The Prime Minister's signalling he'd prefer a one-party Government, rather than a coalition.
Parties appear to be moving closer to campaign mode, announcing policies ahead of Election Day on November seventh.
The Government's also promising further cost-savings to be re-invested into the frontline ahead of this year's Budget.
Christopher Luxon told Kerre Woodham New Zealand First Leader Winston Peters could work with Labour – something he calls a risk.
He says if push comes to shove, he can work with ACT and New Zealand First.
And although National’s campaigning on raising the retirement age, it seems as though not everyone is on board.
A major OECD report is the latest to call for the age of eligibility for Superannuation to increase.
Luxon told Woodham the age should be 67, and it will be an election policy.
He says they'd want to do it as soon as they get in for a second term, but other parties need to come on board and say it's a good idea too.
Meanwhile, Labour's leader has said the party's open to a conversation with other political parties about potentially means-testing the pension.
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Kerry Wood and Morning's podcast from
News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be right.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
You are one hundred and eighty three sleeps till election
twenty twenty six. Right, you're looking forward to it, aren't you.
I'm looking forward to We've got the Prime minister inside
there, there we go, have we got the there we go? Yeah,
one hundred and eighty three sleeps to the election. It
doesn't seem three years that we were sitting here while
you were campaigning.
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Gee.
Speaker 5 (00:28):
It goes fast, doesn't it.
Speaker 6 (00:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (00:30):
I mean these three year terms in New Zealand are
pretty short and there's a lot to do. Still.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Yeah, there's as much to do as when you were
campaigning saying there's a lot to do.
Speaker 5 (00:39):
Well, there is. I mean, there's so much that we
can do to improve this country. I mean we've got
so much great potential in it and it's important that
we solved the problems to get on with it.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Potential, potential, potential. But you know, you promised it was
the economy stupid. You said, get us in here, where
the grown ups, we'll fix it. Nobody feels fixed.
Speaker 5 (00:54):
Well, look, I mean no, I get it. You know,
people have been really dealing with the cost of levine.
We're all over it. Let's be clear. We've had COVID,
We've had weather events, We've had Trump's tariffs, we've had
narrow oil Christus from the last No, I'm not making
I'm not saying they are excuses, but I'm just saying
those are the cards that we've been dealt with, and
we have to do the right thing and work our
way through each of those things. They're incredibly frustrating. We're
(01:16):
all tired, we're all over it, and we're all grumpy
about it. I get it. But my job is to
make sure I get New Zealand through this later set
of crisis, which is around the fuel crisis in particular.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
You know the borrowings. Your government's borrowing more well than
labor ever did.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
Yeah, I mean what we have to do is find
the right balance where we actually need to continue to
support New Zealanders with really good public services. And you
could say, on one hand, I could go cut all
this cost out and put New Zealand to what we
call austerity, and that would make New Zealand go backwards.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
So Ruth Richardson Starbuck.
Speaker 5 (01:48):
Equally, you could carry on doing what labour proposed, which
is spare more, tax more, borrow more and just crank
it up. But actually we've used up the rainy Day
fund and we've mixed out the credit cards and now
the international focus saying you've got to be a bit
careful about all of that. So we've found a middle
way through, which is to say, look, we're going to
keep making savings and the back off of the government
and put that money into the front office. That's why
(02:09):
we've got two thousand more nurses, that's why we've got
six hundred more doctors, a lot of those good.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Things, and you have to borrow to pay for those.
Speaker 5 (02:16):
Yeah, but also we're bending the borrowing down as a
percentage of the economy. You know, that's really the pathway
that we've got to get on too, because one of
the big lessons is that you know, you can spend
up big time like you saw in COVID, but then
you have a lot of long term pain and you
actually have a massive hangover after the big party, and
we have been probably the second worst economy in the
Western world. Its actually what was so much money was
(02:39):
spent during COVID. Now we've got such a big hangover
and been so slow coming out of it all. And
that's what we've been wrestling with the last two years.
High inflation, high interest rates, negative growth.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
There's been a lot of talk about a Grand Coalition
because I think people are realize that ideology is a
luxury we simply don't have we need. If you politicians
who say that you go into politics for the good
of the country really mean that you would work together
to get us out of the crap.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
Well, I'll just say there's three things about the Grand Coalition.
One is labor didn't deliver anything in that six year period.
We've got real issues with their ability to deliver.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
See delivered houses?
Speaker 5 (03:18):
Well, well did they? They actually drove up house prices
thirty percent in a single year, that rents went up
one hundred and eighty dollars a week, and there was
actually but they did actually a lot more people on
state house waitlist, all that sort of stuff, and we've actually,
I'll put our record on housing up against there's any date.
But I just say delivery is a problem. They want
to tax more, spend more, borrow more. And then thirdly,
they haven't even supported the basic stuff where we've tried
(03:39):
to reach out with them on bipartisanship, education, infrastructure plans,
you know, gang patches, you know all those things. They
just haven't supported. Even low you know, tax relief for
lower middle income working New Zealanders, they didn't support that.
So I was clear at the beginning of the year
to say, look, you know, I think the only answer
is you've got to get a national lead government. That's
why I'll make the case all the way through the
(03:59):
year about you know, two ticks Blue. I've said, if
I have push comes to shove, I can work with
ACT in New Zealand first, as I've Dems traded over
the last few years. But I'm not working with Labor
to party Mario or the Greens.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Not even on coming together on specifically.
Speaker 5 (04:12):
Well, we'll continue to do that. I mean on education.
We reached out to Labor to talk about, hey, we
should make education in New Zealand thing not a party thing.
Talking about that superannuation, we'd love to talk to them
about that, particularly about lifting the age requirement, lifting the
contribution rates. There's a lot of things that we could
do there, so we'll keep reaching out about that.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
He would be open to talking about the superannuation.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
Great and we look forward to that because certainly Labor
and his Zellan first have been against lifting the retirement
age to the level that you see in other countries.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
How far do you trust Winston?
Speaker 5 (04:44):
Well, look, I've been able to work with them. I
trust him inside a coalition lead government. That's actually about
by the National Peace.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
On the radio. But Christopher LX and.
Speaker 5 (04:55):
But you know as a party, you know he'll make
his own decision about ultimately you know who he wants
to go with after an election. But I've said I
can work with them, and I've demonstrated I can do that.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Do you believe the that if you get thirty six
and Labor gets thirty six in the election, that Winston
Peters is yours and rules alone? Or do you think
he's going to be going where the best.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
I would in history would say that's something that is
Winston will have his own views on that ultimately. And
that's why I say, if you want to don't want
to put it at risk, you've got to vote.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
National Anna asks has the government considered passing legislation to
freeze MP's pay during this cost of living in fuel crisis?
If not, why not?
Speaker 5 (05:35):
Look the real problem with that is that if you
have MPs or prime ministers determining people's pay in terms
and conditions in parliament, that's not what you want. You
don't want MPs anywhere near their pay terms conditions. So
we put that into an independent remuneration authority. They make
those decisions, and I think that's the way it should
be at arm's length, because as soon as you do that,
(05:55):
what you then encounter is what happened last time, was
then all of a sudden, there's a massive increase at
some point down the road. Rather than letting an independent
body make those decisions, where are.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
We stop saying? Actually, if they're saying we still have
a big shortage of nurses, wait five weeks to get
a doctor's appointment, nurses and one and we have been
waiting two years for their pack bay and still haven't.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
Got it, well, we have actually hired twenty one hundred
extra nurses and what we had just twenty four months ago.
When we came to power, we put a big focus
on that we're actually supporting our nurses to go on
and become nurse prescribers, nurse practitioners so they can do
more of the tasks of GPS, and we're actually supporting
young people to carry on with that study. We've actually
(06:38):
put more investment into the GP practice than any government.
We've put one hundred and seventy five million dollars another
fourteen percent increase into the payments to GPS. We've opened
up twenty four to seven digital health. We've said to
people we should have twelve month prescription so you don't
go back to the doctor every three months, clogging up
the system just to get a repeat prescription, so that
(06:59):
we actually see more people. So I think there's a
lot of work that we are doing in primary care.
We know that that's where we want to put more
of our vent and so we want to see nurses.
And we've opened up a third medical school. We're building
that right now, and that's designed to get doctors out
into the regional New Zealand. We've said to people that
are in New Zealand that have been qualified as doctors
from overseas that actually we can accelerate your conversion course.
(07:23):
And we've actually got a number of doctors into GP
practices already. So there's a lot more for us to do.
I get it, you know, but you've actually got to
get a system response and a change to how we
get more people having access to GPS.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
I've started with questions. Feel free to put jewels to
the Prime Minister. Who is yours for the next forty
five minutes, Wendy, are very good morning to you.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Good morning, Carie, good morning, Chris.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
Good a, Wendy. How are you very good?
Speaker 4 (07:48):
Very good teams listen. One question I've got for you.
So one criticism you, criticism you often get is that
you're more of a CEO than a traditional politician, coming
from the corporate world and South, I actually see the
strengths in that. You know, building teams, delegating well, and
keeping coalition partners together isn't business. What's the biggest thing
(08:09):
you've had to learn that's surprised you about leading a
country versus leading a company.
Speaker 5 (08:15):
What a great question. This is an awesome question, Wendy. No,
I love this one.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
I was going to ask exactly that it must be
a hell of a lot easier being a CEO than.
Speaker 5 (08:22):
A pure Yeah, I think it is. I mean, they're
completely different jobs, and Wendy's exactly right. They're actually I
feel like I was really good at playing rugby and
now I've had to come and play soccer, do you
know what I mean? They're actually different games, but there
are things, Wendy that are common to both of them.
As you understand, Actually, how do you get the best
out of the talent that you've got in the team
that you've got, And that is about putting the right
people on the right assignment at the right time, with
(08:43):
enough clarity but also support but also challenge at times
as well. And I think i've you know that that
skill set has actually been very useful coming into this job.
The bit that's challenging is obviously everything you're doing is
in front of the public and the media all the time.
And for someone who's not a career politician, you know,
I came here four or five years ago into the job,
(09:04):
and I came because I really think, actually there's a
lot of skills that actually are needed that come from
that CEO kind of world, like we need to execute
and to manage things better than what we've been doing.
But I fully admit the other two different tasks, and
there is a lot of things that are common around
leadership and how you get your team built and how
you get them performing. That's very very common and very familiar.
(09:26):
But the other bits are certainly that twenty four to seven.
You make mistakes in front of the media, You don't
get it right all the time, you don't express yourself
perfectly in my case and soundbites, and I promise you
I probably will carry on expressing myself and perfectly going
forward as well, and I apologize for that upfront. But
I think at this time, you know, actually someone who
understands the economy and commercials, as hard as it is,
(09:46):
as frustrating as it is for everybody, is actually what
New Zealand needs right now.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
Yet you're just going to I guess you've got to
get that projected across to the public. You know, I
understand what you're doing and I get it right, but
there's so many that don't, and I hate to see
a change. You know, you've got a great team of
(10:12):
people around you, and yeah, you've got great negotiation skills
all of that side of things, which is what we
need right now. And you're managing I think you're managing
the fuel crisis excellently. But people want to create. They
don't trust it. They want it to it to be
you know a big issue for us, right But it's
(10:34):
managed smoothly and there is no issue, but people try
and make an issue the whole full poppy syndrome a
little bit. But yeah, people just need to relax. But anyway, look,
keep up the good work and look here come November.
Speaker 6 (10:49):
Let's hope.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
You know, well.
Speaker 5 (10:54):
I appreciate the encouragement. Wendy is very kind for you
to be more.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
Hopeful than expectant, but I'm not sure.
Speaker 5 (11:02):
I just say to you, look, I know it's been
a really tough time when New zeal And. We've gone
through all these frustrations, whether it's pandemics, where there are
events you know, Trump, Tariff's war in Iran now and
it's so frustrating because we will want to get back
to sort of a normal life as such, but we
just need to manage our way through these crisis and
I still feel twenty four months of the job. I
am a born optimist. I think New Zealand has a
(11:23):
fantastic future and even though the world is more volatile
and it's more uncertain, there's no reason we can build
a really awesome country. And in fact, the response to
the international crisis is to strengthen what we're doing here
at home. And build a good economy, build a better
energy strategy, make sure we've got more social cohesion, a
whole bunch of things that we've got to get into
work to do.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
If you were a CEO and not a Prime minister,
what would you do with your coalition government members?
Speaker 5 (11:48):
Well, the benefit of being a see well, the benefit
of being CEO is you get to choose the team
that you are working with. In politics, you go to war,
the army you're given and the New Zealand people vote
for members of parliament and then my job is to
actually fashion a team out of that and to make
it work. And you know, I spent a lot of
(12:08):
my time actually with my individual ministers, you know, talking
about what their agenda is, what they're trying to achieve,
pushing them, challenging, supporting them when they're often under fire
from the media or from others. But my job is
make it work and to fuller team. And I'm proud
of we've actually provided stable government in a three party
coalition where most people would have said, you might have
(12:29):
said to me even at the very beginning, this won't last.
Were a lot of people did, and we've actually made
it work very well because we're united on some common ground.
There are differences, for sure, and we will differ where
we must. And you've seen some of that in the
last few weeks.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
But even within your own party, if you're a CEO,
would you have fired the disloyal little oaks that were
making rumblings and making life difficult?
Speaker 5 (12:50):
Well, I think we dealt with that in the last
few weeks. But we have a pretty good team. And
I'm proud of the fact that when you look at
you know what the task we given Erics on education,
When I think about the work that Nichola is doing
on fixing the economy, When I look at what Sime
is doing on healthcare, Chris Bishop on who are you.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
Know, basically taking the headlines away from the good work
that's being done. That must be really annoying.
Speaker 5 (13:13):
Well, like, i think we've dealt with that. But I
think what I'm focused on is actually we'll have to
be focused on the future because the media may want
to talk about all that stuff, but the New Zealand
public don't want to talk about Stuff's chasy to sack them. Well,
the point is I have to go to war. The
army I've got. I think I'm proud of the team
that we've built, and I think everyone's making great contributions.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
And you're sticking very nicely to the script, Mike doing.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
Good morning to you.
Speaker 7 (13:36):
Good good mate. That at the courts of saying that
you just have to try and get the general public
on board. We'll be explaining of some of your policies
and what you're trying to do. I think she's spot
on me. I think he's doing a great job. It's
just trying to explain to that half the population that
(13:56):
just don't get it.
Speaker 5 (13:58):
Yeah, welcome to my challenge, my friend.
Speaker 4 (14:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (14:02):
And another thing is as well on it's calling out labors,
crap pull of things as well.
Speaker 5 (14:10):
Yep.
Speaker 7 (14:11):
One of them is the capital gain tax on the landlord.
And I've got three rentals and I'm up to my
eyeballs on debt on them on all three. But the
capital gain tax, I could take that or leave it whatever.
But what I can't take is not sent out of
the tax deductibility or the interest.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
Yep.
Speaker 7 (14:28):
So if they were to come back, and I'd have
to sell all three of them because I wouldn't be
able to afford to keep them, moo of them have
got beneficiaries in there, they'll become the government's problem and
then they'll have to put them up.
Speaker 5 (14:38):
Yep. And that's exactly right, mate, because essentially, under labor
rents went up one hundred and eighty dollars a week.
And why did that happen was because landlords were disincentivized
from actually putting their properties onto a market, exactly as
you've just said. And so these guys, if they get
back in, they are going to impose a capital gains tax,
they are going to reverse interest deductibility, they will move
back the bright line test. And you know, when they
(15:00):
are in partnership with Chloe and the Greens, you know
they're going to look at trust tax, they're going to
look at wealth tax, they're going to look at income
tax and corporate tax going up as well. They want,
you know, eighty eight million billion dollars of new taxes,
is what the Greens are saying. And you can't tell
me that they won't influence that if that was a coalition.
So but you're exactly right, since we actually put interest
deductibility back in place, which is a legitimate business expense
(15:23):
that you can do in any other business across the
economy and around the world, low and behold rents have
been stable. In fact, I think they came down about
five dollars a week. So that's really a good proposition
for the rental part of the market for housing. And
so I'm proud of that. But you watch they'll reverse
all of that. But the question is how are they
going to pay for it? You know, how are they
going to pay for interest deductibility? How are they going
(15:44):
to pay for you know, all the things they're talking
about when we've already maxed out the credit card and
the debt's pretty high. We spend ten billion dollars on
interest payments on the debt that New Zealand owns. That
is five the need in hospitals every year. I don't
get to build as a consequence of that.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Did you have a follow up make Yeah?
Speaker 7 (16:03):
Yeah, So I was just wondering, Yeah, is there any
way you can communicate to the labor voters because a
lot of those voters would rent houses. Yeah, and I
don't think they realized that their rent's going to go
up and they're voting labor.
Speaker 6 (16:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:17):
Well, that's exactly what happened last time with the removal
of interest deductibility, and it was playing to see you
know that, why would you as a landlord put your
money into the investment your investment money into a property
to put it onto a rental market when you actually
can't deduct interest deductibility that you can with it, You'd
be better to go buy another business or do something else.
So then we have a real pressure problem in that
(16:38):
part of the market, and that puts more people onto
the state House weightlist, which is exactly what happened. It
went from six and a half thousand up to twenty
seven thousand of people on the state House weightlist because
rents had got one hundred and eighty dollars extra a
week and too expensive, and so you get all these
flow on effects into ultimately people in emergency housing and homelessness. Ultimately, good,
Thank you very much.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
Mike. Going into the news headlines, you're going to raise
the age of eligibility for.
Speaker 5 (17:02):
Super well, I think there's a really good conversation we
need to have on superannuation. We've been conversing for we
have and so here's what we need to do. One
is we actually do need to lift the retirement age
from sixty five to sixty Evelis was going to do it.
It's unworkable, it's unaffordable. Secondly, we're actually living four years
longer than we were in two five, So are you
going to raise it? Well, I want to do that,
but I need labor and I need New Zealand first
(17:24):
to come on board with that. And if you talk
about bipartisanship, that's a good start to the superannuation conversation. Secondly,
we need to lift retirement contributions. I want to make
sure that we get to twelve percent by twenty thirty two.
We're doing the lift productivity if we do that, well,
we do, and we're working hard on that in terms
of there's five things we've got to do to lift productivity.
But first and foremost, we've got to make sure that
(17:44):
people have good retirement savings and incomes and that creates
more capital in New Zealand that can be invested in
in infrastructure projects here as well. So you've seen us
lift contribution rates from three to three and a half
pathway to four and then we want to bring that
out to twelve percent up by twenty thirty two. Combination
of employer and employee contributs, which.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
Do you imagine the retirement age. The increasing Bill. English
had a good plan for it, it would have been
in place.
Speaker 5 (18:09):
Yeah, Jim Bolder did it actually in nineteen ninety five.
They lifted it from sixty to sixty five over ten years. Well,
we would want to do it as soon as we
get back in the second term because but for that
to happen, for me to pass that legislation, I need
other parties to come on board and say that's a
good idea too, So you will put it too. We'll
go to the election with another election policy around superannuation
(18:31):
and lifting the retirement age for sure, Criky.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
It goes quickly, and then a question from you.
Speaker 8 (18:38):
Yes, good morning Carrie, Good morning Chris.
Speaker 5 (18:41):
Good to hear from you.
Speaker 7 (18:43):
No, that's even better to hear from you.
Speaker 8 (18:45):
It's off. Congratulations on your Singapore and you deal with India.
I think nobody done that needs pumping up a lot
higher than what it currently gets.
Speaker 5 (18:54):
It's pretty exciting stuff, I'll be honest with you, because
it's just jobs and incomes for New Zealanders and it's
just so exciting when you see that Indian deal in particular,
I'm really excited about that.
Speaker 8 (19:03):
Yes, I fully agree with it's a super yep. I
think you should take the opportunity even and I think
Peters might come on board make it compulsory for the
whole country. Well, as soon as you leave school, you're in.
Speaker 6 (19:19):
Yeah much dollar you were in.
Speaker 5 (19:21):
Yes, I think you're right, because you know what, we've
got to get our young people to understand. And it
is actually happening. They're moving away from believing that the
only way they make money is through property. Actually, the
young people now with their shares these accounts, are starting
to understand if I make regular contributions every week, there's
that dollar cost, you know, there's that compounding value of
interest that you get an investment that actually is actually
(19:41):
very good for them. So I think we've got to
get them to understand that. And you're dead right. If
we can get them in earlier and get the value
of that by the time they get to retirement age,
they've got a really great nesting and if we can
lift the contribution rates at the same time, I think
that'll make New Zealand is much more interested in investments
other than just property as well.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Craig, A very good morning to you.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Good morning, carry Yes it is.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
How are you.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, good, thanks mate. I was frustrating ever since that
outgoing government. And I don't I know you don't like
poking the taking the stick. But my question to you
is why do we not audit in the outgoing government
when they have unaccountable, unaccountable dollars spent. Yeah, I'm self
employed and I have to tell you everything and show
(20:30):
a receipts for everything that I did. Why not then, Yeah,
because it's just us of what I've done all my life.
Speaker 5 (20:35):
Yeah. The closest we got to that Craig was actually
the raw Commission of Inquiry into COVID and what that
showed was the last government spent sixty six billion dollars.
Half of it they don't know where it went and
what it was achieved for and wasn't spent on COVID stuff,
and we don't have any more schools, roads or hospitals.
As a consequence of that, the debt was tripled and
it put real pressure on the zeal And financially. And
(20:55):
that's why we're having to fix up the books a
bit like you with your accounting of your own business,
and so you know, that's the reality of what we've inherited.
I can complain and wing about that, but the reality
is I now and I've got to fix it. And
I may wish to have been dealt with different cards,
but these are the ones I've been dealt with, and
I've got to play, you know, I've got to sort
it out. So I agree with you, I think you know,
But be under no illusions. If these guys get back
(21:17):
in man alive, they're going to spend more, tax more,
borrow more, and that has put huge pressure on New
Zealand's finances, as that Royal Commission of Inquiry highlighted pretty clearly,
do you believe.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
There's an issue with the homeless? Of questions is what's
your policy and plans for the homeless?
Speaker 5 (21:31):
Well, I think we've put you know, we've put three
hundred more housing first places available, We've put ten million
dollars into immediately dealing with you know, the homeless problem,
particularly as we've seen it here in Auckland. We have
Auckland City Council actually doing daily counts of the homeless,
and I think we've done. You know, if you think
about housing, you've got to get housing affordability right. Otherwise
(21:53):
people don't own a house, They rent a house they
can't rent, they end up on a statehouse wasailest, and
then they end up homeless. It's very complex. There's often
a range of issues, and what we have to do
is be able to get those wrap around services around
those individuals and work with the nonprofit organizations as a result.
But it's not just as simple as these people don't
(22:13):
have houses. They have complex needs. Often it could be
addiction issues, it could be mental health issues that could
be homeless you know, generally housing access as well. So
I think, you know we've done you know, getting people
out of emergency motel rooms, which was just ridiculous, has
been really good, and we've got a lot of those
people into proper social housing, proper homes, particularly the families.
(22:36):
When you're raising a family in a motel room for
goodness sake for a year, that's utterly unacceptable. So on homelessness,
we've opened up more housing first places that've been filled up.
We're working very well, particularly with some of the nonprofits,
on getting them delivering on the contracts and the things
that we pay them to do to make sure that
they actually are getting people. And when you look at
the Auckland City Council, you know homeless count. You know,
(22:57):
in different days, it's different dimensions, but it's been twenty
five to thirty five people we're talking about downtown.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Margaret asks if if we can have if people can
claim a percentage of what they give to a church,
why can't you action tax rebates for people who are
paying for private medical insurance, because we are Every operation
we've had is save the public system money.
Speaker 5 (23:20):
Yeah, I think that's a really good question. The way
that and there's some pros and some cons about tax
deductibility for private health insurance, and it's not quite as
simple as it when you get into that issue at
the next level. But what I'm trying to do is
use the capacity that's in the private system and the
public system. So for example, we've had a massive backlog
(23:41):
built up over that six years on people who need
first surgeries or elective surgeries, think about cataracts, think about
knee and hYP replacements. The private system can actually often
deliver that cheaper because are sort of more of a
factory of just churning those things through. And I'm happy
to pay for that. And you don't care whether you're
on your back of your beld looking at the ceiling,
whether it's in a private or public hospital. But the
issue about private insurance, it.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
Come back to tax rebates.
Speaker 5 (24:03):
Yeah, I think that's something we will think about. But
it's quite complicated because for a number of different reasons
which I don't want to go into, but quite technical
as to how that actually works in practice. So are
you for it or again it I'm open to looking
at it. I know Samy and Brown and I've talked
about it, but I don't.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
Say this you're learning that's a very political life. No no, no,
no ceo no.
Speaker 5 (24:24):
But there is real there is real challenges with it
as you don't don't want the unintended conceptence like, for example,
in other countries there's a whole different way in which
they structure their public healthcier system that makes the private
healthcare system tax rebate work. In New Zealand, we've got
pretty universal access in our public system. You don't have
Medicaid or you don't pay it when you get to
a certain income. In Australia, for example, you end up
(24:46):
making payments to the state essentially because your income's getting higher.
That's offsetting your public health liability. So there's just a
bunch of complexity in there. But I like the idea
because I think the point is a really good one,
which is you're taking pressure out of the public system.
My immediate focus is short term to say, we've got
all these fricking backlogs and witless and I've got to
(25:08):
whip my way through it pretty damn fast.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
All the big comments, all the big insights of comments. Carrie,
just complimenting you on your makeup.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
Thank you nice. You said you put a lot of
effort into the eyebrows, in particular.
Speaker 3 (25:22):
Chelsea, my colleague, Chelsea Daniels. Thank god. Otherwise I'd have
looked like a mad professor. But cooly. Anyway, we don't
need to go, we don't need to see how the
sausage is made to do well.
Speaker 5 (25:33):
I'd love I'd love curly here. Just for the record, Carrie,
I'll just say much texture.
Speaker 3 (25:39):
Richard, A very good morning to you. You're packing up
to move to the UK.
Speaker 6 (25:44):
Yeah, good morning, Kerry, Good morning Prime Minister. We're over
here at the moment. We're over here at the moment.
We've been here for the last six seven weeks and
just scoping out just to see if this is where
we want to call home. You go to the supermarket
here and the cost of food and everything is so
much cheaper than what we're paying back home. We talk
to family what they're paying and rates, but they and
(26:06):
insurance is a small fraction of what we're paying back home.
We can't afford to live back in New Zealand. We're
earning over two hundred grand in New Zealand, but we
aren't having the quality of life that we should be
having any longer. So we've made the choice that we've
been over here. We've scoped the place out to look
around what we've got. We're thinking of our retirement planning
(26:28):
and what happens as we get older. There's so many
more hospitals around that can look after us over here.
You walk around the streets, the homelessness isn't there like
we've got back home. You feel safer. People are happier
New Zealand in the UK. In the UK, this is
(26:48):
the UK, but look, people are happy here compared to
New Zealand, and I think that's what needs to happen.
The reality is that the members of Parliament in New
Zealand are so far removed from the general Joe blogs
like us that are workers there and paying our taxes
and trying to do our best. We don't know what
it's like to live there anymore. We can afford to
live in the country that we love and a door,
(27:11):
and that's it. We're going to pack up and leave.
We can't afford to stay there anymore. It's just too expensive.
It's really really hard. But that's that's reality, because it's
it's got everything that we want. Everything is here.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Chaka a soongu and all that each to their own taste.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
Yeah, look, I mean, I know the UK is in
a pretty tough place relative to New Zealand, and having
visited there and having lived there myself and knowing how
expensive housing is and transportation a bunch of things, and
i'd think about some of the challenges when I've spoken
to their Prime Minister that they're dealing with in that country.
I'd put it to you, I'd sooner be leader of
New Zealand and the leader of the UK. The only
thing I'd say to you is that in the last
(27:49):
year we've had an eighteen percent growth in Kiwi's returning home,
and we've had less Kiwis leaving each month than we
you know, And since I think the last year of Hipkins.
So I think you know, and I get it because
you know, there was you know, when New Zealand goes
through tough times, people actually do look for other places
where they think that they work hard can get ahead.
What we have to do, and what we're working hard
to do, is to rebuild back the proposition that if
(28:10):
you work hard in New Zealand, you should be able
to get ahead. We're having to deal with getting inflation down,
interest rates down, Richard's spilling down. No, I get it,
and you know, but you've always got to be safe
in terms of a country. I think we've made some
good progress on law and order. Your kids, actually you
need to get a world class education. Your parents need
to be able to get good healthcare. So we that
is the work that our government is to make sure
that we are building a proposition that actually, you know,
(28:32):
Kiwis actually feel there is a great future here. And
when I see an eighteen percent growth and Keywi's returning
home because it turns out, yep, housing in Australia is
a lot more expensive. It turns out actually it is
a more competitive market in terms of some of the
jobs that are going on. It turns out they do
have higher levels of inflation. So you know, you know,
I understand your frustration about it, and certainly you're right
(28:52):
your cost of living, whether it's insurance rates, you know, food.
You know, we've had a series of high we had
thirty two year high inflation that was locked in for
a number of years and it's expensive.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
Can't afford to deliver here on two hundred k. I
think that's a you problem, not a country problem, says
a Texter.
Speaker 5 (29:09):
I just say I think New Zealand's position is much
better than the UK's.
Speaker 3 (29:13):
UK wouldn't be my first, true, but then I'm not richer.
Stop screening your calls, your tart, Let people tell I
used to be a tart tart retired and let people
tell them what New Zealand really thunks of them. Well,
you ignorant, numpty, I don't screen the calls, so more
for you. And the text machine is here and I'll
pass all that on to Christopher Luxe at the end. Now,
(29:35):
there was a text here about being overrun by Indians,
Indians everywhere. Can we talk about those?
Speaker 5 (29:44):
Yeah, because I just I know there's been a lot
of scare mongering about the Indian FTA, particularly around immigration,
and it is so wrong, absolutely wrong. The deal that
we have done is a very reasonable deal, and we
have total control over the immigration.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
We're going to be flooded with Indians.
Speaker 5 (30:00):
Not true. It's just not true. Because here's the situation.
We we came power, there was one hundred and thirty
five thousand net migration into New Zealand, so we had
too much migration going on of Indians. No of total migration.
We've got twenty five thousand today net migration. And how
have we done that. We've moved it from seventy percent
low skilled to seventy percent high skilled in the two
(30:22):
and a bit years. We have made sure our immigration
settings are smart, they're targeted, are quite tight. We've got
rights and responsibles, we have enforcements, exploitation, a whole bunch
of things that we've done. We've got this green list
where we might need Philippine welders, you know, a couple
of years ago. We may not need that now, but
we might need something else. And it's a very dynamic shift.
So we link our immigration to our economic strategy and
(30:45):
also to our infrastructure. And when you look at the
UK with a thousand illegal immigrants coming in a day.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Illegal immigrants that cause problems is.
Speaker 5 (30:53):
What Trump's dealing with in the US situation. You know,
New Zealand's actually done and we've done a very good
job I think of tightening things up.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
In the last and most of our migrants come from.
Speaker 5 (31:01):
Well, they come from all over the world. Actually. I
mean if we've had this different Vestavisa, where we've said
if you're prepared to come to New Zealand and invest
five or ten million dollars and put it into a
proper business, not a house, but into a business, that's
the only thing you can do. Well, we've had four
billion dollars raised that way from about six hundred people,
forty percent of American, twenty percent German. You know, there's
(31:22):
been a huge influx of people from all over the world.
But I just want to say our immigrant community, you know,
they leave their home, their family, their work, their culture,
their language. They come to New Zealand because they believe
is a better future for this country. They work two
or three jobs, often to get a deposit for a
house or a business. They send their kids to school
because they value education. They don't go on welfare, because
(31:43):
they believe in the work and they are some of
the most aspirational, ambitious, positive people we have in this country.
And we exactly exactly as my forebears were from Ireland
or from Scotland, you know, the same thing.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
We've had people from India here, China here.
Speaker 5 (31:56):
Yeah, but this it's very easy to escape goes. But
I just would say, on the one hand, they have
been great kiwis that they've built, and you know, they've
added something to New Zealand and they've donet But equally
we've also been very smart with our immigration setting so
we don't end up in this situation that we've seen
in other countries around the world.
Speaker 3 (32:12):
And we don't want boom bust like we've had.
Speaker 5 (32:14):
No, No, we've just got to keep it consistent, moderate,
and we link everything to the vacancies that we've got
in our economy and the jobs shortages.
Speaker 6 (32:21):
That we have.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
News talks said, b that's it. Gosh, it goes quickly,
doesn't it. I'm so sorry. We've got a load of
other questions. Ah, we might have to save the maification
ones for next time. All for David Seymour, given the
hits his particular bug bear.
Speaker 5 (32:36):
Yeah, look, I mean, it's I get it. There's been
a challenging time. We're all over it. We've had so
many things that we're just wrestling with and dealing with
that keep coming into our frame. But having just been
traveling even in the last over the weekend, yeah, I've
got to tell you, I'd sooner be in New Zealand
anywhere else. We are being smack in the middle of
the most dynamic part of the world. We've got abundant resources,
we've got goods democratic institutions, and we've got incredible people.
(32:57):
So even as challenging as it is out there in
the world with Trump and all the tariffs and the
wars in Iran and all the things that we're dealing with, Man,
I'd say New Zealand's got a great future still. And
I know it's hard and it's been difficult, but we
can get through this and get to the other side.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
I really hope.
Speaker 7 (33:13):
So.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
Oh I know so, but I would I certainly wouldn't
be going to the UK when the sun goes down.
Speaker 5 (33:19):
At four That used to the low point for me
was sort of the sun would go down at three
thirty over winter, and you've got a two year old
and a baby you've just taken to the park, and
then the two year old throws a tantrum, and I
just remember walking back from Wimbledon Park picked to my
house carrying a scooter a two year old who was
having a tent yep and it was all dark, and
(33:39):
going back to our two up, two down, sort of
our terrace house, not be able to find my car
because I'd parked at several blocks away away from the
house because there wasn't any garage or you know, let's
say so I get it. Look, you know, we've got
challenges here at home, and there are challenges all around
the world, and everyone's frustrated around the world. But I'd
seen a man, I'd seen a beer ki we and
be living.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Here and you chose.
Speaker 5 (34:02):
Oh Sam Fender, he is the British Bruce Springsteen with Olivia.
Speaker 6 (34:07):
Nister.
Speaker 5 (34:08):
Oh no, he's awesome. Go listen to Sam Fender.
Speaker 3 (34:10):
I have not heard of Sam Fender feat Olivia Dean.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
Featuring Olivia Dean, great singer, She's awesome. She is rain
me In, Rain me In, this great duet from both
of them.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
God, let you go, let you go on the on
the loose rain all right, Thank you very much, Prime Minister.
Look forward to catching up in a couple of time.
Take care a couple of months, won't it be. Yeah,
thanks again for the opportunity to talk. Appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
For more from Kerry Wooden Mornings, listen live to news
talks it'd be from nine am weekdays, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Kerry Wood and Morning's podcast from
News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be right.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
You are one hundred and eighty three sleeps till election
twenty twenty six. Right, you're looking forward to it, aren't you.
I'm looking forward to We've got the Prime minister inside
there, there we go, have we got the there we go? Yeah,
one hundred and eighty three sleeps to the election. It
doesn't seem three years that we were sitting here while
you were campaigning.
Speaker 4 (00:28):
Gee.
Speaker 5 (00:28):
It goes fast, doesn't it.
Speaker 6 (00:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (00:30):
I mean these three year terms in New Zealand are
pretty short and there's a lot to do. Still.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
Yeah, there's as much to do as when you were
campaigning saying there's a lot to do.
Speaker 5 (00:39):
Well, there is. I mean, there's so much that we
can do to improve this country. I mean we've got
so much great potential in it and it's important that
we solved the problems to get on with it.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Potential, potential, potential. But you know, you promised it was
the economy stupid. You said, get us in here, where
the grown ups, we'll fix it. Nobody feels fixed.
Speaker 5 (00:54):
Well, look, I mean no, I get it. You know,
people have been really dealing with the cost of levine.
We're all over it. Let's be clear. We've had COVID,
We've had weather events, We've had Trump's tariffs, we've had
narrow oil Christus from the last No, I'm not making
I'm not saying they are excuses, but I'm just saying
those are the cards that we've been dealt with, and
we have to do the right thing and work our
way through each of those things. They're incredibly frustrating. We're
(01:16):
all tired, we're all over it, and we're all grumpy
about it. I get it. But my job is to
make sure I get New Zealand through this later set
of crisis, which is around the fuel crisis in particular.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
You know the borrowings. Your government's borrowing more well than
labor ever did.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
Yeah, I mean what we have to do is find
the right balance where we actually need to continue to
support New Zealanders with really good public services. And you
could say, on one hand, I could go cut all
this cost out and put New Zealand to what we
call austerity, and that would make New Zealand go backwards.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
So Ruth Richardson Starbuck.
Speaker 5 (01:48):
Equally, you could carry on doing what labour proposed, which
is spare more, tax more, borrow more and just crank
it up. But actually we've used up the rainy Day
fund and we've mixed out the credit cards and now
the international focus saying you've got to be a bit
careful about all of that. So we've found a middle
way through, which is to say, look, we're going to
keep making savings and the back off of the government
and put that money into the front office. That's why
(02:09):
we've got two thousand more nurses, that's why we've got
six hundred more doctors, a lot of those good.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Things, and you have to borrow to pay for those.
Speaker 5 (02:16):
Yeah, but also we're bending the borrowing down as a
percentage of the economy. You know, that's really the pathway
that we've got to get on too, because one of
the big lessons is that you know, you can spend
up big time like you saw in COVID, but then
you have a lot of long term pain and you
actually have a massive hangover after the big party, and
we have been probably the second worst economy in the
Western world. Its actually what was so much money was
(02:39):
spent during COVID. Now we've got such a big hangover
and been so slow coming out of it all. And
that's what we've been wrestling with the last two years.
High inflation, high interest rates, negative growth.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
There's been a lot of talk about a Grand Coalition
because I think people are realize that ideology is a
luxury we simply don't have we need. If you politicians
who say that you go into politics for the good
of the country really mean that you would work together
to get us out of the crap.
Speaker 5 (03:08):
Well, I'll just say there's three things about the Grand Coalition.
One is labor didn't deliver anything in that six year period.
We've got real issues with their ability to deliver.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
See delivered houses?
Speaker 5 (03:18):
Well, well did they? They actually drove up house prices
thirty percent in a single year, that rents went up
one hundred and eighty dollars a week, and there was
actually but they did actually a lot more people on
state house waitlist, all that sort of stuff, and we've actually,
I'll put our record on housing up against there's any date.
But I just say delivery is a problem. They want
to tax more, spend more, borrow more. And then thirdly,
they haven't even supported the basic stuff where we've tried
(03:39):
to reach out with them on bipartisanship, education, infrastructure plans,
you know, gang patches, you know all those things. They
just haven't supported. Even low you know, tax relief for
lower middle income working New Zealanders, they didn't support that.
So I was clear at the beginning of the year
to say, look, you know, I think the only answer
is you've got to get a national lead government. That's
why I'll make the case all the way through the
(03:59):
year about you know, two ticks Blue. I've said, if
I have push comes to shove, I can work with
ACT in New Zealand first, as I've Dems traded over
the last few years. But I'm not working with Labor
to party Mario or the Greens.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Not even on coming together on specifically.
Speaker 5 (04:12):
Well, we'll continue to do that. I mean on education.
We reached out to Labor to talk about, hey, we
should make education in New Zealand thing not a party thing.
Talking about that superannuation, we'd love to talk to them
about that, particularly about lifting the age requirement, lifting the
contribution rates. There's a lot of things that we could
do there, so we'll keep reaching out about that.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
He would be open to talking about the superannuation.
Speaker 5 (04:34):
Great and we look forward to that because certainly Labor
and his Zellan first have been against lifting the retirement
age to the level that you see in other countries.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
How far do you trust Winston?
Speaker 5 (04:44):
Well, look, I've been able to work with them. I
trust him inside a coalition lead government. That's actually about
by the National Peace.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
On the radio. But Christopher LX and.
Speaker 5 (04:55):
But you know as a party, you know he'll make
his own decision about ultimately you know who he wants
to go with after an election. But I've said I
can work with them, and I've demonstrated I can do that.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Do you believe the that if you get thirty six
and Labor gets thirty six in the election, that Winston
Peters is yours and rules alone? Or do you think
he's going to be going where the best.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
I would in history would say that's something that is
Winston will have his own views on that ultimately. And
that's why I say, if you want to don't want
to put it at risk, you've got to vote.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
National Anna asks has the government considered passing legislation to
freeze MP's pay during this cost of living in fuel crisis?
If not, why not?
Speaker 5 (05:35):
Look the real problem with that is that if you
have MPs or prime ministers determining people's pay in terms
and conditions in parliament, that's not what you want. You
don't want MPs anywhere near their pay terms conditions. So
we put that into an independent remuneration authority. They make
those decisions, and I think that's the way it should
be at arm's length, because as soon as you do that,
(05:55):
what you then encounter is what happened last time, was
then all of a sudden, there's a massive increase at
some point down the road. Rather than letting an independent
body make those decisions, where are.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
We stop saying? Actually, if they're saying we still have
a big shortage of nurses, wait five weeks to get
a doctor's appointment, nurses and one and we have been
waiting two years for their pack bay and still haven't.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
Got it, well, we have actually hired twenty one hundred
extra nurses and what we had just twenty four months ago.
When we came to power, we put a big focus
on that we're actually supporting our nurses to go on
and become nurse prescribers, nurse practitioners so they can do
more of the tasks of GPS, and we're actually supporting
young people to carry on with that study. We've actually
(06:38):
put more investment into the GP practice than any government.
We've put one hundred and seventy five million dollars another
fourteen percent increase into the payments to GPS. We've opened
up twenty four to seven digital health. We've said to
people we should have twelve month prescription so you don't
go back to the doctor every three months, clogging up
the system just to get a repeat prescription, so that
(06:59):
we actually see more people. So I think there's a
lot of work that we are doing in primary care.
We know that that's where we want to put more
of our vent and so we want to see nurses.
And we've opened up a third medical school. We're building
that right now, and that's designed to get doctors out
into the regional New Zealand. We've said to people that
are in New Zealand that have been qualified as doctors
from overseas that actually we can accelerate your conversion course.
(07:23):
And we've actually got a number of doctors into GP
practices already. So there's a lot more for us to do.
I get it, you know, but you've actually got to
get a system response and a change to how we
get more people having access to GPS.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
I've started with questions. Feel free to put jewels to
the Prime Minister. Who is yours for the next forty
five minutes, Wendy, are very good morning to you.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Good morning, Carie, good morning, Chris.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
Good a, Wendy. How are you very good?
Speaker 4 (07:48):
Very good teams listen. One question I've got for you.
So one criticism you, criticism you often get is that
you're more of a CEO than a traditional politician, coming
from the corporate world and South, I actually see the
strengths in that. You know, building teams, delegating well, and
keeping coalition partners together isn't business. What's the biggest thing
(08:09):
you've had to learn that's surprised you about leading a
country versus leading a company.
Speaker 5 (08:15):
What a great question. This is an awesome question, Wendy. No,
I love this one.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
I was going to ask exactly that it must be
a hell of a lot easier being a CEO than.
Speaker 5 (08:22):
A pure Yeah, I think it is. I mean, they're
completely different jobs, and Wendy's exactly right. They're actually I
feel like I was really good at playing rugby and
now I've had to come and play soccer, do you
know what I mean? They're actually different games, but there
are things, Wendy that are common to both of them.
As you understand, Actually, how do you get the best
out of the talent that you've got in the team
that you've got, And that is about putting the right
people on the right assignment at the right time, with
(08:43):
enough clarity but also support but also challenge at times
as well. And I think i've you know that that
skill set has actually been very useful coming into this job.
The bit that's challenging is obviously everything you're doing is
in front of the public and the media all the time.
And for someone who's not a career politician, you know,
I came here four or five years ago into the job,
(09:04):
and I came because I really think, actually there's a
lot of skills that actually are needed that come from
that CEO kind of world, like we need to execute
and to manage things better than what we've been doing.
But I fully admit the other two different tasks, and
there is a lot of things that are common around
leadership and how you get your team built and how
you get them performing. That's very very common and very familiar.
(09:26):
But the other bits are certainly that twenty four to seven.
You make mistakes in front of the media, You don't
get it right all the time, you don't express yourself
perfectly in my case and soundbites, and I promise you
I probably will carry on expressing myself and perfectly going
forward as well, and I apologize for that upfront. But
I think at this time, you know, actually someone who
understands the economy and commercials, as hard as it is,
(09:46):
as frustrating as it is for everybody, is actually what
New Zealand needs right now.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
Yet you're just going to I guess you've got to
get that projected across to the public. You know, I
understand what you're doing and I get it right, but
there's so many that don't, and I hate to see
a change. You know, you've got a great team of
(10:12):
people around you, and yeah, you've got great negotiation skills
all of that side of things, which is what we
need right now. And you're managing I think you're managing
the fuel crisis excellently. But people want to create. They
don't trust it. They want it to it to be
you know a big issue for us, right But it's
(10:34):
managed smoothly and there is no issue, but people try
and make an issue the whole full poppy syndrome a
little bit. But yeah, people just need to relax. But anyway, look,
keep up the good work and look here come November.
Speaker 6 (10:49):
Let's hope.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
You know, well.
Speaker 5 (10:54):
I appreciate the encouragement. Wendy is very kind for you
to be more.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
Hopeful than expectant, but I'm not sure.
Speaker 5 (11:02):
I just say to you, look, I know it's been
a really tough time when New zeal And. We've gone
through all these frustrations, whether it's pandemics, where there are
events you know, Trump, Tariff's war in Iran now and
it's so frustrating because we will want to get back
to sort of a normal life as such, but we
just need to manage our way through these crisis and
I still feel twenty four months of the job. I
am a born optimist. I think New Zealand has a
(11:23):
fantastic future and even though the world is more volatile
and it's more uncertain, there's no reason we can build
a really awesome country. And in fact, the response to
the international crisis is to strengthen what we're doing here
at home. And build a good economy, build a better
energy strategy, make sure we've got more social cohesion, a
whole bunch of things that we've got to get into
work to do.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
If you were a CEO and not a Prime minister,
what would you do with your coalition government members?
Speaker 5 (11:48):
Well, the benefit of being a see well, the benefit
of being CEO is you get to choose the team
that you are working with. In politics, you go to war,
the army you're given and the New Zealand people vote
for members of parliament and then my job is to
actually fashion a team out of that and to make
it work. And you know, I spent a lot of
(12:08):
my time actually with my individual ministers, you know, talking
about what their agenda is, what they're trying to achieve,
pushing them, challenging, supporting them when they're often under fire
from the media or from others. But my job is
make it work and to fuller team. And I'm proud
of we've actually provided stable government in a three party
coalition where most people would have said, you might have
(12:29):
said to me even at the very beginning, this won't last.
Were a lot of people did, and we've actually made
it work very well because we're united on some common ground.
There are differences, for sure, and we will differ where
we must. And you've seen some of that in the
last few weeks.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
But even within your own party, if you're a CEO,
would you have fired the disloyal little oaks that were
making rumblings and making life difficult?
Speaker 5 (12:50):
Well, I think we dealt with that in the last
few weeks. But we have a pretty good team. And
I'm proud of the fact that when you look at
you know what the task we given Erics on education,
When I think about the work that Nichola is doing
on fixing the economy, When I look at what Sime
is doing on healthcare, Chris Bishop on who are you.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
Know, basically taking the headlines away from the good work
that's being done. That must be really annoying.
Speaker 5 (13:13):
Well, like, i think we've dealt with that. But I
think what I'm focused on is actually we'll have to
be focused on the future because the media may want
to talk about all that stuff, but the New Zealand
public don't want to talk about Stuff's chasy to sack them. Well,
the point is I have to go to war. The
army I've got. I think I'm proud of the team
that we've built, and I think everyone's making great contributions.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
And you're sticking very nicely to the script, Mike doing.
Speaker 5 (13:33):
Good morning to you.
Speaker 7 (13:36):
Good good mate. That at the courts of saying that
you just have to try and get the general public
on board. We'll be explaining of some of your policies
and what you're trying to do. I think she's spot
on me. I think he's doing a great job. It's
just trying to explain to that half the population that
(13:56):
just don't get it.
Speaker 5 (13:58):
Yeah, welcome to my challenge, my friend.
Speaker 4 (14:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 7 (14:02):
And another thing is as well on it's calling out labors,
crap pull of things as well.
Speaker 5 (14:10):
Yep.
Speaker 7 (14:11):
One of them is the capital gain tax on the landlord.
And I've got three rentals and I'm up to my
eyeballs on debt on them on all three. But the
capital gain tax, I could take that or leave it whatever.
But what I can't take is not sent out of
the tax deductibility or the interest.
Speaker 5 (14:27):
Yep.
Speaker 7 (14:28):
So if they were to come back, and I'd have
to sell all three of them because I wouldn't be
able to afford to keep them, moo of them have
got beneficiaries in there, they'll become the government's problem and
then they'll have to put them up.
Speaker 5 (14:38):
Yep. And that's exactly right, mate, because essentially, under labor
rents went up one hundred and eighty dollars a week.
And why did that happen was because landlords were disincentivized
from actually putting their properties onto a market, exactly as
you've just said. And so these guys, if they get
back in, they are going to impose a capital gains tax,
they are going to reverse interest deductibility, they will move
back the bright line test. And you know, when they
(15:00):
are in partnership with Chloe and the Greens, you know
they're going to look at trust tax, they're going to
look at wealth tax, they're going to look at income
tax and corporate tax going up as well. They want,
you know, eighty eight million billion dollars of new taxes,
is what the Greens are saying. And you can't tell
me that they won't influence that if that was a coalition.
So but you're exactly right, since we actually put interest
deductibility back in place, which is a legitimate business expense
(15:23):
that you can do in any other business across the
economy and around the world, low and behold rents have
been stable. In fact, I think they came down about
five dollars a week. So that's really a good proposition
for the rental part of the market for housing. And
so I'm proud of that. But you watch they'll reverse
all of that. But the question is how are they
going to pay for it? You know, how are they
going to pay for interest deductibility? How are they going
(15:44):
to pay for you know, all the things they're talking
about when we've already maxed out the credit card and
the debt's pretty high. We spend ten billion dollars on
interest payments on the debt that New Zealand owns. That
is five the need in hospitals every year. I don't
get to build as a consequence of that.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Did you have a follow up make Yeah?
Speaker 7 (16:03):
Yeah, So I was just wondering, Yeah, is there any
way you can communicate to the labor voters because a
lot of those voters would rent houses. Yeah, and I
don't think they realized that their rent's going to go
up and they're voting labor.
Speaker 6 (16:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:17):
Well, that's exactly what happened last time with the removal
of interest deductibility, and it was playing to see you
know that, why would you as a landlord put your
money into the investment your investment money into a property
to put it onto a rental market when you actually
can't deduct interest deductibility that you can with it, You'd
be better to go buy another business or do something else.
So then we have a real pressure problem in that
(16:38):
part of the market, and that puts more people onto
the state House weightlist, which is exactly what happened. It
went from six and a half thousand up to twenty
seven thousand of people on the state House weightlist because
rents had got one hundred and eighty dollars extra a
week and too expensive, and so you get all these
flow on effects into ultimately people in emergency housing and homelessness. Ultimately, good,
Thank you very much.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
Mike. Going into the news headlines, you're going to raise
the age of eligibility for.
Speaker 5 (17:02):
Super well, I think there's a really good conversation we
need to have on superannuation. We've been conversing for we
have and so here's what we need to do. One
is we actually do need to lift the retirement age
from sixty five to sixty Evelis was going to do it.
It's unworkable, it's unaffordable. Secondly, we're actually living four years
longer than we were in two five, So are you
going to raise it? Well, I want to do that,
but I need labor and I need New Zealand first
(17:24):
to come on board with that. And if you talk
about bipartisanship, that's a good start to the superannuation conversation. Secondly,
we need to lift retirement contributions. I want to make
sure that we get to twelve percent by twenty thirty two.
We're doing the lift productivity if we do that, well,
we do, and we're working hard on that in terms
of there's five things we've got to do to lift productivity.
But first and foremost, we've got to make sure that
(17:44):
people have good retirement savings and incomes and that creates
more capital in New Zealand that can be invested in
in infrastructure projects here as well. So you've seen us
lift contribution rates from three to three and a half
pathway to four and then we want to bring that
out to twelve percent up by twenty thirty two. Combination
of employer and employee contributs, which.
Speaker 3 (18:02):
Do you imagine the retirement age. The increasing Bill. English
had a good plan for it, it would have been
in place.
Speaker 5 (18:09):
Yeah, Jim Bolder did it actually in nineteen ninety five.
They lifted it from sixty to sixty five over ten years. Well,
we would want to do it as soon as we
get back in the second term because but for that
to happen, for me to pass that legislation, I need
other parties to come on board and say that's a
good idea too, So you will put it too. We'll
go to the election with another election policy around superannuation
(18:31):
and lifting the retirement age for sure, Criky.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
It goes quickly, and then a question from you.
Speaker 8 (18:38):
Yes, good morning Carrie, Good morning Chris.
Speaker 5 (18:41):
Good to hear from you.
Speaker 7 (18:43):
No, that's even better to hear from you.
Speaker 8 (18:45):
It's off. Congratulations on your Singapore and you deal with India.
I think nobody done that needs pumping up a lot
higher than what it currently gets.
Speaker 5 (18:54):
It's pretty exciting stuff, I'll be honest with you, because
it's just jobs and incomes for New Zealanders and it's
just so exciting when you see that Indian deal in particular,
I'm really excited about that.
Speaker 8 (19:03):
Yes, I fully agree with it's a super yep. I
think you should take the opportunity even and I think
Peters might come on board make it compulsory for the
whole country. Well, as soon as you leave school, you're in.
Speaker 6 (19:19):
Yeah much dollar you were in.
Speaker 5 (19:21):
Yes, I think you're right, because you know what, we've
got to get our young people to understand. And it
is actually happening. They're moving away from believing that the
only way they make money is through property. Actually, the
young people now with their shares these accounts, are starting
to understand if I make regular contributions every week, there's
that dollar cost, you know, there's that compounding value of
interest that you get an investment that actually is actually
(19:41):
very good for them. So I think we've got to
get them to understand that. And you're dead right. If
we can get them in earlier and get the value
of that by the time they get to retirement age,
they've got a really great nesting and if we can
lift the contribution rates at the same time, I think
that'll make New Zealand is much more interested in investments
other than just property as well.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
Craig, A very good morning to you.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Good morning, carry Yes it is.
Speaker 4 (20:06):
How are you.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, good, thanks mate. I was frustrating ever since that
outgoing government. And I don't I know you don't like
poking the taking the stick. But my question to you
is why do we not audit in the outgoing government
when they have unaccountable, unaccountable dollars spent. Yeah, I'm self
employed and I have to tell you everything and show
(20:30):
a receipts for everything that I did. Why not then, Yeah,
because it's just us of what I've done all my life.
Speaker 5 (20:35):
Yeah. The closest we got to that Craig was actually
the raw Commission of Inquiry into COVID and what that
showed was the last government spent sixty six billion dollars.
Half of it they don't know where it went and
what it was achieved for and wasn't spent on COVID stuff,
and we don't have any more schools, roads or hospitals.
As a consequence of that, the debt was tripled and
it put real pressure on the zeal And financially. And
(20:55):
that's why we're having to fix up the books a
bit like you with your accounting of your own business,
and so you know, that's the reality of what we've inherited.
I can complain and wing about that, but the reality
is I now and I've got to fix it. And
I may wish to have been dealt with different cards,
but these are the ones I've been dealt with, and
I've got to play, you know, I've got to sort
it out. So I agree with you, I think you know,
But be under no illusions. If these guys get back
(21:17):
in man alive, they're going to spend more, tax more,
borrow more, and that has put huge pressure on New
Zealand's finances, as that Royal Commission of Inquiry highlighted pretty clearly,
do you believe.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
There's an issue with the homeless? Of questions is what's
your policy and plans for the homeless?
Speaker 5 (21:31):
Well, I think we've put you know, we've put three
hundred more housing first places available, We've put ten million
dollars into immediately dealing with you know, the homeless problem,
particularly as we've seen it here in Auckland. We have
Auckland City Council actually doing daily counts of the homeless,
and I think we've done. You know, if you think
about housing, you've got to get housing affordability right. Otherwise
(21:53):
people don't own a house, They rent a house they
can't rent, they end up on a statehouse wasailest, and
then they end up homeless. It's very complex. There's often
a range of issues, and what we have to do
is be able to get those wrap around services around
those individuals and work with the nonprofit organizations as a result.
But it's not just as simple as these people don't
(22:13):
have houses. They have complex needs. Often it could be
addiction issues, it could be mental health issues that could
be homeless you know, generally housing access as well. So
I think, you know we've done you know, getting people
out of emergency motel rooms, which was just ridiculous, has
been really good, and we've got a lot of those
people into proper social housing, proper homes, particularly the families.
(22:36):
When you're raising a family in a motel room for
goodness sake for a year, that's utterly unacceptable. So on homelessness,
we've opened up more housing first places that've been filled up.
We're working very well, particularly with some of the nonprofits,
on getting them delivering on the contracts and the things
that we pay them to do to make sure that
they actually are getting people. And when you look at
the Auckland City Council, you know homeless count. You know,
(22:57):
in different days, it's different dimensions, but it's been twenty
five to thirty five people we're talking about downtown.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Margaret asks if if we can have if people can
claim a percentage of what they give to a church,
why can't you action tax rebates for people who are
paying for private medical insurance, because we are Every operation
we've had is save the public system money.
Speaker 5 (23:20):
Yeah, I think that's a really good question. The way
that and there's some pros and some cons about tax
deductibility for private health insurance, and it's not quite as
simple as it when you get into that issue at
the next level. But what I'm trying to do is
use the capacity that's in the private system and the
public system. So for example, we've had a massive backlog
(23:41):
built up over that six years on people who need
first surgeries or elective surgeries, think about cataracts, think about
knee and hYP replacements. The private system can actually often
deliver that cheaper because are sort of more of a
factory of just churning those things through. And I'm happy
to pay for that. And you don't care whether you're
on your back of your beld looking at the ceiling,
whether it's in a private or public hospital. But the
issue about private insurance, it.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
Come back to tax rebates.
Speaker 5 (24:03):
Yeah, I think that's something we will think about. But
it's quite complicated because for a number of different reasons
which I don't want to go into, but quite technical
as to how that actually works in practice. So are
you for it or again it I'm open to looking
at it. I know Samy and Brown and I've talked
about it, but I don't.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
Say this you're learning that's a very political life. No no, no,
no ceo no.
Speaker 5 (24:24):
But there is real there is real challenges with it
as you don't don't want the unintended conceptence like, for example,
in other countries there's a whole different way in which
they structure their public healthcier system that makes the private
healthcare system tax rebate work. In New Zealand, we've got
pretty universal access in our public system. You don't have
Medicaid or you don't pay it when you get to
a certain income. In Australia, for example, you end up
(24:46):
making payments to the state essentially because your income's getting higher.
That's offsetting your public health liability. So there's just a
bunch of complexity in there. But I like the idea
because I think the point is a really good one,
which is you're taking pressure out of the public system.
My immediate focus is short term to say, we've got
all these fricking backlogs and witless and I've got to
(25:08):
whip my way through it pretty damn fast.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
All the big comments, all the big insights of comments. Carrie,
just complimenting you on your makeup.
Speaker 5 (25:16):
Thank you nice. You said you put a lot of
effort into the eyebrows, in particular.
Speaker 3 (25:22):
Chelsea, my colleague, Chelsea Daniels. Thank god. Otherwise I'd have
looked like a mad professor. But cooly. Anyway, we don't
need to go, we don't need to see how the
sausage is made to do well.
Speaker 5 (25:33):
I'd love I'd love curly here. Just for the record, Carrie,
I'll just say much texture.
Speaker 3 (25:39):
Richard, A very good morning to you. You're packing up
to move to the UK.
Speaker 6 (25:44):
Yeah, good morning, Kerry, Good morning Prime Minister. We're over
here at the moment. We're over here at the moment.
We've been here for the last six seven weeks and
just scoping out just to see if this is where
we want to call home. You go to the supermarket
here and the cost of food and everything is so
much cheaper than what we're paying back home. We talk
to family what they're paying and rates, but they and
(26:06):
insurance is a small fraction of what we're paying back home.
We can't afford to live back in New Zealand. We're
earning over two hundred grand in New Zealand, but we
aren't having the quality of life that we should be
having any longer. So we've made the choice that we've
been over here. We've scoped the place out to look
around what we've got. We're thinking of our retirement planning
(26:28):
and what happens as we get older. There's so many
more hospitals around that can look after us over here.
You walk around the streets, the homelessness isn't there like
we've got back home. You feel safer. People are happier
New Zealand in the UK. In the UK, this is
(26:48):
the UK, but look, people are happy here compared to
New Zealand, and I think that's what needs to happen.
The reality is that the members of Parliament in New
Zealand are so far removed from the general Joe blogs
like us that are workers there and paying our taxes
and trying to do our best. We don't know what
it's like to live there anymore. We can afford to
live in the country that we love and a door,
(27:11):
and that's it. We're going to pack up and leave.
We can't afford to stay there anymore. It's just too expensive.
It's really really hard. But that's that's reality, because it's
it's got everything that we want. Everything is here.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
Chaka a soongu and all that each to their own taste.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
Yeah, look, I mean, I know the UK is in
a pretty tough place relative to New Zealand, and having
visited there and having lived there myself and knowing how
expensive housing is and transportation a bunch of things, and
i'd think about some of the challenges when I've spoken
to their Prime Minister that they're dealing with in that country.
I'd put it to you, I'd sooner be leader of
New Zealand and the leader of the UK. The only
thing I'd say to you is that in the last
(27:49):
year we've had an eighteen percent growth in Kiwi's returning home,
and we've had less Kiwis leaving each month than we
you know, And since I think the last year of Hipkins.
So I think you know, and I get it because
you know, there was you know, when New Zealand goes
through tough times, people actually do look for other places
where they think that they work hard can get ahead.
What we have to do, and what we're working hard
to do, is to rebuild back the proposition that if
(28:10):
you work hard in New Zealand, you should be able
to get ahead. We're having to deal with getting inflation down,
interest rates down, Richard's spilling down. No, I get it,
and you know, but you've always got to be safe
in terms of a country. I think we've made some
good progress on law and order. Your kids, actually you
need to get a world class education. Your parents need
to be able to get good healthcare. So we that
is the work that our government is to make sure
that we are building a proposition that actually, you know,
(28:32):
Kiwis actually feel there is a great future here. And
when I see an eighteen percent growth and Keywi's returning
home because it turns out, yep, housing in Australia is
a lot more expensive. It turns out actually it is
a more competitive market in terms of some of the
jobs that are going on. It turns out they do
have higher levels of inflation. So you know, you know,
I understand your frustration about it, and certainly you're right
(28:52):
your cost of living, whether it's insurance rates, you know, food.
You know, we've had a series of high we had
thirty two year high inflation that was locked in for
a number of years and it's expensive.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
Can't afford to deliver here on two hundred k. I
think that's a you problem, not a country problem, says
a Texter.
Speaker 5 (29:09):
I just say I think New Zealand's position is much
better than the UK's.
Speaker 3 (29:13):
UK wouldn't be my first, true, but then I'm not richer.
Stop screening your calls, your tart, Let people tell I
used to be a tart tart retired and let people
tell them what New Zealand really thunks of them. Well,
you ignorant, numpty, I don't screen the calls, so more
for you. And the text machine is here and I'll
pass all that on to Christopher Luxe at the end. Now,
(29:35):
there was a text here about being overrun by Indians,
Indians everywhere. Can we talk about those?
Speaker 5 (29:44):
Yeah, because I just I know there's been a lot
of scare mongering about the Indian FTA, particularly around immigration,
and it is so wrong, absolutely wrong. The deal that
we have done is a very reasonable deal, and we
have total control over the immigration.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
We're going to be flooded with Indians.
Speaker 5 (30:00):
Not true. It's just not true. Because here's the situation.
We we came power, there was one hundred and thirty
five thousand net migration into New Zealand, so we had
too much migration going on of Indians. No of total migration.
We've got twenty five thousand today net migration. And how
have we done that. We've moved it from seventy percent
low skilled to seventy percent high skilled in the two
(30:22):
and a bit years. We have made sure our immigration
settings are smart, they're targeted, are quite tight. We've got
rights and responsibles, we have enforcements, exploitation, a whole bunch
of things that we've done. We've got this green list
where we might need Philippine welders, you know, a couple
of years ago. We may not need that now, but
we might need something else. And it's a very dynamic shift.
So we link our immigration to our economic strategy and
(30:45):
also to our infrastructure. And when you look at the
UK with a thousand illegal immigrants coming in a day.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Illegal immigrants that cause problems is.
Speaker 5 (30:53):
What Trump's dealing with in the US situation. You know,
New Zealand's actually done and we've done a very good
job I think of tightening things up.
Speaker 3 (30:59):
In the last and most of our migrants come from.
Speaker 5 (31:01):
Well, they come from all over the world. Actually. I
mean if we've had this different Vestavisa, where we've said
if you're prepared to come to New Zealand and invest
five or ten million dollars and put it into a
proper business, not a house, but into a business, that's
the only thing you can do. Well, we've had four
billion dollars raised that way from about six hundred people,
forty percent of American, twenty percent German. You know, there's
(31:22):
been a huge influx of people from all over the world.
But I just want to say our immigrant community, you know,
they leave their home, their family, their work, their culture,
their language. They come to New Zealand because they believe
is a better future for this country. They work two
or three jobs, often to get a deposit for a
house or a business. They send their kids to school
because they value education. They don't go on welfare, because
(31:43):
they believe in the work and they are some of
the most aspirational, ambitious, positive people we have in this country.
And we exactly exactly as my forebears were from Ireland
or from Scotland, you know, the same thing.
Speaker 3 (31:54):
We've had people from India here, China here.
Speaker 5 (31:56):
Yeah, but this it's very easy to escape goes. But
I just would say, on the one hand, they have
been great kiwis that they've built, and you know, they've
added something to New Zealand and they've donet But equally
we've also been very smart with our immigration setting so
we don't end up in this situation that we've seen
in other countries around the world.
Speaker 3 (32:12):
And we don't want boom bust like we've had.
Speaker 5 (32:14):
No, No, we've just got to keep it consistent, moderate,
and we link everything to the vacancies that we've got
in our economy and the jobs shortages.
Speaker 6 (32:21):
That we have.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
News talks said, b that's it. Gosh, it goes quickly,
doesn't it. I'm so sorry. We've got a load of
other questions. Ah, we might have to save the maification
ones for next time. All for David Seymour, given the
hits his particular bug bear.
Speaker 5 (32:36):
Yeah, look, I mean, it's I get it. There's been
a challenging time. We're all over it. We've had so
many things that we're just wrestling with and dealing with
that keep coming into our frame. But having just been
traveling even in the last over the weekend, yeah, I've
got to tell you, I'd sooner be in New Zealand
anywhere else. We are being smack in the middle of
the most dynamic part of the world. We've got abundant resources,
we've got goods democratic institutions, and we've got incredible people.
(32:57):
So even as challenging as it is out there in
the world with Trump and all the tariffs and the
wars in Iran and all the things that we're dealing with, Man,
I'd say New Zealand's got a great future still. And
I know it's hard and it's been difficult, but we
can get through this and get to the other side.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
I really hope.
Speaker 7 (33:13):
So.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
Oh I know so, but I would I certainly wouldn't
be going to the UK when the sun goes down.
Speaker 5 (33:19):
At four That used to the low point for me
was sort of the sun would go down at three
thirty over winter, and you've got a two year old
and a baby you've just taken to the park, and
then the two year old throws a tantrum, and I
just remember walking back from Wimbledon Park picked to my
house carrying a scooter a two year old who was
having a tent yep and it was all dark, and
(33:39):
going back to our two up, two down, sort of
our terrace house, not be able to find my car
because I'd parked at several blocks away away from the
house because there wasn't any garage or you know, let's
say so I get it. Look, you know, we've got
challenges here at home, and there are challenges all around
the world, and everyone's frustrated around the world. But I'd
seen a man, I'd seen a beer ki we and
be living.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Here and you chose.
Speaker 5 (34:02):
Oh Sam Fender, he is the British Bruce Springsteen with Olivia.
Speaker 6 (34:07):
Nister.
Speaker 5 (34:08):
Oh no, he's awesome. Go listen to Sam Fender.
Speaker 3 (34:10):
I have not heard of Sam Fender feat Olivia Dean.
Speaker 5 (34:13):
Featuring Olivia Dean, great singer, She's awesome. She is rain
me In, Rain me In, this great duet from both
of them.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
God, let you go, let you go on the on
the loose rain all right, Thank you very much, Prime Minister.
Look forward to catching up in a couple of time.
Take care a couple of months, won't it be. Yeah,
thanks again for the opportunity to talk. Appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
For more from Kerry Wooden Mornings, listen live to news
talks it'd be from nine am weekdays, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
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