January 26, 2025 • 16 mins
Security software used widely by retail staff is in the spotlight after an incident involving a former Green MP.
Golriz Ghahraman quit politics last year after being caught shoplifting from boutique fashion stores, and news emerged earlier this month suggesting she had done it again at a PakNSave supermarket.
But the former MP did not steal anything, and the store never reported the case to Police – yet as the incident was logged in the Auror security system, Police were able to access it, and attempted to use it in the court case against Ghahraman.
NZ Herald senior writer David Fisher has been looking into the case, and the scope of Auror, and joins us now on The Front Page.
Follow The Front Page on iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
You can read more about this and other stories in the New Zealand Herald, online at nzherald.co.nz, or tune in to news bulletins across the NZME network.
Host: Chelsea Daniels
Sound Engineer/Producer: Richard Martin
Producer: Ethan Sills
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Kiota.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a
daily podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Presented by the New Zealand Herald.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Securities software used widely by retail staff, as in the Spotlight.
After an incident involving a former Green MP Goalriz Gutaman
quick Politics last year after being caught shoplifting from boutique
fashion stores, and news emerged earlier this month suggesting she
had done it again at a Pack and Save supermarket.
(00:39):
But the former MP did not steal anything and the
store never reported the case to the police. Yet as
the incident was logged in the aura's security system, police
were able to access it and attempted to use it
in the court case against gutamann.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Enzed Heralden.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
You're writer David Fisher has been looking into the case
and the scope of AURA software and joins us now
on the front Page.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
David, can you.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Give us an overview of what happened between Guaman and
the staff at the Royal Oak Pack and Save last year.
Speaker 3 (01:21):
So on October twelve last year, the day before Gora's
Garriman was due to appeal her sentence for shoplifting at
the High Court, she was at the Pack and Save
Supermarket in Royal Oak doing some shopping, and as she
was walking about the store, she was placing items in
(01:42):
her shopping trolley and also into a tote bag.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
Sitting in a shopping trolley.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
When I'd say tote bag, I mean one of these
ubiquitous not plastic any more type bags that we will
take shopping or carthouse shopping around and stop both store
security she was asked to empty her bags and she
did that. At that stage, she wasn't near the checkout,
(02:10):
she hadn't approached the checkout. She was still going about
doing her shopping. Security staff appear to be concerned about
the manner in which she was doing her shopping and
that led to them asking her to empty her bags. Now,
what we know happened after that is that the security
(02:31):
staff used a platform called Aura through which to enter
details of what they considered to be a retail crime incident.
What it does is it links retailers details get entered
into the system of retail crime incident and it allows
(02:54):
retailers to match incident with incident so that it improves
the level of knowledge and the picture that they have
across the retail space as to what crimes occurring there.
They also have an option to report it to police
so that it then becomes visible to police, Which is
not to say that police don't have visibility across the
(03:15):
AURA platform anyway.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
They do.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
Auras styles their partnership of New Zealand Police is one
of partnership, and I have a contract between AURA and
New Zealand Police that talks about how close that partnership is.
It includes having New Zealand Police talk to other companies
or other police forces about the benefits of the AURA platform.
So it was Goras Garaman's details, including a name being
(03:40):
entered into this crime platform, that then came to the
attention of police the day after her appeal court hearing
October fourteen. Police have told us there were officers going
through the huge number of reports that are made from
retailers and among those reports was the one that was
ident find involving garment. What I understand happened at that
(04:03):
point is that those officers or that officer that was
going through the shoplifting reports then alerted the detective senior
sergeant who was overseeing the inquiry into garam and shoplifting
from hogh End retail stores and as a result of
that officer becoming aware of it, he sought to raise
(04:24):
it with the High Court as a matter that should
be considered as part of a appeal, but he was
unsuccessful in doing so. Garaman was also unsuccessful in her appeal.
So those are the events that we understand took place.
And as we've seen over the last week or so,
this blew up again. But if chatter going around found
(04:44):
its way out through Auckland restauranteur Leo Malloy and a
bit of chat on a social media a little red
blog site as well, which brought it to the public attention.
And here we are a week down the track with
a lot of people with a lot of questions about
what AURA does. Here's the question, how much access do
(05:05):
police have and can they look at everything or any
camera anytime any shop in New Zealand that is using AURA.
Speaker 5 (05:12):
No, they can't, So I think you know, we aren't cameras,
We're not a surveillance system. Quite simply, retailers choose to
make the crimes that they witness in their stores visible
to police and then it's up to police to determine
how they use it information to investigate further and solve
more crime. So it's a way for to provide information,
including evidence like video, to police more efficiently. It's we're
(05:35):
just modernizing what's always happened, but rather than paper files
and USB sticks, we're making it digital much faster for
both sides.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yeah, so she's not been charged, has she?
Speaker 2 (05:50):
So despite nothing really happening in this case was filed
in the Aura software used by food Stuffs which owns
pack and say, can you explain what Aura actually is?
It's a New Zealand based company, right, that's right?
Speaker 4 (06:02):
Or is an incredible New Zealand success story.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Actually it launched in twenty twelve with the idea that
it would create a platform that would link retailers. One
of its pictures that I've said, talk about or seen
executives that the company talk about is that their technology
removes anonymity, and it does so by logging incidents of
retail crime concern and storing them in a database. It's
(06:28):
got incredible capabilities or as network. They're always very quick
to say that they don't do live facial recognition, but
they do have a facial recognition capability within their system.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
I understand.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
But information is also logged about what people wear, what
tattoos they might have, other distinctive characterizing features. Names can
be included. One of the capabilities that AURA has is
automatic number plate recognition. It will also log all of
those details. So when you drive into a supermarket car park,
(07:02):
your number plate has been captured, it can be tracked
as to where it's been in other areas that also
are covered by the URA network. And remember that's ninety
percent or more of New Zealand retail spaces. So a
very very powerful tool, and it can link through that
automatic license plate recognition the individuals that are associated with
(07:24):
that vehicle and who their accomplices might be. So you
get this extraordinary picture of who the individuals are that
are plaguing supermarkets or drive offs at petrol stations, or
all the issues that retailers face when the criminal element
decides that they able to parasite on their good work
and have something for nothing.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
What about privacy though, fesh I see there's been some
concerns over number plate scanning and privacy issues in Australia
for example.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Yes, concerns in Australia and concerns here too. Privacy for
a system like AURA was always going to increase as
it went on. The longer it goes on, the better
its systems get, the more information it harvests, the more
places it harvests information from, and the better it gets
at matching that information, or is stated aim of taking
(08:28):
anonymity away as a real red flag for those that
do have these privacy concerns. You know, we need to
remember here too that this is a network that created
for retailer's purposes, but is also.
Speaker 4 (08:45):
Used to a huge degree by police.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
We know that in the past police have misused the
system when we were subject to COVID lockdowns. You may
recall that there was a hunt on for women that
were believed to have breached the border in and headed
into North and I did some reporting around that and
discovered that police had invented crimes so as to access
(09:09):
or of systems in ways that they would not have
been able to so that they could track those women.
We know, then, from the subsequent police audit that was
done as a result of the discovery that police misused
the system, that it wasn't the only time that.
Speaker 6 (09:22):
Police had misused the system. The guardrails that have been
put in place around police using the system were all
so horribly inadequate. There'd be no real privacy assessment that
had been done or enacted. And that was the Australian
experience as well. The Australian Federal Police had signed on
and worked to exploit the system without having carried out
any sort of a privacy assessment. And this is a
(09:45):
real concern when we have a really strongly diminishing private
space in the country, that we have systems and networks
like this become increasingly powerful. I'd remember a conversation I
had with somebody who worked for one our intelligence agencies,
and that individual had said to me, with a real
(10:05):
hunger in their voice, if only we could get access
to what Google has, And they had said to me,
private surveillance is something that should be a far greater
concern to the public than government surveillance. Now, of course
they would say that I have a view, having covered
a number of intelligence agency breaches, that we should always
(10:26):
be concerned about what the government's doing with our information.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
But it's a good point.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Private companies have a high degree of freedom when it
comes to developing and implementing these types of systems.
Speaker 4 (10:38):
It's an issue.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Which has been picked up by the officer of the
Privacy Commissioner in New Zealand. They currently have work underway
on what's called a biometric code and what they mean
by a biometric code is a set of rules for
anyone that's gathering identifying information about an individual. That can
be information is simp as having CCTV of how people walk,
(11:03):
and if you're using how people walk as a means
to track them through multiple CCTV cameras, that makes a
biometric information. That's the sort of information that the Privacy
Commissioner is looking at putting some pretty strict rules around.
Speaker 7 (11:23):
An AORA spokesperson said Australian Federal Police carried out a
full privacy assessment of AURA in twenty twenty three, which
gave them comfort to continue using the software. AURA is
committed to empowering retailers and law enforcement to improve public
safety and keep our community safe. Or are frequently engages
(11:43):
with regulators and has done so for more than a decade.
AURA will continue to work with a New Zealand Privacy commission.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
It sounds like this technology is what is one of
those instances where our information and our likeness and the
way we walk and our faces are being captured and
we just have to trust in the authorities that it's
not going to be used for nefarious purposes. Do you
think that there are enough of those kind of balances
in place for it not to fall into the wrong hands.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Well, it's always difficult when you're talking about private companies
because we have a degree of oversight of how government
agency responds through the way that we cast our votes,
the decisions that government ministers will make, and the things
that government agencies will put in place, And there's a
general public good.
Speaker 4 (12:35):
That lies underneath that.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
For private companies, and I'm not talking about or specifically here,
companies would very much like to do things that are
in the public good, but making money is what they're
there for. You know, they have to return some form
of benefit to their investors, and so the normal rules
don't necessarily apply. There are systems in place like the
Office of the Prison they commissioner to say to these needs, Hey,
(13:00):
we have a privacy law. We'd like to run a
ruler over you as to how you comply with it.
But technology increases a pace. The development that happens within
companies like Aura that also happens at a rapid pace,
and regulators need to work really really hard to keep
up with that and quite possibly need more funding, need
(13:21):
more resource, need more.
Speaker 4 (13:22):
Expertise to do that.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I asked the Privacy Commissioner and Police about a year ago,
do you know how many cameras are connected to the
AURA system?
Speaker 4 (13:31):
Neither of them.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
The police have now done a privacy assessment around their
interaction with AURA, or they've had AURA do their privacy assessment.
I dare say things have changed a huge amount since
when that was done and where we are now to
have the AURA system covering ninety percent of New Zealand
retail spaces over the course of really only be going
(13:53):
for about ten years or so, it's an incredible advance
and I would argue that every incremental increase in the
ability to surveil the public really gives you a new
set of metrics that you need to apply to the
rules that we have in place for our society. It's
ninety percent here in New Zealand, fifty percent of Australian
retail places covered and booming success in America's Don't get
(14:15):
me wrong. From a startup perspective, this company has done
incredibly well. Twenty twenty one, they were valued around thirty
million dollars. The Australian Financial Review last year valued them
around five hundred million dollars. That's a meteoric rise. And
making sure that you're doing all the things that you
need to do during a incredible surge of growth like
(14:36):
that happening, that's a difficult thing for a company.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
To get a handle on.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I'd like to see them be more directly open with
the public about what they're gathering and what they're doing
with it. I'd like to see a government more proactive
in letting people know things like, for example, you can
go to NZTA and you can say I don't want
my name and address associated with my license plate for
(15:01):
companies like Ora to have access to there's a degree
of choice that the public has about how much we
buy or buy out of this, but there is not
much information there to make the public aware. We need
far far more assertive regulation from the regulator, far more
information coming out to the public, and we need Ora
to be proactively more engaging with the public around this
(15:21):
and really police, you know, police will be the ones
I would think out of any agency that makes the
greatest use of this technology. We need from police a
huge amount of openness around how this is being used
and police right from the outset of discussions that I've
(15:43):
had that other media have had with them around their
use of AURA have not been anywhere near as open
as they should have been.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Thanks for joining us, David, Thanks Chelsea.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
can read more about today's and extensive news coverage at
enzdherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is produced
by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also a
sound engineer.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you
get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look
behind the headlines.
Kiota.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a
daily podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Presented by the New Zealand Herald.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Securities software used widely by retail staff, as in the Spotlight.
After an incident involving a former Green MP Goalriz Gutaman
quick Politics last year after being caught shoplifting from boutique
fashion stores, and news emerged earlier this month suggesting she
had done it again at a Pack and Save supermarket.
(00:39):
But the former MP did not steal anything and the
store never reported the case to the police. Yet as
the incident was logged in the aura's security system, police
were able to access it and attempted to use it
in the court case against gutamann.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Enzed Heralden.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
You're writer David Fisher has been looking into the case
and the scope of AURA software and joins us now
on the front Page.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
David, can you.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Give us an overview of what happened between Guaman and
the staff at the Royal Oak Pack and Save last year.
Speaker 3 (01:21):
So on October twelve last year, the day before Gora's
Garriman was due to appeal her sentence for shoplifting at
the High Court, she was at the Pack and Save
Supermarket in Royal Oak doing some shopping, and as she
was walking about the store, she was placing items in
(01:42):
her shopping trolley and also into a tote bag.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
Sitting in a shopping trolley.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
When I'd say tote bag, I mean one of these
ubiquitous not plastic any more type bags that we will
take shopping or carthouse shopping around and stop both store
security she was asked to empty her bags and she
did that. At that stage, she wasn't near the checkout,
(02:10):
she hadn't approached the checkout. She was still going about
doing her shopping. Security staff appear to be concerned about
the manner in which she was doing her shopping and
that led to them asking her to empty her bags. Now,
what we know happened after that is that the security
(02:31):
staff used a platform called Aura through which to enter
details of what they considered to be a retail crime incident.
What it does is it links retailers details get entered
into the system of retail crime incident and it allows
(02:54):
retailers to match incident with incident so that it improves
the level of knowledge and the picture that they have
across the retail space as to what crimes occurring there.
They also have an option to report it to police
so that it then becomes visible to police, Which is
not to say that police don't have visibility across the
(03:15):
AURA platform anyway.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
They do.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
Auras styles their partnership of New Zealand Police is one
of partnership, and I have a contract between AURA and
New Zealand Police that talks about how close that partnership is.
It includes having New Zealand Police talk to other companies
or other police forces about the benefits of the AURA platform.
So it was Goras Garaman's details, including a name being
(03:40):
entered into this crime platform, that then came to the
attention of police the day after her appeal court hearing
October fourteen. Police have told us there were officers going
through the huge number of reports that are made from
retailers and among those reports was the one that was
ident find involving garment. What I understand happened at that
(04:03):
point is that those officers or that officer that was
going through the shoplifting reports then alerted the detective senior
sergeant who was overseeing the inquiry into garam and shoplifting
from hogh End retail stores and as a result of
that officer becoming aware of it, he sought to raise
(04:24):
it with the High Court as a matter that should
be considered as part of a appeal, but he was
unsuccessful in doing so. Garaman was also unsuccessful in her appeal.
So those are the events that we understand took place.
And as we've seen over the last week or so,
this blew up again. But if chatter going around found
(04:44):
its way out through Auckland restauranteur Leo Malloy and a
bit of chat on a social media a little red
blog site as well, which brought it to the public attention.
And here we are a week down the track with
a lot of people with a lot of questions about
what AURA does. Here's the question, how much access do
(05:05):
police have and can they look at everything or any
camera anytime any shop in New Zealand that is using AURA.
Speaker 5 (05:12):
No, they can't, So I think you know, we aren't cameras,
We're not a surveillance system. Quite simply, retailers choose to
make the crimes that they witness in their stores visible
to police and then it's up to police to determine
how they use it information to investigate further and solve
more crime. So it's a way for to provide information,
including evidence like video, to police more efficiently. It's we're
(05:35):
just modernizing what's always happened, but rather than paper files
and USB sticks, we're making it digital much faster for
both sides.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yeah, so she's not been charged, has she?
Speaker 2 (05:50):
So despite nothing really happening in this case was filed
in the Aura software used by food Stuffs which owns
pack and say, can you explain what Aura actually is?
It's a New Zealand based company, right, that's right?
Speaker 4 (06:02):
Or is an incredible New Zealand success story.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
Actually it launched in twenty twelve with the idea that
it would create a platform that would link retailers. One
of its pictures that I've said, talk about or seen
executives that the company talk about is that their technology
removes anonymity, and it does so by logging incidents of
retail crime concern and storing them in a database. It's
(06:28):
got incredible capabilities or as network. They're always very quick
to say that they don't do live facial recognition, but
they do have a facial recognition capability within their system.
Speaker 4 (06:41):
I understand.
Speaker 3 (06:42):
But information is also logged about what people wear, what
tattoos they might have, other distinctive characterizing features. Names can
be included. One of the capabilities that AURA has is
automatic number plate recognition. It will also log all of
those details. So when you drive into a supermarket car park,
(07:02):
your number plate has been captured, it can be tracked
as to where it's been in other areas that also
are covered by the URA network. And remember that's ninety
percent or more of New Zealand retail spaces. So a
very very powerful tool, and it can link through that
automatic license plate recognition the individuals that are associated with
(07:24):
that vehicle and who their accomplices might be. So you
get this extraordinary picture of who the individuals are that
are plaguing supermarkets or drive offs at petrol stations, or
all the issues that retailers face when the criminal element
decides that they able to parasite on their good work
and have something for nothing.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
What about privacy though, fesh I see there's been some
concerns over number plate scanning and privacy issues in Australia
for example.
Speaker 3 (08:05):
Yes, concerns in Australia and concerns here too. Privacy for
a system like AURA was always going to increase as
it went on. The longer it goes on, the better
its systems get, the more information it harvests, the more
places it harvests information from, and the better it gets
at matching that information, or is stated aim of taking
(08:28):
anonymity away as a real red flag for those that
do have these privacy concerns. You know, we need to
remember here too that this is a network that created
for retailer's purposes, but is also.
Speaker 4 (08:45):
Used to a huge degree by police.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
We know that in the past police have misused the
system when we were subject to COVID lockdowns. You may
recall that there was a hunt on for women that
were believed to have breached the border in and headed
into North and I did some reporting around that and
discovered that police had invented crimes so as to access
(09:09):
or of systems in ways that they would not have
been able to so that they could track those women.
We know, then, from the subsequent police audit that was
done as a result of the discovery that police misused
the system, that it wasn't the only time that.
Speaker 6 (09:22):
Police had misused the system. The guardrails that have been
put in place around police using the system were all
so horribly inadequate. There'd be no real privacy assessment that
had been done or enacted. And that was the Australian
experience as well. The Australian Federal Police had signed on
and worked to exploit the system without having carried out
any sort of a privacy assessment. And this is a
(09:45):
real concern when we have a really strongly diminishing private
space in the country, that we have systems and networks
like this become increasingly powerful. I'd remember a conversation I
had with somebody who worked for one our intelligence agencies,
and that individual had said to me, with a real
(10:05):
hunger in their voice, if only we could get access
to what Google has, And they had said to me,
private surveillance is something that should be a far greater
concern to the public than government surveillance. Now, of course
they would say that I have a view, having covered
a number of intelligence agency breaches, that we should always
(10:26):
be concerned about what the government's doing with our information.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
But it's a good point.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Private companies have a high degree of freedom when it
comes to developing and implementing these types of systems.
Speaker 4 (10:38):
It's an issue.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Which has been picked up by the officer of the
Privacy Commissioner in New Zealand. They currently have work underway
on what's called a biometric code and what they mean
by a biometric code is a set of rules for
anyone that's gathering identifying information about an individual. That can
be information is simp as having CCTV of how people walk,
(11:03):
and if you're using how people walk as a means
to track them through multiple CCTV cameras, that makes a
biometric information. That's the sort of information that the Privacy
Commissioner is looking at putting some pretty strict rules around.
Speaker 7 (11:23):
An AORA spokesperson said Australian Federal Police carried out a
full privacy assessment of AURA in twenty twenty three, which
gave them comfort to continue using the software. AURA is
committed to empowering retailers and law enforcement to improve public
safety and keep our community safe. Or are frequently engages
(11:43):
with regulators and has done so for more than a decade.
AURA will continue to work with a New Zealand Privacy commission.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
It sounds like this technology is what is one of
those instances where our information and our likeness and the
way we walk and our faces are being captured and
we just have to trust in the authorities that it's
not going to be used for nefarious purposes. Do you
think that there are enough of those kind of balances
in place for it not to fall into the wrong hands.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Well, it's always difficult when you're talking about private companies
because we have a degree of oversight of how government
agency responds through the way that we cast our votes,
the decisions that government ministers will make, and the things
that government agencies will put in place, And there's a
general public good.
Speaker 4 (12:35):
That lies underneath that.
Speaker 3 (12:37):
For private companies, and I'm not talking about or specifically here,
companies would very much like to do things that are
in the public good, but making money is what they're
there for. You know, they have to return some form
of benefit to their investors, and so the normal rules
don't necessarily apply. There are systems in place like the
Office of the Prison they commissioner to say to these needs, Hey,
(13:00):
we have a privacy law. We'd like to run a
ruler over you as to how you comply with it.
But technology increases a pace. The development that happens within
companies like Aura that also happens at a rapid pace,
and regulators need to work really really hard to keep
up with that and quite possibly need more funding, need
(13:21):
more resource, need more.
Speaker 4 (13:22):
Expertise to do that.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I asked the Privacy Commissioner and Police about a year ago,
do you know how many cameras are connected to the
AURA system?
Speaker 4 (13:31):
Neither of them.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
The police have now done a privacy assessment around their
interaction with AURA, or they've had AURA do their privacy assessment.
I dare say things have changed a huge amount since
when that was done and where we are now to
have the AURA system covering ninety percent of New Zealand
retail spaces over the course of really only be going
(13:53):
for about ten years or so, it's an incredible advance
and I would argue that every incremental increase in the
ability to surveil the public really gives you a new
set of metrics that you need to apply to the
rules that we have in place for our society. It's
ninety percent here in New Zealand, fifty percent of Australian
retail places covered and booming success in America's Don't get
(14:15):
me wrong. From a startup perspective, this company has done
incredibly well. Twenty twenty one, they were valued around thirty
million dollars. The Australian Financial Review last year valued them
around five hundred million dollars. That's a meteoric rise. And
making sure that you're doing all the things that you
need to do during a incredible surge of growth like
(14:36):
that happening, that's a difficult thing for a company.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
To get a handle on.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I'd like to see them be more directly open with
the public about what they're gathering and what they're doing
with it. I'd like to see a government more proactive
in letting people know things like, for example, you can
go to NZTA and you can say I don't want
my name and address associated with my license plate for
(15:01):
companies like Ora to have access to there's a degree
of choice that the public has about how much we
buy or buy out of this, but there is not
much information there to make the public aware. We need
far far more assertive regulation from the regulator, far more
information coming out to the public, and we need Ora
to be proactively more engaging with the public around this
(15:21):
and really police, you know, police will be the ones
I would think out of any agency that makes the
greatest use of this technology. We need from police a
huge amount of openness around how this is being used
and police right from the outset of discussions that I've
(15:43):
had that other media have had with them around their
use of AURA have not been anywhere near as open
as they should have been.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Thanks for joining us, David, Thanks Chelsea.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
can read more about today's and extensive news coverage at
enzdherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is produced
by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also a
sound engineer.
Speaker 1 (16:11):
I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Speaker 2 (16:14):
Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you
get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look
behind the headlines.
Popular Podcasts
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton tackle the biggest stories in news, politics and current events with intelligence and humor. From the border crisis, to the madness of cancel culture and far-left missteps, Clay and Buck guide listeners through the latest headlines and hot topics with fun and entertaining conversations and opinions.