May 31, 2025 • 47 mins
The Nation’s Jeet Heer examines Leonard Leo vs. Trump and the infighting ripping MAGA apart. Minnesota Lieutenant Governor Peggy Flanagan details her run for the Senate.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
today's best minds, and the US debt is on pace
to set a record high going all the way back
to seventeen ninety. We have such a great show for
you today, the nation's own git here stops by to
(00:22):
talk about one of the very few bright spots, Leonard
Leo versus Donald Trump. Then we'll talk to Minnesota Lieutenant
Governor Peggy Flanagan about her run for the Senate. But
first the news Somali.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
We got very very bleak news out of the Supreme Court.
Everybody's trying to say, like, oh, thank god, the courts
are saving us. Well, there's five hundred thousand immigrants that
the Court is not going to save from Cuba, Haiti,
Nicaragua and Venezuela.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Yeah, you know, it's important to remember then, while the
Supreme Court occasionally does something to prevent a complete bax
slide into authoritarianism, they are largely very much the most
conservative Supreme Court in probably fifty years. They overturned Roe v. Wade,
(01:11):
They empower corporations every day. These are not your fronts.
And in case you're wondering. A pretty great example of
that was this Supreme Court decision. Trump administration can now
end a program that gave temporary production to more than
half a million immigrants from Cuba, Haiti, Nicaragua, and Venezuela.
(01:35):
You'll remember we've talked about this a lot. This was
we became this country after the Holocaust, right, a country
that welcomed immigrants, that had a moral imperative to not
to be the people who turned around the boat to
go back to the desk camp. So what we are
(01:57):
now that country that does that. And I'm not surprised,
nor should any of us be, but it's just an absolutely,
it's just devastating and it's so sad, and people will
go back to their countries and be murdered and we
will have done it right, the GOP will have done it.
And you know this is Mega. Mega does not want
(02:20):
any moral compass when it comes to immigration. They just
don't want immigrants unless, of course they're from South Africa
and then they can come, but otherwise they cannot. So
here we are.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So Trump's very stupid, big cruel Bill are the big
Beautiful Bill as they like to call it, is also
has another nice thing hidden in it. It's going to
roll back the Affordable Care Act, which will hurt so
many different Americans for many years. When I had cancer
years ago, it's one of the only reasons I am
still alive. So this is very disheartening.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Yeah, I mean, the whole idea here, even though this
bill does in fact raise the deficit about three zero
point three trillion dollars, is that this bill, it tries
to run against Medicaid expansion. It tries to roll back
a lot of the expansion that happened under Biden, and
(03:15):
it does all sorts of like seemingly fraudulent things like
making it hard to stay on Medicaid, making it hard
to register for Medicaid, making it I mean, all of
these little bits, it's still not saving anyone any money, right,
I mean, this is like a rounding error. You know
what would work here is if you fucking raise taxes.
(03:38):
And in fact, I just want to pause for a
second and just go into my thoughts here. This is
I'm going to give you my thoughts. We have at
this moment an opportunity and it's funny Trump said he
wanted to do it. I actually don't believe he ever
wanted to do it, but I think he knew that
there was an appetite for it. And this idea of
a tax bracket from people make over two point five
(03:59):
million dollars a year, which is a ton of money. Right,
over two point five million dollars a year. That's a
ton of money, and there should be a tax backet
for those people. There is no reason that people that
we have people making people who have one hundred billion
dollars or you know, eighty billion dollars. It's just completely nonsensical,
(04:22):
you know. And also they need to fund the irs.
So again, there are a lot of Democrats who have
talked about this, I think pretty well, which is, you know,
Elon Musk, the richest man in the world, making sure
your grandmother doesn't get, you know, get sixty four dollars
instead of sixty five dollars. And that's what this comes
down to. We are niggling and diming the poorest Americans
(04:46):
children on SNAP benefits, right, I mean, just they're cutting SNAP,
they're cutting Medicaid, they're cutting they're just cutting all of
the stuff that people need, and they're doing it in
the service of tax cuts for very rich people. So
This is one of the yet another sort of scammy
thing that they're doing here.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yeah, speaking of scams, many people always talk about how
Trump is a product of our reality television. But now
what we're also seeing is he's a product of the
commercials that run between reality shows, which is saying that
he's caused great mental anguish in his lawsuit with CBS,
and he deserves much more money for his mental anguish.
(05:29):
Just like a silino in Barnes at.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Stop giving into Trump. It doesn't work. You know, you
have these law firms that made deals with Trump. Now
you have every person in the world things they can
get free pro bono from them. There was a great
piece I think it was in the New York Times
about veterans, Oh no, it was in the Wall Street Journal,
veterans who felt they had been hurt by anti Trump
(05:54):
forces trying to get these fancy lawyers to do pro
bono for them. I mean, this is just such a
insane You cannot negotiate with him, do not try to
make deals with him. So now, and he's also just
so grifty. So now he turned down a fifteen million
dollars settlement because he wants twenty five million dollars in
an apology. But what really Trump wants. I mean, look,
(06:16):
my man is grifty as how don't do this. It
doesn't work. Like if you pay out Donald Trump twenty
five million dollars, here's what's going to happen. He doesn't care.
It will encourage him to go after you more if
you don't do that and you fight him like Harvard
is the American people say, oh wow, this person is
(06:37):
not a bad person. This person is actually doing the
right thing. And so it's just this is so easy.
Don't do stuff like the Sherry Redstone thinks that by
doing this she'll get the murder through. But the truth
is what they should have done is they should have
just kept negotiating and kept pushing back and eventually Donald
Trump would have forgotten about it and moved on. Instead,
(06:59):
what they're doing, you know, or they could have fought
back more publicly and then it would have become a
big issue and either way they would have won in court. Instead,
what they're doing, and this is what happens when you
make a deal with Trump, is they now made a deal,
or they're trying to make a deal. They don't the
courts do not have their backs right, because they have
to say, you know, they're going to try to make
(07:20):
a deal with Trump, and then we all know what's
going to happen, which is Trump is going to change
his mind, which is what always happens. You can't trust him,
sooner or later he will recant the deal and change
the deal, and so stop doing this. This is ridiculous,
so annoying. It's also really really really bad for American democracy.
(07:40):
You know, what little we have left of really good
news institutions. CBS is just ruining itself for a merger
that you know, Trump still could end up stopping. And
it's just so disappointing. I'm so disappointed and everyone involved
in this really what what a as we say, A Shonda.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Yeah, So, as we discuss in the next segment on
this podcast, The New York Times has a report out
about Elon doing an amount of drugs that I've not
seen since my days in the record business working with
very famous drug addict artists.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
Ed.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
So Stephen Miller was asked about it, and he said,
the thing that we all know, we're worried about drugs
crossing the border, and they always look the other way
when it's a rich white guy doing it.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
It's so unbelievably bad. I mean, it's also this has
never been about any of the things they say it is.
You know, they say it's about fentanyl. It's not about fentanyl.
This is that, right, It's about preventing drugs. It's about this,
It's about that. It's not about any of this fucking stuff.
It's actually about the Trump administration trying to get what
(08:48):
they can get out of the country, to get what
they can get out of the government, to make money.
And I really, really, really think that there is no
world which it's good that you have somebody who has
got tons of different security clearances and that person is
(09:09):
also taking drugs. According to the New York Times, psychedelics.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Not just drugs, like drugs that really make you hallucinate
and not think in your right mind while you're around levers.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
That could do a lot of damage.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Yeah, Look for Stephen Miller, the answer is always racism.
It's always right. So what he's really saying.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
Real hammer and nail scenario, right.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
So what he's really saying is I just want to
use the drug stuff as a way to try to
go to war with Mexico. So the point is that
the worries about drugs, the calls are coming from in
the administration, and there we go. So look, and you know,
I mean, I think when you look back at Elon's behavior,
(09:58):
this is not a person who behaved in a rational way.
So you know from the chainsaw on stage, by the way,
he was holding the chainsaw wrong. It turns out I'm
not a chainsaw ficial, but yeah, he was holding it wrong.
I'm not. I know, you're shocked to hear that because
of all the time I spend chainsawing, But I actually
(10:20):
am not a chainsaw person. But yeah, I mean he
was holding the chain you know, they're just at every point.
And also you know all of the children, the many, many,
many children, you know.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Yeah, it brings us back to the days of the
White House prescription scandal being a kind of lighter, lighter thing.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yes, yes, well, and these are the people who were
so obsessed with Hunter Biden's laptop and drugs. All of
a sudden, those people are now defending Elon. Gee, here's
a contributor to the nation and the host of the
time of Monster. Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to fast politics. Get here.
(11:05):
Always good to be on the proneground. I don't know.
There was so much news this morning. I was like
in the car reading between I'm not driving because nobody
ever loves me drive because everybody's mean to me. But
I don't even know where to start, right? Do we
start with that Elon Musk New York Times he's got
bladder problems from ketamine. I mean, is that where we start?
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
Well, I mean I had a kind of like, I've
been actually thinking about writing about this for a while now,
and I guess this article gives me a good occasion too,
because the Trump administration is on drugs, not in a
good way. There's a kind of a lot of substance
of use. And it's kind of curious because, I mean,
the wrap on Trump was always like, well, his older
(11:50):
brother was an alcoholic. He wasn't like people who drink
and whatnot. And I don't know, he's sort of in
his yellow face because like it seems like you have
to have uh, the you know, like, hey, heck Xeth
serious alcoholic.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Who's the other one?
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Judge a judge, box of wine. Judge Judge Pirow.
Speaker 4 (12:09):
Yeah, exactly exactly. She said, you're normally like the human response,
you know, like very sympathetic. You know, they should be
doing it, but like, you know, should you be in
charge of the Pentagon while.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
You're working on these issues?
Speaker 4 (12:23):
I know, necessarily no, but it actually and I think
there's a couple of things going on here, which is,
I think that people mistakenly think of drugs as like
this hippie left wing thing, right, but in Silicon Valley,
like sort of performance enhancement, drugs have become a big thing,
(12:43):
like ketamine. Uh, And it's all a part of you know,
this kind of like culture of neoliberal competition and you
have to be one step ahead and you have to
you know, like and then also their faith and technology.
Do they think that these things will make to us
a brainiac's super rain that's faster than everyone everyone else?
And it actual has a long kind of history on
the right, going back to the nineteen fifties. Brian Doherty
(13:06):
has a great book on the radicals for Capitalism, on
the libertarian movement, and he basically shows in the fifties
or already, these businessmen who are like, you know, they
wanted to cut taxes, real hardcore republicans. But you know,
we're also doing a lot of experimentation with LSD and
other things. It's easily like it's part of this culture
of individualism. And also they think that they're superman.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Oh yeah, and I want to talk about this because
it's so interesting. Like Trump one point oh, you and
I both have been writing about this. Yeah forever, right,
I feel like we've fucking aged so much, you know,
Trump one point oh.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
I have to say, I'm only like like you as
you look like ten years younger than when I first
met you. I feel that there's a year like ver veritable,
dury and gray, that there's a painting in that closet
behind you that's rapidly agent. Yes, yeah, yeah, you're keeping
up your spirit of youth.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Oh, thank you with botox and fillers. But that's fine. Yes,
but Trump one point oh, grown ups in the room, Yes,
Stom but still a lot of damage. But but disdain
from from Silicon Valley Trump two point zero. Silicon Valley
decides we can buy this guy pretty cheap. Let's go.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
Yeah. No, that I think that's that is a large
part of the story. I think it's also that Trump
felt burned by both the loss of the election and
then some of the establishment blowback, and also the fact
that visually everyone that worked for his first administration with
a book saying this guy's a psychopath should be power.
So he decided, you know, like that it's the second
(14:47):
time around. You know, I'm not gonna go like listen
to Mitch McConnell as to who I should put in
the pensagon.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
I'm just gonna try.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Him, you know, like the whoever is like kisses my
ass the most and we'll like And also all these
hardcore ideologs who were radicalized along with Trump, who you know, like,
so it is it is a very and we reach
a point where, like, I mean, the other bit of
news which ties in with this is like Trump on
the Federalist Society ran the show. They were the ones
(15:15):
we're making all the judicial appointments, and now Trump is
finding that some of those judges are not as much
in his pockets. Yes they should be, yes, And so
he's just just like post about Leonard Leo saying, you know,
he's a sleezebag who hates America in his own way,
and you know, like this is like your cossack, let
them flight because Leonard Deal is one of the most
(15:35):
evil men in America.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
Yeah, yes, but not for the reasons.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
That Trump thinks.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Right. So this is the breaking news is that today
this this podcast will air tomorrow on Saturday, but we'll
still be talking about this because it's so stupid, and
I also want the record to show that we are
laughing to keep from crying. Personally, I am as upset
as I've ever been about the state of American It's terrible,
I mean, right, but Leonard Leo, I want to go
(16:02):
into this because Leonard leon really is incredibly responsible for
everything we're going through right now. Donald J. Trump, on
truth social a very mad We could read some of
the truth, but basically the net net of it is
he's very mad at Leonard Leo. We think this is
about the tariffs and the case that Leonard Leo's group
(16:24):
is bringing with the surviving Koch brother about where they're
going to take away tariff authority from Trump because Trump
is a mad king and he is really fucking up
the American economy.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Yeah, no, that's right, and I think there's a couple
of other issues as well, which yeah, please. Leonard Leo
also had helped appoint a lot of Trump judges from
the first term, and some of these judges are the
ones that are flitting against Trump. And so Trump does
feel this is a great portrayal because you know, he
appointed those judges with the idea that they give him
whatever he wants. But Leonard Leo to backtrack a little bit.
(16:58):
I mean, like obviously, you know, going back to Roe v.
Wade and the Warren Courts, the courts were a big
kind of center for the right wing that they thought
they had to take back the courts. And Leonard Leo
with the Federal Society was the guy that came up
with the strategy. And it came up with the strategy
partially because initially they had problems, like they would nominate
a Republicans would nominate someone like Sandra Day O'Connor or
(17:21):
justice suitor, and they would be conservative on some economic stuff,
but they would still uphold Roe v. Wade right, they
would not go that extra mile. So the Federal Society
was basically designed to make sure that this does not happen.
And what they did was they created a huge, you know,
like multimillion dollar industry within the legal system where they
(17:42):
would I call it the legal grooming project. Would they
would take these very impressionable young adults who were in
law school, and they would show them that if you
joined the Federal Society, you could suddenly get be an
intern at top law firms and at the Supreme Court,
(18:02):
and they would pick up people like the people that
they picked up were like, you know, Brett Cavanaugh, Amy Coney,
Barrett Gorshak and others at Clarence Thomas and hook them
up with this legal system and make sure that you
have these people who are like in the mafia, they're
made men and made women in the case of Colney Vera,
that they are you know, they'll be loyal to the
(18:22):
team more than the Constitution. He got to the point where,
like Leonard Leo was basically the one picking judges both
under Bush Junior and under Crump. And this all worked
out wonderfully for the Republicans that got you know, they
got Row overturned, they got you know, citizens United, a
lot of things. But now there's a kind of crisis
(18:43):
point with Trump because it's two different legal visions. Trump's
legal vision is I'm the king, right, This is like
mel Breson History of the World. It's good to be
the king. You get to do what you want. You know, Now,
the Federal Society they still have a very right wing position,
but it's this is a movement institution. Their thing is
we want our judges who are going to overturn any
(19:05):
laws that are social welfare, are going to overturn Biden's thing.
And so for them it's very important that the courts
be an independent power unit. And also that Trump doesn't
do like, you know, anything that goes against the free market,
like the tariffs, and so this has become a kind
of division point, so that you know, we now have
these two very bad factions.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
And you know when I read Trump's tr social post
saying that Leonard Leo is a sleeve bag, it was,
you know, you know, that great meme, you know, heartbreaking.
Worst person in the world makes a good fight, worst
person you know makes a good fight.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
So I think one of the central tensions of this
problem for Donald Trump is that Trump has two justices
who are in the tank for him, Thomas and Alito,
and anything he wants, Thomas and Alito will sign off
on the other three justice is it's more complicated, and
then you know, and then there's Roberts, who again often
(20:06):
will sign off with him, and Thomas and Alito are
very tight with Leonard Leo. Yes, in fact, there's all
of this reporting about Tom. You know, Thomas is basically
Alito has bought his house, he bought his mother's house,
He's made Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
Leo was the guy who set him up with what's
this guy named crow the right, Remember Harley Crowe bought Yeah,
he's the one who did the vocations and yeah, and
then literally also got a job for Ginny Thomas. He
got her a job which is kind of hidden the
financial sources up. So totally corrupt guy. And this is
(20:46):
actually going to be a kind of juncture point or
this is a possible division, and it's kind of complicated
for those of us, like you know, who are not
I mean, I just sort of taking let them fight attitude,
like the extend the judges are stopping Trump. That's all
to the good. But my colleague at the Nation, Elie Mastelle,
(21:06):
makes a kind of good point, which is that some
of the Trump's judges, just because they're so incompetent, are
actually like in the long term better because they'll make
like really bad decisions that other judges like higher up,
will overturn. Because whereas a Letyard Leo, I mean, these
are people who work within the system and know how
to maximize what they want out of the system.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Right. It's the difference between a Judge Amy Coney Barrett,
who is very smart but overturns Roby Wade very ideological.
Though I do think recusing herself from that decision with
the religious schools because it was Notre Dame involved, and
she was a law professor at Notre Dame. She is
(21:52):
very moral. Yeah, Like, I hard to imagine Alito and
Thomas recusing themselves.
Speaker 4 (21:58):
Oh they haven't, they haven't. The al there's the cases
where you know there are people who gave them money
are involved, and.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Then they're just like, yeah, So I do think she
but she is very smart and very ideological and and newly,
you know, you listen to her and you think, oh wow,
we're in a lot of trouble, whereas someone like Judge
A Lean Cannon, who I mean, she also has delivered
for Trump, but she's clearly not a high level thinker
(22:27):
the same one.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
No, No, yeah, well, I mean you should point that.
I want to reason I brought up because I think
it's a counterint point, but I think it's an interesting
one that Ellie knows the law as well as anyone
is that like actually in terms of like ultimately overturning
this stuff, like to have some of those crazy Trump judges,
(22:48):
even though they'll go along with them, like their stuff
is like so badly written and so badly thought that
it's going to force the Supreme Court and others to
overturn it. So it's an interesting kind of me's It's
a terrible dilemaivion, like like do you want to die
of like liver cancer or do you want to die
of throat cancer?
Speaker 1 (23:09):
I don't know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no no. And
I think that's a really good point. I also think
that as we are in this bizarre moment in American life,
well all our democratic institutions are really under attack. You know,
if we get through this thing, it will be a
lot of luck.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Well a lot of luck. But I mean, the other
point I would make about all the court staff is
like what is missing in all this equation is Congress, right, Like, yeah,
under the American constitution like checks and balances, Sure, the
courts are supposed to be there, but the courts actually
don't have a lot of power. And this notorious cases
where you have presidents like you know, Andrew Jackson has said, well,
(23:50):
the judges made their decision, let them enforce.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
It, right.
Speaker 4 (23:54):
But the institution that could actually like actually fight back
against the president is Congress. And there's like two things.
One is that the Republicans are totally on board with Trump,
even when they go against stuff that their donor class
wants and they themselves think, and so there's no checks
from the Republicans. And the Democrats, you know, like with
(24:17):
varying degrees, have taken a let's play dead strategy.
Speaker 5 (24:20):
Yeah, so so Congress is the missing equation, like yeah,
and then I'll catch you.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
Exactly because I swear about this. There's a real problem
now with threats to judges, right, like no problem. Yeah,
you saw the article where it's like dozens of judges
got these pizza deliveries and it's all under the name
of this the son of a judge who had been
killed by litigant and this is clearly a threat. It's
like it's a mafia thing. We know where you live,
(24:47):
right yea. And judges are very worried because they're getting
more and more threats, especially with like Trump saying like,
you know, impeach the judges get rid of the judges
and the inst titution that protects the federal judges. Below
the Supreme Court is the US Marshall, which is controlled
by the Attorney General, you know, like Pam Bondy by Trump.
(25:09):
So so so judges like now are pushing it to
they want Congress to like remove the US Marshal from
the control of the White House and to make an
independent police force. They don't think that like, you know,
the president that's threatening them is gonna should be running
the police force that protects them, right, Yeah, it's like
putting a mafia boss in charge of the cops.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Yeah yeah, so so.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
But again Congress is missing and I'll give Corey Booker
credit because he's the one he's actually introduced the bill
to do exactly that, to like you know, like beef
up security for judges and to make the US Marshals independent.
And I think more Democrats need to be on this,
and I think he's actually a winning issue, Like I
think that Americans want check and balances. They understand the
(25:51):
danger and you really have to be out there. Uh
as for further midterm saying, you know, you give us
the House, you give us the Senate, protect the judges.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Yeah, and you know, I want to I think that's
totally right. I also to think so many of our
problems that we are having right now are because Congress
refuse to regulate anything. I'm going to tell a very
annoying story. I'm at a book party. A member of
Congress is complaining about how there is no fact checking
(26:26):
on social media, and I have a fork and want
to stab my eye out because I'm like, oh, I
wonder who could have done? Like they don't you know,
you're going to fucking regulate stuff or the world is
going to get ruined. Like this is how it is. Right.
(26:48):
Republicans don't like regulation ideologically, Democrats don't like regulation because
it's they have to work.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Yeah. Well, I think in particularly of a silicon value,
the Democrats unfortunately helped create this monster because they have
ties with Silicon Valley. Yes, they still take a lot
of money, and so things like crypto and social media
don't get regulated. And it is exactly I mean, that
is the institution that has really failed, and it's a
big problem, and it has become you know, like, it's
(27:16):
not surprising that so many members of Congress are old
and ailing and yeah, I think if if you're an
ordinary Democrat, I think that the main institution you should
be looking at thinking about where you can affect change
is Congress. And you have to sure be like, you know,
bothering your congressmen going to those town hell beatings, and
if they're not, if they're caving it to Silicon Valley,
(27:38):
you have to like primary them. You have to like
replace them with Democrats who will fight. I mean, especially
like I think there's a lot of these people in
blue districts. It was like New York and California, where
you know you could easily if you primary them, you're
going to get another Democrat who could be a better
Democrat than the stronger Democrat. So so Congress is a
real battlefield here for like, if we're going to fix
this thing, that's where the battle has.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
I agree, And I also just think we need our
members of Congress to work. This is not you know, this,
this is their fucking jobs. And I get so angry
because I feel like the reason that Democrats are pulling
poorly is not because Republicans are doing great. It's because
(28:22):
Democrats are not doing enough, and that the people are
mad because they are, Like, your job is to take
care of us, to take care of those judges, to
do this fucking work. We don't care that you have
a book deal, We don't care that you have a podcast.
(28:42):
Nobody wants, you know. I mean, such a great example
of just wandering an opportunity to enact change, to you know,
do the stuff we need as Americans for us. And
I really do think these members of Congress have You know,
it's funny because I'm friends with this activist. He's an
(29:05):
activist among other things, and he has a whole theory
of the case that all members of Congress are just
incredibly selfish and obsessed with their own celebrity and unable,
you know, that they're just not in there for public service,
and we need to push our elected to be in
(29:27):
there for public service.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
Sorry, yeah, yeah, I mean I think there's some of that.
I mean there's other issues. There's also the money factor.
You know that they have to be raising money, and
and I think that we need to really move to
a small donor model. The larger issues that they find
it easier to sort of punt and to like just
leave everything to either the president or the courts. And
this is a real problem. I think if American democracy
(29:51):
is going to be saved, I strongly feel Congress more
than the President's He's the battleground and that's where you
actually have to fix things.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that's right.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
I think that's absolutely And we see that's the internal
battle of the Democratic Party where like any attempt to
reform to say, well, you know, some of these members
that are like ninety years old and dying, maybe they.
Speaker 4 (30:10):
Should reside like like that resistance.
Speaker 5 (30:14):
That's that's like, see, yeah, you know, when you raised
this stuff, you can attack like you're you're an ageist,
You're like, uh so I actually think that, like yeah,
I mean, but I also think that it's good that Democrats,
ordinary Democrats are mad at their own party and they're
mad at Congress.
Speaker 4 (30:29):
I think that's where that is the pivot point at
which things can get better.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Yeah. Get here, Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 4 (30:37):
Always great to be on the program.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Peggy flan Again is the Lieutenant governor of Minnesota and
a Democratic candidate for the Senate in Minnesota. Welcome Too
Fast Politics.
Speaker 7 (30:52):
Peggy, thank you so much for having me. I'm happy
to be here.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
I'm so happy to have you. We met each other
at the Democratic National Convention and I interviewed you there.
But because you are from the great sit of Minnesota,
you are the lieutenant governor. For my I feel like
he's my buddy, but I really feel like he's kind
of everybody's buddy. Tim Walls.
Speaker 7 (31:13):
Yes, absolutely, I get to spend a lot of time
talking about Tim Walls and how great he is. And
you know it's part of the gig as being lieutenant governor.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
But you, yourself, you have a really inspirational and important story.
So you know we have to do a Tim Walls
name check. But now tell me how you found yourself
in public service? Sure, so you know I didn't.
Speaker 7 (31:35):
I didn't expect to be in public service as a
as a kid, I wanted to be a ballerina nurse,
which is exactly you.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Know what any ballerina nurses are. Yes, a really popular
career path. Yes, yeah, popular group.
Speaker 7 (31:51):
But I spent my whole life, you know, growing up
in a family where you know, we felt like the
bottom could fall out at any moment, and I know
that there's a lot of.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
Folks who feel that way. Can you explain to us
why you felt like that? Absolutely?
Speaker 7 (32:07):
So I grew up with my mom, with a single
mom who was just amazing, and I grew up in
an apartment which we were able to move into because
of a Section eight housing voucher. The Childcare Assistance program
allowed my mom to go back to school and to
get her certificates in phlebotomy at Saint Kat's and helped
(32:29):
to lift our family into the middle class. But you know,
Medicaid was my healthcare as a kid who had really
severe asthma. It is how we paid the bills, how
we made sure that I had access to all the
medications that I needed, and sometimes it felt like I
was in the hospital more than I was out when
I was, you know, and coming up in elementary school.
(32:52):
And you know, finally snap or back in the day,
what we call the food stamps is what kept food
on our table for our family. Were really fortunate. These
public programs helped to support us.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
But also, you.
Speaker 7 (33:06):
Know, what we see happening right now, it certainly feels
really personal for myself, and I know it feels really
personal for folks all across the country. But I grew
up around women and strong women who just did the
damn thing. So you know, my aunties and my grandmas
who just led organizations and were you know, political organizers,
and so I just I saw that and never questioned
(33:29):
whether or not women were in leadership. But I spent
my college career studying child techology and American Indian studies.
I went into working for nonprofits and American Indian nonprofit
and saw firsthand how Native students and their families navigated
the public school system and it wasn't great and the
(33:50):
outcomes weren't great, and so I thought, you know, we
need to find somebody to run for the school board
and talk to a lot of folks, a lot of advocates,
a lot of leaders.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
In the community.
Speaker 7 (33:59):
And one day people turned around and they looked at
me and they said, why don't you do it? And
I was like, that's not what it meant, So be
careful what you asked for, I guess is the moral
of that story.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
But I did.
Speaker 7 (34:12):
I decided to run. I was twenty four, without any
kids in the district, but thought, you know, we need
to make sure that we have a voice at the
table and a diversity of voices. And so was elected
there and really enjoyed my time there, making sure that
community had a voice, and it learned an incredible just
(34:34):
an incredible amount of navigating these systems and how we
can make them more accessible for folks. And of course
at the same time was working in nonprofits for the
Council of Churches and then for a decade at Wellstone Action,
which is the nonprofit that grew out of the late
great Senator Paul Wellstone's campaign, which is incredible and where
I actually met Tim Walls, who at the time was
(34:57):
a teacher who this stream of running for Congress, and
you know, that then led me to be tapped by
Marian right Edelman, the head of the Children's Defense Fund,
to run Children's Defense Funds in Minnesota, where I got to,
you know, fight for family economic security and work to
move policies that were good for working families. And that
(35:18):
certainly just led to my time at the Minnesota Legislature,
and then was tapped to run with Tim Walls to
be his Lieutenant governor, always focusing on these issues of
family economic security, and so that is I think the
through line from when I was a kid, you know,
to now just knowing that there are so many folks
who are experiencing just a lot of fear and insecurity,
(35:41):
and it doesn't have to be that way, and we've
got got more work to do. So I'm excited to
try to big network that I've done throughout my entire
career to Washington.
Speaker 1 (35:51):
I wonder if you could talk about you grew up
somewhat on a rez, right.
Speaker 7 (35:56):
No, I did grow up on the res, but my
dad was on the res. I'm kind of the perfect
combination of my parents. So I'll say that. You know,
my mom, right out of high school, she went and
she volunteered on Hubert Humphreys presidential election in nineteen sixty eight.
And then my dad was absolutely a rabble rouser and protester,
(36:17):
and you know, he said, my girl, you know, I
want to burn the system down and you want to
change it from the inside out. We need both, and
I think you get you know, that combination, you get me.
I'm a member of the of Whieters, which is an
Ojibwe five in northern Minnesota. And my Ojibwe name is
ji Waved McQuay, which means speaks in a loud and
(36:38):
clear voice woman, you know, which I think is pretty
on the nose, which is all false. And I'm part
of a really strong urban native community here, we've got
in the Twin Cities have an incredible urban native community
as well.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
So you are running for Senate. Lieutenant governor is a
very different job than being a member of this at it,
but governorships and lieutenant governors say, you know, it's a
similar thing. It's all about the executive branch, right making
things happen, making things work. Why do you think and
(37:14):
this is something I spend a lot of time thinking about,
why do you think the Senate in Congress has so
much trouble actually like legislating and getting things done in
a way that governors and lieutenant governors do well.
Speaker 7 (37:27):
I think there's a difference between, you know, the executive
branch and the legislative branch and the judicial branch. And
by the way, I think having three full branches of
government is a really important thing, even if there's some
folks who don't share that philosophy right now, you know,
certainly our politics are are really polarized right now. But
as someone who served in the Minnesota Legislature, one of
(37:51):
my favorite things about being part of a body like
that is that you have to figure out ways to
work together, to work across lines of difference to see
where are those places and spaces where we you know,
might not agree on everything, but we can find that
one thing where we're able to move forward. You know,
when I was a Children's Defense Fund, you know, I
worked with Republicans and Democrats because it was absolutely needed
(38:14):
and necessary. And sometimes, you know, folks on my side
of the aisle might get a little crabby and would say,
why did you have a Republican author that bill? I said,
because they're in the majority, and in this moment, two
years in the life of a child is a really
long time to wait for the next biennium. We've got
to go and we've got to We've got to move
and do this work. I've been troubled, as I know,
(38:35):
there are so many folks who are just worried and
afraid about what is coming out of Washington, d C.
I mean, just recently have heard from Senator Joni Erntz
who was talking about Medicaid cuts and folks were asking
her about it and she said, you know, and they said,
you know, people are going to die, and she said, oh, well,
we're all we're all going to die someday, right.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
I know, that was incredible, you know, like, that's correct.
You know, someday we all walk on.
Speaker 7 (39:05):
We all go. But the reality is we shouldn't ever
have to think that our senators are trying to kill us,
right or that they are part of that process. So,
you know, the dysfunction in Washington. I think we need
more folks who are less Washington to be at the table,
which is one of the reasons why I'm running. And
(39:25):
things like Medicaid and making sure that we are doing
everything that we can to protect it is incredibly important
right now as I travel across the state of Minnesota
and talking to folks. You know, just the other day
was talking to a mom named Chris who's got a
nine year old kiddo named Bentley, who relies on Medicaid
for his healthcare and relies on access to special education
(39:47):
services right through the Department of Education. And she just
wants to be a good mom and wants to make
sure that all of that is there for her to
be able to care for her son. And so it's
not just nameless, faceless folks writer or numbers on a spreadsheet.
It's people like Bentley and you know, his his mom, Chris,
(40:08):
I think about you know, the prescription drugs. And in
this moment where I think Democrats especially like we are
fighting back, but I actually think we have to ask
for more and we have to tell people what it
is that we're for Congress negotiating the price of ten
prescription drugs right, lowering the costs for folks on Medicare.
(40:29):
That's great, But my question is why not all of them?
We should be asking for more and we don't get
what we don't fight for. And I think in this
moment that is the contrast and the opportunity for us
as Democrats or Medicare and you know, needing to make
sure that we're covering vision and hearing and dental, all
(40:50):
of the things that are critical to the overall you know,
health of folks. And while I'm on a role, I
guess I would also just say, you know, the pre
author rization of medical decisions, some person at a desk
deciding whether or not you're going to get the treatments
ever die, right, so live or die? It's outrageous. We
should demand more. And those are the things I think
(41:12):
that people expected us right now. It is all of
us against extremist billionaires. We don't have to agree on everything,
but that we can agree on, and we should be
doing everything possible to help people afford their lives.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
One of the things that we see is that voters
are really really mad at Democrats. Yeah even Democrats. Republicans
for sure, but democrats too. Why do you think they're
mad at Democrats? And what do you think a Democratic
party can do to win them back?
Speaker 7 (41:43):
I think one, we have to listen and we've got
to show up. We've been holding what we're calling kitchen
table conversations all across the state of Minnesota, and they
are last town hall and scripted questions and more big
facilitated conversation. I am most comfortable when we have flip
chart paper on the wall and post it notes and markers,
(42:03):
and so that is what these events are all about.
And we've got folks who are showing up, of course
who are Democrats, but also people who have said, you know,
I've never been to anything like this before, but I'm
really freaked out, and so I'm going to try to
do whatever it is that I can, and we say
come on in. And there have been a handful of
Republicans who've also come to these events who said, you know,
(42:25):
I didn't vote with you or I didn't vote for
your party, and rather than blame and shame folks and
get on our high horse, we said, come on in
right again, we can find common ground. But I think
right now Democrats and members of the Democrat Party again
have to say this is what we're fighting for. It
(42:46):
is not enough for us to be against Donald Trump,
which absolutely we are, and we should use every tool
in our toolbox to push back, but we also again
have to tell people what we're for. And we don't
have enough leaders in Washington who understand the struggles that
people are facing right now and in this moment. And
(43:06):
I think folks can see right through that, and that
is also part of the frustration that people have with
the Democratic Party. People need to know we're going to
show up for them and that we'll be on their side,
and that we are not going to just simply engage
in electoral strip mining right before the election, where we
show up to people's communities tell them how important we are,
(43:27):
like it's the you know, like the circus comes to
town and then we leave that we are doing the
work now, you know, for us here in Minnesota in
this campaign, of course, it is about you know, winning
the US Senate seats. Absolutely, But if we're doing it right,
it's about building lasting infrastructure for twenty eight and thirty
(43:49):
and thirty two, and it's about working in partnership this
summer and fall with our legislators and our legislative candidates
to make sure that they have, you know, organizers on
the ground that we are strengthening the work that they're
doing doing Apartment Knox, showing up for folks so that
you know, we are ready to go in twenty six
(44:10):
to win back the House, to build a bigger majority
in our state senates, and make sure that we can
continue to deliver on the things that we need to
deliver on, to make sure that people feel seen and
heard and value. That work should be happening all the time,
not just before the election. And I think that is
also something that people need to see from us. So ideally,
(44:31):
you know we are we're building that on our campaign,
but also this should be I think what democrats and
candidates and leaders are doing all across the country.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
Yeah, such a good point. Thank you, Thank you, Thank you,
Lieutenant Governor L. G. Plan Again, thanks so much for
having me.
Speaker 7 (44:48):
I appreciate you.
Speaker 3 (44:50):
They're all set on.
Speaker 2 (44:54):
Jesse Cannon, Mai Jung Fast So Senator Joni Ernst of
Iowa one of those town halls. And what we know
about town halls is there's a rule. They don't go
well for Republicans these days. Well, why don't we listen
real fast when we.
Speaker 8 (45:08):
Are talking about the corrections in this reconciliation bill. Again,
it's corrections of overpayments and people that have not been
eligible for these programs by law as it is currently written.
So when you are arguing, when you are arguing about
(45:28):
illegals that are receiving Medicaid.
Speaker 1 (45:31):
Benefits one point four.
Speaker 8 (45:33):
Million one point for they're not they are not eligible,
so they will be coming off.
Speaker 9 (45:41):
So people are not well.
Speaker 8 (45:45):
We all are going to die.
Speaker 9 (45:47):
So we in say the one in said spokes Okay, no,
but but what you don't want to do is listen
to me when I say that we are going.
Speaker 8 (46:00):
To focus on those that are most vulnerable, those that
made the eligible enow.
Speaker 1 (46:09):
Wow, wow, you know it's funny because I read reporting
about it but hadn't heard her.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
Her fellow Iowa Senator Chuck Grassley once talked about pulling
the plug on ground that seems like tripping over the
plug and not even caring that you did it.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
Well, I mean it's pretty great where she's She's like, well,
we're all gonna die. I mean, yes, but we don't
want our senators to kill us.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
Thank you, Sylvia Plath, Thank you.
Speaker 1 (46:35):
Johnny Ernst is up in twenty twenty six. Now she
is in Iowa, and Iowa is an R plus whatever
a gazillion state. But you know, this is the thing.
You don't have to have this person. You don't have
to have this person represent you, like you could have
someone a Republican even, who doesn't say things like that,
(46:58):
just like, we're all going to die day this callousness.
Voters are either going to be okay with this or
they're not right. This is all a question of who
you elect. But let me just say this is really
just so incredibly gross.
Speaker 3 (47:14):
Agreed.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in
every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best
minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If
you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend
and keep the conversation going. Thanks for listening.
Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
today's best minds, and the US debt is on pace
to set a record high going all the way back
to seventeen ninety. We have such a great show for
you today, the nation's own git here stops by to
(00:22):
talk about one of the very few bright spots, Leonard
Leo versus Donald Trump. Then we'll talk to Minnesota Lieutenant
Governor Peggy Flanagan about her run for the Senate. But
first the news Somali.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
We got very very bleak news out of the Supreme Court.
Everybody's trying to say, like, oh, thank god, the courts
are saving us. Well, there's five hundred thousand immigrants that
the Court is not going to save from Cuba, Haiti,
Nicaragua and Venezuela.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Yeah, you know, it's important to remember then, while the
Supreme Court occasionally does something to prevent a complete bax
slide into authoritarianism, they are largely very much the most
conservative Supreme Court in probably fifty years. They overturned Roe v. Wade,
(01:11):
They empower corporations every day. These are not your fronts.
And in case you're wondering. A pretty great example of
that was this Supreme Court decision. Trump administration can now
end a program that gave temporary production to more than
half a million immigrants from Cuba, Haiti, Nicaragua, and Venezuela.
(01:35):
You'll remember we've talked about this a lot. This was
we became this country after the Holocaust, right, a country
that welcomed immigrants, that had a moral imperative to not
to be the people who turned around the boat to
go back to the desk camp. So what we are
(01:57):
now that country that does that. And I'm not surprised,
nor should any of us be, but it's just an absolutely,
it's just devastating and it's so sad, and people will
go back to their countries and be murdered and we
will have done it right, the GOP will have done it.
And you know this is Mega. Mega does not want
(02:20):
any moral compass when it comes to immigration. They just
don't want immigrants unless, of course they're from South Africa
and then they can come, but otherwise they cannot. So
here we are.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
So Trump's very stupid, big cruel Bill are the big
Beautiful Bill as they like to call it, is also
has another nice thing hidden in it. It's going to
roll back the Affordable Care Act, which will hurt so
many different Americans for many years. When I had cancer
years ago, it's one of the only reasons I am
still alive. So this is very disheartening.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Yeah, I mean, the whole idea here, even though this
bill does in fact raise the deficit about three zero
point three trillion dollars, is that this bill, it tries
to run against Medicaid expansion. It tries to roll back
a lot of the expansion that happened under Biden, and
(03:15):
it does all sorts of like seemingly fraudulent things like
making it hard to stay on Medicaid, making it hard
to register for Medicaid, making it I mean, all of
these little bits, it's still not saving anyone any money, right,
I mean, this is like a rounding error. You know
what would work here is if you fucking raise taxes.
(03:38):
And in fact, I just want to pause for a
second and just go into my thoughts here. This is
I'm going to give you my thoughts. We have at
this moment an opportunity and it's funny Trump said he
wanted to do it. I actually don't believe he ever
wanted to do it, but I think he knew that
there was an appetite for it. And this idea of
a tax bracket from people make over two point five
(03:59):
million dollars a year, which is a ton of money. Right,
over two point five million dollars a year. That's a
ton of money, and there should be a tax backet
for those people. There is no reason that people that
we have people making people who have one hundred billion
dollars or you know, eighty billion dollars. It's just completely nonsensical,
(04:22):
you know. And also they need to fund the irs.
So again, there are a lot of Democrats who have
talked about this, I think pretty well, which is, you know,
Elon Musk, the richest man in the world, making sure
your grandmother doesn't get, you know, get sixty four dollars
instead of sixty five dollars. And that's what this comes
down to. We are niggling and diming the poorest Americans
(04:46):
children on SNAP benefits, right, I mean, just they're cutting SNAP,
they're cutting Medicaid, they're cutting they're just cutting all of
the stuff that people need, and they're doing it in
the service of tax cuts for very rich people. So
This is one of the yet another sort of scammy
thing that they're doing here.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yeah, speaking of scams, many people always talk about how
Trump is a product of our reality television. But now
what we're also seeing is he's a product of the
commercials that run between reality shows, which is saying that
he's caused great mental anguish in his lawsuit with CBS,
and he deserves much more money for his mental anguish.
(05:29):
Just like a silino in Barnes at.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Stop giving into Trump. It doesn't work. You know, you
have these law firms that made deals with Trump. Now
you have every person in the world things they can
get free pro bono from them. There was a great
piece I think it was in the New York Times
about veterans, Oh no, it was in the Wall Street Journal,
veterans who felt they had been hurt by anti Trump
(05:54):
forces trying to get these fancy lawyers to do pro
bono for them. I mean, this is just such a
insane You cannot negotiate with him, do not try to
make deals with him. So now, and he's also just
so grifty. So now he turned down a fifteen million
dollars settlement because he wants twenty five million dollars in
an apology. But what really Trump wants. I mean, look,
(06:16):
my man is grifty as how don't do this. It
doesn't work. Like if you pay out Donald Trump twenty
five million dollars, here's what's going to happen. He doesn't care.
It will encourage him to go after you more if
you don't do that and you fight him like Harvard
is the American people say, oh wow, this person is
(06:37):
not a bad person. This person is actually doing the
right thing. And so it's just this is so easy.
Don't do stuff like the Sherry Redstone thinks that by
doing this she'll get the murder through. But the truth
is what they should have done is they should have
just kept negotiating and kept pushing back and eventually Donald
Trump would have forgotten about it and moved on. Instead,
(06:59):
what they're doing, you know, or they could have fought
back more publicly and then it would have become a
big issue and either way they would have won in court. Instead,
what they're doing, and this is what happens when you
make a deal with Trump, is they now made a deal,
or they're trying to make a deal. They don't the
courts do not have their backs right, because they have
to say, you know, they're going to try to make
(07:20):
a deal with Trump, and then we all know what's
going to happen, which is Trump is going to change
his mind, which is what always happens. You can't trust him,
sooner or later he will recant the deal and change
the deal, and so stop doing this. This is ridiculous,
so annoying. It's also really really really bad for American democracy.
(07:40):
You know, what little we have left of really good
news institutions. CBS is just ruining itself for a merger
that you know, Trump still could end up stopping. And
it's just so disappointing. I'm so disappointed and everyone involved
in this really what what a as we say, A Shonda.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Yeah, So, as we discuss in the next segment on
this podcast, The New York Times has a report out
about Elon doing an amount of drugs that I've not
seen since my days in the record business working with
very famous drug addict artists.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
Ed.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
So Stephen Miller was asked about it, and he said,
the thing that we all know, we're worried about drugs
crossing the border, and they always look the other way
when it's a rich white guy doing it.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
It's so unbelievably bad. I mean, it's also this has
never been about any of the things they say it is.
You know, they say it's about fentanyl. It's not about fentanyl.
This is that, right, It's about preventing drugs. It's about this,
It's about that. It's not about any of this fucking stuff.
It's actually about the Trump administration trying to get what
(08:48):
they can get out of the country, to get what
they can get out of the government, to make money.
And I really, really, really think that there is no
world which it's good that you have somebody who has
got tons of different security clearances and that person is
(09:09):
also taking drugs. According to the New York Times, psychedelics.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Not just drugs, like drugs that really make you hallucinate
and not think in your right mind while you're around levers.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
That could do a lot of damage.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Yeah, Look for Stephen Miller, the answer is always racism.
It's always right. So what he's really saying.
Speaker 3 (09:32):
Real hammer and nail scenario, right.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
So what he's really saying is I just want to
use the drug stuff as a way to try to
go to war with Mexico. So the point is that
the worries about drugs, the calls are coming from in
the administration, and there we go. So look, and you know,
I mean, I think when you look back at Elon's behavior,
(09:58):
this is not a person who behaved in a rational way.
So you know from the chainsaw on stage, by the way,
he was holding the chainsaw wrong. It turns out I'm
not a chainsaw ficial, but yeah, he was holding it wrong.
I'm not. I know, you're shocked to hear that because
of all the time I spend chainsawing, But I actually
(10:20):
am not a chainsaw person. But yeah, I mean he
was holding the chain you know, they're just at every point.
And also you know all of the children, the many, many,
many children, you know.
Speaker 2 (10:32):
Yeah, it brings us back to the days of the
White House prescription scandal being a kind of lighter, lighter thing.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
Yes, yes, well, and these are the people who were
so obsessed with Hunter Biden's laptop and drugs. All of
a sudden, those people are now defending Elon. Gee, here's
a contributor to the nation and the host of the
time of Monster. Welcome, Welcome, Welcome to fast politics. Get here.
(11:05):
Always good to be on the proneground. I don't know.
There was so much news this morning. I was like
in the car reading between I'm not driving because nobody
ever loves me drive because everybody's mean to me. But
I don't even know where to start, right? Do we
start with that Elon Musk New York Times he's got
bladder problems from ketamine. I mean, is that where we start?
Speaker 3 (11:27):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (11:27):
Well, I mean I had a kind of like, I've
been actually thinking about writing about this for a while now,
and I guess this article gives me a good occasion too,
because the Trump administration is on drugs, not in a
good way. There's a kind of a lot of substance
of use. And it's kind of curious because, I mean,
the wrap on Trump was always like, well, his older
(11:50):
brother was an alcoholic. He wasn't like people who drink
and whatnot. And I don't know, he's sort of in
his yellow face because like it seems like you have
to have uh, the you know, like, hey, heck Xeth
serious alcoholic.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Who's the other one?
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Judge a judge, box of wine. Judge Judge Pirow.
Speaker 4 (12:09):
Yeah, exactly exactly. She said, you're normally like the human response,
you know, like very sympathetic. You know, they should be
doing it, but like, you know, should you be in
charge of the Pentagon while.
Speaker 1 (12:21):
You're working on these issues?
Speaker 4 (12:23):
I know, necessarily no, but it actually and I think
there's a couple of things going on here, which is,
I think that people mistakenly think of drugs as like
this hippie left wing thing, right, but in Silicon Valley,
like sort of performance enhancement, drugs have become a big thing,
(12:43):
like ketamine. Uh, And it's all a part of you know,
this kind of like culture of neoliberal competition and you
have to be one step ahead and you have to
you know, like and then also their faith and technology.
Do they think that these things will make to us
a brainiac's super rain that's faster than everyone everyone else?
And it actual has a long kind of history on
the right, going back to the nineteen fifties. Brian Doherty
(13:06):
has a great book on the radicals for Capitalism, on
the libertarian movement, and he basically shows in the fifties
or already, these businessmen who are like, you know, they
wanted to cut taxes, real hardcore republicans. But you know,
we're also doing a lot of experimentation with LSD and
other things. It's easily like it's part of this culture
of individualism. And also they think that they're superman.
Speaker 1 (13:27):
Oh yeah, and I want to talk about this because
it's so interesting. Like Trump one point oh, you and
I both have been writing about this. Yeah forever, right,
I feel like we've fucking aged so much, you know,
Trump one point oh.
Speaker 4 (13:43):
I have to say, I'm only like like you as
you look like ten years younger than when I first
met you. I feel that there's a year like ver veritable,
dury and gray, that there's a painting in that closet
behind you that's rapidly agent. Yes, yeah, yeah, you're keeping
up your spirit of youth.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Oh, thank you with botox and fillers. But that's fine. Yes,
but Trump one point oh, grown ups in the room, Yes,
Stom but still a lot of damage. But but disdain
from from Silicon Valley Trump two point zero. Silicon Valley
decides we can buy this guy pretty cheap. Let's go.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
Yeah. No, that I think that's that is a large
part of the story. I think it's also that Trump
felt burned by both the loss of the election and
then some of the establishment blowback, and also the fact
that visually everyone that worked for his first administration with
a book saying this guy's a psychopath should be power.
So he decided, you know, like that it's the second
(14:47):
time around. You know, I'm not gonna go like listen
to Mitch McConnell as to who I should put in
the pensagon.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
I'm just gonna try.
Speaker 4 (14:54):
Him, you know, like the whoever is like kisses my
ass the most and we'll like And also all these
hardcore ideologs who were radicalized along with Trump, who you know, like,
so it is it is a very and we reach
a point where, like, I mean, the other bit of
news which ties in with this is like Trump on
the Federalist Society ran the show. They were the ones
(15:15):
we're making all the judicial appointments, and now Trump is
finding that some of those judges are not as much
in his pockets. Yes they should be, yes, And so
he's just just like post about Leonard Leo saying, you know,
he's a sleezebag who hates America in his own way,
and you know, like this is like your cossack, let
them flight because Leonard Deal is one of the most
(15:35):
evil men in America.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
Yeah, yes, but not for the reasons.
Speaker 3 (15:40):
That Trump thinks.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Right. So this is the breaking news is that today
this this podcast will air tomorrow on Saturday, but we'll
still be talking about this because it's so stupid, and
I also want the record to show that we are
laughing to keep from crying. Personally, I am as upset
as I've ever been about the state of American It's terrible,
I mean, right, but Leonard Leo, I want to go
(16:02):
into this because Leonard leon really is incredibly responsible for
everything we're going through right now. Donald J. Trump, on
truth social a very mad We could read some of
the truth, but basically the net net of it is
he's very mad at Leonard Leo. We think this is
about the tariffs and the case that Leonard Leo's group
(16:24):
is bringing with the surviving Koch brother about where they're
going to take away tariff authority from Trump because Trump
is a mad king and he is really fucking up
the American economy.
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Yeah, no, that's right, and I think there's a couple
of other issues as well, which yeah, please. Leonard Leo
also had helped appoint a lot of Trump judges from
the first term, and some of these judges are the
ones that are flitting against Trump. And so Trump does
feel this is a great portrayal because you know, he
appointed those judges with the idea that they give him
whatever he wants. But Leonard Leo to backtrack a little bit.
(16:58):
I mean, like obviously, you know, going back to Roe v.
Wade and the Warren Courts, the courts were a big
kind of center for the right wing that they thought
they had to take back the courts. And Leonard Leo
with the Federal Society was the guy that came up
with the strategy. And it came up with the strategy
partially because initially they had problems, like they would nominate
a Republicans would nominate someone like Sandra Day O'Connor or
(17:21):
justice suitor, and they would be conservative on some economic stuff,
but they would still uphold Roe v. Wade right, they
would not go that extra mile. So the Federal Society
was basically designed to make sure that this does not happen.
And what they did was they created a huge, you know,
like multimillion dollar industry within the legal system where they
(17:42):
would I call it the legal grooming project. Would they
would take these very impressionable young adults who were in
law school, and they would show them that if you
joined the Federal Society, you could suddenly get be an
intern at top law firms and at the Supreme Court,
(18:02):
and they would pick up people like the people that
they picked up were like, you know, Brett Cavanaugh, Amy Coney,
Barrett Gorshak and others at Clarence Thomas and hook them
up with this legal system and make sure that you
have these people who are like in the mafia, they're
made men and made women in the case of Colney Vera,
that they are you know, they'll be loyal to the
(18:22):
team more than the Constitution. He got to the point where,
like Leonard Leo was basically the one picking judges both
under Bush Junior and under Crump. And this all worked
out wonderfully for the Republicans that got you know, they
got Row overturned, they got you know, citizens United, a
lot of things. But now there's a kind of crisis
(18:43):
point with Trump because it's two different legal visions. Trump's
legal vision is I'm the king, right, This is like
mel Breson History of the World. It's good to be
the king. You get to do what you want. You know, Now,
the Federal Society they still have a very right wing position,
but it's this is a movement institution. Their thing is
we want our judges who are going to overturn any
(19:05):
laws that are social welfare, are going to overturn Biden's thing.
And so for them it's very important that the courts
be an independent power unit. And also that Trump doesn't
do like, you know, anything that goes against the free market,
like the tariffs, and so this has become a kind
of division point, so that you know, we now have
these two very bad factions.
Speaker 1 (19:28):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (19:28):
And you know when I read Trump's tr social post
saying that Leonard Leo is a sleeve bag, it was,
you know, you know, that great meme, you know, heartbreaking.
Worst person in the world makes a good fight, worst
person you know makes a good fight.
Speaker 1 (19:43):
So I think one of the central tensions of this
problem for Donald Trump is that Trump has two justices
who are in the tank for him, Thomas and Alito,
and anything he wants, Thomas and Alito will sign off
on the other three justice is it's more complicated, and
then you know, and then there's Roberts, who again often
(20:06):
will sign off with him, and Thomas and Alito are
very tight with Leonard Leo. Yes, in fact, there's all
of this reporting about Tom. You know, Thomas is basically
Alito has bought his house, he bought his mother's house,
He's made Yeah.
Speaker 4 (20:24):
Leo was the guy who set him up with what's
this guy named crow the right, Remember Harley Crowe bought Yeah,
he's the one who did the vocations and yeah, and
then literally also got a job for Ginny Thomas. He
got her a job which is kind of hidden the
financial sources up. So totally corrupt guy. And this is
(20:46):
actually going to be a kind of juncture point or
this is a possible division, and it's kind of complicated
for those of us, like you know, who are not
I mean, I just sort of taking let them fight attitude,
like the extend the judges are stopping Trump. That's all
to the good. But my colleague at the Nation, Elie Mastelle,
(21:06):
makes a kind of good point, which is that some
of the Trump's judges, just because they're so incompetent, are
actually like in the long term better because they'll make
like really bad decisions that other judges like higher up,
will overturn. Because whereas a Letyard Leo, I mean, these
are people who work within the system and know how
to maximize what they want out of the system.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Right. It's the difference between a Judge Amy Coney Barrett,
who is very smart but overturns Roby Wade very ideological.
Though I do think recusing herself from that decision with
the religious schools because it was Notre Dame involved, and
she was a law professor at Notre Dame. She is
(21:52):
very moral. Yeah, Like, I hard to imagine Alito and
Thomas recusing themselves.
Speaker 4 (21:58):
Oh they haven't, they haven't. The al there's the cases
where you know there are people who gave them money
are involved, and.
Speaker 1 (22:04):
Then they're just like, yeah, So I do think she
but she is very smart and very ideological and and newly,
you know, you listen to her and you think, oh wow,
we're in a lot of trouble, whereas someone like Judge
A Lean Cannon, who I mean, she also has delivered
for Trump, but she's clearly not a high level thinker
(22:27):
the same one.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
No, No, yeah, well, I mean you should point that.
I want to reason I brought up because I think
it's a counterint point, but I think it's an interesting
one that Ellie knows the law as well as anyone
is that like actually in terms of like ultimately overturning
this stuff, like to have some of those crazy Trump judges,
(22:48):
even though they'll go along with them, like their stuff
is like so badly written and so badly thought that
it's going to force the Supreme Court and others to
overturn it. So it's an interesting kind of me's It's
a terrible dilemaivion, like like do you want to die
of like liver cancer or do you want to die
of throat cancer?
Speaker 1 (23:09):
I don't know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no no. And
I think that's a really good point. I also think
that as we are in this bizarre moment in American life,
well all our democratic institutions are really under attack. You know,
if we get through this thing, it will be a
lot of luck.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Well a lot of luck. But I mean, the other
point I would make about all the court staff is
like what is missing in all this equation is Congress, right, Like, yeah,
under the American constitution like checks and balances, Sure, the
courts are supposed to be there, but the courts actually
don't have a lot of power. And this notorious cases
where you have presidents like you know, Andrew Jackson has said, well,
(23:50):
the judges made their decision, let them enforce.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
It, right.
Speaker 4 (23:54):
But the institution that could actually like actually fight back
against the president is Congress. And there's like two things.
One is that the Republicans are totally on board with Trump,
even when they go against stuff that their donor class
wants and they themselves think, and so there's no checks
from the Republicans. And the Democrats, you know, like with
(24:17):
varying degrees, have taken a let's play dead strategy.
Speaker 5 (24:20):
Yeah, so so Congress is the missing equation, like yeah,
and then I'll catch you.
Speaker 4 (24:26):
Exactly because I swear about this. There's a real problem
now with threats to judges, right, like no problem. Yeah,
you saw the article where it's like dozens of judges
got these pizza deliveries and it's all under the name
of this the son of a judge who had been
killed by litigant and this is clearly a threat. It's
like it's a mafia thing. We know where you live,
(24:47):
right yea. And judges are very worried because they're getting
more and more threats, especially with like Trump saying like,
you know, impeach the judges get rid of the judges
and the inst titution that protects the federal judges. Below
the Supreme Court is the US Marshall, which is controlled
by the Attorney General, you know, like Pam Bondy by Trump.
(25:09):
So so so judges like now are pushing it to
they want Congress to like remove the US Marshal from
the control of the White House and to make an
independent police force. They don't think that like, you know,
the president that's threatening them is gonna should be running
the police force that protects them, right, Yeah, it's like
putting a mafia boss in charge of the cops.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Yeah yeah, so so.
Speaker 4 (25:30):
But again Congress is missing and I'll give Corey Booker
credit because he's the one he's actually introduced the bill
to do exactly that, to like you know, like beef
up security for judges and to make the US Marshals independent.
And I think more Democrats need to be on this,
and I think he's actually a winning issue, Like I
think that Americans want check and balances. They understand the
(25:51):
danger and you really have to be out there. Uh
as for further midterm saying, you know, you give us
the House, you give us the Senate, protect the judges.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Yeah, and you know, I want to I think that's
totally right. I also to think so many of our
problems that we are having right now are because Congress
refuse to regulate anything. I'm going to tell a very
annoying story. I'm at a book party. A member of
Congress is complaining about how there is no fact checking
(26:26):
on social media, and I have a fork and want
to stab my eye out because I'm like, oh, I
wonder who could have done? Like they don't you know,
you're going to fucking regulate stuff or the world is
going to get ruined. Like this is how it is. Right.
(26:48):
Republicans don't like regulation ideologically, Democrats don't like regulation because
it's they have to work.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Yeah. Well, I think in particularly of a silicon value,
the Democrats unfortunately helped create this monster because they have
ties with Silicon Valley. Yes, they still take a lot
of money, and so things like crypto and social media
don't get regulated. And it is exactly I mean, that
is the institution that has really failed, and it's a
big problem, and it has become you know, like, it's
(27:16):
not surprising that so many members of Congress are old
and ailing and yeah, I think if if you're an
ordinary Democrat, I think that the main institution you should
be looking at thinking about where you can affect change
is Congress. And you have to sure be like, you know,
bothering your congressmen going to those town hell beatings, and
if they're not, if they're caving it to Silicon Valley,
(27:38):
you have to like primary them. You have to like
replace them with Democrats who will fight. I mean, especially
like I think there's a lot of these people in
blue districts. It was like New York and California, where
you know you could easily if you primary them, you're
going to get another Democrat who could be a better
Democrat than the stronger Democrat. So so Congress is a
real battlefield here for like, if we're going to fix
this thing, that's where the battle has.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
I agree, And I also just think we need our
members of Congress to work. This is not you know, this,
this is their fucking jobs. And I get so angry
because I feel like the reason that Democrats are pulling
poorly is not because Republicans are doing great. It's because
(28:22):
Democrats are not doing enough, and that the people are
mad because they are, Like, your job is to take
care of us, to take care of those judges, to
do this fucking work. We don't care that you have
a book deal, We don't care that you have a podcast.
(28:42):
Nobody wants, you know. I mean, such a great example
of just wandering an opportunity to enact change, to you know,
do the stuff we need as Americans for us. And
I really do think these members of Congress have You know,
it's funny because I'm friends with this activist. He's an
(29:05):
activist among other things, and he has a whole theory
of the case that all members of Congress are just
incredibly selfish and obsessed with their own celebrity and unable,
you know, that they're just not in there for public service,
and we need to push our elected to be in
(29:27):
there for public service.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
Sorry, yeah, yeah, I mean I think there's some of that.
I mean there's other issues. There's also the money factor.
You know that they have to be raising money, and
and I think that we need to really move to
a small donor model. The larger issues that they find
it easier to sort of punt and to like just
leave everything to either the president or the courts. And
this is a real problem. I think if American democracy
(29:51):
is going to be saved, I strongly feel Congress more
than the President's He's the battleground and that's where you
actually have to fix things.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that's right.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
I think that's absolutely And we see that's the internal
battle of the Democratic Party where like any attempt to
reform to say, well, you know, some of these members
that are like ninety years old and dying, maybe they.
Speaker 4 (30:10):
Should reside like like that resistance.
Speaker 5 (30:14):
That's that's like, see, yeah, you know, when you raised
this stuff, you can attack like you're you're an ageist,
You're like, uh so I actually think that, like yeah,
I mean, but I also think that it's good that Democrats,
ordinary Democrats are mad at their own party and they're
mad at Congress.
Speaker 4 (30:29):
I think that's where that is the pivot point at
which things can get better.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Yeah. Get here, Thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 4 (30:37):
Always great to be on the program.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Peggy flan Again is the Lieutenant governor of Minnesota and
a Democratic candidate for the Senate in Minnesota. Welcome Too
Fast Politics.
Speaker 7 (30:52):
Peggy, thank you so much for having me. I'm happy
to be here.
Speaker 1 (30:55):
I'm so happy to have you. We met each other
at the Democratic National Convention and I interviewed you there.
But because you are from the great sit of Minnesota,
you are the lieutenant governor. For my I feel like
he's my buddy, but I really feel like he's kind
of everybody's buddy. Tim Walls.
Speaker 7 (31:13):
Yes, absolutely, I get to spend a lot of time
talking about Tim Walls and how great he is. And
you know it's part of the gig as being lieutenant governor.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
But you, yourself, you have a really inspirational and important story.
So you know we have to do a Tim Walls
name check. But now tell me how you found yourself
in public service? Sure, so you know I didn't.
Speaker 7 (31:35):
I didn't expect to be in public service as a
as a kid, I wanted to be a ballerina nurse,
which is exactly you.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Know what any ballerina nurses are. Yes, a really popular
career path. Yes, yeah, popular group.
Speaker 7 (31:51):
But I spent my whole life, you know, growing up
in a family where you know, we felt like the
bottom could fall out at any moment, and I know
that there's a lot of.
Speaker 1 (32:02):
Folks who feel that way. Can you explain to us
why you felt like that? Absolutely?
Speaker 7 (32:07):
So I grew up with my mom, with a single
mom who was just amazing, and I grew up in
an apartment which we were able to move into because
of a Section eight housing voucher. The Childcare Assistance program
allowed my mom to go back to school and to
get her certificates in phlebotomy at Saint Kat's and helped
(32:29):
to lift our family into the middle class. But you know,
Medicaid was my healthcare as a kid who had really
severe asthma. It is how we paid the bills, how
we made sure that I had access to all the
medications that I needed, and sometimes it felt like I
was in the hospital more than I was out when
I was, you know, and coming up in elementary school.
(32:52):
And you know, finally snap or back in the day,
what we call the food stamps is what kept food
on our table for our family. Were really fortunate. These
public programs helped to support us.
Speaker 1 (33:05):
But also, you.
Speaker 7 (33:06):
Know, what we see happening right now, it certainly feels
really personal for myself, and I know it feels really
personal for folks all across the country. But I grew
up around women and strong women who just did the
damn thing. So you know, my aunties and my grandmas
who just led organizations and were you know, political organizers,
and so I just I saw that and never questioned
(33:29):
whether or not women were in leadership. But I spent
my college career studying child techology and American Indian studies.
I went into working for nonprofits and American Indian nonprofit
and saw firsthand how Native students and their families navigated
the public school system and it wasn't great and the
(33:50):
outcomes weren't great, and so I thought, you know, we
need to find somebody to run for the school board
and talk to a lot of folks, a lot of advocates,
a lot of leaders.
Speaker 1 (33:59):
In the community.
Speaker 7 (33:59):
And one day people turned around and they looked at
me and they said, why don't you do it? And
I was like, that's not what it meant, So be
careful what you asked for, I guess is the moral
of that story.
Speaker 1 (34:11):
But I did.
Speaker 7 (34:12):
I decided to run. I was twenty four, without any
kids in the district, but thought, you know, we need
to make sure that we have a voice at the
table and a diversity of voices. And so was elected
there and really enjoyed my time there, making sure that
community had a voice, and it learned an incredible just
(34:34):
an incredible amount of navigating these systems and how we
can make them more accessible for folks. And of course
at the same time was working in nonprofits for the
Council of Churches and then for a decade at Wellstone Action,
which is the nonprofit that grew out of the late
great Senator Paul Wellstone's campaign, which is incredible and where
I actually met Tim Walls, who at the time was
(34:57):
a teacher who this stream of running for Congress, and
you know, that then led me to be tapped by
Marian right Edelman, the head of the Children's Defense Fund,
to run Children's Defense Funds in Minnesota, where I got to,
you know, fight for family economic security and work to
move policies that were good for working families. And that
(35:18):
certainly just led to my time at the Minnesota Legislature,
and then was tapped to run with Tim Walls to
be his Lieutenant governor, always focusing on these issues of
family economic security, and so that is I think the
through line from when I was a kid, you know,
to now just knowing that there are so many folks
who are experiencing just a lot of fear and insecurity,
(35:41):
and it doesn't have to be that way, and we've
got got more work to do. So I'm excited to
try to big network that I've done throughout my entire
career to Washington.
Speaker 1 (35:51):
I wonder if you could talk about you grew up
somewhat on a rez, right.
Speaker 7 (35:56):
No, I did grow up on the res, but my
dad was on the res. I'm kind of the perfect
combination of my parents. So I'll say that. You know,
my mom, right out of high school, she went and
she volunteered on Hubert Humphreys presidential election in nineteen sixty eight.
And then my dad was absolutely a rabble rouser and protester,
(36:17):
and you know, he said, my girl, you know, I
want to burn the system down and you want to
change it from the inside out. We need both, and
I think you get you know, that combination, you get me.
I'm a member of the of Whieters, which is an
Ojibwe five in northern Minnesota. And my Ojibwe name is
ji Waved McQuay, which means speaks in a loud and
(36:38):
clear voice woman, you know, which I think is pretty
on the nose, which is all false. And I'm part
of a really strong urban native community here, we've got
in the Twin Cities have an incredible urban native community
as well.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
So you are running for Senate. Lieutenant governor is a
very different job than being a member of this at it,
but governorships and lieutenant governors say, you know, it's a
similar thing. It's all about the executive branch, right making
things happen, making things work. Why do you think and
(37:14):
this is something I spend a lot of time thinking about,
why do you think the Senate in Congress has so
much trouble actually like legislating and getting things done in
a way that governors and lieutenant governors do well.
Speaker 7 (37:27):
I think there's a difference between, you know, the executive
branch and the legislative branch and the judicial branch. And
by the way, I think having three full branches of
government is a really important thing, even if there's some
folks who don't share that philosophy right now, you know,
certainly our politics are are really polarized right now. But
as someone who served in the Minnesota Legislature, one of
(37:51):
my favorite things about being part of a body like
that is that you have to figure out ways to
work together, to work across lines of difference to see
where are those places and spaces where we you know,
might not agree on everything, but we can find that
one thing where we're able to move forward. You know,
when I was a Children's Defense Fund, you know, I
worked with Republicans and Democrats because it was absolutely needed
(38:14):
and necessary. And sometimes, you know, folks on my side
of the aisle might get a little crabby and would say,
why did you have a Republican author that bill? I said,
because they're in the majority, and in this moment, two
years in the life of a child is a really
long time to wait for the next biennium. We've got
to go and we've got to We've got to move
and do this work. I've been troubled, as I know,
(38:35):
there are so many folks who are just worried and
afraid about what is coming out of Washington, d C.
I mean, just recently have heard from Senator Joni Erntz
who was talking about Medicaid cuts and folks were asking
her about it and she said, you know, and they said,
you know, people are going to die, and she said, oh, well,
we're all we're all going to die someday, right.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
I know, that was incredible, you know, like, that's correct.
You know, someday we all walk on.
Speaker 7 (39:05):
We all go. But the reality is we shouldn't ever
have to think that our senators are trying to kill us,
right or that they are part of that process. So,
you know, the dysfunction in Washington. I think we need
more folks who are less Washington to be at the table,
which is one of the reasons why I'm running. And
(39:25):
things like Medicaid and making sure that we are doing
everything that we can to protect it is incredibly important
right now as I travel across the state of Minnesota
and talking to folks. You know, just the other day
was talking to a mom named Chris who's got a
nine year old kiddo named Bentley, who relies on Medicaid
for his healthcare and relies on access to special education
(39:47):
services right through the Department of Education. And she just
wants to be a good mom and wants to make
sure that all of that is there for her to
be able to care for her son. And so it's
not just nameless, faceless folks writer or numbers on a spreadsheet.
It's people like Bentley and you know, his his mom, Chris,
(40:08):
I think about you know, the prescription drugs. And in
this moment where I think Democrats especially like we are
fighting back, but I actually think we have to ask
for more and we have to tell people what it
is that we're for Congress negotiating the price of ten
prescription drugs right, lowering the costs for folks on Medicare.
(40:29):
That's great, But my question is why not all of them?
We should be asking for more and we don't get
what we don't fight for. And I think in this
moment that is the contrast and the opportunity for us
as Democrats or Medicare and you know, needing to make
sure that we're covering vision and hearing and dental, all
(40:50):
of the things that are critical to the overall you know,
health of folks. And while I'm on a role, I
guess I would also just say, you know, the pre
author rization of medical decisions, some person at a desk
deciding whether or not you're going to get the treatments
ever die, right, so live or die? It's outrageous. We
should demand more. And those are the things I think
(41:12):
that people expected us right now. It is all of
us against extremist billionaires. We don't have to agree on everything,
but that we can agree on, and we should be
doing everything possible to help people afford their lives.
Speaker 1 (41:26):
One of the things that we see is that voters
are really really mad at Democrats. Yeah even Democrats. Republicans
for sure, but democrats too. Why do you think they're
mad at Democrats? And what do you think a Democratic
party can do to win them back?
Speaker 7 (41:43):
I think one, we have to listen and we've got
to show up. We've been holding what we're calling kitchen
table conversations all across the state of Minnesota, and they
are last town hall and scripted questions and more big
facilitated conversation. I am most comfortable when we have flip
chart paper on the wall and post it notes and markers,
(42:03):
and so that is what these events are all about.
And we've got folks who are showing up, of course
who are Democrats, but also people who have said, you know,
I've never been to anything like this before, but I'm
really freaked out, and so I'm going to try to
do whatever it is that I can, and we say
come on in. And there have been a handful of
Republicans who've also come to these events who said, you know,
(42:25):
I didn't vote with you or I didn't vote for
your party, and rather than blame and shame folks and
get on our high horse, we said, come on in
right again, we can find common ground. But I think
right now Democrats and members of the Democrat Party again
have to say this is what we're fighting for. It
(42:46):
is not enough for us to be against Donald Trump,
which absolutely we are, and we should use every tool
in our toolbox to push back, but we also again
have to tell people what we're for. And we don't
have enough leaders in Washington who understand the struggles that
people are facing right now and in this moment. And
(43:06):
I think folks can see right through that, and that
is also part of the frustration that people have with
the Democratic Party. People need to know we're going to
show up for them and that we'll be on their side,
and that we are not going to just simply engage
in electoral strip mining right before the election, where we
show up to people's communities tell them how important we are,
(43:27):
like it's the you know, like the circus comes to
town and then we leave that we are doing the
work now, you know, for us here in Minnesota in
this campaign, of course, it is about you know, winning
the US Senate seats. Absolutely, But if we're doing it right,
it's about building lasting infrastructure for twenty eight and thirty
(43:49):
and thirty two, and it's about working in partnership this
summer and fall with our legislators and our legislative candidates
to make sure that they have, you know, organizers on
the ground that we are strengthening the work that they're
doing doing Apartment Knox, showing up for folks so that
you know, we are ready to go in twenty six
(44:10):
to win back the House, to build a bigger majority
in our state senates, and make sure that we can
continue to deliver on the things that we need to
deliver on, to make sure that people feel seen and
heard and value. That work should be happening all the time,
not just before the election. And I think that is
also something that people need to see from us. So ideally,
(44:31):
you know we are we're building that on our campaign,
but also this should be I think what democrats and
candidates and leaders are doing all across the country.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
Yeah, such a good point. Thank you, Thank you, Thank you,
Lieutenant Governor L. G. Plan Again, thanks so much for
having me.
Speaker 7 (44:48):
I appreciate you.
Speaker 3 (44:50):
They're all set on.
Speaker 2 (44:54):
Jesse Cannon, Mai Jung Fast So Senator Joni Ernst of
Iowa one of those town halls. And what we know
about town halls is there's a rule. They don't go
well for Republicans these days. Well, why don't we listen
real fast when we.
Speaker 8 (45:08):
Are talking about the corrections in this reconciliation bill. Again,
it's corrections of overpayments and people that have not been
eligible for these programs by law as it is currently written.
So when you are arguing, when you are arguing about
(45:28):
illegals that are receiving Medicaid.
Speaker 1 (45:31):
Benefits one point four.
Speaker 8 (45:33):
Million one point for they're not they are not eligible,
so they will be coming off.
Speaker 9 (45:41):
So people are not well.
Speaker 8 (45:45):
We all are going to die.
Speaker 9 (45:47):
So we in say the one in said spokes Okay, no,
but but what you don't want to do is listen
to me when I say that we are going.
Speaker 8 (46:00):
To focus on those that are most vulnerable, those that
made the eligible enow.
Speaker 1 (46:09):
Wow, wow, you know it's funny because I read reporting
about it but hadn't heard her.
Speaker 2 (46:15):
Her fellow Iowa Senator Chuck Grassley once talked about pulling
the plug on ground that seems like tripping over the
plug and not even caring that you did it.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
Well, I mean it's pretty great where she's She's like, well,
we're all gonna die. I mean, yes, but we don't
want our senators to kill us.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
Thank you, Sylvia Plath, Thank you.
Speaker 1 (46:35):
Johnny Ernst is up in twenty twenty six. Now she
is in Iowa, and Iowa is an R plus whatever
a gazillion state. But you know, this is the thing.
You don't have to have this person. You don't have
to have this person represent you, like you could have
someone a Republican even, who doesn't say things like that,
(46:58):
just like, we're all going to die day this callousness.
Voters are either going to be okay with this or
they're not right. This is all a question of who
you elect. But let me just say this is really
just so incredibly gross.
Speaker 3 (47:14):
Agreed.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in
every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best
minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If
you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend
and keep the conversation going. Thanks for listening.
Host
Molly Jong-Fast
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