April 23, 2026 • 47 mins
Entrepreneur and author Emma Grede joins Angie Martinez to talk about the inspiration behind her book “Start With Yourself,” how women can advocate for themselves and control their finances, and what it’s like to be a leader of a company. Plus, Emma responds to a fan who wants to know how to ask your employer for a raise or to be compensated in a way they deserve.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I love that you identified your own anger issues and
then went and then got help for your anger issues.
Nobody like, nothing terrible happened. Nobody had to intervene.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Yeah, because I knew that that wasn't matching up to
the life that I wanted. I wouldn't be able to
take me and my little angry, crazy girl self and
do the things that I wanted to do. And that
was so clear to me. I said, this is not
going to row. It's not going to work in a workplace.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Hey guys, this episode is brought to you by boost Mobile.
When you look at the word boss, I mean her
face should just appear. As a young kid in London.
She was born an entrepreneur. She built billion dollar brands
like Good American and Skims, all while being a wife
and a mother of four. She's a trailblazer in business,
breaking barriers. Her debut book, Start with Yourself, is out
(00:47):
now and it got gems in it. Emma Greed is
our guest today on I rel Name Pierre. Emma. You
are out here working. I am out in these straight
I don't know if it's my algorithms gives me you,
my algorithm serves.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Me angling my way to you, Auntie, get me close down.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
No, no, but you are working. We met recently for
the first time, not that recently in years. Was it
a year at the Skims Lawn store launch here.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
In New York store launch. You were busy now you were,
you know, around with your friends and all, and.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
You were no, you were already like no. They came
up to me and they were like, Emma Greed would
like to meet you. I was like, I would love
to meet her.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
And I always I have no shame anyone I want
to meet. I'm like, I want to meet her. Can
you introduce me? Do you know her? I think it
was Tiana Taylor or somewhere. I was just literally like,
I want to meet Angie.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Oh, it's so sweet. It was, it was, It was lovely,
but yes, we didn't have a time to connect that.
I think even from that moment, even to now, from
last year to now, has your life changed tremendously or
it's just just from the outside that it seems like
it's changed.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Great question. You know, my life hasn't changed at all, really,
But it's so funny because I don't know that my
life feels like it's changed. For a really long time.
You know, there's such an interesting perception that's out there,
and honestly, it's one of the reasons that I wrote
this book because I honestly feel like people see one
version of you, and the reality of your life is
so different. So I was like, let me write a book.
(02:19):
It tells the truth about actually my life and what
it is.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
It's not just the book though, it's the podcast. It's
your public presence is way more significant than it was
a year ago, for real.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
But my work life hasn't changed. My life life hasn't changed.
And that's what I mean. I think the perception does
a funny thing. You know what it's like if you
have a bit of a following and people see you
on social media, they conflate the two things. They imagine
that you ran into your office, took a picture at
your desk, and went about your day. It's like, no,
I am working, like I'm actually working. I go in,
I work a role, I have a job. And so
(02:53):
it's interesting that people have become much more interested in me.
But the reality of my life is it hasn't changed
very much all but your profile, their profile has shifted,
and that I'm very aware of it's purposeful. I think
I'm trying to do it in a way where I
can equate what I've got now with some impact, because
I really know that there's so much that I can do,
(03:16):
and I'm very very focused.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, sometimes fame, because it's not fame you're really after,
but it's fame comes with the profile that you now have.
And I just wonder if it's I don't know, done
anything to you, surprise you in any way challenging to manage.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
You know, for me, it's so interesting because all I
get is amazing women. You know, I'm not like famous, famous,
so no one's like checking for what I'm wearing. I
live like a normal and normal life. What I get
is women will stop me on the street. They will
slide me little notes in restaurants. I got this beautiful
note from this lady the other day, and I could
(03:53):
have cried. I was interviewing someone at the time, so
I couldn't read it.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
I put it in my bag.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
I got home and I was like you, she said,
you know. She was like, Emma, you have to understand
how much you mean to women like me, how much
you mean to women who come from a place where
they might not have had the right start, but they
are working and they're trying, and it was so heartfelt,
and she was so privileged. First of all, she didn't
even put her name or contact detail on there. She
(04:17):
just wanted me to know. And so I get a
lot of that and that, of course I never used
to get, you know, But at the end of the day,
it's my life is still the same. My life is
a series of problems every single day. You know, no
one calls me to say everything's going right. You know
we're selling out. They only call me with problems, and
so it hasn't changed all that much.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
You have to know that this book is set up
for a humongous success. I mean, do you see that already?
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Is that?
Speaker 2 (04:41):
I hope? So? Yes, I mean so far. Listen, I'm
a day in so I don't want to come as
too much.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
You have poured it so much in here that I
really want to use this as like, I don't know,
just the frame of our conversation. And then somewhere in
the beginning you mentioned women being exhausted, exhausted right exhaust
Somewhere in the beginning of it you said that, and
I thought, yes, women are exhausted because it's it's it's career,
(05:08):
it's emotional health, it's a family, it's mother parenting, it's
all love.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
All relentless. It's relentless. We're getting so much phone at
us all the time that I thought, I'm going to
write a book that people use, not that they read,
because we've got enough to do. And so it was
really important to me that people would read this and
then they would get something and they could put it
into action in their lives.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
I love how honest you are in the book about
some of the you know, anger and forgiveness and your
way of navigating some real life things. So we'll go
through that. But in this in the scheme of business
and money, I've heard you many times.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
Talk about my favorite subject?
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Is it really? It is money?
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Yeah? I want it to be every woman's favorite subject.
That's the time I'm working on that.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
It's this is a big mistake I've made in my life, right,
It's like I feel like, yes, it's because I came
from a family and and a mentality of you know,
money isn't everything. Money can't shouldn't control you. Money is
the root of all evil. You know, all they care
about is money, you know, like really, And it's not
(06:20):
that I don't enjoy some of that.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Is like money doesn't solve all your problems, but it
solves all your money problems. And I feel like we
have to advocate for it for ourselves because no one's
coming to find you, no one's coming to give you
money or power or any of that. And I do
feel like as women, we have to take a level
of responsibility for the fact that we don't talk about
money as to why it eludes us, Why does it
(06:43):
miss us? Why are men paid so much more than women?
Why is that the case that it's so much easier
for men to raise money than it is for women.
And we all know that there are systemic barriers, there
are systems that keep us small. But at the end
of the day, we also have a part to play
in all of that, and I want us to recognize
that and recognize that we can change our behavior and
get more of it.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
What are we doing wrong? What's the number one thing
we do wrong?
Speaker 2 (07:06):
We are not talking about it now, We're just not talking.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
How does that look? What does that look like?
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Tell you what it looks like? First of all, it's
like education, right, I think about myself as always in
learning mode. Every day I'm learning something. And I learned
about money because much like you, I didn't come from
a place where a we had any money, so there
wasn't that much to talk about. It was always that
what don't we have? Where are we going to spend
what we don't have? How we keeping the lights on?
That That's what I learned. But when I got into
(07:30):
the professional environment, it was always like, you don't share
with your colleagues what you earn. You don't talk about money.
That's crass. And actually, what I think that we need
to do is put money right in the center of
our plans. We need to say I am worth this,
this is what I should be being paid. And we
need to educate ourselves. So you need to understand your mortgage,
you need to understand your investment planning, you need to
(07:51):
understand what's in your future. And if you don't know,
you've got to get to know. You've got to make
it your business because money and power then linked right,
inextricably linked. And we're in a place and time in
the world right now where we actually need more women
in positions of power. But again it's not gonna happen
with us. It's not gonna happen passively. It's our responsibility
to say, you know what, I need more of this,
(08:14):
and I'm going to advocate for myself, and I'm going
to educate myself, and I'm gonna learn as much as
I possibly can. And that's what I do all the time.
I ask questions.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
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you navigate? Because it's a little different when I think
about what you do in business. But you're also a
creative he little.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
I'm a creative business warm.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
You are a creative business owner for sure. No, And
so I think sometimes where creative is concerned, like what
comes first, the creative or the opportunity to make money?
You know, I don't know. I just I just wonder
how you navigate that. Or all money ain't all money,
ain't good money. It's all money good money.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
I mean, I don't know most money's good money. I
don't know about you. He's a big money I think
most money is good money. Here's a being. I think
that it's really important that you're not sacrificing yourself for money, right.
I still think at the end of the day, I'm
still Emma from East London. I'm exactly the same person
that I was when I was twelve years old. Yeah,
there's not our integrity like bending or no, because I
(10:26):
don't think that you have to. I actually think that
you can care about money and care about a lot
of other things too. You can do deeply meaningful, impactful work,
creative work and be paid for it. And what we've
done is we've said, like, I'm a creative I'm a
nonprofit I do something so worthy therefore, and I'm like,
absolutely not the two things can exist at the same time.
(10:48):
And too often we're giving away our gifts for free
before we've even valued ourselves, before we've even valued the service.
I'm like, there is never a time when it makes
sense to give something for free without a plan. I
worked for like a full year for free, like doing
workplacements back in the day when you could do that.
But it was always with a plan and a goal
(11:09):
for what I wanted. On the other side, it was
always with an aim that I'm going to get a
job at one of these places that's going to be
my entry point into fashion. So you have to have
a plan if you're giving away your services for free,
and you have to have a plan as to how
you're going to get to the money. That's important. That's
important stuff.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Yeah. I think there's also you know, if you're a
business person, there's great stuff in here, but also just life.
There's just great life lessons in here. Like you talk
about planning your life in your twenties and your thirties
and then your forties you had a plan, like what
is my forties going to be?
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Solarly?
Speaker 1 (11:42):
I love this because we just had Jill Scott on
the other I love Joe. I died so Jill was on.
We had a great episode with Jill and she has
a theory about twenties, thirties, forties. It was Jill said,
when you're in your twenties you work hard.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Facts.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
In your thirties you work smart. In your forties, work
how you want. In your fifties you work when you want,
and in your sixties you work if you want.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Love. Jill's got it down right, and she has got
it so down it's so good to me. Like that
is so good because that thing about like how you
work in your twenties, right, it's like there's a time
and a place, And I think what people don't really
understand is that life is so long. Like even the
idea that she's taken us from twenties to seventies, right,
it's that there's fifty years in between that. But we
(12:31):
really sort of overestimate what you can do in a
year and underestimate what you can do in ten. So
I like to make these plans for myself because it
helps kind of ground me in my decision making. I
know what to say no to because I know if
it's not taking me closer to one of my goals,
I don't need to do it, but I like to.
And I set the book up in the beginning I say,
have a vision for your life. That's not a vision board,
(12:54):
and it's not manifestation. So explained though that clearly ambition
needs to find you working. You cannot think your way
or consume your way. I love a podcast. I have
a podcast, but it's like you can't listen to podcasts
and think that that's going to get you closer to
where you want to go. You want to do the
work right. It's that we have to and.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
Even the best seventy five self help.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Book doesn't matter. That's not going to help you. You
have to help yourself. And so I think when you
have a vision for like what type of person do
I want to be? What type of woman do I
want to be? What type of care and what are
my values? What are my principles, and then you work
out what you want your life to be like based
on that, you say, like, these are the things that
are important to me. My family is really important to me.
(13:36):
So I'm going to make sure that I've ring fenced
these moments in the year to do these things because
I want those memories. I'm going to prioritize X, Y
and Z in my work life because it's important that
I make this money and that won't happen unless I
get to there. So I think the plan is really
about mapping things out and then having a path and
where you're going to work towards it. It's not a
(13:58):
vision border.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
It's also helpful full two so that you don't waste
your time doing things that don't serve you.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Right, Like, that's part of that Who had years like that?
Who had years where we get lost and we get
taken on someone else's agenda and that's what I don't want.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
You said. You were talking here about how women, especially
we care so much about other people's things, Like it's
somebody underpaid, is somebody working too hard, it's somebody like
you for your kids, worry about everyone else but yourself
last on your list.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
And I actually want to make sure that we are
like right at the top of our list of priorities.
As a mother of four, I think people get very
put off by that idea of me saying, you know,
I put myself first. I start with myself. But when
I'm good everyone, they.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Can't wait to you like all the things Miranda, Miranda,
they can't wait to do that to a successful women.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
With me time. We're held to very different standards than
successful men, right because we have to be you know,
nurturing and empathetic and a baller and look good and
an incredible worfe And it's like that's impossible. That's why
I wrote this book.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
That's why women are exhausted.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
That's why we're exhausted that I want to say, like
there's a trade off, there is a way to do this,
you know. I feel like Oprah said it best. She said,
you can have it all but not all at the
same time, which is really true. But I want women
to choose. I don't want us to be kind of
taken on a journey. And I think that this book
is going to teach people how you get the choice.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
But also you've you've chosen well in a partner.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Oh god damn, yes, who's helped you?
Speaker 1 (15:38):
You talk about like the importance of you don't want
a business partner that's that you don't share responsibilities with equally,
and you don't want a marriage also where your partner
is not sharing.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
I think who you choose to spend your life with
your private life is probably the most important business decision
you'd ever make, because they're either going to add to
you or they're going to really take away. And if
you don't have someone who's in support of the greater
vision of you and yourself, like you are in trouble.
Like you're in so much trouble.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
Did you know that going into marriage?
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Yeah, you know what? I knew that. I mean, my
husband's Swedish, right, Like Swedish society is very interesting. It's
very matriarchal society, so there's this kind of balance from
the get go. But I also never assumed that I
would be the lead parent and have to teach him stuff.
You know, it's like I'm going to teach him how
to change a diaper and make a sandwich. Like no,
like he's going to figure that stuff out. But I'm
(16:31):
also I'm not going to micro manage my husband. I
don't think that's my job. And you know, I really
believe that I have a life and he has a life,
and we have this incredible life together. But I wasn't
going to sacrifice the things that I wanted, and I
was lucky that I had a husband who was who
is unbelievably supportive.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
I just think for women who are looking for that partner,
if you have to be conscious of that as you're
looking for the partner, Like did you stumble into that
and then maybe at tracked, Oh you attracted that.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I think I attract that because that's the only type
of partner I've ever had, Like, I don't I think
that you know in that in that early process, like
you know, people show you, they tell you who they are,
they tell you how they're going to be, you see
how they move.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
I never went through like a young There was never
a young and like a young bad decisions.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
A night maybe, but no longer. No longer I made
stupid decisions like in a moment, and I realized in
the morning that that was not for me. I was like,
oh you know, I yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Like I would never like it's a bad boys or anything.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Not a chance. You know, I don't have the disposition
for it. You let me down, I am out. I'm gone.
I just do you know what I mean? I have
such a and it isn't even about like high self worth.
It's just like low tolerance. Yeah, Like I have zero
tolerance for someone who's going to mess me around, like
miss the phone call. I'm like bye, Like no, do
you know what I mean? Because I never believe that like,
(18:01):
oh they get better, like things are going to change.
I'm like, they don't. It won't move on. And also
they were like so many boys when I was little,
you know, you're out here, oh here saying out. I
was like fashionable, Just move on and try something else.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
You never went to let me fix somebody or any
of that type of thing. No, really good.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
But there's not to say I didn't have like some
not so great boyfriends that were like, you know, messing
around and doing whatever. That they were doing, but like
not with me knowing and not with me tolerating anything.
Do you know what I mean. It's like, there's just.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
Yeah, So it wasn't so much that you were looking
for this type of partner. It's that your behavior warranted
and you found somebody because you were moving around that way.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
It was like, so, and I think I have really
high standards, not just that with everyone around me, right,
it's like my entire team. I have high standards. But
also I give a lot, and I think when you're
a person who gives a lot and has high expectations,
like that comes back to you. And so as soon
as I get a ignore, it's like anything. Right, If
I get a signaled that something's off that I'm not
(19:04):
getting equal back, it's like I'm gone to get bye,
I'm gone. It's that's the East London in me though,
you know. That's like where I come from. You don't
suffer fools Like you are expected to tell the truth,
to do what you say you're going to do, to
be true to your word, and suffer the consequences if
you don't. So it's like I don't have time for
foolish Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
Plus a woman on a mission.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I want a mission at a time, like literally, but
you know that literally, like I don't have the energy,
like I would lose my I would lose it. Yeah,
lose it.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
There's there's a I don't even need my cards because
were it goes naturally?
Speaker 2 (19:36):
And what were you just talking about being angry?
Speaker 1 (19:40):
I know where you're going. No, No, it wasn't about
the anger anger issues. But after you talked about that,
I love that you identified your own anger issues and
then went and then got help for your anger issues.
Nobody like, nothing terrible happened, nobody had to intervene. When
I first heard that you had you went to anger
therapy management, I was like, oh god, something, she must
(20:00):
have been arrested or something. No, she had an incident
on the train and she was like, oh God, I'm
so angry. And then went and fixed it yourself. You
identified the problem within yourself, yes, and went and worked
on it.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Because I knew that that wasn't matching up to the
life that I wanted. I wouldn't be able to take
me and my little angry, crazy girl self and do
the things that I wanted to do. And that was
so clear to me. I was like, this is not
going to roll, it's not going to work in a workplace.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
So you worked on that, you got a hold of that,
managed that.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
And I still work on that every day, really yes,
and I still sometimes lose it because I can go
eyes with people and they're just like, you know, I,
it's something that you have to work on every single day,
like like in the same way that I work on
being really sad.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Well, what is that? What is that? What does that?
Speaker 2 (20:46):
I think that is like I'm hardwired like that. I
am not, you know, I think it's so much a
factor of my upbringing. You know, I wasn't taught to
be thoughtful. We certainly weren't. I wasn't ever taught that
you could like take a breath and move past something.
I was always taught that if something happened to you
because someone was disrespecting someone was like that, you were
(21:08):
going to look after yourself and you were going to
lash out. And that just becomes like a pattern, like
a loop in your system, and it wires and wires
and it gets more and more attuned unless you deal
with it. And so I think that that is very
much who I am, and I have to work all
the time and make sure that I keep keep myself
(21:28):
like my head up by boarder, keep practicing, keep training.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
I wondered if it was part or if sometimes it
could be triggered by because I know a lot of amazing,
super high functioning women, right, and there is an impatience.
Like the women that I know that I like run
big companies and stuff, they're all kind of impatient.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Yeah, I'm definitely impatient, like and so I can.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
See that the triggering anger and almost anger.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Here's my thing. I've worked every single one of the jobs, right,
so it's like I have an understanding for what it
takes to pack the boxes, to do the assistant job,
to work your way up the ranks, to be a like,
you know, mid level executive. I did all the things,
and so you like, you know, can you do you
swear on this shark?
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Yes? Please?
Speaker 2 (22:15):
You know we always started on yet today what I
but it's like, you know, in England they say you
can't fuck a fucker, Like I am a person understands.
So if you come to me with an excuse, if
you come to me telling me it's going to take
three hours, and I can do it in forty five minutes,
I'm like, I have been there, I did that thing,
So then I have an impatience, but I'm not going
to get angry about that. I feel like the things
(22:36):
that I get angry about are when I feel like
people don't care, because I care the most. I care
about everything. I care about the glass, the tablecloth, the
thing that like I'm you know, it's like that. That's
how I come into what I do. And so if
you show a lack of care, anger, right, I'm gonna
(22:57):
take a deep breath so you won't work with me
for very.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
I understand too deeply what you're saying, and I have
actually worked on that, right, Britt, I'm better now. I
used to be very It's also you expect people. Beyonce
talked about this once. I think it was her special
like she does. Would do the rehearsals and she wouldn't eat,
she wouldn't sleep, she wouldn't drink, and then she realized, oh,
other people need to sleep and eat. And it's and
(23:23):
you expect people to operate how you operate, and if
you let it frustrate you because they don't, how can
you really be a good leader because you can't. You
can't You can't.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Also, they don't have the same thing to gain as you. Like,
You've got to get real, Like I'm out here doing
what I do. Everybody around me is not got the
same circumstance and they don't have the same upside. So
also I'm realistic. Yeah, you know, if I'm paying you
two hunder ground, I expect two hundred ground of you,
not a million dollars like we're talking about.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
So really, you don't have.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
The same to gain as I do. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Oh so, but the anger thing, it wasn't so much
about the anger management. It was you said that you
still working on forgiveness.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
Oh, yes, I'm not a good forgiver. Yeah I'm not.
Because you know, it's so funny. I did the Hoffmann process.
You know what that is. Oh, it's like such an
l a thing, but it is. It's an incredible process,
like like a you know, nine day intensive therapy process
where you learn all your patterns and you undo your
childhood trauma and all that.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
This sounds very expensive.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
It's expensive, and it's expensive on your like it it's
socially odd like it's like it's such a it's such
a like a deep deep dig and I just you know.
It was one of those things where you're kind of
expected to come out forgiving everything that's kind of happened
to you. And I got to the nine days and
(24:45):
everybody's like yeah, and I was like no, but still no,
still no. But that's like you know again about I'm boundary, right,
It's like I can understand, you know, if somebody slights me,
it's not actually always about and I think as far
as it comes to like childhood trauma, it's like I
can understand it. It doesn't always mean that you need
(25:07):
to forgive.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah, you know, but the way you talk about that
here is you're more likely to instead of forgive somebody.
Oh my god, do you know J Scott, because I
feel like there's so many similar things you should know.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
You should introduce me. I would die because.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
I'm thinking of our interview with her because even in that,
even how you explained, we have a clip of her
going saying, I'm much more likely to forget you than
forgive you. And you talk about that here. You say,
you know it's not worth your time, it's like or
your patient. So you rather just I'm not gonna forgive you.
You just cut you out of the fabric of my life.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
I always think about this idea of like who like
you operate on like these orbits, And I have people
that are in my inner orbit, and I have people
that are outer and more out, And it's like, you
don't have to like, you know, be out of my life,
but you just might not be one of my like
inner circle people. Right, So I'm operating on a system
that says, like you just might have to like be
(26:05):
a couple out, a couple of steps removed. I don't
need to cut people, although I have done that in
the past, But to me, it's like it's just like
there's an inner circle. They're an expectation and I'm not
gonna my value.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
When do you care enough to work on like that
forgiveness or.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
With my husband, you know, that's that's yeah, he's the
only one trying to think everybody else, you know, God bless,
God bless.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
That's really.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Sorry. Hey listen, Oh, so you do transcendental meditation too.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
It's my that's one of the biggest tools that I have.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
How long have you been doing this?
Speaker 2 (26:52):
So I think I did a course. That's a great question.
I want to say, like maybe.
Speaker 1 (26:56):
Three years, okay, and it's one of religion.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
So I don't so I don't do You're supposed to
do twenty minutes a day twice a day, that never
ever happens. But I do do it. I would say
I do twenty minutes a day in the morning, three
or four times a week. And it is a game
changer because I always thought of meditation as something that
turns the noise down. Really I actually think it gives
you energy, gives you space and clarity, and so for me,
(27:20):
it was one of those things that I was like, wow,
this is this is an insane tool that I never
envisaged I would ever use, but it really really works
as something to create some opportunity to slow things down
and call the play like that's what I like to do.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Tried this. How did you find specific meditation too where
you have to say.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
The word you have a mantra.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
I was doing it for a little while, like a
couple of months, and I did notice a difference, and
I just fell off the regimen of the day. I
need to get back on it. And I only got
to ten minutes.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Okay, but that's good.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
They never get past ten when we've got like you,
like they say say, twenty times is when you feel
the real effects.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
The game changer in the twenty is a game change.
You just got to find your perfect time. And also,
I think this again, it's like, yeah, it'd be great
if you had like forty minutes every day to do it.
I think you just find that twenty and for someone
might be interested, for someone who might be interested, you
get a word of mind. Yeah, yep, you say the
word over and over again and you're meditating on the word,
(28:20):
on the word and what does it do for you?
Speaker 1 (28:22):
How does it?
Speaker 2 (28:23):
What does it do it? Literally like imagine it takes
like the temperature down. There's only two things that do
this for me, Like when you you're you know, because
I'm in a constant conversation with myself, Like I'm thinking
about what is happening over there, what's happening next, what
we've got tomorrow, what the kids need, what my husband
just spoke to me about what I'm doing in one company.
(28:45):
It's like like my brain is like this all the time.
It literally is like it's almost like everything just comes
down to this like very quiet place and you end
up having space and in the space comes something like
literally like it's almost like a little gift, Like something
will come in and you're like, oh, I did not
(29:05):
see that, and it becomes clearer, you figure out what
you need to do. I come out with so much energy,
like so much clarity. It's crazy. It's so it really
is to me, Like you know when people say it's
a game changer, it's like, no, it changed your game,
it will change the way that you move. You're going back.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
I'm going back in Brittany gout to five minutes, right,
you go to five I tried together, and I was like,
if it's really I'm feeling a difference. I just didn't
get I didn't get to I didn't go up again.
And it's hard.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
It's hard to sign new things. Like so much of
what I talk about this in this book is like
it's really difficult to untrain your ways, especially when you
get to a certain age. It's hard to stop telling
yourself the stories. But you have to make sure that
what's happening in your own head is not like bad
for you, right, that your biggest enemy isn't living in
(30:00):
your own mind. And so I really tried to make
the things that I do like I have a big
positive impact on me, and that transcendental is one of
those things.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
What is the what is something that you've had to
unlearn recently about yourself?
Speaker 2 (30:14):
I think honestly that I wasn't going to be capable
of writing. You know, I'm dyslexic, highly highly dyslexic. And
so I fixed my work and my life around almost
never writing anything down, you know, like never, I speak
every email on my phone, I speak every text in
I never. You know, when when in your adult life
(30:35):
do you write like in that type of way? And
so I thought a book would be impossible for me.
The other thing is like I wrote the book totally
back to front. I started with all the things that
were easy to me, building a business, making a career
of your dreams, and the leadership money bomb Bomb wrote
it like Cho Choun spoke it all into the phone.
And then I was like, well, why can I do
that stuff? And then I got to the managing emotions.
(30:58):
Then I got to the vision part. But it was
very very hard for me to organize my thoughts. And
once I had it together, there was this sense of
achievement like I was like wow, But that took a
lot of doing because I was constantly telling myself, telling
my agent, telling everyone around me. I was like, I'll
never do a book. I'll never do that. I can't
I literally can't do that. That's not for me.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Turned out, I'm so surprised that you would say that
those kind of things to yourself.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Because you know, when you're a person of you know better, Emma,
you know I should know better. But when you're a
person of certainty, like you're certain about a lot of things,
you're certain about what you can do, you're so certain
about what you can't do, and I'm like, that's not
for me. Like, you know, I can look at an
outfit and be like, that's not for me, that my
body doesn't worked that way, I can't wear that. And
I'm like, oh, that's kind of cute.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
I wore that. We have a voice note? Should we
go a voice No? Now, Hey guys, you ever signed
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Customers will pay twenty five dollars a month as long
as they remain active on the Boost Unlimited plan. All right,
we have a segment. It is called it's a Voicenowe segment.
So this is a fan or listener of the pod news.
You're going to be here. How's a question our comments?
I'm gonna play that. Hi. My name is Tanisha.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
I'm thirty and I have been having a hard time
getting credit for the ideas that are actually present. How
do I get compensated for something like that? Because I
obviously I have left the organization. I didn't get any
conversation or credit for that idea, but it is an
idea that has sustained that program moving forward, So how
do you navigate situations like that to avoid.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Being put in that position? I used to stuff from this,
I will hold everything in because I'd be freedobody who's
going to rob me?
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Wow? See it terrible. I don't know about that kind
of I mean to me, that signal scarcity mindset. But
if we talk about like what Tarnisha is actually saying,
she's obviously in an environment where her ideas can be
taken because she is being paid to give ideas to
do whatever job she's doing. And then she's in an
environment where those ideas can be taken and used. But
(33:35):
it's not she's not working for herself. She's working for
an employer. That means she is being paid and compensated
for our ideas. You don't get to get the full value.
And I do honestly think that sometimes employees can overestimate
their contribution. If you're in a place where you're being
paid to do a job, you have to do that job.
That job might be giving some of your ideas. Now,
(33:56):
if you are doing something that is beyond the expectation
of your remit and you're going above and beyond, you
need to go and have a conversation about your additional contribution.
But I think that it's kind of naive to think
that you know you're going to be contributed, you're going
to be compensated beyond what you're being paid when you're
(34:16):
just giving your idea, Like, do you know what I mean?
It's there's there's so much more to business. It's like,
there's so much more that goes into things, and I
think sometimes we can have a little bit of a
naivety about our contribution.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
Yeah, also because I can't let one hundred people have
the same idea, and not everybody can get it across
the finish line. So an idea is really just an idea.
Speaker 2 (34:36):
Well it's just an idea because it takes a lot
of people to execute it, a lot of people to
create the things. But again, if this is somebody that
feels chronically undervalued, and I've been in that same situation,
I've been in a place where I thought I was
delivering value and I talk about it in the book,
to a company they were making a lot of money
and I didn't feel like I was making enough. But
(34:57):
the company were like, Emma, we pay you for this job.
You are paid and we make a lot of money
out of it. I was like, Okay, I'll take my
services elsewhere and that was the beginning of my first business.
But they weren't wrong. I wasn't wrong either. But sometimes
we have to know that there's nuance in the situation.
You just might have to take your gifts and your
(35:17):
services elsewhere to realize the full potential of what you're doing.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
But you're probably going to be realistic with yourself. Is
that like one one kind of flop idea, one kind
of limp, you know what I mean? Or do you
have many ideas that could expend any business?
Speaker 4 (35:31):
Do you do?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
You have so many ideas that you could pay yourself
what you're being paid currently and if you don't like again,
it's never that black and white. In the book, I
talk so much about negotiation, right. Negotiation isn't one side
winning or losing. You've got to find something mutually advantageous
to go and have a conversation, talk about and understand,
but go with specificity. You know this would be the conversation.
(35:55):
To me, I'd be like, let's roll, So you guys
are paying me sixty five thousand dollars and I came
up with X idea that netted the business X. You're
going to know those exes. You're going to have those numbers.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
I mean, don't come.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Emotion nearly will it. Don't be sad, don't be angry,
don't be silly. It's like, come in factually right and
paid this. I delivered this. The contribution was this. Once
you've got that, you say, you know what, I would
really imagine that my contribution in this company is worth
eighty five thousand. Oh we're not ready to pay you that. Okay,
what do I need to do to get from here
(36:30):
to here? You show me how can you value me
and my ideas? Because if you're unable to do that,
then I would need to move on because I can't
see how I would be contributing above this. It's a conversation.
You don't need to be stupid about it. You can
joke for yourself because, let me tell you, half the time,
the people that are in charge don't fully understand your contribution.
(36:51):
They may not know where the idea comes from. They
also might be coming from a place that they see
it differently. And that feedback is important for you to have.
It's important for you to understand and well, actually you
think we made X, but the costs associated with this
there were five other departments involved. Then you can be like, oh,
I got it, okay, so actually this is what it
was and this is what I need to do in
(37:11):
the future. But still, how do I get to this?
And so I think that you can have a really
nuanced negotiation. You've got to teach yourself to have those conversations.
It also teaches resilience because when and if you get
a knock back, that's not walking out with nothing, that's
information that is like what you need to come back
and do things in a different way. So I just
(37:33):
think like when you're when you have ambition, when you
want more, which is exactly what she's saying, is that
I want more, I want more credit, I want more money,
I want to be recognized. It's like, go and ask
for it. You can write into Angie, that's cool, but like,
make sure you've had a conversation with your boss and
the conversation isn't just happening in your head. You're not
just talking to your co workers that they can't do shit.
(37:54):
You need to go to the people that can actually
help change and in a nuanced way express exactly what
you need and what your expectations are you might get it.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Are you ever you said in here that if if
you never hear the word no, you're not pushing enough. Right, absolutely,
it's ever like because sometimes I'll be in I'm always like,
I'm like too fair. So I'm like, okay, they want
me to do that for them, I do it for
this much. This is me talking to them this I
would say.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
Less than your wife, less than you think you will.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Probably sometimes yes, yes, yes, okay, what is that? That's terrible?
I'm getting better at it. Okay, I'm getting better at it.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
What's the reason though? Why are you doing that? Like
doing a favor? Are you scared or what is it?
Speaker 1 (38:38):
I'm like chronically obsessed with being fair like way to her,
yes right, fair to everybody else? What I think the
value might be to them? Or kind of taking all
of their things into consideration instead of putting my thing
at the center of the start with your stuff, starting
with it's so good, it's so good. I say to you,
(39:04):
have you never do you? Never?
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Have?
Speaker 1 (39:05):
Do you ever say? Okay, our businesses as valued at
one hundred million, but I'm going to go ask for
one hundred and fifty million, whatever the thing is, whatever,
then I'm just making a number up of something I do.
Do you ever feel like what that was? Big? I
went big, oh, and feel like almost crazy about it
all the time.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
But that is something that comes like again with experience
and a willingness to walk away from the thing, because
when we make deals, right, when we decide like I'm
going to give it over here again, it's kind of
a signal that we don't think there's something better on
the other side, or that like what you're willing to
undervalue yourself, Like for what reason? I always imagine that
(39:46):
if somebody is offering me something, the chances are someone
else will offer the same thing. So it's not that
I don't ever do that, it's just that experiences taught
me to know better, Like if somebody is willing to
give you some I'm being someone else will give it
to you. In that same way, when I was like
so young that my boss wouldn't take me from what
I was on twenty five thousand pounds, I think I
(40:09):
asked for thirty thousand, I was like, someone else will
pay me twenty five Are we better be over there?
Because I can manage the trajectory. So I think that again,
these things are chronic because this is just an old
thought that lives in your head. You are undervaluing your services.
You come from a place because you're sitting here maybe
with a scarcity mindset that says, you know, if I
(40:31):
get X, somebody else gets less. It's like, why it's
not it's zero some game, right, That's not how guys
would everythink doesn't make it mean because like you know,
someone gets something over here that somebody else suffers. And
I don't think to the contrary, I don't think it's
about overvaluing yourself. I don't think that you should be
(40:51):
like it's a million dollars. You have to educate yourself.
You have to know the space. You have to find
a place that actually makes sense. But the idea of
like undervalue in my services.
Speaker 1 (41:02):
You want to do? You want to throw up right now?
Speaker 2 (41:04):
Want to I want to die? I want to get angry.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
We're working on your anger. You've come so far.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
I took a deep breath when you said it.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I was like, I know, I know, Angie, I have
gotten way better. But I was me young, I felt
you know. I started doing radio I was eighteen nineteen.
I was grateful to be there. I was like this,
you know, and so I just was happy to have
the opportunity.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
But like you, I wasn't.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
You know.
Speaker 1 (41:31):
It took me a long time.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Now you're Angie, right, and we all have that journey.
And if you stay with the stories like this, like
that stuff will just keep you small. Like I think
that you have to like again, it's like replacing the thought.
It's like you've got all of this stuff that you've
been doing for so long. You have this body of work,
you have these ways that you behave the ways that
(41:54):
you do business, but it will nothing changes unless it changes.
But you have to do that. Like when I say
start with yourself, I really mean to go back inside
yourself and go what is it that actually makes me
undervalue myself? What is it that makes me do that
smaller number than I know I'm worth? Kindness that you
(42:17):
don't want to be seen as a bit, You don't
want to be seen as someone who's taken advantage. You
don't ask me the question.
Speaker 1 (42:22):
Yeah, yeah, probably me wanting to, like I said, be fair,
not take advantage of people. I don't know, Yeah, maybe
wanting to be And it's.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
So interesting because in you being fair and not wanting
to take advantage, you're allowing somebody else to be unfair
and take advantage. So what makes them better than you?
Speaker 1 (42:43):
No, it's no, no, no, we have we're we're on
the other side of this. Okay, we're we're already on
the side. I know it's so interesting, right that, this
big age that it would take me to long, but.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
I talk through it because I think for anybody listening
to this, it's it's it's chronic, it's patterned, it's in rained.
It's not stuff that you do knowingly and flippantly. Because
I reckon anyone who listens to this podcast is that
I'll undervalue myself. I know what I'm worth. I make
my money. It's like, ah, but do you? They do
you every time because sometimes we do things unconsciously. And
(43:15):
that's why I wrote this book in the way that
I did, because when you understand what you're doing, when
you understand what's running through your thoughts and the reasons
and the ways you make decisions, then you can push
against it. But it's not until it's raised to your
attention that you understand some of this stuff, because some
of it is like, it's not even you, it's the culture.
Women are undervalued. Right, it's somebody else with the same
(43:38):
resume and the same you know, set of circumstances. We
put them side by side, and we see this with Ai. Right,
you upload the two same resumes and John gets paid
more than Sally, Like, what the fuck? Like, what is happening?
But it's true. And so I think that there's plenty
of things in society that are already in trench that
(44:00):
WI already make us like small and not progress. You
can't be one of those things for yourself.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
It's not with your sound.
Speaker 2 (44:09):
It's so good, it's so good.
Speaker 1 (44:12):
Hey, guys. Support for this podcast is brought to you
by Walden University. Have you ever thought to yourself, what
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I could really make a difference. Well, you are not alone,
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(44:33):
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that first step. Walden University set a course for change,
certified to operate by shiv. Okay, in real life, let's
do some in real life questions. In real life? What
is one thing you are no longer apologizing for.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
The type of parent I am?
Speaker 1 (45:00):
Hmmm? Facts? Did they get you a little bit though?
Speaker 2 (45:04):
Did they start making you feel no? No, I expected it.
I anticipated okay. I'm very used to the differences in
the way mums are treated versus dad's, the way women
are treated versus men. Yeah. I did it purposefully because
I want to give permission, permission for other women to
just be honest and true.
Speaker 1 (45:20):
Far I'm like, fuck them, Okay, Emma. If God were
to text you right now, what would it say?
Speaker 2 (45:31):
Are you religious? Are you a spiritual I'm a very
spiritual person, not particularly religious. If God was to text me,
you know. My favorite thing to be told, ever, is
when people say to you God, bless Every taxi driver
in the whole of England says that to you all
the time, but when someone says it to me, I
actually feel like blessed, Like I'm blessed for the day.
Just that simple God bless So God would say to you,
(45:56):
God would say to me, God bless God, blesses you,
like for real, the real anointed, like it's coming from
Him in real life. It's because I imagine that every day,
like I feel like it's the best thing to be told.
Like you know, it's like you are blessed, you are
you know, what do you say? Like in America they
say you're blessed and highly favored. I've always loved it
when I heard that because I was I never heard
(46:18):
that before in my life in England, but I feel
like that so much. You're blessed and highly favored. It's
like a beautiful thing. It is pretty great, it's amazing.
And again I've never ever heard that. That was like
black women would say that to me, like it's pretty
I just fought it was incredible.
Speaker 1 (46:37):
Blessed and highly favored.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Yeah, yeah, is it beautiful when you like think when
you break down the words now we say it's so
like flippantly, but it's like blessed and highly favored. That's insane.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
Well, thank you for today, thank you, and thank you
for this beautiful book and God bless.
Speaker 2 (46:54):
Today.
Speaker 1 (46:56):
I'm going to go and spend more time with this book,
because clearly I need to start with myself. You're doing
it all right, Thanks everyone, start with yourself, Emmigreen.
Speaker 2 (47:05):
And so so so much.
Speaker 1 (47:13):
Hey guys, thanks for watching. Make sure you subscribe, like comments,
and check out all of the other episodes we have
on Edge. Martinez I R Podcast
I love that you identified your own anger issues and
then went and then got help for your anger issues.
Nobody like, nothing terrible happened. Nobody had to intervene.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Yeah, because I knew that that wasn't matching up to
the life that I wanted. I wouldn't be able to
take me and my little angry, crazy girl self and
do the things that I wanted to do. And that
was so clear to me. I said, this is not
going to row. It's not going to work in a workplace.
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Hey guys, this episode is brought to you by boost Mobile.
When you look at the word boss, I mean her
face should just appear. As a young kid in London.
She was born an entrepreneur. She built billion dollar brands
like Good American and Skims, all while being a wife
and a mother of four. She's a trailblazer in business,
breaking barriers. Her debut book, Start with Yourself, is out
(00:47):
now and it got gems in it. Emma Greed is
our guest today on I rel Name Pierre. Emma. You
are out here working. I am out in these straight
I don't know if it's my algorithms gives me you,
my algorithm serves.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Me angling my way to you, Auntie, get me close down.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
No, no, but you are working. We met recently for
the first time, not that recently in years. Was it
a year at the Skims Lawn store launch here.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
In New York store launch. You were busy now you were,
you know, around with your friends and all, and.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
You were no, you were already like no. They came
up to me and they were like, Emma Greed would
like to meet you. I was like, I would love
to meet her.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
And I always I have no shame anyone I want
to meet. I'm like, I want to meet her. Can
you introduce me? Do you know her? I think it
was Tiana Taylor or somewhere. I was just literally like,
I want to meet Angie.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Oh, it's so sweet. It was, it was, It was lovely,
but yes, we didn't have a time to connect that.
I think even from that moment, even to now, from
last year to now, has your life changed tremendously or
it's just just from the outside that it seems like
it's changed.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Great question. You know, my life hasn't changed at all, really,
But it's so funny because I don't know that my
life feels like it's changed. For a really long time.
You know, there's such an interesting perception that's out there,
and honestly, it's one of the reasons that I wrote
this book because I honestly feel like people see one
version of you, and the reality of your life is
so different. So I was like, let me write a book.
(02:19):
It tells the truth about actually my life and what
it is.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
It's not just the book though, it's the podcast. It's
your public presence is way more significant than it was
a year ago, for real.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
But my work life hasn't changed. My life life hasn't changed.
And that's what I mean. I think the perception does
a funny thing. You know what it's like if you
have a bit of a following and people see you
on social media, they conflate the two things. They imagine
that you ran into your office, took a picture at
your desk, and went about your day. It's like, no,
I am working, like I'm actually working. I go in,
I work a role, I have a job. And so
(02:53):
it's interesting that people have become much more interested in me.
But the reality of my life is it hasn't changed
very much all but your profile, their profile has shifted,
and that I'm very aware of it's purposeful. I think
I'm trying to do it in a way where I
can equate what I've got now with some impact, because
I really know that there's so much that I can do,
(03:16):
and I'm very very focused.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Yeah, sometimes fame, because it's not fame you're really after,
but it's fame comes with the profile that you now have.
And I just wonder if it's I don't know, done
anything to you, surprise you in any way challenging to manage.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
You know, for me, it's so interesting because all I
get is amazing women. You know, I'm not like famous, famous,
so no one's like checking for what I'm wearing. I
live like a normal and normal life. What I get
is women will stop me on the street. They will
slide me little notes in restaurants. I got this beautiful
note from this lady the other day, and I could
(03:53):
have cried. I was interviewing someone at the time, so
I couldn't read it.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
I put it in my bag.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
I got home and I was like you, she said,
you know. She was like, Emma, you have to understand
how much you mean to women like me, how much
you mean to women who come from a place where
they might not have had the right start, but they
are working and they're trying, and it was so heartfelt,
and she was so privileged. First of all, she didn't
even put her name or contact detail on there. She
(04:17):
just wanted me to know. And so I get a
lot of that and that, of course I never used
to get, you know, But at the end of the day,
it's my life is still the same. My life is
a series of problems every single day. You know, no
one calls me to say everything's going right. You know
we're selling out. They only call me with problems, and
so it hasn't changed all that much.
Speaker 1 (04:34):
You have to know that this book is set up
for a humongous success. I mean, do you see that already?
Speaker 3 (04:40):
Is that?
Speaker 2 (04:41):
I hope? So? Yes, I mean so far. Listen, I'm
a day in so I don't want to come as
too much.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
You have poured it so much in here that I
really want to use this as like, I don't know,
just the frame of our conversation. And then somewhere in
the beginning you mentioned women being exhausted, exhausted right exhaust
Somewhere in the beginning of it you said that, and
I thought, yes, women are exhausted because it's it's it's career,
(05:08):
it's emotional health, it's a family, it's mother parenting, it's
all love.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
All relentless. It's relentless. We're getting so much phone at
us all the time that I thought, I'm going to
write a book that people use, not that they read,
because we've got enough to do. And so it was
really important to me that people would read this and
then they would get something and they could put it
into action in their lives.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
I love how honest you are in the book about
some of the you know, anger and forgiveness and your
way of navigating some real life things. So we'll go
through that. But in this in the scheme of business
and money, I've heard you many times.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
Talk about my favorite subject?
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Is it really? It is money?
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Yeah? I want it to be every woman's favorite subject.
That's the time I'm working on that.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
It's this is a big mistake I've made in my life, right,
It's like I feel like, yes, it's because I came
from a family and and a mentality of you know,
money isn't everything. Money can't shouldn't control you. Money is
the root of all evil. You know, all they care
about is money, you know, like really, And it's not
(06:20):
that I don't enjoy some of that.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Is like money doesn't solve all your problems, but it
solves all your money problems. And I feel like we
have to advocate for it for ourselves because no one's
coming to find you, no one's coming to give you
money or power or any of that. And I do
feel like as women, we have to take a level
of responsibility for the fact that we don't talk about
money as to why it eludes us, Why does it
(06:43):
miss us? Why are men paid so much more than women?
Why is that the case that it's so much easier
for men to raise money than it is for women.
And we all know that there are systemic barriers, there
are systems that keep us small. But at the end
of the day, we also have a part to play
in all of that, and I want us to recognize
that and recognize that we can change our behavior and
get more of it.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
What are we doing wrong? What's the number one thing
we do wrong?
Speaker 2 (07:06):
We are not talking about it now, We're just not talking.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
How does that look? What does that look like?
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Tell you what it looks like? First of all, it's
like education, right, I think about myself as always in
learning mode. Every day I'm learning something. And I learned
about money because much like you, I didn't come from
a place where a we had any money, so there
wasn't that much to talk about. It was always that
what don't we have? Where are we going to spend
what we don't have? How we keeping the lights on?
That That's what I learned. But when I got into
(07:30):
the professional environment, it was always like, you don't share
with your colleagues what you earn. You don't talk about money.
That's crass. And actually, what I think that we need
to do is put money right in the center of
our plans. We need to say I am worth this,
this is what I should be being paid. And we
need to educate ourselves. So you need to understand your mortgage,
you need to understand your investment planning, you need to
(07:51):
understand what's in your future. And if you don't know,
you've got to get to know. You've got to make
it your business because money and power then linked right,
inextricably linked. And we're in a place and time in
the world right now where we actually need more women
in positions of power. But again it's not gonna happen
with us. It's not gonna happen passively. It's our responsibility
to say, you know what, I need more of this,
(08:14):
and I'm going to advocate for myself, and I'm going
to educate myself, and I'm gonna learn as much as
I possibly can. And that's what I do all the time.
I ask questions.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
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you navigate? Because it's a little different when I think
about what you do in business. But you're also a
creative he little.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
I'm a creative business warm.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
You are a creative business owner for sure. No, And
so I think sometimes where creative is concerned, like what
comes first, the creative or the opportunity to make money?
You know, I don't know. I just I just wonder
how you navigate that. Or all money ain't all money,
ain't good money. It's all money good money.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
I mean, I don't know most money's good money. I
don't know about you. He's a big money I think
most money is good money. Here's a being. I think
that it's really important that you're not sacrificing yourself for money, right.
I still think at the end of the day, I'm
still Emma from East London. I'm exactly the same person
that I was when I was twelve years old. Yeah,
there's not our integrity like bending or no, because I
(10:26):
don't think that you have to. I actually think that
you can care about money and care about a lot
of other things too. You can do deeply meaningful, impactful work,
creative work and be paid for it. And what we've
done is we've said, like, I'm a creative I'm a
nonprofit I do something so worthy therefore, and I'm like,
absolutely not the two things can exist at the same time.
(10:48):
And too often we're giving away our gifts for free
before we've even valued ourselves, before we've even valued the service.
I'm like, there is never a time when it makes
sense to give something for free without a plan. I
worked for like a full year for free, like doing
workplacements back in the day when you could do that.
But it was always with a plan and a goal
(11:09):
for what I wanted. On the other side, it was
always with an aim that I'm going to get a
job at one of these places that's going to be
my entry point into fashion. So you have to have
a plan if you're giving away your services for free,
and you have to have a plan as to how
you're going to get to the money. That's important. That's
important stuff.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Yeah. I think there's also you know, if you're a
business person, there's great stuff in here, but also just life.
There's just great life lessons in here. Like you talk
about planning your life in your twenties and your thirties
and then your forties you had a plan, like what
is my forties going to be?
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Solarly?
Speaker 1 (11:42):
I love this because we just had Jill Scott on
the other I love Joe. I died so Jill was on.
We had a great episode with Jill and she has
a theory about twenties, thirties, forties. It was Jill said,
when you're in your twenties you work hard.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
Facts.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
In your thirties you work smart. In your forties, work
how you want. In your fifties you work when you want,
and in your sixties you work if you want.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Love. Jill's got it down right, and she has got
it so down it's so good to me. Like that
is so good because that thing about like how you
work in your twenties, right, it's like there's a time
and a place, And I think what people don't really
understand is that life is so long. Like even the
idea that she's taken us from twenties to seventies, right,
it's that there's fifty years in between that. But we
(12:31):
really sort of overestimate what you can do in a
year and underestimate what you can do in ten. So
I like to make these plans for myself because it
helps kind of ground me in my decision making. I
know what to say no to because I know if
it's not taking me closer to one of my goals,
I don't need to do it, but I like to.
And I set the book up in the beginning I say,
have a vision for your life. That's not a vision board,
(12:54):
and it's not manifestation. So explained though that clearly ambition
needs to find you working. You cannot think your way
or consume your way. I love a podcast. I have
a podcast, but it's like you can't listen to podcasts
and think that that's going to get you closer to
where you want to go. You want to do the
work right. It's that we have to and.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
Even the best seventy five self help.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Book doesn't matter. That's not going to help you. You
have to help yourself. And so I think when you
have a vision for like what type of person do
I want to be? What type of woman do I
want to be? What type of care and what are
my values? What are my principles, and then you work
out what you want your life to be like based
on that, you say, like, these are the things that
are important to me. My family is really important to me.
(13:36):
So I'm going to make sure that I've ring fenced
these moments in the year to do these things because
I want those memories. I'm going to prioritize X, Y
and Z in my work life because it's important that
I make this money and that won't happen unless I
get to there. So I think the plan is really
about mapping things out and then having a path and
where you're going to work towards it. It's not a
(13:58):
vision border.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
It's also helpful full two so that you don't waste
your time doing things that don't serve you.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Right, Like, that's part of that Who had years like that?
Who had years where we get lost and we get
taken on someone else's agenda and that's what I don't want.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
You said. You were talking here about how women, especially
we care so much about other people's things, Like it's
somebody underpaid, is somebody working too hard, it's somebody like
you for your kids, worry about everyone else but yourself
last on your list.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
And I actually want to make sure that we are
like right at the top of our list of priorities.
As a mother of four, I think people get very
put off by that idea of me saying, you know,
I put myself first. I start with myself. But when
I'm good everyone, they.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Can't wait to you like all the things Miranda, Miranda,
they can't wait to do that to a successful women.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
With me time. We're held to very different standards than
successful men, right because we have to be you know,
nurturing and empathetic and a baller and look good and
an incredible worfe And it's like that's impossible. That's why
I wrote this book.
Speaker 1 (15:08):
That's why women are exhausted.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
That's why we're exhausted that I want to say, like
there's a trade off, there is a way to do this,
you know. I feel like Oprah said it best. She said,
you can have it all but not all at the
same time, which is really true. But I want women
to choose. I don't want us to be kind of
taken on a journey. And I think that this book
is going to teach people how you get the choice.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
But also you've you've chosen well in a partner.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Oh god damn, yes, who's helped you?
Speaker 1 (15:38):
You talk about like the importance of you don't want
a business partner that's that you don't share responsibilities with equally,
and you don't want a marriage also where your partner
is not sharing.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
I think who you choose to spend your life with
your private life is probably the most important business decision
you'd ever make, because they're either going to add to
you or they're going to really take away. And if
you don't have someone who's in support of the greater
vision of you and yourself, like you are in trouble.
Like you're in so much trouble.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
Did you know that going into marriage?
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Yeah, you know what? I knew that. I mean, my
husband's Swedish, right, Like Swedish society is very interesting. It's
very matriarchal society, so there's this kind of balance from
the get go. But I also never assumed that I
would be the lead parent and have to teach him stuff.
You know, it's like I'm going to teach him how
to change a diaper and make a sandwich. Like no,
like he's going to figure that stuff out. But I'm
(16:31):
also I'm not going to micro manage my husband. I
don't think that's my job. And you know, I really
believe that I have a life and he has a life,
and we have this incredible life together. But I wasn't
going to sacrifice the things that I wanted, and I
was lucky that I had a husband who was who
is unbelievably supportive.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
I just think for women who are looking for that partner,
if you have to be conscious of that as you're
looking for the partner, Like did you stumble into that
and then maybe at tracked, Oh you attracted that.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I think I attract that because that's the only type
of partner I've ever had, Like, I don't I think
that you know in that in that early process, like
you know, people show you, they tell you who they are,
they tell you how they're going to be, you see
how they move.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
I never went through like a young There was never
a young and like a young bad decisions.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
A night maybe, but no longer. No longer I made
stupid decisions like in a moment, and I realized in
the morning that that was not for me. I was like,
oh you know, I yeah.
Speaker 1 (17:36):
Like I would never like it's a bad boys or anything.
Speaker 2 (17:39):
Not a chance. You know, I don't have the disposition
for it. You let me down, I am out. I'm gone.
I just do you know what I mean? I have
such a and it isn't even about like high self worth.
It's just like low tolerance. Yeah, Like I have zero
tolerance for someone who's going to mess me around, like
miss the phone call. I'm like bye, Like no, do
you know what I mean? Because I never believe that like,
(18:01):
oh they get better, like things are going to change.
I'm like, they don't. It won't move on. And also
they were like so many boys when I was little,
you know, you're out here, oh here saying out. I
was like fashionable, Just move on and try something else.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
You never went to let me fix somebody or any
of that type of thing. No, really good.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
But there's not to say I didn't have like some
not so great boyfriends that were like, you know, messing
around and doing whatever. That they were doing, but like
not with me knowing and not with me tolerating anything.
Do you know what I mean. It's like, there's just.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
Yeah, So it wasn't so much that you were looking
for this type of partner. It's that your behavior warranted
and you found somebody because you were moving around that way.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
It was like, so, and I think I have really
high standards, not just that with everyone around me, right,
it's like my entire team. I have high standards. But
also I give a lot, and I think when you're
a person who gives a lot and has high expectations,
like that comes back to you. And so as soon
as I get a ignore, it's like anything. Right, If
I get a signaled that something's off that I'm not
(19:04):
getting equal back, it's like I'm gone to get bye,
I'm gone. It's that's the East London in me though,
you know. That's like where I come from. You don't
suffer fools Like you are expected to tell the truth,
to do what you say you're going to do, to
be true to your word, and suffer the consequences if
you don't. So it's like I don't have time for
foolish Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
Plus a woman on a mission.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I want a mission at a time, like literally, but
you know that literally, like I don't have the energy,
like I would lose my I would lose it. Yeah,
lose it.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
There's there's a I don't even need my cards because
were it goes naturally?
Speaker 2 (19:36):
And what were you just talking about being angry?
Speaker 1 (19:40):
I know where you're going. No, No, it wasn't about
the anger anger issues. But after you talked about that,
I love that you identified your own anger issues and
then went and then got help for your anger issues.
Nobody like, nothing terrible happened, nobody had to intervene. When
I first heard that you had you went to anger
therapy management, I was like, oh god, something, she must
(20:00):
have been arrested or something. No, she had an incident
on the train and she was like, oh God, I'm
so angry. And then went and fixed it yourself. You
identified the problem within yourself, yes, and went and worked
on it.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
Because I knew that that wasn't matching up to the
life that I wanted. I wouldn't be able to take
me and my little angry, crazy girl self and do
the things that I wanted to do. And that was
so clear to me. I was like, this is not
going to roll, it's not going to work in a workplace.
Speaker 1 (20:25):
So you worked on that, you got a hold of that,
managed that.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
And I still work on that every day, really yes,
and I still sometimes lose it because I can go
eyes with people and they're just like, you know, I,
it's something that you have to work on every single day,
like like in the same way that I work on
being really sad.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Well, what is that? What is that? What does that?
Speaker 2 (20:46):
I think that is like I'm hardwired like that. I
am not, you know, I think it's so much a
factor of my upbringing. You know, I wasn't taught to
be thoughtful. We certainly weren't. I wasn't ever taught that
you could like take a breath and move past something.
I was always taught that if something happened to you
because someone was disrespecting someone was like that, you were
(21:08):
going to look after yourself and you were going to
lash out. And that just becomes like a pattern, like
a loop in your system, and it wires and wires
and it gets more and more attuned unless you deal
with it. And so I think that that is very
much who I am, and I have to work all
the time and make sure that I keep keep myself
(21:28):
like my head up by boarder, keep practicing, keep training.
Speaker 1 (21:31):
I wondered if it was part or if sometimes it
could be triggered by because I know a lot of amazing,
super high functioning women, right, and there is an impatience.
Like the women that I know that I like run
big companies and stuff, they're all kind of impatient.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
Yeah, I'm definitely impatient, like and so I can.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
See that the triggering anger and almost anger.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Here's my thing. I've worked every single one of the jobs, right,
so it's like I have an understanding for what it
takes to pack the boxes, to do the assistant job,
to work your way up the ranks, to be a like,
you know, mid level executive. I did all the things,
and so you like, you know, can you do you
swear on this shark?
Speaker 1 (22:14):
Yes? Please?
Speaker 2 (22:15):
You know we always started on yet today what I
but it's like, you know, in England they say you
can't fuck a fucker, Like I am a person understands.
So if you come to me with an excuse, if
you come to me telling me it's going to take
three hours, and I can do it in forty five minutes,
I'm like, I have been there, I did that thing,
So then I have an impatience, but I'm not going
to get angry about that. I feel like the things
(22:36):
that I get angry about are when I feel like
people don't care, because I care the most. I care
about everything. I care about the glass, the tablecloth, the
thing that like I'm you know, it's like that. That's
how I come into what I do. And so if
you show a lack of care, anger, right, I'm gonna
(22:57):
take a deep breath so you won't work with me
for very.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
I understand too deeply what you're saying, and I have
actually worked on that, right, Britt, I'm better now. I
used to be very It's also you expect people. Beyonce
talked about this once. I think it was her special
like she does. Would do the rehearsals and she wouldn't eat,
she wouldn't sleep, she wouldn't drink, and then she realized, oh,
other people need to sleep and eat. And it's and
(23:23):
you expect people to operate how you operate, and if
you let it frustrate you because they don't, how can
you really be a good leader because you can't. You
can't You can't.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Also, they don't have the same thing to gain as you. Like,
You've got to get real, Like I'm out here doing
what I do. Everybody around me is not got the
same circumstance and they don't have the same upside. So
also I'm realistic. Yeah, you know, if I'm paying you
two hunder ground, I expect two hundred ground of you,
not a million dollars like we're talking about.
Speaker 1 (23:50):
So really, you don't have.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
The same to gain as I do. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Oh so, but the anger thing, it wasn't so much
about the anger management. It was you said that you
still working on forgiveness.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
Oh, yes, I'm not a good forgiver. Yeah I'm not.
Because you know, it's so funny. I did the Hoffmann process.
You know what that is. Oh, it's like such an
l a thing, but it is. It's an incredible process,
like like a you know, nine day intensive therapy process
where you learn all your patterns and you undo your
childhood trauma and all that.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
This sounds very expensive.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
It's expensive, and it's expensive on your like it it's
socially odd like it's like it's such a it's such
a like a deep deep dig and I just you know.
It was one of those things where you're kind of
expected to come out forgiving everything that's kind of happened
to you. And I got to the nine days and
(24:45):
everybody's like yeah, and I was like no, but still no,
still no. But that's like you know again about I'm boundary, right,
It's like I can understand, you know, if somebody slights me,
it's not actually always about and I think as far
as it comes to like childhood trauma, it's like I
can understand it. It doesn't always mean that you need
(25:07):
to forgive.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Yeah, you know, but the way you talk about that
here is you're more likely to instead of forgive somebody.
Oh my god, do you know J Scott, because I
feel like there's so many similar things you should know.
Speaker 2 (25:21):
You should introduce me. I would die because.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
I'm thinking of our interview with her because even in that,
even how you explained, we have a clip of her
going saying, I'm much more likely to forget you than
forgive you. And you talk about that here. You say,
you know it's not worth your time, it's like or
your patient. So you rather just I'm not gonna forgive you.
You just cut you out of the fabric of my life.
Speaker 2 (25:44):
I always think about this idea of like who like
you operate on like these orbits, And I have people
that are in my inner orbit, and I have people
that are outer and more out, And it's like, you
don't have to like, you know, be out of my life,
but you just might not be one of my like
inner circle people. Right, So I'm operating on a system
that says, like you just might have to like be
(26:05):
a couple out, a couple of steps removed. I don't
need to cut people, although I have done that in
the past, But to me, it's like it's just like
there's an inner circle. They're an expectation and I'm not
gonna my value.
Speaker 1 (26:17):
When do you care enough to work on like that
forgiveness or.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
With my husband, you know, that's that's yeah, he's the
only one trying to think everybody else, you know, God bless,
God bless.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
That's really.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Sorry. Hey listen, Oh, so you do transcendental meditation too.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
It's my that's one of the biggest tools that I have.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
How long have you been doing this?
Speaker 2 (26:52):
So I think I did a course. That's a great question.
I want to say, like maybe.
Speaker 1 (26:56):
Three years, okay, and it's one of religion.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
So I don't so I don't do You're supposed to
do twenty minutes a day twice a day, that never
ever happens. But I do do it. I would say
I do twenty minutes a day in the morning, three
or four times a week. And it is a game
changer because I always thought of meditation as something that
turns the noise down. Really I actually think it gives
you energy, gives you space and clarity, and so for me,
(27:20):
it was one of those things that I was like, wow,
this is this is an insane tool that I never
envisaged I would ever use, but it really really works
as something to create some opportunity to slow things down
and call the play like that's what I like to do.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Tried this. How did you find specific meditation too where
you have to say.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
The word you have a mantra.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
I was doing it for a little while, like a
couple of months, and I did notice a difference, and
I just fell off the regimen of the day. I
need to get back on it. And I only got
to ten minutes.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Okay, but that's good.
Speaker 1 (27:52):
They never get past ten when we've got like you,
like they say say, twenty times is when you feel
the real effects.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
The game changer in the twenty is a game change.
You just got to find your perfect time. And also,
I think this again, it's like, yeah, it'd be great
if you had like forty minutes every day to do it.
I think you just find that twenty and for someone
might be interested, for someone who might be interested, you
get a word of mind. Yeah, yep, you say the
word over and over again and you're meditating on the word,
(28:20):
on the word and what does it do for you?
Speaker 1 (28:22):
How does it?
Speaker 2 (28:23):
What does it do it? Literally like imagine it takes
like the temperature down. There's only two things that do
this for me, Like when you you're you know, because
I'm in a constant conversation with myself, Like I'm thinking
about what is happening over there, what's happening next, what
we've got tomorrow, what the kids need, what my husband
just spoke to me about what I'm doing in one company.
(28:45):
It's like like my brain is like this all the time.
It literally is like it's almost like everything just comes
down to this like very quiet place and you end
up having space and in the space comes something like
literally like it's almost like a little gift, Like something
will come in and you're like, oh, I did not
(29:05):
see that, and it becomes clearer, you figure out what
you need to do. I come out with so much energy,
like so much clarity. It's crazy. It's so it really
is to me, Like you know when people say it's
a game changer, it's like, no, it changed your game,
it will change the way that you move. You're going back.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
I'm going back in Brittany gout to five minutes, right,
you go to five I tried together, and I was like,
if it's really I'm feeling a difference. I just didn't
get I didn't get to I didn't go up again.
And it's hard.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
It's hard to sign new things. Like so much of
what I talk about this in this book is like
it's really difficult to untrain your ways, especially when you
get to a certain age. It's hard to stop telling
yourself the stories. But you have to make sure that
what's happening in your own head is not like bad
for you, right, that your biggest enemy isn't living in
(30:00):
your own mind. And so I really tried to make
the things that I do like I have a big
positive impact on me, and that transcendental is one of
those things.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
What is the what is something that you've had to
unlearn recently about yourself?
Speaker 2 (30:14):
I think honestly that I wasn't going to be capable
of writing. You know, I'm dyslexic, highly highly dyslexic. And
so I fixed my work and my life around almost
never writing anything down, you know, like never, I speak
every email on my phone, I speak every text in
I never. You know, when when in your adult life
(30:35):
do you write like in that type of way? And
so I thought a book would be impossible for me.
The other thing is like I wrote the book totally
back to front. I started with all the things that
were easy to me, building a business, making a career
of your dreams, and the leadership money bomb Bomb wrote
it like Cho Choun spoke it all into the phone.
And then I was like, well, why can I do
that stuff? And then I got to the managing emotions.
(30:58):
Then I got to the vision part. But it was
very very hard for me to organize my thoughts. And
once I had it together, there was this sense of
achievement like I was like wow, But that took a
lot of doing because I was constantly telling myself, telling
my agent, telling everyone around me. I was like, I'll
never do a book. I'll never do that. I can't
I literally can't do that. That's not for me.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
Turned out, I'm so surprised that you would say that
those kind of things to yourself.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Because you know, when you're a person of you know better, Emma,
you know I should know better. But when you're a
person of certainty, like you're certain about a lot of things,
you're certain about what you can do, you're so certain
about what you can't do, and I'm like, that's not
for me. Like, you know, I can look at an
outfit and be like, that's not for me, that my
body doesn't worked that way, I can't wear that. And
I'm like, oh, that's kind of cute.
Speaker 1 (31:43):
I wore that. We have a voice note? Should we
go a voice No? Now, Hey guys, you ever signed
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Customers will pay twenty five dollars a month as long
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we have a segment. It is called it's a Voicenowe segment.
So this is a fan or listener of the pod news.
You're going to be here. How's a question our comments?
I'm gonna play that. Hi. My name is Tanisha.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
I'm thirty and I have been having a hard time
getting credit for the ideas that are actually present. How
do I get compensated for something like that? Because I
obviously I have left the organization. I didn't get any
conversation or credit for that idea, but it is an
idea that has sustained that program moving forward, So how
do you navigate situations like that to avoid.
Speaker 1 (33:06):
Being put in that position? I used to stuff from this,
I will hold everything in because I'd be freedobody who's
going to rob me?
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Wow? See it terrible. I don't know about that kind
of I mean to me, that signal scarcity mindset. But
if we talk about like what Tarnisha is actually saying,
she's obviously in an environment where her ideas can be
taken because she is being paid to give ideas to
do whatever job she's doing. And then she's in an
environment where those ideas can be taken and used. But
(33:35):
it's not she's not working for herself. She's working for
an employer. That means she is being paid and compensated
for our ideas. You don't get to get the full value.
And I do honestly think that sometimes employees can overestimate
their contribution. If you're in a place where you're being
paid to do a job, you have to do that job.
That job might be giving some of your ideas. Now,
(33:56):
if you are doing something that is beyond the expectation
of your remit and you're going above and beyond, you
need to go and have a conversation about your additional contribution.
But I think that it's kind of naive to think
that you know you're going to be contributed, you're going
to be compensated beyond what you're being paid when you're
(34:16):
just giving your idea, Like, do you know what I mean?
It's there's there's so much more to business. It's like,
there's so much more that goes into things, and I
think sometimes we can have a little bit of a
naivety about our contribution.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
Yeah, also because I can't let one hundred people have
the same idea, and not everybody can get it across
the finish line. So an idea is really just an idea.
Speaker 2 (34:36):
Well it's just an idea because it takes a lot
of people to execute it, a lot of people to
create the things. But again, if this is somebody that
feels chronically undervalued, and I've been in that same situation,
I've been in a place where I thought I was
delivering value and I talk about it in the book,
to a company they were making a lot of money
and I didn't feel like I was making enough. But
(34:57):
the company were like, Emma, we pay you for this job.
You are paid and we make a lot of money
out of it. I was like, Okay, I'll take my
services elsewhere and that was the beginning of my first business.
But they weren't wrong. I wasn't wrong either. But sometimes
we have to know that there's nuance in the situation.
You just might have to take your gifts and your
(35:17):
services elsewhere to realize the full potential of what you're doing.
Speaker 1 (35:20):
But you're probably going to be realistic with yourself. Is
that like one one kind of flop idea, one kind
of limp, you know what I mean? Or do you
have many ideas that could expend any business?
Speaker 4 (35:31):
Do you do?
Speaker 2 (35:32):
You have so many ideas that you could pay yourself
what you're being paid currently and if you don't like again,
it's never that black and white. In the book, I
talk so much about negotiation, right. Negotiation isn't one side
winning or losing. You've got to find something mutually advantageous
to go and have a conversation, talk about and understand,
but go with specificity. You know this would be the conversation.
(35:55):
To me, I'd be like, let's roll, So you guys
are paying me sixty five thousand dollars and I came
up with X idea that netted the business X. You're
going to know those exes. You're going to have those numbers.
Speaker 1 (36:08):
I mean, don't come.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Emotion nearly will it. Don't be sad, don't be angry,
don't be silly. It's like, come in factually right and
paid this. I delivered this. The contribution was this. Once
you've got that, you say, you know what, I would
really imagine that my contribution in this company is worth
eighty five thousand. Oh we're not ready to pay you that. Okay,
what do I need to do to get from here
(36:30):
to here? You show me how can you value me
and my ideas? Because if you're unable to do that,
then I would need to move on because I can't
see how I would be contributing above this. It's a conversation.
You don't need to be stupid about it. You can
joke for yourself because, let me tell you, half the time,
the people that are in charge don't fully understand your contribution.
(36:51):
They may not know where the idea comes from. They
also might be coming from a place that they see
it differently. And that feedback is important for you to have.
It's important for you to understand and well, actually you
think we made X, but the costs associated with this
there were five other departments involved. Then you can be like, oh,
I got it, okay, so actually this is what it
was and this is what I need to do in
(37:11):
the future. But still, how do I get to this?
And so I think that you can have a really
nuanced negotiation. You've got to teach yourself to have those conversations.
It also teaches resilience because when and if you get
a knock back, that's not walking out with nothing, that's
information that is like what you need to come back
and do things in a different way. So I just
(37:33):
think like when you're when you have ambition, when you
want more, which is exactly what she's saying, is that
I want more, I want more credit, I want more money,
I want to be recognized. It's like, go and ask
for it. You can write into Angie, that's cool, but like,
make sure you've had a conversation with your boss and
the conversation isn't just happening in your head. You're not
just talking to your co workers that they can't do shit.
(37:54):
You need to go to the people that can actually
help change and in a nuanced way express exactly what
you need and what your expectations are you might get it.
Speaker 1 (38:03):
Are you ever you said in here that if if
you never hear the word no, you're not pushing enough. Right, absolutely,
it's ever like because sometimes I'll be in I'm always like,
I'm like too fair. So I'm like, okay, they want
me to do that for them, I do it for
this much. This is me talking to them this I
would say.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
Less than your wife, less than you think you will.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Probably sometimes yes, yes, yes, okay, what is that? That's terrible?
I'm getting better at it. Okay, I'm getting better at it.
Speaker 2 (38:34):
What's the reason though? Why are you doing that? Like
doing a favor? Are you scared or what is it?
Speaker 1 (38:38):
I'm like chronically obsessed with being fair like way to her,
yes right, fair to everybody else? What I think the
value might be to them? Or kind of taking all
of their things into consideration instead of putting my thing
at the center of the start with your stuff, starting
with it's so good, it's so good. I say to you,
(39:04):
have you never do you? Never?
Speaker 2 (39:05):
Have?
Speaker 1 (39:05):
Do you ever say? Okay, our businesses as valued at
one hundred million, but I'm going to go ask for
one hundred and fifty million, whatever the thing is, whatever,
then I'm just making a number up of something I do.
Do you ever feel like what that was? Big? I
went big, oh, and feel like almost crazy about it
all the time.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
But that is something that comes like again with experience
and a willingness to walk away from the thing, because
when we make deals, right, when we decide like I'm
going to give it over here again, it's kind of
a signal that we don't think there's something better on
the other side, or that like what you're willing to
undervalue yourself, Like for what reason? I always imagine that
(39:46):
if somebody is offering me something, the chances are someone
else will offer the same thing. So it's not that
I don't ever do that, it's just that experiences taught
me to know better, Like if somebody is willing to
give you some I'm being someone else will give it
to you. In that same way, when I was like
so young that my boss wouldn't take me from what
I was on twenty five thousand pounds, I think I
(40:09):
asked for thirty thousand, I was like, someone else will
pay me twenty five Are we better be over there?
Because I can manage the trajectory. So I think that again,
these things are chronic because this is just an old
thought that lives in your head. You are undervaluing your services.
You come from a place because you're sitting here maybe
with a scarcity mindset that says, you know, if I
(40:31):
get X, somebody else gets less. It's like, why it's
not it's zero some game, right, That's not how guys
would everythink doesn't make it mean because like you know,
someone gets something over here that somebody else suffers. And
I don't think to the contrary, I don't think it's
about overvaluing yourself. I don't think that you should be
(40:51):
like it's a million dollars. You have to educate yourself.
You have to know the space. You have to find
a place that actually makes sense. But the idea of
like undervalue in my services.
Speaker 1 (41:02):
You want to do? You want to throw up right now?
Speaker 2 (41:04):
Want to I want to die? I want to get angry.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
We're working on your anger. You've come so far.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
I took a deep breath when you said it.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I was like, I know, I know, Angie, I have
gotten way better. But I was me young, I felt
you know. I started doing radio I was eighteen nineteen.
I was grateful to be there. I was like this,
you know, and so I just was happy to have
the opportunity.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
But like you, I wasn't.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
You know.
Speaker 1 (41:31):
It took me a long time.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Now you're Angie, right, and we all have that journey.
And if you stay with the stories like this, like
that stuff will just keep you small. Like I think
that you have to like again, it's like replacing the thought.
It's like you've got all of this stuff that you've
been doing for so long. You have this body of work,
you have these ways that you behave the ways that
(41:54):
you do business, but it will nothing changes unless it changes.
But you have to do that. Like when I say
start with yourself, I really mean to go back inside
yourself and go what is it that actually makes me
undervalue myself? What is it that makes me do that
smaller number than I know I'm worth? Kindness that you
(42:17):
don't want to be seen as a bit, You don't
want to be seen as someone who's taken advantage. You
don't ask me the question.
Speaker 1 (42:22):
Yeah, yeah, probably me wanting to, like I said, be fair,
not take advantage of people. I don't know, Yeah, maybe
wanting to be And it's.
Speaker 2 (42:33):
So interesting because in you being fair and not wanting
to take advantage, you're allowing somebody else to be unfair
and take advantage. So what makes them better than you?
Speaker 1 (42:43):
No, it's no, no, no, we have we're we're on
the other side of this. Okay, we're we're already on
the side. I know it's so interesting, right that, this
big age that it would take me to long, but.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
I talk through it because I think for anybody listening
to this, it's it's it's chronic, it's patterned, it's in rained.
It's not stuff that you do knowingly and flippantly. Because
I reckon anyone who listens to this podcast is that
I'll undervalue myself. I know what I'm worth. I make
my money. It's like, ah, but do you? They do
you every time because sometimes we do things unconsciously. And
(43:15):
that's why I wrote this book in the way that
I did, because when you understand what you're doing, when
you understand what's running through your thoughts and the reasons
and the ways you make decisions, then you can push
against it. But it's not until it's raised to your
attention that you understand some of this stuff, because some
of it is like, it's not even you, it's the culture.
Women are undervalued. Right, it's somebody else with the same
(43:38):
resume and the same you know, set of circumstances. We
put them side by side, and we see this with Ai. Right,
you upload the two same resumes and John gets paid
more than Sally, Like, what the fuck? Like, what is happening?
But it's true. And so I think that there's plenty
of things in society that are already in trench that
(44:00):
WI already make us like small and not progress. You
can't be one of those things for yourself.
Speaker 1 (44:07):
It's not with your sound.
Speaker 2 (44:09):
It's so good, it's so good.
Speaker 1 (44:12):
Hey, guys. Support for this podcast is brought to you
by Walden University. Have you ever thought to yourself, what
if I could go after what I actually want and
I could really make a difference. Well, you are not alone,
and this is exactly why I want to tell you
about Walden University. For over fifty years, Walden has helped
working adults like you get the w with the knowledge,
(44:33):
the skills and everything you need to build the future
that you want, and you can make a difference where
it matters most. If you've been waiting for the right moment.
This is it. Head to waldenu dot edu and take
that first step. Walden University set a course for change,
certified to operate by shiv. Okay, in real life, let's
do some in real life questions. In real life? What
is one thing you are no longer apologizing for.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
The type of parent I am?
Speaker 1 (45:00):
Hmmm? Facts? Did they get you a little bit though?
Speaker 2 (45:04):
Did they start making you feel no? No, I expected it.
I anticipated okay. I'm very used to the differences in
the way mums are treated versus dad's, the way women
are treated versus men. Yeah. I did it purposefully because
I want to give permission, permission for other women to
just be honest and true.
Speaker 1 (45:20):
Far I'm like, fuck them, Okay, Emma. If God were
to text you right now, what would it say?
Speaker 2 (45:31):
Are you religious? Are you a spiritual I'm a very
spiritual person, not particularly religious. If God was to text me,
you know. My favorite thing to be told, ever, is
when people say to you God, bless Every taxi driver
in the whole of England says that to you all
the time, but when someone says it to me, I
actually feel like blessed, Like I'm blessed for the day.
Just that simple God bless So God would say to you,
(45:56):
God would say to me, God bless God, blesses you,
like for real, the real anointed, like it's coming from
Him in real life. It's because I imagine that every day,
like I feel like it's the best thing to be told.
Like you know, it's like you are blessed, you are
you know, what do you say? Like in America they
say you're blessed and highly favored. I've always loved it
when I heard that because I was I never heard
(46:18):
that before in my life in England, but I feel
like that so much. You're blessed and highly favored. It's
like a beautiful thing. It is pretty great, it's amazing.
And again I've never ever heard that. That was like
black women would say that to me, like it's pretty
I just fought it was incredible.
Speaker 1 (46:37):
Blessed and highly favored.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
Yeah, yeah, is it beautiful when you like think when
you break down the words now we say it's so
like flippantly, but it's like blessed and highly favored. That's insane.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
Well, thank you for today, thank you, and thank you
for this beautiful book and God bless.
Speaker 2 (46:54):
Today.
Speaker 1 (46:56):
I'm going to go and spend more time with this book,
because clearly I need to start with myself. You're doing
it all right, Thanks everyone, start with yourself, Emmigreen.
Speaker 2 (47:05):
And so so so much.
Speaker 1 (47:13):
Hey guys, thanks for watching. Make sure you subscribe, like comments,
and check out all of the other episodes we have
on Edge. Martinez I R Podcast
Host
Angie Martinez
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