Talking to kids about death

Grim, we know but death is as much a part of life as life itself, so let's have a chat about it now before we have to.

We have both had to explain to curious young minds the process of death and funerals (Clint as recently as last week), so this week we will talk abut how we do it, and what the experts say.

Enjoy!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey guys, before we get into this week's episode, I
just wanted to give you a quick reminder of how
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Speaker 2 (00:10):
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(00:32):
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Speaker 1 (00:52):
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The Parenting Hangover at gmail dot com. Thanks guys, Hello everybody,
and welcome to a very somber.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
And serious inside the Parents Fever.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
Now we'll have fun with it, but we are going
to talk about death. We're going to talk about dying
and talking to children about it, because like it or not,
death is as much a part of life as life itself.
But kids are really interesting in the questions that they
have when this thought sort of thing comes around. And
I think, as a parent, you want to protect them
as much as possible, So how do we do that
to them?

Speaker 2 (01:31):
It is tough, especially when you've come home with that
brochure about the new style where you can be buried
under a tree, and you left the brochure out. The
kids saw it and they're like, what's the dad. You're like, Oh,
that's me being that didn't happen. But these are the
weird and wonderful questions that kids ask. They ask anything
and everything. I've gone through a little bit of it.
Klet's facing his first time, and we together try to

(01:54):
figure out the best way to tackle this. I think
we had some I think we got there.

Speaker 1 (01:58):
I think we got there. We're going to amble on
a lot about how our kids are first put about
midway through this podcast. It's all about death.

Speaker 2 (02:05):
I actually liked the tree idea, though we didn't get
that tree. We didn't get into that in the extual
episode because I didn't want to make another weird leap
like my brain jays.

Speaker 1 (02:14):
But yeah, and then in thirty years cut me down
and make me into a coffee table.

Speaker 2 (02:19):
Yeah, I think the tree things awesome. You find a
piece of land where you know nothing's going to happen,
and you get buried, and then your kids can go
and eat under the air. They can climb mutes, they
can fertilize you, dogs can pass on you. I seriously,
I'm a massive advocate. I'm a big fan. How's the kids, bro,
The kids are good. Look. I know we've said we

(02:40):
won't talk about it much, and we kind of skimmed
over it last week or had it happened last week? No,
it happens straight after the record. I went down like
a pile of shit with the flu. Skim over it.
I've annoyed my wife by saying when I go to bed. No, babe,
I'm not going to get the sweats. They've gone. I
had the sweets today, They're done. And then I wake
up at like two am and I freak myself out

(03:01):
at how wet my body is and I have to
get up. I have to go and have a shower.
And yep. So Nala has been fighting the same thing.
We had the great email come around from the school saying, hey, guys,
there's currently two things going around. One is like a
tummy bug and a blah blah that makes poos and spews.
The other is a fever like thing. Nala's caught both

(03:24):
of them. Nala, Nala has been off school. This is
my six year old for oh what eight days, like
from last Saturday to the weekend that we've just gone.
She's it's Monday right now? What is it Tuesday? Right now?
This is her first day back at school today, Like
it hit her hard and no one else got it
by me a little bit of it and look, we'll
skim past it. I might sound a touch kroky. I'm

(03:46):
about ninety five percent back to being all good.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
Too bad about skimming over it because I caught up
with some friends and to do, which we'll talk about
later in the podcast. But on Friday I had to
make come over to me and he said, Hey, love
the podcast. My favorite thing that you guys do is
the first thing you do is how's the kids? And
you talk about how shit everything is going, including sickness,
and they go it's so relatable. Bro, makes me feel normal,

(04:11):
makes me feel like I'm I'm living the exact same
life as you guys.

Speaker 2 (04:14):
This podcast has made me really aware of I feel
like I've got a mate down who lives in the
mount and he says to me, Bro, he doesn't listen
to the podcast, but he's just like, mate, you're always
sick or your family's always sick? Really really are we?
And then we started this podcast and we just joke

(04:35):
about how often we're talking about being sick. But look,
it is winter here in New Zealand right now. Touch
wood the others have got like a touch of something
like most kids do this time of year. But no
one house has caught the death plague, the crazy plague.

Speaker 1 (04:48):
You didn't touch any wood. You didn't touch any wood.
Oh sorry, hat behind you, I can see a creak
of bat you. No, I'm going to run over and
touch that if you need.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
To know my deskers? Would I can't touch that when
it's worth lots of money. It's got signatures of amazing
black caps on it.

Speaker 1 (05:03):
But do you and your wife have a spare bed situation?
So if you're a sweety mess, do you can you
relocate to the spear bed to give her and you
a bit of sleep and mean that you don't have
to change those sheets every night.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
I could. We kind of flashed back and giggle. At
about ten years ago, I caught my first ever flu
and she made me this is when we had one kid,
and she made me set up the earbed and put
it in the lounge. And you know it's inflatable. Hairbds
just have no wicking ability. There's no like any moisture
that lands on them is just kind of pool there.

(05:37):
And so I've been told I have to I've got
the flu, Jordan, I don't want to catch it. You
have to sleep out there. And it was just I
would wake up like it was a swimming pool and
I had to put towels down and the flu. I
had never got it, or I used to hear people
about the flu and I got the full like I
was in the shivering and I knew nothing about it,
so I was doing the wrong things. I wish Jody
is at work. It's like one pm in the afternoon,

(05:59):
I am shuddering in the lounge and I would cover
myself in more and more blankets. And that's the worst thing,
because is it. Yeah, the shuddering is your body. Apparently
your body already has a temperature. Your body's trying to
cook this virus that you've got, right, so it raises
your temperature to make your insides not that nice for
this virus you've got. And then it'll drop a bit

(06:19):
and it'll lift up again, and you're not meant to
try and bake yourself like a potato. And I am
like in the shuddering. All you want to do is
wrap yourself warm. And I would bake myself and then
all of a sudden I'd be freezing. And there were
moments there, man, like I remember, we laugh about it,
like ten years ago, where I was just one pm
in the afternoon saying to myself, I'm fine if you
take me now, Lord, I'm fine.

Speaker 1 (06:40):
I've had enough.

Speaker 2 (06:42):
How long can you make me shiver?

Speaker 3 (06:44):
Now?

Speaker 2 (06:44):
Like I've had enough?

Speaker 1 (06:45):
One kid not to focus on the sweat bit too much,
But isn't it disgusting to think about how much sweat
must end up inside your mattress? If that much pulled
on top of the air bed, where does it go
when you're not on a plastic bed.

Speaker 2 (06:59):
We've got we've got quite, We've got no, we've got
quite a good hearty cover. And what is it Metris.

Speaker 1 (07:04):
Cover, metros protector.

Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think Jodi might have had that
in her mind from ten years ago when I sweated
that badly that She's like, yeah and.

Speaker 1 (07:11):
Went because you had that bed winning problem for a while.

Speaker 2 (07:14):
Total, Look, we don't want to talk about that. Au
For a.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
While they were calling you wee Willie winky and you're
winning the bed every night.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, but Jodi was also shouting a lot, so we
had to put it down. She had a shar issue. Yeah. Anyway,
long story short. She didn't make me sleep anywhere differently
this time, because I promised her I was okay. She
did put up a massive like throw pillow between us.
A cushion stood it up right between our pillow so
it was like a square so I couldn't cough into
her face and I wasn't anyway. You know, you roll

(07:39):
over and you try and do your quietus cough at
one am in the morning and it wakes up the
whole house. But I was I'm not going to sweet
tonight and woke up and it was just terrible. Yeah,
and look, the kids had a teacher's only day yesterday
the primary school out of the blue. We don't want
to get into what the teachers were doing. We don't
want to go down that road again. But I on

(08:00):
a Monday, on a Monday, they had a teacher's only day.
I thought it was the whole in New Zealand. I
think it was just this primary school. I think they
had like a poker day at the primary or something
like a poker tournament. I don't know. Yeh, teachers, man,
I'm going to get some evils again when I go
into school. Alba.

Speaker 1 (08:19):
My my favorite thing on the teacher's only day is
recently i've heard, yeah, we didn't use enough of the
teacher's only day last year, so we actually legally have
to have a few more this year to bring our
teacher only day quote up. But you have to use
them like if you don't use them, that the government's
going to come for you and go how come you
ever had had enough teacher only days this year.

Speaker 2 (08:38):
I don't know. There's a lot of there's a lot
of confusing bits, man, I don't know how it works.
Alba this week has like she's like, Dad, I'm off
to school after my teacher's only day. I've now got
choir practice all day today and I'm off to another
primary school to do choir practice. And I'm like, oh,
is your choir performance with other school? She's like, no, Oh,
you're just going to another school to practice you And
she's like yeah, but this again is coming from It's

(09:00):
then she has kappahaka or a netble tournament.

Speaker 1 (09:03):
Sorry that she joined another schools choir.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
No, like her school's going to practice at another school. Oh, look,
I haven't read the newsletter properly, okay. And then she's
got a full day netble tournament thing tomorrow. And I
just stopped to think and I say it to him,
like do you think you're going to do any reading, writing,
and meth This week they get to an age or
it seems like they have so much on where me
and Jody sometimes look at each other like shit, have

(09:26):
you or they'll come home and I'll jokingly be like,
what do you learn today, And they'll go, oh, we
did this, and then we had pei the last few hours,
like we were practicing this pe game like did you
do a bitter? ABC? Singing? Did you do a bitter? Anyway,
we look, we've already ruffled teachers feathers. I'm I'm all
for life lessons. If they're out they're doing stuff.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
And active healthy kids are very important. You shared a
thing on our Instagram this week about about healthy kids
and countries that have a problem with child obesity. So
it's great, it's great, and I'm sure they learn better
if they're out there burning a bunch of energy off
as well.

Speaker 2 (09:58):
Right, and my crazy brain is just going to leap
into that video I shared for those who didn't see it.
Japan has an obesity rate excuse if this is a
few percent off of about four percent. America is at
like forty four. New Zealand, I believe are the worse.
We might be even higher. I believe New Zealand is
like the first or second worst in the world for obesity.
We are terrible. So it's like we're at like maybe

(10:19):
forty forty forty five percent.

Speaker 1 (10:21):
I read something on that once though, that that is
stats for only from countries that correctly report their obesity statistics.
So because we are really honest about our information, it
puts us way higher where there will be countries out
there who are fudging the data or just not paying
that much attention to their like the health of their
children and things like that. Not to excuse it or

(10:42):
to write it off, but yeah, we are. I think
we're disproportionately higher because we are because of our honesty.

Speaker 2 (10:48):
Yes, as Clint sitting here eating a six pack of
donuts and a Sasage roll as he does this podcast,
you are such an honest guy. But Japan right, It's true.
You try and think of obese Japanese people, it's hard
to even think of a overwhel a person. Yes, so okay, okay,
they're obviously not in the statistics, you know, four percent.

Speaker 1 (11:05):
This journal wrestler community is like, this is terrible, guys,
We've only got four percent obesity. We really need to
get these numbers up for the future of Zumo wrestling.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
This journalist, Western journalist goes into these japan schools and
says to the kids, tell me your favorite foods. They
say things like broccoli, seaweed, rice, And he says to
his translator, are these kids taking the purse? And the
translator is like, no, we teach our kids that these
are young foods, like healthy foods are young foods? Do
you not where you're from? He's just like whoa. His

(11:35):
mind was blown, and.

Speaker 1 (11:38):
I like the idea that this school knows this Western
journalist is coming though, and it rounds up all the
kids like, okay, he's going to say watch every food.
You're going to say brocoli. Okay, because like, hah yeah,
that's crack up. I'll definitely say.

Speaker 2 (11:49):
I would agree. But then when you've got four percent
obesity rate and you're just killing the world in health
like cleaning up, it made sense and it made me
really pinch myself and be like, what is this Western
culture we've all fallen into. How you might not be
from a Western culture we're listening to right now, but
you get what I mean. Our fast foods our, quick
foods our? So what are you going to do about it?

Speaker 1 (12:08):
Are you going to start making a more Japanese style
diet for your children's lunchboxes?

Speaker 2 (12:13):
We're quite good like their rule this was at the
school's rule was no processed food. It's banned. The school
does not accept processed food. They eat whole foods every day.
So I don't want to be culturally insensitive, but I'm
thinking they have their rice, they're having their fish or chicken,
they're having broccoli, and it's like all prepared that morning.

(12:33):
Where we're quite good, where we don't send anything packaged,
like the kids don't have packaged stuff.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
Is that a U rule or is that a school rule?

Speaker 2 (12:42):
No, the school rule. You can take as much as
you want, you just can't leave. There's no rubbish bins
at our school, okay, like a lot of schools are now.
But we're not just trying in little packets of chips
and packeted musli bars and packeted biscuits because usually that's shit.
We'll try and buy better brands we like and buy them.
Excuse I'm not trying to sound like Jesus here, because look,
you buy them in larger packets so you don't have
it's more rubbish in our head, like we think we

(13:04):
don't want to be literally in a red way. Yeah,
so and when you do the math. I've talked about
this before. Yeah. We send our kids little We send
them with little corn chips and we buy the bog
bags and you just put a hand. You get a
lunchbox that has the compartments and you save so much
more money. If you're one of those people that's still
eighteen eighteen multi pack of chips is good, it is not.

Speaker 3 (13:25):
Give use a.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
Block bag the corn chips and you just put them
tread in the line.

Speaker 2 (13:28):
No, man, there's a there's a compartment in the lunch box.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
For they don't go soggy.

Speaker 2 (13:31):
They don't go no, no, no, no, they're in their
own when the lid shuts, it's air tight that all
the compartments are air tight. There's no rubbish. But anyway,
the Japan thing, there is no rubbish. I am amazing
done on Trump's out.

Speaker 1 (13:46):
I've never seen less rubbish. My children don't have any rubbish.

Speaker 2 (13:50):
I've rambled too long for my house, the kids moment,
and we don't even I've forgot busy.

Speaker 1 (13:56):
That's sack. They're eating healthy.

Speaker 2 (13:58):
And Japan's amazing. In Japan, if you're listening from Japan tourism,
it's one of the countries I really want to go to.
So if you cant hook me up. They'd be real great.
Hey Clinton, how's your kids?

Speaker 1 (14:07):
Well, we're actually saying that we want to take both
of our families. There were saying we wanted to, you know,
we want to do a podcast in Japan.

Speaker 2 (14:13):
Your two OBEs.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
My kids are good. We have employed the age old
parenting technique that we've never employed before, but we need
to because Maggie, my second daughter, is very different to
my first daughter. We're now using a sticker chart to
try and convince Maggie to sleep through the night. We've
done the grow clock, We've done the taking things away,
the threat of punishment, We've done all those things. She

(14:39):
still gets up and she will be up for like
an hour and a half in the middle of the night,
just like hanging out and continuing to come downstairs and
pester Lucy. We've talked about this before. I quite often
wake up and find out how often she was awake
in the night the next day. But I can't help
that because she doesn't want anything to do with me.
So the new thing is a sticker chart, and we

(15:00):
she fills up a full month of the sticker chart
with full night sleeps, then she gets a reward that
she's chosen and she's chosen a toy from Farmers the
department store, and so far.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
So good, a sturver of flu. I just had to
get that.

Speaker 1 (15:13):
Out two nights and that's good.

Speaker 2 (15:16):
Look it's it's such a cute little premise. You know,
the old sticker chart we had. We have fond memories
of thinking back to our primary school years where that
year one, year two, when you're five and six, you
teach you at the sticker chart and you've got something
at the end of the week and you got to
stand up there. We we've used a stick a chart
for Nala's thumbsucking. Nala likes to see her thumb Meehler
did it and we told her one day when she

(15:38):
was like two, that your fingers will fall off and
she stopped that day. Alba did it a little bit
and we use the same kind of tactic. It took
a little longer, but she stopped because of the fair
and we've told Nala the same thing. It just doesn't
work when she gets real loopy, like drunk tired. It's
just straight in there and like they go for the
little dental checkups and the dentists said, hey, I can
tell you've got a thumbsucker here. You need to get

(15:59):
it to stop. We've employed the sticker chart and it
works all well, and she's like, oh my gosh, I've
gone this many days without doing it. And then it's just.

Speaker 1 (16:06):
That she's Have you done the yuck tasting nail polish.

Speaker 2 (16:09):
We've done the yuck tasting nail polish. We've done the
little thing you put on their thumb.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
Like.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
She's much better. It used to be constant. Now it's
only like when she's just about to go to sleep,
it's in there, and then when I go in five
minutes later, I pull it out when she's fast asleep.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
Have you tried handcuffing her?

Speaker 2 (16:23):
No, it's frowned upon. Yeah. Also there we put a
dog collar on shot collars, Yeah, shot collar. So I
just watched her and as soon as she went to
put it, not on chockmo, just on heavy vibrate.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
So it's one on the other. A you don't handcuffed
and shot collar? You got to do?

Speaker 3 (16:37):
What?

Speaker 2 (16:38):
But or sure is it?

Speaker 1 (16:39):
There's a jokes.

Speaker 2 (16:40):
There's jokes. By the way, that was a joke. There
was a joke. She'll like hide under a blanket and
do it. It's like her vape. It's like her blueberry vape.

Speaker 1 (16:50):
She's doing some illegal thumb sucking. My issue with the
sticker chat, which I don't have an issue with it
yet it has worked. I just know that. And the
sticker chat is excellent when she's well behaved, when she's
kicking off, and when she doesn't want to go back
to bed and it's been two hours and it's three
o'clock in the morning, the thread of not getting a
sticker on the sticker chart is not going to be

(17:10):
weighty enough. She's going to, in her toddler language, gonna
go I don't give a rat's ass about the sticker chart.
I don't care. They don't care.

Speaker 2 (17:19):
In the moment she's gonna turn around, you're gonna be groggy.
It'll be the one time you've worken to hear anything right,
you think nothing happens. You're gonna wake up and you'll
be a bit groggy, and you'll just hear Maggie lean
over and say, fuck your sticker chart.

Speaker 1 (17:36):
The sticker chart is also stupidly in her room, and
she's this kind of kid who would go and fill
it up and come down with a straight face. She
would do this, and she'd go, Daddy, I got a
full sticker chart. There's in There'll be thirty stickers on there,
and it's been like four days, and she'll just try
and play it off as if she's filled up the
whole stick of chart by sleeping.

Speaker 2 (17:54):
I love that you're still also like learning and like
having your mind blown at how different your daughters are.
My oldest Miela did anything wrong, step down the line.
I could just use ten percent of my dad voice
and she was like her world had been flipped upside
down in Elba from the age of six months old.
I'm not even joking to now, I can do full

(18:16):
dad voice, like you do not talk to your mother
like that. And it's just look straight at me, defiantly
death stare me and this has been for her whole
life and just walk off like it has not affected
her whatsoever. And as a dad, it's like you were
just being stabbed, ah multiple shots. You're like, what, ah,
my dad voice didn't work on you know, I've got

(18:37):
nothing else. I've gotten nothing else.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
That You're a police officer in a movie and you
realize there's no bullets in your gun, but anyway, you're like,
oh no, my one line of defense.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
But that Yeah, kids, it's insane that your own offspring
can be so different and so different so early on.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
They just exactly the same.

Speaker 2 (18:53):
But they come out of the JJ who they are. You can,
you can, we've talked about this before, and you can
guide through life, but they are who they are. I
believe the personality traits so much stuff is just set.
It's set in stone because.

Speaker 1 (19:09):
It's the JJ that makes them who they are.

Speaker 2 (19:12):
Maybe like kind of what shape it's in or how.

Speaker 1 (19:15):
Have you programs them on the way out?

Speaker 2 (19:19):
Okay, Yeah, so the slower births might be the smarter
kids and the fast ones just thick as shit.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah, and what about the caesareans.

Speaker 2 (19:25):
Oh, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
You get to progress, you get to program those ones
because they never went through the JJ.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:31):
More science, more science, and the hangover. Hey, let's get
into today's main topic, which.

Speaker 2 (19:36):
Is heavy but obesity.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
No, we can do an obesity episode, but today we're
going to do an episode about talking to kids about death.

Speaker 2 (19:44):
Ah. Many of you will remember the ogs that we've
talked about pet deaths before. Have you had a pet
pass away?

Speaker 1 (19:53):
Yes, in the past, and we talked about that the
cat ZIGGI that passed away. But last week I had
to go to a funeral for a friend, a friend's
brother actually, but I knew the person as well, and
it meant that I was going to be away into
to do where I'm from for the night. And so
my girls always want to know where I'm going and
what I'm doing, and they said where are you going?
And I said, well, I'm going to do her, But

(20:14):
because they always come with me, they were like, why
are you going there? And I looked at Lucy because
this is over the breakfast table, and I was like,
in this moment, do I tell them that I'm going
to a funeral because they don't have to tell them
what a funeral is and why it happens. And she
sort of just nodded, and so I went in and
I said, I've got to go to a funeral because
somebody I know died. And then the flood of questions,

(20:37):
like innocent questions from a five year old, not so
much the three year old, but the five year old,
how did they die, where did they die, why did
they die? And then the more existential questions of what
happens when you die? Where is the body?

Speaker 2 (20:52):
Where?

Speaker 1 (20:52):
No, no, not, where is the body? Where is he?
And I had to look at Lucy in this moment
and go, are we doing the Are we doing the
heaven thing? Are we saying that when someone dies they
go to heaven? Because we're not a religious family. We
don't go to church. I went to a Catholic high school,
but we're not religious and we don't take the kids
to church. But the heaven thing is such an easy

(21:13):
get out of jail free card when you're talking to kids,
because you say where are they, you can just go
They're in heaven. And I looked at Lucy and she
took it off me as you went his soul is
in heaven. Because Lucy is very spiritual and believes in
the spirit and spirituality, and so that was an okay
leap to make that the spirit was in heaven but

(21:34):
the body was still here. And that kind of seemed
to satiate her a bit, like it seemed to soothe
this situation. I don't know, it's just so complex. It's
a weird concept for a child because it makes no sense.
But I think my big fear about talking to them
about death was that they would then think about their
own death, or they would think about our death, and
I don't think I want them to have to consider

(21:57):
that sort of stuff at such a young age. I
was kind of trying to protect them from the concept
where actually I told them the truth about what was
going on, and they were fine. They just kind of
processed it and they didn't overthink it, and they've been
fine about it. We moved on after about ten minutes
of conversation and it hasn't really been an issue.

Speaker 2 (22:15):
Yeah, it's the one time where you kick yourself. I'm
the same as you. We're not a religious family, and
it's the one time you kick yourself. You're like, damned.
I wish I had let heavier into the religion stuff
when a death happens, because yeah, not making light of
religion and your beliefs, but being able to say straight
off the bat, they're in heaven now, and your kid
understands what heaven is and heaven's a great place, then
great done. If you don't, if you're not a religious family,

(22:39):
it becomes a oh, well, you know, granddad is he's
resting now? Yes, Like he's just like when my kids
were much younger, when their granddad passed away. They would
have been on a similategious to yours. And I think
that was the first thing, like granddad has they knew
kind of what something dying was, has died, and they'll

(23:00):
think of like an animal that's died, or a bug
or a dead fish on the beach, right, and they
have their classic will that wake up? And I know
that's asleep for ever now? Yeah, And I remember it
being like a bit of that chat like Granddad's not
going to wake back up now, Granddad's finish. Yes, Yeah,
it's so hard to explain it to kids, and then

(23:21):
the flood of questions do come. So being able to
say heaven. But then again for me, I didn't because
I not a believer whatsoever. I didn't want to bring
that chat in. Yeah. I didn't want them to then
grow up and think about heaven. And it's funny, it's
cute little questions they have now when they hear about
Bibles and God and heaven, and I just say it's

(23:41):
all goods and I have more grown up chats with them. Look,
there's religions. There's many religions. People believe in different gods.
These gods I don't believe that like, I'm someone who
I don't have the answers right. There could be a
god I don't know, but I don't personally believe because
and my kids just like, okay, cool, And I'm like, look,
if you and I go, if you want to learn
more about it when you're older and you understand it more,

(24:02):
one hundred percent, go for it for you, like I don't.
We don't talk negatively about religion.

Speaker 1 (24:07):
No, we operate the exact same way. Well, my wife
is more spiritual. She's not religious, but she's more spiritual.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
Like I said, has she has? She charged her crystals.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
She regularly charges her crystals only under a full moon.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
Though.

Speaker 2 (24:20):
See now I don't know if he's real or not
because you said that quite quick He addswered that pretty quickly.
And I don't want to judge. If she's a crystal charger,
all all power to her.

Speaker 1 (24:29):
Am I allowed to out My wife is a crystal judge,
and she's not ashamed of it. She's not ashamed of
the fact that she's a crystal charger. My wife is
a crystal charger.

Speaker 2 (24:35):
Okay, what does it do? We ain't wanted to get
We didn't have an episode whether and I want to
know the facts and the science behind putting some crystals
in the sunner.

Speaker 1 (24:45):
Of the moonlight. Yeah, she's very lunar based. She's got
lots of she knows what type of moon I was
born under. She knows what type of mood born under.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
Yeah, and does she have insights because of that, Like
when you like when she opened a dishwasher and she's
just like classic half mooner.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
You joke, but quite often you'll go, that's typical behavior
from someone of your star sign or a lunar cycle,
or that's what I expected.

Speaker 2 (25:13):
Oh, we have to We've got to twister and get
her on without we.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
Share great parenting skills. We bring her on crystal and moon.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
Yes, yeah, I want to know. I want to understand
more because I'm quick to make jokes because I don't know.
When you think of people that charge their crystals, they
have large, long dreads, they haven't showered in about a week,
and they are living out of a comby van and
not paying any rates. So that's my view on crystal charges.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
Let's park it. I'll pitch it, and I don't want
to say too much that I don't want to get
in trouble, but you know what, we'll revisit this.

Speaker 2 (25:49):
Please pitch it on a awesome lunar cycle and menstrual cycle.
Don't ask her in the well, the lunar.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
Cycle and the minstrual cycle are intrinsically linked.

Speaker 2 (25:58):
So are they.

Speaker 1 (26:01):
That's not where she washy science. Your mutrocycle comes once
a month and the month is set by the lunar cycle.

Speaker 2 (26:07):
What so you're saying every single woman has their menstrual
cycle at the exact same time because the moon's the
exact same time in New Zealand. Mate.

Speaker 1 (26:13):
No, if they have it, they have it the exact
same distance apart, like it's inexplicable. There is some there
is some science to the fact that women's bodies are
linked to the moon.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
Wow, I did not know that.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
Well, how else would it happen once a month? How
does your body know what a month is?

Speaker 2 (26:27):
It doesn't. We've just named it a month like we've
we're the ones who invented time.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
No, a month is a lunar cycle?

Speaker 3 (26:33):
What it? No?

Speaker 2 (26:34):
Yeah, I hear hear you on that. A month? Yeah,
I get yeah. But you're saying, like, what like they
have high time motime?

Speaker 1 (26:41):
Yes, yeah, well I believe that anyway.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
Yeah, no, I'm not. I uneducated and my mind is blown.
And as soon as we hang up from this, I'm
going to google it and this is our next topic.

Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yeah. Wow, isn't that freaking crazy when you think about it,
that women's cycles are linked to the lunar cycle?

Speaker 2 (26:59):
That's what happen? Do they go to Mars? When their
first ladies travel to Mars?

Speaker 1 (27:02):
Exactly? Women?

Speaker 3 (27:05):
Are?

Speaker 1 (27:05):
Women? Are title this back to death? The benefit of
Christianity or any kind of religion is, yeah, you can
say they've gone to heaven, and you could actually say,
if you didn't want to go too deep in it,
you could just say that the whole body has gone
to heaven. Oh, because the other bit that I had
to grapple with was Toy's question about where is he.

(27:26):
I said, oh, he's with his family, and she's like,
but he is dead. And I was really worried about
going into the detail of what happens to the body,
of whether it's a burial or a cremation. In this situation,
it was a cremation, And yeah, I didn't want to
go into that detail. For a five year old, I
don't I don't want her to have nightmares about it.
I don't want her to be scared about anything.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
So yeah, there'll be there'll be some hard out listeners,
life listeners who are just like it's part of life,
tell them they should know everything. Yeah, but I think again,
I agree with you. There's an age like Milan now,
even Mela now, who's eleven, she wouldn't have faced questions
or understand there. They don't studied at school. But if
someone passed away in our family right now went for
a cremation, she's going to ask them what that is.

(28:11):
But my mom passed away four years ago and she
was cremated and it was very much her. All the
little cousins and kids like it's done. Now, you don't
come to this part. And we all went yes, and
it was the final send off as the coffin has taken.
But you know, the kids went part of that because
again a million questions, what's this? What's going on here?

Speaker 1 (28:30):
Did they see your mom after she had passed away?

Speaker 2 (28:33):
No? No, again, we kind of protected them from that. Yeah,
because yeah, Mela would have been eight. Again, there'll be
lots of people that disagree with that. I think me
and Jodi both just said it because I still remember seeing.
I remember like fourteen when my granddad died and that
was the first that was like the biggest family death right,
the first one that I faced, and just going to

(28:54):
our aunties and not expecting a walking around the corner
and there's my granddad and the coffin there and I'm
just like, WHOA affected me hard? And people were making
me hold his hand, like touch his hand, yeah, and
that's just with me forever. I just I'm not a
big dead body fan. And I still remember touching his
hand and it being freezing, and that's just stuck with
me and been so stuff And it was like I

(29:15):
didn't need that. I really didn't need.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
That, which is where there is. I think there's so
much benefit in the Malori tradition of tongue Yes, which
is tongue is Maori, the native people of New Zealand's
death ritual where the body returns to the fenoa, to
the home the muddeye or wherever they're from, and then
for three days they lie in state and the family

(29:38):
get to come and be with the person and provided
they can. It's usually open casket and we did it
for my grandma, but for a young person there is
that initial shock, but then you all spend time with
them for three days and let kind of the feeling
disseminate and sort of you have time to say goodbye
in that situation. And it's strange because not everybody that

(29:59):
you know, you don't require three days of morning for
everybody that you know, but for family members.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yeah, but yeah, we definitely went and to come come
and ever look kids or come say they they kind
of Yeah, it's funny kids, how their little brains work.
Like even when you told them like your nana's nana
Nan died last night. Oh, and they get sad and
there's tears, but then very soon after, like the next day,
like they're playing on the playground and it'll hit them

(30:26):
now and then and you can't take it lightly. But
there's no like, hey, wanting.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
To wonderful that's what you want?

Speaker 2 (30:32):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, straight back And Jody sorry sorry, before
my mum, Jody's dad died and they would have been
much younger again, like I think me and my eldest
would have been six, and then we would have a
four year old and we would have had a Oh yeah,
Nala was only like a year old. I was in
Australia with Elba. We were filming something for Ford and
it happened and we came home and again they were

(30:55):
too young to understand much. We didn't see. I didn't
see the body. I didn't even think that was an option. Yeah,
he's much older than what my parents were. Jody's dad's
quite old and he had things lined up and this
is how we'll do it anyway. The cool thing we
had there was as we walked out, I was one
of the pool bearers for the coffin, a bumblebee was
annoying us, like flying around our faces. And Jody's one

(31:19):
of three girls, like my kids. Jody's one of three girls,
and they all look at each other and go, oh,
dad love bubble bees. And so now we have like
three months later, we're home and there's a bumblebee just
right next to us as we eat our lunch, sitting
on the table, and Jody just said, done, fory cat,
that's granddad. That's granddad. Come to say hi. And we've
not had this big means talk to them like we're

(31:39):
just joking. It's just a nice thought to have that
that is Granddad. But we've had bumblebees visit way more
since then, and it's just a nice thing that the
kids like, oh, granddad's here, and a bumblebee will come
weirdly close, and that's a nice idea for them to have.

Speaker 1 (31:53):
Yeah, we kind of did the same thing with p
wocka woka with the cat when the cat passed away,
not to reduce the death of a grandparent to a cat. Know,
it's those little moments. Tilly was really curious about what
happens to the body for the funeral that I was
going to last week. So I did tell her that
they would turn the body into ashes, but I didn't
say how because she doesn't know how ashes are made.

(32:14):
So I was kind of comfortable doing that. And luckily
we've still got the cat in a box of ashes
on the bookshelf. Because she relates everything her knowledge of death.
The only death she's experienced is the cat, so she
relates everything to the cat. So I was able to
go and get the box and show her the ashes.
But the kids are so they chase the details so
much like the little private investigators. So she goes, Okay,

(32:37):
She's willing to accept that you turn a person into
ashes if that's the way that you do it. But
then she's like, but what happened to the ashes? Is
the person now going to be on a bookshelf forever?
And I was like, Oh, their family might choose to
do that, or they might choose to bury them in
the garden and plant a tree or something like that.
So I think I'm a fan of giving children as
much information as they want. It's probably a good way

(32:59):
of doing it. But I think I think if you
know there is a death coming, that it's good to
have a game plan. This was a this was a surprise,
and this is not a person I was hugely close with.
This is a friend, a brother of a really good
friend of mine. So it's not it's not hugely impacted
our family. It was a very sad occasion. He was
a father to little children who was taken suddenly. But

(33:20):
I think if you are expecting a death in your family,
that it's good to have a plan of attack with
your partner so you know exactly the things that you're
going to say to your kids, so you don't get
caught in a you know, Yeah, it would be a
good way of doing it and get on the same
page with your partner. Are we doing Heaven? Are we
doing God and angels? Are we doing straight facts? What

(33:40):
are we doing with this? You know?

Speaker 2 (33:42):
One hundred percent? Yeah, you've got to be on the
same way. It's it's not the same as make believe
stories about Santa if anyone's listening, or too theory, if
our seven year old listeners are listening, it's a bit heavier.
But I'm if I lean into the side of be
as realistic as you can.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
Can I read you?

Speaker 3 (33:58):
Can?

Speaker 1 (33:58):
I read you this? I google before we did this podcast.
How to explain death to a child? And this is
this is what the Internet says. It says, gently but directly,
use the words dead and died within short explanations. Using
euphemisms and vague language often creates fear in children. Phrases

(34:19):
like passed away, gone to sleep, he's with grandma now,
or lost their life don't explain in concrete terms what
has happened to their loved one. So they're saying, be
matter of fact about it, but keep the explanation.

Speaker 2 (34:34):
Sure cuts off to the internet. What a great answer.

Speaker 1 (34:37):
Yeah, use use firm but brief language, it says. It
also says, referring to the because we're talking about what
to do with the body thing because they're still physically there,
they said. Referring to the body left as an empty
shell can help them to understand that the person is
no longer alive as they knew them before.

Speaker 2 (34:57):
Yeah, that's the stuff where I This is just my
own feelings on it. But yeah, me and dead bodies
and kids, I'm just not great with it myself, let alone. Like,
I'm still not in a point right now. If like,
if another grandparent passed away touch wood, now, am I
taking Mealer up to see the body? It would be
again now that she's older, we'd say, hey, do your

(35:19):
grandma is here? Would you like with us? Come and
see her and say bye, say some thing, and she
understands it a bit more. But like, am I taking
Nala up? And it's again something I think you just
got to feel it and vibe it out. I don't
think there's any right or wrong, and it's it's kind
of what your own beliefs are. I'm kind of trying
to give myself a tick of approval for being to
lead it out with bodies.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
But it all comes from a place of wanting to
protect your kids. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what it is,
and from a really deep sense of weirdness and awkwardness
around death. But at the court, at the core of it,
you're just trying to not traumatize and not upset your children, right, more.

Speaker 2 (35:54):
Bittish question, Do you have many grandparents your kids? Grandparents
still all kicking about?

Speaker 1 (35:58):
My parents might kids grandparents are all still around?

Speaker 2 (36:01):
Yes, so you got lots of jets coming.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
Up, lots and lots of things to look forward. Dude. Yeah,
they haven't had they haven't had to do a family
member death yet.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
Do they have Do your kids have great grandparents? No?

Speaker 1 (36:16):
I have no grandparents and Lucy has no grandparents.

Speaker 2 (36:19):
Okay, yeah, No, my grandma, one of my grandma's is
still kicking about living on her own independently. Wow. She's
the legend who I said, how I said, my dad's
gone on as oi. She's the legend who went on
her OI when she was like seventy with hers Yeah,
and went over and stayed in backpage. She still going
she's still kicking. How old is she?

Speaker 1 (36:38):
How old is she she is?

Speaker 2 (36:41):
I'm really bad. There's a point where you're younger and
you really listen to and know your grandparents' ages. In
my head, she's been seventy for two decades, but I
would say she's eighty four. Oh yeah, I'm making that
number completely up and I feel really bad, but I
don't know her age. She needed to go and visit
her because Dad, who usually chicks it on her, is

(37:03):
overseas and Dad being dad, didn't pass on any messages
to us. Hey make sure you go chick in on
your on your grandma. But yeah, my kids have a
great grandma who has been a massive part of their lives.
Is that every Christmas, every Birthday, is all the things
when we go away to the beach. She's a legend,
really cool. She's like the matre the matriarch. What's the outlephant,
the lead elephant that leads the hood the matriarchy. That'll

(37:25):
be a real big hit. That's going to be the
real big hit when she passes away for the kids.

Speaker 1 (37:29):
But she's not going to She's going to go river.

Speaker 2 (37:31):
And we and we've had a great chat about it.

Speaker 1 (37:33):
You know, anything else you want to say on death
before we wrap that.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
Up, I don't know. I kind of just ran, but
you've kind of opened a box of worms for me.
We don't have time to carry on. I think I
think we've answered it pretty good. I think so we've
covered it well.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
I think we did. Okay, let's take a break. Far
What a mature, grown up podcast tackling real life topics,
ain't you?

Speaker 3 (37:51):
Yeah? Proud of us?

Speaker 1 (37:53):
From that to middle age back pain, here's a message
from Diogo yoga from Papamoa here.

Speaker 3 (38:01):
My dog actually is a big fan of Jordan's dog.

Speaker 4 (38:04):
That sounds dirty, but anyway, I would like to just
forlot the idea that your dairy consumption not only affects
you snoring, but also it affects your bed back.

Speaker 3 (38:13):
I'm for sure one of those.

Speaker 4 (38:15):
I worked the personal trainer for a long time and
all the dudes that dudes that would come in and
complain of bed back, I'll recommend them cutting dairy and
you would get better.

Speaker 3 (38:25):
And I am one of the suffers as well.

Speaker 4 (38:27):
My dairy affects my snoring, affects my sleep, affects my back,
and it gets quite.

Speaker 3 (38:33):
Graphic in the toilet as well.

Speaker 5 (38:34):
So I of course recommend checking with your professional to
make sure that you have no back injuries, but maybe
cut your dairy for a couple of weeks and see how.

Speaker 3 (38:45):
Your back feels. Maybe you'll feel amazing and you'll think
me forever. Yea.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
I wonder if that comes down to inflammation. These are
people that are already a bit deary and tolerant and
then they're having internal inflammation. Look I sound like a
real good doctor here.

Speaker 5 (38:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (38:59):
Yeah, And that inflammation is is you know, that's spreading
to the nerves and the blood vessels and it's causing
you stiffness and pain in lower back pain Judo cheese.

Speaker 1 (39:10):
We've given out a lot of made up medical advice
on this episode. Jordan was telling us how you don't
get over the flow earlier. Now we're doing back pain
milk milk milk free back pain. But look, I appreciate
a missus like that, and going something like going dairy
free is something you can just try that's not going
to severely impact you. You know you're doing it at
the moment and you are seeing benefits from it.

Speaker 2 (39:31):
Not hugely, not like people say, Like I've had family
members come up who dairy free as well, and they're like, oh, Jordan,
you're like mental state. If I have a bit of cheese,
I'm just a blur in my head. You wait, give
it like a few weeks. You're going to be so sharp.
I haven't noticed anything that. If anything, I've noticed a
better digestion. Okay, sure, I'm having healthier bowel movements, more

(39:55):
regular bowel movements. But spaghetti bolonnees night is fucking terrible.
You know, I'm not great. No cheese on that. I'm
not lumping three types of sour cream on it. I
just got mince spaghetti. It's not the same.

Speaker 1 (40:09):
But convinced myself that going dairy free was virtuous a
few years ago, and changed to oat milk, and then
after a while I was like, this is so boring
my coffee. I am just convincing myself that my coffee
tastes better, and I went straight back to milk. And
my life is fine. Hasn't changed anything. But for some
people at will. For some people at will, I just
understand what you mean.

Speaker 2 (40:28):
It's he makes silver bullet that.

Speaker 1 (40:29):
It might be.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
Yeah, he makes one hundred percent great argument, Like if
you're suffering from anything and you think that trying my
work cutting out dairy isn't the end of the world.
A bit of for Fonterra profits, but other than that.

Speaker 1 (40:40):
It's okay. We also got a message from Silkat who
misses us before, specifically about our blue man at the
Olympics concern have you missed it? We posted a video
about it actually, but the weird naked guy in the
blue loin cloth, I was going to say skin colored loincloth,
but it wasn't. His skin was blue, the loincloth was blue,

(41:01):
so I guess it was skin colored. In the opening ceremony,
which is two weeks ago. Now it's old news, but
we were like, who is he? Why the hell was
he on the screen? Here's the message, Dear Jordan, Dear Clint.
I was a little bit confused that the Blue Man
affected you so much. In Europe, you can always tell
when a TV show is non European because all the
naked people are pixelated. Here they are usually not pixelated,

(41:24):
and we have a lot of beaches in every country
where it is allowed to swim naked. In the East
of Germany it is more common to swim naked than not.
But even in the Catholic south, like Spain and Italy,
it is still common to be naked. Please tell me
what it's like in New Zealand.

Speaker 2 (41:41):
Love Silka, Well, we have to like everyone. If you're
going to swim at a public place, you have to
put on this like valcro pouch that covers your penis
and your butthole, like your butthole can never be seen
especially but and then we put on what's called speedo's,
which like waterpreofunderwear. Then we put on a pair of
dogs or bathers, and then we have to put on

(42:03):
wetsuit pants and then you can swim because we are
allergic to seeing floppy penis running down the beach, like
if someone. If I'm in Europe and a guy runs
over and trips as he's trying to catch a frisbee
and his wang hits me in the face, I'm gonna
lose my shit. I'm just gonna accept your European ways
and I may go cover up. There's children here.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
Also, in my mind, people in Europe are much more attractive,
and so it's much more not just acceptable, but pleas
into the eye to have neity, whereas in our part
of the world, I don't want to see you, you
want to see me.

Speaker 2 (42:36):
Yeah, that was all a joke, clearly, But in New
Zealand we were not like my inclints age. When we
were at school, all the girls and I'm hoping as
a dad of daughters that this fashion sense comes back in.
But New Zealand girls went to the beach with their
bathers on and a pair of board shorts, so swim
shorts over top. Do you remember when that was the thing,

(42:57):
Like you were covered up, All the girls were covered up.
If Gil didn't have her board shots on. For boys,
you're oh my gosh, she doesn't have board shorts on.
Now where again you'll see these Facebook photos come up.
It was just that was the fashion fashion. Yeah, you'll
see these. I love these archival Facebook photos. Someone does
a post from Italy nineteen seventy three. They are in

(43:18):
skimpier stuff than what is been worn now. Anyway we've gone.
We're thirty years behind, we're fifty years behind. But New
Zealand now is very much beach's bikini's like board short.
You don't see anyone on board shorts anymore. We're very scantily.
I talked about this recently on a post and New
Zealand media personality Brody Kane private message me came in

(43:39):
hot with heat. She's like, you got an issue with
me getting my ass out? Do you? And I was like, no,
I don't at all. I was saying, you don't want
to see me doing that, So I'm choosing my words
wisely here.

Speaker 1 (43:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (43:49):
Yeah, but as a dad of daughters also, you go
to see my side of it where I hope that
board shorts come back in because I don't want my
soon to be thirteen fourteen year old daughter coming out
of her bedroom and try a little piece of triangle
cloth that just cut hides over gig and two little
stars on a nipples and that's the new fashion and
goes off to the beach. I'll be like, ah, hey, hey,

(44:10):
could you just come here for a second. But I've
got to be a cool dad and just accept that
this is my body. Hear me raw, I don't know,
but yeah, New Zealand traditionally we're much more covered up.
We're not We don't have beaches here like you're saying
in Europe. There you hear whispers of certain beaches. I
know Auckland has one up on the north Shore apparently
down from me, a certain strip of Papamoa Beach there's

(44:32):
a bit can yeah, get your wang out. But you're
not just going to stroll down to a beach in
summer and see a whang You may see a confident
woman with her breasts out sunbathing and just not caring.
That would be one and like once a one in
a million, right, But if you saw a dude with
his wang out, it is police running down toward the
beach to tackle this man and get him out of there.

Speaker 1 (44:53):
Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (44:54):
Man, we went gone on way too long about this
wang out stuff. So I think is that.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
Us becoming a main topic. That's if you have any
advice about talking to children. I think this is a
really good topic and I think people will take a
lot from it. If you have any advice about talking
to children about death from your own experience, then we
would love a voice message for the next episode of
the podcast. You can send it to us on Instagram.
Our Instagram account is at the Parenting Hangover. Just a

(45:19):
little one minute voice message. If you can't send a
voice message, send me a DM and I'll approve you
so that you can get it through. But yeah, I'd
love to have some of those messages. So your advice,
your experiences for our next podcast.

Speaker 2 (45:30):
One hundred percent, And just quickly before we all head off,
We've talked about this before, but I am an ambassador
for the New Zealand charity kids Can. There is one
in six New Zealand kids that are living in hardship,
going to school without food and their lunch boxes or
shoes and socks in winter. Kids Can is the charity
that helps these kids out. Right now, as we all know,
so many families are struggling. The wait list of schools

(45:53):
needing help from kids can is the longest in history.
If you can please help out, head to kids can
dot org dot in z and you can become a
monthly donor or you can do a one off donation.
Every little bit seriously helps that kids can dot org
dot in z and we'll try and smash this weightless

(46:14):
down because it is very sad how how long the
wait lists.

Speaker 1 (46:18):
Right now, thanks legits, it's devastating. That's the charity that
Jordan played handball for twenty four hours to raise their
money and they already need more money. So I think
it's that diref.

Speaker 3 (46:28):
There at the moment.

Speaker 2 (46:29):
Yeah you think, yeah, you're like, well we did it.

Speaker 1 (46:32):
No, you're like, wow, we solve child poverty.

Speaker 2 (46:34):
You can? You can't so well. So another big push
is happening right now, the winter push, so kids can
dot org, dot inz. Love you guys,