June 20, 2026 • 41 mins
This week on The Panel, Tim Beveridge is joined by Jordan Williams from Taxpayers' Union and Psychotherapist Kyle Macdonald to discuss the biggest stories from this week.
Iran war - what on earth is happening? Winston Peters and Wayne Brown are coming to blows again, and will the Immigration NZ public servants who misled their minister get the sack?
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talk
s ed B.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
And a very good afternoon to you. Welcome to the
Weekend Collective. I'm Tim Beveridge the Saturday, the twentieth of
journey for some Tim Beverridge every day. But the show's
right now. Beautiful day, isn't it. I hope it is?
Where in your place? But anyway, you can text your
feedback anytime on nine two nine two and you can
email Tim b at Newstalk SAIDB dot co dot Nz.
(01:11):
Coming up on today's show shortly our panel and I'll
be introducing them in just a moment, but looking ahead
to later in the show where he is. As you know,
We take your calls on eight hundred and eighty ten
eighty or you can text on ninet two nine two.
But it is news Talk for the one roof radio show.
Brian Thompson's with US Tax Tax Tax. He's the managing
director at Hardcourts and there's a lot of stuff that's
(01:31):
being hung off the idea of how much labour can
raise from a capital gains tax. But we're just we're
actually going to ask about the implications of taxes on
the property market. And you know what it's going to
deliver maybe, but what it means for people's attitude towards property.
Because also we've seen the Opportunities Party who are creeping
up in the polls and they've got a bit of
a land tax thing going on. So we're going to
(01:53):
have a chat about what the implications of those taxes
would be with Brian Thompson, managing director at Hard Courts.
That'll be after four. By the way, the one roof
radio show Property of the Week is quite fascinating. I'll
get you plenty of notice of it so you can
look it up because about five million bucks worth. But
the toilet looks like it's a public toilet bathroom? Should
I say? Anyway? But at five o'clock for the Parents Squad,
(02:14):
I digress giving you too much information. We are going
to be joined by a Maniche diva and we're going
to talk about the head of steam that's building up
regarding the social media band for under sixteen year olds,
which hasn't been too popular with the kids. Over there
is that wonderful one where a woman, a girl, should
I say, was asked what's she going to do without it?
She says, I'm just going to stare at the wall,
(02:35):
and I I was wondering is that a bad thing?
Maybe just to let that fill that science. And we're
going to talk about the adolescent brain. So if you're
a parent of teenagers, what does the adolescent brain really
need for good development? And I'm guessing probably the absence
of a cell phone. But anyway, and shortly before six,
Superman himself joins us Christopher Reeve Super Rugby Final. We've
(02:57):
got a bit of a cricket overnight and the latest
on the FIFA World Cup, so lots to get into.
Welcome to the Weekend Collective. It is nine minutes past three,
wish And by the way, in fact I mentioned this
to my guests. I'll introduce them now in no particular order.
(03:17):
He's a broadcaster and psychotherapist. It's Kyle McDonald cayle. How
are you going very well? Thank you, curer, excellent, excellent?
Have you done the morning sport? Saturday morning Sport?
Speaker 1 (03:29):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (03:29):
I did the drop off and then I went to
the gym, so my partner did the sidelines. The old
netball John's about sex.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Actually, I'm gonna be a bit mischievous and just give
a shout out. My daughter plays for the Barodeene nine
A team, and look, there are some amazing teams and
you know, she's obviously there, and I think they're in
the first division, second Division two or something. But just
seeing the work that coaches put in and the value
of good coaches and the effort that's gone from their
(03:57):
coach Kayla, and seeing the improvement over two or three weeks. God,
it's just so good to see the kids get that
little spring in their step. And look, they're not going
to win every game, but they've had a couple of
good wins. And I love Saturday morning sport. I think
it's just one of the great things about Kiwi culture.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yeah, it's great, isn't it. I mean, my artist has
picked up ripper rugby as well in addition to netball,
and her coach is great, and is that thing of like, actually,
he's just encouraging them to be improving against themselves. I mean,
you know, now we're not losers, great, right, but actually
it's about each week putting the skills on the park
and actually enjoying the process.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Indeed, and joining He's not quite into the Saturday morning
sport yet because his kids are a little bit younger,
but politics is a sport firm in a way blood
sport anyway, from the Taxpairs Union, do I just say
from the Taxpairs Union and everyone out there listening going, oh,
it's Jordan Williams. Jordan, how are you very well?
Speaker 4 (04:50):
I've been away last out of the country for a
few days. It's been great to spend the morning with
my kids. Dancing is the thing that's big in our family,
and we've got to an age where my artist is
now traveling around the country and weekends doing these dance competitions.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Do your kids get you to join in with them
in the living room on their latest dance moves, because
I'd like to see a video of that.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Too young to be embarrassed yet, So I am. I'm
living up that.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
But are you are you? Have you had the moments
where they're like, Daddy, join us, joining for this? Do
this move dad?
Speaker 4 (05:21):
I think that I have again a limited window where
my kids can tolerate my eclectic music taste and get
away with it.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Actually, the good thing is you can lock them in
the car when you take them too sports and then
play your music.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
That's what I've feend actually, just on the music. So
that was a bit of Van Halen there to open it,
and it actually reminded me. I don't know if you've
seen these on YouTube where someone has they do those
concerts that Kim johng n has with all the army
and everyone singing very formally, but they've dubbed it with
a sort of what it could be, and they had
them singing always look on the bright side of life.
(05:56):
But they have the moments where the lips singing and
all the movements of these incredibly militaristic concerts where everyone's applauding,
you know, just so they don't get shot next day.
It's you should google it.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
What Norm does in the middle of the night when
you can't sleep. This is what he's doing.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
It was like, I think I was listening to the
meet of pr The next thing it goes, do you
want to see this North Korea concert.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
Of the phone down to Yeah, I think you should
stick to listening to talk back in the middle of
the night. No social media band for Tim, it was
kind of it is.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I have to I'm gonna have to show you in
the break It is quite funny. Anyway. Look, I got
to be honest with you as I, because otherwise I'd
be a hypocrite, because I said to Jordan, you know,
with what's going on in Iran and the deal and
what peace talks are on and what's off, there's a
memorandum and it does look like the straight of Hormos.
You know, we're going to get some traffic flowing through
(06:54):
that the petrol. I got petrol for two dollars seventy
five the other day diesels below three. Yeah, yep. And
but I can't really keep up with it because and
I can't help but think that if there is going
to be a turd in the punch bowl, its name
is BB Netanyahu. But anyway, Jordan, let's go to you
to get started with that one.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Well, I just think it's nice that, you know, we
can go back to worrying about that the world's going
to end because of AI. We don't have to worry
about the oil situation so much now, Isn't that Isn't
that great?
Speaker 2 (07:24):
I guess so I haven't really thought about the oil
thing for a while.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I sort of just because it's just so up and down.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
If you are following the fortunes of it, I think
you'd go bonkers.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Well, they We were saved really by a couple of
factors China. China stopped importing you going burning through its reserves,
and we were heavily reliant on the Japanese and the
Americans running down their reserves. That meant that that rubber
band stretched. And of course the worry a few weeks
ago is that, you know, the question of it is
what point does that snap and we get armageddon in
(07:55):
terms of the oil price. But you know, the Americans
have really basically crystallized the loss, really, haven't they. It's
a terrible From what has been leaking out, it looks
like a pretty terrible deal. And we saw just just
today that the because it's basically a ceasefire pending further negotiations,
is the first round of these negotiations appear to have
(08:17):
fallen over with dvance canceling going to Switzerland for the talks.
So everything is awesome.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Yeah, as I say, it's my if I fingers crossed, Kyle.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Yeah, well, I mean we did better this week, didn't
we as a country against Iran?
Speaker 4 (08:34):
We drew, so we didn't lose.
Speaker 3 (08:38):
I mean, from a therapist point of view, I mean,
it's kind of continues to be fascinating. The mental gymnastics
that the American president and cabinet having to do to
convince themselves that they've won. You know, all the details
that have kind of come out about the deal, it's
kind of They've spent billions of dollars to end up
back in a slightly worse place. Were now threatening to
(08:59):
use the straight Uorford moose to raise funds after the
sixty days.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
And I mean, the idea of being told by Iran,
I think it's just untenable really, but who knows. But
the sanctions being lifted and then getting a bunch of back,
a bunch of assets and everything, I mean, despite the
fact that Iran was attacked and they've absorbed that this
is a total you know. Yeah. The other interesting thing
that I am pleased that's come out of it is
(09:22):
it seems that the American administration has finally sort of
started to lose a bit of patients with Israel, who probably,
to be honest, nudged them all the way to bombing
Iran in the first place.
Speaker 4 (09:31):
What do you think, Jordan, Well, I know I'm not
going to join in a pile on on Israel, but
I've always been slightly contrarying from the messes on this
that it is unthinkable to have Iran with nuclear weapons
and that if Trump had have succeeded or this episode
had succeeded, and pushing that back even a decade is certainly.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Worth the cost.
Speaker 4 (09:55):
I think that there is a huge amount of naivete
in relation to you know, leave Israel along alone, that sorry,
leave Iran along rather, you know, they do want to
wipe Israel off the face of the earth, and them
having nukes is you know, the whole the way the
West likes the pile on because you know, it's stupid, stupid,
(10:16):
dumb Trump, you know what, an idiot and with a
little bit of side of this is all Israel's fault.
I think it's stupid. I said right at the beginning, yep,
this this could go wrong, but hopefully it goes right.
It hasn't gone It certainly hasn't gone right, It hasn't
gone totally wrong. The scary thing is is even without nukes,
the Iran is in a much stronger position because it
(10:37):
now knows it can close it straight well, possibly.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
In a slightly more extreme position now with their leadership too.
From what I understand, yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
And also considering Trump has said that, you know a
long time, quite a while ago, that their nuclear hability
bed had been obliterated, and all of a sudden, it's like,
now we've got to attack them to stop.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
I mean a bit nervous here, Tim, you're gonna you're
gonna blow up this text machine here within the moment
we mentioned Trump, No, actually, you.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Know what, I actually the one I don't often agree
with them, but he almost took the words right out
of my mouth when he was talking about when he
was a bit cross with Netanyahu. And it's the hez
Bala thing. And actually I'll acknowledge you know what, Yes,
those countries when they save from the river to the
sea palis I must be free. They mean getting rid
of the state of Israel, And so we shouldn't forget.
(11:22):
What does Chloe say then, I don't know. Is it
a nursery rhyme she sings to herself when she goes
to bed at night. I don't know. UM always look
on anyway. But when Trump said, look, you don't have
to blow up an apartment building every time you're looking
for one person or something, and I sort of thought,
that does seem to sum up a little bit. What
(11:43):
you know, Israel want to get at some person and boom,
there's another apartment block gone in Bay Route or something.
And look, I don't have any faith in Netanya who
and I don't know where those corruption charges that he
was facing a long time were going to go or whatever.
But yeah, I wouldn't. I wouldn't trust him as far
as I could throw them, much as I acknowledge the
(12:04):
threats that come exist to Israel. Have you got a
comment on that car? No?
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Look, I mean I'm far from an expert. I think
like a lot of people. One of the things that
I've noticed happening with my own brain is I've started
to tune out because it feels impossible to keep up,
And unfortunately, I think you know, that doesn't do anyone
who's actually on the ground there suffering any service when
the rest of the world starts to tune out. But
it's so hard to keep up and so hard to
stay engaged with the sort of the horror of it,
(12:29):
isn't it.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yeah? So often I think of those Last and Far
Side cartoons for a situation like this, and there's the
kid who's maybe he hasn't been drawn in a flattering
way at the back of the class with the hand
up going please sir can I go My brain is full.
That's pretty much me with them. Yeah, keeping track of
everything anyway. Look, the other extraordinary bit of news was
(12:49):
Ukraine striking deeper into Russia with they've stepped up their strikes.
There was amazing footage of them blowing that the lid
off that massive oil tank into the sky and Kiev
basically demonstrating that look, you know, what's good for the
goose is good for the gander. I don't know really
what this means for the conflict in Russia, but as
(13:11):
a colleague send to me, it's almost like the Ukraine
are winning at the moment. Jordan, what's your take on it?
Speaker 4 (13:14):
Yeah, I think Ukraine did a good job and embedding
it in sensing what could have really gone wrong with
Iran and that with everyone needing Russian oil and the
price of oil coming up, is that the Iranian sense
the opportunity, sorry, the Ukrainian sense the opportunity, and that
they've worked a heck of a lot with with Western
(13:35):
militaries in terms of what they've learned around drone warfare.
You know, that makes the West stronger. I'm trying to
look at the positives, and it does appear that Russia
being unable to recruit the number of soldiers that they're
churning through and this meat grinder is now coming to
bite them. Look as awful as that is, it's probably
(13:59):
a good thing. Hopefully this thing comes to an end
sooner rather than later.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
How does it come to an end?
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Well, Russia runs out of political imph on it, and
it does appear, you know, that's the big question of
of of when that happens. And of course it has strengthened,
you know, the Europeans, knowing that America is an unreliable ally,
seemed to be getting their their act together.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Yeah, what did you make? What are you? What's your
thoughts on it? Carl?
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Look, I mean it sounds a bit cold as well,
but I think the technology is absolutely amazing. I mean,
you know, one of the things, whether it's you know,
psychology or medicine or other civilian technologies, what happens with
wars unfortunately, as a technology gets accelerated.
Speaker 4 (14:45):
Amazing word for it. Did you see the Economist last
week saying that we're going to see this year the
first assassinations with drones. Remember that video about five years
ago that was actually fake, but I thought it was
real of the drone seeking out the person with facial recognition,
going to the full sci fi stuff. That's that, that's
(15:05):
the world we live in now.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
But of course then the technology to counter that, I
guess hopefully for the person who's been targeted. But you know,
the drone stuff, Like you say, Jordan, I mean, I
think that there's a lot of conversations in there in
Europe about actually that needing to change the direction which
where militaries are being armed.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
The innovation, of course, I mean, when your life depends
on the survival of your country's I imagine that's a
fairly hefty motivator to be trying to be one, one, two,
three steps ahead of the opposition. I still remember that
amazing footage of remember that the Ukrainians got those trucks
driving into into Russia and the drivers pulled over the
side of the road and all of a sudden, the
(15:43):
lid of the container lifted up and these drones flew out,
and oh, it's like bloody, let's here's something we prepared earlier.
Very clever. Anyway, Hey, look We're going to head to
a little bit of domestic politics after the break with
the pole of polls. Oh, I don't know what I
think of poles. What We're going to have a bit
of a chat about where we're going and also the
Opportunity Party they are. They seem to have done all
(16:06):
okay in the last pole, so we'll have a chat
with our chaps about that in just a moment. This
is the panel on the Weekend Collective. It's twenty two
past three. Yes, welcome back to our panel today with
(16:31):
Shaz Jordan Williams of the Taxpars Union and psychotherapist to
car MacDonald. Now that there's an analysis of the poll
of polls, reckons the coalition scott still pretty strong chants
of being re elected. I think seventy four point three,
which is up from what it was in February. I
did see a poll recently that said, oh, that's been
(16:52):
good for the Greens because they've doubled their support, and
I'm like, well, there's not a credible pole for a start,
and it doesn't jump around like that. Of course, the
Tax Bad's Union has got its own pole, but what
do you make of the one of the winners from
recent polls has been I've written I'd pretty much written
off the top all the time. It's like wasted vote,
wasted vote, wasted vote. Now they're going for Mount Albert
(17:12):
and they're showing about three point four percent or something.
Are they anyway any chance they'll get in? What do
you make of the Opportunities Party Jordan?
Speaker 4 (17:20):
There are if you're if you're on the center right,
if you want the government with a coalition to stay
in power. They are the wolf in sheep's clothing because
when you scratch away the surface of the rhetoric around, well,
we can work with both. They actually run on quite
a radical left wing platform. So the first is, you know, well,
we want a land tax. So the economists love land
(17:41):
taxes because they know you can't move it, you can't
hide it, and the tax on that incentivisers putting the
land to base use. It's not not like rates which
is often on capital improvement, which is economically stupid, but
it is, as I say, just on the underlying land.
So that amounts though instead of replacing more economically damaging taxes,
(18:04):
TOP would use it as an eighteen billion dollar tax grab.
So it's roughly eight and a half thousand dollars per
NEI Zeland household extra in tax if you adopt the
top parties.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
It's almost like a Wellington or water bill.
Speaker 4 (18:20):
It is. It is a tax policy if you are
the Greens or seriously socialists but aren't quite willing to
admit it. And then you look at one of their candidates,
I understand, was literally the co author of Harpurpoor, which
was the report to how to implement a sort of
quite radical co governance strategy across the whole of society.
(18:45):
So I mean, you know, are they center as well?
You know, according to them, and I think we go
once you scratch the surface, not really now, I know
some center right slightly Macavelian three D chess players is saying, well,
look I'm going to put some money into them because
they waste green votes. That's a very dangerous game because
you look at the way, and with the greatest respect,
(19:07):
I know, the newsrooms pretty empty today, but you know
usually when I walk through the newsroom coming home to
ZB or you walk through stuff's officers, it's a very
young group of people in media and for whatever reason,
they get behind top and top now on three percent
and if they had four that you watch the media party. Sorry,
(19:30):
our friends in the media get behind TOP and they
will be rocketing up. So as I say, dangerous game
because if Top had five percent, that will mean that
Labor could possibly credibly rule out to party Marti, and
it is absolutely game on in terms.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Of the election. Okay. In fact, she did say when
I interviewed it, I liked interviewing because she listened to questions.
Speaker 4 (19:55):
She's really I ran into the press Glory Party for Christmas.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
She's lovely and I said, what will your policy be
on who you negotiat with? And she said it would
be the party that got the most votes, So even
a first Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:11):
They talk to them first, which well.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
That means they've talked to Labor first, probably because Labor
might get more votes than National even though the National
block might be a slightly bigger block. Until the Top
makes its choice. Oh gosh, I'm almost run out of steam. Nikyle,
You've been sitting there very patiently, former Green Party candidate,
of course, for my sins, Would you like to stand
for Top? Look?
Speaker 3 (20:34):
No, but there is a reasonably well trodden path actually
in the past of candidate's going from one to the other.
I think they're interesting. The people that I talk to
in my life that are interested in voting for them
sort of fall into two camps, ready, and it kind
of lines up in a way what you were saying, Jordan.
The first camp is, I think, rightly or wrongly, they've
done a pitch to young people around house ownership and
(20:58):
convince them that top are on their side when it
comes to increasing the likelihood of them being able to
own a home. And I guess the other thing is
that kind of feel like in some ways they're marketing
themselves as the party that aren't other things. You know,
they're they're Green, but they're not the Greens, and they're
they're they're sort of sort of senter right, but they're
not national, and they're sort of seen to left but
they're not labor. Their seoge does seem to be down
(21:19):
to pretty much the Christmas there their new leader thought,
and you know, it seems they have managed to shake
off the whole cats thing, which is nice.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
I guess, well, I wonder how much people are still
nostalgic for Gareth Morgan though, I mean, you know, and
maybe that's why it capture some of the right because
they go, well.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
He's a wealthy guy who was for you know, he's longer,
I think though, yeah, long, I know, yeah, yeah, yeah,
it is incredible though then I think it was Bob
Mccrosscrey tweeted the other day that you can peer the
way of the horror when Colin Craig had for four
and a half percent. You know, this is absolutely to
(21:59):
the absolute seething doll. It's a grueling, delight heading for
four and a half percent. So it just that's why
I think it's quite a dangerous game for the center
right to get behind all these business people who think,
oh yeah, a new way of doing politics. Yeah yeah, yeah,
that sounds good. It sounds evidence based. Yeah yeah, I
(22:20):
love that. When you scratch your surface, it's just not
it's just been a market.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
The whole thing about evidence based. So we got to
drill into what they mean when they say evidence based.
They're talking about there's evidence for what the problem is,
which doesn't actually help you with the solution. Was it evidence?
Speaker 4 (22:33):
It's usually policy based evidence.
Speaker 3 (22:38):
Their policies are of course, you know, there's not a
better mean, but it also politics is just as much
about values.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Well, no, it's actually it's all about that, because I
can give you an example that somebody would say, look,
let's pretend and please don't text me. This is just
a pretend thing. Remember when get a texture? Now, okay,
remember when the flashing up there was a discussion around
the absence of BirdLife and the suburbs. It is because
cats are basically killing and eating birds.
Speaker 4 (23:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Well, I could say, well, this is a policy that's
evidence based because we have the evidence. We know that
cats are killing birds. So my policy is we're going
to vanloads of people going around with batletlaveras and twenty
two shooting every cat on site. I could say it's
evidence based, but it doesn't inform on our values, because
I don't think we'd be too okay with that.
Speaker 3 (23:22):
But then and then I'll throw my anecdata at you,
which is we've got two cats and also a family
of poocicko's living in our backland.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
She can't eat a pookicko. You know how to cook
a pook ecko. You stick it in a in a
pot with a rock and you boil it for forty
eight hours. Then you take out the poocicko, throw it
away and eat the rock.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
That's how they're also slightly bigger than my cats and
a cook And suddenly we've transferred falled into reading New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
There's one annoying thing about the bird call at three o'clock.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
And what do they do? What sound do they make?
Speaker 4 (24:01):
Oh, it's horrendous. Can you do it?
Speaker 2 (24:03):
No, come on, just give us it's give it a word.
Speaker 4 (24:05):
It's screechy.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
I put it down to the fact that they're actually
the Australia. Is that they're actually an Australian, So they're
not They're not even, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
It's such a shame that that bird calls don't match
the you know, the attractness of the bird. I love
magpie calls. I hate magpieses are awful, but I do
love waking after the call of magpies.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
And like a two myself too, extullly lovely love the
sound of the two. Let's just go for something a
bit more indigenous. You know. I'm definitely morphing into our intra.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
There's a spot coming up.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Now. Look. I always think the headline is the hardest
thing to get past here. But the Conservation Minister's proposal
to sell off conservation land doesn't sound very conservation Ye,
that's anyway. There's an amendment bill which could affect up
to sixty percent of the current conservation land. It would
become possible for land in these areas to be exchanged
(25:03):
or disposed of. Blah blah blah blahlah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Yeah, that's the different makes it possible.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Yeah, it's not.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
Let's not lean too heavily.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
That's why I finished. You jumped on me before I
was triggered. Sorry to We love a triggered guest. I'm
going to try and trigger you a bit more, but anyway,
I'm not going to I'm going to throw to the
person who wants, you know, stuck his hat in the
in the ring for the Greenies. Is that the one
through his hat through something in the ring? And then
it's tel.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Kyle and roughly that order. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Look, I mean it's tricky, isn't it. I mean, like
you say, it is important to get past the headline.
It's a pretty hard sell though. I mean, when you
start to talk about mesting around with the conservation land,
I think there's a lot of key. As he start
to get very anxious, very quickly. I appreciate that a
lot of it's ring fenced. However, the idea that it
could be sold but it won't requires us to trust
politicians from now and into the future, and it does
(25:58):
make me very nervous. It's a bit of a noxy
moorn really that we're going to look to commercialize some
of the conservation land and you know, it's okay for
some stuff not to be part of the economy.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
I think I think that that it's a bit more
nuanced though, because actually there is a lot of land
which simply sits under the auspices of the Conservation Department
because they don't know where else to put it. There's
a lot of land where you go, well, of course
we should do something with this. It's hardly you know.
I think that the thing is, if we mentioned the
word conservation and land, we picture you know, remu and
(26:30):
ferns and nik and all the wonderful tree and everything
per kk target. But we picture our special our lovely walks,
and we picture everything that looks like a tourism New
Zealand advert for New Zealand. But a lot of conservation
land is simply crap and it's just by the Department
of Conservation and I mean, I don't think I'm overstating
(26:51):
that there's some very ordinary conservation land and maybe they
need to read it's the definition that upsets us most.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
Well, they should be selling it better then, because I
mean the way it's been sold so far that then
it's like you say in your introduction doesn't sound very conservation.
I mean, you know, the people are putting out maps
and putting out what land is going to be at risk.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
They need to be selling the idea better. That's part
of the political petruck.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Well, Chloe was selling what, you know, the other way around,
so she's not responded. She was just doing misleading us. No,
never public service. We'll get onto that. Jordan.
Speaker 4 (27:32):
Yeah, I mean I'm not quite I'm not quite Kyle
or Haley Holt. You know, I didn't stand for the Greens,
but I was once a member of the Greens.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
So yeah.
Speaker 4 (27:46):
But the vast majority of conservation land has little or
no conservation value. The vast majority, you know, flyve and
New Zealand looked down. New Zealand is pretty empty and
most of it is actually owned by the government for
which is passed over into doc to manage. We all
know is a very poor Manager of Land. I would
(28:09):
actually rather focus on the national parks and on the
actual conservation of what is really worth conserving and actually
in exchange for that, which is what this bill does.
Where you've got land swaps. For example, you know that
here is a lot piece of low value land. You
went want to come and build a new town. Remember
the difficulty the owner of Sleepy Head had to build
(28:32):
a town in the Wye shadow for a big factory
sort of thing. You know, we have to find a
way to protect what's worth protecting, but also get out
of the way in terms of allowing New Zealand. New
Zealanders and our economy to flourish, including taking advantage of
some of the incredible assets that we have available. In
New Zealand continues to be poorer relative to Australia, we
(28:56):
are just as endowed in terms of wealth under the ground.
I would argue that we should make some of that available,
if that means swapping you know, gorse land or or
stuff that no one wants in exchange for better land,
or dare I say it even selling it?
Speaker 2 (29:17):
So be it okay? Anything else to ad there? Should
we take the break cup of tea, lie down.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
I'm still getting over being mentioned in the same sentence
as hade Holt, are you.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
Yeah, well you both be former Green there's quite quite true.
Illustrious list actually, but you only think we haven't.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
I think you should see Kyle on the dance floor.
But I'm in a pair of tights.
Speaker 4 (29:40):
Don't last very long in the Greens, these illustrious people,
but you know they're there.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Look, we're going to take a moment. We'll be back
and just to take we'll touch on just the whole
thing with the immigration public servants and what it means
for just our trust of the whole system in the end,
but we've got lots of other things to touch on
as well. We'll be back in just to take. It's
twenty one minutes to four. News Talk said, be Yes,
(30:06):
News Talk said, be welcome back to the show. Jordan
Williams and car MacDonald are my guest today. Now, guys,
this public this is a few days old, the story,
but the ongoing sort of effect of the revelation that
public servants, you know, sort of cooked the cooked the
books or their story so they didn't have to have
(30:28):
the scrutiny of Cabinet tell them they couldn't spend any
more money on an ill fated biometrics upgrade graded project.
Winston's called for them to be imprisoned. I would have
thought that if they're still around, I gather a lot
of them aren't there. But I actually think this is
the thing that really bothered me from the story I
(30:48):
read was then the interview that Erica gave with The Herald.
She said that she, you know, was hesitant to trust,
you know, it affected her trust in public service officials
and the people who are advising her. I'm thinking, well,
this is it's pretty bad car. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
That actually that was the that worried me about the
story in general, actually was that they've kind of potentially
ruined it for a lot of their colleagues, because you know,
the public service is under the pump a little bit
at the moment, and there's lots of politics around it.
It does seem from what I've read that it was
just misleading the previous labor government as well as so
to be here, this doesn't sound like it was politically motivated.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Andrew Little, Michael Woodchrispafoy, and Eric Stanford, and it's.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
On the face of the reporting, it's just terrible behavior. Obviously,
someone was very invested in a particular project for whatever
reason we don't know, and wanted to push that through
to the point of deceiving their minister, which is just terrible.
So I don't know whether go along with Winston automatically
just chucking them in the tower, but.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Cruciffections to the life of Brian.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
But you know, whatever charges need to be laid probably
should be because this is going to bring the whole
public service into district.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
I'd like to know who it was, actually, Jordan, do
you want to know who it was? Do you want names? Yeah?
Of course.
Speaker 4 (31:58):
The thing is is these inquiries always take years, and
what you find happens is the people that move on.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
You need need to look at.
Speaker 4 (32:04):
Caroline Tremaine, who you know, the minister has said that
she's known about this for some time. Caroline was the
chief executive of mb for which this all fell under,
and under her watch. It wasn't just that there's the
mad behavior of misleading successive ministers. The people the whistleblowers
(32:25):
were moved on when they raised concerns. That is the
other way outrageous And I just cannot believe that only
a few weeks ago as part of the King's Birthday honors,
Caroline Tremaine is there getting a gong? How that is
not paused pending this investigation, look Sir Brian Roach, I
(32:45):
don't know. I've never been able to figure out why
has got this reputation for being the mister fix it.
He's missed the political fix it because I have never
been able to identify anything he's actually fixed. Because you
know he's going in there saying that you know we're
going to get get to the bottom of this. I
will be astonished if people lose their jobs. I don't
think she think there's a criminal offense here. Misfeaes ins
(33:05):
and public office.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Is a very high bar.
Speaker 4 (33:08):
You've got to show a personal benefit and it's difficult
to show them the men's rayal element that just take
the competence on well and you look at Look, we've
not done this in a few years, but I know
we peri ondly do it. With Auckland Council for example,
we my staff have do the official information request. How
many people in the last twelve months have you fired
(33:30):
for incompetence or poor performance? And I can tell you
and we'll have done it with Auckland, the answer is zero.
And in too many departments what they do is they
just shift people on. And what you will see an
MB is if there is anyone with a guilty conscience,
they just sort of shifted sideways, often into di A
or sort of other or the sort of woman's or Maria,
(33:52):
there's the sort of advisory departments and they sort of there,
they sat there for the rest of their careers.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
We should get to the bottom of it because good
to know why, because the motivation is interesting, isn't it Well,
but it is It's always happened, you know, Yes, Minister says,
this has always happened. But I think that what the
point Dominict Cummings has been making in the UK, the
Boris Johnson's former staff for the Brexit campaign manager, is
that actually it is lanyard class, that power is no
(34:22):
longer in the elected cabinets. It sits squarely with the
senior officials. And this would point will suggest that New
Zealand has the same problem and as a real test
for Sir Brian the Public Services Commissioner, whether he actually
can not just get to the bottom of it but.
Speaker 4 (34:41):
Reform the public service. So it is responsive to the
political will, not the other way around. It's serving the
elected leaders.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
Amazing how often in this game that you can and
even in the reporting of it that people will mentioned
episodes of yes Minister and yes Prime Minister, which sees didn't.
It was almost almost getting.
Speaker 4 (35:04):
It is getting. The level of dishonesty within the public service,
I would argue has got worse even than my twelve
years in this job.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
By the way, just on that Shane Jones travel budget blowout,
not on that, just on you know, things that happened
in Wellington. So the cabinet approved a total budget of
about thirty three thousand. The eventual bill was sixty three thousand.
It looks like it's a bit of a hit job
from National on New Zealand first as well. But god,
how much money.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
It's how much.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Money would they spend if you're going over there and
it was your money. I suspect it wouldn't be sixty
three grand, although I sort of you know, when I
heard Jane Jones talk about the difficulty of getting around
in the cold and Toronto, you know, well.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
We got our high family of four around Europe and
the UK for six weeks for.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Less than the sixty three grand. It's a lot of
money anyway. I mean, you'd be used to turning left
and traveling business, wouldn't you, Jordan.
Speaker 4 (35:59):
I mean, I had no problem with people flying business.
If it's on the coin, it's on the coin. You
think of the stick that Steven Joyce Scott for his
two and a half thousand dollars taxi ride. You know,
the taxi ticked all day in Sydney. So don't get
New Zealand politicians that get crowned cars anymore. I think
(36:20):
that the incredible thing about this is actually that the
full amount was ex post approved, despite it being twice
their proved budget. But I am not. I just want
to be clear. I'm not one of those people. And
actually I pointed this out to my staff. I actually
don't think it's fear to seeing politicians and premium economy
(36:40):
without the life flash on overnight flights. I think that
is a false economy. But me, it's that we don't
need stretch limos. We don't need suburbans for our politicians
while in North America. But I googled the company. It's
literally stretch limos sitting outside. Come on, I mean, and
this is such an own goal for Shane Jones budget.
Speaker 3 (37:03):
I mean, if you haven't approved budget and any out
the job, I mean you stick to it all.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
There's a process.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
Well, you have to pay it back.
Speaker 4 (37:08):
You increase it, Yeah, exactly, you pay back the difference.
And that's the thing that the nets, the nets which
presumably have leaked the story, it was the PEAMS office
that retrospectively approved it, right second thirty thousand or thirty.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
I guess did they have no choice but to approve it.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
I don't know, what is your employer have a choice? No,
you pay, No, you prove it.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
I don't understand Jordan as it's public money. Easy come, easy, come, easygo.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
Now you're trying to trigger that. I see what you're doing. Yeah,
I can see there's blood pressure rise out here. I mean,
poor old Shange joke, you've got form, You've got form
on this. I mean we literally named an awards ceremony
after him for a hotel hotel room remote mishap. And
you know that you think he would have learned the lesson,
But this is just this takes it to a whole
(37:55):
new level. And I have a lot of I like change.
I have a lot of sympathy for him. But this
is just come on, this is but.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
Is it as a little bit of a national and
music on the first hit job? I mean, there are
you know now that you've.
Speaker 4 (38:07):
Got to make a cock up in the first place
for it to be a hit job. Yeah, it's I
mean it's such an.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
You've got to make the cock cup in the first
place for it to be a hit job. Excellent work, Kyle,
That's why we get you here. Anyway. Hey, look we're
going to take a moment. We'll be back in just
a ticket. It's nine minutes to four. News Talk dB, Yes,
News Talk z B. Coming to the end of our
panel with car McDonald and Jordan Williams. Guys, just on
(38:39):
the sports side of thing. I woke up in the
middle of last night. I couldn't sleep, and normally I
sort of lie they're just, you know, worrying about all
the problems of the world. Instead, I actually switched on
the cricket of New Zealand, the black Caps versus England,
and actually really joyed about enjoyed about forty five minutes.
And I think it's just because I love I would
love it if we beat the Poms. You've you've been
(39:02):
enjoying the sports, you know, calendar at the moment, feef
for World Cup.
Speaker 4 (39:06):
I'm not a huge football fan.
Speaker 3 (39:08):
I actually haven't actually watched the game for starting to
finish yet, but I'm loving the cricket. I actually went
to Lord's but over the summer when we were in London,
which was pretty cool. Did the tour, which was so
it makes quite a difference when you've been to the
ground and then you're watching on on.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
The mate into Lord's and you loved to Steve abel
is a very big cricket fan.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
The Daily Telegraph, Telegraph you camrick and you've got written
all over you behind the scenes there, Kyle.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
Great to see Henry Nichols get a century, yes, fantastic
And I was was really disappointed about Williams and I
think good on him for making decision that weeks for him.
Speaker 4 (39:45):
But it is a real shame we.
Speaker 3 (39:46):
Don't get to say goodbye.
Speaker 2 (39:47):
God at the Oval. It's I mean, it's a gorgeous
looking arenas amazing and I don't know if the commentator
was joking, but it splashed up on three figures and
one of them was a musical theater composer called Richard
still Goo and lyricist and then goes on the guy
in the middle and it's almost like somebody said in
his and he goes, of course it's Mick Jagger and
it was like jacket Mick Jagger's apparently.
Speaker 4 (40:06):
But it's a huge cricket.
Speaker 3 (40:08):
Cricket, Yeah, he's remember at law it's actually yeah. And
of course the Suga rugby final tonight, Tim, Yes, it
is the chiefs.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Now we're talking.
Speaker 4 (40:16):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
It's a shame we don't broadcast this in a way,
although it's many good reasons. Why it's good we don't
is that you would have seen Jordan just glazed over
at the talk of sport there. But even to the
fief for World Cup, Jordan, you'll.
Speaker 4 (40:29):
Be watching the Well, I've got England and in the
sort of staff Paul, but I've also got Jordan, which
is highly unlikely to go anywhere. And you know the
third country I got that has ranked eighty second?
Speaker 2 (40:40):
What what?
Speaker 1 (40:40):
What?
Speaker 2 (40:41):
What is that? What?
Speaker 4 (40:44):
CRUSEO? Yeah, I didn't know they had a apparently.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
You thought that was what your coffee was so from Yeah.
Speaker 4 (40:50):
So I don't know when you're so we cheering England
for my stut, for my sweep steak with my team. Nice. Nice.
Speaker 3 (40:57):
Actually, you know what, I think this football world would
actually probably cope with the fact of England needs to
win it again.
Speaker 4 (41:02):
It's kind of like that.
Speaker 2 (41:03):
No they don't they.
Speaker 4 (41:04):
Yeah, football is coming home as if it's your cup.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
No it's not, it's not. I hope France all the way.
Speaker 4 (41:10):
France Frank's front, France Frank a pretty rough time. We've
got to give them something. I hopink Scotland might get
someone times up.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
Thank you, Carl and Jordan. We'll be back property next.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to news
Talks it'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Weekend Collective podcast from News Talk
s ed B.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
And a very good afternoon to you. Welcome to the
Weekend Collective. I'm Tim Beveridge the Saturday, the twentieth of
journey for some Tim Beverridge every day. But the show's
right now. Beautiful day, isn't it. I hope it is?
Where in your place? But anyway, you can text your
feedback anytime on nine two nine two and you can
email Tim b at Newstalk SAIDB dot co dot Nz.
(01:11):
Coming up on today's show shortly our panel and I'll
be introducing them in just a moment, but looking ahead
to later in the show where he is. As you know,
We take your calls on eight hundred and eighty ten
eighty or you can text on ninet two nine two.
But it is news Talk for the one roof radio show.
Brian Thompson's with US Tax Tax Tax. He's the managing
director at Hardcourts and there's a lot of stuff that's
(01:31):
being hung off the idea of how much labour can
raise from a capital gains tax. But we're just we're
actually going to ask about the implications of taxes on
the property market. And you know what it's going to
deliver maybe, but what it means for people's attitude towards property.
Because also we've seen the Opportunities Party who are creeping
up in the polls and they've got a bit of
a land tax thing going on. So we're going to
(01:53):
have a chat about what the implications of those taxes
would be with Brian Thompson, managing director at Hard Courts.
That'll be after four. By the way, the one roof
radio show Property of the Week is quite fascinating. I'll
get you plenty of notice of it so you can
look it up because about five million bucks worth. But
the toilet looks like it's a public toilet bathroom? Should
I say? Anyway? But at five o'clock for the Parents Squad,
(02:14):
I digress giving you too much information. We are going
to be joined by a Maniche diva and we're going
to talk about the head of steam that's building up
regarding the social media band for under sixteen year olds,
which hasn't been too popular with the kids. Over there
is that wonderful one where a woman, a girl, should
I say, was asked what's she going to do without it?
She says, I'm just going to stare at the wall,
(02:35):
and I I was wondering is that a bad thing?
Maybe just to let that fill that science. And we're
going to talk about the adolescent brain. So if you're
a parent of teenagers, what does the adolescent brain really
need for good development? And I'm guessing probably the absence
of a cell phone. But anyway, and shortly before six,
Superman himself joins us Christopher Reeve Super Rugby Final. We've
(02:57):
got a bit of a cricket overnight and the latest
on the FIFA World Cup, so lots to get into.
Welcome to the Weekend Collective. It is nine minutes past three,
wish And by the way, in fact I mentioned this
to my guests. I'll introduce them now in no particular order.
(03:17):
He's a broadcaster and psychotherapist. It's Kyle McDonald cayle. How
are you going very well? Thank you, curer, excellent, excellent?
Have you done the morning sport? Saturday morning Sport?
Speaker 1 (03:29):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (03:29):
I did the drop off and then I went to
the gym, so my partner did the sidelines. The old
netball John's about sex.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Actually, I'm gonna be a bit mischievous and just give
a shout out. My daughter plays for the Barodeene nine
A team, and look, there are some amazing teams and
you know, she's obviously there, and I think they're in
the first division, second Division two or something. But just
seeing the work that coaches put in and the value
of good coaches and the effort that's gone from their
(03:57):
coach Kayla, and seeing the improvement over two or three weeks. God,
it's just so good to see the kids get that
little spring in their step. And look, they're not going
to win every game, but they've had a couple of
good wins. And I love Saturday morning sport. I think
it's just one of the great things about Kiwi culture.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yeah, it's great, isn't it. I mean, my artist has
picked up ripper rugby as well in addition to netball,
and her coach is great, and is that thing of like, actually,
he's just encouraging them to be improving against themselves. I mean,
you know, now we're not losers, great, right, but actually
it's about each week putting the skills on the park
and actually enjoying the process.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Indeed, and joining He's not quite into the Saturday morning
sport yet because his kids are a little bit younger,
but politics is a sport firm in a way blood
sport anyway, from the Taxpairs Union, do I just say
from the Taxpairs Union and everyone out there listening going, oh,
it's Jordan Williams. Jordan, how are you very well?
Speaker 4 (04:50):
I've been away last out of the country for a
few days. It's been great to spend the morning with
my kids. Dancing is the thing that's big in our family,
and we've got to an age where my artist is
now traveling around the country and weekends doing these dance competitions.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
Do your kids get you to join in with them
in the living room on their latest dance moves, because
I'd like to see a video of that.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Too young to be embarrassed yet, So I am. I'm
living up that.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
But are you are you? Have you had the moments
where they're like, Daddy, join us, joining for this? Do
this move dad?
Speaker 4 (05:21):
I think that I have again a limited window where
my kids can tolerate my eclectic music taste and get
away with it.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Actually, the good thing is you can lock them in
the car when you take them too sports and then
play your music.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
That's what I've feend actually, just on the music. So
that was a bit of Van Halen there to open it,
and it actually reminded me. I don't know if you've
seen these on YouTube where someone has they do those
concerts that Kim johng n has with all the army
and everyone singing very formally, but they've dubbed it with
a sort of what it could be, and they had
them singing always look on the bright side of life.
(05:56):
But they have the moments where the lips singing and
all the movements of these incredibly militaristic concerts where everyone's applauding,
you know, just so they don't get shot next day.
It's you should google it.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
What Norm does in the middle of the night when
you can't sleep. This is what he's doing.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
It was like, I think I was listening to the
meet of pr The next thing it goes, do you
want to see this North Korea concert.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
Of the phone down to Yeah, I think you should
stick to listening to talk back in the middle of
the night. No social media band for Tim, it was
kind of it is.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I have to I'm gonna have to show you in
the break It is quite funny. Anyway. Look, I got
to be honest with you as I, because otherwise I'd
be a hypocrite, because I said to Jordan, you know,
with what's going on in Iran and the deal and
what peace talks are on and what's off, there's a
memorandum and it does look like the straight of Hormos.
You know, we're going to get some traffic flowing through
(06:54):
that the petrol. I got petrol for two dollars seventy
five the other day diesels below three. Yeah, yep. And
but I can't really keep up with it because and
I can't help but think that if there is going
to be a turd in the punch bowl, its name
is BB Netanyahu. But anyway, Jordan, let's go to you
to get started with that one.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Well, I just think it's nice that, you know, we
can go back to worrying about that the world's going
to end because of AI. We don't have to worry
about the oil situation so much now, Isn't that Isn't
that great?
Speaker 2 (07:24):
I guess so I haven't really thought about the oil
thing for a while.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I sort of just because it's just so up and down.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
If you are following the fortunes of it, I think
you'd go bonkers.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Well, they We were saved really by a couple of
factors China. China stopped importing you going burning through its reserves,
and we were heavily reliant on the Japanese and the
Americans running down their reserves. That meant that that rubber
band stretched. And of course the worry a few weeks
ago is that, you know, the question of it is
what point does that snap and we get armageddon in
(07:55):
terms of the oil price. But you know, the Americans
have really basically crystallized the loss, really, haven't they. It's
a terrible From what has been leaking out, it looks
like a pretty terrible deal. And we saw just just
today that the because it's basically a ceasefire pending further negotiations,
is the first round of these negotiations appear to have
(08:17):
fallen over with dvance canceling going to Switzerland for the talks.
So everything is awesome.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Yeah, as I say, it's my if I fingers crossed, Kyle.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Yeah, well, I mean we did better this week, didn't
we as a country against Iran?
Speaker 4 (08:34):
We drew, so we didn't lose.
Speaker 3 (08:38):
I mean, from a therapist point of view, I mean,
it's kind of continues to be fascinating. The mental gymnastics
that the American president and cabinet having to do to
convince themselves that they've won. You know, all the details
that have kind of come out about the deal, it's
kind of They've spent billions of dollars to end up
back in a slightly worse place. Were now threatening to
(08:59):
use the straight Uorford moose to raise funds after the
sixty days.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
And I mean, the idea of being told by Iran,
I think it's just untenable really, but who knows. But
the sanctions being lifted and then getting a bunch of back,
a bunch of assets and everything, I mean, despite the
fact that Iran was attacked and they've absorbed that this
is a total you know. Yeah. The other interesting thing
that I am pleased that's come out of it is
(09:22):
it seems that the American administration has finally sort of
started to lose a bit of patients with Israel, who probably,
to be honest, nudged them all the way to bombing
Iran in the first place.
Speaker 4 (09:31):
What do you think, Jordan, Well, I know I'm not
going to join in a pile on on Israel, but
I've always been slightly contrarying from the messes on this
that it is unthinkable to have Iran with nuclear weapons
and that if Trump had have succeeded or this episode
had succeeded, and pushing that back even a decade is certainly.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Worth the cost.
Speaker 4 (09:55):
I think that there is a huge amount of naivete
in relation to you know, leave Israel along alone, that sorry,
leave Iran along rather, you know, they do want to
wipe Israel off the face of the earth, and them
having nukes is you know, the whole the way the
West likes the pile on because you know, it's stupid, stupid,
(10:16):
dumb Trump, you know what, an idiot and with a
little bit of side of this is all Israel's fault.
I think it's stupid. I said right at the beginning, yep,
this this could go wrong, but hopefully it goes right.
It hasn't gone It certainly hasn't gone right, It hasn't
gone totally wrong. The scary thing is is even without nukes,
the Iran is in a much stronger position because it
(10:37):
now knows it can close it straight well, possibly.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
In a slightly more extreme position now with their leadership too.
From what I understand, yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
And also considering Trump has said that, you know a
long time, quite a while ago, that their nuclear hability
bed had been obliterated, and all of a sudden, it's like,
now we've got to attack them to stop.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
I mean a bit nervous here, Tim, you're gonna you're
gonna blow up this text machine here within the moment
we mentioned Trump, No, actually, you.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Know what, I actually the one I don't often agree
with them, but he almost took the words right out
of my mouth when he was talking about when he
was a bit cross with Netanyahu. And it's the hez
Bala thing. And actually I'll acknowledge you know what, Yes,
those countries when they save from the river to the
sea palis I must be free. They mean getting rid
of the state of Israel, And so we shouldn't forget.
(11:22):
What does Chloe say then, I don't know. Is it
a nursery rhyme she sings to herself when she goes
to bed at night. I don't know. UM always look
on anyway. But when Trump said, look, you don't have
to blow up an apartment building every time you're looking
for one person or something, and I sort of thought,
that does seem to sum up a little bit. What
(11:43):
you know, Israel want to get at some person and boom,
there's another apartment block gone in Bay Route or something.
And look, I don't have any faith in Netanya who
and I don't know where those corruption charges that he
was facing a long time were going to go or whatever.
But yeah, I wouldn't. I wouldn't trust him as far
as I could throw them, much as I acknowledge the
(12:04):
threats that come exist to Israel. Have you got a
comment on that car? No?
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Look, I mean I'm far from an expert. I think
like a lot of people. One of the things that
I've noticed happening with my own brain is I've started
to tune out because it feels impossible to keep up,
And unfortunately, I think you know, that doesn't do anyone
who's actually on the ground there suffering any service when
the rest of the world starts to tune out. But
it's so hard to keep up and so hard to
stay engaged with the sort of the horror of it,
(12:29):
isn't it.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Yeah? So often I think of those Last and Far
Side cartoons for a situation like this, and there's the
kid who's maybe he hasn't been drawn in a flattering
way at the back of the class with the hand
up going please sir can I go My brain is full.
That's pretty much me with them. Yeah, keeping track of
everything anyway. Look, the other extraordinary bit of news was
(12:49):
Ukraine striking deeper into Russia with they've stepped up their strikes.
There was amazing footage of them blowing that the lid
off that massive oil tank into the sky and Kiev
basically demonstrating that look, you know, what's good for the
goose is good for the gander. I don't know really
what this means for the conflict in Russia, but as
(13:11):
a colleague send to me, it's almost like the Ukraine
are winning at the moment. Jordan, what's your take on it?
Speaker 4 (13:14):
Yeah, I think Ukraine did a good job and embedding
it in sensing what could have really gone wrong with
Iran and that with everyone needing Russian oil and the
price of oil coming up, is that the Iranian sense
the opportunity, sorry, the Ukrainian sense the opportunity, and that
they've worked a heck of a lot with with Western
(13:35):
militaries in terms of what they've learned around drone warfare.
You know, that makes the West stronger. I'm trying to
look at the positives, and it does appear that Russia
being unable to recruit the number of soldiers that they're
churning through and this meat grinder is now coming to
bite them. Look as awful as that is, it's probably
(13:59):
a good thing. Hopefully this thing comes to an end
sooner rather than later.
Speaker 2 (14:04):
How does it come to an end?
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Well, Russia runs out of political imph on it, and
it does appear, you know, that's the big question of
of of when that happens. And of course it has strengthened,
you know, the Europeans, knowing that America is an unreliable ally,
seemed to be getting their their act together.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Yeah, what did you make? What are you? What's your
thoughts on it? Carl?
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Look, I mean it sounds a bit cold as well,
but I think the technology is absolutely amazing. I mean,
you know, one of the things, whether it's you know,
psychology or medicine or other civilian technologies, what happens with
wars unfortunately, as a technology gets accelerated.
Speaker 4 (14:45):
Amazing word for it. Did you see the Economist last
week saying that we're going to see this year the
first assassinations with drones. Remember that video about five years
ago that was actually fake, but I thought it was
real of the drone seeking out the person with facial recognition,
going to the full sci fi stuff. That's that, that's
(15:05):
the world we live in now.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
But of course then the technology to counter that, I
guess hopefully for the person who's been targeted. But you know,
the drone stuff, Like you say, Jordan, I mean, I
think that there's a lot of conversations in there in
Europe about actually that needing to change the direction which
where militaries are being armed.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
The innovation, of course, I mean, when your life depends
on the survival of your country's I imagine that's a
fairly hefty motivator to be trying to be one, one, two,
three steps ahead of the opposition. I still remember that
amazing footage of remember that the Ukrainians got those trucks
driving into into Russia and the drivers pulled over the
side of the road and all of a sudden, the
(15:43):
lid of the container lifted up and these drones flew out,
and oh, it's like bloody, let's here's something we prepared earlier.
Very clever. Anyway, Hey, look We're going to head to
a little bit of domestic politics after the break with
the pole of polls. Oh, I don't know what I
think of poles. What We're going to have a bit
of a chat about where we're going and also the
Opportunity Party they are. They seem to have done all
(16:06):
okay in the last pole, so we'll have a chat
with our chaps about that in just a moment. This
is the panel on the Weekend Collective. It's twenty two
past three. Yes, welcome back to our panel today with
(16:31):
Shaz Jordan Williams of the Taxpars Union and psychotherapist to
car MacDonald. Now that there's an analysis of the poll
of polls, reckons the coalition scott still pretty strong chants
of being re elected. I think seventy four point three,
which is up from what it was in February. I
did see a poll recently that said, oh, that's been
(16:52):
good for the Greens because they've doubled their support, and
I'm like, well, there's not a credible pole for a start,
and it doesn't jump around like that. Of course, the
Tax Bad's Union has got its own pole, but what
do you make of the one of the winners from
recent polls has been I've written I'd pretty much written
off the top all the time. It's like wasted vote,
wasted vote, wasted vote. Now they're going for Mount Albert
(17:12):
and they're showing about three point four percent or something.
Are they anyway any chance they'll get in? What do
you make of the Opportunities Party Jordan?
Speaker 4 (17:20):
There are if you're if you're on the center right,
if you want the government with a coalition to stay
in power. They are the wolf in sheep's clothing because
when you scratch away the surface of the rhetoric around, well,
we can work with both. They actually run on quite
a radical left wing platform. So the first is, you know, well,
we want a land tax. So the economists love land
(17:41):
taxes because they know you can't move it, you can't
hide it, and the tax on that incentivisers putting the
land to base use. It's not not like rates which
is often on capital improvement, which is economically stupid, but
it is, as I say, just on the underlying land.
So that amounts though instead of replacing more economically damaging taxes,
(18:04):
TOP would use it as an eighteen billion dollar tax grab.
So it's roughly eight and a half thousand dollars per
NEI Zeland household extra in tax if you adopt the
top parties.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
It's almost like a Wellington or water bill.
Speaker 4 (18:20):
It is. It is a tax policy if you are
the Greens or seriously socialists but aren't quite willing to
admit it. And then you look at one of their candidates,
I understand, was literally the co author of Harpurpoor, which
was the report to how to implement a sort of
quite radical co governance strategy across the whole of society.
(18:45):
So I mean, you know, are they center as well?
You know, according to them, and I think we go
once you scratch the surface, not really now, I know
some center right slightly Macavelian three D chess players is saying, well,
look I'm going to put some money into them because
they waste green votes. That's a very dangerous game because
you look at the way, and with the greatest respect,
(19:07):
I know, the newsrooms pretty empty today, but you know
usually when I walk through the newsroom coming home to
ZB or you walk through stuff's officers, it's a very
young group of people in media and for whatever reason,
they get behind top and top now on three percent
and if they had four that you watch the media party. Sorry,
(19:30):
our friends in the media get behind TOP and they
will be rocketing up. So as I say, dangerous game
because if Top had five percent, that will mean that
Labor could possibly credibly rule out to party Marti, and
it is absolutely game on in terms.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Of the election. Okay. In fact, she did say when
I interviewed it, I liked interviewing because she listened to questions.
Speaker 4 (19:55):
She's really I ran into the press Glory Party for Christmas.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
She's lovely and I said, what will your policy be
on who you negotiat with? And she said it would
be the party that got the most votes, So even
a first Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:11):
They talk to them first, which well.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
That means they've talked to Labor first, probably because Labor
might get more votes than National even though the National
block might be a slightly bigger block. Until the Top
makes its choice. Oh gosh, I'm almost run out of steam. Nikyle,
You've been sitting there very patiently, former Green Party candidate,
of course, for my sins, Would you like to stand
for Top? Look?
Speaker 3 (20:34):
No, but there is a reasonably well trodden path actually
in the past of candidate's going from one to the other.
I think they're interesting. The people that I talk to
in my life that are interested in voting for them
sort of fall into two camps, ready, and it kind
of lines up in a way what you were saying, Jordan.
The first camp is, I think, rightly or wrongly, they've
done a pitch to young people around house ownership and
(20:58):
convince them that top are on their side when it
comes to increasing the likelihood of them being able to
own a home. And I guess the other thing is
that kind of feel like in some ways they're marketing
themselves as the party that aren't other things. You know,
they're they're Green, but they're not the Greens, and they're
they're they're sort of sort of senter right, but they're
not national, and they're sort of seen to left but
they're not labor. Their seoge does seem to be down
(21:19):
to pretty much the Christmas there their new leader thought,
and you know, it seems they have managed to shake
off the whole cats thing, which is nice.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
I guess, well, I wonder how much people are still
nostalgic for Gareth Morgan though, I mean, you know, and
maybe that's why it capture some of the right because
they go, well.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
He's a wealthy guy who was for you know, he's longer,
I think though, yeah, long, I know, yeah, yeah, yeah,
it is incredible though then I think it was Bob
Mccrosscrey tweeted the other day that you can peer the
way of the horror when Colin Craig had for four
and a half percent. You know, this is absolutely to
(21:59):
the absolute seething doll. It's a grueling, delight heading for
four and a half percent. So it just that's why
I think it's quite a dangerous game for the center
right to get behind all these business people who think,
oh yeah, a new way of doing politics. Yeah yeah, yeah,
that sounds good. It sounds evidence based. Yeah yeah, I
(22:20):
love that. When you scratch your surface, it's just not
it's just been a market.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
The whole thing about evidence based. So we got to
drill into what they mean when they say evidence based.
They're talking about there's evidence for what the problem is,
which doesn't actually help you with the solution. Was it evidence?
Speaker 4 (22:33):
It's usually policy based evidence.
Speaker 3 (22:38):
Their policies are of course, you know, there's not a
better mean, but it also politics is just as much
about values.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
Well, no, it's actually it's all about that, because I
can give you an example that somebody would say, look,
let's pretend and please don't text me. This is just
a pretend thing. Remember when get a texture? Now, okay,
remember when the flashing up there was a discussion around
the absence of BirdLife and the suburbs. It is because
cats are basically killing and eating birds.
Speaker 4 (23:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Well, I could say, well, this is a policy that's
evidence based because we have the evidence. We know that
cats are killing birds. So my policy is we're going
to vanloads of people going around with batletlaveras and twenty
two shooting every cat on site. I could say it's
evidence based, but it doesn't inform on our values, because
I don't think we'd be too okay with that.
Speaker 3 (23:22):
But then and then I'll throw my anecdata at you,
which is we've got two cats and also a family
of poocicko's living in our backland.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
She can't eat a pookicko. You know how to cook
a pook ecko. You stick it in a in a
pot with a rock and you boil it for forty
eight hours. Then you take out the poocicko, throw it
away and eat the rock.
Speaker 4 (23:40):
That's how they're also slightly bigger than my cats and
a cook And suddenly we've transferred falled into reading New Zealand.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
There's one annoying thing about the bird call at three o'clock.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
And what do they do? What sound do they make?
Speaker 4 (24:01):
Oh, it's horrendous. Can you do it?
Speaker 2 (24:03):
No, come on, just give us it's give it a word.
Speaker 4 (24:05):
It's screechy.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
I put it down to the fact that they're actually
the Australia. Is that they're actually an Australian, So they're
not They're not even, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
It's such a shame that that bird calls don't match
the you know, the attractness of the bird. I love
magpie calls. I hate magpieses are awful, but I do
love waking after the call of magpies.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
And like a two myself too, extullly lovely love the
sound of the two. Let's just go for something a
bit more indigenous. You know. I'm definitely morphing into our intra.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
There's a spot coming up.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Now. Look. I always think the headline is the hardest
thing to get past here. But the Conservation Minister's proposal
to sell off conservation land doesn't sound very conservation Ye,
that's anyway. There's an amendment bill which could affect up
to sixty percent of the current conservation land. It would
become possible for land in these areas to be exchanged
(25:03):
or disposed of. Blah blah blah blahlah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (25:05):
Yeah, that's the different makes it possible.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
Yeah, it's not.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
Let's not lean too heavily.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
That's why I finished. You jumped on me before I
was triggered. Sorry to We love a triggered guest. I'm
going to try and trigger you a bit more, but anyway,
I'm not going to I'm going to throw to the
person who wants, you know, stuck his hat in the
in the ring for the Greenies. Is that the one
through his hat through something in the ring? And then
it's tel.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
Kyle and roughly that order. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Look, I mean it's tricky, isn't it. I mean, like
you say, it is important to get past the headline.
It's a pretty hard sell though. I mean, when you
start to talk about mesting around with the conservation land,
I think there's a lot of key. As he start
to get very anxious, very quickly. I appreciate that a
lot of it's ring fenced. However, the idea that it
could be sold but it won't requires us to trust
politicians from now and into the future, and it does
(25:58):
make me very nervous. It's a bit of a noxy
moorn really that we're going to look to commercialize some
of the conservation land and you know, it's okay for
some stuff not to be part of the economy.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
I think I think that that it's a bit more
nuanced though, because actually there is a lot of land
which simply sits under the auspices of the Conservation Department
because they don't know where else to put it. There's
a lot of land where you go, well, of course
we should do something with this. It's hardly you know.
I think that the thing is, if we mentioned the
word conservation and land, we picture you know, remu and
(26:30):
ferns and nik and all the wonderful tree and everything
per kk target. But we picture our special our lovely walks,
and we picture everything that looks like a tourism New
Zealand advert for New Zealand. But a lot of conservation
land is simply crap and it's just by the Department
of Conservation and I mean, I don't think I'm overstating
(26:51):
that there's some very ordinary conservation land and maybe they
need to read it's the definition that upsets us most.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
Well, they should be selling it better then, because I
mean the way it's been sold so far that then
it's like you say in your introduction doesn't sound very conservation.
I mean, you know, the people are putting out maps
and putting out what land is going to be at risk.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
They need to be selling the idea better. That's part
of the political petruck.
Speaker 2 (27:19):
Well, Chloe was selling what, you know, the other way around,
so she's not responded. She was just doing misleading us. No,
never public service. We'll get onto that. Jordan.
Speaker 4 (27:32):
Yeah, I mean I'm not quite I'm not quite Kyle
or Haley Holt. You know, I didn't stand for the Greens,
but I was once a member of the Greens.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
So yeah.
Speaker 4 (27:46):
But the vast majority of conservation land has little or
no conservation value. The vast majority, you know, flyve and
New Zealand looked down. New Zealand is pretty empty and
most of it is actually owned by the government for
which is passed over into doc to manage. We all
know is a very poor Manager of Land. I would
(28:09):
actually rather focus on the national parks and on the
actual conservation of what is really worth conserving and actually
in exchange for that, which is what this bill does.
Where you've got land swaps. For example, you know that
here is a lot piece of low value land. You
went want to come and build a new town. Remember
the difficulty the owner of Sleepy Head had to build
(28:32):
a town in the Wye shadow for a big factory
sort of thing. You know, we have to find a
way to protect what's worth protecting, but also get out
of the way in terms of allowing New Zealand. New
Zealanders and our economy to flourish, including taking advantage of
some of the incredible assets that we have available. In
New Zealand continues to be poorer relative to Australia, we
(28:56):
are just as endowed in terms of wealth under the ground.
I would argue that we should make some of that available,
if that means swapping you know, gorse land or or
stuff that no one wants in exchange for better land,
or dare I say it even selling it?
Speaker 2 (29:17):
So be it okay? Anything else to ad there? Should
we take the break cup of tea, lie down.
Speaker 3 (29:22):
I'm still getting over being mentioned in the same sentence
as hade Holt, are you.
Speaker 4 (29:26):
Yeah, well you both be former Green there's quite quite true.
Illustrious list actually, but you only think we haven't.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
I think you should see Kyle on the dance floor.
But I'm in a pair of tights.
Speaker 4 (29:40):
Don't last very long in the Greens, these illustrious people,
but you know they're there.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
Look, we're going to take a moment. We'll be back
and just to take we'll touch on just the whole
thing with the immigration public servants and what it means
for just our trust of the whole system in the end,
but we've got lots of other things to touch on
as well. We'll be back in just to take. It's
twenty one minutes to four. News Talk said, be Yes,
(30:06):
News Talk said, be welcome back to the show. Jordan
Williams and car MacDonald are my guest today. Now, guys,
this public this is a few days old, the story,
but the ongoing sort of effect of the revelation that
public servants, you know, sort of cooked the cooked the
books or their story so they didn't have to have
(30:28):
the scrutiny of Cabinet tell them they couldn't spend any
more money on an ill fated biometrics upgrade graded project.
Winston's called for them to be imprisoned. I would have
thought that if they're still around, I gather a lot
of them aren't there. But I actually think this is
the thing that really bothered me from the story I
(30:48):
read was then the interview that Erica gave with The Herald.
She said that she, you know, was hesitant to trust,
you know, it affected her trust in public service officials
and the people who are advising her. I'm thinking, well,
this is it's pretty bad car. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
That actually that was the that worried me about the
story in general, actually was that they've kind of potentially
ruined it for a lot of their colleagues, because you know,
the public service is under the pump a little bit
at the moment, and there's lots of politics around it.
It does seem from what I've read that it was
just misleading the previous labor government as well as so
to be here, this doesn't sound like it was politically motivated.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Andrew Little, Michael Woodchrispafoy, and Eric Stanford, and it's.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
On the face of the reporting, it's just terrible behavior. Obviously,
someone was very invested in a particular project for whatever
reason we don't know, and wanted to push that through
to the point of deceiving their minister, which is just terrible.
So I don't know whether go along with Winston automatically
just chucking them in the tower, but.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Cruciffections to the life of Brian.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
But you know, whatever charges need to be laid probably
should be because this is going to bring the whole
public service into district.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
I'd like to know who it was, actually, Jordan, do
you want to know who it was? Do you want names? Yeah?
Of course.
Speaker 4 (31:58):
The thing is is these inquiries always take years, and
what you find happens is the people that move on.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
You need need to look at.
Speaker 4 (32:04):
Caroline Tremaine, who you know, the minister has said that
she's known about this for some time. Caroline was the
chief executive of mb for which this all fell under,
and under her watch. It wasn't just that there's the
mad behavior of misleading successive ministers. The people the whistleblowers
(32:25):
were moved on when they raised concerns. That is the
other way outrageous And I just cannot believe that only
a few weeks ago as part of the King's Birthday honors,
Caroline Tremaine is there getting a gong? How that is
not paused pending this investigation, look Sir Brian Roach, I
(32:45):
don't know. I've never been able to figure out why
has got this reputation for being the mister fix it.
He's missed the political fix it because I have never
been able to identify anything he's actually fixed. Because you
know he's going in there saying that you know we're
going to get get to the bottom of this. I
will be astonished if people lose their jobs. I don't
think she think there's a criminal offense here. Misfeaes ins
(33:05):
and public office.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Is a very high bar.
Speaker 4 (33:08):
You've got to show a personal benefit and it's difficult
to show them the men's rayal element that just take
the competence on well and you look at Look, we've
not done this in a few years, but I know
we peri ondly do it. With Auckland Council for example,
we my staff have do the official information request. How
many people in the last twelve months have you fired
(33:30):
for incompetence or poor performance? And I can tell you
and we'll have done it with Auckland, the answer is zero.
And in too many departments what they do is they
just shift people on. And what you will see an
MB is if there is anyone with a guilty conscience,
they just sort of shifted sideways, often into di A
or sort of other or the sort of woman's or Maria,
(33:52):
there's the sort of advisory departments and they sort of there,
they sat there for the rest of their careers.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
We should get to the bottom of it because good
to know why, because the motivation is interesting, isn't it Well,
but it is It's always happened, you know, Yes, Minister says,
this has always happened. But I think that what the
point Dominict Cummings has been making in the UK, the
Boris Johnson's former staff for the Brexit campaign manager, is
that actually it is lanyard class, that power is no
(34:22):
longer in the elected cabinets. It sits squarely with the
senior officials. And this would point will suggest that New
Zealand has the same problem and as a real test
for Sir Brian the Public Services Commissioner, whether he actually
can not just get to the bottom of it but.
Speaker 4 (34:41):
Reform the public service. So it is responsive to the
political will, not the other way around. It's serving the
elected leaders.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
Amazing how often in this game that you can and
even in the reporting of it that people will mentioned
episodes of yes Minister and yes Prime Minister, which sees didn't.
It was almost almost getting.
Speaker 4 (35:04):
It is getting. The level of dishonesty within the public service,
I would argue has got worse even than my twelve
years in this job.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
By the way, just on that Shane Jones travel budget blowout,
not on that, just on you know, things that happened
in Wellington. So the cabinet approved a total budget of
about thirty three thousand. The eventual bill was sixty three thousand.
It looks like it's a bit of a hit job
from National on New Zealand first as well. But god,
how much money.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
It's how much.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Money would they spend if you're going over there and
it was your money. I suspect it wouldn't be sixty
three grand, although I sort of you know, when I
heard Jane Jones talk about the difficulty of getting around
in the cold and Toronto, you know, well.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
We got our high family of four around Europe and
the UK for six weeks for.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Less than the sixty three grand. It's a lot of
money anyway. I mean, you'd be used to turning left
and traveling business, wouldn't you, Jordan.
Speaker 4 (35:59):
I mean, I had no problem with people flying business.
If it's on the coin, it's on the coin. You
think of the stick that Steven Joyce Scott for his
two and a half thousand dollars taxi ride. You know,
the taxi ticked all day in Sydney. So don't get
New Zealand politicians that get crowned cars anymore. I think
(36:20):
that the incredible thing about this is actually that the
full amount was ex post approved, despite it being twice
their proved budget. But I am not. I just want
to be clear. I'm not one of those people. And
actually I pointed this out to my staff. I actually
don't think it's fear to seeing politicians and premium economy
(36:40):
without the life flash on overnight flights. I think that
is a false economy. But me, it's that we don't
need stretch limos. We don't need suburbans for our politicians
while in North America. But I googled the company. It's
literally stretch limos sitting outside. Come on, I mean, and
this is such an own goal for Shane Jones budget.
Speaker 3 (37:03):
I mean, if you haven't approved budget and any out
the job, I mean you stick to it all.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
There's a process.
Speaker 2 (37:07):
Well, you have to pay it back.
Speaker 4 (37:08):
You increase it, Yeah, exactly, you pay back the difference.
And that's the thing that the nets, the nets which
presumably have leaked the story, it was the PEAMS office
that retrospectively approved it, right second thirty thousand or thirty.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
I guess did they have no choice but to approve it.
Speaker 4 (37:23):
I don't know, what is your employer have a choice? No,
you pay, No, you prove it.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
I don't understand Jordan as it's public money. Easy come, easy, come, easygo.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
Now you're trying to trigger that. I see what you're doing. Yeah,
I can see there's blood pressure rise out here. I mean,
poor old Shange joke, you've got form, You've got form
on this. I mean we literally named an awards ceremony
after him for a hotel hotel room remote mishap. And
you know that you think he would have learned the lesson,
But this is just this takes it to a whole
(37:55):
new level. And I have a lot of I like change.
I have a lot of sympathy for him. But this
is just come on, this is but.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
Is it as a little bit of a national and
music on the first hit job? I mean, there are
you know now that you've.
Speaker 4 (38:07):
Got to make a cock up in the first place
for it to be a hit job. Yeah, it's I
mean it's such an.
Speaker 2 (38:14):
You've got to make the cock cup in the first
place for it to be a hit job. Excellent work, Kyle,
That's why we get you here. Anyway. Hey, look we're
going to take a moment. We'll be back in just
a ticket. It's nine minutes to four. News Talk dB, Yes,
News Talk z B. Coming to the end of our
panel with car McDonald and Jordan Williams. Guys, just on
(38:39):
the sports side of thing. I woke up in the
middle of last night. I couldn't sleep, and normally I
sort of lie they're just, you know, worrying about all
the problems of the world. Instead, I actually switched on
the cricket of New Zealand, the black Caps versus England,
and actually really joyed about enjoyed about forty five minutes.
And I think it's just because I love I would
love it if we beat the Poms. You've you've been
(39:02):
enjoying the sports, you know, calendar at the moment, feef
for World Cup.
Speaker 4 (39:06):
I'm not a huge football fan.
Speaker 3 (39:08):
I actually haven't actually watched the game for starting to
finish yet, but I'm loving the cricket. I actually went
to Lord's but over the summer when we were in London,
which was pretty cool. Did the tour, which was so
it makes quite a difference when you've been to the
ground and then you're watching on on.
Speaker 4 (39:21):
The mate into Lord's and you loved to Steve abel
is a very big cricket fan.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
The Daily Telegraph, Telegraph you camrick and you've got written
all over you behind the scenes there, Kyle.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
Great to see Henry Nichols get a century, yes, fantastic
And I was was really disappointed about Williams and I
think good on him for making decision that weeks for him.
Speaker 4 (39:45):
But it is a real shame we.
Speaker 3 (39:46):
Don't get to say goodbye.
Speaker 2 (39:47):
God at the Oval. It's I mean, it's a gorgeous
looking arenas amazing and I don't know if the commentator
was joking, but it splashed up on three figures and
one of them was a musical theater composer called Richard
still Goo and lyricist and then goes on the guy
in the middle and it's almost like somebody said in
his and he goes, of course it's Mick Jagger and
it was like jacket Mick Jagger's apparently.
Speaker 4 (40:06):
But it's a huge cricket.
Speaker 3 (40:08):
Cricket, Yeah, he's remember at law it's actually yeah. And
of course the Suga rugby final tonight, Tim, Yes, it
is the chiefs.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Now we're talking.
Speaker 4 (40:16):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
It's a shame we don't broadcast this in a way,
although it's many good reasons. Why it's good we don't
is that you would have seen Jordan just glazed over
at the talk of sport there. But even to the
fief for World Cup, Jordan, you'll.
Speaker 4 (40:29):
Be watching the Well, I've got England and in the
sort of staff Paul, but I've also got Jordan, which
is highly unlikely to go anywhere. And you know the
third country I got that has ranked eighty second?
Speaker 2 (40:40):
What what?
Speaker 1 (40:40):
What?
Speaker 2 (40:41):
What is that? What?
Speaker 4 (40:44):
CRUSEO? Yeah, I didn't know they had a apparently.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
You thought that was what your coffee was so from Yeah.
Speaker 4 (40:50):
So I don't know when you're so we cheering England
for my stut, for my sweep steak with my team. Nice. Nice.
Speaker 3 (40:57):
Actually, you know what, I think this football world would
actually probably cope with the fact of England needs to
win it again.
Speaker 4 (41:02):
It's kind of like that.
Speaker 2 (41:03):
No they don't they.
Speaker 4 (41:04):
Yeah, football is coming home as if it's your cup.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
No it's not, it's not. I hope France all the way.
Speaker 4 (41:10):
France Frank's front, France Frank a pretty rough time. We've
got to give them something. I hopink Scotland might get
someone times up.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
Thank you, Carl and Jordan. We'll be back property next.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
For more from the Weekend Collective, listen live to news
Talks it'd be weekends from three pm, or follow the
podcast on iHeartRadio.
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