March 12, 2026 • 32 mins
For Friday Faceoff this week Nick is joined in the studio by lawyer and former MP Stephen Franks and managing director of Gazley Motors Myles Gazley.
Starting with the government's warnings of carless days due to fuel shortages from the Iran conflict.
Gazley and Franks give their insight into the issue, the response from the government and the public. Should the government implement the idea, or are there better alternatives?
Then how's our council doing? As the spending budget for Mayor Little's triennium plan goes through - with amendments to climate funds. Our panel faceoff on the solution - is it amalgamation?
We hear what the panel think of the Wellington mayors' letter to the Prime Minister opposing move on orders.
And Te Matapihi Wellington Central Library opens tomorrow. What do Gazley and Franks think of the 178k opening celebration budget? And is this the library of the future, or an overspend?
Plus they give their hots or nots for the week.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk said B Wellington's official week interview. It's
Friday facearf with Kudovic Property Management, a better rental experience
for all. Visit Kudovic dot cot on its head.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Thursday starts by seven minutes past eleven. Friday face Off
got a couple of characters from Wellington dragged a couple
of old boys from around the town to get into
the studio and have a chat about this news of
the week. Stephen Frank's former MP and lawyer, Good morning, Stephen,
good morning. Can you come a little bit closer to
the microphone? And Myles Gaisly, managing director of Gazely's motor businessman, entrepreneur, Wellingtonian.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Great guy, what's up? Good morning little Can I come
a little bit close closer?
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
I want the microphone away. You have to have to
get on like a popsicle more than a microphone. I
don't know about that. That changes my mind a little bit.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Going.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Let's talk about what we started the show with this morning,
Carla days.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Stephen Franks. Can you remember Carlo's days?
Speaker 4 (01:09):
Yeah? I do, I can remember them. I support the
moves to get us prepared. It's just nuts that we're
just still sailing along relying only on price rationing. In
New Zealand. New Zealanders responded really well to collective self help.
When we used to start running out of water in
(01:30):
the South Island for power, we could get it up
to a fifteen percent saving just by telling people please
please save. And the government should have been doing that.
I think they've been trying to say, oh, we've got
it in hand, and.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
How bad do you think it is? I mean, you
know how government works. You been in there, you know
what's going on. Do you reckon it's as bad or
as good as they're telling us.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
I think they wouldn't be. The figures that they're giving
will be right. But the notion that you can get
a twenty percent reduction in world oil supply and New
Zealand will still get even eighty percent of what we
previously got is pretty fanciful. There are big players out
there who will be saying no, we want all that
(02:11):
we need, and one of them is China, and we
know already that they're getting what they need. And there
will be other strong economies that will be able to
weigh out bid us to divert tankers that we think
would be quite helpful to us. Well, they'll be diverted
to places that can pay more. That's that's how it'll
end up.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Going to you, Miles. I mean, this is your your
business warning, my friend. All day, I've been tell us
what your guys have been thinking.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
I mean, think about this. I mean, the government used
a nine thousand dollars subsidy to try and push EV's along.
That will be nothing compared to what's going to push
people into EV's at the moment. Should they have stayed
with that EV? No, No, that was a complete waste
of taxpayers money. But I mean the point is, though,
is that a real market forces which we're seeing today
are going to be the biggest indicator and the biggest
push to EV that we'll probably see in our lifetime.
(02:57):
If fuel goes to four dollars, you know, eliter, you'll
see you know, the average family person really considering an
electric vehicle. But the point is, we've already got a
massive uptake of PHGV, which is a battery powered car
with a petrol motor, which in many cases like the
Mitsubushi Outlander, for example, which is one of our biggest
selling phgvs runs eighty ks to eighty five k's on
(03:18):
pure electric energy with the ability to then go on
to petrol. Now, most people, if you looked at what
they do in a daily on a daily amount, wouldn't
even do that many case. So they hardly ever use
full when they get home and night. Yeah, we've got
a charge at home. My wife's got one for the children,
and we don't ever use petrol. I can't remember when
Iver saw a debit on a field card. I mean,
we just don't. We don't use it anymore. So there's
(03:38):
already a huge amount of those. And if you look
at the curve at the moment in the market, the
uptake on PAHGV has been immense, or you know, hybrid
in general has been immense, but pH GV particularly is
a very good option because it gives you both for it,
and we're going to see a lot more of that,
and we have in the last three days. We're just
beginning hammered by inquiry on PHGV electric cars. So what
happens is if you want to buy a car right now,
(04:02):
when you go into your yard and you look, oh,
I want this or I want that, right, what happens
to your your salespeople say, well, it could be four
dollars a leader. So have you looked at us other
people coming? Pretty I mean I think people are you know,
they come with their own ideas of what they want,
you know, and if they're looking for a fuel saving
vehicle on this shopping list of course is you know,
electric vehicle or a PHGV and they've done most of
(04:22):
their research online. Really, you know, most buyers are quite educated.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
What percentage would be buying evs now? What percentage of
people for.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Twelve the last twelve months, I'm not sure what the
actual numbers. I think it's like I think we are
we're up to sort of seven or eight percent of
the country. I'm not sure what it is, but whatever's
asked that now people are asking a lot more than that.
I mean, the inquiry on EV would have doubled in
the last three or four days, maybe troubled very rational, Yeah, yeah,
which makes sense.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
Doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
I mean why would you? I mean why would you?
Why would you be buying a vehicle when you can
buy one an EV now is the same price as
a petrol car. So what do you want? To do
you want to pay you know, three fifty year Elida
soon maybe four? Or do you want to plug in.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
The issue that I have Stephen Franks, And you've just
admitted that you just put your name down and are
buying and have you had an EV before?
Speaker 3 (05:04):
And a huge mistake on the Tesla They we all
make errors in life that and you made.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
One as well, But that's okay, no comment. But the
thing is that you do a lot of driving, and
I do a lot of driving, right, And there's still
the issue when you want to go to New Plymouth
somewhere along the line, you've got to stop at Balls
and have a coffee and charge up. And that's half
an hour rather than two minutes or five minutes at
a gas station, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
Yeah, But you accommodate. Thirty years ago or twenty years
ago when we had the card stage, when we were
worried about supply, we had a Nissan Patrol with a
gas cylinder.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
And you remember those yeah, yeah, And.
Speaker 4 (05:41):
We could only two hundred and fifteen kilomeitus on that
because you know, and they were gutless. It was a
big engine, but it could grind. But you just got
used to the fact that you had to look for
where it's where it would be, and you're going to
have to have a cup of tea.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
I say to my customers, it's like when you first
got a cell phone, right, people charge a little bit here,
a little bit there first. In the end you realize
you just charge it overnight. It was ready for the
new day, and it was always on next to you,
and it was plugged in, and the next day you
woke up you had a full battery. And the same
with a car. If you've got a charger at home,
which most people do when they buy an electric car,
you just plug it them before you go to sleep,
(06:16):
and you wake up in the morning you've got a
new day in new cars, all organized. And that's not
a daily thing, you know, most most Keiwis will charge
the cars once a week, you know, I think it
has to be more than once. It's Steve, just just
a little bit of a hint here. Have you bought
the fast charger with your with your new car? Did
you do that?
Speaker 4 (06:30):
I've bought a charger. I don't know what it is.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Well, you need to, doesn't it You need to have
the fast charge?
Speaker 3 (06:34):
Well, it depends if you go three. If you've got
three phase power at Homer, you've got a really fast charger.
But the one that I've got at home is completely sufficient.
It will charge overnight, you know, to fall to one
hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Yeah, I think it makes a hell of a difference
if you've got a full charge. Do you think that
the government Stephen, I'll come to you on this. Do
you think the government's got the under control? Do you
feel that they know what's going on or are they're
just going to wing it as they go. I imagine that
they have pretty good figures and expectations. What I think
is that modern governments are terrified of taking the people
into their confidence. They want to soothe them all the time,
(07:05):
so that they create a system where they say we're
looking after it. Because again it's partly a media product.
Media will will pick on any sign of uncertainty and
turn it into incompetence weakness, so that a Frank, if
we'd had a Frank Minister of energy come out and say, hey,
this could get really serious, he'd be scared that there'd
(07:28):
be a massive rush and everyone stockpiling in cans.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
That anyway that's going to happen.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
Anyway, yeah, just trust the people and ignore ignore the critics.
But at the moment, we're probably we will get announcements
and I fear that they're probably going to try and
fudget that the thing that we'll say the most money,
unfortunately will be price rationing.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
And that's just if the price goes up. Is there
an alternative, Miles, Is there anything else we could do?
Speaker 3 (07:55):
But I think I think we're in a different market though.
Look look at if you look at the makeup of
the New Zealand car Park as we call it. You know,
the amount of cars in the country. We have quite
a few vehicles that are low emission right and an
ev energy you know. So things have changed. And go
back to the nineteen seventies, we drove some pretty inefficient vehicles,
let's think about it. I mean, terrible gas burning things.
I mean now things have changed. Even your most modest
(08:18):
family car, you know, might only do you know, six
leaders or seven leaders per hundred k of driving, you know,
so they're really good compared to what they used to be.
They're not twelve, thirteen or forteen anymore. So I think,
you know, we've changed a lot, you know, and the
technology has already been changing for the last twenty years,
so cars are way different than what they were. I
don't think it's going to be as much of a
panic as people are making out. I think there's a
(08:39):
lot of you know, there's been a lot of media
sensationalizing all this as well. I mean, there's definitely going
to be a price hike, but we'll guess will petrol
run out?
Speaker 4 (08:46):
I don't know. I think that they could do things that,
for example, make car pooling really popular. Change the law
so that you you don't fear any risk of being
an informal taxi drive.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
We'll drive in the bus lanes if you've got more
than two people in the cake can driving the bus lanes,
which will fix a lot of the tickets that people
are getting at the moment right. But also it actually
would make us more efficient, and we were spending all
this money on cycle ways. They can get up in
their bicycle and they can buzz around town, which is
a good idea.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Has anyone talked about their bust think it's a great idea.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
I don't. I think two too. I always got some
very good ideas, though you do. That's why we invited
you it now.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
But that's I think needs to be more than two,
because that's just you and your take it three Stephens.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Three Parson legislation. Now while we're in here, we'll do
will make it three three, okay more than we see
someone of the back seat with the head poking out all.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Right, false pump up exactly up by their face off
of Stephen Franks and Miles Gazely. Wellington City Council yesterday
had their sort of big discussion over the budgets and
how they were going to bring back their three year plan,
how they were going to tapen up to me, Miles Gaizely.
One thing came through when the Greens flexed their muscle.
(09:52):
They still got control. They still got the spending on
the Green initiatives that they wanted spent and got cut
somewhere else. Has anything really changed at Wellington City Council.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
I think it has. I think in some ways. I mean,
and I've dealt with Andrew times recently and I think
he's doing the best he can with an interesting bunch.
You know, you've got a three way table there, You've
got a split a six Centrists, you've got four Greens
and six Labor and I think you know it's it's
a negotiation game. And this is if if you look
at some of the things that they've actually passed, a
lot of them are an agreement to further investigate, yes,
(10:27):
some of you know, and there are some things in there, like,
for example, the land based rating valuation thing. I mean,
that's an interesting one, isn't it, because you know that
he's agreed to look at it.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
But he agreed to look at a lot of things
to be fair.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Yeah, but that's right. But looking at things and doing
things are two different things, right, And if you've got
to get your tridium pan passed and you need all
the votes you can, the center out and voting your way,
he's had to try and work his way around. And
I'm not saying I support it. I'm just saying that
would be what I would see from the outside, and
I think Steven would agree, being you know, being in
the in the in parliament before that. He's had to
play both sides of the fence to try and get
this thing through. Now well, last and Water was a
(10:59):
plan sitting in the ether again and going nowhere. So
he's got it through and I suppose now he's got
to negotiate with all the parties around the table to
try and get the results that he thinks the city needs.
You know, so I think that would be it. I mean,
if you look at the land based rating system right
that they're trying to push through, I mean it's voodo economics,
because if you look at the ones that will affect
the most are the people we need to succeed, like
(11:21):
people like Row's taken on, you know, reading the cinema
and all that land outside, He'll be getting rated the
same as someone with a twenty story building on it.
I mean it's insane. I mean it won't occur. I
don't think Peter Jackson with his movie museum, imagine what
his rates will be on those hectars and hectares of
land Shelley Bay. These are all going to be public
amenities that they would agree to pump up the rates
(11:42):
on to make them nearly unaffordable to own and to
actually operate. I mean it makes no sense.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
But as a commercial property owner in the city, you
know that it doesn't make any sense anyway, because you'll
be talking to car dealers at Auckland that are paying
a hell.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Of a lot less rates than you. Listen, it's terrible.
I mean Wellington. At the moment, a Wellington rate payer,
a commercial rate payer, pays three points seven times more
than a residential rate payer. Now the residential rate payers
rates are high anyway, So three points seven times high?
Are we nearly one point two more than Auckland. It's insane.
So if they do have to, if they are going
to do this, this land based rating value system, they're
(12:13):
going to have to zero back the commercial rates and
then they're gonna have to add that on top of it.
But remember this, we're not far from amalgamation. It's going
to happen. Okay. Now, no other councils in the whole
region have a land based rating system, right, so there's
no way they're all going.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
To You've given up? Are you giving up? Giving up?
What on this algamation stuff?
Speaker 3 (12:35):
As absolutely.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Tell you Stephen Franks, because we've talked about it before
on the show. He hates the idea of amalgamist well,
he wants to actually divide Wellington up again.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Go again, tell us what you want to do. Yeah, no,
I don't want to know.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
We've got the divisions that we need that we have,
and you don't want to reorganize for real. The only
people who went out of reorganizations are the big consulting
firms and and the HR people. But I'm I am
concerned at the thought that the whole of the Wellington
region could be infected by the nutcases who dominate Wellington's politics,
(13:11):
which is what would happen, because they love politics. Other
people don't. That's why the left winds all the time,
because other people tend to have other things in their life.
But you'd get Wellington ro O Valley essentially driving the
region and in many countries, in many places, in many
countries you badly need to have other local, nearby local
(13:35):
authorities that can show the difference. And the best example
is why Makeerari and Selwyn showed up christ Church. Christ
Church was paralyzed after the earthquake, paralyzed, Wymakerari was pretty good.
Selwyn was getting its building consents and resource consents out
in five days. Now. If there had all been part
of ECAN, they'd have been totally stuffed. And the last
(13:58):
thing the Wellington region needs is to spread has spread
the Wellington central ethos across the whole You can't how
do you do it? It depends it depends who loves politics
the most. The left. The left in cities all over
the world, they win. Look at what look at look
at Zorn Mndami in New York, the center of capitalism,
and you've got a nutcase socialist running it because they
(14:21):
love politics and you you cannot get away from that.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
Well, let's wait and see how the actual makeup it works.
Because if they had representation, like you've got people like
fran Over and the wire Rapper and things, I mean
that they would have probably a voice on the main council.
They wouldn't be part of it, wy Rapper. We've tried that.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
New Zealand already has really big local authorities. We we
are way above most world worlds, and in fact they're not.
They're not local authorities. Most of them are now regional government.
And we would get more value because there's quite a
lot of economic evidence that the optimum size for a
(15:01):
local authority is somewhere in the two hundred thousand. You
start getting above that and you get the empires that
you've got more.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
I forgot to warn you that, Stephen, We're not going
to ground everything, but I just think the less pureocracy
there is, the better and I personally don't know that.
I think a job like that might actually not actually
attract a nutter, you know, it might actually attract someone
that actually wants the job, and you might get a
different makeup in that group. You know, we can't always
believe in the worst.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
I mean, we've had a bad run, right, and I
think people like Stephen are clearly you know, you know,
a but gun shy about the whole thing. But you've
got to believe in the future. You've got to believe
that things will get better.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
Well, it depends whether you change the system.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Well, it depends howe's laid out, and it depends how
they actually roll it out. Because if you've got.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
To setting systems worked well when rate payers had votes,
but now we don't. So now the students can come
down here and dominate.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Well maybe you can put that as a rent.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
Well, you're not going to see it. I mean, you've
got to be realistic. We are where we are.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Why does that happen? Tell me why that happens? I mean,
that's not right. Why the students can come and vote.
I agree with Steve and I think it should be
rate payers only that we pay for our city, and
we should be voting. I mean, and how that should
How can the how they go and collate votes of
people that have no financial interest in the city whatsoever.
It's ridiculous. You know, they're basically staying here for studio
(16:12):
for study, which is that doesn't make any sense. Why
did that come in? Stephen? Do you know that with
your background?
Speaker 4 (16:18):
I came from the left and we had this belief
that fat cats and people with money were ripping the
world off, and if we gave everyone equal power, we
would we would transform it, and greed would go and
we'd live in a paradise. It. Well, of course it hasn't,
and it never does, and you get Venezuela. You've got
(16:40):
example after example after example. But Wellington is dominated by
people who want to vote for nice ideas.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
Okay, let's keep it with the city council. I don't
know whether you guys saw it, but a letter from
all the mayors and the so called would be and
should be people that run the city wrote to the
Prime Minister said they don't want this new law about
moving the people on that are living living on the streets.
They want them to find the government to find them
all a nice place to live and try and do
all the things which you know all of us wouldn't
(17:09):
disagree with, but the moving on laws, at least the
government was doing something.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
Miles.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
You would talk to a lot of business people every
day of the week. They would not like these people
living on the streets.
Speaker 3 (17:20):
No, And I think I think it's hard because we've
had a lot to do with city mission and things, right,
so I understand I understand the pressure that's they're under
to actually, you know, to house these people. I mean,
it's a really difficult situation. Yes, I don't think people
should be being in the doorways of lampin Key and
lying there all day, you know, and sort of creating
a nuisance, but they do need somewhere to go. And
I'm not an expert on this field, but it's a
(17:41):
really tough balance. But what this does do is gives
the police the ability to move people along that are
causing nuisance. And they don't have that ability at the moment,
no matter what anyone says, they don't. So I don't know.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
It's were you had even slightly confused why the mayors
were jumping in on this though.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
I read it yesterday. I couldn't get my head around it. Really,
I mean, I mean, it's it really does make the
central city feel a bit unsafe, and it is I
don't know. You need the central so to be polished
and exciting and a place people to visit, so you
actually encourage retail and jobs and things, right, that's really important.
And if these people and there's you know, it's only
a small group, need to be our house somewhere. We
(18:19):
need to work with that and put them somewhere where
they feel safe and they aren't in a situation where
they're in the situation that we're in a doorway, lying
in a rug, you know, with a sleeping bag. You know,
it's sad, really sad. Stephen, when you saw this.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Media attention to the fact that these mayors had written
to the prime mister, what are your thoughts?
Speaker 4 (18:37):
I just thought, how again, how different the theory of
democracy is from the reality. You'd think that they would
be representing the mayors would want to represent the views
and concerns of the people in the district. No, they don't,
And matters like this, they're responding to the very small
carters of people who are active in their constituency. That
(18:59):
is Labor and Grand parties. They are saying, we're virtuous.
We know the government's going to ignore it, so we
can say fulle bleat about this, because we want to
show you that we are on your side, not the
side of people who are concerned about the city, the
side of those who actually nominate them. It's internal party politics,
and in all the Western democracies at the moment, the
(19:21):
political parties have become much more extreme than the people
as a whole. The political parties have views and values.
I mean, it's the inside the Greens and Labor. It
would be the end of your political career to say that,
you know the difference between a man and a woman.
They've got views that are not mainstream. But that's how
(19:42):
our politics now works. Right, So did they do the
right thing by seeing that it's stupid? Yeah, I mean,
but I pit on our hand. In terms of theater
it plays to to The coalition won't mind because they
know what people want. They know our four bears did
it better. When we grew up. You never saw beggars ever,
(20:06):
and the police had a law called that they could
enforce called no visible means of support. If you were
living without any any means they could, but of course
then there were institutions to send them to.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Yeah, that that is where I think we've got a problem.
But anyway, let's move Friday face off with Miles Gayzy
and Stephen Franks a couple of other things.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
I really wanted to go on.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Wellington Chamber of Commerce quarterly Business Confidence survey results came
out this week. Eighteen percent of Wellington thought Wellington businesses
thought Wellington was on the right track. That's pretty low number, Miles,
I'm looking at you for this. Forty five thought it
was on the forty five percent thought it was on
the wrong track, and thirty seven didn't percent did not know.
I mean eighteen percent, it's less than twenty percent thought.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
We were on the right track. Yeah, I mean the
city doesn't feel like it supports business, you know. And
I think that's probably the most important problem we've got,
is that if you look at it, we just don't
seem to understand that commerce builds jobs, which builds a
better life everybody. Right, So if you support business and
you make it easy for people to park, and you
encourage retail shops to stay open and not close, and
(21:12):
you know, you don't do silly things like closing roads
and bits and pieces. You'll actually end up, you know,
and create parking. You know, you know you'll end up
the city will be a better place. And I'll give
you an idea at the moment. Do you know that
next to the Embassy Theater, there's that big empty space
there a right that was was motorcycles stop years ago,
right next to the theater and there's no if you
go to So if you go to the Embassy Theater
(21:33):
right you park. You can't park at nighttime right because
all the residents are in there. The council will not
allow that land owner to turn that into a car park.
Not allowed to I'm not joking, I have no idea.
So the council will not allow that to be a
car park. So the lady that owns that it is
playing rates on empty land. It's got access from the
back from the rear from Mount Victoria, so you can
(21:53):
coming from the back and it's got access to come
out of the front. And it's right next to our
most famous theater. And it is not allowed to be
a car.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Paigner's car. They've taken a whole of a car parking.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
And I've taken all the car parking out from the area.
So if you want to be spontaneous and take your
kids of the theater, can't park you fit probably forty or
fifty cars here more Probably it could actually could actually
actually really help. You know, the theater, which I think
is owned by the council, isn't it yeap, yes it
is now ironically, but but you know, these sorts of things.
But we're just not friendly to business. We're not encouraging
(22:23):
people to spend. We're not encouraging people to come to
the city.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
You know.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
Like my mother, if she's listening, she said the right
thing the other day, Like the car parking times are
two hour maximum, right, No, you go to a movie
or take your kids to the opera, you can get
a ticket before you even come out. Or you don't
have a coffee and you have a great chat like
happened to me.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
I had a chat with an old mate having a
coffee and I went over the two hours to myself.
Speaker 3 (22:44):
You know you've got to ticket. You can go a ticket,
But I mean, make weekends free parking in the city.
Make it free parking after five pm. Encourage people to
come to town and go to movies, go to shows,
go to the restaurants. It doesn't take a scientist to
work this out. And if you took it, if you
look at the lost revenue we're getting out of all
the empty shops and rate people can't afford to paying things,
and dump it back into actually making an incentive for
people to actually come to the town. You'd fix it
(23:05):
in no time at all. But you've just got to
think that commerce builds jobs, builds wealth and health, and
we need the city to run in that direction.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
I'm still completely confused over the fact that they can't
allow that to be a car park.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Stephen, I saw you look at that too.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
I mean, I mean this is a city for having
a green light opening up and trying to make it.
Speaker 4 (23:23):
That's why it's why I objected earlier to the idea
of inflicting the whole region with the ethos of the
people who control Wellington. Political problem is that there will
be a number of probably council offices, but a whole
lot of voters will be feeling virtuous about that. Because
we must make using car private cars unattractive, they must
use buses and they don't care. They don't even know
(23:45):
the cost but they don't try to count it. They
don't care about that cost. And I remember a business,
someone actually in the IT industry, telling me years ago
that they came to Wellington. It sounds, it sounds sort
of superficial when he came to Wellington because they had
that stock exchange ticket tape on the Odland building and
(24:08):
he said, a city that will allow that to be
running on a prominent building on their harbor must be
business friendly. And he was really, so, you're quite right
about the climate, the flavor, but at the moment they delight.
I mean, they want to spend one hundred million putting
you know, flower boxes and stuff in the road so
you can't drive in them and parking them, but they
(24:29):
won't allow someone to park. Well, that tells you who's
in control.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Take a short break, because I'm still flabbergasted by that.
But I tell you what, I ain't going to let
up on that. I'm not going to let up on that.
Over the next couple of weeks. I'm going to find
out what the hell's going on with that. Why the
hell that's not a car?
Speaker 3 (24:42):
We can take ahad leave and be a car park.
Go Mills car parking Gaisly car parking.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
There would be more Gaisly's Caryard Mills and Gazey's Caryard
Friday face off. The Wellington Library, which has been refurbished,
three strength rebuilt, opens again tomorrow. The bill costs two
hundred and seventeen million dollars.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
Now I have been privileged to go through and have
a look. It's way way over the top.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
It's got everything you could possibly ever think of in
a library. It probably is like an event center as
well as a library. Was the opening party. The opening
welcoming ceremony was supposed to cost four one hundred and
five thousand dollars. Stephen Franks, I'm coming to you first
on this. Andrew Littelmeyer saw this and lowered it to
(25:27):
one hundred and seventy eight. Do we need all this
for a public library? Well, in terms of the opening ceremony,
absolutely not. The rest of it, I can't, okay. Public
libraries have becoming.
Speaker 4 (25:41):
Community hubs. Yes, for all sorts of activities. Yes, And
there are some great cities that have got spectacular libraries.
Helsinki's an example. But I think the christ Church has
done very attractive Yeah. So yes, in the sense that
cities do need to feel good about themselves and proud
of things they've got. I hope it is good. I
(26:01):
thought it was an absurd waste of money. But it's
done spend. It'll be the same when we get the
New Town Hall. It's been done, so we just got
to make the best of it now. And I don't
think that spending on a whole lot of the lovies
who can all congratulate each other and who've probably mostly
had nothing to do with it would have been a
(26:22):
good spend of money. I think even one hundred and
eighty thousand is inexplicable. If they want to celebrate sell tickets, don't.
If that's because they're going to bring along a whole
lot of people who've been great contributors, that might be different,
But I suspect it's not. No.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
And I mean, we know that the New Town Fair
got one hundred thousand or so called one hundred thousand peopce.
We know that Kubaduba gets hundreds of thousands of people.
People turn up the free events, the opening of a library,
it's a free event miles. So do we need to
spend that sort of money doing all the welcoming parties
and stuff.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
No, it's quite so it's a public asset. You know,
it's great payers paying for this one hundred and seventy
eight thousand dollars. And I think at the moment, with
the way rates looking, I don't think anyone would agree it.
I think it's a shambles. I don't think you need
a nice speech and a microphone and have a nice
day would have been better. I would have thought.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
The thing is that, And I do want to put
where credit's due. If that's the new way, and you
talk about the hell Sinki one and the christ Church's Library,
if that's the new way libraries are going, they've nailed it.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
They've nailed it.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
I mean it's got every single facility. You can go
in there and you can check for your files, for
your properties.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
That we've forgotten. The population of hell Sinki, what is it.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
Well, I'm sure what will be two hundred and something thousands.
So I mean you've got to look at you good,
look at what we've spent the money on. And I mean,
if you look at what's happened in that whole civic
square area there, we then demolished the council the Council
Chambers building for no particular reason, and then went and
rented on the waterfront a private you know, a building
that was owned by you know, another company, and we're
moving all the council staff in the air at a
(27:59):
huge cost when we could have actually been when you
look at the review that was done by Deloittes, we're
three hundred staff too many already in the council. So
if we've got rid of the people that needed to go,
you know, and or consolidate them in other roles, and
then done up our own building and kept it, which
would have had you know, no deed on it, we
would have been as much smarter move. But it's not
how the council seemed to think. That's different.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
The other thing that's always been wrong with that Civic
Square area is that there was what was the nick
Ow but otherwise it was dead because it didn't have
commerce around it. It needed all of those ground floor
areas to be with cafes percent and going back and
then you.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Know, I don't know, it was a great cafe, the
best k Jurie in Wellington number one.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
Apparently they've released it. They make that major property company precinct.
I think they've got a big lease in there.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
We've got an option on some of the land like
where Civic thea Civic Buildings was and right around there
to add some commerce to it. And I think that'll
probably have to have some retail and things on the
bottom floor as part of the agreement.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Maybe I think we should start a movement from Nick
to be able to start.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
His next cafe. It's a good idea.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Yeah, very good idea, great idea. Thanks very much for that.
Help fund it.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
The Friday.
Speaker 3 (29:10):
Hot than not.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Okay, Stephen Franks, I'm coming to you first. What was
the big hot for you for the week and what
was you're not hot for the week?
Speaker 4 (29:20):
Well, the hot's going to be a paradox. I just
love the fact that there are so many Wellingtonians who
go swimming in the cold water. Yeah. I go down
and see those people trawling past the raft and around
the fountain, and that didn't happen thirty four years ago.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
Cold well.
Speaker 4 (29:38):
I don't know whether the contemporaries change or just people
have got a bit more staunch, but I think it's
really cool. And I died back a bit when they
thought that the ship might be coming in from the
Harbor entrance, but they seem to be back. I think
I just that that really does it for me, really good.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
What's you're not hot? What's upset you this week?
Speaker 4 (29:58):
It hasn't upset me. I'm just going to comment on it. Though.
It's seeing all these limescooters arrive and not quite I
hadn't realize I'm out of touch. I didn't even know
they're coming. And I just opened up a sub yesterday
and they are damn good. But I really hope that
it doesn't. Yeah, I love them. I think I came
here on one, not on the line. I can't here
(30:21):
on a flip. I come here on a flamingo. But
I think those scooters are fantastic. I realized that there
is a problem of shared use.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
Did you put a helmet on?
Speaker 4 (30:29):
No? Well, the poor, the poor Lime guys have got
all these useless helmets that've been made to put on
all our head sizes are different. I can't wear a
helmet under sixty.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
It's just do you think they should be in the
bike LANs?
Speaker 4 (30:40):
Though?
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Yeah, of course they should changing.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
Yeah they changed.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
What what's the hots and lots for you for this week?
I tell the hots. I just went and met with
a friend of mine, Mike Petre, who's a barber up
in Kuma Street, and him and Lizzie Carson's and a
few of them. There's the empty site in it's what
is the address, forty five gauzy with a building boomed down,
you know, the one that was sitting there. So they're
they're fundraising working through that at the moment to build
a like a sort of a portal over it, like
a glass roof well the hole of new palms and
(31:06):
stuff insight and make it an area for Onetingtonians to
go and pack up. And it's going to be it's
a fantastic I've got the things that I'll show you later.
It's gorgeous. They're trying to find sponsors and they're working
through the whole program at the moment where they'll take
over the land. It's owned by another lady when the
building burned down. She's happy to try and get the
to give the land to the city for five years
as part of the program. And it's just a great idea.
(31:27):
It's just a waste of space and it could become
a really cool thing. So what'sit like? It the smell
of poo when I came in the other night from
Melbourne at the airport. Didn't like that very much, did you?
Could you smell it?
Speaker 4 (31:36):
Could you smell? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (31:37):
It wasn't good. It wasn't great. Not the first thing
you want to smell when you walk out of the tone.
Speaker 4 (31:42):
We need, we need the long outfall reda.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
We need something, we need a five Stephen Franks, Miles Gasey,
thank you for taking time and you're very very busy
week to come and share your views with the people
of Wellington. We appreciate you both. We appreciate you both
for what you do for our city. So thank you
very much. Have a great, great weekend.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks It'd Be Wellington from nine am weekday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk said B Wellington's official week interview. It's
Friday facearf with Kudovic Property Management, a better rental experience
for all. Visit Kudovic dot cot on its head.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Thursday starts by seven minutes past eleven. Friday face Off
got a couple of characters from Wellington dragged a couple
of old boys from around the town to get into
the studio and have a chat about this news of
the week. Stephen Frank's former MP and lawyer, Good morning, Stephen,
good morning. Can you come a little bit closer to
the microphone? And Myles Gaisly, managing director of Gazely's motor businessman, entrepreneur, Wellingtonian.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Great guy, what's up? Good morning little Can I come
a little bit close closer?
Speaker 4 (00:53):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
I want the microphone away. You have to have to
get on like a popsicle more than a microphone. I
don't know about that. That changes my mind a little bit.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Going.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Let's talk about what we started the show with this morning,
Carla days.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Stephen Franks. Can you remember Carlo's days?
Speaker 4 (01:09):
Yeah? I do, I can remember them. I support the
moves to get us prepared. It's just nuts that we're
just still sailing along relying only on price rationing. In
New Zealand. New Zealanders responded really well to collective self help.
When we used to start running out of water in
(01:30):
the South Island for power, we could get it up
to a fifteen percent saving just by telling people please
please save. And the government should have been doing that.
I think they've been trying to say, oh, we've got
it in hand, and.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
How bad do you think it is? I mean, you
know how government works. You been in there, you know
what's going on. Do you reckon it's as bad or
as good as they're telling us.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
I think they wouldn't be. The figures that they're giving
will be right. But the notion that you can get
a twenty percent reduction in world oil supply and New
Zealand will still get even eighty percent of what we
previously got is pretty fanciful. There are big players out
there who will be saying no, we want all that
(02:11):
we need, and one of them is China, and we
know already that they're getting what they need. And there
will be other strong economies that will be able to
weigh out bid us to divert tankers that we think
would be quite helpful to us. Well, they'll be diverted
to places that can pay more. That's that's how it'll
end up.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Going to you, Miles. I mean, this is your your
business warning, my friend. All day, I've been tell us
what your guys have been thinking.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
I mean, think about this. I mean, the government used
a nine thousand dollars subsidy to try and push EV's along.
That will be nothing compared to what's going to push
people into EV's at the moment. Should they have stayed
with that EV? No, No, that was a complete waste
of taxpayers money. But I mean the point is, though,
is that a real market forces which we're seeing today
are going to be the biggest indicator and the biggest
push to EV that we'll probably see in our lifetime.
(02:57):
If fuel goes to four dollars, you know, eliter, you'll
see you know, the average family person really considering an
electric vehicle. But the point is, we've already got a
massive uptake of PHGV, which is a battery powered car
with a petrol motor, which in many cases like the
Mitsubushi Outlander, for example, which is one of our biggest
selling phgvs runs eighty ks to eighty five k's on
(03:18):
pure electric energy with the ability to then go on
to petrol. Now, most people, if you looked at what
they do in a daily on a daily amount, wouldn't
even do that many case. So they hardly ever use
full when they get home and night. Yeah, we've got
a charge at home. My wife's got one for the children,
and we don't ever use petrol. I can't remember when
Iver saw a debit on a field card. I mean,
we just don't. We don't use it anymore. So there's
(03:38):
already a huge amount of those. And if you look
at the curve at the moment in the market, the
uptake on PAHGV has been immense, or you know, hybrid
in general has been immense, but pH GV particularly is
a very good option because it gives you both for it,
and we're going to see a lot more of that,
and we have in the last three days. We're just
beginning hammered by inquiry on PHGV electric cars. So what
happens is if you want to buy a car right now,
(04:02):
when you go into your yard and you look, oh,
I want this or I want that, right, what happens
to your your salespeople say, well, it could be four
dollars a leader. So have you looked at us other
people coming? Pretty I mean I think people are you know,
they come with their own ideas of what they want,
you know, and if they're looking for a fuel saving
vehicle on this shopping list of course is you know,
electric vehicle or a PHGV and they've done most of
(04:22):
their research online. Really, you know, most buyers are quite educated.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
What percentage would be buying evs now? What percentage of
people for.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
Twelve the last twelve months, I'm not sure what the
actual numbers. I think it's like I think we are
we're up to sort of seven or eight percent of
the country. I'm not sure what it is, but whatever's
asked that now people are asking a lot more than that.
I mean, the inquiry on EV would have doubled in
the last three or four days, maybe troubled very rational, Yeah, yeah,
which makes sense.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
Doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
I mean why would you? I mean why would you?
Why would you be buying a vehicle when you can
buy one an EV now is the same price as
a petrol car. So what do you want? To do
you want to pay you know, three fifty year Elida
soon maybe four? Or do you want to plug in.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
The issue that I have Stephen Franks, And you've just
admitted that you just put your name down and are
buying and have you had an EV before?
Speaker 3 (05:04):
And a huge mistake on the Tesla They we all
make errors in life that and you made.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
One as well, But that's okay, no comment. But the
thing is that you do a lot of driving, and
I do a lot of driving, right, And there's still
the issue when you want to go to New Plymouth
somewhere along the line, you've got to stop at Balls
and have a coffee and charge up. And that's half
an hour rather than two minutes or five minutes at
a gas station, isn't it.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
Yeah, But you accommodate. Thirty years ago or twenty years
ago when we had the card stage, when we were
worried about supply, we had a Nissan Patrol with a
gas cylinder.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
And you remember those yeah, yeah, And.
Speaker 4 (05:41):
We could only two hundred and fifteen kilomeitus on that
because you know, and they were gutless. It was a
big engine, but it could grind. But you just got
used to the fact that you had to look for
where it's where it would be, and you're going to
have to have a cup of tea.
Speaker 3 (05:56):
I say to my customers, it's like when you first
got a cell phone, right, people charge a little bit here,
a little bit there first. In the end you realize
you just charge it overnight. It was ready for the
new day, and it was always on next to you,
and it was plugged in, and the next day you
woke up you had a full battery. And the same
with a car. If you've got a charger at home,
which most people do when they buy an electric car,
you just plug it them before you go to sleep,
(06:16):
and you wake up in the morning you've got a
new day in new cars, all organized. And that's not
a daily thing, you know, most most Keiwis will charge
the cars once a week, you know, I think it
has to be more than once. It's Steve, just just
a little bit of a hint here. Have you bought
the fast charger with your with your new car? Did
you do that?
Speaker 4 (06:30):
I've bought a charger. I don't know what it is.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Well, you need to, doesn't it You need to have
the fast charge?
Speaker 3 (06:34):
Well, it depends if you go three. If you've got
three phase power at Homer, you've got a really fast charger.
But the one that I've got at home is completely sufficient.
It will charge overnight, you know, to fall to one
hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
Yeah, I think it makes a hell of a difference
if you've got a full charge. Do you think that
the government Stephen, I'll come to you on this. Do
you think the government's got the under control? Do you
feel that they know what's going on or are they're
just going to wing it as they go. I imagine that
they have pretty good figures and expectations. What I think
is that modern governments are terrified of taking the people
into their confidence. They want to soothe them all the time,
(07:05):
so that they create a system where they say we're
looking after it. Because again it's partly a media product.
Media will will pick on any sign of uncertainty and
turn it into incompetence weakness, so that a Frank, if
we'd had a Frank Minister of energy come out and say, hey,
this could get really serious, he'd be scared that there'd
(07:28):
be a massive rush and everyone stockpiling in cans.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
That anyway that's going to happen.
Speaker 4 (07:34):
Anyway, yeah, just trust the people and ignore ignore the critics.
But at the moment, we're probably we will get announcements
and I fear that they're probably going to try and
fudget that the thing that we'll say the most money,
unfortunately will be price rationing.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
And that's just if the price goes up. Is there
an alternative, Miles, Is there anything else we could do?
Speaker 3 (07:55):
But I think I think we're in a different market though.
Look look at if you look at the makeup of
the New Zealand car Park as we call it. You know,
the amount of cars in the country. We have quite
a few vehicles that are low emission right and an
ev energy you know. So things have changed. And go
back to the nineteen seventies, we drove some pretty inefficient vehicles,
let's think about it. I mean, terrible gas burning things.
I mean now things have changed. Even your most modest
(08:18):
family car, you know, might only do you know, six
leaders or seven leaders per hundred k of driving, you know,
so they're really good compared to what they used to be.
They're not twelve, thirteen or forteen anymore. So I think,
you know, we've changed a lot, you know, and the
technology has already been changing for the last twenty years,
so cars are way different than what they were. I
don't think it's going to be as much of a
panic as people are making out. I think there's a
(08:39):
lot of you know, there's been a lot of media
sensationalizing all this as well. I mean, there's definitely going
to be a price hike, but we'll guess will petrol
run out?
Speaker 4 (08:46):
I don't know. I think that they could do things that,
for example, make car pooling really popular. Change the law
so that you you don't fear any risk of being
an informal taxi drive.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
We'll drive in the bus lanes if you've got more
than two people in the cake can driving the bus lanes,
which will fix a lot of the tickets that people
are getting at the moment right. But also it actually
would make us more efficient, and we were spending all
this money on cycle ways. They can get up in
their bicycle and they can buzz around town, which is
a good idea.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
Has anyone talked about their bust think it's a great idea.
Speaker 3 (09:14):
I don't. I think two too. I always got some
very good ideas, though you do. That's why we invited
you it now.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
But that's I think needs to be more than two,
because that's just you and your take it three Stephens.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
Three Parson legislation. Now while we're in here, we'll do
will make it three three, okay more than we see
someone of the back seat with the head poking out all.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Right, false pump up exactly up by their face off
of Stephen Franks and Miles Gazely. Wellington City Council yesterday
had their sort of big discussion over the budgets and
how they were going to bring back their three year plan,
how they were going to tapen up to me, Miles Gaizely.
One thing came through when the Greens flexed their muscle.
(09:52):
They still got control. They still got the spending on
the Green initiatives that they wanted spent and got cut
somewhere else. Has anything really changed at Wellington City Council.
Speaker 3 (10:03):
I think it has. I think in some ways. I mean,
and I've dealt with Andrew times recently and I think
he's doing the best he can with an interesting bunch.
You know, you've got a three way table there, You've
got a split a six Centrists, you've got four Greens
and six Labor and I think you know it's it's
a negotiation game. And this is if if you look
at some of the things that they've actually passed, a
lot of them are an agreement to further investigate, yes,
(10:27):
some of you know, and there are some things in there, like,
for example, the land based rating valuation thing. I mean,
that's an interesting one, isn't it, because you know that
he's agreed to look at it.
Speaker 2 (10:37):
But he agreed to look at a lot of things
to be fair.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Yeah, but that's right. But looking at things and doing
things are two different things, right, And if you've got
to get your tridium pan passed and you need all
the votes you can, the center out and voting your way,
he's had to try and work his way around. And
I'm not saying I support it. I'm just saying that
would be what I would see from the outside, and
I think Steven would agree, being you know, being in
the in the in parliament before that. He's had to
play both sides of the fence to try and get
this thing through. Now well, last and Water was a
(10:59):
plan sitting in the ether again and going nowhere. So
he's got it through and I suppose now he's got
to negotiate with all the parties around the table to
try and get the results that he thinks the city needs.
You know, so I think that would be it. I mean,
if you look at the land based rating system right
that they're trying to push through, I mean it's voodo economics,
because if you look at the ones that will affect
the most are the people we need to succeed, like
(11:21):
people like Row's taken on, you know, reading the cinema
and all that land outside, He'll be getting rated the
same as someone with a twenty story building on it.
I mean it's insane. I mean it won't occur. I
don't think Peter Jackson with his movie museum, imagine what
his rates will be on those hectars and hectares of
land Shelley Bay. These are all going to be public
amenities that they would agree to pump up the rates
(11:42):
on to make them nearly unaffordable to own and to
actually operate. I mean it makes no sense.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
But as a commercial property owner in the city, you
know that it doesn't make any sense anyway, because you'll
be talking to car dealers at Auckland that are paying
a hell.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Of a lot less rates than you. Listen, it's terrible.
I mean Wellington. At the moment, a Wellington rate payer,
a commercial rate payer, pays three points seven times more
than a residential rate payer. Now the residential rate payers
rates are high anyway, So three points seven times high?
Are we nearly one point two more than Auckland. It's insane.
So if they do have to, if they are going
to do this, this land based rating value system, they're
(12:13):
going to have to zero back the commercial rates and
then they're gonna have to add that on top of it.
But remember this, we're not far from amalgamation. It's going
to happen. Okay. Now, no other councils in the whole
region have a land based rating system, right, so there's
no way they're all going.
Speaker 4 (12:26):
To You've given up? Are you giving up? Giving up?
What on this algamation stuff?
Speaker 3 (12:35):
As absolutely.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Tell you Stephen Franks, because we've talked about it before
on the show. He hates the idea of amalgamist well,
he wants to actually divide Wellington up again.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
Go again, tell us what you want to do. Yeah, no,
I don't want to know.
Speaker 4 (12:50):
We've got the divisions that we need that we have,
and you don't want to reorganize for real. The only
people who went out of reorganizations are the big consulting
firms and and the HR people. But I'm I am
concerned at the thought that the whole of the Wellington
region could be infected by the nutcases who dominate Wellington's politics,
(13:11):
which is what would happen, because they love politics. Other
people don't. That's why the left winds all the time,
because other people tend to have other things in their life.
But you'd get Wellington ro O Valley essentially driving the
region and in many countries, in many places, in many
countries you badly need to have other local, nearby local
(13:35):
authorities that can show the difference. And the best example
is why Makeerari and Selwyn showed up christ Church. Christ
Church was paralyzed after the earthquake, paralyzed, Wymakerari was pretty good.
Selwyn was getting its building consents and resource consents out
in five days. Now. If there had all been part
of ECAN, they'd have been totally stuffed. And the last
(13:58):
thing the Wellington region needs is to spread has spread
the Wellington central ethos across the whole You can't how
do you do it? It depends it depends who loves politics
the most. The left. The left in cities all over
the world, they win. Look at what look at look
at Zorn Mndami in New York, the center of capitalism,
and you've got a nutcase socialist running it because they
(14:21):
love politics and you you cannot get away from that.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
Well, let's wait and see how the actual makeup it works.
Because if they had representation, like you've got people like
fran Over and the wire Rapper and things, I mean
that they would have probably a voice on the main council.
They wouldn't be part of it, wy Rapper. We've tried that.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
New Zealand already has really big local authorities. We we
are way above most world worlds, and in fact they're not.
They're not local authorities. Most of them are now regional government.
And we would get more value because there's quite a
lot of economic evidence that the optimum size for a
(15:01):
local authority is somewhere in the two hundred thousand. You
start getting above that and you get the empires that
you've got more.
Speaker 2 (15:07):
I forgot to warn you that, Stephen, We're not going
to ground everything, but I just think the less pureocracy
there is, the better and I personally don't know that.
I think a job like that might actually not actually
attract a nutter, you know, it might actually attract someone
that actually wants the job, and you might get a
different makeup in that group. You know, we can't always
believe in the worst.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
I mean, we've had a bad run, right, and I
think people like Stephen are clearly you know, you know,
a but gun shy about the whole thing. But you've
got to believe in the future. You've got to believe
that things will get better.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
Well, it depends whether you change the system.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Well, it depends howe's laid out, and it depends how
they actually roll it out. Because if you've got.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
To setting systems worked well when rate payers had votes,
but now we don't. So now the students can come
down here and dominate.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Well maybe you can put that as a rent.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
Well, you're not going to see it. I mean, you've
got to be realistic. We are where we are.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Why does that happen? Tell me why that happens? I mean,
that's not right. Why the students can come and vote.
I agree with Steve and I think it should be
rate payers only that we pay for our city, and
we should be voting. I mean, and how that should
How can the how they go and collate votes of
people that have no financial interest in the city whatsoever.
It's ridiculous. You know, they're basically staying here for studio
(16:12):
for study, which is that doesn't make any sense. Why
did that come in? Stephen? Do you know that with
your background?
Speaker 4 (16:18):
I came from the left and we had this belief
that fat cats and people with money were ripping the
world off, and if we gave everyone equal power, we
would we would transform it, and greed would go and
we'd live in a paradise. It. Well, of course it hasn't,
and it never does, and you get Venezuela. You've got
(16:40):
example after example after example. But Wellington is dominated by
people who want to vote for nice ideas.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
Okay, let's keep it with the city council. I don't
know whether you guys saw it, but a letter from
all the mayors and the so called would be and
should be people that run the city wrote to the
Prime Minister said they don't want this new law about
moving the people on that are living living on the streets.
They want them to find the government to find them
all a nice place to live and try and do
all the things which you know all of us wouldn't
(17:09):
disagree with, but the moving on laws, at least the
government was doing something.
Speaker 3 (17:13):
Miles.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
You would talk to a lot of business people every
day of the week. They would not like these people
living on the streets.
Speaker 3 (17:20):
No, And I think I think it's hard because we've
had a lot to do with city mission and things, right,
so I understand I understand the pressure that's they're under
to actually, you know, to house these people. I mean,
it's a really difficult situation. Yes, I don't think people
should be being in the doorways of lampin Key and
lying there all day, you know, and sort of creating
a nuisance, but they do need somewhere to go. And
I'm not an expert on this field, but it's a
(17:41):
really tough balance. But what this does do is gives
the police the ability to move people along that are
causing nuisance. And they don't have that ability at the moment,
no matter what anyone says, they don't. So I don't know.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
It's were you had even slightly confused why the mayors
were jumping in on this though.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
I read it yesterday. I couldn't get my head around it. Really,
I mean, I mean, it's it really does make the
central city feel a bit unsafe, and it is I
don't know. You need the central so to be polished
and exciting and a place people to visit, so you
actually encourage retail and jobs and things, right, that's really important.
And if these people and there's you know, it's only
a small group, need to be our house somewhere. We
(18:19):
need to work with that and put them somewhere where
they feel safe and they aren't in a situation where
they're in the situation that we're in a doorway, lying
in a rug, you know, with a sleeping bag. You know,
it's sad, really sad. Stephen, when you saw this.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Media attention to the fact that these mayors had written
to the prime mister, what are your thoughts?
Speaker 4 (18:37):
I just thought, how again, how different the theory of
democracy is from the reality. You'd think that they would
be representing the mayors would want to represent the views
and concerns of the people in the district. No, they don't,
And matters like this, they're responding to the very small
carters of people who are active in their constituency. That
(18:59):
is Labor and Grand parties. They are saying, we're virtuous.
We know the government's going to ignore it, so we
can say fulle bleat about this, because we want to
show you that we are on your side, not the
side of people who are concerned about the city, the
side of those who actually nominate them. It's internal party politics,
and in all the Western democracies at the moment, the
(19:21):
political parties have become much more extreme than the people
as a whole. The political parties have views and values.
I mean, it's the inside the Greens and Labor. It
would be the end of your political career to say that,
you know the difference between a man and a woman.
They've got views that are not mainstream. But that's how
(19:42):
our politics now works. Right, So did they do the
right thing by seeing that it's stupid? Yeah, I mean,
but I pit on our hand. In terms of theater
it plays to to The coalition won't mind because they
know what people want. They know our four bears did
it better. When we grew up. You never saw beggars ever,
(20:06):
and the police had a law called that they could
enforce called no visible means of support. If you were
living without any any means they could, but of course
then there were institutions to send them to.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Yeah, that that is where I think we've got a problem.
But anyway, let's move Friday face off with Miles Gayzy
and Stephen Franks a couple of other things.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
I really wanted to go on.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Wellington Chamber of Commerce quarterly Business Confidence survey results came
out this week. Eighteen percent of Wellington thought Wellington businesses
thought Wellington was on the right track. That's pretty low number, Miles,
I'm looking at you for this. Forty five thought it
was on the forty five percent thought it was on
the wrong track, and thirty seven didn't percent did not know.
I mean eighteen percent, it's less than twenty percent thought.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
We were on the right track. Yeah, I mean the
city doesn't feel like it supports business, you know. And
I think that's probably the most important problem we've got,
is that if you look at it, we just don't
seem to understand that commerce builds jobs, which builds a
better life everybody. Right, So if you support business and
you make it easy for people to park, and you
encourage retail shops to stay open and not close, and
(21:12):
you know, you don't do silly things like closing roads
and bits and pieces. You'll actually end up, you know,
and create parking. You know, you know you'll end up
the city will be a better place. And I'll give
you an idea at the moment. Do you know that
next to the Embassy Theater, there's that big empty space
there a right that was was motorcycles stop years ago,
right next to the theater and there's no if you
go to So if you go to the Embassy Theater
(21:33):
right you park. You can't park at nighttime right because
all the residents are in there. The council will not
allow that land owner to turn that into a car park.
Not allowed to I'm not joking, I have no idea.
So the council will not allow that to be a
car park. So the lady that owns that it is
playing rates on empty land. It's got access from the
back from the rear from Mount Victoria, so you can
(21:53):
coming from the back and it's got access to come
out of the front. And it's right next to our
most famous theater. And it is not allowed to be
a car.
Speaker 2 (21:59):
Paigner's car. They've taken a whole of a car parking.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
And I've taken all the car parking out from the area.
So if you want to be spontaneous and take your
kids of the theater, can't park you fit probably forty or
fifty cars here more Probably it could actually could actually
actually really help. You know, the theater, which I think
is owned by the council, isn't it yeap, yes it
is now ironically, but but you know, these sorts of things.
But we're just not friendly to business. We're not encouraging
(22:23):
people to spend. We're not encouraging people to come to
the city.
Speaker 4 (22:27):
You know.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
Like my mother, if she's listening, she said the right
thing the other day, Like the car parking times are
two hour maximum, right, No, you go to a movie
or take your kids to the opera, you can get
a ticket before you even come out. Or you don't
have a coffee and you have a great chat like
happened to me.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
I had a chat with an old mate having a
coffee and I went over the two hours to myself.
Speaker 3 (22:44):
You know you've got to ticket. You can go a ticket,
But I mean, make weekends free parking in the city.
Make it free parking after five pm. Encourage people to
come to town and go to movies, go to shows,
go to the restaurants. It doesn't take a scientist to
work this out. And if you took it, if you
look at the lost revenue we're getting out of all
the empty shops and rate people can't afford to paying things,
and dump it back into actually making an incentive for
people to actually come to the town. You'd fix it
(23:05):
in no time at all. But you've just got to
think that commerce builds jobs, builds wealth and health, and
we need the city to run in that direction.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
I'm still completely confused over the fact that they can't
allow that to be a car park.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Stephen, I saw you look at that too.
Speaker 2 (23:19):
I mean, I mean this is a city for having
a green light opening up and trying to make it.
Speaker 4 (23:23):
That's why it's why I objected earlier to the idea
of inflicting the whole region with the ethos of the
people who control Wellington. Political problem is that there will
be a number of probably council offices, but a whole
lot of voters will be feeling virtuous about that. Because
we must make using car private cars unattractive, they must
use buses and they don't care. They don't even know
(23:45):
the cost but they don't try to count it. They
don't care about that cost. And I remember a business,
someone actually in the IT industry, telling me years ago
that they came to Wellington. It sounds, it sounds sort
of superficial when he came to Wellington because they had
that stock exchange ticket tape on the Odland building and
(24:08):
he said, a city that will allow that to be
running on a prominent building on their harbor must be
business friendly. And he was really, so, you're quite right
about the climate, the flavor, but at the moment they delight.
I mean, they want to spend one hundred million putting
you know, flower boxes and stuff in the road so
you can't drive in them and parking them, but they
(24:29):
won't allow someone to park. Well, that tells you who's
in control.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Take a short break, because I'm still flabbergasted by that.
But I tell you what, I ain't going to let
up on that. I'm not going to let up on that.
Over the next couple of weeks. I'm going to find
out what the hell's going on with that. Why the
hell that's not a car?
Speaker 3 (24:42):
We can take ahad leave and be a car park.
Go Mills car parking Gaisly car parking.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
There would be more Gaisly's Caryard Mills and Gazey's Caryard
Friday face off. The Wellington Library, which has been refurbished,
three strength rebuilt, opens again tomorrow. The bill costs two
hundred and seventeen million dollars.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
Now I have been privileged to go through and have
a look. It's way way over the top.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
It's got everything you could possibly ever think of in
a library. It probably is like an event center as
well as a library. Was the opening party. The opening
welcoming ceremony was supposed to cost four one hundred and
five thousand dollars. Stephen Franks, I'm coming to you first
on this. Andrew Littelmeyer saw this and lowered it to
(25:27):
one hundred and seventy eight. Do we need all this
for a public library? Well, in terms of the opening ceremony,
absolutely not. The rest of it, I can't, okay. Public
libraries have becoming.
Speaker 4 (25:41):
Community hubs. Yes, for all sorts of activities. Yes, And
there are some great cities that have got spectacular libraries.
Helsinki's an example. But I think the christ Church has
done very attractive Yeah. So yes, in the sense that
cities do need to feel good about themselves and proud
of things they've got. I hope it is good. I
(26:01):
thought it was an absurd waste of money. But it's
done spend. It'll be the same when we get the
New Town Hall. It's been done, so we just got
to make the best of it now. And I don't
think that spending on a whole lot of the lovies
who can all congratulate each other and who've probably mostly
had nothing to do with it would have been a
(26:22):
good spend of money. I think even one hundred and
eighty thousand is inexplicable. If they want to celebrate sell tickets, don't.
If that's because they're going to bring along a whole
lot of people who've been great contributors, that might be different,
But I suspect it's not. No.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
And I mean, we know that the New Town Fair
got one hundred thousand or so called one hundred thousand peopce.
We know that Kubaduba gets hundreds of thousands of people.
People turn up the free events, the opening of a library,
it's a free event miles. So do we need to
spend that sort of money doing all the welcoming parties
and stuff.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
No, it's quite so it's a public asset. You know,
it's great payers paying for this one hundred and seventy
eight thousand dollars. And I think at the moment, with
the way rates looking, I don't think anyone would agree it.
I think it's a shambles. I don't think you need
a nice speech and a microphone and have a nice
day would have been better. I would have thought.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
The thing is that, And I do want to put
where credit's due. If that's the new way, and you
talk about the hell Sinki one and the christ Church's Library,
if that's the new way libraries are going, they've nailed it.
Speaker 3 (27:26):
They've nailed it.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
I mean it's got every single facility. You can go
in there and you can check for your files, for
your properties.
Speaker 3 (27:33):
That we've forgotten. The population of hell Sinki, what is it.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
Well, I'm sure what will be two hundred and something thousands.
So I mean you've got to look at you good,
look at what we've spent the money on. And I mean,
if you look at what's happened in that whole civic
square area there, we then demolished the council the Council
Chambers building for no particular reason, and then went and
rented on the waterfront a private you know, a building
that was owned by you know, another company, and we're
moving all the council staff in the air at a
(27:59):
huge cost when we could have actually been when you
look at the review that was done by Deloittes, we're
three hundred staff too many already in the council. So
if we've got rid of the people that needed to go,
you know, and or consolidate them in other roles, and
then done up our own building and kept it, which
would have had you know, no deed on it, we
would have been as much smarter move. But it's not
how the council seemed to think. That's different.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
The other thing that's always been wrong with that Civic
Square area is that there was what was the nick
Ow but otherwise it was dead because it didn't have
commerce around it. It needed all of those ground floor
areas to be with cafes percent and going back and
then you.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
Know, I don't know, it was a great cafe, the
best k Jurie in Wellington number one.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
Apparently they've released it. They make that major property company precinct.
I think they've got a big lease in there.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
We've got an option on some of the land like
where Civic thea Civic Buildings was and right around there
to add some commerce to it. And I think that'll
probably have to have some retail and things on the
bottom floor as part of the agreement.
Speaker 4 (28:56):
Maybe I think we should start a movement from Nick
to be able to start.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
His next cafe. It's a good idea.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
Yeah, very good idea, great idea. Thanks very much for that.
Help fund it.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
The Friday.
Speaker 3 (29:10):
Hot than not.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Okay, Stephen Franks, I'm coming to you first. What was
the big hot for you for the week and what
was you're not hot for the week?
Speaker 4 (29:20):
Well, the hot's going to be a paradox. I just
love the fact that there are so many Wellingtonians who
go swimming in the cold water. Yeah. I go down
and see those people trawling past the raft and around
the fountain, and that didn't happen thirty four years ago.
Speaker 3 (29:37):
Cold well.
Speaker 4 (29:38):
I don't know whether the contemporaries change or just people
have got a bit more staunch, but I think it's
really cool. And I died back a bit when they
thought that the ship might be coming in from the
Harbor entrance, but they seem to be back. I think
I just that that really does it for me, really good.
Speaker 3 (29:55):
What's you're not hot? What's upset you this week?
Speaker 4 (29:58):
It hasn't upset me. I'm just going to comment on it. Though.
It's seeing all these limescooters arrive and not quite I
hadn't realize I'm out of touch. I didn't even know
they're coming. And I just opened up a sub yesterday
and they are damn good. But I really hope that
it doesn't. Yeah, I love them. I think I came
here on one, not on the line. I can't here
(30:21):
on a flip. I come here on a flamingo. But
I think those scooters are fantastic. I realized that there
is a problem of shared use.
Speaker 3 (30:28):
Did you put a helmet on?
Speaker 4 (30:29):
No? Well, the poor, the poor Lime guys have got
all these useless helmets that've been made to put on
all our head sizes are different. I can't wear a
helmet under sixty.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
It's just do you think they should be in the
bike LANs?
Speaker 4 (30:40):
Though?
Speaker 3 (30:40):
Yeah, of course they should changing.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
Yeah they changed.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
What what's the hots and lots for you for this week?
I tell the hots. I just went and met with
a friend of mine, Mike Petre, who's a barber up
in Kuma Street, and him and Lizzie Carson's and a
few of them. There's the empty site in it's what
is the address, forty five gauzy with a building boomed down,
you know, the one that was sitting there. So they're
they're fundraising working through that at the moment to build
a like a sort of a portal over it, like
a glass roof well the hole of new palms and
(31:06):
stuff insight and make it an area for Onetingtonians to
go and pack up. And it's going to be it's
a fantastic I've got the things that I'll show you later.
It's gorgeous. They're trying to find sponsors and they're working
through the whole program at the moment where they'll take
over the land. It's owned by another lady when the
building burned down. She's happy to try and get the
to give the land to the city for five years
as part of the program. And it's just a great idea.
(31:27):
It's just a waste of space and it could become
a really cool thing. So what'sit like? It the smell
of poo when I came in the other night from
Melbourne at the airport. Didn't like that very much, did you?
Could you smell it?
Speaker 4 (31:36):
Could you smell? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (31:37):
It wasn't good. It wasn't great. Not the first thing
you want to smell when you walk out of the tone.
Speaker 4 (31:42):
We need, we need the long outfall reda.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
We need something, we need a five Stephen Franks, Miles Gasey,
thank you for taking time and you're very very busy
week to come and share your views with the people
of Wellington. We appreciate you both. We appreciate you both
for what you do for our city. So thank you
very much. Have a great, great weekend.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks It'd Be Wellington from nine am weekday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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