January 22, 2026 • 22 mins
"Which one of us took the (queer)bait? Anney did.
And it was not fun. Not one bit."
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and one of the
stuff I've never told you prodiction of iHeartRadio, and welcome
to another edition of half Hour. On a very dreary Thursday.
We are recording this very spirit.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
We're gonna get another snow apocalypse possibly or isogeddon. I
think it could be ice.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
I think it's going to be ice, which is not fun.
That is not what we like, that's not what we want.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
This is not what we talked about.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Yeah. Well, as always with these halfy hours, if you
choose to drink, please do so responsibly. Samantha, are you
doing anything responsibly? Over there?
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Always things responsibly? I am a responsible, boring adult that
drinks water. End of story. Currently a peppermint because my
tummy is not happy with me. I'm not sure why,
but it's okay. Peppermints for the wind, not for me. Yeah,
not for you unless you're any and allergic.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Yes, So today's episode is going to be a chin
wine or kind of a wallow in wine actually, but
it's it's all gonna be fine. I've psycked myself up
for it. It's not going to be bad. So it
is just my usual red wine I was going to
make like a hot tidy situation because it is cold.
I was like, no, this feels right for this topic.
(01:42):
So before we start this, I want to say everything
in this is one hundred percent my opinion. Uh, and
it is my experience and it is how I deal
with things. I don't think I'm alone by any means,
but I certainly don't speak for everyone. I know. Oh,
this is a people have a lot of emotions and
thoughts about all of this. So just gonna put that
(02:06):
out there at the top, all right. So it finally
happened to me, Samantha, I was successfully queer baited. It happened.
And don't get me wrong, I have watched shows that
I would classify as queer baits, but either I'm too
(02:26):
cynical or like, that'll never happen. They'll never give me
what I want, which is, you know, a queer relationship.
But so I've never actually believed it could happen. Who anyway,
if you haven't listened to our episode on queer baiting,
(02:47):
you can. It's kind of old. We should probably that
was back in our early days, Samantha, when we did
that one.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah, it doesn't feel like that long ago, because I
can remember it.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Yeah, but it was ago. It probably was. So you
can go back and listen to that if you want,
if you want to know more. But basically, what I
will say is some people disagree on what qualifies as
queer bait. I would say there are some examples that
are just straight up queer bait, and then there are
(03:19):
some that are kind of in a more gray area.
But yeah, some people do disagree. If you want to
go and hear more about that, check out that episode.
I actually I actually wrote out a whole thing. I
never do this for a happy hour. Oh my god. Okay,
(03:39):
So I actually don't really want to talk about what
happened to me. I want to talk about the aftermath
of it because I am still processing. I am going
through Like I said in our New Year's episode, I
am processing a lot of queer stuff. I've been thinking
about queer issues for a while and I didn't realize it,
(03:59):
and I have been doing some of those episodes over
the past month. So I think we'll keep talking about it,
but I do, yeah, I want to talk about kind
of the what the fallout and the realizations I had
after it, and I do want to be clear about this.
I might sound a little jokey because that is how
(04:20):
I handle things, but it can sucked. Man. Like I
feel like I was hanging out with some friends that
I trusted. I was having a grand old time. We
were like in a car, we were laughing, and then
they sucker punstry in the face, threw me out the
car and left me ted dead on the highway like
I was. I know. It was like I was so
(04:44):
full of hope and then I was so shocked and
I was so hurt. I cried for like two days.
Oh no, no, I was miserable. So when I say
like I'm making this sound jokey, I was miserable. And
then I made it another friends problem and I made
her sit through a two plus hour presentation that had
(05:07):
videos and images to prove I was not delusional.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
When I tell this a YouTube thing that you show
or did you create this thing?
Speaker 1 (05:18):
I created? Okay, I brought together clips from YouTube, so
in that sense I created it. Yes, Yeah, I had
to back up my points.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, I love that this is not an essay, but
it was a visual representation this time.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
See when I tell you I write these essays, I
need you to believe.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
It is true, but you've come to the new reform.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
I asked her. I was like, would you prefer powerpois or.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Do you want me to write this out? Do you
want me to make this a musical or would you
like it in video form?
Speaker 1 (05:54):
I'm so embarrassed. And she was like, I have my
one condition. I'm going to take a candid picture of
you doing it. And it's very funny because there's a
I didn't place it there specifically or purposefully, but there's
a like affirmation box I have that says calm right
in front of me, and I'm clearly not calm.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
I like, she took a photo evidence. I'm sure I'll
reach out to her and find it.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Don't keep don't, don't, don't, don't don't. I'm embarrassed anyway,
but it was because I was yeah, I was like, so,
it was just so I was distraught and I was
confused and I needed someone to be like, no, I'm
sorry you're coming from And after I did that, I
cried some more because I brought up new I like
(06:42):
dredged it all back up. So if this has happened
to you, I am really sorry. I'm really, really really sorry,
So do not take any of this as dismissal. This
is just me coping right now.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Any way to cope.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Yeah, And I can't really tell you, I suppose how
you have to handle it in your life, but I
promise you I was legitimately hurt. I did kind of
feel traumatized. And there are a lot of reasons for this, because,
(07:20):
first of all, I want to talk about the delusional part,
where it immediately becomes like, oh, I was delusional this
whole time, and that's what people will say online. One
of the things that really hurts about being queer abated,
which if you don't know, I feel like it's pretty obvious,
but it's like you're given hints or promises of a
queer romantic relationship through the source material and usually those
(07:42):
involved making it, and then it not coming to fruition.
Usually at the very end, it's like you're so happy
and you're looking for these things and you're getting all
these signals that it might happen, and then they're like, oh,
actually not, and then they make fun of you for it.
(08:03):
How could you have ever believed that, like obviously that
would never ever happen. And that sucks because as a
queer person, not only do you have to like really
look for good representation and then you find crumbs of
it where you can. But at least some of us
feel this and real life like we feel delusional looking
(08:26):
for any sign that someone is like us, that someone
might like us. And you know, like straight people have
signals too, and there's that level of like reading into
signals for any relationship, but when you're queer, it can
feel much more rare and much more unsafe to misinterpret
those things. So when we are talking about like compets
(08:48):
our compulsory heterosexuality, which we have recently are internalized homophobia.
I hadn't realized until recently how much I do micromanage
things so someone can misinterpret them because I'm gay and
they might misinterpret something and I don't want that, and
that usually looks like withdraw. I think that looks like
(09:09):
withdraw for a lot of queer people, but especially for me,
it looks like, oh, I can't contact them first. I
can never do this first. And I'm not even talking
about guys, I'm talking about anybody like. I don't want
to be the one that does that because they might
misread it, and then the other person of course, is thinking, well,
they don't want to talk to me. She never reaches
out first. It's just a mess. So yeah, those are
(09:30):
the things that you're It's very like projecting, it's very
reading into yourself. But you're thinking like, what if they
think I'm flirting and they're disgusted by it? What if
they realize what I am? And then you shut down
an you wait for them to come to you. And again,
this is not unique to queer people, but it is
something that for a lot of us ties back to
(09:51):
fear and shame. So when you're consuming media and you're
trying to read into these signals that sometimes feel pretty clear,
and then they tell you like you are illusional, it's
very destabilizing, and people make you feel embarrassed and perverted
about it, which I'm going to get into a more second,
but anyway, I don't feel like they do this with
straight couples, especially like the you must be perverted part.
(10:16):
I'm still hung up on that, and I am embarrassed
and I feel stupid. And this is why I brought
my friend and made her watch this Present Day because
I was like, I needed somebody to tell me I
hadn't lost my mind because people online were like, oh,
y'all are desperate, and I was like, yeah, kinda for
good representation kind of yes, And it's all sad, Like
(10:39):
you start you are not only questioning everything you're doing
as a real life queer person, you start questioning everything
someone else is doing, and like how you're reading into
what they are doing, and it's just very confusing. And
I think it probably can be fun when you know
(10:59):
someone else's sextuality or you feel really confident in yours,
but for a lot of us, it's not so fun.
So having something like this is just painful. And sometimes
you do you resign yourself to a life of never
finding what you want, and then you think you're finally
gonna see some queer joy and then you don't get
(11:21):
it and you're like, well, see, there it is. And
also this is a topic for another another day. But
a lot of the queer baiting stuff, I've actually missed
a lot of the big ones. Some of you have
written in about some of the queer baiting shipping wars
you've been involved with, and I've luckily sailed by. But
(11:42):
a lot of thing that does come up with many
of them is queer trauma versus queer joy, So a
lot of times it will be like a very sad
queer story and then maybe like a hint of joy
that you don't really see anywhere. So another thing this
is also going to have to be I'm still wrestling
with this. I've been wrestling with this for a while.
(12:04):
But there's this idea that I've seen around queer baiting
a lot where people are like almost implying that you're
a Monster's too strong a word, but like just that
why do you have to take everything like it means
something it doesn't have to mean anything. Are like why
(12:27):
can't they just be friends or whatever? Which I'm gonna
come back to in a second. But one thing that
has stuck out to me. I this is years ago,
this happened, and I'm still dealing with it, But there
was this big there's a big narrative of around queer
baiting that's usually like character X is making character why uncomfortable,
(12:47):
which I would disagree with given the only like the
constant monitoring thing that usually do as a queer person,
But okay, sure, but it did remind me of when
longtime friend of mine, many many many years ago told
me that he wanted to date, and I was devastated
because I thought it meant that I had been leading
(13:09):
him on when I thought I was just being friendly
and how I scared of my own body, and I
very dramatically wrote about how I was a monster in
my journal. I felt awful, But it wasn't anything that
he did. It wasn't anything I did, to be honest,
but I was shifting the blame onto me. And we've
talked about this before. A lot of women do. This
(13:32):
is not just a queer thing. But I guess what
I'm trying to say when it comes to this conversation
is that, yeah, it can be scary when a friend
feels differently than you do. But I wasn't uncomfortable by
what he did. Afterwards, after he told me, I started
to like be like, oh, I wasn't seeing it that way.
(13:53):
I definitely didn't think he'd done anything like perverted or wrong.
And I did end updating him four years because that's
what I thought I was supposed to want and supposed
to do. And that comes back to the compulsory heterosexuality conversation.
I don't know, I just don't think I see that
as much with straight couples and media where they're immediately like, oh,
(14:15):
it's making him feel uncomfortable or she's making her feel uncomfortable.
It's like, oh, I don't think so it's not anything major.
And yes, like I said, another of the big ones is, no,
they can't just be best friends. We're all for friends.
You know, Samantha and I love best friends. Those is
(14:35):
probably some of the best relationships you can see. Forget
all this romance. But so, I mean sometimes, especially if
they're giving you, like as an audience, like clear insight
into a character's thoughts, intentional choices and music and color
and set design and everything that's meant to communicate things.
(14:59):
So oh, sure, I love best friends, but it would
be nice if it wasn't always directed at like a
potential queer couple that was probably queer bait that, oh,
it can't just be friends. I'm like, sure, but that's
not what they were telling us. With all this information,
(15:20):
and y'all know, like, I feel like I'm just going
on a while. This is why I had to write
this one out. I'm getting derailed. But y'all know, I
process things easier through fictional works and characters. So to
experience this. It was not good. It was not good
for me, and especially like there was also just dismissing
it as a joke. I feel like I said that,
(15:42):
but like kind of the not only are you delusional?
That's very funny that you thought that. I've learned a lot.
That's what I'll say. I've learned a lot through this journey.
(16:06):
I've learned so much about color theory and music theory.
And it's very funny to see other people talking about
this and just be like, oh, okay, so I'm not
the only one. I mean, presentation was pretty good. And
my friend, I have to say when she when it
(16:27):
was over, she was like, you convinced me and she
said it like she meant it. So before somebod y'all
you did this.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Did she have that same feeling of puibating doing that point.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I don't think she'd formed enough. Okay, I like opinion
about it. She was a what a sport? What a sport?
But it's funny because I, you know, I'm an ace
person and so kind of cracks me up how much
I've learned through this. But it it's also funny because
(17:03):
I have realized this over the years. I could care
less about straight couples. Usually I do not care. But
if it's a queer couple, even if that's not like
what I like identify with, I don't really want to
be with somebody. I still want that that I'm interested
in and that I want to see because I always
(17:25):
get kind of hung up on that, and I think
it's just because you don't see it very often. And
as you know, I love fan fiction. I love it.
I love it, I love it, I write it. But
sometimes you do want to like see it or read it,
(17:46):
and you want other people to see it or read
it too, like to see that it's possible. It's not delusional.
This does exist, and this is like the pros and
cons of loving something to the can hurt you so bad.
And I love these things so much and so it
(18:06):
got me.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
So, how do you feel about the show now? You
still love the show? I don't know the show talking about.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
So well, no, no, no, I don't want to say that.
I'm still like processing the whole thing, and I have
like coping mechanisms and basically headcannon, headcannon. But that's yeah,
coping mechanism. But yeah, that's the other thing is like
(18:34):
clearly there's an audience for clear romance, and not even
just for queer people. You can see some examples going
on right now, despite what some studios seem to believe,
because a lot of times they'll put like one like
Star Wars. It is the first one that's coming to mind,
but you know, like two seconds of a gay couple kissing.
(18:56):
They're like sweet it, and you're like no, but you
all have also had a bunch of other couples. You
could have like are you put it in your comics?
Which I love, but they're just not mainstream as much
as like movies or the shows Learner or something like that.
This is also another reminder as what why we need
fandom therapists. Yep, I could have saved my friend a lot.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
Would you have presented this to your therapists.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Well, the fandom therapist would know about it already, so
you don't have to get into the I could.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Have just like, that's gonna be hard because as any therapist,
sometimes they hit new traumas that you have to kind
of work with them through. So I don't think that's
entirely fair, But especially if it's like newer releases of
stuff they weren't ready for. But the queer baiting part
I bet they would be ready for. I think they
would be ready for it, but not specifically to this show.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Maybe. Yeah, well that's why fictional therapist here, they would
have fictional thing. I like that. I like that. Yeah,
they would have to have specialties. That's why, Like when
I was thinking about what mine would be, I could
talk very specifically about like grief and loss and last
of us, I could talk about, oh, how Canon can
(20:16):
really hurt you with Star Wars destruction of something you
loved and have it used for something else, Like I
would have specialties.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
But yeah, no, No, it's been like I've just got
a lot going through my head and there are at
least two things in here I want to come back
and talk about more. So I have been learning a lot.
You know, you finally get cleervated in your thirties, you
start thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
You got it, You got to walk it through, you.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Do you do, And I'm doing my best, but I don't. Yeah,
like I said, I know, I'm like laughing through the
but we've heard from people how much it hurt you,
and so yeah, just if it has happened to you.
I'm very sorry, and you can write in about whatever.
(21:16):
We had somebody write in a very intense email that
I think they were also using humor to cope once.
But she was like, I survived this war, this war,
this queer baiting war. So you're a soldier.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
He's ready.
Speaker 1 (21:29):
Yeah, So, listeners, let us know any thoughts about this
or if you have any unfortunate experience with it, And
thank you for letting me ramble like I was racing through.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
You really were, but it was. I'm glad you had
the moment to be able to let it out. I'm
also curious about this presentation. We'll talk about it later.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Okay, maybe I'll publish it, maybe one day when I've
moved on and doesn't hurt anymore, or it's like behind me,
I'll publish it, okay. But in the meantime, listeners, if
you would like to contact us, you can. Our email
is hello at Stuffwenever Told You dot com. You can
also find us on Blue Skype, Mom Stuff podcast, or
on Instagram and TikTok at stuff one Never Told You.
(22:16):
We're also on YouTube. We have a book, and we
have some new merchandise at comp Bureau. Thanks as always
to our super du Christina or executive producer My and
your contributor Joey. Thank you and thanks to you for
listening stuff Never told you. Specture of I Heart Radio.
For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can check
out the heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or where you
listen to your favorite shows,
Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and one of the
stuff I've never told you prodiction of iHeartRadio, and welcome
to another edition of half Hour. On a very dreary Thursday.
We are recording this very spirit.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
We're gonna get another snow apocalypse possibly or isogeddon. I
think it could be ice.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
I think it's going to be ice, which is not fun.
That is not what we like, that's not what we want.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
This is not what we talked about.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Yeah. Well, as always with these halfy hours, if you
choose to drink, please do so responsibly. Samantha, are you
doing anything responsibly? Over there?
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Always things responsibly? I am a responsible, boring adult that
drinks water. End of story. Currently a peppermint because my
tummy is not happy with me. I'm not sure why,
but it's okay. Peppermints for the wind, not for me. Yeah,
not for you unless you're any and allergic.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Yes, So today's episode is going to be a chin
wine or kind of a wallow in wine actually, but
it's it's all gonna be fine. I've psycked myself up
for it. It's not going to be bad. So it
is just my usual red wine I was going to
make like a hot tidy situation because it is cold.
I was like, no, this feels right for this topic.
(01:42):
So before we start this, I want to say everything
in this is one hundred percent my opinion. Uh, and
it is my experience and it is how I deal
with things. I don't think I'm alone by any means,
but I certainly don't speak for everyone. I know. Oh,
this is a people have a lot of emotions and
thoughts about all of this. So just gonna put that
(02:06):
out there at the top, all right. So it finally
happened to me, Samantha, I was successfully queer baited. It happened.
And don't get me wrong, I have watched shows that
I would classify as queer baits, but either I'm too
(02:26):
cynical or like, that'll never happen. They'll never give me
what I want, which is, you know, a queer relationship.
But so I've never actually believed it could happen. Who anyway,
if you haven't listened to our episode on queer baiting,
(02:47):
you can. It's kind of old. We should probably that
was back in our early days, Samantha, when we did
that one.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah, it doesn't feel like that long ago, because I
can remember it.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Yeah, but it was ago. It probably was. So you
can go back and listen to that if you want,
if you want to know more. But basically, what I
will say is some people disagree on what qualifies as
queer bait. I would say there are some examples that
are just straight up queer bait, and then there are
(03:19):
some that are kind of in a more gray area.
But yeah, some people do disagree. If you want to
go and hear more about that, check out that episode.
I actually I actually wrote out a whole thing. I
never do this for a happy hour. Oh my god. Okay,
(03:39):
So I actually don't really want to talk about what
happened to me. I want to talk about the aftermath
of it because I am still processing. I am going
through Like I said in our New Year's episode, I
am processing a lot of queer stuff. I've been thinking
about queer issues for a while and I didn't realize it,
(03:59):
and I have been doing some of those episodes over
the past month. So I think we'll keep talking about it,
but I do, yeah, I want to talk about kind
of the what the fallout and the realizations I had
after it, and I do want to be clear about this.
I might sound a little jokey because that is how
(04:20):
I handle things, but it can sucked. Man. Like I
feel like I was hanging out with some friends that
I trusted. I was having a grand old time. We
were like in a car, we were laughing, and then
they sucker punstry in the face, threw me out the
car and left me ted dead on the highway like
I was. I know. It was like I was so
(04:44):
full of hope and then I was so shocked and
I was so hurt. I cried for like two days.
Oh no, no, I was miserable. So when I say
like I'm making this sound jokey, I was miserable. And
then I made it another friends problem and I made
her sit through a two plus hour presentation that had
(05:07):
videos and images to prove I was not delusional.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
When I tell this a YouTube thing that you show
or did you create this thing?
Speaker 1 (05:18):
I created? Okay, I brought together clips from YouTube, so
in that sense I created it. Yes, Yeah, I had
to back up my points.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, I love that this is not an essay, but
it was a visual representation this time.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
See when I tell you I write these essays, I
need you to believe.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
It is true, but you've come to the new reform.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
I asked her. I was like, would you prefer powerpois or.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Do you want me to write this out? Do you
want me to make this a musical or would you
like it in video form?
Speaker 1 (05:54):
I'm so embarrassed. And she was like, I have my
one condition. I'm going to take a candid picture of
you doing it. And it's very funny because there's a
I didn't place it there specifically or purposefully, but there's
a like affirmation box I have that says calm right
in front of me, and I'm clearly not calm.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
I like, she took a photo evidence. I'm sure I'll
reach out to her and find it.
Speaker 1 (06:20):
Don't keep don't, don't, don't, don't don't. I'm embarrassed anyway,
but it was because I was yeah, I was like, so,
it was just so I was distraught and I was
confused and I needed someone to be like, no, I'm
sorry you're coming from And after I did that, I
cried some more because I brought up new I like
(06:42):
dredged it all back up. So if this has happened
to you, I am really sorry. I'm really, really really sorry,
So do not take any of this as dismissal. This
is just me coping right now.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Any way to cope.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Yeah, And I can't really tell you, I suppose how
you have to handle it in your life, but I
promise you I was legitimately hurt. I did kind of
feel traumatized. And there are a lot of reasons for this, because,
(07:20):
first of all, I want to talk about the delusional part,
where it immediately becomes like, oh, I was delusional this
whole time, and that's what people will say online. One
of the things that really hurts about being queer abated,
which if you don't know, I feel like it's pretty obvious,
but it's like you're given hints or promises of a
queer romantic relationship through the source material and usually those
(07:42):
involved making it, and then it not coming to fruition.
Usually at the very end, it's like you're so happy
and you're looking for these things and you're getting all
these signals that it might happen, and then they're like, oh,
actually not, and then they make fun of you for it.
(08:03):
How could you have ever believed that, like obviously that
would never ever happen. And that sucks because as a
queer person, not only do you have to like really
look for good representation and then you find crumbs of
it where you can. But at least some of us
feel this and real life like we feel delusional looking
(08:26):
for any sign that someone is like us, that someone
might like us. And you know, like straight people have
signals too, and there's that level of like reading into
signals for any relationship, but when you're queer, it can
feel much more rare and much more unsafe to misinterpret
those things. So when we are talking about like compets
(08:48):
our compulsory heterosexuality, which we have recently are internalized homophobia.
I hadn't realized until recently how much I do micromanage
things so someone can misinterpret them because I'm gay and
they might misinterpret something and I don't want that, and
that usually looks like withdraw. I think that looks like
(09:09):
withdraw for a lot of queer people, but especially for me,
it looks like, oh, I can't contact them first. I
can never do this first. And I'm not even talking
about guys, I'm talking about anybody like. I don't want
to be the one that does that because they might
misread it, and then the other person of course, is thinking, well,
they don't want to talk to me. She never reaches
out first. It's just a mess. So yeah, those are
(09:30):
the things that you're It's very like projecting, it's very
reading into yourself. But you're thinking like, what if they
think I'm flirting and they're disgusted by it? What if
they realize what I am? And then you shut down
an you wait for them to come to you. And again,
this is not unique to queer people, but it is
something that for a lot of us ties back to
(09:51):
fear and shame. So when you're consuming media and you're
trying to read into these signals that sometimes feel pretty clear,
and then they tell you like you are illusional, it's
very destabilizing, and people make you feel embarrassed and perverted
about it, which I'm going to get into a more second,
but anyway, I don't feel like they do this with
straight couples, especially like the you must be perverted part.
(10:16):
I'm still hung up on that, and I am embarrassed
and I feel stupid. And this is why I brought
my friend and made her watch this Present Day because
I was like, I needed somebody to tell me I
hadn't lost my mind because people online were like, oh,
y'all are desperate, and I was like, yeah, kinda for
good representation kind of yes, And it's all sad, Like
(10:39):
you start you are not only questioning everything you're doing
as a real life queer person, you start questioning everything
someone else is doing, and like how you're reading into
what they are doing, and it's just very confusing. And
I think it probably can be fun when you know
(10:59):
someone else's sextuality or you feel really confident in yours,
but for a lot of us, it's not so fun.
So having something like this is just painful. And sometimes
you do you resign yourself to a life of never
finding what you want, and then you think you're finally
gonna see some queer joy and then you don't get
(11:21):
it and you're like, well, see, there it is. And
also this is a topic for another another day. But
a lot of the queer baiting stuff, I've actually missed
a lot of the big ones. Some of you have
written in about some of the queer baiting shipping wars
you've been involved with, and I've luckily sailed by. But
(11:42):
a lot of thing that does come up with many
of them is queer trauma versus queer joy, So a
lot of times it will be like a very sad
queer story and then maybe like a hint of joy
that you don't really see anywhere. So another thing this
is also going to have to be I'm still wrestling
with this. I've been wrestling with this for a while.
(12:04):
But there's this idea that I've seen around queer baiting
a lot where people are like almost implying that you're
a Monster's too strong a word, but like just that
why do you have to take everything like it means
something it doesn't have to mean anything. Are like why
(12:27):
can't they just be friends or whatever? Which I'm gonna
come back to in a second. But one thing that
has stuck out to me. I this is years ago,
this happened, and I'm still dealing with it, But there
was this big there's a big narrative of around queer
baiting that's usually like character X is making character why uncomfortable,
(12:47):
which I would disagree with given the only like the
constant monitoring thing that usually do as a queer person,
But okay, sure, but it did remind me of when
longtime friend of mine, many many many years ago told
me that he wanted to date, and I was devastated
because I thought it meant that I had been leading
(13:09):
him on when I thought I was just being friendly
and how I scared of my own body, and I
very dramatically wrote about how I was a monster in
my journal. I felt awful, But it wasn't anything that
he did. It wasn't anything I did, to be honest,
but I was shifting the blame onto me. And we've
talked about this before. A lot of women do. This
(13:32):
is not just a queer thing. But I guess what
I'm trying to say when it comes to this conversation
is that, yeah, it can be scary when a friend
feels differently than you do. But I wasn't uncomfortable by
what he did. Afterwards, after he told me, I started
to like be like, oh, I wasn't seeing it that way.
(13:53):
I definitely didn't think he'd done anything like perverted or wrong.
And I did end updating him four years because that's
what I thought I was supposed to want and supposed
to do. And that comes back to the compulsory heterosexuality conversation.
I don't know, I just don't think I see that
as much with straight couples and media where they're immediately like, oh,
(14:15):
it's making him feel uncomfortable or she's making her feel uncomfortable.
It's like, oh, I don't think so it's not anything major.
And yes, like I said, another of the big ones is, no,
they can't just be best friends. We're all for friends.
You know, Samantha and I love best friends. Those is
(14:35):
probably some of the best relationships you can see. Forget
all this romance. But so, I mean sometimes, especially if
they're giving you, like as an audience, like clear insight
into a character's thoughts, intentional choices and music and color
and set design and everything that's meant to communicate things.
(14:59):
So oh, sure, I love best friends, but it would
be nice if it wasn't always directed at like a
potential queer couple that was probably queer bait that, oh,
it can't just be friends. I'm like, sure, but that's
not what they were telling us. With all this information,
(15:20):
and y'all know, like, I feel like I'm just going
on a while. This is why I had to write
this one out. I'm getting derailed. But y'all know, I
process things easier through fictional works and characters. So to
experience this. It was not good. It was not good
for me, and especially like there was also just dismissing
it as a joke. I feel like I said that,
(15:42):
but like kind of the not only are you delusional?
That's very funny that you thought that. I've learned a lot.
That's what I'll say. I've learned a lot through this journey.
(16:06):
I've learned so much about color theory and music theory.
And it's very funny to see other people talking about
this and just be like, oh, okay, so I'm not
the only one. I mean, presentation was pretty good. And
my friend, I have to say when she when it
(16:27):
was over, she was like, you convinced me and she
said it like she meant it. So before somebod y'all
you did this.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Did she have that same feeling of puibating doing that point.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I don't think she'd formed enough. Okay, I like opinion
about it. She was a what a sport? What a sport?
But it's funny because I, you know, I'm an ace
person and so kind of cracks me up how much
I've learned through this. But it it's also funny because
(17:03):
I have realized this over the years. I could care
less about straight couples. Usually I do not care. But
if it's a queer couple, even if that's not like
what I like identify with, I don't really want to
be with somebody. I still want that that I'm interested
in and that I want to see because I always
(17:25):
get kind of hung up on that, and I think
it's just because you don't see it very often. And
as you know, I love fan fiction. I love it.
I love it, I love it, I write it. But
sometimes you do want to like see it or read it,
(17:46):
and you want other people to see it or read
it too, like to see that it's possible. It's not delusional.
This does exist, and this is like the pros and
cons of loving something to the can hurt you so bad.
And I love these things so much and so it
(18:06):
got me.
Speaker 2 (18:08):
So, how do you feel about the show now? You
still love the show? I don't know the show talking about.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
So well, no, no, no, I don't want to say that.
I'm still like processing the whole thing, and I have
like coping mechanisms and basically headcannon, headcannon. But that's yeah,
coping mechanism. But yeah, that's the other thing is like
(18:34):
clearly there's an audience for clear romance, and not even
just for queer people. You can see some examples going
on right now, despite what some studios seem to believe,
because a lot of times they'll put like one like
Star Wars. It is the first one that's coming to mind,
but you know, like two seconds of a gay couple kissing.
(18:56):
They're like sweet it, and you're like no, but you
all have also had a bunch of other couples. You
could have like are you put it in your comics?
Which I love, but they're just not mainstream as much
as like movies or the shows Learner or something like that.
This is also another reminder as what why we need
fandom therapists. Yep, I could have saved my friend a lot.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
Would you have presented this to your therapists.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Well, the fandom therapist would know about it already, so
you don't have to get into the I could.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Have just like, that's gonna be hard because as any therapist,
sometimes they hit new traumas that you have to kind
of work with them through. So I don't think that's
entirely fair, But especially if it's like newer releases of
stuff they weren't ready for. But the queer baiting part
I bet they would be ready for. I think they
would be ready for it, but not specifically to this show.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Maybe. Yeah, well that's why fictional therapist here, they would
have fictional thing. I like that. I like that. Yeah,
they would have to have specialties. That's why, Like when
I was thinking about what mine would be, I could
talk very specifically about like grief and loss and last
of us, I could talk about, oh, how Canon can
(20:16):
really hurt you with Star Wars destruction of something you
loved and have it used for something else, Like I
would have specialties.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Yeah, okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (20:29):
But yeah, no, No, it's been like I've just got
a lot going through my head and there are at
least two things in here I want to come back
and talk about more. So I have been learning a lot.
You know, you finally get cleervated in your thirties, you
start thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
You got it, You got to walk it through, you.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Do you do, And I'm doing my best, but I don't. Yeah,
like I said, I know, I'm like laughing through the
but we've heard from people how much it hurt you,
and so yeah, just if it has happened to you.
I'm very sorry, and you can write in about whatever.
(21:16):
We had somebody write in a very intense email that
I think they were also using humor to cope once.
But she was like, I survived this war, this war,
this queer baiting war. So you're a soldier.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
He's ready.
Speaker 1 (21:29):
Yeah, So, listeners, let us know any thoughts about this
or if you have any unfortunate experience with it, And
thank you for letting me ramble like I was racing through.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
You really were, but it was. I'm glad you had
the moment to be able to let it out. I'm
also curious about this presentation. We'll talk about it later.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Okay, maybe I'll publish it, maybe one day when I've
moved on and doesn't hurt anymore, or it's like behind me,
I'll publish it, okay. But in the meantime, listeners, if
you would like to contact us, you can. Our email
is hello at Stuffwenever Told You dot com. You can
also find us on Blue Skype, Mom Stuff podcast, or
on Instagram and TikTok at stuff one Never Told You.
(22:16):
We're also on YouTube. We have a book, and we
have some new merchandise at comp Bureau. Thanks as always
to our super du Christina or executive producer My and
your contributor Joey. Thank you and thanks to you for
listening stuff Never told you. Specture of I Heart Radio.
For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can check
out the heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or where you
listen to your favorite shows,
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