January 15, 2026 • 48 mins
An Illinois surgeon accused of gunning down his ex-wife, Monique Tepe, and her husband, the father of their two young children, Spencer Tepe, allegedly threatened to kill Monique nearly a decade ago on “multiple occasions” during their brief marriage.
Police arrested Michael D. McKee, 39, at a Chick-fil-A in Rockford, Illinois, on January 10, 2026, and charged him with two counts of murder in the deaths of Spencer and Monique Tepe. Authorities then upgraded the charges against McKee, who now faces premeditated aggravated murder.
Police report they have the suspect's vehicle on neighborhood video surveillance in the couple's Ohio neighborhood, arriving just before the murders and leaving shortly after.
A search warrant of McKee's luxury Chicago condo results in multiple weapons being found, with one of those weapons preliminarily matching evidence through ballistic testing to the Tepe murder scene.
Twelve weeks before McKee is accused of murder, he is sued for malpractice by a Nevada man who claims McKee went into hiding or just disappeared, so he couldn't be served with legal documents papers.
Nevada lawyer Dan Laird files the suit, but serving McKee was nearly impossible, as the surgery group he works for gives the attorney a fake address, and the phone number issued by the state medical board for McKee is a fax machine.
Joining Nancy Grace:
- Randy Kessler - Atlanta Trial Lawyer, Emory Law School Professor, Past Chair ABA Family Law Section, and Author of "Divorce, Protect Yourself, Your Kids and Your Future;" Instagram: @rkessler23, X: @GADivorce
- Dr. Bethany Marshall - Psychoanalyst, Author: "Deal Breaker," and featured in hit show "Paris in Love" on Peacock; Instagram & TikTok: drbethanymarshall; Instagram & TikTok: drbethanymarshall, X: @DrBethanyLive
- Koa Lorimor - Former Army Sniper
- Dr. Thomas Coyne - Chief Medical Examiner, District 2 Medical Examiner's Office, State of Florida; Forensic Pathologist, Neuropathologist, Toxicologist; X: @DrTMCoyne
- Susan Hendricks - Journalist, Author: “Down the Hill: My Descent into the Double Murder in Delphi;" IG @susan_hendricks X @SusanHendicks
- Dave Mack - Investigative Reporter, 'Crime Stories'
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, Monster Marriage, the icy threats.
We are learning a vascular surgeon husband made years before,
years before, nearly ten years before, he allegedly shoots his
(00:24):
ex wife and new dentist's husband dead in their own beds,
their children wailing in the background. Now, think about it.
How long did those bodies lie? They're going cold in
pools of blood with their children sitting there with mommy
and daddy dead. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
(00:47):
I want to thank you for being with us. Stone
faced and cold blooded. A surgeon in court after his
ex wife and her dentist husband both shot dead. He
knows exactly what's happening, and not a flicker of emotion
on his face, not one ounce, not one drop, one
scintilla of remorse. How long did he stalk her? As
(01:14):
he gets kicked from one jurisdiction to the next, multiple
malepractice and claims against him, He looks at her online.
She moved on in a big way. She found true love,
gets married to an awesome guy. They have two children.
They get married in their home. They post a video
(01:35):
of it, and there he is alone, alone and miserable.
Now we are learning that she quote just had to
get out of that starter marriage. It was just for
seven months. It was nearly ten years ago, and he
brewed and bubbled and simmered and stewed for nearly ten
(01:57):
years till he makes an over three hundred mild trek
to sheot her dead in bed with her husband, her
children in the room next door. This is what we've learned. Listen.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
She was terrified because he had threatened her life on multiple.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Occasions when they were married.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
She wasn't shy about talking to people about traumatic experiences
that she had with her ex and just how emotionally
abusive he was to her.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
That's my friends at NBC. I'm going to analyze what
we are hearing straight out to investigative reporter Susan Hendrix,
also an author of Down the Hill, My Descent into
the Double Murder in Delphi. Susan on this case from
the very beginning, Susan, that is the brother in law
speaking out. Quote. She was terrified because he had threatened
(02:50):
her life on multiple occasions when they were married, that's
nearly ten years ago. She would talk openly to family members.
What you make of it?
Speaker 4 (03:02):
I believe as he said, that she was terrified.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
And how do I know?
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Because their social media was private. She was very much
kind of on the down low on social media, if
you will. I don't think she wanted to make her
ex angry. I think because the brother in law also
said it changed her as a person. He was that
mostly abusive. I think it went on beyond the marriage.
I think she was fearful of him clearly, and I
(03:28):
think that's why Spencer's dental office knew that something was
off that day.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
If any of us had known that these threats were
actually grounded impossibility, we all would have acted differently. Myself
and many others were well aware of kind of the
negative impact that he had on her. She was willing
to do anything to get out of there.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
From our friends at NBC and GMA. That is the
brother in law raw miss speaking out what I could
have should have. You know what all survivors do. That
isn't that true, Doctor Bethany Marshall. If only we had known,
if actually we had known they were grounded in reality,
we would have done things differently. But people don't live
(04:13):
their lives thinking, oh, he's gonna drive six hours and
shoot them in their beds. There's no reason they should
have known that he was secretly stalking his ex wife
all these years.
Speaker 5 (04:25):
Bethany, the family perhaps shouldn't have known, but I believe
Monique knew if her social media was private, if she
talked about the abuse and Nancy. This escalated in just
seven months of marriage. You know, stalking behavior can start
just after one date. The guy falls in love with
you and then believes there's a special relationship when there's none.
(04:49):
The girl doesn't return the text or the phone call,
and now he's enraged. And so when women leave a relationship,
they're at the highest risk for domestic homicide. As you
pointed out, she left, she had moved on, and that
very act enraged him, and he punished her for this
perceived rejection. That's what he did. He mowed her down.
(05:11):
But I think she knew.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Deep down inside. Or do you think she saw him,
or she got a weird text or an email and
she goes, oh my stars, that's the key, Or do
you think it was just a gut feeling in her
bones she knew.
Speaker 5 (05:25):
I think it was a gut feeling. I treat women
who are stalking victims, and often they fall into a depression.
They're in a dysphoric state, and they become preoccupied with
the offender. They think about them all the time. They
look at that out their car windows. They're sitting in
a restaurant with a new partner and they see, like
say Nicole Brown, they see a car drive by, like
(05:48):
a white Tahoe and they think, Oh my God, is
that my ex husband. So they live in fear Nancy.
It gets into their brains. I bet it was in
her brain, in her thought process that she was at risk.
It was always there and that's why she was talking
about it.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
As we go to air tonight, extradition delayed. What's going on?
Is he some sort of a security threat? Why can't
we get him to Home Turf to get this trial
ball rolling, get the show on the road. At this time,
we know the state is building its case against vascular
(06:26):
surgeon doctor McKee. Just think about this guy. He excelled
in everything he did. That's his mug shot. He excelled
at everything. He played football on a very high level
in college. He was Danselous honor student. In undergrad he
was a star student in medical school. He went on
(06:49):
to become a vascular surgeon. Certified to practice in multiple jurisdictions.
Just before Monique and her husband are shot dead, he
gets sacked with a malpractice suit, a pretty serious one,
and another claim that one patient actually lost his testicle
(07:11):
because of McKee, very serious complaints. And then he ghosts everybody.
He leaves that jurisdiction and disappears to where even a
PI can't find him, and just starts all over again
in another jurisdiction. Could he move that surreptitiously? Which leads
me to how long had he been surreptitiously stalking Monique?
(07:35):
There she is Monique and the first starter husband, Michael McKee,
the vascular surgeon, straight out to a real pro joining
us tonight, Randy Kessler. You know him well. He is
a veteran trial lawyer, Emory Law School professor, former chair
of the ABA Family Law Section, the American Bar Association,
(08:00):
author of Divorced, Protect Yourself, your Kids, and Your Future.
Randy Kessler, you and I have crossed swords many, many
times in court. Kessler, think about it now. I know
you would never bring us up in court about your
own client, right, but this guy's not your client. Tell
me the truth. How long do you think he had
(08:23):
been stalking her in person, maybe even watching them put
the code into the keypad and goes, oh, that's her
father's birthday, or online, watching that wedding video over and
over and over, and there he is sitting alone having
his TV dinner, looking at her video and her happy life.
(08:44):
How long you think he's been stalking Monique?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
It's one of two dates.
Speaker 6 (08:48):
It's either the date that the final divorce was granted
or the date that the divorce was fouled. This was
his first rejection from what we can tell, right, Like
you said, who's so successful in everything?
Speaker 3 (08:58):
I mean, the pinnacle of vascular surge, the football star.
Speaker 6 (09:01):
Dean's List, married to a beautiful woman and then she
rejects him or it doesn't work, and that's you know,
that's what divorce is about. People feel like somebody who
I thought was the perfect person, who I wanted to
be with forever, tells me I'm not good enough. They're
rejecting me. It may not be the truth of the matter.
That could easily be the perception that might have started.
It might have been when he started stalking her. It
(09:22):
might have been when it started the trigger for him thinking,
how do I rectify this. He obviously couldn't handle it.
If this is the guy who did it, And I
think that's that's when it started.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
If you ask me what you did all those years, Kessler,
so you think he started stalking behavior all the way
back to the time that she left him. And did
you know, Kessler, that she on her little money that
she was making, very educated. I believe she had a
master's degree. Not making a lot of money, but the
little bit she made, she paid a private judge to
(09:56):
expedite the divorce proceedings is going to lawyer's docket. Just
think about where you practice, Fulton Superior. You can wait
a year before you can get a divorce on a
dock and be heard, you know, actually get a jury
trial or a hearing. She paid herself alone to expelite
that divorce. And guess what he wanted. I hope you're
(10:17):
sitting down. You needed to lay down, because I happened
to know you've got a big, beautiful brocade sofa, a
plush sofa in your fancy digs at your office. You
may needed to lay down on that. Kestler. He asked,
demanded that she pay him back for the engagement ring
and the wedding band and then he charged her twenty
(10:38):
three percent interest on a twelve hundred dollars miscellaneous debt
he claimed she owed him. Okay, no wonder she left him.
Speaker 6 (10:49):
You know, there's a horrible joke about whyse of the
divorce so expensive, because it's worth it. It was worth
it to her. You know, we have our rich clients
pay for private joses all the time to do it, lead,
to expedite it, to do it at their own schedule.
But yes, sometimes people just went out and a lot
of people were commenting in the press and in the
news that it was an uncontested it was an amicable divorce.
It was amicable just in that it wasn't fought out
(11:12):
in court. And that's because somebody, obviously her now wanted out.
She even agreed to pay her own lawyer fees. When
you have a surgeon on one side, usually the person
making all the money is required to pay both side
attorneys fees because it's a marital expense, that's marital income.
She obviously clearly wanted out. And you know, when did
she ever feel safe?
Speaker 1 (11:30):
And that's the same Look at that picture, Kestler, Do
you see that picture right there that I'm showing off
her pregnant front of the Christmas tree. How crazy do
you think that made that vascular surgeon ex husband there
she is pregnant by another man, which, of course you
know what that means, they had to have sex. I
bet that drove him right over the edge. Kestler.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Yeah, but when do you ever feel safe?
Speaker 6 (11:53):
And that's what tears at me, not just what happened,
but all these women out there that have gotten away
from somebody like that. She's moved on, she's got children,
she's married, she's living in another state.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
When is enough?
Speaker 6 (12:04):
When can you look in the rear view mirror and
say there's nothing there, It's just shadows and you see
cases like this, And there are a lot of people
having post traumatic stress disorder just from this story. I'm
sure we see women that come back to us and say,
I still need to restrain anywhere. I said, but you're divorced. Yes,
but he's still calling, he's still coming by. Just a
terrible situation, and unfortunately, I don't think this is the
(12:25):
only person out there that got this concern.
Speaker 7 (12:28):
On December thirtieth, twenty twenty five, at approximately ten oh
four am, Columbus Police Patrol officers were dispatched to the
fourteen hundred block of North Forth Street on a well
being check. Officers arrived at scene and located the two
adult victims suffering from apparent gunshot wounds. We now know
that they were identified as mister Spencer Teppy and missus
(12:49):
Monique Teppy. Their two small children were also found in
the resident physically unharmed.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Straight out the special guests joining us doctor Thomas Cone,
chief Medical Examiner, just district to Medical Examiner's office, State
of Florida. He is a forensic pathologist, toxicologist, neuropathologist. Doctor Corn,
thank you for being with us. I want to address
what the two children have been through. Guys. I'm going
to get to the news as quickly as I can
(13:17):
about the fact that his extradition has been delayed. What
does it mean. Don't worry. He's not burning up the interstate,
the Ohio Turnpike to get back home, because Ohio does
have the death penalty. It was hanging, then it went
to Old Sparky the electric chair. Now it's needle death
by lethal injection. There's a moratorium on right now on
(13:39):
the death penalty, but it's not official. It's unofficial. They
can't get the correct drugs to perform death by needle,
but who knows, Maybe they'll go back to death by
firing squad like other jurisdictions have done, or possibly some
sort of nitrous oxide that's on the table as well.
That's a whole other can of worms, Doctor Thomas Coin,
(14:01):
I want to talk to you about the two children.
They're both under four years old. They were heard in
the background. If I could get the control room to
pull up the nine to one one call where you
can hear the children screaming, wailing in the background, Doctor Coin,
What would the children have seen, because we know that
(14:22):
the husband was shot twice, Monique was shot once, and
they have placed the shootings after three am, and cops
didn't break in well actually friends had to get in
the home until hours and hours later, well after nine am.
(14:45):
Would the blood have coagulated? Would the bodies have gotten cold,
because I believe the children were in there with their parents'
dead bodies.
Speaker 8 (14:53):
Horrible, horrible, Yeah, I mean I remember one just coming
upon the bodies, and depending upon where they were shot,
it would have been a considerable amount of bleeding, especially
even from a head wound or a wound to the chest,
and so their clothing may have been soaked in blood
where they were lying. For instance, if they were in
the bedroom, the bed sheets may have been soaked in blood.
And depending upon where they were shot, you know, if
(15:14):
it was an angled shot that sort of hit the head,
there could have been a tearing of the scalp tissues.
So it could have been quite horrific and gruesome for
the children to see their parents in that state.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
Tell me about what you would expect to see around
a scene where the husband had been shot twice in
the chest with a nine millimeter and the wife shot once,
we also believe in the chest. Would there have been
well we also known another fact when the friend came
(15:46):
in and saw the dentist's dead body. He said he
was half on, half off the bed or beside the bed.
Would that blood have already coagulated in say, six hours?
Would the bodies already be cold? It's freezing cold outside
and snowing, But the ambiance temperature in the room probably
(16:08):
sixty eight, sixty nine or seventy.
Speaker 8 (16:11):
The bodies would have started I mean, had they been
shot hours prior, the body temperature would have started to
acclimate towards that of the home, and they certainly would
have probably still had some rigor present in the body,
a little stiff.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
The blood would have.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Slowed down, settled, slowdown, doctor Coin rigor gimman. When the
children come upon their mom and they try to touch
her or hold her, she's already in rigor mortis.
Speaker 8 (16:36):
Yes, so her her body would have been stiffed, that cold,
and probably stiff to touch her arms and her legs
may have been rigid. And there probably was also libra mortis,
which is the settling of the blood based upon graphic
so you'll see pinkish or purple discoloration of the body
(16:57):
on the bottom where it's lying, and so they probably
would have encountered that upon seeing the the two victims.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Of the blood.
Speaker 8 (17:04):
Also, yeah, I would have started to coagulate. If it
sits for quite a long period of time, you can
also see separation of the of the cellular component from
the liquid component, so we called serum. So you may
see a little separation of that as well. But if
it's soaked into the bed sheets, it would have just
looked all red.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Just thinking about what those children saw and experienced. When
you say both mom and dad would be in full rigor.
Unless you've seen it, it's hard to explain the only
way I've explained it to a jury is that you
know two by four right, You've been around lumber, right, doctor, Okay, Absolutely,
(17:47):
it's just like that. If you try to touch the mom,
her arm is like a two by four, it's that hard.
It's that stiff, that stiff.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
And you can't bend it. You know, it's almost immobile.
Speaker 8 (18:03):
And so for the child who is going up to
their parents hoping to feel a warm body, it would
probably feel horrible. I mean, just just cold and very stiff,
non responsible, you.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Know, doctor Bethany, I don't know how a child, you know,
two children under the age of four, what they thought
they were seeing. But I can tell you this, I
don't care what all the shrinks say. Children remember long
before three years old. I have memories as early as
two years old that I can identify. I think my
(18:37):
daughter has memories before that. How will they remember that?
Will they suppress it? Will it come back in dreams?
Will it affect their personalities for the rest of their lives.
Speaker 5 (18:52):
It'll come back in so many forms, Nancy. It could
come back as I've said before at a pre conscious,
pre verbal level, meaning they have the sensation of seeing
a traumatic scene, but they can't really put it into words.
They could be walking down the street someday and see
somebody walk in front of a car and have a
flashback and think, oh my god, that car is going
(19:12):
to hit that person. They could become people who refuse
to form attachments because this premature loss of the parent
makes them too terrified of abandonment. It's going to affect
them on all levels. Nance it could predispose them to
personality disorders, to drug abuse, to alcoholism. This will have
(19:32):
a traumatic traumatic effect. The best thing that can happen
for these children is to go into a new family
where there are predictable and safe attachment systems so they
can relatives.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
Now, Dr Bethty, that's.
Speaker 5 (19:47):
Good to their relatives.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
I think the dog is a is a golden doodle
and it is also with the children crime stories with
Nancy Grace. Hey, doctor Coin, let me ask you a question.
I was thinking about what the children would have experienced
(20:10):
and I was out jogging the other night and I
smelled a smell and it immediately made me think of
my grandmother Lucy that helped raise me. It was kind
of a fresh like a cucumber, not quite a cucumber,
but something like that. And I don't know what it is.
I've tried to identify. When I do smell it, where
is that coming from? It must be some kind of
a plant. But I immediately think of her because she
(20:33):
smelled that kind of a fresh smell, Doctor Coin, Why
does blood smell?
Speaker 8 (20:42):
You know, some people say it's got a metallic smell
to it, almost like iron. It's biological, so there are
a number of different biological compounds that we produce that
may be present blood at any given time, you know,
from ammonia type, you know, chemicals just to the you know,
mineral component of blood as well. But there is a
(21:03):
definite unique smell to blood. It doesn't vaporize, let's say,
like human tissue. As our fatty tissue begins to break down,
it aromatized. Is this sort of putrid chemical smell that
is quite unique, you know, human death compared to animal death.
But blood does have a pretty unique smell that I
think most of us can recognize.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Kessler, I know that you specialize in domestic relations. That's
certainly putting perfume on the pig. Divorce, nasty divorce, the
worst divorce, the most expensive divorce. You got to get Kessler.
But you have also handled criminal cases. Have you ever
been on a murder scene.
Speaker 3 (21:45):
No, I've never had the misfortune to go. And I'm
glad we bring in criminals.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Well, I'm glad because that smell is something you never forget,
the smell of a decomposing body or the smell of
blood coagulating. I'm glad. I'm happy for you. But okay,
since that's a note for me, let me go to Bethany. Bethany.
Just like the other night, when I was jogging and
I smell that fresh plant smell, I thought of my grandmother.
(22:14):
I was thinking about something completely different, and then I'm
just thinking about these children going through life. And then
they smell a smell and it smells. Oh, here's another one.
I can't stand to smell chrysanthemums because when I walked
into my fiance's funeral, it was like a hit me
in the face. I hate that smell. I'm just wondering.
(22:37):
There's just so many things that affect these children's memory.
It can be a smell, it can be a moment.
It can be a feeling, it can be anything that's
going to trigger this for them the rest of their lives.
Speaker 5 (22:51):
Nancy, it's called evocative memory. Let's see you go on
a trip and you take a certain kind of perfume
or product on the trip, and then years later you
pull that product out of a drawer and you smell it.
You will think about that trip. So anything those children
sawce smelled, felt in that room, it's going to be evoked.
(23:11):
So let's say they can see the color red. Let's
say they're watching a movie, and we know that there
is violence in all movies unless it's a comedy. They
will see maybe the sight of blood or somebody being killed,
or child looking at a parent. That evocative memory is
going to be triggered. And then you combine that with PTSD,
(23:32):
one of the symptoms of which is flashbacks. A flashback
is when you're in a similar situation to the earlier
trauma and your brain tells you that you're in the
exact same situation.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
Again.
Speaker 5 (23:47):
Let's say you're in the war, you are in the
middle of an explosion and an ied goes off. Years later,
you're walking down the street in the car backfires. All
of a sudden, you feel you're in the war again.
So these kids are going to be exposed to similar
flashbacks and evocative memory throughout the rest of their lives.
Speaker 9 (24:07):
What's changed since the last person I talked to?
Speaker 10 (24:10):
There's a body.
Speaker 11 (24:11):
There's a body inside.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
Yeah, okay, hold on one second.
Speaker 9 (24:18):
Let me get you on the line with the medic.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Okay, on the line.
Speaker 10 (24:22):
Appear's dead.
Speaker 7 (24:26):
Multiple weapons were taken from the property of McKee, and
there's a preliminary link from our NIVEN to one of
the weapons that ties it to the homicide.
Speaker 12 (24:40):
Local and Columbus police in and out of McKee's twelfth
floor Chicago apartment with boxes of potential evidence, lugging it
down to a Columbus PD crime lab van in the
underground garage. Residents receive a notice authorities will be investigating
over several days and they shouldn't be concerned by the
officer posted outside mcke's door. Preliminary testing leads them to
(25:02):
believe one of those weapons is connected to the tepe's murders.
Speaker 5 (25:06):
Did you find any other evidence in his home in
Lincoln Park?
Speaker 7 (25:09):
What I can tell you is that we did search
his property and we have evidence, but I can't speak
to any specific evidence.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
They've got evidence. They were observed lugging box after box
after box out of vascular surgeon doctor McKee's penthouse apartment
there at Lincoln Park, straight out to a special guest
joining us tonight, CoA. Lour Moore, thank you for being
with us, former Army sniper sharpshooter. I want to talk
(25:37):
to you about the weapons. You just heard Columbus Police
Chief Elaine Bryant state that there is a preliminary match
from evidence found in the home. I ate the gun.
I don't know where they found it in the home,
in the car, doesn't matter for your purposes. But they've
got a match to the bullets fired at the scene
(25:58):
where they lodged in the body. Did they cachet off
the wall, where they stuck in the wall, where they
stuck in the matches, where they stuck in the floor,
doesn't matter. They're saying they've got a match. Now, Before
I get to you about how that match is deduced,
I want to talk to you about how difficult would
(26:18):
it be for the killer to engrave or write on
the bullets? Now, you see, I didn't think about that
before the devil kicked Luigi Mangioni into my life, who wrote,
let's see Deny delay depose. He actually took the time
(26:40):
to write that on the bullets that he used to
shoot the United Healthcare boss. According to police, then you've
got the fiend that shot Charlie Kirk Tyler Robinson. He wrote,
hey fascist on the bullet. Okay, they've got way too
much spare time for a shrink. CoA, Laura Moore, tell
(27:02):
me how would you write something on the bullet?
Speaker 13 (27:06):
Well, Nancy, you could take a DREML tool and then
you take the casing of the bullet like I have
right here, and you could basically just engrave whatever you
want on that casing. But I think you would have
to have a special kind of hatred to go to
the lengths of engraving something on that.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Agree. Now let me ask you this, CoA. What if
we learn the defendant, the surgeon dot McKee, created his
own ammunition. Yes, people actually do that. How do you
create your own ammunition? And to me, and I'm going
(27:42):
to get to Kessler on this, that would leave a
trail a mile wide if you created your own bullets.
How do you do that?
Speaker 13 (27:51):
So you need a special machine that they use to
create a bullet like this, and then you take all
the components. You take the primer on the back, the
case obviously, the gunpowder inside, and then the bullet and
you press it all together. This is common practice with
like precision shooters, people that do it for sport. Pretty
(28:12):
uncommon just for your average guy.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Okay, there is actually a machine that does it. It's
a manual swagging process. And you know the reason I'm
asking about this hold on Cole Laura Moore to doctor
Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst joining us out of LA at doctor
Bethany Marshall dot com. Doctor Bethany, he spent practically ten years,
(28:38):
eight years plus thinking about her, and something pushed him
over the edge. It could have been these lawsuits where
one guy lost a testicle and the other had a
pete a shard of catheter stuck in his leg which caused,
according to him, disfigurement. And then when they tried to
sue surgeon doctor McKee, he ghosted everyone and vanished. Even
(29:01):
the process server couldn't find him. And you know, they
make money when they finally serve you the papers. So
he was trying to find him, and he totally disappeared.
That said, that could have triggered it. But all these
years he has been watching her, and I could just
see him hunched over a table with one of these machines,
(29:22):
making his own bullets and engraving them out of hatred.
Speaker 5 (29:27):
You don't, Nancy fifty Almost fifty percent of all stalking
happens during the course of a marriage, not necessarily afterwards.
So this stalking behavior probably started from the first state,
first of all. Secondly, there's going to be a lot
of behavioral evidence. He probably made many attempts to contact hers,
so there's going to be emails, letters, snail mail. I
(29:49):
think we're going to find all sorts of things. And
in terms of the risk factors for violence, why now
what pushed him over the edge? Usually a demotion in
staff and rejection. So the fact that he was potentially
had a lawsuit against him made him feel humiliated.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
At risk of Randy Kesser objection claiming asked an answered,
I always love that objection at trial. But let me,
instead of asking the same thing, doctor Bethany, refine my question.
Let me refine my question. In other words, ask it
in another way. Doctor Bethany. You know how stalkers and
freaks they get enjoyment from the process of the stalking.
(30:32):
I think it makes them feel closer to the target
they're victim, Like writing them letters. They take great pains
to write the letter and then sneak up and leave
it there or mail just they get some enjoyment from that.
So what would he have derived from making his own
bullets if he did with the diy st What joy
would he get from that?
Speaker 5 (30:53):
Well, think about kill kits when serial killers assemble the
kit in preparation for finding victims. The enjoyment he would
have gotten is complete and utter power over her, looking
at the fear in her eyes, blotting her off the
face of the earth, so he doesn't have to think
about her anymore, potentially killing her husband in front of
(31:16):
her while she's still alive. So he shows her who's
really the boss in this situation. And I think, more importantly,
a reversal of power. He imagines she has power over
him because she's moved on, but he's going to try
to assert power over her reverse power dynamic. In my field,
we call it triumphing over the love object. He's triumphing
(31:40):
over her every time he engraves that bullet.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Doctor Bethany, I'm going back to cole Laura Moore right
now with bullet questions, but I want you to think
about something. You know how people when they're dating, they
get ready for the day, Like the woman does her hair,
puts on megup. The man goes wash the car this
is stereotypical, of course, and gets all ready, maybe buys flowers.
It's all in anticipation of those few hours that they
(32:07):
have a date. Just imagine him getting the bullets, getting
the gun, driving all the way down the Ohio Turnpike,
going through the what twenty four tolls to get there,
all in anticipation of the moment he pulls the trigger
and sees her face and her fear. I want to
talk about that process, cole or Moore joining us. Okay,
(32:28):
so we've talked about the dye set. It's the machine
that is used to create your own bullets. And if
he did create his own bullets, there's going to be evidence.
There's going to be a dye set, there's going to
be the material needed to make the bullet, the outside,
the inside. The process requires a lot of let me
just say material, But how do you make the comparison.
(32:53):
Explain to me how just like that that police chief
knows we've got a preliminary match.
Speaker 13 (33:01):
So there's telltale signs on the casing itself, if left
at the scene, Uh, that can be traced back to
the weapon. So first you're going to have a primer
strike where the bullet is fired right on the primer.
Then you're going to have scratches on the casing that
match the ejector, and then denser smudges also on the
(33:24):
casing itself that match the ejector. Now these are all
called tool marks, and they match exactly to the weapon
I have here.
Speaker 10 (33:34):
The body, our our friend wasn't intus phone. We just
did a well of shit to just sitting here in
he appears said, okay, the other flood she's laying next
to his bead off of hiss in there's blood. I
think people are too more than that.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Okay, they can tell he's opposite up bringing her.
Speaker 14 (33:55):
Like how to like like.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
They looks like.
Speaker 10 (34:01):
I can't. Okay, all right, I understand.
Speaker 11 (34:06):
A source has come out and stated that doctor Michael
McKee right here worked a full shift on Monday, December
twenty ninth, twenty twenty five, and then had a cot
reserve for him at the hospital to spend the night.
This was the evening before into the morning of the
Tepees double homicide. So essentially, doctor Michael McKee had planned
to stay overnight at the hospital instead of going home
(34:27):
the night that he committed these crimes. And this may
be part of the reason why authorities are saying that
this was a premeditated, planned attack, because he was thinking
things out.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
Theories are like wildfire online. That is from at Matt
Thibodeaux at TikTok and keep thinking. Citizens sluse, you are
welcome here with all of your theories. Be they crazy
or that was not that crazy? Is it actually that's
a good theory. Was it premeditated? Obviously he had hours
(34:59):
long to drive at this moment tonight extradition has been delayed.
Is he a security risk in the meantime? During our
last live chat during the airing of our program, a
viewer noticed this, do not discount any evidence as being insignificant.
(35:23):
Let's see. Okay, watch and walk. He pulls to the right.
He pulls to the right one more time in the
courtroom the courtroom video. He pulls to the right when
he walks to the right, to the right, to the right.
There he goes and stands, goes to the right. Now
(35:43):
that's from wbnstn TV our friends there. Now let's look
at the video. Well, to the right, to the right,
he pulls to the right on every step. Let me
see that one more time. Okay. Straight out to Randy Kessler,
veteran trial lawyer joining us oude of the Atlanta jurisdiction
(36:06):
at Ksfamilylaw dot Com. Randy, thank you again for being
with us tonight. Randy, I recall I don't know if
you remember it, because you were definitely in the courthouse
during this trial. My first bank robbery case, armed robbery.
Of course, at superior level, you don't usually get a
bank robbery because fdi C it's a federal case. But
(36:30):
I got it, and I thought, wow, Wow, am I
getting to try a bank robbery? This is unusual. It's
because it's a terrible case that couldn't identify the defendants.
Cannot assigned by random, by the way, so it wasn't that,
but you could not identify the defendant at all. He
had on a hat, a wig, dark aviator, sunglasses, a
(36:53):
fake mustache, a fake beard. He was wearing a three
piece double breasted suit which as soon as he got out,
he ripped it all off. Underneath it was just based
up the back underneath it and on shorts of t
shirt and he just got on a bike and pedaled
off as the police arrived. You know, it got him
the way he walked because he was slewfooted. He walked
(37:15):
like a duck. Plus he was dyslexic. And the bank
robbery note said don't touch the owl ram this is
a roby, so that said. He walked with his feet
like that, and he sadly took the stand, and he
took the stand in front of the jury. You know,
that lawyer could have put him on the stand while
(37:35):
the jury was out of the room and not seen
him walk. He could have been sitting up there when
the jury came in. I was just praying they wouldn't
do that. The jury looked over the rail and saw
him walking sleoughfooted, just like the bank robber walked in
feet just like this. Did you see this guy? Did
you see doctor McKee walking pulling to the right every time?
Speaker 6 (37:58):
Yeah, I mean, you never know where it's going to tilt.
The jury or persuade the jury. Hopefully they've got a
lot more evidence than just the way he walks, but
it doesn't hurt to have that in there. And certainly,
you know, video cameras being everywhere, video cameras being in
the courtroom. This is helpful, it's all, you know, adding
on to the prosecution's case. I represent a lot of
men controlling men that my advice is don't go to court.
(38:20):
And you know why, because then all of a sudden,
your wife is just as equal to you, and the
court will make you do something, maybe not make you
pay as much as you want.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
That's hard for a lot of powerful men.
Speaker 6 (38:31):
And women to understand that the relationship they've been controlling
is all of a sudden changed where they are no
longer disuperior in the relationship.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
And who knows if that's what clicked for him or
triggered it. So we're talking about.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
Earlier crime stories with Nancy Grace Dave mac joining us
Tonight Crime Stories investigative reporter. Is it true the vascular
surgeon doctor McKee was arrested at Chick fil A? He
(39:05):
was Nancy.
Speaker 9 (39:06):
The guy is just acting like there's nothing going on,
just a regular day at the races, and he pops
into Chick fil A to get his favorite lunch neck.
That's where he was actually arrested, and the ATF was
there on site.
Speaker 14 (39:18):
Nancy, I wonder.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Why the ATF arrested him. That's a whole nother can
of worms. We know that the extradition procedure has been delayed.
Apparently private company performs the extradition process is being contracted
out and they have a delay. I'm sure he's not
in a hurry to get back Randy Kessler joining US
trial lawyer. The arrogance. You know what this reminds me
(39:44):
of Scott Peterson. And I'll tell you why. When Lacy's
DNA was matched to the body, the body of her
and her unborn child, Connor, officers came and they told
Scott Peterson they wanted to tell him in person. Kessler.
(40:06):
They said, we have to inform you that we've done
a DNA match and the bodies that washed ashore it's
Lacey and Connor. And do you know within about seven
or eight minutes, Scott Peterson asked the police to drive
him through in and out. He wanted it animal style,
(40:29):
which means a special sauce. He wanted a double double
with cheese, fries and a shake. It certainly did not
affect his appetite, did it that? He just learned Lacey
was absolutely dead and he would never have the son Connor.
Same thing here. What did you do? Do a double
(40:50):
round through Chick fil A to get some extra Chick
fil A sauce?
Speaker 3 (40:55):
You're gonna make that closing argument.
Speaker 1 (40:58):
He got right as part of my clothes. He gets
the grease.
Speaker 3 (41:03):
He's a star.
Speaker 6 (41:05):
Pridge and you should sit there and eat TV trays,
TV dinners and do nothing but more.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
This was his ex wife from years ago. He was eating.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
He turned himself in.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
Chick fil A is delicious.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
He should turn himself in.
Speaker 3 (41:18):
Okay, but that's nothing.
Speaker 6 (41:20):
But whether he's eating at Popeye's or Chick fil A
or Church's Fried Chicken, what does that matter.
Speaker 3 (41:25):
He's a guy who's got a stomach.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
Care where. I don't care where he ate. My point is,
you know what, doctor Bethany, I believe you could verbalize
this to Kesser and maybe make some sense get into
that head. Can you explain the significance of this?
Speaker 5 (41:42):
Well, I see it as congratulatory, self congratulatory. So he's
been obsessing all these years about getting rid of her.
We call it katathy macomicide. That's when there's a compulsion
to kill and it creates a horrible tension internally. And
when the criminal finally works up the courage to do it,
they're quite relieved afterwards. They're very satisfied with themselves. As
(42:06):
I said earlier, he triumphed over here, he got his way.
Now his world is all in perfect order. It's not
like somebody who commits vehicular homicide by mistake and afterwards
they're rattled and they're shaken and they can't believe that
they hit somebody. This guy is quite happy, so I
think this is his happy meal. You know, he's dancing
(42:28):
on her grave.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
Dave Matt Crime Stories investigator, reporter. Why did the ATF
arrest him?
Speaker 14 (42:34):
It came down to a lie. Doctor Michael McKee lied
on a federal form when he purchased a handgun in Nevada.
He provided a false residency form of information and that
immediately triggered the federal jurisdiction for firearm violation alongside the
state murder chargers. So the ATF was brought in because
(42:56):
of the lie about where he was living.
Speaker 9 (42:59):
When he filed to that.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Gun okay, did serious lawsuits play into triggering doctor McKee
not that motive is necessary listen.
Speaker 15 (43:11):
Twelve weeks before he's accused of murder, McKee is sued
for malpractice by Nevada man. McKee allegedly overseen erry when
an eight point six inch cather shard breaks off in
the patient's leg. The patient's lawyer spends over a month
trying to track down McKee's serve and papers and has
no luck for the process, server claims. A coworker of
McKee says he just disappeared.
Speaker 16 (43:31):
McKee leaves Vegas after the malpractice lawsuit, taking a job
at OSF St. Anthony Medical Center, Rockford, Illinois, purchasing a
four hundred thousand dollars penhouse apartment in Chicago last July.
The complaint alleges the failure of McKee caused the catheter
to share, leaving an eight point six inch portion of
the device in the plaintiff's body. McKee allegedly breached the
(43:54):
standard of care, including lower extremity bleeding, a demon pain, discolouration, disfigurement,
another in injuries.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
He evaded getting served. He high tailed it, even a
process server couldn't find him.
Speaker 15 (44:06):
McKee able to evade a malpractice lawsuit for months. As
a process server, it makes nearly a dozen failed attempts
to serve McKee with the lawsuit. Nevada lawyer Dan Laird
files the suit, but serving McKee was nearly impossible as
the surgery group he worked for gave the attorney a
fake address and the phone number issued with the State
Medical Board for McKee is a fax machine.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
What did doctor Caravellas say?
Speaker 8 (44:29):
He said he has no idea where doctor Michael McKee
is now, said he just disappeared.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
Wow, so McKee was a ghost. That's from Wsyx and Moore.
Listen to this. A guy loses his testicle.
Speaker 16 (44:43):
A prison inmate of Nevada claims McKee caused him to
have his left testicle removed. The blank of alleges he
suffered a work related injury while incarcerated, causing pain and
swelling in his left testicle. McKee was part of a
medical review panel that approved the inmates medical care, resulting
in a surgeon with limited experience to be used for
the surgery. After a year of pain, repeated procedures to
(45:05):
drain fluid a proper corrective surgery was performed, but the
delay and treatment resulted in the permanent removal of the
inmates left testicle.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
Repeated draining of your testicle. Okay, doctor Thomas Coin, Were
these lawsuits enough to trigger him into doing something horrible
like a double murder? Thinking she caused all of this
strife in my life, it's all her fault. Blah blah blah.
(45:33):
A shard of a catheter left in your leg, a
surgical procedure to amputate your testicle. I guess he was
under stress. How do you end up with a catheter
shard stuck in your leg? And why do you have
your testicle cut off?
Speaker 3 (45:53):
Well?
Speaker 8 (45:54):
I mean so if you if you are performing a
surgery on someone, obviously, especially with vasculars surgery, where you
are instrumenting or entering into or repairing a blood vessel,
oftentimes that you may insert a catheter to maintain the
patency or keep that vessel open while you're operating on it.
I don't know how in this particular case this occurred,
(46:16):
but it's possible that a shard of that catheter was
dislodged during surgery, was accidentally cut off and left in
or just simply left in accidentally rather than being removed
when the surgery was complete. And that if that, if
that catheter is left in place, they can actually block
the normal blood flow within that vessel, causing eschemia as
(46:37):
we say, or lack of blood flow to the testicle,
which could cause that testicle to die.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
It can be very two different cases, doctor Coin. There's
the one case with the Cather's shar left in the leg.
Then there's the other cases. Innate, he has this testicle amputated.
Speaker 8 (46:54):
Oh that I don't know. I don't know how that
process happened. But the the catheter, I mean, listen, there's
been plenty of cases throughout you know, you know my
time during training where there's been instruments left in patients,
wrong sides operated on, you know, small little cloth pieces
(47:17):
left inside of body during a surgery. So it does happen,
and generally it's just you know, carelessness. You know, you're
worried too much about closing or a bleeding area and
you leave a catheter in place. And so that's probably
what happened in that instance. As to the testicle incident, certainly,
testicular torsion can happen in males. I don't know what
(47:39):
went wrong there.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
I don't want to think about what went wrong there.
But I know this, Randy Casser. When I graduated from
law school, I never thought that I would put testical
amputated in the same sentence. You just never know, right.
Speaker 6 (47:51):
There's a lot there that we're on air and I
can't talk about it. But you know, Nancy, you were
tough as a prosecutor, and that's I'll leave it at that.
Speaker 1 (47:58):
Guys, the state is still building its case. If you
know or think you know anything about this case, if
you saw something, heard something, please call six one four
six four five two two two eight repeat six one four, six, four,
five two two two eight. Nancy Grace signing off, goodbye friend,
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, Monster Marriage, the icy threats.
We are learning a vascular surgeon husband made years before,
years before, nearly ten years before, he allegedly shoots his
(00:24):
ex wife and new dentist's husband dead in their own beds,
their children wailing in the background. Now, think about it.
How long did those bodies lie? They're going cold in
pools of blood with their children sitting there with mommy
and daddy dead. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
(00:47):
I want to thank you for being with us. Stone
faced and cold blooded. A surgeon in court after his
ex wife and her dentist husband both shot dead. He
knows exactly what's happening, and not a flicker of emotion
on his face, not one ounce, not one drop, one
scintilla of remorse. How long did he stalk her? As
(01:14):
he gets kicked from one jurisdiction to the next, multiple
malepractice and claims against him, He looks at her online.
She moved on in a big way. She found true love,
gets married to an awesome guy. They have two children.
They get married in their home. They post a video
(01:35):
of it, and there he is alone, alone and miserable.
Now we are learning that she quote just had to
get out of that starter marriage. It was just for
seven months. It was nearly ten years ago, and he
brewed and bubbled and simmered and stewed for nearly ten
(01:57):
years till he makes an over three hundred mild trek
to sheot her dead in bed with her husband, her
children in the room next door. This is what we've learned. Listen.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
She was terrified because he had threatened her life on multiple.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Occasions when they were married.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
She wasn't shy about talking to people about traumatic experiences
that she had with her ex and just how emotionally
abusive he was to her.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
That's my friends at NBC. I'm going to analyze what
we are hearing straight out to investigative reporter Susan Hendrix,
also an author of Down the Hill, My Descent into
the Double Murder in Delphi. Susan on this case from
the very beginning, Susan, that is the brother in law
speaking out. Quote. She was terrified because he had threatened
(02:50):
her life on multiple occasions when they were married, that's
nearly ten years ago. She would talk openly to family members.
What you make of it?
Speaker 4 (03:02):
I believe as he said, that she was terrified.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
And how do I know?
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Because their social media was private. She was very much
kind of on the down low on social media, if
you will. I don't think she wanted to make her
ex angry. I think because the brother in law also
said it changed her as a person. He was that
mostly abusive. I think it went on beyond the marriage.
I think she was fearful of him clearly, and I
(03:28):
think that's why Spencer's dental office knew that something was
off that day.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
If any of us had known that these threats were
actually grounded impossibility, we all would have acted differently. Myself
and many others were well aware of kind of the
negative impact that he had on her. She was willing
to do anything to get out of there.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
From our friends at NBC and GMA. That is the
brother in law raw miss speaking out what I could
have should have. You know what all survivors do. That
isn't that true, Doctor Bethany Marshall. If only we had known,
if actually we had known they were grounded in reality,
we would have done things differently. But people don't live
(04:13):
their lives thinking, oh, he's gonna drive six hours and
shoot them in their beds. There's no reason they should
have known that he was secretly stalking his ex wife
all these years.
Speaker 5 (04:25):
Bethany, the family perhaps shouldn't have known, but I believe
Monique knew if her social media was private, if she
talked about the abuse and Nancy. This escalated in just
seven months of marriage. You know, stalking behavior can start
just after one date. The guy falls in love with
you and then believes there's a special relationship when there's none.
(04:49):
The girl doesn't return the text or the phone call,
and now he's enraged. And so when women leave a relationship,
they're at the highest risk for domestic homicide. As you
pointed out, she left, she had moved on, and that
very act enraged him, and he punished her for this
perceived rejection. That's what he did. He mowed her down.
(05:11):
But I think she knew.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Deep down inside. Or do you think she saw him,
or she got a weird text or an email and
she goes, oh my stars, that's the key, Or do
you think it was just a gut feeling in her
bones she knew.
Speaker 5 (05:25):
I think it was a gut feeling. I treat women
who are stalking victims, and often they fall into a depression.
They're in a dysphoric state, and they become preoccupied with
the offender. They think about them all the time. They
look at that out their car windows. They're sitting in
a restaurant with a new partner and they see, like
say Nicole Brown, they see a car drive by, like
(05:48):
a white Tahoe and they think, Oh my God, is
that my ex husband. So they live in fear Nancy.
It gets into their brains. I bet it was in
her brain, in her thought process that she was at risk.
It was always there and that's why she was talking
about it.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
As we go to air tonight, extradition delayed. What's going on?
Is he some sort of a security threat? Why can't
we get him to Home Turf to get this trial
ball rolling, get the show on the road. At this time,
we know the state is building its case against vascular
(06:26):
surgeon doctor McKee. Just think about this guy. He excelled
in everything he did. That's his mug shot. He excelled
at everything. He played football on a very high level
in college. He was Danselous honor student. In undergrad he
was a star student in medical school. He went on
(06:49):
to become a vascular surgeon. Certified to practice in multiple jurisdictions.
Just before Monique and her husband are shot dead, he
gets sacked with a malpractice suit, a pretty serious one,
and another claim that one patient actually lost his testicle
(07:11):
because of McKee, very serious complaints. And then he ghosts everybody.
He leaves that jurisdiction and disappears to where even a
PI can't find him, and just starts all over again
in another jurisdiction. Could he move that surreptitiously? Which leads
me to how long had he been surreptitiously stalking Monique?
(07:35):
There she is Monique and the first starter husband, Michael McKee,
the vascular surgeon, straight out to a real pro joining
us tonight, Randy Kessler. You know him well. He is
a veteran trial lawyer, Emory Law School professor, former chair
of the ABA Family Law Section, the American Bar Association,
(08:00):
author of Divorced, Protect Yourself, your Kids, and Your Future.
Randy Kessler, you and I have crossed swords many, many
times in court. Kessler, think about it now. I know
you would never bring us up in court about your
own client, right, but this guy's not your client. Tell
me the truth. How long do you think he had
(08:23):
been stalking her in person, maybe even watching them put
the code into the keypad and goes, oh, that's her
father's birthday, or online, watching that wedding video over and
over and over, and there he is sitting alone having
his TV dinner, looking at her video and her happy life.
(08:44):
How long you think he's been stalking Monique?
Speaker 3 (08:47):
It's one of two dates.
Speaker 6 (08:48):
It's either the date that the final divorce was granted
or the date that the divorce was fouled. This was
his first rejection from what we can tell, right, Like
you said, who's so successful in everything?
Speaker 3 (08:58):
I mean, the pinnacle of vascular surge, the football star.
Speaker 6 (09:01):
Dean's List, married to a beautiful woman and then she
rejects him or it doesn't work, and that's you know,
that's what divorce is about. People feel like somebody who
I thought was the perfect person, who I wanted to
be with forever, tells me I'm not good enough. They're
rejecting me. It may not be the truth of the matter.
That could easily be the perception that might have started.
It might have been when he started stalking her. It
(09:22):
might have been when it started the trigger for him thinking,
how do I rectify this. He obviously couldn't handle it.
If this is the guy who did it, And I
think that's that's when it started.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
If you ask me what you did all those years, Kessler,
so you think he started stalking behavior all the way
back to the time that she left him. And did
you know, Kessler, that she on her little money that
she was making, very educated. I believe she had a
master's degree. Not making a lot of money, but the
little bit she made, she paid a private judge to
(09:56):
expedite the divorce proceedings is going to lawyer's docket. Just
think about where you practice, Fulton Superior. You can wait
a year before you can get a divorce on a
dock and be heard, you know, actually get a jury
trial or a hearing. She paid herself alone to expelite
that divorce. And guess what he wanted. I hope you're
(10:17):
sitting down. You needed to lay down, because I happened
to know you've got a big, beautiful brocade sofa, a
plush sofa in your fancy digs at your office. You
may needed to lay down on that. Kestler. He asked,
demanded that she pay him back for the engagement ring
and the wedding band and then he charged her twenty
(10:38):
three percent interest on a twelve hundred dollars miscellaneous debt
he claimed she owed him. Okay, no wonder she left him.
Speaker 6 (10:49):
You know, there's a horrible joke about whyse of the
divorce so expensive, because it's worth it. It was worth
it to her. You know, we have our rich clients
pay for private joses all the time to do it, lead,
to expedite it, to do it at their own schedule.
But yes, sometimes people just went out and a lot
of people were commenting in the press and in the
news that it was an uncontested it was an amicable divorce.
It was amicable just in that it wasn't fought out
(11:12):
in court. And that's because somebody, obviously her now wanted out.
She even agreed to pay her own lawyer fees. When
you have a surgeon on one side, usually the person
making all the money is required to pay both side
attorneys fees because it's a marital expense, that's marital income.
She obviously clearly wanted out. And you know, when did
she ever feel safe?
Speaker 1 (11:30):
And that's the same Look at that picture, Kestler, Do
you see that picture right there that I'm showing off
her pregnant front of the Christmas tree. How crazy do
you think that made that vascular surgeon ex husband there
she is pregnant by another man, which, of course you
know what that means, they had to have sex. I
bet that drove him right over the edge. Kestler.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Yeah, but when do you ever feel safe?
Speaker 6 (11:53):
And that's what tears at me, not just what happened,
but all these women out there that have gotten away
from somebody like that. She's moved on, she's got children,
she's married, she's living in another state.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
When is enough?
Speaker 6 (12:04):
When can you look in the rear view mirror and
say there's nothing there, It's just shadows and you see
cases like this, And there are a lot of people
having post traumatic stress disorder just from this story. I'm
sure we see women that come back to us and say,
I still need to restrain anywhere. I said, but you're divorced. Yes,
but he's still calling, he's still coming by. Just a
terrible situation, and unfortunately, I don't think this is the
(12:25):
only person out there that got this concern.
Speaker 7 (12:28):
On December thirtieth, twenty twenty five, at approximately ten oh
four am, Columbus Police Patrol officers were dispatched to the
fourteen hundred block of North Forth Street on a well
being check. Officers arrived at scene and located the two
adult victims suffering from apparent gunshot wounds. We now know
that they were identified as mister Spencer Teppy and missus
(12:49):
Monique Teppy. Their two small children were also found in
the resident physically unharmed.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Straight out the special guests joining us doctor Thomas Cone,
chief Medical Examiner, just district to Medical Examiner's office, State
of Florida. He is a forensic pathologist, toxicologist, neuropathologist. Doctor Corn,
thank you for being with us. I want to address
what the two children have been through. Guys. I'm going
to get to the news as quickly as I can
(13:17):
about the fact that his extradition has been delayed. What
does it mean. Don't worry. He's not burning up the interstate,
the Ohio Turnpike to get back home, because Ohio does
have the death penalty. It was hanging, then it went
to Old Sparky the electric chair. Now it's needle death
by lethal injection. There's a moratorium on right now on
(13:39):
the death penalty, but it's not official. It's unofficial. They
can't get the correct drugs to perform death by needle,
but who knows, Maybe they'll go back to death by
firing squad like other jurisdictions have done, or possibly some
sort of nitrous oxide that's on the table as well.
That's a whole other can of worms, Doctor Thomas Coin,
(14:01):
I want to talk to you about the two children.
They're both under four years old. They were heard in
the background. If I could get the control room to
pull up the nine to one one call where you
can hear the children screaming, wailing in the background, Doctor Coin,
What would the children have seen, because we know that
(14:22):
the husband was shot twice, Monique was shot once, and
they have placed the shootings after three am, and cops
didn't break in well actually friends had to get in
the home until hours and hours later, well after nine am.
(14:45):
Would the blood have coagulated? Would the bodies have gotten cold,
because I believe the children were in there with their parents'
dead bodies.
Speaker 8 (14:53):
Horrible, horrible, Yeah, I mean I remember one just coming
upon the bodies, and depending upon where they were shot,
it would have been a considerable amount of bleeding, especially
even from a head wound or a wound to the chest,
and so their clothing may have been soaked in blood
where they were lying. For instance, if they were in
the bedroom, the bed sheets may have been soaked in blood.
And depending upon where they were shot, you know, if
(15:14):
it was an angled shot that sort of hit the head,
there could have been a tearing of the scalp tissues.
So it could have been quite horrific and gruesome for
the children to see their parents in that state.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
Tell me about what you would expect to see around
a scene where the husband had been shot twice in
the chest with a nine millimeter and the wife shot once,
we also believe in the chest. Would there have been
well we also known another fact when the friend came
(15:46):
in and saw the dentist's dead body. He said he
was half on, half off the bed or beside the bed.
Would that blood have already coagulated in say, six hours?
Would the bodies already be cold? It's freezing cold outside
and snowing, But the ambiance temperature in the room probably
(16:08):
sixty eight, sixty nine or seventy.
Speaker 8 (16:11):
The bodies would have started I mean, had they been
shot hours prior, the body temperature would have started to
acclimate towards that of the home, and they certainly would
have probably still had some rigor present in the body,
a little stiff.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
The blood would have.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Slowed down, settled, slowdown, doctor Coin rigor gimman. When the
children come upon their mom and they try to touch
her or hold her, she's already in rigor mortis.
Speaker 8 (16:36):
Yes, so her her body would have been stiffed, that cold,
and probably stiff to touch her arms and her legs
may have been rigid. And there probably was also libra mortis,
which is the settling of the blood based upon graphic
so you'll see pinkish or purple discoloration of the body
(16:57):
on the bottom where it's lying, and so they probably
would have encountered that upon seeing the the two victims.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Of the blood.
Speaker 8 (17:04):
Also, yeah, I would have started to coagulate. If it
sits for quite a long period of time, you can
also see separation of the of the cellular component from
the liquid component, so we called serum. So you may
see a little separation of that as well. But if
it's soaked into the bed sheets, it would have just
looked all red.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Just thinking about what those children saw and experienced. When
you say both mom and dad would be in full rigor.
Unless you've seen it, it's hard to explain the only
way I've explained it to a jury is that you
know two by four right, You've been around lumber, right, doctor, Okay, Absolutely,
(17:47):
it's just like that. If you try to touch the mom,
her arm is like a two by four, it's that hard.
It's that stiff, that stiff.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
And you can't bend it. You know, it's almost immobile.
Speaker 8 (18:03):
And so for the child who is going up to
their parents hoping to feel a warm body, it would
probably feel horrible. I mean, just just cold and very stiff,
non responsible, you.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Know, doctor Bethany, I don't know how a child, you know,
two children under the age of four, what they thought
they were seeing. But I can tell you this, I
don't care what all the shrinks say. Children remember long
before three years old. I have memories as early as
two years old that I can identify. I think my
(18:37):
daughter has memories before that. How will they remember that?
Will they suppress it? Will it come back in dreams?
Will it affect their personalities for the rest of their lives.
Speaker 5 (18:52):
It'll come back in so many forms, Nancy. It could
come back as I've said before at a pre conscious,
pre verbal level, meaning they have the sensation of seeing
a traumatic scene, but they can't really put it into words.
They could be walking down the street someday and see
somebody walk in front of a car and have a
flashback and think, oh my god, that car is going
(19:12):
to hit that person. They could become people who refuse
to form attachments because this premature loss of the parent
makes them too terrified of abandonment. It's going to affect
them on all levels. Nance it could predispose them to
personality disorders, to drug abuse, to alcoholism. This will have
(19:32):
a traumatic traumatic effect. The best thing that can happen
for these children is to go into a new family
where there are predictable and safe attachment systems so they
can relatives.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
Now, Dr Bethty, that's.
Speaker 5 (19:47):
Good to their relatives.
Speaker 1 (19:49):
I think the dog is a is a golden doodle
and it is also with the children crime stories with
Nancy Grace. Hey, doctor Coin, let me ask you a question.
I was thinking about what the children would have experienced
(20:10):
and I was out jogging the other night and I
smelled a smell and it immediately made me think of
my grandmother Lucy that helped raise me. It was kind
of a fresh like a cucumber, not quite a cucumber,
but something like that. And I don't know what it is.
I've tried to identify. When I do smell it, where
is that coming from? It must be some kind of
a plant. But I immediately think of her because she
(20:33):
smelled that kind of a fresh smell, Doctor Coin, Why
does blood smell?
Speaker 8 (20:42):
You know, some people say it's got a metallic smell
to it, almost like iron. It's biological, so there are
a number of different biological compounds that we produce that
may be present blood at any given time, you know,
from ammonia type, you know, chemicals just to the you know,
mineral component of blood as well. But there is a
(21:03):
definite unique smell to blood. It doesn't vaporize, let's say,
like human tissue. As our fatty tissue begins to break down,
it aromatized. Is this sort of putrid chemical smell that
is quite unique, you know, human death compared to animal death.
But blood does have a pretty unique smell that I
think most of us can recognize.
Speaker 1 (21:25):
Kessler, I know that you specialize in domestic relations. That's
certainly putting perfume on the pig. Divorce, nasty divorce, the
worst divorce, the most expensive divorce. You got to get Kessler.
But you have also handled criminal cases. Have you ever
been on a murder scene.
Speaker 3 (21:45):
No, I've never had the misfortune to go. And I'm
glad we bring in criminals.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Well, I'm glad because that smell is something you never forget,
the smell of a decomposing body or the smell of
blood coagulating. I'm glad. I'm happy for you. But okay,
since that's a note for me, let me go to Bethany. Bethany.
Just like the other night, when I was jogging and
I smell that fresh plant smell, I thought of my grandmother.
(22:14):
I was thinking about something completely different, and then I'm
just thinking about these children going through life. And then
they smell a smell and it smells. Oh, here's another one.
I can't stand to smell chrysanthemums because when I walked
into my fiance's funeral, it was like a hit me
in the face. I hate that smell. I'm just wondering.
(22:37):
There's just so many things that affect these children's memory.
It can be a smell, it can be a moment.
It can be a feeling, it can be anything that's
going to trigger this for them the rest of their lives.
Speaker 5 (22:51):
Nancy, it's called evocative memory. Let's see you go on
a trip and you take a certain kind of perfume
or product on the trip, and then years later you
pull that product out of a drawer and you smell it.
You will think about that trip. So anything those children
sawce smelled, felt in that room, it's going to be evoked.
(23:11):
So let's say they can see the color red. Let's
say they're watching a movie, and we know that there
is violence in all movies unless it's a comedy. They
will see maybe the sight of blood or somebody being killed,
or child looking at a parent. That evocative memory is
going to be triggered. And then you combine that with PTSD,
(23:32):
one of the symptoms of which is flashbacks. A flashback
is when you're in a similar situation to the earlier
trauma and your brain tells you that you're in the
exact same situation.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
Again.
Speaker 5 (23:47):
Let's say you're in the war, you are in the
middle of an explosion and an ied goes off. Years later,
you're walking down the street in the car backfires. All
of a sudden, you feel you're in the war again.
So these kids are going to be exposed to similar
flashbacks and evocative memory throughout the rest of their lives.
Speaker 9 (24:07):
What's changed since the last person I talked to?
Speaker 10 (24:10):
There's a body.
Speaker 11 (24:11):
There's a body inside.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
Yeah, okay, hold on one second.
Speaker 9 (24:18):
Let me get you on the line with the medic.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Okay, on the line.
Speaker 10 (24:22):
Appear's dead.
Speaker 7 (24:26):
Multiple weapons were taken from the property of McKee, and
there's a preliminary link from our NIVEN to one of
the weapons that ties it to the homicide.
Speaker 12 (24:40):
Local and Columbus police in and out of McKee's twelfth
floor Chicago apartment with boxes of potential evidence, lugging it
down to a Columbus PD crime lab van in the
underground garage. Residents receive a notice authorities will be investigating
over several days and they shouldn't be concerned by the
officer posted outside mcke's door. Preliminary testing leads them to
(25:02):
believe one of those weapons is connected to the tepe's murders.
Speaker 5 (25:06):
Did you find any other evidence in his home in
Lincoln Park?
Speaker 7 (25:09):
What I can tell you is that we did search
his property and we have evidence, but I can't speak
to any specific evidence.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
They've got evidence. They were observed lugging box after box
after box out of vascular surgeon doctor McKee's penthouse apartment
there at Lincoln Park, straight out to a special guest
joining us tonight, CoA. Lour Moore, thank you for being
with us, former Army sniper sharpshooter. I want to talk
(25:37):
to you about the weapons. You just heard Columbus Police
Chief Elaine Bryant state that there is a preliminary match
from evidence found in the home. I ate the gun.
I don't know where they found it in the home,
in the car, doesn't matter for your purposes. But they've
got a match to the bullets fired at the scene
(25:58):
where they lodged in the body. Did they cachet off
the wall, where they stuck in the wall, where they
stuck in the matches, where they stuck in the floor,
doesn't matter. They're saying they've got a match. Now, Before
I get to you about how that match is deduced,
I want to talk to you about how difficult would
(26:18):
it be for the killer to engrave or write on
the bullets? Now, you see, I didn't think about that
before the devil kicked Luigi Mangioni into my life, who wrote,
let's see Deny delay depose. He actually took the time
(26:40):
to write that on the bullets that he used to
shoot the United Healthcare boss. According to police, then you've
got the fiend that shot Charlie Kirk Tyler Robinson. He wrote,
hey fascist on the bullet. Okay, they've got way too
much spare time for a shrink. CoA, Laura Moore, tell
(27:02):
me how would you write something on the bullet?
Speaker 13 (27:06):
Well, Nancy, you could take a DREML tool and then
you take the casing of the bullet like I have
right here, and you could basically just engrave whatever you
want on that casing. But I think you would have
to have a special kind of hatred to go to
the lengths of engraving something on that.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Agree. Now let me ask you this, CoA. What if
we learn the defendant, the surgeon dot McKee, created his
own ammunition. Yes, people actually do that. How do you
create your own ammunition? And to me, and I'm going
(27:42):
to get to Kessler on this, that would leave a
trail a mile wide if you created your own bullets.
How do you do that?
Speaker 13 (27:51):
So you need a special machine that they use to
create a bullet like this, and then you take all
the components. You take the primer on the back, the
case obviously, the gunpowder inside, and then the bullet and
you press it all together. This is common practice with
like precision shooters, people that do it for sport. Pretty
(28:12):
uncommon just for your average guy.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Okay, there is actually a machine that does it. It's
a manual swagging process. And you know the reason I'm
asking about this hold on Cole Laura Moore to doctor
Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst joining us out of LA at doctor
Bethany Marshall dot com. Doctor Bethany, he spent practically ten years,
(28:38):
eight years plus thinking about her, and something pushed him
over the edge. It could have been these lawsuits where
one guy lost a testicle and the other had a
pete a shard of catheter stuck in his leg which caused,
according to him, disfigurement. And then when they tried to
sue surgeon doctor McKee, he ghosted everyone and vanished. Even
(29:01):
the process server couldn't find him. And you know, they
make money when they finally serve you the papers. So
he was trying to find him, and he totally disappeared.
That said, that could have triggered it. But all these
years he has been watching her, and I could just
see him hunched over a table with one of these machines,
(29:22):
making his own bullets and engraving them out of hatred.
Speaker 5 (29:27):
You don't, Nancy fifty Almost fifty percent of all stalking
happens during the course of a marriage, not necessarily afterwards.
So this stalking behavior probably started from the first state,
first of all. Secondly, there's going to be a lot
of behavioral evidence. He probably made many attempts to contact hers,
so there's going to be emails, letters, snail mail. I
(29:49):
think we're going to find all sorts of things. And
in terms of the risk factors for violence, why now
what pushed him over the edge? Usually a demotion in
staff and rejection. So the fact that he was potentially
had a lawsuit against him made him feel humiliated.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
At risk of Randy Kesser objection claiming asked an answered,
I always love that objection at trial. But let me,
instead of asking the same thing, doctor Bethany, refine my question.
Let me refine my question. In other words, ask it
in another way. Doctor Bethany. You know how stalkers and
freaks they get enjoyment from the process of the stalking.
(30:32):
I think it makes them feel closer to the target
they're victim, Like writing them letters. They take great pains
to write the letter and then sneak up and leave
it there or mail just they get some enjoyment from that.
So what would he have derived from making his own
bullets if he did with the diy st What joy
would he get from that?
Speaker 5 (30:53):
Well, think about kill kits when serial killers assemble the
kit in preparation for finding victims. The enjoyment he would
have gotten is complete and utter power over her, looking
at the fear in her eyes, blotting her off the
face of the earth, so he doesn't have to think
about her anymore, potentially killing her husband in front of
(31:16):
her while she's still alive. So he shows her who's
really the boss in this situation. And I think, more importantly,
a reversal of power. He imagines she has power over
him because she's moved on, but he's going to try
to assert power over her reverse power dynamic. In my field,
we call it triumphing over the love object. He's triumphing
(31:40):
over her every time he engraves that bullet.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Doctor Bethany, I'm going back to cole Laura Moore right
now with bullet questions, but I want you to think
about something. You know how people when they're dating, they
get ready for the day, Like the woman does her hair,
puts on megup. The man goes wash the car this
is stereotypical, of course, and gets all ready, maybe buys flowers.
It's all in anticipation of those few hours that they
(32:07):
have a date. Just imagine him getting the bullets, getting
the gun, driving all the way down the Ohio Turnpike,
going through the what twenty four tolls to get there,
all in anticipation of the moment he pulls the trigger
and sees her face and her fear. I want to
talk about that process, cole or Moore joining us. Okay,
(32:28):
so we've talked about the dye set. It's the machine
that is used to create your own bullets. And if
he did create his own bullets, there's going to be evidence.
There's going to be a dye set, there's going to
be the material needed to make the bullet, the outside,
the inside. The process requires a lot of let me
just say material, But how do you make the comparison.
(32:53):
Explain to me how just like that that police chief
knows we've got a preliminary match.
Speaker 13 (33:01):
So there's telltale signs on the casing itself, if left
at the scene, Uh, that can be traced back to
the weapon. So first you're going to have a primer
strike where the bullet is fired right on the primer.
Then you're going to have scratches on the casing that
match the ejector, and then denser smudges also on the
(33:24):
casing itself that match the ejector. Now these are all
called tool marks, and they match exactly to the weapon
I have here.
Speaker 10 (33:34):
The body, our our friend wasn't intus phone. We just
did a well of shit to just sitting here in
he appears said, okay, the other flood she's laying next
to his bead off of hiss in there's blood. I
think people are too more than that.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Okay, they can tell he's opposite up bringing her.
Speaker 14 (33:55):
Like how to like like.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
They looks like.
Speaker 10 (34:01):
I can't. Okay, all right, I understand.
Speaker 11 (34:06):
A source has come out and stated that doctor Michael
McKee right here worked a full shift on Monday, December
twenty ninth, twenty twenty five, and then had a cot
reserve for him at the hospital to spend the night.
This was the evening before into the morning of the
Tepees double homicide. So essentially, doctor Michael McKee had planned
to stay overnight at the hospital instead of going home
(34:27):
the night that he committed these crimes. And this may
be part of the reason why authorities are saying that
this was a premeditated, planned attack, because he was thinking
things out.
Speaker 1 (34:37):
Theories are like wildfire online. That is from at Matt
Thibodeaux at TikTok and keep thinking. Citizens sluse, you are
welcome here with all of your theories. Be they crazy
or that was not that crazy? Is it actually that's
a good theory. Was it premeditated? Obviously he had hours
(34:59):
long to drive at this moment tonight extradition has been delayed.
Is he a security risk in the meantime? During our
last live chat during the airing of our program, a
viewer noticed this, do not discount any evidence as being insignificant.
(35:23):
Let's see. Okay, watch and walk. He pulls to the right.
He pulls to the right one more time in the
courtroom the courtroom video. He pulls to the right when
he walks to the right, to the right, to the right.
There he goes and stands, goes to the right. Now
(35:43):
that's from wbnstn TV our friends there. Now let's look
at the video. Well, to the right, to the right,
he pulls to the right on every step. Let me
see that one more time. Okay. Straight out to Randy Kessler,
veteran trial lawyer joining us oude of the Atlanta jurisdiction
(36:06):
at Ksfamilylaw dot Com. Randy, thank you again for being
with us tonight. Randy, I recall I don't know if
you remember it, because you were definitely in the courthouse
during this trial. My first bank robbery case, armed robbery.
Of course, at superior level, you don't usually get a
bank robbery because fdi C it's a federal case. But
(36:30):
I got it, and I thought, wow, Wow, am I
getting to try a bank robbery? This is unusual. It's
because it's a terrible case that couldn't identify the defendants.
Cannot assigned by random, by the way, so it wasn't that,
but you could not identify the defendant at all. He
had on a hat, a wig, dark aviator, sunglasses, a
(36:53):
fake mustache, a fake beard. He was wearing a three
piece double breasted suit which as soon as he got out,
he ripped it all off. Underneath it was just based
up the back underneath it and on shorts of t
shirt and he just got on a bike and pedaled
off as the police arrived. You know, it got him
the way he walked because he was slewfooted. He walked
(37:15):
like a duck. Plus he was dyslexic. And the bank
robbery note said don't touch the owl ram this is
a roby, so that said. He walked with his feet
like that, and he sadly took the stand, and he
took the stand in front of the jury. You know,
that lawyer could have put him on the stand while
(37:35):
the jury was out of the room and not seen
him walk. He could have been sitting up there when
the jury came in. I was just praying they wouldn't
do that. The jury looked over the rail and saw
him walking sleoughfooted, just like the bank robber walked in
feet just like this. Did you see this guy? Did
you see doctor McKee walking pulling to the right every time?
Speaker 6 (37:58):
Yeah, I mean, you never know where it's going to tilt.
The jury or persuade the jury. Hopefully they've got a
lot more evidence than just the way he walks, but
it doesn't hurt to have that in there. And certainly,
you know, video cameras being everywhere, video cameras being in
the courtroom. This is helpful, it's all, you know, adding
on to the prosecution's case. I represent a lot of
men controlling men that my advice is don't go to court.
(38:20):
And you know why, because then all of a sudden,
your wife is just as equal to you, and the
court will make you do something, maybe not make you
pay as much as you want.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
That's hard for a lot of powerful men.
Speaker 6 (38:31):
And women to understand that the relationship they've been controlling
is all of a sudden changed where they are no
longer disuperior in the relationship.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
And who knows if that's what clicked for him or
triggered it. So we're talking about.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
Earlier crime stories with Nancy Grace Dave mac joining us
Tonight Crime Stories investigative reporter. Is it true the vascular
surgeon doctor McKee was arrested at Chick fil A? He
(39:05):
was Nancy.
Speaker 9 (39:06):
The guy is just acting like there's nothing going on,
just a regular day at the races, and he pops
into Chick fil A to get his favorite lunch neck.
That's where he was actually arrested, and the ATF was
there on site.
Speaker 14 (39:18):
Nancy, I wonder.
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Why the ATF arrested him. That's a whole nother can
of worms. We know that the extradition procedure has been delayed.
Apparently private company performs the extradition process is being contracted
out and they have a delay. I'm sure he's not
in a hurry to get back Randy Kessler joining US
trial lawyer. The arrogance. You know what this reminds me
(39:44):
of Scott Peterson. And I'll tell you why. When Lacy's
DNA was matched to the body, the body of her
and her unborn child, Connor, officers came and they told
Scott Peterson they wanted to tell him in person. Kessler.
(40:06):
They said, we have to inform you that we've done
a DNA match and the bodies that washed ashore it's
Lacey and Connor. And do you know within about seven
or eight minutes, Scott Peterson asked the police to drive
him through in and out. He wanted it animal style,
(40:29):
which means a special sauce. He wanted a double double
with cheese, fries and a shake. It certainly did not
affect his appetite, did it that? He just learned Lacey
was absolutely dead and he would never have the son Connor.
Same thing here. What did you do? Do a double
(40:50):
round through Chick fil A to get some extra Chick
fil A sauce?
Speaker 3 (40:55):
You're gonna make that closing argument.
Speaker 1 (40:58):
He got right as part of my clothes. He gets
the grease.
Speaker 3 (41:03):
He's a star.
Speaker 6 (41:05):
Pridge and you should sit there and eat TV trays,
TV dinners and do nothing but more.
Speaker 3 (41:10):
This was his ex wife from years ago. He was eating.
Speaker 1 (41:13):
He turned himself in.
Speaker 3 (41:15):
Chick fil A is delicious.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
He should turn himself in.
Speaker 3 (41:18):
Okay, but that's nothing.
Speaker 6 (41:20):
But whether he's eating at Popeye's or Chick fil A
or Church's Fried Chicken, what does that matter.
Speaker 3 (41:25):
He's a guy who's got a stomach.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
Care where. I don't care where he ate. My point is,
you know what, doctor Bethany, I believe you could verbalize
this to Kesser and maybe make some sense get into
that head. Can you explain the significance of this?
Speaker 5 (41:42):
Well, I see it as congratulatory, self congratulatory. So he's
been obsessing all these years about getting rid of her.
We call it katathy macomicide. That's when there's a compulsion
to kill and it creates a horrible tension internally. And
when the criminal finally works up the courage to do it,
they're quite relieved afterwards. They're very satisfied with themselves. As
(42:06):
I said earlier, he triumphed over here, he got his way.
Now his world is all in perfect order. It's not
like somebody who commits vehicular homicide by mistake and afterwards
they're rattled and they're shaken and they can't believe that
they hit somebody. This guy is quite happy, so I
think this is his happy meal. You know, he's dancing
(42:28):
on her grave.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
Dave Matt Crime Stories investigator, reporter. Why did the ATF
arrest him?
Speaker 14 (42:34):
It came down to a lie. Doctor Michael McKee lied
on a federal form when he purchased a handgun in Nevada.
He provided a false residency form of information and that
immediately triggered the federal jurisdiction for firearm violation alongside the
state murder chargers. So the ATF was brought in because
(42:56):
of the lie about where he was living.
Speaker 9 (42:59):
When he filed to that.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Gun okay, did serious lawsuits play into triggering doctor McKee
not that motive is necessary listen.
Speaker 15 (43:11):
Twelve weeks before he's accused of murder, McKee is sued
for malpractice by Nevada man. McKee allegedly overseen erry when
an eight point six inch cather shard breaks off in
the patient's leg. The patient's lawyer spends over a month
trying to track down McKee's serve and papers and has
no luck for the process, server claims. A coworker of
McKee says he just disappeared.
Speaker 16 (43:31):
McKee leaves Vegas after the malpractice lawsuit, taking a job
at OSF St. Anthony Medical Center, Rockford, Illinois, purchasing a
four hundred thousand dollars penhouse apartment in Chicago last July.
The complaint alleges the failure of McKee caused the catheter
to share, leaving an eight point six inch portion of
the device in the plaintiff's body. McKee allegedly breached the
(43:54):
standard of care, including lower extremity bleeding, a demon pain, discolouration, disfigurement,
another in injuries.
Speaker 1 (44:00):
He evaded getting served. He high tailed it, even a
process server couldn't find him.
Speaker 15 (44:06):
McKee able to evade a malpractice lawsuit for months. As
a process server, it makes nearly a dozen failed attempts
to serve McKee with the lawsuit. Nevada lawyer Dan Laird
files the suit, but serving McKee was nearly impossible as
the surgery group he worked for gave the attorney a
fake address and the phone number issued with the State
Medical Board for McKee is a fax machine.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
What did doctor Caravellas say?
Speaker 8 (44:29):
He said he has no idea where doctor Michael McKee
is now, said he just disappeared.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
Wow, so McKee was a ghost. That's from Wsyx and Moore.
Listen to this. A guy loses his testicle.
Speaker 16 (44:43):
A prison inmate of Nevada claims McKee caused him to
have his left testicle removed. The blank of alleges he
suffered a work related injury while incarcerated, causing pain and
swelling in his left testicle. McKee was part of a
medical review panel that approved the inmates medical care, resulting
in a surgeon with limited experience to be used for
the surgery. After a year of pain, repeated procedures to
(45:05):
drain fluid a proper corrective surgery was performed, but the
delay and treatment resulted in the permanent removal of the
inmates left testicle.
Speaker 1 (45:13):
Repeated draining of your testicle. Okay, doctor Thomas Coin, Were
these lawsuits enough to trigger him into doing something horrible
like a double murder? Thinking she caused all of this
strife in my life, it's all her fault. Blah blah blah.
(45:33):
A shard of a catheter left in your leg, a
surgical procedure to amputate your testicle. I guess he was
under stress. How do you end up with a catheter
shard stuck in your leg? And why do you have
your testicle cut off?
Speaker 3 (45:53):
Well?
Speaker 8 (45:54):
I mean so if you if you are performing a
surgery on someone, obviously, especially with vasculars surgery, where you
are instrumenting or entering into or repairing a blood vessel,
oftentimes that you may insert a catheter to maintain the
patency or keep that vessel open while you're operating on it.
I don't know how in this particular case this occurred,
(46:16):
but it's possible that a shard of that catheter was
dislodged during surgery, was accidentally cut off and left in
or just simply left in accidentally rather than being removed
when the surgery was complete. And that if that, if
that catheter is left in place, they can actually block
the normal blood flow within that vessel, causing eschemia as
(46:37):
we say, or lack of blood flow to the testicle,
which could cause that testicle to die.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
It can be very two different cases, doctor Coin. There's
the one case with the Cather's shar left in the leg.
Then there's the other cases. Innate, he has this testicle amputated.
Speaker 8 (46:54):
Oh that I don't know. I don't know how that
process happened. But the the catheter, I mean, listen, there's
been plenty of cases throughout you know, you know my
time during training where there's been instruments left in patients,
wrong sides operated on, you know, small little cloth pieces
(47:17):
left inside of body during a surgery. So it does happen,
and generally it's just you know, carelessness. You know, you're
worried too much about closing or a bleeding area and
you leave a catheter in place. And so that's probably
what happened in that instance. As to the testicle incident, certainly,
testicular torsion can happen in males. I don't know what
(47:39):
went wrong there.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
I don't want to think about what went wrong there.
But I know this, Randy Casser. When I graduated from
law school, I never thought that I would put testical
amputated in the same sentence. You just never know, right.
Speaker 6 (47:51):
There's a lot there that we're on air and I
can't talk about it. But you know, Nancy, you were
tough as a prosecutor, and that's I'll leave it at that.
Speaker 1 (47:58):
Guys, the state is still building its case. If you
know or think you know anything about this case, if
you saw something, heard something, please call six one four
six four five two two two eight repeat six one four, six, four,
five two two two eight. Nancy Grace signing off, goodbye friend,
Host
Nancy Grace
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