June 30, 2026 • 8 mins
The Black Caps are celebrating hard following their historic victory over England.
Sealed by a 160-run game three win, New Zealand's overall 2-1 victory is just the second time in their 96-year history they've come-from-behind to win a series in the longest format.
Black Caps bowling coach Jacob Oram joined Elliott to discuss further.
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Waldegrave
from news Talk.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
ZEDB, continuing our reflections on the Black Camps victory against
England and what a victory it was. And you don't
want to single out bowlers or batters, but you know,
we've got the bowling coach, Jacob or I'm standing by,
so I think we're going to lean towards the bowlers. Jacob,
thank you so much for joining us so early morning
(00:31):
out of Nottingham. I appreciate your time with us here
on newstalk ZBB.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Not a problem.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Well the morning after you must be just absolutely thrilled
with the way that your bowling arsenal came together and
of course of course the batters as well, but how
the bowlers managed to get this team towards victory on
day five.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Yeah, look the victory. So it was amazing, and you know,
I sort of discussed it with a few of the
boys last night and reminisced if you liked immediately, and
it was it sort of sunk in quite quickly what
we'd achieved, and then we thought, how did we do that?
You know, and I don't mean that from an initial
defeatus point of view. But you know, from losing that
(01:13):
first test and then the drama and turmoil around that
English side, we sort of just rolled our sleeves up
and got on with our business and it was you know,
I thought in the second and third test we were
just so clinical, so organized, and so specific in what
we were trying to do. Not that we went at
Lord's but it's the execution part that is a difficult bit.
(01:35):
And you know, we just went about our work and
I'm so proud that we just stuck to our task.
We didn't go looking and searching, and obviously the reward
at the end of the day as the series victory,
it is.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Indeed, you mentioned the distractions and obviously Cain retiring was
another one to throw on the mix in England's turmoil.
But did it how much did it show the resilience
I guess of this team. You know that we've seen
over a number of years now, But just to park
all of that and go back to work.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
It's massive, and I actually think it's probably a little
bit uns a weave it. You know, we get talked
about for being the sum of all parts, and you know,
we punch about our weight and you know, underdogs and
all this sort of stuff that we hear a lot of,
specially at ICC tournaments. You know, we'll make a semi
final final and that are New Zealand's overachieved. Again, It's like, well,
hang on, at what point does that tag actually change
(02:25):
into this is a bloody good side And as you
point about the resilience, the relentless nature of it, like
that's actually a skill in itself, and I think New
Zealanders should be proud of that fight as much as anything.
We have terribly skilled players, you know that. And you
mentioned Kane before. I completely forgot to mention that. I mean,
that's through a spinner and the works to what we
(02:45):
were planning throughout the series obviously, but that's just another
sign of it, the way we got on with the job.
And this is obviously the batting side of things. And
Henry Nichols comes in and very next thttings it gets
a hundred. So it just shows that the nature of
this team, the mindset kind of just parking the loss
and lords having a chat about it, of course trying
to learn, looking at some things we can roof, but
(03:07):
at the same time not reinventing the wheel and then
look what we saw at the Oval, in the here
train Bridge in a couple of great victories.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Can you talk to me about Nathan Smith. This felt
like a coming of age series for him, would you agree?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Oh? Absolutely, yeah. He went to another level, not only
in his execution, which comes down to your skill, but
the consistency in that. And I think you can go
also back to the Island Test in Belfast that we
played before the series, where he got five wickets in
the first innings and I think with second ball, maybe
(03:40):
third ball, he got a wicket and you just saw
this really tight line with some late swing and you
just thought, man, he's on At the moment. You wonder
if it's for the over or the spell, or the
day or whatever it is. But he has continued at
four Test matches now and so happy for him and
rightly so. He was our player of the series, voted
by Brendan McCallum.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
The depth and the bowling stocks obviously Nathan Smith, but
then you consider Kyle Jamison didn't play the last Test,
Matt Henry was injured for the first one, didn't play
the last plead technique obviously got injured and was ruled
out through concussion and Zach Folks comes in. I'm not
sure if I'm missing anyone else, but that the depth
that you've got in your yeah, absolutely, Jacob Duffy back
home here in New Zealand, you know, the depth that
(04:23):
you can now call on is a pace bowling arsenal.
As a bowling coach, how do you reflect on that?
Speaker 3 (04:30):
It's just so exciting. I mean, at the same time,
it's about keeping guys certain ready to go, and that
is very hard with such congested schedule nowadays with cricket,
but you know, it is what it is. That that
is not going to change. I doubt we'll be playing
least cricket, so we have to find a way to
manage all these guys. But to know that we have, honestly,
(04:51):
we have ten or eleven, twelve guys that you can
literally call on and you know that they are ready
to go because we've seen it before. Even like you said,
you know, so unfortunate and everyone's just so gutted given
recent the recent you know, injury history would be tickner,
but he got himself into the team. He was ready
to go. Another guy who performed well in Belfast against
(05:13):
Ireland got his chance in this series and he would
have been a handful on that wicket, just heading the
pitch from his high Unfortunately a border the head by
Josh ra Archer can cuss. But then you see Zach
Folks coming and doesn't miss a beat, and I think
again that's the nature of the side. We didn't panic,
you know, we felt sorry for Blea, but at the
same time we were like, yep, Zach's ready, they go here,
(05:34):
we know we're with him and picks up three crucial
wickets of each inning, so massive effort and some good
runs too, which is always helpful.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
It as indeed, just going back to the Oval Test,
I know he did it in twenty twenty two from memory,
but Tom Blundell going up to the stumps to the
pace bowlers and Matt Henry, how did that come about?
Was it a coaching crafted thing? Was it Tom Blundell himself?
Speaker 3 (05:58):
I would love to say it was all me, but yeah,
look Tom's done that before Wellington in twenty one or
twenty two, like you mentioned, and we also saw that
from the Australians. Alex Carey was unbelievable last year last
summer and the Ashes series down Under. So we've seen
it before we knew it was an opportunity to change
(06:20):
their method their style of play. You know, a couple
of their guys, especially Joe Rut and Harry Brook and others,
they like to not just dance down the wicket and
use their feet but actually just start out of their crease,
negate the chance of lbw especially with this juke'spore they
use over here nipping around a wee bit more than
(06:40):
a crooked bar at home. So by Tom coming up
like Alex Carey did, like Tom has done in the past,
it just keeps them rooted in their crease and man,
but I genuinely think if you had to pick one
moment in that Test match, maybe you could say Henery
in coourse hundred was huge and that would be as well.
Or Glenn Phillips evading an hour worth of bounces from
(07:00):
Joff Archer. That's pretty crucial. But Tom coming up getting
wickets straight away like that changed the moment in the
series you mentioned.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Obviously you did some reflecting, and cricket moves on so
incredibly quickly. I know there's a one day series coming
up in the Westerndays in a fortnight, but do you
make sure that you do celebrate these, these victories, these
milestones that are important series wins in England don't come
along too often.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
No, I was in bed early, No I am, it's
morning here. I wouldn't say that's too early, and I've
got kids, I'm well used to getting up early. But yeah,
the heads but saw this morning and I was. We
sort of lead the boys to it and they celebrate
in the appropriate manner in the hotel. I should say,
I make mention that, but you've got to You've got
(07:46):
to make the most of those. They don't come around,
as you say that often, and you know, celebrating them
as sort of makes the fifteen days previous of Test
cricket worthwhile. So yeah, the guys had fine last time,
I'm sure. But now we move on and we go
(08:06):
to the Western these We're actually a few days in
London to twitter our thumbs and then we're off to
the Western the end of this week.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Well, it's been well celebrated here and I'm sure over
the as well. Very proud of the team and the staff.
Jacob Borum, thanks to your time on news Talk Zibe
across New Zealand tonight. I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
All good, not a problem.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
For more from sports talk, listen live to news Talk
ZIB from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Sports Talk podcast with Dancy Waldegrave
from news Talk.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
ZEDB, continuing our reflections on the Black Camps victory against
England and what a victory it was. And you don't
want to single out bowlers or batters, but you know,
we've got the bowling coach, Jacob or I'm standing by,
so I think we're going to lean towards the bowlers. Jacob,
thank you so much for joining us so early morning
(00:31):
out of Nottingham. I appreciate your time with us here
on newstalk ZBB.
Speaker 3 (00:36):
Not a problem.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Well the morning after you must be just absolutely thrilled
with the way that your bowling arsenal came together and
of course of course the batters as well, but how
the bowlers managed to get this team towards victory on
day five.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Yeah, look the victory. So it was amazing, and you know,
I sort of discussed it with a few of the
boys last night and reminisced if you liked immediately, and
it was it sort of sunk in quite quickly what
we'd achieved, and then we thought, how did we do that?
You know, and I don't mean that from an initial
defeatus point of view. But you know, from losing that
(01:13):
first test and then the drama and turmoil around that
English side, we sort of just rolled our sleeves up
and got on with our business and it was you know,
I thought in the second and third test we were
just so clinical, so organized, and so specific in what
we were trying to do. Not that we went at
Lord's but it's the execution part that is a difficult bit.
(01:35):
And you know, we just went about our work and
I'm so proud that we just stuck to our task.
We didn't go looking and searching, and obviously the reward
at the end of the day as the series victory,
it is.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
Indeed, you mentioned the distractions and obviously Cain retiring was
another one to throw on the mix in England's turmoil.
But did it how much did it show the resilience
I guess of this team. You know that we've seen
over a number of years now, But just to park
all of that and go back to work.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
It's massive, and I actually think it's probably a little
bit uns a weave it. You know, we get talked
about for being the sum of all parts, and you know,
we punch about our weight and you know, underdogs and
all this sort of stuff that we hear a lot of,
specially at ICC tournaments. You know, we'll make a semi
final final and that are New Zealand's overachieved. Again, It's like, well,
hang on, at what point does that tag actually change
(02:25):
into this is a bloody good side And as you
point about the resilience, the relentless nature of it, like
that's actually a skill in itself, and I think New
Zealanders should be proud of that fight as much as anything.
We have terribly skilled players, you know that. And you
mentioned Kane before. I completely forgot to mention that. I mean,
that's through a spinner and the works to what we
(02:45):
were planning throughout the series obviously, but that's just another
sign of it, the way we got on with the job.
And this is obviously the batting side of things. And
Henry Nichols comes in and very next thttings it gets
a hundred. So it just shows that the nature of
this team, the mindset kind of just parking the loss
and lords having a chat about it, of course trying
to learn, looking at some things we can roof, but
(03:07):
at the same time not reinventing the wheel and then
look what we saw at the Oval, in the here
train Bridge in a couple of great victories.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Can you talk to me about Nathan Smith. This felt
like a coming of age series for him, would you agree?
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Oh? Absolutely, yeah. He went to another level, not only
in his execution, which comes down to your skill, but
the consistency in that. And I think you can go
also back to the Island Test in Belfast that we
played before the series, where he got five wickets in
the first innings and I think with second ball, maybe
(03:40):
third ball, he got a wicket and you just saw
this really tight line with some late swing and you
just thought, man, he's on At the moment. You wonder
if it's for the over or the spell, or the
day or whatever it is. But he has continued at
four Test matches now and so happy for him and
rightly so. He was our player of the series, voted
by Brendan McCallum.
Speaker 2 (04:02):
The depth and the bowling stocks obviously Nathan Smith, but
then you consider Kyle Jamison didn't play the last Test,
Matt Henry was injured for the first one, didn't play
the last plead technique obviously got injured and was ruled
out through concussion and Zach Folks comes in. I'm not
sure if I'm missing anyone else, but that the depth
that you've got in your yeah, absolutely, Jacob Duffy back
home here in New Zealand, you know, the depth that
(04:23):
you can now call on is a pace bowling arsenal.
As a bowling coach, how do you reflect on that?
Speaker 3 (04:30):
It's just so exciting. I mean, at the same time,
it's about keeping guys certain ready to go, and that
is very hard with such congested schedule nowadays with cricket,
but you know, it is what it is. That that
is not going to change. I doubt we'll be playing
least cricket, so we have to find a way to
manage all these guys. But to know that we have, honestly,
(04:51):
we have ten or eleven, twelve guys that you can
literally call on and you know that they are ready
to go because we've seen it before. Even like you said,
you know, so unfortunate and everyone's just so gutted given
recent the recent you know, injury history would be tickner,
but he got himself into the team. He was ready
to go. Another guy who performed well in Belfast against
(05:13):
Ireland got his chance in this series and he would
have been a handful on that wicket, just heading the
pitch from his high Unfortunately a border the head by
Josh ra Archer can cuss. But then you see Zach
Folks coming and doesn't miss a beat, and I think
again that's the nature of the side. We didn't panic,
you know, we felt sorry for Blea, but at the
same time we were like, yep, Zach's ready, they go here,
(05:34):
we know we're with him and picks up three crucial
wickets of each inning, so massive effort and some good
runs too, which is always helpful.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
It as indeed, just going back to the Oval Test,
I know he did it in twenty twenty two from memory,
but Tom Blundell going up to the stumps to the
pace bowlers and Matt Henry, how did that come about?
Was it a coaching crafted thing? Was it Tom Blundell himself?
Speaker 3 (05:58):
I would love to say it was all me, but yeah,
look Tom's done that before Wellington in twenty one or
twenty two, like you mentioned, and we also saw that
from the Australians. Alex Carey was unbelievable last year last
summer and the Ashes series down Under. So we've seen
it before we knew it was an opportunity to change
(06:20):
their method their style of play. You know, a couple
of their guys, especially Joe Rut and Harry Brook and others,
they like to not just dance down the wicket and
use their feet but actually just start out of their crease,
negate the chance of lbw especially with this juke'spore they
use over here nipping around a wee bit more than
(06:40):
a crooked bar at home. So by Tom coming up
like Alex Carey did, like Tom has done in the past,
it just keeps them rooted in their crease and man,
but I genuinely think if you had to pick one
moment in that Test match, maybe you could say Henery
in coourse hundred was huge and that would be as well.
Or Glenn Phillips evading an hour worth of bounces from
(07:00):
Joff Archer. That's pretty crucial. But Tom coming up getting
wickets straight away like that changed the moment in the
series you mentioned.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Obviously you did some reflecting, and cricket moves on so
incredibly quickly. I know there's a one day series coming
up in the Westerndays in a fortnight, but do you
make sure that you do celebrate these, these victories, these
milestones that are important series wins in England don't come
along too often.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
No, I was in bed early, No I am, it's
morning here. I wouldn't say that's too early, and I've
got kids, I'm well used to getting up early. But yeah,
the heads but saw this morning and I was. We
sort of lead the boys to it and they celebrate
in the appropriate manner in the hotel. I should say,
I make mention that, but you've got to You've got
(07:46):
to make the most of those. They don't come around,
as you say that often, and you know, celebrating them
as sort of makes the fifteen days previous of Test
cricket worthwhile. So yeah, the guys had fine last time,
I'm sure. But now we move on and we go
(08:06):
to the Western these We're actually a few days in
London to twitter our thumbs and then we're off to
the Western the end of this week.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Well, it's been well celebrated here and I'm sure over
the as well. Very proud of the team and the staff.
Jacob Borum, thanks to your time on news Talk Zibe
across New Zealand tonight. I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
All good, not a problem.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
For more from sports talk, listen live to news Talk
ZIB from seven pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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