July 15, 2026 • 21 mins
It's Politics Thursday and Nick Mills is joined by Labour MP Ginny Andersen and National MP for Otaki Tim Costley to discuss the political news of the week.
Starting with Nationals plea for Labour to commit to their rates cap proposal.
Is the risk of flip flopping between governments worth it? Do we need a different solution to the frivolous spends of councils? Andersen shares Labour's thoughts and why they still have not taken a stance on the issue.
Then the panel discuss the introduction of bird flu on Wellington's shore, TOP in the election debate and where are we at with the Wellington Roads of Significance? Is there any chance we could drive through the second Mt Victoria tunnel in the next decade?
And Paul Henry - what do our political panel make of the broadcaster's entrance into parliament through the ACT Party?
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk. Said, b.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Happy birthday Jenny Anderson, twenty one today she's fifty one,
but thank you. I knew that, but I didn't want
to be rude because I knew you had a big
birthday last year, because I missed the invitement.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
So do you go, Happy birthday and welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
In p for o Techi, Tim Costley, you're not quite
fifty one yet, but welcome to the show.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Thank you, Happy.
Speaker 5 (00:48):
Birthday, Jenny. I I was canted to join in the singing.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
I'm not sure it's the gift. You'd be asked to
be fair. No, okay, fair enough.
Speaker 6 (00:54):
I appreciate it.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Right she was here, she'd be singing. That'd be great.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
You had to put a low blow and to start
the show, it'd be great.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Jomp mean a thing? Is that one done? No?
Speaker 2 (01:07):
You just had to have a little crack to start
things up. Anyway, Let's start Nationals asking labor to take
a stance on the proposed four percents rate cap. Now,
I love this idea and I think that they you
should join forces, Ginny, Why don't you just say yes?
If you're bringing this law that will stick to it
if we become parliament.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Why don't we have some more security.
Speaker 6 (01:30):
Well, where where's the money coming from to fix the stuff?
That's the question, right.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
So yus, I agree it's palatable to.
Speaker 6 (01:37):
Have a cap on your rates, but that's still not
a solution to the fact of leaking pipes and broken
infrastructure and a whole bunch of other stuff that rate
payers are having to front up and pay more on parking,
more on libraries, more on polls, all of these extra
costs at the pain. So we need a long term
solution of how these things are going to be funded,
(01:58):
and we don't have that right now.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Ginny, you don't spend enough time listening to the show,
because if you did, you'd know that the people absolutely
had enough of rates high they can't afford it, So
at least National.
Speaker 6 (02:13):
Join us to be clear, we support the idea of
a rat cap, but it needs to be supported by
further sunding for local government.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
Otherwise it's just.
Speaker 6 (02:23):
Kiwis who end up putting the bill. So people shouldn't
have to pay for all of those things like the
Tony's going ups on increased parking at the main of
Jeckson Street. That's really impacting all the local shops and
all the businesses up that way. That's a direct impact
of the not being sufficient funding for local councils. So
we want to make sure that there's a solution that's
(02:45):
not just making local people in the Heart and other
places have to reach into their pockets more and more.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Tim Costy, who is going to pay for all the stuff?
I mean, I love the idea. I'm supportive of the
idea of anything to help rates come down or be stabilized,
But who is going to pay?
Speaker 5 (03:01):
Well, I tell you who's been made to pay. It's
been every mom and dad, every Kiwi that owns a
house has been paying it through their rates and labor.
To say that, you know, we should just fund local government,
wrest it from your rates, We'll guess who that is.
It's the exact same people paying it in their tax.
Speaker 6 (03:16):
Where does it come from them? What's your answer? Where
does it come to?
Speaker 5 (03:19):
The answer is that councils need to prioritize their spending.
Speaker 4 (03:22):
And I'll give you a great example.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
Look at the the bus shelter and part of part
of UMU.
Speaker 4 (03:28):
They spent two.
Speaker 5 (03:29):
Million dollars on that there was already a bus shelter there.
What they did was they put in a second set
of traffic lights one hundred meters from the current set.
They put in a second crossing across the road, and
then they put.
Speaker 4 (03:39):
A garden on the roofs of the bushelter.
Speaker 7 (03:41):
It's on the roof. You can't even see it.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
It's on the roof.
Speaker 5 (03:44):
It's that kind of wasteful.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
Spending that has to be stopped.
Speaker 5 (03:47):
We want councils to get back to basics, focus on
the critical infrastructure, thain site, the pipes, thing site.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
The roads. But we actually have to be careful.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Because they tell you what, in the last six years
on the company coast rates went up more than fifty percent.
Fifty percent. Imagine if we put everyone's taxes up by
fifty percent. We can't keep on with this attitude of
just spend the money, just spend more money.
Speaker 7 (04:09):
We actually have to make some tough decisions.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Ginny, Tim's right, we have to make some tough decisions.
And you know, I would have thought this was in
your wheelhouse. I would have thought this was exactly what
labor want to do. Protect those people that have retired
and can't stay in their own home because they can't
afford the rates.
Speaker 6 (04:26):
Look, we're all for the cost of living measures that
actually make a difference, but I still haven't heard from
Tim where the funding is coming from for water infrastructure
for all of those things.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
Ensure.
Speaker 6 (04:36):
You can point to a seesaw that cost lots of money,
or a block of toilet somewhere else, but that's not
the guts of all the pipes and all the infrastructure
costs that have been landed with local government currently for
that to happen.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Can I just interrupt you a sect there, Jinny, because
isn't actually saving wasteful money going to bring the bottom
line down?
Speaker 6 (04:57):
It will, but that's not enough. You need to do
more than just pointing out.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
Some silly projects.
Speaker 6 (05:02):
And admittedly there'll be ones around the around the country
that weren't a wide spend, but that in itself isn't
sufficient to fund the huge deficit that all local councils
in our facing, and that's why we're paying more for
our parking, that's why we're paying more for our rates.
And I still haven't heard from Tim what the long
term solution is, apart from scrapping from seesaws and toilets.
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Can you just answer me this.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Why isn't so important that you actually get the cross
party agreement? Why why can't you just do it like
everything else?
Speaker 3 (05:29):
And so damn it.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
If they, you know, become government, they can change it back.
Speaker 5 (05:36):
Well, you've got certainty. If your party rate national, then
we're continue on the path we're on. This is supported
by the colition at you seem first, So this is
going ahead. Yeah, sure, we don't need it, but it
gives I think Key week certainty that they know actually
there's agreement across the House that in the future, at
some point Label will.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
Be in government. I think it's a long way.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
Away because of the attitude that we hear, which is
just take more money from Keys and spend it. But
one day we want to give Key with certainty that
actually we're going to live within our means. I have
some economic responsible management. And that's the fundamental difference of
hearing it now. Ginny wants to know where there'll be
more money coming from. We've got to stop just thinking
that we need more and more money, and Key weis
(06:18):
just need to pay more and more. We actually have
to make tough decisions and don'ts.
Speaker 6 (06:22):
When I'm out when I'm out door knocking neck For example,
I was at door knocking in the weekend and I
had a local guy who had sawage coming up in
his front yard and he'd been waiting for three months
to have someone come out either from council, often willing
to water to actually do anything about it, because you know,
the lack of money to be able to go and
(06:45):
do stuff like that. I mean, that's swage and someone's
a bat card, he's got a week K two three
playing in his garden. You know, that's the sort of
reality that New Zealanders are stuck with because these insufficient
funding for basic infrastructure and that causes poor health outcomes
through our community.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Ginny, I beat your dollars for donuts. If you asked
that same man, were you happy with your rates that
you're paying and you can continue to pay and they're
going to go up by the skyrog he'd give you
another mouthful on that as well.
Speaker 6 (07:12):
We need to have that inform discussion. That's what we
need to say, like what is the quality of life
we want in New Zealand And let's let's understand what
the actual cost is for doing this. And how are
we going to fund it in a practical way that
gives key with good quality of life and swage in
your backyards, not quality of life.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
Yeah, but it's also about what we can afford, right,
and we cannot afford to go down the path we
were going down. And when I was doing knocking on
the weekend around the Whippy area, I'll tell you what,
the biggest issue I'm hearing on the doorstep is the
cost of council rates. And that's why we have provided
the tools. That's why we've separated at water. We're letting
them take on long term borrowing and we're increasing the
(07:48):
ratio to borrow so.
Speaker 4 (07:50):
We spread the cost over a long term.
Speaker 5 (07:52):
And just remember rates don't include the water charges, so
it doesn't include the pipes, it doesn't include.
Speaker 4 (07:57):
The sewerage that Jinny's talking about.
Speaker 5 (07:59):
This is about another bill rate case for the other
council of things. That's that's right, and that's why it's
important that we actually get rates under control. So it's
a really easy thing. It'd be great, but you know,
once again, we don't know what.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
Letters stand for.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
They don't seem to have policies on very much at all.
It would be really good for keeps to give them
peace of mind to know, actually, we're going to keep
rates under control.
Speaker 6 (08:19):
You know what, from my poestion, it's kicking the can
down the road. You're kicking the can down the road
without having a real solution in place.
Speaker 7 (08:25):
It's a very awesomeite you.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
You don't have a position on this.
Speaker 5 (08:29):
You are kicking the can down the road. You're not
willing to actually stand up. I'm telling you exactly what
we believe, and we are dealing.
Speaker 4 (08:34):
With this now.
Speaker 5 (08:35):
We're capping rates. We have dealt with local water done well.
We have put in a new system for that.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
Were we're done well.
Speaker 6 (08:42):
How many councils around the country can't pay for it?
And we're getting a bill on top of our increased
rates bill, We're getting another water bill under national And
you promise that you would take action on the cost
of living and the only solution you've got is to
cap rates. Well, that doesn't fix the underlying problem that
these insufficient funding to stop people who have swag in
their backyard.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Can you answer me this though, Jenny, what's more serious
a problem people that get to retirement and have to
sell their forever home. Their family homes because they can't
afford the rates. What is more important and isn't it
a bit smarter to actually say that the next five
generations or four generations of people are going to get
the use out of moneys. That money has been spent
(09:22):
on the water, so let's spread it out further.
Speaker 6 (09:27):
I totally agree. We need a long term solution to
make sure that we have the infrastructure in a place
that we need and people retiring deserve that certainty to
know that they have it there.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
And it's really.
Speaker 6 (09:37):
Concerning that the rates are going up when people are
on a second income and getting super that's a worry.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Time for a quick break. Will be back with Ginny
Anderson and Tim Costly. Tim, from just from my point
of view from doing this job, I wouldn't have heard
many people have a negative thoughts on your stance on
the rates thing. I think, I mean, I think it's
more positive. I're be getting more positive live from that.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Overwhelmingly positive on the doorstep.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Absolutely, yeah, well done.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Are we prepared for the blue food that just to
write in your backyard please, Jenny?
Speaker 7 (10:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (10:09):
Yeah? Concerning, isn't it? Tony Beach I saw that report
yesterday so I mean it's watchful. People don't need to panic,
I suppose because it's not got a human risk. But
from all of the warnings I've seen, it's making sure
people cook thoroughly eggs and chicken, and make sure people
report into MPI if they're seeing birds you know that
look unwell or unusual. But yeah, a bit of a concern.
(10:33):
But in reassuring people that there's no human health risk, are.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
We sure about that, Jenny, Yeah, all.
Speaker 6 (10:41):
The advice seems to indicate that that's not. We need
to be watchful of our own poultry industry to make
sure it's not impacted. And of course there'll be people
concerned about native birds and the impact on our native
bird and how that sort of pans out.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
But in the.
Speaker 6 (10:55):
Interim, I think by people Kee, we are great at
being watchful and reporting them, so that all the advices
if you see you know, two or more birds behaving unusually,
to make sure you've owned into MPI, and we'll just
have to see how things going.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
There's a thousand good lines there, Johny, but I won't
use any of the Minister Hogart Tom said that the
protocols that the government have in place will deal with us.
How confident are you?
Speaker 5 (11:22):
Yeah, we've been prepared for I mean I just said
on the in the break, one of the MBI starts
saying the same thing.
Speaker 4 (11:27):
We've been prepared for this for a long time. You know.
Speaker 7 (11:30):
Just put it in perspective.
Speaker 5 (11:31):
Yeah, it's it's a significant thing that we wanted to
take really seriously. But look at this stage, we've had
one third call in sick.
Speaker 7 (11:38):
That's it.
Speaker 5 (11:39):
The Australia case I see only ever spread to about
a dozen and they have either I've been to visit
like tex Poultry and Foxton, which is part of my electorate.
They have really good on farm and in the factory
biosecurity measures that are in place. So I think people
are really confident that the right bet has been done,
that we're well positioned for it, that we're taking it seriously,
(12:01):
and we should be watchful. But I don't think anyone
needs to be alarmed. There's no threat to humans. There's
there's no risk to eggs and poultry that people are
going to go and find in the supermarket today, So.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
They wouldn't stop you for having your post eggs in
the morning, either of you.
Speaker 7 (12:14):
I don't hard boils maybe.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
Maybe had boils.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I'm a great fror of eggs and olive oil, and
I'm a bit nervous now.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
But anyway, you don't need to be relate. I can't.
But if I get crook, I'm calling you Tom.
Speaker 4 (12:30):
You do that? You do that?
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Paul Henry?
Speaker 2 (12:33):
What do you think of Paul Henry coming into politics?
Come on, Tim, he'll be have more cameras around him
than you will.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
Yes, well, I really enjoyed him on Breakfast TV. I
always thought he was a bit of fun. They used
to say it like it was. It wasn't always very
pleasantly correct and popular. But look, I think a.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
Bit of personality is good.
Speaker 5 (12:55):
But actually what keys are going to ultimately vote on
is party, not Piersonell, And it's going to be on
the ideas and solutions that are going to make life
a little bit better, that are going to see, you know,
this country and a benefosition of a thing three years
and that's my ultimately want to vote for national Tinny.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
How do you think Paul Henry will fit into the beehive?
Speaker 6 (13:14):
Well, I think we saw a steep, blooming curve yesterday.
Really came out saying that you thought that the policy
was right on semi automatics, and the gun policy was good,
and I think Cole McKee dragged him aside and gave
him a quick word. In next minute, he's issued a
retracting that statement, saying that he backs Nicole McKee's policy
around gun changes.
Speaker 4 (13:33):
So I think he will be on a steep, blooming curve.
Speaker 6 (13:36):
And that's often the case with someone who's got a
big personality coming into politics.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
You know, I was about to say that that could
be anyone. That could have been me going into politics,
or your next door neighbor going into politics. They got
to make mistakes and say things that they shouldn't say,
aren't they.
Speaker 6 (13:49):
It's always quite good to read up your own party's
policy before you go into a press conference, and to
make sure if you're if you're making statements about new policy,
you might want to check that with the spokesperson and
your party. But that's often you'll see in other cases
where there's been a high profile person who's used to
shooting offrom the hip and saying what I think, that's
not quite how it works when you're part of a caucus.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Tim, what are your thoughts on celebrity and celebrities in politics.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Do you like the idea of it? I mean, we
should have all sorts of horrible old buildings, didn't we.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
No, I don't think I'm about celebrities and politicismen We've
had quite a few high profile people that have come
and gone in the past without making much of a splash.
But what I'm about is just about having a whole
range of kiwis with diverse backgrounds, you know, diversity of
thought and experience.
Speaker 4 (14:36):
I'm talking about nothing.
Speaker 7 (14:38):
Superficial that actually come in.
Speaker 5 (14:40):
But I do like that when people are free to
just be themselves, you know, yep, You've got to be
aligned with your party, and you've got to be part
of a team.
Speaker 4 (14:48):
This is that this is a team sport. This is
an individual sport. But I think it's good to have
a better personality.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
And you know, I don't know, it's a balance, right,
trying to have personality without without being too outrageous. But
I think that I think there's a place for a
little bit of both.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
We heard this week or last week that Mount Victoria Tunnel,
Grenada to Tony looking very very much on the back burner.
In fact, the back burner is not even burning. It's
turned off, Tim, what are your initial thoughts on this.
Speaker 5 (15:20):
Yeah, I mean it's about staging the construction. I think
that's a good way to give people certainty that there's
a long term pipeline. I mean, if you look at it,
if you're in our region, we'll take you to north
to live in under construction going ahead, there's six projects
already under construction or in procurement. Then is your Phase two,
which is you know, to Stay one, improvement through Wellington
(15:40):
and a whole range of stuff around the country.
Speaker 7 (15:43):
And then you've got these Stage three things.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
Like the Tony two Grenada, which are the roads that
are going to.
Speaker 7 (15:48):
Produce more slowly. But look, we've got a limited budget,
right Tim.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
We were promised when we voted you in that there
was going to be spades or shovels call it what
you want in the ground on Mount Victoria Tunnel before
this election. Now you can talk about the back offices
to you go blue in the face, but there ain't
going to be spades in the show. In fact that
that second Mount Victoria Tunnel probably won't even start in
(16:11):
my lifetime.
Speaker 5 (16:13):
Oh no, you promise that we would commence on Mount
back and it has. We've and we've had that debate
on the show before, and we've talked about the work
and the geological testing that they're doing and the work
that's underway. So that's fine, but what this is about
is about staging the work. We're not going to do
what happened in twenty eighteen where they cancel all these
(16:33):
roads of national significance or taken the North to live
in was canceled.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Many were chopped.
Speaker 5 (16:38):
We're actually giving people certainty about what projects are happening
and at what stage. And it's great to see these
roads happening because I tell you how popular it is.
Speaker 7 (16:46):
Up where I am.
Speaker 5 (16:46):
People can't wait to see or take you to live in.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Open all right, And I'm sorry, but I disagree with
you on that. I think there was shovels in the
ground that was but I mean going.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
To you, Jinny.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I spoke to Chrisipkins yesterday and asked him what would
what would be different and he said nothing under you.
So you're not promising anything either.
Speaker 6 (17:07):
Well, we don't promise roads that aren't funded. That's the difference.
And so national Chris Bishop went out and promised people
in the Hut Valley that PUTTONI to Grenada would be
a priority, but yet there was no money set aside
for that. And I think it's actually really irresponsible for
a local MP and a Minister of Transport to put
(17:29):
local communities through thinking this is going ahead, through thinking
their houses might have to be sold. There was consultation
across the community. All people thought that this was actually
going to happen, and it was trumpeted is going to happen.
And now we find out it's on the back burner
and it's not going to happen. It's being taken off
even being prioritized. So you know, what a waste of money,
what a waste of putting people through a real turmoil
(17:51):
in the community of thinking their houses could be taken.
And it's just downright irresponsible to go out and promise
things as part of an election when there's clearly no
money set aside to pay for them. So we will
only promise things that have money set aside for it.
Speaker 5 (18:07):
How are you paying for the eighteen billion dollars of
stuff that you've promised so far and have no plan
to pay for. We saw this last time laborer, and
they promised so much and they left a whole bunch
of fiscal cliffs, and they promised school classrooms which were
never funded, never took place.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
There's a whole raft of.
Speaker 5 (18:23):
Projects that they promised and never paid for and now
about eighteen billion short this year.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
What's your plan there?
Speaker 6 (18:29):
So you don't tom you don't have a leg to
stand on. When you bought your party has sung up
doubling the tunnel and the Tony to Grenada is key
deliverable to the last election, and now a few months
out from the election you're walking it back saying that
you can't deliver on it. So if anybody has got
a track record of promising and not delivering, it's National
and the Wellington region because people have been put through
(18:51):
the ringer and been told these things were happening. And
now clearly then North I don't know whether no, no,
Hang on a minute, that's not at all true.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
Last time twenty eighteen, Phil Twiceed was Minister of Transport,
took five billion dollars from the Land Transport Fund to
pump into other projects, canceled or taken the North Live
in which we campaigned on and have delivered that labor
of posed transmission gully. They have posed the Company Expressway Nation.
Those you don't even know your own party history transmit
(19:23):
stuff up. No, you go back and check labor a
post transmission gully. They have posed the Company Expressway, they
canceled or taken the North to live in.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
All right.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Get into the tip for tat stuff, but Tim, I'm sorry,
but as far as our listeners are concerned, that you
have broken a promise on Mount Victoria Tunnel because we
expected there to be some sort of construction work there
before the selection and we're not going to get it.
But quickly, very quickly, Top wants to be in on
the party debate the selection. Should they be able to
(19:56):
considering where they're sitting now just under the five percent?
Speaker 4 (19:59):
Tim Costley, Well, that's up to whoever's running the debate.
There's a whole whole range of them. Some have just
the two main parties.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
Some have a whole range of parties. Whoever's running it
can make up their own mind. I guess who they
want to invite.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
But do you think it should be fair that they
are part of a major the big boys?
Speaker 6 (20:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (20:19):
I mean there was probably similar arguments a few years
ago with what was it the Conservative Party? They were
for something percent Look, I'm not going to pick who
should be there and who shouldn't. If the people run
in the debate want to invite, pick which parties?
Speaker 4 (20:31):
Isn't done on a percentage? Is it?
Speaker 5 (20:32):
Often it's done on who's in parliament, like the party
MARTI will be polling lower than top. But does that
mean they don't get invited or do you just go
who's in parliament currently?
Speaker 7 (20:41):
Look, it's up to the.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
People running it.
Speaker 7 (20:42):
I think they can make their own decisions.
Speaker 6 (20:44):
Jenny Edison, I would quite like it when you get
a mix, because if you get lots of parties, you
don't get in depth conversation or you know, analysis, but
you get more views. So I quite like those ones.
But then it's also quite nice to have the two
major parties so you can really delve into issues about
what's funded, how things will plan out. So I'm actually
a favorite of having a variety of debates that give
(21:05):
people a taste the bus.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
Well, I just got some information bar handed on to
me from an article by Orenzen twenty twenty five. The
New Zealand Labor Party historically did not fundamentally oppose the
construction of transmission Gully motorway, but they were highly critical
of its funding, models, model and initial planning. And that's
(21:28):
a good way to finish it with a bit of truth,
isn't it.
Speaker 4 (21:31):
That's great.
Speaker 5 (21:32):
I love truth, crouded way to look at it. That's
the twenty twenty five Spanshal how Jage.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Good eyes, Tim Costly, Yeah, just said, oh gosh, how
can you go? That's documented. Happy birthday, great day. Thank
you both for your time this morning.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks There'd Be Wellington from nine am week days,
or follow the podcast on i Heart Radio
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from News Talk. Said, b.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Happy birthday Jenny Anderson, twenty one today she's fifty one,
but thank you. I knew that, but I didn't want
to be rude because I knew you had a big
birthday last year, because I missed the invitement.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
So do you go, Happy birthday and welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
In p for o Techi, Tim Costley, you're not quite
fifty one yet, but welcome to the show.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Thank you, Happy.
Speaker 5 (00:48):
Birthday, Jenny. I I was canted to join in the singing.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
I'm not sure it's the gift. You'd be asked to
be fair. No, okay, fair enough.
Speaker 6 (00:54):
I appreciate it.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Right she was here, she'd be singing. That'd be great.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
You had to put a low blow and to start
the show, it'd be great.
Speaker 4 (01:06):
Jomp mean a thing? Is that one done? No?
Speaker 2 (01:07):
You just had to have a little crack to start
things up. Anyway, Let's start Nationals asking labor to take
a stance on the proposed four percents rate cap. Now,
I love this idea and I think that they you
should join forces, Ginny, Why don't you just say yes?
If you're bringing this law that will stick to it
if we become parliament.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Why don't we have some more security.
Speaker 6 (01:30):
Well, where where's the money coming from to fix the stuff?
That's the question, right.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
So yus, I agree it's palatable to.
Speaker 6 (01:37):
Have a cap on your rates, but that's still not
a solution to the fact of leaking pipes and broken
infrastructure and a whole bunch of other stuff that rate
payers are having to front up and pay more on parking,
more on libraries, more on polls, all of these extra
costs at the pain. So we need a long term
solution of how these things are going to be funded,
(01:58):
and we don't have that right now.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
Ginny, you don't spend enough time listening to the show,
because if you did, you'd know that the people absolutely
had enough of rates high they can't afford it, So
at least National.
Speaker 6 (02:13):
Join us to be clear, we support the idea of
a rat cap, but it needs to be supported by
further sunding for local government.
Speaker 4 (02:22):
Otherwise it's just.
Speaker 6 (02:23):
Kiwis who end up putting the bill. So people shouldn't
have to pay for all of those things like the
Tony's going ups on increased parking at the main of
Jeckson Street. That's really impacting all the local shops and
all the businesses up that way. That's a direct impact
of the not being sufficient funding for local councils. So
we want to make sure that there's a solution that's
(02:45):
not just making local people in the Heart and other
places have to reach into their pockets more and more.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Tim Costy, who is going to pay for all the stuff?
I mean, I love the idea. I'm supportive of the
idea of anything to help rates come down or be stabilized,
But who is going to pay?
Speaker 5 (03:01):
Well, I tell you who's been made to pay. It's
been every mom and dad, every Kiwi that owns a
house has been paying it through their rates and labor.
To say that, you know, we should just fund local government,
wrest it from your rates, We'll guess who that is.
It's the exact same people paying it in their tax.
Speaker 6 (03:16):
Where does it come from them? What's your answer? Where
does it come to?
Speaker 5 (03:19):
The answer is that councils need to prioritize their spending.
Speaker 4 (03:22):
And I'll give you a great example.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
Look at the the bus shelter and part of part
of UMU.
Speaker 4 (03:28):
They spent two.
Speaker 5 (03:29):
Million dollars on that there was already a bus shelter there.
What they did was they put in a second set
of traffic lights one hundred meters from the current set.
They put in a second crossing across the road, and
then they put.
Speaker 4 (03:39):
A garden on the roofs of the bushelter.
Speaker 7 (03:41):
It's on the roof. You can't even see it.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
It's on the roof.
Speaker 5 (03:44):
It's that kind of wasteful.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
Spending that has to be stopped.
Speaker 5 (03:47):
We want councils to get back to basics, focus on
the critical infrastructure, thain site, the pipes, thing site.
Speaker 4 (03:54):
The roads. But we actually have to be careful.
Speaker 5 (03:56):
Because they tell you what, in the last six years
on the company coast rates went up more than fifty percent.
Fifty percent. Imagine if we put everyone's taxes up by
fifty percent. We can't keep on with this attitude of
just spend the money, just spend more money.
Speaker 7 (04:09):
We actually have to make some tough decisions.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Ginny, Tim's right, we have to make some tough decisions.
And you know, I would have thought this was in
your wheelhouse. I would have thought this was exactly what
labor want to do. Protect those people that have retired
and can't stay in their own home because they can't
afford the rates.
Speaker 6 (04:26):
Look, we're all for the cost of living measures that
actually make a difference, but I still haven't heard from
Tim where the funding is coming from for water infrastructure
for all of those things.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
Ensure.
Speaker 6 (04:36):
You can point to a seesaw that cost lots of money,
or a block of toilet somewhere else, but that's not
the guts of all the pipes and all the infrastructure
costs that have been landed with local government currently for
that to happen.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Can I just interrupt you a sect there, Jinny, because
isn't actually saving wasteful money going to bring the bottom
line down?
Speaker 6 (04:57):
It will, but that's not enough. You need to do
more than just pointing out.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
Some silly projects.
Speaker 6 (05:02):
And admittedly there'll be ones around the around the country
that weren't a wide spend, but that in itself isn't
sufficient to fund the huge deficit that all local councils
in our facing, and that's why we're paying more for
our parking, that's why we're paying more for our rates.
And I still haven't heard from Tim what the long
term solution is, apart from scrapping from seesaws and toilets.
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Can you just answer me this.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Why isn't so important that you actually get the cross
party agreement? Why why can't you just do it like
everything else?
Speaker 3 (05:29):
And so damn it.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
If they, you know, become government, they can change it back.
Speaker 5 (05:36):
Well, you've got certainty. If your party rate national, then
we're continue on the path we're on. This is supported
by the colition at you seem first, So this is
going ahead. Yeah, sure, we don't need it, but it
gives I think Key week certainty that they know actually
there's agreement across the House that in the future, at
some point Label will.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
Be in government. I think it's a long way.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
Away because of the attitude that we hear, which is
just take more money from Keys and spend it. But
one day we want to give Key with certainty that
actually we're going to live within our means. I have
some economic responsible management. And that's the fundamental difference of
hearing it now. Ginny wants to know where there'll be
more money coming from. We've got to stop just thinking
that we need more and more money, and Key weis
(06:18):
just need to pay more and more. We actually have
to make tough decisions and don'ts.
Speaker 6 (06:22):
When I'm out when I'm out door knocking neck For example,
I was at door knocking in the weekend and I
had a local guy who had sawage coming up in
his front yard and he'd been waiting for three months
to have someone come out either from council, often willing
to water to actually do anything about it, because you know,
the lack of money to be able to go and
(06:45):
do stuff like that. I mean, that's swage and someone's
a bat card, he's got a week K two three
playing in his garden. You know, that's the sort of
reality that New Zealanders are stuck with because these insufficient
funding for basic infrastructure and that causes poor health outcomes
through our community.
Speaker 2 (06:59):
Ginny, I beat your dollars for donuts. If you asked
that same man, were you happy with your rates that
you're paying and you can continue to pay and they're
going to go up by the skyrog he'd give you
another mouthful on that as well.
Speaker 6 (07:12):
We need to have that inform discussion. That's what we
need to say, like what is the quality of life
we want in New Zealand And let's let's understand what
the actual cost is for doing this. And how are
we going to fund it in a practical way that
gives key with good quality of life and swage in
your backyards, not quality of life.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
Yeah, but it's also about what we can afford, right,
and we cannot afford to go down the path we
were going down. And when I was doing knocking on
the weekend around the Whippy area, I'll tell you what,
the biggest issue I'm hearing on the doorstep is the
cost of council rates. And that's why we have provided
the tools. That's why we've separated at water. We're letting
them take on long term borrowing and we're increasing the
(07:48):
ratio to borrow so.
Speaker 4 (07:50):
We spread the cost over a long term.
Speaker 5 (07:52):
And just remember rates don't include the water charges, so
it doesn't include the pipes, it doesn't include.
Speaker 4 (07:57):
The sewerage that Jinny's talking about.
Speaker 5 (07:59):
This is about another bill rate case for the other
council of things. That's that's right, and that's why it's
important that we actually get rates under control. So it's
a really easy thing. It'd be great, but you know,
once again, we don't know what.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
Letters stand for.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
They don't seem to have policies on very much at all.
It would be really good for keeps to give them
peace of mind to know, actually, we're going to keep
rates under control.
Speaker 6 (08:19):
You know what, from my poestion, it's kicking the can
down the road. You're kicking the can down the road
without having a real solution in place.
Speaker 7 (08:25):
It's a very awesomeite you.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
You don't have a position on this.
Speaker 5 (08:29):
You are kicking the can down the road. You're not
willing to actually stand up. I'm telling you exactly what
we believe, and we are dealing.
Speaker 4 (08:34):
With this now.
Speaker 5 (08:35):
We're capping rates. We have dealt with local water done well.
We have put in a new system for that.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
Were we're done well.
Speaker 6 (08:42):
How many councils around the country can't pay for it?
And we're getting a bill on top of our increased
rates bill, We're getting another water bill under national And
you promise that you would take action on the cost
of living and the only solution you've got is to
cap rates. Well, that doesn't fix the underlying problem that
these insufficient funding to stop people who have swag in
their backyard.
Speaker 2 (09:02):
Can you answer me this though, Jenny, what's more serious
a problem people that get to retirement and have to
sell their forever home. Their family homes because they can't
afford the rates. What is more important and isn't it
a bit smarter to actually say that the next five
generations or four generations of people are going to get
the use out of moneys. That money has been spent
(09:22):
on the water, so let's spread it out further.
Speaker 6 (09:27):
I totally agree. We need a long term solution to
make sure that we have the infrastructure in a place
that we need and people retiring deserve that certainty to
know that they have it there.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
And it's really.
Speaker 6 (09:37):
Concerning that the rates are going up when people are
on a second income and getting super that's a worry.
Speaker 2 (09:43):
Time for a quick break. Will be back with Ginny
Anderson and Tim Costly. Tim, from just from my point
of view from doing this job, I wouldn't have heard
many people have a negative thoughts on your stance on
the rates thing. I think, I mean, I think it's
more positive. I're be getting more positive live from that.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Overwhelmingly positive on the doorstep.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Absolutely, yeah, well done.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Are we prepared for the blue food that just to
write in your backyard please, Jenny?
Speaker 7 (10:09):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (10:09):
Yeah? Concerning, isn't it? Tony Beach I saw that report
yesterday so I mean it's watchful. People don't need to panic,
I suppose because it's not got a human risk. But
from all of the warnings I've seen, it's making sure
people cook thoroughly eggs and chicken, and make sure people
report into MPI if they're seeing birds you know that
look unwell or unusual. But yeah, a bit of a concern.
(10:33):
But in reassuring people that there's no human health risk, are.
Speaker 3 (10:37):
We sure about that, Jenny, Yeah, all.
Speaker 6 (10:41):
The advice seems to indicate that that's not. We need
to be watchful of our own poultry industry to make
sure it's not impacted. And of course there'll be people
concerned about native birds and the impact on our native
bird and how that sort of pans out.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
But in the.
Speaker 6 (10:55):
Interim, I think by people Kee, we are great at
being watchful and reporting them, so that all the advices
if you see you know, two or more birds behaving unusually,
to make sure you've owned into MPI, and we'll just
have to see how things going.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
There's a thousand good lines there, Johny, but I won't
use any of the Minister Hogart Tom said that the
protocols that the government have in place will deal with us.
How confident are you?
Speaker 5 (11:22):
Yeah, we've been prepared for I mean I just said
on the in the break, one of the MBI starts
saying the same thing.
Speaker 4 (11:27):
We've been prepared for this for a long time. You know.
Speaker 7 (11:30):
Just put it in perspective.
Speaker 5 (11:31):
Yeah, it's it's a significant thing that we wanted to
take really seriously. But look at this stage, we've had
one third call in sick.
Speaker 7 (11:38):
That's it.
Speaker 5 (11:39):
The Australia case I see only ever spread to about
a dozen and they have either I've been to visit
like tex Poultry and Foxton, which is part of my electorate.
They have really good on farm and in the factory
biosecurity measures that are in place. So I think people
are really confident that the right bet has been done,
that we're well positioned for it, that we're taking it seriously,
(12:01):
and we should be watchful. But I don't think anyone
needs to be alarmed. There's no threat to humans. There's
there's no risk to eggs and poultry that people are
going to go and find in the supermarket today, So.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
They wouldn't stop you for having your post eggs in
the morning, either of you.
Speaker 7 (12:14):
I don't hard boils maybe.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
Maybe had boils.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I'm a great fror of eggs and olive oil, and
I'm a bit nervous now.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
But anyway, you don't need to be relate. I can't.
But if I get crook, I'm calling you Tom.
Speaker 4 (12:30):
You do that? You do that?
Speaker 3 (12:32):
Paul Henry?
Speaker 2 (12:33):
What do you think of Paul Henry coming into politics?
Come on, Tim, he'll be have more cameras around him
than you will.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
Yes, well, I really enjoyed him on Breakfast TV. I
always thought he was a bit of fun. They used
to say it like it was. It wasn't always very
pleasantly correct and popular. But look, I think a.
Speaker 4 (12:54):
Bit of personality is good.
Speaker 5 (12:55):
But actually what keys are going to ultimately vote on
is party, not Piersonell, And it's going to be on
the ideas and solutions that are going to make life
a little bit better, that are going to see, you know,
this country and a benefosition of a thing three years
and that's my ultimately want to vote for national Tinny.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
How do you think Paul Henry will fit into the beehive?
Speaker 6 (13:14):
Well, I think we saw a steep, blooming curve yesterday.
Really came out saying that you thought that the policy
was right on semi automatics, and the gun policy was good,
and I think Cole McKee dragged him aside and gave
him a quick word. In next minute, he's issued a
retracting that statement, saying that he backs Nicole McKee's policy
around gun changes.
Speaker 4 (13:33):
So I think he will be on a steep, blooming curve.
Speaker 6 (13:36):
And that's often the case with someone who's got a
big personality coming into politics.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
You know, I was about to say that that could
be anyone. That could have been me going into politics,
or your next door neighbor going into politics. They got
to make mistakes and say things that they shouldn't say,
aren't they.
Speaker 6 (13:49):
It's always quite good to read up your own party's
policy before you go into a press conference, and to
make sure if you're if you're making statements about new policy,
you might want to check that with the spokesperson and
your party. But that's often you'll see in other cases
where there's been a high profile person who's used to
shooting offrom the hip and saying what I think, that's
not quite how it works when you're part of a caucus.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Tim, what are your thoughts on celebrity and celebrities in politics.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Do you like the idea of it? I mean, we
should have all sorts of horrible old buildings, didn't we.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
No, I don't think I'm about celebrities and politicismen We've
had quite a few high profile people that have come
and gone in the past without making much of a splash.
But what I'm about is just about having a whole
range of kiwis with diverse backgrounds, you know, diversity of
thought and experience.
Speaker 4 (14:36):
I'm talking about nothing.
Speaker 7 (14:38):
Superficial that actually come in.
Speaker 5 (14:40):
But I do like that when people are free to
just be themselves, you know, yep, You've got to be
aligned with your party, and you've got to be part
of a team.
Speaker 4 (14:48):
This is that this is a team sport. This is
an individual sport. But I think it's good to have
a better personality.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
And you know, I don't know, it's a balance, right,
trying to have personality without without being too outrageous. But
I think that I think there's a place for a
little bit of both.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
We heard this week or last week that Mount Victoria Tunnel,
Grenada to Tony looking very very much on the back burner.
In fact, the back burner is not even burning. It's
turned off, Tim, what are your initial thoughts on this.
Speaker 5 (15:20):
Yeah, I mean it's about staging the construction. I think
that's a good way to give people certainty that there's
a long term pipeline. I mean, if you look at it,
if you're in our region, we'll take you to north
to live in under construction going ahead, there's six projects
already under construction or in procurement. Then is your Phase two,
which is you know, to Stay one, improvement through Wellington
(15:40):
and a whole range of stuff around the country.
Speaker 7 (15:43):
And then you've got these Stage three things.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
Like the Tony two Grenada, which are the roads that
are going to.
Speaker 7 (15:48):
Produce more slowly. But look, we've got a limited budget,
right Tim.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
We were promised when we voted you in that there
was going to be spades or shovels call it what
you want in the ground on Mount Victoria Tunnel before
this election. Now you can talk about the back offices
to you go blue in the face, but there ain't
going to be spades in the show. In fact that
that second Mount Victoria Tunnel probably won't even start in
(16:11):
my lifetime.
Speaker 5 (16:13):
Oh no, you promise that we would commence on Mount
back and it has. We've and we've had that debate
on the show before, and we've talked about the work
and the geological testing that they're doing and the work
that's underway. So that's fine, but what this is about
is about staging the work. We're not going to do
what happened in twenty eighteen where they cancel all these
(16:33):
roads of national significance or taken the North to live
in was canceled.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Many were chopped.
Speaker 5 (16:38):
We're actually giving people certainty about what projects are happening
and at what stage. And it's great to see these
roads happening because I tell you how popular it is.
Speaker 7 (16:46):
Up where I am.
Speaker 5 (16:46):
People can't wait to see or take you to live in.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Open all right, And I'm sorry, but I disagree with
you on that. I think there was shovels in the
ground that was but I mean going.
Speaker 3 (16:57):
To you, Jinny.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
I spoke to Chrisipkins yesterday and asked him what would
what would be different and he said nothing under you.
So you're not promising anything either.
Speaker 6 (17:07):
Well, we don't promise roads that aren't funded. That's the difference.
And so national Chris Bishop went out and promised people
in the Hut Valley that PUTTONI to Grenada would be
a priority, but yet there was no money set aside
for that. And I think it's actually really irresponsible for
a local MP and a Minister of Transport to put
(17:29):
local communities through thinking this is going ahead, through thinking
their houses might have to be sold. There was consultation
across the community. All people thought that this was actually
going to happen, and it was trumpeted is going to happen.
And now we find out it's on the back burner
and it's not going to happen. It's being taken off
even being prioritized. So you know, what a waste of money,
what a waste of putting people through a real turmoil
(17:51):
in the community of thinking their houses could be taken.
And it's just downright irresponsible to go out and promise
things as part of an election when there's clearly no
money set aside to pay for them. So we will
only promise things that have money set aside for it.
Speaker 5 (18:07):
How are you paying for the eighteen billion dollars of
stuff that you've promised so far and have no plan
to pay for. We saw this last time laborer, and
they promised so much and they left a whole bunch
of fiscal cliffs, and they promised school classrooms which were
never funded, never took place.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
There's a whole raft of.
Speaker 5 (18:23):
Projects that they promised and never paid for and now
about eighteen billion short this year.
Speaker 4 (18:27):
What's your plan there?
Speaker 6 (18:29):
So you don't tom you don't have a leg to
stand on. When you bought your party has sung up
doubling the tunnel and the Tony to Grenada is key
deliverable to the last election, and now a few months
out from the election you're walking it back saying that
you can't deliver on it. So if anybody has got
a track record of promising and not delivering, it's National
and the Wellington region because people have been put through
(18:51):
the ringer and been told these things were happening. And
now clearly then North I don't know whether no, no,
Hang on a minute, that's not at all true.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
Last time twenty eighteen, Phil Twiceed was Minister of Transport,
took five billion dollars from the Land Transport Fund to
pump into other projects, canceled or taken the North Live
in which we campaigned on and have delivered that labor
of posed transmission gully. They have posed the Company Expressway Nation.
Those you don't even know your own party history transmit
(19:23):
stuff up. No, you go back and check labor a
post transmission gully. They have posed the Company Expressway, they
canceled or taken the North to live in.
Speaker 4 (19:32):
All right.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (19:33):
Get into the tip for tat stuff, but Tim, I'm sorry,
but as far as our listeners are concerned, that you
have broken a promise on Mount Victoria Tunnel because we
expected there to be some sort of construction work there
before the selection and we're not going to get it.
But quickly, very quickly, Top wants to be in on
the party debate the selection. Should they be able to
(19:56):
considering where they're sitting now just under the five percent?
Speaker 4 (19:59):
Tim Costley, Well, that's up to whoever's running the debate.
There's a whole whole range of them. Some have just
the two main parties.
Speaker 5 (20:07):
Some have a whole range of parties. Whoever's running it
can make up their own mind. I guess who they
want to invite.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
But do you think it should be fair that they
are part of a major the big boys?
Speaker 6 (20:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (20:19):
I mean there was probably similar arguments a few years
ago with what was it the Conservative Party? They were
for something percent Look, I'm not going to pick who
should be there and who shouldn't. If the people run
in the debate want to invite, pick which parties?
Speaker 4 (20:31):
Isn't done on a percentage? Is it?
Speaker 5 (20:32):
Often it's done on who's in parliament, like the party
MARTI will be polling lower than top. But does that
mean they don't get invited or do you just go
who's in parliament currently?
Speaker 7 (20:41):
Look, it's up to the.
Speaker 4 (20:42):
People running it.
Speaker 7 (20:42):
I think they can make their own decisions.
Speaker 6 (20:44):
Jenny Edison, I would quite like it when you get
a mix, because if you get lots of parties, you
don't get in depth conversation or you know, analysis, but
you get more views. So I quite like those ones.
But then it's also quite nice to have the two
major parties so you can really delve into issues about
what's funded, how things will plan out. So I'm actually
a favorite of having a variety of debates that give
(21:05):
people a taste the bus.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
Well, I just got some information bar handed on to
me from an article by Orenzen twenty twenty five. The
New Zealand Labor Party historically did not fundamentally oppose the
construction of transmission Gully motorway, but they were highly critical
of its funding, models, model and initial planning. And that's
(21:28):
a good way to finish it with a bit of truth,
isn't it.
Speaker 4 (21:31):
That's great.
Speaker 5 (21:32):
I love truth, crouded way to look at it. That's
the twenty twenty five Spanshal how Jage.
Speaker 2 (21:39):
Good eyes, Tim Costly, Yeah, just said, oh gosh, how
can you go? That's documented. Happy birthday, great day. Thank
you both for your time this morning.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
For more from Wellington Mornings with Nick Mills, listen live
to news Talks There'd Be Wellington from nine am week days,
or follow the podcast on i Heart Radio
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