July 7, 2024 • 12 mins
In between making the next Gramsci album and going on an acoustic tour of New Zealand, their singer Paul McLaney has written a book. He called up for a chat about tales from the road and how his words have helped people all over place - including Warkworth.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to Radio Hodar Keys Off the Record podcast with
Greg Treatment.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Let's have a chat with Paul mcclaney.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Got it, Greg, Are you yeah?
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Really well?
Speaker 3 (00:12):
Thanks.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
We're going to talk about your new book shortly and
your band gram Ski. But twenty twenty four just a
bit of a recap.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
It's been an ongoing sort of explosion of creativity. We'll
spent most of the last year working on the new
gram Sci album with Devin Abrams, who was previously in
Shape Shifter, but people will recognize from Pacific Heights. He
did the Dallas Tomorrow EP as well. I did a
track on the Pacific Heights album. I think it was
the beginning of last year, and we sort of headed
off and that turned into a bit of a collaboration
(00:40):
and that sort of quickly became the new what will
be the new gram Ski album And it's probably the
most ambitious thing that I've done, and I've done some
ambitious things, and this is the everest of those. And
when we were sort of winding down on that sophistication
that had been unlocked for me and my writing, to
see if I could take that back to the the
(01:00):
simplest thing that I do which is just like voice
and acoustic guitar right back to you know, those roots,
and went out to Scott Seabright's studio and set up.
I'm a big geek around like recording and things like that,
and we wanted to recreate the Nick Drake Pink Moon
mike setup and sat down and I think I went
in and started recording at ten o'clock and we finished
(01:22):
a secuity album by just before lunch, by before twelve.
So that was like the antithesis of what I've been
doing for the last year, and it was the immediately
with which you can then go on to that. So
hit the road in October and I was touring right
through it all about April. I think the great thing
about you know, just being yourself with an acoustic guitar
is you can go anywhere and play anywhere. If someone
says you want to come to Ragular and you go, yep,
(01:42):
I want to regular, you want to come to Amadu. Yes,
there's no cats to herd.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Yeah, no one else to worry about knowing others flights
or meals or any of that sort of stuff to
work out or the sound of or tuning of other instruments.
And things like that. Drummers with yourself and so some
highlights from that tour.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
In the south down the Amedu Sure at the Grainstore Gallery,
it's like a temple to creativity, right in the heart
of the old part of Amuru, you know, the Victorian part.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
I don't really know Amaru that very well. I've only
ever passed through it.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
If you pass through Omaru you might miss miss it completely.
There's the main drag, you know what. You know that
there's that typical sort of Sarth Island Southland sort of
street that's massive, you know, and you could fit like
two Queen streets into it, dual carriageways on either side.
But right at the very bottom of town, if you
take it like a left, at the very bottom, there's
this whole massive storm precinct which is like completely and
(02:35):
utterly Victorian. It's like stepping back in time. And the
New Zealand Steampunk Museum is down there, and there's an
amazing artist called donnad Demente who owns the Grainstore Gallery.
There used to be a book bindery now, but the
guy who's the bookbinder is now the chief brewer and
he makes all these amazing bespoke ales and there's a
whiskey distillery down there. It's you know, I'm probably describing
(02:55):
heaven to some of your listeners in amongst the gallery
and it's it's like heaving with artwork and sculpture and
knick knacks and brick a bracken. And then the other
one was I think the best one is always the
unexpected ones. Fung A Tau Hall, which is just in
between Markana and Lee. There's a rugby ground there. I'd
(03:17):
probably suggest that it might be the most beautiful rugby
ground in New Zealand. It's right on the harbor. When
I played there, an old friend and mentor, Bruce Lynch
lives out that way now. He was and is Cat
Stevens base player, and so he got up and we
played it off the cuff, just a few a few
songs together and that was pretty magical. It was like
playing with one of your heroes.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Some Cat Stephens songs.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
You obvious got to have a few covers that he sleeps.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Oh, that's great. And then this year you've released a
book which we'll get to shortly. Let's play the opening
track from hinter Land ourselves.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Oh, it probably Owes a massive debt to seventeen Seconds
and The Cure. But everything I do does I think.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Well, it's a right guitar solo at the end, I
can tell you that much. Let's crank into Pull mccleanney's
gram Sky ourselves on Radio Hidecke.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Pull to the Horizon.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
And y O show.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
Scarce Me Backwards, oh Man show we had quiet Weed
be the more?
Speaker 5 (04:39):
Uh say, kid, I can't sp oh.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Between Brad Andy.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
Milbory and earth Os Asus. We feel while we had dos,
I said, we are while we at no more.
Speaker 5 (06:31):
Semones.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
It's lally a hidarchy. That's gram Ski with Ourselves, the
opening track from the Hinterland's album, which came out last year.
We're lucky enough to have singer and guitarist in the band,
Paul on a zoom with us now. Paul mcclaney, thanks
for bringing us that tune.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Tonight. You're welcome. I'd forgotten how hard I went on
those guitar solos.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
You really got into that one. Is there any of
that sort of carry on in the new gram Ski album, because.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
There's plenty of plenty of that sort of carry on. Yeah,
I mean it probably brings in a bit more electronica
like from the previous Gramscy albums again a bit more
sort of boards Canada and AFX Twin, but a little proggia,
I suppose, a little less post punk. There's some saxophones
in there, strings and all the layered vocal stuff. But yeah,
lots of lots and lots of guitars.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
All right, Well, and a half a year we'll get
to hear it, Paul. This year you've released a book.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
The book's called The Deep Dark Hall, and the idea
of it arrived fully formed in my head. I actually
saw the book like when I got it back from
the printers. I've been involved in making many things, many
records and projects and things, but this is the first
time I think of my entire creative life where the
end result looked exactly like the initial idea. Because things
(08:38):
normally you would have a creative idea or a spark
an impulse, and then it goes through a rigor process
of collaboration or testing the idea and it changes and
it morphs and it reduces and it increases. But this
looked it's just this black dot on a white page.
It was a serious concentric circles falling through the book
like a volcanic corn. That was about fifty ten years ago.
(09:00):
I think I thought, well, you know, the deep dark hall,
what is that? Well, it's around and it's black, it
has no front and it has no back, and next
thing or you're on you're following the rhyme. And then
I put it aside. I think it was, oh, that's
that's interesting. Help do that one day. But then during
the whole COVID for what it was for me was
that I was saying a lot of my friends having
(09:22):
a really especially in the musical community, you know, really struggling.
You know, if you're in the business of congregation and
you can't congregate, then you're out of business. And the
time from me having that idea for that book, you know,
there are two members of Strategic Fits that are no
longer with us. There are two members of the Clean
that are no longer with us. I have close childhood friends,
and I'm sure you do too, and most of your
(09:42):
listeners will. I've decided not to be here anymore. And
I think, you know, sometimes when people make those big decisions,
you know that they can be it's just when you're
on a slippery slope into that thought, and sometimes maybe
all you need is a distraction. You know, if a
dog had barked, or if the faun had rang, or
you know, a bird of flowing past the window, that
(10:03):
might have been enough of a distraction just to pull
you out of that, you know, of that thought. Being men,
you know, we perhaps don't take the time to sort
of open up about our emotions as much as we should.
So something like the book I'm hoping will act as
a distraction perhaps and hopefully as a permission to talk
about you know that maybe not everything's going great to
(10:25):
explain it. You read it one way and it's a
deep dark call, and then you turn it around and
you read it back through the way and it's called
the Fanklimber of Hope.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
I sort of get the feeling that it would bring
you out of the deep dark hole. Have you heard
of any examples of that?
Speaker 3 (10:37):
What I was doing on the acoustic tour is at
the end of each performance I would read the book,
and one memorable one in Walkworth with an all the
South African gentleman who was actually going through that at
the time, and he said, I don't even know why
I was here tonight, but hearing you say that, and
I feel seen, I feel recognized. I'm filling the love
in the room, being in a congregation sharing music with people.
(11:00):
You've really lifted me out of myself, you know. And
you know, when you're in that sort of position and
someone's sharing that with you, it's it's sometimes it's a
little hard to feel gratitude because you know, for me,
I feel like the book was a gift, Like that
image popped into my head and I just had to
figure out what it was. And so I'm sort of
paying it forward, I feel. And that's why with the
(11:20):
sales of the book, proceeds called Music Helps, which is
a charity that looked up to people in the music
industry who have gone through hard times.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Yeah, good on you man, you're a great New Zealander.
If we want to have a look at this book,
it's available online, but it's in most bookstores around the
country as well, if we wanted to check it out.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
Yeah, and JB. Haifi as well. They've come on board,
which is you know, with the musical connection. But check
it out at the Deep Dark Hall dot com or
Paul mcclanney dot com or grams doy dot com. All
the comms.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Paul mcclaney, thanks for your Tom on Hidache.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
Pleasure always and thanks for the support and I hope
everyone's having a good day.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Radio Hikes of the Record podcast. Why not subscribe so
they download autumn atically and don't forget.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
To rate us five stars?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Thanks mate.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Find out more about this podcast and the people who
make it at Hodache dot co dot Nz.
Welcome to Radio Hodar Keys Off the Record podcast with
Greg Treatment.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Let's have a chat with Paul mcclaney.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Got it, Greg, Are you yeah?
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Really well?
Speaker 3 (00:12):
Thanks.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
We're going to talk about your new book shortly and
your band gram Ski. But twenty twenty four just a
bit of a recap.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
It's been an ongoing sort of explosion of creativity. We'll
spent most of the last year working on the new
gram Sci album with Devin Abrams, who was previously in
Shape Shifter, but people will recognize from Pacific Heights. He
did the Dallas Tomorrow EP as well. I did a
track on the Pacific Heights album. I think it was
the beginning of last year, and we sort of headed
off and that turned into a bit of a collaboration
(00:40):
and that sort of quickly became the new what will
be the new gram Ski album And it's probably the
most ambitious thing that I've done, and I've done some
ambitious things, and this is the everest of those. And
when we were sort of winding down on that sophistication
that had been unlocked for me and my writing, to
see if I could take that back to the the
(01:00):
simplest thing that I do which is just like voice
and acoustic guitar right back to you know, those roots,
and went out to Scott Seabright's studio and set up.
I'm a big geek around like recording and things like that,
and we wanted to recreate the Nick Drake Pink Moon
mike setup and sat down and I think I went
in and started recording at ten o'clock and we finished
(01:22):
a secuity album by just before lunch, by before twelve.
So that was like the antithesis of what I've been
doing for the last year, and it was the immediately
with which you can then go on to that. So
hit the road in October and I was touring right
through it all about April. I think the great thing
about you know, just being yourself with an acoustic guitar
is you can go anywhere and play anywhere. If someone
says you want to come to Ragular and you go, yep,
(01:42):
I want to regular, you want to come to Amadu. Yes,
there's no cats to herd.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Yeah, no one else to worry about knowing others flights
or meals or any of that sort of stuff to
work out or the sound of or tuning of other instruments.
And things like that. Drummers with yourself and so some
highlights from that tour.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
In the south down the Amedu Sure at the Grainstore Gallery,
it's like a temple to creativity, right in the heart
of the old part of Amuru, you know, the Victorian part.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
I don't really know Amaru that very well. I've only
ever passed through it.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
If you pass through Omaru you might miss miss it completely.
There's the main drag, you know what. You know that
there's that typical sort of Sarth Island Southland sort of
street that's massive, you know, and you could fit like
two Queen streets into it, dual carriageways on either side.
But right at the very bottom of town, if you
take it like a left, at the very bottom, there's
this whole massive storm precinct which is like completely and
(02:35):
utterly Victorian. It's like stepping back in time. And the
New Zealand Steampunk Museum is down there, and there's an
amazing artist called donnad Demente who owns the Grainstore Gallery.
There used to be a book bindery now, but the
guy who's the bookbinder is now the chief brewer and
he makes all these amazing bespoke ales and there's a
whiskey distillery down there. It's you know, I'm probably describing
(02:55):
heaven to some of your listeners in amongst the gallery
and it's it's like heaving with artwork and sculpture and
knick knacks and brick a bracken. And then the other
one was I think the best one is always the
unexpected ones. Fung A Tau Hall, which is just in
between Markana and Lee. There's a rugby ground there. I'd
(03:17):
probably suggest that it might be the most beautiful rugby
ground in New Zealand. It's right on the harbor. When
I played there, an old friend and mentor, Bruce Lynch
lives out that way now. He was and is Cat
Stevens base player, and so he got up and we
played it off the cuff, just a few a few
songs together and that was pretty magical. It was like
playing with one of your heroes.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
Some Cat Stephens songs.
Speaker 3 (03:38):
You obvious got to have a few covers that he sleeps.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Oh, that's great. And then this year you've released a
book which we'll get to shortly. Let's play the opening
track from hinter Land ourselves.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Oh, it probably Owes a massive debt to seventeen Seconds
and The Cure. But everything I do does I think.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Well, it's a right guitar solo at the end, I
can tell you that much. Let's crank into Pull mccleanney's
gram Sky ourselves on Radio Hidecke.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Pull to the Horizon.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
And y O show.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
Scarce Me Backwards, oh Man show we had quiet Weed
be the more?
Speaker 5 (04:39):
Uh say, kid, I can't sp oh.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Between Brad Andy.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
Milbory and earth Os Asus. We feel while we had dos,
I said, we are while we at no more.
Speaker 5 (06:31):
Semones.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
It's lally a hidarchy. That's gram Ski with Ourselves, the
opening track from the Hinterland's album, which came out last year.
We're lucky enough to have singer and guitarist in the band,
Paul on a zoom with us now. Paul mcclaney, thanks
for bringing us that tune.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Tonight. You're welcome. I'd forgotten how hard I went on
those guitar solos.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
You really got into that one. Is there any of
that sort of carry on in the new gram Ski album, because.
Speaker 3 (07:51):
There's plenty of plenty of that sort of carry on. Yeah,
I mean it probably brings in a bit more electronica
like from the previous Gramscy albums again a bit more
sort of boards Canada and AFX Twin, but a little proggia,
I suppose, a little less post punk. There's some saxophones
in there, strings and all the layered vocal stuff. But yeah,
lots of lots and lots of guitars.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
All right, Well, and a half a year we'll get
to hear it, Paul. This year you've released a book.
Speaker 3 (08:18):
The book's called The Deep Dark Hall, and the idea
of it arrived fully formed in my head. I actually
saw the book like when I got it back from
the printers. I've been involved in making many things, many
records and projects and things, but this is the first
time I think of my entire creative life where the
end result looked exactly like the initial idea. Because things
(08:38):
normally you would have a creative idea or a spark
an impulse, and then it goes through a rigor process
of collaboration or testing the idea and it changes and
it morphs and it reduces and it increases. But this
looked it's just this black dot on a white page.
It was a serious concentric circles falling through the book
like a volcanic corn. That was about fifty ten years ago.
(09:00):
I think I thought, well, you know, the deep dark hall,
what is that? Well, it's around and it's black, it
has no front and it has no back, and next
thing or you're on you're following the rhyme. And then
I put it aside. I think it was, oh, that's
that's interesting. Help do that one day. But then during
the whole COVID for what it was for me was
that I was saying a lot of my friends having
(09:22):
a really especially in the musical community, you know, really struggling.
You know, if you're in the business of congregation and
you can't congregate, then you're out of business. And the
time from me having that idea for that book, you know,
there are two members of Strategic Fits that are no
longer with us. There are two members of the Clean
that are no longer with us. I have close childhood friends,
and I'm sure you do too, and most of your
(09:42):
listeners will. I've decided not to be here anymore. And
I think, you know, sometimes when people make those big decisions,
you know that they can be it's just when you're
on a slippery slope into that thought, and sometimes maybe
all you need is a distraction. You know, if a
dog had barked, or if the faun had rang, or
you know, a bird of flowing past the window, that
(10:03):
might have been enough of a distraction just to pull
you out of that, you know, of that thought. Being men,
you know, we perhaps don't take the time to sort
of open up about our emotions as much as we should.
So something like the book I'm hoping will act as
a distraction perhaps and hopefully as a permission to talk
about you know that maybe not everything's going great to
(10:25):
explain it. You read it one way and it's a
deep dark call, and then you turn it around and
you read it back through the way and it's called
the Fanklimber of Hope.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
I sort of get the feeling that it would bring
you out of the deep dark hole. Have you heard
of any examples of that?
Speaker 3 (10:37):
What I was doing on the acoustic tour is at
the end of each performance I would read the book,
and one memorable one in Walkworth with an all the
South African gentleman who was actually going through that at
the time, and he said, I don't even know why
I was here tonight, but hearing you say that, and
I feel seen, I feel recognized. I'm filling the love
in the room, being in a congregation sharing music with people.
(11:00):
You've really lifted me out of myself, you know. And
you know, when you're in that sort of position and
someone's sharing that with you, it's it's sometimes it's a
little hard to feel gratitude because you know, for me,
I feel like the book was a gift, Like that
image popped into my head and I just had to
figure out what it was. And so I'm sort of
paying it forward, I feel. And that's why with the
(11:20):
sales of the book, proceeds called Music Helps, which is
a charity that looked up to people in the music
industry who have gone through hard times.
Speaker 2 (11:27):
Yeah, good on you man, you're a great New Zealander.
If we want to have a look at this book,
it's available online, but it's in most bookstores around the
country as well, if we wanted to check it out.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
Yeah, and JB. Haifi as well. They've come on board,
which is you know, with the musical connection. But check
it out at the Deep Dark Hall dot com or
Paul mcclanney dot com or grams doy dot com. All
the comms.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Paul mcclaney, thanks for your Tom on Hidache.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
Pleasure always and thanks for the support and I hope
everyone's having a good day.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Radio Hikes of the Record podcast. Why not subscribe so
they download autumn atically and don't forget.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
To rate us five stars?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Thanks mate.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Find out more about this podcast and the people who
make it at Hodache dot co dot Nz.
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