January 16, 2026 • 53 mins
Join Sandra to explore the ‘Block Universe’ where no one really dies. Hear incredible stories from Dr. Leo Ruickbie’s Bigelow Contest where he won 3rd place for his essay revealing that the past is still alive.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
And you're here.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Thanks for choosing the iHeartRadio and Coast to Ghost Day
and Paranormal Podcast Network. Your quest for podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural,
and the unexplained ends here. They invite you to enjoy
all our shows we have on this network, and right now,
let's start with Chase of the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and
opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions
only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast
to Coast am employees of Premiere Networks, or their sponsors
and associates. We would like to encourage you to do
(00:42):
your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Hi.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
I'm Sandra Champlain. For over twenty five years, I've been
on a journey to prove the existence of life after death.
On each episodisode, we'll discuss the reasons we now know
that our loved ones have survived physical death and so
will we. Welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. It is
(01:11):
a rainy, dreary day where I am and I had
set aside today for cleaning the house, but the truth
is I don't want to, so I thought, I need
to do something productive, and I thought, let's record another episode.
You may just remember recently we took a deep dive
into the incredible work of doctor Pym van Lommel, who
(01:35):
was the second prize winner of the Bigelow Institute for
Consciousness Studies Essay contest. We talked about the medical proof,
the flatlined brains, the DNA antennas, that our loved ones
and our consciousness is in the cloud, all leading to
the fact that we survive physical death. And then back
(01:56):
on episode two forty four, we had covered the first
prize winner, doctor Jeffrey Mishlove, who gave us historical and
evidence through parapsychology for the continuity of life after life.
So today, as I'm avoiding cleaning, I thought, is my
fabulous listener just as curious as I am about winner
(02:17):
number three? So if you don't mind, I really feel
like diving right back into the Bigelow Papers and introducing
you to third prize winner, the man who took home
one hundred and fifty thousand dollars for his evidence. His
name is doctor Leo Rugby. This is a different kind
of essay, but it is something that I do think
(02:39):
will touch the grieving heart, as I know. That's why
many come to our show. When we think about the afterlife,
the common questions are where are they? Can I still
communicate with them? We may look up at the sky
think of them beyond the clouds, or we imagine them
and the dimension far far away. It does feel like
(03:00):
our loved ones are far from us, but Doctor Rugby
asks a different question. He doesn't ask where they are,
he asks when they are. So his third prize winning
essay is titled the Ghost in the Time Machine, And
in this episode, we're going to look at the evidence
that suggests that our loved ones aren't gone, they are
(03:23):
just living in a different time. And we're going to
look at the moments where they can break the rules
of time and come back to us. So today we're
going to hear some incredible stories of love crossing that
great divide. We're going to hear the famous stories of
the Pollock Twins, two little girls who died in the
tragedy who the belief is they've been reborn to the
(03:46):
same parents because they remembered their old toys and had
their old scars. We'll talk about crisis apparitions, those moments
when a loved one appears at the foot of the
bed to say goodbye at the exact moment they pass away,
proving that their first thought upon leaving the earth was you.
And we'll talk about the welcome committee, the visions of
(04:09):
deceased relatives who have come to hold our hands when
it is our turn to go. But first we have
to understand this idea of the time machine. Doctor Rugby
argues that the biggest mistake we make is thinking that
the past is dead and gone. When we think about
nineteen ninety five or twenty ten or last week, these
(04:31):
are deleted scenes from our minds. But modern physics and
doctor Rugby's research suggests that that isn't true. His essay
begins with the story we all Know a Christmas Carol
by Charles Dickens. Remember Ebenezer Scrooge, He visited the ghost
of Christmas past. The ghost takes his hand, the bedroom
(04:54):
wall dissolves, and suddenly they are standing in a snowy village.
From Scrooge's childlihood, Scrooge sees his old school, He sees
his childhood friends laughing. He sees himself as a young boy, now,
we usually call this a ghost story, but doctor Rugby
points out something interesting. This isn't a ghost story. This
(05:16):
is a time travel story. Scrooge traveled back in time,
and what did he find. He found that the past
was still there. The people were still alive, the laughter
was still ringing in the air. They weren't dead, They
were just happening at a different point on the timeline.
(05:36):
Doctor Rugby suggests that the afterlife works exactly like this.
Let me explain. In his essay, he discusses a concept
in physics called the block universe. Einstein even believed in this.
It's the idea that the past, present, and future all
exist simultaneously. Like a loaf of bread. We are just
(06:02):
a slice moving through it. But just because you haven't
eaten the first slice of bread, it doesn't mean the
first slice never existed. It's still there at the beginning
of the loaf. This means that the moments you had
with your loved ones, the holidays, the hugs, the vacations,
(06:23):
the conversations, they aren't memories fading in your brain. They
are permanent fixtures in the universe. They still exist and
the people in them still exist. To prove that we
can actually visit the past. Doctor Rugby shares one of
the most famous and most well documented cases in history.
(06:44):
It's a story about a sunny afternoon in a garden.
It's known as the Moberly Jordain incident. The year was
nineteen oh one. It was August tenth. Two women, Charlotte
Moberly and Eleanor Jordaine, were visiting the Palace of Versailles
in France. Now who were these women. They weren't spiritualists.
(07:08):
They were serious, high level academics. Charlotte was the principal
of Saint Hugh's College at Oxford University. Eleanor was a
respected author. These were women of logic and skepticism. They
were walking through the beautiful gardens, heading toward a smaller
building called the Petite Triannon. It was a hot summer day.
(07:31):
There were other tourists around. Everything seemed normal until suddenly
the world shifted. Charlotte described a feeling of extraordinary depression
that suddenly came over her. Not sadness, really, but a heaviness,
a fog. It was as if the air had been
sucked out of the world. She noticed the wind stopped blowing,
(07:54):
the trees stood perfectly still, like they were painted on
a canvas. There were no chafeshadows. Even though the sun
was shining, the silence was deafening. They walked across a
bridge and saw two men. These men were wearing long
green coats and three cornered hats, the kind of hats
people wore in the seventeen hundreds. At first, the women thought, oh,
(08:18):
there must be a pageant going on. Maybe they are
gardeners in costume. But the men looked dark and unwelcoming.
Then a man ran up to them. He was wearing
a cloak and a slouch hat, and shouted at them
in French, telling them to go a different way. They
followed his instructions and walked on a grassy lawn, and there,
(08:39):
sitting on the grass was a woman. She was sketching
on a pad of paper. She was wearing a light
summer dress with a long, full skirt and a large
white hat perched on her hair. Charlotte looked at her,
the woman looked up at them, and the woman looked annoyed.
She looked at these two British women from nineteen one
(09:01):
as if they were intruders who didn't belong there. The
two women continued walking, and eventually they met another group
of tourists, and just like that, the spell broke, The
wind blew again, the shadows returned, the feeling of heaviness lifted.
They were back in nineteen oh one. They didn't talk
(09:22):
about it right away. It was very strange. But a
week later they compared notes. They wrote down exactly what
they saw independently. The green coats, the bridge, the woman sketching.
Being academics, they decided to investigate. They went back to Versailles,
and this is where the story gives goosebumps. When they
(09:45):
went back, the bridge they had walked across was gone.
It wasn't just gone, It hadn't existed for one hundred years.
The path the running man sent them down, it was
now blocked by an old stone wall. The uniforms, the
green coats and the triple cornered hats, those were the
exact uniforms of the Swiss guards who protected the palace
(10:09):
in seventeen eighty nine. And the woman sketching. They looked
at paintings of Marie Antoinette, the Queen of France. Charlotte
recognized her instantly. The dress, the hat, the face. It
was the queen that they saw. But here's one more detail.
They researched the date they visited on August tenth, nineteen
(10:33):
oh one. In French history, August tenth, seventeen ninety two
was the day the Palace was sacked and the Swiss
guards were massacred. It was the last day of the
Old World. Doctor Rugby argues that these women didn't see ghosts.
They didn't see spirits floating around. They walked into a
(10:56):
time slip for a few minutes. The curtain between nineteen
one and seventeen ninety two dissolved. They were physically in
nineteen oh one, but somehow their consciousness had tuned them
into the frequency of the past. So is this comforting? Well,
if Marie Antoinette is still sitting in that garden in
(11:17):
seventeen ninety two, it means she isn't dead. She is
just at a different coordinate in time. And if that
is true, then your husband, your wife, your parent, your child,
they aren't dead either. They are simply living in a
part of the block universe that your physical body can't
see right now. But they are safe in the eternal now.
(11:41):
Doctor Rugbet suggests that our consciousness is a time machine.
Usually we only move forward, but sometimes through a glitch
in reality or through the power of love, we can
connect across that timeline. But doctor Ruckbeat doesn't just talk
about strangers in a garden. He moves on to something
much more personal. He asks, if we can accidentally stumble
(12:06):
into the past, can people in the past intentionally come
to visit us. He explores the phenomena called crisis apparitions.
This is when a person, usually a mother, a father,
or a spouse, appears to their loved one at the
exact moment of their death, even if they are thousands
(12:26):
of miles away. These aren't glitches. These are purposeful visits.
It is the soul using the time machine to make
one final stop. I am leaving my body, but I
am not leaving you. And he says that perhaps the
most incredible evidence involves reincarnation. If the soul is outside
(12:47):
of time, can it come back when we come back
from the break. I'm going to share his story of
the Pollock Twins. It's been verified, it is documented, and
doctor Rugby says it is proof that death is not
the end. It is simply a revolving door. We'll be
right back you're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on
(13:08):
the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
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Speaker 5 (14:08):
Thanks for being here.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Now let's get back to more with Sandra.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain.
Today we're looking at doctor Leo Rugby's third prize winning
essay from the Bigelow Contest. We just explored the idea
that the afterlife is not a place but a time,
and that the past is still very much alive in
what he calls the block universe, and sometimes, like the
(14:47):
women in the Garden of Versailles, we can slip through
a crack and see it. But for those of us
who are grieving, time travel is a kind of strange concept.
We don't want to visit the French revel. We want
to know if the specific people that we love and
miss are safe and of course alive, and most importantly,
(15:09):
will we ever be with them again. Doctor Rugby's essay
offers a profound yes. He argues that if consciousness exists
outside of time, then it isn't limited to just one lifetime.
It can enter the stream of time, leave it, and
potentially enter it again. Now it seems to me that
(15:32):
usually half of our listeners are interested in the case
for reincarnation and the other think not so sure it exists.
But let's hear what doctor Rugby presents. This is the
story of the Pollock Twins. Their story begins in Tragedy
on the fifth of May and nineteen fifty seven, and
(15:53):
Hexham England. The Pollock family was destroyed. John and Florence
Pollack had two daughters, Joanna, who was eleven, and Jacqueline,
who was six. On that Sunday morning, the two girls
were walking to church with a friend. A car lost control,
climbed the pavement and struck them dead. All three children, unfortunately,
(16:16):
were killed instantly. I'm sure you can imagine the devastation
the father, John Pollock, was a devout Catholic, but he
also was a believer in reincarnation. He prayed desperately. He
told his wife, they will come back to us. I
just know they will come back. His wife, Florence, did
(16:36):
not believe him. She was grieving and the last thing
she wanted to hear about was second chances. Of course,
she just wanted her girls back. A year later, Florence
became pregnant. John insisted she was carrying twins. The doctor
said he was wrong because they could only hear one heartbeat,
but John was certain. He said, I know it's them,
(17:00):
Joanna and Jacqueline coming back. So on the fourth of
October nineteen fifty eight, Florence gave birth, and sure enough,
it was to twin girls. They named them Jillian, and Jennifer.
So I'll let you decide if this is coincidence or evidence.
When the babies were born, John noticed something strange on
(17:21):
the younger twin, Jennifer. She had a white line scar
on her forehead, right at the hairline. It was the
exact same scar that her deceased sister Jacqueline, had gotten
from falling off a bike. Jennifer also had a birthmark
on her wrist. It was a dark smudge. It was
in the exact same spot and the exact same shape
(17:45):
as the birthmark Jacqueline had. Doctor Rugby points out that
birthmarks are biological right, but scars. Scars are acquired. You
aren't genetically programmed to have a scar from a bike accident,
and yet here it was. As the twins grew up,
the evidence became impossible to ignore. When they were barely toddlers,
(18:10):
the family moved away from Hexham, the twins had never
seen their dead sister's toys. The toys had been packed
away in a box in the attic long before they
were born. One day, John brought the box down. He
opened it up without missing a beat. The twins started
grabbing the toys. They didn't just play with them, they
(18:32):
named them. Jennifer grabbed a doll and said that's my Mary.
Jillian grabbed another and said that's my Suzanne. Those were
the exact names that the deceased sisters had given to
those specific dolls. Plus they knew which toys belonged to whom.
They started referencing events they couldn't possibly know. They would
(18:54):
talk about the school they used to go to, even
though these toddlers were not old enough to go to
school ooh yet. And when they visited Hexham, a town
the twins had never seen, the girls suddenly knew their
way around. They pointed to the playground where we used
to play on the swings. They pointed out the school
that they used to attend. But then came the evidence
(19:17):
from their trauma. Doctor Rugby notes that the twins had
an unexplainable hysterical fear of cars. If a car engine
idle too loudly in the street, the girls would scream
and cling onto each other, shouting, the car is coming
to get us. One day, their mother walked into the
(19:37):
room and found them playing a strange game. Jennifer was
lying on the floor with her head in Gillian's lap.
Gillian was stroking her hair and saying, the blood is
coming out of your eyes. That's where the car hit you.
It was a reenactment of the accident that killed the sisters.
So at the age of five, the age where scientists
(19:59):
say has life memories usually fade, the memories stopped. The
girls grew up to be normal teenagers with no memory
of their past lives. But doctor Rugby uses this case
to argue a profound point. The consciousness of Joanna and
Jacqueline didn't vanish into nothingness. It existed outside of time,
(20:23):
and because of the powerful bond of love with their parents,
it found a way to loop back. And it suggests
that our loved ones are not lost, They are just
in a different part of the cycle, and sometimes love
pulls them right back into our arms. But what about
the moment of leaving. If the Pollock twins prove we
(20:45):
can return, Doctor Rugby also shares evidence that our loved
ones try to reach us the moment they depart. He
calls this phenomena crisis apparitions. This is when a person
appears to a loved one at the person moment of
their death. It's usually to say goodbye. Doctor Rugby shares
the case of Lieutenant David McConnell. It was during the war.
(21:09):
McConnell was an eighteen year old pilot trainee. He was
stationed miles away from his barracks. On a specific afternoon,
he took off for a flight exam. Back at the barracks,
his roommate, Lieutenant Larkin, was sitting in his room reading
a book. Suddenly the door opened. McConnell walked in. He
(21:30):
was wearing his full flying gear. Larkin looked up and
said hello, back already McConnell looked at him, smiled and
said hello boy. Then he said cheerio and walked out
the door and closed it. Larkin thought nothing of it.
He assumed his friend had finished the flight. But a
few hours later the news arrived Lieutenant McConnell had crashed
(21:55):
his plane. He was killed instantly at the exact same
time to the minute that Larkin saw him walk into
the room. Doctor Rugby analyzes this through the lens of
the time machine. At the moment of his death, McConnell's
physical body was destroyed, but his consciousness his ghost, was
(22:15):
ejected from the timeline. In that moment of intense emotion,
his thought was of his friend. He projected himself instantly
across space. He looked solid, he spoke, he even opened
and closed a door. But he wasn't physical. He was
a projection of pure consciousness saying a final goodbye. This
(22:38):
is a huge comfort to any one of us when
our loved ones die. You know, we often carry so
much guilt. I wasn't there for them, I wasn't in
the room when they passed. I didn't get to say goodbye.
But the evidence suggests that they come to us. Distance
doesn't matter, the hospital walls don't matter. At the moment
(22:59):
of try transition, they are free, and the first act
is often to visit the people they love. And finally,
Doctor Rugby offers comfort for the fear of dying itself.
Aren't we all afraid that at that final moment, it'll
be dark and we'll be alone. We have that fear
of the unknown. Doctor Rugby explores deathbed visions in his essay,
(23:22):
specifically the peak in Darienne cases. This is a poetic
term for a very specific type of vision when a
dying person sees someone that he or she did not
know was dead. If you see your grandma who died
ten years ago, skeptics say that's just wishful thinking. But
what if you see someone you think is alive. Doctor
(23:45):
Rugby cites the case of a dying woman in the
nineteenth century Let's call her Sarah. Sarah was dying of
heart failure. Her family was gathered around her. Now Tragically,
Sarah's sister Vita had died three weeks earlier, but because
Sarah was so sick, the family decided not to tell her.
(24:06):
They didn't want to upset her. As far as Sarah knew,
Vida was alive and well in another city. As Sarah
took her final breaths, her face suddenly lit up with
a beautiful, radiant smile. She looked past her family into
the corner of the room and said, oh, there is father.
(24:26):
Her father had been dead for years. But then her
expression changed to one of pure shock and joy, and
Vida is with him. And she turned to her family,
confused and said, you told me Vida was alive, but
she's here, And then Sarah passed away. Doctor Rugby argues
that this destroys the hallucination theory. If Sarah's brain was
(24:51):
creating a comforting hallucination, she would have hallucinated a living
Vita coming to visit her bedside, or she wouldn't have
seen her at all. Her brain expected Vita to be alive,
but her soul saw the truth. This proves that we
all have a welcoming committee. When we step out of
the physical body, we are not stepping into the dark.
(25:12):
We are stepping into a reunion. We are stepping into
a place where everyone we lost is still there, standing there,
waiting to guide us home. So we have the Pollock
twins returning to their parents, We have the pilot saying
cheerio to his friend, and we have the sister waiting
to welcome or dying sibling. All these stories tell us
(25:34):
one thing, the bond of love is stronger than time.
But doctor Rugby's essay doesn't stop at emotional comfort. He
tackles the ghost in the machine of our daily lives.
He asks a rather spooky question. If spirits can communicate
with us, can they also communicate with our technology? Can
(25:55):
they appear on tape? Can they speak through radios? When
we come back? Going to look at the history of
electronic voice phenomena through doctor Rugby's essay and the Charmed Circle,
where physical evidence of the afterlife appeared right in front
of scientists. We'll be right back. You're listening to Shades
(26:17):
of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast
AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
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You got to lose Paranormal Day dot com.
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The Internet is an extraordinary resource that links our children
to a world of information, experiences, and ideas. It can
also expose them to risk. Teach your children the basic
safety rules of the virtual world. Our children are everything.
Do everything for them.
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Hey, it's the Wizard of Weird Joshua P. Warren. Don't
forget to check out my show Strange Things. Each week
as I bring you the world of the truly amazing
and bizarre right here on the iHeartRadio and Coast to
Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain.
I know this is a different kind of episode discussing
the third prize winning essay of Bigelow Contest winner doctor
Leo Rugby. But for me, it's a rainy day outside
and it's interesting. So far, we have looked at the
idea that the afterlife is a time a destination in
(28:34):
the block universe. But if we look at this from
the mind of a skeptic, as we must always do,
they might say, yeah, Sandra, but all these stories are
about perceptions, their visions, their memories. But you can't touch
a ghost. And if they are real, why don't they
leave physical footprints. Well, doctor Rugby, who is actually an
(28:54):
expert on magic and deception, tackles this head on. He
argues that if a post is actually a consciousness slipping
into our timeline, it should theoretically be able to interact
with our physical world, and he presents evidence for what
he calls the charmed circle. This refers to a series
(29:16):
of experiments done in the early twentieth century by Nobel
prize winning scientists and doctors who wanted to test physical mediumship.
They weren't interested in messages of love. They wanted to
see ectoplasm. They wanted to see matter materialize. Doctor Rugby
(29:37):
highlights the famous experiments done at the Institute Metaphysique International
in Paris, involving a medium named Frank Klusky. The scientists
there devised an experiment that was designed to be fraud proof.
They wanted to catch a spirit hand in a way
(29:58):
that could not be faked by a human in hand.
So they placed bowls of hot, melted paraffin wax on
a table. They asked the medium to summon a spirit
entity to dip its hand in the hot wax, let
it cool into a glove, and then this is the
important part, de materialize their hand out of the wax
(30:21):
glove without breaking it. Imagine the physics of this. If
you or I dip our hand into wax, let it harden,
we're trapped right To get our hand out, we would
have to wiggle it, which would crack the wax, or
we would have to cut the wax. You cannot pull
a human hand out of a tight wax glove because
(30:42):
the wrist is more narrow than our knuckles, so it's
physically impossible. But in these experiments, under strict laboratory conditions,
this is exactly what happened. The medium, Frank Klusky, would
go into a trance, the scientists would hold his hands
to ensure he was not moving, and later, floating in
(31:03):
the water, they would find perfect hollow wax gloves. They
analyzed them. The gloves were seamless, there were no cuts,
there were no cracks, but the detail was what shocked them.
The wax had captured microscopic skin ridges, fingerprints, and lines.
(31:25):
Now imagine this. This is on the inside of the
wax gloves. When they brought these gloves in for forensic
experts to look at them, they found that the fingerprints
on the wax gloves did not match the fingerprints of
the medium, and they did not match anyone in the room.
They were fingerprints of a stranger, someone who had materialized,
(31:48):
dipped their spirit hand into wax, and then dissolved back
into the ether. Doctor Rugby points out that they even
tried to get professional magicians to duplicate this. The magicians failed.
The only way to create a seamless wax glove with
a narrow wrist is if the hand inside it simply
(32:10):
ceases to be solid. This is what doctor Rugby calls
the ghost in the machine. It is physical proof that
a consciousness from another time or dimension can enter our space,
becomes solid enough to dip their hand in wax and
then vanish again. But if they can touch wax, can
they touch technology? Doctor Rugby dedicates a fascinating section of
(32:34):
his essay to EVP Electronic voice Phenomena. He tells the
story of Friedrich Jurgensen. Jurgensen wasn't a ghost hunter. He
was a Swedish painter and a film producer. In nineteen
fifty nine, he was out in the countryside trying to
record bird songs for a documentary. He had a real
(32:54):
to real tape recorder. He set it up in a
quiet forest, recorded the birds, and then went home. When
he played the tape back, he heard the birds, but
then underneath the birds he heard a human voice. It
was faint, but it was clear. It was a woman's voice,
and she said something that froze his blood. She said, Friedel,
(33:20):
can you hear me? It's mommy. Friedel was the childhood
nickname only his mother used for him and his mother
had been dead for years. Jurgensen spent the rest of
his life recording these voices. He invited scientists to check
his equipment. They found no stray radio signals. They found
no trickery. Doctor Rugby argues that this is the modern
(33:43):
version of the wax glove. Instead of manipulating wax, the
time travelers are manipulating electrons. They are imprinting their voice
onto the magnetic tape. Today it might be your cell
phone or your computer. Rouckbeat saves his most impressive piece
of evidence for the category he calls intellectual proof. Sometimes
(34:07):
the best proof isn't a physical object, it's information. It's
knowledge that comes through that is so specific, so complex,
and so impossible for the living person to know that
it must come from somewhere else. Doctor Ruckbeat discusses the
phenomena called xenoglossy. This is when a person suddenly gains
(34:28):
the ability to speak a language they have never learned.
He cites the incredible case of utah udar Uta was
a woman living near Nagpur, India. She spoke her native language,
Marathi and some English. She did not know Bengali. In fact,
she had practically had no exposure to the Bengali culture. Suddenly,
(34:51):
seemingly out of nowhere, her personality shifted. She began calling
herself Sharata. When Sharata took over used to speak Marafi.
She spoke only fluid, rapid fire Bengali, but it wasn't
modern Bengali. Experts analyzed her speech and realized she was
(35:12):
speaking a dialect from the early eighteen hundreds, and she
didn't just know the words. She knew their culture. She
asked for foods that hadn't been cooked in India for
one hundred years. She didn't recognize modern technology like trains
or cars. She gave details about her family in the
eighteen thirties, their names, locations, and events. Researchers investigated. They
(35:37):
traveled to the village she named, They found the genealogy records,
and they found her. There really was a woman named
Shirata who lived in that village in the early nineteenth century.
Doctor Rugby argues that this fits with his time travel theory.
Utara wasn't just hallucinating. Her consciousness had somehow entangled with
(36:00):
the consciousness of Sharrata from the eighteen thirties, or perhaps
Sharrata had time traveled to inhabit Utara. Either way, you
cannot hallucinate a language you don't know. That information has
to come from somewhere. So this brings us to another
famous case, the case of intellectual proof. In doctor Rugby's
(36:22):
essay called Patience Worth. This story takes place in Saint
Louis in nineteen thirteen. It involves a woman named Pearl Current.
Pearl was an ordinary housewife. She left school at the
age of fourteen, and she had never traveled. She had
very little interest in literature or history. One evening, she
(36:43):
was playing with the Ouiji board with her friend, just
for fun, of course, and suddenly the planchet began to
move with incredible speed. It spelled out a message many
moons ago, I lived again. I come. Patience Worth is
my name. Over the next twenty four years, Pearl Current
(37:04):
produced through Luigi Board and later through direct dictation, a
staggering amount of literature. She wrote novels, plays, and thousands
of poems. But it wasn't just the quantity she produced,
it was the quality. The writing was brilliant. It received
critical acclaim from the New York Times. It was considered
(37:26):
some of the best literature of the era, but Here's
the impossible part that doctor Rugby focuses on. The vocabulary.
Patience Worth claimed to be from the seventeenth century, and
the novels she wrote were written in a specific archaic
dialect of seventeenth century English. Scholars analyzed the texts, the
(37:49):
writing contained thousands of words that had fallen out of
usage hundreds of years ago. It contained words that per
current with only her eighth grade education could not have
possibly known. For example, in one poem, Patient's Worth used
the word amulet as a verb meaning to give luck.
(38:11):
The scholars check the Oxford English Dictionary. Sure enough, in
the sixteen hundreds, amulet was used as a verb, but
that usage had been dead for centuries. And there was
one more detail that doctor Rugby highlights to prove this
was not Pearl's subconscious. Pearl could perform feats of divided attention,
(38:34):
so she could sit there and write a novel from
Patience Worth with one hand and simultaneously be carrying on
a conversation with a room full of people about a
completely different topic. If this were just Pearl's creativity, she
would need to focus, but she didn't. She acted like
(38:54):
a radio receiver. The signal from Patience Worth was coming
through her regardless of what Pearl was doing. Doctor Rugby
argues in his essay that this is the ultimate ghost
in the machine. Pearl Current became a time machine, her
consciousness tuned into the specific frequency of a woman from
(39:15):
the sixteen hundreds in patients Worth poured her intellect, her vocabulary,
and even her personality through Pearl. So we have the
wax gloves proving that spirits can interact with matter. We
have EVP proving they can imprint on electricity, we have
Sherata proving that they can bring back lost languages, and
(39:37):
we have Patience Worth proving they can bring back lost literature.
It paints a picture we are not alone in this
block universe. Doctor Rugby says, we are surrounded by layers
and layers of consciousness, all existing at once, all trying
to communicate. But if this is true, and the past
is alive and the dead are speaking to us, and
(40:00):
time is an illusion, what does this mean for you
and me? When we come back from the break, we're
going to talk about what it means to be a
time traveler. We'll discuss the comfort of the eternal now
and Doctor Rugby's final beautiful argument for why love is
the force that powers the machine. We'll be right back.
You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeart
(40:23):
Radio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
Speaker 6 (40:35):
Stay there, Sandra will be right back.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
You're listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to cost Am
Paranormal Podcast Network with the best shows that explore the paranormal, supernatural,
and the unexplained. You can enjoy all shows on the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you find your favorite
podcasts the best afterlife information you can get. Well, you're
(41:06):
all long Shades of the Afterlife with Sander Champlain. Welcome
back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sander Champlain. If
(41:27):
you've been a longtime listener of the show, you know
these concepts we spoke about today, We've spoke about quite
often in the past five years. Don't forget to join
my mailing list at We Don't Die dot com and
I've got a list of episodes there for you on
these different topics. Back to Doctor Leo Rugby and his
(41:47):
Ghost in the Machine essay. You've heard these incredible stories
and you may be left with the question So what
if it is true that the afterlife is a time.
If it's true that we live in a block universe
where the past, present, and future are all existing at once,
how does that help us in our lives when we
(42:07):
are exploding with grief, crying at the kitchen table. How
does it help us when we look at the empty
chair at the dinner table. Doctor Rugby dedicates the conclusion
of his essay to shifting our perspective. He argues that
the pain of grief comes from a three dimensional misunderstanding
(42:28):
of the universe. We humans are used to thinking in
three D. In three D, things are either here or there.
If I move a cup from the table to the
kitchen sink, it has gone from the table. It can't
be in two places at once. We apply this limited
logic to people. We think Mom was here and now
she's gone. We think of life as a straight line,
(42:51):
a train track that runs from birth to death, and
when the train goes off the cliff, the journey is over.
But doctor Rugby asks to upgrade our thinking. He wants
us to start thinking like four dimensional beings. To understand this,
let's think of a movie reel. Imagine you are in
(43:11):
a movie theater. Watching a film. You're watching a scene
where the main character is getting married. It's happy. Then
the movie moves on. Ten minutes later, there's a funeral scene.
Now while you are watching the funeral, does the wedding
scene cease to exist? Did the film burn up? No,
the wedding scene is still there, wound up on the reel.
(43:35):
It is perfectly preserved. It is just as real as
the funeral scene. The only difference is the light of
the projector isn't shining on it right now. Doctor Rugby
argues that the universe is the real and your consciousness
is the projector. Just because the light of your focus
(43:55):
has moved to the twenty twenty six section of the real,
it doesn't mean the nineteen ninety nine section was destroyed.
The people in that section, your parents when they were young,
your children when they were babies, the friends you lost,
they are all still here. They're still laughing, and they're
(44:17):
still alive. Doctor Rugby writes that death is not an exit,
it is a shift in coordinate. This is a massive
shift for our mindset. It means that your loved ones
haven't ceased to exist. They have simply become invisible. To
your current moment. They are safe in the earlier chapters
(44:39):
of the book or on the film reel. Here is
the empowering part. You don't have to wait until you
die to rewind the film. Doctor Rugby argues that we
all have a built in time machine that allows us
to connect with those chapters right now, and that machine
is powered by one specific fur love. In his essay,
(45:03):
he calls this time tanglement. It's a play on the
quantum physics term entanglement. In physics, when two particles are entangled,
they remain connected forever, no matter how far apart they are.
If you spin one, the other spins instantly, even if
it's on the other side of the galaxy. Distance implies
(45:25):
nothing to them. Doctor Rugby argues that love is simply
the biological experience of quantum entanglement. When you love someone deeply,
your consciousness becomes entangled with theirs. You become part of
the same system. That is why crisis apparitions happen. That
(45:46):
is why the mother felt the sphere of light when
her son died. That is why the husband saw his
wife's ghost. The entanglement doesn't break just because the physical
body stops working. The wire is still alive. So how
can we use this? Based on doctor Rugby's essay and
the wisdom we've shared today, here are three instructions for
(46:09):
living as a time traveler. Instruction number one, change your coordinates.
When you are missing someone, stop looking up. We have
been trained to look at the sky and imagine they
are in a far away heaven beyond the clouds. But
doctor Rugby suggests they aren't up. They are. Then, instead
(46:29):
of looking up, look back, but don't look back with sadness.
Look back with presence. Use your memory not as a
dusty photo album, but as a portal. Close your eyes
and travel back to a moment when you were together.
See the room, smell the coffee, hear their laugh. According
(46:50):
to the block universe theory, you aren't just imagining that moment.
You are tuning your consciousness to a coordinate where that
moment is still happening. You are visiting them in the
eternal now. Doctor Rugby suggests that because of entanglement, when
you focus on them with love, you are lighting up
(47:12):
that connection. You are ringing the bell. You are literally
spending time with them. Instruction number two, trust the glitches.
Doctor Rugby's essay is full of glitches, time slips, evp voices,
sudden visions. He argues that the veil between now and
(47:32):
then is much thinner than we think. So when you
see a sign, trust it. If you smell their perfume
when no one is there, don't disregard it as a
memory or an illusion. It's a time slip. If you
hear their voice in your head giving you advice, don't
dismiss it as your imagination. It's a transmission. If you
(47:54):
have a dream where they feel incredibly real, believe it.
You have met in the dimension where you are both free.
We often block these communications because our rational three D
brains say that's impossible. But remember the women at Versailles.
The rational brains told them it was impossible. But the
(48:15):
bridge and the Queen we're right there in front of them.
The universe is stranger and much more beautiful than our
logic allows, and Instruction number three live fearlessly. This is
an important one. If doctor Rugby is right, if we
truly are ghosts in a time machine, then there is
(48:36):
no such thing as the end. We spend so much
of our lives terrified about the finish line. We worry
about running out of time. We worry about aging, we
worry about being forgotten. But in a four D universe,
nothing is ever forgotten, because nothing is ever lost. Every
smile you give, every act of kindness, every moment of
(48:59):
love is recorded forever in the fabric of space time.
It's indestructible. This means you can stop racing against the clock.
You can slow down, you can savor the moment you
are in right now, because this moment is your contribution
to eternity. And when it comes time for your own transition,
(49:19):
you don't need to be afraid. Remember the story of
Vita and Sarah. Remember the Welcoming Committee. When you step
out of your physical body, you aren't stepping into the void.
You are simply stepping out of the time machine and
returning to the larger reality. And who is waiting for you. Everyone?
(49:40):
Your parents, your grandparents, the friends you've lost, the pets
you've loved. They're all there, standing on the platform, waiting
for your train to arrive. Doctor Rugby finishes his essay
by challenging the old idea of the ghost in the machine.
The philosopher Gilbert Ryle coin that term to make fun
(50:02):
of the soul. He thought the idea of a spirit
driving a body was ridiculous. He thought we were just
biological robots or toasters that made toast until we broke.
But doctor Rugby says, we realize that it is the
physical body that creates time. For the mind, the ghost
(50:24):
is not just in a machine, but in a time machine.
My friend, you are the driver. Your body is the vehicle.
Time is the road, and love is the fuel. The
vehicle will eventually break down, the road will eventually end,
but the driver is eternal. One last thought as we
(50:45):
go our separate ways today. I know that talking about
time travel and four dimensions can feel a little weird
and not our typical episode, especially when we're missing somebody
we love. It might be interesting to hear about physics,
but then you're thinking, I just want to have my
mom back, or my dad back, or my child back.
(51:07):
Doctor Rugby's theory offers us something that is comforting. If
he is right that the past is real and our
consciousness exists outside of time, then it means the moments
that you shared with your loved ones aren't gone. They
didn't dissolve into nothingness just because the clock ticked forward.
Think about a favorite book you might have read. Just
(51:30):
because you have turned to chapter ten, it doesn't mean
that chapter three no longer exists. Chapter three is still there, fixed, permanent,
and beautiful. The characters in chapter three are still alive,
still laughing, and still loving right there in the book.
Your life is that book. Your loved ones are not erased.
(51:50):
I promise you that they are safe in the eternal
now and now. As Doctor Rugby suggests, since this spirit
is a time traveler, they aren't just stuck back in
chapter three. They can skip forward to read over your
shoulder right now in chapter ten. So as you go
through your week, try to remember you aren't losing time.
You are collecting it, and one day you will step
(52:14):
out of the timeline and see that a whole beautiful
story all at once. I hope our trilogy of Proof
from the Bigelow Institute has given you a foundation to
stand on. Of course, you can revisit some of our
past episodes like first Prize winner Doctor Jeffrey mischlv and
episode two hundred and forty four and Doctor Pym Van
(52:35):
lommel And Episode two hundred and seventy three, And I
encourage you to read some of these essays. Yourself. There's
so many more. Just go to Bigelowinstitute dot org and remember,
come visit me at weedotdie dot com. Come join me
on our free Sunday gathering inspirational service with medium demonstration included. Also,
(52:59):
if you're interested in EVP and capturing those images from
the other side, at the bottom of the main page
you'll see our film about researcher Sonia Andaldi, and also
our new film called Evidence of the Afterlife, saving Evidential Mediumship.
I'm Sander Champlain and from the bottom of my heart,
(53:20):
thank you for listening to Shades of the Afterlife on
the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am Hearinormal podcast Network.
Speaker 2 (53:37):
Thanks for listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to Ghost
Day and Paranormal podcast Network. Make sure and check out
all our shows on the iHeartRadio app or by going
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Thanks for choosing the iHeartRadio and Coast to Ghost Day
and Paranormal Podcast Network. Your quest for podcasts of the paranormal, supernatural,
and the unexplained ends here. They invite you to enjoy
all our shows we have on this network, and right now,
let's start with Chase of the Afterlife with Sandra Champlain.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Welcome to our podcast. Please be aware the thoughts and
opinions expressed by the host are their thoughts and opinions
only and do not reflect those of iHeartMedia, iHeartRadio, Coast
to Coast am employees of Premiere Networks, or their sponsors
and associates. We would like to encourage you to do
(00:42):
your own research and discover the subject matter for yourself.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Hi.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
I'm Sandra Champlain. For over twenty five years, I've been
on a journey to prove the existence of life after death.
On each episodisode, we'll discuss the reasons we now know
that our loved ones have survived physical death and so
will we. Welcome to Shades of the Afterlife. It is
(01:11):
a rainy, dreary day where I am and I had
set aside today for cleaning the house, but the truth
is I don't want to, so I thought, I need
to do something productive, and I thought, let's record another episode.
You may just remember recently we took a deep dive
into the incredible work of doctor Pym van Lommel, who
(01:35):
was the second prize winner of the Bigelow Institute for
Consciousness Studies Essay contest. We talked about the medical proof,
the flatlined brains, the DNA antennas, that our loved ones
and our consciousness is in the cloud, all leading to
the fact that we survive physical death. And then back
(01:56):
on episode two forty four, we had covered the first
prize winner, doctor Jeffrey Mishlove, who gave us historical and
evidence through parapsychology for the continuity of life after life.
So today, as I'm avoiding cleaning, I thought, is my
fabulous listener just as curious as I am about winner
(02:17):
number three? So if you don't mind, I really feel
like diving right back into the Bigelow Papers and introducing
you to third prize winner, the man who took home
one hundred and fifty thousand dollars for his evidence. His
name is doctor Leo Rugby. This is a different kind
of essay, but it is something that I do think
(02:39):
will touch the grieving heart, as I know. That's why
many come to our show. When we think about the afterlife,
the common questions are where are they? Can I still
communicate with them? We may look up at the sky
think of them beyond the clouds, or we imagine them
and the dimension far far away. It does feel like
(03:00):
our loved ones are far from us, but Doctor Rugby
asks a different question. He doesn't ask where they are,
he asks when they are. So his third prize winning
essay is titled the Ghost in the Time Machine, And
in this episode, we're going to look at the evidence
that suggests that our loved ones aren't gone, they are
(03:23):
just living in a different time. And we're going to
look at the moments where they can break the rules
of time and come back to us. So today we're
going to hear some incredible stories of love crossing that
great divide. We're going to hear the famous stories of
the Pollock Twins, two little girls who died in the
tragedy who the belief is they've been reborn to the
(03:46):
same parents because they remembered their old toys and had
their old scars. We'll talk about crisis apparitions, those moments
when a loved one appears at the foot of the
bed to say goodbye at the exact moment they pass away,
proving that their first thought upon leaving the earth was you.
And we'll talk about the welcome committee, the visions of
(04:09):
deceased relatives who have come to hold our hands when
it is our turn to go. But first we have
to understand this idea of the time machine. Doctor Rugby
argues that the biggest mistake we make is thinking that
the past is dead and gone. When we think about
nineteen ninety five or twenty ten or last week, these
(04:31):
are deleted scenes from our minds. But modern physics and
doctor Rugby's research suggests that that isn't true. His essay
begins with the story we all Know a Christmas Carol
by Charles Dickens. Remember Ebenezer Scrooge, He visited the ghost
of Christmas past. The ghost takes his hand, the bedroom
(04:54):
wall dissolves, and suddenly they are standing in a snowy village.
From Scrooge's childlihood, Scrooge sees his old school, He sees
his childhood friends laughing. He sees himself as a young boy, now,
we usually call this a ghost story, but doctor Rugby
points out something interesting. This isn't a ghost story. This
(05:16):
is a time travel story. Scrooge traveled back in time,
and what did he find. He found that the past
was still there. The people were still alive, the laughter
was still ringing in the air. They weren't dead, They
were just happening at a different point on the timeline.
(05:36):
Doctor Rugby suggests that the afterlife works exactly like this.
Let me explain. In his essay, he discusses a concept
in physics called the block universe. Einstein even believed in this.
It's the idea that the past, present, and future all
exist simultaneously. Like a loaf of bread. We are just
(06:02):
a slice moving through it. But just because you haven't
eaten the first slice of bread, it doesn't mean the
first slice never existed. It's still there at the beginning
of the loaf. This means that the moments you had
with your loved ones, the holidays, the hugs, the vacations,
(06:23):
the conversations, they aren't memories fading in your brain. They
are permanent fixtures in the universe. They still exist and
the people in them still exist. To prove that we
can actually visit the past. Doctor Rugby shares one of
the most famous and most well documented cases in history.
(06:44):
It's a story about a sunny afternoon in a garden.
It's known as the Moberly Jordain incident. The year was
nineteen oh one. It was August tenth. Two women, Charlotte
Moberly and Eleanor Jordaine, were visiting the Palace of Versailles
in France. Now who were these women. They weren't spiritualists.
(07:08):
They were serious, high level academics. Charlotte was the principal
of Saint Hugh's College at Oxford University. Eleanor was a
respected author. These were women of logic and skepticism. They
were walking through the beautiful gardens, heading toward a smaller
building called the Petite Triannon. It was a hot summer day.
(07:31):
There were other tourists around. Everything seemed normal until suddenly
the world shifted. Charlotte described a feeling of extraordinary depression
that suddenly came over her. Not sadness, really, but a heaviness,
a fog. It was as if the air had been
sucked out of the world. She noticed the wind stopped blowing,
(07:54):
the trees stood perfectly still, like they were painted on
a canvas. There were no chafeshadows. Even though the sun
was shining, the silence was deafening. They walked across a
bridge and saw two men. These men were wearing long
green coats and three cornered hats, the kind of hats
people wore in the seventeen hundreds. At first, the women thought, oh,
(08:18):
there must be a pageant going on. Maybe they are
gardeners in costume. But the men looked dark and unwelcoming.
Then a man ran up to them. He was wearing
a cloak and a slouch hat, and shouted at them
in French, telling them to go a different way. They
followed his instructions and walked on a grassy lawn, and there,
(08:39):
sitting on the grass was a woman. She was sketching
on a pad of paper. She was wearing a light
summer dress with a long, full skirt and a large
white hat perched on her hair. Charlotte looked at her,
the woman looked up at them, and the woman looked annoyed.
She looked at these two British women from nineteen one
(09:01):
as if they were intruders who didn't belong there. The
two women continued walking, and eventually they met another group
of tourists, and just like that, the spell broke, The
wind blew again, the shadows returned, the feeling of heaviness lifted.
They were back in nineteen oh one. They didn't talk
(09:22):
about it right away. It was very strange. But a
week later they compared notes. They wrote down exactly what
they saw independently. The green coats, the bridge, the woman sketching.
Being academics, they decided to investigate. They went back to Versailles,
and this is where the story gives goosebumps. When they
(09:45):
went back, the bridge they had walked across was gone.
It wasn't just gone, It hadn't existed for one hundred years.
The path the running man sent them down, it was
now blocked by an old stone wall. The uniforms, the
green coats and the triple cornered hats, those were the
exact uniforms of the Swiss guards who protected the palace
(10:09):
in seventeen eighty nine. And the woman sketching. They looked
at paintings of Marie Antoinette, the Queen of France. Charlotte
recognized her instantly. The dress, the hat, the face. It
was the queen that they saw. But here's one more detail.
They researched the date they visited on August tenth, nineteen
(10:33):
oh one. In French history, August tenth, seventeen ninety two
was the day the Palace was sacked and the Swiss
guards were massacred. It was the last day of the
Old World. Doctor Rugby argues that these women didn't see ghosts.
They didn't see spirits floating around. They walked into a
(10:56):
time slip for a few minutes. The curtain between nineteen
one and seventeen ninety two dissolved. They were physically in
nineteen oh one, but somehow their consciousness had tuned them
into the frequency of the past. So is this comforting? Well,
if Marie Antoinette is still sitting in that garden in
(11:17):
seventeen ninety two, it means she isn't dead. She is
just at a different coordinate in time. And if that
is true, then your husband, your wife, your parent, your child,
they aren't dead either. They are simply living in a
part of the block universe that your physical body can't
see right now. But they are safe in the eternal now.
(11:41):
Doctor Rugbet suggests that our consciousness is a time machine.
Usually we only move forward, but sometimes through a glitch
in reality or through the power of love, we can
connect across that timeline. But doctor Ruckbeat doesn't just talk
about strangers in a garden. He moves on to something
much more personal. He asks, if we can accidentally stumble
(12:06):
into the past, can people in the past intentionally come
to visit us. He explores the phenomena called crisis apparitions.
This is when a person, usually a mother, a father,
or a spouse, appears to their loved one at the
exact moment of their death, even if they are thousands
(12:26):
of miles away. These aren't glitches. These are purposeful visits.
It is the soul using the time machine to make
one final stop. I am leaving my body, but I
am not leaving you. And he says that perhaps the
most incredible evidence involves reincarnation. If the soul is outside
(12:47):
of time, can it come back when we come back
from the break. I'm going to share his story of
the Pollock Twins. It's been verified, it is documented, and
doctor Rugby says it is proof that death is not
the end. It is simply a revolving door. We'll be
right back you're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on
(13:08):
the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
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Thanks for being here.
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Now let's get back to more with Sandra.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain.
Today we're looking at doctor Leo Rugby's third prize winning
essay from the Bigelow Contest. We just explored the idea
that the afterlife is not a place but a time,
and that the past is still very much alive in
what he calls the block universe, and sometimes, like the
(14:47):
women in the Garden of Versailles, we can slip through
a crack and see it. But for those of us
who are grieving, time travel is a kind of strange concept.
We don't want to visit the French revel. We want
to know if the specific people that we love and
miss are safe and of course alive, and most importantly,
(15:09):
will we ever be with them again. Doctor Rugby's essay
offers a profound yes. He argues that if consciousness exists
outside of time, then it isn't limited to just one lifetime.
It can enter the stream of time, leave it, and
potentially enter it again. Now it seems to me that
(15:32):
usually half of our listeners are interested in the case
for reincarnation and the other think not so sure it exists.
But let's hear what doctor Rugby presents. This is the
story of the Pollock Twins. Their story begins in Tragedy
on the fifth of May and nineteen fifty seven, and
(15:53):
Hexham England. The Pollock family was destroyed. John and Florence
Pollack had two daughters, Joanna, who was eleven, and Jacqueline,
who was six. On that Sunday morning, the two girls
were walking to church with a friend. A car lost control,
climbed the pavement and struck them dead. All three children, unfortunately,
(16:16):
were killed instantly. I'm sure you can imagine the devastation
the father, John Pollock, was a devout Catholic, but he
also was a believer in reincarnation. He prayed desperately. He
told his wife, they will come back to us. I
just know they will come back. His wife, Florence, did
(16:36):
not believe him. She was grieving and the last thing
she wanted to hear about was second chances. Of course,
she just wanted her girls back. A year later, Florence
became pregnant. John insisted she was carrying twins. The doctor
said he was wrong because they could only hear one heartbeat,
but John was certain. He said, I know it's them,
(17:00):
Joanna and Jacqueline coming back. So on the fourth of
October nineteen fifty eight, Florence gave birth, and sure enough,
it was to twin girls. They named them Jillian, and Jennifer.
So I'll let you decide if this is coincidence or evidence.
When the babies were born, John noticed something strange on
(17:21):
the younger twin, Jennifer. She had a white line scar
on her forehead, right at the hairline. It was the
exact same scar that her deceased sister Jacqueline, had gotten
from falling off a bike. Jennifer also had a birthmark
on her wrist. It was a dark smudge. It was
in the exact same spot and the exact same shape
(17:45):
as the birthmark Jacqueline had. Doctor Rugby points out that
birthmarks are biological right, but scars. Scars are acquired. You
aren't genetically programmed to have a scar from a bike accident,
and yet here it was. As the twins grew up,
the evidence became impossible to ignore. When they were barely toddlers,
(18:10):
the family moved away from Hexham, the twins had never
seen their dead sister's toys. The toys had been packed
away in a box in the attic long before they
were born. One day, John brought the box down. He
opened it up without missing a beat. The twins started
grabbing the toys. They didn't just play with them, they
(18:32):
named them. Jennifer grabbed a doll and said that's my Mary.
Jillian grabbed another and said that's my Suzanne. Those were
the exact names that the deceased sisters had given to
those specific dolls. Plus they knew which toys belonged to whom.
They started referencing events they couldn't possibly know. They would
(18:54):
talk about the school they used to go to, even
though these toddlers were not old enough to go to
school ooh yet. And when they visited Hexham, a town
the twins had never seen, the girls suddenly knew their
way around. They pointed to the playground where we used
to play on the swings. They pointed out the school
that they used to attend. But then came the evidence
(19:17):
from their trauma. Doctor Rugby notes that the twins had
an unexplainable hysterical fear of cars. If a car engine
idle too loudly in the street, the girls would scream
and cling onto each other, shouting, the car is coming
to get us. One day, their mother walked into the
(19:37):
room and found them playing a strange game. Jennifer was
lying on the floor with her head in Gillian's lap.
Gillian was stroking her hair and saying, the blood is
coming out of your eyes. That's where the car hit you.
It was a reenactment of the accident that killed the sisters.
So at the age of five, the age where scientists
(19:59):
say has life memories usually fade, the memories stopped. The
girls grew up to be normal teenagers with no memory
of their past lives. But doctor Rugby uses this case
to argue a profound point. The consciousness of Joanna and
Jacqueline didn't vanish into nothingness. It existed outside of time,
(20:23):
and because of the powerful bond of love with their parents,
it found a way to loop back. And it suggests
that our loved ones are not lost, They are just
in a different part of the cycle, and sometimes love
pulls them right back into our arms. But what about
the moment of leaving. If the Pollock twins prove we
(20:45):
can return, Doctor Rugby also shares evidence that our loved
ones try to reach us the moment they depart. He
calls this phenomena crisis apparitions. This is when a person
appears to a loved one at the person moment of
their death. It's usually to say goodbye. Doctor Rugby shares
the case of Lieutenant David McConnell. It was during the war.
(21:09):
McConnell was an eighteen year old pilot trainee. He was
stationed miles away from his barracks. On a specific afternoon,
he took off for a flight exam. Back at the barracks,
his roommate, Lieutenant Larkin, was sitting in his room reading
a book. Suddenly the door opened. McConnell walked in. He
(21:30):
was wearing his full flying gear. Larkin looked up and
said hello, back already McConnell looked at him, smiled and
said hello boy. Then he said cheerio and walked out
the door and closed it. Larkin thought nothing of it.
He assumed his friend had finished the flight. But a
few hours later the news arrived Lieutenant McConnell had crashed
(21:55):
his plane. He was killed instantly at the exact same
time to the minute that Larkin saw him walk into
the room. Doctor Rugby analyzes this through the lens of
the time machine. At the moment of his death, McConnell's
physical body was destroyed, but his consciousness his ghost, was
(22:15):
ejected from the timeline. In that moment of intense emotion,
his thought was of his friend. He projected himself instantly
across space. He looked solid, he spoke, he even opened
and closed a door. But he wasn't physical. He was
a projection of pure consciousness saying a final goodbye. This
(22:38):
is a huge comfort to any one of us when
our loved ones die. You know, we often carry so
much guilt. I wasn't there for them, I wasn't in
the room when they passed. I didn't get to say goodbye.
But the evidence suggests that they come to us. Distance
doesn't matter, the hospital walls don't matter. At the moment
(22:59):
of try transition, they are free, and the first act
is often to visit the people they love. And finally,
Doctor Rugby offers comfort for the fear of dying itself.
Aren't we all afraid that at that final moment, it'll
be dark and we'll be alone. We have that fear
of the unknown. Doctor Rugby explores deathbed visions in his essay,
(23:22):
specifically the peak in Darienne cases. This is a poetic
term for a very specific type of vision when a
dying person sees someone that he or she did not
know was dead. If you see your grandma who died
ten years ago, skeptics say that's just wishful thinking. But
what if you see someone you think is alive. Doctor
(23:45):
Rugby cites the case of a dying woman in the
nineteenth century Let's call her Sarah. Sarah was dying of
heart failure. Her family was gathered around her. Now Tragically,
Sarah's sister Vita had died three weeks earlier, but because
Sarah was so sick, the family decided not to tell her.
(24:06):
They didn't want to upset her. As far as Sarah knew,
Vida was alive and well in another city. As Sarah
took her final breaths, her face suddenly lit up with
a beautiful, radiant smile. She looked past her family into
the corner of the room and said, oh, there is father.
(24:26):
Her father had been dead for years. But then her
expression changed to one of pure shock and joy, and
Vida is with him. And she turned to her family,
confused and said, you told me Vida was alive, but
she's here, And then Sarah passed away. Doctor Rugby argues
that this destroys the hallucination theory. If Sarah's brain was
(24:51):
creating a comforting hallucination, she would have hallucinated a living
Vita coming to visit her bedside, or she wouldn't have
seen her at all. Her brain expected Vita to be alive,
but her soul saw the truth. This proves that we
all have a welcoming committee. When we step out of
the physical body, we are not stepping into the dark.
(25:12):
We are stepping into a reunion. We are stepping into
a place where everyone we lost is still there, standing there,
waiting to guide us home. So we have the Pollock
twins returning to their parents, We have the pilot saying
cheerio to his friend, and we have the sister waiting
to welcome or dying sibling. All these stories tell us
(25:34):
one thing, the bond of love is stronger than time.
But doctor Rugby's essay doesn't stop at emotional comfort. He
tackles the ghost in the machine of our daily lives.
He asks a rather spooky question. If spirits can communicate
with us, can they also communicate with our technology? Can
(25:55):
they appear on tape? Can they speak through radios? When
we come back? Going to look at the history of
electronic voice phenomena through doctor Rugby's essay and the Charmed Circle,
where physical evidence of the afterlife appeared right in front
of scientists. We'll be right back. You're listening to Shades
(26:17):
of the Afterlife on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast
AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
My name is Mark Rawlins, president of Paranormal Day dot Com.
Over five years ago, George Nori approached me with a
unique concept, a dating site for people searching for someone
with interest in UFOs, ghosts, Bigfoot, conspiracy theories, and the paranormal.
From that, Paranormal Day dot Com was born. It's a
unique site for unique people and it's free to join
(26:52):
to look around. If you want to upgrade and enjoy
more of our great features, use promo code George for
a great discount, So check it out.
Speaker 6 (26:59):
You got to lose Paranormal Day dot com.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
The Internet is an extraordinary resource that links our children
to a world of information, experiences, and ideas. It can
also expose them to risk. Teach your children the basic
safety rules of the virtual world. Our children are everything.
Do everything for them.
Speaker 5 (27:41):
Hey, it's the Wizard of Weird Joshua P. Warren. Don't
forget to check out my show Strange Things. Each week
as I bring you the world of the truly amazing
and bizarre right here on the iHeartRadio and Coast to
Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
Welcome back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sandra Champlain.
I know this is a different kind of episode discussing
the third prize winning essay of Bigelow Contest winner doctor
Leo Rugby. But for me, it's a rainy day outside
and it's interesting. So far, we have looked at the
idea that the afterlife is a time a destination in
(28:34):
the block universe. But if we look at this from
the mind of a skeptic, as we must always do,
they might say, yeah, Sandra, but all these stories are
about perceptions, their visions, their memories. But you can't touch
a ghost. And if they are real, why don't they
leave physical footprints. Well, doctor Rugby, who is actually an
(28:54):
expert on magic and deception, tackles this head on. He
argues that if a post is actually a consciousness slipping
into our timeline, it should theoretically be able to interact
with our physical world, and he presents evidence for what
he calls the charmed circle. This refers to a series
(29:16):
of experiments done in the early twentieth century by Nobel
prize winning scientists and doctors who wanted to test physical mediumship.
They weren't interested in messages of love. They wanted to
see ectoplasm. They wanted to see matter materialize. Doctor Rugby
(29:37):
highlights the famous experiments done at the Institute Metaphysique International
in Paris, involving a medium named Frank Klusky. The scientists
there devised an experiment that was designed to be fraud proof.
They wanted to catch a spirit hand in a way
(29:58):
that could not be faked by a human in hand.
So they placed bowls of hot, melted paraffin wax on
a table. They asked the medium to summon a spirit
entity to dip its hand in the hot wax, let
it cool into a glove, and then this is the
important part, de materialize their hand out of the wax
(30:21):
glove without breaking it. Imagine the physics of this. If
you or I dip our hand into wax, let it harden,
we're trapped right To get our hand out, we would
have to wiggle it, which would crack the wax, or
we would have to cut the wax. You cannot pull
a human hand out of a tight wax glove because
(30:42):
the wrist is more narrow than our knuckles, so it's
physically impossible. But in these experiments, under strict laboratory conditions,
this is exactly what happened. The medium, Frank Klusky, would
go into a trance, the scientists would hold his hands
to ensure he was not moving, and later, floating in
(31:03):
the water, they would find perfect hollow wax gloves. They
analyzed them. The gloves were seamless, there were no cuts,
there were no cracks, but the detail was what shocked them.
The wax had captured microscopic skin ridges, fingerprints, and lines.
(31:25):
Now imagine this. This is on the inside of the
wax gloves. When they brought these gloves in for forensic
experts to look at them, they found that the fingerprints
on the wax gloves did not match the fingerprints of
the medium, and they did not match anyone in the room.
They were fingerprints of a stranger, someone who had materialized,
(31:48):
dipped their spirit hand into wax, and then dissolved back
into the ether. Doctor Rugby points out that they even
tried to get professional magicians to duplicate this. The magicians failed.
The only way to create a seamless wax glove with
a narrow wrist is if the hand inside it simply
(32:10):
ceases to be solid. This is what doctor Rugby calls
the ghost in the machine. It is physical proof that
a consciousness from another time or dimension can enter our space,
becomes solid enough to dip their hand in wax and
then vanish again. But if they can touch wax, can
they touch technology? Doctor Rugby dedicates a fascinating section of
(32:34):
his essay to EVP Electronic voice Phenomena. He tells the
story of Friedrich Jurgensen. Jurgensen wasn't a ghost hunter. He
was a Swedish painter and a film producer. In nineteen
fifty nine, he was out in the countryside trying to
record bird songs for a documentary. He had a real
(32:54):
to real tape recorder. He set it up in a
quiet forest, recorded the birds, and then went home. When
he played the tape back, he heard the birds, but
then underneath the birds he heard a human voice. It
was faint, but it was clear. It was a woman's voice,
and she said something that froze his blood. She said, Friedel,
(33:20):
can you hear me? It's mommy. Friedel was the childhood
nickname only his mother used for him and his mother
had been dead for years. Jurgensen spent the rest of
his life recording these voices. He invited scientists to check
his equipment. They found no stray radio signals. They found
no trickery. Doctor Rugby argues that this is the modern
(33:43):
version of the wax glove. Instead of manipulating wax, the
time travelers are manipulating electrons. They are imprinting their voice
onto the magnetic tape. Today it might be your cell
phone or your computer. Rouckbeat saves his most impressive piece
of evidence for the category he calls intellectual proof. Sometimes
(34:07):
the best proof isn't a physical object, it's information. It's
knowledge that comes through that is so specific, so complex,
and so impossible for the living person to know that
it must come from somewhere else. Doctor Ruckbeat discusses the
phenomena called xenoglossy. This is when a person suddenly gains
(34:28):
the ability to speak a language they have never learned.
He cites the incredible case of utah udar Uta was
a woman living near Nagpur, India. She spoke her native language,
Marathi and some English. She did not know Bengali. In fact,
she had practically had no exposure to the Bengali culture. Suddenly,
(34:51):
seemingly out of nowhere, her personality shifted. She began calling
herself Sharata. When Sharata took over used to speak Marafi.
She spoke only fluid, rapid fire Bengali, but it wasn't
modern Bengali. Experts analyzed her speech and realized she was
(35:12):
speaking a dialect from the early eighteen hundreds, and she
didn't just know the words. She knew their culture. She
asked for foods that hadn't been cooked in India for
one hundred years. She didn't recognize modern technology like trains
or cars. She gave details about her family in the
eighteen thirties, their names, locations, and events. Researchers investigated. They
(35:37):
traveled to the village she named, They found the genealogy records,
and they found her. There really was a woman named
Shirata who lived in that village in the early nineteenth century.
Doctor Rugby argues that this fits with his time travel theory.
Utara wasn't just hallucinating. Her consciousness had somehow entangled with
(36:00):
the consciousness of Sharrata from the eighteen thirties, or perhaps
Sharrata had time traveled to inhabit Utara. Either way, you
cannot hallucinate a language you don't know. That information has
to come from somewhere. So this brings us to another
famous case, the case of intellectual proof. In doctor Rugby's
(36:22):
essay called Patience Worth. This story takes place in Saint
Louis in nineteen thirteen. It involves a woman named Pearl Current.
Pearl was an ordinary housewife. She left school at the
age of fourteen, and she had never traveled. She had
very little interest in literature or history. One evening, she
(36:43):
was playing with the Ouiji board with her friend, just
for fun, of course, and suddenly the planchet began to
move with incredible speed. It spelled out a message many
moons ago, I lived again. I come. Patience Worth is
my name. Over the next twenty four years, Pearl Current
(37:04):
produced through Luigi Board and later through direct dictation, a
staggering amount of literature. She wrote novels, plays, and thousands
of poems. But it wasn't just the quantity she produced,
it was the quality. The writing was brilliant. It received
critical acclaim from the New York Times. It was considered
(37:26):
some of the best literature of the era, but Here's
the impossible part that doctor Rugby focuses on. The vocabulary.
Patience Worth claimed to be from the seventeenth century, and
the novels she wrote were written in a specific archaic
dialect of seventeenth century English. Scholars analyzed the texts, the
(37:49):
writing contained thousands of words that had fallen out of
usage hundreds of years ago. It contained words that per
current with only her eighth grade education could not have
possibly known. For example, in one poem, Patient's Worth used
the word amulet as a verb meaning to give luck.
(38:11):
The scholars check the Oxford English Dictionary. Sure enough, in
the sixteen hundreds, amulet was used as a verb, but
that usage had been dead for centuries. And there was
one more detail that doctor Rugby highlights to prove this
was not Pearl's subconscious. Pearl could perform feats of divided attention,
(38:34):
so she could sit there and write a novel from
Patience Worth with one hand and simultaneously be carrying on
a conversation with a room full of people about a
completely different topic. If this were just Pearl's creativity, she
would need to focus, but she didn't. She acted like
(38:54):
a radio receiver. The signal from Patience Worth was coming
through her regardless of what Pearl was doing. Doctor Rugby
argues in his essay that this is the ultimate ghost
in the machine. Pearl Current became a time machine, her
consciousness tuned into the specific frequency of a woman from
(39:15):
the sixteen hundreds in patients Worth poured her intellect, her vocabulary,
and even her personality through Pearl. So we have the
wax gloves proving that spirits can interact with matter. We
have EVP proving they can imprint on electricity, we have
Sherata proving that they can bring back lost languages, and
(39:37):
we have Patience Worth proving they can bring back lost literature.
It paints a picture we are not alone in this
block universe. Doctor Rugby says, we are surrounded by layers
and layers of consciousness, all existing at once, all trying
to communicate. But if this is true, and the past
is alive and the dead are speaking to us, and
(40:00):
time is an illusion, what does this mean for you
and me? When we come back from the break, we're
going to talk about what it means to be a
time traveler. We'll discuss the comfort of the eternal now
and Doctor Rugby's final beautiful argument for why love is
the force that powers the machine. We'll be right back.
You're listening to Shades of the Afterlife on the iHeart
(40:23):
Radio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal Podcast Network.
Speaker 6 (40:35):
Stay there, Sandra will be right back.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
You're listening to the iHeartRadio and Coast to cost Am
Paranormal Podcast Network with the best shows that explore the paranormal, supernatural,
and the unexplained. You can enjoy all shows on the
iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you find your favorite
podcasts the best afterlife information you can get. Well, you're
(41:06):
all long Shades of the Afterlife with Sander Champlain. Welcome
back to Shades of the Afterlife. I'm Sander Champlain. If
(41:27):
you've been a longtime listener of the show, you know
these concepts we spoke about today, We've spoke about quite
often in the past five years. Don't forget to join
my mailing list at We Don't Die dot com and
I've got a list of episodes there for you on
these different topics. Back to Doctor Leo Rugby and his
(41:47):
Ghost in the Machine essay. You've heard these incredible stories
and you may be left with the question So what
if it is true that the afterlife is a time.
If it's true that we live in a block universe
where the past, present, and future are all existing at once,
how does that help us in our lives when we
(42:07):
are exploding with grief, crying at the kitchen table. How
does it help us when we look at the empty
chair at the dinner table. Doctor Rugby dedicates the conclusion
of his essay to shifting our perspective. He argues that
the pain of grief comes from a three dimensional misunderstanding
(42:28):
of the universe. We humans are used to thinking in
three D. In three D, things are either here or there.
If I move a cup from the table to the
kitchen sink, it has gone from the table. It can't
be in two places at once. We apply this limited
logic to people. We think Mom was here and now
she's gone. We think of life as a straight line,
(42:51):
a train track that runs from birth to death, and
when the train goes off the cliff, the journey is over.
But doctor Rugby asks to upgrade our thinking. He wants
us to start thinking like four dimensional beings. To understand this,
let's think of a movie reel. Imagine you are in
(43:11):
a movie theater. Watching a film. You're watching a scene
where the main character is getting married. It's happy. Then
the movie moves on. Ten minutes later, there's a funeral scene.
Now while you are watching the funeral, does the wedding
scene cease to exist? Did the film burn up? No,
the wedding scene is still there, wound up on the reel.
(43:35):
It is perfectly preserved. It is just as real as
the funeral scene. The only difference is the light of
the projector isn't shining on it right now. Doctor Rugby
argues that the universe is the real and your consciousness
is the projector. Just because the light of your focus
(43:55):
has moved to the twenty twenty six section of the real,
it doesn't mean the nineteen ninety nine section was destroyed.
The people in that section, your parents when they were young,
your children when they were babies, the friends you lost,
they are all still here. They're still laughing, and they're
(44:17):
still alive. Doctor Rugby writes that death is not an exit,
it is a shift in coordinate. This is a massive
shift for our mindset. It means that your loved ones
haven't ceased to exist. They have simply become invisible. To
your current moment. They are safe in the earlier chapters
(44:39):
of the book or on the film reel. Here is
the empowering part. You don't have to wait until you
die to rewind the film. Doctor Rugby argues that we
all have a built in time machine that allows us
to connect with those chapters right now, and that machine
is powered by one specific fur love. In his essay,
(45:03):
he calls this time tanglement. It's a play on the
quantum physics term entanglement. In physics, when two particles are entangled,
they remain connected forever, no matter how far apart they are.
If you spin one, the other spins instantly, even if
it's on the other side of the galaxy. Distance implies
(45:25):
nothing to them. Doctor Rugby argues that love is simply
the biological experience of quantum entanglement. When you love someone deeply,
your consciousness becomes entangled with theirs. You become part of
the same system. That is why crisis apparitions happen. That
(45:46):
is why the mother felt the sphere of light when
her son died. That is why the husband saw his
wife's ghost. The entanglement doesn't break just because the physical
body stops working. The wire is still alive. So how
can we use this? Based on doctor Rugby's essay and
the wisdom we've shared today, here are three instructions for
(46:09):
living as a time traveler. Instruction number one, change your coordinates.
When you are missing someone, stop looking up. We have
been trained to look at the sky and imagine they
are in a far away heaven beyond the clouds. But
doctor Rugby suggests they aren't up. They are. Then, instead
(46:29):
of looking up, look back, but don't look back with sadness.
Look back with presence. Use your memory not as a
dusty photo album, but as a portal. Close your eyes
and travel back to a moment when you were together.
See the room, smell the coffee, hear their laugh. According
(46:50):
to the block universe theory, you aren't just imagining that moment.
You are tuning your consciousness to a coordinate where that
moment is still happening. You are visiting them in the
eternal now. Doctor Rugby suggests that because of entanglement, when
you focus on them with love, you are lighting up
(47:12):
that connection. You are ringing the bell. You are literally
spending time with them. Instruction number two, trust the glitches.
Doctor Rugby's essay is full of glitches, time slips, evp voices,
sudden visions. He argues that the veil between now and
(47:32):
then is much thinner than we think. So when you
see a sign, trust it. If you smell their perfume
when no one is there, don't disregard it as a
memory or an illusion. It's a time slip. If you
hear their voice in your head giving you advice, don't
dismiss it as your imagination. It's a transmission. If you
(47:54):
have a dream where they feel incredibly real, believe it.
You have met in the dimension where you are both free.
We often block these communications because our rational three D
brains say that's impossible. But remember the women at Versailles.
The rational brains told them it was impossible. But the
(48:15):
bridge and the Queen we're right there in front of them.
The universe is stranger and much more beautiful than our
logic allows, and Instruction number three live fearlessly. This is
an important one. If doctor Rugby is right, if we
truly are ghosts in a time machine, then there is
(48:36):
no such thing as the end. We spend so much
of our lives terrified about the finish line. We worry
about running out of time. We worry about aging, we
worry about being forgotten. But in a four D universe,
nothing is ever forgotten, because nothing is ever lost. Every
smile you give, every act of kindness, every moment of
(48:59):
love is recorded forever in the fabric of space time.
It's indestructible. This means you can stop racing against the clock.
You can slow down, you can savor the moment you
are in right now, because this moment is your contribution
to eternity. And when it comes time for your own transition,
(49:19):
you don't need to be afraid. Remember the story of
Vita and Sarah. Remember the Welcoming Committee. When you step
out of your physical body, you aren't stepping into the void.
You are simply stepping out of the time machine and
returning to the larger reality. And who is waiting for you. Everyone?
(49:40):
Your parents, your grandparents, the friends you've lost, the pets
you've loved. They're all there, standing on the platform, waiting
for your train to arrive. Doctor Rugby finishes his essay
by challenging the old idea of the ghost in the machine.
The philosopher Gilbert Ryle coin that term to make fun
(50:02):
of the soul. He thought the idea of a spirit
driving a body was ridiculous. He thought we were just
biological robots or toasters that made toast until we broke.
But doctor Rugby says, we realize that it is the
physical body that creates time. For the mind, the ghost
(50:24):
is not just in a machine, but in a time machine.
My friend, you are the driver. Your body is the vehicle.
Time is the road, and love is the fuel. The
vehicle will eventually break down, the road will eventually end,
but the driver is eternal. One last thought as we
(50:45):
go our separate ways today. I know that talking about
time travel and four dimensions can feel a little weird
and not our typical episode, especially when we're missing somebody
we love. It might be interesting to hear about physics,
but then you're thinking, I just want to have my
mom back, or my dad back, or my child back.
(51:07):
Doctor Rugby's theory offers us something that is comforting. If
he is right that the past is real and our
consciousness exists outside of time, then it means the moments
that you shared with your loved ones aren't gone. They
didn't dissolve into nothingness just because the clock ticked forward.
Think about a favorite book you might have read. Just
(51:30):
because you have turned to chapter ten, it doesn't mean
that chapter three no longer exists. Chapter three is still there, fixed, permanent,
and beautiful. The characters in chapter three are still alive,
still laughing, and still loving right there in the book.
Your life is that book. Your loved ones are not erased.
(51:50):
I promise you that they are safe in the eternal
now and now. As Doctor Rugby suggests, since this spirit
is a time traveler, they aren't just stuck back in
chapter three. They can skip forward to read over your
shoulder right now in chapter ten. So as you go
through your week, try to remember you aren't losing time.
You are collecting it, and one day you will step
(52:14):
out of the timeline and see that a whole beautiful
story all at once. I hope our trilogy of Proof
from the Bigelow Institute has given you a foundation to
stand on. Of course, you can revisit some of our
past episodes like first Prize winner Doctor Jeffrey mischlv and
episode two hundred and forty four and Doctor Pym Van
(52:35):
lommel And Episode two hundred and seventy three, And I
encourage you to read some of these essays. Yourself. There's
so many more. Just go to Bigelowinstitute dot org and remember,
come visit me at weedotdie dot com. Come join me
on our free Sunday gathering inspirational service with medium demonstration included. Also,
(52:59):
if you're interested in EVP and capturing those images from
the other side, at the bottom of the main page
you'll see our film about researcher Sonia Andaldi, and also
our new film called Evidence of the Afterlife, saving Evidential Mediumship.
I'm Sander Champlain and from the bottom of my heart,
(53:20):
thank you for listening to Shades of the Afterlife on
the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast am Hearinormal podcast Network.
Speaker 2 (53:37):
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Day and Paranormal podcast Network. Make sure and check out
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to iHeartRadio dot com.
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