April 18, 2026 • 58 mins
In the wake of Trump's loss in the 2020 election, he and his cronies attacked two Black women poll workers, Ruby Freeman and Shay Moss, baselessly claiming they had tampered with votes. In this classic episode, Bridget Todd breaks down why this was so effective, the online eco-system that amplified it, and the ramifications.
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Anny and Samantha.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
A look of stuff. I never told you, aflicture if I
heard you, And welcome to another classic and today we
were bringing back a Bridgid episode. She always does such
great episodes about the treatment of Shay and Ruby, right.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
I thought it was something that we should look at
because this was based in Georgia. And I don't know
if you're keeping up with everything about this happening when
it comes to elections as well as politics in Georgia,
but it's getting kind of heated. Our Fulton County District
Attorney has been going through it. Fanny willis with President
(00:52):
Trump at this point, and one of the things mentioned
was this case as well. So I felt like it
was a good time to revisit this episode as well
as talk about the importance of election workers as election
season this year and is pretty heated right now.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yes, yes, it is, so please enjoy this classic episode. Hey,
this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stefan never
told you a production of iHeartRadio and welcome back to Samantha.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
My voice is like I just realized as I'm talking
to you, my voice went down.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
By sexy sick voice here we go.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Yeah, oh jeez, I almost said welcome back to Samantha
and the intro. So this is gonna be fun. But
it is a momentous occasion because not only is Samantha
back from COVID, we are joined by the splendid, splendiferous
Brigit Todd. Always a pleasure to have you.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Oh, I'm so happy to be back. I'm happy Samantha's back.
This is your inaugural recordings since being out from COVID.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
How are you feeling, you know, Like I said, I've
got this voice, but I'm feeling much better. This is
the first time I've ever had COVID, so that was
an experience.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Not cool with your best.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yeah, public service.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Like if you can, if you're in the crowd, do it.
I would recommend it, recommend would recommend.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Yes. But oh, y'all, I didn't get to ask you
because I got to complain a lot.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Oh that's the benefit of you know, if you got
to wait the plus side of getting COVID, then the
benefit is to complain.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
I've been waiting to tell you all the als I almost.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
Died complaining and watching lots of TV. Yeah, the best
part about being sick.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
That was my big when I got COVID. I remember,
like I went to shock at first, and I was like,
but the soup though.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I couldn't eat anything hardly, Oh no, eat soup. Yeah,
that's like legitimately like the sucks.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Well that was the because I didn't have like I
sneezed a lot. That was my symptom for like two days.
That was that's so weird.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Well, how are y'all? I hope you were healthy.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yes, I am good. I'm getting actually the updated COVID
vaccine to day vaccine because Bridget who unfortunately has technical
difficulties and we can't see. We're going to Las Vegas
this week.
Speaker 4 (03:37):
That's right for the iHeart Music Festival. Look Out, Las Vegas.
Speaker 5 (03:42):
Look out.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Threatening.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
I mean like not like okay, we're gonna like do
engaging podcasts in your city, Las Vegas.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
Look out for that, not.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Like okay, okay, yeah, we're doing some podcast there. It's
gonna be fun. Samantha is going on a birthday vacation time.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
Yeah, I am missing out. Like the first time in
the years that they asked us to do something. I'm like, yeah, no,
I'm going to go the opposite way. But thanks for asking.
Speaker 5 (04:12):
I'll be on the other coast.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
I like that, but thanks for asking. But yes, I'm
excited to see Bridget in person. And yeah, I'm trying
to not get COVID there, so we'll see how that goes.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
Yeah, because you have more, you have other plans coming out.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I do. I'm going to Orlando because I love a
good haunted house and I love the Last of Us
and there's a Last of Us Haunted house, so's.
Speaker 5 (04:40):
It's like Last of Us themed. Yeah, yeah, my god,
you're gonna.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
That's that's upper Alley, that's like made in a lab
for you, and I know, I know it is.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
I've already seen like TikTok videos that I've had to
send her to like, oh my god.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Her responses. I can't wait.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
I might die of excitement. Oh my god, how are you?
Speaker 5 (05:00):
Yes, I'm doing well, looking forward to Vegas. Also hoping
I don't get sick.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
Yeah, just I think I just need to like stay
in until my flight, just like don't leave my house.
And so just so, because now I'm now I'm like
very nervous, but hopefully it'll be all good. And yeah,
I'm excited to hear more about this last of us
haunted house after you go give us a full report.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Oh oh.
Speaker 5 (05:25):
Oh, I love scary well. I like that. I like titillated.
Speaker 4 (05:31):
There there can be a line where it's like too scary,
so it has to be. It's a little bit of
a finding the right balance vibe for me. I enjoy
spooky things. I enjoy hobble mean, I enjoy haunted houses.
But if it's too scary, then I'm like no longer
enjoying it. So it has to be just the right mits.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
So you don't mind being chased.
Speaker 4 (05:49):
I don't mind being chased. I went to a haunted
house last Halloween, and for some reason, you know, the
like performers who chase you. There was a guy with
a chainsaw who for some reason was like, I'm to
chase her.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
I spent the whole one.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
I spent the whole haunted house. I basically was like.
Speaker 5 (06:05):
Like worked out. Essentially, this guy was chasing me the
whole time.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
See, I used to there's like a key to get
them to pick you. There's a couple like if you
want them to pick you as the person. And I
used to like play that up because I liked being
scared so much.
Speaker 5 (06:22):
What do you do if you want to be picked?
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Uh, there are a couple of things. One of the
big ones is where color. They can see pretty well
in the dark. Another one is I don't usually do
this one, but if you're like really funny being scared,
if you're like really over the top being scared, they
will target.
Speaker 3 (06:39):
This is why I don't go to them because I
know my face, my reaction will say everything and then
they'll pick on me.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
And I'm gonna fight somebody.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
You know that's fair.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
I'm a fight or fight girl, and apparently I fight.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Hey, hey, at least you know it.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
I'm not fast enough.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
It depends, it depends.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
I tip somebody.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
I have faith in you.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I'm maneuver.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
My way I'd said that this is my thing is
like if I would have to do the like trips,
I'm sorry, I would be the villain and set someone
up so I can survive.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Oh instead, yeah, okay, yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
That's fine.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
Old host Caroline and I get along really well because
we have our apocalypse plan is that she's just going
to give up.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
So that's my decoy to survive using her giving up.
Speaker 5 (07:29):
I'm going to be a final girl.
Speaker 4 (07:30):
No matter what I'm making it to the end of this,
of this situation.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
I'm like, I will not be the minority that gets killed.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
I like that You've got a plan.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Well, I have to make sure I'm with Carolina.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
I think that's the first plan. Yes, well, way, happy Halloween.
We do have a quite horrifying thing to discuss today.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Horrifying or is it like vivor exciting?
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Well, yeah, but transition wise, this is a very scary
thing to talk about. You gotta play along with my transition.
Speaker 4 (08:13):
No, cur I've lived for your masterful transitions are so good.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Thank you. I will lay awake at night be like,
how can I do this? Just so you know, there's
a lot of work going on behind the curtains here.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
She's been staring at this waiting for it.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Yeah, oh, all the time. But yes, can you tell
us what we are talking about today, Bridget Yes.
Speaker 4 (08:35):
So, folks probably by now have seen in the news
that former President Trump and eighteen of his associates are
facing charges for violating Georgia's Racketeering, Influence and Corrupt Organizations
or REICHO act.
Speaker 5 (08:48):
Basically, when you are doing some.
Speaker 4 (08:50):
Like organized crime like mob style activities, Georgia as I'm
sure y'all know, take that very seriously, and these are
related to schemes to try to keep Trump in office
after he lost the election. So a big piece of
these charges stem from the way that Trump and his
associate Rudy Giuliani basically claimed that two black women poll workers,
(09:13):
a mother daughter duo Ruby Freeman and Shay Moss, had
tampered with votes.
Speaker 5 (09:17):
Now that has been time and time.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
Again, like on the official record, these women have been
cleared of wrongdoing, and that did not stop Trump and
Giuliani from baselessly, repeatedly and publicly putting them in danger
by lying about them. And so I really see this
story as like a culmination of so many of the
things that I talk about on my own pod. You
(09:40):
know what happens when racism and sexism just run unchecked
online and really creates the conditions for dangerous lies about
black women to find a welcome home where they can
be amplified and legitimized. In this case, those lies threatened
democracy for all of us. And so I think that
there's so much meati reporting going on about what's happening
(10:02):
with these charges related to Trump, but I think it's
important that the story of these women does not go
overlooked or does not go missed, because at its heart,
it is about how these people used their positions and
their power to baselessly smear like two people who hadn't
done anything wrong. And so I just think their story
(10:22):
and their testibility, it's just important to me to keep
making sure that we really center that and that it
doesn't get lost.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
Right because, as we've talked about before, as I am
in Fulton County, that is where I vote a lot
of the times, it's mostly black women who are volunteering
at these voting places and making it run so smoothly
and doing all of these things. And to hear about
this about two people who were wanting to help their
(10:53):
community and did nothing wrong but being used as scapegoats
and that getting amplified in online space and then being
kind of chased away from it, like, it's really upsetting
because that is such an important job. It's so important
to voting, and it's just just because these guys are
(11:19):
jerks and liars, we're looking for someone people that they
could blame, that people would get behind them blaming is
really upsetting.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
Yeah, and you put that exactly right.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
I think that I'm really drawn to the humanity of
Ruby and Shay, but really it's really not just about
them and their story because these attacks on election workers,
poll workers who are like largely women, like that's you know,
a thing, So it's definitely gendered. These attacks on them
are also attacks on democracy because if people like, if
(11:52):
you saw the way that Ruby and Shay were treated
and how other election workers were treated, threatened, harassed, lied about, targeted,
why would you want to do that work? That work
is not well paid. It's not work that is like
put on a pedestal or like well protected or given
a lot of respect. It used to be, and it
should be, but unfortunately it's not. And so if regular
(12:13):
people who are interested in like disc helping our civic
process move forward and move smoothly, if those people are like,
I don't want to do this work anymore, why would
I want to do this? And the only people who
are invested and interested in doing this work are extremists,
it's not good for democracy. And so it's all like,
we'll talk about some of the findings from how this
(12:35):
has impacted elections writ large, but yeah, if election centers
have to close because no one wants to work them.
That means that less people are going to be able
to access those polling places. Polling places end up shutting down.
The wheels of democracy are not able to move as
smoothly as they should. And democracy is like a pretty
(12:56):
tenuous thing. I think I never really thought about it before,
how fragile it is. How you definitely need things to
be moving smoothly, and it doesn't really take much.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
To have the whole system come crashing down.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
Right, to give some context about what Fulton County is,
because we talk about Fulton County and not many of
the people outside of Georgia know what that means.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
We have the funny song that talks about that's not Atlanta.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Fulton County is Atlanta, which is heavily populated with a
lot of black votes and largely amount of black communities,
one of the bluest areas, one of the reasons why
we turn blue in the first place. And after all
of the voting rights stuff that happened with our governor
trying to take away so many things, including not allowing
to give out water, not allowing people to sit, all
(13:50):
of these things, it was pointedly for places like Fulton
County again, especially with all the Jerryman drag and such.
And it's quite funny that the people who were making
such big threats and pointing at Fulton were not from Fulton.
They are literally from outskirts where other places have been
proven to have a campaign election fraud, typically from again
(14:13):
Republican side from the twenty twenty election that we saw,
and it was very, very very targeted for that very reason.
They needed, as you said, to target black women because
we know that for the past decades of election it's
been black women who have turned the votes and really
have made a difference in places like Georgia, which no
(14:34):
one ever saw ever turning blue at any point in time.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
And so it in that context this is a fight.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
It literally was a place to start a war when
it came to elections.
Speaker 4 (14:47):
I've always thought it has got to be so exhausting
to live in Fulton County because it's just like it's
you're just trying to live your life and exists and
all these different institutional horses and like power powerful figures
are trying to stop you from doing that at every turn,
And I just can't imagine what it's like to be
to live someplace but it's just like constantly the subject
(15:11):
of conversation and scrutiny and trickery.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
It's just like it's got to be exhausting.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
You know, bridget one of the first conversations you and
I ever had when we met, what's in twenty nineteen, No,
I guess it was way before then, in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 5 (15:26):
I think that's right.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
You Literally I asked you if you would move to Atlanta,
and you said, we already had our own stuff at Washington.
I don't I don't know if I can do it
again in Atlanta. Yeah, you have to get involved in
it real quickly, because when you were talking about Abrams
something about at the time, and you're like, I don't
know if I can do that again.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
Yeah, that was my whole thing.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
There was a time where I was like, I think
I might have to move to Atlanta, and just the
idea of like and not that DC doesn't have its problem.
Speaker 5 (15:55):
It's just like I have the energy.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
I would have to start again if I can, And
rightly so, it is exhausting. And again because the crux
of the work has been done by the black community,
black women. The organization Fair Fight was created by Stacy
Abrams after her first election, and we know so many
things had happened at that point, and I'm still very
(16:18):
bitter about that point and really caused so much that
we did become a focal point. Georgia specifically Fulton County
became a focal point to this point that Shay and
Ruby got targeted because they needed to find two people
that they can make as suspicious as possible that is
on the side that has been making this huge turnaround.
Speaker 5 (16:41):
So I'm so glad that you put it that way.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
And this is something that I think has kind of
I would say gotten missed, but I would say has
just sort of been implied, and I think that we
should just like say it as is. I believe that
the reason why the attacks on Ruby and Shay were
so effective and like took hold is because they are
black women.
Speaker 5 (17:01):
I think that you're exactly right.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
They needed somebody to pin the Georgia loss on, and
I think that there there's it's not a surprise that
the people they went after were these two black women.
And I think that the way that race and gender
and class intersected to make them these these like effective
(17:24):
targets for this kind of smear campaign.
Speaker 5 (17:26):
I don't think that.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
We have like fully unpacked what that means and why
it was effective. Even in reporting that I think is
really good, like reporting that I respect, I just think
it relies on us to confront some uncomfortable truths about
our society. And I don't think that we have fully
contended with what happened to Ruby and Shay, why it
was effective, and how it was allowed to be amplified
(17:49):
by people like social media platforms and media outlets and
all of that. So yeah, I just think like it's
something we really got to talk about and something that
I think that we really got to take a lot
of important lessons and truths from. So if folks don't know,
Ruby and Shaye were election workers in Fulton County, Georgia,
a state that Trump lost in twenty twenty, get ready
for me to say that over and over again, because
(18:09):
it is a fact, so.
Speaker 5 (18:11):
You might recall.
Speaker 4 (18:11):
I'm sure that y'all recall that in Georgia, he Trump
pressured the Secretary Sake to like find votes for him
to rewrite history. Shay had actually been an election worker
in Georgia for a long time. Listening to her talk
about it, she describes it as something that she had
really done in an effort to support her community and
just like something that she felt like was her civic duty.
Speaker 5 (18:33):
You know.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
She has talked about how like her community has a
lot of older black folks in it, like elders, and
that she saw doing this work as an election worker
as part of service to like the elders in her community.
So was really just like wanted to do her civic good.
During twenty twenty, Fulton County was meant to have a
shortage and election workers because of COVID, so Shae recruited
(18:57):
her then sixty two year old mom, Ruby, a retired
nine to one one operator, to also serve as an
election worker. So this is something that I think is
very sad like. In their testimony, Shay has talked about
how she feels quite a bit of guilt for recruiting
her mother into this work, of course not knowing how
(19:19):
could she know that Trump and Juliani would attack them
in this way, but she she has described feeling quite
a bit of guilt at getting her mom involved in this,
which just really really breaks my heart.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Yeah, that's the when and I know we're going to
talk about this, but when like the whole family gets
drawn into this thing that you think you're doing. They
were doing this like civic duty, feeling really like, this
is what I want to do for my community, and
that is democracy at work. That is like, oh, I
(19:52):
want to make this happen and it's really important to
me and to have that to feel guilty about that,
because they're these other undemocratic like pascist forces who threaten
and who make you feel unsafe and make your loved
ones feel unsafe, like it is heartbreaking, it is it's
(20:14):
disgusting that this is what happens.
Speaker 5 (20:17):
It really is.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
And so basically, on December third, twenty twenty, a lawyer
working for the Trump campaign obtained security video of election
night from.
Speaker 5 (20:27):
State Farm Arena in Georgia.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
So the video just shows like election workers in general,
including Ruby and Shay, just like doing their jobs right,
like nothing untoward is going on. The lawyer brought the
video to the Georgia State Senate Committee, saying that he
thought it showed someone who had the name Ruby across
her shirt somewhere finding a suitcase of ballots from underneath
the table. Now all of this is just a complete lie.
(20:51):
The video just shows them working normally, the election workers
were told to like pack it up for the night,
so they put the ballots away.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
They didn't put them in suitcases.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
They put them in like the normal ballots where ballots
are always kept. And later in the night they were
told to go ahead and restart the count, don't wait
till the morning, and so that's what they did. The
video is just like normal election worker business. But I
think the presence of like just these two black women
was enough for this person to be like, something's going
(21:20):
on here.
Speaker 5 (21:20):
I need to flag this.
Speaker 4 (21:22):
So the video starts making its way online through this
cottage industry of like extremist blogs and media sites. Once
it's in that online pipeline, it's basically everywhere, Like it
doesn't matter. By the time that it starts making the rounds,
it has already been thoroughly debunked by Georgia Secretary of State.
Speaker 5 (21:40):
None of that matters.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
It's already like in this pipeline, and it's going to
be amplified despite the fact that it's already been proven alive.
Speaker 5 (21:47):
So this is where we.
Speaker 4 (21:49):
Meet a big vector of lies and like dissemination of
these lives about Ruby and Shay. The gateway Puntit, which
is an extremist right wing media site. Research from the
Universe Steve Washington Center for an inform Public found that
the Gateway Pundit was the second most prolific purveyor of
election misinformation on Twitter during twenty twenty.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
So they are like.
Speaker 4 (22:10):
A big source of incorrect, inaccurate information about our elections.
And once they get that video, they publish an article
under the headline huge all caps video footage from Georgia
show suitcases filled with ballots pulled from under table after
all caps supervisor told GOP poll workers to leave tabulation center.
(22:34):
So again that's just like a completely misleading claim. But
the way that they framed it is like, we found
this bombshell video evidence of the smoking gun of votes
being tampered with and the election being stolen from Donald Trump.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Which is so hilarious because Fulton County was never Donald
Like it's never.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Been readbody else who lives in Georgia are like, what, no, wait,
and it reminds me honestly, I watched it for like
a few seasons, but a setup of a scandal episode
actlutely the graany security video where they just like redline
somethings and you're like, oh my god, there it is, and.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
They're like, no, wait, they're just boxes. What's happening the proof?
Speaker 5 (23:24):
And it's so funny.
Speaker 4 (23:25):
There's a thing that happens online where anything can look
nefarious if.
Speaker 5 (23:29):
It's like grainy video and you write in all caps
on it.
Speaker 4 (23:33):
Like and it's just like a video of people like
moving around in an empty office building, and it's like
they're like all caps like busted. Like anything looks nefarious
when you when you frame it that.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Way, and then you're like, wait for it. You're like wait,
wait for what, wait for what? We look at it.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
See.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
My My like association with this is ghost videos, which
I don't believe in ghosts, but I watch ghost videos
and they'll be.
Speaker 5 (23:54):
Like there it is.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
I'm like where and they'll circle something and I'm.
Speaker 3 (23:58):
Like, I'm blaming on my eyesight. I'm like it must
be there, like they circled something.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
I really don't see anything there.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
But yeah, it's really interesting because obviously all they needed
they knew that.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
This is why I say this to the scale of video.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
They're like, if we can just pull this video of
these grainy subjects with boxes and then circle the boxes.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
People will believe this, and they it worked. It literally
began the.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
Like I'm like, wow, this is a bad like Shonda
Rhime's episode what is happening?
Speaker 4 (24:32):
It truly is, And so the Gateway Pundit continued taking
their nose from a bad episode of scandal.
Speaker 5 (24:38):
They called Ruby out by name.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
Ruby is somebody who really likes to wear like she
talks about how she was very proud of her name
before all this happened, and so she likes to wear
personalized shirts and hats and things that have her name
on it. So the Gameway Pundit called her out by name,
writing on the site her name is Ruby Freeman.
Speaker 5 (24:57):
And she made the.
Speaker 4 (24:57):
Mistake of advertising her purse on her desk the same
night she was involved in voter fraud on a massive
scale all caps. Her t shirt says Lady Ruby and
her purse says La Ruby, which is her company. This
is not a smart move. Her company is called Larruby's
Unique Treasures. It's on her LinkedIn page. Maybe the Georgia
Police or Bill Barr's DOJ may want to pay Ruby
(25:18):
Freeman a visit. The article concludes with images of Ruby
over the banner that says crook gets caught.
Speaker 5 (25:26):
They play this video on a n N, which is
a kind of I.
Speaker 4 (25:32):
Guess you could call it like a far right news network,
and that is really when it like really blows up.
So once the video gets on to own, that is
when Trump starts amplifying it on his own Twitter, that
is when Fox News starts talking about it, and that
is when the campaign of harassment really gets scary for
(25:55):
these women. Just three days later, after Trump starts amplifying
it on Twitter, Ruby calls nine to one one to
report people showing up at her home, which is terrifying,
and I think it's really important to point out the
ways that racism and misogyny worked to fuel these lives.
I just do not believe that had Ruby and her
(26:15):
daughter not been black women, and that if we did
not have a digital media climate that is like ready
and poised and willing to validate and amplify the worst
racist lies about black women who we know are disproportionately
harmed by conspiracy theories and disinformation and harassments, I don't
think it would have taken off like it did.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
This kind of reminded me of when we did our
episode on Megan Markle, there was all of this outrage
about like, look, she's making all this money from podcasting,
which is just complete nonsense. But I feel like that
going back to that quote of like, oh she's advertising
her company, Look how crass, Like it just I felt
(27:09):
like there was a through line of you know, for
black women so ready to be like that's disgusting, like how.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
Like for things that are totally commonplace, But it's like
when it's a black woman doing it and it's said
in this like manner that is clearly meant to convey
like judgment, it just I mean, people are just willing,
like the Megan and Markle stuff, Like I remember reading like,
oh she ate avocado toast.
Speaker 5 (27:38):
It doesn't matter what it is.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
It's not really about the substance of what she's done
or her behavior or what she said or anything of substance.
It's just like it's just like pulling from this societal
distrust of her identity. And that's what I think really
helped these attacks on Shay and Ruby take hold. I
do not think that had they been white women or
(28:00):
men they that these attacks would have been as amplified
and have taken off the way that they did.
Speaker 5 (28:06):
I just don't. And part of the evidence is the way.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
That the people who were harassing them and attacking them
were doing it in a way.
Speaker 5 (28:14):
That is so clearly racialized.
Speaker 4 (28:16):
Like Rudi Giuliani in a phone call, he looked at
the tape and he said, these women are quite obviously
surreptitiously passing around USB ports as if they're vials of
heroin or cocaine. I mean, it's obvious to anyone who's
a criminal investigator or a prosecutor that they're engaged in
surreptitious illegal activity. Again that day, they're walking around Georgia lying.
(28:38):
They should have been questioned already, their places of work,
their homes should have been searched for evidence of ballots,
evidence of USB ports, evidence of voter fraud. So he's
accusing these women of passing USB ports back and forth
as if they're vials of cocaine or heroin, which, like,
tell me, that is not meant to be a racist
dog whistle. But in reality, these women were just giving
(28:59):
each other a piece of candy. They were like, Oh,
I had a piece of candy in my hand that
I was passing it to my mom, And that's what
that like from that totally innocuous movement. Giuliani said that
they were passing USB ports, is that they were vials
of heroin or cocaine, like like, truly, truly beyond the
pale of just delusional lies.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
I love that the melting man is the one accused,
and there's so many things that this is, this is
for real. I don't know what's happening, you know.
Speaker 3 (29:30):
I have to say in this whole thing that when
I remember what was happening at this point, I don't
think I remembered their names. I just remember people being accused,
and it was specifically two black women that though eventually
the Secretary of State, who got a lot of praise
and he shouldn't have as well as our governor, eventually
(29:50):
started defending them, but not until after they were docked.
It was an interesting setup of like they allowed this
to happen to see again and at the very least
they stood up, but enough to be like, yes, our
votes are fine, there's nothing incredulous about this.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
There's nothing incriminating in here.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
After the fact, But during this time, they didn't do shit.
They're like I remember, like they're just saying they're investigating
that was that was they kept everything kind of to
the side, not agreeing, not saying anything, and until they
started getting harassed, their life was being threatened, and then
they're like, okay, okay, okay, well now we need to
(30:30):
put a stop to this. But they allowed this to
escalate to that point again because they did not care
about protecting them either, like for what they did later shore.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
But I feel like there should have been charges for
their negligence.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
But hey, yeah, I mean by then they had thoroughly
internally debunked this video and they quietly.
Speaker 5 (30:51):
Released like statements eventually, but they knew. We know that
they knew.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
The entire time that Shaye and Ruby had done that
thing wrong and it had been investigated. And so I'm
with you in my book, was just my opinion. You
don't get a ton of credit for quietly eventually being like, actually,
they didn't do anything wrong, and we've already like debunked
this video when they were being like physically threatened by
(31:17):
armed psychopaths.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
Right, And I think it's obvious that they could see
the evidence about how racist this was, how sexist and racist,
like how this all came from misogynoire, but they just
couldn't say that, because then they would have to say
that their party is exactly what we see them as,
and so therefore they were just quietly defending them, not
(31:40):
truly helping. It's it's obvious also that they allowed those perpetrators,
and I'm going to call them perpetrators at this point,
Giuliani and Trump to continue this tirade even after the
fact that they did not do anything to stop them
from harassing.
Speaker 5 (31:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
In that the infamous call that Trump made to join
just Secretary of State Brad Raethensberger asking him to find votes,
Donald Trump calls Ruby out by name. In that call,
he says, we had at least eighteen thousand that's on tape.
We had them counted, very painstakingly, eighteen thousand voters having
to do with Ruby Freeman. She's a vote scammer, a
(32:17):
professional vote scammer and hustler. Yeah, so, like he was
the head of that party, was calling Ruby by her
first and last name and lying about her and blaming
her for his election laws.
Speaker 5 (32:32):
It's terrifying.
Speaker 4 (32:33):
And again I also think, like to your point, Samantha,
it's complicated to talk about, but I think that one
of the reasons why this lie took off the way
it did is because of the visual of Ruby and Shay.
Right Like, sites like Gateway Pundit are really good at
knowing what is going to resonate with their audience, what
(32:53):
is going to stoke something inside them that is going
to motivate them to click and share and have an
emotional respect. And if you go back and look at
what the Gateway Pundit was publishing about Ruby and Shay,
it is highly visual. They posted so many images of
these women online on election night. Ruby and Shay were
(33:14):
wearing like blonde extensions that contrast with their darker complexions. Literally,
it's like how my hair is styled. Right now, I'm
wearing blonde extensions and they Ruby owned a fashion shop
and so her personal style is like a big part
of how she shows up to the world. She likes
bedazzled shirts, she likes to have her name on her
shirt or her hat. These are people who have a
(33:35):
very distinctive look. And I believe the reason why the
Gateway Pundit posted so many images of the women were
basically to be like, look how black these women are look?
How like look how they look because they knew that
these images these visuals of these black women. They could
say anything they wanted because because they were weaponizing this
(33:56):
already pre existing disdain black women. And so I think
that like they knew what they were doing. That is
why you see these images used over and over and
over again of them like with like crooked stamped across
their head. I think they I think they knew that
that was going to be what like moved their audience,
and I think they weaponized that to make this lie stickier.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Yeah, it follows along with what Trump has been saying
about Lanta, especially when he was going after John Lewis
before his death.
Speaker 4 (34:23):
He always does this like, oh, if I were in Atlanta,
I would be more worried about the crime, like just like.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
Yeah, he would go after it and trying to set
it up as if it was just this horrible, stricken
place because it was made up of a large largely
black communities, which is like, no, that's why it's so
productive and wealthy right now, Like, I'm not really sure
what you're trying to point out, because Atlanta is one
(34:50):
of the more successful areas of Georgia.
Speaker 2 (34:54):
Huh mm.
Speaker 3 (34:56):
And then he had been setting that up and that
played right in to this whole scandal, because again, here's
a woman who has her own business and she's doing fine,
and it's so well enough that she helps volunteer.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
Yeah, and I think like him and his cronies knew
that like just evoking the idea that that black women
were involved in the vote counting process in Georgia would
be enough proof. I'm putting that in quotes, not like
actual proof, but like their proof that something nefarious was
(35:29):
going on. They basically told their supporters like, black women
were involved in this voting process, so that should be
evidence enough that that Atlanta or Georgia is like rigged
against me. I think that was really the argument that
they were trying to imply.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Right, and again it just aims it towards his already base,
who is very loud exactly.
Speaker 4 (35:53):
So yeah, I think that these attacks really weaponize and
rely on tropes about black women being inherently untrustworthy, which
we see time and time again with things like online
harassment and disinformation.
Speaker 5 (36:04):
So this I'll led to like.
Speaker 4 (36:05):
A flood of really scary racist death threats and harassment
against Ruby and Shay online. If folks watched the January
sixth Commission their testimony really just like, I think every
American should watch it because it really is horrifying and
also heartbreaking to hear them describe what they went through.
(36:27):
But this is Shay talking about what it felt like
to know that her mom was now involved in this.
Shae at her during the January sixth testimony, said, I
felt horrible. I felt like it was all my fault.
Like if I never would have decided to be an
election worker, I could have done anything else, but that's
what I decided to do. And now people are lying
and spreading rumors and lies and attacking my mom. I'm
her only child going to my grandmother's house. I'm her
(36:50):
only grandchild, and my kid is just I just feel
so bad. I felt bad for my mom, and I
felt horrible for picking this job and for being the
one that always wants to help, always there, never miss
that one election. I just felt like it was my
fault for putting my family in this situation. It is
really heartbreaking. Ruby talks about how she had been so
proud of her nickname and her name, Lady Ruby, that's
(37:13):
the name of her business, that she is definitely a
staple in Georgia. Everybody knew Ruby as Lady Ruby, and
she always wore that shirt with her name on it,
and because of all of this campaign of lives and harassment.
Ruby talks about how she once was this pillar of
the community and now is afraid to use her own name,
(37:33):
her name that she used to wear as a badge
of honor. Like I get emotional just thinking about what
that would have been like for these women and how
threatening it sounds like that was to their own sense
of identity, their own sense of safety, their own sense
of being able to show up in their communities that
(37:53):
was like really important to them, that was just taken
away because of these people lied.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
Like just really upsets me. H.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
Yeah, And I think one of the things to keep
in mind too, is that these were two women who
were just trying to help their community. They were not
looking for this, obviously, but weren't looking for like fame
or attention or they were just trying to help their community.
And then it got blown up and it became this
whole thing where now, yeah, you can't use the name
(38:26):
you were so proud of, or you feel guilty about
doing something good for your community. But there was like
a whole organized effort that ended up getting targeted towards them.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
Exactly, and so let's talk a bit about who were
some of the players in that effort. So, in addition
to the like mixed bag of Trump croonies that you've
heard about, you know, Rudi Giuliani, folks like that, Ruby
and Jay were also being harassed and threatened by a
woman named Trevion Kuti. Trebon was formally a publicist for
the R and B singer slash convicted sex criminal r Kelly.
(39:02):
So she definitely like knows how to pick the men
to associate with. She had some kind of association with
Kanye West at some point, who you may recall, ran
for president himself alongside Trump in twenty twenty before becoming
a vocal Trump supporter.
Speaker 5 (39:19):
NBC News.
Speaker 4 (39:20):
It's not totally clear what her association with Donald Trump is.
NBC News reported that in a biography of her on
a website for the the Women's Global Initiative, a business
networking group, she identified herself as a member of the
Young Black Leadership Council under President Donald Trump. She says
that she was secured as Kanye West's publicist in twenty
(39:41):
eighteen and now serves as his director of Operations, but importantly,
Kanye West camp says that she was not associated with
Kanye West. But Kanye's camp is like, we don't know her.
Speaker 5 (39:52):
They're like, we she.
Speaker 4 (39:54):
Is not associated with us, so like don't know what
to tell you. So, in any event, regardless of whether
or not she is truly associated with Kanye West or
Donald Trump, what went down is this, Travion showed up
at Shay and Ruby's door, and the women, after being
harassed and targeted, understandably just like called the police. The
police show up, and they all end up going to
(40:16):
a police station together to talk. Trivion told them that
she was visiting them at the direction of a high
profile individual who warned that if Ruby and Shay did
not confess to voter fraud, they would be arrested in
forty eight hours. According to Rolling Stone, the body cam
footage of the conversation shows Trivion telling the women, I
cannot say what specifically will take place. I just know
(40:38):
that it will disrupt your freedom and the freedom of
one or more of your family members. You are a
loose end for a party that needs to tidy up,
which is like a real weird thing to tell somebody.
To be honest, with you. That's like a very weird thing.
You say. Yeah, so I will say Travion has said, like, oh,
they're getting it wrong.
Speaker 5 (40:56):
I was trying to help these women. That's not a threat.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
So like that's her defense, is that, like she was
genuinely trying to offer support to these women.
Speaker 5 (41:06):
That's what she says. Uh, you tell me what you
what you think, But like that's her defense.
Speaker 4 (41:11):
Then she calls a man by the name of Harrison
Floyd of Black Voices for Trump, puts him on speakerphone,
and Floyd says that he can offer the women protection.
But according to that body cam audio, he said that
Ruby and Shay would have to confess to voter fraud.
If she did, he would offer her legal protection, but
if she declined, then her and her family would be arrested.
(41:32):
So Floyd worked for the Trump campaign formally as the
executive director of the of Black Voices for Trump, but
he told Rachel Maddow that he sent Trevion to the
women's house as a private citizen, not as an employee
of the Trump campaign. He also in those calls said
that like he has people that can keep her safe.
Speaker 5 (41:51):
If she confessed all.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
Of that, I should say, like I'm including what these
people are saying as their defense or like how they
explain their behavior. I don't really believe any of these people,
but like this is what they said about like why they.
Speaker 5 (42:04):
Did the things that they did.
Speaker 4 (42:05):
So I just think people should know their side of
the story, even though I don't believe any of this.
Speaker 3 (42:11):
This is like again, I just this is such a
bad setup of so many like gang movies.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
That you were like, what is happening?
Speaker 3 (42:21):
Like this reminds me of what would have happened in
Chicago in the early mob days. Like they create a
problem and a threat, but will protect you if you
can truss these things. And you're thinking, so, at what
point does Floyd and COUDI not realize they're bound to
be thrown under the bus like they are the scapegoats now.
Speaker 4 (42:41):
Yeah, I mean so yes and Floyd especially because folks
might remember that when all the other defendants in the
Trump Raiko case got arrested in Georgia, most of them
just like bonded out right away, right Lloyd because when
they initially the FBI initially had like served him at
his apartment.
Speaker 5 (43:02):
They like he got into some kind of like.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Physical scuffle with the FBI, and so that led to
like a warrant for his arrest. And so when he
turned himself in for these Trump Raicho charges, he actually
was not able to bond out like everybody else was
like in and out.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Yeah, it was bad.
Speaker 3 (43:21):
I didn't realize it was for that and BT dubs
the RICO charges here in Georgia is partially racial. So
it's quite funny to me that they got that.
Speaker 4 (43:31):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, it's complicated, but like, I just
can't believe I thought this was a good idea. I
can't believe that they were like, yes, I will get
myself arrested for this man. I will get like pretty
serious charges for this man. I will break the law
for this man, and that will be fine for me.
That will go well for me. I will be in
their club, I will be taken care of, I will
(43:51):
be protected. I cannot believe that somebody would think that. So, yeah,
just really says a lot about the judgment there, I
guess right.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
I can't.
Speaker 3 (44:00):
I'm like, there's nothing about this group of people who
would help you as we.
Speaker 2 (44:05):
Yeah, yeah, they have a long history of throwing people
under the bus, going completely broke.
Speaker 5 (44:10):
Right, even they're not gonna throw you under the bus.
Speaker 2 (44:12):
Yes, you're not special.
Speaker 5 (44:15):
I will say.
Speaker 4 (44:16):
One side note is that Trivion KOUTI I think that
people should She's very active on Instagram. I think that
if folks listening are curious for more information about her,
I really implore them to look at her Instagram. Her Instagram,
I think is very telling about what kind of person
(44:36):
she is. Right, so, yeah, folks are interested in like
cause like when I first was reading about this, I
was like, what kind of per Like, she's suways like
a interesting person.
Speaker 5 (44:44):
Let me look her up.
Speaker 4 (44:45):
And her Instagram really confirmed that she's someone who is
like hashtag overload, Like every post is like so like, honestly,
I can't really even describe it. I mean, if folks
are curious, they should look her up on Instagram, and
I I I don't think you will be disappointed at
what you see.
Speaker 5 (45:02):
I'll put it that right.
Speaker 3 (45:04):
Well, her association with R Kelly, because if I know
one thing, in Atlanta, black women they do not side
with R.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Kelly. Like that's so.
Speaker 4 (45:14):
Rare event in Atlanta when they played Remixed Magnition and
black women were like boom.
Speaker 5 (45:21):
Turn this off. Yeah, until the DJ turned it.
Speaker 3 (45:24):
Off, like, yeah, every debate that I've ever seen, uh,
and like it would be on our.
Speaker 1 (45:32):
Neighbor pages all of that, it was always men.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
Or white people who were and white people were smart
enough to stay out of it for the most part.
Speaker 1 (45:42):
Yeah, they were like, Okay, we're not we're not part
of this.
Speaker 3 (45:44):
But every black woman that you saw was going after anyone.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
So for her to be a supporter at any point,
you're like, hmm, really, yeah, that's that's not that's a
sign right there.
Speaker 4 (46:10):
So this whole conversation between Trevion and Harrison Floyd and
Rubinha went down on January fourth, twenty twenty one, just
two days before January six It honestly sounds like Trump's
associates just wanted to get a forced confession out of
these women as a means to stop the transition of power.
(46:32):
So on January sixth, when pro Trump extremists and goons
were storming the Capitol, they were also surrounding the women's
home with bullhorns, but luckily they had already fled for
their safety. But this is where it gets even scarier.
Trump supporters actually tried to force their way into Shay's
elderly grandmother's home to make a citizen's arrest. I honestly
(46:54):
cannot even fathom how terrifying it would be to have
a mob of angry, potentially armed people show up at
your elderly grandmother's home and with the intent to force
their way in and citizens arrest her. Like, I don't
even I mean, I can't, I don't even have words, like,
I don't even know.
Speaker 5 (47:14):
I can't think of anything more horrifying than that.
Speaker 3 (47:18):
Right, Once again, she had nothing to do with any
of the elections, So this is just the hostage at
this point.
Speaker 4 (47:24):
Essentially, Yes, and like and I think it goes back
to a lot of the things that we that we
talk about on the show. When we deal with things
like harassment campaigns, it is rarely just the woman. So
it's usually a woman at the center of a harassment
campaign like this.
Speaker 5 (47:39):
It is rarely just that one woman.
Speaker 4 (47:42):
Is It is her and her family, her and her parents,
her and her kids, her and her partner. And it's
an effort to, I think, terrify women and other marginalized
people from participating in civic and public life. If like,
I'm one person, if I'm going to face these kinds
of attacks. I wouldn't love it, but like, okay, that's me.
Speaker 5 (48:03):
Fine.
Speaker 4 (48:04):
If it's me and my elderly parents, me and my child,
me and my partner, me and my community, you might
think twice about your behavior if you felt like you
were putting the people that you loved at risk. And
so this is a specific tactic in order to frighten
women out of civic and.
Speaker 5 (48:23):
Public life, and I think it's effective.
Speaker 4 (48:26):
It really it's upsetting that it works, but I can
understand why women don't want to put their families at
risk in this way.
Speaker 3 (48:34):
After that election, I volunteered at a few polls and
I even thought about trying to work at the elections,
and they were in desperately.
Speaker 1 (48:43):
They were begging people to come.
Speaker 3 (48:45):
And this was after several of the voter sites had
been shut down by our governor, so they'd already been
transitioned into like maybe four stations out of those six,
and they were trying desperately to find people because they
having such a struggle.
Speaker 5 (49:01):
Yeah, so that's not surprising to me.
Speaker 4 (49:02):
It's actually become a common problem. According to research from
the Brendan Center, nearly one to three local election officials
no at least one election worker who has left the
job partly due to safety concerns, increased threats, and intimidation.
Ruby herself said that she could never see herself working
another election again for the rest of her life, which
again I don't blame her. In this most recent election,
we had a shortage of poll workers, which of course
(49:25):
leads to anti democratic outcomes like short staffing, polling precingcs
like you just described, Sam that force people to wait
in longer lines to vote. These shortages of poll workers
can also cause some locations to either close or be
consolidated with other polling centers, making it more challenging for
voters to access new polling places. All of this can
(49:45):
lead to disenfranchisement and reduce trust and elections, especially among
communities of color and other marginalized communities who already face
barriers to voting, and so it is a widespread issue
when you go to vote. If people have been intimidated
out of being part of that process, that is an
attack on our democracy and it harms all of us,
(50:08):
not just the women who are attacked and find themselves
the targets.
Speaker 2 (50:12):
Right, and that's terrifying. I remember voting kind of soon
after this for a local election, and you could almost
feel it. You could feel that everyone was more unsure
about the process and everyone was more on edge, and
at one point, like the power flickered and you could
just see people looking around like, oh, like, I can't
(50:32):
trust this anymore. And the damage that has been done
to these specific women does speak to so much more.
It speaks to this doubt and people not feeling safe
to work at polls. And I think who works at poles, Like,
if I go in and it's like a bunch of
(50:54):
kind of burly white dudes that I might think are
Trump supporters, I'm not gonna feel as good about voting,
Like I'm not I feel the safe about voting. And
it's just like a trickle, it's everywhere. It's got a
ripple effects. We're talking about kind of a specific thing
that it's such a larger issue.
Speaker 4 (51:11):
Absolutely, and it's absolutely gendered. Eighty percent of election officials
are women, So these are women being attacked and it's
harming all of us. And it shouldn't be like that
when you go to vote, when the lights flicker, you
shouldn't have to worry like, oh no, what's about to happen?
Like this is the foundation in the cornerstone of our democracy,
and it shouldn't it shouldn't be like that, right, So
(51:32):
we deserve better than a system that is able to
weaponize racism and sexism and lies to disenfranchise us. We
deserve so much better. And you know that kind of
brings us to today. So Ruby and Shay sued the
right wing website The Gateway Pundit and its owners for
defamation her publishing stories that instigated a deluge of intimidation, harassment,
(51:53):
and threats.
Speaker 5 (51:54):
And they also settled a suit with one American news network.
Speaker 4 (51:57):
And honestly, I hope they get penny. Hope they get
so much money and then thumb. Earlier this month, a
federal judge ruled that Rudy Giuliani is liable for defaming
these women.
Speaker 5 (52:08):
He'll have to pay their legal fees.
Speaker 4 (52:09):
He's already paid about ninety thousand dollars and there's going
to be another trial to determine how much you will
have to pay in additional damages.
Speaker 5 (52:16):
It could be in the millions.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
And so I'm pleased that these women are getting some
semblance of justice, Like, I think that's great, But I
do also think that no amount of money can make
right what they went through. They only wanted to serve
their communities and do civic good during a pandemic, and
the President and his associates put their lives at risk
(52:39):
because of that. You know, they testified and spoke off
about what they experienced and putting themselves even more at risk.
And so what they did was heroic. They are absolutely
American heroes. But black women should not have to be
put in such a great danger for a country that
is going to weaponize their own identities against them, right,
and so, yeah, I think that what they did is
(53:00):
really heroic. But I wish they never had to do
that in the first place. I wish that they were
able to just do their jobs and live their lives
and try to support democracy as they were doing, without
facing these kind of attacks, because not only does it
hurt them, it hurts us all.
Speaker 3 (53:18):
Yeah, I hope they get all the money as they deserve.
I'm glad that Juliani actually admitted that he was wrong.
Speaker 1 (53:25):
We shouldn't even have a good to that point.
Speaker 4 (53:27):
Technically, what he admitted was I am so broke that
I can no longer afford to contest these allegations.
Speaker 5 (53:34):
So he didn't admit wrongdoing, but he did. He was like,
I don't have the money to continue to contest fees.
Speaker 3 (53:39):
So okay, sure I read that wrong, but I'm glad
he's getting all his money taken away. That's delightful. And
we know he's never getting any money that he was
supposed to get from Trump, so that's even better.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
It's like begging Trump to pay his legal his legal fees. Also,
even if Trump was like, I'll pay your legal fees,
he doesn't pay anyway, So like, what does that even
look like?
Speaker 5 (54:00):
He doesn't pay his bill.
Speaker 3 (54:01):
I think he actually owes Julianni for the years of
representing him. That like he just doesn't pay, which everybody's like,
you know, that's not a thing. Which I still love
to think about the fact people love him as a businessman,
Trump and roll them. I'm like, all his businesses go bankrupt.
I don't understand what you're talking about. Literally in Atlanta
and he tried to build a whole apartment and it
(54:23):
went bankrupt.
Speaker 4 (54:25):
It's easy to be a savvy businessman where you just
don't pay anybody that you owe money to, Like if
I didn't pay any of my bills, i'd probably be rich.
Speaker 3 (54:32):
I love the whole file bankruptcy thing, which he's done
so many times and he can because he doesn't need credit,
so he's like, I just keep borrowing money. Yeah, And
I hate that this is their legacy. Like that's the
thing that I know they did what they had to
do because they're going to protect themselves and protect their
loved ones.
Speaker 1 (54:50):
But the fact that they had to be put.
Speaker 3 (54:51):
To this point going through so much stress and then
just hiding because I remember when they did high they
later left Atlanta and went to South Georgia and even
there they're just like, what if they find us?
Speaker 4 (55:03):
Yeah, it breaks my heart. My heart goes out to
these women. I think about them often. Yeah, I think
about them a lot. I wish them nothing but peace
and prosperity and abundance for the rest of their lives,
because Lord knows they deserve it.
Speaker 3 (55:17):
They deserve it, and they've done so much, especially for
the state of Georgia with what we're seeing, and we
love to see the fact that, thanks in part to
them to coming out and speaking out, we get to
see mugshots.
Speaker 4 (55:34):
Oh if you if you haven't seen Trevion's mugshot, I
definitely suggest taking a look at that too.
Speaker 5 (55:39):
That's what I'll end there. Just a lot going on.
Speaker 1 (55:44):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (55:45):
And we should also note that it is DA Fanny Willis,
who is a black woman who really.
Speaker 1 (55:53):
Decided like, yeah, we're not gonna let this sit.
Speaker 3 (55:55):
No.
Speaker 4 (55:55):
I don't think I knew like much about her until this,
until this started, so like, yeah, I know it.
Speaker 5 (56:03):
Chaps.
Speaker 4 (56:03):
Trump's asked that so many of the people who are
like trying to hold him accountable or black women, I
know that's got a chat.
Speaker 3 (56:09):
Yeah, and he really hoped that Georgia would pull a
Florida where Kemp would kick the DA off, but Camp
was like, nah, I'm.
Speaker 1 (56:20):
Not messing with her. You got if I messed with Atlanta,
it might be over for me.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
And he realizes that don't mess with Atlanta because the
South's got something to say.
Speaker 1 (56:30):
Look, they know that he barely made it. Buy some Uh.
Speaker 3 (56:35):
I'm going to say Gray areas past Abrams, but like
Fulton County will be the one that takes him out
if he's not careful. And you're here, de Willis, She's
she doesn't play.
Speaker 2 (56:51):
We always love having you so much, Fridgid. I feel
like we could just go on and on and on
and talk about all these different things.
Speaker 5 (56:56):
This is such a pleasure.
Speaker 4 (56:57):
You always let you always let me, Like when I've
got to be in my by about something, you all
always give me a platform.
Speaker 5 (57:03):
So I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (57:04):
We love bees and bonnets. Virgets bees and bonnets.
Speaker 5 (57:09):
Oh that's a good business. Look at that. I had
to save that one.
Speaker 2 (57:15):
Yes, yes, well, thank you, thank you uh for always
being into light and doing this research and making sure
people know these important things. We know you're very busy,
so we really appreciate it. Yes, where can the good
listeners find you?
Speaker 4 (57:31):
Well, you can check out my podcast. There are no
girls on the internet. You can find me on Instagram
at bridget Marie and DC or on Twitter at Bridget Marie.
Speaker 5 (57:38):
And you can see me and Annie in Las Vegas
if you're there, check come check us out.
Speaker 2 (57:43):
Yes, I will wear not pajamas for.
Speaker 1 (57:49):
Are you gonna low key cosplay Scully? Hello?
Speaker 2 (57:56):
I actually have a friend who cosplays a Scully and
she has the bench. Maybe she'll let me. Okay, that's
a good idea. That's a good idea. Okay, well that's
a spoiler for what we might be talking about. But yes,
thank you, thank you, thank you, Bridget. If you would
like to find us, you can. You can email u
a Stuffidia mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com. You can
(58:18):
find us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast, or on
Instagram and TikTok at Stuff I've Never Told You. We
have a tea public store. We also have a book.
You can get it at stuff you should read books
dot com or wherever you get your books. Thanks, it's
always to our super producer Christina, our executive ducer Maya,
and our contributor Joey.
Speaker 1 (58:32):
Thank you and I'm sorry, oh no, Thanks to you.
Speaker 2 (58:36):
For listening Stuff I've Never Told Whose prediction of i
R Radio. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you
can check out the art radio app Apple Podcast wherever
you listen to your favorite shows,
Hey, this is Anny and Samantha.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
A look of stuff. I never told you, aflicture if I
heard you, And welcome to another classic and today we
were bringing back a Bridgid episode. She always does such
great episodes about the treatment of Shay and Ruby, right.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
I thought it was something that we should look at
because this was based in Georgia. And I don't know
if you're keeping up with everything about this happening when
it comes to elections as well as politics in Georgia,
but it's getting kind of heated. Our Fulton County District
Attorney has been going through it. Fanny willis with President
(00:52):
Trump at this point, and one of the things mentioned
was this case as well. So I felt like it
was a good time to revisit this episode as well
as talk about the importance of election workers as election
season this year and is pretty heated right now.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yes, yes, it is, so please enjoy this classic episode. Hey,
this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Stefan never
told you a production of iHeartRadio and welcome back to Samantha.
Speaker 3 (01:35):
My voice is like I just realized as I'm talking
to you, my voice went down.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
By sexy sick voice here we go.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Yeah, oh jeez, I almost said welcome back to Samantha
and the intro. So this is gonna be fun. But
it is a momentous occasion because not only is Samantha
back from COVID, we are joined by the splendid, splendiferous
Brigit Todd. Always a pleasure to have you.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Oh, I'm so happy to be back. I'm happy Samantha's back.
This is your inaugural recordings since being out from COVID.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
How are you feeling, you know, Like I said, I've
got this voice, but I'm feeling much better. This is
the first time I've ever had COVID, so that was
an experience.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Not cool with your best.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Yeah, public service.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Like if you can, if you're in the crowd, do it.
I would recommend it, recommend would recommend.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Yes. But oh, y'all, I didn't get to ask you
because I got to complain a lot.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Oh that's the benefit of you know, if you got
to wait the plus side of getting COVID, then the
benefit is to complain.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
I've been waiting to tell you all the als I almost.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
Died complaining and watching lots of TV. Yeah, the best
part about being sick.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
That was my big when I got COVID. I remember,
like I went to shock at first, and I was like,
but the soup though.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
I couldn't eat anything hardly, Oh no, eat soup. Yeah,
that's like legitimately like the sucks.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Well that was the because I didn't have like I
sneezed a lot. That was my symptom for like two days.
That was that's so weird.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Well, how are y'all? I hope you were healthy.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yes, I am good. I'm getting actually the updated COVID
vaccine to day vaccine because Bridget who unfortunately has technical
difficulties and we can't see. We're going to Las Vegas
this week.
Speaker 4 (03:37):
That's right for the iHeart Music Festival. Look Out, Las Vegas.
Speaker 5 (03:42):
Look out.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Threatening.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
I mean like not like okay, we're gonna like do
engaging podcasts in your city, Las Vegas.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
Look out for that, not.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Like okay, okay, yeah, we're doing some podcast there. It's
gonna be fun. Samantha is going on a birthday vacation time.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
Yeah, I am missing out. Like the first time in
the years that they asked us to do something. I'm like, yeah, no,
I'm going to go the opposite way. But thanks for asking.
Speaker 5 (04:12):
I'll be on the other coast.
Speaker 2 (04:16):
I like that, but thanks for asking. But yes, I'm
excited to see Bridget in person. And yeah, I'm trying
to not get COVID there, so we'll see how that goes.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
Yeah, because you have more, you have other plans coming out.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I do. I'm going to Orlando because I love a
good haunted house and I love the Last of Us
and there's a Last of Us Haunted house, so's.
Speaker 5 (04:40):
It's like Last of Us themed. Yeah, yeah, my god,
you're gonna.
Speaker 4 (04:43):
That's that's upper Alley, that's like made in a lab
for you, and I know, I know it is.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
I've already seen like TikTok videos that I've had to
send her to like, oh my god.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Her responses. I can't wait.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
I might die of excitement. Oh my god, how are you?
Speaker 5 (05:00):
Yes, I'm doing well, looking forward to Vegas. Also hoping
I don't get sick.
Speaker 4 (05:05):
Yeah, just I think I just need to like stay
in until my flight, just like don't leave my house.
And so just so, because now I'm now I'm like
very nervous, but hopefully it'll be all good. And yeah,
I'm excited to hear more about this last of us
haunted house after you go give us a full report.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Oh oh.
Speaker 5 (05:25):
Oh, I love scary well. I like that. I like titillated.
Speaker 4 (05:31):
There there can be a line where it's like too scary,
so it has to be. It's a little bit of
a finding the right balance vibe for me. I enjoy
spooky things. I enjoy hobble mean, I enjoy haunted houses.
But if it's too scary, then I'm like no longer
enjoying it. So it has to be just the right mits.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
So you don't mind being chased.
Speaker 4 (05:49):
I don't mind being chased. I went to a haunted
house last Halloween, and for some reason, you know, the
like performers who chase you. There was a guy with
a chainsaw who for some reason was like, I'm to
chase her.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
I spent the whole one.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
I spent the whole haunted house. I basically was like.
Speaker 5 (06:05):
Like worked out. Essentially, this guy was chasing me the
whole time.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
See, I used to there's like a key to get
them to pick you. There's a couple like if you
want them to pick you as the person. And I
used to like play that up because I liked being
scared so much.
Speaker 5 (06:22):
What do you do if you want to be picked?
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Uh, there are a couple of things. One of the
big ones is where color. They can see pretty well
in the dark. Another one is I don't usually do
this one, but if you're like really funny being scared,
if you're like really over the top being scared, they
will target.
Speaker 3 (06:39):
This is why I don't go to them because I
know my face, my reaction will say everything and then
they'll pick on me.
Speaker 1 (06:45):
And I'm gonna fight somebody.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
You know that's fair.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
I'm a fight or fight girl, and apparently I fight.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Hey, hey, at least you know it.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
I'm not fast enough.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
It depends, it depends.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
I tip somebody.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
I have faith in you.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
I'm maneuver.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
My way I'd said that this is my thing is
like if I would have to do the like trips,
I'm sorry, I would be the villain and set someone
up so I can survive.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Oh instead, yeah, okay, yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
That's fine.
Speaker 3 (07:20):
Old host Caroline and I get along really well because
we have our apocalypse plan is that she's just going
to give up.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
So that's my decoy to survive using her giving up.
Speaker 5 (07:29):
I'm going to be a final girl.
Speaker 4 (07:30):
No matter what I'm making it to the end of this,
of this situation.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
I'm like, I will not be the minority that gets killed.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
I like that You've got a plan.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
Well, I have to make sure I'm with Carolina.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
I think that's the first plan. Yes, well, way, happy Halloween.
We do have a quite horrifying thing to discuss today.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Horrifying or is it like vivor exciting?
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Well, yeah, but transition wise, this is a very scary
thing to talk about. You gotta play along with my transition.
Speaker 4 (08:13):
No, cur I've lived for your masterful transitions are so good.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
Thank you. I will lay awake at night be like,
how can I do this? Just so you know, there's
a lot of work going on behind the curtains here.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
She's been staring at this waiting for it.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
Yeah, oh, all the time. But yes, can you tell
us what we are talking about today, Bridget Yes.
Speaker 4 (08:35):
So, folks probably by now have seen in the news
that former President Trump and eighteen of his associates are
facing charges for violating Georgia's Racketeering, Influence and Corrupt Organizations
or REICHO act.
Speaker 5 (08:48):
Basically, when you are doing some.
Speaker 4 (08:50):
Like organized crime like mob style activities, Georgia as I'm
sure y'all know, take that very seriously, and these are
related to schemes to try to keep Trump in office
after he lost the election. So a big piece of
these charges stem from the way that Trump and his
associate Rudy Giuliani basically claimed that two black women poll workers,
(09:13):
a mother daughter duo Ruby Freeman and Shay Moss, had
tampered with votes.
Speaker 5 (09:17):
Now that has been time and time.
Speaker 4 (09:20):
Again, like on the official record, these women have been
cleared of wrongdoing, and that did not stop Trump and
Giuliani from baselessly, repeatedly and publicly putting them in danger
by lying about them. And so I really see this
story as like a culmination of so many of the
things that I talk about on my own pod. You
(09:40):
know what happens when racism and sexism just run unchecked
online and really creates the conditions for dangerous lies about
black women to find a welcome home where they can
be amplified and legitimized. In this case, those lies threatened
democracy for all of us. And so I think that
there's so much meati reporting going on about what's happening
(10:02):
with these charges related to Trump, but I think it's
important that the story of these women does not go
overlooked or does not go missed, because at its heart,
it is about how these people used their positions and
their power to baselessly smear like two people who hadn't
done anything wrong. And so I just think their story
(10:22):
and their testibility, it's just important to me to keep
making sure that we really center that and that it
doesn't get lost.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
Right because, as we've talked about before, as I am
in Fulton County, that is where I vote a lot
of the times, it's mostly black women who are volunteering
at these voting places and making it run so smoothly
and doing all of these things. And to hear about
this about two people who were wanting to help their
(10:53):
community and did nothing wrong but being used as scapegoats
and that getting amplified in online space and then being
kind of chased away from it, like, it's really upsetting
because that is such an important job. It's so important
to voting, and it's just just because these guys are
(11:19):
jerks and liars, we're looking for someone people that they
could blame, that people would get behind them blaming is
really upsetting.
Speaker 5 (11:28):
Yeah, and you put that exactly right.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
I think that I'm really drawn to the humanity of
Ruby and Shay, but really it's really not just about
them and their story because these attacks on election workers,
poll workers who are like largely women, like that's you know,
a thing, So it's definitely gendered. These attacks on them
are also attacks on democracy because if people like, if
(11:52):
you saw the way that Ruby and Shay were treated
and how other election workers were treated, threatened, harassed, lied about, targeted,
why would you want to do that work? That work
is not well paid. It's not work that is like
put on a pedestal or like well protected or given
a lot of respect. It used to be, and it
should be, but unfortunately it's not. And so if regular
(12:13):
people who are interested in like disc helping our civic
process move forward and move smoothly, if those people are like,
I don't want to do this work anymore, why would
I want to do this? And the only people who
are invested and interested in doing this work are extremists,
it's not good for democracy. And so it's all like,
we'll talk about some of the findings from how this
(12:35):
has impacted elections writ large, but yeah, if election centers
have to close because no one wants to work them.
That means that less people are going to be able
to access those polling places. Polling places end up shutting down.
The wheels of democracy are not able to move as
smoothly as they should. And democracy is like a pretty
(12:56):
tenuous thing. I think I never really thought about it before,
how fragile it is. How you definitely need things to
be moving smoothly, and it doesn't really take much.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
To have the whole system come crashing down.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
Right, to give some context about what Fulton County is,
because we talk about Fulton County and not many of
the people outside of Georgia know what that means.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
We have the funny song that talks about that's not Atlanta.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Fulton County is Atlanta, which is heavily populated with a
lot of black votes and largely amount of black communities,
one of the bluest areas, one of the reasons why
we turn blue in the first place. And after all
of the voting rights stuff that happened with our governor
trying to take away so many things, including not allowing
to give out water, not allowing people to sit, all
(13:50):
of these things, it was pointedly for places like Fulton
County again, especially with all the Jerryman drag and such.
And it's quite funny that the people who were making
such big threats and pointing at Fulton were not from Fulton.
They are literally from outskirts where other places have been
proven to have a campaign election fraud, typically from again
(14:13):
Republican side from the twenty twenty election that we saw,
and it was very, very very targeted for that very reason.
They needed, as you said, to target black women because
we know that for the past decades of election it's
been black women who have turned the votes and really
have made a difference in places like Georgia, which no
(14:34):
one ever saw ever turning blue at any point in time.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
And so it in that context this is a fight.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
It literally was a place to start a war when
it came to elections.
Speaker 4 (14:47):
I've always thought it has got to be so exhausting
to live in Fulton County because it's just like it's
you're just trying to live your life and exists and
all these different institutional horses and like power powerful figures
are trying to stop you from doing that at every turn,
And I just can't imagine what it's like to be
to live someplace but it's just like constantly the subject
(15:11):
of conversation and scrutiny and trickery.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
It's just like it's got to be exhausting.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
You know, bridget one of the first conversations you and
I ever had when we met, what's in twenty nineteen, No,
I guess it was way before then, in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 5 (15:26):
I think that's right.
Speaker 3 (15:27):
You Literally I asked you if you would move to Atlanta,
and you said, we already had our own stuff at Washington.
I don't I don't know if I can do it
again in Atlanta. Yeah, you have to get involved in
it real quickly, because when you were talking about Abrams
something about at the time, and you're like, I don't
know if I can do that again.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
Yeah, that was my whole thing.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
There was a time where I was like, I think
I might have to move to Atlanta, and just the
idea of like and not that DC doesn't have its problem.
Speaker 5 (15:55):
It's just like I have the energy.
Speaker 3 (15:58):
I would have to start again if I can, And
rightly so, it is exhausting. And again because the crux
of the work has been done by the black community,
black women. The organization Fair Fight was created by Stacy
Abrams after her first election, and we know so many
things had happened at that point, and I'm still very
(16:18):
bitter about that point and really caused so much that
we did become a focal point. Georgia specifically Fulton County
became a focal point to this point that Shay and
Ruby got targeted because they needed to find two people
that they can make as suspicious as possible that is
on the side that has been making this huge turnaround.
Speaker 5 (16:41):
So I'm so glad that you put it that way.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
And this is something that I think has kind of
I would say gotten missed, but I would say has
just sort of been implied, and I think that we
should just like say it as is. I believe that
the reason why the attacks on Ruby and Shay were
so effective and like took hold is because they are
black women.
Speaker 5 (17:01):
I think that you're exactly right.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
They needed somebody to pin the Georgia loss on, and
I think that there there's it's not a surprise that
the people they went after were these two black women.
And I think that the way that race and gender
and class intersected to make them these these like effective
(17:24):
targets for this kind of smear campaign.
Speaker 5 (17:26):
I don't think that.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
We have like fully unpacked what that means and why
it was effective. Even in reporting that I think is
really good, like reporting that I respect, I just think
it relies on us to confront some uncomfortable truths about
our society. And I don't think that we have fully
contended with what happened to Ruby and Shay, why it
was effective, and how it was allowed to be amplified
(17:49):
by people like social media platforms and media outlets and
all of that. So yeah, I just think like it's
something we really got to talk about and something that
I think that we really got to take a lot
of important lessons and truths from. So if folks don't know,
Ruby and Shaye were election workers in Fulton County, Georgia,
a state that Trump lost in twenty twenty, get ready
for me to say that over and over again, because
(18:09):
it is a fact, so.
Speaker 5 (18:11):
You might recall.
Speaker 4 (18:11):
I'm sure that y'all recall that in Georgia, he Trump
pressured the Secretary Sake to like find votes for him
to rewrite history. Shay had actually been an election worker
in Georgia for a long time. Listening to her talk
about it, she describes it as something that she had
really done in an effort to support her community and
just like something that she felt like was her civic duty.
Speaker 5 (18:33):
You know.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
She has talked about how like her community has a
lot of older black folks in it, like elders, and
that she saw doing this work as an election worker
as part of service to like the elders in her community.
So was really just like wanted to do her civic good.
During twenty twenty, Fulton County was meant to have a
shortage and election workers because of COVID, so Shae recruited
(18:57):
her then sixty two year old mom, Ruby, a retired
nine to one one operator, to also serve as an
election worker. So this is something that I think is
very sad like. In their testimony, Shay has talked about
how she feels quite a bit of guilt for recruiting
her mother into this work, of course not knowing how
(19:19):
could she know that Trump and Juliani would attack them
in this way, but she she has described feeling quite
a bit of guilt at getting her mom involved in this,
which just really really breaks my heart.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Yeah, that's the when and I know we're going to
talk about this, but when like the whole family gets
drawn into this thing that you think you're doing. They
were doing this like civic duty, feeling really like, this
is what I want to do for my community, and
that is democracy at work. That is like, oh, I
(19:52):
want to make this happen and it's really important to
me and to have that to feel guilty about that,
because they're these other undemocratic like pascist forces who threaten
and who make you feel unsafe and make your loved
ones feel unsafe, like it is heartbreaking, it is it's
(20:14):
disgusting that this is what happens.
Speaker 5 (20:17):
It really is.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
And so basically, on December third, twenty twenty, a lawyer
working for the Trump campaign obtained security video of election
night from.
Speaker 5 (20:27):
State Farm Arena in Georgia.
Speaker 4 (20:29):
So the video just shows like election workers in general,
including Ruby and Shay, just like doing their jobs right,
like nothing untoward is going on. The lawyer brought the
video to the Georgia State Senate Committee, saying that he
thought it showed someone who had the name Ruby across
her shirt somewhere finding a suitcase of ballots from underneath
the table. Now all of this is just a complete lie.
(20:51):
The video just shows them working normally, the election workers
were told to like pack it up for the night,
so they put the ballots away.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
They didn't put them in suitcases.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
They put them in like the normal ballots where ballots
are always kept. And later in the night they were
told to go ahead and restart the count, don't wait
till the morning, and so that's what they did. The
video is just like normal election worker business. But I
think the presence of like just these two black women
was enough for this person to be like, something's going
(21:20):
on here.
Speaker 5 (21:20):
I need to flag this.
Speaker 4 (21:22):
So the video starts making its way online through this
cottage industry of like extremist blogs and media sites. Once
it's in that online pipeline, it's basically everywhere, Like it
doesn't matter. By the time that it starts making the rounds,
it has already been thoroughly debunked by Georgia Secretary of State.
Speaker 5 (21:40):
None of that matters.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
It's already like in this pipeline, and it's going to
be amplified despite the fact that it's already been proven alive.
Speaker 5 (21:47):
So this is where we.
Speaker 4 (21:49):
Meet a big vector of lies and like dissemination of
these lives about Ruby and Shay. The gateway Puntit, which
is an extremist right wing media site. Research from the
Universe Steve Washington Center for an inform Public found that
the Gateway Pundit was the second most prolific purveyor of
election misinformation on Twitter during twenty twenty.
Speaker 5 (22:08):
So they are like.
Speaker 4 (22:10):
A big source of incorrect, inaccurate information about our elections.
And once they get that video, they publish an article
under the headline huge all caps video footage from Georgia
show suitcases filled with ballots pulled from under table after
all caps supervisor told GOP poll workers to leave tabulation center.
(22:34):
So again that's just like a completely misleading claim. But
the way that they framed it is like, we found
this bombshell video evidence of the smoking gun of votes
being tampered with and the election being stolen from Donald Trump.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
Which is so hilarious because Fulton County was never Donald
Like it's never.
Speaker 3 (22:58):
Been readbody else who lives in Georgia are like, what, no, wait,
and it reminds me honestly, I watched it for like
a few seasons, but a setup of a scandal episode
actlutely the graany security video where they just like redline
somethings and you're like, oh my god, there it is, and.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
They're like, no, wait, they're just boxes. What's happening the proof?
Speaker 5 (23:24):
And it's so funny.
Speaker 4 (23:25):
There's a thing that happens online where anything can look
nefarious if.
Speaker 5 (23:29):
It's like grainy video and you write in all caps
on it.
Speaker 4 (23:33):
Like and it's just like a video of people like
moving around in an empty office building, and it's like
they're like all caps like busted. Like anything looks nefarious
when you when you frame it that.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Way, and then you're like, wait for it. You're like wait,
wait for what, wait for what? We look at it.
Speaker 3 (23:48):
See.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
My My like association with this is ghost videos, which
I don't believe in ghosts, but I watch ghost videos
and they'll be.
Speaker 5 (23:54):
Like there it is.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
I'm like where and they'll circle something and I'm.
Speaker 3 (23:58):
Like, I'm blaming on my eyesight. I'm like it must
be there, like they circled something.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
I really don't see anything there.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
But yeah, it's really interesting because obviously all they needed
they knew that.
Speaker 1 (24:12):
This is why I say this to the scale of video.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
They're like, if we can just pull this video of
these grainy subjects with boxes and then circle the boxes.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
People will believe this, and they it worked. It literally
began the.
Speaker 3 (24:26):
Like I'm like, wow, this is a bad like Shonda
Rhime's episode what is happening?
Speaker 4 (24:32):
It truly is, And so the Gateway Pundit continued taking
their nose from a bad episode of scandal.
Speaker 5 (24:38):
They called Ruby out by name.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
Ruby is somebody who really likes to wear like she
talks about how she was very proud of her name
before all this happened, and so she likes to wear
personalized shirts and hats and things that have her name
on it. So the Gameway Pundit called her out by name,
writing on the site her name is Ruby Freeman.
Speaker 5 (24:57):
And she made the.
Speaker 4 (24:57):
Mistake of advertising her purse on her desk the same
night she was involved in voter fraud on a massive
scale all caps. Her t shirt says Lady Ruby and
her purse says La Ruby, which is her company. This
is not a smart move. Her company is called Larruby's
Unique Treasures. It's on her LinkedIn page. Maybe the Georgia
Police or Bill Barr's DOJ may want to pay Ruby
(25:18):
Freeman a visit. The article concludes with images of Ruby
over the banner that says crook gets caught.
Speaker 5 (25:26):
They play this video on a n N, which is
a kind of I.
Speaker 4 (25:32):
Guess you could call it like a far right news network,
and that is really when it like really blows up.
So once the video gets on to own, that is
when Trump starts amplifying it on his own Twitter, that
is when Fox News starts talking about it, and that
is when the campaign of harassment really gets scary for
(25:55):
these women. Just three days later, after Trump starts amplifying
it on Twitter, Ruby calls nine to one one to
report people showing up at her home, which is terrifying,
and I think it's really important to point out the
ways that racism and misogyny worked to fuel these lives.
I just do not believe that had Ruby and her
(26:15):
daughter not been black women, and that if we did
not have a digital media climate that is like ready
and poised and willing to validate and amplify the worst
racist lies about black women who we know are disproportionately
harmed by conspiracy theories and disinformation and harassments, I don't
think it would have taken off like it did.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
This kind of reminded me of when we did our
episode on Megan Markle, there was all of this outrage
about like, look, she's making all this money from podcasting,
which is just complete nonsense. But I feel like that
going back to that quote of like, oh she's advertising
her company, Look how crass, Like it just I felt
(27:09):
like there was a through line of you know, for
black women so ready to be like that's disgusting, like how.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
Like for things that are totally commonplace, But it's like
when it's a black woman doing it and it's said
in this like manner that is clearly meant to convey
like judgment, it just I mean, people are just willing,
like the Megan and Markle stuff, Like I remember reading like,
oh she ate avocado toast.
Speaker 5 (27:38):
It doesn't matter what it is.
Speaker 4 (27:39):
It's not really about the substance of what she's done
or her behavior or what she said or anything of substance.
It's just like it's just like pulling from this societal
distrust of her identity. And that's what I think really
helped these attacks on Shay and Ruby take hold. I
do not think that had they been white women or
(28:00):
men they that these attacks would have been as amplified
and have taken off the way that they did.
Speaker 5 (28:06):
I just don't. And part of the evidence is the way.
Speaker 4 (28:09):
That the people who were harassing them and attacking them
were doing it in a way.
Speaker 5 (28:14):
That is so clearly racialized.
Speaker 4 (28:16):
Like Rudi Giuliani in a phone call, he looked at
the tape and he said, these women are quite obviously
surreptitiously passing around USB ports as if they're vials of
heroin or cocaine. I mean, it's obvious to anyone who's
a criminal investigator or a prosecutor that they're engaged in
surreptitious illegal activity. Again that day, they're walking around Georgia lying.
(28:38):
They should have been questioned already, their places of work,
their homes should have been searched for evidence of ballots,
evidence of USB ports, evidence of voter fraud. So he's
accusing these women of passing USB ports back and forth
as if they're vials of cocaine or heroin, which, like,
tell me, that is not meant to be a racist
dog whistle. But in reality, these women were just giving
(28:59):
each other a piece of candy. They were like, Oh,
I had a piece of candy in my hand that
I was passing it to my mom, And that's what
that like from that totally innocuous movement. Giuliani said that
they were passing USB ports, is that they were vials
of heroin or cocaine, like like, truly, truly beyond the
pale of just delusional lies.
Speaker 1 (29:23):
I love that the melting man is the one accused,
and there's so many things that this is, this is
for real. I don't know what's happening, you know.
Speaker 3 (29:30):
I have to say in this whole thing that when
I remember what was happening at this point, I don't
think I remembered their names. I just remember people being accused,
and it was specifically two black women that though eventually
the Secretary of State, who got a lot of praise
and he shouldn't have as well as our governor, eventually
(29:50):
started defending them, but not until after they were docked.
It was an interesting setup of like they allowed this
to happen to see again and at the very least
they stood up, but enough to be like, yes, our
votes are fine, there's nothing incredulous about this.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
There's nothing incriminating in here.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
After the fact, But during this time, they didn't do shit.
They're like I remember, like they're just saying they're investigating
that was that was they kept everything kind of to
the side, not agreeing, not saying anything, and until they
started getting harassed, their life was being threatened, and then
they're like, okay, okay, okay, well now we need to
(30:30):
put a stop to this. But they allowed this to
escalate to that point again because they did not care
about protecting them either, like for what they did later shore.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
But I feel like there should have been charges for
their negligence.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
But hey, yeah, I mean by then they had thoroughly
internally debunked this video and they quietly.
Speaker 5 (30:51):
Released like statements eventually, but they knew. We know that
they knew.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
The entire time that Shaye and Ruby had done that
thing wrong and it had been investigated. And so I'm
with you in my book, was just my opinion. You
don't get a ton of credit for quietly eventually being like, actually,
they didn't do anything wrong, and we've already like debunked
this video when they were being like physically threatened by
(31:17):
armed psychopaths.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
Right, And I think it's obvious that they could see
the evidence about how racist this was, how sexist and racist,
like how this all came from misogynoire, but they just
couldn't say that, because then they would have to say
that their party is exactly what we see them as,
and so therefore they were just quietly defending them, not
(31:40):
truly helping. It's it's obvious also that they allowed those perpetrators,
and I'm going to call them perpetrators at this point,
Giuliani and Trump to continue this tirade even after the
fact that they did not do anything to stop them
from harassing.
Speaker 5 (31:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
In that the infamous call that Trump made to join
just Secretary of State Brad Raethensberger asking him to find votes,
Donald Trump calls Ruby out by name. In that call,
he says, we had at least eighteen thousand that's on tape.
We had them counted, very painstakingly, eighteen thousand voters having
to do with Ruby Freeman. She's a vote scammer, a
(32:17):
professional vote scammer and hustler. Yeah, so, like he was
the head of that party, was calling Ruby by her
first and last name and lying about her and blaming
her for his election laws.
Speaker 5 (32:32):
It's terrifying.
Speaker 4 (32:33):
And again I also think, like to your point, Samantha,
it's complicated to talk about, but I think that one
of the reasons why this lie took off the way
it did is because of the visual of Ruby and Shay.
Right Like, sites like Gateway Pundit are really good at
knowing what is going to resonate with their audience, what
(32:53):
is going to stoke something inside them that is going
to motivate them to click and share and have an
emotional respect. And if you go back and look at
what the Gateway Pundit was publishing about Ruby and Shay,
it is highly visual. They posted so many images of
these women online on election night. Ruby and Shay were
(33:14):
wearing like blonde extensions that contrast with their darker complexions. Literally,
it's like how my hair is styled. Right now, I'm
wearing blonde extensions and they Ruby owned a fashion shop
and so her personal style is like a big part
of how she shows up to the world. She likes
bedazzled shirts, she likes to have her name on her
shirt or her hat. These are people who have a
(33:35):
very distinctive look. And I believe the reason why the
Gateway Pundit posted so many images of the women were
basically to be like, look how black these women are look?
How like look how they look because they knew that
these images these visuals of these black women. They could
say anything they wanted because because they were weaponizing this
(33:56):
already pre existing disdain black women. And so I think
that like they knew what they were doing. That is
why you see these images used over and over and
over again of them like with like crooked stamped across
their head. I think they I think they knew that
that was going to be what like moved their audience,
and I think they weaponized that to make this lie stickier.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Yeah, it follows along with what Trump has been saying
about Lanta, especially when he was going after John Lewis
before his death.
Speaker 4 (34:23):
He always does this like, oh, if I were in Atlanta,
I would be more worried about the crime, like just like.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
Yeah, he would go after it and trying to set
it up as if it was just this horrible, stricken
place because it was made up of a large largely
black communities, which is like, no, that's why it's so
productive and wealthy right now, Like, I'm not really sure
what you're trying to point out, because Atlanta is one
(34:50):
of the more successful areas of Georgia.
Speaker 2 (34:54):
Huh mm.
Speaker 3 (34:56):
And then he had been setting that up and that
played right in to this whole scandal, because again, here's
a woman who has her own business and she's doing fine,
and it's so well enough that she helps volunteer.
Speaker 4 (35:09):
Yeah, and I think like him and his cronies knew
that like just evoking the idea that that black women
were involved in the vote counting process in Georgia would
be enough proof. I'm putting that in quotes, not like
actual proof, but like their proof that something nefarious was
(35:29):
going on. They basically told their supporters like, black women
were involved in this voting process, so that should be
evidence enough that that Atlanta or Georgia is like rigged
against me. I think that was really the argument that
they were trying to imply.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Right, and again it just aims it towards his already base,
who is very loud exactly.
Speaker 4 (35:53):
So yeah, I think that these attacks really weaponize and
rely on tropes about black women being inherently untrustworthy, which
we see time and time again with things like online
harassment and disinformation.
Speaker 5 (36:04):
So this I'll led to like.
Speaker 4 (36:05):
A flood of really scary racist death threats and harassment
against Ruby and Shay online. If folks watched the January
sixth Commission their testimony really just like, I think every
American should watch it because it really is horrifying and
also heartbreaking to hear them describe what they went through.
(36:27):
But this is Shay talking about what it felt like
to know that her mom was now involved in this.
Shae at her during the January sixth testimony, said, I
felt horrible. I felt like it was all my fault.
Like if I never would have decided to be an
election worker, I could have done anything else, but that's
what I decided to do. And now people are lying
and spreading rumors and lies and attacking my mom. I'm
her only child going to my grandmother's house. I'm her
(36:50):
only grandchild, and my kid is just I just feel
so bad. I felt bad for my mom, and I
felt horrible for picking this job and for being the
one that always wants to help, always there, never miss
that one election. I just felt like it was my
fault for putting my family in this situation. It is
really heartbreaking. Ruby talks about how she had been so
proud of her nickname and her name, Lady Ruby, that's
(37:13):
the name of her business, that she is definitely a
staple in Georgia. Everybody knew Ruby as Lady Ruby, and
she always wore that shirt with her name on it,
and because of all of this campaign of lives and harassment.
Ruby talks about how she once was this pillar of
the community and now is afraid to use her own name,
(37:33):
her name that she used to wear as a badge
of honor. Like I get emotional just thinking about what
that would have been like for these women and how
threatening it sounds like that was to their own sense
of identity, their own sense of safety, their own sense
of being able to show up in their communities that
(37:53):
was like really important to them, that was just taken
away because of these people lied.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
Like just really upsets me. H.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
Yeah, And I think one of the things to keep
in mind too, is that these were two women who
were just trying to help their community. They were not
looking for this, obviously, but weren't looking for like fame
or attention or they were just trying to help their community.
And then it got blown up and it became this
whole thing where now, yeah, you can't use the name
(38:26):
you were so proud of, or you feel guilty about
doing something good for your community. But there was like
a whole organized effort that ended up getting targeted towards them.
Speaker 4 (38:41):
Exactly, and so let's talk a bit about who were
some of the players in that effort. So, in addition
to the like mixed bag of Trump croonies that you've
heard about, you know, Rudi Giuliani, folks like that, Ruby
and Jay were also being harassed and threatened by a
woman named Trevion Kuti. Trebon was formally a publicist for
the R and B singer slash convicted sex criminal r Kelly.
(39:02):
So she definitely like knows how to pick the men
to associate with. She had some kind of association with
Kanye West at some point, who you may recall, ran
for president himself alongside Trump in twenty twenty before becoming
a vocal Trump supporter.
Speaker 5 (39:19):
NBC News.
Speaker 4 (39:20):
It's not totally clear what her association with Donald Trump is.
NBC News reported that in a biography of her on
a website for the the Women's Global Initiative, a business
networking group, she identified herself as a member of the
Young Black Leadership Council under President Donald Trump. She says
that she was secured as Kanye West's publicist in twenty
(39:41):
eighteen and now serves as his director of Operations, but importantly,
Kanye West camp says that she was not associated with
Kanye West. But Kanye's camp is like, we don't know her.
Speaker 5 (39:52):
They're like, we she.
Speaker 4 (39:54):
Is not associated with us, so like don't know what
to tell you. So, in any event, regardless of whether
or not she is truly associated with Kanye West or
Donald Trump, what went down is this, Travion showed up
at Shay and Ruby's door, and the women, after being
harassed and targeted, understandably just like called the police. The
police show up, and they all end up going to
(40:16):
a police station together to talk. Trivion told them that
she was visiting them at the direction of a high
profile individual who warned that if Ruby and Shay did
not confess to voter fraud, they would be arrested in
forty eight hours. According to Rolling Stone, the body cam
footage of the conversation shows Trivion telling the women, I
cannot say what specifically will take place. I just know
(40:38):
that it will disrupt your freedom and the freedom of
one or more of your family members. You are a
loose end for a party that needs to tidy up,
which is like a real weird thing to tell somebody.
To be honest, with you. That's like a very weird thing.
You say. Yeah, so I will say Travion has said, like, oh,
they're getting it wrong.
Speaker 5 (40:56):
I was trying to help these women. That's not a threat.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
So like that's her defense, is that, like she was
genuinely trying to offer support to these women.
Speaker 5 (41:06):
That's what she says. Uh, you tell me what you
what you think, But like that's her defense.
Speaker 4 (41:11):
Then she calls a man by the name of Harrison
Floyd of Black Voices for Trump, puts him on speakerphone,
and Floyd says that he can offer the women protection.
But according to that body cam audio, he said that
Ruby and Shay would have to confess to voter fraud.
If she did, he would offer her legal protection, but
if she declined, then her and her family would be arrested.
(41:32):
So Floyd worked for the Trump campaign formally as the
executive director of the of Black Voices for Trump, but
he told Rachel Maddow that he sent Trevion to the
women's house as a private citizen, not as an employee
of the Trump campaign. He also in those calls said
that like he has people that can keep her safe.
Speaker 5 (41:51):
If she confessed all.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
Of that, I should say, like I'm including what these
people are saying as their defense or like how they
explain their behavior. I don't really believe any of these people,
but like this is what they said about like why they.
Speaker 5 (42:04):
Did the things that they did.
Speaker 4 (42:05):
So I just think people should know their side of
the story, even though I don't believe any of this.
Speaker 3 (42:11):
This is like again, I just this is such a
bad setup of so many like gang movies.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
That you were like, what is happening?
Speaker 3 (42:21):
Like this reminds me of what would have happened in
Chicago in the early mob days. Like they create a
problem and a threat, but will protect you if you
can truss these things. And you're thinking, so, at what
point does Floyd and COUDI not realize they're bound to
be thrown under the bus like they are the scapegoats now.
Speaker 4 (42:41):
Yeah, I mean so yes and Floyd especially because folks
might remember that when all the other defendants in the
Trump Raiko case got arrested in Georgia, most of them
just like bonded out right away, right Lloyd because when
they initially the FBI initially had like served him at
his apartment.
Speaker 5 (43:02):
They like he got into some kind of like.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Physical scuffle with the FBI, and so that led to
like a warrant for his arrest. And so when he
turned himself in for these Trump Raicho charges, he actually
was not able to bond out like everybody else was
like in and out.
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Yeah, it was bad.
Speaker 3 (43:21):
I didn't realize it was for that and BT dubs
the RICO charges here in Georgia is partially racial. So
it's quite funny to me that they got that.
Speaker 4 (43:31):
Yeah, I mean, honestly, it's complicated, but like, I just
can't believe I thought this was a good idea. I
can't believe that they were like, yes, I will get
myself arrested for this man. I will get like pretty
serious charges for this man. I will break the law
for this man, and that will be fine for me.
That will go well for me. I will be in
their club, I will be taken care of, I will
(43:51):
be protected. I cannot believe that somebody would think that. So, yeah,
just really says a lot about the judgment there, I
guess right.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
I can't.
Speaker 3 (44:00):
I'm like, there's nothing about this group of people who
would help you as we.
Speaker 2 (44:05):
Yeah, yeah, they have a long history of throwing people
under the bus, going completely broke.
Speaker 5 (44:10):
Right, even they're not gonna throw you under the bus.
Speaker 2 (44:12):
Yes, you're not special.
Speaker 5 (44:15):
I will say.
Speaker 4 (44:16):
One side note is that Trivion KOUTI I think that
people should She's very active on Instagram. I think that
if folks listening are curious for more information about her,
I really implore them to look at her Instagram. Her Instagram,
I think is very telling about what kind of person
(44:36):
she is. Right, so, yeah, folks are interested in like
cause like when I first was reading about this, I
was like, what kind of per Like, she's suways like
a interesting person.
Speaker 5 (44:44):
Let me look her up.
Speaker 4 (44:45):
And her Instagram really confirmed that she's someone who is
like hashtag overload, Like every post is like so like, honestly,
I can't really even describe it. I mean, if folks
are curious, they should look her up on Instagram, and
I I I don't think you will be disappointed at
what you see.
Speaker 5 (45:02):
I'll put it that right.
Speaker 3 (45:04):
Well, her association with R Kelly, because if I know
one thing, in Atlanta, black women they do not side
with R.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Kelly. Like that's so.
Speaker 4 (45:14):
Rare event in Atlanta when they played Remixed Magnition and
black women were like boom.
Speaker 5 (45:21):
Turn this off. Yeah, until the DJ turned it.
Speaker 3 (45:24):
Off, like, yeah, every debate that I've ever seen, uh,
and like it would be on our.
Speaker 1 (45:32):
Neighbor pages all of that, it was always men.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
Or white people who were and white people were smart
enough to stay out of it for the most part.
Speaker 1 (45:42):
Yeah, they were like, Okay, we're not we're not part
of this.
Speaker 3 (45:44):
But every black woman that you saw was going after anyone.
Speaker 1 (45:49):
So for her to be a supporter at any point,
you're like, hmm, really, yeah, that's that's not that's a
sign right there.
Speaker 4 (46:10):
So this whole conversation between Trevion and Harrison Floyd and
Rubinha went down on January fourth, twenty twenty one, just
two days before January six It honestly sounds like Trump's
associates just wanted to get a forced confession out of
these women as a means to stop the transition of power.
(46:32):
So on January sixth, when pro Trump extremists and goons
were storming the Capitol, they were also surrounding the women's
home with bullhorns, but luckily they had already fled for
their safety. But this is where it gets even scarier.
Trump supporters actually tried to force their way into Shay's
elderly grandmother's home to make a citizen's arrest. I honestly
(46:54):
cannot even fathom how terrifying it would be to have
a mob of angry, potentially armed people show up at
your elderly grandmother's home and with the intent to force
their way in and citizens arrest her. Like, I don't
even I mean, I can't, I don't even have words, like,
I don't even know.
Speaker 5 (47:14):
I can't think of anything more horrifying than that.
Speaker 3 (47:18):
Right, Once again, she had nothing to do with any
of the elections, So this is just the hostage at
this point.
Speaker 4 (47:24):
Essentially, Yes, and like and I think it goes back
to a lot of the things that we that we
talk about on the show. When we deal with things
like harassment campaigns, it is rarely just the woman. So
it's usually a woman at the center of a harassment
campaign like this.
Speaker 5 (47:39):
It is rarely just that one woman.
Speaker 4 (47:42):
Is It is her and her family, her and her parents,
her and her kids, her and her partner. And it's
an effort to, I think, terrify women and other marginalized
people from participating in civic and public life. If like,
I'm one person, if I'm going to face these kinds
of attacks. I wouldn't love it, but like, okay, that's me.
Speaker 5 (48:03):
Fine.
Speaker 4 (48:04):
If it's me and my elderly parents, me and my child,
me and my partner, me and my community, you might
think twice about your behavior if you felt like you
were putting the people that you loved at risk. And
so this is a specific tactic in order to frighten
women out of civic and.
Speaker 5 (48:23):
Public life, and I think it's effective.
Speaker 4 (48:26):
It really it's upsetting that it works, but I can
understand why women don't want to put their families at
risk in this way.
Speaker 3 (48:34):
After that election, I volunteered at a few polls and
I even thought about trying to work at the elections,
and they were in desperately.
Speaker 1 (48:43):
They were begging people to come.
Speaker 3 (48:45):
And this was after several of the voter sites had
been shut down by our governor, so they'd already been
transitioned into like maybe four stations out of those six,
and they were trying desperately to find people because they
having such a struggle.
Speaker 5 (49:01):
Yeah, so that's not surprising to me.
Speaker 4 (49:02):
It's actually become a common problem. According to research from
the Brendan Center, nearly one to three local election officials
no at least one election worker who has left the
job partly due to safety concerns, increased threats, and intimidation.
Ruby herself said that she could never see herself working
another election again for the rest of her life, which
again I don't blame her. In this most recent election,
we had a shortage of poll workers, which of course
(49:25):
leads to anti democratic outcomes like short staffing, polling precingcs
like you just described, Sam that force people to wait
in longer lines to vote. These shortages of poll workers
can also cause some locations to either close or be
consolidated with other polling centers, making it more challenging for
voters to access new polling places. All of this can
(49:45):
lead to disenfranchisement and reduce trust and elections, especially among
communities of color and other marginalized communities who already face
barriers to voting, and so it is a widespread issue
when you go to vote. If people have been intimidated
out of being part of that process, that is an
attack on our democracy and it harms all of us,
(50:08):
not just the women who are attacked and find themselves
the targets.
Speaker 2 (50:12):
Right, and that's terrifying. I remember voting kind of soon
after this for a local election, and you could almost
feel it. You could feel that everyone was more unsure
about the process and everyone was more on edge, and
at one point, like the power flickered and you could
just see people looking around like, oh, like, I can't
(50:32):
trust this anymore. And the damage that has been done
to these specific women does speak to so much more.
It speaks to this doubt and people not feeling safe
to work at polls. And I think who works at poles, Like,
if I go in and it's like a bunch of
(50:54):
kind of burly white dudes that I might think are
Trump supporters, I'm not gonna feel as good about voting,
Like I'm not I feel the safe about voting. And
it's just like a trickle, it's everywhere. It's got a
ripple effects. We're talking about kind of a specific thing
that it's such a larger issue.
Speaker 4 (51:11):
Absolutely, and it's absolutely gendered. Eighty percent of election officials
are women, So these are women being attacked and it's
harming all of us. And it shouldn't be like that
when you go to vote, when the lights flicker, you
shouldn't have to worry like, oh no, what's about to happen?
Like this is the foundation in the cornerstone of our democracy,
and it shouldn't it shouldn't be like that, right, So
(51:32):
we deserve better than a system that is able to
weaponize racism and sexism and lies to disenfranchise us. We
deserve so much better. And you know that kind of
brings us to today. So Ruby and Shay sued the
right wing website The Gateway Pundit and its owners for
defamation her publishing stories that instigated a deluge of intimidation, harassment,
(51:53):
and threats.
Speaker 5 (51:54):
And they also settled a suit with one American news network.
Speaker 4 (51:57):
And honestly, I hope they get penny. Hope they get
so much money and then thumb. Earlier this month, a
federal judge ruled that Rudy Giuliani is liable for defaming
these women.
Speaker 5 (52:08):
He'll have to pay their legal fees.
Speaker 4 (52:09):
He's already paid about ninety thousand dollars and there's going
to be another trial to determine how much you will
have to pay in additional damages.
Speaker 5 (52:16):
It could be in the millions.
Speaker 4 (52:17):
And so I'm pleased that these women are getting some
semblance of justice, Like, I think that's great, But I
do also think that no amount of money can make
right what they went through. They only wanted to serve
their communities and do civic good during a pandemic, and
the President and his associates put their lives at risk
(52:39):
because of that. You know, they testified and spoke off
about what they experienced and putting themselves even more at risk.
And so what they did was heroic. They are absolutely
American heroes. But black women should not have to be
put in such a great danger for a country that
is going to weaponize their own identities against them, right,
and so, yeah, I think that what they did is
(53:00):
really heroic. But I wish they never had to do
that in the first place. I wish that they were
able to just do their jobs and live their lives
and try to support democracy as they were doing, without
facing these kind of attacks, because not only does it
hurt them, it hurts us all.
Speaker 3 (53:18):
Yeah, I hope they get all the money as they deserve.
I'm glad that Juliani actually admitted that he was wrong.
Speaker 1 (53:25):
We shouldn't even have a good to that point.
Speaker 4 (53:27):
Technically, what he admitted was I am so broke that
I can no longer afford to contest these allegations.
Speaker 5 (53:34):
So he didn't admit wrongdoing, but he did. He was like,
I don't have the money to continue to contest fees.
Speaker 3 (53:39):
So okay, sure I read that wrong, but I'm glad
he's getting all his money taken away. That's delightful. And
we know he's never getting any money that he was
supposed to get from Trump, so that's even better.
Speaker 4 (53:52):
It's like begging Trump to pay his legal his legal fees. Also,
even if Trump was like, I'll pay your legal fees,
he doesn't pay anyway, So like, what does that even
look like?
Speaker 5 (54:00):
He doesn't pay his bill.
Speaker 3 (54:01):
I think he actually owes Julianni for the years of
representing him. That like he just doesn't pay, which everybody's like,
you know, that's not a thing. Which I still love
to think about the fact people love him as a businessman,
Trump and roll them. I'm like, all his businesses go bankrupt.
I don't understand what you're talking about. Literally in Atlanta
and he tried to build a whole apartment and it
(54:23):
went bankrupt.
Speaker 4 (54:25):
It's easy to be a savvy businessman where you just
don't pay anybody that you owe money to, Like if
I didn't pay any of my bills, i'd probably be rich.
Speaker 3 (54:32):
I love the whole file bankruptcy thing, which he's done
so many times and he can because he doesn't need credit,
so he's like, I just keep borrowing money. Yeah, And
I hate that this is their legacy. Like that's the
thing that I know they did what they had to
do because they're going to protect themselves and protect their
loved ones.
Speaker 1 (54:50):
But the fact that they had to be put.
Speaker 3 (54:51):
To this point going through so much stress and then
just hiding because I remember when they did high they
later left Atlanta and went to South Georgia and even
there they're just like, what if they find us?
Speaker 4 (55:03):
Yeah, it breaks my heart. My heart goes out to
these women. I think about them often. Yeah, I think
about them a lot. I wish them nothing but peace
and prosperity and abundance for the rest of their lives,
because Lord knows they deserve it.
Speaker 3 (55:17):
They deserve it, and they've done so much, especially for
the state of Georgia with what we're seeing, and we
love to see the fact that, thanks in part to
them to coming out and speaking out, we get to
see mugshots.
Speaker 4 (55:34):
Oh if you if you haven't seen Trevion's mugshot, I
definitely suggest taking a look at that too.
Speaker 5 (55:39):
That's what I'll end there. Just a lot going on.
Speaker 1 (55:44):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (55:45):
And we should also note that it is DA Fanny Willis,
who is a black woman who really.
Speaker 1 (55:53):
Decided like, yeah, we're not gonna let this sit.
Speaker 3 (55:55):
No.
Speaker 4 (55:55):
I don't think I knew like much about her until this,
until this started, so like, yeah, I know it.
Speaker 5 (56:03):
Chaps.
Speaker 4 (56:03):
Trump's asked that so many of the people who are
like trying to hold him accountable or black women, I
know that's got a chat.
Speaker 3 (56:09):
Yeah, and he really hoped that Georgia would pull a
Florida where Kemp would kick the DA off, but Camp
was like, nah, I'm.
Speaker 1 (56:20):
Not messing with her. You got if I messed with Atlanta,
it might be over for me.
Speaker 4 (56:26):
And he realizes that don't mess with Atlanta because the
South's got something to say.
Speaker 1 (56:30):
Look, they know that he barely made it. Buy some Uh.
Speaker 3 (56:35):
I'm going to say Gray areas past Abrams, but like
Fulton County will be the one that takes him out
if he's not careful. And you're here, de Willis, She's
she doesn't play.
Speaker 2 (56:51):
We always love having you so much, Fridgid. I feel
like we could just go on and on and on
and talk about all these different things.
Speaker 5 (56:56):
This is such a pleasure.
Speaker 4 (56:57):
You always let you always let me, Like when I've
got to be in my by about something, you all
always give me a platform.
Speaker 5 (57:03):
So I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (57:04):
We love bees and bonnets. Virgets bees and bonnets.
Speaker 5 (57:09):
Oh that's a good business. Look at that. I had
to save that one.
Speaker 2 (57:15):
Yes, yes, well, thank you, thank you uh for always
being into light and doing this research and making sure
people know these important things. We know you're very busy,
so we really appreciate it. Yes, where can the good
listeners find you?
Speaker 4 (57:31):
Well, you can check out my podcast. There are no
girls on the internet. You can find me on Instagram
at bridget Marie and DC or on Twitter at Bridget Marie.
Speaker 5 (57:38):
And you can see me and Annie in Las Vegas
if you're there, check come check us out.
Speaker 2 (57:43):
Yes, I will wear not pajamas for.
Speaker 1 (57:49):
Are you gonna low key cosplay Scully? Hello?
Speaker 2 (57:56):
I actually have a friend who cosplays a Scully and
she has the bench. Maybe she'll let me. Okay, that's
a good idea. That's a good idea. Okay, well that's
a spoiler for what we might be talking about. But yes,
thank you, thank you, thank you, Bridget. If you would
like to find us, you can. You can email u
a Stuffidia mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com. You can
(58:18):
find us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast, or on
Instagram and TikTok at Stuff I've Never Told You. We
have a tea public store. We also have a book.
You can get it at stuff you should read books
dot com or wherever you get your books. Thanks, it's
always to our super producer Christina, our executive ducer Maya,
and our contributor Joey.
Speaker 1 (58:32):
Thank you and I'm sorry, oh no, Thanks to you.
Speaker 2 (58:36):
For listening Stuff I've Never Told Whose prediction of i
R Radio. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio, you
can check out the art radio app Apple Podcast wherever
you listen to your favorite shows,
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