New figures reveal hundreds of Kiwi officers are continuing to head across the Tasman, nearly one in three police resignations are now linked to the move.
But, the Police Commissioner didn't seem too worried when he spoke to Mike Hosking this morning, saying they prioritise quality over quantity.
Minister of Police Mark Mitchell told Kerre Woodham "of course we want to pay our frontline police, all of our police personnel as much as we can, but we are limited. We are in a pretty bad fiscal situation at the moment as a country but we'll do our best without a doubt."
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Kerrywood and Mornings podcast from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be New figures reveal hundreds of Kiwi officers are
continuing to head across the Tasman. An investigation by one
News reveals one hundred and forty four New Zealand police
officers left for Australia in the past year, with nearly
one in three police resignations now link to the move.
Police across in Australia made two hundred and sixty eight
(00:32):
vetting requests for officers here between January twenty five and
March of this year. The Police Commission didn't seem too
worried when he spoke to Mike Costing this morning, saying
New Zealand cops have an outstanding reputation and it can
be helpful to get experience overseas. Minister of Police Mark
Mitchell joins me, now, very good morning to you.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Hey, good morning, Cairie. Thank you for having me on.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
No, that's great. One hundred and forty four doesn't seem
a lot like when you say exodus, I imagine thousands.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Well, I mean we don't want to lose our police
officers to Australia, of course, but I've always been really
clear about it is that they've already provided.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Great public service for us here.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Like a lot of other professions, people like to move
around and try different things, and so you know. And
by the way, the Australians have been here recruiting for decades.
I remember when I was a young police officer in
Gisbone and I had two young kids.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
I was in a bedroom.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I was in a house with two bedrooms and one
bathroom in there, and the Queensland Police turned up and said,
come over to us and we'll give you a four
bedroom house with an on sweeteness that I didn't even
know what an onn sweet wars then in an in
ground pool, and we'll pay you more money. So you know,
And a few of my friends went, and most of
the state because I wanted to serve my community in
(01:49):
the country that i'd grown up in. So everyone make
their personal choices. The different police forces in Australia, the
State Police force in Australia, and a lot of them
are struggling with recruiting. They and we ENLiGHT The Commissioner said,
we've got world class police officers here in New Zealand,
so we don't want them coming and recruiting our people.
But you understand why they.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
Do, Yeah, you can do you think? Of course it's
pay and I mean it's the same with the nurses
as well. And the nurses have also said to us
it's the conditions of work that they find appealing in
Australia as well. But the conditions of work in Australia
would be vastly different to hear, wouldn't they Look.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
I just think that we do have police officers that
are coming home. There is definitely us reading an article
the other day that a couple of police officers are
coming back said that they just found it was a
very different culture and didn't fully align with the values
all the way that they wanted to police.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
And so we have got people coming back home. But
there's others that will get out there.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
They love the Australia as a wonderful country and they'll
get out there and they'll enjoy everything that Australia has
to offer.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
We cannot compete with wages.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
The reality it is as we're much smaller with a
smaller population, and we don't tap into our we haven't
been willing to tap into our natural resources the way
that Australia has been which has driven them as a
as a high wage economy.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
When it comes to making it worth it for them,
we might not be able to match them dollar for dollar,
but if you offer a pay increase that represents, you know,
a significant increase in this country, if you have courts
that back their decisions, then that might encourage them to stay.
(03:31):
I think it's a feeling of morale, isn't it that
if they feel they're not being backed or supported, then
they're more likely to leave.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Well.
Speaker 4 (03:40):
I think that, you know, I hope that our frontline
police officers have felt like they have been backed and
supported by this government.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
I know that when.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
The under the previous government, they felt like their hands
were tied behind their backs, they felt like they weren't
being supported and they weren't able to actually go out
there and do their job properly. We've given them new legislation,
We've definitely got behind them and they're being extremely effective.
And I'm very proud of the work that our frontline
police and in fact the whole police organization does, whether
it be sworn or non sworn, everyone's got a critical
(04:12):
role to play and it's an incredible way of doing
public service. Of course, we want to pay our frontline police,
all of our police personnel as much as we can.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
We are limited.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
We are in a pretty bad fiscal situation at the
moment as a country, and so but we'll do our
best without a doubt. And obviously we just expect there
to be good faith negotiations now that take place between
the Police Association and the police and I can't get
involved or inject myself into that, but you know, let's
(04:46):
hope that that goes as well as it can.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
How is the Auckland training when working out really well?
Speaker 4 (04:53):
So that's worked out well for us because especially members
of the community that I really want to join the police,
but have got family obligations and commitments and it's very
hard to leave them.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
You know.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
Six month period has meant that they're and they live
in Auckland. Has meant that they can actually stay and
do the training that they need. I've been to the
graduations there. The quality of the training that's delivered is
consistent and world class, and it's worked out really well
for us in terms of really driving forward to delivering
those five hundred that we want.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
A text rights, could you ask Mark please why the
recruitment process takes so long. My son applied in November
last year, is no clear on when he'll progress.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Yeah, so really really good question.
Speaker 4 (05:38):
That does take a bit of time with the psychometric
testing and the physical testing, and we have got a
really big pipeline of people coming in and wanting to
join the police. So just persevere with it, get back
to the recruit to his recruiting officer, indicate that they
would like to get in on the next available wing.
That often helps because a lot of people sort of
(05:59):
say O, I know, wait or you know, and but yeah,
just encourage them to keep pushing.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
They will get through.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
It does take a little bit of time, specially at
the moment because we've got so many people are blind.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Why given that the police have been under a bit
of a cloud recently with Givin mcscumming it.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
L I just think that well, there's this new this
new leadership.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Richard Chambers quite simply is an outstanding Commissioner of Police.
It steeply connected and cares about his front line. That's
been really obvious, and that's that's a really great motivator
for you know, for our front line. Know that they've
got a boss Thatt backs them. You know, we've got
a new executive. It's a great way of doing public service.
It's an exciting job. There's lots of different things that
you can do. There's lots of different areas that you
(06:41):
can pursue, and you know, and and you know what,
looking after your community that you come from is actually
a real privilege, and so you know, it's a good thing.
The recruiting campaigns have gone very well, and we've got
a really strong pipeline if people wanting to join the police,
and not just young people.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Like.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
The thing that I really love about is it is
older people now can come in for a third or
fourth career. And when I go to graduations, there's people
in their forties and fifties that have decided to take
up policing as their public service.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
We're still time for Helen, Helen's I might have had
my runner bit late, although maybe I could cut No, maybe.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Not at all, not at all.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
If you guys listen, if you guys want to join up,
I'll bring the forms up and I'll tell you what
I'll commit to get out in training for the physical
committency tests with you both.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Oh dear Lord, oh those No, the doublefs have never
get me over offence. When it comes to the non
sworn officers, perhaps I could be one of those, because
I've had a text also from somebody saying letting go
of hundreds of non sworn people is making it that
much tougher for cops right now.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
Well, we've been very clear that there was a massive
blowout in the bureau, say and Wellington, and that we
have been very very clear about the fact that our
investment and we've made We've made an enormous investment into
police because when I became minister, they are about a
week away from going broke and the previous government had
failed to actually fund all the support services, so we
(08:12):
pumped one hundred and twenty million dollars immediately into stabilizing them.
Non sworn have got a critically important role to play.
In fact, from my own policing, I often say that
it was the non sworn staff in the station that
we're actually running the place. But we had to right
size the organization. We had to make sure that it's
that it's sustainable and that we're pumping and making sure
(08:34):
that we're putting all of that our investment into the
front line and making sure that we're getting on top
of member that we inherited a really bad situation in
terms of violent crime in this country and it's taken
a lot of focus and big investment to get back
on top of that problem.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Why is there only one class per year for that goodness,
we need to have you on for an hour almost.
Why is there only one class per year for the
Auckland intake. I've applied for the school, achieved everything. I'm
not able to move to Wellington any opportunity for more
Auckland intakes.
Speaker 4 (09:01):
So the commissioner is running more. We are running more
courses in Auckland, so there will be I mean, of
course they're limited in terms of the numbers that they
can take in the size of the wings, but there
are It's been a real success and there are going
to be more courses run in Auckland.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
Well that's good. When do you know?
Speaker 4 (09:21):
Look, I'd have to check on that, but I think
there's I think the next one is getting ready to
ramp up.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Okay, I joined the police at forty two, says another one.
I had twenty years of a great career, So there
you go. Yeah, absolutely, And finally for you before we
let you go, because I know you're busy and you
took time out nice and all, you know, pump up
your tires before you go. Kirie love the show. Great
to have Mark mitchelon. I went to a community event
the other night in Lynnfield. Mark was amazing, really down
(09:47):
to work. Yeah, that's right, he should be our next
prime minister.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 4 (09:52):
I definitely we've got the promise we need, there's no
doubt about that. But thank you to ever wrote in,
and yes I did. I did a public safety meeting
in Mount Roskill with the local MP there, Carlos showing,
and it was very very good and it was nice
to have the people turn out. And normally, of course
I'm there to hear what the issues and problems are
so we get focused on those. But it was lovely
(10:13):
to get some positive feedback and people saying that they've
definitely noticed the difference, how police are doing a great
job and they're feeling safer.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Nice to have you on as always. Thank you so much,
that is police minister. Mark Mitchell News Talk said, b
It was sort of like a sort of like an hour,
wasn't it. I'm glad you sent in your questions. Thank you,
that was sensible, making the most of the minister.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
For more from carry Wood and Mornings, listen live to
news talks. It'd be from nine am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Kerrywood and Mornings podcast from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
He'd be New figures reveal hundreds of Kiwi officers are
continuing to head across the Tasman. An investigation by one
News reveals one hundred and forty four New Zealand police
officers left for Australia in the past year, with nearly
one in three police resignations now link to the move.
Police across in Australia made two hundred and sixty eight
(00:32):
vetting requests for officers here between January twenty five and
March of this year. The Police Commission didn't seem too
worried when he spoke to Mike Costing this morning, saying
New Zealand cops have an outstanding reputation and it can
be helpful to get experience overseas. Minister of Police Mark
Mitchell joins me, now, very good morning to you.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Hey, good morning, Cairie. Thank you for having me on.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
No, that's great. One hundred and forty four doesn't seem
a lot like when you say exodus, I imagine thousands.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Well, I mean we don't want to lose our police
officers to Australia, of course, but I've always been really
clear about it is that they've already provided.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Great public service for us here.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Like a lot of other professions, people like to move
around and try different things, and so you know. And
by the way, the Australians have been here recruiting for decades.
I remember when I was a young police officer in
Gisbone and I had two young kids.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
I was in a bedroom.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I was in a house with two bedrooms and one
bathroom in there, and the Queensland Police turned up and said,
come over to us and we'll give you a four
bedroom house with an on sweeteness that I didn't even
know what an onn sweet wars then in an in
ground pool, and we'll pay you more money. So you know,
And a few of my friends went, and most of
the state because I wanted to serve my community in
(01:49):
the country that i'd grown up in. So everyone make
their personal choices. The different police forces in Australia, the
State Police force in Australia, and a lot of them
are struggling with recruiting. They and we ENLiGHT The Commissioner said,
we've got world class police officers here in New Zealand,
so we don't want them coming and recruiting our people.
But you understand why they.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
Do, Yeah, you can do you think? Of course it's
pay and I mean it's the same with the nurses
as well. And the nurses have also said to us
it's the conditions of work that they find appealing in
Australia as well. But the conditions of work in Australia
would be vastly different to hear, wouldn't they Look.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
I just think that we do have police officers that
are coming home. There is definitely us reading an article
the other day that a couple of police officers are
coming back said that they just found it was a
very different culture and didn't fully align with the values
all the way that they wanted to police.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
And so we have got people coming back home. But
there's others that will get out there.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
They love the Australia as a wonderful country and they'll
get out there and they'll enjoy everything that Australia has
to offer.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
We cannot compete with wages.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
The reality it is as we're much smaller with a
smaller population, and we don't tap into our we haven't
been willing to tap into our natural resources the way
that Australia has been which has driven them as a
as a high wage economy.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
When it comes to making it worth it for them,
we might not be able to match them dollar for dollar,
but if you offer a pay increase that represents, you know,
a significant increase in this country, if you have courts
that back their decisions, then that might encourage them to stay.
(03:31):
I think it's a feeling of morale, isn't it that
if they feel they're not being backed or supported, then
they're more likely to leave.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Well.
Speaker 4 (03:40):
I think that, you know, I hope that our frontline
police officers have felt like they have been backed and
supported by this government.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
I know that when.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
The under the previous government, they felt like their hands
were tied behind their backs, they felt like they weren't
being supported and they weren't able to actually go out
there and do their job properly. We've given them new legislation,
We've definitely got behind them and they're being extremely effective.
And I'm very proud of the work that our frontline
police and in fact the whole police organization does, whether
it be sworn or non sworn, everyone's got a critical
(04:12):
role to play and it's an incredible way of doing
public service. Of course, we want to pay our frontline police,
all of our police personnel as much as we can.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
We are limited.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
We are in a pretty bad fiscal situation at the
moment as a country, and so but we'll do our
best without a doubt. And obviously we just expect there
to be good faith negotiations now that take place between
the Police Association and the police and I can't get
involved or inject myself into that, but you know, let's
(04:46):
hope that that goes as well as it can.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
How is the Auckland training when working out really well?
Speaker 4 (04:53):
So that's worked out well for us because especially members
of the community that I really want to join the police,
but have got family obligations and commitments and it's very
hard to leave them.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
You know.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
Six month period has meant that they're and they live
in Auckland. Has meant that they can actually stay and
do the training that they need. I've been to the
graduations there. The quality of the training that's delivered is
consistent and world class, and it's worked out really well
for us in terms of really driving forward to delivering
those five hundred that we want.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
A text rights, could you ask Mark please why the
recruitment process takes so long. My son applied in November
last year, is no clear on when he'll progress.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Yeah, so really really good question.
Speaker 4 (05:38):
That does take a bit of time with the psychometric
testing and the physical testing, and we have got a
really big pipeline of people coming in and wanting to
join the police. So just persevere with it, get back
to the recruit to his recruiting officer, indicate that they
would like to get in on the next available wing.
That often helps because a lot of people sort of
(05:59):
say O, I know, wait or you know, and but yeah,
just encourage them to keep pushing.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
They will get through.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
It does take a little bit of time, specially at
the moment because we've got so many people are blind.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Why given that the police have been under a bit
of a cloud recently with Givin mcscumming it.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
L I just think that well, there's this new this
new leadership.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Richard Chambers quite simply is an outstanding Commissioner of Police.
It steeply connected and cares about his front line. That's
been really obvious, and that's that's a really great motivator
for you know, for our front line. Know that they've
got a boss Thatt backs them. You know, we've got
a new executive. It's a great way of doing public service.
It's an exciting job. There's lots of different things that
you can do. There's lots of different areas that you
(06:41):
can pursue, and you know, and and you know what,
looking after your community that you come from is actually
a real privilege, and so you know, it's a good thing.
The recruiting campaigns have gone very well, and we've got
a really strong pipeline if people wanting to join the police,
and not just young people.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Like.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
The thing that I really love about is it is
older people now can come in for a third or
fourth career. And when I go to graduations, there's people
in their forties and fifties that have decided to take
up policing as their public service.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
We're still time for Helen, Helen's I might have had
my runner bit late, although maybe I could cut No, maybe.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Not at all, not at all.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
If you guys listen, if you guys want to join up,
I'll bring the forms up and I'll tell you what
I'll commit to get out in training for the physical
committency tests with you both.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Oh dear Lord, oh those No, the doublefs have never
get me over offence. When it comes to the non
sworn officers, perhaps I could be one of those, because
I've had a text also from somebody saying letting go
of hundreds of non sworn people is making it that
much tougher for cops right now.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
Well, we've been very clear that there was a massive
blowout in the bureau, say and Wellington, and that we
have been very very clear about the fact that our
investment and we've made We've made an enormous investment into
police because when I became minister, they are about a
week away from going broke and the previous government had
failed to actually fund all the support services, so we
(08:12):
pumped one hundred and twenty million dollars immediately into stabilizing them.
Non sworn have got a critically important role to play.
In fact, from my own policing, I often say that
it was the non sworn staff in the station that
we're actually running the place. But we had to right
size the organization. We had to make sure that it's
that it's sustainable and that we're pumping and making sure
(08:34):
that we're putting all of that our investment into the
front line and making sure that we're getting on top
of member that we inherited a really bad situation in
terms of violent crime in this country and it's taken
a lot of focus and big investment to get back
on top of that problem.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Why is there only one class per year for that goodness,
we need to have you on for an hour almost.
Why is there only one class per year for the
Auckland intake. I've applied for the school, achieved everything. I'm
not able to move to Wellington any opportunity for more
Auckland intakes.
Speaker 4 (09:01):
So the commissioner is running more. We are running more
courses in Auckland, so there will be I mean, of
course they're limited in terms of the numbers that they
can take in the size of the wings, but there
are It's been a real success and there are going
to be more courses run in Auckland.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
Well that's good. When do you know?
Speaker 4 (09:21):
Look, I'd have to check on that, but I think
there's I think the next one is getting ready to
ramp up.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Okay, I joined the police at forty two, says another one.
I had twenty years of a great career, So there
you go. Yeah, absolutely, And finally for you before we
let you go, because I know you're busy and you
took time out nice and all, you know, pump up
your tires before you go. Kirie love the show. Great
to have Mark mitchelon. I went to a community event
the other night in Lynnfield. Mark was amazing, really down
(09:47):
to work. Yeah, that's right, he should be our next
prime minister.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 4 (09:52):
I definitely we've got the promise we need, there's no
doubt about that. But thank you to ever wrote in,
and yes I did. I did a public safety meeting
in Mount Roskill with the local MP there, Carlos showing,
and it was very very good and it was nice
to have the people turn out. And normally, of course
I'm there to hear what the issues and problems are
so we get focused on those. But it was lovely
(10:13):
to get some positive feedback and people saying that they've
definitely noticed the difference, how police are doing a great
job and they're feeling safer.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Nice to have you on as always. Thank you so much,
that is police minister. Mark Mitchell News Talk said, b
It was sort of like a sort of like an hour,
wasn't it. I'm glad you sent in your questions. Thank you,
that was sensible, making the most of the minister.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
For more from carry Wood and Mornings, listen live to
news talks. It'd be from nine am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
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