January 18, 2026 • 41 mins
Confidence in New Zealand's rural sector has really started recovering over the past year or so.
Stabilising interest rates, great dairy results, and promising meat exports have formed a foundation for what will hopefully be a successful 2026.
Confidence dropped slightly in the last quarter of last year, but it's still much higher than it has been over previous years.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Yes, welcome back to this is Smart Money. I'm Tim
Beverage on the Weekend Collective. By the way, if you
miss any other of the hours during the course of
the show, you can go and check out our podcast.
Just go to news Talk, said B look for the
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we'd love your participation. If you want to join the
(00:55):
conversation eight hundred and eighty ten eighty, you can text
on nine to two, nine to two and for this
of course, it's welcome to Smart Money. And we we've
actually got a new guest on the show and he
is CEO of Rabobank and his name's Todd Charteris and
he's with me now. Todd, how you going.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Yeah, you get a Tim, it's good to be here
and ye're nice to meet you.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Yeah, it's funny when I was Rabobank. Actually, we'll get it.
We'll set up what we want to talk about. But
you know we're going to have a chat about Rabobanks,
a huge player in the rural sector and rural sector's
been been some reasonably good headlines over the past sort
of twelve months, stabilizing interest rates, there's been great dairy results,
(01:43):
promising meet exports, and hopefully that sort of leads into
a successful twenty twenty six. And this is where we
want you, the listeners to join us as well, and
especially if you're in the rural sector. We want to
know it just about how you're feeling. It's election year,
We've got a turbulent, a turbulent international scene. I think,
(02:04):
how are you feeling, are you confident in the rural
sector and if you're a farmer, house that changed over
the past few years, anyway, get tired before we get
into it. For those who are more familiar with the
traditional I'm not sure how the retail banks, trading banks,
that's the one, the AD, the ASPN, stuff like that.
What's Rabobank?
Speaker 4 (02:25):
Yeah, well, first of all, Rabobank is a Dutch cooperative.
So we're actually formed back in the late eighteen hundreds
at a time when Dutch farmers didn't have access to
funds to essentially plant their crops, and so these whole
series are cooperatives spread up all across the Netherlands, people
with money essentially put it into the jar. You know,
(02:47):
people who lived in the villages put in the jar.
Farmers borrowed it, planted their crops, fed the people, and
that was how Rabo Banks started back in eighteen ninety eight,
and so as a cooperative it's a completely different mindset,
I think. And then came to New Zealand in ninety four,
so we've been only thirty one years and since that.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Time, you know, we have grown.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
We're one hundred percent focused on food and agriculture, so
New Zealand's only specialist food and agricultural bank.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Isn't it funny? I mean, I've got a Rabo which
I've usually put money that I want to touch on
it for a while and then put it and jack
it up so I get the bonus in trut et cetera.
I mean, I'm sure you know how it works. But
it's funny because I was aware that they were as
a Dutch bank, but I had no I don't know
what got me into it. I think someone just said
(03:38):
it was I think it was somebody who said, look,
if you want talking about safety of your money and
credit ratings, because Rabo's got it's got a I mean,
there's been some funny headlines, but you guys have had
a pretty stellar credit rating.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
Absolutely, and you know, yeah, we're one of the highest
privately owned because you know, we're essentially privately owned because
of that cooperative nature. We're members And you're right. So
the money you've got in there, Tom, we gladly lend
it out to New Zealand farmers and growers who produce food.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
How actually that it does actually raise that question as
to whether people are there there's a plumby. I'm gonna
we have a few columpesy we have asking questions as
part of the appeal of RABO for customers, how important
is it to them what you're offering versus how important
(04:29):
is to them that they go this is the fact
that's supporting New Zealand farmers. I'm going to stick my
money with them.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
Oh look, I think it's a mix's antre of everything.
It's a mixture of everything. I mean, you need to
be competitive. You know, we are competitive in terms of
the retail deposit rates we offer, but we're also very
clear with our depositors. You put money in with us
and that that's where it will be deployed and that
certainly appeals to a number of people because you know
you're helping, you're helping grow New Zealand. We know how
(04:57):
important food and agria is to New Zealand in terms
of the exports, and it's vitally important and so we
need a strong food nagar sector. So we're supporting that,
you know, completely committed to that on the landing side,
and we need the funding.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
So you were pretty clear.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Okay, before we get into the nuts and bolts of it,
just to learn a little bit about you, and again
I've had other bank CEOs in here and I was
expecting you to come here with your PR team and
a certain of time. Everything. You don't quite you haven't
quite measured up what I mean as just you know,
just it's just you just have a more fun of
(05:35):
rural vibug yuess. But what's your background when it comes
to getting into banking and being in the position you're in.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
Yeah, no, Look, I'm originally from down South. I spent
a lot of time in o Targo in Southland and
you grew up on on smaller farms, so I certainly
agriculturally it's my background. You know, I've still got family farming,
my sisters farming, my cousins. You know, so we're deeply
connected and you know that stays with you. And I
(06:02):
went through a university at Otago, did a finance degree.
I started off as a stock agent actually when I
first left university, and then you know, like a lot
of key weis, went to London, did a couple of
years over there working in banking, which was you know,
it sounded grand grand and it was good on the CV.
But you know, for me, it was about getting back
(06:23):
to New Zealand and getting back to what I love,
which is about working with farmers and growl.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
So did the degree stock agent, went to bank in London. Yeah,
so then coming back to you came back to New
Zealand straight into banking or where.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
Straight straight back into banking. And you know, so when
I was working as a stock agent, I actually worked
for Rightchen's who in the meantime had sold their finance
company to Rabo Bank in nineteen ninety eight. I came
back in late ninety nine, started in two thousand with Rabo.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Oh so you've been almost almost from one day year five,
I guess.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
No, Well, I've been over twenty five years. So yeah,
a good part of my working career.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
But I mean, in terms of Rabo's life in New Zealand,
you were in there fairly early early.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Yeah, we were really small back in the day, and
it's been exciting, you know, because we've been part of
growing and we have grown strongly and and you know,
we're really optimistic about opportunities that continue to exist out
there and we want to continue to grow. We're deeply
committed to the market and you know that excites me.
And you know what excited me about joining RABO back
(07:27):
in two thousand is the same today, and it's that
commitment to those rural communities. It's commitment to New Zealand
food nagri and it's about helping people.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Do you get frustrated with the news cycles on farming
and stuff like that in terms of I don't know
if we ever get the feeling for how things are
really going until we see the dramatic headlines that the
milk pay out. As we've seen some very dramatic headlines
in terms of farmers doing very well, but it either
feels like, you know, the farmers and farming is doing
brilliantly or there's a real struggle. But do you get
(07:57):
frustrated by how the average New Zealander might be able
to understand what's going on in the rural sector.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Oh, look, I wouldn't. I wouldn't say I get frustrated.
I think it's it's you know, I always try and
understand where people are coming from, and so you know,
we've got a part to play to better communicate that
and make that connection. I mean, we talk about it
was often talked about rural urban divide. I'd much rather
than we refer to it now as rural urban connection.
(08:22):
So how do we make that connection more effective? We
do quite a bit of work in education, helping like
agribusiness and schools, which is a way of educating you know,
people who grow up in cities and so you know,
we we try and break it down that way and
just help people understand both sides of the equation.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
So how's it looking that you reckon this year? What's
the current state of finances in the rural sector?
Speaker 5 (08:44):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (08:44):
I think are pretty strong. I mean, you know last
year was we run a confidence survey every quarter out
every quarter.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
With farmers and grows.
Speaker 4 (08:53):
It came off a little bit in that fourth quarter.
But unsurprisingly, you know, we'd send dairy prices come back
down off record highs, of course, and you've got to
keep them in context. So no, look, I think that
outlook looks looks pretty strong. I mean, the last g
DT auction bounced back up about six percent, so that's encouraging.
Red meat is very strong, beef and sheep meat, kibi
(09:14):
fruit's doing doing really well. So yeah, I think the
outlooks look looks strong. And that's what was you know,
that's what we're hearing from our clients. There's a lot
of optimism out there and realism. I mean, it's it's
the world's volatile place, right, and well, we export most
of what we produced, so I wasn't.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Sure how much to get into the world's a volatile place,
but because we could easily end up in a political
discussion which might not be you know, where you want
to go. But so I won't really but how much
how nervous do bankers around the world get, Look, it's inevitable,
(09:50):
I started asking the question. But you know, we've seen
the thing with Arna Breman and Winston telling it to
stay in lane and all that sort of stuff. But
the how how much does the global banking climate influence
us here, Arbou Bank, not just you but A and Z.
I mean, how does that all play out with what
we see going on and the pressure on the Fed
Reserve to do what the president wants?
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Yeah, well, I think I think we're really starts impacting
us here is when it starts to undermine confidence and optimism.
And you know that that's the challenge to overcome is
how do we we acknowledge that there's volatility out there
and we acknowledge that things change literally overnight. You know,
we've seen tariffs come on, We've seen tariffs come off
for some of our products that we produce and export,
(10:36):
and it's to me, it's it's kind of the challenges
to look through those cycles and and remain you know,
to me, it's fundamental. You know, the world needs to eat.
We're pretty good at producing food. In fact, we're very
very good at it, and so a lot let's focus
on that, and I think we're in pretty good shape
and things will go up and down, but there'll be
(10:56):
I think the demand will remain there and flow through.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Actually, that is one of the you've touched on something there. Again.
Politics has never far away from anything?
Speaker 3 (11:04):
Is that no?
Speaker 2 (11:05):
But I guess that's what I was thinking with the frustration,
in a way, is that our farmers are incredibly efficient
at producing what we do. Do you think that it
resonates enough the understanding of you know, the public about
that as well. I mean, there was that I don't
want to fixate on dairy, but there was that new
story that a liter of milk produced in New Zealand
(11:28):
is greener even though it gets shipped across the world
to Ireland than a liter of milk that's produced in
Ireland that isn't enough to go anywhere. The fact that
we're so efficient is that Is that a frustration we
don't understand that a lot of the time, or we're
seeing a mixing of messages.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Well, I think that's one of the challenges for us,
and it comes back to our I think the characteristics
of New Zealanders. We're modest by nature. You know, we're humble,
and we're perhaps not as good at telling a story
as we could be. And I think that's the challenge,
right is getting our story out there, being proud of
what we do and and you know, our farmers and
(12:07):
grows and New Zelda a lot. They're incredibly innovative, always
have been responding to market signals, all of those type
of things. And there's no doubt there's there's pressure on,
right we need we need to produce more food, but
we need to do it in a way that doesn't
have an adverse impact on the environment. And that's been
challenging and it's one of the paradoxes that we need
(12:28):
to deal with and the content, you know, the thought
of us producing less for another less efficient country to
produce more, but it was nonsensical, and so how do
we overcome that? At the same time, we do have
national commitments that we've made internationally, and so how do
we balance all that? And that's the challenge, right And
(12:50):
and you know, when I'm talking to farmers and growls
out there, they just want to get on and do
the job as best they can. And they do a
wonderful job. And some of that noise and messages that
bounce around around them frustrate them and they know the
good at what they do and they'll respond to the market.
And our job, I think is to help them be
(13:12):
as efficient as they can be and learn from one another.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Actually, I was chatting with Jamie Insaw, who's the New
Zealand hell political reporter, And because we've got Christopher Luxon's
making a State of the Nation addressed tomorrow and I
was just chatting to him, to Jamie about what things
he was looking forward to hearing about this year, and
he touched on the India India f t A. What
(13:36):
does that mean? What does that mean for your customers
and for the farming and rural sector in general.
Speaker 4 (13:42):
Oh, look, I think that's it's a great milestone to
get that across the line. That's been twenty years in
the making. And I know there's been criticism from some
quarters about the lack of involvement with dairy, but that
was always going to be very difficult, if not impossible.
So we need to celebrate the fact we've got FDA
(14:03):
opens up that market for a number of our commodities
and gives us choice. And I think that's that's outstanding.
And I think, you know, politically, you know, I think
that's where you know, we want politicians to do a
great job around trade and setting us up so that
our farmers can just get on, as I said earlier,
(14:23):
and do what they're good at, which is producing food.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
How do you go in terms of your communications with
the farmers and your customers, your clients. I'm not sure
what words you use around that in terms of how
they're feeling about things. Do you judge it mostly by
data or data you know about how everything's going with
their borrowing and the servicing of the loans and then
(14:46):
paying down debt and all that, all the things that
you witness, and how much do you actually just have
a chat with them and get a vibe about how
they're going and how are they feeling.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Oh, look, I think it's sort of multiple channels. We do,
as I said, the confidence survey result. The other avenue
that we tap into, which goes back to our cooperative
fruits the Netherlands is we have four client councils in
New Zealand, which are groups of clients that represent you know,
different commodity types, the different rural communities. So we've got
(15:15):
two in the North Island, two in the South and
I spent a bit of time connecting with them, hearing firsthand,
you know, how they're feeling, you know how their communities
are feeling, what are the burning issues?
Speaker 3 (15:30):
You know?
Speaker 4 (15:31):
They give us feedback about how the bank's going what
we can do better, what we're doing well, what they'd
like to see more of. And to me, it's a
bit like a conscience, you know, like it's just like
feedback is a gift and it's incredibly important.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
You know.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
I spend quite a bit of time in different parts
of the country talking to farmers and growers and their clients,
and look, nothing beats that face to face.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
I mean, yeah, I mean you can.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Are they feeling on the whole? You think it's looking good?
For looking how's it looking for twenty twenty sixty, You know.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
I think it's looking very strong. Yeah, I think I
think there's a lot of optimism out there. We've seen that,
you know, investment and tensions are up, you know, which
is unsurprising. You've seen the Fonterra vote go through. So
there'll be some some you know, a substantial amount of
money come back through rural communities that way. You know,
every farm business will be different in terms of the
(16:24):
fontier owners and what they do. You know, some will
pay off debt, so if someone it will kick off
some succession opportunities. Some will invest, you know, So.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
You mean the farm succession opportunities yeah, because that's one
of the big issues in farming, isn't it is passing
that farm on. So I mean, actually we might dig
into that. We take a break actually, but if you've
got any calls for Todd Chaters, he's a CEO of Rabobank.
If you've got something you'd like to ask Todd, get
his reckons on something or something you want to throw
(16:54):
at him for as an opinion, and we'll see where
we go with that. You can give us a call
on eight hundred and eighty ten eighty, you can text
on nine to nine to two and we'll be back
in just a moment. It's twenty three past five. News
Talks ed B, News Talks ed B. My guest is
Todd Charteris. This is for smart money. He's a CEO
of Rabobank, a major play when it comes to financing
and looking after the banking needs of the rural community.
(17:16):
Taking your calls as well, and you know, whatever you
want to throw at him, I'm sure, I'm sure Todd
can deal with it. Peter, Hello, good.
Speaker 6 (17:23):
Morning, good afternoon. Two questions When the Labor Party came
into office with a twenty five percent evaluation with Roger
Douglas other people were horrendously angry because they thought seventy
percent of New Zealand's costs were overseas. So the first
question is what difference does the low currency make towards farmers?
(17:49):
And the second question is with regard to ownership of land. Say,
since Roger Douglas and the reforms of farming when them
probably was less corporate ownership in nineteen eighty four or whatever,
what is the percent of corporates farmers? Because I heard
boarding schools have less farmers because our corporates I don't
(18:11):
send their sons to boarding school anymore. What's the percentage
of corporate ownership versus individual ownership?
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Oh? Actually, that thanks Peter. We were talking a bit
about that in the break, just about the succession thing.
But yeah, okay, I'll hand those over to you there.
Speaker 4 (18:26):
Yeah, no, look, thanks for your questions, Peter. First of all,
in terms of currency, you know that's vital. I mean,
we explort about ninety percent of what we produce, and
so you know, currency helps the exporters. But at the
same time it's a balancing act because we also bring
goods into New Zealand that we use on farm. So
(18:47):
a lower dollar hurts that as well, So it's just
trying to get that balance right. You know, we talk
about input prices like fertilizer and energy cost fuel and
things like that, and machinery of course, so so yeah,
currency is a huge part, but you know, as X
borders allow, currency helps that. So you know, it certainly
(19:09):
bounced around a fair bit over the last few years.
It's that volatility that we spoke about earlier, and I
think that's going to stay for a while. In terms
of that ownership, Look, I haven't got the percentages in
front of me, but we've certainly since you know, probably forever,
we've seen consolidation of farms over time, and we recently
(19:31):
released a white paper in June last year which which
really looks to open up that discussion around farm succession,
and certainly in there we talk about the corporatization of
some farms. But to me, you know, the predominance is
still family owned h and I don't think that's going
(19:52):
to change for a while. But we are seeing continued
consolidation so that the number of farmers and farm owners
orchard owners is reducing and the average size of farms
are getting bigger, and you know, and some of it
is corporatization, but to me, it's stalled the store a
heck of a lot of very well run family operations.
(20:14):
But also, you know, I think what we're also seeing
is the evolution of some of those family businesses, which
are you know, actually bringing in some of those I
guess corporate structures, you know, some of them using advisory boards.
I mean, these are large businesses. I'm still family owned,
but you know, you've got different generations playing different roles
(20:36):
in those and utilizing some of those skills externally. So
it's a whole combination. And look, I think we'll continue
to see consolidation, but you know, they don't take anything
away from family owned farms.
Speaker 6 (20:50):
That's a lot about the competition and future things like
Russia apparently had lots of unused farmland, which is a
big place, and other technology for other lands. Do you
see that we're gonna a greater competition from other parts
of the world on price and volume for land or
(21:11):
for what well, for land being used for WWORTH technology
advancements and all that sort of stuff. To you know,
more land being able to use it wasn't used before.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Well, yeah, I don't think we've got much.
Speaker 6 (21:26):
You've got the warming, you know, the change of climates
where some places are getting better climates in some places
are not going to produce because you know, the climates changed,
not enough water, so you don't see what well, actually.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
I actually see from a climate point of view, is
great opportunity for New Zealand. You know we're we're particularly
well placed. We've got an abundance of water. We're caller climate,
so you know, climate change is a challenge, but I
think it's a big opportunity for us. And I think
you know, the farmers that I speak to and don't
feel threatened by that at all, in fact looking for opportunities.
(22:04):
So yeah, I think I think we're well placed as thanks.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
For call Peters. In terms of New Zealand's position in
the marketplace overseas with exports, is how much of it
is of us being a premium sort of product, you know,
I guess I always think about meat and dairy, but
there's so much more to what you guys look after.
But is that where we belong as that things come
from New Zealand. We're never going to compete with some
(22:29):
of those you know, the countries are massive land masses
of farming and wheat and things like that. But are
we more.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
Well, we're more niche. I think niche. We're definitely high.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
I mean reputation in New Zealand farmers and exporting companies
are really well regarded and you know there's been built
up over over the last hundred plus years and so
you know we're in great shape and we need to
maintain that reputations everything in the marketplace. And so but no,
we're really well positioned, and I think that's something we
(23:00):
should be really proud of, and we need to fight
hard to stay on those those premium shelves.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
That is it because we have just worked out that
that's our place. The market works it out, you know
New Zealander's work out. Look, we're great at creating dairy
and meat and the horticultural side of things. Is it
driven by the fact that we've just found that that's
how we are going to make money or are there
political what our strives? That is it just the New
Zealand sort of innovative way. Why have we become there
(23:29):
rather than I don't know, other Well.
Speaker 4 (23:32):
We're relatively small, you know, we're relatively long way away
from international markets. So we have to be good to compete,
and I think that's been the case. It's in our DNA,
it's needs must, yeah, and so you know we've we've
we've forged a really strong relationship. I think in terms
of a trading nation, we've got a great reputation. I
(23:54):
think successive trade ministers have done a great job in
terms of opening up markets and things like that, and
so I think that's you know, it's just in our DNA.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
I think we're good at.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
It on that. And actually, as you mentioned successive trade ministers.
With the FTA, I think we know that New Zealand
first is not going to support it. Would you be
expecting that that's going to get across the line because labor,
you know, they want their ministers. In the past, they've
worked for FTA, so they'll support it. Have you got
any comment to make or are you try and steer
clear of that?
Speaker 3 (24:23):
So I look, we keep out of the politics. But
I think you know, like you know, you'll never get everything.
Speaker 4 (24:31):
Perfect, right, let's not let perfect get in the way
better and this certainly opens up there's certainly a lot
to be positive about. And I think it would be
crime shame not to get it across the line, I'd
be staggered in fact.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
So yeah, okay, let's take some more calls, shall we.
Eight hundred eighty ten eighty If you've got any questions.
It's his first time on the show's first show of
the year. Todd charteris he's the CEO of Rabobank. In
the studio with me right now, give us a call.
I eight hundred eighty ten eighty Tom.
Speaker 7 (25:06):
Good afternoon, gentlemen. I'm a bit of the simpleton. Tell me, sir,
how do I invest money in your bank?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Oh?
Speaker 7 (25:17):
By the way, you you sound like your bank's doing
a good job. As I had fought in the past,
but didn't know how to join.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Customer, isn't it you want to invest in it? You
want to you're saying time.
Speaker 7 (25:31):
We'll put money in the bank or what you like here?
I've just proven how dottery I am.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
No, No, that's I think many people want to know
how to ask that question.
Speaker 7 (25:39):
Yeah, I look good on your I've seen advertisements, never
a phone call, so I haven't joined in the last
year when I wanted to.
Speaker 4 (25:48):
No, No, we'll give the team a call if you
go on. Can you've got access to a computer go online.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
And you can't use it.
Speaker 7 (25:57):
I can't use it to.
Speaker 4 (25:58):
Okay, Well, well I'll get the number before you.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yep, we'll get the number before you.
Speaker 4 (26:05):
Get the number before your Tom, before the end of
the air, and you ring the team tomorrow and they'll
they'll talk you through finding a way there.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Actually, funny enough, thank you. I actually tell you what
you stand by, because I reckon, I've got that. Are
you talking about online savings? Eight hundred two two four
four three three?
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Yeah, that's it? Do you hear that?
Speaker 2 (26:25):
There you go, Tom, you're there?
Speaker 7 (26:27):
Yeah, two two four three.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
No, double two double four, double three. So it's eight
hundred double two double four double three.
Speaker 7 (26:37):
Secret for so long.
Speaker 2 (26:40):
Two hundred years well secret.
Speaker 4 (26:42):
Yeah, Now, we do get that feedback every now and then, Tom,
But uh, look we're we're here for the long haul.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
So I'm please you.
Speaker 4 (26:52):
You have heard about us, and but yeah, just just
in terms of you will need our offering is online,
so we just talk to the team around you know,
you might have someone in your family that can help
you with that, but we need access to a computer
for you.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
So yeah, so okay, Tom, soon we need to get
access to a computer. Thanks, to your call mate. Actually,
when I first joined Rabbo, you had those the verification
but did you pass? But actually, you guys were sort
of I don't know if you if it's fair, my
impression was you were leading the way when it came
to the security of your account, because to be honest,
(27:32):
it was kind of a pain in the bum logging on.
But I always thought this is safe as houses.
Speaker 4 (27:38):
Yeah, no, that's right and that. Yeah, look, we got
a lot of feedback on those. You got rid of THESS. Yeah,
we've still got this. We've still got the verification you
know that, which is just now on a mobile device,
but it's exactly the same, and so yeah, we unapologetically
take that extra layer of security because you know, protecting
(28:00):
our our clients funds is important, and yeah, it was.
It was quite a change for us when we moved
away from most physical did you passes we got. We've
got a lot of feedback people got used to them
and didn't like to change. But on the main, I
think it's a lot easier now.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I think I prefer it now because usually because I'd
sit down at my desk, can I be oh, where's
that thing I've oh I know, and then you have
to call up and have to send you on anyway.
It wasn't like I was doing it every day. Yeah,
actually why who can who can borrow from you?
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Guys?
Speaker 4 (28:34):
So so we leand one hundred percent to food and
aggre sectors, So right through that value chain though, so
from you know, farmers, growers, processes, exporters, right the way through.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
For your first time buy you.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
No, no, we we know we're not set up to
do that. You know, there's there's a number of really
good banks in New Zealand and that offer that.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
I know.
Speaker 4 (28:59):
We focus on what we're good at, which is food
and agre and rural lending.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Okay, I got a text here from someone saying how
come rural lenders charge more for mortgages than urban mortgage holders?
The rates there and this is just a friend of
mine in the who's a farmer? But the question about
how they slow to reduce interest rates there's an argument there.
I don't know if he's talking about you or the bank.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
Yeah, I mean I can't speak for other banks, but
you know, we certainly off the back of OCR cuts
have our variable rates changed pretty quickly within seven to
ten days. Our fixed rates actually move every day on
the international markets, so that's responsive every day in terms
(29:45):
of the differential between rural lending and residential. Part of
it is we have to hold more capital. It was
the center of center of the banking inquiry really where
over the last twelve months it was a Select Committee
inquiry into banking. A lot of questions around that. But
the fact is, you know, we have to hold more capital.
(30:06):
But also the other thing is, you know it's a
it's a reasonably high high touch model, you know, like
running a team of rural bankers because every farm business
is unique, right.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
And high contact in terms of regular it's much more faced,
regular interfacing.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Is it worth Yeah, And because every every business is
unique and so to really understand the risks of individual
businesses you've got to get quite close. So not taking
anything away from residential lending, but it's it's pretty straightforward.
You've got a highly liquid market and a highly liquid
market compared to rural and so there's just a lot
(30:45):
more complexity. You know, you've got factors a lot we've
just spoken about. You've got foreign exchange, you've got climate,
you've got a whole lot of things impacting you've got
volatility and export markets, so you know you haven't got
a consistent income stream all those type of things. So
it's it's high touch, which so it's completely different markets.
So you can't compare the two. They're not not comparing
(31:08):
apples with apples.
Speaker 2 (31:09):
No to use the horticultural Hell, look, we're going to
be back in just a moment. I love your calls.
I've got a few texts to get on too as well.
We eighte hundred and eighty ten eighty is the numbers,
twenty to six News talks. He'd be news talks. He'd
be with Tim Beverage. We've got Todd Charter, he's the
CEO of Roba Bank in the studio with us and
(31:29):
taking your course. By the way, I read this text here,
This is from Who's this from? Does it not sign?
It says Tim, I'm a widow on super banking with
rabo because I feel I'm helping the rural sector. I
put my money in term deposits as one of the
plus with Rabobank is that one of the pluses with
robobank is that they do one thousand dollars minimum deposit,
(31:50):
which the bigger banks want five for grand I'm delighted
to be one of their customers. Great bank to work with,
loving this discussion as I didn't really know the way
Rabi banks started. So you probably have a few customers
who they go with the brand and then go oh
is that what you guys? Do?
Speaker 3 (32:05):
You know? It's nice? Yeah? Think thank you for that text.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Right, let's go to another caller, shall we. Helen?
Speaker 5 (32:11):
Hello, Oh, couldn't good evening. I haven't been in very long.
I just wanted to confirm that to be a customer
of rabobank you actually have to be online.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
Yes that's right, Helen.
Speaker 5 (32:23):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not. I'm not online, so you know,
I don't I don't do anything on you know, no
banking online, So that counts me out unfortunately, because it's
because I would like to actually, you know, be a customer,
be a customer there, but no online only just counts
me out completely and that's not likely to change.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
Sorry to hear that, Helen is known in your family
that could help you.
Speaker 5 (32:48):
I don't have. I don't have any anyone in my family.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Actually yep, no, sorry I clicked off too soon. Some
of my apologies there, Helen, is that I guess that's
just the sign of the times too, when you when
you started in the market that you know that the
online model is where you're going to go, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
Well, Actually, when we first started in New Zealand and
we were just lending and we were using wholesale funding
as a way of doing that, and into company funding
from our parents in the Netherlands, and then we set
up in the early two thousands, we set up an
online banking offering. Yeah, just to keep it simple, but
(33:27):
certainly targeting mums and dads and individuals. But it's about
trying to keep it simple and you know for us,
you know, we can't be all things to all people unfortunately,
and so that works well for us.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
We've got a text here says does Rubobank lend for
small family farms or only the large commercial ones? In
other words, does a farm have to be exporting or
mass producing for nationwide selling to get a loan? Or
can smaller farms that sell online weekend farmers' market? So
I guess we're talking lifestyle farmers.
Speaker 4 (33:56):
Oh, look at it's difficult for us with the lifestyle
market and we acknowledge that, as I say, we can't
be all things to all people. But you know, some
smaller farms do grow into larger farms, and so you know,
if there are potential growth opportunities for some of those businesses,
you will ever chat. But yeah, I mean, unashamably, it
does have to be a certain scale for us to
(34:19):
for it to work for our model.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Getting back to that succession thing, because the vibe that
if you, if I do talk back on this, just
generally there is a fear amongst New Zealanders that the
farming sector is gradually getting out of the hands of
the family farm you know where maybe the smaller blocks
I don't know, but you know it's becoming more and
more corporatized. We see more farm farms consolidate into larger groups,
(34:47):
larger sort of company corporate entities, and that is that
what's Is there a problem with succession in New Zealand
in terms of the challenge and passing it from generation
to generation.
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Look, I think there's a challenge for sure. I mean,
we released a white paper in June last year on
this on this very topic and it is getting harder,
there's no question about them. But to me, it's a
mixture of even some of those corporate type farms are
still predominantly, if not all, family owned. It's an amalgamation
of families. So it still comes back to that, to
(35:23):
that emotional tie. There's no question about that. And and
so I think we'll see a combination of things. You know,
we see we're starting to see some sort of hot
what I would call hybrid farm ownership models where you've
still got predominantly family owned, but you might have some
external investors that you know, support that family, rely heavily
(35:43):
on the management and commitment that those family members bring,
but are introducing capital that facilitates that intergenerational change.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
As actually those issues more is it sheep, beef and
dairy that we're that sort of romantic idea of the
family farm that gets passed down through generations, and not just.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
That, it's also orchards.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
You know, one of the one of the case studies
we had in our white paper was was a family
down in central Otago the third generation and been passed
down through and and so yeah, no, it's not it's
not just it's just pastoral farming.
Speaker 2 (36:19):
A what's you mentioned the white paper. When you put
together a white paper, who's who's the intended audience for
it when you put something, so you've mentioned it a
couple of times.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Well, I think you know, we've got aspiration to be
New Zealand's leading food and agribank and to do that,
you know, you need to show some leadership. And so
what we want to you know, we're attempting to show
leadership on some of those critical topics. So the audience
really is the industry as you know, farmers and grows
and landowners owners, but also you know corporate corporate through
(36:53):
that value chain because you know, if you're an exporting company,
you rely on primary production to have product to export.
So everyone's everyone's inherently invested in that same process.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
So who was who We've written the white paper. Who's
who's digesting it?
Speaker 4 (37:10):
Industry, Government, you know, we've got feedback from government. We've
had a lot of feedback from different industry groups. It
was quoted by I think the Avocado Council last week
talking about it, and so you know industry groups beef
and lamb and darien zed and and it's it's really
to lead a conversation.
Speaker 3 (37:31):
We don't have the answers. It's about leading the conversation
on that.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Yeah, I was just curious because you don't want to
get into I mean, this is not an argumentative proposition,
by the way, it's just you you talk about we
try and keep away from politics, and yet do you
have a do you see you have a role in
advocacy for the I mean to me, it's bleeding obvious
you must have it. And it's that part of it,
the white paper. Yeah, this is where we think it's going.
We want the politicians to listen to this.
Speaker 4 (37:55):
Therefore, well we want we want people to think about it,
you know, and so whenever you know, yes, I do
spend time going and talking to political leaders, but it's
always through the eyes of our clients. It's always through
the perspective of these are the issues that our clients
are facing. These are the topics that perhaps are keeping
them awake or causing a bit of stress. And so
(38:18):
it's not a political bias from from Revanks point of view,
it's representing the views of our clients.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
That's what I mean. That's why I represent it as advocacy.
And how I mean in a way, because you're representing
so many people who's your success rests on their success
and if you've I mean I don't know how many
customers you have, but you'd be a fairly large voice
in that conversation, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (38:40):
Yeah, and you're absolutely right. I mean, you know, we
don't exist, we don't exist of our clients and farmers
and gravels aren't successful, right and so and that's not
you know, we take a balance view on that. There's
you know, one of our previous white papers, you know,
we talked about the challenges around getting that balance right
between economic, environmental and social concepts and it's not as
(39:05):
not easy, right, and so it's about having those conversations,
trying to get as many people as you can to
the table and to talk through that because you know,
everyone's got a perspective and I think everyone's perspective is valuable,
and how do we bring it together.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
Okay, we're going to take a quick moment and be
back in the tick. It's eight and a half minutes
to six news talks. They'd be news talks it be.
This is pretty much the end of the show. We're
with Todd charteris the ceeover of our bank. With only
about a minute or so to go, Todd, but we
do have the state of the Nation not only or political.
But so I'm not going to ask you what you
want to see, Todd, but what do you think your
customers would like to see? Is there anything they'd be
(39:38):
looking for in the state of the Nation of Morol.
We're just steady as you go.
Speaker 4 (39:43):
Oh look, I think when you know, when I'm talking
to our clients out there, what they're really looking forward
is some certainty instability going forward. I think, you know,
there's there's been quite a bit of change, and the
last thing we need is change for change sake.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
Steady as she goes, I think, well, it's.
Speaker 3 (40:02):
You create the guardrails.
Speaker 4 (40:03):
I think, you know, there's been some great work done
around r A reform and things like that which gives
some certainty. But let's let's get that in place and
then carry on from our politicians doing a great job
out there in those export markets and setting up trade
opportunities for our farmers. But then they just want to
get on farm and good at it. Let's let them
(40:24):
do it.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
And with free trade agreements and stuff like that. It's
the optimism fair enough to say for this year.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
Yeah, look, absolutely, I think guarded optimism because notwithstanding the
volatility that we know and what could happen? So yeah,
we're in good shape though.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
Yeah excellent. Hey, thank hey, thanks so much for coming on.
We can get you on again sometime and will so excellent.
If you missed any of that conversation, then do check
out our podcast just it'll be loaded up almost instantly
once we finish the show. And thanks for listening. We've
enjoyed being back for the first week and back and
Todd thanks for coming in the studio. Mat really appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
Good stuff. Thanks to and we'll look forward.
Speaker 2 (41:03):
To your company next weekend at same time, same place.
Thanks to my producer Tyra Ward, who has done a
great job on show today and I think that's the
reason you're here, So thanks Tyra, and we'll be back
same time next week Sunday, It's six is next.
Speaker 1 (41:31):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talks It'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Yes, welcome back to this is Smart Money. I'm Tim
Beverage on the Weekend Collective. By the way, if you
miss any other of the hours during the course of
the show, you can go and check out our podcast.
Just go to news Talk, said B look for the
Weekend Collective and they all will be there after six
o'clock anyway we want. And as always with these hours,
we'd love your participation. If you want to join the
(00:55):
conversation eight hundred and eighty ten eighty, you can text
on nine to two, nine to two and for this
of course, it's welcome to Smart Money. And we we've
actually got a new guest on the show and he
is CEO of Rabobank and his name's Todd Charteris and
he's with me now. Todd, how you going.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Yeah, you get a Tim, it's good to be here
and ye're nice to meet you.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Yeah, it's funny when I was Rabobank. Actually, we'll get it.
We'll set up what we want to talk about. But
you know we're going to have a chat about Rabobanks,
a huge player in the rural sector and rural sector's
been been some reasonably good headlines over the past sort
of twelve months, stabilizing interest rates, there's been great dairy results,
(01:43):
promising meet exports, and hopefully that sort of leads into
a successful twenty twenty six. And this is where we
want you, the listeners to join us as well, and
especially if you're in the rural sector. We want to
know it just about how you're feeling. It's election year,
We've got a turbulent, a turbulent international scene. I think,
(02:04):
how are you feeling, are you confident in the rural
sector and if you're a farmer, house that changed over
the past few years, anyway, get tired before we get
into it. For those who are more familiar with the
traditional I'm not sure how the retail banks, trading banks,
that's the one, the AD, the ASPN, stuff like that.
What's Rabobank?
Speaker 4 (02:25):
Yeah, well, first of all, Rabobank is a Dutch cooperative.
So we're actually formed back in the late eighteen hundreds
at a time when Dutch farmers didn't have access to
funds to essentially plant their crops, and so these whole
series are cooperatives spread up all across the Netherlands, people
with money essentially put it into the jar. You know,
(02:47):
people who lived in the villages put in the jar.
Farmers borrowed it, planted their crops, fed the people, and
that was how Rabo Banks started back in eighteen ninety eight,
and so as a cooperative it's a completely different mindset,
I think. And then came to New Zealand in ninety four,
so we've been only thirty one years and since that.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Time, you know, we have grown.
Speaker 4 (03:11):
We're one hundred percent focused on food and agriculture, so
New Zealand's only specialist food and agricultural bank.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Isn't it funny? I mean, I've got a Rabo which
I've usually put money that I want to touch on
it for a while and then put it and jack
it up so I get the bonus in trut et cetera.
I mean, I'm sure you know how it works. But
it's funny because I was aware that they were as
a Dutch bank, but I had no I don't know
what got me into it. I think someone just said
(03:38):
it was I think it was somebody who said, look,
if you want talking about safety of your money and
credit ratings, because Rabo's got it's got a I mean,
there's been some funny headlines, but you guys have had
a pretty stellar credit rating.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
Absolutely, and you know, yeah, we're one of the highest
privately owned because you know, we're essentially privately owned because
of that cooperative nature. We're members And you're right. So
the money you've got in there, Tom, we gladly lend
it out to New Zealand farmers and growers who produce food.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
How actually that it does actually raise that question as
to whether people are there there's a plumby. I'm gonna
we have a few columpesy we have asking questions as
part of the appeal of RABO for customers, how important
is it to them what you're offering versus how important
(04:29):
is to them that they go this is the fact
that's supporting New Zealand farmers. I'm going to stick my
money with them.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
Oh look, I think it's a mix's antre of everything.
It's a mixture of everything. I mean, you need to
be competitive. You know, we are competitive in terms of
the retail deposit rates we offer, but we're also very
clear with our depositors. You put money in with us
and that that's where it will be deployed and that
certainly appeals to a number of people because you know
you're helping, you're helping grow New Zealand. We know how
(04:57):
important food and agria is to New Zealand in terms
of the exports, and it's vitally important and so we
need a strong food nagar sector. So we're supporting that,
you know, completely committed to that on the landing side,
and we need the funding.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
So you were pretty clear.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
Okay, before we get into the nuts and bolts of it,
just to learn a little bit about you, and again
I've had other bank CEOs in here and I was
expecting you to come here with your PR team and
a certain of time. Everything. You don't quite you haven't
quite measured up what I mean as just you know,
just it's just you just have a more fun of
(05:35):
rural vibug yuess. But what's your background when it comes
to getting into banking and being in the position you're in.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
Yeah, no, Look, I'm originally from down South. I spent
a lot of time in o Targo in Southland and
you grew up on on smaller farms, so I certainly
agriculturally it's my background. You know, I've still got family farming,
my sisters farming, my cousins. You know, so we're deeply
connected and you know that stays with you. And I
(06:02):
went through a university at Otago, did a finance degree.
I started off as a stock agent actually when I
first left university, and then you know, like a lot
of key weis, went to London, did a couple of
years over there working in banking, which was you know,
it sounded grand grand and it was good on the CV.
But you know, for me, it was about getting back
(06:23):
to New Zealand and getting back to what I love,
which is about working with farmers and growl.
Speaker 2 (06:28):
So did the degree stock agent, went to bank in London. Yeah,
so then coming back to you came back to New
Zealand straight into banking or where.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
Straight straight back into banking. And you know, so when
I was working as a stock agent, I actually worked
for Rightchen's who in the meantime had sold their finance
company to Rabo Bank in nineteen ninety eight. I came
back in late ninety nine, started in two thousand with Rabo.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Oh so you've been almost almost from one day year five,
I guess.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
No, Well, I've been over twenty five years. So yeah,
a good part of my working career.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
But I mean, in terms of Rabo's life in New Zealand,
you were in there fairly early early.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Yeah, we were really small back in the day, and
it's been exciting, you know, because we've been part of
growing and we have grown strongly and and you know,
we're really optimistic about opportunities that continue to exist out
there and we want to continue to grow. We're deeply
committed to the market and you know that excites me.
And you know what excited me about joining RABO back
(07:27):
in two thousand is the same today, and it's that
commitment to those rural communities. It's commitment to New Zealand
food nagri and it's about helping people.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
You know.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Do you get frustrated with the news cycles on farming
and stuff like that in terms of I don't know
if we ever get the feeling for how things are
really going until we see the dramatic headlines that the
milk pay out. As we've seen some very dramatic headlines
in terms of farmers doing very well, but it either
feels like, you know, the farmers and farming is doing
brilliantly or there's a real struggle. But do you get
(07:57):
frustrated by how the average New Zealander might be able
to understand what's going on in the rural sector.
Speaker 4 (08:02):
Oh, look, I wouldn't. I wouldn't say I get frustrated.
I think it's it's you know, I always try and
understand where people are coming from, and so you know,
we've got a part to play to better communicate that
and make that connection. I mean, we talk about it
was often talked about rural urban divide. I'd much rather
than we refer to it now as rural urban connection.
(08:22):
So how do we make that connection more effective? We
do quite a bit of work in education, helping like
agribusiness and schools, which is a way of educating you know,
people who grow up in cities and so you know,
we we try and break it down that way and
just help people understand both sides of the equation.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
So how's it looking that you reckon this year? What's
the current state of finances in the rural sector?
Speaker 5 (08:44):
Oh?
Speaker 4 (08:44):
I think are pretty strong. I mean, you know last
year was we run a confidence survey every quarter out
every quarter.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
With farmers and grows.
Speaker 4 (08:53):
It came off a little bit in that fourth quarter.
But unsurprisingly, you know, we'd send dairy prices come back
down off record highs, of course, and you've got to
keep them in context. So no, look, I think that
outlook looks looks pretty strong. I mean, the last g
DT auction bounced back up about six percent, so that's encouraging.
Red meat is very strong, beef and sheep meat, kibi
(09:14):
fruit's doing doing really well. So yeah, I think the
outlooks look looks strong. And that's what was you know,
that's what we're hearing from our clients. There's a lot
of optimism out there and realism. I mean, it's it's
the world's volatile place, right, and well, we export most
of what we produced, so I wasn't.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
Sure how much to get into the world's a volatile place,
but because we could easily end up in a political
discussion which might not be you know, where you want
to go. But so I won't really but how much
how nervous do bankers around the world get, Look, it's inevitable,
(09:50):
I started asking the question. But you know, we've seen
the thing with Arna Breman and Winston telling it to
stay in lane and all that sort of stuff. But
the how how much does the global banking climate influence
us here, Arbou Bank, not just you but A and Z.
I mean, how does that all play out with what
we see going on and the pressure on the Fed
Reserve to do what the president wants?
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Yeah, well, I think I think we're really starts impacting
us here is when it starts to undermine confidence and optimism.
And you know that that's the challenge to overcome is
how do we we acknowledge that there's volatility out there
and we acknowledge that things change literally overnight. You know,
we've seen tariffs come on, We've seen tariffs come off
for some of our products that we produce and export,
(10:36):
and it's to me, it's it's kind of the challenges
to look through those cycles and and remain you know,
to me, it's fundamental. You know, the world needs to eat.
We're pretty good at producing food. In fact, we're very
very good at it, and so a lot let's focus
on that, and I think we're in pretty good shape
and things will go up and down, but there'll be
(10:56):
I think the demand will remain there and flow through.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Actually, that is one of the you've touched on something there. Again.
Politics has never far away from anything?
Speaker 3 (11:04):
Is that no?
Speaker 2 (11:05):
But I guess that's what I was thinking with the frustration,
in a way, is that our farmers are incredibly efficient
at producing what we do. Do you think that it
resonates enough the understanding of you know, the public about
that as well. I mean, there was that I don't
want to fixate on dairy, but there was that new
story that a liter of milk produced in New Zealand
(11:28):
is greener even though it gets shipped across the world
to Ireland than a liter of milk that's produced in
Ireland that isn't enough to go anywhere. The fact that
we're so efficient is that Is that a frustration we
don't understand that a lot of the time, or we're
seeing a mixing of messages.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Well, I think that's one of the challenges for us,
and it comes back to our I think the characteristics
of New Zealanders. We're modest by nature. You know, we're humble,
and we're perhaps not as good at telling a story
as we could be. And I think that's the challenge,
right is getting our story out there, being proud of
what we do and and you know, our farmers and
(12:07):
grows and New Zelda a lot. They're incredibly innovative, always
have been responding to market signals, all of those type
of things. And there's no doubt there's there's pressure on,
right we need we need to produce more food, but
we need to do it in a way that doesn't
have an adverse impact on the environment. And that's been
challenging and it's one of the paradoxes that we need
(12:28):
to deal with and the content, you know, the thought
of us producing less for another less efficient country to
produce more, but it was nonsensical, and so how do
we overcome that? At the same time, we do have
national commitments that we've made internationally, and so how do
we balance all that? And that's the challenge, right And
(12:50):
and you know, when I'm talking to farmers and growls
out there, they just want to get on and do
the job as best they can. And they do a
wonderful job. And some of that noise and messages that
bounce around around them frustrate them and they know the
good at what they do and they'll respond to the market.
And our job, I think is to help them be
(13:12):
as efficient as they can be and learn from one another.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
Actually, I was chatting with Jamie Insaw, who's the New
Zealand hell political reporter, And because we've got Christopher Luxon's
making a State of the Nation addressed tomorrow and I
was just chatting to him, to Jamie about what things
he was looking forward to hearing about this year, and
he touched on the India India f t A. What
(13:36):
does that mean? What does that mean for your customers
and for the farming and rural sector in general.
Speaker 4 (13:42):
Oh, look, I think that's it's a great milestone to
get that across the line. That's been twenty years in
the making. And I know there's been criticism from some
quarters about the lack of involvement with dairy, but that
was always going to be very difficult, if not impossible.
So we need to celebrate the fact we've got FDA
(14:03):
opens up that market for a number of our commodities
and gives us choice. And I think that's that's outstanding.
And I think, you know, politically, you know, I think
that's where you know, we want politicians to do a
great job around trade and setting us up so that
our farmers can just get on, as I said earlier,
(14:23):
and do what they're good at, which is producing food.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
How do you go in terms of your communications with
the farmers and your customers, your clients. I'm not sure
what words you use around that in terms of how
they're feeling about things. Do you judge it mostly by
data or data you know about how everything's going with
their borrowing and the servicing of the loans and then
(14:46):
paying down debt and all that, all the things that
you witness, and how much do you actually just have
a chat with them and get a vibe about how
they're going and how are they feeling.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Oh, look, I think it's sort of multiple channels. We do,
as I said, the confidence survey result. The other avenue
that we tap into, which goes back to our cooperative
fruits the Netherlands is we have four client councils in
New Zealand, which are groups of clients that represent you know,
different commodity types, the different rural communities. So we've got
(15:15):
two in the North Island, two in the South and
I spent a bit of time connecting with them, hearing firsthand,
you know, how they're feeling, you know how their communities
are feeling, what are the burning issues?
Speaker 3 (15:30):
You know?
Speaker 4 (15:31):
They give us feedback about how the bank's going what
we can do better, what we're doing well, what they'd
like to see more of. And to me, it's a
bit like a conscience, you know, like it's just like
feedback is a gift and it's incredibly important.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
You know.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
I spend quite a bit of time in different parts
of the country talking to farmers and growers and their clients,
and look, nothing beats that face to face.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
I mean, yeah, I mean you can.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
Are they feeling on the whole? You think it's looking good?
For looking how's it looking for twenty twenty sixty, You know.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
I think it's looking very strong. Yeah, I think I
think there's a lot of optimism out there. We've seen that,
you know, investment and tensions are up, you know, which
is unsurprising. You've seen the Fonterra vote go through. So
there'll be some some you know, a substantial amount of
money come back through rural communities that way. You know,
every farm business will be different in terms of the
(16:24):
fontier owners and what they do. You know, some will
pay off debt, so if someone it will kick off
some succession opportunities. Some will invest, you know, So.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
You mean the farm succession opportunities yeah, because that's one
of the big issues in farming, isn't it is passing
that farm on. So I mean, actually we might dig
into that. We take a break actually, but if you've
got any calls for Todd Chaters, he's a CEO of Rabobank.
If you've got something you'd like to ask Todd, get
his reckons on something or something you want to throw
(16:54):
at him for as an opinion, and we'll see where
we go with that. You can give us a call
on eight hundred and eighty ten eighty, you can text
on nine to nine to two and we'll be back
in just a moment. It's twenty three past five. News
Talks ed B, News Talks ed B. My guest is
Todd Charteris. This is for smart money. He's a CEO
of Rabobank, a major play when it comes to financing
and looking after the banking needs of the rural community.
(17:16):
Taking your calls as well, and you know, whatever you
want to throw at him, I'm sure, I'm sure Todd
can deal with it. Peter, Hello, good.
Speaker 6 (17:23):
Morning, good afternoon. Two questions When the Labor Party came
into office with a twenty five percent evaluation with Roger
Douglas other people were horrendously angry because they thought seventy
percent of New Zealand's costs were overseas. So the first
question is what difference does the low currency make towards farmers?
(17:49):
And the second question is with regard to ownership of land. Say,
since Roger Douglas and the reforms of farming when them
probably was less corporate ownership in nineteen eighty four or whatever,
what is the percent of corporates farmers? Because I heard
boarding schools have less farmers because our corporates I don't
(18:11):
send their sons to boarding school anymore. What's the percentage
of corporate ownership versus individual ownership?
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Oh? Actually, that thanks Peter. We were talking a bit
about that in the break, just about the succession thing.
But yeah, okay, I'll hand those over to you there.
Speaker 4 (18:26):
Yeah, no, look, thanks for your questions, Peter. First of all,
in terms of currency, you know that's vital. I mean,
we explort about ninety percent of what we produce, and
so you know, currency helps the exporters. But at the
same time it's a balancing act because we also bring
goods into New Zealand that we use on farm. So
(18:47):
a lower dollar hurts that as well, So it's just
trying to get that balance right. You know, we talk
about input prices like fertilizer and energy cost fuel and
things like that, and machinery of course, so so yeah,
currency is a huge part, but you know, as X
borders allow, currency helps that. So you know, it certainly
(19:09):
bounced around a fair bit over the last few years.
It's that volatility that we spoke about earlier, and I
think that's going to stay for a while. In terms
of that ownership, Look, I haven't got the percentages in
front of me, but we've certainly since you know, probably forever,
we've seen consolidation of farms over time, and we recently
(19:31):
released a white paper in June last year which which
really looks to open up that discussion around farm succession,
and certainly in there we talk about the corporatization of
some farms. But to me, you know, the predominance is
still family owned h and I don't think that's going
(19:52):
to change for a while. But we are seeing continued
consolidation so that the number of farmers and farm owners
orchard owners is reducing and the average size of farms
are getting bigger, and you know, and some of it
is corporatization, but to me, it's stalled the store a
heck of a lot of very well run family operations.
(20:14):
But also, you know, I think what we're also seeing
is the evolution of some of those family businesses, which
are you know, actually bringing in some of those I
guess corporate structures, you know, some of them using advisory boards.
I mean, these are large businesses. I'm still family owned,
but you know, you've got different generations playing different roles
(20:36):
in those and utilizing some of those skills externally. So
it's a whole combination. And look, I think we'll continue
to see consolidation, but you know, they don't take anything
away from family owned farms.
Speaker 6 (20:50):
That's a lot about the competition and future things like
Russia apparently had lots of unused farmland, which is a
big place, and other technology for other lands. Do you
see that we're gonna a greater competition from other parts
of the world on price and volume for land or
(21:11):
for what well, for land being used for WWORTH technology
advancements and all that sort of stuff. To you know,
more land being able to use it wasn't used before.
Speaker 3 (21:23):
Well, yeah, I don't think we've got much.
Speaker 6 (21:26):
You've got the warming, you know, the change of climates
where some places are getting better climates in some places
are not going to produce because you know, the climates changed,
not enough water, so you don't see what well, actually.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
I actually see from a climate point of view, is
great opportunity for New Zealand. You know we're we're particularly
well placed. We've got an abundance of water. We're caller climate,
so you know, climate change is a challenge, but I
think it's a big opportunity for us. And I think
you know, the farmers that I speak to and don't
feel threatened by that at all, in fact looking for opportunities.
(22:04):
So yeah, I think I think we're well placed as thanks.
Speaker 2 (22:07):
For call Peters. In terms of New Zealand's position in
the marketplace overseas with exports, is how much of it
is of us being a premium sort of product, you know,
I guess I always think about meat and dairy, but
there's so much more to what you guys look after.
But is that where we belong as that things come
from New Zealand. We're never going to compete with some
(22:29):
of those you know, the countries are massive land masses
of farming and wheat and things like that. But are
we more.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
Well, we're more niche. I think niche. We're definitely high.
Speaker 4 (22:39):
I mean reputation in New Zealand farmers and exporting companies
are really well regarded and you know there's been built
up over over the last hundred plus years and so
you know we're in great shape and we need to
maintain that reputations everything in the marketplace. And so but no,
we're really well positioned, and I think that's something we
(23:00):
should be really proud of, and we need to fight
hard to stay on those those premium shelves.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
That is it because we have just worked out that
that's our place. The market works it out, you know
New Zealander's work out. Look, we're great at creating dairy
and meat and the horticultural side of things. Is it
driven by the fact that we've just found that that's
how we are going to make money or are there
political what our strives? That is it just the New
Zealand sort of innovative way. Why have we become there
(23:29):
rather than I don't know, other Well.
Speaker 4 (23:32):
We're relatively small, you know, we're relatively long way away
from international markets. So we have to be good to compete,
and I think that's been the case. It's in our DNA,
it's needs must, yeah, and so you know we've we've
we've forged a really strong relationship. I think in terms
of a trading nation, we've got a great reputation. I
(23:54):
think successive trade ministers have done a great job in
terms of opening up markets and things like that, and
so I think that's you know, it's just in our DNA.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
I think we're good at.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
It on that. And actually, as you mentioned successive trade ministers.
With the FTA, I think we know that New Zealand
first is not going to support it. Would you be
expecting that that's going to get across the line because labor,
you know, they want their ministers. In the past, they've
worked for FTA, so they'll support it. Have you got
any comment to make or are you try and steer
clear of that?
Speaker 3 (24:23):
So I look, we keep out of the politics. But
I think you know, like you know, you'll never get everything.
Speaker 4 (24:31):
Perfect, right, let's not let perfect get in the way
better and this certainly opens up there's certainly a lot
to be positive about. And I think it would be
crime shame not to get it across the line, I'd
be staggered in fact.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
So yeah, okay, let's take some more calls, shall we.
Eight hundred eighty ten eighty If you've got any questions.
It's his first time on the show's first show of
the year. Todd charteris he's the CEO of Rabobank. In
the studio with me right now, give us a call.
I eight hundred eighty ten eighty Tom.
Speaker 7 (25:06):
Good afternoon, gentlemen. I'm a bit of the simpleton. Tell me, sir,
how do I invest money in your bank?
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Oh?
Speaker 7 (25:17):
By the way, you you sound like your bank's doing
a good job. As I had fought in the past,
but didn't know how to join.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
Customer, isn't it you want to invest in it? You
want to you're saying time.
Speaker 7 (25:31):
We'll put money in the bank or what you like here?
I've just proven how dottery I am.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
No, No, that's I think many people want to know
how to ask that question.
Speaker 7 (25:39):
Yeah, I look good on your I've seen advertisements, never
a phone call, so I haven't joined in the last
year when I wanted to.
Speaker 4 (25:48):
No, No, we'll give the team a call if you
go on. Can you've got access to a computer go online.
Speaker 6 (25:56):
And you can't use it.
Speaker 7 (25:57):
I can't use it to.
Speaker 4 (25:58):
Okay, Well, well I'll get the number before you.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yep, we'll get the number before you.
Speaker 4 (26:05):
Get the number before your Tom, before the end of
the air, and you ring the team tomorrow and they'll
they'll talk you through finding a way there.
Speaker 2 (26:13):
Actually, funny enough, thank you. I actually tell you what
you stand by, because I reckon, I've got that. Are
you talking about online savings? Eight hundred two two four
four three three?
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Yeah, that's it? Do you hear that?
Speaker 2 (26:25):
There you go, Tom, you're there?
Speaker 7 (26:27):
Yeah, two two four three.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
No, double two double four, double three. So it's eight
hundred double two double four double three.
Speaker 7 (26:37):
Secret for so long.
Speaker 2 (26:40):
Two hundred years well secret.
Speaker 4 (26:42):
Yeah, Now, we do get that feedback every now and then, Tom,
But uh, look we're we're here for the long haul.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
So I'm please you.
Speaker 4 (26:52):
You have heard about us, and but yeah, just just
in terms of you will need our offering is online,
so we just talk to the team around you know,
you might have someone in your family that can help
you with that, but we need access to a computer
for you.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
So yeah, so okay, Tom, soon we need to get
access to a computer. Thanks, to your call mate. Actually,
when I first joined Rabbo, you had those the verification
but did you pass? But actually, you guys were sort
of I don't know if you if it's fair, my
impression was you were leading the way when it came
to the security of your account, because to be honest,
(27:32):
it was kind of a pain in the bum logging on.
But I always thought this is safe as houses.
Speaker 4 (27:38):
Yeah, no, that's right and that. Yeah, look, we got
a lot of feedback on those. You got rid of THESS. Yeah,
we've still got this. We've still got the verification you
know that, which is just now on a mobile device,
but it's exactly the same, and so yeah, we unapologetically
take that extra layer of security because you know, protecting
(28:00):
our our clients funds is important, and yeah, it was.
It was quite a change for us when we moved
away from most physical did you passes we got. We've
got a lot of feedback people got used to them
and didn't like to change. But on the main, I
think it's a lot easier now.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
I think I prefer it now because usually because I'd
sit down at my desk, can I be oh, where's
that thing I've oh I know, and then you have
to call up and have to send you on anyway.
It wasn't like I was doing it every day. Yeah,
actually why who can who can borrow from you?
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Guys?
Speaker 4 (28:34):
So so we leand one hundred percent to food and
aggre sectors, So right through that value chain though, so
from you know, farmers, growers, processes, exporters, right the way through.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
For your first time buy you.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
No, no, we we know we're not set up to
do that. You know, there's there's a number of really
good banks in New Zealand and that offer that.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
I know.
Speaker 4 (28:59):
We focus on what we're good at, which is food
and agre and rural lending.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Okay, I got a text here from someone saying how
come rural lenders charge more for mortgages than urban mortgage holders?
The rates there and this is just a friend of
mine in the who's a farmer? But the question about
how they slow to reduce interest rates there's an argument there.
I don't know if he's talking about you or the bank.
Speaker 4 (29:25):
Yeah, I mean I can't speak for other banks, but
you know, we certainly off the back of OCR cuts
have our variable rates changed pretty quickly within seven to
ten days. Our fixed rates actually move every day on
the international markets, so that's responsive every day in terms
(29:45):
of the differential between rural lending and residential. Part of
it is we have to hold more capital. It was
the center of center of the banking inquiry really where
over the last twelve months it was a Select Committee
inquiry into banking. A lot of questions around that. But
the fact is, you know, we have to hold more capital.
(30:06):
But also the other thing is, you know it's a
it's a reasonably high high touch model, you know, like
running a team of rural bankers because every farm business
is unique, right.
Speaker 2 (30:17):
And high contact in terms of regular it's much more faced,
regular interfacing.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Is it worth Yeah, And because every every business is
unique and so to really understand the risks of individual
businesses you've got to get quite close. So not taking
anything away from residential lending, but it's it's pretty straightforward.
You've got a highly liquid market and a highly liquid
market compared to rural and so there's just a lot
(30:45):
more complexity. You know, you've got factors a lot we've
just spoken about. You've got foreign exchange, you've got climate,
you've got a whole lot of things impacting you've got
volatility and export markets, so you know you haven't got
a consistent income stream all those type of things. So
it's it's high touch, which so it's completely different markets.
So you can't compare the two. They're not not comparing
(31:08):
apples with apples.
Speaker 2 (31:09):
No to use the horticultural Hell, look, we're going to
be back in just a moment. I love your calls.
I've got a few texts to get on too as well.
We eighte hundred and eighty ten eighty is the numbers,
twenty to six News talks. He'd be news talks. He'd
be with Tim Beverage. We've got Todd Charter, he's the
CEO of Roba Bank in the studio with us and
(31:29):
taking your course. By the way, I read this text here,
This is from Who's this from? Does it not sign?
It says Tim, I'm a widow on super banking with
rabo because I feel I'm helping the rural sector. I
put my money in term deposits as one of the
plus with Rabobank is that one of the pluses with
robobank is that they do one thousand dollars minimum deposit,
(31:50):
which the bigger banks want five for grand I'm delighted
to be one of their customers. Great bank to work with,
loving this discussion as I didn't really know the way
Rabi banks started. So you probably have a few customers
who they go with the brand and then go oh
is that what you guys? Do?
Speaker 3 (32:05):
You know? It's nice? Yeah? Think thank you for that text.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
Right, let's go to another caller, shall we. Helen?
Speaker 5 (32:11):
Hello, Oh, couldn't good evening. I haven't been in very long.
I just wanted to confirm that to be a customer
of rabobank you actually have to be online.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
Yes that's right, Helen.
Speaker 5 (32:23):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not. I'm not online, so you know,
I don't I don't do anything on you know, no
banking online, So that counts me out unfortunately, because it's
because I would like to actually, you know, be a customer,
be a customer there, but no online only just counts
me out completely and that's not likely to change.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
Sorry to hear that, Helen is known in your family
that could help you.
Speaker 5 (32:48):
I don't have. I don't have any anyone in my family.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Actually yep, no, sorry I clicked off too soon. Some
of my apologies there, Helen, is that I guess that's
just the sign of the times too, when you when
you started in the market that you know that the
online model is where you're going to go, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
Well, Actually, when we first started in New Zealand and
we were just lending and we were using wholesale funding
as a way of doing that, and into company funding
from our parents in the Netherlands, and then we set
up in the early two thousands, we set up an
online banking offering. Yeah, just to keep it simple, but
(33:27):
certainly targeting mums and dads and individuals. But it's about
trying to keep it simple and you know for us,
you know, we can't be all things to all people unfortunately,
and so that works well for us.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
We've got a text here says does Rubobank lend for
small family farms or only the large commercial ones? In
other words, does a farm have to be exporting or
mass producing for nationwide selling to get a loan? Or
can smaller farms that sell online weekend farmers' market? So
I guess we're talking lifestyle farmers.
Speaker 4 (33:56):
Oh, look at it's difficult for us with the lifestyle
market and we acknowledge that, as I say, we can't
be all things to all people. But you know, some
smaller farms do grow into larger farms, and so you know,
if there are potential growth opportunities for some of those businesses,
you will ever chat. But yeah, I mean, unashamably, it
does have to be a certain scale for us to
(34:19):
for it to work for our model.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Getting back to that succession thing, because the vibe that
if you, if I do talk back on this, just
generally there is a fear amongst New Zealanders that the
farming sector is gradually getting out of the hands of
the family farm you know where maybe the smaller blocks
I don't know, but you know it's becoming more and
more corporatized. We see more farm farms consolidate into larger groups,
(34:47):
larger sort of company corporate entities, and that is that
what's Is there a problem with succession in New Zealand
in terms of the challenge and passing it from generation
to generation.
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Look, I think there's a challenge for sure. I mean,
we released a white paper in June last year on
this on this very topic and it is getting harder,
there's no question about them. But to me, it's a
mixture of even some of those corporate type farms are
still predominantly, if not all, family owned. It's an amalgamation
of families. So it still comes back to that, to
(35:23):
that emotional tie. There's no question about that. And and
so I think we'll see a combination of things. You know,
we see we're starting to see some sort of hot
what I would call hybrid farm ownership models where you've
still got predominantly family owned, but you might have some
external investors that you know, support that family, rely heavily
(35:43):
on the management and commitment that those family members bring,
but are introducing capital that facilitates that intergenerational change.
Speaker 2 (35:52):
As actually those issues more is it sheep, beef and
dairy that we're that sort of romantic idea of the
family farm that gets passed down through generations, and not just.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
That, it's also orchards.
Speaker 4 (36:06):
You know, one of the one of the case studies
we had in our white paper was was a family
down in central Otago the third generation and been passed
down through and and so yeah, no, it's not it's
not just it's just pastoral farming.
Speaker 2 (36:19):
A what's you mentioned the white paper. When you put
together a white paper, who's who's the intended audience for
it when you put something, so you've mentioned it a
couple of times.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Well, I think you know, we've got aspiration to be
New Zealand's leading food and agribank and to do that,
you know, you need to show some leadership. And so
what we want to you know, we're attempting to show
leadership on some of those critical topics. So the audience
really is the industry as you know, farmers and grows
and landowners owners, but also you know corporate corporate through
(36:53):
that value chain because you know, if you're an exporting company,
you rely on primary production to have product to export.
So everyone's everyone's inherently invested in that same process.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
So who was who We've written the white paper. Who's
who's digesting it?
Speaker 4 (37:10):
Industry, Government, you know, we've got feedback from government. We've
had a lot of feedback from different industry groups. It
was quoted by I think the Avocado Council last week
talking about it, and so you know industry groups beef
and lamb and darien zed and and it's it's really
to lead a conversation.
Speaker 3 (37:31):
We don't have the answers. It's about leading the conversation
on that.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Yeah, I was just curious because you don't want to
get into I mean, this is not an argumentative proposition,
by the way, it's just you you talk about we
try and keep away from politics, and yet do you
have a do you see you have a role in
advocacy for the I mean to me, it's bleeding obvious
you must have it. And it's that part of it,
the white paper. Yeah, this is where we think it's going.
We want the politicians to listen to this.
Speaker 4 (37:55):
Therefore, well we want we want people to think about it,
you know, and so whenever you know, yes, I do
spend time going and talking to political leaders, but it's
always through the eyes of our clients. It's always through
the perspective of these are the issues that our clients
are facing. These are the topics that perhaps are keeping
them awake or causing a bit of stress. And so
(38:18):
it's not a political bias from from Revanks point of view,
it's representing the views of our clients.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
That's what I mean. That's why I represent it as advocacy.
And how I mean in a way, because you're representing
so many people who's your success rests on their success
and if you've I mean I don't know how many
customers you have, but you'd be a fairly large voice
in that conversation, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (38:40):
Yeah, and you're absolutely right. I mean, you know, we
don't exist, we don't exist of our clients and farmers
and gravels aren't successful, right and so and that's not
you know, we take a balance view on that. There's
you know, one of our previous white papers, you know,
we talked about the challenges around getting that balance right
between economic, environmental and social concepts and it's not as
(39:05):
not easy, right, and so it's about having those conversations,
trying to get as many people as you can to
the table and to talk through that because you know,
everyone's got a perspective and I think everyone's perspective is valuable,
and how do we bring it together.
Speaker 2 (39:17):
Okay, we're going to take a quick moment and be
back in the tick. It's eight and a half minutes
to six news talks. They'd be news talks it be.
This is pretty much the end of the show. We're
with Todd charteris the ceeover of our bank. With only
about a minute or so to go, Todd, but we
do have the state of the Nation not only or political.
But so I'm not going to ask you what you
want to see, Todd, but what do you think your
customers would like to see? Is there anything they'd be
(39:38):
looking for in the state of the Nation of Morol.
We're just steady as you go.
Speaker 4 (39:43):
Oh look, I think when you know, when I'm talking
to our clients out there, what they're really looking forward
is some certainty instability going forward. I think, you know,
there's there's been quite a bit of change, and the
last thing we need is change for change sake.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
Steady as she goes, I think, well, it's.
Speaker 3 (40:02):
You create the guardrails.
Speaker 4 (40:03):
I think, you know, there's been some great work done
around r A reform and things like that which gives
some certainty. But let's let's get that in place and
then carry on from our politicians doing a great job
out there in those export markets and setting up trade
opportunities for our farmers. But then they just want to
get on farm and good at it. Let's let them
(40:24):
do it.
Speaker 2 (40:24):
And with free trade agreements and stuff like that. It's
the optimism fair enough to say for this year.
Speaker 4 (40:30):
Yeah, look, absolutely, I think guarded optimism because notwithstanding the
volatility that we know and what could happen? So yeah,
we're in good shape though.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
Yeah excellent. Hey, thank hey, thanks so much for coming on.
We can get you on again sometime and will so excellent.
If you missed any of that conversation, then do check
out our podcast just it'll be loaded up almost instantly
once we finish the show. And thanks for listening. We've
enjoyed being back for the first week and back and
Todd thanks for coming in the studio. Mat really appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
Good stuff. Thanks to and we'll look forward.
Speaker 2 (41:03):
To your company next weekend at same time, same place.
Thanks to my producer Tyra Ward, who has done a
great job on show today and I think that's the
reason you're here, So thanks Tyra, and we'll be back
same time next week Sunday, It's six is next.
Speaker 1 (41:31):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talks It'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
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