Alison Vaughan: SPCA senior scientific officer on the calls for reform following Northland dog attack

There's calls from experts, concerned citizens and politicians alike over whether animal control has enough powers and resources to lock animals up.

A woman was mauled to death by dogs at a Kaihu home yesterday morning. 

SPCA senior scientific officer Alison Vaughan says the current laws are out of date, and a review is needed - plus additional funding.

"The Dog Control Act is 30 years old, it's hopelessly out of date with modern science and what we know for other jurisdictions in terms of what is acceptive."

LISTEN ABOVE

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talks be follow
this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio,
so New Zealand.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
First Tiputy Leader and prominent Northland of Shane Jones says
our dog laws are not fit for purpose and joining
us is doctor Allison Vaughan. She is the SPCA Scientific
Officer and she's on the line, doctor Allison, Very good
afternoon to you.

Speaker 3 (00:31):
What leads to a dog attacking a human such that
the owner should be held accountable?

Speaker 4 (00:38):
Well, on an individual case level, there's multiple factors such
as lack of adequate socialization, the dog's been roaming in
the first place. But what we really need in terms
of addressing these sort of tragic incidents is much wider
change and we would agree with the Minister that our
laws are completely out of date in terms of this.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
What are the laws now? Just briefly, if there is
a dog owner who is a terrible owner and lets
their dog out in that dog could take someone, what
is the punishment they had on to confise?

Speaker 4 (01:12):
So there are punishments that are set out under the
Dog Control Act. But the real issue is the Dog
Control Act is thirty years old. It is hopelessly out
of date with modern science and what we know from
other jurisdictions in terms of what is effective at addressing
what is a population level issue. So really moving away
from focusing on the individual cases and focusing on addressing

(01:34):
what is needed, which is much wider action to address this.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
So what kind of water action are you talking about here?

Speaker 4 (01:42):
Well, I'm glad you asked. So there's not a silver bullet.
We need a suite of changes. But the most important
of these is we really need a substantive evidence based
review of the Dog Control Act and we also really
need more investment from central government in terms of desexing.
So the central government previously provided grants to local councils
to subicize the sexing of roaming dogs and dogs classified

(02:04):
as menacing, and we would like to see that return.

Speaker 3 (02:07):
So who's out there identifying that a dog is dangerous?

Speaker 4 (02:14):
So right now it's the individual councils animal management teams,
and really it's a patchwork of different approaches across the country.
So one of the other things we're calling for is
national guidance for councils, so that is a clear stepped
national approach. Following a dog by incident that incorporates evidence
based recognized tools such as the dunbar by a scale.

Speaker 3 (02:38):
So right now, if there's a dog that is clearly
a risk to humans and possibly other dogs and it
needs to be d sexed, can a d sixing order
be issued?

Speaker 4 (02:53):
So it depends on the council bylaws, so in some
cases they can. But what we really want to see
a lot of people might want to desecx their dog,
but there are barriers such as cost, and what we
see with dog by incidents is often we see more
dog attacks in areas lower socio economic areas. So to
help these communities, we need to make it needier so

(03:16):
people who do want to desect their dogs are able to.

Speaker 2 (03:19):
But is that a part of the problem dog de
Vaughn that when you have people who are owning dogs
who are not equipped to be able to provide them
what they need, then this leads to the Roman dog situation.
This leads to aggressive nature of dogs. They're not being
looked after properly because they are not responsible owners. So
is they're not some teeth within the legislation to look
at people whether they are actually fit for purpose to

(03:41):
look after what can be a dangerous animal.

Speaker 4 (03:44):
Absolutely, And I think what we need is a combination
of things because right now we have roaming dogs that
are not desect and this is causing more and more
this growing population of unwanted dogs who are roamings, who
are danger to our communities. So we both need to
address irresponsible owners, but we asto need to stop the
problem from growing.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
Yeah, because if you can't afford to do what's necessary
with a dog such that it doesn't attack people, then
you just can't have a dog. I would have thought,
because maybe it's a lower socioonomic er area, but people
other people in that lower sociology economic area are going
to be the victims of the of the dog attack.

Speaker 4 (04:24):
Absolutely, So we need to a multifactorial approach that addresses
all the different factors that create these situations. Because this
isn't just one case we're talking about here. This is
the third fatality in four years up in Northland and
this urgently needs the minister's attention.

Speaker 3 (04:42):
How easy is it to assign blame to a person
when a dog attack has happened? Does the dog have
some agency in an attack?

Speaker 4 (04:53):
Can you clarify your questions?

Speaker 3 (04:54):
Well, so someone's attacked a dog's attack someone. How easy
is it to assign blame to the human being, because
you know, you could have a dog that's been great
its whole life, and then they about dogs suddenly snapping.

Speaker 4 (05:11):
So one of the reasons we've been pushing for national
guidelines for cancels is because one of the tools that
we would recommend is that Ian Dunbar bite scale. Because
while dogs may bite if provoked, the type of bite
tells us a lot about the prognosis and how likely
that dog is to cause serious injury. So some dogs
will never go past a snap in the air or nip.

(05:35):
That's very different from a dog who may cause multiple
serious bite injuries, which we would consider it's not does
not have a good prognosis and should be euthanized. And
right now, cancels don't have this guidance on taking our
proportional approach that actually accurately assesses the likelihood of future
bites so that they can make sure they're addressing things

(05:56):
and having early intervention with some animals. Some animals euthanasia
would be the right option.

Speaker 3 (06:02):
What was the name of that protocol you just mentioned?
The dog of all.

Speaker 4 (06:06):
The Ian Dunbar bite scale and know there are actually
two petitions in front of the Select Committee about the
Dog Control Act, and one of them is calling for
national guidelines that incorporate this, and we're very much in support.

Speaker 3 (06:18):
Doctor Vaughan.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
Really appreciate your time and for having a chat with us.
Thank you very much and have a good afternoon.

Speaker 4 (06:25):
Appreciate it. Thank you.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
That is doctor Allison Vaughan, SBCA, Senior Scientific Officer.

Speaker 3 (06:30):
I guess it'd be pretty easy to assign blame if
the dog has bitten before and then nothing has been done.

Speaker 2 (06:35):
Yeah, the history of the dog would play into it absolutely.

Speaker 3 (06:38):
But I'm an interesting to look at this bite scale that.

Speaker 2 (06:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (06:41):
For more from News Talk sed B, listen live on
air or online, and keep our shows with you wherever
you go with our podcast on iHeartRadio.