February 25, 2026 • 20 mins
Things get fiery this week on Politics Thursday with Labour MP Ginny Andersen and National MP for Otaki Tim Costley.
They join Nick on the show to talk about the biggest issues in politics this week - including the rough sleeping move on orders announced by the government. Can our police force cope with this with their resources and where are these people being moved to?
Following Mayor Andrew Little's swim in Lyall Bay to prove water quality is safe , would our politicians join him for a swim after the Moa point leak? They discuss the effects, the inquiry and what should happen for impacted businesses.
Plus Labour's state of the nation speech - when can we expect to see big moves from Labour? And should banks be required to accept cash?
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Said B and that's a Thursday, so that's politics Thursday. Well,
good morning and welcome to Ginny Anderson. Good morning mag
How are you having spoken for a while.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
I know I'm looking at Yeah, I was looking forward
to catching up, and I must remember to say I
saw Nick Cave and it was amazing and he reminded me.
Speaker 4 (00:31):
Of your effects.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Okay to say that, I thought there was some strong
similarities between the Cave and Nick Mills.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
I don't know Nick Cave, so I've got to go
look a move.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
You've got the same here cut and everything looks like you.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Well, thanks, I hope it's a compliment.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
He's a great he's a great singer.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Tim m Cave, my gosh, Tim Costley, who reminds me
of what's his name, Sherman, Tim Shim what his name?
What's the guy of the singer.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Risley?
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Come on, I can't see any good morning and I'll
have family at compliments and you're welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, I thought I think you're a bit of insurance.
You'd right to be.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
But tall maybe offensive.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
That's not offensive. It was positive.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
The heads of Allben, But I don't know if I'm
befoll on gain but musical ability blonde.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Jenny, you got me out of a stick there, beautiful, Right,
let's talk more point. I mean, what either of you.
I'm going to ask you both, Jenny, I'll ask you first,
what would you do a stunt like jumping into the
sea pool c to make your point? Was it a
little bit cringe to you?
Speaker 3 (01:43):
You're going to say no, I'll say that Andrew Little
is braver than me.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
I don't know if I would go in there, to
be honest, I'd be a bit a bit concerned so
soon after what's happened, in the fact that they still
might be stuff in there. So yeah, but I've I mean,
I've got friends up there up that way, and after
the big storm they had to they literally had to
hose off the front of the houses with sort of
they call meta.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
So I think so.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
Hard for all the people who who physically have to
be there in that space every day.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
I was more asking if you'd do it as a
sort of stunt to get big stories on the news.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
I know I probably wouldn't. I'm not really into doing stunts.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
You hold on, hold on. I remember the pool nine eye, Paul,
you were there and you and your and your togs.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I didn't do the bomb though, so Chris Bishop and
Chris Hopkins turned up and died a money and I
didn't participate in that. I did go down the hydro
slide at a later date. But no, I don't tend
to do jumps off wolves and jumps off things I can,
but I do kind of Yeah, it doesn't sit so
well with me, doesn't feel you know, natural.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Maybe I thought it felt a little bit cringed. Tim Costly,
would you do something?
Speaker 4 (02:48):
Mean?
Speaker 3 (02:48):
You?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
You're mister bloom and Instagram at the moment, you do
anything for a good reeal, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
I don't have a matrix of our hydroslid's okay, but
a bomb's not or anything. But look, I don't know
if i'd about the publicity stunt, but but i'd go
for a swim. I you know, when I was flying
in the Air Force, I was worked on big sky theory.
The chances are hitting another planes pretty small, and I
kind of think big ocean theory, the chances are hitting
a purse pretty small. I don't want to diminister the
(03:16):
seriousness of it. But I actually I actually looked up
the Lower I looked up the Lower website to check
water Qualie and at the moment it's saying all green
around the Wellington South coast, but it's but it's yellow
up on the Company coast. I can't believe it. I'm not.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (03:30):
I don't know if I even accept this now, because
surely the beaches where I have swum along way can
I are far better than Wellington. But that's not what
their website says, would would washed up to the company
is that's what's happened, is well, I'll be sending Andrew
Little of the bill if it has.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Tim you haven't asked, you haven't answered the question whether
you would have gone for a dip though, if if
the camera was, if your little Instagram mate and your
camera was there.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
I don't. I don't think me and speedos is what
the camera wants to see, if I'm really honest.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Well, to be fair, Andrew Little had one of those
swim toops on which I thought was pretty good. I'd
have to have one of those swimtops.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
Do you know? Okay? Well, thankful because every winter I
do the little fundraising winters from here and I do
were my National Party drive at top, So maybe if
I have my National Party T shirt on there we go.
How about that?
Speaker 2 (04:17):
All right? Couple of serious questions about it, because it's
a very very serious matter. Should we be celebrating so soon?
Speaker 4 (04:27):
I don't think it's you know, when you get back
to what should be everyday experience in New Zealand. I
don't know if it's a celebration. I think it's a
sigh of relief that the immediate water quality is okay
for people that want to enjoy a beautiful coastline. But
I don't think we're celebrating or even really you know,
sitting back until the plant as fixed. They've got the
long term solution in place and some assurance that the
(04:50):
right procedures and process that are in place that can't
happen again.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Should this is coming to you, Jenny, Should the businesses
receive some compensation?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Well, I think that review needs to play out to
find out what actually went wrong before you can start
jumping to things like but.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
The business system. Sorry to interrupt, but to be fair
on the businesses, they didn't create any of them.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
No, not at all, and nor really did the people
in and around that area that have had their property
prices impacted and their quality of life impact. So, I mean,
let's be honest, it's been a real disaster for Wellingtonians
and it really makes me sad that our beautiful ocean
is being filled with sewage. But it does make the
question the water issue is how a local council is
(05:34):
being funded for infrastructure like this when it fails dramatically
and just kepting rates is not going to fix big
problems like this, and that really worries me. What's the
long term solution for big pieces of infrastructure the impact
and natural environment like this?
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Tim, what did you make of a little bit of
a stoush between I Shavira and Andrew Little last week? Yeah,
over what was going on there?
Speaker 4 (05:59):
Well, when we were sitting within the studio, I was
trying to be a little bit polite, but I Shaverra's
not holding back, and you know that's that's her role
to do that, and I don't I don't know what
the history is there, but look, I think it's clear
that people want answers. You know, locals are frustrated by
the situation. You know, I don't know that you know,
(06:21):
Andrew Little wasn't the mayor at the time it happened,
but Wellington council Cerdainly has a lot to answer for,
particularly whether the prioritizing spending on a bike plane over
a sewage plant.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
What did you make of it, Jilly, I mean a
couple of labor buddies having a little bit of a
go at each other. I mean, I thought to be fair,
I'm I'm in ia Vira's corner on this. She she
was right with what she's saying and she wanted some results.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Well, she's doing a great job at being a strong
local advocate for those people that she's standing for for
Wellington North and Nationals kind even find a candidate to
stand in that in that area. So it's just an
absolute radio silence from from the other side. So she's
standing up and representing people's interests in doing a good
job of that.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
I'm talking to Nicol Willis to morrow and my top
question is going to be why the hell can't they
find somebody to run for a major seat in the
capital city of New Zealand. I want to ask you
quickly before we have a break, Nick, Sorry, Tim, The
Reserve Bank have come out and said they need these
more banks open and more areas. We need to keep
the facility of having cash. What are your thoughts on it?
(07:24):
What do you make of it?
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Yeah, look, I get particularly for those you know, our
electric has one of the highest number of over sixty
fives and cash is still important to them. A lot
of people do the vast if not all, their banking online,
and I get that works for a lot of people.
You know, the white example is quite interesting where it's
just it's an automated kind of a fancy ATM that
(07:48):
can do all of that cash. It can change things
that you can deposit things, you can change big notes
for small notes, or coins for small notes or whatever
it might be. So you know, it's not about opening
new banks, I think, but it's having the tools in
place that enable people to do it. The tricky part
is going to be where the rubber hits the road
and you know they're saying, well, it's a three kilometer
walk to find that, you know, a thousand people, but
(08:10):
what if it's three point two k's and you know,
when there's a rural hub or big you know, a
rural hub versus urban hubin so it's the concept's good,
but discussion is interesting. I think having the right tools there,
but it doesn't necessarily look like a traditional.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Bank, Ginny, will anythink come of this?
Speaker 3 (08:28):
I don't know. I mean people need to be able
to access their money, and especially in emergencies. We've seen
that when people need cash and they can't use online banking,
so I hope they do. I mean, why do you mutter?
In My area is where all the banks closed, and
there's a significant population over sixty five and it really
impacted people's ability to do their day to day stuff.
(08:50):
So I know the world's changing and mowes online, but
I think we also need to acknowledge what happens in
New Zealand that we do have more climate change emergencies.
People will need cash and how are we catering to that?
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Tim, do you have any cash on you right now?
Speaker 4 (09:06):
I don't even have a wallet on me right now.
I do, actually him, I've got a I always have
an immugency twins in my wallet. I forget if I
get stuck l I don't know it.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
It might help, yeah, I mean some would help. I
would have thought twenty would be a couple of coffees,
and that's about it, Jenny you have Do you have
any cash on you?
Speaker 3 (09:24):
No?
Speaker 4 (09:24):
I don't.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
Maybe in my handbag, I'd.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Have a wallet, No you don't. What about in your handbag?
Would you have some cash in your handbag in case of.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
The ruld in my handbag yet? Yeah, wouldn't my handbag yet?
Speaker 2 (09:38):
When was the last time you used cash?
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Oh? My goodness? Probably at things like school fears and
and those sorts of things where people are doing raffles
or fundraising. So I always have cash for those sort
of community events where these these things where people don't
have these post facilities, but quite a lot of small
traders now even school fears of getting the.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
Using these post too.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Well, you can get it on your phone if you wanted, Tim,
when was the last time you use cash?
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I was about to say that all tacky market on
a Sunday, But actually it was at Rotary Club on
Tuesday night because they had a was it a ratfall
or something? But there was cash.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Only are you a Rotary Club member?
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Now? I'm a great local MP that just turns up
to everything they can't even want to.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
Then he just turned up by yourself, Tim, I.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Have a very famous quote from a very famous person,
my wife self. Praise is no praise politics Thursday. Ginny Anderson,
Labor MP and spokesperson for police and Tim Costley, the
o Tacki MP. Government is going to grant police powers
to move on rough sleepers, but the Police Association president
(10:47):
says they're not resourced well enough to do that. Tim,
where the hell are they going to move these rough
sleepers to?
Speaker 4 (10:56):
Well, first there, we've got to get them out of
immediate So the lawy itself says they've got to move
out of that descinery for the next twenty four hours. Right.
But the point is some of these places to go. Well,
if you look at this that's that come out of
the the report that was done last year, forty percent
of them had a home to go to. Because it's
not just rough sleepers, right, it's anyone that's intimidating, it's
(11:17):
anyone that is disruptive, it's anyone that's blocking people getting
into shops and businesses. This is a real issue for
our small businesses, the kind of people we should be
supporting and actually claim those people out of that immediate
vicinity is a great first step and something that a
lot of people have been calling for and then it's
about you know, we're pumping millions of dollars into these
proven providers that have where there is genuinely, genuinely no
(11:41):
place for them to go to, that can that can
then house and accommodate these people. But you know, it's
a it's a serious issue. And I bet you say
in Wellington outside your business, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Oh, it's a serious issue, no question about it. Ginny,
How are the police reacting to this?
Speaker 1 (11:56):
How?
Speaker 2 (11:57):
I mean, what are they going to be able to do?
They don't have the numbers. Are they going to go
and pick up somebody that's just done things in their
own clothes that they shouldn't have, put them on the
police car and take them and take them where.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Well, they're going to take them to the next suburb.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
It'll be Kingsland, that it will be, you know, the
next neighboring suburb where they yet moved to. I mean,
this is not a solution, it's just shifting people. You know,
Providing housing is a solution. You know, Chris Bishop gutted
the public housing build and he stopped people from getting
access to emergency housing and the resulting problem is increased homelessness.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Can I just interrupt you there a little bit, because
we know that there's plenty of housing available, isn't there
There's plenty.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
Of This is a mythnic. I debate this. They've made
a small amount of houses available. They're completely filled up
straight away. Homelessness has overdoubled in both Auckland and in Wellington.
In some of those areas.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
There is not enough housing.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
I've been out myself both in both central areas. There
are people like fifteen and sixteen year olds who have
come from homes where there's high levels of family violence
or sexual violence and their home is not safe for them.
And so that is why they are on the streets,
because they actually had nowhere else to go. And this
government's response is to shove them off into the next suburb.
Speaker 4 (13:13):
It doesn't six the problem.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Do you agree with that?
Speaker 4 (13:16):
No? No, And this is the same old lines from Labor.
They said the same thing when we were moving people
out of emergency accommodation, that they would just be dumped
in the next suburb or the next town. That hasn't happened.
That is not as you look to the numbers, right,
So look at what happened under the last Labor government.
We had a thirty percent increase in the number of
(13:36):
people living in this kind of thing. The state House waitlist,
you know, went blew out massively by about four times
to twenty thousand people. It was huge. Housing was terrible
under the last government, and it's not I'm just not
going to sit here and let them come back and say, well,
it's terrible. Now you look at the census starter thirty
percent increase and those that had no accommodation, no shelter
(13:57):
at all under the last labor government.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
We inrupt. Can I interrupt on this pre prepared speech
to yours and say that numbers are actually getting worse,
not let us thank you?
Speaker 4 (14:08):
Yes, but that's not what I'd like to edit as possible.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
So that I've been visited into into the into the
Wellington City Mission that operates there, and they have said
homelessness is the worst they have ever seen it and
the whole time they've been operating. Right now, it's the
worst it has ever been. And the City Mission in
Auckland will say the same thing. These are the frontline
providers at the cold face saying it is the worst
(14:33):
it has ever been. So I simply do not accept
these national lives saying everybody's fine. All these people are
just hanging out to be friends on the street and
having a party, and they've actually got a home to
go to.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
The reality is that they don't like. No one's saying that, right,
but go and read the homelessness.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
Much together for a sense of community. M Mitchell has
said that that people are on the streets because they
come together for a sense of community.
Speaker 4 (14:56):
He has quoted saying that, yeah, that's very different to
what you said before about everyone's just having a big
party and we don't care about it. That's not at
all the case, and that's why we make waitingful. You're
just going to s I'm promising one hundred thousand homes
that you never deliver. You actually promise this with targeted
things so that you can move people. Yes, that is
(15:19):
an absolutely part of it.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
It's going to sux.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
The problem is it's one of the.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
Tools that are saying The police are saying that they
don't have enough numbers to be able to attend things
like burglaries. You've got a head of the police association
saying they don't have the numbers because nationals fail.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
To deliver on five hundred look, you said the same
thing about the gang Patch band and it worked really well.
So Labor are going to stand here and criticize. I
hope that we're going to be having conversation hold on
both a few months. We're all going to be saying, actually,
it's worked.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Really well to you come to the studio, you go past,
you either walk if you walk down here or in
your car. You see the people on the streets. You
know it's alicious.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Of course, I know it's an issue, which is why
we have to make meaningful steps towards it. It has
been an issue for years, if not decades in this country.
But you don't solve it just by downing here and
pretending that the last government were perfect and that we're
doing everything wrong. Moving people away from disruptive and antisocial
places is a good thing to do, not a solution,
(16:18):
and social housing is also a solution, and we're doing that.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Moving on next subject. Earlier this week it was labor
State of the Nation address, Ginny. I hate to break
it to you, but it was very boring. Got nothing
out of it. When are we going to see something
out of labor.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
We have been upfront and said we want to make
sure that we can deliver on what we promise, and
so in order to do that, we need to see
what's in the budget, and we'll be doing that. We've
already put out our tax policy and showing how we
will fund three free GP, but that's for all New Zealanders.
But we know that a cost of living is front
and center for New Zealanders and I think that's why
(16:59):
they get frustrated with national coming out with things like
move on orders for homeless people when the reality is
that for most key us mints or red meat even
as a luxury item in your groceries because they can't
afford to pay for things like that. So we'll be
focused on making sure we have clear policies that deliver
more affordable life because key we's are leaving New Zealand
(17:22):
and record numbers due to the cost of work.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Are you going to tell us how you're going to
do that is my question.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
So we need to see what's in the budget, and
when that available, we can cost it out and show
where that money is coming from. And to do it
before him would mean that we can't show the workings
of where the money is coming from.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Come on, tell me what you got out of the
weakest excuse ever right to say they're waiting for the budget, Like,
guess what governments do they write a budget, write your
own one.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
Tell us what you would do differently, actually commit to something.
It was a land in each Ever. No, I mean,
the only thing that I think he got right was
when he said we won't promise anything we can't deliver,
and then he promised nothing, because that's pretty much what
keyis expect later to deliver. So what I mean, we'd
love to hear them just give us some big thing.
Will you commit to less than fifty percent GDP in
(18:09):
terms of debt? Will you commit to keeping the Reserve
Bank just focused on keeping inflation low? If the cost
of living is so important, when you reverse the changes
we made there, there's a lot your policies come out
and heaven the policy that.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Nationals announced so far. Can you give us a bit
of a outline of your policy?
Speaker 4 (18:25):
Yeah, we're doing it every every week. Move on orders.
There's something that we've just committed to it.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
You got to fix the cost of living by moving
on homeless people.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
That's excellent. I'm sure that it'll hold. Wearing new dealnders,
we do that great right now, getting our spending and
not wasteful spending. We do it by keeping the Reserve
Bank focused on a one to three percent threshold. We
do it by bringing debt down and keeping it under
fifty percent GDP. I mean, why won't labor commit to
any of those?
Speaker 3 (18:48):
If you were actually serious about saving text people payers money,
you would provide social housing because it cost the taxpayer more,
and police and moving on people and all the associated
mental health and other costs with that. If you have
people first into our housing first principle instead of cutting
social housing and cutting access to emergency housing, you would
actually save the text payer.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
Money right over, because they don't. But she can't give
us one policy, right there's not even one like we
free free gits? Where are they going to?
Speaker 3 (19:19):
Simple capital games?
Speaker 4 (19:20):
Text? And where are the doctors? Where are you We've
gone for a food medical school. We're saying, can we
save her up to six percent? You know, where's labors
be on any of that?
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Time out? Time out? I got to go, let's get
over it. I'm over it just quickly. Either of you
are going to go for a swimming larbe this weekend.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
But I've got a good quote for I just had
to look it up. It's a Marti quote. It's crowded
tacumater equorded all more taca and that is a krumater
does not speak of its own sweetness. It's the same
quote you see before. Mary've got one as well.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
There you go. They must have taken it from mine.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
And they don't don't talk about her callwhere.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Because from that quote.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
You there you go, both of you. Thank you very much,
Tim Costley, O tech Emp. Lovely to have you on
the show. Term as always, Ginny Anderson, nice to talk
to you again. Have a great weekend. It's recus week,
so you've had a weekend all week, haven't you really?
I mean, don't try and clear that one up. You've
had a week off, both of you. Yeah, I knew
(20:24):
you were going to come back with that.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Said B and that's a Thursday, so that's politics Thursday. Well,
good morning and welcome to Ginny Anderson. Good morning mag
How are you having spoken for a while.
Speaker 3 (00:22):
I know I'm looking at Yeah, I was looking forward
to catching up, and I must remember to say I
saw Nick Cave and it was amazing and he reminded me.
Speaker 4 (00:31):
Of your effects.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Okay to say that, I thought there was some strong
similarities between the Cave and Nick Mills.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
I don't know Nick Cave, so I've got to go
look a move.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
You've got the same here cut and everything looks like you.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Well, thanks, I hope it's a compliment.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
He's a great he's a great singer.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Tim m Cave, my gosh, Tim Costley, who reminds me
of what's his name, Sherman, Tim Shim what his name?
What's the guy of the singer.
Speaker 3 (00:56):
Risley?
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Come on, I can't see any good morning and I'll
have family at compliments and you're welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Yeah, I thought I think you're a bit of insurance.
You'd right to be.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
But tall maybe offensive.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
That's not offensive. It was positive.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
The heads of Allben, But I don't know if I'm
befoll on gain but musical ability blonde.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Jenny, you got me out of a stick there, beautiful, Right,
let's talk more point. I mean, what either of you.
I'm going to ask you both, Jenny, I'll ask you first,
what would you do a stunt like jumping into the
sea pool c to make your point? Was it a
little bit cringe to you?
Speaker 3 (01:43):
You're going to say no, I'll say that Andrew Little
is braver than me.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
I don't know if I would go in there, to
be honest, I'd be a bit a bit concerned so
soon after what's happened, in the fact that they still
might be stuff in there. So yeah, but I've I mean,
I've got friends up there up that way, and after
the big storm they had to they literally had to
hose off the front of the houses with sort of
they call meta.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
So I think so.
Speaker 3 (02:07):
Hard for all the people who who physically have to
be there in that space every day.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
I was more asking if you'd do it as a
sort of stunt to get big stories on the news.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
I know I probably wouldn't. I'm not really into doing stunts.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
You hold on, hold on. I remember the pool nine eye, Paul,
you were there and you and your and your togs.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
I didn't do the bomb though, so Chris Bishop and
Chris Hopkins turned up and died a money and I
didn't participate in that. I did go down the hydro
slide at a later date. But no, I don't tend
to do jumps off wolves and jumps off things I can,
but I do kind of Yeah, it doesn't sit so
well with me, doesn't feel you know, natural.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Maybe I thought it felt a little bit cringed. Tim Costly,
would you do something?
Speaker 4 (02:48):
Mean?
Speaker 3 (02:48):
You?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
You're mister bloom and Instagram at the moment, you do
anything for a good reeal, wouldn't you.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
I don't have a matrix of our hydroslid's okay, but
a bomb's not or anything. But look, I don't know
if i'd about the publicity stunt, but but i'd go
for a swim. I you know, when I was flying
in the Air Force, I was worked on big sky theory.
The chances are hitting another planes pretty small, and I
kind of think big ocean theory, the chances are hitting
a purse pretty small. I don't want to diminister the
(03:16):
seriousness of it. But I actually I actually looked up
the Lower I looked up the Lower website to check
water Qualie and at the moment it's saying all green
around the Wellington South coast, but it's but it's yellow
up on the Company coast. I can't believe it. I'm not.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (03:30):
I don't know if I even accept this now, because
surely the beaches where I have swum along way can
I are far better than Wellington. But that's not what
their website says, would would washed up to the company
is that's what's happened, is well, I'll be sending Andrew
Little of the bill if it has.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Tim you haven't asked, you haven't answered the question whether
you would have gone for a dip though, if if
the camera was, if your little Instagram mate and your
camera was there.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
I don't. I don't think me and speedos is what
the camera wants to see, if I'm really honest.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Well, to be fair, Andrew Little had one of those
swim toops on which I thought was pretty good. I'd
have to have one of those swimtops.
Speaker 4 (04:05):
Do you know? Okay? Well, thankful because every winter I
do the little fundraising winters from here and I do
were my National Party drive at top, So maybe if
I have my National Party T shirt on there we go.
How about that?
Speaker 2 (04:17):
All right? Couple of serious questions about it, because it's
a very very serious matter. Should we be celebrating so soon?
Speaker 4 (04:27):
I don't think it's you know, when you get back
to what should be everyday experience in New Zealand. I
don't know if it's a celebration. I think it's a
sigh of relief that the immediate water quality is okay
for people that want to enjoy a beautiful coastline. But
I don't think we're celebrating or even really you know,
sitting back until the plant as fixed. They've got the
long term solution in place and some assurance that the
(04:50):
right procedures and process that are in place that can't
happen again.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Should this is coming to you, Jenny, Should the businesses
receive some compensation?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Well, I think that review needs to play out to
find out what actually went wrong before you can start
jumping to things like but.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
The business system. Sorry to interrupt, but to be fair
on the businesses, they didn't create any of them.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
No, not at all, and nor really did the people
in and around that area that have had their property
prices impacted and their quality of life impact. So, I mean,
let's be honest, it's been a real disaster for Wellingtonians
and it really makes me sad that our beautiful ocean
is being filled with sewage. But it does make the
question the water issue is how a local council is
(05:34):
being funded for infrastructure like this when it fails dramatically
and just kepting rates is not going to fix big
problems like this, and that really worries me. What's the
long term solution for big pieces of infrastructure the impact
and natural environment like this?
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Tim, what did you make of a little bit of
a stoush between I Shavira and Andrew Little last week? Yeah,
over what was going on there?
Speaker 4 (05:59):
Well, when we were sitting within the studio, I was
trying to be a little bit polite, but I Shaverra's
not holding back, and you know that's that's her role
to do that, and I don't I don't know what
the history is there, but look, I think it's clear
that people want answers. You know, locals are frustrated by
the situation. You know, I don't know that you know,
(06:21):
Andrew Little wasn't the mayor at the time it happened,
but Wellington council Cerdainly has a lot to answer for,
particularly whether the prioritizing spending on a bike plane over
a sewage plant.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
What did you make of it, Jilly, I mean a
couple of labor buddies having a little bit of a
go at each other. I mean, I thought to be fair,
I'm I'm in ia Vira's corner on this. She she
was right with what she's saying and she wanted some results.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Well, she's doing a great job at being a strong
local advocate for those people that she's standing for for
Wellington North and Nationals kind even find a candidate to
stand in that in that area. So it's just an
absolute radio silence from from the other side. So she's
standing up and representing people's interests in doing a good
job of that.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
I'm talking to Nicol Willis to morrow and my top
question is going to be why the hell can't they
find somebody to run for a major seat in the
capital city of New Zealand. I want to ask you
quickly before we have a break, Nick, Sorry, Tim, The
Reserve Bank have come out and said they need these
more banks open and more areas. We need to keep
the facility of having cash. What are your thoughts on it?
(07:24):
What do you make of it?
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Yeah, look, I get particularly for those you know, our
electric has one of the highest number of over sixty
fives and cash is still important to them. A lot
of people do the vast if not all, their banking online,
and I get that works for a lot of people.
You know, the white example is quite interesting where it's
just it's an automated kind of a fancy ATM that
(07:48):
can do all of that cash. It can change things
that you can deposit things, you can change big notes
for small notes, or coins for small notes or whatever
it might be. So you know, it's not about opening
new banks, I think, but it's having the tools in
place that enable people to do it. The tricky part
is going to be where the rubber hits the road
and you know they're saying, well, it's a three kilometer
walk to find that, you know, a thousand people, but
(08:10):
what if it's three point two k's and you know,
when there's a rural hub or big you know, a
rural hub versus urban hubin so it's the concept's good,
but discussion is interesting. I think having the right tools there,
but it doesn't necessarily look like a traditional.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Bank, Ginny, will anythink come of this?
Speaker 3 (08:28):
I don't know. I mean people need to be able
to access their money, and especially in emergencies. We've seen
that when people need cash and they can't use online banking,
so I hope they do. I mean, why do you mutter?
In My area is where all the banks closed, and
there's a significant population over sixty five and it really
impacted people's ability to do their day to day stuff.
(08:50):
So I know the world's changing and mowes online, but
I think we also need to acknowledge what happens in
New Zealand that we do have more climate change emergencies.
People will need cash and how are we catering to that?
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Tim, do you have any cash on you right now?
Speaker 4 (09:06):
I don't even have a wallet on me right now.
I do, actually him, I've got a I always have
an immugency twins in my wallet. I forget if I
get stuck l I don't know it.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
It might help, yeah, I mean some would help. I
would have thought twenty would be a couple of coffees,
and that's about it, Jenny you have Do you have
any cash on you?
Speaker 3 (09:24):
No?
Speaker 4 (09:24):
I don't.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
Maybe in my handbag, I'd.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Have a wallet, No you don't. What about in your handbag?
Would you have some cash in your handbag in case of.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
The ruld in my handbag yet? Yeah, wouldn't my handbag yet?
Speaker 2 (09:38):
When was the last time you used cash?
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Oh? My goodness? Probably at things like school fears and
and those sorts of things where people are doing raffles
or fundraising. So I always have cash for those sort
of community events where these these things where people don't
have these post facilities, but quite a lot of small
traders now even school fears of getting the.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
Using these post too.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Well, you can get it on your phone if you wanted, Tim,
when was the last time you use cash?
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I was about to say that all tacky market on
a Sunday, But actually it was at Rotary Club on
Tuesday night because they had a was it a ratfall
or something? But there was cash.
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Only are you a Rotary Club member?
Speaker 4 (10:16):
Now? I'm a great local MP that just turns up
to everything they can't even want to.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
Then he just turned up by yourself, Tim, I.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
Have a very famous quote from a very famous person,
my wife self. Praise is no praise politics Thursday. Ginny Anderson,
Labor MP and spokesperson for police and Tim Costley, the
o Tacki MP. Government is going to grant police powers
to move on rough sleepers, but the Police Association president
(10:47):
says they're not resourced well enough to do that. Tim,
where the hell are they going to move these rough
sleepers to?
Speaker 4 (10:56):
Well, first there, we've got to get them out of
immediate So the lawy itself says they've got to move
out of that descinery for the next twenty four hours. Right.
But the point is some of these places to go. Well,
if you look at this that's that come out of
the the report that was done last year, forty percent
of them had a home to go to. Because it's
not just rough sleepers, right, it's anyone that's intimidating, it's
(11:17):
anyone that is disruptive, it's anyone that's blocking people getting
into shops and businesses. This is a real issue for
our small businesses, the kind of people we should be
supporting and actually claim those people out of that immediate
vicinity is a great first step and something that a
lot of people have been calling for and then it's
about you know, we're pumping millions of dollars into these
proven providers that have where there is genuinely, genuinely no
(11:41):
place for them to go to, that can that can
then house and accommodate these people. But you know, it's
a it's a serious issue. And I bet you say
in Wellington outside your business, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Oh, it's a serious issue, no question about it. Ginny,
How are the police reacting to this?
Speaker 1 (11:56):
How?
Speaker 2 (11:57):
I mean, what are they going to be able to do?
They don't have the numbers. Are they going to go
and pick up somebody that's just done things in their
own clothes that they shouldn't have, put them on the
police car and take them and take them where.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
Well, they're going to take them to the next suburb.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
It'll be Kingsland, that it will be, you know, the
next neighboring suburb where they yet moved to. I mean,
this is not a solution, it's just shifting people. You know,
Providing housing is a solution. You know, Chris Bishop gutted
the public housing build and he stopped people from getting
access to emergency housing and the resulting problem is increased homelessness.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Can I just interrupt you there a little bit, because
we know that there's plenty of housing available, isn't there
There's plenty.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
Of This is a mythnic. I debate this. They've made
a small amount of houses available. They're completely filled up
straight away. Homelessness has overdoubled in both Auckland and in Wellington.
In some of those areas.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
There is not enough housing.
Speaker 3 (12:51):
I've been out myself both in both central areas. There
are people like fifteen and sixteen year olds who have
come from homes where there's high levels of family violence
or sexual violence and their home is not safe for them.
And so that is why they are on the streets,
because they actually had nowhere else to go. And this
government's response is to shove them off into the next suburb.
Speaker 4 (13:13):
It doesn't six the problem.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Do you agree with that?
Speaker 4 (13:16):
No? No, And this is the same old lines from Labor.
They said the same thing when we were moving people
out of emergency accommodation, that they would just be dumped
in the next suburb or the next town. That hasn't happened.
That is not as you look to the numbers, right,
So look at what happened under the last Labor government.
We had a thirty percent increase in the number of
(13:36):
people living in this kind of thing. The state House waitlist,
you know, went blew out massively by about four times
to twenty thousand people. It was huge. Housing was terrible
under the last government, and it's not I'm just not
going to sit here and let them come back and say, well,
it's terrible. Now you look at the census starter thirty
percent increase and those that had no accommodation, no shelter
(13:57):
at all under the last labor government.
Speaker 2 (13:59):
We inrupt. Can I interrupt on this pre prepared speech
to yours and say that numbers are actually getting worse,
not let us thank you?
Speaker 4 (14:08):
Yes, but that's not what I'd like to edit as possible.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
So that I've been visited into into the into the
Wellington City Mission that operates there, and they have said
homelessness is the worst they have ever seen it and
the whole time they've been operating. Right now, it's the
worst it has ever been. And the City Mission in
Auckland will say the same thing. These are the frontline
providers at the cold face saying it is the worst
(14:33):
it has ever been. So I simply do not accept
these national lives saying everybody's fine. All these people are
just hanging out to be friends on the street and
having a party, and they've actually got a home to
go to.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
The reality is that they don't like. No one's saying that, right,
but go and read the homelessness.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
Much together for a sense of community. M Mitchell has
said that that people are on the streets because they
come together for a sense of community.
Speaker 4 (14:56):
He has quoted saying that, yeah, that's very different to
what you said before about everyone's just having a big
party and we don't care about it. That's not at
all the case, and that's why we make waitingful. You're
just going to s I'm promising one hundred thousand homes
that you never deliver. You actually promise this with targeted
things so that you can move people. Yes, that is
(15:19):
an absolutely part of it.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
It's going to sux.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
The problem is it's one of the.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
Tools that are saying The police are saying that they
don't have enough numbers to be able to attend things
like burglaries. You've got a head of the police association
saying they don't have the numbers because nationals fail.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
To deliver on five hundred look, you said the same
thing about the gang Patch band and it worked really well.
So Labor are going to stand here and criticize. I
hope that we're going to be having conversation hold on
both a few months. We're all going to be saying, actually,
it's worked.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
Really well to you come to the studio, you go past,
you either walk if you walk down here or in
your car. You see the people on the streets. You
know it's alicious.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Of course, I know it's an issue, which is why
we have to make meaningful steps towards it. It has
been an issue for years, if not decades in this country.
But you don't solve it just by downing here and
pretending that the last government were perfect and that we're
doing everything wrong. Moving people away from disruptive and antisocial
places is a good thing to do, not a solution,
(16:18):
and social housing is also a solution, and we're doing that.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
Moving on next subject. Earlier this week it was labor
State of the Nation address, Ginny. I hate to break
it to you, but it was very boring. Got nothing
out of it. When are we going to see something
out of labor.
Speaker 3 (16:37):
We have been upfront and said we want to make
sure that we can deliver on what we promise, and
so in order to do that, we need to see
what's in the budget, and we'll be doing that. We've
already put out our tax policy and showing how we
will fund three free GP, but that's for all New Zealanders.
But we know that a cost of living is front
and center for New Zealanders and I think that's why
(16:59):
they get frustrated with national coming out with things like
move on orders for homeless people when the reality is
that for most key us mints or red meat even
as a luxury item in your groceries because they can't
afford to pay for things like that. So we'll be
focused on making sure we have clear policies that deliver
more affordable life because key we's are leaving New Zealand
(17:22):
and record numbers due to the cost of work.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Are you going to tell us how you're going to
do that is my question.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
So we need to see what's in the budget, and
when that available, we can cost it out and show
where that money is coming from. And to do it
before him would mean that we can't show the workings
of where the money is coming from.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Come on, tell me what you got out of the
weakest excuse ever right to say they're waiting for the budget, Like,
guess what governments do they write a budget, write your
own one.
Speaker 4 (17:48):
Tell us what you would do differently, actually commit to something.
It was a land in each Ever. No, I mean,
the only thing that I think he got right was
when he said we won't promise anything we can't deliver,
and then he promised nothing, because that's pretty much what
keyis expect later to deliver. So what I mean, we'd
love to hear them just give us some big thing.
Will you commit to less than fifty percent GDP in
(18:09):
terms of debt? Will you commit to keeping the Reserve
Bank just focused on keeping inflation low? If the cost
of living is so important, when you reverse the changes
we made there, there's a lot your policies come out
and heaven the policy that.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Nationals announced so far. Can you give us a bit
of a outline of your policy?
Speaker 4 (18:25):
Yeah, we're doing it every every week. Move on orders.
There's something that we've just committed to it.
Speaker 3 (18:28):
You got to fix the cost of living by moving
on homeless people.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
That's excellent. I'm sure that it'll hold. Wearing new dealnders,
we do that great right now, getting our spending and
not wasteful spending. We do it by keeping the Reserve
Bank focused on a one to three percent threshold. We
do it by bringing debt down and keeping it under
fifty percent GDP. I mean, why won't labor commit to
any of those?
Speaker 3 (18:48):
If you were actually serious about saving text people payers money,
you would provide social housing because it cost the taxpayer more,
and police and moving on people and all the associated
mental health and other costs with that. If you have
people first into our housing first principle instead of cutting
social housing and cutting access to emergency housing, you would
actually save the text payer.
Speaker 4 (19:09):
Money right over, because they don't. But she can't give
us one policy, right there's not even one like we
free free gits? Where are they going to?
Speaker 3 (19:19):
Simple capital games?
Speaker 4 (19:20):
Text? And where are the doctors? Where are you We've
gone for a food medical school. We're saying, can we
save her up to six percent? You know, where's labors
be on any of that?
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Time out? Time out? I got to go, let's get
over it. I'm over it just quickly. Either of you
are going to go for a swimming larbe this weekend.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
But I've got a good quote for I just had
to look it up. It's a Marti quote. It's crowded
tacumater equorded all more taca and that is a krumater
does not speak of its own sweetness. It's the same
quote you see before. Mary've got one as well.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
There you go. They must have taken it from mine.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
And they don't don't talk about her callwhere.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Because from that quote.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
You there you go, both of you. Thank you very much,
Tim Costley, O tech Emp. Lovely to have you on
the show. Term as always, Ginny Anderson, nice to talk
to you again. Have a great weekend. It's recus week,
so you've had a weekend all week, haven't you really?
I mean, don't try and clear that one up. You've
had a week off, both of you. Yeah, I knew
(20:24):
you were going to come back with that.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks It'd be Wellington from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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