September 22, 2026 • 42 mins
The 2000 thriller Romeo Must Die features questions of race and loyalty, a hint of romance and plenty of action - including a memorable game of football. Let's throw it back and chat about this classic movie.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Annie.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
And Samantha.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
And welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told You, a production
of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
And welcome to another Feminist Movie Tuesday. Yes, y'all, we
are crazy busy at this point in time.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
A little more so than usual. Not only because.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Labor Day was later than usual, like on a different day.
That pushed us back a little bit. But we're also
prepping to be gone for a couple of weeks, including
a voyage, which if you haven't heard about it, you
should go look it up. Virginvoyages.com slash stuff. Because, yeah,
you can get more information. Anyway, but because of that,
our schedule is kind of hectic and a little different.
(00:53):
So bear with us because we're trying to get all
these fresh new episodes out still at the same time
as we are planning ahead.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
So, yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
A little bump in the road. We're all about flexibility.
And even more flexible about how we're looking at movies.
And I will say, before anything, that for those of
you who saw the title, you probably already know, we
are putting it in our feminist movie series.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
I wouldn't call this a feminist movie. But more of
one that's, like, nostalgic. Nostalgic.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Because I love it. And for some reason, I needed
Annie to see some of these movies that just gave
me joy in my young years. So we are talking
about the 2000 hit Romeo Must Die, an action movie
that was very, very, very loosely based on Romeo and Juliet. However,
(01:50):
in this tale, we have Jet Li, yes, playing Romeo,
Romeo-ish character, I guess, Han Han. And then we have
the R & B legend Aaliyah playing the Juliet character
Trish O'Day. There is a lot to be said about
this movie, both good and bad. Also, I was already
saying this. I don't think this would pass the Bechdel test.
(02:12):
It might, just because Aaliyah's character talks to a co-worker
who is a woman, and they seem to be friends.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
And they show off their dance moves.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
It's a very brief moment, but it is indeed a moment.
It is.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
So it kind of passes. And then that's about it.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Yeah, so the movie has a pretty interesting cast, including
Delroy Lindo from Sinners and so many more. Isaac O'Day,
the father or the leader. Controversial actor Isaiah Washington as Mac.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
DMX as club owner Silk.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
And when I'm talking about DMX, I'm talking about Rough Rider, rapper.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
DMX. Anyway, but he was in the.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
Movie as club owner Silk, Henry Oh as Choo Sing,
my crush from back in the day, I've talked about
him many a times actually, Russell Wong as Kai, and
Anthony Anderson, yes, Anthony Anderson, as Maurice. He was kind
of the comedic character of it all. Though the critics,
they were not a fan of this movie. They were like, no,
I think Robert and Ebert put it at 1.5 out
(03:17):
of 5.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Of course.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
It was very low.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
The movie did pretty well in the box office, coming
out as number two on its debut behind Erin Brockovich.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
That was that era.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
And made $ 91 million worldwide. And the album, well, the
album is amazing. It has tracks like A Try Again
and others by Aaliyah, which remains as one of my faves.
As in fact, I've been trying to find a Zumba
choreography to that one. I'll get it there. I'm almost there.
The movie was Aaliyah's debut. She would come out and
(03:54):
do Queen of the Damned, but actually died before the
production finished. And I believe they had to kind of
like rearrange some things because of her untimely death.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
This was Jet Li's second U.S. movie. The first one
was being the villain in Lethal Weapon 4. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
So this was his like starring role. And this is
all at the same time as like Rush Hour Commit.
So we know Jackie Chan was really big already. And
Jet Li was making his debut in the U.S. as
the lead.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
He actually didn't know English, which is kind of noticeable.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
He had some interesting line deliveries, I have to say.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
They helped.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
They, like, they did a good job in helping him
with the enunciations and, like, you need to emphasize.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
This, so.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Yeah. Impressive.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So let's talk about plot.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
We open the scene very similar to the all-out brawl
in Romeo and Juliet, but this time it's in a club,
and it's the African-Americans versus Asian-American gangs, essentially. Apparently, there's
a gang war for waterfront properties. We have the son
of Chinese leader Poe, who is lavishly living it up
in this Black-owned club, causing a stir, is told to leave,
(05:05):
causing big problems. And enter his father's number one henchman, Kai,
who quickly shows off his martial arts skill.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
A lot of acrobatics.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
They really try to translate, like, the Crouching Tiger, that
kind of cinematics, into this movie. I don't know if
it translated really well, but.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
I loved it. Look, I loved it. I was okay
with it.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
But he shows off some moves and his skills. And
then enter DMX as Silk with his epic line, Guns
don't kill people.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
People kill people.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
As he's holding a machine gun, and then tells the
Asian people to get out. So that's, I love that line.
I will never forget that line. It's an amazing delivery.
After the disruption, we cut to the following morning to
see Poe had been killed.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
And from there, the plot begins.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
A war has been going on between the two gangs
over land and money. The two main families are working
on getting waterfront properties for the rich white people to
buy a new NFL franchise and build up a stadium.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
So they're going to make a lot of money in
doing this.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
As things heat up, there is unknown accusations about possible
foul play in the death of the son, Poe, who
did this.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Or was it the black gang who did this?
Speaker 3 (06:19):
We soon find out that there is a second son, Han,
who is the oldest, who had been in prison in
Hong Kong for crimes his father had committed. And after
learning the news of his brother's death, he escapes.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Even more martial arts, the first X-ray test. Yes. Scene,
which Annie, you loved. I know you loved.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
And by the way, apparently this was a Jet Li suggestion.
And I want to say it was Joe Silver who
was like, oh, yes. Oh, yes.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
I will get the money for you. We will get
this in there. He was very excited.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
Well, to the listeners who don't know.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
You don't know. You need to stop and go watch
it right now. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
It's where, like, say a kick just lands so solidly,
it will become, the visual will become an x-ray of
the person who has been kicked. And it will show
how it's, like, impacting their skeletal structure.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
So in that first scene, Jet Li breaks the dude's
arm by going underneath and breaking his forearm.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
And you can see the break because of the x-ray vision.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Yes. Yes. It might have been ahead of its time.
I know a couple of movies did this later.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
I think it was.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
This was a gently, it was like, we're going to
do this. And was very excited by this. And so
with all of that, he escapes to come to the U.S.
By the way, again, first role, film in English. So
having a lot of help. So we see him very stoic.
And that's why we see him a lot more stoic.
I think they didn't want to push him too far
(07:58):
with the dialogue.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
But he did a good job.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
We soon meet Trish, who is the daughter of O'Day
and has made sure to show her being someone who
disapproved of her father's business. Her brother actually was a
part of that business, working with the father, even though
she didn't like it. But she's very protective and loves
her brother. And was trying to be like, I'm just
worried about you.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
He's like, I know.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
Because of the current friction between the rival gangs, Trish
is given the security detail. enter Maurice again played by
Anthony Anderson and is the comic relief of it all
even calls her Aaliyah in one of the scenes.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Certain things you just can't take too seriously but I
was like this guy should have been fired ages ago
he's completely incompetent.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Well she does call him moron instead of Maurice quite
often it really gets under his skin you could tell
um Soon, we have Han and Trish crossing paths and
having an interesting meet-cute involving Han stealing a taxi cab.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
And picking Trish up.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Actually, Trish jumps into the cab trying to run away
from Maurice. And they have a whole thing back and
forth and a lot of little flirting happening. At one point,
he's like, are you scared? And she's like, I've known
scarier guys than you.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Real cute, like real cute.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
And then we see her saying, you know, I don't
want you to call me.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
I don't want you to call me because you drive
like s * * *.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
With a cute little wink. Her little wink is real
flirty there.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
After all this, we actually witness the death of her brother,
as well as the girlfriend, which they never mention again.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Oh, yeah. That's true.
Speaker 3 (09:43):
I always thought that was like, poor girl. Which now
brings Trish and Han together to figure out what exactly
is happening. All the while, the deal with the NFL
is going down. There seems to be a lot of
violence happening around the area, interestingly. We soon discover Isaac,
Trish's father, has bigger plans to become quote-unquote legitimate and
(10:04):
wanting to be a part of the ownership of the
NFL team. But uh-oh, it turns out his number one, Mac,
is no good and has actually been the one attacking
the Black community as well as the one who killed
his son.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Boom, boom, boom. After, um, He kidnaps Trish and Han.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
The whole thing goes down.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
A little cute little dance scene that happens with Trish
and Han, where Han is very uncomfortable and just standing
there staring, and Aaliyah's trying to get him to boogie. Literally,
that's the epitome of boogie to me.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Him just, like, arms going back and forth.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yep, she was doing a lot of the work there,
for sure.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
I mean, obviously, between the two of them, who's going
to be dancing? It's going to be him.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
We also have our, I did not mention the fight scene,
which actually became kind of one of the, I think.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
They were the first to honestly do it.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
I could be wrong, where he has a woman fight
for him, but he uses her as the weapon to
fight a woman because he couldn't hit a woman.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Yeah. I mean, Aaliyah is great at that. If somebody
tried to do that with my body... It would be
a disaster for everyone involved.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
I'll just be crumbling. Me too. Me too.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
I will say they did take that and put it
in the Try Again video.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Very cute video. I love that video.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
One of my favorite songs of the whole forever.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Anyway, so all of that goes down.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
And during that point, they get kidnapped by Mac and
his crew because he comes and.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Kills Silk to get the property. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
At this point, he brings him back to confront Isaac
and to tell him he wants his money.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
He doesn't want a part of the NFL. He wants money.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
We see Maurice and crew try to get rid of Han,
but of course, he doesn't. And Han gets away and
comes to help Trish and Isaac and chases down Mac,
who says the line, I'm sorry, Romeo, but you gotta die.
But into Trish, who shoots him himself. So during this
whole confrontation, we found out that he has killed his son,
all these things. At the same time, when he asked
(12:05):
about Han confronted Mac, saying, why did you kill my brother?
Speaker 2 (12:09):
He's like, that was all in-house. We didn't do that.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Uh-oh. Soon we have a confrontation between Kai and Han,
who had been friends, or at least really, like, close,
because they had trained together. And they go into a
very excellent fight scene with the final X-ray scene, as
well as the fire circle that they are in.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
You gotta have that fire circle.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Hello.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
Give me some skin. That was one of the lines
in there that I was like, why? That has to
be a line, but okay.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
And of course, Kai loses the fight. Han then goes
to confront his father for killing his own son, who
takes his own life, rather than having to confront police.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Or having to be arrested, I guess.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
Then we get the end scene of Trish and Han
holding hands, with his burnt hands, by the way, which
I was very confused by.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
The entire time, and walking away. They're coming to check
in on him. Very cute.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
So for this movie, again, I'm going to do it
a bit differently since I wouldn't say this movie is
really a feminist take on anything. Maybe I'm wrong. Y'all
can come tell me. And there are themes here, of course,
of family, of loyalty, classism. I guess since there was
a scene with Trish, again, with a worker there, again,
passing the Bechdel test.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
But I want to talk.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
About why I love this movie as well as why
there's some problems with this movie. And I did find
some really good articles talking about what this type of
movie kind of represented in that era. And then we're
going to have a quote at that at the end.
But before I get into that, Annie, I need your review.
I need your review on A Childhood Love of Mine,
(13:57):
one of my old school favorites.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
What were your thoughts? Oh, my.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Well, I had loosely heard of this movie and I
thought I did think it was going to be like
violence between two different families like Romeo and Juliet I
thought it was going to be much more serious I
thought it was going to be like super serious and
violent and that's why you almost got so many texts
(14:24):
from me that were just quotes out of context they're
playing football.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
Now I would have known I would have known.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
I think you would have it was fun I thought
it was really fun and I think I think when
we're going to talk about some of this stuff, but
some of it I was like really intrigued by. Some
of the like themes of like gentrification and like getting people,
especially people of marginalized communities to sell properties. Like there
(14:55):
were some themes I was like, you know, this is 2000,
but this still feels pretty relevant. But yeah, mostly I
thought it was pretty fun. And I did think it
was interesting too that like, I guess, traitors like Kai
and Mac. Although I bet people view Mac differently now.
(15:22):
Because his whole thing was like, you can't trust these
white guys, man. I just want the money. And it's
sort of like, he was sort of right. But he
was also a complete asshole who was forcing other... Because
a lot of the Black owners you see, they didn't
want to leave.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Right.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
And he was going to kill you. Right. That was it.
So I think it was interesting in terms of that.
It was kind of a fascinating turn of the millennium
movie that had some things that felt so... Like the
x-ray thing. It felt kind of like, oh, this was
of a very specific time. And then some things that
(16:05):
felt like, oh, this is still pretty relevant, actually. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
So.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Getting outside of that, when you start trying to dissect
the movie, it gets kind of like, ugh, fishy.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
But some of the things that I did.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Really love, and I think the reason I love it, again,
it's kind of not the same, but similar to my
love for the Brandy Cinderella movie, that it had.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Representation, whether it was good or bad.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
It was still a type of representation where an Asian
character was the lead, which was so rare. Again, though,
like it comes back to like, of course, if it's
a martial arts, kung fu, whatever movie, of course, typically,
you would expect it to be Asian lead, but that
wasn't happening all the time.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
And a lot of the Asian movies, if.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
It was, had white heroes. So this was one of
those moments that it didn't have that. And I was like, oh,
that's kind of a relief in this. Like it just
was as is. And just like you said, it was
not serious. Like it's It's absolutely, like, some of the
themes can be serious, but it was very glossed over,
which could be also a failure, and we can talk about,
(17:17):
we're going to talk about that in a minute, but, like,
it gave you just enough to understand things were happening
without being over the top. I will say, surprisingly, okay,
with the fact, we'll come back to the fact that
this was written by white men, this was directed by
white men, this was produced typically by white men, but
they didn't had a little more respectful in dialogue. They
(17:41):
didn't try to use hard N, hard N-R.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Like, in their movie. And I was actually, like, I
didn't have ever noticed that.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I mean, they still say, like, you know, terms to
themselves and, like, the Black community would use today, but
not to that effect, that you would hear, like, especially
if you think of, like, Quentin Tarantino really liberally using
it and excitedly using this type of term. I'm like,
at least they didn't do that.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
I'm like, oh, you know what? Okay. Okay. Did they
say things that felt a little racist? For sure. Not
a little.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Very racist? Yes. Yes.
Speaker 3 (18:13):
Like the Asian dude talking about Blacks, and I was like, oh,
I do not need you to say it like that.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Stop that. Stop that.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
So there's definitely like a level of like, still makes
me uncomfortable, but at least they didn't have them saying
these terms that feels like for so many of the
white writer's use it as a go, as a pass,
to be able to.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
So, like, I was relieved of that.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
I also loved that it did show Aaliyah in a
way of being vulnerable and not too sexualized. Like, they
didn't have her overtly being, like, you know, passed around
or any of that. Like, she was very strong and
steadfast and was an independent woman with a lot of
understanding and beliefs. And then you have a father, the
(19:01):
actual father, her father being... you know, not a great guy,
but trying his best and really trying to, you know,
be something for his family.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
That was nice to see. Like so many of.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
The, again, white writers really want to play on things
that you're like, you should not be talking about this.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
Stop this. So like all of that to say, it's like,
it is nice. It is nice to see in that.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
I think that's why, again, I liked it because it was,
there was still good guys, bad guys. But the good guys,
bad guys weren't your typical good guys, bad guys.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
You know what I mean? And I really, I really.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Appreciated that level. I really appreciated seeing coupling. So there
was a big debate about the fact. that apparently they
did test to see, audience test, to see Aaliyah's character
and Jet Li's character kiss, and it apparently did not
go well. And then one was like a hugging scene,
(20:03):
and it did not go well.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
So, but like.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
The same article we read about, we read a little
quote from, it's a Vulture article from 2021 talking about
this movie, that it was because it was written by
white men in a perspective that they themselves couldn't see
that happening. They themselves didn't understand that happening, whether it's
because they were emasculating an Asian man or so like
(20:28):
an emasculated Asian man with a sexualized black woman, you know,
which is their stereotype and understanding.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
Then it wasn't going to fit well.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
But I still, I think I did love the wholesomeness
of their relationship still.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
I think it made it even better for me.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
And I think a part of that is because there
was a huge age difference between them.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
And I was like, Aaliyah's been through enough. I knew
Aaliyah's background.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
And for those of y'all who don't know, Aaliyah became
a star at 14. The people knew who she was. R.
Kelly took advantage of that and actually married her. with
the permission of her parents, and then they got divorced
when she, I think, came of age. And there were
some indications and understanding that that was real off, obviously.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
We know where R.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Kelly is today. And so that was real off. Something
was really shady and really gross in that. And so
seeing him, who was 15 years older, I did not
need to see that between them two.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 3 (21:24):
It was already kind of a stretch to me with
their age difference to put them together.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
I was like, mm-hmm. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Because maybe because.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
Aaliyah was a year older than me and then I
knew his age, I was like, there's no way in
hell I would kiss him.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Because of the age difference. It's shady.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
And we know Hollywood does that a lot, but I
just really respected that level that you can think that
they may be together.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
But maybe they're just really good friends. Let them be
good friends.
Speaker 3 (21:55):
But their wholesomeness and just like their flirting, their innocence
in that flirting, like it was really, It was nice
to me. I thought this was a better way to go,
but I digress in that level. Again, this whole thing
is cheesy. And I love the cheesy.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I think that's why I.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
Love the old school Asian, not old school, but movies
like Crouching Tiger and then Hero. Hero was one of
my favorite movies because it's so gorgeous and it's so
wonderfully laid out.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
However, it is propaganda. It's coming as propaganda. I figured
that out later. I was like, oh, oh, my bad.
But it's so gorgeous. I really did love it.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
But I loved Jet Li, and I think this movie
was what made me love Jet Li and his characters
in this. Again, I loved Aaliyah on her own. So
having her, I probably would have loved her in everything.
Has she been able to continue in her career? Because
I love her. Like, she was up there with me
with Brandy. For some reason, these were people that I loved.
(22:59):
So all of those things were so wonderful.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Again, the music. When I hear that music, I see
the scenes. I can't help it.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
You know, in those movies, you hear it, you're like, oh,
there it is. And you start like, uh-huh, I need
to go back and watch it.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
That's the first thing.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
I have downloaded a lot of the songs. So I
love all of that. These were the things that I loved. Again,
a multiracial couple, the idea that it was okay and normal,
like nicely done. To me, not okay, normal, but, like,
it's not so unheard of here. The fact they had, again,
a story, not the greatest story that was centered on
(23:39):
non-white people.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
And also the white people were the villains here. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
And pretty obviously, pretty immediately.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Like, the way he said cheddar.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
What did they say?
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Cheddar.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I was like, oh, no. No, no, no, no.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
He needs to go. Well, just to have, like, a meeting...
On a golf course about buying waterfront property for NFL, like,
red flags abound.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
And I bet it happens that way.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Oh, I'm sure it does.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
More often than not.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
I am sure it does. But I have to tell you,
it was very clear from the get-go, these are not
the guys you want to be working with.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Don't trust these people. Never trust those, especially in white
polo shirts. Come on.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
Yeah. I mean, they cast them well. They had to look.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Yeah, they definitely did. They looked a little sleazy. No offense.
Then there are things that were problematic. Like, coming back
and looking at them, I'm like, oh, yeah, okay.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
This was written by, directed by, produced by white men
because it was for their entertainment. I will say Joel
Silver was quoted in saying that he was tired of
the regular action movies at the time. They thought he
was just all overdone and he wanted something completely different.
And he wanted to see people of color. He really
did say that being a part of the action movies. Again,
(25:04):
Rush Hour had been a huge hit, so this kind
of made sense. I think as they started bringing more
and more martial arts into it, you started seeing more
and more Asian people being a part of it. Of course, again,
they were all either villainized or they were over-sexualized. Definitely
just there for the martial arts, it seems.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
But nonetheless... It was coming.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
And I will say, I think he produced other movies
that starred Jet Li in DMX.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Cradle to the Grave. I remember watching this. I don't
know anything about it.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Yeah, haven't seen that one.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
It's been a minute.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
Because again, I loved Jet Li so much that I
watched all his stuff.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
I watched one with him and Jason Statham. I don't
recommend it.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Noted.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
Okay. Moving on.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
But like he, Joel Silver really did do this in
a perspective of like, we need change. So, you know,
give him credit to at least bringing it about. But again,
when you have one point of view and you don't
bring the people of color into this conversation that you're
trying to create, whether it's for good intentions or not,
you're going to have some problems.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
And it was very, again, it.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
Was very obvious whether we're talking about literally all Asians
know martial arts, right? That was, That was a joke
they put in there. But at the same time, apparently
they do.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Pretty well.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
As we saw it. As we saw it.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
The Black men are violent and use guns. That was
so over the top. The bad idea of being hip-hop.
I will cringe forever. The first time I saw it
to today about that scene where Aaliyah stops So I'm
going to say it with that. Trish stops Han to
(26:52):
be like, oh, we can't go into this black club
with you looking like that.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
And bro was wearing like a jacket, tucked in.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Polos, belted, like dad khakis, like not even like, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Just dad khakis and a hat.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
And so her fixing him was turning the hat backwards,
giving him some gum.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
And he kind of pulls the pants down. Not really.
I'm like, at least untuck your shirt, bro.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Nope.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
So that being the idea of hip-hop, I also, this
wasn't the bad part, but I did love the fact
that she was dancing to her own song.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
That made me laugh, too.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
In the club. That made me laugh, too. It's a hit, though.
So if you can, if she, if she's making hits
like that, she deserves to dance like that.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Or tries to get that one Asian dude in the
middle of the floor to try.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
To dance like that. She was doing her best.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
And he was not moving.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
He was just smiling.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I will say, I felt like his smiles were genuine
because he doesn't typically smile. And he was having the
time of his life. Some of the things that I've
read about that, it was that she had the best time.
She loved Russell Wong and she loved Jet Li. She
had such a good chemistry with all of them that
it was obvious. And every single one of them, even
(28:11):
before she had died, was saying she was going to
be huge. Like, her acting abilities are only going to grow.
And they really talked about how she blew it out
the water in getting these things done and just really
being excited for her. And this was even before all
of that. So it was really sad to see a
talent diminish that way, her dying so young. So all
(28:36):
that to say, but you can see Jet Li's cheesing
in the movie, and I think that's genuine.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Genuinely done.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
And I love everything about that. But again, you know,
having him putting on a backwards hat, trying to kind
of sag his pants, which, by the way, no one
else seemed to be doing, but whatever. Like, it seemed
kind of interesting in that route. We have the emasculating, again,
of Asian men, a part of the problem. Like, they
didn't really necessarily emasculate him, but they made sure to
(29:06):
keep him in his, like, you do martial arts.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
End of story. You're the action portion, and we're going
to move you on. He did, again, he did have
some good lines. During the football scene.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Oh, the football.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
Having the, y'all. Do you want to describe the football scene?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
When I was watching this.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
I'm trying to blend the martial arts to this.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
I thought, this is where Twilight got the idea. That
was one of my first thoughts.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
You might not be wrong.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
So at this point, Trish and Han have struck up
kind of a flirty relationship. We haven't talked about this yet,
but Mac has been being kind of forcefully flirty with Yeah.
With Trish and pretty much implying, like, I'm going to
(30:02):
have all the power and you're going to be with me.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
So, Mac sees Han sitting on a bench with her
and he's with his crew and they're playing football. And
he comes up to Han and is like, listen, we
need another player. It's going to be so easy. We're
going to go so easy on you. It's going to
be great. And, you know, Han is kind of like, oh,
I've never played this game. I don't know this game.
(30:26):
And they're like, no, no, no. And of course, they
basically don't tell him what's going to happen and just
kind of dive over him. And I think twice that happens.
And then one of them says, I think it's Maurice,
it's like, well, you're the one with the ball. That's
why you're always getting hit. And so Han's like, okay,
let's go again. And he throws the ball to each
(30:51):
of them and then uses that as an excuse to
use his martial arts skills. to take them down, like
the whole 11 people on the team. And very triumphant,
you know? He gets to the other end, spins the ball,
and it was like, great game, love it.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Literally, because the entire time they call each other brother,
he's like, brother!
Speaker 1 (31:18):
And all the kids that Trish was hanging out with,
genuinely she's with the younger kids because she kind of
has an after-school personality. mentoring vibe kind of thing that's
the coolest thing we've ever seen but he just bust
out martial arts in the middle of like football let's talk.
Speaker 3 (31:36):
About the fact that they're playing flag football in the
first place this mean tough game which maybe they do
my thought is like why aren't they playing basketball because
of the opening scene which by the way doesn't make
sense and we have like they the younger version of
Han and Po when they lived in China their children
are in the sea or water and apparently almost drowned,
(31:59):
they remain floating on a deflated basketball in China. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
And then come back.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
And then when he comes back for Poe's funeral and
all that, he finds the deflated basketball.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
Makes no sense whatsoever.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
It makes no sense whatsoever. That you're like, what? Wait, what?
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Maybe.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Yeah. Because I don't even think basketball is popular.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
as popular as other sports like baseball and soccer.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
So, like, it just kind of doesn't.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Quite hit.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Who knows? Maybe people in Hong Kong.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Maybe if you've been, I don't know, Annie, you kind
of know Chinese culture.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
I love Hong Kong. And you've been to Hong Kong.
Was there a lot of basketball?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Not that I witnessed. And I guess this came out
in 2000, so things.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Yes, you were a baby. Don't start with me.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
I was in Hong Kong in 2008, I think. I
didn't notice it. I know that baseball kind of got
a hold in Japan.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
It implies that they were in a small area in
Hong Kong for some reason. Maybe I just made that
up in my head. I.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
For some reason, maybe I've seen too many dramas about this,
but I thought that they were like immigrants and they
were like floating on the, this was how they were
surviving to make it to Hong Kong. I was very
confused by the whole thing also.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
Maybe, I may have missed something. I don't think so.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
No, I don't think you did. I think I was
trying to make it, I was trying to make sense
of it.
Speaker 3 (33:43):
Well, yeah, this level of like things that it doesn't,
like just kind of placed, and again, this is kind
of that unseriousness, but like they took a serious scene
and put something in there that doesn't make a lot
of sense that you start questioning why other than We're
going to correlate sports so that we can talk about
the Black community crossing.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Honestly, I'm trying.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
I'm really reaching here for that one. But there was
kind of an understanding of like, why is this happening?
Speaker 1 (34:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Why did we think this was the way? With that.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
I think like we do have the, again, the masculinity
of men outside of the, you know, karate, but you're
not really, you know, a sexual. And then over-sexualizing black men,
like both Mac and Maurice are so over the top
and flirting with all the women. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
That felt like a ridiculous stereotype that needed, that didn't
need to happen. It was just like, do we need that?
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Yeah. Maurice has like a scene where he tries to
remove a woman's headphones. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
I would, Well, that woman was ready to fight, too.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
She was ready to fight. Rightfully so.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
She was like, what are you doing?
Speaker 3 (35:02):
But it was a little over the top. It seemed
like the way they made sure, the way they wrote.
Maybe it's because they're the bad guys in this. In
order to know that they're the bad guys, you also
need to know, yes, they are going to. One of
the women's biggest fears is being.
Sexually harassed and sexually molested and sexually raped. So maybe
(35:25):
they were playing on that. I don't know, but it
seemed unnecessary.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Yeah, because especially in, like, Maurice's case, it was very comedic.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Unnecessary. Yeah, like, Mac was a little scary.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
And Maurice's is too, but it was played as more comedic.
Speaker 2 (35:44):
Yeah. It was seen for more comedic and an escape.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
Like, it was part of the escape, but, like, again, like,
doing something that's a harassment that's like over the crossing
boundaries so i felt like that was definitely written in
like white perspective of black villains um again it's a
bad writing for the for the black actors the african-american
actors i was like why are they doing this i
(36:08):
feel like they're doing it so over the top and
it was just random times because when you have the
conversations like with the father and with um the sun
it was just a very back and forth about business
and then i'll hold up now hold up though like
that kind of like overly like dramatic use of uh
ave that was like did they even i feel like
(36:34):
maybe it's dated and that's why it feels so clunky
but it just i think even back then i was
like who wrote this again the dmx line was so
ridiculous i was like what is happening I think a
little conversation, like making sure that we knew it was
Black-on-Black crime. Like, sure, they did have the white man
(36:54):
pulling the strings, but showing that Black people were really violent,
and it was Black-on-Black crime and Asian-on-Asian crime, and they.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Were the actual bad guys.
Speaker 3 (37:02):
They were actual, like, violent ones, not the white people. Yes,
white people didn't tell them, but they controlled the money,
but they weren't.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
The violent ones.
Speaker 3 (37:10):
It kind of felt that way to me. That was, like,
unsettling and unnecessary in that route, too.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, and it was definitely touches on a conversation we've
had a lot about kind of white supremacy pitting marginalized
communities against each other.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Exactly.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
And it kind of like played into that, except, oh, no,
the turn is it's not, it's themselves. So still taking
that blame away from white people, but also white people
controlling it.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
They kind of just like lost the deeds and flew away. Yeah.
their helicopter.
Speaker 3 (37:47):
So I hope Ani and Isaac actually kept the team.
So that's what I really hope is happening. We didn't
get that far, but I'm just saying. I did find
it funny, the Asian supervillain, the father, and Kai laughing, literally,
like rubbing their hands together. I was like, bro, while
they were killing off other members of the gang, I
was like, really?
Speaker 1 (38:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
And the bad jokes.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yes. Yes, there were many.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
Yes, there were so many.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
Yeah, so I feel like I love in this context,
but when you have to break it down, unfortunately, you
have to acknowledge all these things, as well as the
fact that, yes, there's only allowed one woman in this
whole conversation. I mean, except for the woman biker who
ends up dying.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
Oh, yeah. I mean, we talked about her already, but... Yeah. Yeah,
she was the woman that Trish.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Has to fight.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
Has to fight because Jet Li Han won't fight a woman. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (38:53):
But in the end, I think the movie was in
itself a nice break from reality. It is one of
those that you separate kind of because it's not.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
On that serious level. It's not as.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Deep as Romeo and Juliet and everybody's like falling apart.
And you're like, oh no, everything is kind of righted
in the end.
Speaker 2 (39:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:12):
With Isaac and with Han and with, you know, Trish.
I thought this was an interesting article. Again, I've referenced
it before. It was a Vulture.com article and Beatrice Loeza,
and I'm hoping I said that right. If I didn't,
and y'all know, tell me. But she writes this about
the movie. So many of the films of this era
are riddled with cultural inaccuracies, racial biases, and the over-representation
(39:36):
of white creatives above and below the line. Yet in
a contemporary landscape that repeatedly approaches cultural diversity and in
a cinematic storytelling by exploiting the traumas of people of
color or by meeting superficial markers of representations, there's something
about the intrepid and unhinged silliness of a movie like
Romeo Must Die, a movie that didn't care to impart
(39:57):
a profound industry-approved sociopolitical message that feels lacking today. So yeah,
it definitely came to a moment of like, oh, okay,
this is just a movie and you can watch some
actions and watch Aaliyah and listen to a great soundtrack.
Speaker 2 (40:13):
Like that's, kind of what it comes down to.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
And I will say, 2000, as things were already getting rough,
it was before September 11th, but it's not the same temperature,
political and social and racial temperature as it is today.
I think it's hard to, I think it would be
(40:35):
hard to do today, to be honest, without it being
a little exploitive. especially when you have an all-white, again,
as she was talking about, behind-the-scenes people with no representation
in it. So that's the thing. But I still, yeah,
(40:57):
I enjoy the movie for its silliness. And if you
have time, watch it again. Watch it with, like, understanding
this is a ridiculous movie, but amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:10):
Yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
It's a fun one.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I'm glad you suggested it. I'm loving going through your
old repertoire and finding out.
Speaker 3 (41:21):
Oh, so we're going to do Center Stage one day.
We're also going to have to do Legend. And this
is in honor of Tim Curry. It might be impossible
to find because this was, again, Tom Cruise's very first movie.
But why I've always been scared of Tim Curry.
Speaker 1 (41:41):
That should be a whole episode. We love you, but
here's why you scared us. I'll start with Fern Gully, which,
by the way, I rewatched and it's not scary at all.
But as a kid.
Speaker 2 (41:52):
You're not the only one.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
It was terrifying.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
You're not the only one.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
Well, this was fun. I look forward to future Samantha pics.
But for now, listeners, if you have any thoughts about
this or any suggestions, we would love to hear from you.
You can email us at hello at stuffwe'renevertoldyou.com. You can
find us on BlueSkype, MomStuffPodcast, We're on Instagram and TikTok
at Stuff I Never Told You. We're also on YouTube.
(42:17):
We have some merchandise at Cotton Bureau, and we have
a book you can get wherever you get your books.
Thanks as always to our super producer, Rima, and our
executive producer, Maya.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
And thanks to you for listening. Stuff I Never Told
You is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
you can check out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Hey, this is Annie.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
And Samantha.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
And welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told You, a production
of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
And welcome to another Feminist Movie Tuesday. Yes, y'all, we
are crazy busy at this point in time.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
A little more so than usual. Not only because.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Labor Day was later than usual, like on a different day.
That pushed us back a little bit. But we're also
prepping to be gone for a couple of weeks, including
a voyage, which if you haven't heard about it, you
should go look it up. Virginvoyages.com slash stuff. Because, yeah,
you can get more information. Anyway, but because of that,
our schedule is kind of hectic and a little different.
(00:53):
So bear with us because we're trying to get all
these fresh new episodes out still at the same time
as we are planning ahead.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
So, yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
A little bump in the road. We're all about flexibility.
And even more flexible about how we're looking at movies.
And I will say, before anything, that for those of
you who saw the title, you probably already know, we
are putting it in our feminist movie series.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
I wouldn't call this a feminist movie. But more of
one that's, like, nostalgic. Nostalgic.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Because I love it. And for some reason, I needed
Annie to see some of these movies that just gave
me joy in my young years. So we are talking
about the 2000 hit Romeo Must Die, an action movie
that was very, very, very loosely based on Romeo and Juliet. However,
(01:50):
in this tale, we have Jet Li, yes, playing Romeo,
Romeo-ish character, I guess, Han Han. And then we have
the R & B legend Aaliyah playing the Juliet character
Trish O'Day. There is a lot to be said about
this movie, both good and bad. Also, I was already
saying this. I don't think this would pass the Bechdel test.
(02:12):
It might, just because Aaliyah's character talks to a co-worker
who is a woman, and they seem to be friends.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
And they show off their dance moves.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
It's a very brief moment, but it is indeed a moment.
It is.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
So it kind of passes. And then that's about it.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Yeah, so the movie has a pretty interesting cast, including
Delroy Lindo from Sinners and so many more. Isaac O'Day,
the father or the leader. Controversial actor Isaiah Washington as Mac.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
DMX as club owner Silk.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
And when I'm talking about DMX, I'm talking about Rough Rider, rapper.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
DMX. Anyway, but he was in the.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
Movie as club owner Silk, Henry Oh as Choo Sing,
my crush from back in the day, I've talked about
him many a times actually, Russell Wong as Kai, and
Anthony Anderson, yes, Anthony Anderson, as Maurice. He was kind
of the comedic character of it all. Though the critics,
they were not a fan of this movie. They were like, no,
I think Robert and Ebert put it at 1.5 out
(03:17):
of 5.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Of course.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
It was very low.
Speaker 3 (03:22):
The movie did pretty well in the box office, coming
out as number two on its debut behind Erin Brockovich.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
That was that era.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
And made $ 91 million worldwide. And the album, well, the
album is amazing. It has tracks like A Try Again
and others by Aaliyah, which remains as one of my faves.
As in fact, I've been trying to find a Zumba
choreography to that one. I'll get it there. I'm almost there.
The movie was Aaliyah's debut. She would come out and
(03:54):
do Queen of the Damned, but actually died before the
production finished. And I believe they had to kind of
like rearrange some things because of her untimely death.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
This was Jet Li's second U.S. movie. The first one
was being the villain in Lethal Weapon 4. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
So this was his like starring role. And this is
all at the same time as like Rush Hour Commit.
So we know Jackie Chan was really big already. And
Jet Li was making his debut in the U.S. as
the lead.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
He actually didn't know English, which is kind of noticeable.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
He had some interesting line deliveries, I have to say.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
They helped.
Speaker 3 (04:33):
They, like, they did a good job in helping him
with the enunciations and, like, you need to emphasize.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
This, so.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:39):
Yeah. Impressive.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
So let's talk about plot.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
We open the scene very similar to the all-out brawl
in Romeo and Juliet, but this time it's in a club,
and it's the African-Americans versus Asian-American gangs, essentially. Apparently, there's
a gang war for waterfront properties. We have the son
of Chinese leader Poe, who is lavishly living it up
in this Black-owned club, causing a stir, is told to leave,
(05:05):
causing big problems. And enter his father's number one henchman, Kai,
who quickly shows off his martial arts skill.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
A lot of acrobatics.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
They really try to translate, like, the Crouching Tiger, that
kind of cinematics, into this movie. I don't know if
it translated really well, but.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
I loved it. Look, I loved it. I was okay
with it.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
But he shows off some moves and his skills. And
then enter DMX as Silk with his epic line, Guns
don't kill people.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
People kill people.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
As he's holding a machine gun, and then tells the
Asian people to get out. So that's, I love that line.
I will never forget that line. It's an amazing delivery.
After the disruption, we cut to the following morning to
see Poe had been killed.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
And from there, the plot begins.
Speaker 3 (05:53):
A war has been going on between the two gangs
over land and money. The two main families are working
on getting waterfront properties for the rich white people to
buy a new NFL franchise and build up a stadium.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
So they're going to make a lot of money in
doing this.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
As things heat up, there is unknown accusations about possible
foul play in the death of the son, Poe, who
did this.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
Or was it the black gang who did this?
Speaker 3 (06:19):
We soon find out that there is a second son, Han,
who is the oldest, who had been in prison in
Hong Kong for crimes his father had committed. And after
learning the news of his brother's death, he escapes.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Even more martial arts, the first X-ray test. Yes. Scene,
which Annie, you loved. I know you loved.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
And by the way, apparently this was a Jet Li suggestion.
And I want to say it was Joe Silver who
was like, oh, yes. Oh, yes.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
I will get the money for you. We will get
this in there. He was very excited.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
Well, to the listeners who don't know.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
You don't know. You need to stop and go watch
it right now. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
It's where, like, say a kick just lands so solidly,
it will become, the visual will become an x-ray of
the person who has been kicked. And it will show
how it's, like, impacting their skeletal structure.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
So in that first scene, Jet Li breaks the dude's
arm by going underneath and breaking his forearm.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
And you can see the break because of the x-ray vision.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Yes. Yes. It might have been ahead of its time.
I know a couple of movies did this later.
Speaker 2 (07:36):
I think it was.
Speaker 3 (07:38):
This was a gently, it was like, we're going to
do this. And was very excited by this. And so
with all of that, he escapes to come to the U.S.
By the way, again, first role, film in English. So
having a lot of help. So we see him very stoic.
And that's why we see him a lot more stoic.
I think they didn't want to push him too far
(07:58):
with the dialogue.
Speaker 1 (07:59):
But he did a good job.
Speaker 3 (08:01):
We soon meet Trish, who is the daughter of O'Day
and has made sure to show her being someone who
disapproved of her father's business. Her brother actually was a
part of that business, working with the father, even though
she didn't like it. But she's very protective and loves
her brother. And was trying to be like, I'm just
worried about you.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
He's like, I know.
Speaker 3 (08:24):
Because of the current friction between the rival gangs, Trish
is given the security detail. enter Maurice again played by
Anthony Anderson and is the comic relief of it all
even calls her Aaliyah in one of the scenes.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
Certain things you just can't take too seriously but I
was like this guy should have been fired ages ago
he's completely incompetent.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Well she does call him moron instead of Maurice quite
often it really gets under his skin you could tell
um Soon, we have Han and Trish crossing paths and
having an interesting meet-cute involving Han stealing a taxi cab.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
And picking Trish up.
Speaker 3 (09:07):
Actually, Trish jumps into the cab trying to run away
from Maurice. And they have a whole thing back and
forth and a lot of little flirting happening. At one point,
he's like, are you scared? And she's like, I've known
scarier guys than you.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
Real cute, like real cute.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
And then we see her saying, you know, I don't
want you to call me.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
I don't want you to call me because you drive
like s * * *.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (09:30):
With a cute little wink. Her little wink is real
flirty there.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
After all this, we actually witness the death of her brother,
as well as the girlfriend, which they never mention again.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Oh, yeah. That's true.
Speaker 3 (09:43):
I always thought that was like, poor girl. Which now
brings Trish and Han together to figure out what exactly
is happening. All the while, the deal with the NFL
is going down. There seems to be a lot of
violence happening around the area, interestingly. We soon discover Isaac,
Trish's father, has bigger plans to become quote-unquote legitimate and
(10:04):
wanting to be a part of the ownership of the
NFL team. But uh-oh, it turns out his number one, Mac,
is no good and has actually been the one attacking
the Black community as well as the one who killed
his son.
Speaker 2 (10:15):
Boom, boom, boom. After, um, He kidnaps Trish and Han.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
The whole thing goes down.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
A little cute little dance scene that happens with Trish
and Han, where Han is very uncomfortable and just standing
there staring, and Aaliyah's trying to get him to boogie. Literally,
that's the epitome of boogie to me.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Him just, like, arms going back and forth.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yep, she was doing a lot of the work there,
for sure.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
I mean, obviously, between the two of them, who's going
to be dancing? It's going to be him.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
We also have our, I did not mention the fight scene,
which actually became kind of one of the, I think.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
They were the first to honestly do it.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
I could be wrong, where he has a woman fight
for him, but he uses her as the weapon to
fight a woman because he couldn't hit a woman.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Yeah. I mean, Aaliyah is great at that. If somebody
tried to do that with my body... It would be
a disaster for everyone involved.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
I'll just be crumbling. Me too. Me too.
Speaker 3 (11:17):
I will say they did take that and put it
in the Try Again video.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
Very cute video. I love that video.
Speaker 3 (11:24):
One of my favorite songs of the whole forever.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Anyway, so all of that goes down.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
And during that point, they get kidnapped by Mac and
his crew because he comes and.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
Kills Silk to get the property. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
At this point, he brings him back to confront Isaac
and to tell him he wants his money.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
He doesn't want a part of the NFL. He wants money.
Speaker 3 (11:43):
We see Maurice and crew try to get rid of Han,
but of course, he doesn't. And Han gets away and
comes to help Trish and Isaac and chases down Mac,
who says the line, I'm sorry, Romeo, but you gotta die.
But into Trish, who shoots him himself. So during this
whole confrontation, we found out that he has killed his son,
all these things. At the same time, when he asked
(12:05):
about Han confronted Mac, saying, why did you kill my brother?
Speaker 2 (12:09):
He's like, that was all in-house. We didn't do that.
Speaker 3 (12:12):
Uh-oh. Soon we have a confrontation between Kai and Han,
who had been friends, or at least really, like, close,
because they had trained together. And they go into a
very excellent fight scene with the final X-ray scene, as
well as the fire circle that they are in.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
You gotta have that fire circle.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
Hello.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
Give me some skin. That was one of the lines
in there that I was like, why? That has to
be a line, but okay.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
And of course, Kai loses the fight. Han then goes
to confront his father for killing his own son, who
takes his own life, rather than having to confront police.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Or having to be arrested, I guess.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
Then we get the end scene of Trish and Han
holding hands, with his burnt hands, by the way, which
I was very confused by.
Speaker 2 (12:58):
The entire time, and walking away. They're coming to check
in on him. Very cute.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
So for this movie, again, I'm going to do it
a bit differently since I wouldn't say this movie is
really a feminist take on anything. Maybe I'm wrong. Y'all
can come tell me. And there are themes here, of course,
of family, of loyalty, classism. I guess since there was
a scene with Trish, again, with a worker there, again,
passing the Bechdel test.
Speaker 2 (13:35):
But I want to talk.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
About why I love this movie as well as why
there's some problems with this movie. And I did find
some really good articles talking about what this type of
movie kind of represented in that era. And then we're
going to have a quote at that at the end.
But before I get into that, Annie, I need your review.
I need your review on A Childhood Love of Mine,
(13:57):
one of my old school favorites.
Speaker 2 (13:58):
What were your thoughts? Oh, my.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Well, I had loosely heard of this movie and I
thought I did think it was going to be like
violence between two different families like Romeo and Juliet I
thought it was going to be much more serious I
thought it was going to be like super serious and
violent and that's why you almost got so many texts
(14:24):
from me that were just quotes out of context they're
playing football.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
Now I would have known I would have known.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
I think you would have it was fun I thought
it was really fun and I think I think when
we're going to talk about some of this stuff, but
some of it I was like really intrigued by. Some
of the like themes of like gentrification and like getting people,
especially people of marginalized communities to sell properties. Like there
(14:55):
were some themes I was like, you know, this is 2000,
but this still feels pretty relevant. But yeah, mostly I
thought it was pretty fun. And I did think it
was interesting too that like, I guess, traitors like Kai
and Mac. Although I bet people view Mac differently now.
(15:22):
Because his whole thing was like, you can't trust these
white guys, man. I just want the money. And it's
sort of like, he was sort of right. But he
was also a complete asshole who was forcing other... Because
a lot of the Black owners you see, they didn't
want to leave.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Right.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
And he was going to kill you. Right. That was it.
So I think it was interesting in terms of that.
It was kind of a fascinating turn of the millennium
movie that had some things that felt so... Like the
x-ray thing. It felt kind of like, oh, this was
of a very specific time. And then some things that
(16:05):
felt like, oh, this is still pretty relevant, actually. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
So.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Getting outside of that, when you start trying to dissect
the movie, it gets kind of like, ugh, fishy.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
But some of the things that I did.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
Really love, and I think the reason I love it, again,
it's kind of not the same, but similar to my
love for the Brandy Cinderella movie, that it had.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Representation, whether it was good or bad.
Speaker 3 (16:33):
It was still a type of representation where an Asian
character was the lead, which was so rare. Again, though,
like it comes back to like, of course, if it's
a martial arts, kung fu, whatever movie, of course, typically,
you would expect it to be Asian lead, but that
wasn't happening all the time.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
And a lot of the Asian movies, if.
Speaker 3 (16:55):
It was, had white heroes. So this was one of
those moments that it didn't have that. And I was like, oh,
that's kind of a relief in this. Like it just
was as is. And just like you said, it was
not serious. Like it's It's absolutely, like, some of the
themes can be serious, but it was very glossed over,
which could be also a failure, and we can talk about,
(17:17):
we're going to talk about that in a minute, but, like,
it gave you just enough to understand things were happening
without being over the top. I will say, surprisingly, okay,
with the fact, we'll come back to the fact that
this was written by white men, this was directed by
white men, this was produced typically by white men, but
they didn't had a little more respectful in dialogue. They
(17:41):
didn't try to use hard N, hard N-R.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Like, in their movie. And I was actually, like, I
didn't have ever noticed that.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I mean, they still say, like, you know, terms to
themselves and, like, the Black community would use today, but
not to that effect, that you would hear, like, especially
if you think of, like, Quentin Tarantino really liberally using
it and excitedly using this type of term. I'm like,
at least they didn't do that.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
I'm like, oh, you know what? Okay. Okay. Did they
say things that felt a little racist? For sure. Not
a little.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Very racist? Yes. Yes.
Speaker 3 (18:13):
Like the Asian dude talking about Blacks, and I was like, oh,
I do not need you to say it like that.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Stop that. Stop that.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
So there's definitely like a level of like, still makes
me uncomfortable, but at least they didn't have them saying
these terms that feels like for so many of the
white writer's use it as a go, as a pass,
to be able to.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
So, like, I was relieved of that.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
I also loved that it did show Aaliyah in a
way of being vulnerable and not too sexualized. Like, they
didn't have her overtly being, like, you know, passed around
or any of that. Like, she was very strong and
steadfast and was an independent woman with a lot of
understanding and beliefs. And then you have a father, the
(19:01):
actual father, her father being... you know, not a great guy,
but trying his best and really trying to, you know,
be something for his family.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
That was nice to see. Like so many of.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
The, again, white writers really want to play on things
that you're like, you should not be talking about this.
Speaker 2 (19:19):
Stop this. So like all of that to say, it's like,
it is nice. It is nice to see in that.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
I think that's why, again, I liked it because it was,
there was still good guys, bad guys. But the good guys,
bad guys weren't your typical good guys, bad guys.
Speaker 2 (19:36):
You know what I mean? And I really, I really.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Appreciated that level. I really appreciated seeing coupling. So there
was a big debate about the fact. that apparently they
did test to see, audience test, to see Aaliyah's character
and Jet Li's character kiss, and it apparently did not
go well. And then one was like a hugging scene,
(20:03):
and it did not go well.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
So, but like.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
The same article we read about, we read a little
quote from, it's a Vulture article from 2021 talking about
this movie, that it was because it was written by
white men in a perspective that they themselves couldn't see
that happening. They themselves didn't understand that happening, whether it's
because they were emasculating an Asian man or so like
(20:28):
an emasculated Asian man with a sexualized black woman, you know,
which is their stereotype and understanding.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
Then it wasn't going to fit well.
Speaker 3 (20:37):
But I still, I think I did love the wholesomeness
of their relationship still.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
I think it made it even better for me.
Speaker 3 (20:45):
And I think a part of that is because there
was a huge age difference between them.
Speaker 2 (20:48):
And I was like, Aaliyah's been through enough. I knew
Aaliyah's background.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
And for those of y'all who don't know, Aaliyah became
a star at 14. The people knew who she was. R.
Kelly took advantage of that and actually married her. with
the permission of her parents, and then they got divorced
when she, I think, came of age. And there were
some indications and understanding that that was real off, obviously.
Speaker 2 (21:10):
We know where R.
Speaker 3 (21:11):
Kelly is today. And so that was real off. Something
was really shady and really gross in that. And so
seeing him, who was 15 years older, I did not
need to see that between them two.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 3 (21:24):
It was already kind of a stretch to me with
their age difference to put them together.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
I was like, mm-hmm. No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Because maybe because.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
Aaliyah was a year older than me and then I
knew his age, I was like, there's no way in
hell I would kiss him.
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Because of the age difference. It's shady.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
And we know Hollywood does that a lot, but I
just really respected that level that you can think that
they may be together.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
But maybe they're just really good friends. Let them be
good friends.
Speaker 3 (21:55):
But their wholesomeness and just like their flirting, their innocence
in that flirting, like it was really, It was nice
to me. I thought this was a better way to go,
but I digress in that level. Again, this whole thing
is cheesy. And I love the cheesy.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
I think that's why I.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
Love the old school Asian, not old school, but movies
like Crouching Tiger and then Hero. Hero was one of
my favorite movies because it's so gorgeous and it's so
wonderfully laid out.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
However, it is propaganda. It's coming as propaganda. I figured
that out later. I was like, oh, oh, my bad.
But it's so gorgeous. I really did love it.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
But I loved Jet Li, and I think this movie
was what made me love Jet Li and his characters
in this. Again, I loved Aaliyah on her own. So
having her, I probably would have loved her in everything.
Has she been able to continue in her career? Because
I love her. Like, she was up there with me
with Brandy. For some reason, these were people that I loved.
(22:59):
So all of those things were so wonderful.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Again, the music. When I hear that music, I see
the scenes. I can't help it.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
You know, in those movies, you hear it, you're like, oh,
there it is. And you start like, uh-huh, I need
to go back and watch it.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
That's the first thing.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
I have downloaded a lot of the songs. So I
love all of that. These were the things that I loved. Again,
a multiracial couple, the idea that it was okay and normal,
like nicely done. To me, not okay, normal, but, like,
it's not so unheard of here. The fact they had, again,
a story, not the greatest story that was centered on
(23:39):
non-white people.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
And also the white people were the villains here. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
And pretty obviously, pretty immediately.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Like, the way he said cheddar.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
What did they say?
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Cheddar.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
I was like, oh, no. No, no, no, no.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
He needs to go. Well, just to have, like, a meeting...
On a golf course about buying waterfront property for NFL, like,
red flags abound.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
And I bet it happens that way.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
Oh, I'm sure it does.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
More often than not.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
I am sure it does. But I have to tell you,
it was very clear from the get-go, these are not
the guys you want to be working with.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Don't trust these people. Never trust those, especially in white
polo shirts. Come on.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
Yeah. I mean, they cast them well. They had to look.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Yeah, they definitely did. They looked a little sleazy. No offense.
Then there are things that were problematic. Like, coming back
and looking at them, I'm like, oh, yeah, okay.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
This was written by, directed by, produced by white men
because it was for their entertainment. I will say Joel
Silver was quoted in saying that he was tired of
the regular action movies at the time. They thought he
was just all overdone and he wanted something completely different.
And he wanted to see people of color. He really
did say that being a part of the action movies. Again,
(25:04):
Rush Hour had been a huge hit, so this kind
of made sense. I think as they started bringing more
and more martial arts into it, you started seeing more
and more Asian people being a part of it. Of course, again,
they were all either villainized or they were over-sexualized. Definitely
just there for the martial arts, it seems.
Speaker 2 (25:25):
But nonetheless... It was coming.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
And I will say, I think he produced other movies
that starred Jet Li in DMX.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Cradle to the Grave. I remember watching this. I don't
know anything about it.
Speaker 1 (25:41):
Yeah, haven't seen that one.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
It's been a minute.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
Because again, I loved Jet Li so much that I
watched all his stuff.
Speaker 2 (25:48):
I watched one with him and Jason Statham. I don't
recommend it.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
Noted.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
Okay. Moving on.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
But like he, Joel Silver really did do this in
a perspective of like, we need change. So, you know,
give him credit to at least bringing it about. But again,
when you have one point of view and you don't
bring the people of color into this conversation that you're
trying to create, whether it's for good intentions or not,
you're going to have some problems.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
And it was very, again, it.
Speaker 3 (26:18):
Was very obvious whether we're talking about literally all Asians
know martial arts, right? That was, That was a joke
they put in there. But at the same time, apparently
they do.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Pretty well.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
As we saw it. As we saw it.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
The Black men are violent and use guns. That was
so over the top. The bad idea of being hip-hop.
I will cringe forever. The first time I saw it
to today about that scene where Aaliyah stops So I'm
going to say it with that. Trish stops Han to
(26:52):
be like, oh, we can't go into this black club
with you looking like that.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
And bro was wearing like a jacket, tucked in.
Speaker 3 (26:58):
Polos, belted, like dad khakis, like not even like, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Just dad khakis and a hat.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
And so her fixing him was turning the hat backwards,
giving him some gum.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
And he kind of pulls the pants down. Not really.
I'm like, at least untuck your shirt, bro.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
Nope.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
So that being the idea of hip-hop, I also, this
wasn't the bad part, but I did love the fact
that she was dancing to her own song.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
That made me laugh, too.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
In the club. That made me laugh, too. It's a hit, though.
So if you can, if she, if she's making hits
like that, she deserves to dance like that.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Or tries to get that one Asian dude in the
middle of the floor to try.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
To dance like that. She was doing her best.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
And he was not moving.
Speaker 1 (27:48):
He was just smiling.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
I will say, I felt like his smiles were genuine
because he doesn't typically smile. And he was having the
time of his life. Some of the things that I've
read about that, it was that she had the best time.
She loved Russell Wong and she loved Jet Li. She
had such a good chemistry with all of them that
it was obvious. And every single one of them, even
(28:11):
before she had died, was saying she was going to
be huge. Like, her acting abilities are only going to grow.
And they really talked about how she blew it out
the water in getting these things done and just really
being excited for her. And this was even before all
of that. So it was really sad to see a
talent diminish that way, her dying so young. So all
(28:36):
that to say, but you can see Jet Li's cheesing
in the movie, and I think that's genuine.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Genuinely done.
Speaker 3 (28:44):
And I love everything about that. But again, you know,
having him putting on a backwards hat, trying to kind
of sag his pants, which, by the way, no one
else seemed to be doing, but whatever. Like, it seemed
kind of interesting in that route. We have the emasculating, again,
of Asian men, a part of the problem. Like, they
didn't really necessarily emasculate him, but they made sure to
(29:06):
keep him in his, like, you do martial arts.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
End of story. You're the action portion, and we're going
to move you on. He did, again, he did have
some good lines. During the football scene.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Oh, the football.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
Having the, y'all. Do you want to describe the football scene?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
When I was watching this.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
I'm trying to blend the martial arts to this.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
I thought, this is where Twilight got the idea. That
was one of my first thoughts.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
You might not be wrong.
Speaker 1 (29:42):
So at this point, Trish and Han have struck up
kind of a flirty relationship. We haven't talked about this yet,
but Mac has been being kind of forcefully flirty with Yeah.
With Trish and pretty much implying, like, I'm going to
(30:02):
have all the power and you're going to be with me.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
So, Mac sees Han sitting on a bench with her
and he's with his crew and they're playing football. And
he comes up to Han and is like, listen, we
need another player. It's going to be so easy. We're
going to go so easy on you. It's going to
be great. And, you know, Han is kind of like, oh,
I've never played this game. I don't know this game.
(30:26):
And they're like, no, no, no. And of course, they
basically don't tell him what's going to happen and just
kind of dive over him. And I think twice that happens.
And then one of them says, I think it's Maurice,
it's like, well, you're the one with the ball. That's
why you're always getting hit. And so Han's like, okay,
let's go again. And he throws the ball to each
(30:51):
of them and then uses that as an excuse to
use his martial arts skills. to take them down, like
the whole 11 people on the team. And very triumphant,
you know? He gets to the other end, spins the ball,
and it was like, great game, love it.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Literally, because the entire time they call each other brother,
he's like, brother!
Speaker 1 (31:18):
And all the kids that Trish was hanging out with,
genuinely she's with the younger kids because she kind of
has an after-school personality. mentoring vibe kind of thing that's
the coolest thing we've ever seen but he just bust
out martial arts in the middle of like football let's talk.
Speaker 3 (31:36):
About the fact that they're playing flag football in the
first place this mean tough game which maybe they do
my thought is like why aren't they playing basketball because
of the opening scene which by the way doesn't make
sense and we have like they the younger version of
Han and Po when they lived in China their children
are in the sea or water and apparently almost drowned,
(31:59):
they remain floating on a deflated basketball in China. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
And then come back.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
And then when he comes back for Poe's funeral and
all that, he finds the deflated basketball.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
Makes no sense whatsoever.
Speaker 2 (32:15):
It makes no sense whatsoever. That you're like, what? Wait, what?
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Maybe.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Yeah. Because I don't even think basketball is popular.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
as popular as other sports like baseball and soccer.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
So, like, it just kind of doesn't.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
Quite hit.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Who knows? Maybe people in Hong Kong.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Maybe if you've been, I don't know, Annie, you kind
of know Chinese culture.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
I love Hong Kong. And you've been to Hong Kong.
Was there a lot of basketball?
Speaker 1 (32:43):
Not that I witnessed. And I guess this came out
in 2000, so things.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
Yes, you were a baby. Don't start with me.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
I was in Hong Kong in 2008, I think. I
didn't notice it. I know that baseball kind of got
a hold in Japan.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
It implies that they were in a small area in
Hong Kong for some reason. Maybe I just made that
up in my head. I.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
For some reason, maybe I've seen too many dramas about this,
but I thought that they were like immigrants and they
were like floating on the, this was how they were
surviving to make it to Hong Kong. I was very
confused by the whole thing also.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
Maybe, I may have missed something. I don't think so.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
No, I don't think you did. I think I was
trying to make it, I was trying to make sense
of it.
Speaker 3 (33:43):
Well, yeah, this level of like things that it doesn't,
like just kind of placed, and again, this is kind
of that unseriousness, but like they took a serious scene
and put something in there that doesn't make a lot
of sense that you start questioning why other than We're
going to correlate sports so that we can talk about
the Black community crossing.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
Honestly, I'm trying.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
I'm really reaching here for that one. But there was
kind of an understanding of like, why is this happening?
Speaker 1 (34:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Why did we think this was the way? With that.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
I think like we do have the, again, the masculinity
of men outside of the, you know, karate, but you're
not really, you know, a sexual. And then over-sexualizing black men,
like both Mac and Maurice are so over the top
and flirting with all the women. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
That felt like a ridiculous stereotype that needed, that didn't
need to happen. It was just like, do we need that?
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Yeah. Maurice has like a scene where he tries to
remove a woman's headphones. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
I would, Well, that woman was ready to fight, too.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
She was ready to fight. Rightfully so.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
She was like, what are you doing?
Speaker 3 (35:02):
But it was a little over the top. It seemed
like the way they made sure, the way they wrote.
Maybe it's because they're the bad guys in this. In
order to know that they're the bad guys, you also
need to know, yes, they are going to. One of
the women's biggest fears is being.
Sexually harassed and sexually molested and sexually raped. So maybe
(35:25):
they were playing on that. I don't know, but it
seemed unnecessary.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Yeah, because especially in, like, Maurice's case, it was very comedic.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Unnecessary. Yeah, like, Mac was a little scary.
Speaker 2 (35:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
And Maurice's is too, but it was played as more comedic.
Speaker 2 (35:44):
Yeah. It was seen for more comedic and an escape.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
Like, it was part of the escape, but, like, again, like,
doing something that's a harassment that's like over the crossing
boundaries so i felt like that was definitely written in
like white perspective of black villains um again it's a
bad writing for the for the black actors the african-american
actors i was like why are they doing this i
(36:08):
feel like they're doing it so over the top and
it was just random times because when you have the
conversations like with the father and with um the sun
it was just a very back and forth about business
and then i'll hold up now hold up though like
that kind of like overly like dramatic use of uh
ave that was like did they even i feel like
(36:34):
maybe it's dated and that's why it feels so clunky
but it just i think even back then i was
like who wrote this again the dmx line was so
ridiculous i was like what is happening I think a
little conversation, like making sure that we knew it was
Black-on-Black crime. Like, sure, they did have the white man
(36:54):
pulling the strings, but showing that Black people were really violent,
and it was Black-on-Black crime and Asian-on-Asian crime, and they.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
Were the actual bad guys.
Speaker 3 (37:02):
They were actual, like, violent ones, not the white people. Yes,
white people didn't tell them, but they controlled the money,
but they weren't.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
The violent ones.
Speaker 3 (37:10):
It kind of felt that way to me. That was, like,
unsettling and unnecessary in that route, too.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, and it was definitely touches on a conversation we've
had a lot about kind of white supremacy pitting marginalized
communities against each other.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Exactly.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
And it kind of like played into that, except, oh, no,
the turn is it's not, it's themselves. So still taking
that blame away from white people, but also white people
controlling it.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
They kind of just like lost the deeds and flew away. Yeah.
their helicopter.
Speaker 3 (37:47):
So I hope Ani and Isaac actually kept the team.
So that's what I really hope is happening. We didn't
get that far, but I'm just saying. I did find
it funny, the Asian supervillain, the father, and Kai laughing, literally,
like rubbing their hands together. I was like, bro, while
they were killing off other members of the gang, I
was like, really?
Speaker 1 (38:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
And the bad jokes.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yes. Yes, there were many.
Speaker 2 (38:17):
Yes, there were so many.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
Yeah, so I feel like I love in this context,
but when you have to break it down, unfortunately, you
have to acknowledge all these things, as well as the
fact that, yes, there's only allowed one woman in this
whole conversation. I mean, except for the woman biker who
ends up dying.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
Oh, yeah. I mean, we talked about her already, but... Yeah. Yeah,
she was the woman that Trish.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Has to fight.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
Has to fight because Jet Li Han won't fight a woman. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (38:53):
But in the end, I think the movie was in
itself a nice break from reality. It is one of
those that you separate kind of because it's not.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
On that serious level. It's not as.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Deep as Romeo and Juliet and everybody's like falling apart.
And you're like, oh no, everything is kind of righted
in the end.
Speaker 2 (39:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:12):
With Isaac and with Han and with, you know, Trish.
I thought this was an interesting article. Again, I've referenced
it before. It was a Vulture.com article and Beatrice Loeza,
and I'm hoping I said that right. If I didn't,
and y'all know, tell me. But she writes this about
the movie. So many of the films of this era
are riddled with cultural inaccuracies, racial biases, and the over-representation
(39:36):
of white creatives above and below the line. Yet in
a contemporary landscape that repeatedly approaches cultural diversity and in
a cinematic storytelling by exploiting the traumas of people of
color or by meeting superficial markers of representations, there's something
about the intrepid and unhinged silliness of a movie like
Romeo Must Die, a movie that didn't care to impart
(39:57):
a profound industry-approved sociopolitical message that feels lacking today. So yeah,
it definitely came to a moment of like, oh, okay,
this is just a movie and you can watch some
actions and watch Aaliyah and listen to a great soundtrack.
Speaker 2 (40:13):
Like that's, kind of what it comes down to.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
And I will say, 2000, as things were already getting rough,
it was before September 11th, but it's not the same temperature,
political and social and racial temperature as it is today.
I think it's hard to, I think it would be
(40:35):
hard to do today, to be honest, without it being
a little exploitive. especially when you have an all-white, again,
as she was talking about, behind-the-scenes people with no representation
in it. So that's the thing. But I still, yeah,
(40:57):
I enjoy the movie for its silliness. And if you
have time, watch it again. Watch it with, like, understanding
this is a ridiculous movie, but amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:10):
Yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
It's a fun one.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I'm glad you suggested it. I'm loving going through your
old repertoire and finding out.
Speaker 3 (41:21):
Oh, so we're going to do Center Stage one day.
We're also going to have to do Legend. And this
is in honor of Tim Curry. It might be impossible
to find because this was, again, Tom Cruise's very first movie.
But why I've always been scared of Tim Curry.
Speaker 1 (41:41):
That should be a whole episode. We love you, but
here's why you scared us. I'll start with Fern Gully, which,
by the way, I rewatched and it's not scary at all.
But as a kid.
Speaker 2 (41:52):
You're not the only one.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
It was terrifying.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
You're not the only one.
Speaker 1 (41:57):
Well, this was fun. I look forward to future Samantha pics.
But for now, listeners, if you have any thoughts about
this or any suggestions, we would love to hear from you.
You can email us at hello at stuffwe'renevertoldyou.com. You can
find us on BlueSkype, MomStuffPodcast, We're on Instagram and TikTok
at Stuff I Never Told You. We're also on YouTube.
(42:17):
We have some merchandise at Cotton Bureau, and we have
a book you can get wherever you get your books.
Thanks as always to our super producer, Rima, and our
executive producer, Maya.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (42:25):
And thanks to you for listening. Stuff I Never Told
You is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
you can check out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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