it's hard to.
Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
Do that for sure, because like, all right, so right now,
like anytime I was going for my postpartum checkups, or
when I even go to the baby's like monthly appointments,
like his checkups, they give you that questionnaire, right, And
I straight up asked my midwife office. I was like,
are people honest on this postpartum depression screening? Because I
just feel like most people would probably lie. And they said,
(01:12:29):
since they started handing out the papers, more people have
been honest than when they're asked face to face. Yeah,
that's interesting, which I think is interesting because I'm like,
I'm sitting there thinking if I was experiencing this, would
I be honest because I don't want a whole thing, right,
Like some people don't want them.
Speaker 3 (01:12:47):
They'll be like, well, what do you mean? What do
you mean?
Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
I feel like I would be honest because I'm so
scared to death, especially when we're covering this.
Speaker 3 (01:12:56):
Well, I have like mouth diarrhea.
Speaker 1 (01:12:59):
Just say everything my mind. So yeah, but yeah, they
said they started doing the papers because they saw that
so many more people were upfront about it, which is
really interesting.
Speaker 3 (01:13:09):
Yeah, it is. So we'll stay up to date on it.
I mean, like I don't know when the trial is
going to be over, we'll like we'll be.
Speaker 2 (01:13:17):
Covered more for sure, and like look in the gross
room too, because I'm going to write about some of
the medical stuff this week, and.
Speaker 1 (01:13:22):
We talk about updates on YouTube Life, so you don't
want to miss it.
Speaker 2 (01:13:26):
Yeah, I mean we did talk about a lot of
this on YouTube Live last week.
Speaker 1 (01:13:29):
All right, guys, please head over to applers, Spotify, leave
us five star review, submit your stories of stories at
mothernowsdeth dot com and don't forget to subscribe to our
YouTube channel.
Speaker 2 (01:13:38):
Thank you for listening to Mother Knows Death. As a reminder,
my training is as a pathologists assistant. I have a
master's level education and specialize in anatomy and pathology education.
I am not a doctor and I have not diagnosed
or treated anyone dead or alive without the assistance of
a licensed medical doctor. This show, my website, and social
(01:14:02):
media accounts are designed to educate and inform people based
on my experience working in pathology, so they can make
healthier decisions regarding their life and well being. Always remember
that science is changing every day and the opinions expressed
in this episode are based on my knowledge of those
subjects at the time of publication. If you are having
(01:14:24):
a medical problem, have a medical question, or having a
medical emergency, please contact your physician or visit an urgent
care center, emergency room.
Speaker 3 (01:14:35):
Or hospital.
Speaker 2 (01:14:36):
Please rate, review, and subscribe to Mother Knows Death on Apple, Spotify, YouTube,
or anywhere you get podcasts.
Speaker 1 (01:14:44):
Thanks
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