September 4, 2026 • 18 mins
New book from hero Whakaari helicopter pilot and former NZSAS soldier Mark Law tells his story of surviving a series of life-threatening events that would shape his life and career.
Law joined Matt and Tyler to discuss his experiences and the new book 'Lucky You're Tough'.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
You're listening to a podcast from Newstalk ZB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Newstalk ZB. So Mark Law is a former SAS soldier.
He worked with the British SAS, spent years doing private
security work in some of the world's most dangerous places,
and then came home and became a helicopter operator in
the Bay of Plenty. But it's what happened on December 9, 2019,
that most New Zealanders will remember him for. When Whakaari erupted,
(00:36):
Mark and a group of fellow pilots flew into an
active volcanic disaster when the official rescue response wasn't coming.
They found badly injured survivors and flew them off the island,
knowing that there was a very real chance the volcano
could erupt again. They were later awarded some of the
country's highest bravery honours. Mark's extraordinary life, from rural Taranaki
to the SAS war zones, And eventually, Fakari is in
(00:59):
his new book, Lucky You're Tough. And Mark Lord joins
us now. Mark, g'day.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
Yeah, g'day, boys.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Hey, Mark, take us right back to SAS selection and training.
What was that like? What did you go through mentally
and physically to find out whether you had what it
takes to get through?
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Yes, so the New Zealand selection course was, there was nothing,
not a lot of information about it when we were,
you know, just joined the Army. So there was a
couple of books around, but the general sort of information
was that, you know, for the most part, you had
a big pack on and you walked a whole bunch
(01:39):
of distances for many days and, And you had to
make sure that you met those timings to ensure that
you carried on every day. And someday, one of the days,
it was going to end. There was a couple of
specific sort of, I suppose, challenges in there. The last
one being the endurance walk, the 60K walk. So I
(02:00):
was able to fortunately get on the selection course and
be nominated to have a crack. And so, yeah, so
I set out there to do that. And yeah, it
was certainly different than what I'd expected, but sort of
based around the same things. And yeah, it was a
massive challenge. I think I would have been okay if
my feet weren't destroyed by some my blisters caused by
(02:25):
tight boots but anyway regardless of that it was still
a massive effort so mentally just had to push through
the pain of the feet coming apart and taking them
up every day but otherwise it was just sort of
dig it in and finally the nine days come to
an end.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Wow and was there any point going at you thinking
I just can't do this I can't make it and
if so how did you keep going?
Speaker 4 (02:50):
Yeah, on the last day, the 60k-er, I was nearly
at the end, but it was nighttime. I had no
idea other than I thought I was getting really close.
But by then, my legs, my feet were just a
massive puff around where the blisters had been popping and
had sort of endured all those days of walking on.
(03:11):
I had sort of tracking up my legs. And I
remember resting on this bank on a road that we
were walking on. And it just was like I just
couldn't get my legs to go. They just wouldn't keep moving.
And I remember thinking, damn, you know, come on, legs.
You know, we're so close. And a mate, a good
(03:32):
mate later on came along. I didn't know him at
the time. And he pulled in beside me and said, look, mate,
you've just got to keep going. It's real close. The
final RV is close. And so, yeah, that was, you know,
got me through. And just not long after that, you know,
I finally found the last truck.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah, and once you've got these skills, you're in a
different league from basically anyone else. Very few people are
in the same league as you, and you ended up
in hotspots like Angola. And in the book, there's a
bit where you're attacked and a grenade actually shoved into
your mouth. When you've lived through something like that, that
most of us will never even get close to experiencing,
(04:11):
does that change, I guess, your relationship with fear? Does
that make you more resilient after the fact? Does it
change you?
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah, I reckon it does. It does change you. You
know what it's like with experiences. Once you've had something
go on in your life, it wasn't as so scary
or you didn't think about it as much, and that's
what has happened to me. You know, all the different
situations that while being through, you know, it definitely helps
(04:40):
when you arrive at the next one, albeit not looking
for it. It's just if it pops up, you know,
you're sort of well better armed mentally and physically to,
you know, to get into it or take it on
or react or do something. So, yeah, those situations, you know,
with the grenade in the mouth and that, you know,
I certainly wasn't contemplating that. I was too worried about
(05:01):
trying to find my false tooth at the bottom of
the Land Rover. And then when I felt that, you know,
I was like, oh, man, what the heck. But I
always knew, you know. I don't think he's going to
pull the pin and leave it in there, you know,
because he was sitting on top of me. But, you know,
it was just something in passing. It wasn't until you
sort of recollect later on, you're like, oh, yeah, what
a bloody dickhead, you know, trying to terrorise us. But, yeah,
(05:23):
you're just sort of focused on trying to sort of
survive and get away at that time.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
An unreal situation, Mark. So after all that, and you
certainly experienced some pretty crazy situations abroad, you came home
to New Zealand to start a helicopter company. Did that
feel like you were choosing a bit of a quieter life? Yeah.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
Yeah, no, it did. Yeah. Well, the industry I got into,
shooting deer and shooting and recovering deer for human consumption,
you know, like a little bit naive of me. I
sort of like, I think I like the look of it. And,
you know, I love hunting and flying, but man, it
was a tough gig. And a lot of people passed away, sadly.
And so, yeah, but it was sort of nicer to
(06:02):
be home in New Zealand. I loved being there. It
was peaceful. So it was good to get away from
that tempo and all that uncertainty and high risk.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yeah then December 9 2019 happens and you see that
enormous plume coming off the island. What went through your
head at that point Mark?
Speaker 4 (06:24):
I thought I thought the island had erupted, but I
wasn't too sure sort of the magnitude of it. And
then some phone calls went down really quickly between my staff,
Tim Barrow, Volcanic, and when we just did a quick
ring around, you know, trying to find, talk to PJ,
talk to a charter boat fisherman friend out there. And
(06:46):
then we very quickly learned that it was a significant eruption.
And so... And then that, coupled with Tim's helicopter, with
his pilot and crew were still there. They were actually,
we knew they were actually on the island. And so, yeah,
that just sort of, you know, drove us to, you know,
(07:08):
for me to get to the hangar quickly. Jason was there.
He quickly prepped two helicopters, called another pilot in, got
all a bunch of gear ready, some order and more
masks and bits and pieces and thought, right, we'll go
out there and have a look for the heli or
have a look for the crew on the helicopter. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Newstalk ZB, we're talking to Mark Law, a helicopter pilot
who led a rescue operation when White Island erupted on
his new memoir, Lucky You're Tough. So after the eruption, Mark,
and quite rightly, you expected the rescue emergency services to
be helping you with that operation. What went through your
head when you were told they weren't coming?
Speaker 4 (07:44):
Um. Not much other than, oh, you know, like, wow, okay,
they're not coming. And then it was just like within seconds, right,
it's us, you know, we're on. Right, so I've been
telling everyone and Tommy and Jason have been talking to
people on the ground and saying, like, help's coming, you know,
(08:08):
and we're with you, you know, we'll help you. But
all of a sudden that's just turned into, well, that's
us guys. We're going to do that. So, yeah, it
was OK. I quickly formulated a plan and told the
boys what was going to go on. And then we
got stuck into it. So, yeah, so now we, so ourselves,
(08:29):
you know, obviously, yeah, got that plan going. Tim arrived
in his helicopter and one other. So we informed him
as well of the plan and that was it. We
were under way.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
For you, it makes perfect sense to do that. You're
not even thinking about it. But for most people, it
wouldn't have been such an instant decision to go and help.
I mean, that's the heroic nature of it. And when
you landed on the island and saw what had happened
to those people, some that you knew well, you know,
you did what can only be described as heroic things.
(09:00):
And how much did SAS training and other experiences in
your life come into play? And how much was it?
that instinct just to help other people? Kind of a
difficult question to answer, I guess.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
No, no, that's, that's, that's a good one. You know,
like you're trying to get across, you know, what, you know,
what others might feel and, and, but essentially I reckon
all New Zealanders have got that little, that want to help.
So that, that, that, that flagged up straight away and, and,
we were just fortunate that we had helicopters and we
could fly. So, you know, we could burn across that
50 kilometres of water, get to the island really quick.
(09:35):
So that was helpful. It wasn't until we sort of
got to the island and you could see the, you know,
the crater or the damage, I suppose, from the eruption.
The column was just pumping ash and you could see
all the ash across the island. And then we saw
(09:56):
the helicopter fly And then it wasn't until I sort
of saw some people on the island that I thought, okay,
I'm landing, I'm going to go and see them. And
then once we jumped out and it was just incredibly
tough going. to breathe. And then it was just bang,
just straight into people, you know, dealing with people that
are hurt. And fortunately, my army and particularly the regiment
(10:19):
and some post-regiment stuff, it's sort of all those experiences
just sort of flooded in without me, you know, just subconsciously.
And I was into it, you know, and I was just, okay,
there's a person there, a person there, a whole bunch
of them, some friendly couple of guys that we knew.
And it was just, right, let's just take care of
these people quickly. as fast as we can, try and
help them. And in the background, just formulate a plan
(10:43):
to get these people off. Obviously, there's a couple of
other boys there. Tom and Jason, it was just to
make sure that they were on the same program. This
was the plan. Tim arrived and it was just making
sure the comms was going and we're just relaying back
up to John on the plane above to warn out
what was going on on the island and what we
were going to do.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
I mean, people were so lucky to have someone, A,
with the inclination to do it, the choppers to do it,
and also the training to what you're clearly talking about,
the coordination and making sure everyone's on the same plan.
I mean, those are three very, very helpful things to
come along for the people that were in need that day.
How did you process what happened over the days and
(11:24):
weeks that followed the incident?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
I was a real mix of sort of emotions and
what was happening. You know, like very quickly you were
sort of wrapped up in the thoughts that there was
all these people that had got off. Then there was
all these people that were still on the island or
being that passed away. So that was conflicting. Then we
(11:49):
were straight away under an investigation with the police, which
was fine and understandable. But then we were sort of
right up against this massive group you know, body of
people and organisations that came in and just felt like
it started to stall and people were trying their best but,
you know, the big wheel was turning and it just
sort of morphed into something that, you know, wasn't, to me,
(12:09):
didn't feel like it was, we were achieving any aim.
Everyone was, like, really worried about risk and stuff like that. So,
It was a real mix there. There was a lot
of people, you know, desperate to find out about their
family members and no one was talking. That's why, you know,
I decided to start talking to reporters and others just
(12:31):
to let them know what was going on because there
was just no information there. So it was going up
and down, you know, with regards to what we were doing. Obviously,
I realised that my whole business was done. Because 80%
of my business was White Island at that time, was
a bit limited on income stream. And so that dawned
on me that I was going to have to let
everyone go and aircraft and did we damage any aircraft,
the least ones and so on and so forth. So yeah,
(12:54):
it was so much going on and they sort of
didn't really have time to dwell. You're just like, right,
we've got to take care of the police, take care of,
you know, should we go out? We've made a plan
to actually go back out and get those other people
off the island if nothing happened. So there was a
lot of things going on in that short time after.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
We're talking with Mark Law, a helicopter pilot who saved
people on White Island the day it erupted on his
new memoir, Lucky You're Tough. And then after all of that, Mark,
there was another big curveball coming your way.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
One of the pilots who helped rescue people from Whakaari,
White Island, feels he's been labelled a criminal by our
health and safety watchdog. Mark Law is charged in relation
to the lead-up to the eruption.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
Of that, I mean, you saved people that day and
you received one of the New Zealand's highest bravery awards.
But then, and it was, you know, to many, most Kiwis, heartless, pedantic,
it was illogical. And you had 140,000 people sign that petition.
I mean, how did you deal with that when WorkSafe said,
we're going to investigate you and prosecute you?
Speaker 4 (13:56):
Yeah, we had open arms about the investigation from WorkSafe
because our sector of work, aviation, is pretty regulated. So
we used the audits and things like that. So I
welcomed that. The people that were investigating us were great
WorkSafe investigators. We had a great relationship with them for
the eight months that they were here. We also– but
(14:19):
it was weird– that the investigation came out, it was
really light on detail, so much so that they were
investigating us for three years up to the time of
the eruption, but nothing of the eruption and nothing thereafter.
So that was a strange one. We didn't have anyone
on the island at that time, but obviously we were
conducting tours. And so it unfolded. Once it was announced
(14:44):
that we were going to be criminally charged, that was
really hard to get your head around, that's for sure,
you know, because, you know, it wasn't as if we
were sort of, you know, going out to, seeking out
to hurt people, you know, like criminally minded. You know,
we were just going about our business. We thought we
were doing as much as we could possibly do to
(15:06):
look after people. So, yeah, once that dropped, that was
a hard pill to swallow. And then that whole process
sort of evolved. But then in the background, you know,
to learn what happened to all that good work that
those investigators did sort of, Nearly Matt had nought once
it went to senior management and then into the great
(15:28):
grinder of senior management of WorkSafe, the lawyers, et cetera,
et cetera. And then, you know, finally we were checkmated.
It just, that was a bloody travesty, I reckon. And
it was something that I really struggled with in that
whole process.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Oh, man, it would totally piss you off.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Heck yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
I mean, it's an understatement to put it like that.
And now the book is out, Lucky You're Tough. What
do you hope people will take away from the book, Mark?
Speaker 4 (16:01):
I think a lot of people really wanted to find
out what we did on White Island. There's a huge
amount of curiosity and interest in what happened with the
WorkSafe investigation. So I think that's going to be a
nice piece for New Zealanders to sort of read and
sort of get a feel for themselves, you know, and
understanding of what went on. And then, yeah, I just,
(16:26):
when I was a young fella, I was growing up,
you know, there was people I really, I thought were
quite sort of heroic and did amazing things. And I
love those books, you know, and I love people that
were out there doing that sort of stuff. And so I,
you know, hope that some, you know, younger fellas and
younger ladies, you know, get to read it and get
some inspiration and aspiration from it. and, you know, like
(16:49):
charge ahead and, you know, try and do interesting things
and good things and, you know, sort of just carry
on that good New Zealand flavour that we have here,
you know.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
Now, this will sound like a trite question, but I
think people will be interested in the answer, Mark. You
were clearly a hero, as were others there that day.
You were given, obviously, one of the country's highest bravery awards,
and then your company was prosecuted. So after everything that
happened after 2019, do you think you would make exactly
the same decision and fly back to that island?
Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah. And knowing what I know now, I
wouldn't have stopped for anyone because, you know, what are
they going to do in New Zealand? No one's going
to come along and arrest you or anything like that.
We should have just climbed back in those helicopters and
just flew back out there like we wanted to do
and grabbed everyone off that island and it would have
saved a whole bunch of heartache and been helpful for
(17:39):
a lot of people. So, yeah, absolutely, I would not
change it at all.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Mark, you're a great Kiwi. Thank you very much for
chatting with us. Lucky You're Tough is the name of
his book. It is out now in all good bookstores.
An extraordinary story from an extraordinary Kiwi. Mark, thank you
very much, mate.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
No, thank you. Thanks, boys.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
That is Mark Law in the name of the book again,
Lucky You're Tough. Go and find it in bookstores.
Speaker 4 (18:02):
An incredible read.
You're listening to a podcast from Newstalk ZB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
Newstalk ZB. So Mark Law is a former SAS soldier.
He worked with the British SAS, spent years doing private
security work in some of the world's most dangerous places,
and then came home and became a helicopter operator in
the Bay of Plenty. But it's what happened on December 9, 2019,
that most New Zealanders will remember him for. When Whakaari erupted,
(00:36):
Mark and a group of fellow pilots flew into an
active volcanic disaster when the official rescue response wasn't coming.
They found badly injured survivors and flew them off the island,
knowing that there was a very real chance the volcano
could erupt again. They were later awarded some of the
country's highest bravery honours. Mark's extraordinary life, from rural Taranaki
to the SAS war zones, And eventually, Fakari is in
(00:59):
his new book, Lucky You're Tough. And Mark Lord joins
us now. Mark, g'day.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
Yeah, g'day, boys.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Hey, Mark, take us right back to SAS selection and training.
What was that like? What did you go through mentally
and physically to find out whether you had what it
takes to get through?
Speaker 4 (01:17):
Yes, so the New Zealand selection course was, there was nothing,
not a lot of information about it when we were,
you know, just joined the Army. So there was a
couple of books around, but the general sort of information
was that, you know, for the most part, you had
a big pack on and you walked a whole bunch
(01:39):
of distances for many days and, And you had to
make sure that you met those timings to ensure that
you carried on every day. And someday, one of the days,
it was going to end. There was a couple of
specific sort of, I suppose, challenges in there. The last
one being the endurance walk, the 60K walk. So I
(02:00):
was able to fortunately get on the selection course and
be nominated to have a crack. And so, yeah, so
I set out there to do that. And yeah, it
was certainly different than what I'd expected, but sort of
based around the same things. And yeah, it was a
massive challenge. I think I would have been okay if
my feet weren't destroyed by some my blisters caused by
(02:25):
tight boots but anyway regardless of that it was still
a massive effort so mentally just had to push through
the pain of the feet coming apart and taking them
up every day but otherwise it was just sort of
dig it in and finally the nine days come to
an end.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Wow and was there any point going at you thinking
I just can't do this I can't make it and
if so how did you keep going?
Speaker 4 (02:50):
Yeah, on the last day, the 60k-er, I was nearly
at the end, but it was nighttime. I had no
idea other than I thought I was getting really close.
But by then, my legs, my feet were just a
massive puff around where the blisters had been popping and
had sort of endured all those days of walking on.
(03:11):
I had sort of tracking up my legs. And I
remember resting on this bank on a road that we
were walking on. And it just was like I just
couldn't get my legs to go. They just wouldn't keep moving.
And I remember thinking, damn, you know, come on, legs.
You know, we're so close. And a mate, a good
(03:32):
mate later on came along. I didn't know him at
the time. And he pulled in beside me and said, look, mate,
you've just got to keep going. It's real close. The
final RV is close. And so, yeah, that was, you know,
got me through. And just not long after that, you know,
I finally found the last truck.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Yeah, and once you've got these skills, you're in a
different league from basically anyone else. Very few people are
in the same league as you, and you ended up
in hotspots like Angola. And in the book, there's a
bit where you're attacked and a grenade actually shoved into
your mouth. When you've lived through something like that, that
most of us will never even get close to experiencing,
(04:11):
does that change, I guess, your relationship with fear? Does
that make you more resilient after the fact? Does it
change you?
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah, I reckon it does. It does change you. You
know what it's like with experiences. Once you've had something
go on in your life, it wasn't as so scary
or you didn't think about it as much, and that's
what has happened to me. You know, all the different
situations that while being through, you know, it definitely helps
(04:40):
when you arrive at the next one, albeit not looking
for it. It's just if it pops up, you know,
you're sort of well better armed mentally and physically to,
you know, to get into it or take it on
or react or do something. So, yeah, those situations, you know,
with the grenade in the mouth and that, you know,
I certainly wasn't contemplating that. I was too worried about
(05:01):
trying to find my false tooth at the bottom of
the Land Rover. And then when I felt that, you know,
I was like, oh, man, what the heck. But I
always knew, you know. I don't think he's going to
pull the pin and leave it in there, you know,
because he was sitting on top of me. But, you know,
it was just something in passing. It wasn't until you
sort of recollect later on, you're like, oh, yeah, what
a bloody dickhead, you know, trying to terrorise us. But, yeah,
(05:23):
you're just sort of focused on trying to sort of
survive and get away at that time.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
An unreal situation, Mark. So after all that, and you
certainly experienced some pretty crazy situations abroad, you came home
to New Zealand to start a helicopter company. Did that
feel like you were choosing a bit of a quieter life? Yeah.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
Yeah, no, it did. Yeah. Well, the industry I got into,
shooting deer and shooting and recovering deer for human consumption,
you know, like a little bit naive of me. I
sort of like, I think I like the look of it. And,
you know, I love hunting and flying, but man, it
was a tough gig. And a lot of people passed away, sadly.
And so, yeah, but it was sort of nicer to
(06:02):
be home in New Zealand. I loved being there. It
was peaceful. So it was good to get away from
that tempo and all that uncertainty and high risk.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Yeah then December 9 2019 happens and you see that
enormous plume coming off the island. What went through your
head at that point Mark?
Speaker 4 (06:24):
I thought I thought the island had erupted, but I
wasn't too sure sort of the magnitude of it. And
then some phone calls went down really quickly between my staff,
Tim Barrow, Volcanic, and when we just did a quick
ring around, you know, trying to find, talk to PJ,
talk to a charter boat fisherman friend out there. And
(06:46):
then we very quickly learned that it was a significant eruption.
And so... And then that, coupled with Tim's helicopter, with
his pilot and crew were still there. They were actually,
we knew they were actually on the island. And so, yeah,
that just sort of, you know, drove us to, you know,
(07:08):
for me to get to the hangar quickly. Jason was there.
He quickly prepped two helicopters, called another pilot in, got
all a bunch of gear ready, some order and more
masks and bits and pieces and thought, right, we'll go
out there and have a look for the heli or
have a look for the crew on the helicopter. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
Newstalk ZB, we're talking to Mark Law, a helicopter pilot
who led a rescue operation when White Island erupted on
his new memoir, Lucky You're Tough. So after the eruption, Mark,
and quite rightly, you expected the rescue emergency services to
be helping you with that operation. What went through your
head when you were told they weren't coming?
Speaker 4 (07:44):
Um. Not much other than, oh, you know, like, wow, okay,
they're not coming. And then it was just like within seconds, right,
it's us, you know, we're on. Right, so I've been
telling everyone and Tommy and Jason have been talking to
people on the ground and saying, like, help's coming, you know,
(08:08):
and we're with you, you know, we'll help you. But
all of a sudden that's just turned into, well, that's
us guys. We're going to do that. So, yeah, it
was OK. I quickly formulated a plan and told the
boys what was going to go on. And then we
got stuck into it. So, yeah, so now we, so ourselves,
(08:29):
you know, obviously, yeah, got that plan going. Tim arrived
in his helicopter and one other. So we informed him
as well of the plan and that was it. We
were under way.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
For you, it makes perfect sense to do that. You're
not even thinking about it. But for most people, it
wouldn't have been such an instant decision to go and help.
I mean, that's the heroic nature of it. And when
you landed on the island and saw what had happened
to those people, some that you knew well, you know,
you did what can only be described as heroic things.
(09:00):
And how much did SAS training and other experiences in
your life come into play? And how much was it?
that instinct just to help other people? Kind of a
difficult question to answer, I guess.
Speaker 4 (09:11):
No, no, that's, that's, that's a good one. You know,
like you're trying to get across, you know, what, you know,
what others might feel and, and, but essentially I reckon
all New Zealanders have got that little, that want to help.
So that, that, that, that flagged up straight away and, and,
we were just fortunate that we had helicopters and we
could fly. So, you know, we could burn across that
50 kilometres of water, get to the island really quick.
(09:35):
So that was helpful. It wasn't until we sort of
got to the island and you could see the, you know,
the crater or the damage, I suppose, from the eruption.
The column was just pumping ash and you could see
all the ash across the island. And then we saw
(09:56):
the helicopter fly And then it wasn't until I sort
of saw some people on the island that I thought, okay,
I'm landing, I'm going to go and see them. And
then once we jumped out and it was just incredibly
tough going. to breathe. And then it was just bang,
just straight into people, you know, dealing with people that
are hurt. And fortunately, my army and particularly the regiment
(10:19):
and some post-regiment stuff, it's sort of all those experiences
just sort of flooded in without me, you know, just subconsciously.
And I was into it, you know, and I was just, okay,
there's a person there, a person there, a whole bunch
of them, some friendly couple of guys that we knew.
And it was just, right, let's just take care of
these people quickly. as fast as we can, try and
help them. And in the background, just formulate a plan
(10:43):
to get these people off. Obviously, there's a couple of
other boys there. Tom and Jason, it was just to
make sure that they were on the same program. This
was the plan. Tim arrived and it was just making
sure the comms was going and we're just relaying back
up to John on the plane above to warn out
what was going on on the island and what we
were going to do.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
I mean, people were so lucky to have someone, A,
with the inclination to do it, the choppers to do it,
and also the training to what you're clearly talking about,
the coordination and making sure everyone's on the same plan.
I mean, those are three very, very helpful things to
come along for the people that were in need that day.
How did you process what happened over the days and
(11:24):
weeks that followed the incident?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
I was a real mix of sort of emotions and
what was happening. You know, like very quickly you were
sort of wrapped up in the thoughts that there was
all these people that had got off. Then there was
all these people that were still on the island or
being that passed away. So that was conflicting. Then we
(11:49):
were straight away under an investigation with the police, which
was fine and understandable. But then we were sort of
right up against this massive group you know, body of
people and organisations that came in and just felt like
it started to stall and people were trying their best but,
you know, the big wheel was turning and it just
sort of morphed into something that, you know, wasn't, to me,
(12:09):
didn't feel like it was, we were achieving any aim.
Everyone was, like, really worried about risk and stuff like that. So,
It was a real mix there. There was a lot
of people, you know, desperate to find out about their
family members and no one was talking. That's why, you know,
I decided to start talking to reporters and others just
(12:31):
to let them know what was going on because there
was just no information there. So it was going up
and down, you know, with regards to what we were doing. Obviously,
I realised that my whole business was done. Because 80%
of my business was White Island at that time, was
a bit limited on income stream. And so that dawned
on me that I was going to have to let
everyone go and aircraft and did we damage any aircraft,
the least ones and so on and so forth. So yeah,
(12:54):
it was so much going on and they sort of
didn't really have time to dwell. You're just like, right,
we've got to take care of the police, take care of,
you know, should we go out? We've made a plan
to actually go back out and get those other people
off the island if nothing happened. So there was a
lot of things going on in that short time after.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
We're talking with Mark Law, a helicopter pilot who saved
people on White Island the day it erupted on his
new memoir, Lucky You're Tough. And then after all of that, Mark,
there was another big curveball coming your way.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
One of the pilots who helped rescue people from Whakaari,
White Island, feels he's been labelled a criminal by our
health and safety watchdog. Mark Law is charged in relation
to the lead-up to the eruption.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
Of that, I mean, you saved people that day and
you received one of the New Zealand's highest bravery awards.
But then, and it was, you know, to many, most Kiwis, heartless, pedantic,
it was illogical. And you had 140,000 people sign that petition.
I mean, how did you deal with that when WorkSafe said,
we're going to investigate you and prosecute you?
Speaker 4 (13:56):
Yeah, we had open arms about the investigation from WorkSafe
because our sector of work, aviation, is pretty regulated. So
we used the audits and things like that. So I
welcomed that. The people that were investigating us were great
WorkSafe investigators. We had a great relationship with them for
the eight months that they were here. We also– but
(14:19):
it was weird– that the investigation came out, it was
really light on detail, so much so that they were
investigating us for three years up to the time of
the eruption, but nothing of the eruption and nothing thereafter.
So that was a strange one. We didn't have anyone
on the island at that time, but obviously we were
conducting tours. And so it unfolded. Once it was announced
(14:44):
that we were going to be criminally charged, that was
really hard to get your head around, that's for sure,
you know, because, you know, it wasn't as if we
were sort of, you know, going out to, seeking out
to hurt people, you know, like criminally minded. You know,
we were just going about our business. We thought we
were doing as much as we could possibly do to
(15:06):
look after people. So, yeah, once that dropped, that was
a hard pill to swallow. And then that whole process
sort of evolved. But then in the background, you know,
to learn what happened to all that good work that
those investigators did sort of, Nearly Matt had nought once
it went to senior management and then into the great
(15:28):
grinder of senior management of WorkSafe, the lawyers, et cetera,
et cetera. And then, you know, finally we were checkmated.
It just, that was a bloody travesty, I reckon. And
it was something that I really struggled with in that
whole process.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Oh, man, it would totally piss you off.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Heck yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
I mean, it's an understatement to put it like that.
And now the book is out, Lucky You're Tough. What
do you hope people will take away from the book, Mark?
Speaker 4 (16:01):
I think a lot of people really wanted to find
out what we did on White Island. There's a huge
amount of curiosity and interest in what happened with the
WorkSafe investigation. So I think that's going to be a
nice piece for New Zealanders to sort of read and
sort of get a feel for themselves, you know, and
understanding of what went on. And then, yeah, I just,
(16:26):
when I was a young fella, I was growing up,
you know, there was people I really, I thought were
quite sort of heroic and did amazing things. And I
love those books, you know, and I love people that
were out there doing that sort of stuff. And so I,
you know, hope that some, you know, younger fellas and
younger ladies, you know, get to read it and get
some inspiration and aspiration from it. and, you know, like
(16:49):
charge ahead and, you know, try and do interesting things
and good things and, you know, sort of just carry
on that good New Zealand flavour that we have here,
you know.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
Now, this will sound like a trite question, but I
think people will be interested in the answer, Mark. You
were clearly a hero, as were others there that day.
You were given, obviously, one of the country's highest bravery awards,
and then your company was prosecuted. So after everything that
happened after 2019, do you think you would make exactly
the same decision and fly back to that island?
Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah. And knowing what I know now, I
wouldn't have stopped for anyone because, you know, what are
they going to do in New Zealand? No one's going
to come along and arrest you or anything like that.
We should have just climbed back in those helicopters and
just flew back out there like we wanted to do
and grabbed everyone off that island and it would have
saved a whole bunch of heartache and been helpful for
(17:39):
a lot of people. So, yeah, absolutely, I would not
change it at all.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Mark, you're a great Kiwi. Thank you very much for
chatting with us. Lucky You're Tough is the name of
his book. It is out now in all good bookstores.
An extraordinary story from an extraordinary Kiwi. Mark, thank you
very much, mate.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
No, thank you. Thanks, boys.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
That is Mark Law in the name of the book again,
Lucky You're Tough. Go and find it in bookstores.
Speaker 4 (18:02):
An incredible read.
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