September 12, 2026 • 31 mins
Let's be honest: Bugs aren't everyone's cup of tea, but they're fascinating, crucial parts of the ecosystem. They're also, according to a few eggheads, the perfect weapons of war. Join the guys as they explore the bizarre experiments governments conducted in the field of entomological warfare.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Fellow Ridiculous historians, as we're wrapping up this week of
celebratory classics for Labor Day, we've got to tell you,
there is a story we ran into in our sister show,
Stuff They Don't Want You to Know, about cyber cockroaches.
Remember that one? Yeah. It was odd, right?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
They were technically designed to be deployed to find survivors
amidst rubble. But then there was talk of them being
able to also inject people with things.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
That one threw me a little bit. It seemed like
those features exist at cross purposes.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
They were also pretty vague about what could be injected.
They just kept using the word injectables. Injectables.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Which is not very reassuring. You're talking about train spotting here? Exactly. We,
we were, we were, Both startled, I think, in a
bit of synchronicity to learn that after we had reported
the latest news on cyber cockroaches, this story from 2019
popped up on our radar. Folks, it turns out that
(01:06):
multiple governments have been trying to turn insects into soldiers
for like decades. And why not, Ben? That's what I say.
Why not?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
We are on a bit of a run with a
little break in between for Yasuke of odd soldiers. I
suppose in feudal Japan, Yasuke would have been considered an
odd soldier.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Oh, yes, very much so. And check this one out.
We can't wait to hear your thoughts. Be kind to
your local insects, even if bugs aren't your cup of tea.
And do tune in next week when we're going to
get into some even more weird war stuff. Backpack nukes
at Matahari. Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome
(02:16):
to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thanks so much for tuning in.
My name is Ben, and I got to tell you,
something's bugging me. My name is Noel the Big Buzz Brown.
Is that what they call you? Oh, no, they call
me that. Who are they? You know, the royal they. Oh, good.
The editorial they. We're also joined by our super producer,
(02:39):
Casey the Big Itch Pegram. How's it going, Casey? Scratching
away over here, I guess. It's that summertime in Georgia, man.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
And, you know, when you realize, too, part of the
story is the government actually dumping more mosquitoes into Georgia.
That's when you realize how truly callous and cruel the
American government can be.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Yeah, I'll take the name Ben Dropkick Bolin. And it
is true. The thing that's specifically bugging me today is
just the heat walking to work. But we are talking
about bugs. We're talking about entomology. We're talking about warfare.
We're talking about bug wars. That sounds pretty cool. Yeah,
(03:22):
literal bug wars, right? So, Noel, what are you talking about?
People were dropping mosquitoes into Georgia? That's one of them.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
That was Operation Big Buzz, which in the 1950s, the
Army put more than 300,000 mosquitoes uninfected mosquitoes into bombs
and then drop them onto the unsuspecting population of Savannah, Georgia.
And this was a test for something that the government
was working on on a much larger scale, the weaponization
(03:54):
of insects. We'll get into the specifics of each of
these operations. But for now, Ben, what the hell is
the weaponization of insects? Let's backtrack a little bit. Sure.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
It's a form of biological warfare that You know, it's
something that a lot of engineers have said before in
the past. People can make things that are pretty good
in terms of technology. But when it comes to the
natural results of evolution, Mother Nature tends to make pretty
great stuff. So why would we go back and try
(04:24):
to build tiny, tiny machines and weapons of our own
when we could just use the existing creatures? insects.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, we know that various versions of weaponizing animals have
gone varying ways, you know, dolphins, tiny bat bombs, you know,
that on Japan, the idea that the bats would deploy
into eaves of homes and then these incendiary devices would
go off and burn down Japan.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
That didn't work out so well.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
This story that we're talking about today, the weaponization of insects,
has had varying.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Degrees of success in various different cultures, not only ours.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
But here's the thing. So the turn of the 20th century,
human beings in general started figuring out that insects carry diseases.
The term is vectors. They were vectors for diseases. There
is a professor at the University of Wyoming who explained
it as such in the Casper Star Tribune, a gentleman
by the name of Jeff Lockwood. He says– Quote, the Japanese, French, Germans, English,
(05:27):
and the United States all had entomological disease programs active
during the golden years of 1930 to 1970. And that
includes a Japanese World War II program. The name of
that program was Unit 731.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Unit 731 was the Japanese government's World War II analog
to the horrific human experimentation that took place under the
Nazi regime during the Holocaust. So Unit 731 is a very,
very dark thing. It's not ridiculous, but do be aware
(06:02):
that it exists. Essentially, Unit 731 engaged in tremendously horrific,
unethical human experimentation. There are sickening stories that are all
true and that are worse than fiction. You can learn
more about these evil science experiments. I do not use
(06:23):
the word evil lightly. by searching online. There are, of course,
numbers of books here. They were doing stuff like studying
hypothermia by submerging people's limbs in water until the arm
or leg is frozen solid and ice formed over it,
and then striking them with canes. They were essentially vivisecting people,
conducting surgery on them while they were alive, starving them,
(06:46):
burning them, infecting them with various diseases.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
And part of it was their weaponization of insects wherein
they sprayed fleas from low-flying airplanes, and these fleas were
infected with cholera. And according to the Boston Globe, in
another piece that Lockwood contributed to, these deaths could have
exceeded that of both Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined, those bombings.
(07:15):
At least 440,000 Chinese were killed using these plague-infected fleas.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
That number comes from an international symposium of historians in 2002.
So relatively speaking, it's pretty recent. And think about that number,
440,000 people. Japan, we should say as well, is the
only country in history that has verifiably used plague. bugs
(07:45):
in war. Other countries have experimented with it. Spoiler alert,
one of them being the good old U.S. of A.
In fact, we experimented with this not once, but multiple
times in a very short time span in the 1950s, right?
Because we said there's a golden age from the 1930s
to the 70s. In the U.S., we had not one,
(08:08):
but three huge operations, weaponizing insects, In the mid-1950s, and
it's fascinating stuff. The first one where Casey Pegram took
his nickname for today is Operation Big Itch, which also
used fleas, right? They took a page from the Japanese
government there.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Yes, and we have, thanks to the lovely folks at
The Smoking Gun, have a document that catalogs several of
these programs, one of which has been entirely redacted. But
we do have a little bit of information about that
one from some other sources. But according to Section 1
of a document called The History of In-Field Testing in
the U.S., Operation Big Itch took place in 1954 and
(08:48):
was a series of trials, of tests, that were conducted
using fleas loaded into E-14 munitions with what's described as
cardboard and sponge inserts. The idea was that the bugs
would be dropped from altitudes of between 305 and 610
meters over a testing area called the Dugway Proving Ground
(09:11):
in Utah. The idea was to investigate the the viability
of the munitions used here and how effective they would
be in disseminating what's referred to very scientifically as these
arthropod vectors.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
Right, exactly. This specifically was the tropical rat flea or
Xenopsila chopis. The logic here is pretty sound, right? The
waves of death known collectively as the Black Plague came
from fleas. They're very, very good for transmitting diseases quickly.
Big Itch showed a lot of promise, but it also
(09:48):
had some problems. So they were loaded into these munitions,
dropped from the air, as you said, up to, what,
610 meters. They used a couple of different bombs. The
E-14 bomb and the E-23 bomb, which they could cluster
into a kind of a Voltron arrangement called the E-86
(10:09):
cluster bomb or the E-77. Without getting too in the
weeds on these abbreviations and numbers, just know that the
E-14 was designed to hold 100,000 fleas, and the E-23
was designed to hold 200,000 fleas. The E-23 was the
worst performer. Over half of the bombs failed. They didn't
(10:30):
meet their expectations. They malfunctioned during, this is the worst part,
they malfunctioned during testing. On the plane, right? Yeah, and
the fleas were released into the aircraft where they attacked
the pilot, the bombardier, and an observer. Someone was just
sitting there, you know, As a bystander. So they imagine
you're about to launch a bomb of fleas and the
(10:52):
bomb goes off in the plane. That's exactly what happens.
And this, by the way, comes from a great book
called Weapons of Mass Destruction, an Encyclopedia of Worldwide Policy,
Technology and History by James J. Wirtz.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Next, we have Operation Big Buzz, which was in 1955.
And this was an experiment that the Georgia centric one
that we mentioned earlier in the show. It was a
field test that was trying to figure out the, I
don't know, the viability again of actually breeding and then
housing and then loading up into bombs and ultimately, you know,
(11:30):
scattering these across the land. Yellow fever infected mosquitoes.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
Yeah. Yeah. Over 300,000, right? It gets even crazier.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Than that, right?
Speaker 1 (11:39):
So they did these tests.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
In Savannah, Georgia, where they released 330,000 Aedes aegypti mosquitoes,
which are known vectors for yellow fever. And they did
this by dropping them on Georgia parks all throughout Savannah.
And they were kind of released out into suburbs as well.
And the idea was that they would see how many
(12:07):
reports came in of citizens being being bitten, and they
would kind of be able to tell how effective this
was as a means of dispersing this disease.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Not the best methodology. When's the last time you contacted
the government because a mosquito attacked you? These mosquitoes, by
the way, thankfully, were not actually infected with yellow fever
for the purposes of this test. But it's pretty insane
(12:38):
to think that they said, okay, let's just drop this
off and see what happens. See who is so concerned
about mosquitoes that they call us. They were also dropping
these from the same bombs in the Big Itch, the
E14 bombs. So they clearly thought that there was some
promise for this. In total, I think it was 1
(13:00):
million female mosquitoes they bred for the testing. At least
according to Public Health Issues Disaster Preparedness. That's a real...
Very sexy acronym. Yeah, super creative. Oh, that would be FIDIP.
Now that is pretty cool sounding. FIDIP. That comes from
John Marr and Lloyd Novick over at FIDIP.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
I think that's why I like acronyms so much, because
the sound of the acronym is usually infinitely more fascinating
and intriguing than when you actually name out the individual words.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
It's a little easier to remember, too, because it's a mnemonic.
So what happened with the yellow fever run through or
rehearsal there in Savannah? Well, I mean, it was annoying, right? Right.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I mean, it was literally like, you know, Georgia, Savannah
in particular, is a swampy kind of breeding ground for
mosquitoes anyway. Can you imagine just unleashing that on your
own people? I mean, sure, they weren't infected with the
actual disease, right? But they were still infected. essentially doing
military tests on their own citizens, right?
Speaker 1 (14:06):
And there was even more subterfuge because we found that
government officials disguised themselves as healthcare professionals to monitor the population.
So that's how they were getting, just to clarify, that's
how they were intending to get feedback. That's pretty gross, man.
It's definitely unethical. And with the results there, Would we
(14:28):
say that that was a success? Because the idea, again,
was they would drop them, and the test was going
to be whether the mosquitoes could survive the drop and
then seek food on the ground, right? Seek blood.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Yeah. What they determined was that the female mosquitoes actively
sought blood meals from humans and guinea pigs, which is
what they were described as in the report.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Right.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
And that some of the mosquitoes were collected as far
as four-tenths of a mile from the target release site. So, yes,
it was absolutely effective. They could get into homes, you know.
I mean, if they were infected with this deadly disease,
it would have been an absolute bloodbath, no pun intended,
or maybe pun intended.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
What do I know? Yeah, I mean, absolutely. This seems
ridiculous now, but it had enormous potential for destruction, so
much so that that after releasing these Aedes aegypti mosquitoes,
the U.S. government said, I really think we're on to something. Okay,
maybe big itch was just a good starting point for us.
(15:31):
And the big buzz showed some promise. So, hey, guys,
it's 1956. We're living in the future. Let's do this
one more time. What do you say for old time's sake?
Fun is what I say. So that gives us one.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
Of the more shadowy operations known as Operation Dropkick, which
I believe was your.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Nom de plume in this episode, right, Ben? Yeah, I
have a very lazy fighting style. I just sort of
put my foot up and then it drops. Yeah, exactly.
It's very effective on shoes. Yeah, well, it's kind of
an MMA style. It's like an MMA move. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
So this was kind of similar to these other operations,
but had some pretty important distinctions. This took place in
1956 when this is the Chemical Corps.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
Isn't that right? Isn't that what conducted this operation? Yep.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Which is an organization I was not familiar with. Tell
us a little bit about the Chemical Corps, Ben.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Sure. The Chemical Corps is the branch of the U.S. Army.
The official stories, they specifically work on defense against nuclear weapons, chemical,
biological weapons. You'll hear people say that for most of
its history, the Chemical Corps was actually tasked with delivering
these weapons instead of defending against them. And you'll hear
(16:46):
that because it's true. Right. Exactly.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
So they conducted Operation Dropkick when they released 600,000 uninfected
mosquitoes onto a bombing range in Avon Park, Florida.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Yes, that's right. And their methodology was improving. They were
able to track these mosquitoes a little bit better. They
were able to come up with an estimate of how
many entered houses and bit people. And they also found
that they could deliver them through a couple of different
devices or methods. In this case, they were released from helicopters, right?
(17:24):
And people in Avon Park, still some of them remembered this.
You know, they were old enough to be conscious of
these things happening. And they reported that mosquitoes weren't the
only things released. There is a Avon Park resident named
Beatrice Peterson, who wasn't aware of the mosquito releases because
(17:44):
there are already mosquitoes in Florida. But she did recall
that a ton of screw worm flies were released in
the mid to late 1950s when she was 14.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
I think. Yeah. And she describes them as being dropped
from little boxes out of these helicopters and that they'd
see them at school and the boxes would open up
and the flies would be dispersed.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
And here's the thing.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Avon Park in Florida was a prominently black neighborhood and
prominently lower income. And a lot of folks actually got
sick because of this. And I believe a handful actually died.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah. And we shouldn't skip over that because it is
true that in many of the illegal experiments that the U.S.
conducted domestically, they focused on marginalized communities because they thought
they could get away with it. There would at the
very least be less legal trouble or less possibility. So
the big question is, what would have happened if these
(18:41):
insects were carrying disease? The answer is clearly a public
health disaster would have been possible, would have been in
the cards, you know, a yellow fever outbreak. So they
found that in theory, unlike the bat bomb or the
cyborg cat, which are both real things, this weaponization of
insects had some sand to it. It could actually work.
(19:04):
And although the three experiments we outlined occurred in the 1950s,
that doesn't mean that the U.S. Army called it quits.
We have evidence that shows they were interested in it
even more recently, right?
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Yeah, we have some documentation that shows that up until
as recently as the 1980s, 81 in fact, there's a
report on entomological warfare that piggybacks off of the research
that was done at that Dugway Proving Ground in Utah.
And the study actually looks more at how we could
(19:35):
defend ourselves against attacks being done on U.S. soil by
infected mosquitoes with yellow fever. And according to the report,
it noted that U.S. intelligence information indicated that Warsaw Pact
nations have attempted to develop this capability, and it also
looks at cost estimates of what the fallout from these
(19:59):
kinds of attacks might be. So this isn't necessarily looking
at doing the research and developing these techniques ourselves, but
more guarding against it. in the case of attacks from
other nations outside of America.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Right. And this leads us into a bit of conspiratorial
speculation here. We've heard of the Zika virus, right? Remember,
that was in the news a lot. So the Zika
virus is a disease transmitted primarily by these mosquitoes that
we mentioned earlier. Symptoms can be mild and include fever, rash, conjunctivitis, muscle,
(20:33):
joint pain, malaise, a headache. It's 2019, man. I feel
like most people have malaise of some sort nowadays. But
it can pose great dangers. It can be particularly dangerous
to unborn children. It can cause infants to be born
with a number of deleterious conditions. But some people will
(20:57):
tell you that the Zika virus is an offshoot of
the U.S. Army's EW or Entomological Warfare Program because in
the 1930s, This mosquito, Aedes aegypti, was found in every
country in South and Central America, throughout the Caribbean, and
even here in the southeastern United States. And then it
came with, you know, it came with all the diseases
(21:19):
that this creature usually carries. Yellow fever, dengue fever, also
called breakbone, and now Zika. So people were working to
eradicate this troublesome creature, which was occurring naturally. It's not
like Peru was bombing Brazil with these or something. In 1958,
Brazil successfully eradicated the mosquito and was working to eradicate
(21:41):
it not just from its own country, but from the
rest of the hemisphere. This was going to be the
culmination of decades of work. And unfortunately, even while the U.S.
was funding eradication efforts in South America, it was still
secretly raising colonies of millions of these mosquitoes to use
(22:01):
as weapons. So it was kind of shooting ourselves in
the foot, robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
It seems like it got out of hand really quickly.
And a lot of this research really makes me think,
is the U.S. responsible for how many mosquitoes ended up, like,
in the South?
Speaker 1 (22:16):
They had to, mosquitoes already naturally occurred. No, I know that.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
But I'm just saying, like, when you dump that many
more on top of an already thriving population.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not going to double down
on that. Great time to be a bird.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Ooh, that's Because I was just thinking like already in
the summer here in Atlanta, I'm already covered in mosquito
bites and I haven't been spending that much time outside.
So they definitely are able to infiltrate homes and get
inside and get at those those blood bags that are
human beings.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
I hear you can modify your diet. I don't know
if it's true such that mosquitoes won't find you tasty. Really? Yeah. Yeah.
You will hear people say that there are a couple
of different what they call mosquito repellent foods, garlic and onions.
That's not a problem. Apple cider vinegar, lemongrass, chili peppers, grapefruit,
which I am not going to eat. Not a grapefruit fan. No,
(23:06):
I hate it. Really? Hate it. Not even like in
a little cocktail, like a little grapefruit and vodka? Grapefruit
is an injustice that shall not stand. Interesting. I used
to not like it either.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
The ruby red I find a little bit more palatable
than the regular old grapefruit.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
I think it was because when I was in Boy Scouts,
One summer in the middle of nowhere, we were stranded
in a place where the only thing to drink was
water or this rancid grapefruit juice. So that was my
first success. Yeah, I just can't do it. Got it.
I fully support everyone who enjoys grapefruit. Just don't make
(23:41):
me participate. No, that's fine. To each his own.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
I also heard a thing about mosquitoes that if you
flick them off before they've fully had a chance to
do their dirty work, it itches more.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Because there's some kind of antibody or something they inject
into the bite after they've finished that makes it, like,
less itchy.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Kind of like the little Cheez-Its you get if you
donate blood. Exactly.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
It's just like that. I'm not even going to bother
confirming whether this is true or not. I just choose
to believe it is true. But what we definitely know
is true is there is a precedent for this kind
of research, and we alluded to it earlier in the show.
But in 1941, Heinrich Himmler was ordered to create a
research station, a laboratory that was based out of the
concentration camp at Dachau under the command of the Nazi SS.
(24:31):
And that was to focus on studying diseases with the
goal of protecting the Germans. But some new reports from
the University of Tübingen, an ecologist by the name of
Klaus Reinhardt, indicate that they were actually working on offensive
biological warfare programs as well.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Yeah, just like the U.S. Chemical Corps. You know, they
say it's for defense or research, but it turns out
the potential for weaponizing this stuff is just too promising.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Yeah, so under the 1925 Geneva Protocol, Hitler wasn't allowed
to use chemical or biological weapons during World War II. But,
you know, like we say, we can on paper say, yeah,
of course, we're going to follow the rules of engagement.
But behind closed doors, he had folks working around the
clock to study the same thing that we're talking about
(25:24):
in the United States, weaponization of mosquitoes and fleas.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
Right. And as Klaus Reinhart points out, reading through the
details of the research seems to indicate that there was
a nother research program, a classified project codenamed Dormaus, or
can you give it a shot in German?
Speaker 2 (25:46):
How about Siebenschlafer or Schlefer?
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Because it's got the umlaut over the A, so that
makes it an E sound.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Schlefer.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
I'm glad you're here. We found this in a Smithsonian article.
This title is golden. Nazi scientists wanted to use mosquitoes
to send diseases behind enemy lines.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Yeah, and that's by Colin Schultz. And it goes through
this research material that we discussed. And some of the
wording in these documents is what indicates there may have
been a parallel program. So we don't necessarily know this
for a fact or have confirmation, but there is some indication. Again,
according to Reinhart, the wording, he says, in the German
(26:24):
documents suggests that they knew that there was a planned
release of mosquitoes.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Yeah, exactly. So. There's a report dated in September of 1944,
September the 23rd. And in this report, they have some
what we call weasel words. They've got some wiggle room.
They say they're carrying out research, quote, in order to
clarify the question whether an artificial mass infection of the
(26:52):
malaria parasite onto humans is possible and how one can
counter an action that aims at such mass infection. So
the idea here is, Ultimately, we're learning how to protect
ourselves against weaponized bugs. And the way we're going to
do that is to weaponize some bugs and infect a
ton of people with malaria.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
And then a pretty solid cover story is that they
were doing this research to prevent plague outbreaks in the
concentration camps with already weakened, you know, prisoners.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Of war that were used basically as slave labor. So
that was an important quality of this research as well. Right.
They were entirely concerned with the slave labor aspect. It's
not like they were working on people's quality of life.
And I got to say, you know, I'm surprised that
this kind of thing has not been more widely reported
(27:45):
or has not happened more often because it's clearly unethical,
but it would have to be effective. You know, the
mosquitoes just get in everywhere. They're ubiquitous.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Well, we know it is effective from the way the
Japanese used it on the Chinese, which With those insane
numbers of casualties, I think we said in the neighborhood.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Of half a million. Yeah, 440,000.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
So I guess, knock wood, thank our lucky stars that
this hasn't been used more because it just sounds like
an absolute terror. I mean, even the testing in Savannah,
can you imagine having that many bitey mosquitoes dropped on
you during the heat of summer? And all of a sudden, like,
where are these clouds of, you know, insects coming from?
It sounds like a biblical plague.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Yeah. Yeah, and Savannah already has an atomic bomb resting
in the water off the coast. Yeah, man, they can't
get a break. They can't get a break. I have
to ask you guys. Okay, so, Noel, you have what
they in the South call sweet blood. Yeah. Right? Because
mosquitoes bite you. They love me. Casey, what about you?
Are bugs a fan of your blood? Unfortunately, yes, they are. Wow. Well,
(28:46):
maybe you guys should incorporate some garlic onions. But I
eat a lot of garlic and onions. Grapefruit. Do I
have to rub it on my actual body? Yes. While
intoning the phrase, bugs, bugs, go away. Drink my blood
another day. All right. I'll remember that for next time.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
And you folks, for next time, remember to check us
out on Facebook.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
Our group is called The Ridiculous Historians. You can be
a member.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
All you got to do is invoke my name, Casey's name,
Ben's name, all three, or just make a funny joke
that makes us laugh.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Yeah, give me a T-shirt idea, too, if it's a
good T-shirt. Wow, that sounds harsh. I promise if you
send a good T-shirt idea or even one that we
don't end up using, That's not grounds for rejection.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
And those sweet t-shirt ideas may or may not end
up in our TeePublic store, teepublic.com slash ridiculous history, where
you can buy all kinds of ridiculous swag, including... the
brand new Casey on the Case childhood modeling photo t-shirt
that to me looks like some kind of cool indie rock,
like Dinosaur Jr.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Sonic Youth shirt.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
I am actually, I've got one packed in my bag
for my upcoming trip, and I plan to rock it
all over New York City.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
They did a fantastic job with that one. Also, Casey,
by the way, huge thanks again for letting us do that.
I know I bugged you for a while.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
No, I love how it turned out. So, yeah, all's
well that ends well. So get you one of those shirts.
If you don't want to do that, which you should,
you can check us out on Instagram. Me and Ben
exist independently of the show. I am at HowNowNoelBrown.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
I post, you know, My stories are fun.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
You can check me out hanging out with my kid,
eating a lot of fancy foods at different eateries around
town in the United States.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
And Ben, you're on there too, aren't you? The rumors
are true. You can find me on Instagram, getting kicked
into and out of various countries. I am at Ben
Bolin there. And you can find me on Twitter, hot
takes left and right. I am at Ben Bolin, H-S-W-L-E.
We want to give a huge, huge thanks, of course,
to you, super producer Casey Pegram, to you folks listening,
(30:51):
and also to Alex Williams, who composed our track. Yeah,
Gabe Luger, our research associate and friend. Christopher Asiotis, here
in spirit as always. Jonathan Strickland, the quiz star. I'm
starting to warm up to his antics a little bit.
It is his birthday today as we record. HBD, Jay Strick. Yeah,
I just walked by, shot him a little finger gun
and said, Happy New Year, bro. I'll shoot him a
different finger when I walk by. Okay, I feel like
(31:13):
you might. But it will accompany birthday wishes. So let
us know what you think about these strange sorts of experiments,
not just entomological warfare, but also the use of animals
in war in general. We have never done what would
be a lighthearted and delightful episode on animals who got
(31:33):
military ranks. No. That's just adorable. Okay, we got to
do that. We got to do that one. And if
you want to send us those recommendations, you can write
to us at ridiculous at iheartradio.com. See you next time, folks.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Fellow Ridiculous historians, as we're wrapping up this week of
celebratory classics for Labor Day, we've got to tell you,
there is a story we ran into in our sister show,
Stuff They Don't Want You to Know, about cyber cockroaches.
Remember that one? Yeah. It was odd, right?
Speaker 2 (00:20):
They were technically designed to be deployed to find survivors
amidst rubble. But then there was talk of them being
able to also inject people with things.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
That one threw me a little bit. It seemed like
those features exist at cross purposes.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
They were also pretty vague about what could be injected.
They just kept using the word injectables. Injectables.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Which is not very reassuring. You're talking about train spotting here? Exactly. We,
we were, we were, Both startled, I think, in a
bit of synchronicity to learn that after we had reported
the latest news on cyber cockroaches, this story from 2019
popped up on our radar. Folks, it turns out that
(01:06):
multiple governments have been trying to turn insects into soldiers
for like decades. And why not, Ben? That's what I say.
Why not?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
We are on a bit of a run with a
little break in between for Yasuke of odd soldiers. I
suppose in feudal Japan, Yasuke would have been considered an
odd soldier.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
Oh, yes, very much so. And check this one out.
We can't wait to hear your thoughts. Be kind to
your local insects, even if bugs aren't your cup of tea.
And do tune in next week when we're going to
get into some even more weird war stuff. Backpack nukes
at Matahari. Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome
(02:16):
to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thanks so much for tuning in.
My name is Ben, and I got to tell you,
something's bugging me. My name is Noel the Big Buzz Brown.
Is that what they call you? Oh, no, they call
me that. Who are they? You know, the royal they. Oh, good.
The editorial they. We're also joined by our super producer,
(02:39):
Casey the Big Itch Pegram. How's it going, Casey? Scratching
away over here, I guess. It's that summertime in Georgia, man.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
And, you know, when you realize, too, part of the
story is the government actually dumping more mosquitoes into Georgia.
That's when you realize how truly callous and cruel the
American government can be.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Yeah, I'll take the name Ben Dropkick Bolin. And it
is true. The thing that's specifically bugging me today is
just the heat walking to work. But we are talking
about bugs. We're talking about entomology. We're talking about warfare.
We're talking about bug wars. That sounds pretty cool. Yeah,
(03:22):
literal bug wars, right? So, Noel, what are you talking about?
People were dropping mosquitoes into Georgia? That's one of them.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
That was Operation Big Buzz, which in the 1950s, the
Army put more than 300,000 mosquitoes uninfected mosquitoes into bombs
and then drop them onto the unsuspecting population of Savannah, Georgia.
And this was a test for something that the government
was working on on a much larger scale, the weaponization
(03:54):
of insects. We'll get into the specifics of each of
these operations. But for now, Ben, what the hell is
the weaponization of insects? Let's backtrack a little bit. Sure.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
It's a form of biological warfare that You know, it's
something that a lot of engineers have said before in
the past. People can make things that are pretty good
in terms of technology. But when it comes to the
natural results of evolution, Mother Nature tends to make pretty
great stuff. So why would we go back and try
(04:24):
to build tiny, tiny machines and weapons of our own
when we could just use the existing creatures? insects.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, we know that various versions of weaponizing animals have
gone varying ways, you know, dolphins, tiny bat bombs, you know,
that on Japan, the idea that the bats would deploy
into eaves of homes and then these incendiary devices would
go off and burn down Japan.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
That didn't work out so well.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
This story that we're talking about today, the weaponization of insects,
has had varying.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Degrees of success in various different cultures, not only ours.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
But here's the thing. So the turn of the 20th century,
human beings in general started figuring out that insects carry diseases.
The term is vectors. They were vectors for diseases. There
is a professor at the University of Wyoming who explained
it as such in the Casper Star Tribune, a gentleman
by the name of Jeff Lockwood. He says– Quote, the Japanese, French, Germans, English,
(05:27):
and the United States all had entomological disease programs active
during the golden years of 1930 to 1970. And that
includes a Japanese World War II program. The name of
that program was Unit 731.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Unit 731 was the Japanese government's World War II analog
to the horrific human experimentation that took place under the
Nazi regime during the Holocaust. So Unit 731 is a very,
very dark thing. It's not ridiculous, but do be aware
(06:02):
that it exists. Essentially, Unit 731 engaged in tremendously horrific,
unethical human experimentation. There are sickening stories that are all
true and that are worse than fiction. You can learn
more about these evil science experiments. I do not use
(06:23):
the word evil lightly. by searching online. There are, of course,
numbers of books here. They were doing stuff like studying
hypothermia by submerging people's limbs in water until the arm
or leg is frozen solid and ice formed over it,
and then striking them with canes. They were essentially vivisecting people,
conducting surgery on them while they were alive, starving them,
(06:46):
burning them, infecting them with various diseases.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
And part of it was their weaponization of insects wherein
they sprayed fleas from low-flying airplanes, and these fleas were
infected with cholera. And according to the Boston Globe, in
another piece that Lockwood contributed to, these deaths could have
exceeded that of both Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined, those bombings.
(07:15):
At least 440,000 Chinese were killed using these plague-infected fleas.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
That number comes from an international symposium of historians in 2002.
So relatively speaking, it's pretty recent. And think about that number,
440,000 people. Japan, we should say as well, is the
only country in history that has verifiably used plague. bugs
(07:45):
in war. Other countries have experimented with it. Spoiler alert,
one of them being the good old U.S. of A.
In fact, we experimented with this not once, but multiple
times in a very short time span in the 1950s, right?
Because we said there's a golden age from the 1930s
to the 70s. In the U.S., we had not one,
(08:08):
but three huge operations, weaponizing insects, In the mid-1950s, and
it's fascinating stuff. The first one where Casey Pegram took
his nickname for today is Operation Big Itch, which also
used fleas, right? They took a page from the Japanese
government there.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Yes, and we have, thanks to the lovely folks at
The Smoking Gun, have a document that catalogs several of
these programs, one of which has been entirely redacted. But
we do have a little bit of information about that
one from some other sources. But according to Section 1
of a document called The History of In-Field Testing in
the U.S., Operation Big Itch took place in 1954 and
(08:48):
was a series of trials, of tests, that were conducted
using fleas loaded into E-14 munitions with what's described as
cardboard and sponge inserts. The idea was that the bugs
would be dropped from altitudes of between 305 and 610
meters over a testing area called the Dugway Proving Ground
(09:11):
in Utah. The idea was to investigate the the viability
of the munitions used here and how effective they would
be in disseminating what's referred to very scientifically as these
arthropod vectors.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
Right, exactly. This specifically was the tropical rat flea or
Xenopsila chopis. The logic here is pretty sound, right? The
waves of death known collectively as the Black Plague came
from fleas. They're very, very good for transmitting diseases quickly.
Big Itch showed a lot of promise, but it also
(09:48):
had some problems. So they were loaded into these munitions,
dropped from the air, as you said, up to, what,
610 meters. They used a couple of different bombs. The
E-14 bomb and the E-23 bomb, which they could cluster
into a kind of a Voltron arrangement called the E-86
(10:09):
cluster bomb or the E-77. Without getting too in the
weeds on these abbreviations and numbers, just know that the
E-14 was designed to hold 100,000 fleas, and the E-23
was designed to hold 200,000 fleas. The E-23 was the
worst performer. Over half of the bombs failed. They didn't
(10:30):
meet their expectations. They malfunctioned during, this is the worst part,
they malfunctioned during testing. On the plane, right? Yeah, and
the fleas were released into the aircraft where they attacked
the pilot, the bombardier, and an observer. Someone was just
sitting there, you know, As a bystander. So they imagine
you're about to launch a bomb of fleas and the
(10:52):
bomb goes off in the plane. That's exactly what happens.
And this, by the way, comes from a great book
called Weapons of Mass Destruction, an Encyclopedia of Worldwide Policy,
Technology and History by James J. Wirtz.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Next, we have Operation Big Buzz, which was in 1955.
And this was an experiment that the Georgia centric one
that we mentioned earlier in the show. It was a
field test that was trying to figure out the, I
don't know, the viability again of actually breeding and then
housing and then loading up into bombs and ultimately, you know,
(11:30):
scattering these across the land. Yellow fever infected mosquitoes.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
Yeah. Yeah. Over 300,000, right? It gets even crazier.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Than that, right?
Speaker 1 (11:39):
So they did these tests.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
In Savannah, Georgia, where they released 330,000 Aedes aegypti mosquitoes,
which are known vectors for yellow fever. And they did
this by dropping them on Georgia parks all throughout Savannah.
And they were kind of released out into suburbs as well.
And the idea was that they would see how many
(12:07):
reports came in of citizens being being bitten, and they
would kind of be able to tell how effective this
was as a means of dispersing this disease.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Not the best methodology. When's the last time you contacted
the government because a mosquito attacked you? These mosquitoes, by
the way, thankfully, were not actually infected with yellow fever
for the purposes of this test. But it's pretty insane
(12:38):
to think that they said, okay, let's just drop this
off and see what happens. See who is so concerned
about mosquitoes that they call us. They were also dropping
these from the same bombs in the Big Itch, the
E14 bombs. So they clearly thought that there was some
promise for this. In total, I think it was 1
(13:00):
million female mosquitoes they bred for the testing. At least
according to Public Health Issues Disaster Preparedness. That's a real...
Very sexy acronym. Yeah, super creative. Oh, that would be FIDIP.
Now that is pretty cool sounding. FIDIP. That comes from
John Marr and Lloyd Novick over at FIDIP.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
I think that's why I like acronyms so much, because
the sound of the acronym is usually infinitely more fascinating
and intriguing than when you actually name out the individual words.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
It's a little easier to remember, too, because it's a mnemonic.
So what happened with the yellow fever run through or
rehearsal there in Savannah? Well, I mean, it was annoying, right? Right.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
I mean, it was literally like, you know, Georgia, Savannah
in particular, is a swampy kind of breeding ground for
mosquitoes anyway. Can you imagine just unleashing that on your
own people? I mean, sure, they weren't infected with the
actual disease, right? But they were still infected. essentially doing
military tests on their own citizens, right?
Speaker 1 (14:06):
And there was even more subterfuge because we found that
government officials disguised themselves as healthcare professionals to monitor the population.
So that's how they were getting, just to clarify, that's
how they were intending to get feedback. That's pretty gross, man.
It's definitely unethical. And with the results there, Would we
(14:28):
say that that was a success? Because the idea, again,
was they would drop them, and the test was going
to be whether the mosquitoes could survive the drop and
then seek food on the ground, right? Seek blood.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Yeah. What they determined was that the female mosquitoes actively
sought blood meals from humans and guinea pigs, which is
what they were described as in the report.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Right.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
And that some of the mosquitoes were collected as far
as four-tenths of a mile from the target release site. So, yes,
it was absolutely effective. They could get into homes, you know.
I mean, if they were infected with this deadly disease,
it would have been an absolute bloodbath, no pun intended,
or maybe pun intended.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
What do I know? Yeah, I mean, absolutely. This seems
ridiculous now, but it had enormous potential for destruction, so
much so that that after releasing these Aedes aegypti mosquitoes,
the U.S. government said, I really think we're on to something. Okay,
maybe big itch was just a good starting point for us.
(15:31):
And the big buzz showed some promise. So, hey, guys,
it's 1956. We're living in the future. Let's do this
one more time. What do you say for old time's sake?
Fun is what I say. So that gives us one.
Speaker 2 (15:45):
Of the more shadowy operations known as Operation Dropkick, which
I believe was your.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Nom de plume in this episode, right, Ben? Yeah, I
have a very lazy fighting style. I just sort of
put my foot up and then it drops. Yeah, exactly.
It's very effective on shoes. Yeah, well, it's kind of
an MMA style. It's like an MMA move. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
So this was kind of similar to these other operations,
but had some pretty important distinctions. This took place in
1956 when this is the Chemical Corps.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
Isn't that right? Isn't that what conducted this operation? Yep.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Which is an organization I was not familiar with. Tell
us a little bit about the Chemical Corps, Ben.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Sure. The Chemical Corps is the branch of the U.S. Army.
The official stories, they specifically work on defense against nuclear weapons, chemical,
biological weapons. You'll hear people say that for most of
its history, the Chemical Corps was actually tasked with delivering
these weapons instead of defending against them. And you'll hear
(16:46):
that because it's true. Right. Exactly.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
So they conducted Operation Dropkick when they released 600,000 uninfected
mosquitoes onto a bombing range in Avon Park, Florida.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Yes, that's right. And their methodology was improving. They were
able to track these mosquitoes a little bit better. They
were able to come up with an estimate of how
many entered houses and bit people. And they also found
that they could deliver them through a couple of different
devices or methods. In this case, they were released from helicopters, right?
(17:24):
And people in Avon Park, still some of them remembered this.
You know, they were old enough to be conscious of
these things happening. And they reported that mosquitoes weren't the
only things released. There is a Avon Park resident named
Beatrice Peterson, who wasn't aware of the mosquito releases because
(17:44):
there are already mosquitoes in Florida. But she did recall
that a ton of screw worm flies were released in
the mid to late 1950s when she was 14.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
I think. Yeah. And she describes them as being dropped
from little boxes out of these helicopters and that they'd
see them at school and the boxes would open up
and the flies would be dispersed.
Speaker 1 (18:05):
And here's the thing.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Avon Park in Florida was a prominently black neighborhood and
prominently lower income. And a lot of folks actually got
sick because of this. And I believe a handful actually died.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
Yeah. And we shouldn't skip over that because it is
true that in many of the illegal experiments that the U.S.
conducted domestically, they focused on marginalized communities because they thought
they could get away with it. There would at the
very least be less legal trouble or less possibility. So
the big question is, what would have happened if these
(18:41):
insects were carrying disease? The answer is clearly a public
health disaster would have been possible, would have been in
the cards, you know, a yellow fever outbreak. So they
found that in theory, unlike the bat bomb or the
cyborg cat, which are both real things, this weaponization of
insects had some sand to it. It could actually work.
(19:04):
And although the three experiments we outlined occurred in the 1950s,
that doesn't mean that the U.S. Army called it quits.
We have evidence that shows they were interested in it
even more recently, right?
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Yeah, we have some documentation that shows that up until
as recently as the 1980s, 81 in fact, there's a
report on entomological warfare that piggybacks off of the research
that was done at that Dugway Proving Ground in Utah.
And the study actually looks more at how we could
(19:35):
defend ourselves against attacks being done on U.S. soil by
infected mosquitoes with yellow fever. And according to the report,
it noted that U.S. intelligence information indicated that Warsaw Pact
nations have attempted to develop this capability, and it also
looks at cost estimates of what the fallout from these
(19:59):
kinds of attacks might be. So this isn't necessarily looking
at doing the research and developing these techniques ourselves, but
more guarding against it. in the case of attacks from
other nations outside of America.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Right. And this leads us into a bit of conspiratorial
speculation here. We've heard of the Zika virus, right? Remember,
that was in the news a lot. So the Zika
virus is a disease transmitted primarily by these mosquitoes that
we mentioned earlier. Symptoms can be mild and include fever, rash, conjunctivitis, muscle,
(20:33):
joint pain, malaise, a headache. It's 2019, man. I feel
like most people have malaise of some sort nowadays. But
it can pose great dangers. It can be particularly dangerous
to unborn children. It can cause infants to be born
with a number of deleterious conditions. But some people will
(20:57):
tell you that the Zika virus is an offshoot of
the U.S. Army's EW or Entomological Warfare Program because in
the 1930s, This mosquito, Aedes aegypti, was found in every
country in South and Central America, throughout the Caribbean, and
even here in the southeastern United States. And then it
came with, you know, it came with all the diseases
(21:19):
that this creature usually carries. Yellow fever, dengue fever, also
called breakbone, and now Zika. So people were working to
eradicate this troublesome creature, which was occurring naturally. It's not
like Peru was bombing Brazil with these or something. In 1958,
Brazil successfully eradicated the mosquito and was working to eradicate
(21:41):
it not just from its own country, but from the
rest of the hemisphere. This was going to be the
culmination of decades of work. And unfortunately, even while the U.S.
was funding eradication efforts in South America, it was still
secretly raising colonies of millions of these mosquitoes to use
(22:01):
as weapons. So it was kind of shooting ourselves in
the foot, robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Speaker 2 (22:06):
It seems like it got out of hand really quickly.
And a lot of this research really makes me think,
is the U.S. responsible for how many mosquitoes ended up, like,
in the South?
Speaker 1 (22:16):
They had to, mosquitoes already naturally occurred. No, I know that.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
But I'm just saying, like, when you dump that many
more on top of an already thriving population.
Speaker 1 (22:25):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not going to double down
on that. Great time to be a bird.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
Ooh, that's Because I was just thinking like already in
the summer here in Atlanta, I'm already covered in mosquito
bites and I haven't been spending that much time outside.
So they definitely are able to infiltrate homes and get
inside and get at those those blood bags that are
human beings.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
I hear you can modify your diet. I don't know
if it's true such that mosquitoes won't find you tasty. Really? Yeah. Yeah.
You will hear people say that there are a couple
of different what they call mosquito repellent foods, garlic and onions.
That's not a problem. Apple cider vinegar, lemongrass, chili peppers, grapefruit,
which I am not going to eat. Not a grapefruit fan. No,
(23:06):
I hate it. Really? Hate it. Not even like in
a little cocktail, like a little grapefruit and vodka? Grapefruit
is an injustice that shall not stand. Interesting. I used
to not like it either.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
The ruby red I find a little bit more palatable
than the regular old grapefruit.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
I think it was because when I was in Boy Scouts,
One summer in the middle of nowhere, we were stranded
in a place where the only thing to drink was
water or this rancid grapefruit juice. So that was my
first success. Yeah, I just can't do it. Got it.
I fully support everyone who enjoys grapefruit. Just don't make
(23:41):
me participate. No, that's fine. To each his own.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
I also heard a thing about mosquitoes that if you
flick them off before they've fully had a chance to
do their dirty work, it itches more.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Because there's some kind of antibody or something they inject
into the bite after they've finished that makes it, like,
less itchy.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Kind of like the little Cheez-Its you get if you
donate blood. Exactly.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
It's just like that. I'm not even going to bother
confirming whether this is true or not. I just choose
to believe it is true. But what we definitely know
is true is there is a precedent for this kind
of research, and we alluded to it earlier in the show.
But in 1941, Heinrich Himmler was ordered to create a
research station, a laboratory that was based out of the
concentration camp at Dachau under the command of the Nazi SS.
(24:31):
And that was to focus on studying diseases with the
goal of protecting the Germans. But some new reports from
the University of Tübingen, an ecologist by the name of
Klaus Reinhardt, indicate that they were actually working on offensive
biological warfare programs as well.
Speaker 1 (24:50):
Yeah, just like the U.S. Chemical Corps. You know, they
say it's for defense or research, but it turns out
the potential for weaponizing this stuff is just too promising.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Yeah, so under the 1925 Geneva Protocol, Hitler wasn't allowed
to use chemical or biological weapons during World War II. But,
you know, like we say, we can on paper say, yeah,
of course, we're going to follow the rules of engagement.
But behind closed doors, he had folks working around the
clock to study the same thing that we're talking about
(25:24):
in the United States, weaponization of mosquitoes and fleas.
Speaker 1 (25:28):
Right. And as Klaus Reinhart points out, reading through the
details of the research seems to indicate that there was
a nother research program, a classified project codenamed Dormaus, or
can you give it a shot in German?
Speaker 2 (25:46):
How about Siebenschlafer or Schlefer?
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Because it's got the umlaut over the A, so that
makes it an E sound.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
Schlefer.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
I'm glad you're here. We found this in a Smithsonian article.
This title is golden. Nazi scientists wanted to use mosquitoes
to send diseases behind enemy lines.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Yeah, and that's by Colin Schultz. And it goes through
this research material that we discussed. And some of the
wording in these documents is what indicates there may have
been a parallel program. So we don't necessarily know this
for a fact or have confirmation, but there is some indication. Again,
according to Reinhart, the wording, he says, in the German
(26:24):
documents suggests that they knew that there was a planned
release of mosquitoes.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Yeah, exactly. So. There's a report dated in September of 1944,
September the 23rd. And in this report, they have some
what we call weasel words. They've got some wiggle room.
They say they're carrying out research, quote, in order to
clarify the question whether an artificial mass infection of the
(26:52):
malaria parasite onto humans is possible and how one can
counter an action that aims at such mass infection. So
the idea here is, Ultimately, we're learning how to protect
ourselves against weaponized bugs. And the way we're going to
do that is to weaponize some bugs and infect a
ton of people with malaria.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
And then a pretty solid cover story is that they
were doing this research to prevent plague outbreaks in the
concentration camps with already weakened, you know, prisoners.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Of war that were used basically as slave labor. So
that was an important quality of this research as well. Right.
They were entirely concerned with the slave labor aspect. It's
not like they were working on people's quality of life.
And I got to say, you know, I'm surprised that
this kind of thing has not been more widely reported
(27:45):
or has not happened more often because it's clearly unethical,
but it would have to be effective. You know, the
mosquitoes just get in everywhere. They're ubiquitous.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Well, we know it is effective from the way the
Japanese used it on the Chinese, which With those insane
numbers of casualties, I think we said in the neighborhood.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Of half a million. Yeah, 440,000.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
So I guess, knock wood, thank our lucky stars that
this hasn't been used more because it just sounds like
an absolute terror. I mean, even the testing in Savannah,
can you imagine having that many bitey mosquitoes dropped on
you during the heat of summer? And all of a sudden, like,
where are these clouds of, you know, insects coming from?
It sounds like a biblical plague.
Speaker 1 (28:24):
Yeah. Yeah, and Savannah already has an atomic bomb resting
in the water off the coast. Yeah, man, they can't
get a break. They can't get a break. I have
to ask you guys. Okay, so, Noel, you have what
they in the South call sweet blood. Yeah. Right? Because
mosquitoes bite you. They love me. Casey, what about you?
Are bugs a fan of your blood? Unfortunately, yes, they are. Wow. Well,
(28:46):
maybe you guys should incorporate some garlic onions. But I
eat a lot of garlic and onions. Grapefruit. Do I
have to rub it on my actual body? Yes. While
intoning the phrase, bugs, bugs, go away. Drink my blood
another day. All right. I'll remember that for next time.
Speaker 2 (29:04):
And you folks, for next time, remember to check us
out on Facebook.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
Our group is called The Ridiculous Historians. You can be
a member.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
All you got to do is invoke my name, Casey's name,
Ben's name, all three, or just make a funny joke
that makes us laugh.
Speaker 1 (29:18):
Yeah, give me a T-shirt idea, too, if it's a
good T-shirt. Wow, that sounds harsh. I promise if you
send a good T-shirt idea or even one that we
don't end up using, That's not grounds for rejection.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
And those sweet t-shirt ideas may or may not end
up in our TeePublic store, teepublic.com slash ridiculous history, where
you can buy all kinds of ridiculous swag, including... the
brand new Casey on the Case childhood modeling photo t-shirt
that to me looks like some kind of cool indie rock,
like Dinosaur Jr.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Sonic Youth shirt.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
I am actually, I've got one packed in my bag
for my upcoming trip, and I plan to rock it
all over New York City.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
They did a fantastic job with that one. Also, Casey,
by the way, huge thanks again for letting us do that.
I know I bugged you for a while.
Speaker 2 (30:07):
No, I love how it turned out. So, yeah, all's
well that ends well. So get you one of those shirts.
If you don't want to do that, which you should,
you can check us out on Instagram. Me and Ben
exist independently of the show. I am at HowNowNoelBrown.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
I post, you know, My stories are fun.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
You can check me out hanging out with my kid,
eating a lot of fancy foods at different eateries around
town in the United States.
Speaker 1 (30:28):
And Ben, you're on there too, aren't you? The rumors
are true. You can find me on Instagram, getting kicked
into and out of various countries. I am at Ben
Bolin there. And you can find me on Twitter, hot
takes left and right. I am at Ben Bolin, H-S-W-L-E.
We want to give a huge, huge thanks, of course,
to you, super producer Casey Pegram, to you folks listening,
(30:51):
and also to Alex Williams, who composed our track. Yeah,
Gabe Luger, our research associate and friend. Christopher Asiotis, here
in spirit as always. Jonathan Strickland, the quiz star. I'm
starting to warm up to his antics a little bit.
It is his birthday today as we record. HBD, Jay Strick. Yeah,
I just walked by, shot him a little finger gun
and said, Happy New Year, bro. I'll shoot him a
different finger when I walk by. Okay, I feel like
(31:13):
you might. But it will accompany birthday wishes. So let
us know what you think about these strange sorts of experiments,
not just entomological warfare, but also the use of animals
in war in general. We have never done what would
be a lighthearted and delightful episode on animals who got
(31:33):
military ranks. No. That's just adorable. Okay, we got to
do that. We got to do that one. And if
you want to send us those recommendations, you can write
to us at ridiculous at iheartradio.com. See you next time, folks.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Ridiculous History News
Hosts And Creators
Ben Bowlin
Noel Brown
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