April 19, 2026 • 40 mins
For decades we've watched as professional athletes spend a whole lot of time warming up behind the pre-game interviews on game day, from stretching to sprinting and everything in between.
The professionals take it seriously and so do the amateurs - parents will know the rush to show up an hour or two early to make enough time for a thorough warm up on a Saturday morning.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
The nice lou E Wesvan facking.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Can make you.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Happy Sometimes I think nice he Wesvin facking can make
you happy.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Usually Yes, and welcome back.
Speaker 4 (00:35):
This is the Weekend Collective and this hour it is
the Health Hub and we've got a new guest to
introduced to you in just a moment. But of course
it's the where we invite. We want your calls and
participation on eight hundred and eighty ten eighty and look,
there are a bunch of things we're going to get into,
and as always with a new guest, we sort of
get to know each other along the ways, and it's
(00:56):
amazing that the conversation things that pop out as we
get going. But for decades, obviously we watch we've all
watched professional athletes spend a whole lot of time warming
up between the pregame interviews on game day, from stretching
stretching to sprinting and everything in between. And yet we
have had a guest on the show who was talking
about warming. I don't want to quote them out of context,
(01:20):
but that you know, there's interesting information around stretching and
when you should stretch all that sort of stuff, and
the warm up and things. But how important is the
warm up because what I've seem to have learned is
that the warm up for the biking that I do
is Okay, m up be a little bit to do
with your muscles, but it's also about getting your cardiovascular.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
System going, get your heart pumping and everything.
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Anyway, so we're gonna have a chat about, you know,
how important warming up is, but also other things to
do with injuries and how we've seen ACL injuries increase
twenty nine fold since the nineties, and I don't know
if it's just to do with diagnosis or whatever. Anyway,
we're going to talk about your bodies and fitness and
warming up and looking after yourself, and probably a bit
(02:03):
of it we might dig into as well, because kids
these days, I don't know, I get the feeling that
with modern training techniques there, they're subjecting themselves to much
greater forces. It used to be the days, the old days,
that kids just bounced back from injuries, but I think
things have changed a little bit there. Anyway, we want
to have your cause on one hundred and eighty ten
(02:23):
eighty text nine nine two and joining us.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
He is, well, I think he's a bit of a
superstar to be working for this.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
He's the team physiotherapist for the Breakers and his name
is Rob Knight and Rob's with me.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
Now get a Rob.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
Thank you. Privileged to be here.
Speaker 4 (02:37):
Yeah, that's that is a pretty high falutant team to
be physio for, isn't.
Speaker 5 (02:41):
It's it's a great team to be physio for. Yeah,
it's obviously I love basketball, but the Breakers is a
great organization as well, and they've got new owners recently,
so that's changed it again for the better.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
Yeah. And how long have you been? Tell us a
little bit about you. How did you get involved in physiotherapy?
How long you've been doing it? In sports physiotherapy and
all that.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I've been almost forty years now working as a physio
sort of. I was lucky. My first job was actually
with the all Black Physis of the Times. I was
straight into performance sport. Ye had a stint in London
working on the London Musicals for a brief time, so
I know.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Wow, Yeah, so that was okay.
Speaker 5 (03:14):
Yeah, that's an interesting one because I look on dancers
and performers as performance athletes, but they don't get the
same care that performance athletes get.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Actually, it's interesting because we mentioned that the you know,
the advent of pilates, everyone's doing it. When I was
in Foundom of the Opera back in Sydney.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Quite a few years ago, okay, thirty years ago, close
to thirty years ago, the ballet dancers did pilates I
think once or twice a week, and it was a
thing that the company paid for. It was totally it
was very new and they were and they would describe
what they'd do and I'd.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Be like, no, that sounds easy.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
And one of them put me through some pilates stuff
that she was doing, and I was like, okay, okay.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
You went, and now it's like just normal.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Yeah. I mean, it's amazing how it's become. What sort
of interest you see on stage? Is it more dancing and.
Speaker 5 (04:03):
A lot of overuse injuries because these guys work their
asses off, like they'll be, you know, doing a show
in the morning and a show in the evening two
hours and so you know, that's full on like dancers especially.
One of the musicals was Starlut Express with the roller skill.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Oh okay, well, I'd imagine that had more than one
physio would they.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
Ah, they were pretty underdone, to be honest, like their
medical care is not like today where you're looking after it. Yeah,
but I remember one and lame is where it was
the closing scene and the guy I think he was
dying down the stairs or something, but he actually fell
and looked really great. We found he actually broke his
ankle on the way down and he lay there still
delivered his lines, but he'd actually broke at his ankle.
These people are tough.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
Was it the guy at the top of the barricade.
Speaker 5 (04:40):
It's a long time ago, but I remember going on
stage upwards going oh, yeah, he goes, I can't actually
get up, so yeah, But I don't know. I think
stage performers, dances, ballet dancers, these guys have a really
tough life. We see we see you know, contact sport,
et cetera. But these guys work just as hard and have.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
It's unrelenting because as I say it, I mean eight
shows a week with two Matt mates.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Now that's got fascinating. I have to dig into that
with a bit more.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
But on that off air, and so then from there
I was basically my career was in private practice and
performance sports. So I was lucky enough to be with
New Zealand rugby, the Warriors and then the Breakers now
in the tour backs.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Hey, we'll touch on that because I did open with
the discussion on warmups.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
But actually, how what does a warm up look like
these days? Because I mean it does time to kids sport,
because I've.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
Got a daughter who's thirteen and she's involved with hockey
and netball, you know, highly competitively. And you know, I
remember when we did how I used to play volleyball
and we'd do warm up, but we jog up and
down the gym a couple of times and that was it.
Then we'd get into it because you don't really think
about it when you're younger exactly. But how what is
a warm up and what is a warm up for?
Speaker 5 (05:49):
So I look at warm up in three stages. The
first is I guess what I call physiological. It's just
getting yourself warm. You could jump on a bike, you
could run, but it's sort of ten to fifteen minutes
just getting the systems or working blood pumping. Your body
also switches energy, so you run out of muscle glycogene's
which is the liver glycogen that's that second win that
athletes talk about. So you want to get into that
(06:11):
before you've actually started.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Before you can start competing.
Speaker 5 (06:14):
You don't want it to happen halfway through. You wanted
to sort of be kicking in before you go.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
So is that why that when we see I mean
we've seen it with rugby games, it seems that they
really put themselves through quite a few paces. Is that
because they're trying to get themselves into that.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
Yeah, They're trying to get their body over into the
next sort of level of energy wa storage. Yeah, and
so I look on that as physiological and you could
do anything. You could cycle, and you could play hacky sack,
it doesn't really matter. It's just getting the blood pumping
and getting the energy systems primed. The second stage, and
this is to me, is the most important one. I've
got a story here from the Breakers last season which
I call neurological. This is activation. This is wakening up
(06:50):
all your reactions or your smart systems, which are protection.
So that's the one that you know stops you getting
a knee injury because you can land and pivot and
react quickly. So is that a mental thing or as
physical thing? It's a physical thing. It's get it's getting
your neurological system, your brain activating to react really really quickly.
And so the soccer has done a great thing called
(07:11):
the Fee for eleven. They've divided this into stages where
because of the ACL injuries and soccer going through the roof,
they developed the system. First part physiological like I talk about.
Second part is activation. It's making things smart. It's balancing
on one leg, it's hopping its pliometrics and so it's
activating your nervous system so you are ready to go.
And so we had an incident in the Breakers this year.
(07:32):
One of our players, for whatever reason, missed the neurological
part of our warm up. Our warm up was very structured.
I can't remember the reason.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Why.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
How long is it take by the way the Breakers
warm up.
Speaker 5 (07:41):
Oh it's maybe forty five minutes?
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Oh wow? Okay, yeah, okay, yep.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
And so, and he had ruptured his ACL that game. Now,
you can't say it was directly because he missed that
part of us wall we do go, but we were
very very very very strict from then on that nobody
misses that part. And the third part is sports specific,
where you know if you're if you're a tennis player,
you start hitting a tennis ball, if you were a
basketball or you shoot a basketball, and then you do
the things that you would do in a game. Soccer
(08:06):
players cut, change direction?
Speaker 3 (08:08):
So does it take longer to warm up the older
you get?
Speaker 4 (08:12):
And that's asking for a friend, because I mean, you know,
I'm learning a lot about it just through cycling.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
But it's it's funny.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
The first about an hour and a bit today and
I didn't really get ahead of steam up, And the
last twenty minutes I was on fire.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
But for the first forty I.
Speaker 5 (08:27):
Was, Yeah, everything takes longer and you're older.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Okay, So that's true.
Speaker 5 (08:32):
It's true.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
What about kids then, because.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
I mean, I'd love to be able to give my kid,
my daughter's you know, sporting team and my daughter advice
on warming up and they go through a sort of
motions of warm up and you know, you know, that's
tossing balls around and let's do some shuttle runs and stuff.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
But what does a warm up? You know, what should
it look like for kids?
Speaker 5 (08:55):
Exactly the same. And so if you're twelve, you know,
you kind of bend you like a rubber band and
you don't really need to warm up, but as you
get to sort of thirteen fourteen, fifteen, you go through puberty,
can develop more power. That's where the imbalance starts to
happen at adolescent athletes, where you it's not so much
your less flexible, but your muscle system overpowers your skeletal system.
(09:17):
And so you've got these I use the analogy it's
like a helicopter where the big roador is power and
the little road is control. And as you go through puberty,
your big roader gets stronger as your muscles grow exponentially,
but your stability and control system is lagging behind. And
so part of going back to warm up these kids
need to really do the activation part. That's that's more
(09:39):
important than the physiological part. In my mind, that's a
stimulating hang on.
Speaker 3 (09:43):
So we've got the physical physical hang on, we've got physiological, neurological, neurological,
that's where's the energy system one that's stays in the
physiological physiological Okay, so what because you've got a particular
interest and interests in injuries and fitness with them, I wis.
Speaker 5 (10:02):
Adolescents, yeah, teenagers, and.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
As is it just it's a different game these days
because of the expectations and modern training, you know, the
ability to with weights and what we've learned over the
years has meant that kids are just getting so much
stronger than their systems are ready for.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
Is that it is so you're as you go through puberty,
your muscles developed very very quickly, especially in boys, but
your skeletal system is still not until you're round about
twenty fully developed. And so what you've got is you've
got these powerful muscles that are growing and acting on
an adolescent skeleton which is still quite weak. And so
(10:39):
you kind of get this imbalance where these massive like
I said, go back to helicopter analogy. You get the
big rotor which is power and the little roader, which
is controlled. They get out of balance, and a helicopter
that has its situation crashes and that's why we're seeing
a massive increase in adolescent injuries. Especially the ACL is
the most documented one.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
What what's what's with the I mean the ACL, it's
three initials.
Speaker 4 (11:01):
I've never heard of until you know, ten years ago,
no idea what an ACL was. When I was and
I used to play volleyball competitively, where you think, well,
you know, I know what a moniscus is.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
Yeah, but what is the ACL and why are we
hearing about it so much?
Speaker 5 (11:18):
So, I mean, I remember diagnosing. I still remember her
very clearly diagnosing my first adolescent ACL and a fourteen
year old back in the nineties, and I had to
argue with the doctor at the time he's going to
teenagers don't rupture their acls. These days, it's a common occurrence.
Like you said, suddenly everybody knows what an ACL is,
and so it's driven by a number of reasons. One
(11:39):
is surfaces. Our surfaces are better. So in the old days,
you know, you slide across a rugby field, it's okay.
These days you stop and it's dry, and your foot
stops and your nee keeps on going. That's one of
the things. Things like sprigs and rugby boots are now
designed for grip, so you land. It used to be
your foot could move. These days you land and your
footstays fixed. So when you rotate someone, the force has
(12:00):
got to go somewhere, so your need gets hurt. But
I think the biggest issue from my perspective is the
modern athlete. This is adolescents and also performance athletes. Without
sounding derogatory in some ways. They're a little bit like
garla apples that they're all polished and shining on the outside,
but the inside is actually not stable. And so have
you kind of have three parts to your system. You
(12:23):
got the skeleton, which is just a bag of bones
with no strength outside the skeleton hard against it. You
have what I call the muscular skeleton now that is
designed to protect, desalerate and control movement. Outside that. You
have the show ponies, you know, the pectoral muscles and
all that. And when people go to the gym these days,
they try and develop size and power. And that's you know,
(12:45):
to the gym and saying I can make you stronger,
but you look any different. People don't really like that much.
Same with the young athletes. They spend ages doing heavy squats,
pec deck whatever. Those muscles are power, but they are
not protection. And so I remember again going bt acl
AD a guy come in the clinic who had been
cleared to play rugby after an acl reconstruction. What criteria?
(13:05):
He said, I can squat twice my body weight. He could,
he was strong. I get him to stand on one
league and close his eyes and he fell over straight away.
So he had absolutely no balance or stability or appropriate
exception we call it, which is knowing we are in space.
He reruptured as ACL the next game, so it's kind
of god.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
You must have watched How did you feel watching Lindsay Vaughn?
Speaker 5 (13:26):
Yeah, yeah, I know, Yeah?
Speaker 4 (13:28):
Was she just bonkers to to well, you know, she
thought of what the hell? Yeah, this is the winter,
this is the winter skiing downhill legend who skied down
here with a brace and no a CL or no
CL And she's, I don't know what you can live
with an a CL like I'm part of my When
I was younger, I did a lot of work with
(13:48):
Pacific Island rugby teams and I used to sort of
strap them I testing and so they said, yeah, I
had a really bad injury three years ago, but.
Speaker 5 (13:55):
It's fine, and they had no a CL. So you
can actually live without an a CL one hundred percent.
Speaker 4 (13:59):
Okay, Hey, look, I've got lots to ask Rob. Rob
Knight as my guest. He's physiotherapist for the Break, among
other things. He also has an interest in adolescent.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
Physiotherapy health.
Speaker 4 (14:11):
I guess what's the word to, you know, just keeping
our young pep young athletes injury free. So if you've
got any questions on behalf of a young person in
your house, I have one in my house. I'm going
to probably QUIZZM a bit on, but I W eight
hundred eighty ten eighty. If you've got any questions around
your own physio, what's the word about your own physical
(14:32):
health when it comes from muscular sort of stability, then
give us a call. I W eight hundred eighty ten
eighty Text nine to nine to two.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
We started talking about the warm up.
Speaker 4 (14:42):
I'm quite fascinated with the fact that you've got to
do at least forty five minutes.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Well, you have to do a length for you warm up.
Then you might think, I think that's what we settle on.
Speaker 5 (14:50):
Isn't it wrong for performance sport because you know, obviously
they've got to get down to the nitty gritty of
the skill set that they've got to get into.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
So maybe not the same for bulls.
Speaker 5 (14:58):
No, definitely, Okay.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Twenty one past four, I W eight hundred eighty ten eighty.
Back in Attack News Talks, there be we are with
a new guest on the show. He's robbed nineties physiotherapist
for the Breakers and we're taking your calls on eight
hundred eighty ten and eighty.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
Let's let's kick it off with Jeff. Hi, Jeff, good, idea,
how are you?
Speaker 6 (15:17):
I'm my grandfather of a fifteen year old rugby player yep,
who's about what are one eighty two high yep and
maybe ninety kg's and he's complaining about pain in the
top of his knees, top of his knees.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
Okay, yeah, and that's haunded able to Rob to. He's
going to cause you a bit more and we'll give
us some reckons. Hew Robot. I'll just turn Rob's microphone on.
That's the trick.
Speaker 5 (15:43):
There we go, Hey, Jeff, how good? Goody? I mean,
it's pretty hard to make a diagnose without seeing it.
But he's ninety kg's, which is a decent size for
a fifteen year old. And I suspect yeah, big big boy, Yeah,
doing a lot of squats.
Speaker 6 (15:57):
Yeah, probably is into rowing. Yeah, he's doing rowing, and
he's he's rugby season started, but he's training him stuff because.
Speaker 5 (16:06):
His knees hurt, so it's above his knees or behind
his knee cap.
Speaker 6 (16:11):
I saw him rubbing some physio cram into above his knees,
you know, to try and yeah, to make them get
the pain to go away. But he said, it's just
it's just walking their own running.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
I mean, so when you're sort of growing at that age,
when you're fifteen, your bones grow rapidly, your muscles are
sort of lagging behind, and so often what you get
is like a pulling of the tendons on the bone.
So you know, check first of all, if he's had
a big growth spurt, because that's the first sign. If
he has, then he's going to be getting that tension
injury and the second this year. Yeah, so if he's
(16:45):
had a big growth spurt, like I said, it catches
up where your muscles eventually catch up with your bones.
You know, they used to talk about growing pains in
the old days, and they are actually a real thing,
sort of you know, feeling your bones are stretching. And
the second thing is when kids are playing a lot
of sport, they do start to overload the tendon attachments
to the kneecap and so you might find that he
he needs to stretch his quads a lot more. But
(17:06):
what I'd said, he is probably get him to see
a physio. There's some really good ones around it, and
they'll diagnose accurately and give him exactly what he needs
to do.
Speaker 6 (17:14):
Okay, thanks, thanks.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Thanks Jeff. Hey, Now let's dig into that, because I mean,
I'm conscious because.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
I've got kids who are athletic and you know, into
sport and things and dance a whole lot of things.
But one of the texts someone has sent in and
has touched on something we talked about off here, it says, Tim,
I love that your guest mentioned hacky sack underrated for
warm up and coordination. And this is from an ex
motocross racer. But and the conversation you and I had
off here was I was talking about one of my
(17:43):
daughters who does a bit of dance, and she's doing
hockey and netball.
Speaker 3 (17:46):
But and you' you've just made a remark.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
That there's there's there's another sort of play, which is
quite good for kids because there's this formal structure that's
all well and good.
Speaker 5 (17:56):
But yeah, so I think we're like like your children
you're talking about. Your thirty year old is very active.
She's doing hockey, jazz, ballet, netball, but they're all structured
activities where she goes and she does a very you know,
structured period. And so what I think we're missing these days,
(18:17):
without sounding up my grandfather, is what I call incidental exercise,
where basically you're just mucking around. You walking to school,
you're kicking a stone along the road, you're playing hacky sack,
you're climbing a tree, whatever. And I know that sounds like, yeah,
something from the old days, and they've got old days,
but it's something that's missing because that's the foundation of
how we learn. So for example, when you when you're
(18:37):
a baby, one of the key developmental stages is crawling.
And so you know, when a baby's crawling, it learns
to stabilize and it learns to movement. It has a
huge impact on learning as well. So we know that
they're using crawling in ten and eleven year olds learn
to do that's an important stage. And then what happens
is put them in jolly jumpers and they look up
and they go, holy hell, I never want to crawl again.
(18:58):
And they sit there looking at the world. And that's
a structured environment. Same with your children. So I call
them active couch potato is where they do nothing, then
they go into an hour of hockey training. Then they
sit on their bum again and do nothing and do
an hour of jazz batter and you think, oh, that's
an active kid, and it's actually not how the human
body was designed. The human body was designed to move
all the time in different directions and stuff like that,
(19:20):
and so we know that early specialization. So it's great
your daughter's doing three different activities which are complimentary, but
we see again. You know, years ago you played every
sport and two about fifteen sixteen, they said, oh, you're
pretty good at basketball, and you start specializing in basketball.
These days, you know your talent identified at age twelve,
and talent identification is often just early puberty. But then
(19:42):
you're channeled into one sport and so you do basketball
or you know, sport a and you become very good
at basketball. And I remember back in two thousand and nine,
an American S and C trainer came from the States
to work with some of the New Zealand netballers and
they said, what do you think of our netballers And
he said, well, they're like baby giraffes. He said, the
only reason they're good at netball is because they're seven
feet tall and play lots of netball. Fundamentally, they weren't
(20:05):
a good athlete, they weren't stable, but they played a
lot of netball, and they were tall. They were talented supposedly,
And so with the kids these days, what's missing is
a foundation layer of activity.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
Just so does that you have a funny thing is
I mean we almost I almost touched on this with
you in the break as well, but because we've noticed
that one of our very famous adolescents has got a
stress factor and somebody's just texted about that. Yes, I mean,
you're not going to speculate on Sam Ruth with a
stress fracture, but I think the.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Whole country where he's got a stress.
Speaker 5 (20:37):
Fracture, but I do. I mean Sam's crew looking after
him are doing an amazing job, so it would have
been probably bad luck or something completely under I.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
Was hoping it wasn't while he was playing Hanky sat But.
Speaker 4 (20:48):
Actually I mean that question, I think it resonates with
a lot of parents who've got sporty kids.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
That you know, in fact, as.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
You mentioned, you know, going from couch potato to being
really active in a specific sport. So how how can
young people I've got to stop seeing kids, How can
young people.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
How can young people can like them? You know, how
can they whatever, how can they strengthen themselves or how
can they best protect them to be protected from that
sort of phenomenon you're talking about.
Speaker 5 (21:23):
I mean it is hard. I mean it's one of
those things where you know, young kids right now will
spend a huge amount of time on screens and you know,
again without sending like my grandfather, they should be outside playing,
climbing trees, et cetera, because that that develops the muscles
that stabilize and support you as an adolescent. You almost
have to do things to counteract the modern world. Like
(21:43):
you know, I always think that you know, people drive
to school, Like when I went to school, there was
one car in my car park at school. These days
the car park they're knocking out hockey fields to put
a new car park, and the kids need to, for example,
just park further away. You try and gather that incidental
exercise through your day. It's one of those things I
saw them I study again in Wellington where they put
(22:04):
a pedometer on a bunch of different people, school kids, builders, whatever,
and just saw how much they walk through the day
just incidental exercise and the least active person in that
group was actually a high schooler who played two or
three sports like your daughter, but they actually did very
very little outside of it. And it's also a trap
that we get into as adults, where you know, currently,
(22:24):
you get up in the morning, you do forty five
minutes at the gym, on your bike or whatever you're
going to do, and then do nothing for the rest
of the day. And that's not how the human body
was designed. We were designed to continuously move.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Well, this sounds like there are a lot of I mean,
it sounds like we're creating an injury prone population in
a way because of our I mean, god, how often
do we talk about devices on this show when it
comes to parenting and.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
All that sort of thing. But for instance, I don't
want to fall in love with the Hackey sack text, right,
But actually, I mean that was a throwaway remark from
you're talking about but it's talking about it just playing
having fun, and I do remember how bloody hard Hackey
sack is.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
Yeah, but I mean there's a part of me that
wants to go and get my daughter a Hackey sack.
That's not necessarily dumb move, was it? It's a training tool.
And there's a there's a thing in adolescent sport where
they talk about that you never that fitness should be games,
So you don't do you know, fourteen year olds running
shuttle runs that bores the hell out of them and
breaks their brain. But if you get them, you know,
carrying each other on a piggyback and doing and running,
(23:23):
it's a game. And they're not actually realizing they're doing it.
Is that safe for them to do so because I
suddenly go the older person goes, oh my god, that ainaying.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
But like I said, playing hanky sack, the kids or
athletes don't realize they're actually doing a training thing. I
remember one one of the things we did and one
of the sports teams we did a preseason training was brutal.
It was gruesome, and we did a fitness session. At
the end of the session, the guys were on the ground,
but we'd organize the zorb soccer balls, you know the
ones you go inside and you run against each other
with bank. So they all turned up and then the
(23:55):
guys suddenly found their second wind and we did another
thirty minutes of sorb soccer, which.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
Is really really hard because you're having a lot of fun.
Speaker 5 (24:01):
But they didn't realize we were just we were increasing
their fitness training because they were having fun. And same
with kids. You know, like I said, you.
Speaker 4 (24:07):
Know, not every team you can get in the Zorb
soccer balls, even though I've made a note Zorb soccer
ball and Hackey Sack.
Speaker 5 (24:15):
I'm changing. But you know, so the gym programs, for example,
if if you're going to do it an instruction environment,
if for example, it's not going to happen playing Hacky
Sack in a gym environment. The key thing is destabilized.
So you try and do everything in an unstable environment,
which mimics real life, like real life is not you know,
a level ground.
Speaker 4 (24:33):
Okay, because that reminds me of you know something I
wrote down on my notes before the show is and
that's sort you're probably just frown at me.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
As soon as somebody talks about.
Speaker 4 (24:43):
Doing something for core strength, they go, oh god, I
hate doing core strength stuff. But I imagine if you're
doing stable core strength stuff, you're not are you helping
yourself or you're not. It's another structure to exercise.
Speaker 5 (24:56):
This is one of my soapbox issues is that core
strength if you're lying here doing a plank, the plank
is not a core strength and.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
I hate planks, so thank you.
Speaker 5 (25:05):
So what So, basically, going back to what I said
at the beginning, you've got your skeleton. Around your skeleton,
you have lots of little muscles all attached, like around
your spine. You've got these little muscles that go one segment,
but they act like a school of fish. If one
starts to move, the other start to move. That's your stability.
So for example, if you're doing a bicep curl at
the gym and you're over there, you know, a big
preacher curl, and you're growing your bicep, then in real
(25:26):
life you've got to lift something. The body goes will
where's my support and it hasn't got the strength to
do it. If you stand on a bosu ballers half
round balls, close your eyes and do a curl, you're
like this and suddenly you're engaging the true core muscles,
which are the stability muscles, and you're making them smart.
Then you actually don't need to do core exercises. So
(25:46):
if you trade, if you look at bench press, which
is one of my pet hates, where you're basic lying
on a stable platform and pushing with your pecks and
you get big pecks. But then in real life your
car breaks down and you go to push your car
and your body goes, well, where's the bench and you
hurt your back because you haven't got true strength. And
so destabilizing can use a cable pulley for example, and press.
(26:07):
Then you're engaging your core muscles and it's all working
as a system.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
So you look, you would come across talented athletes who
are on the younger side of the ledger do you
have how do you how do you handle working with
the younger athletes? I mean, I'm thinking of the comment
you made about you know, netballers who are just you know,
very very talented netball giraffes.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
But how do you look after young people who are
shoved into a professional environment and make sure that they
have that that physical resilience. That's the word I'm looking for.
Speaker 5 (26:36):
So I think I saw an article a while ago
the biggest barrier to success as a sportsperson is not
lack of talent or lack of work ethic. It's injury.
So you know, most adolescent athletes fail to get the
next level because of injury, not because of any other reason.
And so during that period of adolescence, especially when kids
(26:57):
are going through puberty and their bodies changing. Actually there's
a there's a can I seeguay off on this one?
Speaker 7 (27:02):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (27:02):
Yeah, where we go? I a young trampoline who was
I think he was the New Zealand trampoline champion from memory,
but he suddenly became like a gumby at of age fourteen.
He was tripping over his own feet and the guy
who could do a triple somersault literally we had to
pull him off the tramplin because he was going to
kill himself. He had a growth spurt and it was
a massive growth spit and his body was just so
(27:23):
out of kilter.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
And I see that it was out of balance, but absolutely.
Speaker 5 (27:27):
Things were growing. Muscles were growing at different rates of bones,
and he became a menace and we had to stop
him for his years.
Speaker 4 (27:32):
It's almost like the full crimbs in his body. You
know where he's swiveling around, they'd all been. They would
have all moved, even if it's just a centimeter.
Speaker 5 (27:39):
It literally went from it like a size eight shoe
to a size eleven shoe, and he was literally tripping
over his own feet. And so, you know, bringing an
adolescent sports person through is be patient. Like nobody remembers
who the best seventeen year old rugby player was. They
remember the best twenty three year old rugby player because
you you know, and so you try and nurse them through.
And so the key thing we go back to is
(28:00):
we don't build power out I mess, we're building stability.
And so when young player at the Breakers this year
and our head of high performance, Shane Connolly, did a
fantastic job this kid, like I said, he's going to
go onto a great career, but seventeen eighteen looked like
a man, but his skeleton was still a young boys
and so we were really careful that what we do.
Everything we did with him was based around activation, neurological stimulation, stability,
(28:26):
not power. And power came. Power will come as he develops.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
So my gosh, I've got a lot of questions.
Speaker 4 (28:33):
But by the way, look I'm just going to throw
this out to the audience. We've got Peter waiting, and
what usually happens when we have a new guest on
the shows, everyone listens and in the last five minutes
you all.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Want to talk to him. I would suggest that the
now is the time.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
If you got any questions for Rob Knight, he's a
physiotherapist for the Breakers, then get on the blower. Oh
eight hundred and eighty ten eighty will be back in
just a moment. Twenty one minutes to five. Newstalk said B.
News Talk said B where with Rob Knight, he's physiotherapist
for the Break is taking your calls as well. I've
got quite a few texts to get to, but first
the first quarter online Peter good.
Speaker 7 (29:00):
A, Oh good A fellows a hi rod. I fell
down three weeks ago on a concrete and upset my
arthritic arthritic knee and I've been to the I got
a chit acc went to the doctor and I've been
(29:20):
going to physio every two weeks. And well, I've got
a walking stick at the moment. I don't like to
be on a walking stick and I'm seventy eight, but
I like to get back into the running section. I'm
doing aquad jogging twice a week and tied Chie, how
(29:43):
do you reckon? It would be do you reckon another
couple of weeks or something?
Speaker 3 (29:47):
Peter, You're amazing, Yeah, it's incredible.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
So you were running before, Peter, I.
Speaker 7 (29:53):
Do jogging yet, and I do athletics, still doing the
throwing and the trying and keep myself was fit as possible,
but it's a bit frustrating. The physio suggested that or
in the future, you'll be able to start walking around
around a grass panic one lap at a time and
(30:17):
have a rest and build it up like that that
the knees got half a cartilage and so I'm battling
away there to try and get back into normality.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
Yeah, okay, I mean that's a that's a tough one, Petter.
But not not knowing not I think seeing the extra
thing like that, like the fact you're doing variety, like
you're throwing, you're aqua jogging, you're you know, that's fantastic.
But the second thing is cycling is often really really
good because it keeps the muscles going while you can't
own and when you get back to running. One of
(30:48):
my favorite things for athletes who have a worn cartilage,
even even I'm talking in their twenties and we do
this for performance athletes is if you're running upper hill,
there's no impacts. So I've had friends who are high
leveled athletes with really early arthritic knees, they can't actually
go for a jog, but they can sprint up a hill.
They throw up. And so when you get back to exercising,
(31:09):
go uphills, running hard and walking back down that that
means your knees aren't getting impact, but it keeps you
fitting strong.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Gosh, I hadn't thought about that. What that sound like
to you, Peter? You like running up hill?
Speaker 7 (31:21):
Not really not now mind, I don't mind that, but
the bike and side of it, I think that's that
sounds quite good. That I've also given an exercise to
to strengthen the quads, and I'm doing that each day.
(31:43):
So I'm sort of hoping that time heels and I'll
be back.
Speaker 5 (31:48):
But I'm sure your physias is doing a great job
on it.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
Got on your Peter, well good luck with that. Actually,
I mean I was interested that you said you would.
You know how some people say want to get back running.
It's like you were running until recently, I assume because
obviously seventy eight you wouldn't want suddenly pick it up necessarily.
That's just what about jogging? Actually, yeah, which I mean
it's a funny one.
Speaker 5 (32:06):
That's again and One of my sort of things that
I get on is that humans there's this. I don't
think there's any other species in the world at jogs
except humans.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Whose fault is that? Is that arth Lydiad's fault.
Speaker 5 (32:17):
I don't know how it came out.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
Why was it that invented jogging? Yeah, I mean where
did that? Was it?
Speaker 5 (32:22):
Jim the guy in the States? But we're designed to
sprint or walk physically okay, yeah, the in between the
jogging is like driving your car and said year, it's
great for meditation, but not necessarily the best for your joints.
Speaker 4 (32:34):
What's cycling like then, because I mean, it's been something
I've discovered. So I'm a middle aged man in lycra
but it's been revolutionary for me for knees and stuff.
And I'm wayferter than I've been ever, I think. But
you know, I'm probably doing something that's a bit specific.
I'm probably not that.
Speaker 5 (32:50):
You know, robust cycling is fantastic, you know, cardiovascularly leg strength,
it doesn't. It's a little bit one dimensional, and that cyclists,
for example, make terrible runners. So if you're a cyclist
and a lot of cycling, you try and run your
hamstrings under developed. Your quad's dominant. But all I say
is if you're cycling, you try and balance it up
by doing things like stretching or you know, some hamstring
(33:13):
work off there.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
Or walking walking, you know. I mean, we've got a
specialist in that show.
Speaker 4 (33:18):
He says, Look, you can probably get back under the running,
but I just I don't enjoy run up hills. Okay,
We've got a few texts here, and there'll be a
lot of parents who have heard this one before that. Anyway,
this was one from joy I think, says my son
thirteen years played foot Saul had an accident during a
game and a hard fall landed on his knees. He
complained of pain for months later. When he was a
(33:38):
spike riding, the osteopath said, he at Osgood. She's spelt
it wrong, but I think she's referring to Osgod schlatters
or something. He still has large bumped below his knee bones.
Should we investigate surgery is a question. But anyway, Osgood slatters?
Is that how he say Good slatters.
Speaker 5 (33:53):
It's a specific thing where the attachment of the patel
attendont onto your shin bone and there's a growth plate
right where it attaches. And so what happens as kids
Two things. One is they grow quickly and suddenly that
like I said, their bones are longer than their muscles
and there's a like a traction injury on that growth
plate and you get calcification. Well, secondly, if they play
a lot of sports and they just load that area.
(34:15):
I have never sorry, I can tell a lie in
my whole career. I've seen one that required surgery.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
So okay, it is very very unlikely. So is it
something you can exit?
Speaker 4 (34:25):
I had it when I was a kid, say, and
it slowed me down? Of course it's slow me down'
It stopped me because I refused to let it stop me.
But what is the story with those goriuge slats and
managing it?
Speaker 5 (34:35):
So you just manage your level of exercise. That's the
first thing. If you're playing, you know, if you're training
three different sports every night and just doing too much,
you look at how much you're doing. Second thing, it
often happens through the rapid growth period, so you just
literally back off a little bit in your volume of
exercise to that period. And third thing, I get the
kids to stretch the hell out of their quads. Like
literally twenty times quad stretched.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
So stretching is because is there a different schools of
thought on how important stretching is?
Speaker 5 (35:00):
Yep, So I mean stretching is a thing that keeps
you mobile. So if you sit on your bum all
day your head flexes get tight, you should stretch them
and lengthen them out. But that's a static stretch, and
you should do.
Speaker 3 (35:12):
That so you don't have to be warmed up to
do that.
Speaker 5 (35:14):
Not necessarily, just do it gently. So if you're not
warmed up, you just don't push it quite as hard.
But that's different from dynamic stretching. Going back to warm up,
where you do not do static stretching in your warm up.
Static stretching is designed to make you more flexible, yeah,
over long periods.
Speaker 4 (35:31):
So static stretching is like me sticking my foot up
on a desk and leaning forward gently until I feel
some stretch.
Speaker 5 (35:37):
And hold that for thirty seconds, and that will gradually
over time length in your hamstring. Short term, it actually
reduces your contractile force on your hamstrings. So if I
got you stretch your hamstrings for three or four minutes
and made you sprint, you could quite likely tear your
hamstring yeah, So stretching statically as part of a warm
up is not the thing.
Speaker 3 (35:53):
Don't do that.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
No, dynamic stretching where you if you want to do
your hamstrings, you stand there, hold onto a pole and
you swing your leg back and forth. That's prepping your hamstring.
Oh yeah, well that's a big one because it's different.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
So static stre or do it at nighttime, don't do it.
So do dynamic stretching. Yeah, what's a dynamic quad stretch?
Look like?
Speaker 5 (36:12):
Again, swing your leg back and forth. You're stretching your
quad dynamically as well. So if you know you stand,
let it bend and yeah, just let your need bend
at the other end and you've stretched your quade at
the same time.
Speaker 3 (36:19):
I've just swung it back and forth. Oh that's that's
nice and easy.
Speaker 4 (36:22):
Okay, seventeen year old six foot eighty kilos painful shin
splints even after a lot of time off. Does stretches
or don't it static or active or whatever?
Speaker 3 (36:33):
It has custom orthotics, good shoes. That's the text.
Speaker 5 (36:38):
Yeah, that's a tough one. That is a really tough one.
So shin splints is where the muscles on the inside
of your shin bone basically microscopically tear away from the
bone and they microscopically bleed. They form in my head
like a little scab. Then you start running again, the
scab rips open again and it just becomes a self
perpetuating thing. It's tough. So first of all, the first
thing I look at is not biomechanics. I look at volume.
(37:00):
Shin splins are almost always a volume related problem where
you're just doing too much thing. Then you look at
obviously you look at biomechanics, but it sounds like they've
got really good orthotics and stuff like that. The treatment
for them is a lot of massage and that get
people to do it themselves. They sit there, work your
fingers up and out. It just loosens up and freeze
that that attachment up.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
Okay, we've got to come more texts to come to it,
but we'll be back in just to tick.
Speaker 4 (37:21):
We're with Rob Knight. He's physio for the Breakers. Taking
your course of actually well not sure if we have
time for course. We'll see how we go. But it
is nine and a half minutes to five news talks.
It'd be it's news talks. It'd be a lot of time.
Has flown this hour with Rob night. He's physiotherapists for
the breakers. But Rob, the thing that's popped out from
this conversation is just about you know, it's one thing
(37:41):
to have kids who are driven to do well at
a particular sport or even a couple of sports, but
you know, don't forget to get them playing to make
them more resilient, so they're not just focused on one
style of movement or exercise.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Will that be right? Oh? How let me just turn
your mic on. That's on my fault again.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
I think the key thing is that playing, whether it
be like I said, climbing a tree, whatever, it builds
a resilient base for a kid. Lifting weights in the gym,
doesn't it when it breaks their brain. If you're twelve
year I trying to lift weights, it breaks your body
and it breaks your brain.
Speaker 3 (38:13):
I just find it. I haven't found that. I always
find the gym a bit boring anyway.
Speaker 5 (38:17):
So for a kid, it's a nightmare. And like I said,
you know, running shuttles as a fourteen year old just
destroys you physically and mentally. So a lot of these
things can be replicated with play, and it doesn't seem
like training, but it actually is. It's building and making
that kid resilient and protecting them because but like I said,
thing in sports is longevity. You want to be there
at the end, not a not as a burned out
(38:38):
fourteen year.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Old, just out of curiosity, because you look pretty fit.
You what do you do to keep your wheels spinning?
Speaker 5 (38:44):
I try, I mean I do, try and follow that
philosophy what I said. I am like I walk. I
actually wear a weighted vest when I walk, so you know,
we're two fifteen CAGs up bush tracks. I do sprints.
Just like I said, I try and go to the
field and just you know, I probably look like an
old guy sprinting. I go to the gym. We have
a little farm and I cut firewood. It's actually interesting
(39:05):
article recently where the thing that increases testosterone in a
male more than anything is actually wood chopping more than
any other activity.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
Really. Yeah, so after a fascinating, a little bit of
serious to.
Speaker 5 (39:18):
Sixty minutes, it falls off because you're getting tired, But
forty five minutes of wood chopping increases testro so more
than playing rugby. It's incredible.
Speaker 3 (39:25):
It's interesting because it's a sort of asymmetric activity in
a way, isn't it? And asymmetric things like golf and
stuff that I mean, do we have?
Speaker 4 (39:36):
One of my other guests is so you don't know.
No one's in balance, you know, And he was talking
about some athletes he works with. He said, none of
them are in balance. And everyone thinks you've got to
be symmetrical. He said, that's bollocks.
Speaker 5 (39:46):
Are the only people who need to be symmetrical are
people are doing very competitive things like a marathon runner.
If they've got a leg link, that's one sending me
short on the other it shows up because they do
it ten thousand times. A rugby play at does some
different because they're changing direction all the time.
Speaker 4 (39:57):
So hey, Rob God, time flies when you're having fun.
I hope we can get you back love to excellent.
It's difficult to say no on here, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Anyway? Hey? By the way, if you're missed any of that,
then check out the podcast. After six o'clock we will
be back with the smart money next. Janets o cars
with us.
Speaker 4 (40:14):
I'm going to ask you how you can hide your
assets legally and illegally.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
She might not answer it, but it'll be fun asking.
We'll be back shortly.
Speaker 4 (40:20):
This is News Talk said be the weekend clicktive, but
coming up to three minutes to five.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
News Talks EDB.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
For more from the weekend collective, listen live to News
Talks EDB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talks EDB.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
The nice lou E Wesvan facking.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
Can make you.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Happy Sometimes I think nice he Wesvin facking can make
you happy.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Usually Yes, and welcome back.
Speaker 4 (00:35):
This is the Weekend Collective and this hour it is
the Health Hub and we've got a new guest to
introduced to you in just a moment. But of course
it's the where we invite. We want your calls and
participation on eight hundred and eighty ten eighty and look,
there are a bunch of things we're going to get into,
and as always with a new guest, we sort of
get to know each other along the ways, and it's
(00:56):
amazing that the conversation things that pop out as we
get going. But for decades, obviously we watch we've all
watched professional athletes spend a whole lot of time warming
up between the pregame interviews on game day, from stretching
stretching to sprinting and everything in between. And yet we
have had a guest on the show who was talking
about warming. I don't want to quote them out of context,
(01:20):
but that you know, there's interesting information around stretching and
when you should stretch all that sort of stuff, and
the warm up and things. But how important is the
warm up because what I've seem to have learned is
that the warm up for the biking that I do
is Okay, m up be a little bit to do
with your muscles, but it's also about getting your cardiovascular.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
System going, get your heart pumping and everything.
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Anyway, so we're gonna have a chat about, you know,
how important warming up is, but also other things to
do with injuries and how we've seen ACL injuries increase
twenty nine fold since the nineties, and I don't know
if it's just to do with diagnosis or whatever. Anyway,
we're going to talk about your bodies and fitness and
warming up and looking after yourself, and probably a bit
(02:03):
of it we might dig into as well, because kids
these days, I don't know, I get the feeling that
with modern training techniques there, they're subjecting themselves to much
greater forces. It used to be the days, the old days,
that kids just bounced back from injuries, but I think
things have changed a little bit there. Anyway, we want
to have your cause on one hundred and eighty ten
(02:23):
eighty text nine nine two and joining us.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
He is, well, I think he's a bit of a
superstar to be working for this.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
He's the team physiotherapist for the Breakers and his name
is Rob Knight and Rob's with me.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
Now get a Rob.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
Thank you. Privileged to be here.
Speaker 4 (02:37):
Yeah, that's that is a pretty high falutant team to
be physio for, isn't.
Speaker 5 (02:41):
It's it's a great team to be physio for. Yeah,
it's obviously I love basketball, but the Breakers is a
great organization as well, and they've got new owners recently,
so that's changed it again for the better.
Speaker 3 (02:51):
Yeah. And how long have you been? Tell us a
little bit about you. How did you get involved in physiotherapy?
How long you've been doing it? In sports physiotherapy and
all that.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I've been almost forty years now working as a physio
sort of. I was lucky. My first job was actually
with the all Black Physis of the Times. I was
straight into performance sport. Ye had a stint in London
working on the London Musicals for a brief time, so
I know.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Wow, Yeah, so that was okay.
Speaker 5 (03:14):
Yeah, that's an interesting one because I look on dancers
and performers as performance athletes, but they don't get the
same care that performance athletes get.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
Actually, it's interesting because we mentioned that the you know,
the advent of pilates, everyone's doing it. When I was
in Foundom of the Opera back in Sydney.
Speaker 4 (03:31):
Quite a few years ago, okay, thirty years ago, close
to thirty years ago, the ballet dancers did pilates I
think once or twice a week, and it was a
thing that the company paid for. It was totally it
was very new and they were and they would describe
what they'd do and I'd.
Speaker 3 (03:47):
Be like, no, that sounds easy.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
And one of them put me through some pilates stuff
that she was doing, and I was like, okay, okay.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
You went, and now it's like just normal.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Yeah. I mean, it's amazing how it's become. What sort
of interest you see on stage? Is it more dancing and.
Speaker 5 (04:03):
A lot of overuse injuries because these guys work their
asses off, like they'll be, you know, doing a show
in the morning and a show in the evening two
hours and so you know, that's full on like dancers especially.
One of the musicals was Starlut Express with the roller skill.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Oh okay, well, I'd imagine that had more than one
physio would they.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
Ah, they were pretty underdone, to be honest, like their
medical care is not like today where you're looking after it. Yeah,
but I remember one and lame is where it was
the closing scene and the guy I think he was
dying down the stairs or something, but he actually fell
and looked really great. We found he actually broke his
ankle on the way down and he lay there still
delivered his lines, but he'd actually broke at his ankle.
These people are tough.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
Was it the guy at the top of the barricade.
Speaker 5 (04:40):
It's a long time ago, but I remember going on
stage upwards going oh, yeah, he goes, I can't actually
get up, so yeah, But I don't know. I think
stage performers, dances, ballet dancers, these guys have a really
tough life. We see we see you know, contact sport,
et cetera. But these guys work just as hard and have.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
It's unrelenting because as I say it, I mean eight
shows a week with two Matt mates.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Now that's got fascinating. I have to dig into that
with a bit more.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
But on that off air, and so then from there
I was basically my career was in private practice and
performance sports. So I was lucky enough to be with
New Zealand rugby, the Warriors and then the Breakers now
in the tour backs.
Speaker 4 (05:16):
Hey, we'll touch on that because I did open with
the discussion on warmups.
Speaker 3 (05:21):
But actually, how what does a warm up look like
these days? Because I mean it does time to kids sport,
because I've.
Speaker 4 (05:28):
Got a daughter who's thirteen and she's involved with hockey
and netball, you know, highly competitively. And you know, I
remember when we did how I used to play volleyball
and we'd do warm up, but we jog up and
down the gym a couple of times and that was it.
Then we'd get into it because you don't really think
about it when you're younger exactly. But how what is
a warm up and what is a warm up for?
Speaker 5 (05:49):
So I look at warm up in three stages. The
first is I guess what I call physiological. It's just
getting yourself warm. You could jump on a bike, you
could run, but it's sort of ten to fifteen minutes
just getting the systems or working blood pumping. Your body
also switches energy, so you run out of muscle glycogene's
which is the liver glycogen that's that second win that
athletes talk about. So you want to get into that
(06:11):
before you've actually started.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Before you can start competing.
Speaker 5 (06:14):
You don't want it to happen halfway through. You wanted
to sort of be kicking in before you go.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
So is that why that when we see I mean
we've seen it with rugby games, it seems that they
really put themselves through quite a few paces. Is that
because they're trying to get themselves into that.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
Yeah, They're trying to get their body over into the
next sort of level of energy wa storage. Yeah, and
so I look on that as physiological and you could
do anything. You could cycle, and you could play hacky sack,
it doesn't really matter. It's just getting the blood pumping
and getting the energy systems primed. The second stage, and
this is to me, is the most important one. I've
got a story here from the Breakers last season which
I call neurological. This is activation. This is wakening up
(06:50):
all your reactions or your smart systems, which are protection.
So that's the one that you know stops you getting
a knee injury because you can land and pivot and
react quickly. So is that a mental thing or as
physical thing? It's a physical thing. It's get it's getting
your neurological system, your brain activating to react really really quickly.
And so the soccer has done a great thing called
(07:11):
the Fee for eleven. They've divided this into stages where
because of the ACL injuries and soccer going through the roof,
they developed the system. First part physiological like I talk about.
Second part is activation. It's making things smart. It's balancing
on one leg, it's hopping its pliometrics and so it's
activating your nervous system so you are ready to go.
And so we had an incident in the Breakers this year.
(07:32):
One of our players, for whatever reason, missed the neurological
part of our warm up. Our warm up was very structured.
I can't remember the reason.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Why.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
How long is it take by the way the Breakers
warm up.
Speaker 5 (07:41):
Oh it's maybe forty five minutes?
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Oh wow? Okay, yeah, okay, yep.
Speaker 5 (07:45):
And so, and he had ruptured his ACL that game. Now,
you can't say it was directly because he missed that
part of us wall we do go, but we were
very very very very strict from then on that nobody
misses that part. And the third part is sports specific,
where you know if you're if you're a tennis player,
you start hitting a tennis ball, if you were a
basketball or you shoot a basketball, and then you do
the things that you would do in a game. Soccer
(08:06):
players cut, change direction?
Speaker 3 (08:08):
So does it take longer to warm up the older
you get?
Speaker 4 (08:12):
And that's asking for a friend, because I mean, you know,
I'm learning a lot about it just through cycling.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
But it's it's funny.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
The first about an hour and a bit today and
I didn't really get ahead of steam up, And the
last twenty minutes I was on fire.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
But for the first forty I.
Speaker 5 (08:27):
Was, Yeah, everything takes longer and you're older.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Okay, So that's true.
Speaker 5 (08:32):
It's true.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
What about kids then, because.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
I mean, I'd love to be able to give my kid,
my daughter's you know, sporting team and my daughter advice
on warming up and they go through a sort of
motions of warm up and you know, you know, that's
tossing balls around and let's do some shuttle runs and stuff.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
But what does a warm up? You know, what should
it look like for kids?
Speaker 5 (08:55):
Exactly the same. And so if you're twelve, you know,
you kind of bend you like a rubber band and
you don't really need to warm up, but as you
get to sort of thirteen fourteen, fifteen, you go through puberty,
can develop more power. That's where the imbalance starts to
happen at adolescent athletes, where you it's not so much
your less flexible, but your muscle system overpowers your skeletal system.
(09:17):
And so you've got these I use the analogy it's
like a helicopter where the big roador is power and
the little road is control. And as you go through puberty,
your big roader gets stronger as your muscles grow exponentially,
but your stability and control system is lagging behind. And
so part of going back to warm up these kids
need to really do the activation part. That's that's more
(09:39):
important than the physiological part. In my mind, that's a
stimulating hang on.
Speaker 3 (09:43):
So we've got the physical physical hang on, we've got physiological, neurological, neurological,
that's where's the energy system one that's stays in the
physiological physiological Okay, so what because you've got a particular
interest and interests in injuries and fitness with them, I wis.
Speaker 5 (10:02):
Adolescents, yeah, teenagers, and.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
As is it just it's a different game these days
because of the expectations and modern training, you know, the
ability to with weights and what we've learned over the
years has meant that kids are just getting so much
stronger than their systems are ready for.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
Is that it is so you're as you go through puberty,
your muscles developed very very quickly, especially in boys, but
your skeletal system is still not until you're round about
twenty fully developed. And so what you've got is you've
got these powerful muscles that are growing and acting on
an adolescent skeleton which is still quite weak. And so
(10:39):
you kind of get this imbalance where these massive like
I said, go back to helicopter analogy. You get the
big rotor which is power and the little roader, which
is controlled. They get out of balance, and a helicopter
that has its situation crashes and that's why we're seeing
a massive increase in adolescent injuries. Especially the ACL is
the most documented one.
Speaker 3 (10:57):
What what's what's with the I mean the ACL, it's
three initials.
Speaker 4 (11:01):
I've never heard of until you know, ten years ago,
no idea what an ACL was. When I was and
I used to play volleyball competitively, where you think, well,
you know, I know what a moniscus is.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
Yeah, but what is the ACL and why are we
hearing about it so much?
Speaker 5 (11:18):
So, I mean, I remember diagnosing. I still remember her
very clearly diagnosing my first adolescent ACL and a fourteen
year old back in the nineties, and I had to
argue with the doctor at the time he's going to
teenagers don't rupture their acls. These days, it's a common occurrence.
Like you said, suddenly everybody knows what an ACL is,
and so it's driven by a number of reasons. One
(11:39):
is surfaces. Our surfaces are better. So in the old days,
you know, you slide across a rugby field, it's okay.
These days you stop and it's dry, and your foot
stops and your nee keeps on going. That's one of
the things. Things like sprigs and rugby boots are now
designed for grip, so you land. It used to be
your foot could move. These days you land and your
footstays fixed. So when you rotate someone, the force has
(12:00):
got to go somewhere, so your need gets hurt. But
I think the biggest issue from my perspective is the
modern athlete. This is adolescents and also performance athletes. Without
sounding derogatory in some ways. They're a little bit like
garla apples that they're all polished and shining on the outside,
but the inside is actually not stable. And so have
you kind of have three parts to your system. You
(12:23):
got the skeleton, which is just a bag of bones
with no strength outside the skeleton hard against it. You
have what I call the muscular skeleton now that is
designed to protect, desalerate and control movement. Outside that. You
have the show ponies, you know, the pectoral muscles and
all that. And when people go to the gym these days,
they try and develop size and power. And that's you know,
(12:45):
to the gym and saying I can make you stronger,
but you look any different. People don't really like that much.
Same with the young athletes. They spend ages doing heavy squats,
pec deck whatever. Those muscles are power, but they are
not protection. And so I remember again going bt acl
AD a guy come in the clinic who had been
cleared to play rugby after an acl reconstruction. What criteria?
(13:05):
He said, I can squat twice my body weight. He could,
he was strong. I get him to stand on one
league and close his eyes and he fell over straight away.
So he had absolutely no balance or stability or appropriate
exception we call it, which is knowing we are in space.
He reruptured as ACL the next game, so it's kind
of god.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
You must have watched How did you feel watching Lindsay Vaughn?
Speaker 5 (13:26):
Yeah, yeah, I know, Yeah?
Speaker 4 (13:28):
Was she just bonkers to to well, you know, she
thought of what the hell? Yeah, this is the winter,
this is the winter skiing downhill legend who skied down
here with a brace and no a CL or no
CL And she's, I don't know what you can live
with an a CL like I'm part of my When
I was younger, I did a lot of work with
(13:48):
Pacific Island rugby teams and I used to sort of
strap them I testing and so they said, yeah, I
had a really bad injury three years ago, but.
Speaker 5 (13:55):
It's fine, and they had no a CL. So you
can actually live without an a CL one hundred percent.
Speaker 4 (13:59):
Okay, Hey, look, I've got lots to ask Rob. Rob
Knight as my guest. He's physiotherapist for the Break, among
other things. He also has an interest in adolescent.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
Physiotherapy health.
Speaker 4 (14:11):
I guess what's the word to, you know, just keeping
our young pep young athletes injury free. So if you've
got any questions on behalf of a young person in
your house, I have one in my house. I'm going
to probably QUIZZM a bit on, but I W eight
hundred eighty ten eighty. If you've got any questions around
your own physio, what's the word about your own physical
(14:32):
health when it comes from muscular sort of stability, then
give us a call. I W eight hundred eighty ten
eighty Text nine to nine to two.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
We started talking about the warm up.
Speaker 4 (14:42):
I'm quite fascinated with the fact that you've got to
do at least forty five minutes.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
Well, you have to do a length for you warm up.
Then you might think, I think that's what we settle on.
Speaker 5 (14:50):
Isn't it wrong for performance sport because you know, obviously
they've got to get down to the nitty gritty of
the skill set that they've got to get into.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
So maybe not the same for bulls.
Speaker 5 (14:58):
No, definitely, Okay.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Twenty one past four, I W eight hundred eighty ten eighty.
Back in Attack News Talks, there be we are with
a new guest on the show. He's robbed nineties physiotherapist
for the Breakers and we're taking your calls on eight
hundred eighty ten and eighty.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
Let's let's kick it off with Jeff. Hi, Jeff, good, idea,
how are you?
Speaker 6 (15:17):
I'm my grandfather of a fifteen year old rugby player yep,
who's about what are one eighty two high yep and
maybe ninety kg's and he's complaining about pain in the
top of his knees, top of his knees.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
Okay, yeah, and that's haunded able to Rob to. He's
going to cause you a bit more and we'll give
us some reckons. Hew Robot. I'll just turn Rob's microphone on.
That's the trick.
Speaker 5 (15:43):
There we go, Hey, Jeff, how good? Goody? I mean,
it's pretty hard to make a diagnose without seeing it.
But he's ninety kg's, which is a decent size for
a fifteen year old. And I suspect yeah, big big boy, Yeah,
doing a lot of squats.
Speaker 6 (15:57):
Yeah, probably is into rowing. Yeah, he's doing rowing, and
he's he's rugby season started, but he's training him stuff because.
Speaker 5 (16:06):
His knees hurt, so it's above his knees or behind
his knee cap.
Speaker 6 (16:11):
I saw him rubbing some physio cram into above his knees,
you know, to try and yeah, to make them get
the pain to go away. But he said, it's just
it's just walking their own running.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
I mean, so when you're sort of growing at that age,
when you're fifteen, your bones grow rapidly, your muscles are
sort of lagging behind, and so often what you get
is like a pulling of the tendons on the bone.
So you know, check first of all, if he's had
a big growth spurt, because that's the first sign. If
he has, then he's going to be getting that tension
injury and the second this year. Yeah, so if he's
(16:45):
had a big growth spurt, like I said, it catches
up where your muscles eventually catch up with your bones.
You know, they used to talk about growing pains in
the old days, and they are actually a real thing,
sort of you know, feeling your bones are stretching. And
the second thing is when kids are playing a lot
of sport, they do start to overload the tendon attachments
to the kneecap and so you might find that he
he needs to stretch his quads a lot more. But
(17:06):
what I'd said, he is probably get him to see
a physio. There's some really good ones around it, and
they'll diagnose accurately and give him exactly what he needs
to do.
Speaker 6 (17:14):
Okay, thanks, thanks.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Thanks Jeff. Hey, Now let's dig into that, because I mean,
I'm conscious because.
Speaker 4 (17:22):
I've got kids who are athletic and you know, into
sport and things and dance a whole lot of things.
But one of the texts someone has sent in and
has touched on something we talked about off here, it says, Tim,
I love that your guest mentioned hacky sack underrated for
warm up and coordination. And this is from an ex
motocross racer. But and the conversation you and I had
off here was I was talking about one of my
(17:43):
daughters who does a bit of dance, and she's doing
hockey and netball.
Speaker 3 (17:46):
But and you' you've just made a remark.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
That there's there's there's another sort of play, which is
quite good for kids because there's this formal structure that's
all well and good.
Speaker 5 (17:56):
But yeah, so I think we're like like your children
you're talking about. Your thirty year old is very active.
She's doing hockey, jazz, ballet, netball, but they're all structured
activities where she goes and she does a very you know,
structured period. And so what I think we're missing these days,
(18:17):
without sounding up my grandfather, is what I call incidental exercise,
where basically you're just mucking around. You walking to school,
you're kicking a stone along the road, you're playing hacky sack,
you're climbing a tree, whatever. And I know that sounds like, yeah,
something from the old days, and they've got old days,
but it's something that's missing because that's the foundation of
how we learn. So for example, when you when you're
(18:37):
a baby, one of the key developmental stages is crawling.
And so you know, when a baby's crawling, it learns
to stabilize and it learns to movement. It has a
huge impact on learning as well. So we know that
they're using crawling in ten and eleven year olds learn
to do that's an important stage. And then what happens
is put them in jolly jumpers and they look up
and they go, holy hell, I never want to crawl again.
(18:58):
And they sit there looking at the world. And that's
a structured environment. Same with your children. So I call
them active couch potato is where they do nothing, then
they go into an hour of hockey training. Then they
sit on their bum again and do nothing and do
an hour of jazz batter and you think, oh, that's
an active kid, and it's actually not how the human
body was designed. The human body was designed to move
all the time in different directions and stuff like that,
(19:20):
and so we know that early specialization. So it's great
your daughter's doing three different activities which are complimentary, but
we see again. You know, years ago you played every
sport and two about fifteen sixteen, they said, oh, you're
pretty good at basketball, and you start specializing in basketball.
These days, you know your talent identified at age twelve,
and talent identification is often just early puberty. But then
(19:42):
you're channeled into one sport and so you do basketball
or you know, sport a and you become very good
at basketball. And I remember back in two thousand and nine,
an American S and C trainer came from the States
to work with some of the New Zealand netballers and
they said, what do you think of our netballers And
he said, well, they're like baby giraffes. He said, the
only reason they're good at netball is because they're seven
feet tall and play lots of netball. Fundamentally, they weren't
(20:05):
a good athlete, they weren't stable, but they played a
lot of netball, and they were tall. They were talented supposedly,
And so with the kids these days, what's missing is
a foundation layer of activity.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
Just so does that you have a funny thing is
I mean we almost I almost touched on this with
you in the break as well, but because we've noticed
that one of our very famous adolescents has got a
stress factor and somebody's just texted about that. Yes, I mean,
you're not going to speculate on Sam Ruth with a
stress fracture, but I think the.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Whole country where he's got a stress.
Speaker 5 (20:37):
Fracture, but I do. I mean Sam's crew looking after
him are doing an amazing job, so it would have
been probably bad luck or something completely under I.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
Was hoping it wasn't while he was playing Hanky sat But.
Speaker 4 (20:48):
Actually I mean that question, I think it resonates with
a lot of parents who've got sporty kids.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
That you know, in fact, as.
Speaker 4 (20:58):
You mentioned, you know, going from couch potato to being
really active in a specific sport. So how how can
young people I've got to stop seeing kids, How can
young people.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
How can young people can like them? You know, how
can they whatever, how can they strengthen themselves or how
can they best protect them to be protected from that
sort of phenomenon you're talking about.
Speaker 5 (21:23):
I mean it is hard. I mean it's one of
those things where you know, young kids right now will
spend a huge amount of time on screens and you know,
again without sending like my grandfather, they should be outside playing,
climbing trees, et cetera, because that that develops the muscles
that stabilize and support you as an adolescent. You almost
have to do things to counteract the modern world. Like
(21:43):
you know, I always think that you know, people drive
to school, Like when I went to school, there was
one car in my car park at school. These days
the car park they're knocking out hockey fields to put
a new car park, and the kids need to, for example,
just park further away. You try and gather that incidental
exercise through your day. It's one of those things I
saw them I study again in Wellington where they put
(22:04):
a pedometer on a bunch of different people, school kids, builders, whatever,
and just saw how much they walk through the day
just incidental exercise and the least active person in that
group was actually a high schooler who played two or
three sports like your daughter, but they actually did very
very little outside of it. And it's also a trap
that we get into as adults, where you know, currently,
(22:24):
you get up in the morning, you do forty five
minutes at the gym, on your bike or whatever you're
going to do, and then do nothing for the rest
of the day. And that's not how the human body
was designed. We were designed to continuously move.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Well, this sounds like there are a lot of I mean,
it sounds like we're creating an injury prone population in
a way because of our I mean, god, how often
do we talk about devices on this show when it
comes to parenting and.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
All that sort of thing. But for instance, I don't
want to fall in love with the Hackey sack text, right,
But actually, I mean that was a throwaway remark from
you're talking about but it's talking about it just playing
having fun, and I do remember how bloody hard Hackey
sack is.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
Yeah, but I mean there's a part of me that
wants to go and get my daughter a Hackey sack.
That's not necessarily dumb move, was it? It's a training tool.
And there's a there's a thing in adolescent sport where
they talk about that you never that fitness should be games,
So you don't do you know, fourteen year olds running
shuttle runs that bores the hell out of them and
breaks their brain. But if you get them, you know,
carrying each other on a piggyback and doing and running,
(23:23):
it's a game. And they're not actually realizing they're doing it.
Is that safe for them to do so because I
suddenly go the older person goes, oh my god, that ainaying.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
But like I said, playing hanky sack, the kids or
athletes don't realize they're actually doing a training thing. I
remember one one of the things we did and one
of the sports teams we did a preseason training was brutal.
It was gruesome, and we did a fitness session. At
the end of the session, the guys were on the ground,
but we'd organize the zorb soccer balls, you know the
ones you go inside and you run against each other
with bank. So they all turned up and then the
(23:55):
guys suddenly found their second wind and we did another
thirty minutes of sorb soccer, which.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
Is really really hard because you're having a lot of fun.
Speaker 5 (24:01):
But they didn't realize we were just we were increasing
their fitness training because they were having fun. And same
with kids. You know, like I said, you.
Speaker 4 (24:07):
Know, not every team you can get in the Zorb
soccer balls, even though I've made a note Zorb soccer
ball and Hackey Sack.
Speaker 5 (24:15):
I'm changing. But you know, so the gym programs, for example,
if if you're going to do it an instruction environment,
if for example, it's not going to happen playing Hacky
Sack in a gym environment. The key thing is destabilized.
So you try and do everything in an unstable environment,
which mimics real life, like real life is not you know,
a level ground.
Speaker 4 (24:33):
Okay, because that reminds me of you know something I
wrote down on my notes before the show is and
that's sort you're probably just frown at me.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
As soon as somebody talks about.
Speaker 4 (24:43):
Doing something for core strength, they go, oh god, I
hate doing core strength stuff. But I imagine if you're
doing stable core strength stuff, you're not are you helping
yourself or you're not. It's another structure to exercise.
Speaker 5 (24:56):
This is one of my soapbox issues is that core
strength if you're lying here doing a plank, the plank
is not a core strength and.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
I hate planks, so thank you.
Speaker 5 (25:05):
So what So, basically, going back to what I said
at the beginning, you've got your skeleton. Around your skeleton,
you have lots of little muscles all attached, like around
your spine. You've got these little muscles that go one segment,
but they act like a school of fish. If one
starts to move, the other start to move. That's your stability.
So for example, if you're doing a bicep curl at
the gym and you're over there, you know, a big
preacher curl, and you're growing your bicep, then in real
(25:26):
life you've got to lift something. The body goes will
where's my support and it hasn't got the strength to
do it. If you stand on a bosu ballers half
round balls, close your eyes and do a curl, you're
like this and suddenly you're engaging the true core muscles,
which are the stability muscles, and you're making them smart.
Then you actually don't need to do core exercises. So
(25:46):
if you trade, if you look at bench press, which
is one of my pet hates, where you're basic lying
on a stable platform and pushing with your pecks and
you get big pecks. But then in real life your
car breaks down and you go to push your car
and your body goes, well, where's the bench and you
hurt your back because you haven't got true strength. And
so destabilizing can use a cable pulley for example, and press.
(26:07):
Then you're engaging your core muscles and it's all working
as a system.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
So you look, you would come across talented athletes who
are on the younger side of the ledger do you
have how do you how do you handle working with
the younger athletes? I mean, I'm thinking of the comment
you made about you know, netballers who are just you know,
very very talented netball giraffes.
Speaker 3 (26:25):
But how do you look after young people who are
shoved into a professional environment and make sure that they
have that that physical resilience. That's the word I'm looking for.
Speaker 5 (26:36):
So I think I saw an article a while ago
the biggest barrier to success as a sportsperson is not
lack of talent or lack of work ethic. It's injury.
So you know, most adolescent athletes fail to get the
next level because of injury, not because of any other reason.
And so during that period of adolescence, especially when kids
(26:57):
are going through puberty and their bodies changing. Actually there's
a there's a can I seeguay off on this one?
Speaker 7 (27:02):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (27:02):
Yeah, where we go? I a young trampoline who was
I think he was the New Zealand trampoline champion from memory,
but he suddenly became like a gumby at of age fourteen.
He was tripping over his own feet and the guy
who could do a triple somersault literally we had to
pull him off the tramplin because he was going to
kill himself. He had a growth spurt and it was
a massive growth spit and his body was just so
(27:23):
out of kilter.
Speaker 3 (27:24):
And I see that it was out of balance, but absolutely.
Speaker 5 (27:27):
Things were growing. Muscles were growing at different rates of bones,
and he became a menace and we had to stop
him for his years.
Speaker 4 (27:32):
It's almost like the full crimbs in his body. You
know where he's swiveling around, they'd all been. They would
have all moved, even if it's just a centimeter.
Speaker 5 (27:39):
It literally went from it like a size eight shoe
to a size eleven shoe, and he was literally tripping
over his own feet. And so, you know, bringing an
adolescent sports person through is be patient. Like nobody remembers
who the best seventeen year old rugby player was. They
remember the best twenty three year old rugby player because
you you know, and so you try and nurse them through.
And so the key thing we go back to is
(28:00):
we don't build power out I mess, we're building stability.
And so when young player at the Breakers this year
and our head of high performance, Shane Connolly, did a
fantastic job this kid, like I said, he's going to
go onto a great career, but seventeen eighteen looked like
a man, but his skeleton was still a young boys
and so we were really careful that what we do.
Everything we did with him was based around activation, neurological stimulation, stability,
(28:26):
not power. And power came. Power will come as he develops.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
So my gosh, I've got a lot of questions.
Speaker 4 (28:33):
But by the way, look I'm just going to throw
this out to the audience. We've got Peter waiting, and
what usually happens when we have a new guest on
the shows, everyone listens and in the last five minutes
you all.
Speaker 3 (28:41):
Want to talk to him. I would suggest that the
now is the time.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
If you got any questions for Rob Knight, he's a
physiotherapist for the Breakers, then get on the blower. Oh
eight hundred and eighty ten eighty will be back in
just a moment. Twenty one minutes to five. Newstalk said B.
News Talk said B where with Rob Knight, he's physiotherapist
for the Break is taking your calls as well. I've
got quite a few texts to get to, but first
the first quarter online Peter good.
Speaker 7 (29:00):
A, Oh good A fellows a hi rod. I fell
down three weeks ago on a concrete and upset my
arthritic arthritic knee and I've been to the I got
a chit acc went to the doctor and I've been
(29:20):
going to physio every two weeks. And well, I've got
a walking stick at the moment. I don't like to
be on a walking stick and I'm seventy eight, but
I like to get back into the running section. I'm
doing aquad jogging twice a week and tied Chie, how
(29:43):
do you reckon? It would be do you reckon another
couple of weeks or something?
Speaker 3 (29:47):
Peter, You're amazing, Yeah, it's incredible.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
So you were running before, Peter, I.
Speaker 7 (29:53):
Do jogging yet, and I do athletics, still doing the
throwing and the trying and keep myself was fit as possible,
but it's a bit frustrating. The physio suggested that or
in the future, you'll be able to start walking around
around a grass panic one lap at a time and
(30:17):
have a rest and build it up like that that
the knees got half a cartilage and so I'm battling
away there to try and get back into normality.
Speaker 5 (30:28):
Yeah, okay, I mean that's a that's a tough one, Petter.
But not not knowing not I think seeing the extra
thing like that, like the fact you're doing variety, like
you're throwing, you're aqua jogging, you're you know, that's fantastic.
But the second thing is cycling is often really really
good because it keeps the muscles going while you can't
own and when you get back to running. One of
(30:48):
my favorite things for athletes who have a worn cartilage,
even even I'm talking in their twenties and we do
this for performance athletes is if you're running upper hill,
there's no impacts. So I've had friends who are high
leveled athletes with really early arthritic knees, they can't actually
go for a jog, but they can sprint up a hill.
They throw up. And so when you get back to exercising,
(31:09):
go uphills, running hard and walking back down that that
means your knees aren't getting impact, but it keeps you
fitting strong.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Gosh, I hadn't thought about that. What that sound like
to you, Peter? You like running up hill?
Speaker 7 (31:21):
Not really not now mind, I don't mind that, but
the bike and side of it, I think that's that
sounds quite good. That I've also given an exercise to
to strengthen the quads, and I'm doing that each day.
(31:43):
So I'm sort of hoping that time heels and I'll
be back.
Speaker 5 (31:48):
But I'm sure your physias is doing a great job
on it.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
Got on your Peter, well good luck with that. Actually,
I mean I was interested that you said you would.
You know how some people say want to get back running.
It's like you were running until recently, I assume because
obviously seventy eight you wouldn't want suddenly pick it up necessarily.
That's just what about jogging? Actually, yeah, which I mean
it's a funny one.
Speaker 5 (32:06):
That's again and One of my sort of things that
I get on is that humans there's this. I don't
think there's any other species in the world at jogs
except humans.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Whose fault is that? Is that arth Lydiad's fault.
Speaker 5 (32:17):
I don't know how it came out.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
Why was it that invented jogging? Yeah, I mean where
did that? Was it?
Speaker 5 (32:22):
Jim the guy in the States? But we're designed to
sprint or walk physically okay, yeah, the in between the
jogging is like driving your car and said year, it's
great for meditation, but not necessarily the best for your joints.
Speaker 4 (32:34):
What's cycling like then, because I mean, it's been something
I've discovered. So I'm a middle aged man in lycra
but it's been revolutionary for me for knees and stuff.
And I'm wayferter than I've been ever, I think. But
you know, I'm probably doing something that's a bit specific.
I'm probably not that.
Speaker 5 (32:50):
You know, robust cycling is fantastic, you know, cardiovascularly leg strength,
it doesn't. It's a little bit one dimensional, and that cyclists,
for example, make terrible runners. So if you're a cyclist
and a lot of cycling, you try and run your
hamstrings under developed. Your quad's dominant. But all I say
is if you're cycling, you try and balance it up
by doing things like stretching or you know, some hamstring
(33:13):
work off there.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
Or walking walking, you know. I mean, we've got a
specialist in that show.
Speaker 4 (33:18):
He says, Look, you can probably get back under the running,
but I just I don't enjoy run up hills. Okay,
We've got a few texts here, and there'll be a
lot of parents who have heard this one before that. Anyway,
this was one from joy I think, says my son
thirteen years played foot Saul had an accident during a
game and a hard fall landed on his knees. He
complained of pain for months later. When he was a
(33:38):
spike riding, the osteopath said, he at Osgood. She's spelt
it wrong, but I think she's referring to Osgod schlatters
or something. He still has large bumped below his knee bones.
Should we investigate surgery is a question. But anyway, Osgood slatters?
Is that how he say Good slatters.
Speaker 5 (33:53):
It's a specific thing where the attachment of the patel
attendont onto your shin bone and there's a growth plate
right where it attaches. And so what happens as kids
Two things. One is they grow quickly and suddenly that
like I said, their bones are longer than their muscles
and there's a like a traction injury on that growth
plate and you get calcification. Well, secondly, if they play
a lot of sports and they just load that area.
(34:15):
I have never sorry, I can tell a lie in
my whole career. I've seen one that required surgery.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
So okay, it is very very unlikely. So is it
something you can exit?
Speaker 4 (34:25):
I had it when I was a kid, say, and
it slowed me down? Of course it's slow me down'
It stopped me because I refused to let it stop me.
But what is the story with those goriuge slats and
managing it?
Speaker 5 (34:35):
So you just manage your level of exercise. That's the
first thing. If you're playing, you know, if you're training
three different sports every night and just doing too much,
you look at how much you're doing. Second thing, it
often happens through the rapid growth period, so you just
literally back off a little bit in your volume of
exercise to that period. And third thing, I get the
kids to stretch the hell out of their quads. Like
literally twenty times quad stretched.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
So stretching is because is there a different schools of
thought on how important stretching is?
Speaker 5 (35:00):
Yep, So I mean stretching is a thing that keeps
you mobile. So if you sit on your bum all
day your head flexes get tight, you should stretch them
and lengthen them out. But that's a static stretch, and
you should do.
Speaker 3 (35:12):
That so you don't have to be warmed up to
do that.
Speaker 5 (35:14):
Not necessarily, just do it gently. So if you're not
warmed up, you just don't push it quite as hard.
But that's different from dynamic stretching. Going back to warm up,
where you do not do static stretching in your warm up.
Static stretching is designed to make you more flexible, yeah,
over long periods.
Speaker 4 (35:31):
So static stretching is like me sticking my foot up
on a desk and leaning forward gently until I feel
some stretch.
Speaker 5 (35:37):
And hold that for thirty seconds, and that will gradually
over time length in your hamstring. Short term, it actually
reduces your contractile force on your hamstrings. So if I
got you stretch your hamstrings for three or four minutes
and made you sprint, you could quite likely tear your
hamstring yeah, So stretching statically as part of a warm
up is not the thing.
Speaker 3 (35:53):
Don't do that.
Speaker 5 (35:54):
No, dynamic stretching where you if you want to do
your hamstrings, you stand there, hold onto a pole and
you swing your leg back and forth. That's prepping your hamstring.
Oh yeah, well that's a big one because it's different.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
So static stre or do it at nighttime, don't do it.
So do dynamic stretching. Yeah, what's a dynamic quad stretch?
Look like?
Speaker 5 (36:12):
Again, swing your leg back and forth. You're stretching your
quad dynamically as well. So if you know you stand,
let it bend and yeah, just let your need bend
at the other end and you've stretched your quade at
the same time.
Speaker 3 (36:19):
I've just swung it back and forth. Oh that's that's
nice and easy.
Speaker 4 (36:22):
Okay, seventeen year old six foot eighty kilos painful shin
splints even after a lot of time off. Does stretches
or don't it static or active or whatever?
Speaker 3 (36:33):
It has custom orthotics, good shoes. That's the text.
Speaker 5 (36:38):
Yeah, that's a tough one. That is a really tough one.
So shin splints is where the muscles on the inside
of your shin bone basically microscopically tear away from the
bone and they microscopically bleed. They form in my head
like a little scab. Then you start running again, the
scab rips open again and it just becomes a self
perpetuating thing. It's tough. So first of all, the first
thing I look at is not biomechanics. I look at volume.
(37:00):
Shin splins are almost always a volume related problem where
you're just doing too much thing. Then you look at
obviously you look at biomechanics, but it sounds like they've
got really good orthotics and stuff like that. The treatment
for them is a lot of massage and that get
people to do it themselves. They sit there, work your
fingers up and out. It just loosens up and freeze
that that attachment up.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
Okay, we've got to come more texts to come to it,
but we'll be back in just to tick.
Speaker 4 (37:21):
We're with Rob Knight. He's physio for the Breakers. Taking
your course of actually well not sure if we have
time for course. We'll see how we go. But it
is nine and a half minutes to five news talks.
It'd be it's news talks. It'd be a lot of time.
Has flown this hour with Rob night. He's physiotherapists for
the breakers. But Rob, the thing that's popped out from
this conversation is just about you know, it's one thing
(37:41):
to have kids who are driven to do well at
a particular sport or even a couple of sports, but
you know, don't forget to get them playing to make
them more resilient, so they're not just focused on one
style of movement or exercise.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
Will that be right? Oh? How let me just turn
your mic on. That's on my fault again.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
I think the key thing is that playing, whether it
be like I said, climbing a tree, whatever, it builds
a resilient base for a kid. Lifting weights in the gym,
doesn't it when it breaks their brain. If you're twelve
year I trying to lift weights, it breaks your body
and it breaks your brain.
Speaker 3 (38:13):
I just find it. I haven't found that. I always
find the gym a bit boring anyway.
Speaker 5 (38:17):
So for a kid, it's a nightmare. And like I said,
you know, running shuttles as a fourteen year old just
destroys you physically and mentally. So a lot of these
things can be replicated with play, and it doesn't seem
like training, but it actually is. It's building and making
that kid resilient and protecting them because but like I said,
thing in sports is longevity. You want to be there
at the end, not a not as a burned out
(38:38):
fourteen year.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Old, just out of curiosity, because you look pretty fit.
You what do you do to keep your wheels spinning?
Speaker 5 (38:44):
I try, I mean I do, try and follow that
philosophy what I said. I am like I walk. I
actually wear a weighted vest when I walk, so you know,
we're two fifteen CAGs up bush tracks. I do sprints.
Just like I said, I try and go to the
field and just you know, I probably look like an
old guy sprinting. I go to the gym. We have
a little farm and I cut firewood. It's actually interesting
(39:05):
article recently where the thing that increases testosterone in a
male more than anything is actually wood chopping more than
any other activity.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
Really. Yeah, so after a fascinating, a little bit of
serious to.
Speaker 5 (39:18):
Sixty minutes, it falls off because you're getting tired, But
forty five minutes of wood chopping increases testro so more
than playing rugby. It's incredible.
Speaker 3 (39:25):
It's interesting because it's a sort of asymmetric activity in
a way, isn't it? And asymmetric things like golf and
stuff that I mean, do we have?
Speaker 4 (39:36):
One of my other guests is so you don't know.
No one's in balance, you know, And he was talking
about some athletes he works with. He said, none of
them are in balance. And everyone thinks you've got to
be symmetrical. He said, that's bollocks.
Speaker 5 (39:46):
Are the only people who need to be symmetrical are
people are doing very competitive things like a marathon runner.
If they've got a leg link, that's one sending me
short on the other it shows up because they do
it ten thousand times. A rugby play at does some
different because they're changing direction all the time.
Speaker 4 (39:57):
So hey, Rob God, time flies when you're having fun.
I hope we can get you back love to excellent.
It's difficult to say no on here, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Anyway? Hey? By the way, if you're missed any of that,
then check out the podcast. After six o'clock we will
be back with the smart money next. Janets o cars
with us.
Speaker 4 (40:14):
I'm going to ask you how you can hide your
assets legally and illegally.
Speaker 3 (40:17):
She might not answer it, but it'll be fun asking.
We'll be back shortly.
Speaker 4 (40:20):
This is News Talk said be the weekend clicktive, but
coming up to three minutes to five.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
News Talks EDB.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
For more from the weekend collective, listen live to News
Talks EDB weekends from three pm, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio
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