Out with the old...and in with the new secondary school qualifications, with more detail on what's replacing NCEA revealed.
Year 11 students will now need to get a foundational literacy and numeracy award before they pass Year 12 and 13.
Senior students will also face a compulsory exam in each subject, and must pass at least three subjects each year to pass.
But Chair of the New Zealand Secondary Principals' Council, Steve McCracken, says while the new system seems easy to understand - NCEA is still a valid qualification.
"What I think we've got is actually an advancement in terms of the minister's priorities - it makes it really clear and concise and able to be read really easily."
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudgin
from News talksb SO.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Details of the NCAA qualification replacement have been announced. The
new system will have a compulsory Literature and Numeracy Foundation
award a Year twelve New Zealand Certificate of Education and
Year thirteen New Zealand Advanced Certificate of Education. Year twelve
and thirteen's will study at least five subjects a year,
with a minimum of three subjects required to achieve the certificate.
Students in year nine this year will be the first
(00:34):
to try the new qualification. Education Minister, as I mentioned,
Erica stanfordh is a bit tied up at the moment.
Should be with us later this hour, but right now
I'm joined by Chair of the New Zealand Secondary Principles Council,
Steve McCracken. Thank you for your time this morning, Steve.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
No problems at all. Good morning, Francisia.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Okay, so broad question to start with, is this an
upgrade from NCAA. The government has said they wanted a
clearer and more credible qualification. Is that what we've got here.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Look, there's nothing wrong with the current NCAA system. I
think it's a very gallic qualification and those who are
still going to go through it in the next couple
of years, we'll be able to go off and be
the nextplored leader that they can with this current qualification system.
What I think we've got is actually, I suppose in
advancement in terms of the Minister's priorities and making it
(01:18):
really clear and concise and able to be read really
easily by the public and understanding what NCAA is currently
it's a little bit complicated, if you could say that. So, yeah,
it is definite development. However, we've got to make sure
we don't throw out twenty twenty five years worth of
work and that through this transition period.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Overall thoughts on the replacement qualification because when I look
at it as someone whose children have just left school,
actually it's pretty similar. You know, we had to get
your numerocy in year eleven, you get your literacy in
year twelve, and you have to have three you know,
get three courses in year thirteen. So actually, to me,
(02:02):
when I look at it, this isn't going to be
a huge shift for parents or students to get head around.
It's the qualification itself is all sort of quite similar
to what we have.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Yeah, and on the surface, I think that that's a
very fair statement, Francesia. However, when you get in beneath
the detail or start looking at the detail and a
lot more with the microscopic view, I suppose the moving
from the literacy and humiracy at its current level of
looking at the curriculum around year nine and ten and
raising that up to year eleven does raise the bar
(02:33):
as such and allow a little bit more complicated knowledge
of literacy and numeracy to be assessed. But in terms
of the overall qualification and what that looks like is
going to be very similar. The five or six grade
points are a little bit more detailed obviously than the
four that we have currently, So get a little bit more,
(02:56):
a little bit more detail around what the students have
achieved at their particular subject and having that overall qualification
with an endorsement or that in three, four or five
subjects actually assesses what is going to happen or what
students have actually been taught and can understand and be
(03:17):
assessed on.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Steve, have you seen the curriculum.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
You've seen parts of it, of course, in years nine
and ten and that's come out, and then on Friday
there was the release of the first tranch of the curriculum.
So yeah, at an outset, there is quite a bit
of change in things. But I think overall, once we
get through and into some of the detail and feedback
and refinement, I think it's going to be a really
(03:43):
interesting process to go through.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
So the curriculum isn't complete yet, the senior for the eleven.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Twelve, No, that's right. So the draft has only just
been released of the first it's been released in three
parts and the first part was released on Friday for consultation.
So I understand that there's been a huge amount of
work being done in the background and writing furiously and
quick clear around trying to get this ready for the
(04:08):
timelines that have been given.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Okay, because it does feel like we should have probably
got the curriculum in place before we then decided on
what structure the assessment would take place. Would that make sense?
Speaker 3 (04:18):
Yeah, absolutely, it makes sense.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Right.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
Curriculum in terms of an education perspective, curriculum always drives
assessment and that's that's really clear and making sure we
are understanding I think the Minister's announcements over the last
twelve months or so that there has been around the
structure of the assessment, not necessarily the detail. So having
a more detail now is good, but you're right around,
Actually the curriculum is really where the meter is on
(04:42):
the bones.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
Internal assessments remain, but exams in our compulsory is a
mix important.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Yes, exams are a definite moment and snapshot in time
around assessments and making sure that there is that knowledge
that can be regurgitative for use of a better word,
and really assessed in that high stakes assessment stuff. But
actually what would become really accustomed to is being able
to have learners and students really be able to input
(05:13):
and make sure their knowledge is really embedded and then
assessed at the appropriate time when they're ready to be assessed.
So a mixture of assessment is a really good thing.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Science is now, Yes, science is now compulsory and year eleven.
Will schools have the resources to manage this?
Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's going to be a real interesting challenge, right And
most schools, nearly all the schools that I've spoken to
personally have science as a either strongly recommended or highly
recommended subject. So There will be some schools though that
don't offer science as a compulsory subject, and there will
be a change needed from them in terms of how
they structure their schools and programs. There could be a
(05:53):
facility challenge and there could be a teacher challenge as
well in terms of actually making sure we have the
appropriate work stream going on there. But overall I have
a really good progress there in terms of making science
compulsory as well.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
So up until now, schools have had the ability to
man NCA the way that best suits their school and
students by in a way sort of mandating education. Now,
are you concerned that those who are already struggling at
school are going to be disadvantage? Do you think more
will leave without a qualification?
Speaker 3 (06:19):
There's always that risk, right, However, this really strengthens to
qualification around being able to ensure that the curriculum is,
as the Minister said, knowledge rich and really really clear
in terms of what is being taught and what is
being delivered in schools. I think when we get down
into the detail, though, I think what I'm reading is
that you'll see that whatether the students are able to
(06:42):
do and be assessed on and be good at will
actually show through their record of learning. Excuse me. So yeah,
if for example, there's a skill in terms of the
Barista course or that that will show on the record
of learning, So it might not look like what it
is currently, but will definitely show in terms of the
skills and attributes that the young people can have.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Stepha, can't thank you enough for your time. I'm on
a Sunday morning, very much appreciate it. That was Chair
of the New Zealand Secondary Principals Counsel Steve McCracken.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
There for more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin.
Listen live to News Talks it B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Sunday Session podcast with Francesca Rudgin
from News talksb SO.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
Details of the NCAA qualification replacement have been announced. The
new system will have a compulsory Literature and Numeracy Foundation
award a Year twelve New Zealand Certificate of Education and
Year thirteen New Zealand Advanced Certificate of Education. Year twelve
and thirteen's will study at least five subjects a year,
with a minimum of three subjects required to achieve the certificate.
Students in year nine this year will be the first
(00:34):
to try the new qualification. Education Minister, as I mentioned,
Erica stanfordh is a bit tied up at the moment.
Should be with us later this hour, but right now
I'm joined by Chair of the New Zealand Secondary Principles Council,
Steve McCracken. Thank you for your time this morning, Steve.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
No problems at all. Good morning, Francisia.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
Okay, so broad question to start with, is this an
upgrade from NCAA. The government has said they wanted a
clearer and more credible qualification. Is that what we've got here.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
Look, there's nothing wrong with the current NCAA system. I
think it's a very gallic qualification and those who are
still going to go through it in the next couple
of years, we'll be able to go off and be
the nextplored leader that they can with this current qualification system.
What I think we've got is actually, I suppose in
advancement in terms of the Minister's priorities and making it
(01:18):
really clear and concise and able to be read really
easily by the public and understanding what NCAA is currently
it's a little bit complicated, if you could say that. So, yeah,
it is definite development. However, we've got to make sure
we don't throw out twenty twenty five years worth of
work and that through this transition period.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Overall thoughts on the replacement qualification because when I look
at it as someone whose children have just left school,
actually it's pretty similar. You know, we had to get
your numerocy in year eleven, you get your literacy in
year twelve, and you have to have three you know,
get three courses in year thirteen. So actually, to me,
(02:02):
when I look at it, this isn't going to be
a huge shift for parents or students to get head around.
It's the qualification itself is all sort of quite similar
to what we have.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Yeah, and on the surface, I think that that's a
very fair statement, Francesia. However, when you get in beneath
the detail or start looking at the detail and a
lot more with the microscopic view, I suppose the moving
from the literacy and humiracy at its current level of
looking at the curriculum around year nine and ten and
raising that up to year eleven does raise the bar
(02:33):
as such and allow a little bit more complicated knowledge
of literacy and numeracy to be assessed. But in terms
of the overall qualification and what that looks like is
going to be very similar. The five or six grade
points are a little bit more detailed obviously than the
four that we have currently, So get a little bit more,
(02:56):
a little bit more detail around what the students have
achieved at their particular subject and having that overall qualification
with an endorsement or that in three, four or five
subjects actually assesses what is going to happen or what
students have actually been taught and can understand and be
(03:17):
assessed on.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Steve, have you seen the curriculum.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
You've seen parts of it, of course, in years nine
and ten and that's come out, and then on Friday
there was the release of the first tranch of the curriculum.
So yeah, at an outset, there is quite a bit
of change in things. But I think overall, once we
get through and into some of the detail and feedback
and refinement, I think it's going to be a really
(03:43):
interesting process to go through.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
So the curriculum isn't complete yet, the senior for the eleven.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
Twelve, No, that's right. So the draft has only just
been released of the first it's been released in three
parts and the first part was released on Friday for consultation.
So I understand that there's been a huge amount of
work being done in the background and writing furiously and
quick clear around trying to get this ready for the
(04:08):
timelines that have been given.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
Okay, because it does feel like we should have probably
got the curriculum in place before we then decided on
what structure the assessment would take place. Would that make sense?
Speaker 3 (04:18):
Yeah, absolutely, it makes sense.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
Right.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
Curriculum in terms of an education perspective, curriculum always drives
assessment and that's that's really clear and making sure we
are understanding I think the Minister's announcements over the last
twelve months or so that there has been around the
structure of the assessment, not necessarily the detail. So having
a more detail now is good, but you're right around,
Actually the curriculum is really where the meter is on
(04:42):
the bones.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
Internal assessments remain, but exams in our compulsory is a
mix important.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Yes, exams are a definite moment and snapshot in time
around assessments and making sure that there is that knowledge
that can be regurgitative for use of a better word,
and really assessed in that high stakes assessment stuff. But
actually what would become really accustomed to is being able
to have learners and students really be able to input
(05:13):
and make sure their knowledge is really embedded and then
assessed at the appropriate time when they're ready to be assessed.
So a mixture of assessment is a really good thing.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Science is now, Yes, science is now compulsory and year eleven.
Will schools have the resources to manage this?
Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's going to be a real interesting challenge, right And
most schools, nearly all the schools that I've spoken to
personally have science as a either strongly recommended or highly
recommended subject. So There will be some schools though that
don't offer science as a compulsory subject, and there will
be a change needed from them in terms of how
they structure their schools and programs. There could be a
(05:53):
facility challenge and there could be a teacher challenge as
well in terms of actually making sure we have the
appropriate work stream going on there. But overall I have
a really good progress there in terms of making science
compulsory as well.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
So up until now, schools have had the ability to
man NCA the way that best suits their school and
students by in a way sort of mandating education. Now,
are you concerned that those who are already struggling at
school are going to be disadvantage? Do you think more
will leave without a qualification?
Speaker 3 (06:19):
There's always that risk, right, However, this really strengthens to
qualification around being able to ensure that the curriculum is,
as the Minister said, knowledge rich and really really clear
in terms of what is being taught and what is
being delivered in schools. I think when we get down
into the detail, though, I think what I'm reading is
that you'll see that whatether the students are able to
(06:42):
do and be assessed on and be good at will
actually show through their record of learning. Excuse me. So yeah,
if for example, there's a skill in terms of the
Barista course or that that will show on the record
of learning, So it might not look like what it
is currently, but will definitely show in terms of the
skills and attributes that the young people can have.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Stepha, can't thank you enough for your time. I'm on
a Sunday morning, very much appreciate it. That was Chair
of the New Zealand Secondary Principals Counsel Steve McCracken.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
There for more from the Sunday session with Francesca Rudkin.
Listen live to News Talks it B from nine am Sunday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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