Full Show Podcast: 06 September 2026

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Weekend Sport Podcast with Jason Pine
from Newstalk ZB. The only place for the big names,
the big issues, the big controversies and the big conversations.
It's all on Weekend Sport with Jason Pine and the
Volkswagen Amarok V6 on Newstalk ZB, your home of sport.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Hi there, Kia ora, welcome in. This is Weekend Sport
on Newstalk ZB for Sunday, September the 6th, the Father's Day.
Happy Father's Day to my dad. Happy Father's Day to
Andy's dad. Happy Father's Day if you're a dad. Rugby's
greatest rivalry has produced another terrific test match.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
Final score, 29-24.

Speaker 4 (00:49):
The All Blacks can no longer win rugby's greatest rivalry.
2-1 down to the series in South Africa. Underline their
status as the.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
World's... 2-1 to South Africa, who win the three-match South
African-based segment of this series. Test four, of course, a
week today in Baltimore. All Blacks assistant coach Mike Blair
with us very shortly with his reflections. Elliot Smith and
Liam Napier. Bring us their evaluation this afternoon as well,
but plenty of time for your assessment. Lines open immediately

(01:21):
and all afternoon to get your thoughts across. In the
early game, the Black Ferns put 50 on their South
African counterparts. Head coach Whitney Hanson's going to review that
for us. Also this afternoon, the Warriors have completed their
best ever regular season in the NRL by the metric
of games won. The 31-30 victory over Manly yesterday, their

(01:43):
18th of the season. They've never had that many in
a single season. Assistant coach Rich Agar on the show
after two. And we'll get you to Monza, where Liam
Lawson's going to start from the back of the grid.
In Formula One's Italian Grand Prix, he copped a grid
penalty for the Red Bull team who changed the engine
ahead of the race at Monza. The invitation to join

(02:05):
the show is warmly extended to you. 0800 80 1080.
We'll get you through on the phones. 9292 for your
text messages. Jason at Newstalkzb.co.nz for your emails. Eight and
a half past midday.

Speaker 1 (02:19):
The scoreboard only tells half the story. Piney tells the rest.
Weekend Sport with Jason Fine and the Volkswagen Amarok V6.

Speaker 5 (02:27):
Uncompromised capability. Premium comfort. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yeah, that was the first try of the game in
Soweto this morning. The All Blacks, though, going down to
South Africa 29-24. Assistant coach Mike Blair is with us.
Thanks for your time, Mike. What was your overall assessment,

(02:52):
first of all, of the 80 minutes in Soweto?

Speaker 6 (02:57):
Yeah, we're obviously really disappointed with the results. we felt
in the first half we put a lot of our
game on the pitch we were able to move South
Africa around we scored a couple of great tries and
we felt we were going to bear fruit for the
work that we put in the first half unfortunately in
the second half we struggled to get any momentum in

(03:18):
the game for one reason or another I thought the
South Africans defended well and their set piece was excellent
as well and they were able to get their game
on the pitch so yeah we're frustrated we had some
Some excellent work. I think we had 12 line breaks,
which is a great start against this South African defence.
But it was the same story last week. We just

(03:40):
need to finish those opportunities.

Speaker 2 (03:42):
South Africa scored 17 unanswered points in 11 minutes in
the second half. What did you see happening during that period?

Speaker 6 (03:48):
I think they were just able to get their game going.
They got some penalty advantages through through their work in
the set piece. And, you know, they moved the ball
around a little bit in that period while they had
the advantage. But ultimately, yeah, they were more clinical with

(04:10):
the ball in that period and that put a little
bit of pressure on us.

Speaker 2 (04:13):
Is there anything that you can do better when a
side like South Africa gets a roll on like that?

Speaker 6 (04:19):
This is obviously something that we talk about. We're very
conscious that Against a team like South Africa, they're the
number one team in the world. And against them, you're
going to lose momentum at times. So we talk about
ways in which we can get back into the game. Unfortunately,
we stacked a couple of errors, whether that be in

(04:43):
the breakdown or a set piece. And that allowed them
to get their game going. And when they get momentum
and get on the front foot, they're a difficult team
to stop.

Speaker 2 (04:53):
When you see... inaccuracy like that. And as you say,
a couple of errors stacked on top of one another.
Is there anything you can do as a coaching staff
in game?

Speaker 6 (05:02):
We obviously send messages down about, you know, what the
guys are seeing and what's happening. But, you know, this
is a pressure environment. The guys are having to make
decisions every 10 seconds on, you know, options they can take.

(05:24):
defensive reads, setups for set-piece defence. The way that South
Africans play, they do drain you of energy in that way.
But we're also really confident in what we're trying to do.
We've got to just put our game together for longer.
I think you'll have seen in that first half about

(05:47):
when we can get momentum in our game. We're going
to put the best defence in the world, like South
Africa's under pressure.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
Oh, certainly. I mean, the start and the first 30 minutes,
the best of the year. Was starting well a specific
focus in this one?

Speaker 6 (06:04):
It was a real focus. We talk about South Africa
in the first 15 minutes and when they're fresh and
when they're trying to impose their physical game on us
and what's important for us. We won the toss and
we took the kickoff and thought, you know, there's a
great opportunity here to to start the game with a
bit of territory. But I think within about 15 seconds,

(06:25):
we were back in our own half again because we
conceded a penalty. But, you know, after that, we were excellent.
I thought the continuity in our game was good. And
as I say, we really bent the South African defence.
And I thought our attack was excellent. Just maybe one
pass off, you know, finishing things on a number of occasions. But,

(06:48):
you know, what we did put together was excellent.

Speaker 2 (06:51):
With ball in hand, Mike, how do you evaluate the
balance you're striking between optimism and pragmatism?

Speaker 6 (07:00):
Yeah, it's a great question. And we kicked the ball
20 times in the game, so they have to kick
the ball 19 times. Up until the 60th minute, we
were having really positive, statistically, our outcomes from our kicking
game was really strong. So probably subjectively watching the game,
you wouldn't think, We kick the ball more than South Africa,

(07:22):
but the balance in our game is really important. We've
also got to appreciate that when there are opportunities for us,
whether it's inside our 22 or not, we want to
be optimistic about taking those opportunities because sometimes kicking the
ball back to the opposition doesn't actually relieve pressure. And
having the ball in our hand to manipulate a defence

(07:43):
when we're numbers up, as a way of manipulating that pressure.
So it's just getting the balance right. When we kick,
we've got to kick well, but equally when we play
the ball from our own third, we need to do
that well.

Speaker 2 (07:58):
Well, no injuries are a fact of life, but was
there a degree of the team being a little bit
mentally affected by seeing their skipper, their inspirational skipper, depart
in the fashion that he did?

Speaker 3 (08:12):
I mean, no, you know, Ardy's exactly that, isn't he?
He is inspirational.

Speaker 6 (08:15):
I think his form over the last couple of months
has been absolutely unbelievable. He's led from the front in
the way he speaks, how he prepares and how he's played.
So it's really disappointing to lose him. And, you know,
we hope a speedy recovery for him. On the flip side,
I thought, while Satiti came in and I thought he

(08:36):
did a brilliant job when he came on. I thought
he got the ball a lot, made a couple of
great turnovers and it's great to see him playing with
that real energy as well.

Speaker 2 (08:46):
And you jump on a plane now for Baltimore. I
don't know, it just felt like this was the series decider.
I know it's not, Mike. I know there's one more
to go, but the third and final test on South
African soil. There must have been a lot of emotional
energy put into this one. Will there be enough gas
in the tank for another test seven days from now?

Speaker 6 (09:06):
There was definitely a huge amount of emotional energy put
into this game. You know, to win a To win
a series in the games in South Africa would have
been massive for us. But when you ask about will
we be able to get up for next week, 100%.
The series is on the line.

Speaker 3 (09:25):
So there's a.

Speaker 6 (09:26):
Huge amount on the game next week and we'll be
looking forward to preparing for that.

Speaker 7 (09:30):
All right.

Speaker 2 (09:30):
Travel safe, Mike. Thanks for your time this afternoon on ZB.
Mike Blair, assistant coach of the All Blacks there. 12-16,
lines open on the All Blacks.

Speaker 8 (09:37):
0-800-80-10-80.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
Anything you want to pick up on that you heard
there or anything you saw or heard in the game
this morning or in the time subsequent to that? Congratulations,
South Africa. They were the better team. World champions for
a reason. Today they showed why. When they get a
role on, as they did midway through the second half,
they are very, very hard to contain. Their scrum and
their maul functioned impeccably during that time, and the All

(10:01):
Blacks struggled to cope. The loss of Adi Savia can't
be over. He was having a whale of a test match.
Two tries, one of those inspirational follow-me performances that only
he can really produce. His injury and forced departure after
30 minutes and what the All Blacks lost in his
absence were major factors in this game. Wallace Atiti came on,

(10:22):
had his best test of the year, but Adi is Adi.
And him not being there was telling. The All Blacks
start a lot better today. They're best in the six
test matches this year. They were focused from the opening whistle,
showed intent and tempo, had the breakdown with vigour, secured
their own scrum and line out ball, scored the first try.
They actually could have had a second from a line
dropout by South Africa shortly afterwards if Tupufe had caught it.

(10:46):
He had a clear run to the line. First 35 minutes,
some of the best All Blacks minutes of the year.
But as we know, the game lasts 80 minutes. And
when you look back on that game, it is the
period after Will Jordan's try on 55 minutes that decides it.
The Springboks took it up a notch or two, in
fact more than that, and the All Blacks could not

(11:07):
live with them. It was a noticeable difference from the
first two test matches where the All Blacks had the
better of the last 25 minutes at both Ellis Park
and in Cape Town. Today it was South Africa who
won the back end of the game. In that period
between minutes 58 and 71... when they scored two converted
tries and kicked a penalty, that's series-defining. Now, there were

(11:30):
many pivotal things that happened in that period, a lot
of them of the All Blacks' own making, giving away penalties,
four of them, in a 12-minute period between the 61st
and 73rd minutes. Missed tackles, not being able to defend
a 25-metre rolling wall, some poor decision-making with ball in hand,

(11:52):
missing touch, with one of our own penalties. As Mike
Blair said then, these things all stack on top of
each other, and they allowed South Africa to take control
of the game. By contrast, the All Blacks just lacked
that cool-headed composure and a bit of cohesion in that period,
and that is where the game was won and lost.

(12:14):
If we fast forward a year, if this is a
World Cup knockout match, then the All Blacks are out.
Undone by a short but crucial period in the second half,
where they just couldn't contain the South African juggernaut and
did themselves no favours with some of their own discipline,
or in-discipline, and decision-making. But as with any test match,

(12:35):
and specifically tests between these two, we can acknowledge the
work on areas while also absolutely appreciating the positives. Are
the All Blacks a competitive test side?

Speaker 5 (12:45):
Of course.

Speaker 2 (12:46):
The first 30 minutes proved that. Is there still work
to do? Again, absolutely yes. They've lost back-to-back test matches,
and that's never acceptable for the All Blacks, regardless of
who the opposition is. Who's the better side right now
between these two? South Africa are. But can that gap
be closed before we play them, probably, in a World

(13:08):
Cup quarterfinal next year? Without question, that gap absolutely can
be closed. News Talk ZB, 0800 8010 80 is our number.
Pick up the phone. Have a yarn about the All Blacks. Hello, Nathaniel.

Speaker 9 (13:22):
Hello, Jason Pine.

Speaker 10 (13:23):
How are you today?

Speaker 2 (13:24):
Very good. Thank you, Nathaniel.

Speaker 9 (13:27):
So, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 10 (13:30):
I wasn't, yeah, I was a bit shocked that the
All Blacks, you know, lost again, you know, especially last
weekend game. But, you know, if.
You know, because the 15th is next weekend, and if
the All Blacks can bounce back after that loss, you know,

(13:50):
they'd be still in the World Cup. But, you know,
like you said, Jason Boyne, you know, Springboks is the
world champion in that, and Paul, this is in Serbia,
you know, he suffered an injury in and then we
saw hot Olympics, but, you know, I was, you know,

(14:12):
early Serbian, and we saw hot Olympics, you know, speed
of recovery, because, you know, it's a bit hard to
think about, you know, because, you know, every rugby team,
they suffer injuries, and it just, you know, they just.

Speaker 2 (14:36):
Yeah, look, Nathaniel, I agree. I think when Artie Savia
went off, much as they'll say it's next man up
and they'll, you know, and the leadership responsibility passes on
to others in that leadership group. When you lose a
guy like Artie, when you lose your spiritual leader, but
your actual leader as well, and the man who was
having an absolutely magnificent test match cut off at the

(14:56):
knees after 31 minutes, um, it is going to have
an effect, I think. You lose what he brings to
the field, but you also lose that greater leadership capability.

Speaker 3 (15:06):
That he has.

Speaker 2 (15:07):
Thanks for calling through, Nathaniel. Good to hear from you, mate.
Enjoy the rest of your day.

Speaker 11 (15:11):
Hello, Mark.

Speaker 7 (15:13):
Hey, Piney. Yeah, I mean, congratulations to the Springbok supporters.
I think it was a fair result, really. I think
they dominated the series, to be honest, with their forwards.
I mean, Rusty had the game plan that was obviously
very effective. We sort of knew what it was going
to be, and You know, you just have to be
impressed with their execution at the end of the day. Yeah,

(15:34):
I mean, we've got a lot of improvement to do.
We've blooded a lot of players. I thought Adi Saveria
has really grown as All Black captain during this tour. And,
you know, this last couple of games, unfortunately, went off. But,
you know, he's going to be our main man going
into the World Cup next year. And, yeah, I just
think he's sort of hit his stride. So that's good.
Hopefully his injury is not too serious. But, yeah, we've

(15:57):
got a lot of work on us to do, really,
in the forwards. I mean, I think our backs are,
you know, firing pretty well. We might have had a
couple of defensive lapses today, but, I mean, getting run
over by Jesse Creel is probably, yeah, you know, it
happens quite a bit probably. But, yeah, I think our forwards,

(16:17):
we know we've got to get better to compete. Otherwise,
we will get blown away in the World Cup. Yeah,
that's my assessment of it. That's my blunt assessment of it.
We've just got to get better. And I think they've
set the yardstick. We know what they've got. We know
how they're going to play, what they're going to do.
We just have to get better and find a way

(16:40):
to be better, I guess. And we have got players
to come back.

Speaker 2 (16:43):
Yeah, and thankfully, Mark, we've got the time as well.
It's September of 2026. We've got a year. This team
has had six test matches together under Dave Rennie. You
look at South Africa, they've been together under Rassi for, what,
eight years. So there is time. Not as much runway,
I'm sure, as Dave Rennie would like, but the circumstances

(17:04):
are what they are. I think, you know, they have
shown in the last three test matches that that they
are closing that gap. The gap isn't as big as
perhaps a lot of people thought it was when they
landed in South Africa.

Speaker 7 (17:20):
Yeah, and I think this has been a great test
to see where we're at against the best team in
the world. And they're undisputed. I think they're probably... I
think New Zealand and South Africa are probably quite a
way in front of third. I mean, I know people
like to talk about France and England, and, you know,
probably their full pack might be even better than ours, but...

(17:40):
I just think it's been a great learning experience. I won't,
I won't use that in the vernacular that you hate,
but I think there's a lot of lessons we can.

Speaker 12 (17:50):
Take, take out of it.

Speaker 7 (17:51):
And, and yeah, I mean, I guess the last game
is a bit of a dead rubber in my opinion,
but it's a chance for the, for the All Blacks
to experiment. I mean, I'd like to see Richie Mwanga.
I think Richie's going to play an important part in
the next World Cup. I'd also like to see Bowden
Barrett get a run. Um, I'd like to see Rico
get back in the game. I think Tupai is injured,

(18:12):
so he'll be back in the game. Yeah, I just
think there's a lot of players who probably will play
in the next week game. It'll be interesting to see
how they go.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
Yeah, indeed, Mark. Good summary as always, mate. No Tapia,
no Sarvia, and no Jacobson. Those three are definitely not
going to Baltimore. So there'll be injury-enforced changes, three of them,
in the starting 15. And I think you're right, Mark.
I think there'll be other changes as well. We can
talk about that a bit later on. In fact, I'm

(18:44):
going to get Elliot Smith and Liam Napier on after
1 o'clock and get their view. But you might have
a view as well. 0800 80 1080 1225. Full board
at the moment, as usual, after an all-blacks test. But
if you would like to try your luck, 0800 80 1080.
Back in a moment. Yeah, that was, I guess, the

(19:19):
turning point, really, after that try by Will Jordan. That's
when South Africa put their foot down and moved away
from the All Blacks and won the Test match. More
on that across the afternoon. A questionnaire about who's going
to captain the side without Artie Savia and Luke Jacobson
next week. In the leadership group, Cody Taylor, Cam Roygard,
Geordie Barrett and Will Jordan. the other members of the

(19:39):
leadership group. So I guess Cody Taylor would be the
obvious captain next week, but that's provided he plays from
the start. I'd quite like to see Asafo-Wamua get another start.
I thought he was good in the starting role this morning.
So then maybe you're looking at a guy who's never
capped in the All Blacks in Test matches. Cam Roygard,
Geordie Barrett, Will Jordan, perhaps it'll all come down to
who takes the field. Of course. Hello, Carlos.

Speaker 9 (20:02):
Good afternoon, Piney.

Speaker 11 (20:04):
The probably best thing that sums it up for me,
in the words of bloody Barry Crump and his dog,
is bugger. Anyway, out of that, for me, came some
real positives.

Speaker 3 (20:15):
Um.

Speaker 11 (20:16):
We've come such a long way this year with the
depth injected into the squad and team, you know. And
I think we're definitely going forward, in my mind, so
really looking so positive for next year. Now, you know,
we won next year's World Cup for two major reasons,
as far as I'm concerned. It's a no-brainer. And it's

(20:39):
a reflection or a mirror image of 31 years ago.
We lost the World Cup at 95 against them. The
following year, we win the first test series, securing it
with a 33-26 win in the second test. This year,
the Vox win 33-26 in the second test this year.
So for me, win the series because it's over there.

(21:00):
So therefore, we win the bloody World Cup next year.

Speaker 2 (21:05):
I like the arithmetic gymnastics you've got going on there, Carlos.
I can see where you're getting to with it, though.

Speaker 13 (21:11):
Yeah, but look, honestly, I mean, I think what Mr
Rene's created or creating, it looks really positive in my
mind anyway. And the depth that's been created in this
year has been quite incredible considering that he's only just
taken the blooming job on and had chucked in at
the deep end, so to speak. But as far as

(21:32):
I'm concerned, he's come up swimming.

Speaker 2 (21:34):
Yeah, I mean, extrapolate it out. You're dead, right, Carlos?
If you extrapolate it out so... I mean, he's made
this progress in the space of, what, six test matches, basically.
You know, if it had the full four years, I
guess you can double it and say, OK, well, if
we were this far ahead after 12 test matches, would

(21:54):
we be happy? And I think the answer is yes,
we would. So he's accelerated their improvement by necessity more
than anything else. And look, you're right. I don't think
there's no doom and gloom here. Yes, there's disappointment. We've
lost a test series in South Africa. Let's call it
what it is. Next week is a fourth test that's
been bolted on. We've lost a test series in South Africa,

(22:15):
missed the chance to emulate that team you talked about
from 1996. But there are green shoots of progress here,
a lot of them, and reasons to be positive moving
forward for sure.

Speaker 11 (22:28):
Yeah, absolutely right. Yeah, I totally agree. And it's just
quite incredible what he's done, considering it's not like you're playing, sorry, but,
you know, any other test nation. You're playing South Africa
in South Africa. He's just taken the blimmin' pill on,
and he's run with it, and look what he's produced.

(22:48):
And he operates under pressure, obviously. And to me, the
guys are doing that now. They're starting to believe in
themselves again.

Speaker 2 (22:58):
Thanks, Carlos. Always good to hear from you, mate. 0800
8010 80 is our number. It's not rocket science, says Anthony.
Our tackling was abysmal and they're not called springboks for nothing.
A springbok can often evade an attack from a predator.
As an ex-South African and an all-black supporter of 28
years in this beautiful country, says Anthony, it's a good

(23:19):
time to have a loss and to learn some tricks
for the next World Cup. I think they missed as
many tackles as us. I'm going to check those stats.
I know our line breaks were superior to theirs, Anthony.
I do like your Springbrock predator analogy, though. Hello, Mike.

Speaker 14 (23:36):
G'day, Troy.

Speaker 7 (23:37):
How are you?

Speaker 2 (23:38):
Mike, I'm great, thanks. Good to hear from you.

Speaker 14 (23:41):
Hey, I just wonder whether we haven't got a bit
advanced on ourselves with respect to our new selector coach.

Speaker 4 (23:51):
Um.

Speaker 14 (23:52):
I was one of the many who was fully in
support of Dave's allocation to the point of all that
coach before he got the job. But I was a
bit worried about some of the selection process. Just recently
he made a change and he pushed Josh Morby out

(24:13):
of the second test team after his pretty good game,
I thought, and put Leroy Carter in. And he told
us that that was based on the fact that Leroy
was a proven sevens player and he has a nickname
amongst the other players of being a bit of a
rugged little individual and that he would take care of

(24:35):
defensive situations. Well, from my mind watching the game, the
South Africans' first try came about when the runner before
the try scorer ran straight past Leroy and passed the
ball that led to the try. And then right at
the end of the game, with South African's last try,

(24:58):
the try scorer brushed straight past Leroy and ran on
the try. So I don't think his estimation of Leroy's
capabilities was really that good at all.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
No, not based on the evidence of today, Mike. You're right.
Leroy Carter is usually a very good defender, but he
missed tackles on both Damien D'Alende in the first half
and Jesse Creel in the second. That led to South
African tries, you're right. And you talk about Josh Morby
being left out after his first test start, and Dave
Rennie basically went on the record and said, we think

(25:31):
Leroy Carter is a better defender than Josh Morby. So, look,
and he did, sorry, just one more point on that.
Dave Rennie addressed that in the media conference afterwards and said, yeah,
that Leroy Carter will be feeling down about it. And
of course you will be. You missed tackles in the...
white-hot atmosphere of a test match, and they cost tries,
and you are going to examine it. So, yeah, no,

(25:55):
he won't be happy with those missed tackles at all.

Speaker 14 (25:57):
You know, your caller before the last guy, Carlos, the
one before him, identified wanting to see or looking forward
to seeing a chance of there being a Richie Moanga
and someone else and Rico Gear, Rico....

Speaker 9 (26:14):
Ioane?

Speaker 11 (26:15):
Ioane.

Speaker 12 (26:15):
Ioane.

Speaker 14 (26:17):
Getting a run on the test side, well, a couple
of games ago, we were falling behind in a game
against the Transvaal, and Rico Ioane came into the paddock,
and he stripped the ball off of South African and
ran in a lovely try, and then he intercepted it
almost a minute or two later and ran in another one,

(26:38):
which turned the game around. Now, on that performance, I
would have thought he'd be in there because he certainly
wouldn't drop some of those tackles up on opposing guys
of his own size and ability. He's a strong defender.

Speaker 2 (26:55):
Mike, I think you might see Rico Ioane in the
team next week. I think he'll be one who's well
and truly in contention to come in. I think there'll
probably be a number of changes, both injury and force.
We know about those. But also selection-wise, guys who haven't
featured at all or not much in the three tests

(27:15):
in South Africa, I think you'll find in the 23.
It's not a free hit necessarily, but it feels like,
and just listening to Mike Blair before, there was so
much emotion wrapped around this test and these three tests.
This feels like a three-test series with almost an add-on,
a bolt-on at the end of it. I think most

(27:36):
All Blacks and South African fans would be reasonably content
if the series was finished now. We'll all watch next week.
Of course we will. But it'll be a very, very
different atmosphere and quite a different challenge for both sets
of players and coaching staff to negotiate than these three
test matches. We've had three brilliant tests in South Africa.

(28:01):
I'm just not sure about the dynamic of the fourth
one with both teams hopping on a plane together and
flying to neutral territory where rugby is really only just
a bit of a novelty, a... You know, something that
the good folk of the United States look on and
sort of wonder what it's all about. South Africa know

(28:22):
they've won the series. The All Blacks know they've lost
the series. Yes, there's another test next week. Yes, there's
a trophy which still hasn't been handed out. But I
said yesterday, you know, this is a three-test series. And
I can't say that yesterday and change my mind today
just because the All Blacks lost, and I'm not going to.
South Africa won the Test Series in South Africa 2-1.

(28:43):
Thanks for calling, Mike. Hello, John.

Speaker 9 (28:46):
Yeah, one thing that we probably missed out on, two
conversions and a penalty that didn't go over.

Speaker 11 (28:53):
All their kicks did.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
Yep, seven points left out there by Ruben Love in
a tight game. John, you're right to bring that up.

Speaker 9 (29:03):
You know, it would have been two points ahead at
the end.

Speaker 4 (29:06):
Of the game.

Speaker 2 (29:08):
It's interesting because it's an outlier as far as Ruben
Love's season is concerned. I had a quick check on
this because I thought this doesn't feel like it's something
that is happening often. Before today, he'd kicked 29 of
his 34 shots at goal. That's 85%. So one out
of four today is an outlier. But he was wayward,

(29:28):
and in tight games, you need to kick your goals.
Absolutely right, John.

Speaker 7 (29:32):
Yep, just thought I'd pass that comment on.

Speaker 2 (29:34):
Good on you for doing so. I appreciate it, John.
Thanks for calling through. 0800 80 1080, 21 away from one.
We'll take a break, come back after this. Kevin, with
you when we get back. Lines are open on 0800 80 1080.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Sport doesn't stop at the full-time whistle weekend sport with
jason pine and the volkswagen amarok v6 uncompromised capability premium
comfort call.

Speaker 2 (29:55):
0800 80 1080 news talk zb.

Speaker 3 (29:59):
18-1.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
Bruce on text. I don't think the length of time
Rennie's had with the All Blacks compared to Rassi with
the box has anything to do with the All Blacks'
future or the World Cup. I want to visit the
elephant in the room, says Bruce. The box size and
stature compared to the All Blacks is a massive difference.
They are huge, says Bruce. And he's used capital letters
to emphasise the point. And I think too big a

(30:21):
gap to make up before the World Cup. I'm a
massive All Blacks fan and hate to lose to the box,
but in a respectful manner. We've got work to do
and maybe dietary plans to look into. Yeah, look, I mean, yes,
they are bigger. And I've had a couple of texts
to this point as well. So what do we do?
Just pick the biggest guys.

Speaker 15 (30:42):
Or.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
Do you actually go deeper than that and say, well,
there's a guy like, I'll use Peter Larkeye, for example.
He's not as big as Simon Parker, but brings a
different skill set and ability to bend and break the line.
Size is important. Absolutely it is. And Dave Rennie's acknowledged
that by his selections. Luke Jacobson at seven is the
perfect example of that. There are a lot smaller sevens around,

(31:06):
but he's gone with Jacobson. And I think for the
most part, he's got the selection right. But yes, size
is important. Not the be-all and end-all, but important nonetheless. Thanks, Bruce. Hi, Kevin.

Speaker 12 (31:18):
Yeah, how are you?

Speaker 2 (31:19):
Good, thank you.

Speaker 12 (31:22):
Now, constructive criticism of the all-black coach. I can't understand
how he hasn't put into the side that you never
turn down three points. If you can kick them, you
take them. And, you know, I played for 35 years

(31:42):
as a lock and a prop, later years as a prop. So,
you know, and the discipline is just not there in
the side. There are guys that have gone on that
tour that shouldn't have gone. There should have been younger
guys put in there and get them ready for, yeah,
over the next three or four years. I mean, you

(32:04):
can't pick guys like our number 11, You can't pick
him when he's played against Wales and he's had a
good game. You can't say that he's an All Black
anymore because you've got to have guys that are picked
on ability against teams that are at your level or above.

(32:26):
And that's the way the All Blacks need to be
picking the side. And I'll finish on this. Our halfback
needs to be told, and I don't know why the
All Black squad haven't done this, the training group, that
you cannot, when you put the ball in the scrum,
when you get around to the back at the number eight,

(32:47):
you've got to know which way you're swinging the ball,
not pick up the ball and then look both ways.
And that's the only fault he's got. But he needs
to get that sorted out because you get rumbled.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
Kevin, can I just ask you, I'll just pick up
on a couple of your points there, well made. The
turning down of the three points, presumably you feel the
same way about every coach in the world then, because,
I mean, South Africa turned down shots at goal this morning.
Every team I've seen kicks for the corner, you know,
in kickable positions. So I don't know whether it's a
specific criticism you can aim just at Dave Rooney.

Speaker 16 (33:21):
Is it?

Speaker 12 (33:22):
Well, you know, it's not just him, but I mean, surely...
You don't want to give... Like, when you get three points,
back in my day, when you get three points on
the board against the opposition, it really lowers the morale
of the opposition when you keep putting on points on them.

(33:45):
And that's understandable. Because, you know, when it happened the
other way around, we know what it feels like. But,
for God's sake, but even at provincial level today, you know,
you watch it and they... They'll go for the line-out
rather than kick the points, which is just crazy stuff.

(34:05):
It's just madness.

Speaker 2 (34:06):
Yeah, scoreboard pressure, they call it, don't they, Kevin? Thanks, mate. Yeah, look, and,
you know, you're right. You can win games and you
can increase your score in threes. Look, this morning's test
match was a five-point difference. You know, across the three
test matches, there's only five points between the two sides.
The All Blacks have actually scored more points. 83 to

(34:27):
South Africa's 78. So yeah, the odd three points here
and there, absolutely worth looking at. I'm not sure about
your comment on Leroy Carter. I think the way you
increase somebody's experience is by playing them in big test
matches like the last two. Leroy Carter was the best
guy out there last week. In the eyes of most people,
he was the All Blacks man of the match last week.

(34:49):
He had a difficult time of things today. You build experience.
He missed a couple of tackles. He'll reflect on that.
Dave Rennie will talk to him about that. and then
we move. Thanks for your call, though, Kevin. Hello, James.

Speaker 13 (35:03):
Yeah, hi.

Speaker 9 (35:04):
Yeah, just in terms of the rugby test, obviously, you know,
obviously Dave Rennie has been switching players around, and you
can tell that he's seeing some of these, and it's
quite a young team, and you can tell he's just
testing to see if they can get used to this
big atmosphere in terms of what's required in the World Cup.

(35:25):
But either way, I mean, losing a test is not great.
And some of the guys who made mistakes out there
quite young. It's still a youthful team. Like you said,
it's in the infancy. And, you know, they'll learn from that.
I mean, South Africa, when you look at their team,
I mean, those guys have now been around for like
two cycles. And those guys used to lose games against
the Matanonus and Conway Smith teams and Richie McCaw before

(35:46):
they matured like the Lendys and the... and the Creoles
and all of them won the World Cup rugby game
finals twice. So this team will take at least five,
eight years to mature, then they'll become right. But it's
just that they're young and they make mistakes. We've never
had a problem with players. It depends on if you

(36:09):
pick the wrong players on the wrong day or if
they don't perform on the day. That's basically it. That's
why I read Leo Ricciardo. You can have a good
game last week, but you stuff up today. That's the thing.
In test matches, it's cutthroat. You just can't make any
missed tackles. You put him in the game next week
and he might score three tries and make all his tackles.

(36:30):
It's just the way it goes.

Speaker 2 (36:33):
Indeed. You look back to 2017. The All Blacks beat
South Africa 57-0 that year. 57-0 at Albany. Two years later,
who's lifting the World Cup? South Africa, right?

Speaker 9 (36:43):
And if you look at that team who lost 57-0,
it was the Seahawks, it was the Estabeth, and they
were juniors to the Retallics and Whitelocks, and we had
an awesome team back then. So they took two soccers
to lose before they started winning World Cups. So we'll
do the same as well.

Speaker 2 (37:01):
Good man, James. Thanks for calling through, mate. Like your
enthusiasm and your analysis. 0800 8010 80's our number. Tristan, hi.

Speaker 10 (37:07):
How you going there, Pony?

Speaker 2 (37:09):
Very good, thanks, mate.

Speaker 17 (37:11):
Yeah, one thing for sure, like I always say, a
week's a long time in rugby, or what have you.
Last week, Leroy Carter was probably one of the best
players on the park for the All Blacks. And then
this week, you know, you only have to look at
a few social media posts and whatnot, and a number
of people were blaming him for the loss, but You've
got to remember, you know, Morby missed a tackle in

(37:33):
the first game. Like, everyone misses tackles. And sure, yeah,
they probably were crucial at the end of the day,
but there's a number of factors that, you know, contributed
to that loss, not just two tackles. For a start,
you know, our scrum. You know, we're obviously struggling in
the scrum there. We get penalised, particularly when the spring
box gets.

Speaker 3 (37:52):
A put in.

Speaker 17 (37:53):
So there's obviously issues there in the front row, whether
it's technically or the front row itself. And then obviously
there's a few other critical moments. I think we can't
downplay the fact that Artie Sevier coming off the field,
I think that was quite a contributing factor. I find
his leadership, and at that time he was everywhere. He

(38:15):
scored two tries and we were on the front foot.
I felt when he went off the field, no disrespect
to Luke Jacobson or anything, but You know, he's one
of our most influential players on that side, without a doubt,
with Artie Sevier and him going off. I just noticed
there was just a drop in the way we were
playing a little bit, and the leadership, and even when

(38:38):
Reuben Love went for that penalty goal, I sort of
wondered whether, you know, if Artie was on the field,
we may have went for the corner. Perhaps it might
have been the right decision. In fact, the kick was
a wee way out, and Reuben Love hasn't exactly been
I think he'd missed a couple of conversions at that
point or whatever. Yeah, there's just a few things there,

(38:59):
I thought, that sort of let us down.

Speaker 7 (39:02):
We've got to remember South Africa, they're the best.

Speaker 17 (39:05):
Team in the world, they're double world champs, and we
only lost by five points at the end of the day.
Last week, we could have drew the game, we won
the first game. Not too far away, there's just a
few critical moments there that just making the difference at
the end of the day, and you can't put a
price on experience, and that Springbok team's obviously very, you know,

(39:26):
experienced in that whole squad, isn't it?

Speaker 2 (39:29):
Absolutely. Good man, Tristan. Look, the key moment for me
was when the the All Blacks scored, Will Jordan scored
a try. Then Jesse Creel bumps off Leroy Carter and
South Africa score their 19-17 ahead. And then a short
time after that, South Africa knock the ball on. There's

(39:49):
an All Blacks scrum. It's a good scrum. It gets
spun wide and Will Jordan kicks it long. He kicks
it dead from inside his own half. Look, the bounce
of the rugby ball. It could have taken it infield,
into touch. Instead, it goes end over end, goes dead.
So they come all the way back for the scrum.
South Africa win a scrum penalty. They kick for the line.

(40:10):
They secure the ball and put together a 25-meter rolling
wall to score and go up 26-17. That is the
key moment in the game. Will Jordan kicking the ball dead.
As Dave Rennie said afterwards, it's a good decision. And
from 65 metres out, how often would the ball not
go dead? I'd say it would go dead, what, maybe

(40:31):
one out of four times? And yet, here we are.
It turned out to be a turning point in the game.
Small margins, but not that far away. Thanks, Tristan. 7-1,
Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 5 (40:42):
When there's a line call, it's your call.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
Weekend Sport with Jason Fine, Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
It's extra here just to finish this hour. We do
not scrum or draw play the power game at any
level in New Zealand. This goes back to first 15
MPC and super. We play a beautiful hybrid game of
running that falls over when we get to the under
20 World Cup and carries on from there. We have
to get all the coaches and teams across New Zealand
to adapt the way we play to the way South

(41:10):
Africa and the North play because we cannot beat it.
We have to join it. We must adapt or be
happy with second place. Thank you very much for your text.
Thanks for all your texts. We're going to have our
news at one and then on we'll go. Elliot Smith
and Liam Napier are going to join us after one o'clock.
They have been with the All Blacks right throughout this tour,

(41:32):
so they'll give us their analysis. We'll also get inside
the Black Ferns camp next hour too. They put 50
on South Africa. Their coach, Whitney Hanson, on the show.

Speaker 1 (41:40):
The only place to discuss the biggest sports issues.

Speaker 5 (41:43):
On and off the field.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
It's all on Weekend Sport with Jason Pine and the
Volkswagen Amarok V6.

Speaker 5 (41:52):
On Newstalk ZB, your home of sport.

Speaker 2 (41:56):
107, this is Weekend Sport on Newstalk ZB. Andy McDonald
is running the cutter. I'm Jason Pine. We're here till three.
Email from Cobus, good friend of the show. Hi, Piney.
Today's game confirmed a couple of things. Number one, the
Springboks are number one. Number two, you know nothing about rugby.

(42:16):
That's all. My condolences. Love it. Love it, Cobus. Good
to have you with us, mate. And I'm sure you
enjoyed that this morning. Let's see what happens next week.
Your calls and correspondence are welcome. 0800 80 1080 9292
for your text messages or flick us an email. As
the great Cobus has done. to jason at newstalkzb.co.nz.

Speaker 4 (42:41):
Right running ball libock has numbers creel creel jesse creel
away from leroy carter jesse creel will respond straight away
for south.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
Africa Yeah, that was the try that took South Africa
into a 1917 lead, a lead they never relinquished. South
Africa 29, All Blacks 24. To continue our analysis, let's
bring in the co-hosts of the Rugby Direct podcast, Newstalk
ZB rugby editor and our match commentator, Elliot Smith, and
senior rugby writer with the New Zealand Herald, Liam Napier.

(43:14):
Thanks for staying up late for us, guys.

Speaker 18 (43:16):
Elliot.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
It was 17-12 to the All Blacks when Will Jordan scored.
15 minutes later, it's 29-17 to South Africa. What did
you see happen in that period?

Speaker 4 (43:29):
What I saw happen was the All Blacks not take
advantage of the momentum they had in that game and
the goalie.

Speaker 3 (43:36):
Had tried it.

Speaker 4 (43:37):
Will Jordan scored to put them up by five points.
They missed the conversion. They head back downfield. They don't
take the restart correctly. and South Africa score from it,
and they get their noses in front. And I feel,
you know, this series has been a game of a
series of momentum swings. When one team has it, they're very,
very hard to stop. And look what happened in the
first test when the All Blacks snatched it. Look what

(43:58):
happened in the second test when South Africa managed to
take hold of it. Well, tonight, South Africa... As soon
as they got their noses in front, refused to relent.
And it was that moment, or those key moments, that again,
I think, decided the test match for South Africa and
consigned New Zealand to defeat.

Speaker 2 (44:16):
Liam, was there anything the All Blacks could have done
differently to stymie South Africa's momentum?

Speaker 19 (44:22):
Well, you could fix the scrum, but it's not an
easy fix.

Speaker 20 (44:27):
And I think that's where a lot of South Africa's
dominance came from, and particularly in that second half.

Speaker 19 (44:34):
And that one massive mall try.

Speaker 20 (44:35):
When they get a roll on South Africa, when they
get their power game, they're incredibly difficult to stop. So
as Elliot mentioned, you've got to take your chances when
you have that momentum. And the All Blacks, I thought
in that first half, they were quite dominant.

Speaker 19 (44:52):
They had ruck speed.

Speaker 20 (44:52):
They had some great ball carries from Asafa Amor and
Peter Lakai. But they probably didn't take as many chances
as they would have liked. Didn't capitalise on that early
yellow cards. Should have been up by more at halftime. And, yeah,
then the momentum switched in the second half and they
couldn't wrestle it back.

Speaker 2 (45:12):
Elliot, how big an impact did Adi Sarvia's departure from
the game have?

Speaker 4 (45:17):
I think it was a turning point in the game,
in all honesty, Piney. He was playing some incredible rugby
to that point, scored both of the All Blacks tries
and was on track for a captain's knock. And the
kind of rugby that he was playing in the opening
half hour, he was strong. With the carry, he was
hitting rucks. He was really everywhere around the park. And
when he went off, the All Blacks just looked a

(45:40):
little lost. They didn't really regain the kind of ascendancy
that they had, even though they did go back in
front later on in the game after halftime. It felt
like they weren't quite able to play the way they
had been in that opening half hour. And there were
a variety of reasons there. for that, and South Africa
certainly played some better rugby after that point, but I
think you have to mark it down as a major

(46:02):
turning point in the game. And look, it didn't look
good for Adi Sarvia, and the fact he went off,
they just lacked a little bit of leadership, I think,
out there. Luke Jacobson took on the captaincy for the
rest of the test match, but they weren't able to
play the kind of rugby that Adi Sarvia had them
playing in the opening 30 minutes.

Speaker 2 (46:23):
Ruben Love missed three shots at goal, which would have
given the All Blacks another seven points. Liam, does that
need further examination in such a tight test match, or
did he just have an off day off the tee?

Speaker 19 (46:35):
I think he'll be disappointed, Piney.

Speaker 20 (46:38):
He came into this series kicking exceptionally well, and I
don't think we've seen the best of him off the tee.

Speaker 19 (46:45):
It was difficult conditions in Soweto.

Speaker 20 (46:46):
There was a lot of wind, but that didn't really
affect the spring box, so Look, in the context of
how the game finished up, it did have a big impact,
but there were other factors in the defeat as well.
I thought the margin of defeat probably didn't reflect the
nature of the second half. The box were pretty dominant

(47:08):
on the whole, and it was a sort of late
consolation try that closed the margin of defeat. So I
didn't think it was Ruben Love's best test. I'm a
big advocate of his, but I thought he was a
bit A bit rattled early, he had some moments, but
after three starts at 10, I wouldn't be surprised if
the All Blacks, while I expect them to make some

(47:29):
big changes next week, given the injuries, given the toll
of the series, but I think there could be one
coming at 10 as well.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
All right, want to come to the changes in a moment,
but Elliot, the All Blacks wanted to bring fatigue into
the game. They talked about how playing at altitude might
actually be in their favour. Were they the ones, though,
the All Blacks, who were a bit gassed in the
second half?

Speaker 4 (47:49):
Yeah, I think there's certainly an argument for that, and
we've been used to them finishing strongly in this series,
the way that they've been able to out-muscle South Africa.
But it felt like South Africa had done some things
right to be able to conserve maybe a little bit
of energy. I think they used their bench a lot
smarter this week as well, South Africa. So the All

(48:12):
Blacks just weren't able to get on top as much
as they would have liked, and you know, that momentum
swing we talked about earlier when, you know, South Africa
went in front, you know, they sort of got their
tails up a little bit and, you know, it would
have been easy for them, not easy necessarily, but, you know,
17-12 down. If the All Blacks score next, then there's
a long way back to South Africa. But they scored

(48:32):
quickly after that and they get the energy and the
ascendancy heading into the final 20 minutes that the All
Blacks were certainly wanting themselves. So I think it was
a game of, you know, fine margins and small moments where,
you know, it was a turnover here or there. But ultimately,
the All Blacks just weren't able to capitalise on, you know,
the big moments that they did have during that game. And, yeah,

(48:54):
maybe in the last 20 minutes, they perhaps looked a
little bit gassed, you know, compared to the South Africans
who looked a lot fresher and, as I said, made
some smarter tactical substitutions than they have in the previous
two tests.

Speaker 2 (49:06):
In your analysis piece, Liam, you wrote two and a
half months into Dave Rennie's tenure. progress is clearly evident,
but so too is more evolution required. Where are the
major improvements needed?

Speaker 20 (49:19):
Well, I think when you look at, the box is
such a unique proposition, aren't they, finally, in terms of
how they play the game this was a classic clash
of styles throughout the series the box using their set
piece their power game their kicking so I think the
vulnerabilities for the All Blacks are under the high ball
I think that's been pretty consistent and Discipline remains a

(49:42):
major issue. I think the penalty count was only 12-11,
but some of those penalties, just at such crucial times.

Speaker 19 (49:49):
That's gifted the box field position.

Speaker 20 (49:51):
When the box had their early yellow card, the All
Blacks conceded four straight penalties, and so basically rendered the
one-man advantage irrelevant. So I think that's one area. Confirming opportunities, look,
the All Blacks are creating so much. They had 12
line breaks to five, but some of their finishing at
times isn't quite where it wants to be.

Speaker 19 (50:14):
But, yeah, look, there is still a lot of positives.

Speaker 20 (50:17):
Two and a half months isn't a long time, and
I think Dave Rooney's done a lot with this team.
Coming over here, facing the world champions, back-to-back world champions
on home soil was always going to be a massive task,
so we do have to reflect on that. But having
won the first test at Ellis Park, to lose the
next two, they'll be hugely disappointed at this point.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
All right, let's finish by looking ahead to Baltimore and
any changes that might be expected. A question for both
of you, maybe start with you, Elliot. What sort of
changes do you expect on top of the ones which
will be injury enforced for the All Blacks?

Speaker 4 (50:52):
Yeah, look, I'm with Liam. I think perhaps a chance
next week to have a look at Another player at 10,
Richie Mwonga seems like the likely candidate there. Leroy Carter
fell off a couple of tackles today. Wouldn't surprise me
to see maybe the All Blacks look to bring in
a power winger next week. Now, at this point, we
also don't know who is travelling and who isn't because

(51:15):
some players are going to head home. But I think,
you know, I'd like to see Asafa Omua start again.
I thought he was really, really good. The line-out was
much better than last week. Um, for, for most of
the game, uh, it wasn't perfect, but it was, um,
considerably improved. So I'd like to see him get another start. And, um,
so look, some, some, some minor tweaks, I think to

(51:35):
this all blacks team. Um, they still haven't said on
a blind side flanker, uh, Peter like I was, was
solid today, perhaps without being spectacular. So, um, a lot
to mull over for Dave Rennie and, um, as they
take this big flight to Baltimore or Washington, D.C. Not
much time because they flew out midnight South African time,

(51:57):
so a lot to ponder on the plane over.

Speaker 20 (51:59):
I'd like to see guys like Amani Naraoa get a chance.
I think he impressed me on this tour. There's a
bit of context around performing in a midweek match compared
to a a test game, but I like what he
brings in terms of size and silky skills in the
back three. I think he could be good under the
high ball as well. Ethan de Groot and Josh Lord

(52:20):
will come back into the picture after effectively missing two
tests with HIAs. Maybe Rika Awani comes into the picture.
They'll need another midfielder there as well. Cam Roygard's played
a lot at halfback. I thought he was really good tonight. So, yeah, Yeah,
I think there'll be quite a few changes. You can't
underestimate how much three tests out of both teams.

Speaker 19 (52:44):
And the Springboks have been open.

Speaker 20 (52:45):
It's been interesting to see the lack of rotation from
Russia Rasmus. They've effectively treated this as a World Cup
run of knockout games, quarter semi-final. They've basically played the
same team the last two weeks, only made changes because
of injuries.

Speaker 19 (53:03):
And so I expect them to make quite a few
tweaks as well.

Speaker 2 (53:06):
Appreciate you both staying up for us late, and appreciate
you bringing the rugby direct aura to weekend sport. Thanks
for your time.

Speaker 19 (53:16):
Any time, Barney.

Speaker 3 (53:17):
Thanks for the offer, Barney. Appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (53:18):
No, thank you both for joining us. Elliot Smith and
Liam Napier, live from Johannesburg, where it's getting very late
over there. They're still working away, those two. You can
read Liam at nzherald.co.nz. Elliot Smith, of course. You'll know
well his voice on our commentary. And they do have
a podcast, as I mentioned, Rugby Direct, very popular, one
of Newstalk ZB's most popular podcasts. So subscribe to that

(53:41):
and get the benefit of their wisdom. Lines are back
open on 0800 80 10 80. Over the last three weeks,
I feel like we've seen the very best of Test Rugby.
Two historical powerhouses, one re-emerging, that's us, the other protecting
the summit they've occupied for most of the last eight years.

(54:03):
All three test matches in South Africa have been compelling,
as we knew they would be. I'm really not sure
if Baltimore can possibly live up to what we've seen
over these last three weekends. It'll be, as I said
before the one o'clock news, a unique challenge for both
sides to replicate what we've seen in the rugby hotbed

(54:24):
of South Africa when they move over to the neutral
fields of Baltimore, where Rugby's little more than a curiosity
for the locals, and the game itself is very much
a commercial consideration more than anything else. Both sides invested
massive amounts of physical and emotional energy into these three

(54:47):
test matches, knowing this was the real series, these three
games in the Republic. Is there enough gas in the
tank to go around again? I mean, there will be.
And it may come from players who are injected into
the series in its slightly unusual fourth chapter, having not
played too big a part up until now. And maybe

(55:09):
that's how we should view next weekend. A standalone game
with its own context rather than any sort of climax
to a series which has delivered in spades and which
could end now without too many complaints, I don't reckon,
from players or from fans. 1.20 on Newstalk ZB. How

(55:29):
are you, James?

Speaker 21 (55:31):
Oh, nah, not very happy. Quite depressed about life. Look,
I'm going to take a different spin on all this.
I'm a bit surprised about how sort of optimistic people
are about what's gone on in the last few months
or six weeks over there. I think it's been quite
a disappointing tour. I'm surprised. about the analysis a lot

(55:57):
of people brought to the first test. I don't say
we were lucky to win, but South Africa controlled that
game effectively up to the 55th minute. We scored some
good tries, but I never felt that, I thought the
score flatted us quite a lot in that first test.
And in the last two tests, yes, people talk about

(56:18):
fine margins, but, you know, at this level of rugby,
it's all about winning. And I think on balance, South
Africa won the last two tests pretty easily. Yeah, the
score may not reflect that, but, you know, we got
those late tries, which were consolation tries. They weren't really
tries which were going to put us back into the

(56:38):
mix to win. And I think that, you know, we
knew going into the series what strength South Africa would bring,
and we didn't manage really to quell their strengths. We're
better rugby players, but, you know, at this level, it's
about winnings. And I think on balance it's been quite disappointing.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
What were you hoping to see more of, James?

Speaker 21 (57:02):
I was hoping to see perhaps, well, less errors by us,
but I think if we had matched them 50% or
even 45% line-out, scrum, sort of set-piece stuff, then I
think we would have blitzed them just with our general play,
you know, doing what we do well, which is sort

(57:23):
of second phase ball, just literally creating something out of nothing.
And I thought that's why we might have won yesterday.
Because I thought we were going to be the team
that would improve from last week. Whereas I didn't think
South Africa could improve, but they did. And I think
we regressed.

Speaker 2 (57:41):
I'm just trying to– let's look at it as a–
let's divide the three tests into six halves, shall we,
and see who– I'm thinking about who won each of
the halves. I think– I mean, you make a very
good point, James. I mean, and here we are talking
about an all-black side that's lost two straight matches. There's
no getting away from that. I think the All Blacks
had good periods in all three test matches, but you're right.

(58:03):
The Scrum let them down in the first test, the
line-out last week, and I think South Africa were just better,
certainly in that 20-minute period in the second half today.
They deserve to win the series, you're right. And look,
you're right to be disappointed about that as a, I
can tell, passionate All Blacks fan.

Speaker 21 (58:18):
I think they won the series quite easily. I don't
think it was that close. You can look at the
scores and be a bit deceived about how close it was.
As I say, I go back to that first test.
I think that score flattered us a lot.

Speaker 12 (58:36):
It was a.

Speaker 21 (58:36):
Very close game. Yes, we came through in the last
20 minutes. Last week, they improved, and that's why I thought,
I'm repeating myself a bit, but I thought we would
work out a way to play our game better. But
in the end, we didn't.

Speaker 16 (58:54):
We weren't able to.

Speaker 9 (58:55):
We fell off tackles.

Speaker 21 (58:58):
Obviously our goal kicking wasn't great, but you want to
win these games.

Speaker 16 (59:03):
We've got some good players.

Speaker 21 (59:05):
We've got five or six world-class players, but boy, the
South Africans muscled up and proved that it was, I
wouldn't say men against boys, but I think there was
quite a gap in the teams.

Speaker 2 (59:17):
Good viewpoint, James. Thanks for being so articulate, mate. Please
call again at any time over the next year, mate.
Let's chart the progress of this team together.

Speaker 16 (59:27):
Thanks.

Speaker 2 (59:28):
Good on you, James. 0800 8010 80 is our number.

Speaker 11 (59:30):
Harry, hi.

Speaker 22 (59:33):
Yeah, I'm a little bit like the last caller.

Speaker 9 (59:36):
I'm disappointed.

Speaker 22 (59:37):
And it's not about the losing. I thought that we
would be further ahead tactically with.

Speaker 7 (59:46):
Rennie than we are at the moment.

Speaker 22 (59:49):
You know, I heard one of your commentators before saying
that Roy got had a good game last night. I
thought he was a lot slower than usual. I thought
he kicked away too made some unnecessary kicks and gave
away possession on three or four occasions. I have no
issue with kicking the ball way downfield when you're in

(01:00:13):
a really serious defensive position, but I've got an issue
doing it around the halfway when you're just handing the opposition.

Speaker 16 (01:00:21):
Possession.

Speaker 22 (01:00:23):
I think that our forwards.
Okay, we know we've got problems in the scrums and
the line-outs against these guys, but we did all right.
But they're not as good as what you'd expect from
All Blacks. My big issue is that we tried to
take these guys on physically in the forwards, and you

(01:00:46):
look at the bloody size of them and how big
and muscly they are and everything like that. And, you know,
I thought that tactically, would have been to spread the
ball wide and run them into the ground. But I
don't think it went out wide that often. And I think,

(01:01:08):
you know, we didn't even handle that well when we
did do it. Grant Fox always used to say that
the speed of the ball through the hand would always
beat the defense. And I don't think we're doing that anymore.
You know, it's just, as I said, disappointing. But there's

(01:01:30):
plenty of work on, and Rennie is early in his career.

Speaker 5 (01:01:34):
As a coach.

Speaker 22 (01:01:35):
But I do think he needs to be consulting more
on tactics to beat teams. I think we played too
much of their game, and we gave them too much
of their position. They were always going to win too different.

Speaker 2 (01:01:48):
Yeah, sorry, Harry, just on the spinning the ball wide, you...
Have you noticed, though, the greater, and I'll use the
word that they've used a lot, the greater optimism in
terms of trying to spread the ball? Why, when you
said they're not doing it as much anymore, do you
mean across this year? Like you didn't see it as
often this morning, for example, compared to the last couple
of weeks?

Speaker 22 (01:02:09):
Well, I think that because they kept the ball in
the forwards way too long and didn't release it, that
they would end up literally in the middle of the
field and not having a lot of room to go
either way. Whereas if they were driving it up the

(01:02:31):
sidelines or something like that, you've got a whole big
back line there to open up the opposition with. It
makes the defence much more difficult. When you're sitting in
the middle of the field, you've got forwards and backs
in the defensive line. The back forwards generally, big South

(01:02:52):
African forwards, if you're going wide from the sidelines to
the other sideline and back again, you're running them ragged
and you're focusing on their weaknesses. But what we did
was we ran it up the guts a hell of
a lot. And I just think that was dumb tactics, really. And,
you know, Roy Gard, I'd really rate him as a halfback.

(01:03:15):
I think he's great. But I think last night was
one of his worst games, purely and simply from the
lack of commitment to what he was doing. I thought
he was slow compared to his normal game. And I
thought that, as I said before, I think he kicked
away a position he didn't need to kick away.

Speaker 2 (01:03:35):
Thanks for your thoughts, Harry. I've got to move, mate.
I've got to get on. But look, I appreciate you
calling in and giving us your viewpoint. Again, call any
time and let's chart the progress of this team. 129,
Newstalk ZB, back in a moment on Weekend Sport.

Speaker 1 (01:03:49):
From brilliant victories to baffling selections, it's all fair game
on Weekend Sport with Jason Vine and the Volkswagen Amarok V6.
Power and comfort combined. On sale now. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
Newstalk ZB and Weekend Sport. The Black Ferns have pumped
South Africa in the first test of their historic doubleheader
in Soweto. That'll be full time.

Speaker 18 (01:04:12):
New Zealand win the historic first ever test between New
Zealand and South Africa on Springbok soil.

Speaker 2 (01:04:18):
52 points to 20. Yeah, 52-20. New Zealand, though, survived
conceding four yellow cards. They scored eight tries to four.
They led 24-10 at the break. Blake Fern's head coach
is Whitney Hanson, who joins us now. Congratulations on this
win on such an historic occasion. Whitney, how satisfying was
the performance from your team?

Speaker 23 (01:04:39):
Yeah, thank you. It was really exciting to just be
a part of. I think, you know, when you're a
part of moments like that and you get to create history,
it's always pretty special to kind of acknowledge that and
acknowledge the privilege that that was and, you know, really
happy with the rugby that we played too. There's definitely
some areas in there where we've, we'll take away some
learnings and put into our week leading in France next week,

(01:05:03):
but really proud of the girls in this today.

Speaker 2 (01:05:05):
When you bring up 50 points in a test match,
eight tries, obviously the attack becomes a focus. What pleased
you the most about the way your team attacked today?

Speaker 23 (01:05:17):
We've worked really hard on having an attack that's been
built around being really unpredictable, whether that's in or out
of system, and I think you see that on I
thought it was going to be a wee try for
Amirante Satiti at the end there. He was just going
to put the icy on the cake, did quite get there.
But moments like that, I think, just showcase where our
attack's going. There's some things in there too around our

(01:05:39):
ball carrier we need to be better at. We're in
key position. We've got to do that a little bit longer,
so just sort of 80 minutes, a bit more clinical
around it. But you can see in the patches where
we are now, it's a pretty exciting game to watch.

Speaker 2 (01:05:49):
Whenever you play South Africa, they bring physicality, obviously. How
happy were you with the way you matched South Africa physically?

Speaker 23 (01:05:58):
Yeah, I think we talked at halftime around our ball carrying,
our clean. We probably lacked a little bit of urgency
there and came out and did that a bit better
in the second half. We knew they were going to
bring that. So I think there's a piece here and
around our mental fortitude and how we sort of turn
up to that. You know, big games and can't afford
to wait for halftime to turn that on. So, you know,

(01:06:19):
some people did that really well. Matt Anderson was superstar
for us in that space and a couple of others
did that really well.

Speaker 11 (01:06:26):
So, yeah.

Speaker 23 (01:06:26):
Proud of those efforts and but again you know spaces
where we can keep being better.

Speaker 2 (01:06:31):
Yeah it's interesting to talk to you and in every
answer you've talked about the improvements that you're looking for
is that kind of a bit of a mantra internally
that you know there's there's no satisfaction even with big
wins like this and and that there is always you
know a lesson to take?

Speaker 23 (01:06:47):
Yeah we talked you know right from the beginning of
this year that about performance over outcome and is a
game that we're wanting to play and we want to
show the world. And we did that in patches today
and we've done it in patches across the year so far.
And I think that's, that's, that's, you know, that's not surprising.
It's a group that's growing super proud of what we

(01:07:07):
did put out there today. But we want to go
from good to great.

Speaker 2 (01:07:11):
People who didn't watch the game will wake up this
morning and see the headline that there were four yellow cards.
Can you just talk us through your, your thinking when,
when that was all going on across the 80 minutes?

Speaker 23 (01:07:22):
Yeah, I think some of those ones just sort of
ride off a bit to some other bits of our
game that we need to be better at. I know
Ponce's yellow card around the mall stuff probably really came
from pressure versus poor decision making. But there's some things
in there that are just like should be non-negotiables for us.
We can't afford to have yellow cards for head-high tackles

(01:07:43):
and we can't afford to have them for offside. So
lots of work to do in that space. And we're
lucky we'll probably get punished further.

Speaker 16 (01:07:49):
For that, to be honest.

Speaker 23 (01:07:50):
So yeah, disappointed in that, frustrated by it, but I
know we can do better in that.

Speaker 2 (01:07:55):
What was it like at FNB Stadium? It looks like
a marvellous arena. What was it like to experience a
Black Ferns South Africa game at that venue?

Speaker 23 (01:08:06):
Yeah, I think like 94 or something, you know, people,
I think by the time our sort of game had
kicked off, it was sort of around the 30,000s and
it was pretty noisy, like it's a pretty cool culture
over here and You know, pretty excited about watching sport
and I think win, lose, draw. And regardless of what

(01:08:26):
team it is, they're just passionate supporters of rugby. So, again,
I know it's just such a privilege to be part
of a pretty cool experience that we'll all take away from.

Speaker 2 (01:08:38):
And so, I mean, for you, obviously, Whitney, this is
newish as well. This is your first year, of course,
as head coach. I mean, how happy are you with
the way everything's going and how much are you enjoying
the role and developing our best players?

Speaker 23 (01:08:54):
Yeah, it's always special when you get to work with
the best. And I think there's such amazing talent in
New Zealand. And alongside being great rugby players, they're also
really amazing people. And that's the same for our management group.
So it's a privilege to lead them, to be honest.
And I'm just working really hard to try and be
the best that I can, to be worthy of being

(01:09:15):
in front of them and enjoying all the moments that
we do spend together. And, yeah, it'll just be, like
you say, it's a bit of a mantra at the moment,
that good to great. Now we keep searching for ways
to keep improving and keep showcasing to the world what
it means.

Speaker 16 (01:09:29):
To be a Blackman.

Speaker 2 (01:09:30):
And in that regard, it must be really quite a
cool prospect to know that over the next three weekends,
it's France, it's Scotland, it's England. You know, with games
coming regularly like that, how important is that consistency to
be able to work on the things that you want
to work on? You know, you've got the team together regularly.
for a decent length of time.

Speaker 23 (01:09:51):
Yeah, I think, you know, we've talked a lot around
it's not a new thing around the women's game, the
growth and the need for games like this. It's been
a pretty popular headline. So I think the reality of
that now is that it's here and we have that
and that's so exciting because, you know, being able to
go week to week and have the chance to keep

(01:10:11):
improving your game like that, I think it also sort
of gives us opportunity to grow continuously with certain combinations
of players and for people to get game time and
then it also allows you to lead in young talent
and give opportunities to new leaders so we're really excited
about the rest of this tour and really grateful that
that's sort of ahead of us for this year and

(01:10:33):
the games that we are getting it's going to be great.

Speaker 2 (01:10:35):
Well, congratulations on this win, Whitney. What a wonderful occasion
for you all and a great result as well. Travel safe.
Look forward to seeing how you go in Lyon a
week or so from now. Thanks for your time.

Speaker 23 (01:10:46):
Thanks, Matt.

Speaker 9 (01:10:46):
No worries.

Speaker 2 (01:10:47):
Thank you, Whitney. Whitney Hanson there. After the Black Ferns
did a job on South Africa, 52 points to 20.
It was the early game at First National Bank Stadium, Johannesburg,
Soccer City, as it's colloquially known. Great to see Ruahei
de Montt as part of the pre-game. ceremony as well.

(01:11:07):
She was selected to carry the flag out. The South
African captain carried out the South African flag that played
the early game and then out they went to hold
the flags. It was a cool moment. So the Black
Ferns are off to now play in the WXV Global Series.
They have France next Sunday morning. That game is in Lyon.

(01:11:28):
Then they head to Edinburgh to take on Scotland the
following Sunday. And then after that, it's England at Twickenham.
So three big test matches to come for Whitney Hansen
and her Black Ferns. Unbeaten under Whitney Hansen so far.
Let's see if they can make that another three over
the next three weekends. 20-2 when we come back, it's
James McConey.

Speaker 1 (01:11:49):
Call it how you see it on 0800 80 1080.
Weekend Sport with Jason Pine and the Volkswagen Amarok V6.

Speaker 5 (01:11:57):
On sale now. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (01:12:00):
News talk, ZBN Weekend Sport. Just before we get to
James McConey, text through from Tom. Massive congratulations to St
Andrews College, first 15, beating Tauranga Boys in the National Comp.
Final impressive journey from a co-ed college with a comparatively
small pool of players. Yep, I picked up on that.
St Andrew Stack, as they call them, 34-24 winners over
Tauranga Boys in Palmerston North. It's their maiden national title.

(01:12:25):
So congratulations to all involved. Text through here from John.
Does the injury to Jacobson and also Savia open the
door for Duplicy Khalifi? Look, I don't know whether they'll bring...
Anyone else over for one game, John? I look at
the loose forwards they still have available to them. Peter Larkai,
Tupu Vahie, Wallace Satiti, Ethan Blackadder, Simon Parker, Samisi Tupuata-Iloa.

(01:12:48):
I think for one test match they'll be okay. I'm
not sure that they would call for reinforcements. But, yeah,
the loose forwards, yeah, there's been a bit of attrition there,
hasn't there, with Jacobson, with Sarvia, Anton Segner, of course, also.
Departing early. So yeah, it's an interesting little conundrum for
Dave Rennie. James McConey is here. Hello, mate.

Speaker 16 (01:13:08):
Hello, Pioneer. Yes, and even Dalton Papali leaving early has
probably hurt them a bit too when you break it down.

Speaker 2 (01:13:16):
Yes, indeed. I wouldn't imagine for one test they'd call
anybody in, would they? They'll go with what they've got
to Baltimore?

Speaker 16 (01:13:25):
No, it'll be hard to see it happening. Although I
still think that Duplicy could if he should have made
the cut. and could have made a difference. He's our
Quokka Smith, you know? He's nuggety, he's rugged, he's combative,
he's a true competitor, and I know that the selector
said something about how he didn't get as many turnovers

(01:13:45):
as other players. Well, we won the turnovers today, and
that didn't do us any favours, so I'm talking about
all the other stuff that he gives you, which is leadership,
just being an absolute competitor, you know? Someone who just
stays in the fight that well, and also led the
the Hurricanes to a famous, huge victory over my beloved Chiefs.

(01:14:06):
It hurts.

Speaker 2 (01:14:08):
Well, how do you reckon the All Blacks will be
feeling as they board the plane? I think they're on
the plane now, actually. They were going straight to the airport.
I think both teams were flying together to Baltimore. How
do you assess the first three tests of this series?

Speaker 16 (01:14:22):
Well, in terms of how they're feeling, I'll answer your
first question, Piney. I think Leo Ricciardo will be feeling
the worst. And if he does win the lottery of
getting a business class seat, I think he'll be giving
that up to one of the big units. That's just me.
I think he'll be doing that. But the rest of
it is, I thought that overall the series, it just

(01:14:44):
showed the suffocating Sapphires. That's what they are, the South Africans.
They're better at slowing the game down than we are
at speeding it up. and that's where their dominance is.
And even though they do score some nice tries, really
a lot of it is about dragging people down into
their world, which is what they did in the second
half of both the last two tests. And to be honest,

(01:15:05):
when you got the Georgian referee there, he's a bit
of an enabler, and everything slowed down. And also, I've
got to say, the rapport between the referee and Seah Khaleesi,
it was like a rom-com. It was like Tom Hanks
and Meg Ryan The chemistry, like Sleepless in Seattle, I'm
telling you, and if you've met Siakalisi, he is charismatic.

(01:15:26):
Or as the kids say, he's got maximum aura points.

Speaker 2 (01:15:29):
Yes, he's high on the aura scale, as they call it.

Speaker 24 (01:15:33):
Very high.

Speaker 2 (01:15:34):
Have you seen enough from the Dave Rooney-coached All Blacks
in the six test matches he's had them, the tour
games as well, so what's that, 10 games they've played together?
Have you seen enough from them to feel a degree
of optimism about 2027?

Speaker 16 (01:15:49):
Yeah, I'm optimistic. I think it's good. I think we're
trending in the right direction. I think Rooney has provided... probably,
what do you call it, a bit of unity, a
bit of kind of like solid old-school direction, really. And
so I can't fault him for that, but I think

(01:16:11):
the one thing I would say, and I was on
your show last week, Piney, saying Richard Mawonga should have
been in the 23 today. I mean, why bring him
on tour? I know you're sort of trying to get
him back used to the All Blacks environment. This guy
is an all-time great.

Speaker 3 (01:16:26):
He.

Speaker 16 (01:16:27):
it's like you don't keep the Rolls Royce in the
garage on your wedding day, Pony, okay?

Speaker 2 (01:16:34):
He'll play next week, won't he?

Speaker 16 (01:16:36):
Well, he will, but I mean, next week, yeah, I mean,
we might draw the series, but I think Mawunga should
have definitely been on the field because the pressure ramps up.
You can see it. Poor old Reuben Love, you know,
is kicking, sort of went out the window a little
bit today because it is, it's the I think Liam
on your show Liam Napier was comparing it to a
World Cup and this was really the final this was

(01:16:57):
the final if you consider those other twos were the
semi and the quarter final so look that was something
I think Dave Rennie though had the equivalent of a
commentator's curse when he said he picked Leroy Carter on
the strength of his defence it's just we've all done
it Piney we've always said we've all said this kicker
hasn't missed a penalty for 10 games he's in incredible

(01:17:19):
form and Look at this batsman. He's looking imperious. And
then it's got him!

Speaker 3 (01:17:23):
Gone.

Speaker 16 (01:17:25):
So I don't think Lenny will ever say that again.
And anyway, he was talking about a player who was
in a Super Rugby team that lost the final by
50 points as well. So, you know, I'm just saying
there's some things that didn't add up. But look, I
think the All Blacks have shown good signs. But one
Herald writer said, oh, the All Blacks are the only

(01:17:47):
team in the world that could win Even one test
in South Africa. Well, the Wallabies beat the Springboks 38-22
at Alice Park last year and scored six tries in
the process. So let's be real here, Piney. It just
wasn't good enough.

Speaker 2 (01:18:03):
All right, good summary. A couple of other matters to
discuss with you. NRL, the Warriors' regular season is all done.
They now wait to see whether the West Tigers can
surprise us all by either beating the Panthers or losing
by a very, very small margin. Regardless of any of that,
how are you feeling about the Warriors heading into finals

(01:18:24):
next week?

Speaker 16 (01:18:26):
I'm feeling bullish because I think it's a timing thing.
I think Webby is an outstanding coach. and I was
hosting a Warriors Legends lunch on Friday, and it was
an amazing event. There were 80 Warriors there, and if
you count the ones who was training down on the field,
about 30 down there, they had more than a third

(01:18:46):
of the all-time Warriors in at Mount Smart. And Webby
was saying, look, all those guys, because I was noting
the young players in the team, but guys like Jacob Lowe,
Leka Halasima, Tain Tua Piki, all the young guys in
the team have kind of grown up together and they're
best mates. Ali Latawa, the list goes on. And so

(01:19:07):
he said just having those guys who would play for
each other and for the team and then having the
experienced heads sort of directing them around and just showing
them um, how to do it is just this, um,
really amazing mixture. My big issue is I think the
dolphins are really good. They have a number of excitement machines, Pony.

(01:19:28):
We're talking Selwyn Cobbo, Tabu Ifedo, Herbie Farmworth, Tevita Naufahu.
And then you forget about Jermaine Osaka, who's the best
kicker in the NFL and I mean, NRL, sorry. And these, um,
people will remember that from his schoolboy days at Shirley
Boys and St. Beads down in Christchurch. He was kicking
goals back then, and he's still doing it at a
high level.

Speaker 2 (01:19:49):
Yeah, the Dolphins, they lost 66-0 to the Sharks in July,
and since then they've won seven straight games. Talk about
a kick in the backside, and yeah, you're right, I think... Yeah,
the Warriors would probably rather face the Roosters who have
lost the last three than the Dolphins who have won
the last seven. Anyway, we can get to that. I
did want to just check in with you on the
NFL as well. High excitement in our house with our

(01:20:10):
son Johnny looking forward to the new season starting. How
are you feeling about the NFL season ahead?

Speaker 16 (01:20:17):
Look, I'm a Detroit Lions fan because of the music,
you know, Motown, et cetera, and the cars. When I
was a kid, I went, that's my team, and they
were fantastic. They were actually okay, and then they got
quite good there for a while. We had Barry Sanders,
and now somehow we've kind of got this team that
is a contender. But it just doesn't seem like it'll

(01:20:37):
be enough. But one thing I do pioneer around this
time of the year is I brace myself for fantasy sport.
If anyone out there plays fantasy sport and you get
a hard time from your partner or your wife or
whatever or your husband, and just remember, fantasy sport is
just the modern-day equivalent, someone was telling me, of basketball.
doing the crossword, okay? And so you can devote some

(01:20:59):
time to fantasy sport and not feel guilty about it.
Doomscrolling's another problem, though, that I still haven't dealt with, Piney,
but fantasy sport, you're not going to take that away
from my cold, dead hands.

Speaker 5 (01:21:11):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:21:13):
Gee, what a segment you've provided, as per usual. Always
good to have you on the show, James. Enjoy the
rest of your day, mate, and we'll catch up again
next week, eh?

Speaker 12 (01:21:21):
All right.

Speaker 7 (01:21:22):
Cheers, mate. See you.

Speaker 2 (01:21:24):
See you, James. James McConey, big part of our Sundays.
Catch him on the Alternative Commentary Collective, Crowd Goes Wild,
and across your socials as well. Eight away from two,
Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 1 (01:21:33):
The biggest names in sport are here. Weekend Sport with
Jason Vine. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (01:21:40):
Coming up, four and a half to two, just a
couple of emails to mop up on the rugby. From Richard, Jason,
it's been great to see the All Blacks competitive in
this series, but rugby's won up front, and unless that's fixed,
then that's all we will be, competitive. The type of
rugby we play is not going to be good enough
on its own. We need to find solutions, says Richard,
to de-weaponise the Springbok Scrum. It's a non-negotiable. It would

(01:22:03):
halve the number of penalties we conceded in this series.
The other option is don't knock the ball on. The
rest we can sort. Thank you, Richard. And from Adrian Jason,
this series reminded me of the All Blacks against Ireland
in New Zealand in 2022. We won the first test,
but it didn't reflect the Irish dominance and their one-off mistakes.
This series, once the box reduced their mistakes after the

(01:22:25):
first test, their dominance became apparent. And also, nobody has
mentioned the referees. They've done a brilliant job this series.
I think that needs to be called out. Thank you, Adrian.
Thank you for all your calls and correspondence on the
All Blacks. We'll pivot away after two to the Warriors.
But of course, the fourth test in this series is
next Sunday. It's a rather more civilised time to take

(01:22:49):
in a game of rugby. 9am next Sunday morning. We'll
have full commentary of that here on Newstalk ZB and
we'll kick off weekend sports straight away afterwards. But after two,
the Warriors. Rich Agar, assistant coach, is with us.

Speaker 1 (01:23:02):
The only place to discuss the biggest sports issues on.

Speaker 5 (01:23:07):
And off the field.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
It's all on Weekend Sport with Jason Fine and the
Volkswagen Amarok V6. On Newstalk ZB, your home of sport.

Speaker 2 (01:23:18):
Hi there, 207. This is Weekend Sport on Newstalk ZB.
I'm Jason Fine, Andy McDonald running the cutter. We're here
till three, then Tim Beveridge with the Weekend Collective Sunday edition.
Before we get there, I want to get you to Monza. Well,
Liam Lawson's going to start at the back of the grid.
This is due to a grid penalty. None of his doing.
It was an engine change, which meant that regardless of

(01:23:41):
Liam Lawson's qualifying overnight, he would start from the back
of the grid. Qualified 14th, for what it's worth, but
he'll have to come from the back to get himself
among the points. And there's a surprise at the front
of the grid as well. Peter Windsor, well-respected... Formula One

(01:24:01):
journalist and broadcaster, going to break it all down for
us this hour. Rich Agar from the Warriors along shortly.
I'm quite keen to hear from your Warriors fans about
where this all sits as far as your Warriors experiences
are concerned. I know we've got the finals to come,
but here's a team that has done something no other

(01:24:23):
Warriors team in the club history has achieved, and that's
18 wins. That's the most wins. by a Warriors team
in a regular season in the club's history dating all
the way back to 1995. It's magnificent, isn't it? 10
of 12 at home. They've only lost twice at home

(01:24:45):
all season. Anyway, we can kick this around. And who
would you rather face? It's a silly question, isn't it?
Who would you rather the Warriors face next week? It's
either going to be the Dolphins or the Roosters. The
Dolphins have won seven in a row. The Roosters have
lost their last three in a row. So momentum very
different with those two sides. Of course, the Warriors can't
do anything else now. All they can do is watch

(01:25:06):
the game against the Panthers and the Tigers later on
this afternoon and into the early evening and hope that
the West Tigers can do us a favour. and rise
above what's been a pretty mediocre season for them. Beat
the Panthers, or at least lose by a very small margin.
That would give the Warriors the minor premiership in the

(01:25:26):
game against the Roosters. Anyway, we'll talk all about that
when Rich Agar joins us. Your calls are still welcome, though.
0800 80 1080 on the Warriors, 9292 on text. Nine
past two, as we always do, though. Just after the
two o'clock news on Weekend Sport, let's get you across
some of the stuff that's happened in the last little while.
that you might not have caught up with in case
you missed it. Starting in the Premier League, there were

(01:25:49):
four draws overnight, but Manchester City picked up three points.

Speaker 25 (01:25:53):
Semenya with the cross, Rushworth left it, and Haaland at
the far post, nods the ball in. Two against Crystal Palace,
and the celebrations are going in the way of the
City number nine. Manchester City have their noses in front.

Speaker 2 (01:26:10):
Yeah, and stayed there. 1-0 to City over Coventry. Crystal
Palace also won at Fulham. Halali's away here.

Speaker 3 (01:26:17):
He goes round.

Speaker 2 (01:26:17):
Bernd Leno, Kamada looking.

Speaker 12 (01:26:19):
To follow up.

Speaker 2 (01:26:20):
And now he breaks to Ben Chilwell.

Speaker 25 (01:26:23):
Back at Crystal Palace.

Speaker 26 (01:26:26):
And how about that?

Speaker 3 (01:26:28):
Welcome back, Ben Chilwell.

Speaker 26 (01:26:31):
And for the first.

Speaker 25 (01:26:31):
Time this afternoon, Crystal Palace lead here.

Speaker 2 (01:26:35):
At Craven Cottage. 3-2 the final score to the NRL,
season over for last year's minor premiers, but a win
to leave their fans happy.

Speaker 3 (01:26:44):
He's got it all, he's going to run this time. Oh,
he goes himself!

Speaker 14 (01:26:47):
Kobe Black down the middle! Puts him in rubber!

Speaker 4 (01:26:50):
He's estranged!

Speaker 27 (01:26:51):
Stop it!

Speaker 3 (01:26:52):
Stop it! This kid is playing some unbelievable football. Where
has he been?

Speaker 25 (01:26:58):
Kirby Black lays on a try for strange.

Speaker 2 (01:27:02):
A real points fest there. Raiders 50, Cowboys 30. The
Cowboys do though. Go into the finals in eighth place.
A last-minute bit of razzle-dazzle meantime. End of the Melbourne
Storms season with a win.

Speaker 26 (01:27:15):
Munster looks to pass. Finds Whishaw. Then Grant. Hot potato.
Back to Josh King. King with a flick pass.

Speaker 12 (01:27:24):
On the ground.

Speaker 26 (01:27:25):
Ute Kamaru with it. Through the centre.

Speaker 4 (01:27:27):
Off line to Grant.

Speaker 2 (01:27:29):
Flick pass the arrow.

Speaker 5 (01:27:30):
Melbourne!

Speaker 26 (01:27:34):
Score and try to win it. Last match of the
year for them. They sent their fans out smiling.

Speaker 2 (01:27:42):
Yeah, the storm getting up over the Sharks by 24
points to 20. To the NPC, the muckle extended Wellington's
misery in Blenheim.

Speaker 25 (01:27:51):
Excellent work from Tasman on their heels.

Speaker 2 (01:27:53):
And away we go with Tal Moifelau.

Speaker 26 (01:27:55):
Tal Moifelau with the angle. And Davis couldn't bring him down.

Speaker 5 (01:27:59):
And Karen Tal Moifelau scores an amazing try off a
quick tap.

Speaker 2 (01:28:06):
42-28 the final score. Canterbury, meantime, too good for Waikato.

Speaker 18 (01:28:11):
Hello with the carry. Bellworthy saw a little gap, went
for a snipe. Gets up, goes again. Still going, needs support.
There's Newstown. Takes the advantage out to Twency.

Speaker 2 (01:28:28):
36 points to 14, and Manawatu picking up some real
momentum too. Philipson looks for the run as it comes
in the form of, oh, Philemoni, huge contact into Broughton.

Speaker 23 (01:28:37):
Ware made the tackle down low.

Speaker 6 (01:28:38):
Still there for Manawatu.

Speaker 2 (01:28:40):
Held up brilliantly.

Speaker 23 (01:28:42):
And over for the try is Rory Woods of Alaskan.
lovely ball by Kyle Brown and Manawatu extend the advantage.

Speaker 2 (01:28:51):
Yeah, the Turbo's winning 29-12 over the Bay of Plenty
steamers and finally nothing could separate the Wallabies and Los
Pumas in Argentina this morning. What a crazy game it's been,
Cannon with a tackle. Goes front on. Have they had enough?
Is it a draw?

Speaker 3 (01:29:11):
It is.

Speaker 26 (01:29:16):
It's a draw, but it's a series win for the Wallabies.

Speaker 1 (01:29:21):
The biggest names in sport talk to Piney. Weekend Sport
with Jason Pine and the Volkswagen Amarok V6. Power and
comfort combined. On sale now. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (01:29:33):
13 past two, the Warriors have completed their best ever
regular season in the NRL by the metric of games won.
And he'll play the ball again, 15 away, still two
to come, two and.

Speaker 5 (01:29:44):
A half to play. Here it is for Harris, to
meet him, he.

Speaker 4 (01:29:46):
Knows it, does he?

Speaker 27 (01:29:47):
Yes!

Speaker 5 (01:29:47):
One point there, manly.

Speaker 3 (01:29:55):
We'll play the ball.

Speaker 5 (01:29:56):
On the halfway. Up over the halfway.

Speaker 12 (01:29:58):
They come.

Speaker 4 (01:29:58):
Back to face with the Warriors.

Speaker 5 (01:30:00):
To the little ground.

Speaker 23 (01:30:01):
Waiting for the full time.

Speaker 24 (01:30:02):
Hurry up.

Speaker 26 (01:30:02):
Waiting.

Speaker 10 (01:30:02):
Waiting.

Speaker 4 (01:30:03):
And the Warriors win the game.

Speaker 26 (01:30:13):
In their final regular season.

Speaker 2 (01:30:20):
Game in 2026, the Warriors win it by one. Yeah,
the 31-30 victory over Manly yesterday, the Warriors' 18th win
of the season. They now wait for the Penrith Tigers
game later on today. That's a six o'clock kickoff New
Zealand time to see if they've claimed the minor premiership
for just the second time or will finish in second place.
A Penrith win by three points or more secures them

(01:30:43):
the minor premiership. Any other result, we'll see the Warriors
claim the regular season silverware. If the Warriors finish top,
they'll host the Roosters in a qualifying final next weekend.
If the Warriors finish second, they will host the Dolphins.
Assistant coach of the side is Rich Agar, who joins
us now. Rich, congratulations to you and the team on

(01:31:03):
making club history. 18 wins this season, 10 wins from
12 at home. How much satisfaction do you take from
the regular season before we start talking about the finals?

Speaker 16 (01:31:16):
Hi, Jason.

Speaker 8 (01:31:16):
Thanks for having me on, mate. Yeah, we're proud of
our efforts. You know, I can't see Penrith slipping up tonight,
to be perfectly honest. But nonetheless, for it to come
down to points difference, I think when we would have
set off at the start of the year, everybody got
high hopes, high expectations. You know, we always internally talk

(01:31:38):
about setting the bar high and shooting for the stars.
And 27 rounds, mate, is a long, attritional season. And And,
you know, there's always some bumps in.

Speaker 22 (01:31:49):
The road along the way.

Speaker 8 (01:31:50):
But we put ourselves in a really good position.

Speaker 16 (01:31:53):
It's good to be able to get those little.

Speaker 8 (01:31:59):
Sort of history markers about points in the season, home wins,
points scored, stuff like that. But ultimately, we put ourselves
in a position to have a crack at the big prize,
which is, you know, what it's all about for us
from here on in.

Speaker 2 (01:32:13):
You mentioned it being an attritional season. You did right.
You've had to use 30 players across your 24 matches
and you've had some big players miss large chunks of
the season. How challenging has the attritional nature of the
season been for the coaching staff?

Speaker 8 (01:32:30):
Yeah, very challenging. You want to get to this part
of the year and sort of get everybody to the
start line as much as you can, fit and fresh. But,
you know, over the course of our season, it's been
very well documented. Obviously, We've had to change our halfback
a fair bit. Losing an experienced, quality player like Roger

(01:32:50):
Tuivasa-Shek has not been easy. And even as we're coming
into these final weeks, we lost Alan and a couple
of other guys that we took care of a little
bit yesterday. But we're no different to any other club.
But I certainly think the reason that we are sat
where we are in the league standings at the moment

(01:33:12):
is because of the strength and depth and I guess
the investment and the quality of some of our younger
guys that, you know, two, three, four pre-seasons in. The
club have had a plan. We've had some, you know,
we've had stability throughout the club and we're starting to,
you know, we're starting to sort of bear the fruit
of it now that these young guys are turning into

(01:33:34):
top-line NRL players.

Speaker 2 (01:33:37):
On the flip side of that, Rich, you look at
the players who have been there the whole time. I
look at Aaron Clark. He started every single game. Jacob
Laban has played in every single game. Wade Egan's only
missed one, and that was yesterday, and I presume selectorial.
How key have those guys been, the ones who haven't
been injured, the ones who have been there the whole time?

Speaker 8 (01:33:56):
Yeah, well, just the three guys that you mentioned. You know,
Wade is obviously very much key to how we play
in our attack, and it was just an opportune time
to rest in, but he's had a wonderful season. Aaron
Clark is, you know, he got Dallium Locker of the
Year last year, and, you know, it's a personal opinion,

(01:34:18):
but I'm pretty adamant that this season is sort of
eclipsed what he turned out last year. You know, I
feel he's had a stronger season. He's grown, not only in,
you know, the output and the quality of his performances,
you know, the way he's enhancing his game. But also

(01:34:40):
in his leadership, you know, he's highly motivated at the minute, Aaron, to,
you know, to finish this season off in the right way.
And I think Jacob is, you know, along with guys
like Dimitri Kali and Lekker, Jacob's just a prime example
of a kid that's come in and just grown in
stature and feels so much more confident and at home

(01:35:04):
in the NRL now and The strides that he's made
this year have been hugely impressive.

Speaker 2 (01:35:13):
Just a word on yesterday's game. You led 24-12, then
were 30-24 behind, got back level with a converted try,
then the field goal from Chanel Harris-Taveta to give you
the one-point win. How do you sum up yesterday's performance?

Speaker 7 (01:35:28):
Not that easy, really.

Speaker 8 (01:35:29):
It was a funny old game because... You know, you
look at the stats. We had a look at some
stats this morning. I think we spent about eight minutes
of the game inside their 20. They've spent literally, I think,
48 seconds inside of ours. So, you know, we've completely
dominated the field position and.

Speaker 16 (01:35:50):
The territory and possession.

Speaker 8 (01:35:53):
I think we're around 60-40, something like that.

Speaker 22 (01:35:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:35:57):
We limited some of their sets to really low meters,
but we had a bad day on the edges. There's
no doubt about that, and that's an area that I
feel we've probably lacked a little bit of cohesion and continuity.
With some guys coming back that have not played for
a couple of weeks, we plain.

Speaker 11 (01:36:16):
And simply got some decisions wrong.

Speaker 8 (01:36:19):
With a team that's got a player like Tom Travojevic
and some of the speed that they've got on the outside,
it would have been a bad day to get it
wrong as well. So I actually feel that the closeness
of the score and the fact that we had some
bad moments on the edge that led to really long-range
tries or long-range breaks probably took away from, actually, there

(01:36:45):
were plenty of good things about our game yesterday as well.
But having said that, you know, what we've seen over
the last couple of weeks, you know, we're going to
have to make an improvement to the way that we,
you know, I guess conceded at times yesterday, but we're
confident we can do that too.

Speaker 2 (01:37:01):
Yeah, and in those three games, the last three, Rich,
you've had three different right wingers, three different centre combinations
and three different halves combinations. And you mentioned continuity there or,
you know, an inability to have that continuity because of injury.
Is that one of the main reasons that the edge
defence has been a little inconsistent for you?

Speaker 8 (01:37:22):
Oh, yeah, definitely in some ways. You know, I'll point
to the South Sydney game. We lost Allen. We had
to shift Adam Pompey to right wing. We had Eddie
Ermeyer playing right centre, along with Lou Canson in his,
I think, his second or third game of first grade.
So it's not just a continuity. We had some inexperience
in there too, and we had some guys playing out

(01:37:43):
of position. So I think when you throw everything into
the pot, that's.

Speaker 16 (01:37:47):
Certainly a factor.

Speaker 8 (01:37:49):
But nonetheless, we... We probably, you could say at times,
got from a little bit too passive to a bit
too aggressive with it. We've just got to find the
right balance on what works for us and look for
the right cues when it's time to go and shut
some of those plays down. But as I say, we
had some real good examples of us doing it yesterday,

(01:38:10):
but we got a couple of them wrong back-to-back, which
really hurts.

Speaker 2 (01:38:15):
As you said, I think it's most likely that Penrith
will beat the West Tigers later on today. That would
feed you into a qualifying final against the Dolphins. They're
in good form. No getting away from that. Seven straight wins.
You had a narrow win over them in Wellington in
round eight. They reversed that with a narrow win at Suncorp.

(01:38:36):
in round 17. They feel like a team you're very
closely matched with. How do you feel like you match
up with them in a knockout game? It won't be
a knockout game, but a finals game.

Speaker 8 (01:38:48):
I think whoever's in the top eight, regardless, you're going
to come up against a good side. And in this
first round, you're going to play a team in the
top four. So if indeed it is the Dolphins, we've
had some terrific games with them over the last couple
of seasons. Real close and actually real good games and

(01:39:10):
some quality football play. But yeah, they're confident. They're healthy
at the moment. They've got a really good spine and
they've got some speed and some guys that, you know,
beat tackles and break tackles. So we wouldn't expect anything
any different at this stage of the year. But, you know,

(01:39:31):
we would be very much, you know, we'd do our
diligence on them, but we're very much concentrating on ourselves,
fixing up. fixing up some of the things we need
to look at, but also doubling down on what we
know wins us games. I'm not sure how many games
we've actually won on the trot at the moment. You
probably look at both teams and think they're both in

(01:39:53):
a decent run of form. As I say, at this
stage of the year, if you want to make an
NRL grand final, you're going to have to knock some
good teams off.

Speaker 2 (01:40:02):
You've won six in a row, Rich. Six in a
row and eight of your last nine. There you go. See,
this is how focused you are on a game-to-game basis.
You don't even know how many games in a row
you've won, which I think is a good thing. Six
in a row.

Speaker 8 (01:40:15):
We're just getting done and we've already.

Speaker 16 (01:40:19):
looked at it today.

Speaker 8 (01:40:20):
We've, you know, we've put the review to bed, um,
from an assistant coach point of view, we've had to
prepare for two teams this week. So it's been double
the work for us.

Speaker 22 (01:40:29):
To be honest.

Speaker 8 (01:40:31):
So that might be why I.

Speaker 16 (01:40:32):
Lost count of, of that.

Speaker 8 (01:40:34):
But, um, yeah, until, until I guess eight o'clock tonight,
we will not be sure what day we're playing and again, who,
so yeah. I'm with you. Look, I feel, I feel
three points, um, again a Tigers team that probably not
got as much to play for with the greatest respect
I feel Penrith will probably overcome that points difference and

(01:40:58):
yeah it certainly looks like a home tie against the
Dolphins at the moment.

Speaker 2 (01:41:02):
Alright well it's a piece of history with 18 wins
in a regular season for you Rich here we'll find
out in a few hours who you're playing next week
and then you can start your planning in earnest always
appreciate you taking the time for a chat to us
mate all the best as well for the week ahead
and for a big finals match at home next weekend Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:41:17):
Much appreciated, Jason. Thanks for having me on, mate, and
good to chat.

Speaker 2 (01:41:22):
Yeah, good to chat, Rich. Rich Agar, assistant coach of
the Warriors, always very level with his analysis and his thinking.
I think that kind of permeates across the entire coaching staff.
Doesn't matter who you talk to, whether it's Andrew Webster,
Stacey Jones, Rich Agar, Slade Griffin, they're all great. they're
all very level, aren't they? Which is probably the secret, really,

(01:41:45):
in many ways. Okay, our Warriors fans, got some time
for a bit of chat. Just having a look at
the two teams that the Warriors might come up against.
And as I've just mentioned, and as I talked about
at length there with Rich, unless the West Tigers do
something which is kind of unlikely, then it'll be the

(01:42:05):
Dolphins next week. If the West Tigers somehow get up
and either beat the Panthers later on today or lose
by less than three points. So a two-point loss, a
one-point loss, a draw if it came to that, or
a win by the Tigers would mean the Warriors won

(01:42:27):
the minor premiership. That is the least likely scenario. The
more likely scenario is that with the minor premiership on
the line, the wind in their sails, and against a
team that's got nothing really to play for, the Panthers
will probably win that game by three or more. They
will win the minor premiership. That would mean the Warriors
play the Dolphins. The Warriors have won their last six games,

(01:42:50):
as I just mentioned to Rich, eight of their last nine. Now,
since the Dolphins lost to the Sharks in round 19
on the 11th of July by 66 points to nil,
which dropped them down to seventh on the table, they
have won seven straight games. to storm back into third place.

(01:43:12):
They clearly got a bit of a talking to after
the 66-0 mauling at the hands of the Sharks and
have since then beaten the Cowboys, the Dragons, the Broncos,
the Sea Eagles, the Eels, the Roosters, and the Titans. Now,
there aren't too many other top eight sides in there,
but you still can only play what's in front of you.

(01:43:34):
The other part of the equation is against the Warriors.
They played in Wellington in round eight. Warriors 20, Dolphins 18.
And they played at Suncorp in round 17, Dolphins 26,
Warriors 24. So two-point margins in both of the games.
Warriors fans, how are you feeling? Let's say it is

(01:43:55):
the Dolphins. I feel like whoever comes to go media
stadium next week and in the week or weeks that
follow is going to be up against it. 10 of
12 wins at home for the Warriors this season. Just
two home losses all season. So how are you feeling,

(01:44:17):
Warriors fans, with the regular season now all done and
finals football to look forward to?

Speaker 5 (01:44:23):
0800 80 10 80 228.

Speaker 2 (01:44:23):
Let's talk some Warriors when we come back.

Speaker 1 (01:44:28):
From grassroots to the grandstand, we can sport with Jason
Vine and the Volkswagen Amarok V6.

Speaker 5 (01:44:35):
Power and comfort combined. On sale now. Call 0800 80 1080.
Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 19 (01:44:42):
2.31.

Speaker 2 (01:44:42):
Happy to take your calls on the Warriors. 0800 80 1080.
Got a bunch of texts to get through here, but
if you want to get your point across... Happy to
have a yarn to you. We're going to get to
Monza before three o'clock for the Italian Formula One Grand
Prix qualifying overnight with the race tomorrow morning from one.
Let's have a look at some of these some of
these texts that are coming through. There's a bit of
concern about the edge. Yeah, bro, I was at the

(01:45:05):
game last evening. We were badly exposed on the left side,
said this one. The wire's got some work to do
on that edge. It's not that good, says says this one.
This one here says it would have been better if
the Warriors lost yesterday. They've been awful last couple of games.
A loss might have galvanized them. I don't necessarily think
you need a loss to galvanize you. I know what
you're saying. As far as the defense is concerned, you

(01:45:26):
look at the last three games, they've conceded 30 points
against the Sea Eagles yesterday, 32 against the Knights the
previous week, and 26 away at the Rabbitohs the week
before that. In the three games previous to that, it
was 24 points combined in the three games. And look,
as I said to Richard Agar, there's been no continuity

(01:45:48):
at all in team selection over the last three weeks. Thankfully,
that hopefully will, well, thankfully, that looks like it will
improve with the return of some players. But I think
you're always going to lack a bit of cohesion, aren't you,
when you're sort of chopping and changing your team all
the time. Aidan says, I'd rather finish minor premieres than
have a record winning season, especially if it means a

(01:46:11):
one and four playoff against the Roosters. ahead of a
2-3 playoff against the Dolphins. Yeah, look, I think we'd
all rather face the Roosters as Warriors fans purely on
the strength of what they've been doing in the last
little while. Three weeks ago, you forget this, three weeks ago,
if I'd said, yeah, who would you rather play, the
Roosters or the Dolphins, you would have all said the

(01:46:31):
Dolphins because the Roosters were top. They'd won eight straight games.
They were favourites for the minor premiership. But they've lost
their last three. to the Tigers. The Tigers? Well, actually,
that might give us hope that the Tigers could beat
the Panthers. They lost that one pointer to the Tigers.
Then they lost to the Dolphins. And then last, when

(01:46:53):
was that, Friday night? They lost to the Rabbitohs. Highly
emotional game, of course. Jai Arrow's final game. So they've
lost the last three to drop down to fourth place
and have lost any sense of momentum that they had
at all heading into the finals. They also lost to
the Warriors in the only meeting between the two this year.

(01:47:16):
It was long enough ago, though, to be almost irrelevant.
It was in round one, actually. Very first game of
the season at Go Media. The Warriors beat the Roosters
by 42 points to 18. But, I mean, I don't
think you can take anything, really, from that, apart from
the fact that when the Roosters turn up, if they do,
at Go Media Stadium, they know the last time they

(01:47:38):
were there, they had 40 put on them. But, yeah,
I think it's clearly the Dolphins that we... that we
want to come up against. A couple of other texts
here have come through. There's been some blowout scores in
the NRL this season, says Nick. Not many teams have
had 50 put on them in the regular season and
then won the title. How many teams are still going

(01:48:01):
to be in the running for the premiership with that
in mind? The other thing, it's very hard to win
the NRL from outside the top four. You know, if
you're in that sort of five to eight and We
can go through who's in there. It really is difficult
because you've got to win so much or so many
games on the road. So the Sharks are fifth. The

(01:48:23):
Rabbitohs sixth. The Knights are seventh. and the Cowboys eighth.
That's all locked in. They've all played their games. They've
all completed their seasons, their regular season. So the Sharks
will play the Cowboys next week. The Rabbitohs will play
the Knights. Knockout matches. Losers eliminated. Meantime, at the top end,

(01:48:46):
Warriors and the Panthers, whichever way they end up, will
play against the Dolphins and the Roosters. And as I've
said ad nauseum this year, but it does bear repeating,
finishing in the top two brings with it a massive
advantage in terms of being at home. You host in
week one against either the third or fourth place side.

(01:49:08):
You win that game, you get a week off, and
then you host again. And that game... if you win it,
takes you to the grand final. So it's a huge
advantage to finish in the top two. Final couple of texts.
As much as the Dolphins are in form, says this one,
they've never played finals footy. We will get the job done.

(01:49:31):
Simple as that. As much as the Dolphins show their
talent in the backs, it won't be enough to match
our forward pack on attack. The Warriors won't get the
dub easy, but it will get done. Due to that
golden opportunity, to go to the big darts. Thank you.
Appreciate that text. And Erin says, Piney, many seem fixated

(01:49:53):
on picking holes in the wars, but honestly, we as
a community need to remember what these boys have already
accomplished this season. They deserve our respect. Let's get behind
them with positivity and power. They have earned it up
the wars. Couldn't have said it better myself, Erin. And
I think there has been a growing sense of momentum

(01:50:14):
here in terms of the support behind this team. Everybody
loves a winner, of course, but the way, as you've
pointed out, Aaron, they've connected with their community and galvanised
that community and their supporter base has been terrific. Even
across the Tasman, they are by far the best supported

(01:50:36):
team in the NRL for away matches. So even if
they do have to travel away at some point, and
let's hope it's not until the grand final, you know
that those stands will be packed with Warriors fans.

Speaker 23 (01:50:47):
23-3.

Speaker 2 (01:50:48):
That game between the Tigers and the Panthers kicks off
at 6. By 8 o'clock tonight, we'll know who the
Warriors will play next week. And after that, we'll also
know which day. That hasn't been decided yet either. There
are four games next weekend. Friday night, Saturday afternoon, Saturday night,
and Sunday afternoon, presumably. We don't know yet when the

(01:51:09):
Warriors game will be. That won't be decided until after
the final game is played later on tonight. Let's take
a break. Come back. Head to Monza. We'll wrap what
happened in qualifying for the Italian Formula One Grand Prix
with motor racing journalist Peter Windsor. He's with us after this.

Speaker 5 (01:51:25):
Hear what matters in sport.

Speaker 1 (01:51:27):
Weekend Sport with Jason Pine and the Volkswagen Amarok V6.

Speaker 5 (01:51:31):
Uncompromised capability. Premium comfort. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (01:51:35):
Coming up 241 on Weekend Sport, Liam Lawson will start
from the back of the grid for Formula One's Italian
Grand Prix tomorrow morning, copping a major penalty for the
Red Bull team. who have changed the engine ahead of
the Monza race. At the front of the grid, Alpine's
Pierre Gasly claimed a shock pole position. He'll start at
the front for the first time in his career on

(01:51:57):
a track where he achieved the only win of his
career six years ago. Let's bring in award-winning and hugely
respected Formula One journalist and broadcaster and championship-winning race and
test team manager, Peter Windsor. Peter, let's start at the
front of the grid. Pierre Gasly on pole at Monza.
How big a surprise was that?

Speaker 25 (01:52:20):
It was.

Speaker 15 (01:52:21):
Anyone who's critical of this year's championship regulations, which I
have been, I have to confess to that, and I
still am, the engine regs, on the other side of
the coin, you've got to say it's throwing up some really.

Speaker 3 (01:52:32):
Cool results.

Speaker 15 (01:52:33):
Pierre had that very good race at Monaco and was
then obviously tainted by all the dramas with the speed
limit in the pit lane and everything else. But here,
a very clear pole and shocking everybody. Yeah, absolutely brilliant.
I mean, one thing about Monza is that it is
what they call an energy-poor circuit, as distinct from an

(01:52:53):
energy-rich circuit. We're speaking electric versus internal combustion engine now.
It's all a bit complicated, but... In qualifying, they reduced
the amount of electrical power you can generate quite considerably
so that the cars actually look a little bit quicker
on the straight and sound a bit better on the straight.
And I think that reduction threw quite a lot of

(01:53:14):
teams sideways. Mercedes factory team, obviously Ferrari too. And I
think it played into the hands of some of the
teams like Alpine who had fewer variables around which they
had to work and could just focus on some of
the good things about their car and keep the job uncomplicated.

Speaker 3 (01:53:30):
And Pierre has always been super quick anyway.

Speaker 15 (01:53:32):
So I think everybody delighted to see him on the pole.

Speaker 3 (01:53:34):
Really good guy as well. Nice guy. So very pleased
for them all.

Speaker 15 (01:53:38):
And also that team, Flavia Briatore is at the top
of it.

Speaker 3 (01:53:41):
But then you've got great guys like Steve Nielsen.

Speaker 15 (01:53:43):
You've got Jason Somerville and a very good Arrow.

Speaker 3 (01:53:47):
Team there now. So it seems to look really good.

Speaker 2 (01:53:50):
So what is your evaluation then of his ability to
turn that pole position into another race win?

Speaker 15 (01:54:00):
Well, my gut feeling is that when we go back
to a higher electrical rating tomorrow, it's going from five
megajoules up to seven for the race. We've been running
7.5 yesterday and this morning.

Speaker 3 (01:54:14):
I think it'll probably hurt them.

Speaker 15 (01:54:15):
I think you'll see the factory Mercedes, which historically are
the best team in Formula One this year in terms
of energy management. Again, it's sorry to be so complicated,
but that is what this championship is all about. I
think the energy management will play into the hands of
the factory Mercedes team tomorrow. And you'll see George Russell
in very, very good shape.

Speaker 3 (01:54:35):
He's on the front row.

Speaker 15 (01:54:37):
And Kimi Antonelli starting at the back by Liam Lawson,
as you say. Yeah, could well get through to the podium,
I suspect.

Speaker 2 (01:54:44):
Well, let's talk about Liam Lawson. A fascinating couple of weeks. Really,
seventh at Zandvoort, then back in the Red Bull for
a second race. First of all, Peter, how impressed have
you been with his ability to jump between two very
different Red Bull cars and teams?

Speaker 3 (01:54:59):
Oh, very impressed indeed.

Speaker 15 (01:55:00):
I thought he did an outstanding job at Zandvoort just
to get in that car and go as quickly as
he did. He was right up there with Max in
qualifying and he drove well in the race. There's no
doubt about that. He hasn't had a very good Italian
Grand Prix through no fault of his own. And as
you know, he had the engine change, as we've just mentioned.
And then he was very badly held up by Oscar

(01:55:21):
Piastri's McLaren in Q2, the middle session when he was
I think he would have got through to Q3, but
for some reason, Oscar was going really slow in the
middle of the chicane at the beginning of the lap.
And even though Max Verstappen was there in front of him,
ready to give Liam a tow, by then the damage
was done and Liam couldn't do anything about it.

Speaker 3 (01:55:39):
He was rightfully very annoyed about that.

Speaker 2 (01:55:43):
Monza turned into a difficult one for him anyway because
of the power unit change, the big grid penalty. How
difficult is that psychologically, knowing that before qualifying, effectively, it
isn't going to determine your starting position?

Speaker 15 (01:55:57):
No, I mean, for Kimi Antonelli and for Liam, in
a way, you could say, if you're not going to
be on the front row or the first two rows,
I mean, Kimi can't say that, but of course, I
think you can say that about Liam.

Speaker 3 (01:56:10):
Being at the back is.

Speaker 15 (01:56:11):
Not horrendous because there are two very tight chicanes at
Monza in the beginning of the lap. And inevitably, I
say inevitably, almost certainly there's going to be some sort
of incident there. And if you're at the back, you
can avoid that and stay out of trouble. So that's
one positive, if you want to look at it from
a positive point of view. Also, Monza's not bad for

(01:56:31):
overtaking if you've got a quick car and it's going well.
And I suspect for at least the first half of
the field, Leon will be pretty good in traffic. And
I think he'll pass quite a lot of cars. Once
he gets to sort of high midfield, it's going to
be more difficult, I think. But it'll be a fun
race for him. I think he'll be looking forward to
it in a way because he's very good at, you know,

(01:56:52):
he's good at late braking, he's good at passing, he's
an aggressive driver and he's good at getting into a
rhythm and driving well within that rhythm in the race.

Speaker 3 (01:57:01):
So I think he's probably looking forward to it.

Speaker 15 (01:57:04):
But.

Speaker 3 (01:57:05):
You know, it's obviously not great.

Speaker 15 (01:57:07):
I mean, to be honest with you, if he was
standing in the middle of the pack, you'd say, you know,
he's pretty vulnerable to somebody knocking the front wing off or.

Speaker 3 (01:57:12):
Something at the first corner.

Speaker 15 (01:57:13):
Where he is, you know, he's going to come through unscathed,
hopefully at the end of the first lap. And he's
got a race in front of him. So that's a
good thing.

Speaker 11 (01:57:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:57:20):
What then would represent a good race for him?

Speaker 15 (01:57:25):
Oh, P7, P6 from where he is in the Red Bull.
I mean, well, that's being a bit unkind. I think P8, P9, actually,
because it's quite probable Max could finish fifth or sixth,
to be honest. If nobody retires, he's going to be
struggling to finish higher than fifth or sixth. So on
that basis, Liam, I guess, you know, in the points,

(01:57:45):
you'd say he's a good drive by Liam, for sure.
If he's in the top 10, he'll be doing well.

Speaker 4 (01:57:49):
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:57:49):
And just on his journey, I mean, it's been unusual.
Dropped by Red Bull earlier last season. He's getting another
opportunity now. Do you think this latest spell in the
Red Bull gives him a genuine chance to change how
Red Bull view him long term?

Speaker 3 (01:58:04):
Yeah, I do.

Speaker 11 (01:58:05):
I do.

Speaker 15 (01:58:05):
I think if this was the Helmut Marko era, you'd
probably say not because he just loved all those young
guys coming through and he loved sort of shouting and
screaming at the ones he didn't like, who didn't deliver
and then getting another. batch but they seem to be
a bit more mature now I think in the way
they're approaching their drivers and I think that's shown with
the way Yoki Tsunoda has been treated as well I
mean he's just the third driver at Red Bull and

(01:58:27):
they put him into the the B team, and he's
done a very good job. And I think they will
treat Liam with a lot of respect now because what
he did at Zandvoort and the feedback he's giving. I think,
you know, they'll realize they've got quite a valuable property there.
And I don't mean that in terms of financial terms.
I mean in real terms. And I think I'd like–

(01:58:47):
I'm pretty sure they will treat him quite well now.
I'm not quite sure what that will manifest itself into being,
but I think his stock has risen as a result
of the drive at Zandvoort.

Speaker 22 (01:58:58):
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:58:59):
Look forward to that. Just to circle back to the race.
Then to finish, Peter, as we say, Gasly on pole.
He's got George Russell and the Mercedes alongside. Look, as
you've outlined, Monza's a track where there are overtaking opportunities.
What do you see playing out? And to ask the
question I asked earlier, can Gasly actually win it from

(01:59:19):
pole or not?

Speaker 15 (01:59:21):
Well, my gut feeling is no for the reasons I said.
I think with the more electrical power available, with which
they have to play in the race, Mercedes are so
good at the way they manage the energy around the lap.
That is what they've done all year. They are the
gold standard at that. And as I say, when you

(01:59:42):
reduce the power, as we had in qualifying, it kind
of nullifies some of that advantage that Mercedes normally have.
But it will come back in the race at seven megajoules.
So I think not that Alpine will do a bad
job in the race. I just think the Mercedes will
eventually prevail over the Alpine. And I suspect Ferrari will
be looking stronger than they did in qualifying for the

(02:00:04):
same reasons. I think they got hurt by the five
megajoule thing quite a lot. And I think with seven,
they'll be back pretty near Mercedes and probably therefore able
to beat.

Speaker 3 (02:00:15):
I'd probably be able to beat McLaren and Alpine, I
would have thought, in the race.

Speaker 2 (02:00:19):
Peter, you've given us outstanding analysis as always. Thanks so
much for joining us across New Zealand. Really appreciate your time.

Speaker 3 (02:00:26):
Great pleasure.

Speaker 15 (02:00:26):
I just want to say how brilliant it was to
see Ryan Fox win the Open.

Speaker 3 (02:00:31):
So pleased to see that. Absolutely brilliant. Foxy, go for it, man.

Speaker 2 (02:00:37):
I love it, Peter. Thanks indeed. Yeah, very proud of
Ryan Fox. That's Peter Windsor, award-winning and hugely respected Formula
One journalist and broadcaster. So Liam Lawson, along with Kimi
Antonelli and Alexander Elbon, will all start from the back
of the field due to using additional power unit elements
or their teams doing so. Oscar Piastre has also been

(02:00:57):
handed a three-place grid drop. for impeding other drivers in qualifying.
Pierre Gasly in the Alpine at the front of the grid,
George Russell in the Mercedes alongside. Charles Leclerc and Lewis
Hamilton make up the second row of the grid in
their Ferraris. Then Max Verstappen, Oscar Piastri in the third row.

(02:01:19):
So Gasly, Russell, Leclerc, Hamilton, Verstappen, Piastri. But Watching Liam
come from the back of the field will be a
really interesting exercise in itself to see how he goes
in a fast car from the back, trying to pass
as many of the cars in front of him as
he can. We might find out quite a bit about

(02:01:39):
Liam Lawson's development and progress as a Formula One driver
at Monza. One o'clock tomorrow morning, the race gets underway.
Nine to three, Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 1 (02:01:50):
The big names and the big calls on your home
of sport. Weekend Sport with Jason Fine. Newstalk ZB.

Speaker 2 (02:01:58):
Six away from three. Just a couple of things to
mop up in terms of some live sport. In the NPC,
Counties Manukau, against Southland. This game is in Pukekohe, approaching halftime.
In fact, it is halftime. Counties Manukau with a 19-5
lead at the moment. North Harbour take on Northland at
5 past 5. This game at North Harbour Stadium in Albany.

(02:02:19):
Intriguing clash, this one, really. Northland, as we know, have
the Ranfuli Shield. Shield not on the line in this
one because they're away. But North Harbour, with victory, could
jump from 6th all the way up to 2nd on
the table. Similarly, Northland can also go 2nd. if they
get victory at Albany this afternoon. So those are the
two remaining NPC matches in round six of our provincial

(02:02:43):
rugby competition. And just on that NRL equation, Panthers, Tigers,
five past six, Combank Stadium in Sydney. Remembering, of course,
that for the Warriors to win the minor premiership, they
need the West Tigers to beat the Panthers, which the
TAB say is most unlikely. Panthers are $ 1. 08, the Tigers $ 7.

Speaker 4 (02:03:04):
75.

Speaker 2 (02:03:05):
So yeah, it looks as though the Warriors will finish second,
even with a record number of wins, and it'll be
the Dolphins next week. That'll all be confirmed a bit
later on tonight. Huge thanks to Andy McDonald for producing.
Great work, mate. Enjoy a couple of hours off this afternoon.
Tim Beveridge is on your radio after three. Thank you
so much for listening in, especially to all the dads

(02:03:27):
on Father's Day. Hope it's been a good one for you.
Taking us out, father and son, Cat Stevens. See you
on Sports Talk tomorrow night. Bye for now.

Speaker 19 (02:03:38):
It's not time.

Speaker 27 (02:03:40):
To make a change Just sit down take it slowly
you're still young that's your fault there's so much.

Speaker 24 (02:03:50):
You have to go through find a girl settle down
if you want you can marry look at me i
am old but i'm happy.

Speaker 2 (02:04:07):
All the times.

Speaker 25 (02:04:08):
That I've cried Keeping all the things.

Speaker 24 (02:04:12):
I knew inside It's hard But it's harder to ignore

Speaker 1 (02:04:20):
It If they were right I'd agree But it's them
they know Not me Now there's a way And I
know That I have to go away I know I
have to go.