He's Only 12

Trying to raise boys into responsible young men is a hard task. But the pressure we put on our kids can be even harder. In this episode, Khadeen and Devale discuss taking a step back to teach their son to step up. Dead Ass. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
There are a lot of times in this house where
I learn more from my kids than I think they
learned from me.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Say it again, dead ass, and it really makes me think,
not only did I wish that I was like that
as a kid, it makes me know that we're doing
a good job.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
Dead ass.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
Hey, I'm Kadeen and I'm Devoued, and we're the Ellis's.

Speaker 3 (00:29):
You may know us from posting funny videos.

Speaker 4 (00:31):
With our voice and reading each other publicly as a
form of therapy.

Speaker 3 (00:36):
Wait, I make you need therapy most days. Wow.

Speaker 4 (00:39):
Oh, and one more important thing to mention, we're married, Yes.

Speaker 3 (00:42):
Sir, we are.

Speaker 1 (00:43):
We created this podcast to open dialogue about some of
Li's most taboo topics.

Speaker 4 (00:47):
Things most folks don't want to talk about.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
Through the lens of a millennial married couple. Dead ass
is a term that we say every day.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
So when we say dead ass, we're actually saying facts
one hundred the truth, the whole.

Speaker 3 (00:59):
Truth, and nothing but the truth. We about to take
pillows off to our whole new level.

Speaker 4 (01:06):
Dead ass starts right now.

Speaker 3 (01:10):
I'm gonna take us back to.

Speaker 1 (01:13):
A couple months ago, actually two days ago, from when
we recorded this. But by the time you gotta tell
you this. Me a couple of months ago. It's the
middle of football season, and Jackson has been playing well,
like he's learned. This is his second year playing football,
and me, as the coach slash father, understands that there

(01:34):
is a change when you get from.

Speaker 3 (01:36):
Sixth grade to seventh grade.

Speaker 1 (01:38):
Right, So seventh grade you have kids who are going
through puberty. Some kids have already hit puberty, some kids
who have not hit puberty. So the size differential in
seventh grade is way different. Right, So we happen to
have on our team a bunch of kids who are
not super developed yet, like they just not big physically,
and we're going up against other schools who have kids

(02:00):
my size. So naturally, you know, it's seventh grade, you're
gonna take some lumps.

Speaker 4 (02:04):
Kids did as drive themselves to the game.

Speaker 1 (02:06):
Right, So there were some games we took some lumps,
you know. And in the beginning of the season, I
told Jackson, you know, I really don't want to coach you.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
I want you to hear someone else's voice.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
But I do have a level of expertise in this
field because I played for so long and a couple
of the dads last year who volunteered, they were volunteered,
you know. So for example, they didn't want to necessarily volunteer,
but they chose to because if we didn't, the kids
would have a team. So I'm like, you know what,
if the other dads are gonna volunteer, they tell my
mind is will volunteer my time as well. A couplet

(02:39):
happening right, Ain't nothing going on, so I'm not working
right now. And two other dads decided who played football
in college. So at the beginning of the season, I
told Jackson, look, I'm the coach. I can't add a
boy you, you know, and I'm probably gonna be harder
on you because it sets the tone for the other children.
When I'm hard on them, they can't say, well, coach,

(03:00):
the value your favoritism. No, I'm even harder on Jackson.
So I explain this to Jackson in the beginning of
the year and he was like, Okay, get dad, I
got you. Now We're week seven into the year and
Jackson just doesn't have the same level of intensity towards
the game as he had before. So I'm talking to
him like, yo, what's up, what's up?

Speaker 3 (03:17):
What's up? And he's kind of beating around the bush.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
And then finally he broke down and he said, you know,
it's just hard for me because I get nervous before
the games. And I said, because you're constantly trying to
be perfect and he said, yes, I'm trying to be perfect.
And I said, who told you you had to be perfect?
And he started to get a little bit emotional, overwhelmed,
and I was just like, well, tell me, I never
told you you had to be perfect. And then he

(03:41):
said this to me. He said, yeah, but when I
do something good, whether it's in practice of the game,
you say nothing, I do one thing wrong, even if
it's not my fault. If a teammate assists me and
doing something wrong, I get screamed at.

Speaker 3 (03:55):
The First thing I thought was but I told you
this is the way it was going to be.

Speaker 1 (04:00):
But then I had to sit back and realize he
has to deal with those feelings. Even if he knows
that it's happening, he still has to deal with those
feelings three to four times a week. That's not fair
to a twelve year old, you know. And it was

(04:20):
unfair for me to ask him to understand that at twelve. Exactly,
it's not like, he's twenty two and I'm the head
coach of a professional basketball team. He's emotionally more mature
now and he understands it. No. I asked him to
understand this at twelve, because in my forty year old mind.

Speaker 3 (04:37):
It made sense.

Speaker 4 (04:40):
Damn babe.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
Yeah, needless to say, I was hurt for him during
that conversation.

Speaker 3 (04:50):
Yeah, and will will unpack it a little bit when
we come back.

Speaker 4 (04:52):
And I'm gonna fight you for making my son feel
like that.

Speaker 1 (04:55):
Okay, I knew that was coming. Guds, I knew that
was coming. But I'll explain. I'll explain the whole process
where we are now.

Speaker 4 (05:01):
All right, sounds good? All right, karaoke time.

Speaker 3 (05:05):
So karaoke time.

Speaker 4 (05:06):
You came out the gate like you I got a song.
I'm like, I do you think that.

Speaker 3 (05:11):
It's a song? You may know? Okay, let me know
if it sounds familiar.

Speaker 4 (05:15):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
Akuna matata, Oh my god, what a wonderful phrase.

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Acuna matada. Ain't no passing praise.

Speaker 4 (05:27):
You actually doing means.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
No worries for the rest of your days. It's a
problem free philosophy.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
A COONa matada.

Speaker 4 (05:41):
The best part was aaa a coulaa a COONa. All right,
lion can come.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
Yes, yes, yes, it means no worries. So I'll explain
after we pay some bills. I'll come back and explain
why Akuna Matatah was the song.

Speaker 3 (06:00):
For today's episode.

Speaker 4 (06:01):
This is cute.

Speaker 2 (06:02):
I like that, all right, y'all, we'll be back, all right.
So yeah, So back to the story. You had our
son out here trying to, uh, you know, deal with
his emotions and the way you would have dealt with
it as a forty year old, not even realizing that damn,
even though you may have explained this to him, he

(06:24):
still wants that reassurance. And the complex thing about it
is that he wants the reassurance from you, not just
as coach, but his dad. So it's like trying to
It's like the duality in making sure that you are
you know, not adda boying him playing daddy ball, but
also to making sure that he knows that.

Speaker 4 (06:43):
You're proud of him.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
I thought you were doing a good job of that
because I would see you at home when you guys
come from practice, whether he had a good practice or not.
You would break things down, you would reassure him, you
would dap him up we would tell him to have fun.
But what do you think was different in the particular moment.

Speaker 1 (06:59):
Well that you missed even you said, like he wants
my affirmation and my reassurance as dad.

Speaker 3 (07:05):
No, he wanted my reassurance as his coach.

Speaker 1 (07:08):
Oh, because when I'm out there, I'm a coach. So
I said to him, I said, Jacks, well, all the
other coaches were telling you how good you was doing,
he said, but I wanted it from you. I wanted
to hear you say you're the offensive coordinator. I wanted
to know from you that I was doing a good job.
And then when I didn't hear it, it made my
confidence go down. And then when my confidence went down,

(07:29):
I was afraid to make a mistake because I knew
if I made a mistake, then.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
You would jump on me.

Speaker 1 (07:35):
And I was like, yo, Like, there's no way I
could have expected my son to understand that at twelve.

Speaker 3 (07:44):
You know, I was.

Speaker 1 (07:47):
Teaching him a lesson, but the lesson had very little
to do with football. As you know, I don't care
if he plays football. This was a choice he made.
He wanted to play football. At one point he was
all into basketball. Then he said he wanted to play
football in order to get tougher for basketball. So for me,
I just thought this is an opportunity for me to
use football as a lane to teach him. You know,

(08:10):
one responsibility to how to listen to what a coach
says and not listen to how he says it, but
also to be able to navigate a situation where you
may be treated unfairly, but learn how to control your
emotions so you can get through the situation and still
be successful. Because I know from being a professional athlete
and a collegiate athlete, you're going to have coaches who purposely,

(08:31):
for whatever reason or not, they're not going to tell
you every time you do something good.

Speaker 3 (08:36):
It's your job.

Speaker 1 (08:37):
It is expected for you to make a catch, for
you to score a touchdown, for you to do something
is expected. So we're not going to add a boy
you for doing what's expected. They'll ad a boy you
for doing what's profound or beyond right. You make a
one handed grab, break three tackles, hurdle to people, you

(08:57):
save a touchdown from happening, then it's like at a boy.
But I just wanted my son to not walk around
looking for ata boys for doing stuff that you're supposed
to do because because.

Speaker 3 (09:08):
Then you lower the bar, right, then the standard is
so low.

Speaker 2 (09:11):
Yeah, you know that, right, Like bare minimum is like
we're praising these kids.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
And I'm watching how these children in this generation all
are affected by it.

Speaker 3 (09:23):
Right.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
It's not just Jackson, right, a lot of the kids
on his team. You can praise them all day. The
minute you tell them they're doing something wrong.

Speaker 3 (09:35):
I don't want to pay no more.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
It sucks like coach sucks and the coach said I
sucked at it. No, no, coach didn't say you suck.
You did ten plays in practice. Nine of the ten
praise plays you did well. The last one you made
a mistake. So I'm pointing out the mistake you make
so you don't do it again. But all you hear
is the mistakes. And what they say to me is
I always make mistakes. Yeah, everyone always makes mistakes, so

(09:56):
there's always something to correct.

Speaker 4 (10:00):
It does sound like you and I'm pushing forty and
then you were spoiled? Is that your Yeah?

Speaker 3 (10:04):
Absolutely, you were spoiled.

Speaker 1 (10:05):
Your mom had a girl to you all the time
and told you how special you were and how great
you are. And sometimes when you don't hear it from
the person you wanted from, you feel like that person
doesn't like you. But that's not the case, you know,
And I just wanted Jackson to understand that, you know.
I wanted him to learn it at an early age
when the stakes are low, so that he can understand

(10:27):
it and won't struggle with it when the stakes are high.
Because my fear was he goes to high school or
gets to college, and he's been at avoid and now
the coach ain't out of boying him, and he thinks
the coach don't like him, and he's ready to give
up on his dream. Right, So it backfired, right, It
backfired because he is a little bit too young for
that lesson at twelve, he's not emotionally mature enough. But

(10:50):
also he pointed out something and this is what he
checked my parenting. He said to me, I just go
into the games nervous because I didn't want other people
to think that I sucked. Sorry, that's Kadeen once again.
Guys who always tells me make sure all your stuff
is off.

Speaker 4 (11:08):
You know what, I haven't opened this laptop since.

Speaker 3 (11:13):
I ain't gonna add a boy accepted, I'm gonna just
leave I'm gonna.

Speaker 1 (11:17):
Leave it alone because then she's gonna say she don't
do nothing ever right, you know, but just act like
it didn't happen. Now it's taking to take the notification off.

Speaker 4 (11:27):
You don't know how to stop on my cord do because if.

Speaker 3 (11:29):
The bell goes off again, it's gonna mess.

Speaker 4 (11:31):
Up the podcast is done? Period?

Speaker 3 (11:35):
Are we ready? Triple? You got all that trouble? I
was gonna make sure you got that trouble.

Speaker 4 (11:40):
He's an old ass text message is coming through to
I'm like, what is going to.

Speaker 3 (11:43):
Open laptop in a minute?

Speaker 1 (11:46):
What was I saying before? I was so really interrupted
by your old text messages?

Speaker 2 (11:52):
I think you were talking about when Jackson checked your
parenting right?

Speaker 1 (11:56):
So what what he made me realize when Jackson ultimately
checked my parenting style was that he didn't want other
people to think that he sucked, so me at for
it. It is just like, why are you concerned about what
other people think? And he said to me, he said, well,
when we're at games and I score a touchdown or
I have a long run and you say nothing, why

(12:18):
other people watch that? But then when I make a
mistake and you jump on me, then it makes it
seem to other people like all I do is something wrong.

Speaker 3 (12:25):
And I was like, you know, he's twelve.

Speaker 1 (12:27):
He has nothing else to think about other than what
other people think about.

Speaker 2 (12:31):
To say, you know us who are now programmed to
be like fuck what people think, right, you know, we
can take that now.

Speaker 3 (12:37):
And we got to this point over years.

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Absolutely absolutely and thinking about just the fragile state that
a twelve year old is in, right, So thinking about
the middle school age in particular, where emotions are high,
they're trying to figure out why they feel the way
they feel, They're looking at their friends for either confirmation,
affirmation or you know, it's just a lot going on

(13:02):
at this particular age. And I think that's why you
and I and I will say, Babe, like you when
you're parenting and when you're taking an approach with the kids,
I know that you're always trying to look at it
from every angle, and you'll even run it by me first, like,
you know, do you think that I should approach it
this way? Or even after the fact, like I handle
it like this, what do you think? And we've been

(13:22):
doing a lot of that lately with Jackson, so we've
kind of divvied up the responsibility. When it comes to
Jackson and the kids in general, Deval is definitely like
all hands on sports, you know, teaching them how to
be a good student athlete, you know, discipline, you know
all that. And then I'm on the academic side of things,
and there's some things that overlap with the way we

(13:43):
approach things. And Deval will see sometimes that I'm taking
an approach and he'd be.

Speaker 4 (13:47):
Like, damn, I tried that shit and it didn't work.
It didn't work. But he'll let me have my moment.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
He'll let me have my moment and then he'll interject
after or he'll pull me to the side after and say, hey, kay,
you know, I tried this with Jackson and I noticed
this outcome.

Speaker 4 (14:01):
Maybe you can try it this way.

Speaker 2 (14:03):
Or just recently, when I think about Jackson bringing home
a grade and I was just like for school, you know,
and I was taking the approach of I don't want
to be the mom that raises coddled men.

Speaker 4 (14:18):
I want them to be strong. I want them to
be independent. I want them to think for theirselves.

Speaker 2 (14:23):
And I'm trying to toe the line right now between
raising an independent young man but also guiding him through
and wanting to foreseeing that there's going to be a
mistake made, trying to like buffer it or try to
be that cushion, but sometimes you know you can't. You
have to let them fall flat. And the thing that

(14:44):
you told me that made the most sense was at
the age eleven twelve, a middle school age, when the
stakes are lower, and if they do make a mistake
or if they do get a bad grade or the
lesson in that is way less. Yeah, you know, destructive
if they were to do it when they're older. Absolutely,

(15:05):
So I've been allowing Jackson a little bit of latitude
to make those mistakes, and then he's naturally almost understanding
the repercussions. So in this particular incident, this happened kind
of almost back to back in the school incident, and
then there.

Speaker 1 (15:18):
Was a force and there was no football incident. Right,
he hasn't played bad. He's been playing well. Right, It
was just me trying to constantly keep his standard high
for him and him feeling like he wasn't doing light.

Speaker 3 (15:30):
But go ahead, finish your story.

Speaker 2 (15:31):
Yeah, So I've been on him about making sure that
he puts his exams in the calendar. We have a
family calendar with the three of us, so that way
we can just be aware of like when his exams
are coming up. I have access to the online portal,
so I can at any point log in and see
all of the boys' grades, their progression, all that. I'm
getting emails from at least eleven teachers every other day

(15:52):
between all of his teachers, then Cairo and Kaz's, so
it's a lot to juggle, but I try to stay
on top of it as much as possible. Jackson, especially
now has teachers who literally send out like newsletters with
informations and dates like weekly, you know, And I love
that because they try to keep the parents involved. So
I stay abreastive certain things, and I kind of sit
back sometimes to watch and see, like is Jackson gonna

(16:14):
let me know that he had this exam or I
haven't seen him studying for this exam, So what's the
outcome going to be? And I will say eight times
out of ten so far this semester, Jackson has really
been He's it. I mean, his grades are like nineties,
like he's been able to juggle it. And even my
dad sometimes says, like I don't know how Jackson does it.

Speaker 4 (16:34):
A lot he has a lot on his plate.

Speaker 2 (16:36):
He's in school all day, he comes home, he may
have an hour hour and a half before he's in practice.

Speaker 4 (16:40):
Then he's home at eight thirty nine o'clock.

Speaker 2 (16:42):
He's nice.

Speaker 4 (16:43):
Does boxing, Yeah, he does that debate.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
There's like so many different things that he has going on,
so it's actually impressive to see the way he juggles.
But there's certain goals that he's also set for himself
that I want to see him reach. So if I
know there's certain things that's required that may require the
extra mile from him, I'm trying to instill that in
him now. So he had an exam. I've been asking him.

(17:06):
I knew the exam was coming up the week before,
so I was asking him, Hey, did you make your
flash cards? Because I had introduced the idea of flash cards,
and my biggest thing this year was teaching him how
to prepare for exams, how to study, how to retain information,
and try to help him to develop his own system.
So flash cards, I knew worked for you and I
we had a conversation with him about that, so I
knew a week out he had that going on.

Speaker 4 (17:27):
Jackson, did you do your flash cards? Did you do
your flash cards? Did you do your flash cards? Did
you do the online flash cards? Your teacher? Yeah, mom, yeah, yeah,
yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:36):
So literally I said, okay, make sure you're doing your
flash cards and you're studying. The night before the exam,
I want to test you on the flash cards. So
what happens the night before the exam? Can't find the
flash cards that he made online or can't find them,
can't log in, no physical flash cards. Oh but mom,
I'm ready, I'm ready. So then we sit down to
test him before bed, and he's mumbling and he's bumbling,

(17:59):
and he's stumbling over these terms. So deval and I
ended up staying up late with him and like, yo,
you got to go through these definitions. A lot of
it was just like heavy science facts, like things you
just had to know.

Speaker 1 (18:11):
But here was the change, though, because I would have
got whooped, wait until the last minute and not knowing.

Speaker 4 (18:17):
My stuff, she would have blown my head clear off right, And.

Speaker 1 (18:21):
Then my mother probably would have got the books, slammed
them on the table, got a pins and say you
do these flash nights and flash cars, and I'd have
been there by myself, crying, trying to do it.

Speaker 3 (18:31):
But we didn't do that.

Speaker 1 (18:32):
No, we stayed up with him, We went over the
flash cars. He was upset, he had an attitude. We
constantly reminded him that his attitude would not be accepted.
And he went out the next day and he did
horrible on that test.

Speaker 4 (18:43):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (18:44):
But the thing was him doing horrible on that test
was more of a reaction to him. Was more of
a consequence to him than anything we could have ever done. Absolutely,
because he had his own standard he wanted for himself, absolutely,
and one thing Jackson don't like is to be wrong.
So when he told us that he was prepared and
it didn't get the grade he wanted, now he's proven

(19:06):
to be wrong.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
So now he has to prove us right and get
good grades after.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Its Absolutely, but then it also required to sit down,
right because he had the exam. Yeah, we picked him
up from school. I said, babe, how is the test?
Like I'm excited to hear about it because you know,
he was so prepared, and he was just like it
was good.

Speaker 4 (19:22):
I was good, good, you know.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
Like, so we're in the chiropractor office and I was like,
oh really, he's just like, eh, like brushing me off.

Speaker 4 (19:28):
So I was like, okay.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
The teacher sent that grade the night that night, and
pretty much in the email was like, there's going to
be a retest for people who scored under seventy five.

Speaker 4 (19:37):
Blah blah blah blah blah.

Speaker 2 (19:38):
He didn't score under seventy five, thankfully, However, he didn't
get the grade that he wanted, right, and I sent
it over to him, and.

Speaker 3 (19:47):
He's taking it under seventy five.

Speaker 4 (19:49):
He had seventy nine I think, so no, because it
was nine.

Speaker 3 (19:52):
One grade he got that. He said I can retake it,
but all I would get is a more Well, it was.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
That seventy five because she said that you can retake
it if you got under seventy five, but max you
would get is seventy five.

Speaker 4 (20:02):
So he didn't even qualify for the retake.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
Yeah, so I sent him a screenshot of it because
at this point he was on his way to practice.
I saw the email that came through and I saw
his grade, and I said, let's be prepared to speak
about it tonight. And there was another grade from another
subject that was also low, and I was like, what's
going on. We're supposed to be aware of what's happening.
So de val and I coo to sit down with him.
Now after he comes in from practice, he comes straight

(20:24):
to me too, because I know Deval probably already prepped
him in the car to talk to your.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
Mind, because this whole process is about him understanding, first
of all, learning how to control his emotion, but also
learning how to deal with confrontation. Right, at some point,
he may be someone's employee, he may be someone's teammate,
someone's subordinate, at some point that he has to face
that authority figure but has to learn how to do
it with confidence.

Speaker 3 (20:47):
He's going to be someone's husband someday.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
Right, you have an issue with your wife, you need
to learn how to go walk in the house and
be like, babe, so what's the problem in the moment?

Speaker 3 (20:54):
Don't walk around it?

Speaker 1 (20:56):
And that's also part of what I'm trying to teach
him and realize and also learning to that he's only twelve, right,
because that's what this whole podcast is about, understanding that
he's twelve, but also trying to create a very assertive, astute,
emotionally mature young man. Yes, right, so that's what this
whole thing is about. So, yes, I told we were

(21:17):
in the car. I said listen, your mom's not gonna
spas out right. You have to go up to her
and say, hey, mom, I heard about my grades. I
want to talk to you about it. And that's immediately
what he did. He didn't need to run from it.

Speaker 4 (21:30):
He did. He knocked on the door.

Speaker 2 (21:31):
I was coming out the shower, and he was like, oh, none,
can we talk.

Speaker 1 (21:35):
I remember he's coming out the shower. I was distracted
too when you came out of the show and I forgot.
I was like, I don't even want to talk about
this no more. What my mom was on something else,
but not him.

Speaker 4 (21:44):
He was focused on, which he sure was, and I
was focused on talking to him so we could get this,
get this over with, you know. So we sat and talking.

Speaker 2 (21:51):
Devout spoke, and Devout sat along with us, because you know,
we do things as a unit as parents, regardless of
who you know, had what or what message needed to
be delivered or what needed to be hashed out. And
also too, because I lean on you for you know,
well support, but also to say like, hey, how did
that go or how could I have done that differently?

(22:14):
So we start the conversation and I'm just at this point,
I'm pissed.

Speaker 4 (22:17):
I'm pissed.

Speaker 2 (22:18):
I wasn't yelling and screaming because I just know that
that approach never worked, especially with me as a child.

Speaker 4 (22:23):
So I really just wanted to be like, what the
fuck you see?

Speaker 3 (22:27):
What the fuck?

Speaker 4 (22:27):
You see? What happened? You See?

Speaker 2 (22:29):
You were so sit you were Yeah, you were so confident,
you knew everything. Oh mom, blah blah blah blah, I'm
doing too much? Okay, Yeah, and then look, this is
a grade that you bring home.

Speaker 3 (22:41):
So you didn't say no and act like the sky
is falling.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
And treat him like he failed all of his classes
in one day, which didn't happen. So, and the thing is,
I told him like, your mom's not gonna spats out,
like relax, and I didn't want him to walk into
that with me saying that, and then you start to
spast and then he'd be like, yo, she wasn't.

Speaker 3 (23:05):
I ain't never saying nothing to At this.

Speaker 4 (23:07):
Point, I was just like I was ready to take
I was like, what are we gonna take away? What
are the privileges that were gonna take away? Then Bell
was like can I interject?

Speaker 3 (23:13):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (23:13):
I was like, hey, got privileges like that don't do nothing.

Speaker 3 (23:16):
You don't do anything.

Speaker 4 (23:18):
What are you gonna take away from him?

Speaker 1 (23:19):
But I also remember being twelve and having a ninety
average and then mister Fast, who was just an asshole
of a social studies teacher at Andrew's Huddie, gave me.
I think he gave me a sixty five because he
said I wasn't doing homework. So then I pulled out
all my homework and my mom saw she signed it
that mister Fast and made a mistake when he really
was just fucking with me. But he gave me my

(23:40):
fifteen points on my homework but gave me an eighty.
She wouldn't let me play basketball because all my grades
was ninety and I got an eighty, and to me,
I felt like that's not fair. So it's like, so
wait a minute, So I literally have to be perfect
in order to enjoy it myself. And then I did
the same thing to Jackson while trying to check remember
trying to help you through the academics. I realized that

(24:02):
I was doing this to him through football. He does
everything right, he does one mistake and a jumping check
on him.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
Yeah, and I kind of did the same thing too, Right,
you got all these great grades. You're doing so well
your juggle and everything. But then for me, it wasn't
even just about that one situation. It was about the
fact that I'd spoken to him about certain things ahead
of time, you know, and I said, and I've been
following up, and it's me trying to give him the
independence to not be on him and do the flash

(24:30):
cards for him, because man, it took everything and me
not to go get the rainbow of flash cards, make
them for him, like you know, color coded this, that
the third like, that's really what I want to do, right,
But it's not about my way. He needs to find
his own way. So the lesson in that was not
even just the grade. It was the whole process that

(24:50):
got him to that grade that just made me be like,
this is exactly what it is. But I feel like
that was also the lesson in it for himself. I
didn't have to double down in that moment. I didn't
have to pull away privilege. The lesson was that he
was like, damn, mom was right, I should have made
the flashcars, damn. And he ended up staying up until
almost one o'clock that morning. That was tired the next
day and I'm like, I don't want to hear about

(25:11):
being tired because you still have your sports responsibilities. And
that's one thing that you helped me to understand is
that I cannot punish him in the sports department because
of his lack of academics and vice versa, because they're
both important.

Speaker 4 (25:24):
Yes, I raating a student now.

Speaker 3 (25:26):
I never understood why moms do that.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
Like the first thing mom says when I was mentoring
young men, a child has an issue, a behavioral issue
or something. They take away football, take away basketball. Football
and basketball are the only things that are teaching him
discipline right now, And you want to take away the
two things that teaching him discipline as a form of
discipline for not being disciplined in school makes no sense.

Speaker 4 (25:49):
Because we were looking at it as this is extracurricular.

Speaker 2 (25:51):
Right in my mind initially, I was like, Oh, it's
extra curricular stuff.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
You know, sports can be extra curricular playing a sport.
If your child is playing a sport, he's in a
rec league and he's just doing it for fun, and
they're rolling the balls out, pause and they're out there
just playing and no one cares who wins.

Speaker 3 (26:09):
Yes, that's extra curricular.

Speaker 1 (26:12):
When your child is in a competitive team traveling, he
makes commitment to that team, commitments to other families, commitments
to other parents. So it's not just about him, it's
also teaching him something greater than just himself individually. So
that commitment in a lot of times those coaches, you
let those coaches know that that child is performing poorly
in school or having behavioral issues, he'll get a greater

(26:34):
level of discipline at those opportunities in after cur after
school activities. Remember when I was at Prototype, we have
a report card. Check you hit below a eighty, everybody's running.
So what it did was it created an environment where
being the dumb class clown was not accepted because if
everybody here who is bigger, stronger, and faster than your

(26:55):
average teenager has to have above eighty.

Speaker 3 (26:58):
But now we all got to run because you don't
have an eighty.

Speaker 1 (27:01):
Now it creates that environment where being the dumb kid
gets ostracized. Right, And I've just learned over the years,
especially when you have boys, boys need discipline, boys need structure.
And the more I'm learning about young women and young
young women who are athletes, they've all said the same thing.
They adored having the structure because as a child, it

(27:25):
gives you something to look forward to that guarantees you'll
have a level of success because when you don't have structure,
most kids are lost.

Speaker 3 (27:31):
Most people are lost.

Speaker 4 (27:32):
That's a fact.

Speaker 3 (27:33):
Think about it.

Speaker 1 (27:34):
When we first got out of college, right, that's when
structure was stripped of us.

Speaker 3 (27:39):
Like, think about it, from the time you're.

Speaker 4 (27:41):
Schedule a child.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
You see, from the time you're a child to you
graduate from college, there's a schedule, there's classes, there's certain
things you have to do that if you perform well
at these things, you'll be successful. The minute people leave college,
there's no more blueprint. That's when the anxiety happens because
there's no one to tell you. You know, that happened
for me too. When I first got out of the NFL,
it was like, well, I want to do TV. How

(28:04):
do I go about getting there?

Speaker 2 (28:06):
Man? I low key registered for grad school for that
very reason.

Speaker 3 (28:10):
Because you were already ready. You are already I.

Speaker 4 (28:12):
Was not ready.

Speaker 2 (28:12):
And that's the part where we're not like rushing our
kids through the school system, like, oh, he's advanced, let's
start him at two at school so you can graduate
by sixteen.

Speaker 4 (28:19):
No, we're not.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
Putting in college till twenty so he can graduate and
then be like, what, You're just not even old enough
or ready.

Speaker 3 (28:24):
But you know, we just did.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
We actually just broke down how we ended up over
parenting Jackson. Your fear and anxiety of not knowing what
was next after college is what you're projecting onto Jackson.
My fear of not being prepared when I was done
in the NFL and not knowing how to deal with
my emotions, because remember, part of the reason why I

(28:49):
got cut is because my emotions. I said some things
to some coaches, and I you know, it wasn't appropriate
at the time, and I ended up getting cut.

Speaker 4 (28:57):
He was also in those feelings, but whatever.

Speaker 1 (29:00):
Speaking of truth, I wasn't my feelings because I didn't
think it was fair.

Speaker 3 (29:03):
Yeah, and you know, just a real long story short.

Speaker 1 (29:06):
I didn't like being put in a box where you're
only going to be the fifth receiver. I felt like
I was good enough to compete for any position, and
when I heard that that's what I was competing for,
I got pissed and I voiced my opinion, and the
offensive coordinator at the time didn't want to hear my opinion,
so I ended up getting cut, but it taught me
that I have to learn how to control my emotions
and say yes sir, no sir, even when a coach

(29:28):
is not.

Speaker 3 (29:29):
Treating me right.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
Yes, I'm projecting that on to Jackson at twelve. Yes,
you're projecting your fear of not being prepared for the
real world on Jackson at twelve, and both of us
have to realize he's only twelve. Like listening to you
speak on why you you parent him the way it is,
and I parent him it's all based on fear.

Speaker 3 (29:50):
Yes, think of it.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
It's all I don't want my son to feel the
way I felt when I was out in the world.

Speaker 2 (29:56):
Or I don't want him to be, you know, a
coddled and titled expected the last hole that we will
go out and recavoc in this world like I'm not
while I'm alive.

Speaker 4 (30:06):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
You know it's crazy. We can't.

Speaker 1 (30:09):
We can't parent our kids like that. Like, think about it.
If we're parenting them through fear. I fear that they'll
become an entitled asshole. I feel they'll become a coddle
kid who does lost is lost, Like all of this
is fear so.

Speaker 3 (30:21):
What do we do when we were afraid?

Speaker 4 (30:23):
We over we over you know what I'm saying over
So we're almost like like helicopter parenting in a way,
but like in a different kind of way, right, So
we're just not like it's not like, you know, we're
smothering me. Do you think we're smothering him a little bit?

Speaker 3 (30:37):
No, To be honest, I think that.

Speaker 4 (30:39):
I try not to smother because I don't want to
be that mom.

Speaker 3 (30:42):
I don't think. I don't think you smothered him. I
don't think I smolled them.

Speaker 1 (30:44):
But I think what what we did, in turn was
try to compensate for the fact that we weren't small,
that we didn't want to smother him, so we didn't
even I didn't give him any love during football season,
which I feel like now now knowing about as fucked up.

Speaker 3 (30:56):
Yeah, I was so.

Speaker 1 (30:58):
Like, well, I'm not gonna be a hell copter that
I'm there every day in practice, so I'm not gonna
say nothing to him, but if he does something wrong,
I'm gonna check him caause I don't want him to
do things wrong in practice.

Speaker 3 (31:07):
Yeah, that he needs the balance.

Speaker 4 (31:09):
He definitely needs the balance.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
And I need to do a good job to of
like you know. I'll ask him when he comes up, Hey,
how is practice? Did you have fun?

Speaker 4 (31:16):
Like you know?

Speaker 2 (31:17):
So we can do the same, Like when it comes
to sports academics, we flip flop and stuff just to be.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
Like you know, or even this is why I ended
up singing a kunamatata m h. I was like, bro,
I need you to go out there at twelve and
play and have no worries like you're you're concerned about
making me proud, being perfect. You're concerned about other people's

(31:42):
ideas of who you are, and that's always going to
create a level of anxiety and nervousness that you won't
be able to perform to your standard because you're worried
about everything else else. You need to only focus on
you and let's think of let's think about it. And
this is what I've learned to empower how I've learned
to empower him. Sit down and settle and give him

(32:02):
a perspective. Right we're sitting in this house, I said, Jackson,
think about where you were when you in Cairo's age.
I was in the apartment. Do you remember having to
get on the train with dad? Remember having to help
me carry laundry up the stairs. You remember having to
go parking. He's like yeah, I said, you see how

(32:25):
hard dad has worked and mom has worked to get
us to a different level where you can have a
different level of comfort. He was like yeah. I said,
are you comfortable? He was like, yeah, I am comfortable.
So I said, so, what are you worried about? Think
about how many people in the world don't have what
you have, can't do what you do. How many dads

(32:46):
can't be there with their son in practice. I said,
think about your own your own team. How many of
your friend's dad can't be there at practice. Think about
how many of your friends struggling in school whose moms
aren't up to one PM. And he looked at me
and he was just like, you know, I never thought
about that. And he was just like that, he said

(33:08):
one of my friends when he said, one of my
friends did say to me at basketball, you know, I
wish my dad cared like yours and was scream at
me to get me going in basketball games, because he
says he said, his friend was like, sometimes I'll be
sitting there and I don't know what to do, and
I'll listen to your dad scream at you to be like, well,
if he told Jackson to do that, then I'll do
the same thing.

Speaker 3 (33:29):
So Jackson was like.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
You know, you're right, like there are certain things that
I have advantages of, and I can't stop looking at
the negative. I said, yeah, rather than thinking about if
I dropped this past, my dad's going to scream, how
about you start to think if I catch this pass
and score a touchdown, everybody's going to be cheering my name.
I said, do you think that? He's like, now, I
don't think about the positive. I only think about the negative.

(33:54):
And I was like, well, we got to change that.
And I said, well, why do you only think about
the negative? Because the negative is the only time I
hear your voice?

Speaker 4 (34:01):
Yeah, okay, man, break don't get me started up in
here today.

Speaker 1 (34:07):
When I tell you man, I was like, I was
apologizing so much, like one thing I've never done gotten
from my parents. Bruh, I've never gotten an apology. I said, bro,
come in, bro, I'm sorry, but I am sorry. I
I you didn't deserve that.

Speaker 3 (34:21):
I'm here.

Speaker 1 (34:22):
I am teaching you to focus on the negative, while
only saying focus on the positive, like that's not fair.

Speaker 2 (34:27):
To you, bro, Yeah, that's insanity and yeah, and I'm
like thinking about the overarching topic today, right, and shout
out to you, because one thing you do is you
apologize when you're wrong. We both do trying to make
sure that, Yeah, especially when it's coming from your child.
It's like, man, But the overarching topic today is, you know,
growing up in black families, our generation, we were always

(34:48):
taught to never talkt back. We didn't have conversations like
this with our parents. It's like, don't complain their parents
are right, you're wrong. You know, you don't get a
single explanation. Don't expect an.

Speaker 4 (34:59):
Apology from your parents if they hurt your feelings.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
But now as parents, you know, we're recognizing that not
all of our parenting tactics meant well. Well, they mean well,
but it didn't land well when it came to how
we emotionally developed in our relationship with our kids. We're
trying to be different, right, and the whole gentle parenting
movement too, and what that looks like for our kids

(35:23):
and being tough on the kids like we really try
to I think balance between what that looks like.

Speaker 4 (35:28):
You know, are certain moments called for certain things.

Speaker 2 (35:32):
I mean, what exactly is the definition of gentle parenting?

Speaker 4 (35:37):
Well, what is it more like the hands off approach
to it?

Speaker 1 (35:41):
No, No, I feel like it's not just the hands off.
It's parenting with approach of positivity, not using fear tactics
or pain or violence or trauma to create a foundation
for your children to where they just listen to you
because they're afraid that. When I think about gentle parenting,

(36:02):
it's like that because back in the day, it was
if I hit him, he'll stop.

Speaker 3 (36:06):
You know what I'm saying. If I scream, he'll listen.
That's that's not gentle parenting. That's not it. That's not
a gentle approcessing.

Speaker 2 (36:13):
Nothing gentle about that. So let's break down exactly what
gentle parent is. I think it is, Like maybe I'm
kind of kind of confused about what that looks like
because I don't even conform to people's social media is.

Speaker 1 (36:23):
Like, you know, it would just be as simple as this, Right.
Traditional parenting was very coercive. Right, you do what I say,
you get a reward, you don't, you get punished, you know,
very manipulative parenting. You don't explain much, just do what
I say. Get a reward. Don't do what I say,
you're the bad guy, you get punished. Now with more
gentle parenting, it's more teaching understanding and empathy, you.

Speaker 3 (36:47):
Know which, which to me, I think there has to
be a mix.

Speaker 2 (36:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (36:51):
Yeah, you can't be all one one way.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
No, it can't be because when you grow up in
the real world, your parents don't have the means to
curate how the world is going to receive.

Speaker 2 (37:03):
Absolutely, and you don't know what these questions are going
to look like for the when you do something wrong.
But I think that, for example, when I spoke to
Jackson about his science grade, I reverted to what I
knew and how I was raised, just like, oh, you
don't do what you're supposed to do, then you're going
to get certain privileges taken away, because that's just that's
just the consequence. Like there has to be a consequence

(37:23):
for parenting. And I think that there still should be
a consequence. But what is happening there for sure. But
what's happening now is that I feel like Jackson's learning
the consequence and the lesson when he doesn't do what
he's supposed to do on his part, and we kind
of sit back and watch that unfold because he doesn't
like the way it feels when he falls short of
whatever the goal is.

Speaker 1 (37:44):
No, I mean, yeah, you're right, but okay, but here's
the thing though, right, how how can you just be
a gentle parent? You have to have some traditional standards
because sure most people in the world will work for
someone at some point in their life.

Speaker 3 (38:00):
Right.

Speaker 1 (38:00):
When you work for someone, you're a subordinate, right, that person,
that employer, that manager.

Speaker 3 (38:06):
They are going to use.

Speaker 1 (38:07):
Those same traditional tactics to get you to do what
they need you to do. Because this is every business
is production based. It's not feeling based, right, So it's like,
you do what I say, you get a reward, you don't.
There's a consequence. That's just the real world. So when
you remove that aspect of parenting from your kid, that's
when you get those entitled kids who grow up and say,

(38:27):
well I don't feel and it's like.

Speaker 3 (38:29):
Whoa wait, we don't give Nobody gives a shit about
how you do.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
There's no feeling in business, baby, there's no. But that's
exactly what it is.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
Though.

Speaker 4 (38:35):
Look at the workforce.

Speaker 2 (38:36):
Now, yes, we have a couple of friends who own businesses,
that cannot even keep employees because the minute like you
reprimand them, the minute you write them up, they're not
doing what they're supposed to do, and you speak to
them about it, it's like, oh, how dore you speak
to me this way? And I'm going to quit? And
they're onto the next one. Attention is at an all
time low. That's just what we are dealing with.

Speaker 3 (38:57):
Everyone wants to be an entrepreneur.

Speaker 2 (38:58):
Why because can make their own way. They can make
according to what people think.

Speaker 3 (39:03):
But do you know how to?

Speaker 1 (39:04):
But do you know how do you get money from
being How do you get money to become a successful entrepreneur?
You either have to work for someone, which means you
do what I say and you get your reward, or
you ask for a loan from someone who's going to
give you stipulations and conditions, which means you do.

Speaker 3 (39:21):
What I say rules like.

Speaker 1 (39:22):
There's no way to avoid, you know, understanding the fact
that at some point you're gonna have to deal with
authority figures. And that's why I'm not big on the
whole We're kicking the traditional way out and we're just
doing gentle parenting, especially if you have a child who
plays sports. Sports is production based, production based, production based,
like you have to be able to adhere to rules

(39:43):
and discipline and do the things you don't want to
do to be.

Speaker 4 (39:46):
Successful and deal with the mind fuck that's going to
be figure, you know it, trying to find ways to
motivate you watch you know, absolutely absolutely all right, a
couple of facts and stats that we have from trouble.

Speaker 2 (39:59):
Still can't get it, like twelve seasons in y'all and six.

Speaker 4 (40:02):
Seven years in Now, I'm.

Speaker 2 (40:05):
Gonna just let that be you like here on out.
A different developmental periods, kids go through a process called individuation.
Individuation refers to the process through which a person achieves
a sense of individuality, separate from the identities of others,
and begin to consciously exist as a human in the world.

Speaker 1 (40:26):
That's deep, that's crazy because parents don't understand that each
individual child has to go through that. And that's what
Remember when you said you learned that Jackson has to
go through his own process.

Speaker 3 (40:39):
Yes, I remember when I said Jackson likes to be right.

Speaker 1 (40:43):
Yes, he's starting to get to that point where he
wants to be an individual. He just doesn't want to
listen to what you say. He wants to understand why
and how does this benefit me? Yeah, and if you're
not a parent who's going to be patient enough to
explain the benefits, that's true, and you just want to
them to listen, you're going to find self battling with
your child.

Speaker 2 (41:01):
I feel like they're all kind of like that when
I think about it. Even Cairo's like that now. When
I realize if he'll ask me a question about something,
I see him in his mind like re saying it
so that it soaks in and then he may or
may not have a follow up question. But that's his
way as an individual of processing what I've said, and
then he moves, you know, you.

Speaker 4 (41:20):
Know how after that.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
But I think as parents we have to give our
kids latitude to be able to go through that process.

Speaker 3 (41:26):
I just got my moment of truth.

Speaker 4 (41:29):
Hold it, Holy, Holy, hold it. As kids separate and
find their individual identities, they start to learn how to
express their own opinions. This process can be difficult for
parents if their opinions have been routinely squashed as they
grow up.

Speaker 2 (41:45):
That was me and my mom for a long time.
I remember it was just like Mama, like anything she said,
when anything.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
She anybody that my father attitude stay And I said,
why because I don't agree with what you agree with?
How my attitude got to stay?

Speaker 4 (42:00):
Right? But you was doing that at like twelve.

Speaker 2 (42:01):
I did that when I was out the house and
when I was out the house in college, and my
mom was like, I didn't know you did that, and
you decided to do that.

Speaker 4 (42:08):
You didn't run that by me.

Speaker 2 (42:09):
And I was like, oh, since I don't have to
now I'm a big girl, I'm eighteen.

Speaker 4 (42:14):
Like challenge, I was challenging.

Speaker 3 (42:17):
You know the hardest part about it.

Speaker 1 (42:19):
But as a child, when you challenge your parent and
they don't have an answer, so they just get mad
and punish you.

Speaker 3 (42:25):
That used to be me.

Speaker 2 (42:26):
But but you, but you knew though, I feel like
you knew that you were right.

Speaker 1 (42:29):
I didn't know I was right. I knew I was
right because no one could answer the question. And then
I would watch them lose their emotions and they would
get frustrated.

Speaker 4 (42:37):
My father was Sunday School.

Speaker 3 (42:39):
You got kick and I kicked out of Sunday School.
I think I told you that story. I got kicked
out of Sunday School. Oh man, my dad didn't. Damn
They wanted to kick me out the house.

Speaker 4 (42:48):
Which one of our kids you think would be like,
is like that so far?

Speaker 1 (42:51):
Like, well, I know, I know for a fact that
kaz It does not change his opinion or his viewpoint
based on how we respond. So I think he's going
to be the one that's going to be like, well,
I don't want to do that, and you're going to
be like, well, if you don't do that, you're gonna
be x Z. He's gonna go okay. Jackson is more
like wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait, So

(43:13):
why why can't I do that?

Speaker 3 (43:14):
Like I want to?

Speaker 1 (43:15):
But I want to do that, though, And if I
explain to him why, I think he'll he'll think about
it and he'll say, Okay, I'll try your way. Cairo
will listen to me, act like he's thinking about it,
and do it his own way.

Speaker 3 (43:28):
Anyway, He'll just do it. He'll like he'll he'll do it.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
His own way, like on the low, and then to
act like he didn't know that I told him to
do it another way.

Speaker 4 (43:36):
Chaz Sorr, I'm laughing because I'm thinking about something that
happened this morning. I wasn't cutting you off.

Speaker 2 (43:41):
You okay, this morning, for example, Kaz getting them ready
for school, He's like, Mom, can you take out my
office so we can I can match because he's into matching,
like he's getting into outfits and his you know.

Speaker 4 (43:52):
So we're looking in this closet.

Speaker 3 (43:54):
I'm like, that was Cairo last year.

Speaker 2 (43:56):
Literally, so it was chilly this morning, it was like
forty something degrees and I'm like, you have to wear
like either a jacket or a vest or something. So
Cairo pulls out a jacket and he throws it on
like a little wind breaker jacket with his hoodie. Caz
has a hoodie on with a T shirt underneath, and
then the other jacket. He has realized it's too small.
So I've found a vest, one of those puffer vests

(44:17):
that have no sleeves. So I'm like, okay, so you
can put this on. This is nice. So he's looking
at it and he's just like what.

Speaker 4 (44:23):
Is this, you know. He's just like, this is not
a jacket, you know. And I was just like, well, buddy,
you just need to get to school. I said, probably
by the time recess happens, it'll be nicer outside.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
You can take it off or whatever. And he was
like I don't want to wear it this Like he
could just tell he did not like this, Like what
this is?

Speaker 3 (44:36):
This is this?

Speaker 4 (44:38):
So I said, Kaz, just wear it to school. When
you get to school, take it off and hang it up.
No big deal.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
So he's going I see his face, he's frowning. I'm like,
have a good day, go be great. Give him the
same spiel I give them every morning. And then as
he's walking out the door, I hear him say, I'm.

Speaker 4 (44:52):
Taking this off in a car and I was like,
leave it on til you get to school.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
And then he just looked back at me and was like,
she go, but he gonna do what you want to
do regardless.

Speaker 4 (45:03):
Let's don't give a damn. He is so me. He
is so me.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
A lot of them are. I mean, Jackson has his
ways like you as well too, Chill.

Speaker 4 (45:14):
And it's like, as a parent to you see the
flaws in yourself and you see some of the things
the same habits and your children, and you're just like,
I am trying so desperately to protect you from yourself
because I know the things I've struggled with in my
life and how it's affected me negatively and how I've
had to work through it and I'm still working through it.

Speaker 1 (45:34):
Yo.

Speaker 4 (45:34):
Shit, that's my moment of truth.

Speaker 1 (45:35):
Child.

Speaker 3 (45:36):
I ain't gonna lie to you this.

Speaker 1 (45:37):
Sometimes I look at Jackson and he's just like you,
and I'll.

Speaker 3 (45:39):
Just be like, yo, glut blood, I swear no, no,
for real, for real. I'd be like, yo, you get
that from your mother? Yo.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
And then I'll be looking at you like you see
you see, And then sometimes remember how we we'll have
our debates, and I'll be like, you see how you're
acting right now?

Speaker 3 (45:55):
When Jackson does that to.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
You, he sure don't come to me and be like,
get your son, because he is literally just like you.
So the way I gotta deal with it, you deal
with it.

Speaker 3 (46:03):
And when he does it.

Speaker 1 (46:04):
To you, I'll be like, Yep, yep, hit your hit
your mom with that little k, that little bit of
k you got hit your mom with the same thing that.

Speaker 4 (46:12):
They got hit with the valve too. Though they do
hit me.

Speaker 3 (46:15):
With the deval, they do it me with the devil,
and I be prepared for it.

Speaker 2 (46:18):
Right because your mother said that too. When you have
your kids, bro, she told she said it before we
had kids. She said, de val everything that you put
us through is a parent when you have your own kids,
be gonna go.

Speaker 4 (46:27):
We're gonna circle them back.

Speaker 1 (46:28):
The ones who challenge me like in my face though,
that's the devo. You're gonna challenge me in my face.
The ones who act like they're not wrong when they
know they're wrong, that's you. Absolutely just ignore the fact
that they're wrong, and they slow blink right and they
need to push it in you like yo, but you know.

Speaker 3 (46:44):
You wrong, and they just like that's you. But you're
gonna have to deal with them. And I'm gonna be laughing.

Speaker 4 (46:51):
You know, I'm prepared. I'm prepared. You know it's gonna
be fun over here. It's been fun up here.

Speaker 2 (46:55):
This house fun as Matt Matt shows up on a
random day and it's always sit going on in here, Okay,
I promise. And lastly, most experts say listen to your
child's opinion, even if you don't agree with them. Listening, engaging,
and learning is how learning how your child is learning
to form their opinions can only inform your relationship more
positively as they grow. And I think that's a great

(47:17):
like closing statement because that's exactly what we're trying to do.
We want to know how they feel. We want to
be able to engage in conversation, promote that, nurture it.
We want to hear how they feel. And that's just
you know, a bit of how we parent. So all right,
I think this was a good low chat. We're gonna

(47:37):
take a quick break y'all and get into some listener
letters after we pay some bills. So stick around all right,
and we're about you want to do one?

Speaker 3 (47:54):
Yeah, we got ten minutes so we could do one. Yeah,
and then we can do yeah.

Speaker 4 (47:57):
Okay, cool, all right, back to listener letters. I'll dive
in really quickly. All right, Hey, deavalencadeen love y'all real bad. Oh,
we love y'all real bad.

Speaker 3 (48:08):
Love me too.

Speaker 2 (48:09):
I've been watching ever since the New York Apartment when
it was only Jack's and baby Row all the good
old days. We were just looking at old pictures of
early y'all, and I'm just like, I cannot deal. The
growth is amazing and y'all are so deserving. Thank you
so much. So here's my questions. Last situation. I'm a
twenty seven year old female having love troubles. Ah man,
I've literally only had three serious relationships in my life,

(48:31):
and of course I kind of sort of believe that
I was in love each time, but now I know
for a fact that I was only truly in love
the last time. I mean, this person was it for
me the end all be all showed me so many
beautiful things in love. Damn, neare close to engagement, to
be honest. Plus, we had an ironic backstory from years
and years ago that kind of foreshadowed us ending up together.

(48:55):
Yet in the end I found out he was in
others in boxes.

Speaker 4 (48:59):
Repeatedly.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
This person made so many changes in himself for the better,
just to revert and end up like the rest of them.
In the end, we both worked through so many personal
issues together to make sure the other was heard.

Speaker 4 (49:12):
Happy, and comfortable.

Speaker 2 (49:13):
I used to think I didn't do much wrong in
a relationship because I don't cheat, but he made me
see some things that I could change as well, and
I did. I truly thought this was it, two people
working through any and every all, but the whole time
he was lying to me, or they were working through
any and everything, sorry, but the whole time he was
lying to me. I've been heartbroken before, but man, this one,

(49:37):
I don't think i'll ever come back from it. So
for this listening letter, I'm talking about heartbreak. Oh man,
I'm so sorry for you.

Speaker 3 (49:44):
Sis.

Speaker 4 (49:44):
I got over all the.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
Rest of them fairly easily, but now I can't help
but wonder how do you begin to get over who
you thought or knew was your person. I'm literally in
a season of isolation. While he seems fine. Y'all are
a bit older with more experience, and i've heard y'all
discuss things like this or such as this. Tell me
what you honestly think. Thank you for reading, Love y'all much.

Speaker 1 (50:08):
I don't feel bad for No No, because she made
the right decision.

Speaker 3 (50:14):
She said he was lying.

Speaker 1 (50:17):
She realized that she then didn't lie to herself and
remain in the situation right where someone was likeing No.
She used discernment to say that I thought this person
was for me, but they're not for me because they're
not being truthful. It's time for me to move on
and find the person that's going to be truthful. That's
how you get rid of heartbreak. You don't hold back.

(50:38):
That's why I don't feel sorry for like you can't
feel sorry for people who value themselves so much that
they're not going to put up with someone else's bullshit.

Speaker 3 (50:45):
That you don't feel sorry for somebody like that. You
be proud of somebody like that, Nigga, he lion.

Speaker 1 (50:51):
If he made you believe something that wasn't true, then
that you're not in love with that person. You're in
love with the idea of who that person was presenting
themselves to be.

Speaker 2 (51:00):
Right, Could you think about the backstory that for together? Yeah,
she doesn't seems like the perfect love story.

Speaker 3 (51:06):
Because he lied. I don't feel sorry for her. She
got clarity.

Speaker 1 (51:09):
Once she got the clarity, now she can make a
choice for herself, drop that and move on. But now
you also have that as an example of what not
to accept. So now you have more information about yourself.
You're still only twenty seven, you while young, right.

Speaker 2 (51:24):
I was gonna say, I wonder if he's around that
age too, because he too may know that you are
the one, but he's not ready.

Speaker 1 (51:30):
You know, here's the thing the lying. When someone is
lying to you and we'll be honest with you, that's
not the one. Someone who really is the one will
be honest with you, even if they know it may
ass up their chances or hurt that person.

Speaker 3 (51:44):
We've been there before.

Speaker 4 (51:45):
That's true.

Speaker 3 (51:46):
Right. I know this may hurt your feelings.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
Yeah, I know it's ma hurt your feelings. But this
is how I felt, and this is what I did
in the moment, you know what I'm saying. After doing it,
I realized that that didn't give me what I wanted.
So I'm letting you know honestly, and this is how
we can move forward.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
Sure, because what it does it gives the person or
the other a choice, a choice, a choice to say, Okay,
I understand how you feel.

Speaker 4 (52:05):
At least you're honest. No, I can decide if this
is something I can deal with, be move on from,
or even want to even entertain. Right, So I.

Speaker 1 (52:13):
Don't feel sorry for I'm happy she found out while
she's twenty seven, she don't have any kids, she can still,
you know, move forward and find someone else. And when
you think, remember she said, I felt all the other
ones was the love of my life, but then I
found out it was this one. When you find the love,
you'll think the same thing about this one and you'll.

Speaker 3 (52:31):
Be like, that was the love neither I found someone.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
That's why I don't feel I'm actually very proud of her,
because how many listening letters do we hear them say
this person did this, and then that and then that.

Speaker 3 (52:40):
Am I a fool for staying?

Speaker 1 (52:42):
Right? Nah, this person already said, I'm not staying that
person lied.

Speaker 3 (52:45):
How do I move on? So I don't feel sorry
for all?

Speaker 2 (52:48):
I'm proud of you, very very good perspective, babe.

Speaker 4 (52:53):
Love that.

Speaker 2 (52:54):
All right, y'all, that was pretty easy. If you want
to be featured as a listener letter, please email us.
Keep them coming in, y'all were twelve seasons deep of
getting a y'all's business sound.

Speaker 4 (53:04):
I want to stay there. I'm cozy.

Speaker 2 (53:06):
I'm cozy, dead ass advice at gmail dot com.

Speaker 1 (53:10):
That's d E A D A S S A d
V I C E at gmail dot com.

Speaker 4 (53:15):
All Right, moment of truth time. I feel like I
came up with one in the middle of this because
there were so many good things that we hit on.
Do you remember yours? I know you had mentioned you
knew your moment of truth?

Speaker 3 (53:24):
Yes, I did have my moment of truth. I didn't
have my mom truth.

Speaker 1 (53:27):
My moment of truth is going to sound a little
crazy because it doesn't only talk about the child. It
talks about us as parents, right, if you really want
to parent your child in a way that is conducive
with them being successful, but not afraid, don't parent your

(53:49):
children out of fear.

Speaker 3 (53:52):
And I feel like that's what you and I were.

Speaker 1 (53:54):
Doing, even though we were able to self correct and
check because we always check in and we check in
with Jackson, we were both admenting out of fear. I
was doing things out of fear that something else would happen,
not realizing that what I was doing in itself was fucked.

Speaker 4 (54:07):
Up because we were all what we were doing. I
think we were forward or fast forwarding, playing like how
this moment would affect him.

Speaker 2 (54:15):
Later on in life as a twenty two year old,
for example. And it's like we weren't even dealing with
the twelve year olds in the moment.

Speaker 3 (54:21):
Yes, that's it in the moment. He's twelve in the moment.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
Yeah, we're preparing for when he's twenty two. But can
he at least just be twelve right now? Yes, let
him be twelve and let him have fun for her,
have fun, fun, fun, fun, like everything can't be about
just the life lesson It takes away from takes away
the fact that their children bro let him have.

Speaker 2 (54:42):
Fun, right, And that kind of spirals into my moment
of truth is like, let's not take the fun out
of having the engagements and the conversations with our children,
watching them grow through what we had talked about earlier,
the individuation process. Yes, there's a beauty in that because
you're seeing literally how each child, especially if you have multiple,

(55:03):
how each child is unfolding into the individual that they're
meant to be. And we're not here to, you know,
infiltrate that process. We're here to aid them in it
and just kind of sit back and just help them through.
So yeah, that's I think the perfect way to kind
of join our two moments of truth. Continue to have

(55:25):
those conversations with your children, learn who they are, you know,
try to style step accordingly when it comes to your approach,
and just keep the conversations going with your children. That's
something that we didn't have growing up in our generation.
We can't say that it particularly was awful, because you know.

Speaker 3 (55:42):
It wasn't awful.

Speaker 4 (55:43):
I don't know our parents.

Speaker 2 (55:44):
They parented out of fear too, in a lot of circumstances,
and you know, they've raised pretty decent humans.

Speaker 1 (55:51):
But the more you learn the better you Like, they
parented out of fear, and they were able to teach
us their fears. And so now what's going to happen
is Jackson's gonna become a parent and look back at us, say, hey,
mom and dad, you guys could have did this a
little differently, right and evolved rights evolution.

Speaker 4 (56:06):
Absolutely, So let's just keep evolving as good humans and
good parents, right, all right? And be sure to find
us on Patreon. If you haven't evolved yet and like
signed up the Patreon what are you doing period?

Speaker 2 (56:18):
You're going to see exclusive dead Ass podcasts video content.
There a ton of family content, yes, the house Man Cave,
all DAKA, all that good stuff. It's a great place
to be all If you haven't signed up yet, and
be sure to follow us on social media. Dead Ass
the podcast. You can find me at Kadeen, I Am That's.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
Right and I am devou And if you're listening on
Apple Podcasts, be sure to rate, review, subscribe, and also
pick up your copy of We Over Me, The Counterintuitive
Approach to Getting Everything you Want out of your Relationship.

Speaker 3 (56:46):
That's Right. It's a New York.

Speaker 1 (56:46):
Times bestseller and it's available where you can purchase books
and audio books everywhere right now.

Speaker 2 (56:52):
Also Love against the World Baby. Yes, have you gotten
your tickets yet?

Speaker 3 (56:57):
Yes?

Speaker 4 (56:57):
Bigcause Baby VIP is sold out. Sorry would you lose?
If you were on Patreon you would have known earlier.
But there are still tickets there.

Speaker 2 (57:04):
We're going to be in some amazing cities at the
top of the year in February.

Speaker 4 (57:09):
Cannot wait to see you there. So I has your
tickets now, now, now, now, don't wait as.

Speaker 1 (57:15):
Dead Ass is a production of iHeartMedia podcast network and
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