January 31, 2026 • 41 mins
Schools have started back up and we all, obviously, want our children to do well.
Parents will be doing drop off and pick up, making sure the homework is done and forms are signed, keeping an eye on grades and reports.
But how involved should parents really be in their children's education?
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Be okay again, Yes, welcome back to the Weekend Collective.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
I'm Tim Beverage and this is the Parents Squad where
we want your calls on eight hundred eighty and eighty
and text on nine two nine two. Sorry I was
about to stop the text number halfway through there. And look,
schools that have started back up, well, if they haven't
started back up, you must be one of the last
runs if you're about to start on Monday. Anyway, Look,
all parents, we want our kids to do well. You
(01:00):
know we're going to be doing the drop off, the pickup,
making sure the homework has done, forms a signed keeping
any on how everything's going. But the question that every
parent has, regardless of what age it is. In fact,
I think earlier on it's a bit more obvious, isn't it,
in terms of how involved you should be in your
child's education. And you know, maybe that is connected with
(01:23):
just reading to your kids before be it, or maybe
it's not, or quizzing them on their times tables. But
further on, how should you be involved with your child's
education without also being a parent who's like, hey, dad,
you know, I know what I'm doing here. Back off
that perennial decision. I guess it's with anything a parent
(01:44):
has to do as to when you trust your child
to be able to do more and more without you
writing shotgun all the time. So how involved should parents
really be in their in their children's education? Where's and
what's the balance? We love your calls on eight hundred
and eighty ten to eighty. What did you do with
your kids? When did you decide it was time to
(02:06):
back off? Or did you just say, look our schools.
You know they've got great teachers. They're there to do
a job. I'm just passing it over straight away. I
would tend to think that you might be in the minority,
or maybe you're not. But anyway to discuss that, among
other things. He is principal psychologist at Umbrella well Being,
and it's fair to say it looks like he hasn't
(02:27):
had a haircut during the holidays. It's pretty relaxed. It's
Doogle Sutherland, Doogle hair I'm good.
Speaker 4 (02:34):
Weirdly enough, you know what, my barber broke his finger
and true story, and so I couldn't get a haircut.
And then I kind of went, do you know what
I kind of my hair goes curly, and I haven't
had curly long here for a while. So I've let
it go. I've let it. I've trimmed it up at
the side.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
I think if you shaved that beard off, you'd be
looking about seventeen years old.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
I looked at a photo of me when I was
like seventeen years old, and it was like, hang on,
and I look like that now.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
So ah, that's called a hum brag. It's like, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
It is, it is. It's so I'm I'm keeping the
longer curely here. You're looking trim too. I thought, have
you been working out or going to the gym or living?
Speaker 3 (03:17):
Well, that's actually you know. The funny thing is that
you should say that is that I bought a I
bought a bike. I got my I got my mountain
bike and serviced and the guy who serviced it classic
called bike works, brilliant bike mechanic, and he just goes,
I'm selling I've got a carbon fiber bike here. You
can have it for five hundred bucks. I'm just selling
(03:37):
it from mate who's got another one. And I bought
it and I've been cycling four or five days a week.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Wow, o, excellent.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
So I like to think, you know, anyway, it's got
nothing but thank you the mutual cop.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
That's that's that's that's It's good, isn't it. You've got
you've got to You're gonna look good and feel good
to be a good parent. Surely there's a connection there.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Does being vain make you a good parent?
Speaker 4 (04:08):
Oh my god, yes, there, that's how you want to
do it. I was feeling good and looking good? Does
that help you for your parent? Well?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
The funny thing was. The funny thing was we went
to a place called Tree Adventures out out west where
it's a fantastic facilly But I just I went with that,
you know, and I'm in my fifties, well into my fifties,
and we did it was with my thirteen and fourteen
year old, and they do bouldering and climbing and stuff,
(04:35):
so they're quite you know. And I said, I just
assume you should do the top level that you were
old enough for or tall enough for. So we booked
the Tazan level. Okay, and there was there are a
couple of things. I thought, oh my god, this is
just killing me totally and at the end, in fact
(04:56):
that the people there said, oh, we were watching you.
They said, actually, no, don't worry. You did well. But
and that's when I realized you could do easier versions
of it.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Were you harnessed him? Do you
have to get is this?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Oh yeah, you've got to clip in and out of
this and that. But you know that's good.
Speaker 4 (05:15):
Yeah. I just said, this sort of nightmarish vision of
you on a on a typwrite sort of balancing along
afty foot up without any equipment.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
No, you have the equipment, but the rest of it's true.
Speaker 4 (05:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
Well, oh that's good fun. I highly recommend it. Anyway.
How involved have you been well, did you make a
conscious effort to be involved with your kids' education?
Speaker 4 (05:41):
Well? Involved from the sidelines, I would say, in terms
of we let it was interesting as you were doing
the intro, I was reflecting on it. So our eldest
so he's twenty five, twenty six. Now, hey, we he
didn't love school, and we kind of didn't want to
put super heaps of pressure on him, so we just
sort of let him left in to it. He finished
(06:04):
school at end of year twelve, so didn't do year thirteen. Was,
which took me a little bit of getting to grips
with and oh my god. You know. Anyway, he went
off and did a few other things. He just went back.
He finished last year or the year before, he finished
his university degree in market and management and HR and
(06:26):
is now gainfully employed, which was kind of I guess what.
I sort of hoped for him to get a university education.
But he said to us, in a moment of clarity
at the end of year twelve, we said, look, I
just don't think I can do year thirteen. I think
school's not going to be right for me. I can
see myself getting into trouble. Oh I finish And we
went okay, and so we just we had we adopted
(06:48):
the route of sort of hands off ish for him.
We were still encouraging but interesting. With our daughter, she's
just his second year now, just starting a second year
of Midwiffrey training. When she was at school, her school
had a no homework policy. Her high school had no
homework until you got to senior school. So there wasn't
(07:08):
really much for us to do because they deliberately had
no homework.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
That actually that is because that is one of the
obvious ones isn't it what you said about your son
and that he made. I mean, it sounded the way
you described it as quite the self aware decision, like
this is going to work for me. And he wasn't
like I hate school. It's just like, I don't think
this is going to bring the breast out and bring
(07:35):
the best out of me. And your involvement wasn't actually listening.
I mean, that was him making an independent decision at
a young age that you support.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Was yeah, And to be fair to him, it was
probably he knew that the decision was not the one
that we would have agreed with. And my my wife
was better at it than I was. And she said
to us and she said, look, just give dad a
little while, Just give him a little while to come
around for the idea. Because I was like, oh no,
(08:03):
you got to go. You know, years thirteen, you've got
to get that university entrance even if you don't go
blah blah blah. Yeah, he was luck, he was. I
really respected him for that. He just said, hey, look
I could just see it, you know, just see year
thirteen being terrible for me, and I want to do
other things. So he went off and did some extra
training non university training, and then worked for a little
(08:27):
while and then decided he did want to go back.
It did want to go to UNI after all. So
from my point of view, it all worked out.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
For different parents. I mean, are there kids well, I mean,
I think I know the answer to this question. Every parent.
Every child is different and some need a bit of
a nudge, and some respond really well to a nudge,
and others are like the nudge me and I'm going
to run a mile And I guess that's the first thing.
But okay, if you go, let's let's go back to
early days. Do you remember the early days when your
(08:54):
kids were at school and what was your involvement in
their education back then?
Speaker 4 (09:00):
Yeah, I think it was. There wasn't heaps for us
to do. I've got to be honest, apart from make
sure they went to school and we read to them like,
you know, like people do. Actually, I think I think
that sort of idea about creating an environment that's supportive
of education, if you know what I mean, like reading
(09:21):
to your kids and supporting them without sort of in
a natural environment, without saying, come on, you've got to
knuckle down and do seven hours of homework tonight. I
think that I like that idea of just the environment
being broadly supportive and oriented towards education and you know,
having books around for kids to read, that kind of thing,
rather than sort of pushing and pushing and pushing and pushing. Yeah,
(09:44):
I'm not a great fan of that.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
In fact, as you say that, I think probably if
I was to try and sum up, and I'll give
them as anyone who's listened to me on rating the notes,
I'll give them a wife credit for this is that
the one thing I think you should do as a
parent is teach your kids read with your kids, yeah,
books in front of them. And I think if you
if you do thing else ever as a parent, I
(10:08):
think you've close to have nailed it if you can
get them on the love of books. And my wife
Anne Marie, has been amazing with my girls. Literally we
still have problems with devices. Yeah, you know and say right,
get off your device. But you know, the amazing thing
that still surprises me is I say, hey, come on,
put your device down and read. And I remember just
(10:29):
recently one of my daughters, you know, she's like, oh,
I don't really want to get off my phone. And
two minutes later, she's reading a book and I thought,
oh cool, Oh thank goodness. But that's probably the one
big thing every parent should do, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (10:42):
Yeah? It is. And I think reading with your kids
has so many more benefits than just educationally. I think
it teaches them language. I think it's sharing. I think
it helps with relationships with your kids. That's because it's you,
especially if it's just you reading to them, rather than saying, okay,
you've got to read this and get you know what,
it's just that it's just a lovely she had sense
some time. Do they still do that? You remember, you'll
(11:03):
remember that scheme that the used to do books and
homes with from Alan Duff Alan Duff, Yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah is that sort of thing, you know, because that
was the whole idea, right, let's get some books and
kids homes because not everybody can always afford them. So
I thought that was a great idea. You know, it
just just and hits on that idea about let's just
let's make sure that kids just have books available that
(11:24):
parents can read to them.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
From from what I can see, yeah, books and homes
dot org dot en z. And it was the Ellen
Duff foundation. I think it became so from what I
can see, yes, it is. It is still active. It's
just yeah, yeah, I guess it's just not in the
it's not in the forefront of the news headlines these days.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
They tell you what. We'll came around talking in just
a moment. But let's go. But let's bring someone else
into the conversation on how involved should parents be and
what's the most important thing a parent can do to
support their child's education. I think you've heard Google and
I probably agree that if you do one thing, and
that thing is teaching them a love of reading, you
can almost say job done. Almost maybe helen, Hello, yes, hi,
(12:12):
hied to them.
Speaker 5 (12:13):
I strongly believe that parents should be really involved in
their children's education, especially in the early years. And I'm
not one of these people that says that the constant
tests are a bad thing. I think that if the
tests are getting this bad reputation, it is because of
(12:34):
the way tests are done, and they should be made
done so that it's not putting children off. But if
you don't, if you don't have some way of testing,
you can have all these generations of kids just boiling
between the cracks and the jails are full of people
who can't read. So if you've got a child that's
not doing well with math, prinstance, you should find out why,
(13:00):
and Jolly will insist that they get told properly or
take mother MESSI just be really assertive about this because
you know, I actually think the tests are a very
good idea because.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
If you don't have well, you've got to you've got
to tell them where they're at. I mean, you've got
to keep tabs on where they're at. Actually, yeah, when
you said so, can I just ask Helen? So when
you say you you know earlier on there should be
constant involvement in your child's education, that's don't This is
not a challenge to you. But it's an easy thing
to say, But what does that actually look like?
Speaker 5 (13:37):
Well, I mean, if the kid's getting a bad report
or something, the parents it's up to the parents, the
parents responsibility to say why is this happening and find
out exactly why is this happening and you just get
something done about it. Because you can have parents who
are just going, oh, well, the teacher's always right and
blah blah blah. You know, I really feel that you've
(13:59):
got to get the basics right, and that there's too
many kids who go to the system leave the school.
They can't do maths, they can't read, and something was
done about this in the early years. And it's up
to the parents if this is happening, to absolutely insist
that something is done about this, put dempression on the
education system to get it done. I mean all these
(14:21):
you know, so the kids with disabilities are not getting
proper education. You know, people have got to stand up
for this sort of thing because it has lifelong impacts
on your life.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Actually, but I've come up with another one, Helen. Did
you used to go to the parent teacher interviews?
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Noel, I haven't got any children, but I'm talking about say, well,
my parents, but my parents for instance, I you know,
I had very good reasons why I am so hopeless
at maths. And I don't think naturally I'm not hopeless
because I was. I was quite a lot of time
(14:57):
when I was a child away from school for one
reason another you know, I had, I was quite a
sickly child. And no, you seem to realize that, you know,
to say maths education is a continuum and if you
miss out along the way on certain steps, so you
go to full I went through school without one one
(15:20):
mass teacher asked, I had none of my teachers, my
math teachers had any conversation with me from year right
through the school, right through the very well. I got
the university on good scholarships, but it was because of
all my other subjects. But it's really impacts very negatively
on my life. My math education is so bad.
Speaker 3 (15:41):
Yeah, yeah, actually, thanks Helen, because the parent teacher in
the view thing that I just tossed into the conversation. See,
that's the other one where here's the thing though, usually
the parents that turn up are not the ones that
the school really wants to see. It's a nice social
catch up for the teacher and the parents, but really
(16:04):
what the parents the teachers want to see is a
list of people whose names are not on that Parenteah.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
Yeah, they're often so passed up they're like five minutes
and you seak. That was like, but look, just a
couple of points I thought that Helen made were quite good.
I completely agree with her that if you if academic
achievement or being successful at school is really important for
later life, and as she said, the prison system is
full of people who have who have who academically have
(16:32):
not or have failed academically at school or school has
failed them the other thing too. It just made it
reminded me too that actually we've got a mass tudor
for our son at Uni no, sorry, a university student
to tutor our son at maths at school because he
was struggling. Uh, And I guess that's parental involvement. I
was like, mate, well.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
That's parental involvement. That's parental involvement.
Speaker 4 (16:54):
Google, It wasn't, but that wouldn't have gone well. But yeah, no,
we recognized from school reports, et cetera, that that that
something extra help was needed, and luckily we were able
to do that, you know, but not everybody's in that position.
But yeah, just that, you know, I think those are
some good points. Just you know, are you aware, are
(17:14):
you alert? Are you involved? Do you go to the
five the best the best parent teacher interviews? I either did.
They did them all on Zoom during lockdown one year,
and it was actually super easy because you just went
click click click from one room to the other. You
didn't have to walk across the wall or down to
C block or over to H block or up to
G four or something, and they just went boom, boom boom,
(17:34):
and that was much quicker.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
I thought, well, I'm quite a sociable being, so I
quite like I quite like the face to face. I
don't know if it's just about saying a lot of
different people or my wife's got to be like now,
just tim, just let her, let the teacher say what
they need to say. Just can you just stay quiet
for vit? ANDAM like, oh yes, yes, must remember to
do that. Anyway, Hey, we're going to be back in
(17:57):
just a moment. Cherry is up next. We're talking about
how involved should you be with your with your children's education.
But I think that the question is okay, you should
really be involved, but what does that look like? Eight
hundred eighty ten eighty. It's twenty five past five newstalks
hed be this news talks had been. My guest is
Google Sutherland. He's a psychologist at Umbrella. Well been. We're
talking about how involved should you be with your children's
(18:19):
education throughout the years and what does that that actually
look like? Is it involve, you know, turning up to
those parent teacher interviews. I've got a few. I've got
some brilliant texts actually that I'll get on to in
just a moment Google. But first, well, Cherry, Hello.
Speaker 6 (18:32):
Hello, I just am ringing to tell Toko your comment
about reading was your children rather than reading to your children.
I'm a retired teacher of far too many decades, but
the one thing that you know, I've noticed is that
(18:54):
parents read it's almost at the kids and don't get
them interactive. When you get to the end of the page,
say what do you think is going to happen next?
Or you know, so, will this little kid get found
or lost? Or will you can think of questions to ask,
because there's nowhere really in the education system where children
(19:19):
learn the dispositions of predicting or consequences and that can
start pre school. Was that kind of action at reading,
and it is just so important.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
The more that I think about the reading, it just
it's it is the no brainer that you should really
if you can as a parent, You've got to make
the effort to try and get your kids reading with you.
Speaker 6 (19:48):
Yes, but interactive. You know, you're asking questions. It's not
just reading to them and the kids sitting there passively.
It has to be an interactive process.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
Yeah, Hey, just out of curiosity. You were a teacher,
did you sort of when you were at sixty five
or did you work beyond that?
Speaker 6 (20:10):
I had an unusual teaching Korea because I didn't go
to training college. I walked straight into a teaching job.
I taught in Sydney, in the Australian Desert, in portabus, Newfoundland,
and an experimental school, and Madison, Wisconsin. Then I came
back to New Zealand and taught for twenty years in
(20:35):
one school, and then I saw the lights and opened
an early childcare center ever and next for twenty five years.
Speaker 3 (20:42):
Wow. So yes, it sounds like you still do it. It
sounds like you'd have to be about ninety to be
able to look back on that as something you've squeezed in.
Speaker 6 (20:52):
Not quite.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
Hey, No, the reason I asked you it's just just
by the bye because I see I know of more
and more more teachers who work beyond sixty five, simply
because the system needs them. That was all that was
really where I was leading.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (21:09):
No, I yes, I taught beyond sixty five, but I
was working in my own early child care business, so
that was a little bit different. I worked with a
number of people who were not sixty five, who should
have retired ten years previously. But you know that's not
(21:30):
within the system.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
No, indeed, and nice to hear from your thanks for
your call. Actually, Google, there is the other thing about
and I think I've had some conversations with you know,
when you've got a concern about your child. I think
most kiwis are like, I don't want to be.
Speaker 4 (21:50):
Parents.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
You don't want to be that parent. And because I'm
married to a teacher, you know what that parent's like.
But you also need to advocate for your child and
if you think something's not right. And I would say
I've been lucky because I've had some you know people
through the job I do. I've interviewed some interesting people
and managed to have more time chatting to them about things.
(22:11):
And the one thing that came across from people involved
in education, it's like, we want to know, you know,
that's the last thing we want is for We actually
do need parents to tell us about their children. If
there's a concern, if there's something that's bothering them, then
you're doing it, you know, you share it with us,
And that's the other thing you should do as a parent,
doesn't it, I guess, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:32):
It's just that, Yeah, it's that regular homeschool communication are
getting information home from you know, from school and then
and then being able to feed that back as well.
Just keeping that feedback loop loop openly so that so
that kids don't fall through the cracks. I think two touches.
I was just reflecting on as Jerry was talking about
how reading to your kids. Everybody, we're all in agreement,
(22:54):
that's a great thing, but you know, it just shows
you that intergenerational gap if a parent struggles with literacy
and hasn't had help, and then how difficult it is
for them to read to their kids, and that flows
down the system. So you know, I you know, even
get even adults that they have missed out and getting
them some supporters well I like their books and homes
(23:15):
and and you know, even and teaching literacy in prisons
I think hugely important if we're going to help the
next generation of kids.
Speaker 3 (23:22):
Actually, for me, I don't so much recall much reading
with my with my parents, but probably as a parent.
I think my one of my memories that will stick
with me forever is simply, you know, lying down next
to my child and next one of my daughters and
just reading a book and having a chat, and then
of course that you relate. It's also the relationship building.
(23:45):
Yeah yeah, because it's in between the pages, something else
will pop out.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
Yeah yeah, different for generator, I remember generationally it's a
bit different. You know, you were talking about your kids
being on devices and screens. I can remember my brother
getting told off for reading too much when we were young.
Get outside, What are you doing inside.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
Reading a book?
Speaker 4 (24:05):
There you go? So I think you used to take
a book outside and just read it outside. You know,
there's always something to moan about, isn't there.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Well, the old clich of everything in moderation, isn't it.
By the way, we love your calls on this. What
is look, what is getting involved in your children's education
look like? And you know, how do the rules change
over the years? Actually, just before I get onto the text,
because as kids go through the years, and I'm at
that age when my oldest is going to be facing
(24:38):
a first external exams and I'm not. You want to
make sure that she is coping and everything, and you
have conversations to help put things in perspective. If they're
getting a little bit you know, nervous. But when it
comes to the homework sort of thing, I always had
a rule of thumb that when the maths got too hard,
I had to back off.
Speaker 4 (24:58):
Anyway, I don't know what that actually means. I wouldn't
have no idea how to do that, to ask somebody
that does. But then that's the link back to school writers.
If you're if you're not sure, and she's not sure,
then you want to be able to feed that back
to school and say, hey, you know, my kids having
trouble with their maths. I can't help them in any suggestions.
And I guess that's a great interactive way of doing it,
(25:20):
just asking school what you can do to help them,
because often teachers are just looking for it, you know.
Oh yeah, we've got heaps of ideas and heaps of
solutions if you only just asked.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
Okay, here's one from a teacher. Actually, yeah, Cratim. As
a teacher, I love for families to be involved and
ask questions, tell me things they want me to know.
I'm in a year one to year eight primary school.
As a parent, I've been involved as far as making
sure I know what's going on at school and that
my kids are happy. I'm very fortunate that they've had
few issues with learning or behavior. As far as helping
(25:49):
them out. Suffice it to say, I just help my
daughter refine her architecture PhD proposal. She still trusts me
even though I have very little knowledge of the actual topic.
Oh well, yeah, okay.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
That sounds That sounds like there's a lovely relationship there.
It doesn't it though? When somebody could go to their
their mum and say, could you've got mom, I don't
know if it's a mom, sorry able parents, and say,
you know, can you help me with my PhD topic?
Speaker 3 (26:15):
It's like, okay, yeah, I imagine it's probably just with
the grammar and the structure and the consult.
Speaker 4 (26:20):
Yeah, I assumed. So making it, making it read well
and making it.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
As opposed to your design sucks.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Yeah that doesn't sound very good. That's interesting. You know,
you touch the touch on kids getting nervous. They do
get anxious before those exams. I remember my daughter being
in fits before her first exam. But it's I think
it's a good lesson to learn, right is how do
I how do I manage that pressure, whether it's an
exam or a test or whatever. But there's heaps of
times when we have to perform under pressure, but often
(26:47):
kids get super anxious in those first few few exams.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
I think, actually, that's one of the biggest challenges of parenthood,
is helping your kids put things in perspective for lessons
you've learned, you know. So, yeah, I mean I was lucky.
I guess I never panic during exams. I always had
a level of confidence that I pass at least. But
you know, I could imagine I've got one of my
(27:11):
daughters will get a bit tense about it, and I
just want to tell her that ultimately the sun will
come up tomorrow in the east and set in the west. Ye,
And you know, there's but it does, you know what
I mean, trying to put in perspective that even failure
is not catastrophic, but of course it would be for them.
Speaker 4 (27:28):
Yes, yeah, well that's if that's your entire world. I
know exactly what you mean. It's like when you look
back at school, it's like, does it really matter whether
I got an A or a B or a C
in the subject? Not really, as long as I kind
of passed.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
Like c's get degrees.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
It does a little bit, But you know, Ultimately, who
looks go Who goes back and looks at your once
you're once you're doing whatever, Who goes back and look
at looks at your school records? But yeah, when when
you're in the middle of it, when you're fifteen, it's
the it's the it's your world, and it's a big thing.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Did you have school certain when you were Yeah.
Speaker 4 (28:02):
We had school shirt and I think I was. I
did a sixth form was UI and I don't know
what seventh form was, just sort of mucking around.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
That's funny. I can tell you my my marks I
got in school shirt but nothing else. Yeah, I don't
know why, but school it's because it's the first external exam.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
Chip, first big one. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, what
I got.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
I know. I'm not going to rattle it off now
because you.
Speaker 4 (28:27):
Know, I'm sure they were very good ground mixed.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Hey, look, we've with some more calls in just a
moment with Google Sutherland. How should you involve should you
be with your child's education? And what actually does that
look like? It's easy to say, yes, you should be
right in there, but what does that look like? Does
it mean calling the school when your child's got a problem?
With something. Does it mean you're reading with them at night?
Does it mean, you know, making sure they do their homework?
Don mean helping them do their homework. We're doing it
(28:56):
for them? Just about I would have met I've argue
obviously no for that one. It's twenty two to sex
News Talks, it'd be yes, it is indeed with Google.
Sutherland talking about how involved you should be with the
child's education. Charlotte, Hello, Hi.
Speaker 7 (29:10):
My experience was reading was Mum and Dad had always
read to us, you know, right from the time we
were little. And my two brothers went to you know,
started school, and they had no trouble with the way
they're taught, but I had been. I was burnt with
boiling water when I was twenty two months older, and
(29:31):
I was five weeks in hospital before I came home.
In that time, I had some books in my bed,
but nobody ever read them to me. Mum and Dad
went down in the room. There was just this lady
with a white with a white uniform on the green walls.
No picture, no nothing. So anyway, I came home read Christmas.
And I started school a couple of years later, and
(29:53):
I I just couldn't get it. You know, when we
started doing this, reading it and I bought you know,
I used to have to bring books home from school.
You had to read them to parents at night, and
I mean they always read to us, but we had
to read to them in this and I just couldn't
get it. And Dad thought this is very ridiculous. So
(30:16):
he taught me the alphabet.
Speaker 6 (30:18):
And I can.
Speaker 7 (30:19):
Remember sitting in the Centralia's outside the chemist shop looking
at the name on the wall when I was about
probably five and a half six or something, and he
and I said, it's a chemist. And he said, well,
it's a good, good one. But you know, it's like
your name. Your name starts with a ch and you
(30:40):
call it Charlotte, but in this case that ch is
pronounced chemist. He said, okay, and you know, he explained
it all see, and that was fine, and I used
to you know, it was a game to us then,
you know, for a long time. Anyway, they went to
the and I was doing fine in them by reading
and everything. I learned to read and write and everything.
(31:02):
And when they went to the parent teachers Vita at
the end of my I suspect it was the end
of my first year. The dead would not let it
go on any longer. And they sat down to talk
to the teacher and she said, I'm sick of Charlotte
knowing all the words.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
I'm Charlotte, do you pop me up and ruin everyone else's.
Speaker 7 (31:27):
Well, yeah, I mean i'd look at the words she's
put it on the ball. Oh, yes, you know I
could work.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
That was all down to your dad. You and your
dad then, was it?
Speaker 7 (31:35):
Yes, yeah, because and I'm sure it was this hospitalization
that didn't It didn't allow me to pick it up
like my two brothers did and my sister below me.
They all they didn't have to be taught alphabetics or anything,
but I was. And once it was some done, you know,
I was fine. You know, I never had another book.
(31:55):
I could work out any word, and they always read
to us, you know.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah, I mean parental involvement and getting your kids to read.
And I think you can't just leave it up to
the schools. Charlotte. Yeah, And I think that actually that
is one of the problems, isn't it. Google that we face,
is that you know, we see with Erica Stanford and
you know, talking about literacy and what they're trying to
do to get more and more kids up to standard.
But if more and more parents would would not just
(32:24):
I don't mean don't trust the schools, but don't just
leave it to them.
Speaker 4 (32:28):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that's the point, isn't
it that that actually educating kids is a joint effort
between home and schools. But I think your question that
you've been asking all along is a really good one,
Tim in terms of what does that look like? And
you know, I think we've settled on things like reading
to your kids, reading with your kids, to paraphrase the
caller earlier, but just being interested, being involved, knowing where
(32:53):
they're at, how can and asking schools how can I
be of help if I've got concerns, let the schools
know and then ask the school and doing it together
in that kind of partnership way, because you know, I'm
not an educator, like with my kids, I'm no expecting education.
I don't really know what to do what am I
supposed to be doing? But you know, if I get
a bit of advice from school, we really help them.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
Yeah. Actually, just before you get to the next caller,
there's a great text here from another teacher, which I
think in a modern context is well, I'll just read
it Shell.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
Hi.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
They're a great topic teacher here from Emma. Parents can
make sure their children have good sleep habits, control over
screen use and devices, and get them outside with siblings
and mates doing activity and sport able to follow rules
and do what they're told, and develop emotional regulation and
the ability to fail and get back up brackets, resilience.
(33:48):
Social skills will be developed along with the academic process
needed if they're in place from early years. I sort
of feel that in the modern context that nails it,
doesn't it.
Speaker 4 (33:59):
Yeah, it's good. Yeah, it's interesting. She mentioned emotional regulation,
and that's one of the key findings from the need
and Longitudinal study is that one of the key things
to teach your kids as they're growing up is that
self regulation or help them to develop it. You can't
sort of teach it, but help them develop emotion regularly,
model it and model it. That absolutely, they've got to
learn that how to manage these big, intense feelings when
(34:22):
they come, because they will come, and that's that can
be a real gateway. Richie Pulton, you know, the late
Richie Pulton, who was the head of the study that
was that was what he said, was the key thing
if your teach your kids anything would be around self regulation.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Yeah. And actually that also forgetting whether you happen to
be riding shotgun, you know, going into talk to the
teacher every couple of weeks or something in the early days,
if you can get your kids to have a good
night's sleep, yeah, and feed them properly, control over the devices,
get them outside being active.
Speaker 4 (34:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
I mean, how far along the path are you to
doing the right job?
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Sitting them up pretty well? Aren't you sitting them up
pretty well?
Speaker 3 (35:02):
Excellent? I would say that was. There have been some
good texts to the show, but Emma, I think you've
nailed that one. Let's take away text of the week.
Imagine if we had that. It'd be fun. One day
you can get a special prize and get a sponsor
text of the week.
Speaker 8 (35:19):
Alita, Hello, oh hi there, I just pulled over and
underneath countdown, so I thought a bit call. This is interesting.
I'm a grandmother, but going back, my mother never read
to us as kids, okay, and I can admit I
did not read very much to my own children. However,
(35:43):
three generations down, I go visit my daughter and every
time I come, I go, and I actually stay in
the room with my well we slep it with my granddaughter.
I sleep in the room with her when I come visit,
and anyway, every night when I do go down, I
always read a book because she's used to doing this.
(36:05):
But backtracking a little bit, this granddaughter six, she's only
been in school about a year now, and previous to this,
when she was a toddler or a baby just with
a cock, my daughter of the parents used to throw
things in the cot so that when she used to
wake up really early, the parents went waking up. So
(36:25):
she had all these books. She had no toys in
the cop just these books. She has grown up as
a toddler baby just picking up books when she wakes
up in the morning and just looking at them and
probably imagining what these books are, you know. And consequently,
over the years, since she's been one or two, my
(36:46):
daughter put a put a shelf in, put box on
a shelf, and a little table in chairs, and for
the last couple of years, since she know she's become
three four, she actually gets up and she makes a
big mess in the room as well. But she has
all these books to choose from. Actually, I mean, I'm
(37:07):
amazed she I walk in there in the place of
an absolute bombshell, but you know what, she I'll find her
sitting there with a book and I just yea. Anyway, recently,
I was actually visiting and I read her a book
before she went to sleep. This book was kept in America,
and I looked at the words and I thought to myself,
hang on a minute, how does she know these words?
(37:28):
And I just looked and I thought, Young Jesus are
quite hard, quite long words. You know, it's just my
son in law.
Speaker 7 (37:37):
Why does she know these words?
Speaker 8 (37:38):
Oh, she's just been reading them for a little while,
and she just gets She looks at it, she looks
at the picture, and if they shared trouble with a word,
they help.
Speaker 7 (37:46):
Her with it.
Speaker 8 (37:46):
But consequently after that, she's she just keeps going. And
I just I'm really shocked.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
You're just talking about giving her the resources to you.
Speaker 8 (37:57):
Know, yeah, exactly. And it all started from strowing these
little books and the cop when the parents were going
to get up early and up in.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
The morning, sound like, toss a couple of these and
the way you go, Well, they.
Speaker 8 (38:12):
Did, and then I would not realize that just from
a baby that's you can that habit can actually just grow.
And consequently she loves books, so don't go around anywhere.
I take it with me and she's in her car
seat at the back. And the next minute, this little
five year old when she was this is last year,
(38:32):
she comes up. She heard me say something. She's that's
very interesting. So what do you know about interesting? Yeah,
that I had to stop and say that notal children
have a love for books. I understand because some of
my grandchildren they won't pick it up at all, and
they're the ones that are struggling at school right now. However,
(38:53):
this six year old, she's actually reading the equivalent of
an eight and nine year old right now.
Speaker 3 (38:59):
And I think it's good. You've given a good a
good humble grandma brag there.
Speaker 8 (39:04):
Oh she taught me something. You know, she has taught
me something. And I never would have thought, oh my gosh,
why didn't I do this when they have a baby.
Speaker 3 (39:12):
Well, you know, look, there's no perfect way about going
about any of this stuff. But yeah, that's a lovely
little story there. Actually, I mean the kids who don't
like reading it, I would just imagine it's because they
haven't been given the chance to enjoy it, isn't it.
I don't know. I don't want to summarize it.
Speaker 4 (39:29):
Yeah, I mean some kids will you know, some kids,
If you struggle with learning, then there's probably nothing worse
than having to look at a book. Really, it's like,
oh God, this is going to be effortful. But I
like that sort of what the caller was saying. They're
just sort of developing that environment where they where they're
interested in learning. There's not for it, but it's having
the resources around you, right. I was thinking how many
books I've got now? But I read a lot. I
(39:51):
read quite a lot. I usually have a book or
two and they go. But they're all on Kindle, So
you know, the number of physical books that we have
at home now is actually quite small. I was going, oh,
was that a good thing?
Speaker 3 (40:02):
Yeah, I know what you mean. I think it's it's
good to mix and match in a way. It's a
really good book. It's nice to actually own the physical thing.
But anyway, hey, look we need to take a break.
We'll be back in just to take it seven and
a half minutes to six news talks. He'd be thank
you for all your calls and your texts as well,
actually there's just one on the reading Google. Somebody says
that it's good for kids also to see us enjoying
reading as well, just you know, the role modeling sort
(40:25):
of thing. But actually, I think I think we've come
up with I wouldn't say we always discover the answer,
but I would have thought, read to your kids and
make sure they get a good night's sleep, A couple
of the bass and that's it.
Speaker 4 (40:37):
There we go. We've almost solved the education problem.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
There we go, Google Sutherland, the Ministry of Ed, Ministry
of Education. I think you might have some competition for
that one. Great to see you, mate, Thanks so much, mate,
Bye bye, and that wraps the parents squad. Tomorrow for
Smart Money, we've got a divorce lawyer on, so look
forward to that. Sharon Chanders with us and also Clear
(41:02):
Turnbull on nutrition on Nutrition will be joining. We'll catch
you again Sametime tomorrow and Man Travers is next when.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk ZB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Be okay again, Yes, welcome back to the Weekend Collective.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
I'm Tim Beverage and this is the Parents Squad where
we want your calls on eight hundred eighty and eighty
and text on nine two nine two. Sorry I was
about to stop the text number halfway through there. And look,
schools that have started back up, well, if they haven't
started back up, you must be one of the last
runs if you're about to start on Monday. Anyway, Look,
all parents, we want our kids to do well. You
(01:00):
know we're going to be doing the drop off, the pickup,
making sure the homework has done, forms a signed keeping
any on how everything's going. But the question that every
parent has, regardless of what age it is. In fact,
I think earlier on it's a bit more obvious, isn't it,
in terms of how involved you should be in your
child's education. And you know, maybe that is connected with
(01:23):
just reading to your kids before be it, or maybe
it's not, or quizzing them on their times tables. But
further on, how should you be involved with your child's
education without also being a parent who's like, hey, dad,
you know, I know what I'm doing here. Back off
that perennial decision. I guess it's with anything a parent
(01:44):
has to do as to when you trust your child
to be able to do more and more without you
writing shotgun all the time. So how involved should parents
really be in their in their children's education? Where's and
what's the balance? We love your calls on eight hundred
and eighty ten to eighty. What did you do with
your kids? When did you decide it was time to
(02:06):
back off? Or did you just say, look our schools.
You know they've got great teachers. They're there to do
a job. I'm just passing it over straight away. I
would tend to think that you might be in the minority,
or maybe you're not. But anyway to discuss that, among
other things. He is principal psychologist at Umbrella well Being,
and it's fair to say it looks like he hasn't
(02:27):
had a haircut during the holidays. It's pretty relaxed. It's
Doogle Sutherland, Doogle hair I'm good.
Speaker 4 (02:34):
Weirdly enough, you know what, my barber broke his finger
and true story, and so I couldn't get a haircut.
And then I kind of went, do you know what
I kind of my hair goes curly, and I haven't
had curly long here for a while. So I've let
it go. I've let it. I've trimmed it up at
the side.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
I think if you shaved that beard off, you'd be
looking about seventeen years old.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
I looked at a photo of me when I was
like seventeen years old, and it was like, hang on,
and I look like that now.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
So ah, that's called a hum brag. It's like, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
It is, it is. It's so I'm I'm keeping the
longer curely here. You're looking trim too. I thought, have
you been working out or going to the gym or living?
Speaker 3 (03:17):
Well, that's actually you know. The funny thing is that
you should say that is that I bought a I
bought a bike. I got my I got my mountain
bike and serviced and the guy who serviced it classic
called bike works, brilliant bike mechanic, and he just goes,
I'm selling I've got a carbon fiber bike here. You
can have it for five hundred bucks. I'm just selling
(03:37):
it from mate who's got another one. And I bought
it and I've been cycling four or five days a week.
Speaker 4 (03:42):
Wow, o, excellent.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
So I like to think, you know, anyway, it's got
nothing but thank you the mutual cop.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
That's that's that's that's It's good, isn't it. You've got
you've got to You're gonna look good and feel good
to be a good parent. Surely there's a connection there.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Does being vain make you a good parent?
Speaker 4 (04:08):
Oh my god, yes, there, that's how you want to
do it. I was feeling good and looking good? Does
that help you for your parent? Well?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
The funny thing was. The funny thing was we went
to a place called Tree Adventures out out west where
it's a fantastic facilly But I just I went with that,
you know, and I'm in my fifties, well into my fifties,
and we did it was with my thirteen and fourteen
year old, and they do bouldering and climbing and stuff,
(04:35):
so they're quite you know. And I said, I just
assume you should do the top level that you were
old enough for or tall enough for. So we booked
the Tazan level. Okay, and there was there are a
couple of things. I thought, oh my god, this is
just killing me totally and at the end, in fact
(04:56):
that the people there said, oh, we were watching you.
They said, actually, no, don't worry. You did well. But
and that's when I realized you could do easier versions
of it.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Were you harnessed him? Do you
have to get is this?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Oh yeah, you've got to clip in and out of
this and that. But you know that's good.
Speaker 4 (05:15):
Yeah. I just said, this sort of nightmarish vision of
you on a on a typwrite sort of balancing along
afty foot up without any equipment.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
No, you have the equipment, but the rest of it's true.
Speaker 4 (05:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
Well, oh that's good fun. I highly recommend it. Anyway.
How involved have you been well, did you make a
conscious effort to be involved with your kids' education?
Speaker 4 (05:41):
Well? Involved from the sidelines, I would say, in terms
of we let it was interesting as you were doing
the intro, I was reflecting on it. So our eldest
so he's twenty five, twenty six. Now, hey, we he
didn't love school, and we kind of didn't want to
put super heaps of pressure on him, so we just
sort of let him left in to it. He finished
(06:04):
school at end of year twelve, so didn't do year thirteen. Was,
which took me a little bit of getting to grips
with and oh my god. You know. Anyway, he went
off and did a few other things. He just went back.
He finished last year or the year before, he finished
his university degree in market and management and HR and
(06:26):
is now gainfully employed, which was kind of I guess what.
I sort of hoped for him to get a university education.
But he said to us, in a moment of clarity
at the end of year twelve, we said, look, I
just don't think I can do year thirteen. I think
school's not going to be right for me. I can
see myself getting into trouble. Oh I finish And we
went okay, and so we just we had we adopted
(06:48):
the route of sort of hands off ish for him.
We were still encouraging but interesting. With our daughter, she's
just his second year now, just starting a second year
of Midwiffrey training. When she was at school, her school
had a no homework policy. Her high school had no
homework until you got to senior school. So there wasn't
(07:08):
really much for us to do because they deliberately had
no homework.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
That actually that is because that is one of the
obvious ones isn't it what you said about your son
and that he made. I mean, it sounded the way
you described it as quite the self aware decision, like
this is going to work for me. And he wasn't
like I hate school. It's just like, I don't think
this is going to bring the breast out and bring
(07:35):
the best out of me. And your involvement wasn't actually listening.
I mean, that was him making an independent decision at
a young age that you support.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Was yeah, And to be fair to him, it was
probably he knew that the decision was not the one
that we would have agreed with. And my my wife
was better at it than I was. And she said
to us and she said, look, just give dad a
little while, Just give him a little while to come
around for the idea. Because I was like, oh no,
(08:03):
you got to go. You know, years thirteen, you've got
to get that university entrance even if you don't go
blah blah blah. Yeah, he was luck, he was. I
really respected him for that. He just said, hey, look
I could just see it, you know, just see year
thirteen being terrible for me, and I want to do
other things. So he went off and did some extra
training non university training, and then worked for a little
(08:27):
while and then decided he did want to go back.
It did want to go to UNI after all. So
from my point of view, it all worked out.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
For different parents. I mean, are there kids well, I mean,
I think I know the answer to this question. Every parent.
Every child is different and some need a bit of
a nudge, and some respond really well to a nudge,
and others are like the nudge me and I'm going
to run a mile And I guess that's the first thing.
But okay, if you go, let's let's go back to
early days. Do you remember the early days when your
(08:54):
kids were at school and what was your involvement in
their education back then?
Speaker 4 (09:00):
Yeah, I think it was. There wasn't heaps for us
to do. I've got to be honest, apart from make
sure they went to school and we read to them like,
you know, like people do. Actually, I think I think
that sort of idea about creating an environment that's supportive
of education, if you know what I mean, like reading
(09:21):
to your kids and supporting them without sort of in
a natural environment, without saying, come on, you've got to
knuckle down and do seven hours of homework tonight. I
think that I like that idea of just the environment
being broadly supportive and oriented towards education and you know,
having books around for kids to read, that kind of thing,
rather than sort of pushing and pushing and pushing and pushing. Yeah,
(09:44):
I'm not a great fan of that.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
In fact, as you say that, I think probably if
I was to try and sum up, and I'll give
them as anyone who's listened to me on rating the notes,
I'll give them a wife credit for this is that
the one thing I think you should do as a
parent is teach your kids read with your kids, yeah,
books in front of them. And I think if you
if you do thing else ever as a parent, I
(10:08):
think you've close to have nailed it if you can
get them on the love of books. And my wife
Anne Marie, has been amazing with my girls. Literally we
still have problems with devices. Yeah, you know and say right,
get off your device. But you know, the amazing thing
that still surprises me is I say, hey, come on,
put your device down and read. And I remember just
(10:29):
recently one of my daughters, you know, she's like, oh,
I don't really want to get off my phone. And
two minutes later, she's reading a book and I thought,
oh cool, Oh thank goodness. But that's probably the one
big thing every parent should do, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (10:42):
Yeah? It is. And I think reading with your kids
has so many more benefits than just educationally. I think
it teaches them language. I think it's sharing. I think
it helps with relationships with your kids. That's because it's you,
especially if it's just you reading to them, rather than saying, okay,
you've got to read this and get you know what,
it's just that it's just a lovely she had sense
some time. Do they still do that? You remember, you'll
(11:03):
remember that scheme that the used to do books and
homes with from Alan Duff Alan Duff, Yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah is that sort of thing, you know, because that
was the whole idea, right, let's get some books and
kids homes because not everybody can always afford them. So
I thought that was a great idea. You know, it
just just and hits on that idea about let's just
let's make sure that kids just have books available that
(11:24):
parents can read to them.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
From from what I can see, yeah, books and homes
dot org dot en z. And it was the Ellen
Duff foundation. I think it became so from what I
can see, yes, it is. It is still active. It's
just yeah, yeah, I guess it's just not in the
it's not in the forefront of the news headlines these days.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
They tell you what. We'll came around talking in just
a moment. But let's go. But let's bring someone else
into the conversation on how involved should parents be and
what's the most important thing a parent can do to
support their child's education. I think you've heard Google and
I probably agree that if you do one thing, and
that thing is teaching them a love of reading, you
can almost say job done. Almost maybe helen, Hello, yes, hi,
(12:12):
hied to them.
Speaker 5 (12:13):
I strongly believe that parents should be really involved in
their children's education, especially in the early years. And I'm
not one of these people that says that the constant
tests are a bad thing. I think that if the
tests are getting this bad reputation, it is because of
(12:34):
the way tests are done, and they should be made
done so that it's not putting children off. But if
you don't, if you don't have some way of testing,
you can have all these generations of kids just boiling
between the cracks and the jails are full of people
who can't read. So if you've got a child that's
not doing well with math, prinstance, you should find out why,
(13:00):
and Jolly will insist that they get told properly or
take mother MESSI just be really assertive about this because
you know, I actually think the tests are a very
good idea because.
Speaker 3 (13:15):
If you don't have well, you've got to you've got
to tell them where they're at. I mean, you've got
to keep tabs on where they're at. Actually, yeah, when
you said so, can I just ask Helen? So when
you say you you know earlier on there should be
constant involvement in your child's education, that's don't This is
not a challenge to you. But it's an easy thing
to say, But what does that actually look like?
Speaker 5 (13:37):
Well, I mean, if the kid's getting a bad report
or something, the parents it's up to the parents, the
parents responsibility to say why is this happening and find
out exactly why is this happening and you just get
something done about it. Because you can have parents who
are just going, oh, well, the teacher's always right and
blah blah blah. You know, I really feel that you've
(13:59):
got to get the basics right, and that there's too
many kids who go to the system leave the school.
They can't do maths, they can't read, and something was
done about this in the early years. And it's up
to the parents if this is happening, to absolutely insist
that something is done about this, put dempression on the
education system to get it done. I mean all these
(14:21):
you know, so the kids with disabilities are not getting
proper education. You know, people have got to stand up
for this sort of thing because it has lifelong impacts
on your life.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Actually, but I've come up with another one, Helen. Did
you used to go to the parent teacher interviews?
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Noel, I haven't got any children, but I'm talking about say, well,
my parents, but my parents for instance, I you know,
I had very good reasons why I am so hopeless
at maths. And I don't think naturally I'm not hopeless
because I was. I was quite a lot of time
(14:57):
when I was a child away from school for one
reason another you know, I had, I was quite a
sickly child. And no, you seem to realize that, you know,
to say maths education is a continuum and if you
miss out along the way on certain steps, so you
go to full I went through school without one one
(15:20):
mass teacher asked, I had none of my teachers, my
math teachers had any conversation with me from year right
through the school, right through the very well. I got
the university on good scholarships, but it was because of
all my other subjects. But it's really impacts very negatively
on my life. My math education is so bad.
Speaker 3 (15:41):
Yeah, yeah, actually, thanks Helen, because the parent teacher in
the view thing that I just tossed into the conversation. See,
that's the other one where here's the thing though, usually
the parents that turn up are not the ones that
the school really wants to see. It's a nice social
catch up for the teacher and the parents, but really
(16:04):
what the parents the teachers want to see is a
list of people whose names are not on that Parenteah.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
Yeah, they're often so passed up they're like five minutes
and you seak. That was like, but look, just a
couple of points I thought that Helen made were quite good.
I completely agree with her that if you if academic
achievement or being successful at school is really important for
later life, and as she said, the prison system is
full of people who have who have who academically have
(16:32):
not or have failed academically at school or school has
failed them the other thing too. It just made it
reminded me too that actually we've got a mass tudor
for our son at Uni no, sorry, a university student
to tutor our son at maths at school because he
was struggling. Uh, And I guess that's parental involvement. I
was like, mate, well.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
That's parental involvement. That's parental involvement.
Speaker 4 (16:54):
Google, It wasn't, but that wouldn't have gone well. But yeah, no,
we recognized from school reports, et cetera, that that that
something extra help was needed, and luckily we were able
to do that, you know, but not everybody's in that position.
But yeah, just that, you know, I think those are
some good points. Just you know, are you aware, are
(17:14):
you alert? Are you involved? Do you go to the
five the best the best parent teacher interviews? I either did.
They did them all on Zoom during lockdown one year,
and it was actually super easy because you just went
click click click from one room to the other. You
didn't have to walk across the wall or down to
C block or over to H block or up to
G four or something, and they just went boom, boom boom,
(17:34):
and that was much quicker.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
I thought, well, I'm quite a sociable being, so I
quite like I quite like the face to face. I
don't know if it's just about saying a lot of
different people or my wife's got to be like now,
just tim, just let her, let the teacher say what
they need to say. Just can you just stay quiet
for vit? ANDAM like, oh yes, yes, must remember to
do that. Anyway, Hey, we're going to be back in
(17:57):
just a moment. Cherry is up next. We're talking about
how involved should you be with your with your children's education.
But I think that the question is okay, you should
really be involved, but what does that look like? Eight
hundred eighty ten eighty. It's twenty five past five newstalks
hed be this news talks had been. My guest is
Google Sutherland. He's a psychologist at Umbrella. Well been. We're
talking about how involved should you be with your children's
(18:19):
education throughout the years and what does that that actually
look like? Is it involve, you know, turning up to
those parent teacher interviews. I've got a few. I've got
some brilliant texts actually that I'll get on to in
just a moment Google. But first, well, Cherry, Hello.
Speaker 6 (18:32):
Hello, I just am ringing to tell Toko your comment
about reading was your children rather than reading to your children.
I'm a retired teacher of far too many decades, but
the one thing that you know, I've noticed is that
(18:54):
parents read it's almost at the kids and don't get
them interactive. When you get to the end of the page,
say what do you think is going to happen next?
Or you know, so, will this little kid get found
or lost? Or will you can think of questions to ask,
because there's nowhere really in the education system where children
(19:19):
learn the dispositions of predicting or consequences and that can
start pre school. Was that kind of action at reading,
and it is just so important.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
The more that I think about the reading, it just
it's it is the no brainer that you should really
if you can as a parent, You've got to make
the effort to try and get your kids reading with you.
Speaker 6 (19:48):
Yes, but interactive. You know, you're asking questions. It's not
just reading to them and the kids sitting there passively.
It has to be an interactive process.
Speaker 3 (20:00):
Yeah, Hey, just out of curiosity. You were a teacher,
did you sort of when you were at sixty five
or did you work beyond that?
Speaker 6 (20:10):
I had an unusual teaching Korea because I didn't go
to training college. I walked straight into a teaching job.
I taught in Sydney, in the Australian Desert, in portabus, Newfoundland,
and an experimental school, and Madison, Wisconsin. Then I came
back to New Zealand and taught for twenty years in
(20:35):
one school, and then I saw the lights and opened
an early childcare center ever and next for twenty five years.
Speaker 3 (20:42):
Wow. So yes, it sounds like you still do it. It
sounds like you'd have to be about ninety to be
able to look back on that as something you've squeezed in.
Speaker 6 (20:52):
Not quite.
Speaker 3 (20:55):
Hey, No, the reason I asked you it's just just
by the bye because I see I know of more
and more more teachers who work beyond sixty five, simply
because the system needs them. That was all that was
really where I was leading.
Speaker 4 (21:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (21:09):
No, I yes, I taught beyond sixty five, but I
was working in my own early child care business, so
that was a little bit different. I worked with a
number of people who were not sixty five, who should
have retired ten years previously. But you know that's not
(21:30):
within the system.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
No, indeed, and nice to hear from your thanks for
your call. Actually, Google, there is the other thing about
and I think I've had some conversations with you know,
when you've got a concern about your child. I think
most kiwis are like, I don't want to be.
Speaker 4 (21:50):
Parents.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
You don't want to be that parent. And because I'm
married to a teacher, you know what that parent's like.
But you also need to advocate for your child and
if you think something's not right. And I would say
I've been lucky because I've had some you know people
through the job I do. I've interviewed some interesting people
and managed to have more time chatting to them about things.
(22:11):
And the one thing that came across from people involved
in education, it's like, we want to know, you know,
that's the last thing we want is for We actually
do need parents to tell us about their children. If
there's a concern, if there's something that's bothering them, then
you're doing it, you know, you share it with us,
And that's the other thing you should do as a parent,
doesn't it, I guess, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:32):
It's just that, Yeah, it's that regular homeschool communication are
getting information home from you know, from school and then
and then being able to feed that back as well.
Just keeping that feedback loop loop openly so that so
that kids don't fall through the cracks. I think two touches.
I was just reflecting on as Jerry was talking about
how reading to your kids. Everybody, we're all in agreement,
(22:54):
that's a great thing, but you know, it just shows
you that intergenerational gap if a parent struggles with literacy
and hasn't had help, and then how difficult it is
for them to read to their kids, and that flows
down the system. So you know, I you know, even
get even adults that they have missed out and getting
them some supporters well I like their books and homes
(23:15):
and and you know, even and teaching literacy in prisons
I think hugely important if we're going to help the
next generation of kids.
Speaker 3 (23:22):
Actually, for me, I don't so much recall much reading
with my with my parents, but probably as a parent.
I think my one of my memories that will stick
with me forever is simply, you know, lying down next
to my child and next one of my daughters and
just reading a book and having a chat, and then
of course that you relate. It's also the relationship building.
(23:45):
Yeah yeah, because it's in between the pages, something else
will pop out.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
Yeah yeah, different for generator, I remember generationally it's a
bit different. You know, you were talking about your kids
being on devices and screens. I can remember my brother
getting told off for reading too much when we were young.
Get outside, What are you doing inside.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
Reading a book?
Speaker 4 (24:05):
There you go? So I think you used to take
a book outside and just read it outside. You know,
there's always something to moan about, isn't there.
Speaker 3 (24:17):
Well, the old clich of everything in moderation, isn't it.
By the way, we love your calls on this. What
is look, what is getting involved in your children's education
look like? And you know, how do the rules change
over the years? Actually, just before I get onto the text,
because as kids go through the years, and I'm at
that age when my oldest is going to be facing
(24:38):
a first external exams and I'm not. You want to
make sure that she is coping and everything, and you
have conversations to help put things in perspective. If they're
getting a little bit you know, nervous. But when it
comes to the homework sort of thing, I always had
a rule of thumb that when the maths got too hard,
I had to back off.
Speaker 4 (24:58):
Anyway, I don't know what that actually means. I wouldn't
have no idea how to do that, to ask somebody
that does. But then that's the link back to school writers.
If you're if you're not sure, and she's not sure,
then you want to be able to feed that back
to school and say, hey, you know, my kids having
trouble with their maths. I can't help them in any suggestions.
And I guess that's a great interactive way of doing it,
(25:20):
just asking school what you can do to help them,
because often teachers are just looking for it, you know.
Oh yeah, we've got heaps of ideas and heaps of
solutions if you only just asked.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
Okay, here's one from a teacher. Actually, yeah, Cratim. As
a teacher, I love for families to be involved and
ask questions, tell me things they want me to know.
I'm in a year one to year eight primary school.
As a parent, I've been involved as far as making
sure I know what's going on at school and that
my kids are happy. I'm very fortunate that they've had
few issues with learning or behavior. As far as helping
(25:49):
them out. Suffice it to say, I just help my
daughter refine her architecture PhD proposal. She still trusts me
even though I have very little knowledge of the actual topic.
Oh well, yeah, okay.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
That sounds That sounds like there's a lovely relationship there.
It doesn't it though? When somebody could go to their
their mum and say, could you've got mom, I don't
know if it's a mom, sorry able parents, and say,
you know, can you help me with my PhD topic?
Speaker 3 (26:15):
It's like, okay, yeah, I imagine it's probably just with
the grammar and the structure and the consult.
Speaker 4 (26:20):
Yeah, I assumed. So making it, making it read well
and making it.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
As opposed to your design sucks.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Yeah that doesn't sound very good. That's interesting. You know,
you touch the touch on kids getting nervous. They do
get anxious before those exams. I remember my daughter being
in fits before her first exam. But it's I think
it's a good lesson to learn, right is how do
I how do I manage that pressure, whether it's an
exam or a test or whatever. But there's heaps of
times when we have to perform under pressure, but often
(26:47):
kids get super anxious in those first few few exams.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
I think, actually, that's one of the biggest challenges of parenthood,
is helping your kids put things in perspective for lessons
you've learned, you know. So, yeah, I mean I was lucky.
I guess I never panic during exams. I always had
a level of confidence that I pass at least. But
you know, I could imagine I've got one of my
(27:11):
daughters will get a bit tense about it, and I
just want to tell her that ultimately the sun will
come up tomorrow in the east and set in the west. Ye,
And you know, there's but it does, you know what
I mean, trying to put in perspective that even failure
is not catastrophic, but of course it would be for them.
Speaker 4 (27:28):
Yes, yeah, well that's if that's your entire world. I
know exactly what you mean. It's like when you look
back at school, it's like, does it really matter whether
I got an A or a B or a C
in the subject? Not really, as long as I kind
of passed.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
Like c's get degrees.
Speaker 4 (27:44):
It does a little bit, But you know, Ultimately, who
looks go Who goes back and looks at your once
you're once you're doing whatever, Who goes back and look
at looks at your school records? But yeah, when when
you're in the middle of it, when you're fifteen, it's
the it's the it's your world, and it's a big thing.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Did you have school certain when you were Yeah.
Speaker 4 (28:02):
We had school shirt and I think I was. I
did a sixth form was UI and I don't know
what seventh form was, just sort of mucking around.
Speaker 3 (28:10):
That's funny. I can tell you my my marks I
got in school shirt but nothing else. Yeah, I don't
know why, but school it's because it's the first external exam.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
Chip, first big one. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, what
I got.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
I know. I'm not going to rattle it off now
because you.
Speaker 4 (28:27):
Know, I'm sure they were very good ground mixed.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Hey, look, we've with some more calls in just a
moment with Google Sutherland. How should you involve should you
be with your child's education? And what actually does that
look like? It's easy to say, yes, you should be
right in there, but what does that look like? Does
it mean calling the school when your child's got a problem?
With something. Does it mean you're reading with them at night?
Does it mean, you know, making sure they do their homework?
Don mean helping them do their homework. We're doing it
(28:56):
for them? Just about I would have met I've argue
obviously no for that one. It's twenty two to sex
News Talks, it'd be yes, it is indeed with Google.
Sutherland talking about how involved you should be with the
child's education. Charlotte, Hello, Hi.
Speaker 7 (29:10):
My experience was reading was Mum and Dad had always
read to us, you know, right from the time we
were little. And my two brothers went to you know,
started school, and they had no trouble with the way
they're taught, but I had been. I was burnt with
boiling water when I was twenty two months older, and
(29:31):
I was five weeks in hospital before I came home.
In that time, I had some books in my bed,
but nobody ever read them to me. Mum and Dad
went down in the room. There was just this lady
with a white with a white uniform on the green walls.
No picture, no nothing. So anyway, I came home read Christmas.
And I started school a couple of years later, and
(29:53):
I I just couldn't get it. You know, when we
started doing this, reading it and I bought you know,
I used to have to bring books home from school.
You had to read them to parents at night, and
I mean they always read to us, but we had
to read to them in this and I just couldn't
get it. And Dad thought this is very ridiculous. So
(30:16):
he taught me the alphabet.
Speaker 6 (30:18):
And I can.
Speaker 7 (30:19):
Remember sitting in the Centralia's outside the chemist shop looking
at the name on the wall when I was about
probably five and a half six or something, and he
and I said, it's a chemist. And he said, well,
it's a good, good one. But you know, it's like
your name. Your name starts with a ch and you
(30:40):
call it Charlotte, but in this case that ch is
pronounced chemist. He said, okay, and you know, he explained
it all see, and that was fine, and I used
to you know, it was a game to us then,
you know, for a long time. Anyway, they went to
the and I was doing fine in them by reading
and everything. I learned to read and write and everything.
(31:02):
And when they went to the parent teachers Vita at
the end of my I suspect it was the end
of my first year. The dead would not let it
go on any longer. And they sat down to talk
to the teacher and she said, I'm sick of Charlotte
knowing all the words.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
I'm Charlotte, do you pop me up and ruin everyone else's.
Speaker 7 (31:27):
Well, yeah, I mean i'd look at the words she's
put it on the ball. Oh, yes, you know I
could work.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
That was all down to your dad. You and your
dad then, was it?
Speaker 7 (31:35):
Yes, yeah, because and I'm sure it was this hospitalization
that didn't It didn't allow me to pick it up
like my two brothers did and my sister below me.
They all they didn't have to be taught alphabetics or anything,
but I was. And once it was some done, you know,
I was fine. You know, I never had another book.
(31:55):
I could work out any word, and they always read
to us, you know.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yeah, I mean parental involvement and getting your kids to read.
And I think you can't just leave it up to
the schools. Charlotte. Yeah, And I think that actually that
is one of the problems, isn't it. Google that we face,
is that you know, we see with Erica Stanford and
you know, talking about literacy and what they're trying to
do to get more and more kids up to standard.
But if more and more parents would would not just
(32:24):
I don't mean don't trust the schools, but don't just
leave it to them.
Speaker 4 (32:28):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that's the point, isn't
it that that actually educating kids is a joint effort
between home and schools. But I think your question that
you've been asking all along is a really good one,
Tim in terms of what does that look like? And
you know, I think we've settled on things like reading
to your kids, reading with your kids, to paraphrase the
caller earlier, but just being interested, being involved, knowing where
(32:53):
they're at, how can and asking schools how can I
be of help if I've got concerns, let the schools
know and then ask the school and doing it together
in that kind of partnership way, because you know, I'm
not an educator, like with my kids, I'm no expecting education.
I don't really know what to do what am I
supposed to be doing? But you know, if I get
a bit of advice from school, we really help them.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
Yeah. Actually, just before you get to the next caller,
there's a great text here from another teacher, which I
think in a modern context is well, I'll just read
it Shell.
Speaker 5 (33:24):
Hi.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
They're a great topic teacher here from Emma. Parents can
make sure their children have good sleep habits, control over
screen use and devices, and get them outside with siblings
and mates doing activity and sport able to follow rules
and do what they're told, and develop emotional regulation and
the ability to fail and get back up brackets, resilience.
(33:48):
Social skills will be developed along with the academic process
needed if they're in place from early years. I sort
of feel that in the modern context that nails it,
doesn't it.
Speaker 4 (33:59):
Yeah, it's good. Yeah, it's interesting. She mentioned emotional regulation,
and that's one of the key findings from the need
and Longitudinal study is that one of the key things
to teach your kids as they're growing up is that
self regulation or help them to develop it. You can't
sort of teach it, but help them develop emotion regularly,
model it and model it. That absolutely, they've got to
learn that how to manage these big, intense feelings when
(34:22):
they come, because they will come, and that's that can
be a real gateway. Richie Pulton, you know, the late
Richie Pulton, who was the head of the study that
was that was what he said, was the key thing
if your teach your kids anything would be around self regulation.
Speaker 3 (34:35):
Yeah. And actually that also forgetting whether you happen to
be riding shotgun, you know, going into talk to the
teacher every couple of weeks or something in the early days,
if you can get your kids to have a good
night's sleep, yeah, and feed them properly, control over the devices,
get them outside being active.
Speaker 4 (34:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
I mean, how far along the path are you to
doing the right job?
Speaker 4 (34:59):
Sitting them up pretty well? Aren't you sitting them up
pretty well?
Speaker 3 (35:02):
Excellent? I would say that was. There have been some
good texts to the show, but Emma, I think you've
nailed that one. Let's take away text of the week.
Imagine if we had that. It'd be fun. One day
you can get a special prize and get a sponsor
text of the week.
Speaker 8 (35:19):
Alita, Hello, oh hi there, I just pulled over and
underneath countdown, so I thought a bit call. This is interesting.
I'm a grandmother, but going back, my mother never read
to us as kids, okay, and I can admit I
did not read very much to my own children. However,
(35:43):
three generations down, I go visit my daughter and every
time I come, I go, and I actually stay in
the room with my well we slep it with my granddaughter.
I sleep in the room with her when I come visit,
and anyway, every night when I do go down, I
always read a book because she's used to doing this.
(36:05):
But backtracking a little bit, this granddaughter six, she's only
been in school about a year now, and previous to this,
when she was a toddler or a baby just with
a cock, my daughter of the parents used to throw
things in the cot so that when she used to
wake up really early, the parents went waking up. So
(36:25):
she had all these books. She had no toys in
the cop just these books. She has grown up as
a toddler baby just picking up books when she wakes
up in the morning and just looking at them and
probably imagining what these books are, you know. And consequently,
over the years, since she's been one or two, my
(36:46):
daughter put a put a shelf in, put box on
a shelf, and a little table in chairs, and for
the last couple of years, since she know she's become
three four, she actually gets up and she makes a
big mess in the room as well. But she has
all these books to choose from. Actually, I mean, I'm
(37:07):
amazed she I walk in there in the place of
an absolute bombshell, but you know what, she I'll find her
sitting there with a book and I just yea. Anyway, recently,
I was actually visiting and I read her a book
before she went to sleep. This book was kept in America,
and I looked at the words and I thought to myself,
hang on a minute, how does she know these words?
(37:28):
And I just looked and I thought, Young Jesus are
quite hard, quite long words. You know, it's just my
son in law.
Speaker 7 (37:37):
Why does she know these words?
Speaker 8 (37:38):
Oh, she's just been reading them for a little while,
and she just gets She looks at it, she looks
at the picture, and if they shared trouble with a word,
they help.
Speaker 7 (37:46):
Her with it.
Speaker 8 (37:46):
But consequently after that, she's she just keeps going. And
I just I'm really shocked.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
You're just talking about giving her the resources to you.
Speaker 8 (37:57):
Know, yeah, exactly. And it all started from strowing these
little books and the cop when the parents were going
to get up early and up in.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
The morning, sound like, toss a couple of these and
the way you go, Well, they.
Speaker 8 (38:12):
Did, and then I would not realize that just from
a baby that's you can that habit can actually just grow.
And consequently she loves books, so don't go around anywhere.
I take it with me and she's in her car
seat at the back. And the next minute, this little
five year old when she was this is last year,
(38:32):
she comes up. She heard me say something. She's that's
very interesting. So what do you know about interesting? Yeah,
that I had to stop and say that notal children
have a love for books. I understand because some of
my grandchildren they won't pick it up at all, and
they're the ones that are struggling at school right now. However,
(38:53):
this six year old, she's actually reading the equivalent of
an eight and nine year old right now.
Speaker 3 (38:59):
And I think it's good. You've given a good a
good humble grandma brag there.
Speaker 8 (39:04):
Oh she taught me something. You know, she has taught
me something. And I never would have thought, oh my gosh,
why didn't I do this when they have a baby.
Speaker 3 (39:12):
Well, you know, look, there's no perfect way about going
about any of this stuff. But yeah, that's a lovely
little story there. Actually, I mean the kids who don't
like reading it, I would just imagine it's because they
haven't been given the chance to enjoy it, isn't it.
I don't know. I don't want to summarize it.
Speaker 4 (39:29):
Yeah, I mean some kids will you know, some kids,
If you struggle with learning, then there's probably nothing worse
than having to look at a book. Really, it's like,
oh God, this is going to be effortful. But I
like that sort of what the caller was saying. They're
just sort of developing that environment where they where they're
interested in learning. There's not for it, but it's having
the resources around you, right. I was thinking how many
books I've got now? But I read a lot. I
(39:51):
read quite a lot. I usually have a book or
two and they go. But they're all on Kindle, So
you know, the number of physical books that we have
at home now is actually quite small. I was going, oh,
was that a good thing?
Speaker 3 (40:02):
Yeah, I know what you mean. I think it's it's
good to mix and match in a way. It's a
really good book. It's nice to actually own the physical thing.
But anyway, hey, look we need to take a break.
We'll be back in just to take it seven and
a half minutes to six news talks. He'd be thank
you for all your calls and your texts as well,
actually there's just one on the reading Google. Somebody says
that it's good for kids also to see us enjoying
reading as well, just you know, the role modeling sort
(40:25):
of thing. But actually, I think I think we've come
up with I wouldn't say we always discover the answer,
but I would have thought, read to your kids and
make sure they get a good night's sleep, A couple
of the bass and that's it.
Speaker 4 (40:37):
There we go. We've almost solved the education problem.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
There we go, Google Sutherland, the Ministry of Ed, Ministry
of Education. I think you might have some competition for
that one. Great to see you, mate, Thanks so much, mate,
Bye bye, and that wraps the parents squad. Tomorrow for
Smart Money, we've got a divorce lawyer on, so look
forward to that. Sharon Chanders with us and also Clear
(41:02):
Turnbull on nutrition on Nutrition will be joining. We'll catch
you again Sametime tomorrow and Man Travers is next when.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to News
Talk ZB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
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