Part Two: Prince Mohammed Bin Salman: The Tyrant of Saudi Arabia

Robert continues the early history of Mohammed Bin Salman and the House of Saud.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Also media, Welcome back to Behind the Bastards, a podcast
about Mohammad ben Salmon for this week and next week
with my former colleague and current friend David Belle. David, Hello, Hi,
where could the good and bad people on the Internet
find you?

Speaker 2 (00:21):
You know, before that, I realized I don't think I've
said thank you for having me on.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
I didn't say that.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
Well, you don't, I know, it's just the thing you
say on podcasts, and it occurred to me. I was like,
I didn't even say that anyway, thank you for having
me on. You you asked where you could find me
Google gamefully Unemployed g A M E. F U L
Y Unemployed as a movie podcast mostly in TV. Or

(00:50):
watch some more news hosted by Cody Johnston news show
like a talking head news show.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
I'm the head writer over there. What he is? I'm
I'm Boston people around.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
Yeah, you're the You're the you're the king over there.
Just thought she had been Solomon kind of is in
Saudi Arabia and Dave, I would thank you for being
the guests, but actually I'm going to thank you for
watching my cat for half a year that one time
figure of an ass than being on a podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:22):
Oh yeah, that cat. That cat left a scar on me.
I'm pretty sure I still have it somewhere.

Speaker 1 (01:28):
That's good. She left some on me too. She was
a great cat.

Speaker 3 (01:32):
Yeah she she got a bite on her.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
Yeah, she got a bite on her.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
She also got along with my cat, way more than
my current second cat gets along.

Speaker 1 (01:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
She.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
She and Kenton were best friends for well again, like
half a year.

Speaker 3 (01:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:53):
So. By the time Prince Mohammed ben Salmon was born
in nineteen eighty five, the Saudi state had reached a
level of what we might call catastrophic dependence on oil revenues.
ARAMCO accounted for roughly eighty percent of state spending, which
meant that any serious drop in oil prices rendered the
state insolvent, living off its savings in order to continue spending.

(02:13):
Nearly two thirds of Saudi men were government employees, right,
And that doesn't mean they're working. It just means they're
government employees. Most of them aren't doing real jobs, you know.
Most of the state jobs that they have are lifetime
gigs that exist as a form of welfare. They're a
way for the House of Sound to bribe enough of
the free male population to ensure there's never too much

(02:34):
unrest because.

Speaker 2 (02:34):
Any lose your job, Like I would be fine with
a government then I guess you could call it bribing,
but just paid us all to live. But that's what's
happening here, right, It's just enough people so that they
can screw other people.

Speaker 1 (02:49):
Yeah, and they have to bring other people into the
country to really fuck over, like to have an underclass
that they can fuck over enough, you know. And this
state of affairs leads to some complications. Because so many
jobs are lifetime things, giving raises to certain classes of
jobs is financially untenable. If you give like everyone who
has this job a raise, that's a meaningful percentage of

(03:12):
the country, and you just can't afford to do that
because you have to keep that raise going for everyone
who holds that job forever. Instead, the government gets into
a habit of adding benefits to jobs, which are salary
bumps for employees who have specific skills, like classes of
workers will get an amount of money every year for
knowing how to type or knowing how to use like

(03:32):
Microsoft Office, and workers who have these skills get these bumps.
And there are so many of these bumps that over time,
many workers get paid more as a result of all
of the bumps to their salary than the actual base
value of their salary itself. Saudi government employee benefits constitute
between ten and one hundred and fifty percent of worker
income by the late twentieth century. What it's they get

(03:56):
around us to try to avoid paying more money, and
it winds up costing a huge amount of the national
budget to do.

Speaker 3 (04:02):
Right, I really got away from them.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
Yeah, they're robbing Peter to also pay Peter.

Speaker 3 (04:07):
Yeah, right.

Speaker 1 (04:09):
Now. The fact that most people working in Saudi Arabia
were not Saudi represented another issue. The state again tries
to fix the problem by fiddling around the edges. They
issue a novel benefit for employees and departments that have
fewer than fifty percent Saudi workers. The idea is that
if they give a benefit to these jobs, more Saudis
will get jobs in these fields because these jobs have

(04:30):
higher pay. But it actually discourages the hiring of Saudi
employees because every worker in that field is like, if
we hire any more Saudis, we won't get that huge
pay bump, So we have to not hire any Saudis.
You have to only hire foreign workers, right, yah, Yeah,
It's just a constant series of like really avoidable. If

(04:50):
like you'd spent three if it was anyone other than
a bunch of like princes who's never worked making these decisions,
you'd be like, but when this just encourage them not
to hire mar Saudis, it's do a thing that gets
them their pay cut, right.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
It's one of those things where you just have to
kind of go like, all right, everybody stop, let's start over.
Like we It's like we're buildings.

Speaker 1 (05:12):
Yeah, a scratch scratch in this country, guys.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
Yeah, we gotta take all the wiring out put in
new wiring.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
It's like when you're working on a screenplay or a
novel that just isn't coming together. Sometimes at some point
you just you just have to throw the idea out right,
oh yeah, and some people can't do that. It's like that,
but with a country. NBS's father, Prince Solomon during most
of NBS's child all of NBS's childhood, is the governor
of Riyad, and Muhammad Ban Salomon is the first son

(05:41):
of his dad's second wife, because again he'd had like
six kids with his first wife, Sultana. But then she
gets like this recurrent kidney infection and she can't have
any more kids, so he kind of reluctantly gets a
second wife, this lady Fada bint Fala al Hathlim, who
is brought on to let him continue to have sons,
and over the years she gives him six more sons.

(06:02):
Mohammad ban Salmon is the oldest of these kids, right,
so he is the oldest son from his dad's second family.
On paper, again, he's the oldest son of the second family,
so he should never have wound up anywhere near becoming
the king, right his dad shouldn't have become the king,
let alone to him. He's even further down the line.
He is the sixth son of the original king's twenty

(06:23):
fifth son, and was literally several generations removed from being
in line for the throne. Muhammad ben Salmon's early life was,
in Ben Hubbard's words, steeped and inherited an unearned privilege.
He spends most of his childhood and palaces socializing with
other members of the royal family, almost to the exclusion
of anyone else. When he travels from one palace to
the other, it's in convoys of armored cars surrounded by

(06:45):
bodyguards he's raised mostly by a mix of nannies and
tutors who watch over him on a daily basis, alongside
servants and other household staff who don't have the power
to discipline him in a meaningful way, so most of
the people raising him can't punish hip sounds healthy exactly, exactly,
like I cant if your family killed you know that?

Speaker 2 (07:07):
To me, Let's say you make a monster, like that's
a monster. Yeah, yeah, that's like if a group of
people are like, hey, you know what, be funny if
we made a monster, Yeah, how do we do that?

Speaker 3 (07:17):
And that sounds like what you would do.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
That's it's it's one of those things. There's a sweet spot,
because it's bad if a kid is always afraid that
his parents are going to hit him, But it's also
bad if a kid knows no one he could possibly
talk to will ever smack him in the mouth. Right.
It's true, like it shouldn't be your parents, but you
should know that if you mop off to a stranger
who knows what they'll do right, right, as opposed to
the stranger will be scared that you'll have their family killed. Right.

(07:40):
One of those is worse than the others.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
He's living on the holidack, like that's what it is.
It's a world exclusively built for him exactly. Yeah, you
should go through the brain damage.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Ye.

Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, you should know that you could get a smack
from somebody, someone, not someone, yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:00):
A classmate against some guy to the bar, you know, like.

Speaker 1 (08:03):
That someone could put you in check if you're out
of pocket enough. Right, that's important for people.

Speaker 3 (08:09):
Right because it seems like you don't want to learn
that late.

Speaker 1 (08:13):
Right now. It's a measure of how fucked up this
kid's upbringing is that almost no one in his life
is allowed to call him by his real name. Right.
That's how separated from the world this boy is a
handful of close friends and his family members can call
him Mohammed Ben Solomon Right. To people actually raising him,

(08:33):
who are largely servants, which are most of the people
who talks to on a daily basis, they call him
tall omroc. This means literally, may God prolong your life,
but a more accurate translation is what people like people.
It's like your highness, right, that's what they mean when
they call him tall and rock right. In recent interviews,
MBS has claimed that his father took responsibility for organizing

(08:54):
his and his siblings educations. They were each assigned a
book a week to read and would be quizzed on it.
His mother used a lot of the family clout and
money to bring in scholars and academics from around the
Kingdom to lead discussions with the royal family and take
her kids on field trips for Hubbard's book. MBS quote
both parents were strict. Showing up late for lunch with
his father was a disaster. In Salmon's words, his mother

(09:17):
was harsh too. My brothers and I used to think,
why is our mother treating us this way? She would
never overlook any of the mistakes he made. He later
concluded that the scrutiny made him much stronger. NBS is
rather unique among the royalty we covered on the show,
and that we don't have a lot of detail on
his early life, right. You get a lot of that
with like European royalty, because there's someone making notes of

(09:39):
everything they do for like the entirety of their early life,
and we don't have that with him. He doesn't say
much about his childhood, and the people who would know
more were mostly servants and state employees, who again could
be seriously punished if they told anybody, and they never do.
We know that. Prince Solmon, his father, continued to live
with his first wife, life and family in a palace

(10:01):
referred to in jest as the White House. NBS's mom,
who's his set. His dad's second wife raises the kids
in another palace, and so he's he's already the Bee family, right.
He grows up knowing he's the Bee family, But his
mom takes him and his siblings to the main house
regularly because he wants She wants her kids to have
face time with their dad, which will guarantee them a

(10:23):
future in the power structure in the country. And as
you might guess, this is awkward.

Speaker 2 (10:28):
Yeah, it's just such a perfect storm of like we're
going to give you an inferiority complex, but also still
a palace.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
Yeah, still a palace. And no one can yell at
you except for your dad and mom, who will do
it and then never raise you. Right, that's all they're
there for is to yell at you. Now, Sultana doesn't
like her husband's second family, right, and her kids follow suit.
The older kids, the first kids treat all of the
second kids like shit, you know, like he is the

(10:58):
only people who can bully him are his half brothers,
right like, they're the ones talking shit about him constantly,
and NBS's early memories involve a lot of bullying from
these siblings. He's also raised on stories of his royal
ancestors that would have emphasized how normal it was for
members of the Saud family to kill each other. While
his paternal grandfather was King Abdulaziz, his maternal grandfather had

(11:21):
murdered the king's only brother and the man who would
be King Karen House adds. Indeed, MBS's maternal ancestor died
on alhith Lane's Ajman troops had wounded Abdulaziz in a
nineteen fifteen battle that killed his only full brother. More
than a decade later, alhith Lane was treacherously murdered bearing
a leather of safe conduct signed by Abdulaziz, alhith Lane

(11:41):
and eleven companions with Abdulaziz's regional governor's son. While he
declined to stay overnight, saying his men would come looking
for him if he didn't return, his host refused to
allow him to leave. When the Ajman tribesmen did arrive,
their chief's throat was slit, along with those of his
eleven companions. Some Saudis see this treachery as parallel to
that of a murder of a nearly a century later,
of Jamal Kashogi, the Washington Post columnist invited to a

(12:03):
Saudi consulate Nistenbold and then murdered a night in twenty eighteen.
So he grows up on stories of like his family
members killing each other and was told that this, like,
this is what made your grandpa strong is that he
killed this other grand member of your family.

Speaker 2 (12:17):
Right, some stories of like your grandfather fighting in the war,
but it's fighting in the war against against your other
grandfather or something.

Speaker 1 (12:25):
Yeah, his cousin who killed his brother.

Speaker 3 (12:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:29):
So NBS grows up constantly mocked and derided by his older,
more accomplished half brothers, and he is initially a shy
and anxious boy. During a third grade play, he is
so uncomfortable with the idea of performing in front of
people that he can't take the stage when the moment comes,
even though his dad, the governor of Riad, is in
the audience to see. So one of the few times

(12:50):
his dad shows up to see him do something he's like,
I can't be I got stage fright, I can't show
up on stage.

Speaker 3 (12:55):
Listen.

Speaker 2 (12:55):
I feel for the kid, like I don't want to
go on stage either.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
But man, yeah, man, that's a rough one. That's a
rough one. His earliest memories would have involved a lot
of rage at the religious police too. Again, movies and
music are illegal while he's a child. Television exists in
Saudi Arabia, but it sucks complete ass because you can't
watch a lot of the TV that other people are watching.
It's basically just news and boring religious discussions.

Speaker 2 (13:20):
Yeah, we all grew up with those like weird neighbor
kids who didn't have a TV.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
Yeah, yeah, and they develop a complex about it.

Speaker 3 (13:28):
Yeah, that's what happens.

Speaker 1 (13:30):
His only entertainment option at home is video games, because
video games are a new enough concept that the actual
fun police Saudi Arabia has hasn't gotten around of banning
them yet, right, Like they kind of get grandfathered in.
So he is, for his whole life at the present moment,
a huge video game nerd because it's just kind of
the only cool thing he can do as a kid. Incredible,

(13:51):
and in this way, his childhood's not that different from
a lot of people listening. His first console was a Nintendo,
followed by a Neo Geo, which he got when he
was six. Biographer care In House notes that he still
has his original Neo Geo in his childhood bedroom at
the family palace.

Speaker 3 (14:05):
Amazing, captain.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
I think he's worth some money these days.

Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah, you know, not that he cares, but yeah, that
solid he throw on eBay, Yeah, that'd be a hell
of a bye.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
As I said earlier, Prince Salmon was not rich by
al Soud standards. That's again NBS.

Speaker 3 (14:21):
His dad.

Speaker 1 (14:22):
He was certainly in the top one percent in the country,
probably still in the world, but that still puts him
in the bottom fifty percent of the house of sud.
MBS was conspicuously aware of this fact. As a child.
His monthly allowance was equivalent to about five hundred US
dollars while he was a fourth grader, and it says
a lot that he felt poor next to his cousins
the wealth of well theset of whom received about five

(14:42):
thousand dollars a week.

Speaker 2 (14:44):
Right if you, if you gave me five hundred dollars
as a fourth grader and brought me to the ball.

Speaker 3 (14:50):
I would die, like, I would be dead from that.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
Yeah, it would get me killed. Yeah, I would have
overdosed on Warhammer models. Yeah Noda had Pewter poisoning or
some shit.

Speaker 3 (15:05):
I'd find a way. I don't know half and I'd die.

Speaker 1 (15:07):
I would find a way.

Speaker 3 (15:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
His NBS's frustration with his family financial situation was compounded
by the fact that things were worse for Prince Salmon's
second family. Again, they live in the second palace, they
have a smaller cut of the family income, and when
the family goes on vacation to Spain, Prince Salmon takes
his first wife and their kids to his mansion in Marbella,
and NBS's mom and the kids have to stay at

(15:29):
a hotel in Barcelona. No, it's a nice hotel, right,
but you're not staying in the palace your dad owns
because you're not allowed there because you're not the real family.
Right that's got a fucking kid up.

Speaker 2 (15:42):
Yeah, it's again perfect storm is like you have so
much privilege, but also like the weird anger of someone
who doesn't feel like they do, and we're giving you
just nothing but video games, which I mean, I love
video games, but something about that.

Speaker 1 (15:57):
Also no parental love, but all of the video games
you eat. So as a father, Prince Salmon was more
hands on than most of his family. He sets an
aggressive curriculum for his kids, and he devotes a significant
amount of money to their education, but he doesn't spend
time to them, with them face to face. He manages
them like sims basically right, like he's a spreadsheet dad.

(16:20):
NBS grows up with the distinct impression that his dad
was prioritizing his first family because he was. He watches
with jealousy as one older half brother becomes the first
Muslim astronaut and another gains international renown for helping American
journalists during the First Gulf War. In more recent years,
a rumor has spread that MBS was always his father's favorite,
and this is true now he's definitely his dad has

(16:42):
made him the crown Prince. It doesn't seem to have
been true back then. MBS himself told Karen House, I
was yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:49):
If my kid, if one of them was an astronaut,
I feel like no one would even ask what the favorite.

Speaker 1 (16:54):
Like astronaut more Yeah.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
Yeah, it's really tough to compete. But when it went
to easy.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
Yeah. Nbs himself told Karen House, I was not my
father's favorite, and then listed the names of four siblings
that his dad preferred, and the fact that he had
a list ready to hand says a lot about this kid,
where he's like, no, I knew my rank. I knew
my exact rank in the family.

Speaker 3 (17:20):
They had it on the wall. They had a letter board.

Speaker 1 (17:22):
Yeah, they had a letter board and the astronaut was top.

Speaker 3 (17:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:27):
One family associate postulated a house that quote. He felt
a need to strive for distinction from an early age.
This was stoked by his father, who treated his kids
with his second wife like they were the Bee family, right,
you know, like this is this is the way that
they're He's like almost saying this to them. So INDs
grows up with a bone to pick in regards to
his half siblings and a burning sense that he is

(17:48):
a great deal to prove if he's going to win
his father's affections. This becomes more of an urgent need
as he gets older. By sixth grade, he's aged out
of his shyness, and according to his recollections, he'd replaced
his younger brother Turkey as the leader of his siblings.
One of the few good sources we have on his
childhood that isn't either MBS himself or someone who he

(18:08):
could imprison for having something negative said about him is
a British tutor that his father hired to teach his
sons English. This guy, Rashid Sakai, had been a teacher
at a fancy school in Jedda before the Prince called
him up in nineteen ninety six when MBS was eleven,
and he's one of our only sources who can be
kind of objective about these kids in this period of time.

(18:29):
Here's how he describes the family living arrangements when he
went to work with the family, And keep in mind
these are poorer members of the royal family. Once through
the heavily guarded gates, the car would wind past a
series of jaw dropping villas with immaculate gardens maintained by
workers in white uniforms. There was a car park filled
with a fleet of expensive a luxury cars. It was
the first time I saw what looked like a pink Cadillac.

(18:52):
That is like, yeah, that's his second his second family says.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
Right, it's like when you read about Stephen Miller in
your life, his family had to downgrade, and it's like,
what do you mean by downgrade? He's like, well, he's
still had maids and stuff and like servants.

Speaker 3 (19:09):
Yeah, it was slightly smaller.

Speaker 1 (19:12):
It was fewer maids than he thought he ought to have.

Speaker 3 (19:14):
And that fucked him up for the rest of his life.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
Yeah, he never got over that.

Speaker 3 (19:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:21):
You know who isn't like Stephen Miller? Dave, hold on, now,
just tell me the sponsors of this podcast, who are
probably not Miller. It's not there's not a zero percent chance,
and we're back. I just looked. Steven Miller is still

(19:44):
not a podcaster, so we're doing good.

Speaker 3 (19:47):
He's not a sponsor, not.

Speaker 1 (19:49):
Yet, not yet, not yet. We do look forward to
him sponsoring the show though.

Speaker 3 (19:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:54):
So we're talking about this guy Rashid Sakai who starts
teaching when like the second family of Prince Salomon, when
NBS is eleven, and he recalled that when he starts
working for the family, he notices that NBS is close
to the palace director and the palace guards, like the
people who are like the servants who are kind of
running the household, all really like this kid. He tends

(20:17):
to prefer NBS tends to prefer socializing with the guards
to paying attention during his English lessons quote. As the
oldest of his siblings, he seemed to be allowed to
do as he pleased. My ability to command the younger
prince's attention would only last until Mohammad would turn up.
So again, he's not the top of his family, but
he's the top of the second family. So it's like again,
he's constantly the worst of all worlds right where he's

(20:40):
the head of his small world, but he also regularly
butts up against this other world where he's nothing. You know,
Since his dad lives in a different palace and is
seldom around, this means that MBS is effectively the man
of the house from like sixth grade on. He is
in charge in a very literal sense, and he gets
to give orders to a staff of dozens of adults.
He develops a habit of playing pranks, as Rashid recollected,

(21:02):
I still have a memory of him using a walkie
talkie in our classes, borrowed from one of the guards.
He would use it to make cheeky remarks about me
and crack jokes between his brothers and guards. On the
other end.

Speaker 3 (21:13):
That's one of very good.

Speaker 1 (21:15):
It's not a break at all.

Speaker 3 (21:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
Yeah, again, a teacher should have the right to, like
at least spray water at a kid if they do
something like that, a little bit of water, right, just
like a cat, like a cat, exactly like sta Damn.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
They had to give him like some sort of special
pass for this stuff.

Speaker 1 (21:34):
Yeah, now, I'd be remiss if I didn't note that.
Sakai himself still says that he became fond of Mohammad
and his siblings. He describes them all as curious to learn,
but keen to play around, just like his non royal students.
Sakai's account gives us an interesting insight into the bizarre
world of royal family life. For example, quote on one occasion,
I was taken aback when Muhammad told me that his mother,

(21:56):
the Princess, said that I had said that I seemed
like a true gentleman. I had no recollection of meeting her.
Saudi women royalty don't appear in front of strangers, and
the only female I came across was a nanny from
the Philippines. I was oblivious to the fact that I
was being watched until the future heir to the throne,
pointed to some CCTV cameras on the wall. From that
point onwards, I would always feel self conscious in my
lessons like that. That's the vibes here.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
Oh my god, justin I think about what like school
teachers have to deal with in this country.

Speaker 3 (22:27):
Not being recorded like that is Oh god.

Speaker 1 (22:31):
No, yeah, just just a bad time. After several months
on the job, the future King Solomon NBS's father scheduled
a meeting with all the different tutors that he'd hired
for his children. Sakai initially thought that this might be
a good opportunity to discuss the kid's behavioral issues. So
we can infer that, despite his fondness for Mohammed Vin Salmon,
Sakai did consider the kid to have a behavior issue.

(22:55):
Quote when he appeared before us, the teachers instinctively rose up,
and I watched in awe as they approached the real
governor one by one. Bout kissed his hand and hastily
conferred about the children and moved on. And when I
turn came, I couldn't for the life of me been
like they did. I had never done it before, And
before I froze completely, I reached out to take the
future King's hand and shook it firmly. I remember a

(23:15):
faint grin of amazement on his face. However, he made
no fuss about my faux pas. Now, Sakai does not
decides like, I've already pushed my luck enough, I'm not
gonna talk about the fact that your kids acting up
in class.

Speaker 3 (23:27):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (23:27):
He says this is because he'd already decided to leave
for the UK, but he just recalled that. Afterwards, the
house manager yells at him for not showing respect for
the future king. Right then he's like, you shook his hand,
you fucking ass off.

Speaker 2 (23:38):
Yeah, this is a job where I'm not gonna marry Poppins.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
This.

Speaker 3 (23:43):
I'm getting the help out here, Like I'm this weird.

Speaker 1 (23:47):
Yeah, yeah, this can't be on me to figure this out.

Speaker 2 (23:52):
It's that feeling of like, if you speak up, they
might go like, well, I have a different plan.

Speaker 3 (23:57):
Well he's just gonna execute you.

Speaker 1 (23:59):
Like, yeah, we're getting you in a different direction.

Speaker 3 (24:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:04):
By the time he enters his teen years, Prince Muhammad
had jettisoned the shy, awkward side of his personality. He
continued to play pranks and act up in class and
in public. His relatives describe him as being frustrated and angry,
with a sharp temper that went off explosively for little
to know reason. One of his earliest defining character traits
is that he was completely unsatisfied with his family's level

(24:25):
of wealth in the fourth grade. Again, he's making about
five hundred dollars a week as a fourth grader, so
we're talking about like a pretty good monthly income for
a ten year old, but he complains again about the
fact that his other relatives get more. Karen House describes
the young prince as saying that his immediate family sat
below the salt right, Like, that's the term for we're
not making as much money as the other people in

(24:47):
the royal family.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
It's hard normal because if it's the only life, you know,
if you go to your cousins and you're like, I
have all the POGs in the world, and they're like
I have all the POGs in the world, plus several cars,
and you're like, ah.

Speaker 1 (24:59):
Yeah, I have custom POGs.

Speaker 3 (25:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:02):
Again, like by the time he's in high school, it's
normal for princes at his level to have Porsches or BMW's,
but that's not good enough for him. He can't stand
having the same kind of fancy car as the other
poor princes. I'm wanting to read a quote from the
man who would be king here. Quote. As a high
school senior, MBS was old enough to get his first car.
His father urged his son to get a car like

(25:23):
the other boys had luxury, but low key MBS declined.
He had saved money from gifts his uncles had given
him on Islamac holidays, and he was going to have
the car he wanted, even though it cost nearly two
hundred and thirty thousand dollars. So he buys the car,
which is like a fancy Lamborghini, but he doesn't get
a lot of time to show it off for long
because I don't know this might be surprising to you, Dave,

(25:44):
sixteen year olds are not ready to drive Lamborghinis.

Speaker 2 (25:47):
I was literally my mind was flashing through my history
of cars as he was saying that. Of like, no, no, no, no,
no no no no, that's all you want to do.
That's absolutely I don't care how much money you have.
You want something you'll drag race with your friend on
the highway or off.

Speaker 3 (26:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
Yeah, kitt a lancer, Yeah, NBS rear in some poor
fucker in Riad and totals his Lamborghini. He has to
call a friend to be rescued. I don't He's probably
not drunk, he's probably just incompetent. I doubt the person
he hits gets to file. Imagine filing a claim against
the fucking prince.

Speaker 2 (26:25):
I would run, like I would literally on the street,
just see him and get the out of there.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
S Yeah, what a horrible time. It's like hitting a
cop car, like.

Speaker 2 (26:38):
Fuck yeah, yeah, it's like hitting a dinosaur. It's just like,
I need to get out of here right now. That
thing's gonna kill me.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
There's only one kind of dude driving a Lamborghini in
Saudi Arabia right now now. The turn of the millennium
brings several huge changes to Mohammed Ben Salmon's life, two
of which bring a rap had an unexpected alteration to
his chances at reaching the throne. In two thousand and one,
Prince Salmon's oldest son fought, the guy who'd helped reporters

(27:07):
during desert storm dies unexpectedly of a heart condition. His
second brother, Ahmed, who's forty six. A year later, and
like this is the guy. He's like owned a Kentucky
Derby winning horse. He'd been great at shit. He dies
at age forty four of another heart related issue. In
his biography MBS, ben Hubbard writes, quote the declared cause
in both cases was heart attack, but the underlying reasons

(27:29):
were never made clear. Right, So were they poisoned? Were
they killed?

Speaker 2 (27:34):
And I was heart attacking quotes big heartartacking quote.

Speaker 1 (27:39):
Yeah it's a little soft, right right that' said. NBS
probably wasn't the culprit either way, because he's just a
kid at this point in time.

Speaker 2 (27:47):
It would be tough to live in a family like
this and then there be an actual, like genetic medical
issue because you might not even know, like what if
it is just heart attacks? And they're like, well, we
assumed they were poisoned. We're not going to look into that.
I'm not going to be a cardiologist.

Speaker 1 (28:03):
Yeah, who knows. They're rich? Are they doing like coke
or something like that?

Speaker 3 (28:06):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
This is mom orgust. Who's to say it's entirely possible
these are what they seem to be. Whatever the case,
this shifts the family dynamics in very short order. For
one thing, NBS is dad Prince Salmon is devastated, as
his and his most prominent biographers tend to agree, right,
this presents an opportunity to MBS because his dad has

(28:29):
other older kids from his first marriage. But by the
time the two oldest sons die, they're all mature adults
following their careers and ambitions, while NBS is just sixteen
years old and has nowhere better to be during his
father's time of need and vulnerability than right by his
dad's side. So while the other older kids are off
doing stuff, NBS starts showing up to support his dad

(28:51):
while he's grieving, which is going to immediately put him
in a better position. Right, It's just, yeah, a smart play.
It's not hard to see why this plays dividends for him.

Speaker 2 (29:03):
Yeah, and a convenient one where it might have even
naturally happened. Where like you said, everybody else is fucked
off doing other things. It don't seem like as interested
in the family business essentially.

Speaker 1 (29:14):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Now, the main consequence of these deaths
isn't just that two names get pulled from the front
of the line. It's that NBS and his dad get
really close. People note that Mohammad and Salmon starts following
his father to work on a daily basis and gets
to watch him do the job of governing the capitol.
He starts to get a feel for how power works
in the kingdom, and he gets a lot of FaceTime

(29:35):
with his father. Power players in the state apparatus get
used to seeing mbs as well, and he becomes a
default part of increasingly large bits of the power structure.
One thing he comes to understand is that his father
wields power and influence within the Alsaud family. In his
article for The Africa Report, Jahad Gillan writes, as governor
of Riyad, he had access to a small private prison

(29:56):
where he could punish any badly behaved relatives for offenses
such as public intoxication, unpaid hotel bills in Paris, and
reckless driving. I have several princes in my palace at
this moment, he bragged to the British writer Robert Lacy.
In this way, his position meant that he knew all
the secrets, big and small of the Alsad Klan and
possessed incriminating information on many of them. Right, so he's

(30:18):
he's kind of able. His dad is part of what
NBS grows up seeing is his dad is patting his
money and is kind of increasing his power by punishing
a lot of his relatives who have less power, right,
and NBS becomes aware of, like, oh, that's how you
get ahead in the family, you know, is by getting
leverage and wealth over your loved ones.

Speaker 2 (30:38):
It's like any family you blackmail, yeah, the rest of
your family.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
Yeah exactly exactly. You put him in there in the
prison you keep for family members.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Yeah, exactly. Everybody needs a cousin jail.

Speaker 3 (30:50):
You need one.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
If I had a cousin jail, believe me, it would
have gotten use when I was a kid.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
Oh yeah, listen, here's the thing, Robert. It can be
a shed, like it could be anything you needed to be.
It's ideally you want like a you know, like like
a ten person cousin jail.

Speaker 1 (31:06):
If you have a pair of handcuffs, you have a
cousin jail.

Speaker 2 (31:09):
Yeah exactly exactly. If you have like a cinder block
and some rope, you have a cousin jail.

Speaker 1 (31:16):
Realizing jail, anyone can have a cousin jail. So big
Hubbard sites that interview with an anonymous member of the
family entourage who claims quote NBS is social life centered
around using his royal privilege to help build bonds with
the people. In the summer, his family would DeCamp for
the Red Sea coast, where NBS would rent a fleet
of jet skis for the young man for the young men.

(31:37):
In the winter, they would set up a camp across
the desert where MBS would have the biggest camp, serve
roast lambs on huge platters of rice, and keep fleets
of buggies for the Bedouin who drop by to greet
the locals. In Bin's reading, one of been Salomon's strengths
is that he loved, or at least was able to
convince his father and a lot of power burgers in
the country that he loved Saudi Arabia. While his cousins
and siblings and half siblings loved the West and spent

(31:59):
their time and foreign countries, he was primarily like hanging
out at home. Right. This isn't totally accurate. He parties,
oversees a lot, and he violates the religious laws his
family's supposed to abide by constantly, But he puts in
a good show of liking Saudi Arabia, right, and that
gets that pays dividends for him, you know, right.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
I mean, he's a rich kid. You have to party overseas.
That's just what you gotta do.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
Yeah, that's just part of the life. Yeah. Yeah, but
you throw in some parties at home too, you know.

Speaker 3 (32:29):
And yeah they did.

Speaker 1 (32:31):
Yeah. And this the fact this is a deliberate lie
doesn't mean that his dad isn't convinced that his son
feels this way. The evidence suggests that NBS is able
to keep a sort of jeckle and hide situation going
for most of his adolescents. In young adulthood. To his father,
he's this disciplined, obedient, patriotic boy, the perfect successor to
a lot of his peers and relatives. He makes a
habit out of petty crime and disobedience, stretching the limits

(32:53):
of his royal immunity as far as possible. Per an
article in the Africa Report quote, as a teenager, he
was a bad tempered troublemaker who sometimes behaved out landishly,
like the time he dressed up as a policeman so
he could wander around a riodd shopping center. He was
caught in the act by actual police officers, but they
let him walk free when they realized who he was.

Speaker 2 (33:12):
He's doing like a princess Jasmine. He's going out. He
wants to blend in. But you normally when you want
to blend in, you don't dress like a cop. That's
the opposite of blending in.

Speaker 3 (33:23):
No, I mean he.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
Doesn't want to blend in. He wants to bully people.

Speaker 2 (33:27):
Yeah, it sounds really like real my dad owns the
dealership energy. Yeah, where like he's he's a jerk, but
he's a perfect angel to the family, to the people
who are keeping him in that position, Like yeah, yeah,
Like he's doing a great job at being a shitty
rich kid.

Speaker 3 (33:46):
Like he's he's not nailing it.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
It sounds that's exactly right. Now as a young man,
one of the first revelations NBS has is that, unlike
many of his close relatives, he's going to have to
work for his money. It'll be clear. He's not going
to have to work to have access to life of
luxury and excess. He's guaranteed that as a member of
the royal family. But he wants power and influence, and
his birthright isn't going to guarantee him that. It's become

(34:10):
increasingly clear to him by this period that Prince Solomon
is in a lot of debt, both to other family
members and to non royal rich Saudi guys. NBS is
keenly aware of this fact, and he's also paying a
lot of attention to the financial situations of his closer relatives.
During a conversation with one such cousin, he comes to
the horrifying conclusion that his branch of the family is
going to get left on the sidelines. Per an investigation

(34:32):
by Jahad Gillan published in The Africa Report, quote while
still a teenager, MBS told his father that he wanted
to start a business, an atypical ambition for a Saudi
royal family member, one that extracted nothing other than a
smile from Salmon. MBS's significant relationships with his male relatives
are all based around either vengeance or imitation. As an
insecure teenager, the cousin he most wants to imitate is

(34:55):
his cousin, Prince Alwaheed bin Tallal, who's the richest man
in Saudi Arabia. Reporting on Bintelal's earlier business dealings makes
it seem like this is the kind of thing where
MBS would regularly bring up his rich cousin during business
deals to be like I'll be richer than him in
like two years, you know, like this guy's this guy's
the cousin. I'm most in byer now, but I'm going

(35:15):
to get more money than my cousin. Like you you
think he's rich, now you get in bed with me,
I'm going to have even more money. Right. He's not
initially good at business. The first big business deal he
tries to set up involves trying to buy, like trying
to land a deal importing asphalt from Kuwait, and this
falls apart, as do most of his subsequent business deals,

(35:36):
because despite having a lot of cunning and a work
ethic that surpasses his relatives, he's not good at a
lot of stuff. By age sixteen, yeah, exactly, Like.

Speaker 2 (35:46):
I know things I feel like being born into wealth.
It's it feels harder to be into business because it's
like it's like it's like driving a Gta, where like
the steaks are are not high enough for me to
be at this. Yeah you know if I if I
fuck up, eh, it'll be fine.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
It's and like if you get good at driving a Gta,
that's fun, but you still fucked up enough that if
you'd been a real person, you would have died a
million times by that. Yeah right, Yeah, a case in point,
at age sixteen, he's saved up about one hundred thousand
dollars in cash, mostly from Hawking gold, jewelry and fancy washes.
He got his birthday gifts from his dad and uncles,

(36:30):
and he uses that money to launch an investment portfolio
that he's going to try to turn into a personal fortune. Right,
he wants to turn this hundred thousand to millions of
dollars so that he's independently wealthy. Gillan writes that quote.
At first, the value of his share portfolio went up,
but soon enough MBS was losing money and in financial ruin,
as he would later admit, like, he takes a bath
on all of this money because he's basically day trading

(36:52):
and he doesn't know what he's doing right now. My
greatest yeah, of course, the greatest advantag again, just took
that money in an index fund. Man, you'd have been fine.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
Give it to me.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
You're fine, give them money to me, give them money
to day. It'll work out just as well for you. Yeah,
The greatest advantage of being born into money. Is that
a setback? Like burning your life savings at age sixteen
does not have any consequences. You're not gonna starve and
you're not going to fail to meet any bills. You
just gotta have to keep saving up birthday rolexis until
you can try again. So he does that, and he

(37:25):
graduates high school as one of the top ten students
in Saudi Arabia. And I know you're wondering, did he
really earn that honor or was it nepotism? And the
best answer I can give is this, can you think
of a real national education system that has a list
of the ten best students in the country. No, because
that's stupid. Real real countries don't do that.

Speaker 3 (37:47):
No, No, they tell you're right. It's a good point.
I mean, it's almost like the best.

Speaker 1 (37:52):
Students in America.

Speaker 2 (37:54):
Yeah, but it's like, what is gonna have? Is he
not gonna graduate? There's no world where it's it's like,
is he a good steerio or not?

Speaker 3 (38:03):
Yeah? Yeah, maybe he's smart. We'll never know.

Speaker 1 (38:06):
Guy whose teachers will get shot for not giving good
grades has good grades news at eleven. Yeah, speaking of
people who might get shot, probably not our advertisers. I
think solid, solid, Thank you, and we're back. So we're

(38:34):
talking about Mohammed Ben Solomon. He's graduated high school at
this point. He goes to college at a university named
after his great grandfather, King Saud. I'm sure he earned
his admittance the hard way, uh, and he gets a
law degree. He graduates second in his class, which again
I'm sure he did the honest way. By this point,
Mohammed Ben Solomon decided to take another stab at trying

(38:55):
to get rich on his own. He makes the smart
move of finally reaching out to actual professionals, businessmen and
riad who are scared of pissing off the governor and
wouldn't tell his annoying kid to fuck off. One imagines
that Prince Salmon puts in a good word with them
on behalf of his son, and perhaps maybe brings up
some blackmail gently. However it happens, MBS winds up with

(39:16):
eight hundred thousand dollars to try his hand at starting
another investment portfolio. Right wow, he managed to bootstrap himself
up again to having even more money to try to
make money with. Amazing He invests in US corporations and
this goes better for him. In two thousand and eight,
when he's twenty three, he starts investing in the tadal

(39:36):
Wu Exchange, which is the Saudi stock exchange right now,
since nearly all of the companies on the Saudi Exchange
are owned or run by the government aka his family,
it's pretty easy for someone like NBS to do we
would call insider trading, which he calling his cousin who
runs the company and says, hey, are you about to

(39:56):
have any good news? Should I get some stock?

Speaker 3 (39:59):
Now? I'm surprised he even had to try.

Speaker 2 (40:02):
It rids me of the Stonecutter Simpsons episode where they're
all just like Homer Win where it's like, what do
you even have to call?

Speaker 3 (40:09):
Like yeah, they could just yeah man, And.

Speaker 1 (40:12):
It's a it's a mark of how of how sketchy
he still isn't this that he does get invested for
insider trading and that happens to him, but he's still
obvious enough that someone looks into it.

Speaker 3 (40:25):
Who looked into that? That's incredible?

Speaker 1 (40:27):
Yeah, like bone saw?

Speaker 2 (40:30):
That's who right to do something so bad or illegal
that someone's like, Okay, this is gonna kill me, but
I have to do something about it.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
I just can't ignore this man.

Speaker 3 (40:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:41):
Now, NBS's first year's after graduation are a blizzard of
firms and businesses launched by him, usually in partnership with
someone who needed favors from his dad or the royal family.
Because he is somewhat willing to do real work, he
does get appointed to some actual jobs. Oh there again,
they're nepo jobs. He's made Secretary General for the Riod
Competitive Council. He's made special advisor for a foundation named

(41:04):
after his grandfather, that sort of stuff. He creates his
own philanthropic foundation cultivating leadership skills in young Saud. He's
got his little Lebowski Urban Achievers program of his own right,
and in two thousand and nine he gets made special
advisor to the Governor of Riod, who is his dad.
Now this is probably the earliest clear sign that this

(41:26):
middle son of Prince Solomon had somehow engineered his way
into being a favored son of the heir apparent. This
still puts him nowhere near the running for throne or
for the running the entire kingdom. His focus at this
point is just on getting rich. Real estate speculation is
finally how he succeeds financially in a big way. Per

(41:46):
that article in the Africa Report quote, MBS teamed up
with landowners who agreed to give him a cut of
the revenue generated by property sales to build developments on
greenfield estates. The business model turned out to be lucrative,
and the prince began to a as a small fortune.
Then a rumor made the rounds that NBS had sent
an envelope containing a bullet to an owner who deigned
to refuse to sell a plot of land to him.

(42:08):
Whether true or false, the anecdote earned him the name
Abu Rasala, the Father of the bullet, within the royal family.

Speaker 2 (42:16):
Mm hmm, that father of the bullet. Yeah, I think
that's just a complicated way of saying a gun, right,
like the father of.

Speaker 1 (42:25):
The father of the bullet. Is it more of a
mother his gun? Bullets are more like eggs in a gun.
More guns, so maybe they're not good. Yeah, that's what
hr Geiger would have argued for the painting on my wall.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
Would have done all sorts of things. It would have
been both and none at the same time.

Speaker 1 (42:47):
Yeah, uh Geiger. And again that's also such like a
that is kind of like a weak sauce version of
threatening someone with murder is like just making them an
envelope with the.

Speaker 2 (43:00):
Bullet, because then there's something like I guess the thing
about mailing someone a bullet is that then you get
to imagine that they had to like go out, get
some stamps, put the bullet in the envelope, mail the envelope.

(43:20):
Like there's just something like kind of silly about that
threat where it's almost like too much work.

Speaker 1 (43:26):
I don't know, Yeah, yeah, it's it's just like kind
of sweaty, right, Like.

Speaker 2 (43:31):
Yeah, it's like when you watch seven and you're like
he had to mail that head, which means that he
had to like go to ups and like war line
and like get it all, get it all wrapped up,
and I don't know, it just kind of takes the
edge off when you think about that a little too much.

Speaker 1 (43:48):
Father, When you get mailed a bullet, do you call me,
like do me to like shoot myself? What am I?

Speaker 3 (43:53):
Do you mean to mail me a bullet?

Speaker 1 (43:57):
Is this purposefully?

Speaker 3 (43:58):
Were sitting.

Speaker 1 (44:01):
Likely? What are we doing here?

Speaker 3 (44:03):
Yeah, it's very sweaty.

Speaker 1 (44:06):
His master stroke, like in terms of financial deals, is
that this this deal he inks in two thousand and
eight with Verizon. Weirdly enough, that's how MBS gets his
like his major financial success. He takes a minority stake
in a joint venture involved with one of his many
companies to bring the fiber optic infrastructure to Saudi Arabia. Right,

(44:27):
This partnership helps boost MBS's growing stature, although it doesn't
actually get off the ground. Right, this is like his
one of his big deals and it never happens, but
he doesn't get paid for it. And Prince Salomona said
to have bragged, my son made millions for the family
as a result of this, even though again it doesn't
work out, right, Like, all that matters is we got paid,

(44:47):
you know, well, did we get fiber optic?

Speaker 3 (44:49):
No fibers like LaserDisc you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (44:53):
Where I feel like I was talking to someone like, oh,
I can't wait to get fiber optic, and it's like
they don't. We have wireless internet. Now we're completely stipping
over fiber optic.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
He's like that deadbeat dad who like promises his family
we're getting fiber and then he just gets like faster
dial up.

Speaker 3 (45:09):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, hey, and that works.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
Yeah. In late January of twenty fifteen, King Abdullah died NBS'
His father, Governor Salomon, had been the crown prince for
some period of time, and so he becomes the king
after the old king's death. This was noted as being
an unusually smooth transition given the messy circumstances of the
Saudi family in general. The fact that it's the smoothest

(45:33):
scene is that there's a kind of an agreement that
now King Solomon and the old king had, and basically
the former king is like, I will make you the king,
but you have to appoint these people to positions in
the government, right, who would otherwise be your ribals and
not and agree not to fight them or have like
bloodshed with them, right. So they kind of make an
agreement before the old king dies to try to spare

(45:56):
the kingdom any sort of power struggles. Saudi kings, as
you might, don't have to follow a strict family line
to decide who gets power when they're gone. They get
to pick a successor. Salmon gets the job because he
convinces the old king he was the most capable option,
and he promises to do a bunch of stuff that
the old king says, now he doesn't follow all of
these to the letter. Before King Abdullah died, he had

(46:17):
picked a crown prince that he wanted to be the
crown Prince for King Solomon, the guy who would succeed
if Salomon died, and this was Prince Markin bin Abdullah Ziz,
who at age seventy two was just seven years younger
than Prince now King Solomon. I found a write up
by Stephen Matthews who noted what was interesting about Prince
Markin becoming crown Prince is that he was officially designated

(46:38):
in a royal decree by former King Abdullah as next
in succession after King Solomon. After a further royal decree
by King Abdullah stated that Prince Markin would become crowned
Prince after Crown Prince Salomon became king and cannot be
changed by anyone. Now this doesn't last, right, And there's
some speculation that because Murkin's prince mom was Yemini, he

(46:59):
was seen as an una acceptable air. I think that
King Solomon just kind of knew the guy wasn't gonna
be a good successor. He was too old, and so
after a few months he picks a more capable successor,
and this guy kind of steps aside, and the man
he picks for the job is not his son, but
his nephew, Mohammed bin Nayaf otherwise known as MBN, a

(47:19):
very capable man who would have the misfortune of being
the first person targeted for destruction by Mohammed ben Salomon,
who's going to succeed him as the crown Prince. And
we will tell that story in part three. How are
you feeling so far about this kid, Dave, You know, no.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
Warning signs, no red flags. Seems fine to me, not
at all. Yeah, you know, nobody sawed up.

Speaker 1 (47:44):
Nobody's sawed up. He's mailed a bullet to some guy.
I'm sure that's the worst thing he'll do.

Speaker 2 (47:49):
Yeah, I mean, listen, that's like real teenage edged lord
stuff where it's like I can see someone doing that here.

Speaker 3 (47:57):
I could see like if he you know, know, at.

Speaker 1 (48:01):
Least should have bullet, you know, Yeah, you.

Speaker 2 (48:05):
Can sell that to like a child. Child doesn't know
how much a bullet costs. They'll give you anything.

Speaker 1 (48:11):
They don't know that that's not worth that much money. Yeah, Well, David,
got any pluggles to plug before we roll out here.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Ah, same as before. Game for the unemployed, some more news.
Google those things if you feel like it.

Speaker 1 (48:27):
Yeah, google those things if you feel like it. Oh
you don't, still do it?

Speaker 3 (48:32):
I'll yeah, blue Sky, I guess, Okay, okay, movie whol again?
Why not? I'm not really on it, but you know
I'm on it.

Speaker 1 (48:42):
Yeah. Anyway, Find Dave on the internet, Harass him on
the internet, find him on the street, talk to a bullet.
Mail day of a bullet.

Speaker 2 (48:51):
If enough people mail me a bullet, I'll have a
shitload of bullets.

Speaker 3 (48:55):
I have no guns, but.

Speaker 1 (48:57):
Yeah, yeah, those are as good as money. You can
pay your rent to bullets. In some places you actually
probably can't. That might be illegal, but oh yeah right,
paying your written to know they probably would take that
as a threat. Yeah yeah, well, Dave, I think that's
going to be all for those of us here at
Behind the Bastards and those of us here at David
Bell until next week. Continue not living in Saudi Arabia

(49:21):
unless you live in Saudi Arabia, at which point good luck.
In which case good luck, I guess either way, whatever, yeah,
and have fun, have fun.

Speaker 4 (49:33):
Behind the Bastards is a production of Cool Zone Media.
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