The Luck of the Irish (2001)

On this episode, leprechauns Caitlin and Jamie head to the end of the rainbow to discuss the Disney Channel Original Movie, The Luck of the Irish (2001).

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
On thee cast, the questions asked if movies have women
and them, are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,
or do they have individualism? The patriarchy, Zephy and Beast
start changing with the Bechdel.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
Cast top of the episode, to.

Speaker 3 (00:18):
You, Jamie, Oh wait, I had to do. I can't do.
I can't do an Irish accent. But that didn't stop
anyone in this movie. Oh let's do. Let's do a
wee bit of podcast.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
And guess I love that.

Speaker 3 (00:33):
I loh my god watching Ryan Merriman crash out over
saying da instead of Dad, He's like, no, I'm Irish. Also,
this movie is so iconic presenting Irishness as a disease,
like out of Irish as a mostly Irish person, you know,
I saw the vision. Being Irish is a disease and

(00:54):
it's wow. Shout out to our Irish listeners. I think
we have any we do, we do and truly like
some of our I think longest most loyal listeners are
are Irish. And Caitlyn, are you Irish at all?

Speaker 2 (01:10):
I am, I'm about twenty five percent Irish.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
Nice, so you're you're you? Gulds aer so a wee
a week.

Speaker 2 (01:17):
I would say, I'm a wee bit Irish.

Speaker 3 (01:19):
I'm I believe, like sixty seventy percent Irish. I'm quite Irish.
My dad's side of the family is all Irish. Sure,
I guess, well, I guess. Let's start the show. This
is a main feed episode. Well, welcome to the Bechdel Cast.
My name is Jamie loftis Irish, so you can't yell
at me Irish last name. Yes, I'm taking out my

(01:42):
Irish card.

Speaker 2 (01:43):
My name is Caitlyn Derante. Caitlin spelled the Irish way exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
Okay, yup, yup, yup. We won't be doing the accent.
We only do that to punish our Australian listeners for
some reason.

Speaker 2 (01:57):
Yeah, sorry about that too, are Australian listeners. I might
accidentally kind of slip into an Irish accent a little
bit in this episode.

Speaker 3 (02:06):
That's okay.

Speaker 2 (02:07):
I beg your forgiveness, listeners.

Speaker 3 (02:09):
Look, I just you know this is my revenge on
anyone who has ever butchered the Boston accent. All right,
Oh yeah no, I really I don't know why, because
I have I like have Irish family, but I just
have never the accent. Has never leapt out of me.
I don't know what it is.

Speaker 2 (02:28):
It's a hard one.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
It's a very tricky one. It's a very master But
here we are. This is the Bechdel Cast podcast where
we take a look at your favorite movies and today
Ryan Coogler's favorite movies and take a look at it
from an intersectional feminist lens. And we are in fact,
I mean, it is the week of Saint Patrick's Day
and we are talking about the two thousand and one

(02:51):
movie What a year in film? This, Shrek Wow, end
of this.

Speaker 2 (02:59):
Pretty much it?

Speaker 3 (02:59):
Yeah, but yeah, a d com from two thousand and one.
Kind of obscure, but in the news recently, genuinely because
of Ryan Cougler, who is doing such an amazing press
tour or like an Oscar's tour for sinners. He's just
saying kind of whatever. The two stories that I've seen

(03:21):
from his interviews that have gone viral are about this
the Luck of the Irish and also about the Coke
Remix Machine. Have you seen that story?

Speaker 2 (03:30):
Oh? I haven't seen that one.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
What's this? Wait? Hold on, I think I'm getting the
name of it wrong. It's like the coke machine at
AMC's and like Wendy's and wait, what is that called coke?
Like the Dispenser ye January Okay, this is a Vulture
headline from January twenty eighth, twenty twenty six. Ryan Kugler
spills on love affair with Coke freestyle machine. Quote I

(03:53):
got involved with that unquote. Oh he's so funny. I
forget that. Ryan Coogler is like in his thirties, Like
he's young and would have seen The Luck of the
Irish on TV. We'll talk more about his history with it,
but that's sure how this iconically not even remotely Irish

(04:15):
movie has come across our radar, as it apparently had
a hand in inspiring the Irish characters and sinners, which
is wild. Yes, honestly brave of him to admit. Yeah,
if I were him, I would have That's I appreciate
when someone says something so embarrassing that it has to
be true. I know.

Speaker 2 (04:35):
Well, the clip that's going around is him. It's at
a screening or whatever. It's like a panel and someone's
interviewing him and he starts talking about Luck of the
Irish and then someone in the audience.

Speaker 3 (04:47):
Has worked on it.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah, she's like, that was my idea. And he's like,
wait what, and she's like, yeah, I pitched it to Disney.
I meant to look into that further, but I simply
didn't even I was not.

Speaker 3 (04:57):
Able to figure out who that was. But I have
read inner views with I'm like, weirdly well prepared for
this episode. I've read interviews with the writer, which and
you won't believe this. He he does not know a
lot about Irish culture. What can you believe that? Can
you believe that it's going to be shocking based on
this movie's presentation of presenting being Irish as both something

(05:21):
to be extremely proud of but not as proud as
being American, as well as.

Speaker 2 (05:26):
Being present being very ashamed of it, something.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
That is a cause for shame, and it's basically a disease.
I kind of it's such a mess that it's I'm choosing,
and I'm so interested what our Irish listeners think. This
movie is so convoluted that it's like hard for me
to get offended by it because you're just like, I
think the intent is good, but it's kind of impossible

(05:50):
to know.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
Well, yeah, we'll talk about it.

Speaker 3 (05:55):
There's a lot of there's it's mainly the colonialism stuff
that you're just like, well, we maybe should have learned
a little about Irish history before talking about being the
power hungry king of Irish. You're like, well, well you
have to go back pretty far anyways. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Yeah, everything is very very vague, glossed over, or just
not even acknowledged it all.

Speaker 3 (06:21):
They're either talking about the Lucky Charms mascot or they're
talking about kind of England. At a lot of points
where were like, this is not this is like this
is what are you doing? Anyways? This is the Bechdel cast.
This is gonna be a silly one.

Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, yes, but what's your well, what's your history with
this Jamie?

Speaker 3 (06:41):
My history with this baby? I have to imagine. I
don't think I saw it like right when it came out,
But this was shown on Disney Channel all the time,
so I definitely had seen it more than once, I'm assuming,
but not in a very very long time. I did
not remember most of what happens in this movie. I

(07:02):
just remember mainly being like, I have a crush on
Ryan Merryman because he was just like a boy you
had a crush on. At this time.

Speaker 2 (07:11):
It was he was in Smart House. Also was he not?

Speaker 3 (07:14):
He was iconically in Smart House and Final Destination three.
Let's not forget Well, so we've covered. This is our
third Ryan Merriman movie. Yes, and the Merryman a verse
goes deep. I don't really know anything about Oh and
he was in Pretty Little Liars, which is one of
my guilty pleasure shows. I don't know how much he's
working now, but he should be. He should have been

(07:36):
in Centers, although I guess by watching the look of
the Irish Ryan Cocher would be like, well, he can't
do the accent, so maybe that's why he didn't get cast. No,
this was a fascinating watch because this movie is We're
going to try to cover as much as we can
in the time we have, but it's kind of impossible.
There's so much that happens. Okay.

Speaker 2 (07:57):
I so normally when I'm watching the movie, because I'll
watch the movie twice generally to prep for the episode. Sure,
the first time is when I write the recap, and
so I'm sort of like writing, maybe pausing occasionally to
like kind of catch up. I could not do both
at the same time because this story moves so fast
and so much happens, and none of it makes sense that,

(08:19):
Like I was like, I just need to let this
wash over me and I'll do the recap later.

Speaker 3 (08:24):
I have no choice but to say, like this, I
don't know. There are parts of this movie that are
incredibly frustrating, but it's so silly that it's hard not
to be like, yes, time well spent. Yeah, yeah, So
I definitely saw it when I was a kid. I
did not remember really any of it other than this
is the Saint Patrick's Day movie with my crush. So

(08:47):
it was really interesting to realize that it falls into
I think it's weirdly in conversation with another movie we've
covered and another dcon that we haven't covered. And I'm
gonna call this and let me know if you can
think of others like family friendly, coming of age body horror,

(09:08):
because that is definitely what this is. There's another d
com that also stars a young man, which I think
is interesting, called The Thirteenth Year, and it's about a
boy who on his thirteenth birthday becomes a merman. And okay,
I remember watching it another movie. I haven't seen it

(09:31):
easily twenty years. I remember being like, am I having
a Sexual Awakening with the with the Mermaid boy and
you know, so there's that, But it also reminded me
a little bit of a movie we've covered, Turning Red,
another coming of age body horror movie. Okay, yes, I
was just thinking that this is a whole sub genre.
And then I was also thinking about speaking of Pixar.

(09:53):
Was Turning Around a Pixar or.

Speaker 2 (09:55):
Was it just Disney animation either way?

Speaker 3 (09:59):
Brave. Yeah, but that's the mom though, that's the mom.

Speaker 2 (10:02):
Turns into a bear, right, Okay, I couldn't totally remember.

Speaker 3 (10:05):
What the plut Brother Bear.

Speaker 2 (10:07):
Oh, you know, I've never seen that one.

Speaker 3 (10:09):
I haven't seen it in a very long time. I
think Brother Bear might be the bear transfer bait. Weird
that there's too Brother Bear might be the one that's different,
although I feel like Brother Bear it's like a curse
or something which I would almost put in a different
category because oh, this is like because my like you're

(10:31):
I don't know, and I don't mean to like be
creepy about it, but it's like my in Turning Red,
it's the most explicit my body is changing and so
I am now a different species.

Speaker 2 (10:42):
And so we have Leprechaun Merman and Panda and Red Panda. Okay,
then there's Witches, where a boy is turned into a mouse,
and the horror imagery in that movie, if you recall it,
is really gruesome.

Speaker 3 (10:56):
Right.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
Then you have something like Honey, I Shrunk the Kids, which.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
I don't think I've ever seen that weirdly, even though
Rick Morana's could get it, you could crush.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
Yeah, I haven't seen it in a really, really long time,
so I don't remember a lot of details. But no,
I think there are a lot of wow movies in
this subshote. This is a letterboxed list waiting to happen.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
I'm kind of into it. I mean, I think it's
fun that it's not presented as horror, but it is
pretty horrific. What is happening to this young boy throughout
the movie? He's really I don't know. I just think
it's interesting. Anyways, I saw this movie, I had no
memory of how weird it is, and I'm very excited
to talk about it. Had you seen it before, because

(11:41):
I know you weren't a deep n kid.

Speaker 2 (11:42):
Yeah, No, I grew up without cable famously, and so
any Disney Channel original movie I've ever seen it was
because I watched it for this podcast.

Speaker 3 (11:53):
Wow, You're welcome. I really do think I don't know
if we ever would have covered this movie if it
were because we've covered like movies by Irish filmmakers. We
very recently covered Bantches of It Ash Saron, So it
almost like this might not be a movie we would
have gotten around to if it weren't for mister Kugler.
So thank you, question Mark. There's a lot. I also

(12:15):
like that he started like kind of a standing ovation
for the woman who worked on the Luck of the Irish,
and he's like a lot of kids in Oakland loved
your film. It's like.

Speaker 4 (12:26):
Ryan cleg was fun.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
He's great. But yeah, I had never seen this before. However, However,
like the character Kyle, I have Irish ancestry, and like
the character Kyle, I feel not very connected to it
because I think this is a pretty common thing in
the US of white people with European ancestry, especially in

(12:52):
I don't know if this is maybe like more of
a small town thing because I've like I've met white
people from cities who are like, yeah, I have this
big Italian family and we're very connected to our Italian
ness or our greekness or you know, XYZ country in Europe.

Speaker 3 (13:10):
I think that's just true of like many immigrant communities.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
True, but also like I don't know if it was
like growing up in a small town where you're encouraged
to like assimilate and like leave any previous cultural heritage behind.
But I'm you know, Irish, Italian, I think a little
bit German, some Scandinavians in there, and I don't have

(13:36):
any connection to any of these cultures.

Speaker 3 (13:40):
So I feel like that that's so, I mean, it's
like that's so much of what the movie is commenting on.
I think, like at some points very effectively, other times
not quite the opposite so much, but like it is
interesting seeing that, Like where it reminded me of this
was like, god, maybe five years ago now, but the
conversation we had with Ali Naddy when we were talking

(14:03):
about Frozen two about how and I'm paraphrasing here because
this was half a decade ago, but she was saying
that white people should be more interested in what their
indigenous culture is instead of appropriating but nothing American culture,
well not even that, but like instead of appropriating American

(14:24):
indigenous culture, it's like you do have your own heritage,
take an interest in it. Like, but but there is
this like discouragement to do that. I think how many
Because I grew up I would say, like, I don't
I didn't know a lot about Ireland's history or anything
like that, but I did grow up with Irish family members.

(14:47):
It's weird to remind this reminded me a lot of
like the parents in this movie kind of reminded me
of my dad's family a little bit. This is pretty
this is a stretch, but like my dad is fully
Irish and every summer when he was a kid, he

(15:07):
would be sent to Ireland to be with his family,
but he would mostly be doing like manual farm labor,
and so he was like, I don't like Ireland. That's
where I go to work to Bailhey, I don't like it.
But like he was pretty like removed from that, Like

(15:30):
he experienced a lot of it firsthand, but like he
never really talked to us about it, And I wonder
why that is. I just I don't know. It's interesting
to think about because I would like to know more
about specifically Irish culture.

Speaker 2 (15:45):
Have you been to Ireland?

Speaker 3 (15:47):
Yeah, I've been twice. I've been to only Dublin. I've
been to Dublin to do shows twice. Yeah, I've never
met my family. My brother and I are actually possibly
going to be going this summer to meet some of
our family.

Speaker 2 (16:02):
It's lovely.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. But all that to say,
this is such an interesting cultural like piece because it
does sort of direct well sometimes directly, sometimes not interface
with how estranged white Americans can be from their culture.

Speaker 4 (16:22):
Yes, I think it's quite which is which is not
something I've seen explored in children's media before, So I
don't know, But yeah, what did you What was your
experience of watching this movie?

Speaker 2 (16:35):
You know, when you do not grow up with d
cooms and then you watch them well into your adult life,
and like, these movies and these types of stories have
not been normalized for you, You're just like, what the
fuck this?

Speaker 3 (16:50):
Like? What am I looking at? This sucks?

Speaker 2 (16:54):
Like?

Speaker 3 (16:54):
Is that kind of like that?

Speaker 2 (16:56):
It's exactly like that, I would say. But you know
what is great about this movie is that it's like
eighty five minutes long and so.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
Many such dcoms. Yeah, no, it's ultimately this movie is
really it's I appreciate it on the strictly on the
grounds that it's fucking weird, and I'm happy that it exists,
because I'm happy anytime a movie this weird exists and
people are still talking about it twenty five years later,
that's kind of cool. That said, it's nice the movie

(17:28):
is unhinged, so wild, it is so weird.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
We take a quick break and then come back for
the recap. I'm so excited for you to recap this.

Speaker 3 (17:37):
Good luck, thank you be back. Yeah, we're back, okay recapping.
We also, we didn't say what the if this is
your first episode of the Bechdel Cast. Interesting choice the

(18:00):
Bechdel test. You know, I would say, you know, don't
worry about it. It's this movie does not pass it.

Speaker 2 (18:09):
No, you could yeah, look it up on your own
time or listen to another episode.

Speaker 3 (18:14):
But there was one exchange that almost almost really close,
but it was like between a teacher and a student
and the teacher had no name, so oh swinging a
miss and the rest is men having crisises about their
leprechaun bodies.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
So well that okay, I I kind of knew that
this was one of the many many not just dcoms,
but just like family like kids movies in general, that
centers around a sport, and often specifically basketball.

Speaker 3 (18:50):
This is not even the first dcom basketball movie that
we've covered, too, because we covered the what was it
like Full Court Miracle or something?

Speaker 2 (18:58):
Oh yes, a movie, right, and then High School Musical
heavily features basketball.

Speaker 3 (19:06):
And we haven't covered I think a lot of millennial
queer awakenings to the movie Double Teamed, which is a
pretty wild name to give to a children this movie,
but they but they did that and it's about twin
basketball players. Wow, yeah, okay, yeah, because that was the

(19:28):
other millennial media trend was sports and twins.

Speaker 2 (19:32):
Twins, yes, yeah, yeah, so lots of sports. So I
knew that about this movie because I've seen the poster
before and like he's in his basketball jersey on the poster. Yeah,
I thought it was gonna be a story about him
going to Ireland and then like, I don't know, doing
something that far too simple, too simple, and since way

(19:54):
too big of a budget. They don't have go to
Ireland money, no budget.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
They really don't. Apparently it was shot in like Utah,
like yes, because I was like, there is like a beautiful,
like mountainous background. I'm like, where the hell are they
and they're apparently in Utah for I'm assuming budgetary reasons.

Speaker 2 (20:16):
Yeah, I'm like, what tax breaks was Utah offering in
two thousand and one.

Speaker 3 (20:20):
We don't know.

Speaker 2 (20:22):
Anyway, Here's here is what the story is about, not whatever.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
I thought it might be.

Speaker 2 (20:28):
We meet Kyle Johnson played by Ryan Merriman. He's having
a bad dream where he's at a school heritage day
assembly thing and he's about to perform. But wait, he's
only like two inches tall, so no one can see him.

(20:48):
Foreshadowing alert.

Speaker 3 (20:51):
Yeah, okay, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:53):
There's also voiceover from Kyle talking about.

Speaker 3 (20:56):
How a lot of voiceover from Kyle every time. Well,
I think it is necessary, and they just probably didn't
shoot some stuff they should have.

Speaker 1 (21:07):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (21:07):
Well, true, there's a lot of things where there. I
was like, oh, I guess they just couldn't afford to
show us that. So he's just saying it.

Speaker 2 (21:16):
He's telling us in his voiceover. He's saying he's talking
about how everyone in the world is different and we
all have these different cultural backgrounds that should be celebrated.

Speaker 3 (21:28):
But wait a.

Speaker 2 (21:29):
Minute, he doesn't know anything about his heritage. So he
wakes up and he asks his mom and dad where
their family comes from, and he's interested because of this
like upcoming heritage day assembly that's actually happening. He's not
just dreaming about it.

Speaker 3 (21:46):
He's organized by his crush.

Speaker 2 (21:50):
His crush slash frenemy girl, Unclaire.

Speaker 3 (21:54):
She really hands his ass to him so many times
in this movie. It's so awesome. One time she literally
hands his ask to him and then like gets up
basketball in the hoop like awesome. Yeah. She literally she's like,
you suck and then swishes, It's awesome, go bond.

Speaker 2 (22:13):
She does hand his ass to him a lot, but
she also spends all of her waking hours like chasing
him down, being like, let me help you figure out
your heritage. I'm like, you have others?

Speaker 3 (22:24):
Don't you have anything else going on? She's a girl
in a movie, Cayle, what's she gonna do have a friend?
I don't think so not in this movie, no way.
And then the twist at the end is I also,
I don't know, I'm getting way ahead of myself, but
like the twist at the end, being like she wanted
to play basketball the whole time, I was like, oh,
I was not picking up on naw But I guess

(22:45):
good for her. That her the Wish. We didn't know
she had came true question mark.

Speaker 2 (22:50):
Yeah, the Irish Wish. Remember that movie that I'm still
petitioning that we cover.

Speaker 3 (22:57):
We should cover it, we should be Look, I if
you're listening to this, it's possible that we are covering
it on the Matreon because as of this recording, we
haven't pulled yet. So yeah, if you're a if you're
a matron, maybe maybe you've chosen violence, then we have
in fact covered that movie at this point.

Speaker 2 (23:13):
Yes, yes, yes, anyway, so Kyle asks his mom and
dad where their family immigrated from, and they're like, no,
we're we're from here. We're from America. We're Americans and
that's the only heritage we need.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
I thought this was a really interesting again, like we
were talking about, like, I think it's obviously super exaggerated
because it's I also like that it's basically shot like
a horror movie where it's like all fish islandses they're
eating this like horrific, disgusting castrole and Kyle, my god,
that was so funny. I thought, like this, there's moments

(23:49):
where this movie is really cooking. I thought, like where
she's making this like lettuce monstrosity. And Kyle's like, oh,
is this like a dish from our from our culture,
and she's like, no, it's just from a magazine. It
looks horrible.

Speaker 2 (24:04):
Let me describe this dish. It's like plain spaghetti or
glass noodles or something. Point is, there's no sauce to
speak of, although.

Speaker 3 (24:13):
The but it is wet. It is a wet, slimy
but it's just like.

Speaker 2 (24:20):
Glass noodles with like gelatinous globs of tofu or chicken
or something, and then like random vegetables kind of loosely
scattered throughout, and it served in this enormous bowl that's
lined with romaine lettuce leaves.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
Like it is horrible. It's it's horrifect horrible. But I
also I was like, shout out to whatever prop master
came up with that, because it was it was really amazing.
I was. I was so impressed. But yeah, but I
did like that for a portion. And again, this movie,
anything that you like about this movie will prove to

(25:02):
be inconsistent as the movie goes on. But but I
did sort of like the like that this like aggressive
like we're not anything, We're American is presented like a
horror movie, because uh yeah, that is you know, not
far off right, because it's just I mean, the thing

(25:25):
that this movie won't do that we'll talk about is
like acknowledge like it. I feel like multiple times they
walk right up to the line of acknowledging colonialism, but
and then not quite then back off and say Americans
believe in baseball, and they're like, well, what the hell
like you like, it's so close, and multiple instances of

(25:50):
genocidal colonialism as well. It's like American colonialism, English colonialism
of Ireland like, but instead it's just kind of vaguefied
and to like, we had some difficult times, but we
were resilient and now you're fine, and you're like, Okay,
what was the what happened? What happened? And that's you

(26:13):
know where Disney draws the line. They're not about to
talk about what.

Speaker 2 (26:16):
Happened, certainly not and certainly not in two thousand and one. Okay,
So Kyle is curious. His parents keep being like, no,
that's we're American, so shut the hell off.

Speaker 3 (26:29):
We're from Cleveland again, and a very funny joke.

Speaker 2 (26:32):
Yeah, that maybe goes on for too long, but they
talk about it all the time.

Speaker 3 (26:36):
Until the very end of the movie they're still I'm like, okay, okay, yeah,
But anyways.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
Either way, Kyle can't help but feel like there's something
his parents are not telling him. Also, Kyle has a
Chekhov's Lucky Coin necklace thing which he takes to his
basketball game where he made makes a lucky shot. It
wins his team the big game and they're gonna go

(27:05):
to the championships. And then the next day he takes
a test at school and he guesses all the correct
answers by pure luck. So he's a lucky guy.

Speaker 3 (27:15):
Although at some point I felt like it got confusing
where it's like the it stands for the luck of
the Irish, which again is like pretty laden in tropes
around Irish people, but also at some points it seems
to in conversations with Bonnie, it seems to sort of
be the lucky coin stands in for like white.

Speaker 2 (27:35):
Privilege, white privilege.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
Yeah, but kind of only in that one scene where
she's like, oh, well, you never have to try, like
you know, some of us actually have to try, and
it feels like she's talking about white privilege. But then
that kind of just goes away and you're like well,
that was like many things in this movie, We're like,
that was an interesting idea, we will not be saying
it again.

Speaker 2 (27:54):
Yeah. That immediately tapers off and goes nowhere. Yes, yeah, okay.
So that night he asks his parents again where their
ancestors are from, and this is where we get the
scene with the disgusting bowls.

Speaker 3 (28:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:10):
Yeah, and again his parents dodge the question. So at
school the next day he goes on www dot Internet
search website dot com, slash two thousand and one, every movie.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
Every Yeah, He's like, what is what? Who is my dad?
Like that's sort of yes.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
And then the girl at school who keeps hounding him
about Bonnie the Heritage Day assembly, This is Bonnie Lopez.
She sees him struggling, so she tries to help. But
Kyle's last name is Johnson, which of course is one
of the most common names in the US, So he
cannot find anything. There's like four million hits on his search,

(28:59):
and he does not know his mother's maide a name.
He says something like, yeah, I've never really thought about
my mom's side of the family, and it's like, oh,
do you not consider women at all?

Speaker 3 (29:12):
People? And also like seeing his dad I'm like, this
is the interesting person in your family. Oh my gosh,
it is like the most like stereotypical, like Dufus Disney dad.
Oh my god, ever, I'm from Cleveland whatever. And of
course this will come up with Bonnie multiple times. But
like Bonnie good potential for a character, right, But like,

(29:35):
the thing with Bonnie is that her whole you know,
she is in charge of heritage day all this stuff,
and we never find out what herriage, anything about her heritage.
We find out at the end that her and Kyle's
other friend, Russell, who is black, they both have fathers.

(29:57):
That's the reveal at the end of the movie. They
both have fathers, and you're it's just like, okay, but
you never learned anything about their heritage except for a
very weird line of dialogue that we'll get to oh later,
trust me.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
Yeah, okay. So Kyle is like, why don't I know
anything about my family's heritage. So he keeps digging around.
He looks through his dad's yearbook and newspaper clippings and
like his birth certificate or something. I don't know, but
he discovers that his dad's last name wasn't originally Johnson,

(30:28):
but Smith.

Speaker 3 (30:29):
And You're like, is he a spy? Is he cool?

Speaker 2 (30:32):
The answer is no, no, And I don't even does
this even come back? Why did he change his name?

Speaker 3 (30:39):
It's they changed They changed it so that they wouldn't Okay,
this is confusing, Like they they said later that there
is and this is like again based in something real,
but the way they're describing it is so incoherent, where
they're like, oh, like leprechauns don't accept leprechaun's marry non

(31:00):
leprechaun like you can't have marriages with non leprechauns, which
does come off a bit anti irish, but that they like, Okay.
This is where I get confused, because I think that
they changed their names so that they would they could
like live in cognito mode. But they also moved to

(31:22):
the town where her father owns a very successful potato
chip factory. So I'm like, why did they not move
somewhere else?

Speaker 2 (31:31):
Well, I think they moved their first to Utah, and
then the father follows them but doesn't try to interact
with them.

Speaker 3 (31:39):
At all, and so I'm like, well, then why the
hell did he do that? And why I mean the
potato chip of it all is so funny. And also
Bonnie is so like smartgirl dot jpeg that she knows
things that you're like, what the hell who told you that?

(32:00):
Where she when they get to the potato chip factory
because listeners, there is a climactic scene at the potato
chip factory where she's like, actually, potato chips were invented
over one hundred years ago. I'm like, why do you
know when potato chips were invented? You can't just be
like anyways, and it's not even Irish, it's just whatever,

(32:21):
It's fine.

Speaker 2 (32:21):
It's so confusing, Okay. So Kyle learns that there's some
mystery with his family name, and so he and his
friend Russell speculate why his dad might have changed his
last name. And this is all happening while they're shooting
hoops because they wedge basketball in every chance they.

Speaker 3 (32:39):
Get anywhere, anywhere possible.

Speaker 2 (32:42):
And then Kyle sees a sign advertising this like Irish
fair thing yeah that this guy named Seamus McTiernan runs.

Speaker 3 (32:56):
Who randomly ends up being the villain, although it takes
a really long time.

Speaker 2 (33:00):
Oh yeah, yeah, and so on this sign is a
symbol that matches the symbol that's on Kyle's lucky coin.
So Kyle is like, what am I Irish? And so
they go to this Irish fair.

Speaker 3 (33:16):
It also is so funny to be that, Like, I
don't know, maybe it's because I grew up in a
very like high concentrated Irish Italian area, but the fact
that he's like shocked that he could be Irish, I'm like,
it's it can't be that shocking. That's so it's I'm

(33:38):
like trying to think of an equally ludicrous thing for
him to be shocked by. But he's like, I'm Irish.
You're like, I mean, yeah, you're Ryan Merriman. He also
looks Irish. Yeah, his mom has red hair, Like he's like,
I'm Irish. Anyways, well, he never noticed his mom's hair

(34:01):
because he never noticed his mom before because he does
not consider women to be people. Yeah he said he
he said, women actually aren't people to me, And you're like, oh,
got it got him?

Speaker 2 (34:11):
Oh I see Okay. So at the fair, they meet
an old irishman who keeps carrying on about Kyle's shoes,
and he mentions Kyle's mom there's this weird thing with
cgi quarters, and then the old irishman mysteriously disappears, and

(34:32):
so we're like, okay, we're getting kind of like plot
Wich vibes, except it's a plot man man, which yes, okay.
So then some step dancers start performing, led by the
man who runs this fair, shamous McTiernan played by Timothy Omendsen,

(34:54):
who is like in things like he was in psych
and he's in some other stones.

Speaker 3 (34:59):
Yeah. G was like, I love this guy.

Speaker 2 (35:02):
I don't know, You're like, oh yeah, sure. And so
Kyle starts like doing the dance along with all these dancers,
like he somehow instinctively knows all the steps, which.

Speaker 3 (35:14):
I again, it's presenting like I'm displaying symptoms of irishness, like.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
He's having an Irish outbreak.

Speaker 3 (35:24):
Uncontrollable step dancing, It's like it's iconic. It's iconic, the
uncontrollable step dancing. It's like, I'm you know, Irish SLISters
is very possible. I don't know, You're like, am I
offended by it? It's hard, it's hard. It's just so silly.

Speaker 2 (35:43):
It's so so silly.

Speaker 3 (35:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:45):
So he's dancing, but then someone bumps into him and
knocks him on the ground, and then they help him
up and they're kind of like man handling him a bit,
and we're like, hmmm, what was that all about. Don't worry,
we'll find out soon. But before then, his mother, Kate,
seemingly apropos of nothing, suddenly has an Irish accent. She's

(36:10):
cooking traditional Irish food for breakfast. She has unleashed her
curly red hair, and she's like, by the way, Kyle,
I've decided to tell you that me family came from Ireland.
And he's like, oh, okay, what what?

Speaker 3 (36:28):
He cannot believe it. I cannot believe his white Irish
family with red hair is from Ireland.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
I also don't understand why she changed her mind all
of a sudden. Is it because of the coin thing?

Speaker 3 (36:43):
I think it's again, it's like, the rules are so unclear.
I thought I thought that the rules of being Irish,
but like, also it fully conflates being Irish with being
a straight up leprechaun. Like I couldn't I couldn't tell
if this movie in the world this movie takes place
in regular Irish people exist.

Speaker 2 (37:02):
Or right or all Irish people. Leprechauns is a leprechaun movie.

Speaker 3 (37:07):
There's also confusing rules around, like when you can see
a Leprechun versus when you can't. At the at the
climax of this movie, the grandfather Leprechaun is just sitting
on top of a basketball hoop, and so I I
was like trying to get there, and I'm like, oh,
probably only other leprechauns can see him. Question work. But
then Russell just walks up to him and is like hey,

(37:29):
and I was like, okay, so everyone can see him
and no one cares. Yeah, the rules are I mean,
it's you'll, You're just there's there's no point in trying
to understand the rules because there's no rules. But I
I thought that the mom was becoming uncontrollably irish as
a symptom of being irish. I thought it was like

(37:51):
she she's like, you know, she can't control it. It couldn't.
I didn't interpret it as a decision she was making
well because which is not great for agency of women,
which is what the show is about.

Speaker 2 (38:04):
This is true. I okay, here's my best guess. Okay,
her suddenly displaying her irishness.

Speaker 3 (38:12):
But also not irishness.

Speaker 2 (38:14):
It's she's leprechaunness.

Speaker 3 (38:16):
Yes, it's like being Irish is a symptom that could
lead to becoming a leprechaun. That's sort of the because she,
I guess she did first embrace like very broad iris,
like Irish food, and uh, her hair is out and
she has an accent, but then it's presented as like

(38:37):
and the symptoms continued to worsen, and then she became
a leprechaun. So here's what it is. Maybe okay, try
yeah anything.

Speaker 2 (38:47):
Her displaying these quote unquote Irish slash leprechaun because the
movie does not know the distinction between the two traits.
Coincides with Kyle losing his coin, which he doesn't know
that he has lost it yet, but it happens at
the fair because it gets stolen. We'll find that out.
And then that seems to be the moment that his

(39:09):
mom and the whole thing is that the coin allows
this family to hide their leprechaun features, such as their
very short stature and their Irish accents. That's why the
coin is so important. And then when he loses it,
that's when his mom is no longer able to like,

(39:30):
quote unquote pass as a human right.

Speaker 3 (39:33):
I mean, it's like that's fine. I mean, this movie
there's so many reads of this movie, and the movie
just never really decides on what.

Speaker 2 (39:41):
Well, no, the movie like the grandpa does say that
he's like, the coin is what we use.

Speaker 3 (39:47):
Well, yes, he literally.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
Says, like that's how we pass as human, I know,
the lucky coin.

Speaker 3 (39:52):
But it's like, but that also kind of but that
read which they state, also for me kind of chafed
with the Body Horror read, which they also state, and
like it just feels like there's a little bit of
mixed messaging of like should we be proud to be
irish or not? Like it's, oh, we're so confusing because yeah,
I wrote, like you know, there's a read of this

(40:14):
movie that's like a coming of age body horror. And
then there's the one that like, being a leprechaun is
a metaphor for being a descendant of an immigrant culture
that's been forced to assimilate, but it's still an unavoidable
part of who you are, and that's nothing to be
ashamed of. And you can't at some point, you can't
tide where you come from, even if you don't fully
understand why you are the way you are, and that

(40:35):
there is this you know, inherent disconnect if you are
isolated from your native culture. And then there's the one
where it's like I'm so short now and I'm scared,
Like it's so confusing. I love this movie.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
I think wait right, it's like and maybe this is
us getting ahead of ourselves, but the movie is trying
to be like, America is a culturally diverse melt pot,
and that's part of what makes it great.

Speaker 3 (41:03):
But then it's also like, also, being American is a
distinct identity and it's important that you adhere to it.
It's very confusing, and.

Speaker 2 (41:13):
Our cultural differences should be celebrated. But also if you
are culturally different from quote unquote American culture, such as
being a leprechaun question mark, you should hide it.

Speaker 3 (41:28):
And well that's the thing. It's like, yeah, but the
like when Kyle embraces his and again like we have
to for the sake of the way the movie works
conflate Irish people and leprechauns, which is but like, once
he embraces the fact that he is Irish, all his
leprechaun like qualities disappear and he is himself again. So

(41:53):
you're like, well, it's not it's not very Shrekian, is
what I'll say, because part of why Shrek is so
effective genuinely is because he continues to embody the other
form and like embraces the beauty of it. And that's
what Fiona does, right, But Kyle kind of goes back

(42:15):
to looking like a white kid in Utah, so like
it's just whatever, whatever, this movie doesn't make any sense again.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
No, okay, where were we? Kyle's mom is displaying irish qualities.

Speaker 3 (42:34):
But also like he's yeah, sort of quote unquote quote
exactly quote unquote.

Speaker 2 (42:39):
And then the other unusual thing about this day is
that Kyle's luck seems to have run out. He gets
splashed by a puddle, he keeps dropping things and spilling
food all over himself. He drinks from a drinking fountain
that makes him look like he pissed his pants, he
can't make any foul shots at basketball practice. And then

(43:01):
also after this practice, they also have another the big
basketball game that same night. Like normally you don't have
a practice and then a game on the same day,
but sure, yeah, this.

Speaker 3 (43:16):
Is like we've got bigger fish to fry. I don't
even know. Honestly, that did not even scan for me.
I was like, yeah, of course, of course. Of course
we've been at the school for forty hours at this point.

Speaker 2 (43:25):
The other sports thing that doesn't scan is that toward
the end of the movie, Kyle is wrestling and then
Russell says like, oh, yeah, Kyle's on the wrestling team.

Speaker 3 (43:34):
Oh. I loved that. I loved that. They just throw
that in there so that the scene makes sense so exactly.
But here's the thing.

Speaker 2 (43:41):
The wrestling season, oh h happens at the same time
as basketball season, so you probably can't do both.

Speaker 3 (43:47):
I think that that that to me screamed studio note
where they're like, why can you do that? Oh, just
have Russell say he's on the wrestling team. That'll make sense. Meanwhile,
it's like one of the most incoherency in the entire
movie where they're doing ancient Gaelic games while repeating incorrect
Irish history, like it's so bizarre. It's so bizarre. Yep.

Speaker 2 (44:11):
Okay. Anyway, so before we get there, there is this
basketball game and Kyle, because his luck has run out,
biffs the game and everyone is mad at him, although
they still win. So they have another the big game
the following night.

Speaker 3 (44:28):
The next day.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Okay, so then the next day his mom is now
in like, I don't know, nineteenth century Irish garb. Her
irishness quote unquote keeps heightening, and Kyle is still having
really bad luck, and he finally realizes it's because his
lucky coin necklace is gone, because his is made from gold,

(44:54):
but the one he has is iron, which he finds
out in science class because they're experimenting with magnet.

Speaker 3 (45:00):
Yeah, and Russell knows how magnets work, which is how
we randomly when we're later told I want to be
a scientist, I was like, oh, because he knew one
thing about magnets.

Speaker 2 (45:09):
Well, he knows about magnets, and he knows about rainbows
and like it's refracting of lights.

Speaker 3 (45:13):
So he knows stuff. He's a science kid.

Speaker 2 (45:16):
He's a kid in stem.

Speaker 3 (45:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
Yeah, So this is how Kyle finds out about his necklace.
So he realizes someone must have stolen the coin and
swapped it out for a different one. Kyle goes home
and discovers then that his mom is a leprechaun and
comes from a long line of the leprechauns of the

(45:40):
like clan O'Reilly. So his mom's maiden name is O'Reilly.
His mom is now six inches tall, and this all
explains why Kyle his hair is turning red, his ears
are kind of pointy, he's shrinking, he's like shorter than
he used to be because he's half Leprechaun.

Speaker 3 (46:02):
It's it's pretty cool. It's pretty he is. Again, this
is like a horrific sequence. But they're like, I also
like that they stop short of They're like, well, he's
only half leprecan so he's only going to get like
a little smaller, right, He's gonna be just like a
short kid. And his and he has like kind of

(46:22):
like a box dye job for sure, which is awesome.
The ears, it it's you know, it's a lot, but
I'm into it.

Speaker 2 (46:30):
The makeup department was really they were cooking, Yeah, with
all twelve dollars they were given precisely. Okay, So we
learn that as long as the O'Reilly clan has their
luck aka the Lucky Coin, they can pass as human.
But because Kyle no longer has the coin, that's why

(46:55):
they're all shrinking and becoming more leprechaun like. And Kyle
is like, okay, I think I know who stole the coin.
This old Irish man at the fair and his mom
is like, oh, yeah, that's your grandfather. We were bound
to run into him ever since he opened up that
potato chip factory down the road.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
And You're just like, I cannot, I cannot take in
another piece of information right now? What do you mean
ever since he opened that potato chip factory around the
corner from where we live in Utah? Like sure, if
any why the hell not?

Speaker 2 (47:34):
Wouldn't it make more sense if the if the movie
was set in Idaho, which is famous for potatoes.

Speaker 3 (47:41):
Yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, and also not for nothing.
Like again, just the randomization of this movie, like potato
chips are not from Ireland, they were invented in England.
Oh again, just like a lot of weird English history
is being attributed to and that's like very obscure. It

(48:02):
was invented in England in like the eighteen hundreds. So
I'm like what, so why? So just like why why?

Speaker 2 (48:10):
Why? Is the question you can ask every thirty seconds
I would say in this movie. Okay, so we learned
this about Kyle's grandfather, who he had never met because
the grandfather disowned his daughter aka Kyle's mom when she
married a human. Because as you alluded to earlier Leprechauns

(48:34):
don't believe in mixed marriages.

Speaker 3 (48:36):
And he's never thought about his family before.

Speaker 2 (48:42):
Yeah, he doesn't, although he does like it seems like
he approached Kyle at that fair knowing that that was
his grandson. And he's like, wow, shoes, leather, potato chips,
and it's just like, is this how you talk to
your grandson?

Speaker 3 (49:00):
Yeah? I also loved the cgi quarters he throws into
the sky.

Speaker 2 (49:04):
Oh it's icon hideous. Okay. So Kyle and his family
go to the potato chip factory called Emerald Isle to
confront Kyle's granddad, whose name is Riley, Oh Riley, And
let that sink in for a minute.

Speaker 3 (49:25):
And that's on Ireland, right.

Speaker 2 (49:31):
Right, And he's played by Henry Gibson, who I recognize
from a few different things. He's also like, you know,
he's in stuff, not you.

Speaker 3 (49:43):
Know, he's American for what it's worth, he's American. If
you couldn't tell, that's not a real Irish accent. He
does look very weight. I'm looking at his Oh oh grant, Okay,
I'm out in my fiance as a dork. He's he's
in magnet. Oh yeah, that's what Grant knew him from.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
I think that's what I most recognize him from as well.

Speaker 3 (50:03):
In Magnolia, he's in wedding crashers and he's in Boston Legal.
Maybe that's what I know him from. Oh wow, anyways,
he's I think he makes a meal of whatever the
hell he's supposed to be doing, and oh, absolutely, I enjoyed.
I enjoyed it.

Speaker 2 (50:20):
Okay, So they go to try to confront Grandpa Riley O'Reilly,
but they can't get in to see him. Meanwhile, Bonnie
is at the factory for a tour with the Young
Achievers Club, so Kyle links up with her. The security
guards start chasing them because Kyle isn't supposed to be there,

(50:42):
and then they end up bumping into Grandpa Riley O'Reilly,
who tells them about the luck of the Clan O'Reilly
and he's like, well, I didn't steal your coin, but
I think I know who did. Seamus McTiernan, the guy
who puts on the Irish step dancing.

Speaker 3 (51:02):
Fair And you're like, right, the perfect crime there.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
And we learn that Seamus is a fair dereg which
I had to look this up. It's a type of
fairy found in Irish folklore, one who loves playing pranks,
especially like kind of gruesome pranks.

Speaker 3 (51:24):
Yes, there are random real things that are referenced here,
but there's so few and far between that I have
to attribute it to rewrites. Oh yeah, they're like, we
should put a fact in here, right, So.

Speaker 2 (51:39):
They go after Seamus in Riley's lime green convertible. So awesome,
So it is pretty cool. Also, Riley O'Reilly has a
long white beard now because I guess this is him
turning more and more into a leprocase.

Speaker 3 (51:58):
Again, it's like Irish as Irish is a disease and
you're catching it. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:04):
Russell also randomly joins them because he's just sort of
out wandering the streets.

Speaker 3 (52:11):
As many characters as most of the supporting characters in
this movie seem to be doing. They're just loose.

Speaker 2 (52:17):
They're just kind of waiting around for Kyle.

Speaker 3 (52:19):
It's kind of Truman show ish. They're just like, where's
Kyle at?

Speaker 2 (52:24):
Is exactly like that?

Speaker 3 (52:25):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (52:25):
Yeah, So together they start chasing Seamus's mobile home camper
van thing that has a pot of gold inside. But
because the Clan O'Reilly don't have luck anymore, they crash
the car because Seamus throws corned beef and cabbage on

(52:46):
the windshield.

Speaker 3 (52:47):
So some really interesting, intense, like intense shots of corn
beef and cabbage really beautiful, Like, yeah, I and I
love my Irish brethren, but the food is just not
for me. It's just not for me. And I don't
think this movie does it any favors in making it.
Oh my god, well, because the breakfast looks good. The

(53:08):
breakfast looks good.

Speaker 2 (53:09):
Sure, but then also his mom is like, here, take
this to school. It is a rusty bucket full of
what appears to be mostly slopped.

Speaker 3 (53:18):
Why does she give him lunch in a bucket? Is
a question.

Speaker 2 (53:21):
I had no lid.

Speaker 3 (53:22):
This is taking this is taking it back a little bit.
But I did think it was very funny and very
like Disney coated that on like Kyle's least Lucky day.
Ninety percent of what happens to him is he's just
like spilling things on himself. He's just like every he's like,
this is the worst day ever. And then he'll like
slip on a banana peel and fall into like a

(53:42):
bowl of soup, and like it's just him getting stuff
on his clothes.

Speaker 2 (53:47):
Yeah, all day long, all day long, worse day ever,
which okay, you know we've talked so much about like
Hillary duff pratfalls. Yeah, it's nice to see a boy
character do he gets something similar for one.

Speaker 3 (54:02):
Yeah, but he's like not even I guess he does fall.
He does fall, he does fall.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
But you're right, it is mostly it's like whatever, it's
it's general clumsiness.

Speaker 3 (54:11):
It's just like a scene after scene, we cut a
cut a few because he gets he gets spilled on
at the locker, he gets spilled on at lunch, he
gets spilled on out, he gets he spills the bucket
on himself.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
The water fountain sprays his crotch, and then it looks
like he pete himself. He gets splashed by a puddle
with a car driving by. It's truly like eight different things.

Speaker 3 (54:29):
It's just so. And meanwhile he's like doing this weird
teenage like hitting on a girl where he's like, looky
looking good ladies.

Speaker 5 (54:40):
It's like, ah, Ryan Merryman, looking good ladies. I'm like, yeah,
definitely what fifteen year old boys were doing. It's so
like my dad wrote a script.

Speaker 3 (54:52):
Oh looking good the ladies.

Speaker 2 (54:55):
Yeah, okay, so the car has a flat tire. Their chase,
their pursuit of Seamus McTiernan has come to a screeching cult.
All hope is lost. Kyle is like, I'm not even
good at basketball, am I it was just my luck
that made me good at it. And then his dad

(55:17):
is like, oh, I'm so sorry, Kyle. We should have
told you about your leprechaun heritage a long time ago.

Speaker 3 (55:24):
I do appreciate that the dad apologizes to him. I
sure am confused about the implications of his whole life
being attributed to a coin. Like again, this is where
the white privilege thing becomes introduced and unintroduced. There's a
great scene with Bonnie and Kyle where she says like,

(55:46):
you're a nice guy, but you'd be a better person
if everything hadn't always been so easy for you, and
then she like basically dunks a basketball that wasn't luck,
it was practice, you know, hard work. And you're like, oh,
that's interesting, but it's also kind of I feel like
it's it's sad for Kyle's entire like his passion is
playing basketball, and they're like, well, that had nothing to

(56:07):
do with you, and you're like, that's really that's really dark.
That's a really dark thing to introduce. Like without this,
I don't know, I like it doesn't even really scan
for me. Like, without without a connection to your culture,
you have no function, You're useless, Like it's just a Again,
the messaging is a little bit like muddled. I don't

(56:29):
quite a muddled Dan. Yeah, Like I don't think that
there's a way to be like, oh, this is what
they were trying to say. They were just like, we
got to fill eighty minutes on TV. Yes, exactly by
any means necessary. Yeah, including what is about to happen,
which I definitely didn't remember and could not have anticipated.
The ancient games.

Speaker 2 (56:48):
Yeah, so that's coming up very shortly. First in this
like you know, end of act to low point moment,
it starts pouring rain and so they're stuck.

Speaker 3 (56:58):
In the rain.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
But Bonnie an uplifting speech.

Speaker 3 (57:02):
About how Irish people lifted themselves by their bootstraps and
America is slay. Wait when the Irish also, she knows
so much about Irish history, and we get no insight
into her heritage this scene. We have to just go
through it. Yeah, Bonnie says, when the Irish came to America.
Things were tough, and they had to work at jobs

(57:24):
that other people wouldn't take, and they didn't get paid
what they deserve. Russell interjects, at least they got paid,
which I think is supposed to reference that he is
possibly descended from enslaved people.

Speaker 2 (57:36):
That's what I thought as well.

Speaker 3 (57:37):
Yes, which is an unhinged way to acknowledge acknowledge slave slavery.
And yes, also that is the only insight we get
into any non Irish character's heritage. It's upsetting. Bonnie ignores
the thing Russell has said, correct and continues, but they

(57:58):
didn't give up, and they kept trying until things got better.
That's what makes them special, not where they are now,
but the spirit that keeps them going on the way there.
Kyle says she's a young achiever to nag her, and
then Bonnie is, you know, whips are fucking flat, and
she doesn't, but she says, I'm an American, That's what

(58:19):
we all are, and Americans don't give up. And everyone's
like clapping check yeah, Like it's one of the weirdest
jingoistic Like I mean, it does sort of. I still
think it's weird even for its time, But like, it
definitely lines up with a lot of the messaging that

(58:39):
you received or you received. It's certainly not messaging that
children are getting now from the oppressive power structure they
live inside of, because we now live in an openly
anti immigrant country. But for a long time, the way
that Americans would and particularly white Americans would obvious gate

(59:00):
the internalized racism and anti immigrant tendencies was to tell kids,
we're a nation of immigrants, we're a melting but all together,
we're a melting pot, and we're all Americans, and the
identity of Americans is one of tolerance. And and then
like capitalism, basically it's like working hard. There's a there's

(59:22):
a scene that happens later with Kyle and his grandfather
where Kyle's grandfather, Riley O'Reilly, is like, I'm gonna take
the gold. Then Kyle's like, no, don't take the gold.
We work hard to do to earn, like to or
we came to America to work hard. And so it's

(59:43):
like preaching the melting pot myth that America was founded on.
And also capitalism is is how immigrant communities are able
to lift themselves up. And you're just like, this is
a mess and it ends on this land is your land?

Speaker 2 (01:00:03):
Or like yeah, yeah, no, there's so many either like
monologues or bits of voiceover or just imagery that is
basically like you will say, you would say, like it is.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
So jinguistic, right, which feels very of its time, Like
it feels like it reminds me again of a very
weird and coherent version of like stuff you would experience
at school as a kid, of like assemblies and like
we're so proud to be Americans. And I don't know
if you were at if you were in a public school,
anytime I ran around nine to eleven, like it was

(01:00:37):
relentless m hm.

Speaker 2 (01:00:39):
So Bonnie gives this speech about how awesome America is,
which causes the rain to instantly stop and a rainbow appears.
Oh you didn't think the rain was plot relevant, Well
it is because now there's a rainbow.

Speaker 3 (01:00:56):
They have to go fight in the ancient games and.

Speaker 2 (01:00:59):
They have to chase the under the rainbow. So they do,
and they're running and running, and then they eventually find
Seamus's camper van and Kyle and his grandfather sneak inside
and take back Kyle's lucky coin, but not.

Speaker 3 (01:01:16):
All of the gold, because that would be you have
they have to earn the gold. I was like, I
don't think Seamus earned the gold. No, and that's well whatever, whatever. No,
for some reason, Kyle is right in this situation.

Speaker 2 (01:01:32):
Kyle is right. Well, yeah, we learned that Seamus the
whole reason that he stole Kyle's coin was that he's
collecting all the lucky coins from all the leprechauns across
America so that he can become the king of the Leprechauns.

Speaker 3 (01:01:46):
And based on what we've seen, because we are conflating
Leprechauns and Ireland, I'm like, so he's sort of like,
I'm going to be the k King of Ireland Ireland,
which to my understanding, and again I'm not super tapped
into Irish history. I think that the reason they're going
into ancient history and the Teltan Games is because he's

(01:02:09):
trying to recapture an ancient version of Ireland question mark.
But again, it is confusing that they do that. It
feels like kind of obvious gating that they're doing that
because the relevant parts of Irish culture that we're talking
about to the plot, it seems like Kyle's grandfather immigrated

(01:02:30):
from Ireland, possibly around the time that Ireland gained independence,
possibly during the time of the potato fan man. That
history isn't interfaced with because that is too challenging to colonialism.
I think. I think that's why they go into ancient history,
because they don't want to talk about English colonization anymore

(01:02:55):
than they want to talk about American colonization. That's my guess.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Yeah, no, I I can see it. Yeah, I'm also
guessing that that's why they're like, yeah, Riley O'Reilly invented
the potato chip because Ireland equals potatoes. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:03:12):
I do think that that is as far as they're
thinking about it, honestly for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:03:16):
Okay, so they find Kyle's lucky coin again, but Seamus
McTiernan uses his fair Darrig magic to sense that something
is wrong, and he appears and kidnaps Riley O'Reilly, and
then Kyle remembers that Seamus can't say no to a bet,

(01:03:37):
something that was planted earlier in the movie. So Kyle
challenges Seamus, saying, if I beat you at sports, you
have to let my grandfather and I go, and I
get to keep my lucky coin.

Speaker 3 (01:03:53):
And then he really raises the steaks for seemingly no
reason at all and says, yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 2 (01:04:01):
Well, okay, so they play sports, but oh no, it's
not you know, basketball and baseball and football like Kyle
was expecting. Seamus transports Kyle and Russell maybe to Ireland.
I'm not sure where they are, but they're on a
field where they play the Charlton Games, which again had

(01:04:22):
to look up, but it's a series of games and
sporting events similar to but pre dates the Greek Olympics
by over a thousand years. And then I started to
do a deep dive on these games and I was like, focus, Caitlin,
it's really interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:04:38):
Yeah, it is is. I'd never heard of these before,
nor I.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
So they start doing the various kind of sporting events
such as the sport of hurling. They're also heaving around
boulders and chariot wheels, and they're wrestling and Kyle's team
and Seamus's teams and up tying, and Seamus was like, well,
the bet was that you would beat me, and you

(01:05:06):
didn't beat me because we tied. So Kyle has to
hand over his lucky coin. But then he's like, well
wait a minute. What if if I beat you at
basketball without my luck and my lucky coin, I get
to get my luck back, and you have to go
to the land of my forefathers, the shores of Eerie

(01:05:28):
for all of eternity. And if I lose. I think
these are the stakes you were talking about, I will
be your slave, he says.

Speaker 3 (01:05:37):
And why the hell does he raise the stakes in
that way that is not asked of him? He just says,
here are the stakes. I'm willing to Like, it's so weird.
I know that, like I would say the stakes are
appropriately high before he says that, it's just I don't

(01:05:59):
have an xation for it. I just thought it was
very weird that the stakes were raised so severely.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
I guess he's trying to save his grandpa, because yeah,
But also it's just like, why did he suggest that?
I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:06:15):
I would have suggested something far less consequential, right, But
Kyle is so confident in his basketball skills that he
has been told he doesn't have that he would be
willing to raise the stakes in that way.

Speaker 2 (01:06:27):
He's risking it all.

Speaker 3 (01:06:29):
I was confused. I was confused, But the stakes were
raised regardless of how I feel.

Speaker 2 (01:06:35):
This is true and actually that's really good storytelling. So yeah,
there you go, there you go. Okay, so Seamus transports
them to the middle of Kyle and Russell's the biggest
game yet it.

Speaker 3 (01:06:48):
Is so well because the Telton games I thought was
the big game, but there was bigger games to be had.
There's a still somehow another game, and now Riley O'Reilly
is chained a basketball.

Speaker 2 (01:07:00):
Who yes, yeah, and theoretically everyone everyone can see him
to everyone can see him, no one reacts, and when
they're playing against Shamus, the referee.

Speaker 3 (01:07:12):
Like again, it feels like a studio note of like,
well they wouldn't just let Ryan Merriman play basketball, I
guess a forty year old, and so they call it
out for some reason where I think again, it's like
Russell is tasked with having to like spackle the plot
where he's like, wait, you're not just gonna let us
play against a forty year old and the referee is

(01:07:33):
like trunk whatever, then lets him play against an angry.

Speaker 2 (01:07:40):
Forty year old who becomes at one point really like
ghoulish looking. He becomes this like Leprechaun monster. But don't
worry it has absolutely no consequences or effect on the plot. No,
and it happens right before Russell scores the winning basket,
although before that they're playing in their Kyle's team is losing,

(01:08:01):
and then he has to realize that actually, luck doesn't
come from a lucky coin, it comes from your heart.
Or maybe luck is confidence and confidence comes from your heart.

Speaker 3 (01:08:15):
Or there's a number of possible answers. There's an you
can really kind of choose your own adventure as to
what the ending means. Also, we randomly see Russell's dad.
Russell's dad is presented as like this big I feel
like he's presented as a reveal, even though we've been
told he exists many times. No, we see him.

Speaker 2 (01:08:34):
Earlier in the like we see him pretty early on
in the movie.

Speaker 3 (01:08:37):
Yeah, okay, we do see it because he's talked about
a lot, because Russell's always like my dad, my dad,
my dad, And you're like, okay, this is going to
be another person of call our best friend whose family
we never meet. I guess we technically meet his family.
But also it's just weird that Bonnie and Russell. You
know this happens, but I just thought it was weird
that they were both like, here's their dad, and because

(01:09:01):
this story is like pretty aggressively disinterested in women and
specifically mothers, because it's like, to me, Kyle's mother is
very important until the grandfather's introduced, and then she all
but disappears from the movie for sure. It was like
they just were waiting for it to get to a
point where it could be about fathers and sons, and
then they kind of do away with her, like.

Speaker 2 (01:09:23):
This movie could easily write out the grandpa character and
just just have Kyle's mom take on that role.

Speaker 3 (01:09:30):
Well, but then how are there be a potato chip factory.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
Caitlin, Well, yeah, and that's a hugely important part of
the stories.

Speaker 3 (01:09:38):
I'm guessing that that's a big reason stand that's corrected. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:09:43):
Also, I was wondering, like, so my best guess about like, Okay,
we only meet Russell and Bonnie's dads, but not their
mom's because both of those characters, Bonnie and Russell have
tiny little arcs, but they're both about basketball, and I
think the movie was just like, well, okay, they both

(01:10:04):
like basketball, and so their dad has to be involved
because sports and basketball are boy things. Even though Bonnie
wants to play bad. So like, I don't know, I
don't know the logic behind any of this, but it
is messy and ridiculous. Yeah, Okay, The point is Kyle's
team at the last minute wins the big game to

(01:10:28):
end all big games, which means that Kyle takes back
his lucky coin and Seamus is cast away not to
era like Seamus Things, which of course is the name
of Ireland in the Irish language.

Speaker 3 (01:10:46):
Yes, which is I didn't think was clearly explained. No,
I had to look it up, not that it's And
again it's like it's interesting because there are certain movies
we just talked about Daughters of the Dust recently that
is like it is a directorial choice and intention to
not explain a culture because it is not someone's job

(01:11:09):
to explain their culture to you. But I don't think
that really plays here, because no, this whole movie has
been presenting very broad Irish stereotypes and also still explaining them.
So then to present an actual fact and not tell
us what it means is weird.

Speaker 2 (01:11:25):
Weird And also you like, consider the audience, this is
young people watching it. Yeah, it's like clearly like sort
of an educational intention with this movie, but they're not
correctly educating the audience. No, Okay, so a little trick
because Kyle is a leprechaun and leprecauns love little tricks.
He says, I didn't mean Era, I meant Eerie aka

(01:11:49):
the shores of Lake Erie aka Cleveland, Ohio. Oh my god,
because Dad, because Kyle's dad is famously from Cleveland. Yeah,
there's the small beat with Bonnie and her dad, who
is always pressuring her to overachieve. But Bonnie's whole thing
is she actually wants to play basketball. And because a

(01:12:10):
white man told Bonnie's dad that he should let her
play basketball, He's like, Okay.

Speaker 3 (01:12:16):
Sounds great because it turns out this is what she's Yeah,
fixed it there. And then Riley r Is like and
that's kind of the magic of America, isn't it?

Speaker 2 (01:12:24):
And You're like, right, right, right, And then the movie
ends with the Heritage Day assembly where Kyle does Irish
step dancing because he's fully embracing his Irish heritage.

Speaker 3 (01:12:38):
Now, poor Ryan Merriman, I'm like, did they give him
even one minute of training? He looks awful, he looks terrible.

Speaker 2 (01:12:46):
Doesn't appear to be doing it. Well, and then he
leads the crowd in song. Like you said, Jamie, They're
singing this land is your island, this line is Mineland,
and it's all very yay America.

Speaker 3 (01:13:02):
The end, Yeah, it's it's and again like we could
get into and there's I believe a lot of good
episodes of cool people who did cool stuff about this,
like the history of the song this land is Your
Land and Woody Guthrie is far more nuanced than the
very jingoistic way it's presented here. But I don't think
it's intended to I don't think it's put here for

(01:13:23):
the sake of nuance. I think it's just like America
is all about, uh, whatever this movie was. And you're like, right, yeah, totally.

Speaker 2 (01:13:37):
Well, let's take a quick break and then we'll come
back for more.

Speaker 3 (01:13:51):
And we're back and we're back.

Speaker 2 (01:13:53):
Okay, we've already talked about a lot of the things. Yeah, yeah,
I mean, And the big thing with this movie is
that it clearly wants to present this idea of like, Wow,
America is great because it's so culturally diverse and it's

(01:14:14):
a melting pot and all of our cultural differences from
all of our heritages make it awesome.

Speaker 3 (01:14:21):
But while avoiding all of the parts of American history
that did not support that. It's so it's like, obviously
it's like bad for kids to be receiving this messaging
in the way that it's bad when kids receive that
messaging at school, which the message itself the message of

(01:14:41):
tolerance and the message of like it is a positive
thing to be connected with your heritage and to know
and understand it and to feel comfortable sharing it with
other people. That is true? Is it true that you know,
at different points in history there have been opportunities for

(01:15:02):
immigrant communities that were not possible elsewhere. Sure, but it's
just so clearly American propaganda that like there's no nuance
to what is being said. So it's frustrating. It undercuts
what I think is like kind of a nice message,
which is like a connection to your native heritage is

(01:15:22):
a positive thing, right, which is like yeah, but it's
also tying that in with I mean, like we've talked
about on the show a lot, and what is like
very clear here is just like, but on top of
your native heritage, you're also an American capitalist and you

(01:15:43):
love America, don't you. And there's nothing wrong with America.
All we do is play baseball and work really hard
and there's no I mean, there's a moment with Kyle
and his parents at the beginning where it's like almost
presented as a joke where he asks if he's if
they're indigenous. He's just throwing out random cultures of like
are we this?

Speaker 5 (01:16:02):
Are we this?

Speaker 3 (01:16:02):
Are we this? And they're like, no, I don't, of
course we're not indigenous. You know, Like there are moments
where colonialism is acknowledged, right referenced, but I guess referenced
is the word, but not acknowledged.

Speaker 2 (01:16:18):
The way indigenouity in this movie is handled is very bizarre.
I have a whole spill about this. It f you'll
indulge me, please. So opening scene of the movie is
Kyle's dream. We're in the auditorium. We see like different
people from different cultural backgrounds who are never characters that

(01:16:41):
we meet never never. The stage features flags from around
the world, including the flag of Israel, the genocidal fake
country of Israel. There's the voice over talking about, oh,
celebrating our cultural differences. We see a native person dancing
on stage. They're in regalia. They're doing what appears to

(01:17:04):
be a traditional Native dance. I am unable to say
how authentic any of this is, right, I don't know
for sure either way. Again, another character, well, I wouldn't
even call him a character, Like, we don't meet this,
but they're not a character, you know, we know nothing
about them. Yeah, And then again the way indigenouity in
this movie is either largely ignored or referenced in very

(01:17:28):
bizarro interactions. The next one is, like you were just
talking about Kyle asking his parents where they immigrated from.
He says, everyone's family comes from somewhere else if you
go far back enough, unless we're Indians meaning native people, right.

Speaker 3 (01:17:44):
Which is referencing that, like native people were on this
land before. But there's no effort to be like I mean,
it's just that like obfuscation of like and then what
happened because this is a movie or more importantly, a
media company that is ever going to acknowledge colonialism or

(01:18:07):
colonial genocide exactly. And then the dad is like, no,
I don't, We're from Cleveland.

Speaker 2 (01:18:14):
We're from Cleveland, right. A little bit before that, one
of the many times Bonnie goes up to Kyle to
ask him about his heritage. And what he's gonna do
for the Heritage Day Assembly, and she says America is
a nation of immigrants. Everyone's ancestors came from another country,
which again not true for people indigenous to Turtle.

Speaker 3 (01:18:35):
Island, right. I mean it's oversimplified, like you see what
she's saying. But it's what frustrates me more there is
that if this were a normal human interaction, she would
then be talking about her family exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:18:48):
She's like, for example, my family's from x y Z
place we don't know. She doesn't offer any information, and
then Russell responds, I'm part Cherokee, which number one one
contradicts what Bonnie just said, but he says it in
such a way where it seems like he's supporting Bonnie's statement.
So it's either weird acting or.

Speaker 3 (01:19:08):
Just it's not the kid's fault.

Speaker 2 (01:19:10):
It's bad writing.

Speaker 3 (01:19:12):
It's bad writing. I think that it's genuinely like a
writer not even thinking hard enough to realize that that's
a contradictory statement for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:19:20):
And then if Russell is Afro Indigenous, we learn nothing
more about that part of his identity because.

Speaker 3 (01:19:27):
We learn that he is part Cherochy and he's it's
implied he's descended from enslaved people, right sol.

Speaker 2 (01:19:34):
But that's the point, Like there's no attention or care
about any character's cultural heritage or ethnic heritage except for
the white kid whose family's from Ireland.

Speaker 3 (01:19:48):
And which is like, you know, Irish heritage valid, great,
love it, We've got it, we love it. But it
is it is glaring that in this like fairly diverse
cast of kids that it's only the white kid who's
I feel like and this is not to put down

(01:20:10):
my Irish brethren, but it is sort of present the
way that the very real oppression of Irish people, which
again is it's not really said who why things were hard?
And then we came to America? Who was oppressing us?
Why America? Like you know, all of these questions that
there are clear answers for, but that it's presented that

(01:20:32):
like Irish people are uniquely oppressed in a way that
is just like, no, this is this is how colonial
oppression works. You know, it's not explained what the oppression
is and it's sort of presented as like and this
is the only time that's ever happened, which again is like,

(01:20:54):
you know, this movie is like obviously a bad educational
tool if that's what it's supposed to be, which I
don't think it is. But but it's just like, okay,
if we're acknowledging that Russell's ancestors were enslaved, like we
know nothing about Bonnie's ancestors. Like, it's just I think
it presents this weird form of in the way that

(01:21:16):
I think Irish culture is sometimes sort of used as
a way of being like, well, white people have been
oppressed too, and you're like okay, like okay, but that
but but it's I feel like it's sometimes used as
a way to obvious gate how disproportionately non white cultures
are oppressed by white cultures, right, So it just feels

(01:21:38):
like I'm not opposed to the premise. Well, I don't
even know if that's true. I'm not opposed to the
premise of like acknowledging oppression of the Irish, which by
the way, is not a completely white culture, but like,
I'm not opposed to that, but it is weird to
do it in the framing device of a heritage fair
and not acknowledge any other heritage. Not only not acknowledge

(01:22:01):
any other heritage, but not acknowledge any other culture's oppression.

Speaker 2 (01:22:07):
Right, except for in very passing again Bizarrow lines of
dialogue when Yah Russell says, well, at least the Irish
people were paid. Just mind boggling.

Speaker 3 (01:22:19):
I think it sucks that they made a kid say that,
I know.

Speaker 2 (01:22:23):
And then you have Bonnie Lopez, who we can presume
because we have to presume because the movie doesn't give
us any more information, but we could potentially presume that
she's Latina based on her last name and her father
who we meet at the end.

Speaker 3 (01:22:42):
It seems like she is like a first generation American,
but that's all we know, and we only know that
at the very end. And I think that they're also
kind of trafficking in some cultural stereotypes around immigrant parents
there too, because Bonnie is there's a lot of pressure
on her to go to med school, there's a lot
of pressure on her to excel. She kind of implies

(01:23:04):
it multiple points in the movie that like if she
doesn't do well in school, her parents are going to
be or her dad specifically is going to be very
upset with her, which is, you know, like just a
stereotype around immigrant parents in the US writ large for sure,
that is presented with absolutely no nuance because we don't
know anything about her family. It's like a shock. I

(01:23:27):
was honestly shocked we met her father at all.

Speaker 2 (01:23:29):
Same Yeah, and he's truly on screen for fifteen seconds
at the very end of the movie.

Speaker 3 (01:23:34):
And what I found to be ultimately a kind of
depressing interaction because first of all, the movie does not
tell us that Bonnie actually wants to play basketball, and
then at the end she gets to, but it's only
sort of through deception.

Speaker 2 (01:23:49):
Well, yeah, it's because Riley O'Reilly is like, hey, Bonnie's dad,
you need to let her play so that she can
get an internship or a scholarship or whatever my potato factory.
So let her play basketball.

Speaker 3 (01:24:04):
And then he's like, oh, great, okay, I'll let her
do that now. And then Bonnie says whatever you say, dad,
and you're like, ooh, that's bleak like that. You know,
She's like, well, I don't think that relationship was improved
at all, So yeah, I don't know's there's also a
lot of references to like American individualism and you know,

(01:24:26):
implying that, and I think that this is like again
where like the heritage messaging gets a little muddled, is
like it. I think there's a specific line of dialogue
that I have so many notes, I can't find it.
But there's a specific line of dialogue that like references
where it's like and it is a sort of satirical
line of dialogue because it's before we find out he's
Irish the reveal, but that like America is a place

(01:24:50):
where you can really be an individual who cares about
your heritage. I think it's something that his dad says, yeah,
and so I think so. But I don't think that
the movie really does a lot to push back on
the fact that it's very possible to be an individual
in other cultures. It's sort of presented as like America
is the only place you can be a distinct individual,

(01:25:11):
and other cultures are so all consuming that if you
engage with them even a little, you will shrink a
foot or sprout a beard, or like begin dancing uncontrollably,
and so like being American is presented as the norm and.

Speaker 2 (01:25:28):
The cure to your leprechaun disease.

Speaker 3 (01:25:32):
Yeah. So yeah, there's just like this is ultimately in
a movie that is supposed to be about Ireland, it
is way more about America, yes, and about American understanding
of other cultures, and I think it is kind of
like an interesting case study there because it's like like
most like American propagandistic systems, like it's only interested in

(01:25:57):
presenting broad stereotypes and saying we're fine with this, but
ultimately you're American, right, which is why I think part
of why and also just because I assume this movie
was made in forty five minutes, why the actual facts
about Irish culture are? You know, there are facts there,
there's other facts sort of half there, and then there's

(01:26:21):
just broad stereotypes presented all alongside each other. Really hard
to distinguish, especially if you're a kid watching this, distinguishing
what's real and what isn't sure because it is like
being Irish means you could be a leprechaun. That was
sort of my takeaway. It's not really pushedback on that.
There's just Irish people.

Speaker 2 (01:26:39):
Right, yeah, because I think every well, okay, it seems
as though Riley O'Reilly has hired nothing but Irish expats
slash immigrants.

Speaker 3 (01:26:52):
To work in his potato factory, right, which does make
all Irish people seem deceptive and evil. Also not a
great vibe, but.

Speaker 2 (01:26:59):
It's also like, well, are they also leprechaun? Like the
movie again, the world building is.

Speaker 3 (01:27:04):
We have no idea. I'm I think it is implied
via Seamus that any Irish person has the ability to
become a Leprechaun. And it also kind of gets a
little bit eugenicsy because they're like, oh, well, Kyle's not
full Irish, so he can only become half Leprechaun. And
you're like, I'm not loving the how Matthey we're getting

(01:27:27):
with this. It's again, this is nothing the movie is
intending to do. The movie is just I think, intending
to come out on time. But it is interesting the
kind of crutches they use to accomplish that. I guess I.

Speaker 2 (01:27:44):
Wonder if there were like white children in two thousand
and one, and there were on there were two of
them who saw this movie and perhaps felt seen by
the riot by the Kyle character not knowing and like
being curious about his cultural identity and heritage but not

(01:28:09):
really knowing anything about it.

Speaker 3 (01:28:10):
But other than that, I think that that's what the
movie ultimately kind of does that felt unique to me,
was acknowledged. This kind of I think pretty common but
not often acknowledged truth that like, and I think that
that is like a tool of colonialism is if you
are completely you know, if you as a white, a

(01:28:32):
white American, are completely estranged from your culture of origin
and encouraged to believe that you are just American, you
are therefore encouraged to believe that America belongs to you.
So I think it is like it is a tool
of colonialism to estrange anyone from their culture. But it's
kind of like this different pernicious thing with white cultures specifically.

Speaker 2 (01:28:55):
Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 3 (01:28:56):
And also this movie doesn't care about women, obvious, they
said women suck and they're boring Bonnie, Bonnie. I'm curious.
It did remind me a bit about how I mean,
because Disney Channel dcoms very often have a little romance,
to the point where it felt curious that the what

(01:29:19):
I think would ordinarily be a romance between Kyle and
Bonnie was not expanded upon a little more. And I wonder,
I don't know, I just I'm putting that out there
because there is you know, the further you go back
in time, the more resistance there is to showing an
interracial romantic interest. And I can't think of a ton

(01:29:39):
of d cooms where that happens. I'm not stating that
that's what's happening here. It also could just be that
the movie is a mess, but I did want to
shut that out. And also that Bonnie, as with any
many women characters, seems to only care about what happens
to Kyle. She has no life outside. The one thing

(01:30:01):
we know about her is that she's very smart.

Speaker 2 (01:30:05):
She's in charge of a lot of extracurricular clubs.

Speaker 3 (01:30:08):
But it doesn't appear that she has any friends because
I wouldn't for much of the movie describe her and
Kyle as friends, right. It seems like they're kind there's
kind of an antagonistic relationship, but we don't really see
her talk to anybody else. She sort of just walks
out of the ether and it's like, Kyle, are you
irish or not?

Speaker 2 (01:30:26):
Her whole function in the story, yeah, is to support
Kyle's journey that he's going.

Speaker 3 (01:30:32):
Journey to being irish, which is like so silly, And
again it just there are small, as with most of
these movies, small modifications to the story that include Bonnie
being like, for example, like it still can be Kyle's story,
but like how would it not help the story for

(01:30:52):
her to say, like, for example, this is my connection
to my culture, and I find it very affirming. It's
very important to me. I like blah blah blah, get
specific about it that helps tell the story. So it
just feels like this weird void where like, you know,
to speculate, a white writer doesn't know anything about any

(01:31:15):
cultures that aren't their own and didn't even bother to
research it for the sake of this character. Right, same
goes for Russell, really any character, and also frankly the
same goes for Kyle because there's really not a lot
of Irish information in the story. There's a lot of stuff, just.

Speaker 2 (01:31:36):
A lot of either conflation or like things that your
average American associates with Irish cultures, such as leprechauns, pots
of gold at the end of a rainbow, the color green,
Like the amount of green in the production design in
this movie is astonishing.

Speaker 3 (01:31:57):
Which I mean again, this is like in the same
way that Dcom's had like a Hanuka movie Capital h
this is these Saint Patrick's Day movie, I think just
because they didn't have one, and so it feels very
rushy and very like what are people like it's it's
more presenting the commercial holiday versus anything else, because I mean,

(01:32:19):
and there is you know, the leprechauns are a bit
of Irish folklore. In American media, they're presented it seems
like pretty incorrectly. I did a little bit of did
you do some leprechaun research? A little bit. They're they're
wearing red most of the time. They're not even usually
wearing green.

Speaker 2 (01:32:38):
This is correct. I did a little bit of research,
and I mean suffice it to say that everything we
see a lot of what we see in this movie
is either it's just like a home a stereotype, or
an oversimplification of it, or just like flat out incorrect.
I forgot to say that part of my just general

(01:32:59):
history with Irish culture in Ireland is that I also
have been to Ireland a couple of times, mostly to
do comedy and.

Speaker 3 (01:33:07):
To go to see Titanic related things.

Speaker 2 (01:33:11):
Because I went to Northern Ireland, which I know is
a different country than Ireland, just so listeners know that
I know their distinction. I went to Belfast to visit
the Titanic Museum, of course, but also when I was
in Dublin, I went to the National Leprechaun Museum of Ireland.

(01:33:32):
And I will say that I forgot everything I learned
because it was seven years ago. Okay, so I don't
really didn't really retain, but I remember learning a lot
about Irish folklore, folklore specific to leprechauns, how it's almost
always misrepresented in popular media. So yeah, I found it

(01:33:52):
very interesting. Yeah again, this movie's representation of leprechauns. You know,
it's I would say, not super accurate, safety say.

Speaker 3 (01:34:04):
And it's like again, it's just it's it's the disney
fied version of it, but like also something even weirder
than that, and I can't really under I don't understand
what the hell's going on. Dcoms were Look say what
you will, because most of them are bad, but there
is a lawlessness to a dcom that I find very

(01:34:26):
nostalgically appealing, where like they were doing whatever, oh, they
were doing whatever and just throwing They said, here's your slop, kids,
and we were and we were loving them.

Speaker 2 (01:34:37):
Here's your here's the spaghetti slash weird glass noodle dish
that's surrounded by romaine lettuce and an enormous bowl. Throw
it against the wall and see what sticks.

Speaker 3 (01:34:48):
Eat up, bitch, and like we and I was eating up.
I was slurping it up and loving it, and so
was acclaimed genius Ryan Coogler. So look, I'm glad that
mister Kogler brought this to our attention. I would be
really curious how he felt on a rewatch. I did

(01:35:11):
want to just share because we've got to wrap up,
but I just want to share. I read an interview
with the screenwriter that was like refreshingly honest. I believe
Andrew Price is his name. This was an interview online
from a while ago where he basically admits he did
no research. So he's asked the movie centers on heritage.

(01:35:32):
Is that an aspect of life you feel strongly about?
And he says I used his search for heritage as
a jumping off point for what I hoped to be
a more personal story. After reading my first draft, my
wife kept trying to convince me I was writing about
a boy discovering and coming to terms with being gay.
I was more interested in a boy who has to
rediscover himself. Since I'm not a leprechaun, I needed defend.

(01:35:55):
This is such a weird interview. He's like it's not
about being gay. I'm not a laprechaun. Since I'm not
a leprechaun, I needed to find something about Kyle that
I could relate to and make personal. Not to harp
on my own life experience, but for me, high school
was very easy, but college was like an ice bath.
I wanted Kyle to have those personal feelings of security

(01:36:17):
followed by confusion, alienation, and fear culminating in a newfound
confidence and joy. So I think that was his way
of saying, I do not feel strongly about heritage at all.
I'm not gay and I'm not a laprechaun, and so
that's interesting. A follow up question, I love the character
detail that Riley O'Reilly invented potato chips. How much research

(01:36:40):
into Irish history and folklore did you do? The writer replies,
I did a little research into the culture, read books
and watched some Irish dancing, as well as ate some
of the food. However, I didn't want to feel hemmed
in by mythology and wanted my story to come from
my own imagination. I use what I read as color,
but didn't go too deeply in the actual folklore. So

(01:37:02):
if there was any question, he was like, I read
a book and I ate a piece of cabbage and
I watched River Dance, and then I was kind of like,
I get it. And then he just freeform jazzed all
over Ireland since I'm not a leprechaun, which I think
is his way of saying, since I'm not Irish, since
I'm not a leprecaun. So it's just like I don't know,

(01:37:27):
I don't know, and then there and then the interview
ends like have you written another movie since this? And
he's like, no, no one wants them for some reason.
It's funny. It's funny. Men.

Speaker 2 (01:37:43):
In my research about leprechauns, I learned that listeners from
Ireland please share your experience with this, but I learned
that a not insignificant number of Irish people believe in

(01:38:05):
leprechauns currently or believe they once existed in the past.

Speaker 3 (01:38:09):
Okay, so Irish listeners sound off, Yeah, is this is
this accurate?

Speaker 5 (01:38:14):
Are we?

Speaker 3 (01:38:14):
Yeah? And and if you do believe in leprechauns, tell
us I'm I'm open. I'm open to being swayed. I
believe in all sorts of shit.

Speaker 2 (01:38:25):
Yeah, we we you know, many of us believe in
I'm a Taurus, therefore I'm I'm stubborn, and also I
like to lie down a lot on a comfy bed.

Speaker 3 (01:38:37):
It's true, it's true. I've seen it, so you know that.
So it doesn't pass the Bachdel test, and I wouldn't
even say it comes close. There is one exchange that
I noticed between women that was like a teacher. That's
like the science teacher talking to a student that randomly

(01:38:59):
gets a name, and we learned about magnets and that
becomes relevant later. So I would have been able, I
would have given it a pass as a relevant exchange
of dialogue. But we don't know what the teacher's name is.

Speaker 2 (01:39:10):
So and I entirely forgot about that conversation. So if
it's not a very memorable moment it was, Yeah, I'm
not too sure about that.

Speaker 3 (01:39:19):
It's a nice try. I was gonna say nice try,
but obviously they were trying.

Speaker 2 (01:39:24):
Not a try at all. Yeah, Like I mean Kyle's mom,
who does have a name. Kate and Bonnie will appear
here and there throughout the story. Sometimes there will be
like plot relevant they.

Speaker 3 (01:39:37):
Say that they're both important characters.

Speaker 2 (01:39:39):
They are, but then they'll also get jettisoned out of
the main action of the story for large swaths of it.

Speaker 3 (01:39:47):
So yes, not doing a.

Speaker 2 (01:39:49):
Great job there. Yeah, the movie does not pass the
Bechdel test. What about our nipple scale though, our scale, god,
our scale where we rate the movie zero to five
nipples based on examining it through an intersectional feminist lens.
I'm gonna give it a half nipple, Like it's not
I'm kind of maybe a nipple. I don't know, I'm gonna.

Speaker 3 (01:40:11):
Give it one because women are in it.

Speaker 2 (01:40:16):
Right, women are in it, and it's trying to say
something about being proud of your cultural heritage, but it's
also saying a lot about how but if you're American,
that's the most important thing, and go, go, go America
America number one.

Speaker 3 (01:40:33):
I be very curious if that is something that appeared
in the first draft, or if that was like a
disneyfied element. I'm always very curious about how these because
like media for children is so deliberate in that way, right.
I would love to see a second interview with this
writer where he's like, first of all, I'm not a leprechaun.

Speaker 2 (01:40:48):
Second of all, Second of all, college was really hard that.

Speaker 3 (01:40:54):
That interview is so iconic to me, where it was
like a pretty long interview and I'm like, this guy
is like the lights are not on. Amazing that he
has a produced screenwriting credit and like three women in
history do yeah, awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:41:12):
Bleak.

Speaker 2 (01:41:13):
Anyways, Yeah, so one nipple, uh, you know all the
things we talked about, and I will give my nipple
two leprechauns.

Speaker 3 (01:41:24):
I'm gonna give it one nipple and I'm gonna give
the nipple to I think just the plot point that
the grandfather Leprechaun is shackled to a basketball hoop, that
is like such a funny detail that clearly no one
in the movie knows what to do with. We cannot
decide if we can actually see him or not. Sometimes
we can. Sometimes the entire gymnasium decides this game is

(01:41:49):
so important that it doesn't matter if there's an old
man shackled to the away teams basketball hoop or not.
And that is very Santa University coded to me. I
really appreciated that that They're like, we don't know what
to do with it, so it just is take it
or leave it, and I'm taking it. No, I'm taking it.

(01:42:11):
I'm claiming it.

Speaker 2 (01:42:12):
It's a very brave storytelling choice.

Speaker 3 (01:42:14):
Yes, well, there you have it.

Speaker 2 (01:42:17):
Listeners for more movies that are about Ireland slash Irish
people slash maybe leprechauns. Yeah, refer to our Matreon this
month because we're covering a few more.

Speaker 3 (01:42:33):
Yes, please join us in celebrating. Well, it depends. We're
going to give you a charcutery board. If you're already
a matron, you already know. We're doing both movies written
and directed by Irish artists and movies that are about
Ireland and may or may not do better than the
movie we discussed today. But once again, well, actually I

(01:42:56):
guess I'm giving I'm going to take back my nipple
from Bonnie, Sorry Bonnie and give it to Ryan Coogler. Ohay,
this episode possible. Thank you for making interviews fun to watch.
And we've already covered Sinners on the show, so you
can listen to that. We've covered black Panthers, so plenty
of Coogler on the pod. You can yeah find us

(01:43:16):
over on the Matreon or on Instagram. And with that,
shall we go to the end of the rainbow and
then engage in ancient warfare?

Speaker 2 (01:43:29):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (01:43:30):
Awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:43:31):
Bye, Okay Bye.

Speaker 3 (01:43:35):
The Bechdel Cast is a production of iHeartMedia, hosted and
produced by Me, Jamie Loftus and.

Speaker 2 (01:43:41):
Me Caitlyn Dorante. The podcast is also produced by Sophie Lichtermann.

Speaker 3 (01:43:46):
And edited by Caitlyn Durrante. Ever Heard of Them? That's Me?

Speaker 2 (01:43:50):
And our logo and merch and all of our artwork,
in fact are designed by Jamie Loftus, Ever heard of her?

Speaker 3 (01:43:57):
Oh My God? And our theme song, by the way,
was composed by Mike Kaplan with vocals by Katherine Voskrasinski.
Iconic and especial thanks to the one and only Aristotle Ascevedo.

Speaker 2 (01:44:09):
For more information about the podcast, please visit linktree slash
Spectelcast