Minister Paul Goldsmith on Wellington mayors signing letter against move on orders

Nick chats to Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith after an open letter was signed by Wellington's regional mayors.

The letter states the mayors and other community leaders reject the government's plan to give police power to move on rough sleepers for 24 hours. 

Minister Goldsmith shares his thoughts on the rejection of the orders, and the reputation of Wellington.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News talks'd B.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Now I'm going to go straight to the right honorable
Paul Goldsmith. Good morning, mister Goldsmith, Good morning.

Speaker 3 (00:17):
Pork, good morning. How are you.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
I'm really really well. You heard what Rogers just said.
He works with the mental, the mental people, mental health issues.
What's your answer to it.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
Well, I mean, I mean, as he stated, I mean,
it's very complex issues for a wide for a group
of people. It's not something that you can just fix
with any single response. And so I mean, I saw
this letter from the various people, and you know, if
if the government's only response to homelessness and anti social

(00:52):
behavior in the city was to do move on orders,
that have a point, But of course it's not our
only response. We do many many things. We've got one
of the most generous welfare systems in the world. We
have a whole host of hounds programs, housing first, We've
got very strong mental health services. Of course they don't

(01:12):
meet everybody's needs and demands immediately, but we've got a
lot of tools that we have to help people on
in need. But we're short of a couple of tools
to deal with people who don't want to take that
support for whatever reason, and who are acting in a
very disruptive way in our town streets, and so we

(01:33):
want to reclaim those town centers for the enjoyment of
people who live and work there. So this is one
tool amongst many.

Speaker 2 (01:40):
Paul, were you surprised by the letter from the so
called leaders and the mayors of the Onontington region when
you have basically what you're doing is reacting to a
problem that we've got all through New Zealand and businesses
have been screaming out for.

Speaker 3 (01:54):
Well, yes, no, I'm not surprised. There is a group
of well meaning people who are very focused on on
helping those who are in need. But you know, the
point is, yes, you can help people, but there are

(02:16):
occasions where where society has a right to stand up
and say hang on a moment. We also have other
people who live in the cities, and we've got young
people who come into work, We've got university students. You've
got people who live in the cities and they need
they have rights as well, and they have expectations to
be able to go about their business without being abused

(02:38):
and having to deal with situations that are unwelcoming essentially,
and so I just I find you know, it's just
one of those things of life. The retailers and the
people who live and work in the city don't tend
to want to sort of put up their hand and say,
come on, we've got to do something about this. But
those who are in the in the business of dealing

(03:00):
with this occasion on day by day more likely to
come out.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
Is it just well Inton kicking up or are getting
the same sort of backlash from Auckland and christ Church.

Speaker 3 (03:12):
Ah, well, there's a sort of I think a recently
well organized campaign to oppose it, and you know, good
luck to them, and that's that's how it is, and
you know they're making their points. But I'm you know,
we're very firm as a government that you know, we're
about restoring law and order, we're about creating you know,
when you talked about trauma, I mean the most important
thing we can do to avoid that long term is
to reduce the number of victims of crime. And the

(03:34):
good news that we're making real progress on that, you know,
forty nine thousand fewer victims of crime. So long term
you've got to deal with those violent issues and then
but also you know, we want to we want to
reclaim our town centers and we make no apology for that.
And you know, I think we've lost our way in
the last few years. And everybody, I mean everybody, all
your listeners know that they walk down through through the

(03:56):
streets of Wellington and Auckland, wherever you go. People know
that over the last few years there's been a real
deterioration and we want to turn that around.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
A couple of months ago, a young guy, successful young
coffee cafe guy in Wellington stopped me in the street
and he said, Nick, I don't know why people aren't
talking about this, but I cannot get any of my
female staff to open the shop at seven o'clock in
the morning. I have got to get a male because
it is that bad that I can't take that. I

(04:27):
can't take the responsibility of having a young female walk
into your city.

Speaker 3 (04:31):
Yeah. Well, and that's why we're doing what we're doing. Absolutely,
we're doing it for those people who've got that absolute
right and expectation to be able to turn up seven
o'clock and not have to deal with somebody who's in
the doorway being aggressive and so that's why we're giving
the police of this extra tool. And on its own
it's not going to solve all the problems in the world,
of course not, but as part of a broader social response,

(04:54):
I think it's an important tool that we need.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
Yeah, I think you're one hundred percent right. I don't
like agreeing with politicians, but I think you're one hundred
percent right about the we When I grew up, Wellington
was such and it's still it's such a university city.
I love watching the young people arrive the bright. They're smart,
they determined, they're going to change our country. They shouldn't
have to walk down the streets and put up with
what they have to put up watching people that are

(05:18):
urinating on the side of the street. That's not New Zealand,
is it.

Speaker 3 (05:22):
No, No, it's not. And you know New Zealand is
a fair minded people. They want to help those people
in need, and we do in so many ways. But
you know, we've also got to send some clear message
about what is except from what isn't. And I think
the balance of got out of whack and we're trying
to bring it back into a reasonable position. And that's
why we're trying to do this.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Thank you so so much recording in the show. I
really really appreciate it. The right honorable Paul Goldsmith.

Speaker 1 (05:49):
There for more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills. Listen
live to news talks There'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio