April 8, 2026 • 20 mins
For this week's Politics Thursday Nick is joined by National MP for Wairarapa and newly appointed Minister for Land Information Mike Butterick, and Labour MP and Spokesperson for Education and Police Ginny Andersen.
With the announcement of the two-week ceasefire between the US, Israel and Iran, Nick asks our politicians how this will affect NZ and their thoughts on what has unfolded these last few days.
Also, how fuel is being impacted - and why is the price of diesel hitting $4 if we still have 51 days left of supply.
And how is Luxon coping with the pressure of leadership?
During Butterick's minister appointment ceremony, he and Cameron Brewer were mistaken for ushers. Hours after Luxon appeared on Breakfast and stumbled around how many Māori MPs were in his cabinet - forgetting Tama Potaka.
They dissect his performance as Prime Minister - and how he is coping with the conflict.
New Zealand is seeing a huge surge in drug imports at the border. In the first 4 months of 2025 at Auckland Airport the amount of drugs seized was more than the total from all NZ airports the year prior.
What will our politicians do to solve this issue, where do the problems lie?
And the RBNZ has decided to keep OCR 2.25%, what does this mean for our economy.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Said b Thursday with Ginny Anderson in Labor, MP and
Spokesperson for Education, Jobs and Incomes, Police treaty a White
Tanging negotiations Morning Jenny, Good morning, Max. How are you good?
Thank you. That's a lot of things you're responsible for, Buddy.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
I know my emails atures longer than most of my emails.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
And Mike Butter and people Wirerappa and newly appointed Minister
for Land Information and Associate Minister of Agriculture Land Information Minister. Gosh,
are you the guy that that the Governor General and
the Prime Minister walked past and thought was an usher? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (00:49):
Goodboying and goodbrning, Jenny. Great, great to be on the show.
You know, it was quite funny, very very special moment.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
And walking Parson Russia. Was that a very special moment?
Speaker 4 (01:03):
Yeah, it was very very special, very humbling and super
to have my wife and one of our kids there
and my brothers, so yeah, very very special.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Was that a true story or was that a falsity?
Speaker 5 (01:17):
No?
Speaker 4 (01:17):
No, no, we were just tucked around the corner and
they walked down the room and anyway.
Speaker 5 (01:22):
They turned around and laughed.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
It was It was actually quite funny and broke the
ice a little bit because you know, pretty uh.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
We did recognize you in the first place.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
Have you met that? What's that? Sorry?
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Have you met the prime minister? Does he know who
you are?
Speaker 5 (01:38):
I've met the Prime Minister lots of times? Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
What did you think when you heard that story, Jenny?
Speaker 3 (01:45):
I wouldn't watch the video. I thought it was so amusing.
I went onto stuff and he's a little video and
it's just as entertaining as the story.
Speaker 6 (01:51):
I have to say. It was quite funny.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Was it true? Was it a true story or not?
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Well, it looks like it is. He's a video of
them walking in the room. Man, I think it just
was kind of heading around the corner and they walk
in and then they turned rounds. It's like a little
comedy sketch and they go, oh, these guys are ministers.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
And I'm not making and to be sorry, Michae, if
I'm making light of you've got a very senior position.
And I congratulate you for them. So let's let's put
that on on on record as well.
Speaker 5 (02:17):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Now let's talk about the American Israel Aran. They've agreed
to it two weeks cease fire. Jinny, what's going to happen?
Is this cease fire at the end of it? What
are you what's your take?
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Well, it's pretty volatile. I think already this talk of
I think it's closed again, isn't it? The last I've
read it's it's temporarily closed again because they're saying they
want Israelan stop strikes and so so it's incredibly sensitive
and volatile. So we welcome it with you know, if
(02:52):
it holds, but and it comes as a real relief
to those in the region and around the world. But
we're just early in the early hours of the announcements,
and questions really do remain about whether they're all parties
share an equal understanding of what the commitment and what
the terms are.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
And Mike, I mean, the problem is you've still got
one country bombing your way, two countries bombing away.
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Yeah, yeahh Look, I mean I would just echo what
Gin he said. It's you know, it is incredibly complex,
incredibly dangerous, and it's evolving and changing by the by
the hour, by the day. You know, the ceasefire is encouraging,
but it's it's very early days.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Can I just quickly ask you, because I didn't know
about it until I heard earlier thisition this morning with
Ryan that farmers are not getting their diesel deliveries, or
some farmers aren't. Is that something I mean you, that's
your that's your bread and butter. Is that something you're
hearing as well?
Speaker 5 (03:45):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (03:46):
A little bit, Nick, I guess in terms of fuel
supply is you know, we're still in phase one of
our of our fuel plan, and in fact that fuel
plan has been so good at Australia's adopted it. Yeah,
there has been a little bit of, I guess, a
shift in demand in terms of what we are hearing
around some people that have begin how storage are actually
going and effectively holding it and you using the truck stops.
(04:08):
And of course that is a domino domino, So how
serious the messages?
Speaker 2 (04:12):
How serious the story is? Is this pretty serious? Because
we're hearing, you know, once once month, once a week
deliveries of diusels now gone to one month, farmers running
out not using some of their year because of it.
Is it more serious that it's been made out?
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Look, I think on the whole neck, the fuel supply
is still pretty good. You know, I last week actually
spent it all day on the phone ringing egg contractors
and stock firm, freight carriers, general freight carriers. On the
whole fuel supply was pretty good. There were some issues
around the truck stops, but effectively that's been a lift,
lift and shift and demand, and of course there is
(04:48):
that domino impact. You know, there's a lot of the
egg contractors have almost finished for the season. The meat
companies have been very proactive with the freight stock carriers
in terms of adjusting the rate on a weekly basis
to reflect the changes in the fuel price. And you know,
we've also had a briefing with the MPI. They monitoring
(05:10):
it very closely and working with all the sector groups
as well. So there's a lot of stuff going on
and behind the scenes to make sure that we have
secure fuel. And you know, currently we said it fifty
one and a half days of diesel, right.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Jenny, do you just sort of do you think it's
over now? Genny? Do you think that you know, the
ceasefire is enough to get some I mean, I know
we're talking about the strait's been closed again, must has
been closed again, But do you feel like it might
be over.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, I hope so for everybody, and for all those
New Zealanders who can't afford to buy, you know, have
to choose between food and fuel. You know, it's a
really tough time, not just for New Zealand but all
those two impacted. But the problem I have with Nationals
plan have been too complacent and there's really no clear
explanation of what will happen if we do need to
(06:00):
move to another stage. And there's been no explanation about
how fuel will be prioritized. Is it you know, how
emergency services will be prioritized, even in how people get fueled,
like is it a petrol station to make that decision
or is it a government? But these are sorts of things.
For example, under COVID that when we had stages, it
was really clear about what moving to the next stage
(06:20):
actually meant for people's lives, and I think the government
hasn't really been able to do that.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
In a clear way.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
So I'm quite surprised that Mike says that Australia's adapted,
you know, picked up our plan, because there's been a
lack of clarity and businesses and people have said there, right.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Let's move on the Prime Minister's had a few stumbles
this week on breakfast, making mistakes on who's Amari, MP's
and cabinet. It was forgetting about Tama Potaker. Then he
obviously we've talked about it before. He mistaken Minister Cameron
and Brewer for rushes. Does the Prime Minister know who
his cabinet ministers are?
Speaker 5 (06:56):
Of course he does, of course he does.
Speaker 4 (06:58):
And you know, you got the media might be focused
on that, but the PM's not spending all his time
doing a demographic breakdown of cabinet.
Speaker 5 (07:05):
The p as very focused, as.
Speaker 4 (07:08):
With Nikola Willison and other ministers on fuel because it's
about fueld supply at the moment.
Speaker 5 (07:13):
That's how thin.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
There's got to be some talk amongst the members about
the way that this has all been handled though, because
I mean it's not this is not now being a
one off. I mean it's you know, the war, could
talk about talk about the war. I mean it's just
coming happening all the time at the moment. There must
be some rumbles.
Speaker 4 (07:31):
No, no, there's not, there's not, Nick, and it's not
happening all the time.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
And you know I've given you three Sorry Mike, but
I've given you three very clear examples over the last
few weeks, and I could probably get another three.
Speaker 5 (07:46):
Look, Nick, there's certainly no talk the PM is.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
He is the most focused person that I have ever met,
and dedicated and passionate about doing the right thing for
New Zealanders, and right now we have a challenge to
make sure we're on top of that because ultimately our
whole economy revolves around fuel.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Ginny Anderson, you wouldn't have to be a brain surgeon
to work out there's something going on. Nikola Willis has
been front and fronting all the situation with the fuel
stuff and almost helping the Prime Minister out, hasn't she.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
Well, it does really rate questions where there he's up
to the job, and it's embarrassing when you can't remember
who's in your own cabinet, and I think that's that's
the problem. But there seems to be a lot of
indicators that not only is Christopher Luxan out of touch,
is that he's continually promised that the economy would be
made better and from all accounts we can see it's
(08:41):
actually was worse, and then we've had this fuel crisis.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Unfortunately, we can't be target economic position. Sorry, sorry Jenny
for interrupting, but we can't be targeting him. He can't
decide what Trump's doing.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
No, I'm saying that we weren't set up to be
in a strong position when that happened. So already the
job cuts, the local economy in Wellington, all those decisions
that the government made caused record numbers of liquidation, people
to lose their jobs, in the cost of living to increase,
and so when this came along, it's made life even
harder for those New Zealanders already doing it tough under
(09:16):
a national government.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Stuff good amounts of closings, aren't we.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
Yeah, a lot, But that's that's not an accurate reflection
because I mean, cast your mind back. Adrian or sat
in front of SELECTMDY in November twenty twenty two and said,
I am going to engineer a recession and we will
see over five percent unemployment.
Speaker 5 (09:35):
That's what he said. And you run a.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
Business, you know, I run a farming business, and anyone
with any debt remember that feeling in the pit of
your stomach when we had twelve consecutive ocr ill really.
Speaker 6 (09:46):
Say that we had say I'm going to engineer Do
you do a Google.
Speaker 5 (09:52):
He was going to do a Google.
Speaker 6 (09:53):
A Google, you do a Google, and that's what he
had you've been governor said he was going to.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Engineer it and then you fight them and is that
and that's why you find them?
Speaker 5 (10:02):
But no, you But so that was what he had
to do to control and flow.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
That was sitting at seven point three and in terms
of you know, from a real perspective, inflation, we had
thirty percent inflation over a three year period, massive escalation
and cost pressures, working expenses on the farm.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
It was pretty untidy.
Speaker 4 (10:20):
And that was reflecting fed farmers that are business farmers
confidence minus sixty six percent confidence in the sector, which
has now turned around to thirty seven percent over one
hundred percent change.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Well, I mean, I mean to be very very fair, Mike.
Let's be honest, National and government farmers are going to
be happy. They could be doing anything they wanted to do,
and farmers are going to be happy. Just take a
short break six Thursday with Jenny Anderson and Mike Butterick. Mike,
someone's just texted and asked and said, please ask Mike,
why when we have fifty one days worth of diesel
(10:52):
prices knocking on four dollars a liter. I use a
uteful work and I have spent three hundred and fifty
dollars on diesel, giving me the equivalent of one and
a half tanks last week. What pressure is the government
putting on fuel companies to reduce it to the customers.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Well, look the way the fuel works because it's the
price they have to pay because you pay, you prepay
for the orders that are coming, and that's just a
result of what's happening over overseas at the moment. So
I did note there was a story this morning. Hopefully
there's a little bit of downward pressure.
Speaker 5 (11:23):
You know, very.
Speaker 4 (11:23):
Difficult to control the pricing, but what we are focused
on is making sure we've got supply sorted.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Yeah. I couldn't understand how our prices went straight up
when the pre fuel they were paying for. I knew
that they feel it increased, but it hadn't even left
the country was being pumped into them, we were paying it.
Speaker 5 (11:40):
Yeah, that's right, Nick.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
So effectively, the way it works is, you know you
want fuel, you've got to pay for it first at
today's prices, and then that leaves port of origin and
heads our way.
Speaker 5 (11:49):
So it's all prepaid.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Ginny, I can't work this out though we've put what
about the stuff that's on the we've already pre paid
for and we're still pay more for it.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
Well, you know who knows.
Speaker 6 (12:01):
And we see a lot of businesses, you know, without.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Knowing what those margins are and when they come, and
it's really difficult to know whether some of the price
is being jacked up just to increase profit for those businesses.
It's really difficult to be able to know that. But
one of the many projects that the national government scrapped
was a seventy million leter diesel sawage facility that would
have been should have been up and operating by now.
And so Shane Jones made a big song and dance
(12:26):
trying to deflect the blame. But was actually that government
that canceled plans to make New Zealand more resilient And
if we had had that seventy meter sorry, seventy million
liter diesel storage facility in place, that would have helped
deal with some of the problems that they call it
are just ranging with.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Hey guys, New Zealand is seeing a massive So can
I just you can come back to I want to
get the drug story out because I've just done it.
We've just seen a massive surge and drug imports on
the border, the first one equivalent of last year's. Basically,
Customs Minister Casey costelliss, we're not winning, but we're not losing.
What do you make of that.
Speaker 3 (13:03):
Jinny, Well, you know, we know that gangs and organized
crime are making record profits from bringing in and distributing
harmful drugs and methn fhetamine, cocaine.
Speaker 6 (13:16):
You absolutely destructive. So look, I think.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
It's it's been the worst rates we've ever seen probably
in New Zealand's history, and I just don't think that
the government is doing enough.
Speaker 6 (13:27):
They actually cut resources at the border.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
Before that big spike of meth and fetamin came in
about two years ago, there was cut resources and subsequent
that have reinvested a bit more, but not enough.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
To Jy, what would you have done different if you're
in power.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Well, we wouldn't have cut our customs. So every government
department where national came into power cut around six percent
of their budget, and customs was one of those government
agencies that lost. For example, intelligence roles the people that
figure out which containers might have drugs in them and
looking at a strategy on how we counter that, so
we would not have cut intelligence roles at customs time
(14:06):
when we know there are record levels of drug circulating
in other countries. And sure and we saw post that
we had a ninety eight percent increase of menything cintamine
in our way towater testing.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Mike, this whole thing was supposed to go away when
the banning of gang patches happened and we were going
to get rid of the gangs now without record numbers.
Speaker 4 (14:28):
Well, look, I mean, I know I think in the
first instance, I mean I lead to to spear at
our drug use in this country because I just struggled
to understand the rationale for those that pedal drugs to
their community, you know, and we see the results of that,
and it just breaks your heart. It just destroys communities,
Absolutely destroys communities in terms of the gangs that we
make absolutely no apologies for focusing on the gangs. Their
(14:51):
quarter of one percent and they have twenty five percent
of the serious crime as their contribution, and so we
make no apologies for focusing on them. Look, we have
invested thirty five million more into our custom service and
that's technology it's you know, additional investigations and prosecution staff
are thirty million dollars into a myth action plan last
(15:13):
November because you know, we've had we've got a global
network which as well, and we've also got a meth
action plan and of course that will probably have a
whole lot of synergies with in terms of these stories
of the cocaine news.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Sorry, Mike, you go interrupt you joj.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
I was going to add and I see that the
thing that the government's promise is five hundred more police officers.
Speaker 6 (15:37):
They failed to deliver there.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
In the time frame. They still haven't got there. They've
promised they would crack down on games, but we've actually
got more gang members than police officers in New Zealand
under this government.
Speaker 6 (15:47):
They don't like that fact, but it's a true fact.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
And the reality is that gangs are making more money
than ever before by peddling dangerous drugs like meth and
phetamine to our community. So their track record in this
space is absolutely abysmal.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
And that's a fact, isn't it.
Speaker 5 (16:02):
Mike.
Speaker 4 (16:03):
Well, no, Well, look, I would dispute that we are
folksing on gangs. You've only got to look at the
gang patch band. What that's actually allowed the police to do.
Going you know, you can have a look at the
guns that have seized from cars and houses, the drugs
that have seized from houses.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
And in cars.
Speaker 4 (16:21):
So you know, that's been very effective and importantly, we
don't have you know, members of their community been intimidated
and terrorized by gang members.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Can I, Mike, Can I just interrupt there when this
first came in, because you know, I feel I'm experienced
enough from the job I do to bring this up.
I said when they banned gang patches, it was going
to make things worse, not better, because the gang patches
identified who you're dealing with. Now that the gang members
can go along and deal and wheel and deal, no
(16:52):
one knows who they are, and it's got bigger and
more powerful, exactly what I predicted.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
No, look, I don't think that the police still know
the police still know who the gang. The police still
know who the gang members are. But just reflect on
on the amount of drugs and the guns that they
have got out of vehicles and households, you know, where
children live.
Speaker 5 (17:14):
That's been incredibly successful.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
And ill too, you know, I mean, I think it's
a clack that we're talking about.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
One of the times, just.
Speaker 4 (17:23):
Talking about gang pictures in parts of you know, my
electra here, there has been previously a visible gang presence.
It's not something that people talk about now and reflect on.
Speaker 5 (17:34):
They feel a lot safer, absolutely definitely feel a lot safer.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
Well, it's good that people might feel a lot safer,
but the reality of what's actually happening under the surface
is their end worse.
Speaker 6 (17:47):
More drugs and ever before.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
Finding its way into New Zealand.
Speaker 6 (17:50):
Fewer police officers, and more gang members, more of them.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
Have signed up and joined a gang.
Speaker 6 (17:55):
And so just National's approach to so many.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Things, it's just if you can't see it, it's not
a problem. But we know with these numbers today that
drugs are at record levels and all the actions that
National has taken might take the pictures off, but it
doesn't fix the problem. It's still causing harm in our community.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Mike, I've got you only got a couple of minutes,
a couple of seconds.
Speaker 4 (18:13):
Just all I was just going to very quickly say, Nick,
is forty nine thousand fewer victims of crime. That's absolutely
stunning success because you think forty nine thousand victims less victims.
And you know I always say people don't wake up
and choose to be a victim. We make no apologies.
I'm being tough on the gangs because I say caught
it of one percent. See, I don't think percent of
(18:35):
all violent crime, do you know. I think the forty
nine thousand victims speaks for itself.
Speaker 5 (18:38):
Well, that that least thing.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
I mean, that's only a partial part of the gang situation.
But anyway, let's move on. The Reserve Bank chose to
keep the OCR steady at two point five. Ginny I
thought this was a really good sign that we have
the right person and the right job. And you know,
that would have been so easy for her to move
on that, but she held her nerve.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yeah, I think in all productions it was sort of
steady the boat and things would be sit saying. So
you know, we know that it held that at that
two point twenty five is expected.
Speaker 6 (19:10):
But even before the conflict in the Middle.
Speaker 3 (19:12):
East started, businesses and households we're struggling under and we
know that high cost of living and it really was
made worse by this government. So it's great that that
are in you know, the rbn z's decision to whold
rates now reflects the uncertainty that so many New Zealanders
are feeling right now.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Mike, what are you hearing we're going to get a
couple of rises very shortly or are we going to stay.
Speaker 4 (19:33):
Look, I mean where we're we're living an incredibly complex
and volatile times times at the moment, Nick, and it's
not for me to speculate on that, but you know,
previous to this conflict, the economy was set for a
circle about three percent growth rate, so it certainly put
the ket in amongst the pigeons. It's incredibly volatile. Encouraging
to see that the OCR rate did stay stable.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Once again, so you know, once again, I just wanted
to reiterate my congratulations on getting put into cabinet. I
think well done to you. It's a credit to and
very much Jenny Anderson, Mike butter Right, thank.
Speaker 5 (20:06):
You and joining Thanks Johnny. For more from Wellington Mornings
with Nick Mills.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
Listen live to news Talks It'd be Wellington from nine
am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Wellington Mornings podcast with Nick Mills
from news Talk.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Said b Thursday with Ginny Anderson in Labor, MP and
Spokesperson for Education, Jobs and Incomes, Police treaty a White
Tanging negotiations Morning Jenny, Good morning, Max. How are you good?
Thank you. That's a lot of things you're responsible for, Buddy.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
I know my emails atures longer than most of my emails.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
And Mike Butter and people Wirerappa and newly appointed Minister
for Land Information and Associate Minister of Agriculture Land Information Minister. Gosh,
are you the guy that that the Governor General and
the Prime Minister walked past and thought was an usher? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (00:49):
Goodboying and goodbrning, Jenny. Great, great to be on the show.
You know, it was quite funny, very very special moment.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
And walking Parson Russia. Was that a very special moment?
Speaker 4 (01:03):
Yeah, it was very very special, very humbling and super
to have my wife and one of our kids there
and my brothers, so yeah, very very special.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Was that a true story or was that a falsity?
Speaker 5 (01:17):
No?
Speaker 4 (01:17):
No, no, we were just tucked around the corner and
they walked down the room and anyway.
Speaker 5 (01:22):
They turned around and laughed.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
It was It was actually quite funny and broke the
ice a little bit because you know, pretty uh.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
We did recognize you in the first place.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
Have you met that? What's that? Sorry?
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Have you met the prime minister? Does he know who
you are?
Speaker 5 (01:38):
I've met the Prime Minister lots of times? Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
What did you think when you heard that story, Jenny?
Speaker 3 (01:45):
I wouldn't watch the video. I thought it was so amusing.
I went onto stuff and he's a little video and
it's just as entertaining as the story.
Speaker 6 (01:51):
I have to say. It was quite funny.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Was it true? Was it a true story or not?
Speaker 3 (01:56):
Well, it looks like it is. He's a video of
them walking in the room. Man, I think it just
was kind of heading around the corner and they walk
in and then they turned rounds. It's like a little
comedy sketch and they go, oh, these guys are ministers.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
And I'm not making and to be sorry, Michae, if
I'm making light of you've got a very senior position.
And I congratulate you for them. So let's let's put
that on on on record as well.
Speaker 5 (02:17):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Now let's talk about the American Israel Aran. They've agreed
to it two weeks cease fire. Jinny, what's going to happen?
Is this cease fire at the end of it? What
are you what's your take?
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Well, it's pretty volatile. I think already this talk of
I think it's closed again, isn't it? The last I've
read it's it's temporarily closed again because they're saying they
want Israelan stop strikes and so so it's incredibly sensitive
and volatile. So we welcome it with you know, if
(02:52):
it holds, but and it comes as a real relief
to those in the region and around the world. But
we're just early in the early hours of the announcements,
and questions really do remain about whether they're all parties
share an equal understanding of what the commitment and what
the terms are.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
And Mike, I mean, the problem is you've still got
one country bombing your way, two countries bombing away.
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Yeah, yeahh Look, I mean I would just echo what
Gin he said. It's you know, it is incredibly complex,
incredibly dangerous, and it's evolving and changing by the by
the hour, by the day. You know, the ceasefire is encouraging,
but it's it's very early days.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Can I just quickly ask you, because I didn't know
about it until I heard earlier thisition this morning with
Ryan that farmers are not getting their diesel deliveries, or
some farmers aren't. Is that something I mean you, that's
your that's your bread and butter. Is that something you're
hearing as well?
Speaker 5 (03:45):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (03:46):
A little bit, Nick, I guess in terms of fuel
supply is you know, we're still in phase one of
our of our fuel plan, and in fact that fuel
plan has been so good at Australia's adopted it. Yeah,
there has been a little bit of, I guess, a
shift in demand in terms of what we are hearing
around some people that have begin how storage are actually
going and effectively holding it and you using the truck stops.
(04:08):
And of course that is a domino domino, So how
serious the messages?
Speaker 2 (04:12):
How serious the story is? Is this pretty serious? Because
we're hearing, you know, once once month, once a week
deliveries of diusels now gone to one month, farmers running
out not using some of their year because of it.
Is it more serious that it's been made out?
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Look, I think on the whole neck, the fuel supply
is still pretty good. You know, I last week actually
spent it all day on the phone ringing egg contractors
and stock firm, freight carriers, general freight carriers. On the
whole fuel supply was pretty good. There were some issues
around the truck stops, but effectively that's been a lift,
lift and shift and demand, and of course there is
(04:48):
that domino impact. You know, there's a lot of the
egg contractors have almost finished for the season. The meat
companies have been very proactive with the freight stock carriers
in terms of adjusting the rate on a weekly basis
to reflect the changes in the fuel price. And you know,
we've also had a briefing with the MPI. They monitoring
(05:10):
it very closely and working with all the sector groups
as well. So there's a lot of stuff going on
and behind the scenes to make sure that we have
secure fuel. And you know, currently we said it fifty
one and a half days of diesel, right.
Speaker 2 (05:22):
Jenny, do you just sort of do you think it's
over now? Genny? Do you think that you know, the
ceasefire is enough to get some I mean, I know
we're talking about the strait's been closed again, must has
been closed again, But do you feel like it might
be over.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, I hope so for everybody, and for all those
New Zealanders who can't afford to buy, you know, have
to choose between food and fuel. You know, it's a
really tough time, not just for New Zealand but all
those two impacted. But the problem I have with Nationals
plan have been too complacent and there's really no clear
explanation of what will happen if we do need to
(06:00):
move to another stage. And there's been no explanation about
how fuel will be prioritized. Is it you know, how
emergency services will be prioritized, even in how people get fueled,
like is it a petrol station to make that decision
or is it a government? But these are sorts of things.
For example, under COVID that when we had stages, it
was really clear about what moving to the next stage
(06:20):
actually meant for people's lives, and I think the government
hasn't really been able to do that.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
In a clear way.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
So I'm quite surprised that Mike says that Australia's adapted,
you know, picked up our plan, because there's been a
lack of clarity and businesses and people have said there, right.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Let's move on the Prime Minister's had a few stumbles
this week on breakfast, making mistakes on who's Amari, MP's
and cabinet. It was forgetting about Tama Potaker. Then he
obviously we've talked about it before. He mistaken Minister Cameron
and Brewer for rushes. Does the Prime Minister know who
his cabinet ministers are?
Speaker 5 (06:56):
Of course he does, of course he does.
Speaker 4 (06:58):
And you know, you got the media might be focused
on that, but the PM's not spending all his time
doing a demographic breakdown of cabinet.
Speaker 5 (07:05):
The p as very focused, as.
Speaker 4 (07:08):
With Nikola Willison and other ministers on fuel because it's
about fueld supply at the moment.
Speaker 5 (07:13):
That's how thin.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
There's got to be some talk amongst the members about
the way that this has all been handled though, because
I mean it's not this is not now being a
one off. I mean it's you know, the war, could
talk about talk about the war. I mean it's just
coming happening all the time at the moment. There must
be some rumbles.
Speaker 4 (07:31):
No, no, there's not, there's not, Nick, and it's not
happening all the time.
Speaker 2 (07:35):
And you know I've given you three Sorry Mike, but
I've given you three very clear examples over the last
few weeks, and I could probably get another three.
Speaker 5 (07:46):
Look, Nick, there's certainly no talk the PM is.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
He is the most focused person that I have ever met,
and dedicated and passionate about doing the right thing for
New Zealanders, and right now we have a challenge to
make sure we're on top of that because ultimately our
whole economy revolves around fuel.
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Ginny Anderson, you wouldn't have to be a brain surgeon
to work out there's something going on. Nikola Willis has
been front and fronting all the situation with the fuel
stuff and almost helping the Prime Minister out, hasn't she.
Speaker 3 (08:21):
Well, it does really rate questions where there he's up
to the job, and it's embarrassing when you can't remember
who's in your own cabinet, and I think that's that's
the problem. But there seems to be a lot of
indicators that not only is Christopher Luxan out of touch,
is that he's continually promised that the economy would be
made better and from all accounts we can see it's
(08:41):
actually was worse, and then we've had this fuel crisis.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Unfortunately, we can't be target economic position. Sorry, sorry Jenny
for interrupting, but we can't be targeting him. He can't
decide what Trump's doing.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
No, I'm saying that we weren't set up to be
in a strong position when that happened. So already the
job cuts, the local economy in Wellington, all those decisions
that the government made caused record numbers of liquidation, people
to lose their jobs, in the cost of living to increase,
and so when this came along, it's made life even
harder for those New Zealanders already doing it tough under
(09:16):
a national government.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Stuff good amounts of closings, aren't we.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
Yeah, a lot, But that's that's not an accurate reflection
because I mean, cast your mind back. Adrian or sat
in front of SELECTMDY in November twenty twenty two and said,
I am going to engineer a recession and we will
see over five percent unemployment.
Speaker 5 (09:35):
That's what he said. And you run a.
Speaker 4 (09:37):
Business, you know, I run a farming business, and anyone
with any debt remember that feeling in the pit of
your stomach when we had twelve consecutive ocr ill really.
Speaker 6 (09:46):
Say that we had say I'm going to engineer Do
you do a Google.
Speaker 5 (09:52):
He was going to do a Google.
Speaker 6 (09:53):
A Google, you do a Google, and that's what he
had you've been governor said he was going to.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Engineer it and then you fight them and is that
and that's why you find them?
Speaker 5 (10:02):
But no, you But so that was what he had
to do to control and flow.
Speaker 4 (10:06):
That was sitting at seven point three and in terms
of you know, from a real perspective, inflation, we had
thirty percent inflation over a three year period, massive escalation
and cost pressures, working expenses on the farm.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
It was pretty untidy.
Speaker 4 (10:20):
And that was reflecting fed farmers that are business farmers
confidence minus sixty six percent confidence in the sector, which
has now turned around to thirty seven percent over one
hundred percent change.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Well, I mean, I mean to be very very fair, Mike.
Let's be honest, National and government farmers are going to
be happy. They could be doing anything they wanted to do,
and farmers are going to be happy. Just take a
short break six Thursday with Jenny Anderson and Mike Butterick. Mike,
someone's just texted and asked and said, please ask Mike,
why when we have fifty one days worth of diesel
(10:52):
prices knocking on four dollars a liter. I use a
uteful work and I have spent three hundred and fifty
dollars on diesel, giving me the equivalent of one and
a half tanks last week. What pressure is the government
putting on fuel companies to reduce it to the customers.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Well, look the way the fuel works because it's the
price they have to pay because you pay, you prepay
for the orders that are coming, and that's just a
result of what's happening over overseas at the moment. So
I did note there was a story this morning. Hopefully
there's a little bit of downward pressure.
Speaker 5 (11:23):
You know, very.
Speaker 4 (11:23):
Difficult to control the pricing, but what we are focused
on is making sure we've got supply sorted.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Yeah. I couldn't understand how our prices went straight up
when the pre fuel they were paying for. I knew
that they feel it increased, but it hadn't even left
the country was being pumped into them, we were paying it.
Speaker 5 (11:40):
Yeah, that's right, Nick.
Speaker 4 (11:41):
So effectively, the way it works is, you know you
want fuel, you've got to pay for it first at
today's prices, and then that leaves port of origin and
heads our way.
Speaker 5 (11:49):
So it's all prepaid.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Ginny, I can't work this out though we've put what
about the stuff that's on the we've already pre paid
for and we're still pay more for it.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
Well, you know who knows.
Speaker 6 (12:01):
And we see a lot of businesses, you know, without.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Knowing what those margins are and when they come, and
it's really difficult to know whether some of the price
is being jacked up just to increase profit for those businesses.
It's really difficult to be able to know that. But
one of the many projects that the national government scrapped
was a seventy million leter diesel sawage facility that would
have been should have been up and operating by now.
And so Shane Jones made a big song and dance
(12:26):
trying to deflect the blame. But was actually that government
that canceled plans to make New Zealand more resilient And
if we had had that seventy meter sorry, seventy million
liter diesel storage facility in place, that would have helped
deal with some of the problems that they call it
are just ranging with.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Hey guys, New Zealand is seeing a massive So can
I just you can come back to I want to
get the drug story out because I've just done it.
We've just seen a massive surge and drug imports on
the border, the first one equivalent of last year's. Basically,
Customs Minister Casey costelliss, we're not winning, but we're not losing.
What do you make of that.
Speaker 3 (13:03):
Jinny, Well, you know, we know that gangs and organized
crime are making record profits from bringing in and distributing
harmful drugs and methn fhetamine, cocaine.
Speaker 6 (13:16):
You absolutely destructive. So look, I think.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
It's it's been the worst rates we've ever seen probably
in New Zealand's history, and I just don't think that
the government is doing enough.
Speaker 6 (13:27):
They actually cut resources at the border.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
Before that big spike of meth and fetamin came in
about two years ago, there was cut resources and subsequent
that have reinvested a bit more, but not enough.
Speaker 2 (13:39):
To Jy, what would you have done different if you're
in power.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Well, we wouldn't have cut our customs. So every government
department where national came into power cut around six percent
of their budget, and customs was one of those government
agencies that lost. For example, intelligence roles the people that
figure out which containers might have drugs in them and
looking at a strategy on how we counter that, so
we would not have cut intelligence roles at customs time
(14:06):
when we know there are record levels of drug circulating
in other countries. And sure and we saw post that
we had a ninety eight percent increase of menything cintamine
in our way towater testing.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
Mike, this whole thing was supposed to go away when
the banning of gang patches happened and we were going
to get rid of the gangs now without record numbers.
Speaker 4 (14:28):
Well, look, I mean, I know I think in the
first instance, I mean I lead to to spear at
our drug use in this country because I just struggled
to understand the rationale for those that pedal drugs to
their community, you know, and we see the results of that,
and it just breaks your heart. It just destroys communities,
Absolutely destroys communities in terms of the gangs that we
make absolutely no apologies for focusing on the gangs. Their
(14:51):
quarter of one percent and they have twenty five percent
of the serious crime as their contribution, and so we
make no apologies for focusing on them. Look, we have
invested thirty five million more into our custom service and
that's technology it's you know, additional investigations and prosecution staff
are thirty million dollars into a myth action plan last
(15:13):
November because you know, we've had we've got a global
network which as well, and we've also got a meth
action plan and of course that will probably have a
whole lot of synergies with in terms of these stories
of the cocaine news.
Speaker 2 (15:28):
Sorry, Mike, you go interrupt you joj.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
I was going to add and I see that the
thing that the government's promise is five hundred more police officers.
Speaker 6 (15:37):
They failed to deliver there.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
In the time frame. They still haven't got there. They've
promised they would crack down on games, but we've actually
got more gang members than police officers in New Zealand
under this government.
Speaker 6 (15:47):
They don't like that fact, but it's a true fact.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
And the reality is that gangs are making more money
than ever before by peddling dangerous drugs like meth and
phetamine to our community. So their track record in this
space is absolutely abysmal.
Speaker 2 (16:01):
And that's a fact, isn't it.
Speaker 5 (16:02):
Mike.
Speaker 4 (16:03):
Well, no, Well, look, I would dispute that we are
folksing on gangs. You've only got to look at the
gang patch band. What that's actually allowed the police to do.
Going you know, you can have a look at the
guns that have seized from cars and houses, the drugs
that have seized from houses.
Speaker 5 (16:19):
And in cars.
Speaker 4 (16:21):
So you know, that's been very effective and importantly, we
don't have you know, members of their community been intimidated
and terrorized by gang members.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Can I, Mike, Can I just interrupt there when this
first came in, because you know, I feel I'm experienced
enough from the job I do to bring this up.
I said when they banned gang patches, it was going
to make things worse, not better, because the gang patches
identified who you're dealing with. Now that the gang members
can go along and deal and wheel and deal, no
(16:52):
one knows who they are, and it's got bigger and
more powerful, exactly what I predicted.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
No, look, I don't think that the police still know
the police still know who the gang. The police still
know who the gang members are. But just reflect on
on the amount of drugs and the guns that they
have got out of vehicles and households, you know, where
children live.
Speaker 5 (17:14):
That's been incredibly successful.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
And ill too, you know, I mean, I think it's
a clack that we're talking about.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
One of the times, just.
Speaker 4 (17:23):
Talking about gang pictures in parts of you know, my
electra here, there has been previously a visible gang presence.
It's not something that people talk about now and reflect on.
Speaker 5 (17:34):
They feel a lot safer, absolutely definitely feel a lot safer.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
Well, it's good that people might feel a lot safer,
but the reality of what's actually happening under the surface
is their end worse.
Speaker 6 (17:47):
More drugs and ever before.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
Finding its way into New Zealand.
Speaker 6 (17:50):
Fewer police officers, and more gang members, more of them.
Speaker 3 (17:53):
Have signed up and joined a gang.
Speaker 6 (17:55):
And so just National's approach to so many.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Things, it's just if you can't see it, it's not
a problem. But we know with these numbers today that
drugs are at record levels and all the actions that
National has taken might take the pictures off, but it
doesn't fix the problem. It's still causing harm in our community.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
Mike, I've got you only got a couple of minutes,
a couple of seconds.
Speaker 4 (18:13):
Just all I was just going to very quickly say, Nick,
is forty nine thousand fewer victims of crime. That's absolutely
stunning success because you think forty nine thousand victims less victims.
And you know I always say people don't wake up
and choose to be a victim. We make no apologies.
I'm being tough on the gangs because I say caught
it of one percent. See, I don't think percent of
(18:35):
all violent crime, do you know. I think the forty
nine thousand victims speaks for itself.
Speaker 5 (18:38):
Well, that that least thing.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
I mean, that's only a partial part of the gang situation.
But anyway, let's move on. The Reserve Bank chose to
keep the OCR steady at two point five. Ginny I
thought this was a really good sign that we have
the right person and the right job. And you know,
that would have been so easy for her to move
on that, but she held her nerve.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Yeah, I think in all productions it was sort of
steady the boat and things would be sit saying. So
you know, we know that it held that at that
two point twenty five is expected.
Speaker 6 (19:10):
But even before the conflict in the Middle.
Speaker 3 (19:12):
East started, businesses and households we're struggling under and we
know that high cost of living and it really was
made worse by this government. So it's great that that
are in you know, the rbn z's decision to whold
rates now reflects the uncertainty that so many New Zealanders
are feeling right now.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Mike, what are you hearing we're going to get a
couple of rises very shortly or are we going to stay.
Speaker 4 (19:33):
Look, I mean where we're we're living an incredibly complex
and volatile times times at the moment, Nick, and it's
not for me to speculate on that, but you know,
previous to this conflict, the economy was set for a
circle about three percent growth rate, so it certainly put
the ket in amongst the pigeons. It's incredibly volatile. Encouraging
to see that the OCR rate did stay stable.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
Once again, so you know, once again, I just wanted
to reiterate my congratulations on getting put into cabinet. I
think well done to you. It's a credit to and
very much Jenny Anderson, Mike butter Right, thank.
Speaker 5 (20:06):
You and joining Thanks Johnny. For more from Wellington Mornings
with Nick Mills.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
Listen live to news Talks It'd be Wellington from nine
am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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