Kerre Woodham: Should security guards have the power to intervene?

Security guards will be given the power to detain people and use force under a sweeping ACT Party proposal that makes the very fair point that police are overstretched, and businesses can no longer wait for officers to respond. Some of them would see tectonic plates drift as they waited for the Police to respond to shoplifters who are slowly but surely causing their business to buckle under the pressure and the increased costs. Repeated shoplifters, those who just wander in, take what they want and leave because they know nobody's coming. Those who urinate in doorways and do all sorts of vile things I've heard about from inner city retailers because they know they're not a high priority. It's not good enough and nobody's come up with a solution yet until ACT's proposal. Under the plan, the accredited security operators would have and could use new powers on private premises, filling in the gap between police and community patrols. The policy would allow retailers, business associations, transport operators and others to deploy the guards. 

In the story in the Herald this morning, David Seymour said the law and order pledge would protect business owners. He said police can't respond quickly to every call and we know that – security professionals have the potential to fill the gap. New Zealand has twice as many licensed security officers as police officers, but they currently have no more authority than any other citizen. And it's true that this has been a hardy talkback chestnut. The question is always asked; why can security guards tackle pitch invaders but not shoplifters who are brazenly walking out of supermarkets with hundreds of dollars worth of goods in their trolleys, taking one hand off the trolley to give two fingers to the supermarket owners, the customers and the security guards?  

The answer is that pitch invaders are a threat to public safety apparently, to the players, to other people. So security guards are allowed to prevent disruption and mitigate high risk safety threats by tackling the hoors, whereas walking out with trolleys worth of stuff is not considered a threat to public safety. The physical intervention, the thumping tackles and the arm behind the back and the walking out of the grounds is purely for expulsion and safety, not for recovering property, which makes the tackle legally defensible if it prevents physical harm or major disruption.  The question is would you want to? Do security officers want the expectation on the part of the business owner and on the part of the customers, the legal customers, do you want that expectation on your shoulders that you will intervene? Do you want everybody to look at you and say well go after them? 

There's all kinds of crazy out there, especially with people who are just blatant career thieves. Will it escalate violence? If you do the thumping tackle, can you expect that the person who's trying to flee will resort to violence to get away? Will simply the threat of security guards being able to act rather than having to stand there like cardboard cutouts of coppers while the thieves laugh all the way to the boot of their car and load it up with all their goods? That must be so galling for everybody, for paying customers to have to see it, for the business owner to have to see it, for the security guards to have to see it, these lowlifes just walking out and laughing because they know that everybody is powerless.  

If you're given power, if the security officers have the power, will that be a sufficient deterrent? I'd really love to hear your thoughts on this. I don't know the answer. I'd love to see them get the powers, the legal powers to intervene, but are you paid enough to risk your life? The coppers aren't and yet they do and they're paid a lot more than you guys and girls. There's enormous acts of bravery on the part of security officers, but should there be an expectation of that kind of bravery? 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Carrywood and Morning's podcast from News Talks,
he'd be.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
Security guards will be given the power to detain people
and use force under a sweeping Act Party proposal that
makes the very fair point that police are overstretched and
businesses can no longer wait for officers to respond. Some
of them would see tectonic plates drift as they waited

(00:37):
for the police to respond to shoplifters who are slowly
but surely causing their business to buckle under the pressure
and the increased costs. Repeated shoplifters, those who just wander
and take what they want and leave because they know

(00:57):
nobody's coming. Those who urinate in doorways and do all
sorts of vile things I've heard about from in a
city READI because they know they're not a high priority.
It's not good enough, and nobody's come up with a
solution yet until Act's proposal. Under the plan, the accredited

(01:20):
security operators would have and could use new powers on
private premises, filling in the gap between police and community patrols.
The policy would allow retailers, business associations, transport operators and
others to deploy the guards. In the story in the

(01:40):
Herald this morning. David Seymour said the Law and Order
Pledge would protect business owners. He said police can't respond
quickly to every call, and we know that security professionals
have the potential to fill the gap. New Zealand has
twice as many licensed security officers as police officers, but

(02:01):
they currently have no more authority than any other citizen.
And it's true that this has been a hardy talk
back chestnut. The question is always asked, why can security
guards tackle pitch invaders but not shoplifters who are brazenly
walking out of supermarkets with hundreds of dollars worth of

(02:22):
goods in their trolleys, taking one hand off the trolley
to give two fingers to the supermarket owners, the customers
and the security guards. The answer is that pitch invaders
are a threat to public safety, apparently to the players,
to other people, so security guards are allowed to prevent

(02:45):
disruption and mitigate high risk safety threats by tackling the hoos,
whereas walking out with trolley's worth of stuff is not
considered a threat to public safety. The physical intervention, the
thumping tackles and the arm behind the back, and the

(03:06):
walking out of the grounds is purely for expulsion and safety,
not for recovering property, which makes the tackle legally defensible
if it prevents physical harm or major disruption. So what
acts legislation? What acts proposal would look like would be

(03:29):
that you could go after the thief and if they ran,
you could tackle them. The question is would you want
to do security officers want the expectation on the part
of the business owner and the part of the customers,
the legal customers. Do you want that expectation on your

(03:53):
shoulders that you will intervene? Do you want everybody to
look at you and say we'll go after them. There's
all kinds of crazy out there, especially with people who
are just blatant career thieves. Will it escalate violence if

(04:17):
you do the thumping tackle? Can you expect that the
person who's trying to flee will resort to violence to
get away? Will simply the threat of security guards being
able to act rather than having to stand there like

(04:38):
cardboard cutouts of coppers while the thieves laugh all the
way to the boot of their car and load it
up with all their goods. They must be so gauling
for everybody, for paying customers to have to see it,
for the business owner to have to see it, for
the security guards to have to see it. These low

(05:00):
lives just walking out and laughing because they know that
everybody is powerless. If you're given power, if the security
officers have the power, will that be a sufficient deterrent.
I'd really love to hear your thoughts on this. I
don't know the answer. I'd love to see them get

(05:25):
the powers, the legal powers to intervene. But are you
paid enough to risk your life? The coppers aren't, and
yet they do, and they're paid a lot more than you,
guys and girls. There's enormous acts of bravery on the
part of security offices, but should there be an expectation
of that kind of bravery.

Speaker 1 (05:46):
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