The importance of perspective ​in mental health

In this weeks episode, Psychotherapist Kyle McDonald emphasised the critical role of perspective in maintaining mental health. ​ He explained that perspective helps individuals focus on what they can control, rather than being overwhelmed by external stressors or events beyond their influence. McDonald highlighted the importance of mindfulness and being intentional about the information we consume, especially in a world saturated with negative news. ​

Listeners shared their experiences and coping strategies, including taking breaks from social media, engaging in hobbies like fishing, and finding solace in nature. Caller Rob described how fishing allows him to disconnect from daily stressors and focus entirely on the present moment, which helps him sleep better and feel more at peace. Another listener, Yvonne, shared her journey of living with bipolar disorder and the importance of journaling and finding supportive relationships to navigate her mental health challenges.

The show also addressed the impact of global and personal tragedies on mental health. McDonald advised listeners to limit their exposure to distressing news and focus on actionable steps within their control. He likened this approach to the airplane safety rule of securing one’s own oxygen mask before assisting others, emphasising the need for self-care to effectively support others. ​

Listeners also shared stories of resilience and hope. Phil from Christchurch recounted his journey from homelessness and despair to finding a stable job, housing, and a supportive relationship. His message to others was to keep moving forward and maintain faith that circumstances can improve. ​

The episode concluded with a reminder that seeking professional help, such as therapy, is a valuable step for addressing unresolved trauma or persistent mental health struggles. ​McDonald recommended therapies like Eye Movement Desensitisation and Reprocessing (EMDR) for those dealing with stuck memories from childhood trauma. 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
You're listening to a podcast from News Talk said B.
Follow this and our wide range of podcasts now on iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Greetings and welcome. I'm Hamish Williams and you're listening to
the podcast version of The Nuts Club, a show about
mental health broadcast weekly on News Talk shd B. Each
week we talk with people about mental health experiences in
the hope that it might help you with your own.
The show is broadcast live on Sunday nights on News
Talk shad B right across New Zealand and around the world.

(00:43):
Psychotherapist Carl McDonald rejoins the show for twenty twenty six
and discusses how creating and retaining perspective is critical to
being able to maintain balance when it comes to mental health.
The insights from our audience, as well as their questions,
really helped show how valuable and at times challenging, perspective

(01:07):
can be. Let us know what you think as well
as what you learn from our chat on any of
our social media platforms. Just search for the Nutters club Z.
Come and join over one hundred and forty one thousand
fellow nutters. Let's get into this week's episode when you
have time away from your normal environment, right, your perspective

(01:29):
can sometimes change a bit, right, you know, new places,
new faces, just not doing the norm and it can
have a massively big impact on our mental health.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
Right, yeah, look, it can do. I mean they say
that one of the things about traveling is that it
makes you more mindful because all of a sudden you've
got to pay attention to everything. You know, if everything's unfamiliar,
you actually have to pay attention to it to figure
it out. One of the things that I did and
I actually haven't returned it yet, as I actually took
a complete break from social media as well, because I

(02:00):
actually really wanted to be where I was and I
haven't actually done that before. But it's been while I
us sort of close to seven weeks now my accounts
that exist, but I haven't really paid any attention and
took them off the phone. And for me, that was
about perspective, because it was about actually, what do I
want to be paying attention to on the special time
that I'm having with my family. And it wasn't my phone,

(02:21):
I can tell you that much.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
Why is it important for us to be mindful about
our perspective? Like what what part is that playing in
our day to day mental health.

Speaker 3 (02:30):
Well, it comes back to that old thing, doesn't it,
of being able to make sure that we're paying attention
to what's going in to our consciousness. You know, what's
the content, what's what's the what's the stream of consciousness
that we're allowing ourselves to have come at us, but
also what their influence is, what goes on inside us.

(02:52):
And often it can feel like we don't necessarily have
much choice, you know, we can be dragged around by
world events, by you know, by stressful events, by by
things that we're over focusing on, which of course makes
them feel bigger and more stressful for us. But often
I think we end up focusing on things that aren't
actually within our sphere of control either, I mean not

(03:14):
just the news, but actually you know, world events or
actually even things just you know, that our mind drifts
to that actually we can't have any influence over. It
might be from our own past, for instance, or things
that have happened to us in the past. And so
I think when it comes to perspective, I have to
think about it as trying to shift the horizon. You know,
if we think about the fact that actually a lot

(03:35):
of things are over the horizon, and actually what we
can pay attention to is what's just you know, have
influence over the things that we pay attention to. So
I mean it's a hard skill to do if you're
not used to it, but it does come down to
a sort of kind of applied mindfulness in a way.
But it's just actually paying attention to what we're paying
attention to.

Speaker 2 (03:54):
So when you're talking about that, there's lots of things
out there, lots of information that competes for that attention
what we pay attention to. Yeah, and you know, this
week in New Zealand, for instance, has been horrific. If
we're talking about the tragedy that's unfolded and todd on
it now, that has competed and demanded our attention, and

(04:16):
for people that are connected to that, for people who
live in the area, or any just general everyday New Zealanders,
you know, listening to the news here on ZB, reading
about it online, watching it on television, that can have
a huge effect on how we feel. And I'm sure
that there'd be very few people who have heard not

(04:37):
you know, had an emotional response to hearing that information
over the week. Then let's go on to global scale.
And we're watching on the news again tonight. And literally
when I walked into the zb news droom on the
big TVs there, it was all these pictures coming in
from CNN and BBC about what's happening in Minneapolis in

(04:58):
the States, and it just looks absolutely horrific, just down
to a tragic story about a young man who's died
from a shark attack in Sydney. Now, all of that
has come at anybody who watched the news tonight, and
it's not the first time that any of those stories
have have popped up. You know, this is this is

(05:18):
an escalating Does all of that can that have have
an effect on our on our mental health if we're
not kind of maintaining that perspective.

Speaker 3 (05:27):
Well, it can do. And I think the important thing,
first of all is to decide for ourselves whether it
does and if it does have an impact, and then
to make some choices about what we do. So I'll
give you an example. I think what happened in mung
and Nui and is horrendous and my heart really goes
out to all the people down there, not not just

(05:48):
those who have lost directly loved ones, but the community,
I mean the community is obviously shattered by it, and
understandably so I've read a little bit. I know what's happened,
and I may make some contributions to some of the
funds down there that are helping people out, because taking
action is important. But I can't real the stories about

(06:08):
the kids and the parents, so I've just chosen not
to because that's just too harrowing for me as a
parent of similar age children. I'm just I can't go there. So,
you know, I think we have to be careful about
what we get drawn into with our feelings as well,
and also to be careful to not buy into the
idea that if we don't engage or read everything or

(06:29):
be up to the minute with what's happening, that it
means anything about whether we care or not, because I
think that can be one of the hooks that we
lay out for ourselves. We have to be careful with
ourselves too, and you know, how we care and how
much we have the ability to care can be our
by our day by day.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
I've often heard it compared to like when you're on
an airplane and they say, you know, if the oxygen
drops on the roof secure your own mask first before
you help others beside you. And actually that the whole
idea being that if you can't breathe, you can't help
the other person beside you particularly easily.

Speaker 3 (07:06):
Absolutely, And you know, I mean I think one of
the things that you know, tragedies, whether they be global
or whether they be closer to home, it is that
thing too often where it does make us feel more
aware of the close connections to us, you know. So,
I mean you'll often hear people both affect. I saw
a quote from one of the people down and Teltong

(07:28):
are saying, you know, hug your kids closer, and it
is that kind of idea of like, oh yeah, life happens, right, death,
tragedy happens. Pay attention to what's in front of your
value what you have, and you know that's a perspective
shift as well.

Speaker 2 (07:41):
Okay, how do we go about maintaining our own perspective?

Speaker 4 (07:44):
Then?

Speaker 2 (07:44):
How do we actually do that in a day to
day situation.

Speaker 3 (07:47):
Well, I think one of the things that it starts
with is actually being able to pay attention to how
we're tracking in ourselves. So you know, some days we'll
have more capacity some days will have less to One
of the things that I think is really important to
keep an eye out is when we get stuck on something. So,
you know, if the particular details of tragedies or world

(08:10):
events that you find yourself just being unable to look
away from or unable to stop thinking about, that's actually
a pretty good sign that it's got under your skin
and that it may actually be worth making a bit
of an effort to step back from. Because I think
that you know that what we technically call rumination, that
like the record getting stuck because it's got a scratch

(08:30):
on it, our mind can keep replaying these things in
ways that actually can get us really stuck in a
distressed place. And also, like I said, to not buy
into the idea, whether it's from our own thoughts or
whether it's from what other people might say to us,
that if we're not paying attention, if we're not reading
the stories, if we're not up to date with what's happening,
that it means anything about whether we care. We can

(08:52):
care without deep diving into the gory details in a
way that's harmful to us.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Okay, well, I think that we've talked about, you know,
the big events that might seem you know, when I'm
talking about that, I'm talking about international news and of
course you know the kind of national tragedies that we're
going through right at the moment. What about the more
personal stuff, you know, things in our own lives, you know,
could be in our own relationships, whether that's with family, friends,

(09:21):
you know, when we have those kind of things crop
up and can sometimes feel like it's really really important
to you or you really affecting you because it's right
there in front. How do you find perspective in those
situations to be able to move forward?

Speaker 3 (09:36):
Well, again, I think perspective when it comes to really
close to home is bringing the horizon right in. So
a pretty good place to start is to take a
deep breath and look at what can I actually control
right now about what's happening, Not what I want to control,
not what I want to change, but what can I
actually have influence over. And often that will come back

(09:58):
to day to day life, it will come back to
our friends and family relationships. It might just come down
to what you eat next, but actually exercising control over
the things that you can control and bringing that horizon
right in, and so you know, it might be that
are much better focus, for instance, than global tragedies than
you know, the events in the US or DeVos or

(10:21):
wherever you might be paying attention. It might be better
just to actually pay some attention to the relationship with
your kids right now, and because you can do something
about that, to connect with the people close to you.
And it's not because it's a distraction or it's a
good idea, but actually it is something we have control over.
It is something we can do something about and potentially
even make better.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
The one I always like is being able to actually
tell people who you have interactions with, whoever that is,
whether it's in a workplace or in your community, if
you've got someone that you value or someone you thinks
just just doing a good job in life, tell them yeah, nice, Yeah,
don't don't, don't leave it till tomorrow, tell them now.

(11:02):
The reason being is that actually no one actually knows
what the hell you're thinking. And sometimes when you say
something positive, like they're just saying thank you to someone
and telling them why you value them, they have no
idea unless you actually spell it out.

Speaker 3 (11:16):
Yeah, simple legs of kindness are great, and they don't
actually have to be much bigger than thank you. You're
doing a great job. That's the thing, right that they
can actually be quite small and they in terms of effort,
but they made a lot.

Speaker 2 (11:28):
Let's go straight to the lines. We'll go to Tony, Tony,
good evening to you, Hi, Hi, how.

Speaker 5 (11:35):
Are you good evening?

Speaker 6 (11:36):
It's it's a really really great topic that you guys
are on because I think it's it really affects us all,
you know, and the amount of information we are taking
in and how it's affecting us. And I think it's
really the big thing that I took from what we
were saying was that a lot of times this information,
because it's always quite negative, and negative information tends to

(12:00):
stick harder. It's the big thing about controlling or moving
the horizon closer and showing what taking power of what
we can control, is that a lot of times this
information makes us feel very powerless. And I think it's
really good when it says, you know, focusing on what
you can control, because that gives you a little bit

(12:22):
of some semblance of power and control over your environment
and overall the n effects you know, how you perceive
things and helps you get a bit of control over
it and you knowing that anxiety and stuff like that,
because a lot of it just comes from that powerlessness
of you know, the world is falling apart around me,
you know, type of situation. So, yeah, how much to

(12:44):
consume online or with any form of social media really
or any formal media is really important in affecting our psyche?

Speaker 2 (12:53):
Yeah, absolutely, Tony. So you know, when when you're experiencing
that yourself, what is it that you do for being
able to maintain your perspective? Yeah?

Speaker 6 (13:04):
I think a lot of times before I even notice
that it's happened, I probably have to be like, there'll
probably be a series of events happening, you know, and
the like they say, when it rains, it pours, it
fits one thing, and there's the tragedy there, and then
there's another tragedy here, and there's another tragedy there, and
sometimes you have to like pause, like I said, take

(13:24):
a break from social media. That is massive because again
there's algorithms, right, So you're getting a bad piece of
information and all of a sudden, the social media is
telling you, oh, that looks like something that you're interested
in in bad news, and all of a sudden you're
being fed a series of bad news, and then all

(13:46):
you feel is, oh my god, everything around me is bad.
You know, you're not seeing they're not showing you all
the cat that was saved in the tree, or you know,
the kids that won this sports game. You know, all
of a suddenly, all you're seeing is all the negative stuff.
So I would just kind of put a pause on
the social media, all forms of media, even if it's
for you know, twenty four hours, for eight hours, because

(14:09):
it makes a big difference in trying to just recalibrate yourself.
And you're so I find that, just like you said,
just getting off social media, you'll be it's be amazed
how much it affects when you just give yourself just
even it's a twenty four hour break.

Speaker 2 (14:25):
Yeah, I mean.

Speaker 6 (14:27):
You'll be surprised how much how easily you can kind
of forget these things for a minute.

Speaker 3 (14:31):
It's fantastic what's happening. Fantastic advice. And you know, I mean,
I people know I'm a big fan of social media.
I think it has lots of value. But it's interesting
when we talk about algorithms, because actually our brain has
an algorithm. So psychologists have identified this for a long time.
It's what we call the negativity bias, and it's actually,
when you think about it, it makes sense from a

(14:51):
survival point of view. But our brains are actually hard
wired to pay attention to negative and to remember negative
and painful events more that they're more sticky than positive events.

Speaker 2 (15:03):
Why is that?

Speaker 4 (15:04):
What?

Speaker 3 (15:04):
What function is that? Performing survival? You know, if something
bad tappen, and you better pay attention because it might
kill you. And so over time, through revolution, we've tended
to be more successful in staying alive and breeding and
passing our genes on if we pay slightly more attention
to the negative and painful things than the positive things.
That's the theory anyway, and it's a pretty solid theory

(15:24):
because actually what we see in modern day humans is
that's how what throws us off a lot of the time,
is that we get flooded with negative and we pay
too much attention to the negative because of this bias.
And so actually we have to work against that quite
consciously sometimes to actually write to that bias.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
I like the idea of changing the algorithm, changing your
brains algorithm. You know, if you've been looking at all
the negative news, go and find some inspirational docos, and
I'll tell you my go to I love sports dockos.

Speaker 3 (15:56):
Oh yeah, and even about sports that I've.

Speaker 2 (15:58):
Got no interest in or no experience with, for no
other reason than a good sports docko usually is about
somebody overcoming the odds and achieving greatness for.

Speaker 3 (16:10):
Some unheard of team all of a sudden, winning the championship,
that sort of thing.

Speaker 2 (16:14):
Yeah, and it's it's incredibly uplifting and even if you're
not that big into sports, don't think of it like that.
It's the story about humans deciding to change their perspective,
usually about themselves, and then proving it to the rest
of the world with a winning score or a first
across the finish line title. They're great yarns.

Speaker 6 (16:35):
You know.

Speaker 2 (16:35):
For my partner it might sound a little bit sappy,
but I'll say it anyway. Who knows, she might even
be awake. But I honestly, and when it comes down
to the tragedies the horrors of the world, I often
just be really grateful that I have my wife to
wake up with every day. Now that that is pure
and simple, and it's just that that's bringing the horizon

(16:55):
in it is. It does help. Now, let's go back
to the lines, We'll go to Susie. Now, Susie, good
evening to you.

Speaker 7 (17:04):
You're a hampcious Kyle. I always into you. Thank you
my way, I guess, my way of dealing with life
because for a start, you go to start with yourself.

(17:29):
It's like when you throw a people or a rock
into some water. You know how it's got brings around it.

Speaker 2 (17:39):
Yes, yes, oh you're the.

Speaker 7 (17:42):
Strong one, so you can stand tall.

Speaker 5 (17:54):
And have.

Speaker 7 (17:58):
And calmed yourself first. They need to calm others around you.

Speaker 2 (18:08):
And there's something about that, Susie, isn't there, Because often
when you see that that calm person actually showing you
that that this is how you can do it, it
actually gives people someone to look to, to be able
to emulate, to be able to copy. You know, it's
hard to know how to do these things unless someone
shows you the way first.

Speaker 7 (18:27):
Absolutely, I've been for a lot and I'd like to
acknowledge the natural disaster and Mount Mongani. Also, however, you

(18:50):
have to send to yourself first before you could help
others around you, and I think that's the key.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
I agree. I think on the money that season.

Speaker 7 (19:13):
Not look uh like I really believe that if you
can look out of your being and it's really helpful.

(19:36):
And and look what's growing thinks. It's just I just
think like it's like ring as the water, Like you
throw a rock in the pole. You're the rocks that're

(19:58):
throwing in the pole. There's a little rain, and then
there could be a bigger ring, bigger ring, blah blah blah.
But first say, you've got to be okay. Yeah, and
if you're okay, then it can help other people.

Speaker 2 (20:17):
You've got it souizing. Absolutely, And that's that's what we
were sort of saying before when I made the comment
about the you know, put your own oxygen mask on
if you're on the plane. Absolutely, yeah, yeah, And I
think it's it's important because often too, you know, we
we can want to be okay. But I think it's
an important part to actually say here that just because

(20:39):
you might see that others need that doesn't mean that
you should be doing it at the sacrifice of your
own mental health. Because sometimes we feel like we need
to be strong for everybody else around us, and yet
actually we could be finding it really hard ourselves, but
we we end up trying to be the be the
tough man or the or the strong the strong wahina

(21:00):
for for others.

Speaker 3 (21:01):
We'll give too much of ourselves.

Speaker 2 (21:03):
Yeah, yep, and I think that often it's about finding
that balance, which is again finding that you've actually got
the perspective.

Speaker 3 (21:12):
Yeah, and you know you're not going to be any
use to anybody if you were yourself out. So it's
absolutely true you've got to take care of yourself first.
But it's also true that if you are feeling in
a good space, if you do feel on top of things,
it's a really great time to feel like maybe it
just time to check in with that friend who I
know is struggling, or if you do have a little
bit extra to give, it's a great time to reach
out too.

Speaker 2 (21:32):
Susie, thank you so much for your call. We are
going to take a break back soon here on the
Nutters Club.

Speaker 1 (21:39):
This is the Nutters Club thanks to New Zealand on
air on News Talks.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
That'd be Hey, welcome back to the show. So look
so far, what we're hearing from you in terms of
maintaining perspective, your experiences have been around the ideas of
taking a break from social media or just being more
conscious about actually what kind of media you are consuming Look,
I think everything in moderation, to be quite honest, you know,

(22:05):
once you've got your update and you fell on what's
happening in the use, unless there's major updates coming, does
get a bit repetitive. But don't tell anybody out in
the newsroom that we said that. That's right. And then
the other thing too, Just like SUSI was saying, you know,
looking for that person around you who's the strength for others,
you know, being able to find someone who's that, who
perhaps has got their own perspective and loarning from them.

(22:28):
I think those are really important things. And Kyle, you've
you've been sort of noticing someone who seems to have
been sharing a little bit of that and putting that
into action recently.

Speaker 3 (22:36):
Yeah, Like it was just your comment about sports documentaries.
I mean, you know, listeners of the show will both
know that both Hamish and I are different ways of
sports tragics. And I've been watching a lot of the
Australian Open, and fans of tennis will i Stan Wrinka,
the Swiss tennis player who played his whole career really
in the shadow of Roger Federer, who of course was

(22:56):
Swiss and not just the best Swiss tennis player, but
the best tennis player full stop for quite a period
of time. But he did pretty well. He won three
Grand Slams and in each of the finals he played,
he beat the number one of them to actually win
the final.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
Well done.

Speaker 3 (23:10):
And he just got knocked out of the austral And
Open last night. And his previous game in round two,
I think it was he won a five setter against
the twenty one year old, so nineteen years younger than him.

Speaker 2 (23:20):
So great.

Speaker 3 (23:21):
It was great tennis to watch and great great to
watch him sort of bow out. But I didn't realize
he has a tattoo on his arm, and I just
I really liked the quote, so I wanted to read
it out. It's from a very well known Irish author,
Samuel Beckett, and the quote has ever tried, ever failed,
no matter, try again, fail again, fail better. And I

(23:43):
just really liked it because it was actually for you
know in interviews that he's talked about it and why
he got that. It was about for him about resilience
and about no matter what happens, just keep going and
if you fail, keep going, and if you fail again,
just make sure that you're getting incrementally better that one
percent every day. I thought, no, you know, obviously this
guy knows a little bit about keeping going. You played

(24:03):
top tennis for twenty odd years and played pretty well,
so you know, and like we said, sports often has
a lot to teach us about residence.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
Well, I mean, look, the reason why people like sports
is because it imitates life in a in a kind
of you know, structured you know, sort of sense with
rules and time durations. And yet ultimately we're watching people
trying to do sort of incredible things, you know, in

(24:32):
a highly competitive environment. And it would seem that sometimes
those experiences on full display for our viewing pleasure, seem
to just find sometimes the best and what we can be.
It's not to say that those stories are limited just
to sports, to be very clear, it's just an easy
place to find them.

Speaker 3 (24:50):
Well, I think it's the thing when you get top
athletes who are all about as fit as one another,
what makes the difference, as they say, it's the top
two inches.

Speaker 2 (24:56):
Yeah, something like that. Let's go back to the lines.
I've got Maria here, Maria, good evening to you.

Speaker 8 (25:04):
It is good evening. Concerned about the life of we
seem to have from so called government agency that are
constantly lying on the phone into the office we have

(25:26):
to go. And you've got a different story of given
to you on the phone to your appointment in the office.

Speaker 2 (25:38):
Is this any one specific, Maria or just in general?

Speaker 9 (25:41):
Oh?

Speaker 8 (25:41):
Well, it's every day living and having to keep up
to date with things health and home and food and
all that medical seventy this year, and I've thought it
was an honest father, and yeah, prayers, say my prayers.

(26:10):
I'm doing the board to the Lord. But this year
I had to get an advocate to speak for me.
I'm very concerned because I don't lie, but I seem
to get the liars from these government so called workers
who are meant to be professional for for our tee

(26:31):
wee ages that are constantly lying.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
And how do things go with the advocate? Maria? Did that?
Did that help help it all? With what you're trying
to do.

Speaker 8 (26:43):
I'm just going to experience here tomorrow. But you know,
when we can speak for our sounds of one hundred
percent tweeds, which I am, I sure sheep, milk cows,
but I'm seventh this year and I seem to get
the people lying on the phone and then you get

(27:08):
it in the office you told to wait.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
Yeah, it could be really frustrating.

Speaker 8 (27:13):
You're abused for saying something. You've got to leave if
you speak out of their team. But I'm just concerned
with these people that are lying.

Speaker 2 (27:26):
Well, absolutely, Maria, And can I just say I think
that the fact that you've gone and got an advocate
in your corner is absolutely one hundred percent gold star
the right thing to be doing. Because here's the thing
about about lies and this truth, it's it's often a
lot harder when there's somebody else in the room with you,

(27:48):
you know, to actually be able to you know, say
things or or perhaps use phrases that might not be clear.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
Well, people have heard me talk about it on the
show a lot over the last few years. I mean,
I think whether it's the health system or whether it's
the income support system, advocates are incredibly important and they're
actually available, you know, if you simply google Health Advocate
Service or ACC is another one, acc Advocacy Services. There

(28:19):
are people there who literally are paid to do this work.
And the Health and Disability Commissioner also has health advocates
available who can help you and talk you through and
potentially come to appointments or find someone who can go
to those appointments for you. So if you don't have
friends and family who can do that, get yourself an
advocate because it changes things immediately when you've got someone

(28:42):
else in the room.

Speaker 2 (28:43):
It actually helps you know when you have the advocate there,
and this is Maria, I'm really hoping for you. This
will be your experience tomorrow with your appointment. It helps,
Actually the advocate helps somebody else understand your perspective. Yes,
because you know, when you're talking about something as important
as your health, if you don't feel that someone's listening
to you, you can get frustrated by that, and sometimes

(29:07):
you know the first station may not be acceptable to
the person that you're dealing with. The advocate can help
actually keep those kind of tensions at bay before they
overtake for either party, so that the perspective of both
people can be understood and hopefully you can find a
good way forward. Agreed, Maria, thank you for your call

(29:27):
and all the best for your appointment tomorrow. Give us
an update next week if you like, we'd love to
hear from you. Let's go to the text messages because
I've had a few coming through so look things that
people are struggling with on perspective calm. This one's pretty
much to the point just says I've been struggling with
my mental health and meeting people, right, so that could
be incredibly isolating. If you're having that experience in quite common.

Speaker 3 (29:50):
Yeah, it's very common. So I think it depends on
how you want to attack it really. I mean, one
option is to look at accessing peer support work, you know,
and actually getting some peer support to actually help you
get back re engaged with the world and with other people.
The other option, if you feel able to jump straight
to this one, is if you google meetup groups. There's

(30:16):
most cities now in New Zealand have these. It's a
very informal organization, but it's basically, in simple terms, people
who want to get together and do something together, and
they will be strangers. And it's not a weird dating thing,
it's not anything like that. It's actually just literally people
who maybe have come from out of town, maybe are
isolated like yourself, and actually just want to go and

(30:36):
see a movie, or go kayaking, or go get an
ice cream at Mission Bay, and you can jump on
and you can have a look at what's available and
sign up. And I think things like this are really
great because they enable us to practice. But it's also
that thing. Of course, it's hard. I'm not going to
suggest that it's easy, but knowing that kind of everybody
else is kind of in the same boat, I think
is often really helpful.

Speaker 2 (30:56):
You know what you know obviously I talk about again.
I'm going to come back to sports clubs for a
moment here and just say, you know, if you used
to play a sport at high school and you enjoyed
playing it, going back and doing it in social clubs
as a great idea. It's exactly why people are there.
They're they're not there to win national titles, perhaps that
those days have passed, but they're there to have a

(31:18):
have a good time and be social that that can
be good. Or I think about the now late but
great Sir Tim Sheadbolt advice that he gave me many
many years ago. Do you remember he was on Dancing
with the Stars.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
I do, yeah, one of the first rounds, wasn't it.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
Yeah yeah, yeah, So he was on it and he
was paired with a with a young, much much younger
dancer than himself. And I think that was kind of
the thing, right, they had, you know, sort of beauty
and the beast type thing going on. And I don't
think he'd mind me saying that. I think her name
was Rebecca off the top of my head. And I
was doing local TV in Dunedin and Tim came through

(31:53):
to kind of solicit votes and he literally well sort
of twirling this dancer around in the middle of this
of the student area there, student union area there in
Attager University. And he's said, in his classic Tim shed
Bolt way, if you want to meet a pretty girl,
don't hang out of the funny club, go join the

(32:16):
ballroom dancing. Look at what I got. And it was
just like, and I think he has a point.

Speaker 5 (32:25):
You know.

Speaker 2 (32:25):
It's like, you know, it is hard, and it can
be really daunting walking into a room or an organization
where you know exactly nobody, But this is how things happen.
This is how you meet people, and it might be
an uncomfortable few first steps, but ultimately there's probably other
people there who are either in the same situation or

(32:46):
once upon a time where.

Speaker 3 (32:49):
You got to be a joiner.

Speaker 2 (32:51):
Yeah, yeah, you've got to be willing to give it
a crack. Absolutely just on your quote that you're talking
about with the tennis player Frank Textan, and he just said,
there's a book called fail Forward. Good good book.

Speaker 3 (33:03):
I haven't heard of that one. I have to look
it up. Yeah, so good.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
I think that fail forward, fail Forward perfect. So see
what you can find there. Back on the lines, though, David, good,
more evening to you, good eating to you.

Speaker 10 (33:17):
Oh, good evening, Yes, not morning yet. So yeah, so
you were saying how we deal with things this year
and everything, and how at the present moment we have
to stay in the moment and we've got to deal
with things from our perspective and say we can do
it and all stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
Yeah. I think self beliefs really important. David, absolutely. Yeah.

Speaker 10 (33:42):
Well, what I'm doing is cleaning up my room. No, well,
we've got we've got inspectors coming around at the beginning
of March. I think we said of March, so the
counsel and everything, because the counsel wants to the counsel
would love to shut us down, and we want to
stay open and stay This house is a really good house.

(34:06):
It accommodates quite a few people, and we really need
this house and the chalets and and then like I'm
going down to White Pokera for two weeks in February,
two weeks and two days, So I have to have
my room up to scratch and everything before I go,

(34:28):
because I'll be back by the twenty by at least
by the twenty third, and it was coming back on
the twenty third, and so I'll be back on the
twenty fourth, and so the third of March that coming around.
So I want to have this room done before I go.
I'm leaving on the seventh, sorry sex sex for February,

(34:50):
and I want to So I want to before then.
I've only got like nine days or so to have
this room tidy before I go. Even so I talked
to the Mormon sisters and I said a prayer. We
said a prayer, and I said, I prayed that I
have the string and the willpower and the initiative to

(35:12):
get this room tidy and not be lazy, just get
motivated and be onto it and not not go off
topic and onto other things. Just stay on the focus
on the and stay in the now and tidy in
my room, throw stuff out, and be really onto it.
And I think I am getting that way, like what
I'm saying now is exactly what I almost said to them.

(35:35):
And I want to in a prayer of this. So
I want to pray that I have the initiative, the strength,
the motivation, and the willpower to do all all things
that are possible that are good you know that I
can do, and that I can do easily and have
the rest eat, eat properly, sleep properly, and have normal

(35:58):
normal hours and not overdo it, you know, not wear
myself out.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
Also, Yeah, David's awesome, Thank you David, and go well,
go well, David, Hey, can we can we just endorse
everything everything that David just said there in a nutshell,
that's that's it, that's the recipe. That's it. And you
know what substitute, you know, cleaning your room worth like,

(36:24):
you know, whatever the task is that you're trying to
concentrate that you're trying to get through. I mean, I
think you and I can both think of things we
need to do in our life. Where did David get
these Mormon sisters? Can they come around? And you know, honestly,
with the amount of stuff I've got to get through
this week, I'll take some Mormon sister's help. No prop
Thank you, perfect whatever work say, I've got two lines

(36:46):
free at the moment. I'm going to come back to
the calls in just a moment, but I wanted to
go to some of the texts because we've got some
goods in here, Cole. This one from Matt says, I
have trouble with perspective. I take on way too much.
I panic, and lately it's been loneliness. I spend my
weekends alone here from nobody. Keep getting told you need

(37:06):
to love yourself, and I really don't think highly of myself.
I hold down a job, but apart from that, I
have nothing and nobody. I hate constantly waking up alone.
And that's from that.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
Yeah, look, I mean that's really tough, and I think
that I go to the first bit of the text, though,
which is where he said that actually he takes on
too much, because I suspect part of the problem that's
driving this was probably an out of balanceness that actually
there isn't a gas in the tank to be able
to do the fun things or the social things. So

(37:41):
you know, i'd really suggest to focus on that. And
I think, actually, you know, if you're not already this
is a very common conversation to start in therapy. In
my experience, you know that sense of when our life
has gotten really out of balance, when we've lost relationships
or haven't been able to maintain them for whatever reason,
being driven by and I hear the insight really clearly,

(38:02):
which is a wonderful place to start therapy of saying,
you know, I don't feel much feel very good about myself.
I don't like myself, and I think there's the work
and therapy. Finding a good counselor a good psychologist is
a great place to start that work. But I think
also a really practical thing to focus on is if
you take on too much. My number one tip is

(38:24):
never say yes or no. Say give me a minute,
a day, a little time to think about it, because
often it's that pressure to feel like we have to
say yes to everything otherwise the people won't like us,
or you know, we'll get fired or whatever. That actually
push us us over the cliff. And actually sometimes it's
okay just to slow it down.

Speaker 2 (38:42):
Yeah, I think i'd say yes to most things.

Speaker 3 (38:46):
Yeah, I imagine you do.

Speaker 2 (38:48):
I'm not sure if I it's like you do you
want a third scoop of ice cream? Yeah? Yeah, I
do actually, now that I think about.

Speaker 3 (38:58):
It, stay out late every Sunday night doing a radio show.

Speaker 2 (39:01):
Well, I mean Boris asked me that to about ten
years ago and I said yes, and I'm still here.
So you go. You know that that can work out,
can't it. This one from Tom this is a good text,
he says, when I coached rugby, I would tell my
players that under the high ball, I wouldn't mind if
they dropped the ball trying to catch it on the fall,
then let it bounce. Persistence is the key if you're

(39:22):
doing your best.

Speaker 4 (39:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:24):
Fail better?

Speaker 2 (39:25):
Yeah, fail better? Yeah. So and also too, just saying
what Tom's doing there is just you know, giving that
perspective to the players and actually giving them a bit
of a bit of an out so that they're not
feeling overly pressured.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
And let's bring that back to the social stuff, because
we've had a couple of texts about that tonight. You know,
what does fail better? What does give it a crack anyway?
Actually look like? Well, I think it's actually just being
prepared to go along and see for yourself what some
of these experiences are like, whether it be a meetup group,
whether it be you know, connecting with old friends, whether
it be actually picking up the phone and calling someone,

(39:59):
it's actually about recognizing that whatever we're playing, whatever story
we're playing in our head, is probably a thousand times
worse than reality.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
So the words just just give it a go. It's
probably not as bad as you think it's going to be.

Speaker 3 (40:12):
And if it is, at least you tried and then
try again, fail better next time.

Speaker 2 (40:17):
Let's go back to the lines. Jason, good morning to you. Okay, yeah,
very good. Nice to hear your voice.

Speaker 6 (40:24):
Mate.

Speaker 5 (40:25):
Look, oh sorry, I used my voice.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
That's okay.

Speaker 5 (40:32):
Can you hear me?

Speaker 2 (40:32):
Yep, nice and clear?

Speaker 5 (40:34):
Oh cool, No, I was. I was listening to a
previous call regarding she had to basically have someone have
the cap for and stuff like that. Me personally, I
actually I would just like to talk about the healthcare

(40:57):
and you shall at the moment. So basically for me,
I've had a couple of doctors appointments. Well I now
I've got to get something rectified. And to be completely honest,
they said, if you can and you're still able to

(41:18):
go to Australia to get it done. Because of the
current state of affairs and New Zealand when it comes
to waiting lists and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
Can you do that though? Like, can can you just
like turn up an Aussie and wander into a hospital
and be like, how do I need need a check out?
Like it does it work that easy?

Speaker 5 (41:38):
No, it doesn't work that easier. I arrived in Australia
probably and I think it was a pre two thousand
or just after before the law changed. So long story short,
ended up with a Medicare CAD. I didn't have one.
I just turned up in the mail after I'd seen
a doctor, so I was classed as a resident. I

(41:59):
still currently have a Medicare CAD. So for I heard
horror stories of a lot of New Zealm was coming over.
This is pre the law change, whereas they would have
to pay for their doctors visits, they weren't covered under
Medicare all that sort of stuff. I just lucked in

(42:21):
at a certain time. Whereas that those things were given
so once you had their Medicare card and you go
your TFM all that sort of stuff. But back to
the point, Well, I've seen a couple of doctors over here.
I need some surgery and it's like yeah, surgery, there

(42:42):
you're going to need within five years, and I've been
dealing with them and both doctors, two of them said
enough if you can go over to Australia if you're
still able vital. So I'm just pointing out the fact

(43:03):
that what's probably going to kill me could probably be
excellent Australia, but you you're just going to sit on
a waiting list over here to you critical And that's it.
I'm again, I'm being completely honest.

Speaker 2 (43:21):
I too, I appreciate, appreciate that, Jason, and I guess
you know, we've been talking about having perspective tonight and
perhaps that that's one of them, isn't it is that
you know, what is what is the accessibility for you know,
for how we assess health needs. So I really feel

(43:42):
for you though, Jason. I mean, it's a it's a
terrible position to be in, but I would I would
actually say, in all honesty, if you've got the option
to go to Australia and you qualify to get access
to the health system, go and do it.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
It's important to do what works, and I do I
do think also, you know, and you probably tried this
and it sounds like you have been through this process,
but for people there maybe in similar situations and at
the beginning of this process. Don't underestimate the power that
a good GP can have as an advocate with the

(44:17):
system too. Obviously, you know, if genuine funding is an
available and it's a condition that's not treated at all,
that's not going to help very much. But gps can
often have a lot of power in the system when
they start to throw their weight around. If if you've
got one on your side, they're worth their weight in gold.

Speaker 2 (44:33):
Okay, thanks very much, Jason, and all the best to you.
This guy. This text yep from Phil. There we go.
Thanks Phil, Phil says, Hi, guys, fourteen months ago I
hit rock bottom and I decided I didn't want to
be here. Since then, I've been to Helen back. I
ended up homeless and living on four dollars of food
a week. Gosh, being diabetic, it was hard. I now

(44:57):
have an amazing job, an amazing new woman in my life,
and although it's community housing, it's a roof over my head.
Just keep moving forward and keeping the faith things will improve.
And that's from Phil and christ Church.

Speaker 3 (45:12):
Nice one, Phil, and hey, thanks for letting us know,
because it is important I think to know that there's
always hope.

Speaker 6 (45:18):
You know.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
I would imagine, you know, if you just go back
fourteen months ago, I would imagine that when you're you know,
you're diabetic, and you've got no money and you're trying
to make ends meet. Yeah, I can absolutely understand why
you would think that you don't want to be here.
But then here's the thing, right you might be missing
out on the future. In fact, you will be because
that's not a situation you can stay in, right, No,

(45:42):
And so you've you know, when you face with those
kind of challenges, you've got to find a way to
be able to move forward. And what Phil is saying
is he's just saying, look, you know, he just kept
moving forward and keeping his faith that actually things would improve,
and they have, and I'd say fourteen months from now,
Phil'll be doing even better.

Speaker 3 (46:03):
I don't doubt it, because Phil sounds to me like
the kind of guy who knows how to take an
opportunity when presented with one, and also knows how to
hold onto hope, because I hope that's the key to life.

Speaker 2 (46:16):
This one here just says I lost my mum last year,
then twelve weeks later, I lost my dad. That's tough.
Some days I'm numb and other days emotional. So I
HEIKOI so go for a walk.

Speaker 3 (46:30):
Nice.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
I think that's really important too, is that if you
are going through especially if you're going through grief, if
you're in a period of grief, put some structured exercise
into your life.

Speaker 5 (46:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (46:43):
So what the golden rule with grief and to stop
it sliding into depression is to get active mentally or
physically active. And you don't have to train for a marathon,
not do anything silly. It's the text that just said,
get up and go for a walk, get the blood flying,
get something different happening.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
I love that you sort of a marathon or anything silly,
like you know, like who does a marathon? That's so silly.

Speaker 3 (47:07):
Lots of people do marathons. I tell you, I saw
a great sign. I think it was whatever the most
recent I think. I'm in the New York with the
Boston Marathon, and someone was standing on the sidelines with
a big black card over the head said therapy is easier.
I've just annoyed all of the marathon.

Speaker 2 (47:24):
Yeah, I've got a I've got a close friend who's
training for the I think it's the Topau iron Man
in March. That's mad. You know. He's literally like telling
me about it.

Speaker 3 (47:35):
You go for a swim and a bike ride before
you run a marathon.

Speaker 2 (47:37):
That's right. And he's actually getting quite stressed out about it.
And I just sort of said to him, was like,
do you have to do this?

Speaker 4 (47:45):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (47:46):
He's like, well no, And I was like, do you
want to do it? And he goes, I thought I did,
But I was like, I feel like there's a there's
a simplatza here, like if you're stressed out about it,
you don't have to do it.

Speaker 3 (48:00):
You could choose not to.

Speaker 2 (48:01):
He could choose not to. And he's like, oh, I
don't know, because I think you know you've got to
commit a bit of funds to it too. Oh yeah,
you got some skin in the game, right the old
race ticket? Yeah? Yeah. This one from Nina says, my
perspective is a little different. I work on what I
can change now, and some things I just have to
accept for now that I'm not ready or unable to

(48:22):
work on.

Speaker 4 (48:23):
I like that.

Speaker 2 (48:24):
So if you can so what she's saying, if you
can affect change to something right in this moment, go
for it and if you know that you can't, then
just just leave it beef for now. That may change
in the future, may not always be that way, but
just leave it as it is. And that's PACs.

Speaker 3 (48:39):
You part of the problem with sleep because actually there's
very little you can do about anything it's three o'clock
in the morning. That's part of the problem. Is it
actually pretty much everything apart from late literally your house
burning down, you just actually have to accept because at
three in the morning you can't solve any of the problems.

Speaker 2 (48:55):
I quite like that though, about you know, three in
the morning, it's like no one can disturb you. I mean,
so you may as well just be sleeping. Yeah, I
mean I am most of the time. Jack says, Hi,
there love the show. Been trying to keep things in
perspective this year, after losing all my friends, I moved
back to my hometown after university and get my head
down and work. I think having a laugh on the

(49:16):
phone with a mate or even just a funny text
really makes the move a bit easier. I had my
see if A Level one exam this year and managed
to pass.

Speaker 3 (49:25):
Well done.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
Definitely helps listen to the show too, And that's from
Keegan well.

Speaker 3 (49:29):
Done, Kegan, well done, and well done on recognizing that
actually just those little connections that you can still have
with your friends that are in another town do actually
really help.

Speaker 4 (49:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:39):
Yeah, And I take that note about just being able
to have people that you interact with now and then.
I mean, I've got a few group chats and stuff
just with old friends that you know, we don't talk
all the time, but just that little bit of connection
that you do have, when you have it, it means.

Speaker 3 (49:54):
The world absolutely. And I mean moving towns is a
big one. I mean, we've both done it at different
points in our lives, and it does take a little
while to build those networks up.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
Again, Rob, good morning to you.

Speaker 4 (50:03):
Yeah, good morning. On a bit of a nutter. Now
I get over my naughtiness. Is that I enjoy going
fishing by myself.

Speaker 2 (50:14):
Love it all right.

Speaker 4 (50:16):
I'll pick a valley, I'll walk up it, and I'm
concentrating on so much on what I'm doing looking in
front of me, the whole world around me disappears.

Speaker 2 (50:31):
Literally, it's it's it's a wonderful thing when we can
go And I mean, look, the technical term that Karl
would give this would be what mindfulness yeah, and.

Speaker 3 (50:40):
Cutting out the distractions.

Speaker 4 (50:41):
Ah yeah, everything disappears, and when I come home, I
sleep better, my wells teen times better. And I just
enjoy it. And so it's as like a passion. So
now that I mean, I show people how to fish,
eye teach them when you would charge me anything. But

(51:02):
there's one saying that I do say to them. Many
fishermen go through life not realize I think it's the
fish that they are after. See where I'm coming from.

Speaker 2 (51:13):
Yeah, I hear, I hear. That's that's pretty philosophical. Rob
I like it.

Speaker 4 (51:18):
Yeah, And I mean, okay, I've been through a lot
of very interesting things in my life. Well a lot
of people would would not handle. But yet some weird
reading my fishing kind of Please.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
If youthinker, how often do you go?

Speaker 4 (51:41):
I go? I finished night shift to night so probably
tomorrow afternoon, I'm going to go fishing.

Speaker 3 (51:45):
Nice.

Speaker 4 (51:46):
But I don't I do it all the time. I
just enjoy it, and I love teaching people how to
do it. Kids down the river bom boom boom.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
You know.

Speaker 4 (51:54):
I mean, I just enjoy it, and they're enjoying it
as well, So you know, it's it's something that's good.

Speaker 2 (52:01):
You know, well, it's something to be said about you
disengaging from whatever our our our norm is, if you like,
you know, whether it's work or you know, a family,
whatever it is. But being able to remove yourself from
you know, where you where you spend the majority of
your time and put yourself in a completely abstract environment

(52:23):
that that is absolutely proven to be very very good
for our mental health. It's it's actually where we gain
that perspective, right, because we are away from all of
the things that we have to be engaged with. And
now this is where we were able to have that
kind of that break. You know, it's an interesting one
because you know, you've brought up fishing and it's great,

(52:45):
and I think I was talking about sports docos earlier,
but do you know that even in the most terrible
of times, even in financially struggling times, movies always do
really well. And it's because it's that escapism, right, It's
that whole thing about people just needing to get away
from the reality whatever that is, just to be able

(53:08):
to have that mental break exactly.

Speaker 4 (53:13):
You know, I'm a pretty strong minded person. I mean
I've seen things. I mean, I work in probably one
of the most dangerous places in the world. Okay, so
you probably imagine what I used to do for a living.
And but that stuff never worried me. What I've seen
and what I was involved, and it never worried me
at all, never lost sleep over it. But yeah, when

(53:38):
it comes to fishing, oh my god, you know, any
other little problem in my life? What does even you
know that just wipes off the boardlight? You wouldn't believe.

Speaker 2 (53:47):
Yeah, And I think you know the number of people
who go fishing in New Zealand. I know that we all.
I mean, who doesn't like fresh cork copped fish. But
I think it's a lot more than that.

Speaker 4 (53:59):
Yeah, I mean I don't even kill them. I let
him go, you know, fish for tomorrows. You know, that's
that's all. People you're posting your your follows, all your fish.

Speaker 5 (54:12):
I don't.

Speaker 4 (54:13):
I'm happy you're not posting it or anything like that online.
You know, I just enjoyed doing it.

Speaker 2 (54:21):
Nice one, Rob, Thank you so much, And think so
I think for the whole fishing community of New Zealand.
I think you've you've brought up a wonderful, wonderful mental
health pastime.

Speaker 4 (54:32):
Yeah, thank you very much. You guys have got event all.

Speaker 2 (54:35):
Yeah, you go well, Rob, cheers.

Speaker 3 (54:37):
I think there's something to be said for being on
or near the water too. I mean you would know that.

Speaker 2 (54:42):
Yeah, So look if you don't know, I mean, I
won't harp on about it too long. But you know,
I'm a lifelong sailor and I love being out on
the water. And I can tell you right now it
doesn't for me. It doesn't matter really whatever I've been
going through back on land, because when you're sailing, the
experience is all encompassing, totally. You know, you are quite

(55:04):
literally every every bit of your attention has to be
focused on what you're doing. You can't worry about the
problems back on So, whether.

Speaker 3 (55:13):
It's sailing or fishing or sea kayaking or surfing, whatever
it is, I think if water is your thing, it's
a great way to get a perspective.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
But even then, you know, you're just talking about your
tennis mate. You know, over that you get your best
warts is name Stan warnka yeah or stand standing you
you're pretty tight A yeah, gotcha. Anyway, you're over there
when you I would imagine that, you know, when you're
in the grips of a of a of a highly
competitive tennis match, probably ain't worrying about what you're going

(55:42):
to have for dinner tonight. Well, no, if you are,
you're probably about to miss the ball, correct, you know
you're not. You're not actually going to be able to
do it particularly well. So different people will find different
things that take them away from whatever it is in
order to gain that perspective, because it's often when you
come back to it that you just realize that, you know,
it's probably may not have been as big as it's

(56:04):
grown to be in your own mind, which sometimes are challenges.
Can I know a guy who sailed solo all the
way from Martinique in the Caribbean to Auckland. He did
it during COVID through Panama, He did come through Panama,
came through Panama, straight across the Pacific, beautiful weather the

(56:25):
whole way. Yeah, honestly, it was. It was a dream run.
It was his first time.

Speaker 3 (56:29):
Solo sailing a long way to sail in.

Speaker 2 (56:32):
Very long way, very very long way. And he was
a guy who had never sailed solo for a start,
So the fact that he did it was kind of
impressive in and of itself. Nuts really totally nuts, absolutely bonkers.
But he also too had worked, you know, he'd gone
to school, he had gone to gone to UNI, and

(56:52):
he'd worked his whole life. And he had a very
firm held belief that if he stopped working, his whole
world would fly apart. And he was in his thirties,
so he still young. Yeah, And he had had a family,
had a son, all of that going on. And actually
when I went and caught up with them, so I
was in communication with him during the trip, and then
when I went and caught up with him when he

(57:13):
arrived in Auckland and we actually had a bit of
time together, he was the most serene and at peace
I had ever seen him in my life. And it
was because he had actually understood that in the absence
of him being connected in the world, because he was
busy sailing this boat, you know, to be able to

(57:35):
get home during the COVID lockdown, he had realized that actually, no,
he didn't die, his world didn't stop churning it. It
was actually fine. And suddenly he had perspective over where
he sat in the world and felt quite empowered by it.

Speaker 3 (57:51):
It'd be quite a lot of time to think.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
Huge amounts of time to think. So, you know, I
think that's got to be said. Got another text here
It says Nutter's Club. When I was a young feller,
age six, I was buried in a hole up to
my neck while my father the lawn around me, and
that was punishment for stealing food. I'm now early sixties

(58:14):
and it's never left my thoughts, and I always use
alcohol to forget, but it never helps. It's always the
same thing I'm fixated on. I listen to you guys
to find a solution to training my thought processes. It
does help sometimes listening. Thanks for a great program. Okay,
So Kyle, Yeah, this you know when we talk about rumination.

Speaker 3 (58:36):
So this is trauma. So this is there's no other
word to use.

Speaker 2 (58:39):
So fifty he's saying he's in a sixties. This is
over fifty years.

Speaker 3 (58:43):
Yeah. So the thing about traumatic memories is they get stuck,
and they get stuck because the distress around them means
that we can't process them in the way a normal
memory gets processed. And particularly if you found over the
course of your life that you used alcohol to manage
that distress, because my guess is that this is a
very difficult memory on its own. But the kind of

(59:05):
childhood where this happened means that it probably on average
wasn't that great either. You know, it's never too late
to start therapy, and I say that because actually seeing
an experienced therapist is absolutely the treatment of choice for
childhood trauma, particularly if we find that it's still you know,
catching up with us forty or fifty years later. So

(59:28):
you know, find someone that you feel comfortable speaking to. Male, female,
doesn't matter, Just you know, pick someone that you feel
comfortable with and see what it feels like to talk
about it, because actually you can shift these memories and experiences.
And let me just give you a little pointer. If
this particular memory on its own is a particularly stuck memory,

(59:48):
there's a particular kind of therapy that can be very
useful called E M M for Mary d R, which
is a particular kind E M D a particular kind
of therapy that can help with stuck memories. So you
might want to google that and see if you can
find a therapist in your area who does that particular
kind of therapy.

Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
And also it's an interesting thing because my understanding, because
we've talked about it on the show here before. When
it comes to you know, really traumatic things that happened
in early childhood, so age six, which is you know
what the text is talking about that would that would
totally qualify. Is it? Actually it takes on average, and
it may be a bit longer for you, but on
average it takes about thirty plus years for you to

(01:00:32):
really start dealing with the things that happened to you
in early childhood.

Speaker 3 (01:00:36):
Yeah, I can do, because it shapes the personality and
then often launches us into ways often dysfunction or not
always of dealing with the trauma. And you know, it
sounds like alcohol fits the bill there for you. And
so what tends to happen is we often get quite
a long way through adulthood coping with these things before
the wheels start to come off. But absolutely therapy is
the treatment of choice and EMD or eye movement, desensitization

(01:01:00):
and reprogramming is the full term. Is the therapy of
choice for particular stuck memories.

Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
So all the best with and I would say go
and go and see if you can reach out to
somebody in terms of like a counselor GP can be
a great fust to stop.

Speaker 3 (01:01:15):
If you have a GP, start with them they'll be
able to help.

Speaker 2 (01:01:17):
To Yeah, and there is no time like the present.
You never it's never, it's never too too long ago,
it's you're never too old. And this idea that you
know time will heal everything, well not quite. Thank you
very much for sending us that text, and I really
hope that's been of some use to you. We have
got to take a break and we come back. I'm
going to have a yarn with Yvonn ECONMO.

Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
This is the Nutters Club, thanks to New Zealand on
News Dogs that'd be.

Speaker 2 (01:01:45):
Welcome back to the show. I said, we'll go to Yvonne,
and so we're going to Evonne. Good morning to you.

Speaker 9 (01:01:51):
Hello, hey machine, Kyle. I wanted to talk to you
about your perspective way of looking at things, and for me,
I wanted to write my book called the book p

(01:02:13):
P is for Perception and that's how I sort of
analyzed what was going on in my mind and that
when I got diagnosed with my bipolar disorder some twenty
years ago, I had already gone to a psychologist of

(01:02:36):
my own choosing. I had a bit of money and
I thought, oh blow. You know, I've always sort of
wondered you know, sort of what's the matter with me?

Speaker 3 (01:02:47):
Why are you?

Speaker 9 (01:02:48):
Was I sort of thinking and being the way I
was inside myself. So within a year unraveling my sort
of situation with this wonderful man, he said to me, Eva,
he said, just go and do it. You know, you're
not going to lose anything, you know, by trying. But

(01:03:13):
the thing was, I didn't know what do it was.
There was so much sort of going around in my mind.
And I tell you what, I struggled so much because
I didn't agree with the diagnosis. I really resisted the
fact that they told me I had bipolar disorder type

(01:03:36):
two because I had always been the way I was,
you know, to me, I thought, here's a bunch of
strangers telling me I've got this mental health condition, and
yet to me, I have always been how I am.
But anyway, working through it, some of the points that

(01:03:59):
I wanted to make note of was that I gave
thought to the fact that there's a big beginning, a middle,
and an end. And I'm so grateful now to be
in the position of reading back over my old journal

(01:04:19):
and it's sort of revealing in a revelation to me.
I'm so pleased. I wrote and journaled, and I would
encourage anybody to do that if that's sort of something
that might help them, you know, or some of them
write lyrics or you know, poems and stuff like that,

(01:04:40):
or they do art. All that sort of thing really
really helps to get it out of your mind onto paper,
because you can't always be talking to somebody else because
that somebody else doesn't necessarily understand you where you're coming from,
and that sort of thing. And the other thing that

(01:05:04):
I wanted to sort of say was that I where
where was the different scenarios I encountered.

Speaker 4 (01:05:14):
And et cetera.

Speaker 9 (01:05:15):
Some of them were wonderful, absolutely, because I ended up
sort of when I was going in and out of
the mental health facilities, I was there with like minded
people and I thought, well, why are you yeah sort
of thing, you know, and you know, and they had,

(01:05:37):
you know, these stories to tell and their revelations and
stuff like that, and I thought, you know, it would
have been really good to see the professionals sort of mingling,
if you like, not all the time, because I know
money doesn't allow, but you know, to sort of see

(01:05:58):
these people in their real life situation, not fifteen minute
fifteen minute meetings that I came to realize that, you know,
I was treated really well, probably because I was older.
And my psychiatrist or psychologist said to me, oh, even,

(01:06:21):
he said, well, reduce your medication. You're doing really well.
You've got yourself a job and all the rest of it.
And I thought, how the hell do you really know?
You know, you're just assuming and assessing me, you know,
But anyway, you sort of let things go and what
have you. But I made wonderful friends, and I just

(01:06:43):
sort of progressed through a course, if you like, of
living my life. And I got to really neat volunteer jobs,
and then I got one at Citizens' Advice Bureau and
I had one. I had wonderful counsel there, you know,
and had the opportunity of working with the lovely peers

(01:07:04):
and that you know, older people and and what have you,
you know, And then the friends and that that they made,
you know, they were not even, they weren't done well.
They were just living a different sort of life to
one that I have experienced. I mean to say, I
used to live in a really flash colonial home and

(01:07:27):
then while and behold here I am wheeling wet washing
in my suitcase to launder that up the road, and
I thought, what the hell's going on?

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
But I think the most important thing here, ofvon is
that you know you've you actually found people to help
advocate in those positions, because the other thing too, And
you've brought up a really good point. If you don't
like it or you don't feel comfortable with what you're
hearing from, you know, from your doctor, you can go
and get a second opinion.

Speaker 10 (01:07:59):
Yeah you can.

Speaker 3 (01:08:00):
And I mean I think it's also important to recognize
what she's saying about the need for a relationship. You
know that actually that consistent relationship over time is really
important in the system. You know, knowing that you have
someone and often that's account Sol could be a key worker.
But actually making sure you have and maintain those relationships
or find them if you don't have them really important.

Speaker 2 (01:08:24):
Well that's it for this episode of the Natas Club.
Thanks to the shared experiences and insight from all our
callers and texters, as well as psychotherapist Carl McDonald for
his professional assessment. Great to have you back. If you
liked what you heard and think it might help someone
out there, then please share this episode on your own
channels or with family and friends. And if you ever

(01:08:46):
want to be part of the show, then give us
a call or text. When we broadcast live on Newstalk
SEDB eleven pm Sunday nights, New Zealand Standard time. Check
out Newstalk ZEDB dot co dot z for local frequencies
or a link to the live stream. A big thanks
to New Zealand on Air for their ongoing support and
making the show. Take care and always remember that the

(01:09:10):
world's a better place with you in it. Life it
isn't easy, it is, however, with it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
For more from News Talks at B. Listen live on
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