November 29, 2025 • 48 mins
In this classic episode of Stuff to Blow Your Mind, Robert and Joe continue their look at sacred trees of the world with a look at lightning-struck trees in European traditions, as well as the sacred rowan tree. (originally published 12/10/2024)
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. My name is Robert Lamb.
It is Saturday, and in this classic episode, we're going
to be discussing lightning, struck Wood, and the Rowan. This
originally published twelve ten, twenty twenty four. Let's dive right in.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My name
is Robert Lamb.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
And I am Joe McCormick. And hey everybody, I got
to apologize right here at the start for my voice
and my brain. Possibly today I am wrestling a pretty
nasty cold, but we're plowing right through. And today we're
going to be talking about a topic. We're actually returning
to a topic we talked about a couple of weeks ago,
the subject of sake trees. In that previous episode, Rob,
(01:03):
you talked about the giants Equoia of western North America,
arguably the largest tree in the world depending on how
you measure, and we talked about the history of how
people regarded these massive plants with reverence. And I ended
up talking about the Ohea, the Hua tree of Hawaii
and a lot of interesting, beautiful ways that it interlocks
(01:23):
with Hawaiian religion and traditional practices. In some cases it's
the physical embodiment of a god. In other cases it's
like a tree beloved by the gods in storytelling and
so forth. But when we were researching that episode, we thought, man,
there are so many interesting angles on sacred trees that
we could come back to. So that's what we're doing today.
Here's a new installment. I'm sure this is something we'll
(01:46):
probably return to again in the future.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Yeah, and it's a good month for it, since we're
into December here, and a lot of December holiday traditions
center around a sacred tree. I guess one of the
things I think we both encountered it in the last episode,
especially in this episode. It's the thing about sacred trees
is that it's never just a case of like, oh, well,
you know, there's this tree around and at one point
there's a group of people that thought it was sacred
(02:10):
and then they stopped. You know, No, the trees have
been around a long time, and human cultures enter into
these areas where these trees grow, develop these ideas about them,
and build upon those ideas, pass them down, and the
trees remain and So you start pulling the threads on
some of these beliefs, and you know, those threads connect
(02:31):
across different peoples, you know, into neighboring territories, and oftentimes
there is far flung as a particular you know, it's
the range of a tree species itself. So before long
you realize, oh, well, this isn't necessarily just a look
at one particular tree and or one particular folk belief
or mythology, but you can easily touch upon like a
(02:52):
dozen different folk beliefs and mythologies concerning the same tree.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
M h.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
Which is to say, we're not going to pull all
We're not going to pull all those those threads today.
We're going to pull some of those threads, and we're
going to find some, I think, some very tantalizing, very
interesting things to say about a couple of different topics
related to sacred trees.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
That's right. So to kick things off today, I wanted
to explore something interesting I came across in a book.
The book is called European Paganism The Realities of cult
from Antiquity to the Middle Ages, originally published in the
year two thousand. I think the edition I was reading
was from maybe twenty thirteen, but from Rutledge Press by
(03:33):
an author named Ken Dowden, who was a professor of
classics at the University of Birmingham in the UK. This
is a book about the religious practices of European cultures
before the introduction of Christianity, and then also those pagan
religions interacting with Christianity once it was introduced. And these
(03:54):
religious beliefs and practices were, of course not all the same,
though there are some themes that kind of emerge repeatedly,
so you can kind of make some rough generalizations about
pre Christian European paganism, but they don't apply in every case.
And one is that a lot of pre Christian European
religions saw sacred dimensions in the features of the physical land,
(04:16):
like rocks, waters, and of course trees. But there are
many different ways to understand the sacredness of trees. Now
down and actually begins this section of the book with
an ancient passage describing something that's a little bit of field,
but I thought it was so interesting I wanted to
throw it in here. It's describing one way of showing
(04:37):
appreciation for trees that's kind of hard to classify. It
doesn't seem exactly right to call it a religious practice,
but it definitely goes beyond, like, Oh, look at the poplars,
they're so nice. This is a translated passage from Plenty
of the Elder that reads as follows. On a hill
called Corna in the suburban part of the land of Tusculum,
(04:58):
there is a grove in a ancient reverence dedicated by
Latium to Diana. And that would be by the way Diana,
goddess of the hunt of wild animals in the moon,
sort of a wilderness goddess. The ranger of the party
Plenty goes on. The foliage of the beech forest is sheared,
as though by topiary. In it. An exceptional tree was
(05:20):
loved in our times by Passienus Crispus twice Console, the orator,
later more famous thanks to his marriage with Agrippina, through
which he became the stepfather of Nero. He was in
the habit of kissing and embracing it. Talking about the
tree kissing and embracing it, not only of lying under
(05:40):
it and pouring wine over it.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Literal tree hugging here.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yes, So this tree is interesting in the example here
because it is in one sense a literal sacred tree.
In a religious sense, it's part of an ancient sacred grove.
And I guess one thing we could talk about is
a distinction between sacred trees, as in, like a type
(06:05):
of tree or a tree species has a religious significance
within a particular culture, versus an individual tree like this
tree right here has religious significance of some kind, versus
a collection of trees have some kind of religious significance,
a sort of expanded version of this tree right here,
this forest right here has significance. And there are a
(06:28):
lot of those in pre Christian European religions, sacred groves,
sacred forests throughout the continent. But so in this case,
it is a particular sacred grove, a forest of beech
trees that are in honor of the goddess Diana. So
these are the trees of Diana, the goddess of the hunt.
(06:48):
But this Roman politician isn't necessarily worshiping Diana. I don't know.
Maybe he is, but it's not discussed in the passage here.
He's not just honoring the sacred forest as a whole
in its relation to the goddess Diana. It sounds like
he is in erotic love with one particular, very special tree.
(07:09):
Hard to think of a parallel to this, I just
thought I thought it worth mentioning. But anyway, From here,
Doubtan goes on to a section where he sort of
thinks about the implicit logic of our relationship to trees,
especially in our desire to think of them as persons,
as like a symbol of a person, or as containing
the essence of a divine person, and he notes an
(07:32):
interesting parallel between trees and humans which has been observed
by a number of scholars of religion. It's not unique
to this book, and that parallel is in the form
of posture. Humans are mostly unique in the animal world
for our verticality. What appears to physically differentiate humans from
(07:53):
other animals is that we are a column a standing
straight up, compared to most other animals, which tend to
position their bodies in a more horizontal fashion. You can
think of a few little counter examples here and there,
but for the most part this does really hold true.
Humans appear to be different from all other animals in
that we stand straight up. And what makes a tree
(08:14):
different from a bush or a shrub or lots of
other plants. Is that it is also a tall vertical column.
So it's true of both trees and humans that we
take the form of a vertical column. We grow taller
as we age, and when we die, we fall down.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
That's a good point.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Yeah, So with this kind of knowledge just sort of
operating in our minds all the time, it seems very
natural to think of the tree as the sort of
human analog within the alien kingdom of plant life, except,
of course, trees grow much larger than humans, and are
much tougher than humans, and often live for hundreds of years,
(08:53):
so in a sense, you can think of them as
something that has always been here. So it's I think
quite natural to start thinking of them as like superhuman
super persons. They are gods.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yeah, yeah, these are great points. Yeah, it stands tall
like a human, it has the verticality, and then you know,
lives before and after us and on this different time
scale than we are.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
So that's just sort of one theory as to why
we're sort of primed to see godhood in the form
of trees. But Doubtin also emphasizes that many trees are
integrated into religion, not simply by their nature, not by
being trees, but in a specific sense, by being connected
directly to myth or to history, as in like this
(09:38):
plane tree at Delphi was planted by Agamemnon and that's
why it's special. Or when Io was transformed into a
cow by Hera and tied to a tree, it was
this olive tree right here. Or this tree was the
source of heracles first oak leaf crown, or this tree
is where Helen of Troy was hanged after she fled
(10:00):
to roads. So in those cases you might say that
these physical existing trees are sacralized by way of intersections
with stories, and whether those are like sort of founding
ethnic stories, like founding histories of a people or a nation,
or myths about the gods. On one hand, you have
(10:20):
a physical object that is right here, right now, this
tree we're all looking at, And on the other hand,
you have the story we all know. And so by
connecting the to the tree, the physical object makes the
story more real, and the story makes the physical object
more meaningful.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Yeah, yeah, Like eventually we'll come around to talking about
the body tree in this series. The Bodhi tree, of course,
in Buddhist traditions, is the tree under which the Buddhist
sat when he attained enlightenment. You know, it is the
place where it happened. Yeah, yeah, so yeah. We see
versions of that in various different myths and religions.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
But one example I really wanted to focus sun for
a minute because I thought it was so interesting, was
something Dowdin brings up in this chapter. That is the
idea of a sacred tree struck by lightning. Dowtan writes
that the ancient Romans had a practice of enclosing a
tree after it was struck by lightning, so like after
(11:19):
a tree was hit by lightning, that it would be
subject to a type of sacrificial or religious immurement. The
enclosure for a tree would sometimes be what this author
identifies as a puteal put el pleural would be putealia,
which usually refers to a well head. So this would
(11:39):
be the raised stone structure around the opening of a
water well. Now, in the case of a water well,
usually you have a wellhead raised in part to prevent
the well from simply being a hole in the ground
that people can fall into. You know, it's like a
wall for safety. In ancient Rome, these well heads were
often made of marble and decorated with carvings or with
(12:00):
bas relief. I've got a picture from from a well
headed venice for you to look at here, Rob, so
you can see, you know, it's a there's a cap
on it right now. I think it's a it's an
iron cap. I don't know what the original material of
the cap would have been, possibly iron, you know, hundreds
of years ago or thousands of years ago as well.
But in this case, you know, you could open it
(12:22):
up and imagine looking down into the well, but then
down on the wall around it, we've got I don't know,
some kind of creepy dancing god babies who are thrown
around some what do you what do you think that is?
Is that grape leaves or olives or something?
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Yeah, some sort of like wreaths and leaves.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Yeah. Yeah. But as Dowdan says in this chapter, sometimes
a poute al would be built not around a water well,
but around a tree or really any spot that had
been touched by a bolt of lightning. So a lightning
kissed location like this was called in Roman times a dental.
(13:01):
And I was reading about this in an older source
from the Dictionary of Greek and Roman Antiquities by William
Smith from the nineteenth century. This reference book goes into
sources from ancient history describing what the bidental was and
what its religious significance was. And so it says that
the Bidental was named after the fact that you would
(13:23):
sacrifice a sheep here after lightning struck. It would be
a two year old sheep called a biden, which means
two tooth by DN like dental, and the sequence would
go like this. So lightning strikes somewhere and people witness it,
and whatever was struck, be that a tree or a
person or just the earth, whatever is there is buried,
(13:49):
in some cases burned, in other cases not burned, but
is buried by priests in the ground in that very spot.
So if you get struck by lightning and killed in
a rome where these bidental priests are operating, you are
not Your body is not transported to a cemetery and
is not cremated. You are buried in the spot where
(14:10):
you fell. And then the two year old sheep is
sacrificed and added to the lot. And then that spot
is in some sense sort of walled off from human contact.
It is capped with an altar and then enclosed in
some way by a fence or in some cases by
a poutel a marble wellhead, and thereafter it is made taboo.
(14:34):
No one may walk there, no one may touch it,
no one may even look at it. And if a
person were to violate this taboo, like to remove the
well head or the altar, or in some other way
violate the prohibition against treading there, they would be subject
to swift, violent punishment by the gods, and this connects
(14:55):
to the original action there. Lightning was often thought to
be the weapon of the god. It's an ancient Rome,
particularly of Jupiter, so a place struck by lightning was
both terrifying and holy. It was a sacred point of
connection with divine power and a conduit of divine wrath.
So as one example of a puteal which may once
(15:17):
have covered a tree made wholly by lightning, Dowdin mentions
a fig tree attested in ancient sources in the area
of the Committium of Rome. The committium is an ancient
public meeting space in the city center, and this fig
tree was known as the Ficus romanaalis, which literally means
(15:38):
the ficus of suckling. Though experts apparently debate whether that's
its original meaning or how it should be understood. But
there are actually a couple of sacred objects said to
be in the vicinity here. One thing is this tree
the ficus room analyis. But there is also a stone
which was said to have been cut in half with
(16:00):
a razor by the ancient Roman augur Attus Navius, and
the story goes that he cut the stone in half
in a display of his powers when he is in
the middle of rebuking a legendary king of Rome who
was sort of arrogantly trying to expand his own glorification
at Us. Navius was rebuking him and saying, like you
(16:21):
go to far king, And in their conflict, he's like,
I better show how strong my divinatory skills are and
the kind of power I can command. So I'm going
to cut a stone, cut a wet stone in half
of a razor.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Oh wow, I guess it worked.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
It did, according to the story. So you've got this
split stone here, and then you've got the Ficus tree.
And here Doubdan again quotes a passage from Plenty of
the Elder describing the site of the tree and the
sliced rock. So Plenty in translation rights, a fig tree
growing in the actual Forum and Committium of Rome is
(16:58):
revered sacred because of the lightning bolts buried there, and
still more to commemorate the fig tree under which the
nurse of Romulus and Remus first sheltered those founders of
empire at the lupercal. It is called ruminalis because it
was beneath it that they found the she wolf offering
her RuMIS. That is what they used to call abreast
(17:21):
to her babies, a miracle commemorated nearby in bronze, as
though the wolf had of her own accord crossed the
Committeum while Adis Navius was acting in his role as Auger.
Nor is it without significance when it dries up and must,
through the efforts of the priests, be replaced. So I
thought this was interesting in that the way Plenty tells
(17:42):
the story, the way he understands it, at least this
fig tree is in part sacred because of an intersection
with legend, like we mentioned earlier. So you know, much
like you might say this tree was planted by Agamemnon,
in this case you would say this tree is the
site where Romula and Remus were nursed by wolf Mother,
and then also by proximity to the site where Adis
(18:07):
Navius split the stone. That's another connect intersection with legend.
But then according to Plenty, it's also sacred because lightning
bolts are buried beneath it. And then here Dowban also
mentions a possible connection of the legend of the ficus
from Analys to the interesting sort of botanical fact that
(18:28):
the fig tree produces a sap like secretion, which I
believe is part of an anti predator strategy that is
said to look like milk. So, like you, if you
wound a fig tree, the ficus will we'll leak out
this white milky substance that is said to be quite
bitter and I think is supposed to deter things from
munching on it.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Yeah, yeah, we used to have a fig tree, and yeah,
I can attest to.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
This, And so Dowbdan's saying, you know, so you have
a place where, according to these ancient texts, you have
a stone which is interesting because of its shape it's
like a split stone. And then you also have a
tree which has interesting sort of biological features. This tree
appears to leak milk and then can be kind of
(19:12):
attached to myths, and so he writes, quote the tree
is tended and when necessary renewed by the priests. If
it is surrounded by a puute al, then originally this
may have been understood as a place where lightning had struck.
And the wet stone, that's the stone that was apparently
split in the story. The wetstone might have been considered
(19:32):
a thunderstone.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Wow, this is all really fascinating and fascinating to me,
especially when you think about the idea that, like the
world tree in myth is often situated as this thing
that connects Earth to the heavens and lightning as well.
Is this momentary connection between Earth and heaven that leaves
like a physical sign. You know, we see it and
(19:55):
then we can if we can find where it hit.
We have evidence this contact between like a lightning and
the earth, between storm clouds and the earth, but on
another level, between the divine and the mundane world totally.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
And you know, one thing I like is the kind
of ambiguity of the is this good magic or bad magic?
The way you know that you can have a place
where a tree is struck by lightning and it becomes
in some sense sacred. But it seems to me rather
there's a kind of ambivalence, like is this a place
that is cursed and dangerous and will hurt you? Or
(20:33):
is this a place that is in some way blessed
and is showing off the power of the gods or
God's power in a way that can be celebrated and sacralized.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
There's almost kind of a U curve, right, It's like
this the place is so sacred or it is so
cursed that it essentially amounts to the same thing, and
that is no trespassing. Sorry, you can't visit it, you
can't touch it. Well, that is all really fascinating. And
(21:07):
another cool thing is that it does lead directly into
the tree that I'm going to talk about here, the
Rowan tree. I was looking at several different sources on this,
one of which was I didn't spend a lot of
time with this source, but there was an older article
titled the Folklore of Trees by Lizzie M. Hadley. This
was published in the Journal of Education back in eighteen
(21:29):
ninety four, and it's very short, little kind of wordy
right up touching on various sacred ideas of trees, but
the Rowan tree is mentioned in passing and just a
few ideas connected to it or thrown out, including the
idea in some European traditions that the tree grew from
a place where lightning struck. That's like the origin of
(21:51):
this tree.
Speaker 3 (21:53):
That would be interesting in the So remember the phrasing
plenty uses is that lightning bolts are buried there where
the tree is. So it's like when lightning hits the ground,
it's almost like a seeding of the ground, like it
plants something when it hits. And so you could imagine, well,
if what it's planting is some kind of seed, what
(22:13):
grows it could be a type of tree, that's right.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
So why did I pick the Rowan tree? Well, I
recently had the opportunity, in the privilege, to to go
on a little tour of Whales with my family, and
I was enraptured by the haunting beauty of its rolling hills,
these dramatic valleys and in some cases hilltop ruins of
which there ghost stories about. So I thought, well, I
should I should cover a tree that is sacred within
(22:38):
Welsh traditions. There's obviously going to be a lot of
overlap with other sacred trees in the British Isles and
and so forth. But yeah, I wanted to pick something
that had significance in Whales. And I realized I was
already talking a little bit about Welsh tradition and mythology
on the monster fact, and I should go ahead and
(22:59):
drive home. If anyone's not familiar Wales as a country
in western Great Britain, it is part of the United Kingdom,
but it boasts its own distinctive culture and language. We've
touched on Welsh Welsh mythology before, which of course shares
various ideas with other cultures of the British Isles. But
I don't know if we'd really if we've ever really
stopped to just talk about the idea of Whales and
(23:19):
Welsh tradition and Welsh language in any degree of detail.
Maybe we haven't. I forgot about it, but I just
wanted to bring it up again. So again, it's the
Rowan tree or sorbus occuparia, also known as the mountain ash,
though it is not closely related to either true ash
trees or a particular tree. This is Eucalyptus regnums this
(23:44):
is the plant that you find in Australia, so obviously
a good ways away from Wales in Europe, but that
one is sometimes called a mountain ash, but it is
not related to the tree we're talking about here. No,
the rowan tree is actually a tree or shrub of
the rose family.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
Oh I didn't know that.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Yeah, So according to the UK's Woodland Trust, which has
a nice little overview about the species here, a rowan
tree can reach heights of fifteen meters or nearly fifty
feet in height. The trees bark is smooth and silvery
gray and leaf the leaf buds are purple and hairy.
I included a close up image here for you, Joe,
But everyone out there, if you do a search, you
(24:24):
can find like rowan tree buds. You'll see these. And yeah,
it has this, as is often sometimes the case with
like the little details, especially with budding of trees. You know,
there's almost like a velvety appearance to it. It almost doesn't
look like tree flesh, but more like you know, it's
like part of a deer growing out of the tree.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Or so I was gonna say, like like a little
fallen's ear. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Now, when the leaves develop, it's gonna have the serrated
leaflets and groups of five to eight it produces white flowers, which,
following pollination, develop into vibrantly scarlet berries. Sometimes I've seen
various photographs, and of course, you know, color, you know,
details of color kind of vary depending on the exact
(25:07):
photography in question. But yeah, sometimes they look more scarlett,
sometimes they look a little more orange, but it's a
vibrant color. And yeah, you can get into a discussion
about it. What is red, what is orange? Anyway? At
any rate, it's bright. It catches the eye, and that's
going to be important as we proceed. And how long
do they live? Well, a rowan tree apparently can live
for upwards of two centuries according to the Woodland Trust,
(25:28):
though a source I'm going to side in a minute
put it more at about one hundred and fifty years.
But at any rate, you know, not the longest lived
tree by any stretch. But still they tend to live
longer than humans. So they still have that kind of
like you know, mythic connotation. They stand outside of our
short time on this.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Earth, always been here.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Yeah, So they're native to the cooler parts of the
northern Hemisphere, mostly western and northern UK. That's or at
least that's one of the key areas that where they grow,
and that's where we're going to be talking about here.
So you'll find them not only in whales, find them
in the highlands of Scotland, and they're they're pretty far flung.
(26:08):
Another source I was looking at was a Journal of
Ecology ride up on the species. This was by all
Olivier rasp at All titled just Sorbus Occuparia l and
this article pointed out that one of the British isles,
you know, are certainly a place where you can find them.
(26:28):
They're present through most of Europe, from Iceland to northern Russia,
though not into Arctic Russia, down into Spain, Portugal, Italy, Macedonia,
and it seems limited by poor drought tolerance and a
necessity for a short growing season and a cold requirement
for the bud burst. This source, also, this is the
(26:52):
one that puts the age at more of like a one
hundred and fifty year range, So I'm not sure if
it's one fifty or two hundred, you know, it depends.
I guess you know where you want to fall on that.
But It's also been pointed out that the sorbus species
here seems to have perhaps originated in Southeast Asia and
gradually spread. Now, another interesting thing to think about trees
(27:16):
in terms of, you know, having a sacred nature is that,
of course we make use of trees, We do things
with trees. Trees, you know, produce wood that we may
use for various purposes depending on the quality of the wood.
They produce leaves, they produce berries, they produce flowers, and
so forth. So they are also this like font of
(27:36):
materials that we might make use of, and I guess
you don't always know exactly how that's going to fall. Like,
you know, there are plenty of examples of cultures where
the things that make the mundane world possible are in
and of themselves sacred, you know, be it a food
product or whatever. Like, just because you interact with it
every day, it doesn't mean that it can't be sacred.
It may be very sacred within a tradition because it
(27:58):
is part of your survival mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
But then of course our lives are full of things
that we don't really give sacred connotations too, because they
are just part of the mundane world. So what do
whom humans use it for? Well, the wood of the
rowant is usable. Apparently, it's hard and tough, but not
super durable. And my understanding of this is that basically
(28:21):
it means you maybe wouldn't want to build a house
out of it or use it for like really like
high stress situations.
Speaker 3 (28:30):
You wouldn't build a car out of it.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Well, yeah, I guess so. Yeah, But on the other hand,
it's not like it's super fragile, like, because you can
make furniture out of it, craft works and even tools,
you know, So it's like, I guess it's you know,
it's not so fragile that you could make a tool
out of it. But just again, I guess maybe not
a house, though perhaps there are examples of such usage
as well. But that's that's what the sources were saying.
(28:55):
And as far as the berries go, I think we
were talking about Mike earlier you asked me, well, can
people eat the berries? Apparently, so now I want to
add the caveat here. Anytime we're talking about eating berries,
please do please do additional research before you eat berries.
But my understanding is that they are edible for humans,
(29:16):
but they are quite tart, and that means that jam
is one of the most common culinary uses of the berries,
you know, So, you know, typical jam making scenario usually
there's a lot of sugar added or some sort of
sweetener added, there's a you know, a reduction taking place,
So there are a lot of steps in place to
take something that is otherwise quite tart and make it
(29:37):
consumable and you know, and appealing to the human palate.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
So cooked rowan thumbs up, raw rowan question mark, right.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
But on the other hand, the sources I was looking at,
they did say that, you know what they've the rowan
berries have long been a part of the human diet.
There's evidence from like southern Sweden from around six thousand
years ago that that gives us evidence that, yeah, like
people have been eating the rowan berries. So as to
I didn't get into details about ancient preparations of rowan berries,
(30:10):
if they were cooking them or if they were just
eating them raw, but it seems like when you get
into more modern uses, and not even just modern, but
like you know, last several centuries, people were generally talking
about taking the rowan berries and doing some sort of
culinary preparation to get them to a place where we
enjoy them. Yeah, and sadly, I did not know to
(30:33):
look out for Rowan jam while I was in Wales,
so I don't know if it's something I could have
purchased or tried if i'd been looking for it. I
did a quick look around the internet. I'm not even
sure you can get in the States, so I'm not sure.
If you have tried rowan jam and or you are
familiar with all the things you can do with rowan berries,
do reach out to us. Email us. We'll have that
(30:54):
email at the end of this episode and we will
gladly share your rowan berry experience in the future edition
of Listener Mail. Hey.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
In fact, this connects to a project that's been on
my mind lately. I have never made jam at home,
but for some reason, I've got a hankering to make
homemade raspberry jam. Not exactly sure why, but it's in
my mind and it's not going to leave until I
do it. Jam makers, right and let us know what
are your tips? How do you make the best jam?
Speaker 1 (31:21):
All right now? According to rasp in that paper I
referenced earlier, if you if you look around in Poland,
the fruits there are used to flavor vodka. Now, another
source I was looking at does mention a Welsh spirit.
This is in a book titled Rowan by Oliver Soffel
twenty twenty three. This is a erect on book. I
(31:45):
think that they have a number of books related to
different species. Reference to at least one of these a
book on squid in the past on the show. But
there's apparently a traditional Welsh spirit called dia grioval and
this was made by steeping crushed rowan berries in water.
Though I have to add here nobody offered me a
diaudriaval while I was in Wales. They offered me beer,
(32:07):
they offered me cider, but they did not offer me this.
So if you have experience with this spirit, do reach
out to us on this matter as well.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
All right.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
So there's a ton of more botanical information we might
get into with the tree. That is, you know, ultimately
this far flung and there are a lot of cultural
interpretations of the plant that we're not going to get
into because we're dealing with so many different cultures across
a considerable period of time here. But one of the
(32:37):
really interesting things about them is about that the tree
itself is that it is considered a sacred tree, and
it's considered a sacred tree not only in Wales, but
throughout the British Isles and of course into Europe as well.
Mainland Europe. The berries seem to be a key part
of the tree's sacred appeal. That bright color, that red,
(32:58):
that scarlet, sometimes looking more like a deep orange in
some of the photos I'm looking at. At any rate,
this is a color that stands out. It catches the eye,
and we know that it resonated with people in this
part of the world going way back. In fact, this
is something that Suthel brings up in his book. You know,
(33:20):
if we look to the Red Lady archaeological find, we
see the importance of the color red. This is something
that actually came up during my tour. This was an
Upper Paleolithic partial male skeleton that was found buried in
Whales and the bones are dyed not with rowan berries,
(33:42):
but with red ochre. But it does give it this
red coloration. Is the remains I believe are dated to
about thirty one thousand BCE, and Suthel, here inciting this
says that it stands as quote indication of the early
sacramental importance of the color red in Northern Europe. So
just a little taste of the importance of red in
(34:04):
the region. Though I think we can all sort of
speak to the experience of seeing red, you know, as
if we see red in nature, it stands out to us,
It calls to us. It is communicating something to us,
certainly about the natural world, but perhaps about the unseen
world as well.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
It's a high salience color in nature, as opposed to
you know, you're browns and greens, which are more kind
of background.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Yeah, and so in Wales and throughout the British Isles,
one of the most widespread folk traditions concerning the rowan
is its ability to keep evil away, particularly certainly in
(34:49):
later interpretations getting into the Christian era, is the idea
that it will keep away witches and it will stand
as a deterrent witchcraft. So it has a long standing
role in protective magic. Amulets made out of rowan or
somehow incorporating rowan wood or other elements of the tree.
(35:12):
These have been employed as charms against witchcraft, though ironically
it several points out this was itself considered witchcraft by
the church, you know, so you get this weird you
see this, of course, you know, all over where the
Christian Church was also dealing with well, you know, folkloric
traditions and over pagan religion. Religious ideas is that they're
(35:36):
warning them about the dangers of the devil, and then
they're like, well, this devil thing seems pretty serious. Of
course I'm going to use all the tools in my toolbox.
And then the church is saying, no, not all the tools,
only the tools.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
You could hear this reminds me of In October, we
did a couple of episodes about the demons of ancient Mesopotamia,
and we were talking about the demon Pizuzu, which features
in the story The Exorcystem, written from a Catholic Christian
Catholic perspective in which this demon is sort of the devil,
one of the denizens of Hell, a servant of Lucifer.
(36:09):
But in fact, looking into it, we found that Pazuzu
was often used as a protective entity against worst demons
in ancient Mesopotamia. So yeah, yeah, one person's guardian angel
is another person's devil, I guess.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
So yeah, it's it's worth driving home there apotropic magic
is ancient. It is it has been a part of
human culture since time out of mind and of the
use of Rowan based apotropaic magic also naturally predates Christianity
in the British Isles, but it comes into sharp focus,
according to Sothal, during the age of the Reformation, solidifying
(36:48):
in this perceived modern struggle between the Christian faithful and
which is in league with the devil. And of course
we've we've talked about like the witchcraft persecution before, and
it is interesting how you know, it's easy to think
about witchcraft persecution. You think Monty Python, the Holy Grail,
you think firm Middle Ages, and a lot of what
we talk about when we talk about the persecution of
(37:10):
quote unquote witches, and which often boiled down to the
persecution of non Christian ideas, of people who didn't fit in,
of women in general. This was largely more of a
of a Renaissance idea. You can really, you know, tease
that apart in various ways, but you know, it is
the it's not so much, you know, to use a
(37:33):
popular description, it's not so much a part of the
demon haunted world, but is the world is illuminating and
there's a need to find those demons again, like like, no,
there's less darkness, there's less place for me to imagine
the demons, and I need to see them, you know. Anyway,
we could go on and on about that.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
Or you could see it as a kind of lashing out,
an attempt to get control during times of disruption and disorder,
which you know was certainly going on in Europe during
the Reformation. You know, there's so there's undermining of the
traditional dominant institution. There are schisms and factions and wars
that follow, and and you know, there's all the kind
of chaos that comes with that, and people are trying
(38:12):
to get control and they demonize somebody to make sense
of everything.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah, and and then on another level, it's worth noting that, Okay,
so it comes into sharp focus here, and certainly there's
a lot of writing for this time period that references
it as people are using rowan then as an ambulant
against the devil and or which is in the surface
of the devil. But of course again it's an old practice.
(38:38):
People are pulling out old practices even as this you know,
modern threat is explained to them. And in you know,
in the pre in pre Christian times and even into
Christian times of course, because you know, different belief systems
can can, and often do stand alongside each other. It's
not always devils and witches you're trying to keep it bay. Sometimes,
(38:59):
of course, it is the fairy folk, you know, the
the original unseen threats. And you know, we talked in
our episodes from I think what the year before last,
we talked about elfshot. We talked about the idea that
the uh that these invisible folk are out there potentially
targeting your cattle, your live stock, with invisible missiles that
(39:22):
will make them sick. And and so there's this long
standing tradition then of using rowan to ward off not
only magical harm to your home or you know, your
family and so forth, but to prevent magical harm to
your live stock. And not only live stock, but you're
like your milk, animal products that might be corrupted by
(39:48):
the invisible fairy folk, that they might harm like the
crucial element in the milk and either make the milk
bad or you know, or or not nutritious, or make
butter making possible, all due to magical attack.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
I recall passages about this in the Secret Commonwealth of Elves,
Fawns and Fairies, which if you've never looked into that's
that's a great cool historical book. It's from the late
seventeenth century, sort of an anthropological study done by a
Scottish priest named Robert Kirk is from the sixteen nineties,
(40:23):
and he went out and like talked to people about
what they believed about like elves and fairies and stuff.
And I recall a concern of it being that elves
we're gonna come make your cow's milk sour.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
Yeah, yeah, and that means, you know, not only might
they make the milk taste bad, they might like destroy
something very beneficial about it, and they might prevent you
from using it in other products and so forth. So
it's like it's you know, it was seen as a
sensitive time right after the milk has been collected, and yeah,
(40:56):
you have to you have to apply these protections. And
that might mean rowan would rowan berries and so forth.
By the way, reading about this was also pointed out.
This is in the Soulful Book, but I've seen this
pointed out elsewhere as well. Is that if you take
a rowan berry, pluck it from the tree and you
look at where the stem was attached, you will see
(41:18):
what is sometimes described I think, I think very with
a fair amount of flourish, as a cross. It's not
really cross. It looks more like a star. I've also
seen it described as being pentagram like, again, vaguely like
a star. I think it's maybe a stretch to say
it looks like a pentagram, but still I guess it
(41:39):
does have a novel shape. I don't know. I think
we see this in a lot of berries and fruits
and so forth.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
I've never looked at one myself, but you've got the
pictures here, and I'm looking at a five pointed star. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Yeah, Well, when I look at it next to an
image of a pentagram as presented here, I'm like, Okay,
I guess I can see it. But all of this,
you know, all of this energy around the row in
these traditions of the tree having some sort of sacred
protective property to it, this continues again to holdsway during
Christian times and in Rowan trees were then planted, for instance,
(42:12):
in Welsh graveyards and churchyards to ward away evil. And
this is another case where I wish I had known
to look out for one of these trees, because I
got to roam around in a Welsh graveyard at one point,
and you know, it was very it was very neat.
I was looking at frozen spiderwebs. It was pretty fascinating.
But I didn't know to look for these trees. So
maybe there was one there doing all this protective work
(42:36):
and I just didn't know about it. The Woodland Trust
website also points out that they're often situated in front
of homes in Ireland, and then in various traditions where
you want to protect that milk, you might have some
sort of an implement made from rowan wood that is
used to stir the milk. So like a direct interface
between the sacred wood and the substance you were trying
(42:58):
to protect from the fairy folks.
Speaker 3 (43:00):
Hmmm interesting, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:02):
To prevent the milk from curdling, for example. Also, the
Woodland Trust website mentions the idea of also having a
pocket charm made from rowing wood to protect against rheumatism,
so you know, there are various uses for it, also
using it to make divining rods, so you know, you
can get into various examples of where the wood is used.
(43:25):
Maybe it's used in a tool to make a tool,
and maybe that tool is you know, less a practical
tool and more of a supernatural tool to you know,
find things hidden in the earth or to magically stir
your milk to protect it. I guess one of the
other things worth noting about the row and tree, though,
we need to start talking about, like where it's planted
(43:45):
and its protective properties, is that again it is as
it's a widespread tree, and it is widely planted they
point out as a street or garden tree. So there
are gonna be plenty of examples where a rowan tree
is just around and it doesn't mean that someone's you know,
protecting the local coffee shop or gas station. There just
happens to be a rowan tree there. So I don't know.
(44:07):
I guess one has to avoid getting too two into
the idea of them being planted strategically to protect against evil.
But on the other hand, it does seem like it was,
at least in some instance definitely planted as a form
of protective magic.
Speaker 3 (44:23):
Oh, it couldn't hurt. I mean, you don't want to
be at the gas station and have an elf shooting
in and souring your gas.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
Exactly, and I also want to throw this out just
a quote provided direct quote about the consumption of rowan berries.
The Woodland Trust does right quote. Rowan berries are edible
to humans when cooked. They are sour but rich in
vitamin C and can be used to make a tart jam.
So I'd say, let's let's leave it at that. Then
that sounds okay, that's that sounds it sounds good to me.
(44:53):
Look up how to cook rowan berries before you eat them.
And then I should also point out, I mean, they're
obviously we don't have time to go into all the
but I was reading a little bit about how there
also are medicinal properties to the berries, often used as
is like a laxative, you know, uses usages like that.
So there are going to be various traditions in these
(45:14):
different European cultures that also involve uses for rowan berries
and so forth. They're going to help with some sort
of ailment. So again we get into the idea of
that the sacred tree is this thing that may have
you know, symbolic power, but then also it has these
various you know, mundane uses that may also take on
(45:36):
qualities that are sacred. It may have medicinal uses that
could also take on qualities that are sacred as well.
Speaker 3 (45:42):
Can't think about the word Rowan without thinking about the
name Rowan. Can't think about the name Rowan without thinking
of who am I going to say? Am I going
to say the mister bean guy? No, I'm thinking of
the wicker Man. That's the name of the kid that
the detective is looking for.
Speaker 1 (45:57):
Oh, well, that that I haven't looked in to it.
But that that can't be an accident, right, I mean
that seems like that. That seems like a film that
was very concerned with folkloric traditions and and so forth.
So be a mighty coincidence. Yeah, the kid wasn't named
like Bill. We may have to come back to the
(46:17):
wicker Man on Weird House Cinema at some point. That's
that's a that's a big one.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
That's a favorite at our house.
Speaker 1 (46:24):
Yes, that's the full Car Royalty right there.
Speaker 3 (46:28):
There's a lot of great Christopher Lee out there, but
that is peak Christopher Lee.
Speaker 1 (46:34):
All right, Well, we're gonna I'm gonna go ahead and
close out this episode. Again, this is a series we'll
likely come back to in the future. We already have
some notes about some other Sacred Trees, so you'll be
on the lookout, and if you have any suggestions for
future Sacred Tree episodes, right in let us know. Likewise,
as we said, if you have experience with anything we
(46:54):
discussed in this episode of or feedback on it, we'd
love to hear from you. Stuff to Blow Your Mind
is primarily a science and culture podcast, with core episodes
on Tuesdays and Thursdays, but on Fridays we set aside
most serious concerns to just talk about a weird film
on Weird House Cinema. If you are on Instagram you
want to follow the show, find us at st b
y M podcast.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.
If you would like to get in touch with us
with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest
a topic for the future, or just to say hello,
you can email us at contact at stuff to Blow
your Mind dot com.
Speaker 2 (47:37):
Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 1 (48:00):
A po polic
Hey, welcome to Weird House Cinema. My name is Robert Lamb.
It is Saturday, and in this classic episode, we're going
to be discussing lightning, struck Wood, and the Rowan. This
originally published twelve ten, twenty twenty four. Let's dive right in.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My name
is Robert Lamb.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
And I am Joe McCormick. And hey everybody, I got
to apologize right here at the start for my voice
and my brain. Possibly today I am wrestling a pretty
nasty cold, but we're plowing right through. And today we're
going to be talking about a topic. We're actually returning
to a topic we talked about a couple of weeks ago,
the subject of sake trees. In that previous episode, Rob,
(01:03):
you talked about the giants Equoia of western North America,
arguably the largest tree in the world depending on how
you measure, and we talked about the history of how
people regarded these massive plants with reverence. And I ended
up talking about the Ohea, the Hua tree of Hawaii
and a lot of interesting, beautiful ways that it interlocks
(01:23):
with Hawaiian religion and traditional practices. In some cases it's
the physical embodiment of a god. In other cases it's
like a tree beloved by the gods in storytelling and
so forth. But when we were researching that episode, we thought, man,
there are so many interesting angles on sacred trees that
we could come back to. So that's what we're doing today.
Here's a new installment. I'm sure this is something we'll
(01:46):
probably return to again in the future.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Yeah, and it's a good month for it, since we're
into December here, and a lot of December holiday traditions
center around a sacred tree. I guess one of the
things I think we both encountered it in the last episode,
especially in this episode. It's the thing about sacred trees
is that it's never just a case of like, oh, well,
you know, there's this tree around and at one point
there's a group of people that thought it was sacred
(02:10):
and then they stopped. You know, No, the trees have
been around a long time, and human cultures enter into
these areas where these trees grow, develop these ideas about them,
and build upon those ideas, pass them down, and the
trees remain and So you start pulling the threads on
some of these beliefs, and you know, those threads connect
(02:31):
across different peoples, you know, into neighboring territories, and oftentimes
there is far flung as a particular you know, it's
the range of a tree species itself. So before long
you realize, oh, well, this isn't necessarily just a look
at one particular tree and or one particular folk belief
or mythology, but you can easily touch upon like a
(02:52):
dozen different folk beliefs and mythologies concerning the same tree.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
M h.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
Which is to say, we're not going to pull all
We're not going to pull all those those threads today.
We're going to pull some of those threads, and we're
going to find some, I think, some very tantalizing, very
interesting things to say about a couple of different topics
related to sacred trees.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
That's right. So to kick things off today, I wanted
to explore something interesting I came across in a book.
The book is called European Paganism The Realities of cult
from Antiquity to the Middle Ages, originally published in the
year two thousand. I think the edition I was reading
was from maybe twenty thirteen, but from Rutledge Press by
(03:33):
an author named Ken Dowden, who was a professor of
classics at the University of Birmingham in the UK. This
is a book about the religious practices of European cultures
before the introduction of Christianity, and then also those pagan
religions interacting with Christianity once it was introduced. And these
(03:54):
religious beliefs and practices were, of course not all the same,
though there are some themes that kind of emerge repeatedly,
so you can kind of make some rough generalizations about
pre Christian European paganism, but they don't apply in every case.
And one is that a lot of pre Christian European
religions saw sacred dimensions in the features of the physical land,
(04:16):
like rocks, waters, and of course trees. But there are
many different ways to understand the sacredness of trees. Now
down and actually begins this section of the book with
an ancient passage describing something that's a little bit of field,
but I thought it was so interesting I wanted to
throw it in here. It's describing one way of showing
(04:37):
appreciation for trees that's kind of hard to classify. It
doesn't seem exactly right to call it a religious practice,
but it definitely goes beyond, like, Oh, look at the poplars,
they're so nice. This is a translated passage from Plenty
of the Elder that reads as follows. On a hill
called Corna in the suburban part of the land of Tusculum,
(04:58):
there is a grove in a ancient reverence dedicated by
Latium to Diana. And that would be by the way Diana,
goddess of the hunt of wild animals in the moon,
sort of a wilderness goddess. The ranger of the party
Plenty goes on. The foliage of the beech forest is sheared,
as though by topiary. In it. An exceptional tree was
(05:20):
loved in our times by Passienus Crispus twice Console, the orator,
later more famous thanks to his marriage with Agrippina, through
which he became the stepfather of Nero. He was in
the habit of kissing and embracing it. Talking about the
tree kissing and embracing it, not only of lying under
(05:40):
it and pouring wine over it.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Literal tree hugging here.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yes, So this tree is interesting in the example here
because it is in one sense a literal sacred tree.
In a religious sense, it's part of an ancient sacred grove.
And I guess one thing we could talk about is
a distinction between sacred trees, as in, like a type
(06:05):
of tree or a tree species has a religious significance
within a particular culture, versus an individual tree like this
tree right here has religious significance of some kind, versus
a collection of trees have some kind of religious significance,
a sort of expanded version of this tree right here,
this forest right here has significance. And there are a
(06:28):
lot of those in pre Christian European religions, sacred groves,
sacred forests throughout the continent. But so in this case,
it is a particular sacred grove, a forest of beech
trees that are in honor of the goddess Diana. So
these are the trees of Diana, the goddess of the hunt.
(06:48):
But this Roman politician isn't necessarily worshiping Diana. I don't know.
Maybe he is, but it's not discussed in the passage here.
He's not just honoring the sacred forest as a whole
in its relation to the goddess Diana. It sounds like
he is in erotic love with one particular, very special tree.
(07:09):
Hard to think of a parallel to this, I just
thought I thought it worth mentioning. But anyway, From here,
Doubtan goes on to a section where he sort of
thinks about the implicit logic of our relationship to trees,
especially in our desire to think of them as persons,
as like a symbol of a person, or as containing
the essence of a divine person, and he notes an
(07:32):
interesting parallel between trees and humans which has been observed
by a number of scholars of religion. It's not unique
to this book, and that parallel is in the form
of posture. Humans are mostly unique in the animal world
for our verticality. What appears to physically differentiate humans from
(07:53):
other animals is that we are a column a standing
straight up, compared to most other animals, which tend to
position their bodies in a more horizontal fashion. You can
think of a few little counter examples here and there,
but for the most part this does really hold true.
Humans appear to be different from all other animals in
that we stand straight up. And what makes a tree
(08:14):
different from a bush or a shrub or lots of
other plants. Is that it is also a tall vertical column.
So it's true of both trees and humans that we
take the form of a vertical column. We grow taller
as we age, and when we die, we fall down.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
That's a good point.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Yeah, So with this kind of knowledge just sort of
operating in our minds all the time, it seems very
natural to think of the tree as the sort of
human analog within the alien kingdom of plant life, except,
of course, trees grow much larger than humans, and are
much tougher than humans, and often live for hundreds of years,
(08:53):
so in a sense, you can think of them as
something that has always been here. So it's I think
quite natural to start thinking of them as like superhuman
super persons. They are gods.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yeah, yeah, these are great points. Yeah, it stands tall
like a human, it has the verticality, and then you know,
lives before and after us and on this different time
scale than we are.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
So that's just sort of one theory as to why
we're sort of primed to see godhood in the form
of trees. But Doubtin also emphasizes that many trees are
integrated into religion, not simply by their nature, not by
being trees, but in a specific sense, by being connected
directly to myth or to history, as in like this
(09:38):
plane tree at Delphi was planted by Agamemnon and that's
why it's special. Or when Io was transformed into a
cow by Hera and tied to a tree, it was
this olive tree right here. Or this tree was the
source of heracles first oak leaf crown, or this tree
is where Helen of Troy was hanged after she fled
(10:00):
to roads. So in those cases you might say that
these physical existing trees are sacralized by way of intersections
with stories, and whether those are like sort of founding
ethnic stories, like founding histories of a people or a nation,
or myths about the gods. On one hand, you have
(10:20):
a physical object that is right here, right now, this
tree we're all looking at, And on the other hand,
you have the story we all know. And so by
connecting the to the tree, the physical object makes the
story more real, and the story makes the physical object
more meaningful.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Yeah, yeah, Like eventually we'll come around to talking about
the body tree in this series. The Bodhi tree, of course,
in Buddhist traditions, is the tree under which the Buddhist
sat when he attained enlightenment. You know, it is the
place where it happened. Yeah, yeah, so yeah. We see
versions of that in various different myths and religions.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
But one example I really wanted to focus sun for
a minute because I thought it was so interesting, was
something Dowdin brings up in this chapter. That is the
idea of a sacred tree struck by lightning. Dowtan writes
that the ancient Romans had a practice of enclosing a
tree after it was struck by lightning, so like after
(11:19):
a tree was hit by lightning, that it would be
subject to a type of sacrificial or religious immurement. The
enclosure for a tree would sometimes be what this author
identifies as a puteal put el pleural would be putealia,
which usually refers to a well head. So this would
(11:39):
be the raised stone structure around the opening of a
water well. Now, in the case of a water well,
usually you have a wellhead raised in part to prevent
the well from simply being a hole in the ground
that people can fall into. You know, it's like a
wall for safety. In ancient Rome, these well heads were
often made of marble and decorated with carvings or with
(12:00):
bas relief. I've got a picture from from a well
headed venice for you to look at here, Rob, so
you can see, you know, it's a there's a cap
on it right now. I think it's a it's an
iron cap. I don't know what the original material of
the cap would have been, possibly iron, you know, hundreds
of years ago or thousands of years ago as well.
But in this case, you know, you could open it
(12:22):
up and imagine looking down into the well, but then
down on the wall around it, we've got I don't know,
some kind of creepy dancing god babies who are thrown
around some what do you what do you think that is?
Is that grape leaves or olives or something?
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Yeah, some sort of like wreaths and leaves.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Yeah. Yeah. But as Dowdan says in this chapter, sometimes
a poute al would be built not around a water well,
but around a tree or really any spot that had
been touched by a bolt of lightning. So a lightning
kissed location like this was called in Roman times a dental.
(13:01):
And I was reading about this in an older source
from the Dictionary of Greek and Roman Antiquities by William
Smith from the nineteenth century. This reference book goes into
sources from ancient history describing what the bidental was and
what its religious significance was. And so it says that
the Bidental was named after the fact that you would
(13:23):
sacrifice a sheep here after lightning struck. It would be
a two year old sheep called a biden, which means
two tooth by DN like dental, and the sequence would
go like this. So lightning strikes somewhere and people witness it,
and whatever was struck, be that a tree or a
person or just the earth, whatever is there is buried,
(13:49):
in some cases burned, in other cases not burned, but
is buried by priests in the ground in that very spot.
So if you get struck by lightning and killed in
a rome where these bidental priests are operating, you are
not Your body is not transported to a cemetery and
is not cremated. You are buried in the spot where
(14:10):
you fell. And then the two year old sheep is
sacrificed and added to the lot. And then that spot
is in some sense sort of walled off from human contact.
It is capped with an altar and then enclosed in
some way by a fence or in some cases by
a poutel a marble wellhead, and thereafter it is made taboo.
(14:34):
No one may walk there, no one may touch it,
no one may even look at it. And if a
person were to violate this taboo, like to remove the
well head or the altar, or in some other way
violate the prohibition against treading there, they would be subject
to swift, violent punishment by the gods, and this connects
(14:55):
to the original action there. Lightning was often thought to
be the weapon of the god. It's an ancient Rome,
particularly of Jupiter, so a place struck by lightning was
both terrifying and holy. It was a sacred point of
connection with divine power and a conduit of divine wrath.
So as one example of a puteal which may once
(15:17):
have covered a tree made wholly by lightning, Dowdin mentions
a fig tree attested in ancient sources in the area
of the Committium of Rome. The committium is an ancient
public meeting space in the city center, and this fig
tree was known as the Ficus romanaalis, which literally means
(15:38):
the ficus of suckling. Though experts apparently debate whether that's
its original meaning or how it should be understood. But
there are actually a couple of sacred objects said to
be in the vicinity here. One thing is this tree
the ficus room analyis. But there is also a stone
which was said to have been cut in half with
(16:00):
a razor by the ancient Roman augur Attus Navius, and
the story goes that he cut the stone in half
in a display of his powers when he is in
the middle of rebuking a legendary king of Rome who
was sort of arrogantly trying to expand his own glorification
at Us. Navius was rebuking him and saying, like you
(16:21):
go to far king, And in their conflict, he's like,
I better show how strong my divinatory skills are and
the kind of power I can command. So I'm going
to cut a stone, cut a wet stone in half
of a razor.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Oh wow, I guess it worked.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
It did, according to the story. So you've got this
split stone here, and then you've got the Ficus tree.
And here Doubdan again quotes a passage from Plenty of
the Elder describing the site of the tree and the
sliced rock. So Plenty in translation rights, a fig tree
growing in the actual Forum and Committium of Rome is
(16:58):
revered sacred because of the lightning bolts buried there, and
still more to commemorate the fig tree under which the
nurse of Romulus and Remus first sheltered those founders of
empire at the lupercal. It is called ruminalis because it
was beneath it that they found the she wolf offering
her RuMIS. That is what they used to call abreast
(17:21):
to her babies, a miracle commemorated nearby in bronze, as
though the wolf had of her own accord crossed the
Committeum while Adis Navius was acting in his role as Auger.
Nor is it without significance when it dries up and must,
through the efforts of the priests, be replaced. So I
thought this was interesting in that the way Plenty tells
(17:42):
the story, the way he understands it, at least this
fig tree is in part sacred because of an intersection
with legend, like we mentioned earlier. So you know, much
like you might say this tree was planted by Agamemnon,
in this case you would say this tree is the
site where Romula and Remus were nursed by wolf Mother,
and then also by proximity to the site where Adis
(18:07):
Navius split the stone. That's another connect intersection with legend.
But then according to Plenty, it's also sacred because lightning
bolts are buried beneath it. And then here Dowban also
mentions a possible connection of the legend of the ficus
from Analys to the interesting sort of botanical fact that
(18:28):
the fig tree produces a sap like secretion, which I
believe is part of an anti predator strategy that is
said to look like milk. So, like you, if you
wound a fig tree, the ficus will we'll leak out
this white milky substance that is said to be quite
bitter and I think is supposed to deter things from
munching on it.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Yeah, yeah, we used to have a fig tree, and yeah,
I can attest to.
Speaker 3 (18:52):
This, And so Dowbdan's saying, you know, so you have
a place where, according to these ancient texts, you have
a stone which is interesting because of its shape it's
like a split stone. And then you also have a
tree which has interesting sort of biological features. This tree
appears to leak milk and then can be kind of
(19:12):
attached to myths, and so he writes, quote the tree
is tended and when necessary renewed by the priests. If
it is surrounded by a puute al, then originally this
may have been understood as a place where lightning had struck.
And the wet stone, that's the stone that was apparently
split in the story. The wetstone might have been considered
(19:32):
a thunderstone.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Wow, this is all really fascinating and fascinating to me,
especially when you think about the idea that, like the
world tree in myth is often situated as this thing
that connects Earth to the heavens and lightning as well.
Is this momentary connection between Earth and heaven that leaves
like a physical sign. You know, we see it and
(19:55):
then we can if we can find where it hit.
We have evidence this contact between like a lightning and
the earth, between storm clouds and the earth, but on
another level, between the divine and the mundane world totally.
Speaker 3 (20:12):
And you know, one thing I like is the kind
of ambiguity of the is this good magic or bad magic?
The way you know that you can have a place
where a tree is struck by lightning and it becomes
in some sense sacred. But it seems to me rather
there's a kind of ambivalence, like is this a place
that is cursed and dangerous and will hurt you? Or
(20:33):
is this a place that is in some way blessed
and is showing off the power of the gods or
God's power in a way that can be celebrated and sacralized.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
There's almost kind of a U curve, right, It's like
this the place is so sacred or it is so
cursed that it essentially amounts to the same thing, and
that is no trespassing. Sorry, you can't visit it, you
can't touch it. Well, that is all really fascinating. And
(21:07):
another cool thing is that it does lead directly into
the tree that I'm going to talk about here, the
Rowan tree. I was looking at several different sources on this,
one of which was I didn't spend a lot of
time with this source, but there was an older article
titled the Folklore of Trees by Lizzie M. Hadley. This
was published in the Journal of Education back in eighteen
(21:29):
ninety four, and it's very short, little kind of wordy
right up touching on various sacred ideas of trees, but
the Rowan tree is mentioned in passing and just a
few ideas connected to it or thrown out, including the
idea in some European traditions that the tree grew from
a place where lightning struck. That's like the origin of
(21:51):
this tree.
Speaker 3 (21:53):
That would be interesting in the So remember the phrasing
plenty uses is that lightning bolts are buried there where
the tree is. So it's like when lightning hits the ground,
it's almost like a seeding of the ground, like it
plants something when it hits. And so you could imagine, well,
if what it's planting is some kind of seed, what
(22:13):
grows it could be a type of tree, that's right.
Speaker 1 (22:16):
So why did I pick the Rowan tree? Well, I
recently had the opportunity, in the privilege, to to go
on a little tour of Whales with my family, and
I was enraptured by the haunting beauty of its rolling hills,
these dramatic valleys and in some cases hilltop ruins of
which there ghost stories about. So I thought, well, I
should I should cover a tree that is sacred within
(22:38):
Welsh traditions. There's obviously going to be a lot of
overlap with other sacred trees in the British Isles and
and so forth. But yeah, I wanted to pick something
that had significance in Whales. And I realized I was
already talking a little bit about Welsh tradition and mythology
on the monster fact, and I should go ahead and
(22:59):
drive home. If anyone's not familiar Wales as a country
in western Great Britain, it is part of the United Kingdom,
but it boasts its own distinctive culture and language. We've
touched on Welsh Welsh mythology before, which of course shares
various ideas with other cultures of the British Isles. But
I don't know if we'd really if we've ever really
stopped to just talk about the idea of Whales and
(23:19):
Welsh tradition and Welsh language in any degree of detail.
Maybe we haven't. I forgot about it, but I just
wanted to bring it up again. So again, it's the
Rowan tree or sorbus occuparia, also known as the mountain ash,
though it is not closely related to either true ash
trees or a particular tree. This is Eucalyptus regnums this
(23:44):
is the plant that you find in Australia, so obviously
a good ways away from Wales in Europe, but that
one is sometimes called a mountain ash, but it is
not related to the tree we're talking about here. No,
the rowan tree is actually a tree or shrub of
the rose family.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
Oh I didn't know that.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Yeah, So according to the UK's Woodland Trust, which has
a nice little overview about the species here, a rowan
tree can reach heights of fifteen meters or nearly fifty
feet in height. The trees bark is smooth and silvery
gray and leaf the leaf buds are purple and hairy.
I included a close up image here for you, Joe,
But everyone out there, if you do a search, you
(24:24):
can find like rowan tree buds. You'll see these. And yeah,
it has this, as is often sometimes the case with
like the little details, especially with budding of trees. You know,
there's almost like a velvety appearance to it. It almost doesn't
look like tree flesh, but more like you know, it's
like part of a deer growing out of the tree.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
Or so I was gonna say, like like a little
fallen's ear. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Now, when the leaves develop, it's gonna have the serrated
leaflets and groups of five to eight it produces white flowers, which,
following pollination, develop into vibrantly scarlet berries. Sometimes I've seen
various photographs, and of course, you know, color, you know,
details of color kind of vary depending on the exact
(25:07):
photography in question. But yeah, sometimes they look more scarlett,
sometimes they look a little more orange, but it's a
vibrant color. And yeah, you can get into a discussion
about it. What is red, what is orange? Anyway? At
any rate, it's bright. It catches the eye, and that's
going to be important as we proceed. And how long
do they live? Well, a rowan tree apparently can live
for upwards of two centuries according to the Woodland Trust,
(25:28):
though a source I'm going to side in a minute
put it more at about one hundred and fifty years.
But at any rate, you know, not the longest lived
tree by any stretch. But still they tend to live
longer than humans. So they still have that kind of
like you know, mythic connotation. They stand outside of our
short time on this.
Speaker 3 (25:45):
Earth, always been here.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
Yeah, So they're native to the cooler parts of the
northern Hemisphere, mostly western and northern UK. That's or at
least that's one of the key areas that where they grow,
and that's where we're going to be talking about here.
So you'll find them not only in whales, find them
in the highlands of Scotland, and they're they're pretty far flung.
(26:08):
Another source I was looking at was a Journal of
Ecology ride up on the species. This was by all
Olivier rasp at All titled just Sorbus Occuparia l and
this article pointed out that one of the British isles,
you know, are certainly a place where you can find them.
(26:28):
They're present through most of Europe, from Iceland to northern Russia,
though not into Arctic Russia, down into Spain, Portugal, Italy, Macedonia,
and it seems limited by poor drought tolerance and a
necessity for a short growing season and a cold requirement
for the bud burst. This source, also, this is the
(26:52):
one that puts the age at more of like a one
hundred and fifty year range, So I'm not sure if
it's one fifty or two hundred, you know, it depends.
I guess you know where you want to fall on that.
But It's also been pointed out that the sorbus species
here seems to have perhaps originated in Southeast Asia and
gradually spread. Now, another interesting thing to think about trees
(27:16):
in terms of, you know, having a sacred nature is that,
of course we make use of trees, We do things
with trees. Trees, you know, produce wood that we may
use for various purposes depending on the quality of the wood.
They produce leaves, they produce berries, they produce flowers, and
so forth. So they are also this like font of
(27:36):
materials that we might make use of, and I guess
you don't always know exactly how that's going to fall. Like,
you know, there are plenty of examples of cultures where
the things that make the mundane world possible are in
and of themselves sacred, you know, be it a food
product or whatever. Like, just because you interact with it
every day, it doesn't mean that it can't be sacred.
It may be very sacred within a tradition because it
(27:58):
is part of your survival mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
But then of course our lives are full of things
that we don't really give sacred connotations too, because they
are just part of the mundane world. So what do
whom humans use it for? Well, the wood of the
rowant is usable. Apparently, it's hard and tough, but not
super durable. And my understanding of this is that basically
(28:21):
it means you maybe wouldn't want to build a house
out of it or use it for like really like
high stress situations.
Speaker 3 (28:30):
You wouldn't build a car out of it.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Well, yeah, I guess so. Yeah, But on the other hand,
it's not like it's super fragile, like, because you can
make furniture out of it, craft works and even tools,
you know, So it's like, I guess it's you know,
it's not so fragile that you could make a tool
out of it. But just again, I guess maybe not
a house, though perhaps there are examples of such usage
as well. But that's that's what the sources were saying.
(28:55):
And as far as the berries go, I think we
were talking about Mike earlier you asked me, well, can
people eat the berries? Apparently, so now I want to
add the caveat here. Anytime we're talking about eating berries,
please do please do additional research before you eat berries.
But my understanding is that they are edible for humans,
(29:16):
but they are quite tart, and that means that jam
is one of the most common culinary uses of the berries,
you know, So, you know, typical jam making scenario usually
there's a lot of sugar added or some sort of
sweetener added, there's a you know, a reduction taking place,
So there are a lot of steps in place to
take something that is otherwise quite tart and make it
(29:37):
consumable and you know, and appealing to the human palate.
Speaker 3 (29:41):
So cooked rowan thumbs up, raw rowan question mark, right.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
But on the other hand, the sources I was looking at,
they did say that, you know what they've the rowan
berries have long been a part of the human diet.
There's evidence from like southern Sweden from around six thousand
years ago that that gives us evidence that, yeah, like
people have been eating the rowan berries. So as to
I didn't get into details about ancient preparations of rowan berries,
(30:10):
if they were cooking them or if they were just
eating them raw, but it seems like when you get
into more modern uses, and not even just modern, but
like you know, last several centuries, people were generally talking
about taking the rowan berries and doing some sort of
culinary preparation to get them to a place where we
enjoy them. Yeah, and sadly, I did not know to
(30:33):
look out for Rowan jam while I was in Wales,
so I don't know if it's something I could have
purchased or tried if i'd been looking for it. I
did a quick look around the internet. I'm not even
sure you can get in the States, so I'm not sure.
If you have tried rowan jam and or you are
familiar with all the things you can do with rowan berries,
do reach out to us. Email us. We'll have that
(30:54):
email at the end of this episode and we will
gladly share your rowan berry experience in the future edition
of Listener Mail. Hey.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
In fact, this connects to a project that's been on
my mind lately. I have never made jam at home,
but for some reason, I've got a hankering to make
homemade raspberry jam. Not exactly sure why, but it's in
my mind and it's not going to leave until I
do it. Jam makers, right and let us know what
are your tips? How do you make the best jam?
Speaker 1 (31:21):
All right now? According to rasp in that paper I
referenced earlier, if you if you look around in Poland,
the fruits there are used to flavor vodka. Now, another
source I was looking at does mention a Welsh spirit.
This is in a book titled Rowan by Oliver Soffel
twenty twenty three. This is a erect on book. I
(31:45):
think that they have a number of books related to
different species. Reference to at least one of these a
book on squid in the past on the show. But
there's apparently a traditional Welsh spirit called dia grioval and
this was made by steeping crushed rowan berries in water.
Though I have to add here nobody offered me a
diaudriaval while I was in Wales. They offered me beer,
(32:07):
they offered me cider, but they did not offer me this.
So if you have experience with this spirit, do reach
out to us on this matter as well.
Speaker 3 (32:17):
All right.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
So there's a ton of more botanical information we might
get into with the tree. That is, you know, ultimately
this far flung and there are a lot of cultural
interpretations of the plant that we're not going to get
into because we're dealing with so many different cultures across
a considerable period of time here. But one of the
(32:37):
really interesting things about them is about that the tree
itself is that it is considered a sacred tree, and
it's considered a sacred tree not only in Wales, but
throughout the British Isles and of course into Europe as well.
Mainland Europe. The berries seem to be a key part
of the tree's sacred appeal. That bright color, that red,
(32:58):
that scarlet, sometimes looking more like a deep orange in
some of the photos I'm looking at. At any rate,
this is a color that stands out. It catches the eye,
and we know that it resonated with people in this
part of the world going way back. In fact, this
is something that Suthel brings up in his book. You know,
(33:20):
if we look to the Red Lady archaeological find, we
see the importance of the color red. This is something
that actually came up during my tour. This was an
Upper Paleolithic partial male skeleton that was found buried in
Whales and the bones are dyed not with rowan berries,
(33:42):
but with red ochre. But it does give it this
red coloration. Is the remains I believe are dated to
about thirty one thousand BCE, and Suthel, here inciting this
says that it stands as quote indication of the early
sacramental importance of the color red in Northern Europe. So
just a little taste of the importance of red in
(34:04):
the region. Though I think we can all sort of
speak to the experience of seeing red, you know, as
if we see red in nature, it stands out to us,
It calls to us. It is communicating something to us,
certainly about the natural world, but perhaps about the unseen
world as well.
Speaker 3 (34:19):
It's a high salience color in nature, as opposed to
you know, you're browns and greens, which are more kind
of background.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
Yeah, and so in Wales and throughout the British Isles,
one of the most widespread folk traditions concerning the rowan
is its ability to keep evil away, particularly certainly in
(34:49):
later interpretations getting into the Christian era, is the idea
that it will keep away witches and it will stand
as a deterrent witchcraft. So it has a long standing
role in protective magic. Amulets made out of rowan or
somehow incorporating rowan wood or other elements of the tree.
(35:12):
These have been employed as charms against witchcraft, though ironically
it several points out this was itself considered witchcraft by
the church, you know, so you get this weird you
see this, of course, you know, all over where the
Christian Church was also dealing with well, you know, folkloric
traditions and over pagan religion. Religious ideas is that they're
(35:36):
warning them about the dangers of the devil, and then
they're like, well, this devil thing seems pretty serious. Of
course I'm going to use all the tools in my toolbox.
And then the church is saying, no, not all the tools,
only the tools.
Speaker 3 (35:47):
You could hear this reminds me of In October, we
did a couple of episodes about the demons of ancient Mesopotamia,
and we were talking about the demon Pizuzu, which features
in the story The Exorcystem, written from a Catholic Christian
Catholic perspective in which this demon is sort of the devil,
one of the denizens of Hell, a servant of Lucifer.
(36:09):
But in fact, looking into it, we found that Pazuzu
was often used as a protective entity against worst demons
in ancient Mesopotamia. So yeah, yeah, one person's guardian angel
is another person's devil, I guess.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
So yeah, it's it's worth driving home there apotropic magic
is ancient. It is it has been a part of
human culture since time out of mind and of the
use of Rowan based apotropaic magic also naturally predates Christianity
in the British Isles, but it comes into sharp focus,
according to Sothal, during the age of the Reformation, solidifying
(36:48):
in this perceived modern struggle between the Christian faithful and
which is in league with the devil. And of course
we've we've talked about like the witchcraft persecution before, and
it is interesting how you know, it's easy to think
about witchcraft persecution. You think Monty Python, the Holy Grail,
you think firm Middle Ages, and a lot of what
we talk about when we talk about the persecution of
(37:10):
quote unquote witches, and which often boiled down to the
persecution of non Christian ideas, of people who didn't fit in,
of women in general. This was largely more of a
of a Renaissance idea. You can really, you know, tease
that apart in various ways, but you know, it is
the it's not so much, you know, to use a
(37:33):
popular description, it's not so much a part of the
demon haunted world, but is the world is illuminating and
there's a need to find those demons again, like like, no,
there's less darkness, there's less place for me to imagine
the demons, and I need to see them, you know. Anyway,
we could go on and on about that.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
Or you could see it as a kind of lashing out,
an attempt to get control during times of disruption and disorder,
which you know was certainly going on in Europe during
the Reformation. You know, there's so there's undermining of the
traditional dominant institution. There are schisms and factions and wars
that follow, and and you know, there's all the kind
of chaos that comes with that, and people are trying
(38:12):
to get control and they demonize somebody to make sense
of everything.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
Yeah, and and then on another level, it's worth noting that, Okay,
so it comes into sharp focus here, and certainly there's
a lot of writing for this time period that references
it as people are using rowan then as an ambulant
against the devil and or which is in the surface
of the devil. But of course again it's an old practice.
(38:38):
People are pulling out old practices even as this you know,
modern threat is explained to them. And in you know,
in the pre in pre Christian times and even into
Christian times of course, because you know, different belief systems
can can, and often do stand alongside each other. It's
not always devils and witches you're trying to keep it bay. Sometimes,
(38:59):
of course, it is the fairy folk, you know, the
the original unseen threats. And you know, we talked in
our episodes from I think what the year before last,
we talked about elfshot. We talked about the idea that
the uh that these invisible folk are out there potentially
targeting your cattle, your live stock, with invisible missiles that
(39:22):
will make them sick. And and so there's this long
standing tradition then of using rowan to ward off not
only magical harm to your home or you know, your
family and so forth, but to prevent magical harm to
your live stock. And not only live stock, but you're
like your milk, animal products that might be corrupted by
(39:48):
the invisible fairy folk, that they might harm like the
crucial element in the milk and either make the milk
bad or you know, or or not nutritious, or make
butter making possible, all due to magical attack.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
I recall passages about this in the Secret Commonwealth of Elves,
Fawns and Fairies, which if you've never looked into that's
that's a great cool historical book. It's from the late
seventeenth century, sort of an anthropological study done by a
Scottish priest named Robert Kirk is from the sixteen nineties,
(40:23):
and he went out and like talked to people about
what they believed about like elves and fairies and stuff.
And I recall a concern of it being that elves
we're gonna come make your cow's milk sour.
Speaker 1 (40:34):
Yeah, yeah, and that means, you know, not only might
they make the milk taste bad, they might like destroy
something very beneficial about it, and they might prevent you
from using it in other products and so forth. So
it's like it's you know, it was seen as a
sensitive time right after the milk has been collected, and yeah,
(40:56):
you have to you have to apply these protections. And
that might mean rowan would rowan berries and so forth.
By the way, reading about this was also pointed out.
This is in the Soulful Book, but I've seen this
pointed out elsewhere as well. Is that if you take
a rowan berry, pluck it from the tree and you
look at where the stem was attached, you will see
(41:18):
what is sometimes described I think, I think very with
a fair amount of flourish, as a cross. It's not
really cross. It looks more like a star. I've also
seen it described as being pentagram like, again, vaguely like
a star. I think it's maybe a stretch to say
it looks like a pentagram, but still I guess it
(41:39):
does have a novel shape. I don't know. I think
we see this in a lot of berries and fruits
and so forth.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
I've never looked at one myself, but you've got the
pictures here, and I'm looking at a five pointed star. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Yeah, Well, when I look at it next to an
image of a pentagram as presented here, I'm like, Okay,
I guess I can see it. But all of this,
you know, all of this energy around the row in
these traditions of the tree having some sort of sacred
protective property to it, this continues again to holdsway during
Christian times and in Rowan trees were then planted, for instance,
(42:12):
in Welsh graveyards and churchyards to ward away evil. And
this is another case where I wish I had known
to look out for one of these trees, because I
got to roam around in a Welsh graveyard at one point,
and you know, it was very it was very neat.
I was looking at frozen spiderwebs. It was pretty fascinating.
But I didn't know to look for these trees. So
maybe there was one there doing all this protective work
(42:36):
and I just didn't know about it. The Woodland Trust
website also points out that they're often situated in front
of homes in Ireland, and then in various traditions where
you want to protect that milk, you might have some
sort of an implement made from rowan wood that is
used to stir the milk. So like a direct interface
between the sacred wood and the substance you were trying
(42:58):
to protect from the fairy folks.
Speaker 3 (43:00):
Hmmm interesting, Yeah.
Speaker 1 (43:02):
To prevent the milk from curdling, for example. Also, the
Woodland Trust website mentions the idea of also having a
pocket charm made from rowing wood to protect against rheumatism,
so you know, there are various uses for it, also
using it to make divining rods, so you know, you
can get into various examples of where the wood is used.
(43:25):
Maybe it's used in a tool to make a tool,
and maybe that tool is you know, less a practical
tool and more of a supernatural tool to you know,
find things hidden in the earth or to magically stir
your milk to protect it. I guess one of the
other things worth noting about the row and tree, though,
we need to start talking about, like where it's planted
(43:45):
and its protective properties, is that again it is as
it's a widespread tree, and it is widely planted they
point out as a street or garden tree. So there
are gonna be plenty of examples where a rowan tree
is just around and it doesn't mean that someone's you know,
protecting the local coffee shop or gas station. There just
happens to be a rowan tree there. So I don't know.
(44:07):
I guess one has to avoid getting too two into
the idea of them being planted strategically to protect against evil.
But on the other hand, it does seem like it was,
at least in some instance definitely planted as a form
of protective magic.
Speaker 3 (44:23):
Oh, it couldn't hurt. I mean, you don't want to
be at the gas station and have an elf shooting
in and souring your gas.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
Exactly, and I also want to throw this out just
a quote provided direct quote about the consumption of rowan berries.
The Woodland Trust does right quote. Rowan berries are edible
to humans when cooked. They are sour but rich in
vitamin C and can be used to make a tart jam.
So I'd say, let's let's leave it at that. Then
that sounds okay, that's that sounds it sounds good to me.
(44:53):
Look up how to cook rowan berries before you eat them.
And then I should also point out, I mean, they're
obviously we don't have time to go into all the
but I was reading a little bit about how there
also are medicinal properties to the berries, often used as
is like a laxative, you know, uses usages like that.
So there are going to be various traditions in these
(45:14):
different European cultures that also involve uses for rowan berries
and so forth. They're going to help with some sort
of ailment. So again we get into the idea of
that the sacred tree is this thing that may have
you know, symbolic power, but then also it has these
various you know, mundane uses that may also take on
(45:36):
qualities that are sacred. It may have medicinal uses that
could also take on qualities that are sacred as well.
Speaker 3 (45:42):
Can't think about the word Rowan without thinking about the
name Rowan. Can't think about the name Rowan without thinking
of who am I going to say? Am I going
to say the mister bean guy? No, I'm thinking of
the wicker Man. That's the name of the kid that
the detective is looking for.
Speaker 1 (45:57):
Oh, well, that that I haven't looked in to it.
But that that can't be an accident, right, I mean
that seems like that. That seems like a film that
was very concerned with folkloric traditions and and so forth.
So be a mighty coincidence. Yeah, the kid wasn't named
like Bill. We may have to come back to the
(46:17):
wicker Man on Weird House Cinema at some point. That's
that's a that's a big one.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
That's a favorite at our house.
Speaker 1 (46:24):
Yes, that's the full Car Royalty right there.
Speaker 3 (46:28):
There's a lot of great Christopher Lee out there, but
that is peak Christopher Lee.
Speaker 1 (46:34):
All right, Well, we're gonna I'm gonna go ahead and
close out this episode. Again, this is a series we'll
likely come back to in the future. We already have
some notes about some other Sacred Trees, so you'll be
on the lookout, and if you have any suggestions for
future Sacred Tree episodes, right in let us know. Likewise,
as we said, if you have experience with anything we
(46:54):
discussed in this episode of or feedback on it, we'd
love to hear from you. Stuff to Blow Your Mind
is primarily a science and culture podcast, with core episodes
on Tuesdays and Thursdays, but on Fridays we set aside
most serious concerns to just talk about a weird film
on Weird House Cinema. If you are on Instagram you
want to follow the show, find us at st b
y M podcast.
Speaker 3 (47:15):
Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.
If you would like to get in touch with us
with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest
a topic for the future, or just to say hello,
you can email us at contact at stuff to Blow
your Mind dot com.
Speaker 2 (47:37):
Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For
more podcasts from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,
Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 1 (48:00):
A po polic
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