February 25, 2026 • 34 mins
Elijah captures his push and pull between craving praise, guarding against rejection, and wanting both connection and independence through a poem. Elliott explains how art can function as therapy—an outlet for emotions we can’t always say out loud, and invites listeners to think about their own safe place to put their feelings.
In the session, Elijah talks about how insecurity can make him vulnerable to controlling or demeaning “tough love,” and how that affects the power dynamics in his relationships. He shares that he often presents a more stoic public persona, even though he wants to feel more peaceful and authentic, and he’s trying to create a space where he doesn’t have to hide those softer parts of himself.
Elliott challenges Elijah to build self-esteem around what he can control instead of outside feedback. Elijah decides to attach his confidence to effort, discipline, and creativity: writing, reading, drawing, cooking, and building projects, rather than whether other people notice or validate him.
The episode ends with a reminder that anxiety grows when self-worth depends on variables we can’t control, and that small daily habits can move you closer to being your authentic self.
Learn More: ElliottConnie.com
Connect: @ElliottSpeaks Text: 972.426.2640
Read: Change Your Questions, Change Your Future
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
My mind is on the line now, shopping for a
prize I dread to obtain. I know better than the
seek your poison. Yet this paradox I deeply crave. I've
been likened to a child before my glutton for praise
gives me away. I hate the need, and I'm a
fiend for more. By No, I mustn't stay. My time's up.
(00:23):
I can't keep the space the weather boot. I feel beaten.
Still all the mud I tek through isn't enough, But
I still feel hungry for another try. Despite the madness,
I can't give up. Am I true?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Hey?
Speaker 1 (00:35):
That pathetic? I cringe to think? Oh woe is me?
The beggar, the loner, are dependent independent? How confused can
one man be? Is there anything more to this reluctance?
Or must I continue without a plan? Maybe another face
will answer and reveal where I stand. If not, then
I'll wander, half man, half the mad.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Mm. This is family therapy and I'm Elliott Connie. And
what you just heard was poetry. But it wasn't just poetry.
It was a young man trying to understand himself in
real time, processing his thoughts, identifying his feelings, and using
art as a tool to express and reflect. Art is therapy.
(01:24):
Music is therapy. Writing is therapy because it allows us
to shape and create something from the overwhelming feelings we
have inside. When we can't articulate anxiety in a conversation,
sometimes we can write it when we can't explain in
security directly. Sometimes it comes out in metaphor when we
(01:46):
don't yet know who we are becoming. Sometimes art becomes
the rehearsal space. And if you're listening right now, I
want you to think about this. What is your outlet?
Is it music? Is it journaling? Is it working out?
Is it painting? Is it building something with your hands?
(02:08):
Is it prayer? Therapy doesn't only happen in a chair
across from someone like me. It also happens when you
give your emotions somewhere safe to land. And Elijah is
accepting that writing is one of his tools. In today's session,
him and I talked about insecurity, about identity, about the
(02:30):
tension between wanting validation and wanting independence, And you can
hear all of that in his poem. Let's examine some
of the lines in his.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
Poetry, striving for a prize I dread to obtain. I
know better than to seek your poison, the.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Idea of wanting something, recognition, closeness, success, but fearing what
it might cost you emotionally.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
My gutton for praise gives me away. I hate the need.
Then I'm a fiend for more. Oh I mustn't stay.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
That's someone wrestling with the human need for affirmation and
judging himself for having it. Anxiety often grows when we
shame ourselves for normal things, especially when we didn't necessarily
grow up with the praise and support to make it comfortable.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Oh woe is me? The beggar, the loner, a dependent independent.
How confused can one man be?
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Now? That's powerful, There's nothing confusing about it, because most
of us live right there. We want autonomy, we want connection,
We want to stand alone. We want someone to stand
with us. And this may be the most revealing line.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Maybe another face will answer and reveal where I stand.
If not, then I'll wander, half man, half demand.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
What I hear in? That is someone wondering if I
don't know who I am yet? Will I become what
others expect? Will I shape shift to survive? Will I
guard myself so tightly that I lose the softer parts
of me. That's where stoicism can become armor. That's where
personas develop. And in this session you'll hear Elijah talk
(04:14):
about presenting a more stoic version of himself publicly while
privately longing to be more peaceful, more open, and more authentic.
The poem wasn't just creative writing, it was diagnostic. It
showed us the tension he lives with, craving connection, guarding
against rejection, wanting praise, resenting the need for it, trying
(04:38):
to become independent without losing his humanity. And that's what
we explore today, not just his poetry, but the person
behind it. Let's get into it. What's been better since
we last talked.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
I'm getting back to the flow of things. School starting,
work is starting. Those parts of my life are starting again.
So I'm just working on that good deal.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
No, no, it hasn't been that long since your list time.
So what's been going on.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I've been trying to do things that we've talked about before,
which is writing and being more mindful of how I speak,
like where I put my energy with my words specifically.
And then I also had a conversation with someone close
to me about my relationship with them. And the issues
(05:34):
in that relationship. So yeah, that's been it. Okay. Did
those conversations go, Well, the conversations were enlightening and it
just made me, you know, it made me reflect on
how I'm supposed how I should interact with people, especially
(05:56):
interact with people.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
So yeah, how you good interact with people?
Speaker 1 (06:01):
How it should Yes, okay. So something that this person
said was that sometimes this person can be a bit
mean to me and they don't mean to, but it's
how they it's they. It's they have a form of
(06:23):
tough love and they can be you know, a bit
controlling and demeaning if you're not meaning up to their standards.
So and I tend to be like a somewhat sensitive
person and just like through the years of being around
this person and other issues I've had with like members
(06:46):
of family, friends, other things that has made it so
like I am, like I have self esteem issues. And
we talked about that and I said, why is it
that like you get on me, or that I meet
people like you that get on me like that? And
she said something that like she said that they can
(07:12):
smell that quote unquote smell that insecurity that I have.
And there is this instinctual part of them that just
latches onto that or takes advantage.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Of that, And how did that impact you?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
It makes me think that in terms of just that,
I think this is just with anyone, but everyone has
their own agenda, their own perspective on things, and many
of times they will try to push that agenda onto you.
(07:56):
And if you are what's it called, if you're not willing,
if you're if you do not have the what's it called?
If you do not know how to navigate that like,
you can, in a sense a lot of times just
be at their mercy. And for me, it's how that
impacts me. It's like, it's how I interact with people,
(08:16):
Like what sort of how much power do I have
let this person have control over like the situation or
how I'm feeling, or yeah, it the dynamics of our relationship,
whether it's like family, friends, lovers, strangers, acquaintances. That's how
(08:41):
I feel and that's what I've observed.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
And that how do you want that dynamic to go?
Speaker 1 (08:47):
I think an important thing is what I rat like
my name. For instance, normally I go by my first name.
I love my first name. It's unique and it has
a nice backstory. But I prefer it if people who
I don't know or who I'm not close with were
not like who I don't consider my friends in my
(09:09):
close circle to call me by my first name and
said I'd rather than call me by my middle name, okay,
And that for me is creating a boundary that I
feel comfortable with and I'm not normally I just nowadays
like I just go buy that middle name unless like
(09:31):
the people who actually know my first name say that.
But it is mostly like just it's knowing that, Okay,
this is the person that I present myself as. This
is the type of behavior that you're going to get
from me, because because I'm putting that not wall up, well,
(09:51):
it's not that I think it less as a less
as a wall and more as a persona like and
it's for me it's more like more not businesslike, but
more not not not nonchalant either. It's more straightforward, more honest.
(10:12):
There's not as much like as much as like the
playful side that I like that I show others. It's
just more it's it called so wick you could say yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Elijah for me, every time we talk, it seems to
me and let me know how you respond to this.
But every time you talk, it seems to me like
you're on a journey of authenticity. What do you think
about that? Yeah? Okay? And and I mean like being
(10:47):
your true authentic self, whether other people like it or not.
Would you would you agree with that?
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Okay? What's the next step for you?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
The next step? Well, what do you mean by.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Like, what's the next step towards your authenticity for you?
Speaker 1 (11:06):
For me, it's just creating a space that I don't have.
I don't have to have that more still with PERSONA.
That's the most important thing for me right now because
if I can't make that space at the moment, I
think even fear, yes, that that part of me will
(11:26):
be you know, taking advantage of or hurt. And so
that's why I tend to show this one side of
me in the space I'm not like in just most
hours of my life, right most hours of my life,
and then the other time during the private time of
(11:49):
my life where I'm not like at least right now,
it's like when I'm not around anyone, because I don't
really have like a lot of people who I show
that more. I show that more playful side of myself
or like non still excited myself.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
What would you call the non still excited yourself? You
just said playful, But like, what would you what do
you want to be instead of stoic?
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Well, it's not that I don't know yet, I don't
have a few I don't have a way to describe it.
It's just I guess we could just call it like
peaceful at the moment.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Okay, so you want to be the peaceful version of
you instead of the stoic version of you.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
I think this poem that I have, it's like encapsulates
the things that the type person that I don't want
to be, Like that's why I'm playing the guard up
if so.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
The poem is about what you don't want to be.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yes, and the reason why I try to be more
stoic in the public version of my personality.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Do you often write poetry about how you're feeling? Yeah,
what was happening for you when you wrote that?
Speaker 1 (13:00):
During the summer, I went through like a bit of
a hard time because like it's one it's a new place,
I'm doing what I love. At the same time, like
there are just so many strangers that I never get
a break from, Like any of them. I don't have
much privacy at all to myself, honestly, Like, at times
I felt that I was showing that more private side
of my personality, but at the same time, I felt
(13:22):
like I was getting nothing back in return, Like and
oftentimes I feel as if no matter how hard I
try to be social, I still don't get that same
Like I still don't get that the response that I'm
looking for back, And I guess, like yeah, and oftentimes,
(13:49):
like I think that part of the issues that I
am the problem, Like, for instance, there was like there's
things I'm not willing to compromise for. So for instance, sleep,
We oftentimes like when you were done with work, you
could go out with the others or just hang around
this place with the others. And but for me, I'm like,
(14:10):
I want to go to sleep because we got work
tomorrow in the morning. Why am I trying to stay
Why am I trying to stay up even longer? But
if I didn't, I might have like actually made some
stronger connections. But the thing is, like, I'm not that
type of guy. I don't like staying up unless it's
like I'm already in my bed and I'm watching TV.
That's the most self deal, right, but it's that's not
(14:35):
the same here. And the thing is like when I
felt like I was trying to be open, when I
was trying to be like close, it just felt like nothing.
And but I will say this, like there were friends
I made over there, of course, but you know, even
when I thought I was trying to I was like
doing my best, like the moans who I like really
(14:56):
needed it, it just like it wasn't coming to me.
It was it like no, like no one really helped me.
So except this one guy, well these two, these two people.
But I went to them to ask for it. I
was more like I instead I what I was wanting
was instead of me always having to like put my
(15:17):
foot forward to do what get the connection, Like I
wish someone would come towards me, because that's oftentimes what
I do for others. Like there was this one person
who was really upset. I didn't really know her. I
didn't really talk to her like I saw her here
and there. But when I saw she was upset, like I,
I generally like I wanted to have a conversation with
(15:38):
like a you okay, And we talked for a bit
and then I said like, if you need help, I'm
ear and I left, And then when I saw her
at lunch, I asked her again, like you good, But
it was just like I wish someone would do that
for me. But I think at the same time, it's
just like oftentimes I'm in my head, I am distracted
(16:00):
or aloof or just socially awkward, and so as this
is so part of the blame is on me. But
at the same time, it's just like I've always wondered,
like why can't I get that in returnity?
Speaker 2 (16:11):
Right, what would a poem be, like Elijah that was
about instead of who you don't want to be? What
kind of poem would you write that was about who
you do want to be?
Speaker 1 (16:24):
I think I'm actually trying to write that one now.
I mostly just write poems about like what I'm like,
not upset about, but like things I'm reflecting on. I
think right now, it's just like my ideal like self
I would place in the poems, Like it's like when
I know that I'm so one of the things I know,
(16:45):
Like when I'm home, I think I told you like
on the very first day, like I would have windows
that wouldn't like be full of sunshine when I wake up.
And the reason why is because I've created because and
mostly I think the most recent moments of my life,
like the place I lived, they had no sun They
(17:09):
would get glimpses of sun from being in the back
of the building, but not a lot of sunlight. And
that always was a sign of depression for me, because
I would just send these dark rooms and rot. Basically
it rot. But if I were to be in a
place that I made of my design, I would have
(17:31):
windows where I slept. And so the first thing that's
waking me up, if it's not my alarm, it's the sun.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Elijah. First of all, I love this, but can I
tell you the one part that concerns me. Sure, I
think it's so important that people, in this case, you
learned to be your authentic self regardless of what's going
on around you. The journey towards authenticity, Elijah, I think
is one of the most important things that anyone could do.
(18:01):
And you have to learn how to be your authentic
self regardless of how the world around you responds to it.
And you're saying so many really important things, But I
want to tell you the part that concerns me most
if you. So, let's say you could buy a mini
bus tomorrow, you'd be happy about that, right, Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Well then I would thinking like, oh, well, how am
I supposed to like fix this up for me to
live in? I'm not exactly going to be sleeping on
a on a chair like what's it called seat? Okay,
so I'll even be better for you. Let's say you
got like a custom built, ready to live in mini bus.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Tomorrow, right, You'll be happy about that. Yeah? And then
you go live in the mini bus and you're like, oh,
I can't wait to wake up tomorrow by the sunlight
coming in the windows, and Elijah, I love that. But
what if? What if when you wake up the next
(18:58):
day it's dark, gray and cloudy, should you be sad
because the sunlight didn't wake you up? Do you see
what I'm saying? Like, I want you to be the
best version of yourself, not dependent upon variables you can't control.
And one variable you can't control is whether or not
the sun is shining on your face or not.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
It's the end result. What does having the minibus mean
to me? Like the journey to get to that the
minibus meant that I worked enough money to buy it.
I was independent enough to buy I didn't have to
rely on my parents. I designed it myself, meaning like
I took the time to create something that I'm proud of.
(19:42):
I took the crime to create a home for myself.
The fact that there's a kitchen that I can cook,
which is something that we all know I love to do.
Instead of the minibus being it's more of just like
for me, the creation of this home is like just
the entire journey of becoming like you could say, a
(20:04):
man at that point, though I don't fully take stock
of like that title, but it's the best way to describe.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
It, Okay, which I think that's great too. But then
I'm thinking, when you're being your authentic self, Let's say
you're being your authentic self before you get the minibus,
when you when you check on your friend like hey
you okay, and then you start wondering how come nobody
checks on me like that? How do I get you
(20:34):
to not wonder that and just focus on the part
that you can control, which is how you show up.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Well, that's what I think is just creating that space
where I can focus on where I don't need to
feel sad about that like my hobbies, drawing, writing, like animals,
like those things that I have, I won't have to
worry about anyone my self esteem won't have to worry
(21:01):
about anyone else. And that's why I say, like the
part of me that people see in public, that is
the side that that though like, that's the side that,
though it might help people like, it's also the one
that's like guarding from what's inside my home or inside
(21:22):
that space.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Here's more from my session with Elijah. What will you
be attaching your self esteem to? Now?
Speaker 1 (21:38):
I think my efforts, my discipline, my creativity, the things
that I can necessarily make, like it's called I think
the things that I make I'll attach my self esteem to.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
And how would that be different?
Speaker 1 (21:57):
What do you mean? How will that be different? What
do you mean by that question?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
How would that be different from what is happening now?
Speaker 1 (22:04):
It means I'm going somewhere like the creation of things
is my self expression come to life or made form,
you know, a drawing or a work of art, a
projects that now sits on my counter. Those things are
(22:24):
time care, dedication. Those things that I can now do
shows that I've actually come how far the steps I've
taken and that makes me feel like a sense of
pride that no one can take away from me or
(22:45):
nothing can drain from that, right.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
And you'd like that?
Speaker 1 (22:50):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Okay? Who around you would notice that your self esteem
is now attached to your creativity moving forward? And what
I love so much about that, Elijah, is you're now
attaching yourself as the things that you control. Who else
would notice that?
Speaker 1 (23:09):
My stepmom, my dad? I think that's about it.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
How would they see it?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
I don't think they would not unless they followed me
on Instagram or something like that. But unless they walked
into my apartment and saw But they wouldn't mostly see it.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
What if they were following me on Instagram? What would
they notice?
Speaker 1 (23:34):
They would just notice a lot of work and dedication
place into the stuff I've done, like poetry videos I've
made I plan on posting my poems with like cinematography projects.
So yeah, yeah, they would definitely be about it.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
How would they let you know? How would your stepmom
and dad let you know they were happy about it?
Speaker 1 (24:02):
They probably think about themselves, or they might like or
come over and give me all. Maybe I'm not sure.
I'm not entirely sure. Usually when I am like, usually
they don't follow me on anything, but when I do
do projects, it's like I show them myself. But nowadays
(24:24):
I'm just like, I'm gonna start like probably cutting back
on that because just they're not writers. Well, my stepmom
is a writer, but like she's not the type of
writer I am. She's not, like I don't think she's
fully eight. Like she's interested, of course, so listen, but
she's not a she she doesn't know, and so she
(24:44):
can't really get excited with me like that. My dad
does and he's not, but that's because like he's I
think he he's not more invested, but he I guess
you could say he takes more time than my stepmom does.
And certainly in that area.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Where did you get this writing?
Speaker 1 (25:04):
Like so with the poetry before and third grade, we'd
have an assignment every day to write a page of
information or a page about something, and I would always
write by animals and my dad, like every single day.
And my dad at one point told me, no, you're
not going to write by animals. You're gonna write You're
(25:24):
gonna do something else, because it's at this point it's
too old to be writing by animals, and then my
dad forced me to write poetry, and I'm like, Dad,
I don't want to write poetry, like this is the
one time I'll be allowed to watch Naciographic and wild
Grats in peace, like, let let me have my time.
But no, he forced me, and I ended up like
(25:47):
making a really bad poem on purpose because I'm like,
you think you can force me to write that? No,
But now looking I'm like, I'm actually pretty good at it.
But this is how writing really came into my life.
So I was doing the SSATS for in ninth grade
and when I like, it took like of course, like
(26:07):
it took like an hour or two hours to complete it.
But when we got out of school, like my brain
was fried and I did not want to go through
that again. So the very next day, when we had
another SAT, I'm like, you know, screw this, I'm going
to Starbucks. I'm gonna buy a I'm gonna buy a
season of Avatar the Last Airbender and just binge watch
(26:27):
that all day. I was like, you know what, I
can do this too. I can write. I can write
a story that people like. And that's how it started.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Wow, when did you realize you were good at it.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Well, I realized I was good. It was just something
that I found like really fun and that I liked doing.
I was working on this for like since ninth grade,
so I was so what I was like sixteen, yeah, sixteen,
so six years I was working on like an original story,
and I was researching about like how do stories work,
story structured characters, protagonists, antagonists, what makes a good world
(27:05):
that you're building because it's it's fiction, magic systems all that,
And I was like, you know what, I really enjoy
doing this. I want I just want to do more.
So I think I've learned. I've learned that I was
good at it. When I gave someone, when I showed
someone the idea of the story I made like a
(27:25):
prototype of the story I would make the world was making.
I was like, okay, this is act. They were like, Okay,
this is really good.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
And going back to this authenticity and being creative and
letting that be the thing that drives your self esteem.
How different would that be from how you've been in
the past?
Speaker 1 (27:44):
For me, different like with how the type of environment
not just also the type of environment that I have
like in my room, my place of residence, but It's
also like how I dress, like how I dress, what
I do like For instance, I feel like I need
to be reading more, reading more like increasing, like reading
(28:07):
does so much for the mind. I feel like I'm
missing out on a lot of benefits from reading, especially
as a writer, if I don't read at least thirty
minutes every single day, and that is something that I'm doing.
Like the way I'm behaving too, It's like I may
want to be an author, but the type of thing
(28:27):
I want to do is graphic novels. I'm not a drawer,
not yet at least, but I need to practice thirty
minutes every single day if I want to get good
and me being the type of person like that needs
to be disciplined enough to write every day, or to
not just write but draw every single day. That shows
(28:50):
I'm actually growing.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
Are you doing that every day now?
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Yeah? I've been like for the last like well, until
I actually went to camp, I was pretty much drawing
every single day. I've been working on the basics. I'm
even going like that's why I'm going to school for anyway,
But like I'm really dedicating to trying every single day
and working on like to a point where like I might, yeah,
partner with someone to make the graphic novel series, like
(29:17):
for a little while, for a little bit, but once
I'm once, I'm there, I'm not relying on anyone else
with me.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
How long have you been doing that? So every day thing?
Speaker 1 (29:30):
It's just been this week because I had to, Like,
I can't count it every single day if I was
gone for two months, but beforehand, I was doing it
for like three weeks.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
Okay, so three weeks. Then now you're back on it? Yeah,
are you enjoying being back on it?
Speaker 1 (29:48):
I mean, I'm gonna be doing more our classes anyway,
So I hope to like really improve there and make
something really really amazing.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
How if I were to ask you on a scale
of zero to ten, ten being you're always your authentic
self and zero is the opposite, you're as far away
from being your authentic self as possible, Where would you
say you are these days? Four? Maybe five? Okay? As
(30:22):
you go on and attach this creativity, your daily habits
of writing, reading and drawing and all the other things
that we discussed, I want you to notice evidence that
you're moving up to Like today you said four maybe five,
But I want you to notice evidence that you're moving
(30:42):
up to like five maybe six. Yeah. To be honest
with you, Elijah, this for me is a journey of
authenticity for you, even when other people and the things
around you don't give you the kind of response or
of feedback that you were hoping for.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
So I'm going to be the Elijah I want to be.
I'm gonna write draw cook, I'm going to have a
routine that I like and that serves me. And if
no one asked me about it, great, if no one
likes it, cool, But I'm going to do it because
it's right for.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Me, exactly.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Yeah, Okay, all right, that's all I got.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Okay, cool, I appreciate it. Talk.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
I appreciate it. To Elijah, I'm excited to see you
continue to turn into your authentic self. If you saw
yourself in Elijah's poem, if you've ever felt like a
dependent independent, if you've ever craved praise and then judge
yourself for needing it, You're not less than you're human.
(31:43):
Anxiety often grows when our self worth depends on variables
we can't control. Who checks on us, who compliments us,
who understands us, who notices what Elijah is learning, And
what I hope you take from this is that it's
okay to attach your self esteem to effort instead of outcome,
(32:04):
to what you build, to what you practice, to how
you show up When you feel that tension, that paradox
of craving and resisting, try asking yourself if I acted
from authenticity instead of fear, what would I do next?
(32:26):
What small habit today would move me from a four
to a five? What effort can I respect myself for
even if no one else sees it. You don't have
(32:47):
to solve your entire identity at once. Just notice the
evidence that you're moving forward. That's how anxiety loosens its grip.
That's how authenticity grows, and that's how you stop wondering
half man and start becoming whole. Tune in next week
for our final episode of the season. I would love
(33:16):
to hear from you about your healing journey, your family,
and your feedback. Leave a review, send a DM, connect
with me on socials at Elliott Speaks, and you can
also send me a text message to nine seven two
four two six two six four zero. Family Therapy is
a production of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect Podcast Network.
Special Thanks to our assistant, Glendale Sepe. It's produced by
(33:38):
Jack Queech Thomas and the executive producer Dolly S. S Fisham.
For more podcasts from The Black Effect, visit the iHeartRadio
app or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. The
content presented on the Family Therapy Podcast serves solely for
educational and informational purposes. It should not be considered a
replacement for personalized medical or mental health guidance and does
not constitute a provider of patiently life. It is advisable
(34:01):
to consult with your healthcare provider or health team for
any specific concerns or questions you may have.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
M
My mind is on the line now, shopping for a
prize I dread to obtain. I know better than the
seek your poison. Yet this paradox I deeply crave. I've
been likened to a child before my glutton for praise
gives me away. I hate the need, and I'm a
fiend for more. By No, I mustn't stay. My time's up.
(00:23):
I can't keep the space the weather boot. I feel beaten.
Still all the mud I tek through isn't enough, But
I still feel hungry for another try. Despite the madness,
I can't give up. Am I true?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Hey?
Speaker 1 (00:35):
That pathetic? I cringe to think? Oh woe is me?
The beggar, the loner, are dependent independent? How confused can
one man be? Is there anything more to this reluctance?
Or must I continue without a plan? Maybe another face
will answer and reveal where I stand. If not, then
I'll wander, half man, half the mad.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Mm. This is family therapy and I'm Elliott Connie. And
what you just heard was poetry. But it wasn't just poetry.
It was a young man trying to understand himself in
real time, processing his thoughts, identifying his feelings, and using
art as a tool to express and reflect. Art is therapy.
(01:24):
Music is therapy. Writing is therapy because it allows us
to shape and create something from the overwhelming feelings we
have inside. When we can't articulate anxiety in a conversation,
sometimes we can write it when we can't explain in
security directly. Sometimes it comes out in metaphor when we
(01:46):
don't yet know who we are becoming. Sometimes art becomes
the rehearsal space. And if you're listening right now, I
want you to think about this. What is your outlet?
Is it music? Is it journaling? Is it working out?
Is it painting? Is it building something with your hands?
(02:08):
Is it prayer? Therapy doesn't only happen in a chair
across from someone like me. It also happens when you
give your emotions somewhere safe to land. And Elijah is
accepting that writing is one of his tools. In today's session,
him and I talked about insecurity, about identity, about the
(02:30):
tension between wanting validation and wanting independence, And you can
hear all of that in his poem. Let's examine some
of the lines in his.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
Poetry, striving for a prize I dread to obtain. I
know better than to seek your poison, the.
Speaker 2 (02:46):
Idea of wanting something, recognition, closeness, success, but fearing what
it might cost you emotionally.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
My gutton for praise gives me away. I hate the need.
Then I'm a fiend for more. Oh I mustn't stay.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
That's someone wrestling with the human need for affirmation and
judging himself for having it. Anxiety often grows when we
shame ourselves for normal things, especially when we didn't necessarily
grow up with the praise and support to make it comfortable.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Oh woe is me? The beggar, the loner, a dependent independent.
How confused can one man be?
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Now? That's powerful, There's nothing confusing about it, because most
of us live right there. We want autonomy, we want connection,
We want to stand alone. We want someone to stand
with us. And this may be the most revealing line.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Maybe another face will answer and reveal where I stand.
If not, then I'll wander, half man, half demand.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
What I hear in? That is someone wondering if I
don't know who I am yet? Will I become what
others expect? Will I shape shift to survive? Will I
guard myself so tightly that I lose the softer parts
of me. That's where stoicism can become armor. That's where
personas develop. And in this session you'll hear Elijah talk
(04:14):
about presenting a more stoic version of himself publicly while
privately longing to be more peaceful, more open, and more authentic.
The poem wasn't just creative writing, it was diagnostic. It
showed us the tension he lives with, craving connection, guarding
against rejection, wanting praise, resenting the need for it, trying
(04:38):
to become independent without losing his humanity. And that's what
we explore today, not just his poetry, but the person
behind it. Let's get into it. What's been better since
we last talked.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
I'm getting back to the flow of things. School starting,
work is starting. Those parts of my life are starting again.
So I'm just working on that good deal.
Speaker 2 (05:05):
No, no, it hasn't been that long since your list time.
So what's been going on.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I've been trying to do things that we've talked about before,
which is writing and being more mindful of how I speak,
like where I put my energy with my words specifically.
And then I also had a conversation with someone close
to me about my relationship with them. And the issues
(05:34):
in that relationship. So yeah, that's been it. Okay. Did
those conversations go, Well, the conversations were enlightening and it
just made me, you know, it made me reflect on
how I'm supposed how I should interact with people, especially
(05:56):
interact with people.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
So yeah, how you good interact with people?
Speaker 1 (06:01):
How it should Yes, okay. So something that this person
said was that sometimes this person can be a bit
mean to me and they don't mean to, but it's
how they it's they. It's they have a form of
(06:23):
tough love and they can be you know, a bit
controlling and demeaning if you're not meaning up to their standards.
So and I tend to be like a somewhat sensitive
person and just like through the years of being around
this person and other issues I've had with like members
(06:46):
of family, friends, other things that has made it so
like I am, like I have self esteem issues. And
we talked about that and I said, why is it
that like you get on me, or that I meet
people like you that get on me like that? And
she said something that like she said that they can
(07:12):
smell that quote unquote smell that insecurity that I have.
And there is this instinctual part of them that just
latches onto that or takes advantage.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Of that, And how did that impact you?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
It makes me think that in terms of just that,
I think this is just with anyone, but everyone has
their own agenda, their own perspective on things, and many
of times they will try to push that agenda onto you.
(07:56):
And if you are what's it called, if you're not willing,
if you're if you do not have the what's it called?
If you do not know how to navigate that like,
you can, in a sense a lot of times just
be at their mercy. And for me, it's how that
impacts me. It's like, it's how I interact with people,
(08:16):
Like what sort of how much power do I have
let this person have control over like the situation or
how I'm feeling, or yeah, it the dynamics of our relationship,
whether it's like family, friends, lovers, strangers, acquaintances. That's how
(08:41):
I feel and that's what I've observed.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
And that how do you want that dynamic to go?
Speaker 1 (08:47):
I think an important thing is what I rat like
my name. For instance, normally I go by my first name.
I love my first name. It's unique and it has
a nice backstory. But I prefer it if people who
I don't know or who I'm not close with were
not like who I don't consider my friends in my
(09:09):
close circle to call me by my first name and
said I'd rather than call me by my middle name, okay,
And that for me is creating a boundary that I
feel comfortable with and I'm not normally I just nowadays
like I just go buy that middle name unless like
(09:31):
the people who actually know my first name say that.
But it is mostly like just it's knowing that, Okay,
this is the person that I present myself as. This
is the type of behavior that you're going to get
from me, because because I'm putting that not wall up, well,
(09:51):
it's not that I think it less as a less
as a wall and more as a persona like and
it's for me it's more like more not businesslike, but
more not not not nonchalant either. It's more straightforward, more honest.
(10:12):
There's not as much like as much as like the
playful side that I like that I show others. It's
just more it's it called so wick you could say yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Elijah for me, every time we talk, it seems to
me and let me know how you respond to this.
But every time you talk, it seems to me like
you're on a journey of authenticity. What do you think
about that? Yeah? Okay? And and I mean like being
(10:47):
your true authentic self, whether other people like it or not.
Would you would you agree with that?
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Okay? What's the next step for you?
Speaker 1 (10:59):
The next step? Well, what do you mean by.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Like, what's the next step towards your authenticity for you?
Speaker 1 (11:06):
For me, it's just creating a space that I don't have.
I don't have to have that more still with PERSONA.
That's the most important thing for me right now because
if I can't make that space at the moment, I
think even fear, yes, that that part of me will
(11:26):
be you know, taking advantage of or hurt. And so
that's why I tend to show this one side of
me in the space I'm not like in just most
hours of my life, right most hours of my life,
and then the other time during the private time of
(11:49):
my life where I'm not like at least right now,
it's like when I'm not around anyone, because I don't
really have like a lot of people who I show
that more. I show that more playful side of myself
or like non still excited myself.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
What would you call the non still excited yourself? You
just said playful, But like, what would you what do
you want to be instead of stoic?
Speaker 1 (12:15):
Well, it's not that I don't know yet, I don't
have a few I don't have a way to describe it.
It's just I guess we could just call it like
peaceful at the moment.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Okay, so you want to be the peaceful version of
you instead of the stoic version of you.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
I think this poem that I have, it's like encapsulates
the things that the type person that I don't want
to be, Like that's why I'm playing the guard up
if so.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
The poem is about what you don't want to be.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yes, and the reason why I try to be more
stoic in the public version of my personality.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Do you often write poetry about how you're feeling? Yeah,
what was happening for you when you wrote that?
Speaker 1 (13:00):
During the summer, I went through like a bit of
a hard time because like it's one it's a new place,
I'm doing what I love. At the same time, like
there are just so many strangers that I never get
a break from, Like any of them. I don't have
much privacy at all to myself, honestly, Like, at times
I felt that I was showing that more private side
of my personality, but at the same time, I felt
(13:22):
like I was getting nothing back in return, Like and
oftentimes I feel as if no matter how hard I
try to be social, I still don't get that same
Like I still don't get that the response that I'm
looking for back, And I guess, like yeah, and oftentimes,
(13:49):
like I think that part of the issues that I
am the problem, Like, for instance, there was like there's
things I'm not willing to compromise for. So for instance, sleep,
We oftentimes like when you were done with work, you
could go out with the others or just hang around
this place with the others. And but for me, I'm like,
(14:10):
I want to go to sleep because we got work
tomorrow in the morning. Why am I trying to stay
Why am I trying to stay up even longer? But
if I didn't, I might have like actually made some
stronger connections. But the thing is, like, I'm not that
type of guy. I don't like staying up unless it's
like I'm already in my bed and I'm watching TV.
That's the most self deal, right, but it's that's not
(14:35):
the same here. And the thing is like when I
felt like I was trying to be open, when I
was trying to be like close, it just felt like nothing.
And but I will say this, like there were friends
I made over there, of course, but you know, even
when I thought I was trying to I was like
doing my best, like the moans who I like really
(14:56):
needed it, it just like it wasn't coming to me.
It was it like no, like no one really helped me.
So except this one guy, well these two, these two people.
But I went to them to ask for it. I
was more like I instead I what I was wanting
was instead of me always having to like put my
(15:17):
foot forward to do what get the connection, Like I
wish someone would come towards me, because that's oftentimes what
I do for others. Like there was this one person
who was really upset. I didn't really know her. I
didn't really talk to her like I saw her here
and there. But when I saw she was upset, like I,
I generally like I wanted to have a conversation with
(15:38):
like a you okay, And we talked for a bit
and then I said like, if you need help, I'm
ear and I left, And then when I saw her
at lunch, I asked her again, like you good, But
it was just like I wish someone would do that
for me. But I think at the same time, it's
just like oftentimes I'm in my head, I am distracted
(16:00):
or aloof or just socially awkward, and so as this
is so part of the blame is on me. But
at the same time, it's just like I've always wondered,
like why can't I get that in returnity?
Speaker 2 (16:11):
Right, what would a poem be, like Elijah that was
about instead of who you don't want to be? What
kind of poem would you write that was about who
you do want to be?
Speaker 1 (16:24):
I think I'm actually trying to write that one now.
I mostly just write poems about like what I'm like,
not upset about, but like things I'm reflecting on. I
think right now, it's just like my ideal like self
I would place in the poems, Like it's like when
I know that I'm so one of the things I know,
(16:45):
Like when I'm home, I think I told you like
on the very first day, like I would have windows
that wouldn't like be full of sunshine when I wake up.
And the reason why is because I've created because and
mostly I think the most recent moments of my life,
like the place I lived, they had no sun They
(17:09):
would get glimpses of sun from being in the back
of the building, but not a lot of sunlight. And
that always was a sign of depression for me, because
I would just send these dark rooms and rot. Basically
it rot. But if I were to be in a
place that I made of my design, I would have
(17:31):
windows where I slept. And so the first thing that's
waking me up, if it's not my alarm, it's the sun.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Elijah. First of all, I love this, but can I
tell you the one part that concerns me. Sure, I
think it's so important that people, in this case, you
learned to be your authentic self regardless of what's going
on around you. The journey towards authenticity, Elijah, I think
is one of the most important things that anyone could do.
(18:01):
And you have to learn how to be your authentic
self regardless of how the world around you responds to it.
And you're saying so many really important things, But I
want to tell you the part that concerns me most
if you. So, let's say you could buy a mini
bus tomorrow, you'd be happy about that, right, Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Well then I would thinking like, oh, well, how am
I supposed to like fix this up for me to
live in? I'm not exactly going to be sleeping on
a on a chair like what's it called seat? Okay,
so I'll even be better for you. Let's say you
got like a custom built, ready to live in mini bus.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
Tomorrow, right, You'll be happy about that. Yeah? And then
you go live in the mini bus and you're like, oh,
I can't wait to wake up tomorrow by the sunlight
coming in the windows, and Elijah, I love that. But
what if? What if when you wake up the next
(18:58):
day it's dark, gray and cloudy, should you be sad
because the sunlight didn't wake you up? Do you see
what I'm saying? Like, I want you to be the
best version of yourself, not dependent upon variables you can't control.
And one variable you can't control is whether or not
the sun is shining on your face or not.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
It's the end result. What does having the minibus mean
to me? Like the journey to get to that the
minibus meant that I worked enough money to buy it.
I was independent enough to buy I didn't have to
rely on my parents. I designed it myself, meaning like
I took the time to create something that I'm proud of.
(19:42):
I took the crime to create a home for myself.
The fact that there's a kitchen that I can cook,
which is something that we all know I love to do.
Instead of the minibus being it's more of just like
for me, the creation of this home is like just
the entire journey of becoming like you could say, a
(20:04):
man at that point, though I don't fully take stock
of like that title, but it's the best way to describe.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
It, Okay, which I think that's great too. But then
I'm thinking, when you're being your authentic self, Let's say
you're being your authentic self before you get the minibus,
when you when you check on your friend like hey
you okay, and then you start wondering how come nobody
checks on me like that? How do I get you
(20:34):
to not wonder that and just focus on the part
that you can control, which is how you show up.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Well, that's what I think is just creating that space
where I can focus on where I don't need to
feel sad about that like my hobbies, drawing, writing, like animals,
like those things that I have, I won't have to
worry about anyone my self esteem won't have to worry
(21:01):
about anyone else. And that's why I say, like the
part of me that people see in public, that is
the side that that though like, that's the side that,
though it might help people like, it's also the one
that's like guarding from what's inside my home or inside
(21:22):
that space.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
Here's more from my session with Elijah. What will you
be attaching your self esteem to? Now?
Speaker 1 (21:38):
I think my efforts, my discipline, my creativity, the things
that I can necessarily make, like it's called I think
the things that I make I'll attach my self esteem to.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
And how would that be different?
Speaker 1 (21:57):
What do you mean? How will that be different? What
do you mean by that question?
Speaker 2 (22:00):
How would that be different from what is happening now?
Speaker 1 (22:04):
It means I'm going somewhere like the creation of things
is my self expression come to life or made form,
you know, a drawing or a work of art, a
projects that now sits on my counter. Those things are
(22:24):
time care, dedication. Those things that I can now do
shows that I've actually come how far the steps I've
taken and that makes me feel like a sense of
pride that no one can take away from me or
(22:45):
nothing can drain from that, right.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
And you'd like that?
Speaker 1 (22:50):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Okay? Who around you would notice that your self esteem
is now attached to your creativity moving forward? And what
I love so much about that, Elijah, is you're now
attaching yourself as the things that you control. Who else
would notice that?
Speaker 1 (23:09):
My stepmom, my dad? I think that's about it.
Speaker 2 (23:15):
How would they see it?
Speaker 1 (23:17):
I don't think they would not unless they followed me
on Instagram or something like that. But unless they walked
into my apartment and saw But they wouldn't mostly see it.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
What if they were following me on Instagram? What would
they notice?
Speaker 1 (23:34):
They would just notice a lot of work and dedication
place into the stuff I've done, like poetry videos I've
made I plan on posting my poems with like cinematography projects.
So yeah, yeah, they would definitely be about it.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
How would they let you know? How would your stepmom
and dad let you know they were happy about it?
Speaker 1 (24:02):
They probably think about themselves, or they might like or
come over and give me all. Maybe I'm not sure.
I'm not entirely sure. Usually when I am like, usually
they don't follow me on anything, but when I do
do projects, it's like I show them myself. But nowadays
(24:24):
I'm just like, I'm gonna start like probably cutting back
on that because just they're not writers. Well, my stepmom
is a writer, but like she's not the type of
writer I am. She's not, like I don't think she's
fully eight. Like she's interested, of course, so listen, but
she's not a she she doesn't know, and so she
(24:44):
can't really get excited with me like that. My dad
does and he's not, but that's because like he's I
think he he's not more invested, but he I guess
you could say he takes more time than my stepmom does.
And certainly in that area.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Where did you get this writing?
Speaker 1 (25:04):
Like so with the poetry before and third grade, we'd
have an assignment every day to write a page of
information or a page about something, and I would always
write by animals and my dad, like every single day.
And my dad at one point told me, no, you're
not going to write by animals. You're gonna write You're
(25:24):
gonna do something else, because it's at this point it's
too old to be writing by animals, and then my
dad forced me to write poetry, and I'm like, Dad,
I don't want to write poetry, like this is the
one time I'll be allowed to watch Naciographic and wild
Grats in peace, like, let let me have my time.
But no, he forced me, and I ended up like
(25:47):
making a really bad poem on purpose because I'm like,
you think you can force me to write that? No,
But now looking I'm like, I'm actually pretty good at it.
But this is how writing really came into my life.
So I was doing the SSATS for in ninth grade
and when I like, it took like of course, like
(26:07):
it took like an hour or two hours to complete it.
But when we got out of school, like my brain
was fried and I did not want to go through
that again. So the very next day, when we had
another SAT, I'm like, you know, screw this, I'm going
to Starbucks. I'm gonna buy a I'm gonna buy a
season of Avatar the Last Airbender and just binge watch
(26:27):
that all day. I was like, you know what, I
can do this too. I can write. I can write
a story that people like. And that's how it started.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Wow, when did you realize you were good at it.
Speaker 1 (26:41):
Well, I realized I was good. It was just something
that I found like really fun and that I liked doing.
I was working on this for like since ninth grade,
so I was so what I was like sixteen, yeah, sixteen,
so six years I was working on like an original story,
and I was researching about like how do stories work,
story structured characters, protagonists, antagonists, what makes a good world
(27:05):
that you're building because it's it's fiction, magic systems all that,
And I was like, you know what, I really enjoy
doing this. I want I just want to do more.
So I think I've learned. I've learned that I was
good at it. When I gave someone, when I showed
someone the idea of the story I made like a
(27:25):
prototype of the story I would make the world was making.
I was like, okay, this is act. They were like, Okay,
this is really good.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
And going back to this authenticity and being creative and
letting that be the thing that drives your self esteem.
How different would that be from how you've been in
the past?
Speaker 1 (27:44):
For me, different like with how the type of environment
not just also the type of environment that I have
like in my room, my place of residence, but It's
also like how I dress, like how I dress, what
I do like For instance, I feel like I need
to be reading more, reading more like increasing, like reading
(28:07):
does so much for the mind. I feel like I'm
missing out on a lot of benefits from reading, especially
as a writer, if I don't read at least thirty
minutes every single day, and that is something that I'm doing.
Like the way I'm behaving too, It's like I may
want to be an author, but the type of thing
(28:27):
I want to do is graphic novels. I'm not a drawer,
not yet at least, but I need to practice thirty
minutes every single day if I want to get good
and me being the type of person like that needs
to be disciplined enough to write every day, or to
not just write but draw every single day. That shows
(28:50):
I'm actually growing.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
Are you doing that every day now?
Speaker 1 (28:54):
Yeah? I've been like for the last like well, until
I actually went to camp, I was pretty much drawing
every single day. I've been working on the basics. I'm
even going like that's why I'm going to school for anyway,
But like I'm really dedicating to trying every single day
and working on like to a point where like I might, yeah,
partner with someone to make the graphic novel series, like
(29:17):
for a little while, for a little bit, but once
I'm once, I'm there, I'm not relying on anyone else
with me.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
How long have you been doing that? So every day thing?
Speaker 1 (29:30):
It's just been this week because I had to, Like,
I can't count it every single day if I was
gone for two months, but beforehand, I was doing it
for like three weeks.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
Okay, so three weeks. Then now you're back on it? Yeah,
are you enjoying being back on it?
Speaker 1 (29:48):
I mean, I'm gonna be doing more our classes anyway,
So I hope to like really improve there and make
something really really amazing.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
How if I were to ask you on a scale
of zero to ten, ten being you're always your authentic
self and zero is the opposite, you're as far away
from being your authentic self as possible, Where would you
say you are these days? Four? Maybe five? Okay? As
(30:22):
you go on and attach this creativity, your daily habits
of writing, reading and drawing and all the other things
that we discussed, I want you to notice evidence that
you're moving up to Like today you said four maybe five,
But I want you to notice evidence that you're moving
(30:42):
up to like five maybe six. Yeah. To be honest
with you, Elijah, this for me is a journey of
authenticity for you, even when other people and the things
around you don't give you the kind of response or
of feedback that you were hoping for.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:01):
So I'm going to be the Elijah I want to be.
I'm gonna write draw cook, I'm going to have a
routine that I like and that serves me. And if
no one asked me about it, great, if no one
likes it, cool, But I'm going to do it because
it's right for.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Me, exactly.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Yeah, Okay, all right, that's all I got.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Okay, cool, I appreciate it. Talk.
Speaker 2 (31:23):
I appreciate it. To Elijah, I'm excited to see you
continue to turn into your authentic self. If you saw
yourself in Elijah's poem, if you've ever felt like a
dependent independent, if you've ever craved praise and then judge
yourself for needing it, You're not less than you're human.
(31:43):
Anxiety often grows when our self worth depends on variables
we can't control. Who checks on us, who compliments us,
who understands us, who notices what Elijah is learning, And
what I hope you take from this is that it's
okay to attach your self esteem to effort instead of outcome,
(32:04):
to what you build, to what you practice, to how
you show up When you feel that tension, that paradox
of craving and resisting, try asking yourself if I acted
from authenticity instead of fear, what would I do next?
(32:26):
What small habit today would move me from a four
to a five? What effort can I respect myself for
even if no one else sees it. You don't have
(32:47):
to solve your entire identity at once. Just notice the
evidence that you're moving forward. That's how anxiety loosens its grip.
That's how authenticity grows, and that's how you stop wondering
half man and start becoming whole. Tune in next week
for our final episode of the season. I would love
(33:16):
to hear from you about your healing journey, your family,
and your feedback. Leave a review, send a DM, connect
with me on socials at Elliott Speaks, and you can
also send me a text message to nine seven two
four two six two six four zero. Family Therapy is
a production of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect Podcast Network.
Special Thanks to our assistant, Glendale Sepe. It's produced by
(33:38):
Jack Queech Thomas and the executive producer Dolly S. S Fisham.
For more podcasts from The Black Effect, visit the iHeartRadio
app or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. The
content presented on the Family Therapy Podcast serves solely for
educational and informational purposes. It should not be considered a
replacement for personalized medical or mental health guidance and does
not constitute a provider of patiently life. It is advisable
(34:01):
to consult with your healthcare provider or health team for
any specific concerns or questions you may have.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
M
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