Women and Bagpiping

The history of bagpipes stretches further back than many of us might realize, though the the history of women pipers is harder to follow. Anney and Samantha dig into the surprising history and future of women pipers.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
Hey, this is Annie.

Speaker 2 (00:06):
And Samantha.

Speaker 1 (00:07):
And welcome to Stuff I Never Told You, a production
of iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
And this episode, well, it came about as a byproduct,
I guess, in my research for something else. If you
listened previously to our activists around the world, we did
feature an Egyptian Scottish woman. And it kind of led me, like,
I was going through all of these avenues, and it
led me to this episode. But I was very excited

(00:38):
because I was like, oh, this is interesting. I need
to know this immediately. And it needed to be done.
And today we're doing it. We're looking at the world
of bagpiping or piping and a couple of the women
who made history in it. And it is a very few.
So this became one of those episodes, as I researched,
I got really into the history.

Speaker 1 (00:57):
Mm-hmm. of bagpiping.

Speaker 2 (01:01):
So we're going to be talking a lot more about that.
We are featuring a couple of women and then some
of the women today who are making giant changes and
breaking barriers and just the depth that needs to be done,
I guess, in order to make it more equitable because
it's still not quite there because bagpiping has been dominated

(01:24):
mainly by men, partially because it was kind of a
military thing. ish thing. It was used in order to
distract and or to celebrate victory. So a lot of things.
Let me start by saying this, because this is the
history of bagpipes. It's still shorter than what it could
have been, because there's books and books and books of this, obviously.

(01:44):
I don't know anything about bagpipes, as in fact, I've
never necessarily cared for it. Before y'all jump on me,
bagpipe fans, because if you're here, you're like, oh, you're
going to finally talk about it. Or, oh, I found
this because you're talking about it. Don't be mad. It's
just because I didn't know much about it. It does
have a higher pitch in things that I don't necessarily,

(02:04):
especially when it's super loud next to you. I'm like, oh,
what's happening? I feel the same way about like the
fiddle and the violin. When it hits a certain pitch,
it kind of hurts my ears. And I'm like, oh, no.
But I do get used to it. And I do
appreciate the complexities of this instrument because I wouldn't even
know how to start with a backup. And contrary to

(02:27):
my last name, which is Scottish, my family, my adoptive
family is Scottish. I know very little. They know very little.
Let's just be really honest about this culture. Like I said,
I guess this is one of those many things that
we can file under something I never really thought about
until I was like, oh, women and bagpiping, yeah. It

(02:48):
just was one of those things that kind of left
it as it's always been here. I took it for
granted as it's always been here. And honestly, this thought
process is not far off when you look at the history.
You're like, oh, it truly may have always, some form
of bagpipes have always been here. So the origination of
bagpipes are unknown, but the history does show that it

(03:11):
most likely was a part of the Mesopotamia, Egypt, Greek,
and Roman culture. It may have even dated back to
like 1000 BC era, and apparently was mentioned in the Bible,
in the book of Daniel specifically. That's not as old
as 1000 BC, but you know what I'm saying. The
Book of Daniel apparently happened around like 605 BC or

(03:32):
would take place at 605 BC or like 500 BC.
Around in there. So this is even before then. There
is some evidence that shows an image that appears to
be something similar to the bagpipes in a Hittite stone
carving in what is now known as Turkey. So this
is a bit from bethroars.com. It is speculated that pipes

(03:54):
came about as far back as ancient Egypt. I've read
about an ancient Egyptian carving showing a street musician with
what seems like a bagpipe chanter in a bag under
the left arm. I can't, however, seem to find the photograph,
so she was looking through that, but did find a
carving of this description from the Hittite empire that was
around at the same time as the ancient Egyptians, but

(04:15):
in what is now Turkey. The Hittite did have a
lot of trade with Egypt, so it could have been
passed on from Egyptians. So it was kind of like, okay,
it seems like Egypt is the focal point in here.
And we know they did a lot of interesting things
that brought a lot of, like, modern inventions. Like, they
had a lot of that before. So from there, an
Egyptian reference of the Piper of Thebes. This is kind

(04:39):
of where it comes from. So from the discoverybritain.com article,
they write, Musicians said to have played instruments fashioned from
materials like dogskin and chanter's card from bone around 400 B.C.,
It appears that the bagpipe was hinted at the Bible,
specifically the symphonia mentioned in the book of Daniel. So
they had different names. I don't love that it was like,

(05:00):
I mean, it makes sense that it was made up
of body, like of animal parts. A lot of instruments
are still saying that now. It feels like, oh, no. Anyway, again,
from there, the Romans come into play and took the
instrument globally back to the Beth Roars dot com. It
is written that Emperor Nero of the ancient Romans could
play the pipe both by means of his lips and

(05:22):
by tucking a skin under his armpits. And here comes
the first blasphemous piece of history. In the form of
the legend of Caesar's bagpipes during the conquest of Britain,
the story tells of Caesar, in an effort to keep
the Roman casualties to a minimum, decides to ambush the Celts.
He did this by asking his pipers to hide and
the prearranged signal all play at once. The Celtic horses

(05:45):
bolted through their riders and the Roman army rushed in.
The Romans used the original pipe band against the Celts.
It is blasphemous indeed. Very blasphemous. So back to that
discoverbritain.com article. They talk about the make of these bagpipes. Quote,
these early bagpipes were typically fashioned with naturally hollow materials

(06:06):
such as reeds, bamboo, and as mentioned, even bone, while
animal skins were often used for those with a bag part.
So there you go. See, you could use reeds. You
could use reeds. I guess skin still has to be used. So,
and back to the legend from bethroars.com. They write this.
Legend says that when the Britons realized what had happened,

(06:28):
they believed the bagpipe was divine with magical qualities. Hearing this,
the English then copied the Roman instrument. In fact, there
is an archaeological find at Tewksbury Abbey, Gloucester, of a
small altar that 2nd century AD depicting a figure playing
an early type of bagpipe. So a lot of artistry
when it comes to the bagpipes. So as the legend

(06:49):
of the instrument is traveling internationally, the makeup of the
instrument has also progressed. So here's a bit of information
from historicuk.com. Bagpipes have existed in various forms in many
places around the world. In each country, the construction of
the basic instrument comprises the same component parts, an air supply,
a bag with a chanter, and one or more drones.
By far, the most common method of supplying air to

(07:11):
the bag is by blowing with the mouth, although some
early interventions included the use of bellows. The bag, commonly
made from the animal skin, is simply an airtight reservoir
to hold the air and regulate its flow, thus allowing
the piper to breathe and maintain a continuous sound, both
at the same time. The changer is the melody pipe,
usually played by one or two hands. Generally comprising two

(07:32):
or more sliding parts, the drone allows the pitch of
the pipes to be altered. So now we kind of know,
we kind of understand how a bagpipe works. I'm learning,
I'm learning. So with these commonalities, but still some variations,
the bagpipe has been featured throughout history. So back to
that discoverbritain.com article they write, from the Middle Ages, the

(07:53):
bagpipes could be found in varying forms all across Europe.
While the earliest physical trace of a wooden chanter found
in Rostock, Germany, dates from the late 14th century, in
Geoffrey Chaucer's description of baggy pipae. in the Miller's till,
in the Canterbury tills. So it gives a nod to
their place within society at the same time. And there

(08:13):
was one type of bagpipe that took shape above all others.
And y'all, when I was saying baguette pipé, it's pretty
much bagpipes. It's just spelled in Old English. And apparently
that's how you say it, according to the computers that
told me that. Or they were making fun of me.
One of the two things. So I'm going to go
with it, though. I'm going to trust the computer on
that one. And with that, it seems the bagpipes were

(08:36):
pretty popular in England during that time. So back to
the bethroars.com blog. England became the center of the bagpiping world,
with Orchester, Nottinghamshire, and Lancashire producing noted pipers in areas
such as Cornwall, Northumberland, Lancashire, and Lincolnshire made their own
types of bagpipe. Strong evidence indicates that the Irish got
the instrument from invading Anglo-Norman armies, while the French and

(08:59):
Gaul Celts who lived in France, produced at least seven
types of bagpipes, also inspired by the Romans. So really
big history when it comes to the bagpipes. I really
didn't understand it because in my mind, it just was Scottish. Yeah.
In the story, right? So the level of like the
spread of the bagpipes is pretty intense and very, very,

(09:22):
like it's one of, it's kind of one of the
oldest instruments out there with that type of history, you know?

Speaker 1 (09:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:27):
I don't want to know. I am correct. It is
one of the oldest instruments. So the computer tells me
once again.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
I'm worried this computer is becoming your friend. It's got
too much influence, Samantha.

Speaker 2 (09:42):
I know, I know. This is the problem when you
do research online all the time and have to go
through everything. But it's true. It is one of the
oldest instruments. So says many an article out there. So
I'm very surprised by that. I'm not surprised that it is.
But like the order. i really thought was with scotland

(10:02):
so it is way bigger than that and it's been
used for many things And the blog goes on to
talk about the first notable evidence of the bagpipe in Scotland, which, quote,
the earliest evidence of the pipe in Scotland is on St.

(10:23):
Martin's Cross at Iona from 750 AD. Looking at it,
it is a little of a stretch to say it
is definitely a bagpipe. However, it would fit when the
Normans come to the island who definitely did have pipes
at the time. The first unquestionable depiction in Scotland is
in Roslyn Chapel in Melrose Abbey's carvings from the 15th century.

(10:44):
In fact, hilariously, Melrose Abbey has a carving of a
pig playing the bagpipes. I don't know why. She just
said it's hilarious, so.

Speaker 1 (10:53):
Yeah, I'm very interested as to why, because there must
be a historical reason for that.

Speaker 2 (11:01):
Context.

Speaker 1 (11:02):
At first, I would say that sounds like an insult.
The pigs were very fortuitous at the time. That's one
of the reasons we eat a lot of pork around holidays.

Speaker 2 (11:14):
Oh. Fortuna.

Speaker 1 (11:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, well, they were associated with... I've
made it through the winter.

Speaker 2 (11:21):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (11:22):
In Europe, specifically. Okay.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
Okay, that's interesting. Maybe he has something to do with that.
I also know, again, like, the blasphemous stuff with, like,
the battle that happened in Scotland, so I wondered.

Speaker 1 (11:34):
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. There must be a heated, perhaps debated
history behind that.

Speaker 2 (11:41):
Right, yeah, right. So, just... We're going to leave it there,
but she said it's hilarious. We're going to go with that.
So soon after, the Great Highland Bagpipe comes to play,
and the DiscoverBritain.com references Richard McLaughlin, who published The Bagpipes,
A Cultural History, and wrote this. One variant that eventually
developed was the Great Highland Bagpipes, says McLaughlin. While early

(12:02):
bagpipes were likely to have had just one drone at
the top, a bag and a chanter, By the mid-16th century,
it suggested a second tenor drone had been added and
then the third, the bass drone, and evolved by the
early 18th century. So the article continues, quote, exactly when
bagpipes arrive in Scotland is still a matter of debate.
As heartstring-pluckingly good as it would be to believe the

(12:23):
unfounded suggestions that pipes were seen at the 1314 Battle
of Bonnockburn, it wasn't until a little later, 1396, that
were first properly recorded in Scottish history at the Battle
of North Inch. when war pipes were said to have
been played. Scottish historian George Buchanan said that the bagpipes
had replaced the trumpet on the battlefield in Scotland by

(12:43):
the mid-1500s, something supported by their reference at the 1547
Battle of Pinkie near Musselboro. And linkage of bagpipes to
military is pretty lengthy and costs many pipers their lives.
It's believed that possibly a thousand pipers died in the
First World War, and the loss was pretty consistent throughout
every time they would have pipers which led to a

(13:05):
banning of pipers in the front line during World War II.
So they're like, oh, this is bad. This is not
working out. This is getting them killed. Let's take them off.
And they kind of just banned it. Rightly so, I think.
I mean, it doesn't seem like that was the way
to go in general. And at a certain point in history,
owning a bagpipe in Scotland was considered treason. So this

(13:27):
is from scotiapipers.co.uk. The Highlanders were the ones to develop
the pipes into the instrument it is now and to
make it the national instrument of Scotland in peace and war.
All the chiefs of the Highland clans employed pipers. They
were considered a very important part of their establishments. The
music of the pipes spurred the troops on to many
a victory. They were used in many great battles. The

(13:49):
playing of the bagpipe was banned in Scotland after the
uprising of 1745. They were classified as an instrument of
war by the loyalist government. They were kept alive in secret.
Anyone caught carrying pipes were punished, the same as any
man that bore arms for Bonnie Prince Charlie. So in
1746 in New York, James Reed, a piper who bore

(14:09):
no arms against the English king, was tried for treason.
The court came to the conclusion, quote, no Highland regiment
ever marched without a piper, and therefore his bagpipes in
the eyes of the law was an instrument of warfare.
He suffered death on the 6th of November, 1746. So
I'm assuming suffered death meant like.

Speaker 1 (14:29):
Execution?

Speaker 2 (14:30):
Yeah, executed. I was trying to, when I first read that,
I was like, wait, what do you mean by that?
Because other things could happen. So I guess the banning
was even more political than just, A, maybe we should
not have them murdered. And maybe they were murdered on
purpose to try to squash out any type of victorious

(14:53):
feelings or, like, camaraderie. So there's a lot to that.
So it got that bad that people were executed or
at least imprisoned for having a bagpipe. And it was
seen as an act of war. So... Though this ban
was used to discourage and dismantle Scottish culture, I think

(15:14):
it's safe to say it did the opposite. The bagpipes
had been associated with different clans and families throughout the
lands for celebration, for remembrance, and more. And it has
continued to do so for the people. And not just
for the Scottish people. The culture of Scottish, yes, but
the Highland Celtic culture really lived on beyond Scotland, we

(15:35):
know this. So today, the bagpipes are as popular as ever,
and its origins are worldwide. Many people, like myself, still
associate it to Scottish culture, but that doesn't mean it's
not played all over the world. And actually, the recent
World Cup has brought even more attention to this instrument.
So this is from heraldscotland.com. It was an article they

(15:56):
wrote about how the World Cup has changed. So they write,
Visit Scotland analysis suggests growing interest in Scotland's piping tradition
among U.S. audiences. with searches for bagpipes increasing by 22%
in July year-on-year and searches for Piping Scotland rising by 120%.
Interest in Scotland's piping culture is also reflective in online

(16:18):
visitor behavior. Scotland's annual week-long piping celebration, Piping Live, recorded
a 30.4% increase in visits to its website from people
in the United States in July compared with June, while U.S.
web visits were up 220% compared with July 2025. So
it just jumped thanks to the World Cup. I mean,
come on. We were really excited to see Scotland in

(16:42):
the World Cup. Yeah, we were excited. It was short-lived.
Longer-lived than Korea, I think. But still, it was glorious.
It was.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
They just seemed like they were having fun.

Speaker 2 (16:53):
Yeah. Mexico loves Scotland. Oh, yeah.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
They just seemed like a fun bunch. And a lot
of really... Entertaining news stories came out from them in
a time where I think we all really needed that boost.
Entertaining news stories.

Speaker 2 (17:11):
They drank Boston Dry.

Speaker 1 (17:14):
They drank Boston Dry, and I loved hearing the interviews
with them about it. Like, oh, they don't got any
beer over there. It was fantastic.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
It was a fabulous moment. I loved every bit of it.
So of course it did. It did rise. And some
things to know about bagpipes, thanks to clan.com. This is
what they write. These are just some fun facts. Bagpipes
have several parts, including the air supply blowpipe, the bag,
the chanter, the chanter reed, and the drone or drones.
The chanter is the melody pipe, which can be played

(17:44):
by the piper, while the drone or drones provide a
constant note. Another fact, The bagpipes can play nine notes
from G to A. However, there are no sharps or flats,
so there is no need for a key signature. Also,
the bagpipes have a bag that holds air. The player
keeps the bag full of air by blowing into it
with a tube or pumping it with the bellows. To

(18:05):
make music, the bag is pressed and the air comes
out through a kind of flute or chanter. There are
usually one or more other tubes coming from the bag
that make sounds whenever the bag is squeezed, called drones.
Each drone normally plays a different note and stays on
the same note the whole time it is playing to
play a harmony with the chanter. The sounds are made
by a single or more commonly double reed, which vibrates

(18:28):
when air is blown over it. See, aren't you glad
to know these facts? Moving on, the chanter in the
bagpipe is never silent. This means that there is no
rest between notes and the volume of the instrument cannot
be altered. The use of grace notes means that a
variation can be created, rather than through dynamics. This is

(18:48):
a lot to know. And another fact, and we missed it,
by the way, we missed it. The 10th of March
is International Backpipe Day. Inaugurated by the Backpipe Society, it
is a grassroots celebration of all the world's backpipes. There
are celebrations across the UK, but also in Greece, America, Kenya,
and even Iran. Pipers of every kind gather, put on concerts,

(19:10):
visit schools, play on the streets, or for dancing. Put
that in your calendar. And speaking of other countries, apparently
there are more pipe bands in the U.S. than there
are in Scotland. And just in case you're wondering, pipe
bands are musical groups that include the bagpipes and drum corps,
which I don't talk about drum corps much here. I

(19:30):
just am focusing on bagpipes. If y'all have things that
you need to tell me about the entire band, please
let us know. You know I'll love more information. Again,
I got really caught up in the history of this.
So that's kind of why I was really focused on that,
not necessarily what the components can be. So if you
feel like I need to know more about it, please

(19:51):
get at me nicely. And when it comes to pipers
in total, there's quite a lot. In general, there's quite
a lot. And these numbers aren't exact, so I don't
have statistics, but some estimations are that in Scotland, there
are around 10,000 people who play the bagpipes. In North America,

(20:12):
all of North America, the number goes around 100,000. So yeah,
the history is being preserved all over the world. I
was trying to look at Australia because they got a
pretty good group of them. I could not find any,
but apparently if Australia broke the world record by having
374 bagpipe players play the ACDC, it's... It's a long

(20:40):
way to the top.

Speaker 1 (20:41):
If you want to rock and roll. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:44):
There you go. So they played that. 374 bagpipers came
through and broke this record, which was held as 333
people played in Bulgaria in 2012. So this happened in,
I want to say, 2025.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
2025.

Speaker 2 (21:00):
Yeah, this happened in 2025. So congratulations, Australia.

Speaker 1 (21:04):
Yeah, recent victory.

Speaker 2 (21:05):
Kudos to you, you know? But I thought that was funny.
I was like, okay, okay. Because I couldn't get numbers
from Australia, but I got those numbers. So there you go. So, okay.
But like its very own origins, the spread of piping
when it comes to gender was a bit fraught. And
though women may have always been there playing the pipes,

(21:25):
apparently one of the Egyptian carvings, that we were talking
about of the bagpipes was a woman. So it was
like put on a woman's casket because she was a
bagpipe player. It would take almost 200 years for women
to compete in the competitions alongside men for some of them.
Although there were women's only contests. And this is for

(21:45):
solo competitions. And I want to say like there were
some big name competitions that would just not allow women.
And this is what we were talking about. It seemed
for the pipe bands, like we talked about before, where
they had the bands or larger groups, it would be
around the 30s and 40s when they could begin competing
against men. I think it was like 1938. So that

(22:07):
was a little more progressive, having groups. Because they would
also allow women to be a part of bands with men,
I believe. Although some people did not like it. Oh, no.
They were like, we don't accept this. So with that,
let's talk a little bit about bagpiping, again, with women. Again,
like I said, this is a little shorter part. Sorry,

(22:28):
I got really caught up in the history. We'll come back,
I'm sure. And if y'all have people that you want
me to talk about, send me that info. Give me
what you know. So when it comes to women and bagpiping,
the history is interesting with individual women who broke barriers
and then moving on to see a cultural shift that
let more women in. This is from ThistleShoes.com. So they write,
bagpipes and drums were long tied to military regiments and

(22:51):
civic ceremonies, roles historically closed to women. Until anti-discrimination laws
of the 1970s, many bands and competitions either directly barred
women or discouraged their participation. Some of the most prestigious groups,
like the Edinburgh City Police Pipe Band, resisted female involvement
well into the 20th century. And not to, like, go
after them specifically, but that was one of those, like, big,

(23:16):
notable places to be a part of. So people were
upset because they really did have, like, a higher standard
when it came to, so they thought, the respectability in bagpiping.
But we have those who were the exception and not
just the rule. So let's talk about a couple of them.
And these are brief overviews, but I will tell you

(23:37):
where the articles came from. So you can go read
it yourself and to get a little more in-depth look
at these women. And even more, they feature a lot
of women. One from Jenny Campbell, who wrote about trailblazing
female pipers for PipesDrums.com, is Elspath Angela Campbell, who is
featured in several different articles. She comes up as one
of the big beginnings. Campbell was born in 1873 and

(24:00):
came from a lineage of royalty, so this may be
why she was able to break some of those barriers.
The daughter of Lord Archibald Campbell, granddaughter to the 8th
Duke of Argyle, her aunt by marriage was Princess Louise,
daughter of Queen Victoria, so royalty, royalty, okay, royalty. Her
father was a historian and enthusiast of piping and founded

(24:21):
the Inverary Pipe Band, and the band played their first parade,
which led to Inverary Castle, where Elspeth spent her childhood.
So it isn't surprising that she would also become a
part of the music world. So back to Campbell's article,
she writes, Elspeth spent her childhood at Inverary Castle. She
shared her father's interest and became a capable piper who
marched on parade with her father's pipe band and liked

(24:43):
to play around the table after dinner, like the pipe
major of Highland Regiment. She was also a founding member
of the People's Arts Society in 1902 and the only
lady member. She took an active part in the work
of the People's Arts Society and was the secretary at
the time. In addition to the bagpipe, Elspeth played the spinet, piano,
and harp. Newspaper articles often referred to her as an

(25:05):
accomplished player, so they wrote, The Inverary Pipe Band walked
abroad in Inverary the other day, headed by a young
lady who blew the feet floor with all dexterity and
success of a prized bagpiper at Highland Games. This was
Lady Elspeth Campbell, Lord Osterbald's handsome daughter. She's an expert
player and has done a good deal to make the
national instrument popular in fashionable circles. We love a good

(25:29):
fashionable circle, right?

Speaker 1 (25:31):
If I was ever invited to one, I'd be thrilled.

Speaker 2 (25:35):
Right. This needs to be like on an episode of
Downton Abbey.

Speaker 1 (25:39):
Yes. Right? Yes, absolutely.

Speaker 2 (25:42):
I know it's gone, but I'm just saying. And from
another The Queen, the lady's newspaper, that's the article, they write,
Miss Elspeth Campbell, who is the best lady piper in Scotland,
acted as judge of the pipe playing at the fifth
annual Highland Gathering of the London Highland Athletic Club, which
took place recently in the athletic grounds at Richmond. Lady

(26:03):
Eleanor Douglas Hamilton distributed the handsome prizes and was presented
with a beautiful bouquet. I just love that it was
such like, these lovely ladies are doing something so glam.
At the gardens today. The ladies. And it seems throughout
history when they spoke of her, it would be added

(26:23):
that she was a very accomplished piper. Even when she
was given the title Lady Lesbeth Campbell. And by the way,
she never married. She just went on, did her thing,
and became a lady. And she's like, cool. Peace out.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
I'm good.

Speaker 2 (26:38):
Yeah. Yeah. So her history is pretty deep. And she loved,
loved music. As she said. Then we have Bessie Watson,
and I will say this was the name that caught
my attention, and I wanted to be like, oh, I
want to talk about her. Who is this? So Bessie Watson,
known as the child suffragette and piping pioneer, and this
was a really great article that was written by Scotland

(27:00):
with Hannah blog. And by the way, I want to
put this as a side. They are a blue badge
guide with the Scottish Tourist Guides Association and I think
we need to connect with her because, again, my FYP
is telling me I need to go to Scotland. And
they may be the person. And, y'all, they do walking
towards exploring women's history and queer history. I mean, what

(27:23):
could be more cementy-coated? Yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:26):
We were trying to do that for a while.

Speaker 2 (27:28):
Now we have a connection. Now I know of a person.
I don't know them personally. I know of a person
who could be amazing when we actually get there. One
day we're going to start traveling. Yeah. soon. Yes. So

(27:51):
back to Bessie Watson, an Edinburgh-born woman. She had been
one of the few bagpipe women of that time. And
it isn't too surprising as she had grown up in
an area that was filled with music and lively gatherings.
But that's not to say that she or the country
didn't face hardships. So this is from Scotlandwithhannah.com. Bessie also

(28:11):
grew up in an era where when fear of disease
was ever present, especially in crowded urban areas. In 1900,
it was still common for children and adults to die
from illnesses that we can easily treat with antibiotics and
vaccinate against, like tuberculosis. It was fear of TB, an
infection which attacks the lungs, and had killed Bessie's Aunt
Margaret that motivated Bessie's parents to get her started playing

(28:32):
the bagpipes when she was about seven or eight. It
was believed that the mighty amount of breath needed for
piping would help to strengthen we Bessie's lungs and keep
her healthy, which is an interesting tactic. And this started
Bessie's journey into her playing. Her mother, at the same time,
decided to sign herself and Bessie up to be a
part of the Women's Social and Political Union. So back

(28:55):
to that blog. Women's Social and Political Union, WSPU, in Edinburgh,
it was to celebrate, quote, what women have done and
can and will do at a time when women had
very few legal rights and no voting rights whatsoever. It
was still nearly a decade before the first women gained
the right to vote in Britain. and almost 20 years
before full suffrage. And the idea of the pageant was

(29:17):
to portray the achievements of women throughout history. So during
the time that her mom signed her up for this,
it was also when the pageant was happening. So it
was a great opportunity for Bessie to get to play
her bagpipes. And there, Bessie played the bagpipes in a
large parade with the Lothian Lassies, a band that contained
several other young girls as well as her, but she

(29:39):
was the youngest of the group, and was even recognized
by a British woman's suffrage icon, Christabel Pankhurst, who was
one of the founders of the WSPU. And from there,
Bessie started her suffragette journey as that child. Back to
that article. She soon became a committed suffrage activist and
remained involved in the movement. She even wore her ribbons

(30:00):
in the colors of the suffrage campaign, white, purple, and green,
to school. She used her pipes as a form of
political expression. She played on platforms at Waverly Station, as
trains left to carry women's right campaigners to Holloway Prison
in London, and she would often go after school to
stand outside Carlton Jail in Edinburgh and pipe for the
women incarcerated inside. So she was all about that movement

(30:21):
at that young age. She also would go beyond just
playing outside of locations and in parades, but would go
on to play to help with the war efforts at
the time. Even became the first woman to pipe in
the regimental dinner at Seaforth Highlanders Battalion, which apparently had
a long tradition of piping. And it was a very
prestigious group of people that she was playing for. She

(30:43):
would soon go on to teach at Broughton, where she
would form the first state pipe band in Scotland with
a former piper major at the Edinburgh City Police. And
she led this band for 20 seven years at the school.
But back to that Scotland with Hannah blog, they write,
Bessie continued to be recognized as a significant force for
change in Scottish piping, as well as politics. At 14,

(31:07):
she became the first female member of the Highland Piper Society,
winning several awards, and later founded the Broughton School Pipe
Band and led it for 27 years. She studied French
at the University of Edinburgh before becoming a teacher of
music and modern languages, working at schools throughout the city.
Music and piping remained a constant in Bessie's life, and
she was still playing the pipes in her late 80s.

(31:28):
I think she died at 91. So a very long
year of her life. And I'm really glad she was
alive to see voting rights. Like, it's nice to know
that she was aware of what was going on. She
did at such a young age. The article showed a
picture of her scarf, the suffrage scarf, and it was
really cute. I was like, oh my God, it was

(31:48):
her original. I was like, dang, that's awesome. So that's
just a couple of women. I mean, there's many, many more.
I've left out so many that we can come back to.
And if you feel like we need to highlight a few,
please send that our way, and we will. But that
brings us to women competing today. So this is from Backpipe.News.
Although the solo piping competition system began in 1781, it

(32:12):
was almost 200 years later, in 1976, women were allowed
to take part on an equal footing with male competitors
at the major competitions. Before this, many women did compete
at other competitions and in events, especially for women's only.
So whether it had to be a band or women's
only competitions, it was really rare for women to be
able to be competing. It took 200 years for it

(32:35):
to get to that point. So in Australia, though, there
was a woman who won the competition as well as
another woman winning second place, but it didn't seem to
be handled well. So it's not just Scotland. We're saying everywhere.
So this is from that bagpipe.news. Women played in solo
events in Australia in the early years of the century.
On Boxing Day 1900, the Lismore NSW Caledonian Society Highland

(32:59):
Gathering had several piping events. The best piper, who has
never won a prize, was won by Poppy Windsor with
Janet Dargie second, but the papers reported that, quote, in
this event, a protest has been entered against the winners.
At the inaugural gathering of the Clarence River Scottish Society
in April 1927, as well as the usual solo contest

(33:20):
for adults and juveniles. There was a Constellation March and
an event for Lady Pipers in which the winner was Mrs.
Antonelli and second was Mrs. Ruby Antonelli. So there was
a few that were allowed, but I think they were
all like, no, we're not, we're going to protest. And
I don't know, like, other than saying we're not, we
don't acknowledge it. Right.

Speaker 1 (33:42):
You can, you can participate, but you cannot win.

Speaker 2 (33:45):
But like, also, They didn't win any prizes. So it
wasn't like other than the prestige.

Speaker 1 (33:51):
Yeah, the skill, the perceived. Not even perceived, but yeah,
the skill level. Women don't have that.

Speaker 2 (34:00):
So it took a long time for anything to come
about and people to hear like, oh, okay, maybe women
do deserve being able to compete. Because only deeper conversations
we know. But So today there's trailblazers and leaders happening
as well because, again, like we said, it's still iffy

(34:22):
about whether or not they will accept women in the competition.
Faye Henderson made history, who was from Scotland, in 2010
as the first woman to win the prestigious gold medal
at Obon, and she was only 18 years old. So
this is from Thistleshoes.com. Back to that article. They write,
her victory secured her place at the Glenfiddich Championship, breaking
a 21-year absence of female competitors there. So, like, her

(34:46):
winning was a huge deal. It broke several barriers. And
this happened in 2010, so not even that long ago.
Margaret Dunn Houlihan, who is Irish slash Scottish, began piping
at nine and went on to win top solo prizes,
including being the first woman to play in the former
winner's march, Strathspey and Reel at Oban. And she now
teaches National Piping Centers. So that's awesome for future pipers.

(35:10):
And then we have Allie the Piper, who actually I've
seen her name quite a few times because she has
gained apparently like the most followers. And she is from
the U.S. So again, back to the thistle shoes dot com.
They write Allie the Piper from the U.S. has gained
worldwide attention for reinventing the Great Highland bagpipe for today's

(35:31):
music scene. Beginning her journey at 14 to honor her
Scottish roots, she now blends Celtic tradition with rock, metal
and pop. reaching millions online. So I've seen several people
talk about how she is one of the biggest influencers
for backpiping today. I don't know if I've ever seen
her pop up on my FYP, but I've heard her name.

(35:51):
So we got to acknowledge when these women come through
and really blow up things like this and bringing national
attention or international attention to instruments and historical things like this,
especially one that has been gatekept for so long. Again,
like I said, I know we didn't really dig deep
into individual women. Like I need to, I need to

(36:12):
come back so we can. But the history of the
bagpipes alone is fascinating and just the people and the
players in it. So y'all, I feel like I learned something.
This is one of those episodes I felt like I
really learned a lot.

Speaker 1 (36:27):
Same. I also have never really given much thought to
the bagpipes. They're just something I would see in a
parade and be like, Oh, yeah. There we go. Backpipes.
There they are. That's it. So I'm glad to hear
about this and learn that there are women who are
really pushing to get past these gates that have been

(36:50):
there for so long.

Speaker 2 (36:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
Well, yeah, we would love to hear any listeners with
any experience, any history that you know. That would be fantastic.
You can email us at hello at StuffI'veNeverToldYou.com. You can
find us on Blue Sky at Mom's Stuff Podcast or
on Instagram and TikTok at Stuff I've Never Told You.
We're also on YouTube. We have some merchandise at Cotton

(37:14):
Bureau and we have a book you can get wherever
you get your books. Thanks as always to our super
producer Rima and our executive producer Maya.

Speaker 2 (37:20):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (37:21):
And thanks to you for listening. Stuff I've Never Told
You is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio,
you can check out the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
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