Society is always under pressure to keep up – given the world around us is in a constant state of change.
Our education sector is no different.
Education officials are attempting to crack down on the use of artificial intelligence in NCEA exams, after a rise in substantiated breaches last year.
It’s an extra challenge for schools on top of other issues that have emerged since Covid – like a decline in students’ mental health.
Today on The Front Page, Newstalk ZB education reporter Jaime Cunningham joins us to discuss the multitude of problems facing the education sector.
Follow The Front Page on iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
You can read more about this and other stories in the New Zealand Herald, online at nzherald.co.nz, or tune in to news bulletins across the NZME network.
Host: Chelsea Daniels
Sound Engineer/Producer: Richard Martin
Producer: Ethan Sills
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hilda.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a
daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Society is
always under pressure to keep up. Given the world around
us is in a constant state of change. Our education
sector is no different. Education officials are attempting to crack
(00:28):
down on the use of artificial intelligence in NCA exams
after a rise in substantiated breaches last year. It's an
extra challenge for schools on top of other issues that
have emerged since COVID, like a decline in student's mental health. Today,
on the Front Page News Talks That'd be Education reporter
Jamie Cunningham joins us to discuss the multitude of problems
(00:51):
facing our education sector. Jamie, tell me a little bit
about concerns around AI So I understand there were a
number of NCA exam breaches last year.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
So education officials are cracking down really hard on the
aius as more students are using things like chat, GPT
and other tools and it's actually flowed on to exams.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
So last year MZQA.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Investigated eight hundred and seventy six reported breaches of external assessments.
Seven hundred and thirty eight were substantiated and the total
figure is a two hundred and fifty percent increase on
the twenty nine total which was three hundred and forty five.
And I guess part of that reason is a lot
(01:42):
of aius.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
So only fifty nine last.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
Year were reported breaches of involving AI use, but authenticity
was the most common type of breach with two hundred
and nine reported cases. But now principles believe that these
type of cases also involve AI use, But it's just
I guess that balance between them that it's really hard
(02:06):
for teachers and marketers to know when the technology is
being used in exams, so it's possibly been used in
these external assessments which also involve literacy and numerousy standards now,
so they can also be or not always in an
exam setting, so it could be easier in these standards
(02:26):
to use AI and.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
Things like chat GPT.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Right, what do these AI breaches look like? So what
are these kids actually using it for?
Speaker 4 (02:35):
Well, it's different for each student, and normally it's something
like putting a question into a software like chat, GPT
or another technology platform and asking it to write an
essay for them or googling and helping.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
Someone else's work.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
So that's where I guess that authenticity can get brought
out in the AI use because a lot of that
is just copying house's work, and so that obviously can
be AI when a temology has come up with this
essay or answered all these questions in an exam for them.
So it's hard to know. And that's what ENZQA are
(03:20):
also trying to like figure out at the moment is
how to provide guidance on how AI can benefit education
and teachers, and how to teach these standards using the tools,
but also identifying.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
When it's being used and at the wrong times. I guess, I.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Guess the biggest problem they have sometimes is understanding where
their work begins and ends and where AI's work begins
and ends. You know, schools have sort of left it
up to teachers to decide what's okay to use AI,
when it's not okay to use use AI, and how
to use AI, and unfortunately, a lot of students sort
(04:04):
of see those as guidelines, not really hard rules in
terms of the honor code. So it's very easy for
students to see all of their classmates using AI and
think this is this is okay, this is a tool
that I'm going to have access to the rest of
my life. I might as well take advantage of it now.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Yeah, when we talk about authenticity, is that when a
kid in the class, you know, wouldn't have a clue
about how to write something about I don't know, I'm
talking from something that I did at school, but writing
an essay about the Scarlet Letter in class, for example,
and they're not able to do it, but then they
miraculously go home and come back tomorrow morning with like
an amazing essay about the Scarlet Letter and all of
its themes and pros and things like that. So is
(04:45):
that where teachers can really question it and be like,
hang on a minute.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
Yeah, that's one example, and I guess one side of things.
But I've talked to the Secondary Principles Association who they
also say that it's more challenged to identify those cases
when it's a talented student and that's someone who's produced
some really good work throughout the year and then so
it's not as questioned as much when it's used in
(05:12):
an exam. So obviously it's easier to identify when a
student has miraculously produced some piece of work that's so
different from the rest of their work throughout the year.
But it is I guess hard to know when the
AI is being used and students that I don't know
why they're using it, but they just use it in
(05:35):
an exam when possibly they don't need to, but they're
relying on another tool to help them get a better grade.
Speaker 6 (05:41):
And do the benefits of introducing digital assessments outweigh the negatives.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
What I'm thinking here is why can't we just go
back to pensil and paper exams in person with someone
watching over your shoulder making sure you're not passing notes.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
Yeah, And I guess it's a question that the whole
sector is asking themselves.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
But it's also something that ENDSQA are looking into.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
And I guess how AI can be used to help
guide students and be used as a tool before they
get to the examination process. So they're more looking at
how they can use the technology better, so it's not
relied on cheating, because it can be used as a
really useful tool that doesn't always result in cheating, but
(06:25):
it can help them learn and in that learning process,
so it doesn't seem like they're looking at turning away
from using the technology. But the benefits are not not
all there at the moment, as you can see in
these stats with the such a big increase on just
a few years before COVID.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
So it's something they're.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
Looking at, but definitely pen and paper not on their
radar at the moment.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
So I guess.
Speaker 7 (06:54):
Firstly, our kids are enrolled in Takota, which is the
New Zealand National Correspondence School. So our kids asked part
of the New Zealand Ministry of Education and doing their
learning remotely from our caravan as we travel around.
Speaker 6 (07:05):
All right, tybe, Takuda go.
Speaker 8 (07:08):
The teachers always asked you like if you want that,
like if you want to do that for school and
now then I say yes or you can say no.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Something moving on, Jamie, can you explain to me what
Takuda is.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Yeah, So Tikuda used to be known as the Correspondence School.
So this was made, you know, almost one hundred years
ago as a school for students in rural places that
were so couldn't get to a school in reasonable distance
each day, so they turned to some kind of online
(07:46):
learning and head facilities to make sure that they're getting education,
but not in I guess a stereotypical way in a classroom.
And so now Tikuta has thirty one thousand students at
the moment, it's the largest state school in New Zealand.
But it's no longer called the Correspondence School because it
(08:07):
has moved away from that model of learning that it
used to be known for. So enrollments are commonly a
range of things. So students have to meet eligibility criteria
to enroll. But this can include students who have families
living overseas or they've been referred for their engagement and
(08:28):
this may be by the Department of Corrections or odung
A Toomadi Keith. It can include young parents or people
that women that are pregnant, and it can include elite
athletes as well. So there's a really wide range of
students who are enrolled now and that's kind of why
they've moved away from being known as the Correspondence School.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yeah, homeschooling was quite a niche thing when I was younger,
but I'm also a thousand years old, but it does
sound like it's something more mainstream now.
Speaker 4 (08:59):
Hey, Yeah, and I guess that reflects in these numbers
that they've seen just exponential growth really since twenty eighteen.
They've had thirty two percent more enrollments since then, so
from twenty one thousand to thirty one thousand, and I
guess it is a niche way of schooling. And people
may say, is this due to COVID that people want
(09:22):
to learn online more, but Tikuta is pointing it more
towards just more students with mental health issues and social
anxiety really wanting a different type of education just to
help them and make sure that they're still getting some
kind of learning, but in a different way from normal.
(09:42):
So that's why they're seeing this really large growth, and
they do reckon it's believed to be partly due to COVID,
So possibly more students have realized the benefits of learning
online and really enjoy it, and that's why possibly that
there's been more students, particularly in the year nine to
(10:04):
thirteen age group as where.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
They're seeing the most growth.
Speaker 4 (10:08):
But they do teach from right from ECE to young adults,
so a really wide range of age groups there.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Yeah, and I guess if it's seeing more young people
with mental health needs than a few years ago, I
guess this is being seen as a success because these
kids would otherwise just not have gone to school.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Yeah, and that's right.
Speaker 4 (10:27):
The Tikuta chief executive, Tarena Leonard, she told me that
it's just really cool to see that these kids are
still getting some type of education because they've got that
more flexibility and they don't need to go to school
for that typical nine till three hour time slot. They
can go do some learning at six am and then
(10:48):
go do something during the day or go back to it.
And that's why it fits for those more elite athletes
as well, because there's so much more flexibility. But she
did remind me that there is fake to face contact
as well. They've normally got a learning advisor based in
the area, so it's not all online and there is
someone checking on them, so they've got that support like
(11:10):
a teacher like.
Speaker 9 (11:11):
They normally would in a classroom.
Speaker 6 (11:21):
When it comes to the elite athletes.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
Did you see the story a few weeks ago about
the homeschool kids who missed out in those medals in
their biking competition because they were homeschooled.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
Yes, yes I did, and it's easy to see how
that would happen. And I guess Tikuta is different because
it is a state school and so those kids still
get those opportunities when homeschooling is so different because it's
even more flexible than Tikuta in the online learning they provide.
(11:51):
So it's very easy to see that those opportunities would
just not be there for homeschooled kids because they're not
necessary doing the New Zealand curriculum. And I guess maybe
that's a reason behind why they don't get to get
these meddles and get the achievements that other students would.
It's a very fine line other so, yeah, there's more
(12:13):
in the education space than we think, and there's lots
of avenues for kids to do, which makes it more
complex than people I guess think it would be.
Speaker 5 (12:24):
Yea.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Governments have been talking about mental health and kids for
years now. Does it feel like a failure that families
see it as a better option just to keep their
kids at home.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
And it's hard though, because I guess it really depends
on each each child and it but it is I
guess concerning that more students are turning to these learning providers.
Of course there's several others in the country, not just
to Kuda, but it comes as those that we've got
the unice OF report that just came out last week
(12:56):
that found New Zealand has the highest suicide rate and
the OECD and so it does correlate with what we're
seeing in these trends to online learning. And it's definitely
something that people have told me in the sector that
they want to see more. You've mental health or recognition
of youth mental health in this budget and see the
(13:19):
government recognize it more. And because obviously we can't have
Takuda and other online learning providers overloaded with all these
children because it's just so so much more known than
it used to be, and so it's really time for
more to be done so that it doesn't get to
(13:39):
the point of all these children being referred because obviously
all schools in New Zealand are really struggling with resourcing
at the moment as well.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
How about if children can't speak, are unable to communicate,
you look at the parents and say, how about you
do a better job of parenting before your kid comes
to school. How about principles urge families to do more
to look after their children instead of bitching and moaning
(14:16):
about the government demanding better support for kids who are
not toilet trained at five. It is not the teacher's job.
I couldn't agree more. It absolutely is not the teacher's job.
But nor is it the taxpayer's job.
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Well.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
I so you spoke to some school principles saying they're
grappling with growing numbers of new entrants with behavior and
oral communication issues.
Speaker 6 (14:45):
What are they saying is to blame here?
Speaker 4 (14:47):
Yeah, Well, they believe that COVID, the COVID pandemic, had
a big part to play in this, along with the
increased screen time that came with lockdowns in that period.
I talked to New Zealand Principals Federation President lynn Or Tinny,
and she believes that these children that were born around
(15:07):
twenty twenty in the COVID period, they also didn't get
an ECE education like a lot of other kids would,
and that's why we're seeing that there's a bit of
a lack of communication skills. She's actually saying that some
five year olds are turning up to school with virtually
no communication skills that they can. Teachers cannot even have
(15:29):
a conversation with these new entrants because of the increased
screen time and just not enough conversation with other kids
and teachers while going through that phase from being a
newborn toddler to a new entrant at schools. So that's
become really really more frequent after COVID. It's been known
(15:55):
for a while, but it's really just heightened the whole
problem at that level.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
And what do we do about that? Yeah, well, this.
Speaker 4 (16:04):
Is the biggest issue for education at the moment is
the need for learning support funding. So learning support is
commonly known as teacher aids or people that can help
those in schools that have neurodiversity or they just cannot
learn or have trauma issues.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
It's a really wide bracket of people.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
So yeah, So the New Zealand Education Institute, which is
the primary union for teachers, they say that two point
five billion dollars in learning support funding is needed by
twenty thirty to ensure that the waitlists for learning support
can be white because they're just that overloaded at the moment.
(16:54):
And Eric Stanford, the Minister of Education, has hinted that
we can expect more funding and learning support, but we're
just not sure how much that will be and if
it will be enough, because it's from who I've talked
to in the sector.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
It's the number one problem at the moment.
Speaker 4 (17:13):
It's across the board, primary school, high school eces.
Speaker 6 (17:17):
Thanks for joining us, Jamie, awesome.
Speaker 3 (17:19):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage
at enzdherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is
produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also
our sound engineer.
Speaker 6 (17:40):
I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you
get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look
behind the headlines.
Hilda.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
I'm Chelsea Daniels and this is the Front Page, a
daily podcast presented by the New Zealand Herald. Society is
always under pressure to keep up. Given the world around
us is in a constant state of change. Our education
sector is no different. Education officials are attempting to crack
(00:28):
down on the use of artificial intelligence in NCA exams
after a rise in substantiated breaches last year. It's an
extra challenge for schools on top of other issues that
have emerged since COVID, like a decline in student's mental health. Today,
on the Front Page News Talks That'd be Education reporter
Jamie Cunningham joins us to discuss the multitude of problems
(00:51):
facing our education sector. Jamie, tell me a little bit
about concerns around AI So I understand there were a
number of NCA exam breaches last year.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
So education officials are cracking down really hard on the
aius as more students are using things like chat, GPT
and other tools and it's actually flowed on to exams.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
So last year MZQA.
Speaker 4 (01:20):
Investigated eight hundred and seventy six reported breaches of external assessments.
Seven hundred and thirty eight were substantiated and the total
figure is a two hundred and fifty percent increase on
the twenty nine total which was three hundred and forty five.
And I guess part of that reason is a lot
(01:42):
of aius.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
So only fifty nine last.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
Year were reported breaches of involving AI use, but authenticity
was the most common type of breach with two hundred
and nine reported cases. But now principles believe that these
type of cases also involve AI use, But it's just
I guess that balance between them that it's really hard
(02:06):
for teachers and marketers to know when the technology is
being used in exams, so it's possibly been used in
these external assessments which also involve literacy and numerousy standards now,
so they can also be or not always in an
exam setting, so it could be easier in these standards
(02:26):
to use AI and.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
Things like chat GPT.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Right, what do these AI breaches look like? So what
are these kids actually using it for?
Speaker 4 (02:35):
Well, it's different for each student, and normally it's something
like putting a question into a software like chat, GPT
or another technology platform and asking it to write an
essay for them or googling and helping.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
Someone else's work.
Speaker 4 (02:56):
So that's where I guess that authenticity can get brought
out in the AI use because a lot of that
is just copying house's work, and so that obviously can
be AI when a temology has come up with this
essay or answered all these questions in an exam for them.
So it's hard to know. And that's what ENZQA are
(03:20):
also trying to like figure out at the moment is
how to provide guidance on how AI can benefit education
and teachers, and how to teach these standards using the tools,
but also identifying.
Speaker 3 (03:35):
When it's being used and at the wrong times. I guess, I.
Speaker 5 (03:41):
Guess the biggest problem they have sometimes is understanding where
their work begins and ends and where AI's work begins
and ends. You know, schools have sort of left it
up to teachers to decide what's okay to use AI,
when it's not okay to use use AI, and how
to use AI, and unfortunately, a lot of students sort
(04:04):
of see those as guidelines, not really hard rules in
terms of the honor code. So it's very easy for
students to see all of their classmates using AI and
think this is this is okay, this is a tool
that I'm going to have access to the rest of
my life. I might as well take advantage of it now.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Yeah, when we talk about authenticity, is that when a
kid in the class, you know, wouldn't have a clue
about how to write something about I don't know, I'm
talking from something that I did at school, but writing
an essay about the Scarlet Letter in class, for example,
and they're not able to do it, but then they
miraculously go home and come back tomorrow morning with like
an amazing essay about the Scarlet Letter and all of
its themes and pros and things like that. So is
(04:45):
that where teachers can really question it and be like,
hang on a minute.
Speaker 4 (04:49):
Yeah, that's one example, and I guess one side of things.
But I've talked to the Secondary Principles Association who they
also say that it's more challenged to identify those cases
when it's a talented student and that's someone who's produced
some really good work throughout the year and then so
it's not as questioned as much when it's used in
(05:12):
an exam. So obviously it's easier to identify when a
student has miraculously produced some piece of work that's so
different from the rest of their work throughout the year.
But it is I guess hard to know when the
AI is being used and students that I don't know
why they're using it, but they just use it in
(05:35):
an exam when possibly they don't need to, but they're
relying on another tool to help them get a better grade.
Speaker 6 (05:41):
And do the benefits of introducing digital assessments outweigh the negatives.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
What I'm thinking here is why can't we just go
back to pensil and paper exams in person with someone
watching over your shoulder making sure you're not passing notes.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
Yeah, And I guess it's a question that the whole
sector is asking themselves.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
But it's also something that ENDSQA are looking into.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
And I guess how AI can be used to help
guide students and be used as a tool before they
get to the examination process. So they're more looking at
how they can use the technology better, so it's not
relied on cheating, because it can be used as a
really useful tool that doesn't always result in cheating, but
(06:25):
it can help them learn and in that learning process,
so it doesn't seem like they're looking at turning away
from using the technology. But the benefits are not not
all there at the moment, as you can see in
these stats with the such a big increase on just
a few years before COVID.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
So it's something they're.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
Looking at, but definitely pen and paper not on their
radar at the moment.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
So I guess.
Speaker 7 (06:54):
Firstly, our kids are enrolled in Takota, which is the
New Zealand National Correspondence School. So our kids asked part
of the New Zealand Ministry of Education and doing their
learning remotely from our caravan as we travel around.
Speaker 6 (07:05):
All right, tybe, Takuda go.
Speaker 8 (07:08):
The teachers always asked you like if you want that,
like if you want to do that for school and
now then I say yes or you can say no.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Something moving on, Jamie, can you explain to me what
Takuda is.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Yeah, So Tikuda used to be known as the Correspondence School.
So this was made, you know, almost one hundred years
ago as a school for students in rural places that
were so couldn't get to a school in reasonable distance
each day, so they turned to some kind of online
(07:46):
learning and head facilities to make sure that they're getting education,
but not in I guess a stereotypical way in a classroom.
And so now Tikuta has thirty one thousand students at
the moment, it's the largest state school in New Zealand.
But it's no longer called the Correspondence School because it
(08:07):
has moved away from that model of learning that it
used to be known for. So enrollments are commonly a
range of things. So students have to meet eligibility criteria
to enroll. But this can include students who have families
living overseas or they've been referred for their engagement and
(08:28):
this may be by the Department of Corrections or odung
A Toomadi Keith. It can include young parents or people
that women that are pregnant, and it can include elite
athletes as well. So there's a really wide range of
students who are enrolled now and that's kind of why
they've moved away from being known as the Correspondence School.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yeah, homeschooling was quite a niche thing when I was younger,
but I'm also a thousand years old, but it does
sound like it's something more mainstream now.
Speaker 4 (08:59):
Hey, Yeah, and I guess that reflects in these numbers
that they've seen just exponential growth really since twenty eighteen.
They've had thirty two percent more enrollments since then, so
from twenty one thousand to thirty one thousand, and I
guess it is a niche way of schooling. And people
may say, is this due to COVID that people want
(09:22):
to learn online more, but Tikuta is pointing it more
towards just more students with mental health issues and social
anxiety really wanting a different type of education just to
help them and make sure that they're still getting some
kind of learning, but in a different way from normal.
(09:42):
So that's why they're seeing this really large growth, and
they do reckon it's believed to be partly due to COVID,
So possibly more students have realized the benefits of learning
online and really enjoy it, and that's why possibly that
there's been more students, particularly in the year nine to
(10:04):
thirteen age group as where.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
They're seeing the most growth.
Speaker 4 (10:08):
But they do teach from right from ECE to young adults,
so a really wide range of age groups there.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
Yeah, and I guess if it's seeing more young people
with mental health needs than a few years ago, I
guess this is being seen as a success because these
kids would otherwise just not have gone to school.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Yeah, and that's right.
Speaker 4 (10:27):
The Tikuta chief executive, Tarena Leonard, she told me that
it's just really cool to see that these kids are
still getting some type of education because they've got that
more flexibility and they don't need to go to school
for that typical nine till three hour time slot. They
can go do some learning at six am and then
(10:48):
go do something during the day or go back to it.
And that's why it fits for those more elite athletes
as well, because there's so much more flexibility. But she
did remind me that there is fake to face contact
as well. They've normally got a learning advisor based in
the area, so it's not all online and there is
someone checking on them, so they've got that support like
(11:10):
a teacher like.
Speaker 9 (11:11):
They normally would in a classroom.
Speaker 6 (11:21):
When it comes to the elite athletes.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
Did you see the story a few weeks ago about
the homeschool kids who missed out in those medals in
their biking competition because they were homeschooled.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
Yes, yes I did, and it's easy to see how
that would happen. And I guess Tikuta is different because
it is a state school and so those kids still
get those opportunities when homeschooling is so different because it's
even more flexible than Tikuta in the online learning they provide.
(11:51):
So it's very easy to see that those opportunities would
just not be there for homeschooled kids because they're not
necessary doing the New Zealand curriculum. And I guess maybe
that's a reason behind why they don't get to get
these meddles and get the achievements that other students would.
It's a very fine line other so, yeah, there's more
(12:13):
in the education space than we think, and there's lots
of avenues for kids to do, which makes it more
complex than people I guess think it would be.
Speaker 5 (12:24):
Yea.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Governments have been talking about mental health and kids for
years now. Does it feel like a failure that families
see it as a better option just to keep their
kids at home.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:34):
And it's hard though, because I guess it really depends
on each each child and it but it is I
guess concerning that more students are turning to these learning providers.
Of course there's several others in the country, not just
to Kuda, but it comes as those that we've got
the unice OF report that just came out last week
(12:56):
that found New Zealand has the highest suicide rate and
the OECD and so it does correlate with what we're
seeing in these trends to online learning. And it's definitely
something that people have told me in the sector that
they want to see more. You've mental health or recognition
of youth mental health in this budget and see the
(13:19):
government recognize it more. And because obviously we can't have
Takuda and other online learning providers overloaded with all these
children because it's just so so much more known than
it used to be, and so it's really time for
more to be done so that it doesn't get to
(13:39):
the point of all these children being referred because obviously
all schools in New Zealand are really struggling with resourcing
at the moment as well.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
How about if children can't speak, are unable to communicate,
you look at the parents and say, how about you
do a better job of parenting before your kid comes
to school. How about principles urge families to do more
to look after their children instead of bitching and moaning
(14:16):
about the government demanding better support for kids who are
not toilet trained at five. It is not the teacher's job.
I couldn't agree more. It absolutely is not the teacher's job.
But nor is it the taxpayer's job.
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Well.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
I so you spoke to some school principles saying they're
grappling with growing numbers of new entrants with behavior and
oral communication issues.
Speaker 6 (14:45):
What are they saying is to blame here?
Speaker 4 (14:47):
Yeah, Well, they believe that COVID, the COVID pandemic, had
a big part to play in this, along with the
increased screen time that came with lockdowns in that period.
I talked to New Zealand Principals Federation President lynn Or Tinny,
and she believes that these children that were born around
(15:07):
twenty twenty in the COVID period, they also didn't get
an ECE education like a lot of other kids would,
and that's why we're seeing that there's a bit of
a lack of communication skills. She's actually saying that some
five year olds are turning up to school with virtually
no communication skills that they can. Teachers cannot even have
(15:29):
a conversation with these new entrants because of the increased
screen time and just not enough conversation with other kids
and teachers while going through that phase from being a
newborn toddler to a new entrant at schools. So that's
become really really more frequent after COVID. It's been known
(15:55):
for a while, but it's really just heightened the whole
problem at that level.
Speaker 6 (16:00):
And what do we do about that? Yeah, well, this.
Speaker 4 (16:04):
Is the biggest issue for education at the moment is
the need for learning support funding. So learning support is
commonly known as teacher aids or people that can help
those in schools that have neurodiversity or they just cannot
learn or have trauma issues.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
It's a really wide bracket of people.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
So yeah, So the New Zealand Education Institute, which is
the primary union for teachers, they say that two point
five billion dollars in learning support funding is needed by
twenty thirty to ensure that the waitlists for learning support
can be white because they're just that overloaded at the moment.
(16:54):
And Eric Stanford, the Minister of Education, has hinted that
we can expect more funding and learning support, but we're
just not sure how much that will be and if
it will be enough, because it's from who I've talked
to in the sector.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
It's the number one problem at the moment.
Speaker 4 (17:13):
It's across the board, primary school, high school eces.
Speaker 6 (17:17):
Thanks for joining us, Jamie, awesome.
Speaker 3 (17:19):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You
can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage
at enzdherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is
produced by Ethan Sills and Richard Martin, who is also
our sound engineer.
Speaker 6 (17:40):
I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you
get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look
behind the headlines.
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