January 15, 2026 • 31 mins
Mark is joined by Gerry Dulac to talk Tomlin's decision to step down as Steelers coach. Josh Yohe joins to talk Penguins and Flyers.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
These Steelers' coaching searches in progress, joining me now to
talk about it. He covers the team for the Post Caazette.
Always a pleasure to talk to, Jerry Dulac. Jerry, how
long will this process take and how many interviews will
be conducted? If I'm conning correctly, there's been like eight
lined up.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Yeah, I don't know if the numbers reached that high.
It was, well, lets let me say it is.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Mark.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
It reached five before I got started doing a number
of these radio hits and TV hits. But I'll go
with eight. But I will say this, they're a week
behind Mark because all the other firings occurred last week
by Tomlin was just two days ago when he stepped down,
So they're a week behind. Will they be able to
(00:44):
catch up? Well, yeah, they're going to have to, you know,
expedite the process. But I don't think that's going to effect.
They're not going to make a rash decision just to
hurry up to hire the person. You know, you look
at the past three hires, the latest one in the
calendar Chuck Noll, January twenty seventh. I don't think it's
(01:04):
going to be before then. But I think by the
first week of February. The one danger is you don't
want to miss out on a guy you know, and
if you're behind. I don't think that's going to happen.
I think one week you can catch up. But they
are a little bit behind the eight ball and they
will expedite. You know, the protocols are in place now,
(01:25):
market makes it. You know, there's a lot of boxes
to check before you even get down to the real interviews.
There's enough of them that slows the process a little bit.
But you know, I don't think it's going to be
a large deal that they started, you know, a week
later than most teams who.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Are the front runners. Give me a couple of names
you think have the most realistic shot.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
In your eyes, Mark, I really can't, but let me
say this because I don't like to play that game,
because I don't know yet. It's way too early in
the process. But I will say this, I do not
believe that they will hire a former NFL head coach
and unemployed NFL NFL head coach to be their head coach. Now,
(02:10):
the hire one as a coordinator, I think is a
great move. You know, Mike McDaniel to be your offensive
for for example. I'm not saying that's going to happen.
I'm just using that as an example. I think, you know,
when you look at their tempo for the you know,
since Chuck No a young thirty ish, young thirty guy
who was defensive minded. Now I'm not going to tell
(02:31):
you that it's going to be a defensive minded guy.
Probably is probably a good chance it will be. But
one thing I learned from Dan Ruddy is they will
hire the right person. And you look at Chuck No.
Though I know it's a different animal now between social
media and all the talking heads on television these days,
(02:53):
and especially with the NFL, but you know, Chuck No
was hired. He was a secondary coach with the Baltimore
Colts that Don Shula highly recommended. Bill Kawer was. You know,
he was a known coordinator with the Kansas City Chiefs.
I wouldn't call him the hot commodity, wasn't Ben Johnson
and Mike Tomlin was only one year as the defensive coordinator.
(03:16):
And you know they had two candidates in Russ Grimm
and Ken Wizenhunt in their discussions, you know, guys who
were on the current staff. But yet Mike Tomlin came
in and just blew them away in the interview process.
And Dan Rooney always said he wanted to hire the
(03:36):
right person, and I think that's what they're looking for.
With who they are going to hire, I would imagine
it's probably going to be like the past. It's going
to be a young guy that they can build with.
That's what they want to do. That's been their history.
It's obviously worked very well, and I think I think
they'll follow the same process. Bringing in the former NFL
(03:59):
coach me does nothing for them.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Mark Okay, I agree with that, except for one guy
I'd talked to Stefanski.
Speaker 4 (04:06):
He's forty three offensive.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Mind, it gets how the league is, had a great
defense in Cleveland too, knows the division. That would be
my one exception, and I think they're doing themselves a
disservice to not.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
At least consider.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah. Look, I'm not going to tell you that they
are or not going to, but I don't think that's
in their cards. I don't think that's the direction they
want to go. But I don't dispute what you said.
I think Kevin Stefanski is a good coach. He's had
to deal with that dysfunction in Cleveland. Yet despite having
the deal with that dysfunction, which is the Browns and
(04:41):
the Jets are right at the top of the league
when it comes to dysfunction, he still wasn't able to
overcome it enough. I know who he was in a
division with the Steelers and the Ravens and even the
Bengals with Joe Burrow. But I don't think that's the
direction they want to go.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
We're talking to Jerry Dulac from the because that brought
to us by bud Light, easy to drink in, easy
to enjoy. Now, Art said, competing is the intent and
no wasted years. I get it, that's always been their focus.
But boy, Jerry, I can't help but think they could
do with the six and ten year or six and
eleven now, because that's how they got Ben.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
You know Mark, Yeah, when he's you know, when he
said that, it made it sound as though he would
rather be content competitive and have a shot than advance
in the playoffs, and of course that's not the case.
But his point is they were always competitive under Mike
Tommin They you know, eight division titles, you know, you
know the whole story, one hundred and ninety three wins,
(05:45):
and he would take that being competitive and to use
his words, have a shot rather than have six and ten,
six and eleven in the case, maybe five and twelve
or whenever the bottom falls out. And so that's his point.
I mean, I get it. The problem is, you know,
nine years without a playoff win, seven losses in a row,
(06:06):
nine to one and done. That's what's frustrated a lot
of the fan base. I mean, there's not even one
win in there, which is what they were hoping to
accomplish this year by bringing in Aaron Rodgers and it
didn't happen, and so that that's you know, that's where
the frustration lies with the people who wanted to see
a change. And I don't blame them. I don't blame them.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
A lot of players specifically loved playing for Tomlin, wanted
to play for tom win. That's why Rogers came here.
How will Tomlin's departure affect the roster makeup? I'm sure
Rogers won't be back.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Yeah, Aaron Rodgers won't be back. Mark And even if
Mike Tomlin stayed, I think the loss to the Texas
stealed that deal. He came in for one year. They
brought him in to hopefully win a playoff game and
maybe start to get something going in the postseason, and
when that didn't happen, they were just you know, they
were going up on the plan B. So I expect
(07:00):
them back after that loss anyhow. But Mike Tomlin being gone,
he's the person who wanted him. He's the reason why
Aaron Rodgers came. And with him not here, that's it's
a foregone conclusion. He won't be back. They're gonna make
some changes, Mark. I don't think they're going to overhaul.
They just don't do that. But if you look at
the last two years, how active they been in free
(07:21):
agency and with trades. That roster has turned over a
lot in the last two years, and I expect it
to happen again. And you have some decisions with some
older players. You know, it's you get to the point
where you say, okay, we can finish last with them,
or we can find not that they finished last, but okay,
we cannot win a playoff game with them. We cannot
(07:43):
win a playoff game without them. So you know, it
gets to that point. You don't, though, have to make
a decision on Cam Hayward despite the fact that he
had an outstanding year. You know, are you going to
keep Jalen Ramsey, John new Smith, guys you brought in
to cost a lot of money. Are you going to
stick with them when what you are doing isn't working now?
(08:04):
Mike Tomlin fell on the sword if you will. You
know when he told the players in the meeting, Look,
I haven't gotten the best out of you. I haven't
been able to get you guys over the hump. Give
them credit for the unselfish self analysis. But you know
that that's the truth. And so it's it's is it?
(08:26):
The coach is the common denominator. But you have to
look at the roster and I think you'll see I
think you'll see some overhaul, not not a blow up.
They don't believe in that. They've been in the playoffs
five the last six years, so they're not more abund
But I think you'll see them continue to make changes
because they're not going to sit there and say we're
satisfied with our roster.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
What do I do with Watt is average annel Value's
forty one million, one hundred eight million was guaranteed upon signing.
He's clearly and obviously in decline, I knew that contract
was a mistake and he said he only wants to
play for Tom. When now he's got a contract, it's
not really his choice, you know who he plays for.
And on that Tom was left. But what's gonna happen
(09:07):
with him? Will he be back?
Speaker 4 (09:08):
For sure?
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Well, Mark, they kind of the ship kind of sailed
last year. They missed not to use the same analogy.
They missed the boat last year when they could have
dealt him, and I will tell you that was that
was something they that they had thought about. But instead
they gave him the big deal because you know, well,
because he's t J Watt and what he's been, what
he had done, and you know they didn't believe he
(09:33):
was finished. But you saw again this year that that
turns out to be not a smart business decision, which
they were aware of committing that kind of money for
five years to a guy who was going to be
thirty one. So at this point, you know you're going
to trade him. You won't get for him this year
what you would have gotten for him last year, meaning
probably a number one draft pick, but you won't get
(09:56):
that now. I don't think so his value is not
you know, this isn't Micah Parsons. So if you could
get that, you know, and get somewhat, you know, off
the hook to a degree with his contract.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Jared, I think you'd have trouble trading him for anything.
I think his performance in that contract makes him untradable.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Now, well, the contract is what makes him untradable. But
I'm just saying last year, before the contract, you could
have gotten away with that, and you probably could have
gotten a top pick for him. But that's why I
say that ship has sailed and I don't see that happening.
So now what do you do? Either way, you got
to bite the bullet and they'll keep them because they're
(10:36):
on the hope for that amount of money. So if
that's the case, I mean, it's not like he's thirty nine.
You know, they'll keep them and hope they get you know,
the old production out of him. Next year, you know,
at age thirty two, who's.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Going to be the quarterback? What direction do they go
in then?
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Because clearly they got to draft the long term guy,
but I'm not sure sure that presents itself in this
year's draft.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Well, Mark, and that's what's going to play out here.
That's their intention, That doesn't mean that's what's going to happen,
and so then you know they'll take a look at
Will Howard. The last thing they want to do is
bring in a six different quarterback for.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
The in the past six years.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
That is not on their radar at all. They know
they have to get started with a with the next
quote franchise quarterback, and so they're hoping to accomplish that
this year. I don't know if they can. That's but
that's what we're going to find out.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
See, Jerry, I would just go if you can't draft
the guy, I just go with with Rudolph and Howard
and Thrus stuff at the wall and see what sticks
in the interim.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Well, I think the the option there would be they
would take the look at Will Howard first to see
if whatever they thought they had in him. And the
understand mark is, you know, he's a six round pick,
so it's not exactly like they thought they were drafting
a franchise quarterback, but they do like them, and so
you know what, take a look. You know, that was
the problem of not seeing him in a preseason where
(12:03):
they can at least make some evaluation in a game,
not in practice in a game, and he didn't even
have a lot of practice with them for a long
time as well. So that's where they are behind on
evaluating Will Howard. But he will be part of taking
a look at him, and I would imagine they'll bring
(12:24):
Mason Rudolph back. But yeah, that's curious to see how
that's going to play out. But I know what their
intention is, Mark, but it doesn't mean that's going to
be the case.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Finally, Jerry, and I think I know the answer. Bit.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Was Art Rooney really surprised when Tomlin quit? And was
there any acrimony at all between the two?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
No, not at all, Mark, I've never got any indication
there was. As you heard Art Rooney say he was
tending to talk to him about twenty twenty six, and
you know, and it never got to that conversation because
Tomlin delivered that bombshell. And in retrospect, Mark I would
have been I wouldn't have been as surprised if the
(13:06):
Steelers cut ways and part of ways with Mike Tomlin
rather than Mike Tomlin stepping down when I look at it,
think about it in retrospect, when I know the type
of coach and the type of guy Mike Tomlin is.
You know, Mark, this guy, he's a football junkie. He
watches If there's a coach in the National Football League
(13:26):
who watches more film than him, I want to meet him.
This is a guy, My god, He loves OTAs. He
talks all the time about embracing challenges. He tells his
players all the time, you run to the fire and
not away from it. And so I'm not saying I
can't believe that he's stepping away for any other reason.
(13:48):
I don't think he has any diabetical plan in his mind, like, hey, look,
I'll take a powder this year. I'm walking away from
sixteen or seventeen million, but I'll be a free agent
after the twenty twenty sixth season and I could go
get a John Harbaugh contract that averages twenty million dollars
a year, which he would. I don't think that's what
(14:09):
was his plan at all. But that's but all what
I said is why I expect him to be on
an NFL sideline. Again, I don't know that, but knowing him,
if I had to guess, that's what we'll see.
Speaker 4 (14:21):
Jerry.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Great stuff is always good work at the PG. We'll
talk again soon.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Thanks Mark, good chat with you, my friend.
Speaker 4 (14:27):
That's Jerry Do.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
I brought us by Bud White segment before brought to
us by Danny's peach and hogies on route a day
to Bethel Park, and that actually strikes me as a
rather good combination. We got all kinds of guests today,
Yoe talking hockey at the bottom of the hour. At
four o'clock the return of the King of Old School,
John Steigerwald will be in studio, and at four point
thirty former Penguins coach Michelle Terrion.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
They say they care. I know they don't. What oh
five ninety X, here's your.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
Big fan, Mark, And after the gallon at like the
Mark Madden, what do you want?
Speaker 4 (15:02):
What do you want?
Speaker 5 (15:02):
Damn it?
Speaker 2 (15:03):
The X at one oh five nine, I.
Speaker 4 (15:08):
Forgot to plug.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
It's time for calls on the fifteen styal aight three
three four one two wxdx eight three three four one
two w xdx. We got Josh Joey talking Penguins in
just a few moments. I was down at the River's
Casino last night, won thirty bucks playing blackjack, only played
for about twenty minutes. I had dinner, watched the first
(15:30):
period of the Flyers game. They lost a Buffalo four
to one. Flyers with a four game losing streak, which
is how I like it. Coming into tonight's visit the
Pittsburgh we got the Hockey Night Show talking about that
at five thirty, got Yowei talking about that at three thirty.
I'm thinking about playing poker again. I played poker for
number of years, not very well. I might start playing
(15:52):
a little bit at the River's poker room. Although the
problem with poker is it really frustrates me because I
should be great at it because it requires intelligence, but
I'm not very good at it.
Speaker 4 (16:03):
You know an idea I had.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Everybody wants to give people stuff for free, feed the poor, etc.
I was walking through the wheelhouse at the Rivers last night,
had a steak there and keeping with the awaken one
to eighty parameters, and I saw people leaving a lot
of food on their plates, like waffle fries and buffalo
chicken dip. Why not bring bums in off the street
and just let them eat off the plates. Once people
(16:26):
are done enough left the table. It wouldn't be real
good optics, but I've seen bums eat ravelly all out
of a can on the sidewalk on the south side. Really,
how different would this be? Not very Let's go to
Nick in the truck. Nick, you're on with double.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
M hey Mark.
Speaker 5 (16:42):
So Jerry sang his praise as an earlier Proshuido did
on DVE about Mike Tomlin. How no one is a
student of the game like he was.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
With the amount of film he washed and prepared.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
It reminds me of like a kid who is a
terrible baseball player and takes all of his time to
practice practice to eventually meet his peak at average at best.
So he watched a lot of film and prepared.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
No, no, I don't care.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
But Jerry is certainly entitled to his opinion as his
pursuit of But I've always said on this program that
the most overrated thing in the world is efforts. You
can try hard all you want, but at some point
you're gonna have the talent. Now, if effort enables you
to maximize your talent, that's a good thing. But I've
known athletes and people in any walk of life who
(17:28):
work minimally but have so much talent they're just destined
to success coming out of the womb and I trust
that guy before I trust a guy that isn't talented.
Speaker 4 (17:40):
But works hard to reach.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Like you said, mediocrity, Mike Tonwin didn't win a playoff
game in nine years. He got double figured in his
last five playoff games. I don't think he's anything close
Bah Hall of Famer. In fact, that goes so far
as to say, as I have said, that he's an
absolute fraud. But like kiss albums, everybody has one and
(18:03):
they're mostly stupid. Why'd I say kiss? I like kiss up?
Speaker 4 (18:06):
Next, talk to Joe one oh five nine.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Hey, find yourself needing a little post holiday cash infusion.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
Say no more the eggs as you're shot at extra cash. Oh, Mark,
Madden beat can eat you off.
Speaker 5 (18:20):
Time, Mark, I have to have a porn question for you.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
That right there, my friends, that's asking for trumpets.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
The ex at one.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Penguin's hosting The Hated Flyers tonight, joining me now to
talk about it. He covers the team for the Athletic
It is Josh, Joey Josh. One thing I like about
the Flyers these days, which is to say something that
I enjoy hating. Trevor Zegris is Philly's best player. It's
his first year there, and he's become a panamime villain
for the Penguins. He's like a chicken scratch, cheap shot guy,
(18:52):
and it makes the rivalry more fun.
Speaker 3 (18:55):
It certainly does, Mark, and I think for the last
few years the peng One's Flyers rivalry has not had
the same sizzle, not even close in fact. And maybe
that's because neither team has been particularly good. I don't know,
but I think the fact that they're both in a
fight for a playoff spot right now, and then you
throw in the Zegres factor, who the Penguins absolutely cannot stand.
(19:17):
I mean even to the point where like players in
the locker room like Connor Clifton are actually not afraid
to say in the press that they don't like him,
Like the Penguins don't ever do that. So he's clearly
gotten under their skin. And yeah, I think that adds
to the intensity of what already is a very important game.
Speaker 4 (19:34):
Now Zegres is playing well.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
On the other hand, talking can't get Mitchkov going the
mercurial Russian. He's a talent, but obviously a pain in
the backside.
Speaker 3 (19:46):
Yeah, he's got to be. And you know, I know,
there's a lot of fans in Philly who are very
critical of Talking for not playing him more and for
being too hard on him. You know, Talk's kind of
an old school guy, but Talks also no dummy, and
he has played with some of the great players of
all times. So Talk, while he might be, you know,
(20:07):
a tough guy from Canada as a hockey player, he
certainly appreciates skill on how important it is in today's game.
So if he's benching the guy a lot and not
always playing him, I think that tells you he's a
pain in the ass and that he has to grow up.
But Philly's never going to get anywhere without him. He
is their most gifted hockey player. But Mark, I've seen
(20:28):
him play in person numerous times, and there are some
games I don't even notice him literally, and that's a
real problem given the talent that that really has.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Why did the Penguins stop scoring Josh two goals in
three games and all were losses.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
You know, I think goaltending has something to do with it.
They were playing maybe the best goalie in the world
the other night. He was pretty darn good. I think
Sidney Crosby hasn't been very good in the last week,
and he still obviously carries the offense to a large
extent for the Penguins more than anything else, though, I
think Dan Muses has really made some mistakes with his
line configurations. I just don't like taking Malkoln away from
(21:07):
Braso and Mantha. I think those three work. I think
there's something of a proven commodity at this point. I
would leave them together, and I think there's a trickle
down effect that's really, you know, impacted the first and
third lines really because he's just not playing those three
guys together, which I don't understand. And there's also this
mark I've Ben Kendall, who's been wonderful all season. He's
(21:28):
done fourteen games without a goal, and he's not hurting
the Penguins because he's so darn good defensively, but they
still could use some production from him, no question.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
Yeah, I want to stay with Kendall for a second.
Is he hit a wall?
Speaker 1 (21:40):
And if so, that wouldn't you alarm me because he's
an eighteen year old rookie and I think he's still
playing good. But like you said, the production's not there,
and really the good moments they're there, but they're more sporadic.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
I think he is hitting a wall if I had
to guess, and he's such of an intelligent Cereb player
that yeah, he'll get away with it. Like I said,
he's not going to hurt you. But I was talking
to him the other day. I asked how his body
was holding up, and he said, eh, okay. He wasn't
real convincing the way he said it, And I said,
(22:14):
are you looking forward to the Olympic break? And his
eyes got kind of big. He said, oh yeah, that
just tells me he's a kid who needs a bit
of a rest. And listen, he's eighteen. He's not a
big kid to begin with. It's his first year of
life in the National Hockey League. I think that Olympic
break is actually going to be really good for the
Penguins in general and for Kendall specifically.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
Now getting back to Sid, I think he's played pretty
good even without the production these last three games.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
But I think he's passing up good shots.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
It's it's tough to question Sid in his method, but
like the other night against Tampa, Josh, he passed up
a great chance to try to set up Ryan Shay
back door.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Yeah, you and I were very alarmed by that in
the press box, and we see this with Sid every season.
I always say this, Mark, he's one of the greatest
players in the history of the sport, but in some
ways he's human and for whatever reason, his confidence with
his goal scoring with his shot isn't there right now.
And we see this every year from him. He goes
(23:12):
through a little slide. Well, he'll go six or seven
games without a goal and he's passing up shots. You
don't really understand why he's forcing passes. I think it's
just a confidence thing and he doesn't feel great with
his shot right now. It will come back. I'm sure
he's not playing bad hockey by any stretch. In fact,
he made one of the greatest passes I've ever seen
in my life in overtime to Brian Russ and I
(23:33):
set him up for a breakaway's I got backhand passed
from one hundred and twenty feet unbelievable. So he'll be fine, Mark,
And if ever there was a time for him to
break out of it. We know how he feels about
the Flyers and how he plays against them. Historically, he's
gone three games without a point. I would not bet
on it going to four.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yeah, he says he doesn't necessarily hate the Flyers, but
the numbers in his extra drive of that as possible
with sid when he plays Philadelphia indicates otherwise.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
The odd thing about this scoring slump, though, well, it's
not odd.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Defensively, they've been outstanding while they stopped scoring. But that's
what kind of not very good teams do. They can't
put everything together on many nights.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
Yeah, I would suggest the Penguins are just a highly
average hockey team. I'm not knocking them. They're better than
I thought they'd be, but average teams when they cheat
a little bit to score, they're going to give up
four goals tonight. And when they pack it in defensively
the way they did against Tampa, like I thought, they
played a really smart game against Tampa. I can't remember
one odd man rush they allowed all game until overtime,
(24:41):
so that they played smart hockey. But I just don't
know that they're good enough to produce offense regularly when
they play it that way, and that's their problem. So
they're not playing poorly. I actually like their game the
other night without Carlson, especially too. It's just it's so
much harder to generate offense without this version of Carlson
in the lineup. And I thought Crystal Tang played one
(25:03):
of his best games of the season against Tampa, and
that's really encouraging. They need him to be really, really
good if Carlson's out three weeks or whatever it's.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Going to be.
Speaker 3 (25:11):
They need him to play the way he did the
other night. But they're going to have to win a
lot of close games. They're not going to dominate many
people with how there are Carlson.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Well, the problem with Carlson's absence is the trickle down
as much as anything. Obviously, Josh, you want to have
Carlson out there the way he's played this year, in
particular for the Penguins, but Lok Tank can only play
so many minutes, saying Ivan, he had a great game,
But I mean, I don't think you're going to associate
the word great with him on too many nights. And
Connor Clifton, I mean, a dumb penalty be not that good?
Speaker 3 (25:42):
Well, yeah, I mean, I am reminded of a conversation
I had with Ben Lovejoy about ten years ago. He
was talking about minutes that defenseman play. He said, have
you ever noticed like Tanger is even better when he
plays thirty minutes a night. I said, yes, I have.
He said, well, I'm not like that, and most defensemen aren't.
He said, I'm a pretty good player. If I got
fourteen minutes a night, you give me like eighteen to twenty,
(26:02):
you're probably gonna have a problem. That's just the way
it is. And I think the Penguins have a lot
of defensemen that are in that cluss. I like Shane
San and Ivany is a pairing. I really do when
they're together. I think they're both good third pairing defensemen.
You don't want them playing twenty two minutes. Eventually they're
going to run into problems. So the faster Carlson gets back,
the better. And they just need Chris to turn back
(26:23):
the clock a little bit here the next couple of
weeks in it. Listen, he was good the other night.
He's been better lately in general with Kulak. They need
this version of Crystal Tang badly.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Skinner's and goal tonight, I think the goaltending has been
real good, you know, while they've not been scoring even
shilloffs the other night, except he let in the one
bad goal when he dropped the puck in his feet,
and then he sucked in the shootout, as he always
does one in five and shootouts.
Speaker 4 (26:48):
Eleven goals on sixteen shots. That's a lot of points lost.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
But as you heard me ask news after the game,
would you sub him out?
Speaker 4 (26:56):
And mus said no? And I just don't get it.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
I get it because I mean, respect is everything in
that dressing room, every hockey dressing room, and they don't
want to take it away from showoffs. But again, that's
a lot of points lost. It is.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
On the bright side, Skinner has been really good since
the new year. He has played four games since the
holiday break and he's given up four goals and exactly
one in each of those appearances. He's the best goaltender
right now. And if I were the Penguins, I would
start to ride him a little more. They're doing the
whole fifty to fifty thing that they did at the
beginning of the season, but she loves and Jari. It
(27:35):
worked for a while, but Jari was clearly the better goalie,
so they had to start playing him more and the
Penguins started winning more games when they did. I would
recommend the same thing from Skinner if we keep seeing
this version of him she loves has been better. I
think he's an okay backup, quite honestly, but I think
Skinner's the better goaltender, and he's not going to kill
you in shootouts. He might actually give you a chance.
(27:56):
He might be the worst goalie I've ever seen in shootouts.
Markets not just how many goals he allows, it's how
easy he makes it look for the opposition. It's like
they're shooting into an open net. He's not even coming
close to making this age. I've never seen anything quite
like it at the NHL level.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Josh, we've got breaking news mainson Heinsch was going to
stay at pitt They say he's locked in and JJ
Watt didn't like the Mike de Febo story because he
felt like that could have stayed in the dressing room.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
Oh god, wow, I thought.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
It was the perfect response. I thought it was a
brilliant story, no question. It made the dressing room come
to life.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
But you see, Josh, that's the problem we're headed for
in our business. Pretty soon, it's going to be all
athletes with every microphone, and they'll keep stuff like that
secret because they just don't think it's the public's business.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
That's right. And I've always viewed my job as you know,
I'm supposed to be the bridge from the public to
the locker room and vice versa. And unfortunately, you're right,
there's so many ex jocks who are more interested in
protecting the brotherhood. And I think that's an incredibly dangerous
thing for the world of sports journalism, if it even
still exists, and even more so for fans who sometimes
(29:07):
I don't want to see it that way, but I
think sometimes you need to know the truth as a
sports fan.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Yeah, JJ tweet. It feels like this moment could have
stayed in the dressing room. If I could speak to
JJ personally, I'd say, you tell him, Frank. Now, the
Penguins need to win tonight, don't they. I mean, you know,
they've lost three in a row. The Flyers have lost
four in a row. Flyers played last night Penguins where
idle Flyers lose to Buffalo, and the Flyers are a
(29:34):
team that are competing with the Penguins for playoffs, but
right now the same amount of points. I mean, never
mind the usual rivalry, never mind Trevor Ziegris, this is
a chance to kind of push the Flyers just a
little bit over the edge. I think.
Speaker 3 (29:50):
It's the biggest game of the season for the Penguins,
and I'm not saying that because of the rivalry. I'm
saying that because of the standings, Like we're like what
thirty seven games left. The Penguins are a couple of
points out of a playoff spot, and one of the
teams they're battling with that got them in their backyard tonight.
That alone makes it the biggest game of the year.
The fact that it's the Flyers add some sizzle. But
you're right, Philly played last night lost in Buffalo. Yeah, Frankly,
(30:15):
it's a game the Penguins should win. And I know
they're playing without Carlson, but you know, every team's banged
up right now, is playing without players. The Penguins have
their top goalie going tonight there at home. They you know, Yeah,
it's an absolutely massive game for the Penguins. I don't
think there's any other way to look at it. And
the schedule right now for them is fairly soft up
until the Olympic break and then it gets absolutely outrageously
(30:37):
difficult in March. They got to make up some ground,
right now, in the next two weeks, I'm telling you
that the only game that like looks like a loss
on their schedule right now for sure, is at Edmonton
next week. Other than that, the schedule is pretty soft
the next couple of weeks.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
Gosh, there's always great stuff we'll see at the rink.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
An honor to be on a show with this many
distinguished guests, Mark, thank you.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
That's right, Frank. Five nine.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
It's The Woody Show weekday mornings at six.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
One of five ninety x
These Steelers' coaching searches in progress, joining me now to
talk about it. He covers the team for the Post Caazette.
Always a pleasure to talk to, Jerry Dulac. Jerry, how
long will this process take and how many interviews will
be conducted? If I'm conning correctly, there's been like eight
lined up.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Yeah, I don't know if the numbers reached that high.
It was, well, lets let me say it is.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Mark.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
It reached five before I got started doing a number
of these radio hits and TV hits. But I'll go
with eight. But I will say this, they're a week
behind Mark because all the other firings occurred last week
by Tomlin was just two days ago when he stepped down,
So they're a week behind. Will they be able to
(00:44):
catch up? Well, yeah, they're going to have to, you know,
expedite the process. But I don't think that's going to effect.
They're not going to make a rash decision just to
hurry up to hire the person. You know, you look
at the past three hires, the latest one in the
calendar Chuck Noll, January twenty seventh. I don't think it's
(01:04):
going to be before then. But I think by the
first week of February. The one danger is you don't
want to miss out on a guy you know, and
if you're behind. I don't think that's going to happen.
I think one week you can catch up. But they
are a little bit behind the eight ball and they
will expedite. You know, the protocols are in place now,
(01:25):
market makes it. You know, there's a lot of boxes
to check before you even get down to the real interviews.
There's enough of them that slows the process a little bit.
But you know, I don't think it's going to be
a large deal that they started, you know, a week
later than most teams who.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Are the front runners. Give me a couple of names
you think have the most realistic shot.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
In your eyes, Mark, I really can't, but let me
say this because I don't like to play that game,
because I don't know yet. It's way too early in
the process. But I will say this, I do not
believe that they will hire a former NFL head coach
and unemployed NFL NFL head coach to be their head coach. Now,
(02:10):
the hire one as a coordinator, I think is a
great move. You know, Mike McDaniel to be your offensive
for for example. I'm not saying that's going to happen.
I'm just using that as an example. I think, you know,
when you look at their tempo for the you know,
since Chuck No a young thirty ish, young thirty guy
who was defensive minded. Now I'm not going to tell
(02:31):
you that it's going to be a defensive minded guy.
Probably is probably a good chance it will be. But
one thing I learned from Dan Ruddy is they will
hire the right person. And you look at Chuck No.
Though I know it's a different animal now between social
media and all the talking heads on television these days,
(02:53):
and especially with the NFL, but you know, Chuck No
was hired. He was a secondary coach with the Baltimore
Colts that Don Shula highly recommended. Bill Kawer was. You know,
he was a known coordinator with the Kansas City Chiefs.
I wouldn't call him the hot commodity, wasn't Ben Johnson
and Mike Tomlin was only one year as the defensive coordinator.
(03:16):
And you know they had two candidates in Russ Grimm
and Ken Wizenhunt in their discussions, you know, guys who
were on the current staff. But yet Mike Tomlin came
in and just blew them away in the interview process.
And Dan Rooney always said he wanted to hire the
(03:36):
right person, and I think that's what they're looking for.
With who they are going to hire, I would imagine
it's probably going to be like the past. It's going
to be a young guy that they can build with.
That's what they want to do. That's been their history.
It's obviously worked very well, and I think I think
they'll follow the same process. Bringing in the former NFL
(03:59):
coach me does nothing for them.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Mark Okay, I agree with that, except for one guy
I'd talked to Stefanski.
Speaker 4 (04:06):
He's forty three offensive.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Mind, it gets how the league is, had a great
defense in Cleveland too, knows the division. That would be
my one exception, and I think they're doing themselves a
disservice to not.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
At least consider.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah. Look, I'm not going to tell you that they
are or not going to, but I don't think that's
in their cards. I don't think that's the direction they
want to go. But I don't dispute what you said.
I think Kevin Stefanski is a good coach. He's had
to deal with that dysfunction in Cleveland. Yet despite having
the deal with that dysfunction, which is the Browns and
(04:41):
the Jets are right at the top of the league
when it comes to dysfunction, he still wasn't able to
overcome it enough. I know who he was in a
division with the Steelers and the Ravens and even the
Bengals with Joe Burrow. But I don't think that's the
direction they want to go.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
We're talking to Jerry Dulac from the because that brought
to us by bud Light, easy to drink in, easy
to enjoy. Now, Art said, competing is the intent and
no wasted years. I get it, that's always been their focus.
But boy, Jerry, I can't help but think they could
do with the six and ten year or six and
eleven now, because that's how they got Ben.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
You know Mark, Yeah, when he's you know, when he
said that, it made it sound as though he would
rather be content competitive and have a shot than advance
in the playoffs, and of course that's not the case.
But his point is they were always competitive under Mike
Tommin They you know, eight division titles, you know, you
know the whole story, one hundred and ninety three wins,
(05:45):
and he would take that being competitive and to use
his words, have a shot rather than have six and ten,
six and eleven in the case, maybe five and twelve
or whenever the bottom falls out. And so that's his point.
I mean, I get it. The problem is, you know,
nine years without a playoff win, seven losses in a row,
(06:06):
nine to one and done. That's what's frustrated a lot
of the fan base. I mean, there's not even one
win in there, which is what they were hoping to
accomplish this year by bringing in Aaron Rodgers and it
didn't happen, and so that that's you know, that's where
the frustration lies with the people who wanted to see
a change. And I don't blame them. I don't blame them.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
A lot of players specifically loved playing for Tomlin, wanted
to play for tom win. That's why Rogers came here.
How will Tomlin's departure affect the roster makeup? I'm sure
Rogers won't be back.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Yeah, Aaron Rodgers won't be back. Mark And even if
Mike Tomlin stayed, I think the loss to the Texas
stealed that deal. He came in for one year. They
brought him in to hopefully win a playoff game and
maybe start to get something going in the postseason, and
when that didn't happen, they were just you know, they
were going up on the plan B. So I expect
(07:00):
them back after that loss anyhow. But Mike Tomlin being gone,
he's the person who wanted him. He's the reason why
Aaron Rodgers came. And with him not here, that's it's
a foregone conclusion. He won't be back. They're gonna make
some changes, Mark. I don't think they're going to overhaul.
They just don't do that. But if you look at
the last two years, how active they been in free
(07:21):
agency and with trades. That roster has turned over a
lot in the last two years, and I expect it
to happen again. And you have some decisions with some
older players. You know, it's you get to the point
where you say, okay, we can finish last with them,
or we can find not that they finished last, but okay,
we cannot win a playoff game with them. We cannot
(07:43):
win a playoff game without them. So you know, it
gets to that point. You don't, though, have to make
a decision on Cam Hayward despite the fact that he
had an outstanding year. You know, are you going to
keep Jalen Ramsey, John new Smith, guys you brought in
to cost a lot of money. Are you going to
stick with them when what you are doing isn't working now?
(08:04):
Mike Tomlin fell on the sword if you will. You
know when he told the players in the meeting, Look,
I haven't gotten the best out of you. I haven't
been able to get you guys over the hump. Give
them credit for the unselfish self analysis. But you know
that that's the truth. And so it's it's is it?
(08:26):
The coach is the common denominator. But you have to
look at the roster and I think you'll see I
think you'll see some overhaul, not not a blow up.
They don't believe in that. They've been in the playoffs
five the last six years, so they're not more abund
But I think you'll see them continue to make changes
because they're not going to sit there and say we're
satisfied with our roster.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
What do I do with Watt is average annel Value's
forty one million, one hundred eight million was guaranteed upon signing.
He's clearly and obviously in decline, I knew that contract
was a mistake and he said he only wants to
play for Tom. When now he's got a contract, it's
not really his choice, you know who he plays for.
And on that Tom was left. But what's gonna happen
(09:07):
with him? Will he be back?
Speaker 4 (09:08):
For sure?
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Well, Mark, they kind of the ship kind of sailed
last year. They missed not to use the same analogy.
They missed the boat last year when they could have
dealt him, and I will tell you that was that
was something they that they had thought about. But instead
they gave him the big deal because you know, well,
because he's t J Watt and what he's been, what
he had done, and you know they didn't believe he
(09:33):
was finished. But you saw again this year that that
turns out to be not a smart business decision, which
they were aware of committing that kind of money for
five years to a guy who was going to be
thirty one. So at this point, you know you're going
to trade him. You won't get for him this year
what you would have gotten for him last year, meaning
probably a number one draft pick, but you won't get
(09:56):
that now. I don't think so his value is not
you know, this isn't Micah Parsons. So if you could
get that, you know, and get somewhat, you know, off
the hook to a degree with his contract.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Jared, I think you'd have trouble trading him for anything.
I think his performance in that contract makes him untradable.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Now, well, the contract is what makes him untradable. But
I'm just saying last year, before the contract, you could
have gotten away with that, and you probably could have
gotten a top pick for him. But that's why I
say that ship has sailed and I don't see that happening.
So now what do you do? Either way, you got
to bite the bullet and they'll keep them because they're
(10:36):
on the hope for that amount of money. So if
that's the case, I mean, it's not like he's thirty nine.
You know, they'll keep them and hope they get you know,
the old production out of him. Next year, you know,
at age thirty two, who's.
Speaker 4 (10:50):
Going to be the quarterback? What direction do they go
in then?
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Because clearly they got to draft the long term guy,
but I'm not sure sure that presents itself in this
year's draft.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Well, Mark, and that's what's going to play out here.
That's their intention, That doesn't mean that's what's going to happen,
and so then you know they'll take a look at
Will Howard. The last thing they want to do is
bring in a six different quarterback for.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
The in the past six years.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
That is not on their radar at all. They know
they have to get started with a with the next
quote franchise quarterback, and so they're hoping to accomplish that
this year. I don't know if they can. That's but
that's what we're going to find out.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
See, Jerry, I would just go if you can't draft
the guy, I just go with with Rudolph and Howard
and Thrus stuff at the wall and see what sticks
in the interim.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Well, I think the the option there would be they
would take the look at Will Howard first to see
if whatever they thought they had in him. And the
understand mark is, you know, he's a six round pick,
so it's not exactly like they thought they were drafting
a franchise quarterback, but they do like them, and so
you know what, take a look. You know, that was
the problem of not seeing him in a preseason where
(12:03):
they can at least make some evaluation in a game,
not in practice in a game, and he didn't even
have a lot of practice with them for a long
time as well. So that's where they are behind on
evaluating Will Howard. But he will be part of taking
a look at him, and I would imagine they'll bring
(12:24):
Mason Rudolph back. But yeah, that's curious to see how
that's going to play out. But I know what their
intention is, Mark, but it doesn't mean that's going to
be the case.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
Finally, Jerry, and I think I know the answer. Bit.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
Was Art Rooney really surprised when Tomlin quit? And was
there any acrimony at all between the two?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
No, not at all, Mark, I've never got any indication
there was. As you heard Art Rooney say he was
tending to talk to him about twenty twenty six, and
you know, and it never got to that conversation because
Tomlin delivered that bombshell. And in retrospect, Mark I would
have been I wouldn't have been as surprised if the
(13:06):
Steelers cut ways and part of ways with Mike Tomlin
rather than Mike Tomlin stepping down when I look at it,
think about it in retrospect, when I know the type
of coach and the type of guy Mike Tomlin is.
You know, Mark, this guy, he's a football junkie. He
watches If there's a coach in the National Football League
(13:26):
who watches more film than him, I want to meet him.
This is a guy, My god, He loves OTAs. He
talks all the time about embracing challenges. He tells his
players all the time, you run to the fire and
not away from it. And so I'm not saying I
can't believe that he's stepping away for any other reason.
(13:48):
I don't think he has any diabetical plan in his mind, like, hey, look,
I'll take a powder this year. I'm walking away from
sixteen or seventeen million, but I'll be a free agent
after the twenty twenty sixth season and I could go
get a John Harbaugh contract that averages twenty million dollars
a year, which he would. I don't think that's what
(14:09):
was his plan at all. But that's but all what
I said is why I expect him to be on
an NFL sideline. Again, I don't know that, but knowing him,
if I had to guess, that's what we'll see.
Speaker 4 (14:21):
Jerry.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Great stuff is always good work at the PG. We'll
talk again soon.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Thanks Mark, good chat with you, my friend.
Speaker 4 (14:27):
That's Jerry Do.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
I brought us by Bud White segment before brought to
us by Danny's peach and hogies on route a day
to Bethel Park, and that actually strikes me as a
rather good combination. We got all kinds of guests today,
Yoe talking hockey at the bottom of the hour. At
four o'clock the return of the King of Old School,
John Steigerwald will be in studio, and at four point
thirty former Penguins coach Michelle Terrion.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
They say they care. I know they don't. What oh
five ninety X, here's your.
Speaker 2 (14:58):
Big fan, Mark, And after the gallon at like the
Mark Madden, what do you want?
Speaker 4 (15:02):
What do you want?
Speaker 5 (15:02):
Damn it?
Speaker 2 (15:03):
The X at one oh five nine, I.
Speaker 4 (15:08):
Forgot to plug.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
It's time for calls on the fifteen styal aight three
three four one two wxdx eight three three four one
two w xdx. We got Josh Joey talking Penguins in
just a few moments. I was down at the River's
Casino last night, won thirty bucks playing blackjack, only played
for about twenty minutes. I had dinner, watched the first
(15:30):
period of the Flyers game. They lost a Buffalo four
to one. Flyers with a four game losing streak, which
is how I like it. Coming into tonight's visit the
Pittsburgh we got the Hockey Night Show talking about that
at five thirty, got Yowei talking about that at three thirty.
I'm thinking about playing poker again. I played poker for
number of years, not very well. I might start playing
(15:52):
a little bit at the River's poker room. Although the
problem with poker is it really frustrates me because I
should be great at it because it requires intelligence, but
I'm not very good at it.
Speaker 4 (16:03):
You know an idea I had.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Everybody wants to give people stuff for free, feed the poor, etc.
I was walking through the wheelhouse at the Rivers last night,
had a steak there and keeping with the awaken one
to eighty parameters, and I saw people leaving a lot
of food on their plates, like waffle fries and buffalo
chicken dip. Why not bring bums in off the street
and just let them eat off the plates. Once people
(16:26):
are done enough left the table. It wouldn't be real
good optics, but I've seen bums eat ravelly all out
of a can on the sidewalk on the south side. Really,
how different would this be? Not very Let's go to
Nick in the truck. Nick, you're on with double.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
M hey Mark.
Speaker 5 (16:42):
So Jerry sang his praise as an earlier Proshuido did
on DVE about Mike Tomlin. How no one is a
student of the game like he was.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
With the amount of film he washed and prepared.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
It reminds me of like a kid who is a
terrible baseball player and takes all of his time to
practice practice to eventually meet his peak at average at best.
So he watched a lot of film and prepared.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
No, no, I don't care.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
But Jerry is certainly entitled to his opinion as his
pursuit of But I've always said on this program that
the most overrated thing in the world is efforts. You
can try hard all you want, but at some point
you're gonna have the talent. Now, if effort enables you
to maximize your talent, that's a good thing. But I've
known athletes and people in any walk of life who
(17:28):
work minimally but have so much talent they're just destined
to success coming out of the womb and I trust
that guy before I trust a guy that isn't talented.
Speaker 4 (17:40):
But works hard to reach.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Like you said, mediocrity, Mike Tonwin didn't win a playoff
game in nine years. He got double figured in his
last five playoff games. I don't think he's anything close
Bah Hall of Famer. In fact, that goes so far
as to say, as I have said, that he's an
absolute fraud. But like kiss albums, everybody has one and
(18:03):
they're mostly stupid. Why'd I say kiss? I like kiss up?
Speaker 4 (18:06):
Next, talk to Joe one oh five nine.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
Hey, find yourself needing a little post holiday cash infusion.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
Say no more the eggs as you're shot at extra cash. Oh, Mark,
Madden beat can eat you off.
Speaker 5 (18:20):
Time, Mark, I have to have a porn question for you.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
That right there, my friends, that's asking for trumpets.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
The ex at one.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Penguin's hosting The Hated Flyers tonight, joining me now to
talk about it. He covers the team for the Athletic
It is Josh, Joey Josh. One thing I like about
the Flyers these days, which is to say something that
I enjoy hating. Trevor Zegris is Philly's best player. It's
his first year there, and he's become a panamime villain
for the Penguins. He's like a chicken scratch, cheap shot guy,
(18:52):
and it makes the rivalry more fun.
Speaker 3 (18:55):
It certainly does, Mark, and I think for the last
few years the peng One's Flyers rivalry has not had
the same sizzle, not even close in fact. And maybe
that's because neither team has been particularly good. I don't know,
but I think the fact that they're both in a
fight for a playoff spot right now, and then you
throw in the Zegres factor, who the Penguins absolutely cannot stand.
(19:17):
I mean even to the point where like players in
the locker room like Connor Clifton are actually not afraid
to say in the press that they don't like him,
Like the Penguins don't ever do that. So he's clearly
gotten under their skin. And yeah, I think that adds
to the intensity of what already is a very important game.
Speaker 4 (19:34):
Now Zegres is playing well.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
On the other hand, talking can't get Mitchkov going the
mercurial Russian. He's a talent, but obviously a pain in
the backside.
Speaker 3 (19:46):
Yeah, he's got to be. And you know, I know,
there's a lot of fans in Philly who are very
critical of Talking for not playing him more and for
being too hard on him. You know, Talk's kind of
an old school guy, but Talks also no dummy, and
he has played with some of the great players of
all times. So Talk, while he might be, you know,
(20:07):
a tough guy from Canada as a hockey player, he
certainly appreciates skill on how important it is in today's game.
So if he's benching the guy a lot and not
always playing him, I think that tells you he's a
pain in the ass and that he has to grow up.
But Philly's never going to get anywhere without him. He
is their most gifted hockey player. But Mark, I've seen
(20:28):
him play in person numerous times, and there are some
games I don't even notice him literally, and that's a
real problem given the talent that that really has.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Why did the Penguins stop scoring Josh two goals in
three games and all were losses.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
You know, I think goaltending has something to do with it.
They were playing maybe the best goalie in the world
the other night. He was pretty darn good. I think
Sidney Crosby hasn't been very good in the last week,
and he still obviously carries the offense to a large
extent for the Penguins more than anything else, though, I
think Dan Muses has really made some mistakes with his
line configurations. I just don't like taking Malkoln away from
(21:07):
Braso and Mantha. I think those three work. I think
there's something of a proven commodity at this point. I
would leave them together, and I think there's a trickle
down effect that's really, you know, impacted the first and
third lines really because he's just not playing those three
guys together, which I don't understand. And there's also this
mark I've Ben Kendall, who's been wonderful all season. He's
(21:28):
done fourteen games without a goal, and he's not hurting
the Penguins because he's so darn good defensively, but they
still could use some production from him, no question.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
Yeah, I want to stay with Kendall for a second.
Is he hit a wall?
Speaker 1 (21:40):
And if so, that wouldn't you alarm me because he's
an eighteen year old rookie and I think he's still
playing good. But like you said, the production's not there,
and really the good moments they're there, but they're more sporadic.
Speaker 3 (21:54):
I think he is hitting a wall if I had
to guess, and he's such of an intelligent Cereb player
that yeah, he'll get away with it. Like I said,
he's not going to hurt you. But I was talking
to him the other day. I asked how his body
was holding up, and he said, eh, okay. He wasn't
real convincing the way he said it, And I said,
(22:14):
are you looking forward to the Olympic break? And his
eyes got kind of big. He said, oh yeah, that
just tells me he's a kid who needs a bit
of a rest. And listen, he's eighteen. He's not a
big kid to begin with. It's his first year of
life in the National Hockey League. I think that Olympic
break is actually going to be really good for the
Penguins in general and for Kendall specifically.
Speaker 1 (22:33):
Now getting back to Sid, I think he's played pretty
good even without the production these last three games.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
But I think he's passing up good shots.
Speaker 1 (22:42):
It's it's tough to question Sid in his method, but
like the other night against Tampa, Josh, he passed up
a great chance to try to set up Ryan Shay
back door.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Yeah, you and I were very alarmed by that in
the press box, and we see this with Sid every season.
I always say this, Mark, he's one of the greatest
players in the history of the sport, but in some
ways he's human and for whatever reason, his confidence with
his goal scoring with his shot isn't there right now.
And we see this every year from him. He goes
(23:12):
through a little slide. Well, he'll go six or seven
games without a goal and he's passing up shots. You
don't really understand why he's forcing passes. I think it's
just a confidence thing and he doesn't feel great with
his shot right now. It will come back. I'm sure
he's not playing bad hockey by any stretch. In fact,
he made one of the greatest passes I've ever seen
in my life in overtime to Brian Russ and I
(23:33):
set him up for a breakaway's I got backhand passed
from one hundred and twenty feet unbelievable. So he'll be fine, Mark,
And if ever there was a time for him to
break out of it. We know how he feels about
the Flyers and how he plays against them. Historically, he's
gone three games without a point. I would not bet
on it going to four.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yeah, he says he doesn't necessarily hate the Flyers, but
the numbers in his extra drive of that as possible
with sid when he plays Philadelphia indicates otherwise.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
The odd thing about this scoring slump, though, well, it's
not odd.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Defensively, they've been outstanding while they stopped scoring. But that's
what kind of not very good teams do. They can't
put everything together on many nights.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
Yeah, I would suggest the Penguins are just a highly
average hockey team. I'm not knocking them. They're better than
I thought they'd be, but average teams when they cheat
a little bit to score, they're going to give up
four goals tonight. And when they pack it in defensively
the way they did against Tampa, like I thought, they
played a really smart game against Tampa. I can't remember
one odd man rush they allowed all game until overtime,
(24:41):
so that they played smart hockey. But I just don't
know that they're good enough to produce offense regularly when
they play it that way, and that's their problem. So
they're not playing poorly. I actually like their game the
other night without Carlson, especially too. It's just it's so
much harder to generate offense without this version of Carlson
in the lineup. And I thought Crystal Tang played one
(25:03):
of his best games of the season against Tampa, and
that's really encouraging. They need him to be really, really
good if Carlson's out three weeks or whatever it's.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Going to be.
Speaker 3 (25:11):
They need him to play the way he did the
other night. But they're going to have to win a
lot of close games. They're not going to dominate many
people with how there are Carlson.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Well, the problem with Carlson's absence is the trickle down
as much as anything. Obviously, Josh, you want to have
Carlson out there the way he's played this year, in
particular for the Penguins, but Lok Tank can only play
so many minutes, saying Ivan, he had a great game,
But I mean, I don't think you're going to associate
the word great with him on too many nights. And
Connor Clifton, I mean, a dumb penalty be not that good?
Speaker 3 (25:42):
Well, yeah, I mean, I am reminded of a conversation
I had with Ben Lovejoy about ten years ago. He
was talking about minutes that defenseman play. He said, have
you ever noticed like Tanger is even better when he
plays thirty minutes a night. I said, yes, I have.
He said, well, I'm not like that, and most defensemen aren't.
He said, I'm a pretty good player. If I got
fourteen minutes a night, you give me like eighteen to twenty,
(26:02):
you're probably gonna have a problem. That's just the way
it is. And I think the Penguins have a lot
of defensemen that are in that cluss. I like Shane
San and Ivany is a pairing. I really do when
they're together. I think they're both good third pairing defensemen.
You don't want them playing twenty two minutes. Eventually they're
going to run into problems. So the faster Carlson gets back,
the better. And they just need Chris to turn back
(26:23):
the clock a little bit here the next couple of
weeks in it. Listen, he was good the other night.
He's been better lately in general with Kulak. They need
this version of Crystal Tang badly.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Skinner's and goal tonight, I think the goaltending has been
real good, you know, while they've not been scoring even
shilloffs the other night, except he let in the one
bad goal when he dropped the puck in his feet,
and then he sucked in the shootout, as he always
does one in five and shootouts.
Speaker 4 (26:48):
Eleven goals on sixteen shots. That's a lot of points lost.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
But as you heard me ask news after the game,
would you sub him out?
Speaker 4 (26:56):
And mus said no? And I just don't get it.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
I get it because I mean, respect is everything in
that dressing room, every hockey dressing room, and they don't
want to take it away from showoffs. But again, that's
a lot of points lost. It is.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
On the bright side, Skinner has been really good since
the new year. He has played four games since the
holiday break and he's given up four goals and exactly
one in each of those appearances. He's the best goaltender
right now. And if I were the Penguins, I would
start to ride him a little more. They're doing the
whole fifty to fifty thing that they did at the
beginning of the season, but she loves and Jari. It
(27:35):
worked for a while, but Jari was clearly the better goalie,
so they had to start playing him more and the
Penguins started winning more games when they did. I would
recommend the same thing from Skinner if we keep seeing
this version of him she loves has been better. I
think he's an okay backup, quite honestly, but I think
Skinner's the better goaltender, and he's not going to kill
you in shootouts. He might actually give you a chance.
(27:56):
He might be the worst goalie I've ever seen in shootouts.
Markets not just how many goals he allows, it's how
easy he makes it look for the opposition. It's like
they're shooting into an open net. He's not even coming
close to making this age. I've never seen anything quite
like it at the NHL level.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Josh, we've got breaking news mainson Heinsch was going to
stay at pitt They say he's locked in and JJ
Watt didn't like the Mike de Febo story because he
felt like that could have stayed in the dressing room.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
Oh god, wow, I thought.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
It was the perfect response. I thought it was a
brilliant story, no question. It made the dressing room come
to life.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
But you see, Josh, that's the problem we're headed for
in our business. Pretty soon, it's going to be all
athletes with every microphone, and they'll keep stuff like that
secret because they just don't think it's the public's business.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
That's right. And I've always viewed my job as you know,
I'm supposed to be the bridge from the public to
the locker room and vice versa. And unfortunately, you're right,
there's so many ex jocks who are more interested in
protecting the brotherhood. And I think that's an incredibly dangerous
thing for the world of sports journalism, if it even
still exists, and even more so for fans who sometimes
(29:07):
I don't want to see it that way, but I
think sometimes you need to know the truth as a
sports fan.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Yeah, JJ tweet. It feels like this moment could have
stayed in the dressing room. If I could speak to
JJ personally, I'd say, you tell him, Frank. Now, the
Penguins need to win tonight, don't they. I mean, you know,
they've lost three in a row. The Flyers have lost
four in a row. Flyers played last night Penguins where
idle Flyers lose to Buffalo, and the Flyers are a
(29:34):
team that are competing with the Penguins for playoffs, but
right now the same amount of points. I mean, never
mind the usual rivalry, never mind Trevor Ziegris, this is
a chance to kind of push the Flyers just a
little bit over the edge. I think.
Speaker 3 (29:50):
It's the biggest game of the season for the Penguins,
and I'm not saying that because of the rivalry. I'm
saying that because of the standings, Like we're like what
thirty seven games left. The Penguins are a couple of
points out of a playoff spot, and one of the
teams they're battling with that got them in their backyard tonight.
That alone makes it the biggest game of the year.
The fact that it's the Flyers add some sizzle. But
you're right, Philly played last night lost in Buffalo. Yeah, Frankly,
(30:15):
it's a game the Penguins should win. And I know
they're playing without Carlson, but you know, every team's banged
up right now, is playing without players. The Penguins have
their top goalie going tonight there at home. They you know, Yeah,
it's an absolutely massive game for the Penguins. I don't
think there's any other way to look at it. And
the schedule right now for them is fairly soft up
until the Olympic break and then it gets absolutely outrageously
(30:37):
difficult in March. They got to make up some ground,
right now, in the next two weeks, I'm telling you
that the only game that like looks like a loss
on their schedule right now for sure, is at Edmonton
next week. Other than that, the schedule is pretty soft
the next couple of weeks.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
Gosh, there's always great stuff we'll see at the rink.
Speaker 3 (30:53):
An honor to be on a show with this many
distinguished guests, Mark, thank you.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
That's right, Frank. Five nine.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
It's The Woody Show weekday mornings at six.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
One of five ninety x
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