July 5, 2026 • 23 mins
Iconic NFL running backs explain technique and what it takes to be a successful running back in the NFL. Untold stories from Corey Dillon, Brandon Bolden, Reggie Bush, Lorenzo Neal, and LeSean McCoy
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to Games of Names.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'm Julli Gentleman, and we got a brand new compilation
highlight Reels starting now.
Speaker 3 (00:09):
Now. Corey Dillon on his inspirations at running back.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I watched a lot of Jim Brown, Jim Brown Ice film.
Speaker 4 (00:17):
Man, and that's who I wanted to be, like, you know,
I watched a lot. It looked like, you know what,
he get hit, he get up slow, you know, stumble
back to the huddle and come back and run you
over again. And it was just repeated. And I was
just watching him all that film I was watching. He
(00:39):
was big, strong, fast, and I'm like, hm, I'm going
to try to pat my game after that. And then
on top of that, you know, I grew up watching football,
so it was like the Tony dor sets try to
steal a little bit from him, the Eric Dickerson's they
try to, Yeah, big guys, fast, take a little from him.
(01:01):
Earl Campbell's, Walter Payton's Berry saying as I never could
be like that. That dude is phenomenal. But yeah, I
just used to watch the running back position and watch
all these great running backs and then be like, hmm,
I like that. I'm gonna take a little bit from there,
take a little bit from there, and then you know
(01:22):
what kind of form my own style, which my thing was,
I call it my little bag. Like you know, I
may start off the first two quarters running you over,
setting you up. Next two quarters, I might try to
dance around you and mix it up so or vice versa.
You know, just depends on what kind of what they're
(01:42):
giving me. Kind of worked out, it worked out pretty good.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
But you also you were always like really good, like
the duo play, you know, duo or you have the
two double teams and the running back really has to
set that up.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
It's all vision, man, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
And you can't be too early lead to the cut
or the fucking the guy scrapes over.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, can you explain that?
Speaker 4 (02:06):
I was real Well, we had this Jim Anderson running
back coach for Cincinnati. This is what he preached to me.
Constantly slow, too fast through meaning footwork and pressed the line,
but at a pace where you could see the cuts.
(02:26):
And that's that's all I really did. I never went
full speed grabbing that ball. I was always on my
footwork and a little patient enough where I pressed that
line where I could see multiple cuts. And just by
doing that alone, things that opened up, Like I could
see the backside, see the defense over pursuing, and then
(02:47):
you know what, as soon as I see that opening,
that's when I explode through.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Next up, Lorenzo Neil on the importance of running the
ball in the NFL.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
Why was the nineties the best football?
Speaker 4 (02:57):
Though?
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I think nineties people were vibing to try to I'll
do the eighties because you knew in the eighties is
just hard and the game was starting to change in
nineties certain things, more people wearing knee braces or so.
Nineties was just still the big safety. The guys that
would still want to hit you. You know, Ronnie Lott was
leaving and here comes Darius and here comes the John Lynch.
Speaker 6 (03:22):
You know, Doc be Doc, And it.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
Was like, okay, they looked up to those guys, and
so you went through those transitions and then it's now
it's like, okay, Troy's gone, Paulamo. So it's like what
safety just brings fear like it used to be. You
have a couple not even gonna say the guys still
don't hit, They're still they're still going after but the
game is it.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Is different it's very different.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
But I think my personal opinion is when you like
safety is now, you have to cover tight ends, right,
you got to be able to play, you gotta, you
know what I mean, just because these these tight ends
now are receivers a B. Safeties get money taken out
of their pocket with big hits now, right, And ain't
(04:09):
nobody get paid for how many knockout hits?
Speaker 4 (04:11):
You get?
Speaker 1 (04:11):
What do they get paid for? Interceptions?
Speaker 2 (04:14):
And these little kids have been farming that since these
little seven on sevens that you get paid if you
touch the ball TfL or I mean pbu's and picks,
So they don't even go for the hit no more
because you want to get the money. Like that's kind
of like we're I that's kind of how because these
guys are huge, fast, strong. It's a little smaller because
(04:35):
they're faster as far as like linebackers. There's two hundred
and thirty five pounds linebackers now. When I first got
in the league, Ray Lewis was two sixty, right.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
You know what I mean. But he could move, you
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (04:45):
But like it's the game has just changed, it has,
you know what I mean, And people want those stats
because stats turn into dough.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
And when you look at the tight end position now Titans,
most of the Titans, you want them, they're too They're
too fast for line and too strong for safety because
you you changed the game. You had safeties that used
to be able to cover. But now these safeties are
guys are too strong. This pound them, beat them up,
so you got to double them. So there's certain things
elements of the game that you have to compensate for
(05:15):
because you have went with you know, more of the hybrids,
because it's more sidelined the sideline because teams aren't patient
enough to say, I'm a lineup and I'm gonna go
right at you. And that's why when you look at
November and December, teams that usually win usually can run
the ball.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Even the Patriots. When you got and we had James
Devlin and he said, hello.
Speaker 5 (05:36):
Oh y'all, tell ja what up? And that's what made
you got. Everyone thought, oh the Patriots got break. No,
they knew that if you did, if you put eight
nine in box, guess what you were going to hurt people.
Walker was gonna hurt people when y'all had mosque and hurt.
So it's like dare you so, you so and that,
But when you run the ball. Corey Dill another guy
blocked for in Cincinnati, tough get Downhill can run physical love.
(06:00):
So you guys, everyone talks, No, this was not a
finesse team. It was still physical and that when you
can be two dimensional, you're hard out.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
It's tough out.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
And I mean you look at the last five six
Super Bowl winners. I mean Philadelphia Eagles, they ran the
shit out of the ball. They tried throwing it the
first four weeks. It wasn't until the bye week that
they said, hey, let's run the ball. We have the
best running back in the league, we got a best
line in the league, and then we'll set up our
pass game through play action. You know, you look at
you know the Rams when they won. They had Gurley,
(06:31):
he was a stud and they had off the run game,
right you know, everyone, we all fascinate to make this
such a spread them and shred them game. But still
fundamentally speaking, like the teams that run the ball, like
you said late in the year, are the teams that go.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
On to win the Super Bowl. That was because you
can control the game, control the game. Not the Niners
were doing that.
Speaker 5 (06:53):
You know, a couple of years ago, when they had
everything in place, they were still one of those teams
hell against against the team that we're gonna watch new
the Vikings.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Bather.
Speaker 5 (07:03):
Remember they ran. They threw the ball eight times NFC Championship.
I mean you only through the ball eight times, Jimmy
g you know, eight passes. The rest was just run.
When you can run the ball and just make teams
quick because it checks your heart, you just got to
be like man as a guy's four yards three yards
and boom, first down, it just kills the momenttal yes,
(07:24):
the moralize the defense and even.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
When you're the guy and the like, when you're on
offense and a team is running the ball on you, it.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Takes you out of your rhythm. Yep.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
It's like when you're sitting there on the sideline, you're
going over your place for the next goddamn dry We
got the third down, you get ready to the offense first. Yeah,
they just got three yards. Oh we're up six yards? Right,
how the fuck can we get out there? That part
and that's what and that's you know it is. I mean,
(07:52):
when you when you have a big explosion play touchdown,
it's so damn quick. Sometimes you're like, man, we were
just on offense. We got our fuel, let's go right.
But it's funny, it's the game has definitely changed.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
You're right.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
What is the one thing that you what's like the
one bit of advice that you give for the fullback,
like if you're going to be the team, because that's
a that's a badge of honor. Because if you're on
the team and you're a fullback, like you ain't have
no backup. You don't have a backup. You gotta know
a lot of shit. It's like a mentality thing. My fullback,
(08:25):
James Devlin, like the fullback was always like the first
guy in the locker room, fucking smelling salt, swallly squat
and like drinking cement for fucking breakfast, Like that's what.
But that was his job, right he had to show that,
like I'm part of the toughness team, and I am
the toughness team. What's your advice for the fullback? The
(08:47):
young fullback trying to come in and make his his
way on a team.
Speaker 5 (08:52):
I think the biggest thing is walk lightly, but carry
a heavy bat. I didn't to be anyone's friends I said,
we just work together. I'm not your friend. We just
work together. We got to you know, you can buy
yourself some friends. You have to be mean, you have
to be physical. You it fullback to My vice is
like it's yeah, it's some technique to it, but it's like, guys,
(09:16):
do not want to hit and head on when you
see me coming and you see me, you have to
make a decision. My advice to fullbacks if you want
to make this game come back and fullbacks become an
integral part of this game again, you have to be fearless.
You have to run in there, whether it hurts or not,
and say I'm going to win this battle. I'm talking
(09:39):
about cutting the leg when you block, block up and through.
If you're going head to head, when you hit, you dip,
you lift, and you create a new line stre When
you stell mate as a fullback, and you stell mat
and the linebacker step you in a hole, you make
the tailback now stop his feet. You have to say
I'm gonna hit you, I'm gonna stay lord, and I'm
gonna push you out of the way. If you can
(09:59):
push and get create a new line of scrimmage. Now
you give the tail back a two way cut.
Speaker 6 (10:05):
That's what I knew.
Speaker 5 (10:05):
When I played full back, I could see the safety
coming down, and I knew if the safety came down,
he was playing force, trying to knock the linebacker and
make it spill inside. I said, if you know that,
if I could get to his inside shoulder, throw my
head across. Now you have ladanian safety and linebackers playing
air because you created that space. So it's about knowing
(10:27):
your job, attention to details, and play the game physical.
Speaker 6 (10:31):
That's what right, you know what.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
I couldn't agree one thousand percent more. I'm not a fullback,
but I just always hung around fullbacks.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
And I remember when you.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Know, James ended up fucking like having a neck problem,
because that's what you have if you're a and I
would explain to the new fullback, okay, that's this is
going to happen. This is what you have. This has
to happen for you to be a proper fullback. You
have to have neck problems. You have to go in
(11:02):
and literally look like you're you don't care about your body.
You don't like that, and that's what it because you know,
then we'd have some other new fullbacks come in they
try to go with the chess fird, you know what
I mean, I'm like, dude.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Now Reggie Bush talks his iconic highlight runs.
Speaker 7 (11:19):
I think one of those runs was running NonStop for
like two weeks on top ten plays, and so everybody
you know remembered that play, but specifically about you know me.
People thought I put the ball behind my back and
it wasn't a predetermined move.
Speaker 6 (11:36):
It was just I actually had the ball in the
wrong hand.
Speaker 7 (11:39):
So as you know, when you're running down the sideline outside,
you got to have that ball on the outside hand
and so you can stick f him exactly. And I
did not have the ball on the outside hand. I
had it on the inside. And I really when the
ball is in my right hand and I got open field.
That's that's where I'm comforting. That's why I'm really like
getting I'm taking. So you're you're a right hand guy,
(11:59):
right hand you know what's crazy.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
I was always I'm a right handed guy, but I
was always a left ki because when I was a
kid in Pop Warner, I was the four back and
I'd always go to the left.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
So it trained me.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
I always use because I'd always use it to the
outside of the hand because they're always getting in the head.
So I was like an orthodox, but give me a no,
you're good.
Speaker 7 (12:18):
And so what happened to me my senior year in
high school. I broke my wrist. And I actually was
catching a swing a swing route, and when I went
to stiff arm the guy, he was already up on me.
He was coming full speed and knocked my hand backwards
and I broke this bone right here, the navicular scaffold,
which is one of the bones that has like lowest
(12:39):
blood supply. So but obviously I was young enough doctor
put a cast on it. I played my entire football
my senior year with a cast on my left wrist,
I think remember, And so I heard that I wasn't
necessarily comfortable yet back with carrying that ball on my
left hand. So there are a lot of games you
might see when I'm in college when I'm carrying the
ball wrong again going down left side. But I got
(13:01):
in the right hand because I just hadn't got gained
that comfort level back with squeezing it and holding it tight,
especially when you're fighting through traffic. And so again on
this specific play though, when I'm running down the sideline.
Speaker 6 (13:13):
I'm literally trying to outrun the safety.
Speaker 7 (13:15):
And what happened earlier in the game, I had a
touchdown where I actually outran him, same exact spot, almost identical.
And so this second time, now I'm coming around and
I peek out a corner of my eye and I
see his head down and he's just.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
Like last time, I gotta go higher.
Speaker 7 (13:35):
I gotta go higher, exactly, And so he learned his lesson, right,
So now he's going at a higher angle.
Speaker 6 (13:41):
He got his head down, he's digging.
Speaker 7 (13:43):
And so now I after peaking and I see that,
I know I got to put my foot in the
ground because I'm not gonna outrun him, and so I stopped.
And he was close enough to me where if he
actually reached his hand out, he probably could have hit
the ball. And so so naturally, when somebody's that close
to you, it's either you squeeze it or if you're.
Speaker 6 (14:04):
Trying to get busy, you just do something crazy.
Speaker 7 (14:06):
Right, That's what came out, you know, And that's and
I think, you know, when we played the game, a
lot of things and a lot of part of most
of the game is really built on instincts.
Speaker 6 (14:17):
You know what I'm saying and instincts and.
Speaker 7 (14:20):
Vision, and so for me in that moment, it was
all about instincts and vision, and I just my hand
went back, I put my foot in the ground.
Speaker 6 (14:27):
I knew I was gonna stop in reverse. I just
didn't know I was gonna put my hand.
Speaker 7 (14:30):
On the side behind my back like that with the
ball and cut behind him. But and then outrun everyone
and then out.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Everybody next up.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Brandon Bolden on the tight knit running back room.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
What was the legacy of the running backs room?
Speaker 1 (14:45):
I was the one.
Speaker 8 (14:46):
I was the one constant was I've been through everybody.
I was there with Woody, Shane, rid lg Dion Guilessly,
James White, Sony Michelle.
Speaker 6 (14:58):
We had like, uh uh even Jackson.
Speaker 8 (15:02):
You mentioned Stephen Jackson, Tyler Gaffney. We I and I've
seen everybody, remindre Stevens and Damon Harris.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
I was there with everybody.
Speaker 6 (15:12):
Sexy Rexy, Uh I.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
See Damon on CBS. Yeah, Dames, Dames, Dames doing it.
Speaker 8 (15:20):
Dame's got his kid now too, so it's just like
he's hilarious. But the running back room we always since
I first got there, and Woody was kind of the
one who started it. Bro, you don't have to do
none of this ship by yourself. Like, I'll never forget
that conversation me and him had. I was like, what
you mean. He was like, if you don't remember the
fucking plays, bro, look to the sideline, we're helping you.
(15:43):
And it was like preseason. I think that was the
last preseason game they had bought Jeff in because it
was just me. It was me and Jeff, and that's
when we started doing like the two backs and they
called one play and I just knew I had the wheel.
(16:03):
But then I look at Jeff and Jeff was like, no,
I got the wheel. I was like, the fuck it?
We both about to.
Speaker 6 (16:08):
Run the wheel.
Speaker 8 (16:09):
As I'm starting off on my wheel, I just see Shane.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
No you gotta Oh.
Speaker 8 (16:15):
So I'm running the route on the fucking numbers to
the field and Tom threw the fucking ball the other way.
Speaker 6 (16:21):
I was so fucking happy.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
I was like, you know what you had? Did you? No?
And no, I got no clue. But that was the thing.
Speaker 8 (16:29):
And it was like from that point on, we always
we tried to eat together.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
We want to hang out together.
Speaker 6 (16:35):
I want to know you, your mom, your girl, you.
Speaker 8 (16:37):
Got kids, bring the kids over, and we kept that
running back room as tight. Like you remember you you
didn't see one of us without.
Speaker 4 (16:44):
The other one.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Yeah, always together, always now.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
Lashawn McCoy on what makes a great running back?
Speaker 9 (16:51):
The Bills, they still haven't had one thousand yard rusher.
So my thing is, where is your real impact? If
it's a good of a player, soon you leave the
backup of the see ain't thing?
Speaker 4 (17:00):
Nah? How good are you? Really?
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Do you get what I'm saying?
Speaker 6 (17:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (17:04):
But what if they let's go, But.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
What if the teams because they had such a dominant back,
they were like running the ball. They had such the
offense was built around the running back.
Speaker 6 (17:17):
Great, great question, and.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Then all of a sudden they could just couldn't win
the Super Bowl. They couldn't get to the super Bowl.
So they're like, fuck it, we're gonna we're getting rid
of running back. We already had that insane running back.
We want to we gotta we gotta evolve to what
everyone else is that Maybe that someone could say that.
Speaker 9 (17:34):
Sort of coats So I told you that. I don't
know if you heard me. They had Peyton Manning.
Speaker 6 (17:39):
Yeah, So when we go into the game, who who.
Speaker 9 (17:42):
Do you think we trying to stop? You can be
about to pack the line of scrimmage up to stop esmen, James.
Are we gonna stop pay Maine in that passing game?
Speaker 2 (17:51):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Make him one dimensional?
Speaker 6 (17:52):
He stopped the run?
Speaker 9 (17:53):
Noways okay, all right, Well if you think that that's cool,
I just got It's everything comes off the run, whether
you have one or not, I mean depends on I mean,
I hear that. But then like there's some things that
we throw the ball. We just we're throwing the ball.
I personally haven't had a lot of open boxes running
the ball.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
No, you didn't.
Speaker 9 (18:12):
But what I'm saying is if I had a Pagan,
I'm damn sure you know what I'm saying. Yeah, but
no one put No one put Eggar and James in
all time. Great, he's Hall of Famer. You saw the
Hall of Fame backs, right these you want it as
you asked for, So were going into some of these,
these these Hall of Fame.
Speaker 6 (18:28):
Running and James the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
He had a lot of yards though, didn't he He
had a lot of carries too. See that's impressive though
a lot of probably was healthy too. That's the thing
about running backs.
Speaker 9 (18:37):
He had a lot of three hundred yard three hundred carriers.
I've only had one. That's impressive.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
A lot of guys get hurt, and we're seeing it
right now. Guys can't run the ball, Like, what's the
number now, I don't know. They're saying every it's like
three hundred and sixty snaps for running back. They're like,
if they play that or they have those carries, they're
like going to get hurt. That's what the analytics I
don't know. So when you see a guy that can
(19:03):
do it repetitively, like that's why Frank Gore was crazy
to me, Like that dude carried the ball so much.
Speaker 6 (19:08):
Longevity.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Longevity is huge and running back, but.
Speaker 9 (19:11):
There's nobody that blocks Burn and Frank Gore. There's nobody
that plays in.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
The between the tackles. Bro he got good eyes downhill
and he's always leaning forward. I've never seen my better
than him at that now can He makes the right
read always, and he knows how to manipulate blocks the
double teams because they always had the double teams with them.
Speaker 9 (19:30):
You know.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
And he and you'll see a lot of like really
like that's the difference between a pro back and a
college back. College backs can get away with not making
the right lead in the defense. Yeah, they could run
through arm tackles and stuff. When you get to the league,
it's like there's a track that you have to run
because of how the blocking schemes are. And I didn't
(19:51):
know that until I got to the NFL, because I
was like, this guy's gonna be hell o good, we
gotta and then you see that he makes the cut,
you know, three three steps too early.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
The guy sheds off the block, and that's that's one
of the young back.
Speaker 9 (20:02):
The hardest thing is, damn patient, there's a whole man'te
no sell that shit more?
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, come off his heels, right, they always say come
off his ass?
Speaker 4 (20:10):
Pause.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
I always say, coach a pause.
Speaker 6 (20:12):
Dude, Yeah, I paused a lot of the stuff coach.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
Be saying, coaches saying, Now, Reggie Bush talks about the
original Bush push.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
Hey, we just had Leonard talking about the Bush push.
Did you what's your perspective on that whole thing? My
present is I want to see if it dials up.
I want to see who's who's talking.
Speaker 7 (20:30):
That needed me on that play one hundred percent needed me.
He was going backwards.
Speaker 6 (20:42):
He was going back.
Speaker 7 (20:43):
First of all, all right, let's just when you look
at what Jalen Hurst is doing now, they they're trying
to call it the brotherly brotherly love shove or the
tush push. That's bullshit, all right, it's the bush push, okay,
all right. And it started on accident, all right. It
was started because I was trying to fucking win the
game and I just didn't want to lose. And that's
that relentless pursuit, that relentless mindset, like you know, no
(21:05):
matter what, we we're gonna score this touchdown. And so
before that play, we're in the huddle, it's time out
because everything's going crazy.
Speaker 6 (21:14):
Matt just gets knocked out of bounds.
Speaker 7 (21:16):
First of all, Matt got knocked out of bounds and
fumbled the ball out of bounds. So it was it
was one of those plays where if he gets tackled
in bounds, game over. So he gets knocked out of bounds,
ball goes out, clock stops, even though Notre Dame tried
to keep the clock running. And we get the time
out and we're in the huddle and it's just I
(21:38):
just remember it just being chaos, and I'm just like,
I can't fucking believe we could possibly lose this game
right now, Like I can't believe we're in this dogfight
with Notre Dame. Like, and so I go to I
say to the man, I'm like, what are you gonna do?
And he's like, I'm gonna sneak it. I'm like, fuck,
literally the first thing came in my head.
Speaker 6 (21:55):
I'm like, oh.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Shit, didn't he say like, yeah, dude, he said he
said that. You said like, yeah, man, I think you
got it.
Speaker 6 (22:03):
That's not how I felt.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
I was like, yo, because he was doing some hand
signal things. He said, I got this audible.
Speaker 7 (22:13):
Something like he might have the audible or something right now,
because I don't know if this is going to work.
And so then we break the huddle and all eleven
players are lined up waiting for this QB sneak and I'm.
Speaker 6 (22:27):
Like, man, oh my god. And so Matt hikes the ball.
Speaker 7 (22:31):
He starts getting knocked backwards on a QB sneak. He's
moving backwards. I'm like, oh no, this is happening. I
just shove his ass, push him as hard as I
could bro over the line, and then.
Speaker 6 (22:42):
He kind of like does some little you didn't even
like the head down and like.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
Dude, you gotta have a knack for the end zone.
Speaker 7 (22:52):
I'm so glad that we have the Philadelphia Eagles perfecting
it now, because you see what it's supposed to look
opposed to that's what it's supposed to look like.
Speaker 6 (23:00):
Ours ain't looked like look like a dead fish.
Speaker 3 (23:03):
He was doing one of those moves he learned in
the ballroom dancing class he was taking, You're a wet.
Speaker 6 (23:09):
It was a dead fish move. Here was the.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Ballroom dead seat that he was taking that year, only.
Speaker 6 (23:15):
He slid up in there.
Speaker 7 (23:16):
But but again he needed that push over that over
that line, and I had I didn't even know it
was illegal at the time.
Speaker 6 (23:27):
I was just like, we got to win this game.
Welcome to Games of Names.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
I'm Julli Gentleman, and we got a brand new compilation
highlight Reels starting now.
Speaker 3 (00:09):
Now. Corey Dillon on his inspirations at running back.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I watched a lot of Jim Brown, Jim Brown Ice film.
Speaker 4 (00:17):
Man, and that's who I wanted to be, like, you know,
I watched a lot. It looked like, you know what,
he get hit, he get up slow, you know, stumble
back to the huddle and come back and run you
over again. And it was just repeated. And I was
just watching him all that film I was watching. He
(00:39):
was big, strong, fast, and I'm like, hm, I'm going
to try to pat my game after that. And then
on top of that, you know, I grew up watching football,
so it was like the Tony dor sets try to
steal a little bit from him, the Eric Dickerson's they
try to, Yeah, big guys, fast, take a little from him.
(01:01):
Earl Campbell's, Walter Payton's Berry saying as I never could
be like that. That dude is phenomenal. But yeah, I
just used to watch the running back position and watch
all these great running backs and then be like, hmm,
I like that. I'm gonna take a little bit from there,
take a little bit from there, and then you know
(01:22):
what kind of form my own style, which my thing was,
I call it my little bag. Like you know, I
may start off the first two quarters running you over,
setting you up. Next two quarters, I might try to
dance around you and mix it up so or vice versa.
You know, just depends on what kind of what they're
(01:42):
giving me. Kind of worked out, it worked out pretty good.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
But you also you were always like really good, like
the duo play, you know, duo or you have the
two double teams and the running back really has to
set that up.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
It's all vision, man, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
And you can't be too early lead to the cut
or the fucking the guy scrapes over.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Yeah, can you explain that?
Speaker 4 (02:06):
I was real Well, we had this Jim Anderson running
back coach for Cincinnati. This is what he preached to me.
Constantly slow, too fast through meaning footwork and pressed the line,
but at a pace where you could see the cuts.
(02:26):
And that's that's all I really did. I never went
full speed grabbing that ball. I was always on my
footwork and a little patient enough where I pressed that
line where I could see multiple cuts. And just by
doing that alone, things that opened up, Like I could
see the backside, see the defense over pursuing, and then
(02:47):
you know what, as soon as I see that opening,
that's when I explode through.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Next up, Lorenzo Neil on the importance of running the
ball in the NFL.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
Why was the nineties the best football?
Speaker 4 (02:57):
Though?
Speaker 5 (02:58):
I think nineties people were vibing to try to I'll
do the eighties because you knew in the eighties is
just hard and the game was starting to change in
nineties certain things, more people wearing knee braces or so.
Nineties was just still the big safety. The guys that
would still want to hit you. You know, Ronnie Lott was
leaving and here comes Darius and here comes the John Lynch.
Speaker 6 (03:22):
You know, Doc be Doc, And it.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
Was like, okay, they looked up to those guys, and
so you went through those transitions and then it's now
it's like, okay, Troy's gone, Paulamo. So it's like what
safety just brings fear like it used to be. You
have a couple not even gonna say the guys still
don't hit, They're still they're still going after but the
game is it.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Is different it's very different.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
But I think my personal opinion is when you like
safety is now, you have to cover tight ends, right,
you got to be able to play, you gotta, you
know what I mean, just because these these tight ends
now are receivers a B. Safeties get money taken out
of their pocket with big hits now, right, And ain't
(04:09):
nobody get paid for how many knockout hits?
Speaker 4 (04:11):
You get?
Speaker 1 (04:11):
What do they get paid for? Interceptions?
Speaker 2 (04:14):
And these little kids have been farming that since these
little seven on sevens that you get paid if you
touch the ball TfL or I mean pbu's and picks,
So they don't even go for the hit no more
because you want to get the money. Like that's kind
of like we're I that's kind of how because these
guys are huge, fast, strong. It's a little smaller because
(04:35):
they're faster as far as like linebackers. There's two hundred
and thirty five pounds linebackers now. When I first got
in the league, Ray Lewis was two sixty, right.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
You know what I mean. But he could move, you
know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (04:45):
But like it's the game has just changed, it has,
you know what I mean, And people want those stats
because stats turn into dough.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
And when you look at the tight end position now Titans,
most of the Titans, you want them, they're too They're
too fast for line and too strong for safety because
you you changed the game. You had safeties that used
to be able to cover. But now these safeties are
guys are too strong. This pound them, beat them up,
so you got to double them. So there's certain things
elements of the game that you have to compensate for
(05:15):
because you have went with you know, more of the hybrids,
because it's more sidelined the sideline because teams aren't patient
enough to say, I'm a lineup and I'm gonna go
right at you. And that's why when you look at
November and December, teams that usually win usually can run
the ball.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Even the Patriots. When you got and we had James
Devlin and he said, hello.
Speaker 5 (05:36):
Oh y'all, tell ja what up? And that's what made
you got. Everyone thought, oh the Patriots got break. No,
they knew that if you did, if you put eight
nine in box, guess what you were going to hurt people.
Walker was gonna hurt people when y'all had mosque and hurt.
So it's like dare you so, you so and that,
But when you run the ball. Corey Dill another guy
blocked for in Cincinnati, tough get Downhill can run physical love.
(06:00):
So you guys, everyone talks, No, this was not a
finesse team. It was still physical and that when you
can be two dimensional, you're hard out.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
It's tough out.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
And I mean you look at the last five six
Super Bowl winners. I mean Philadelphia Eagles, they ran the
shit out of the ball. They tried throwing it the
first four weeks. It wasn't until the bye week that
they said, hey, let's run the ball. We have the
best running back in the league, we got a best
line in the league, and then we'll set up our
pass game through play action. You know, you look at
you know the Rams when they won. They had Gurley,
(06:31):
he was a stud and they had off the run game,
right you know, everyone, we all fascinate to make this
such a spread them and shred them game. But still
fundamentally speaking, like the teams that run the ball, like
you said late in the year, are the teams that go.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
On to win the Super Bowl. That was because you
can control the game, control the game. Not the Niners
were doing that.
Speaker 5 (06:53):
You know, a couple of years ago, when they had
everything in place, they were still one of those teams
hell against against the team that we're gonna watch new
the Vikings.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Bather.
Speaker 5 (07:03):
Remember they ran. They threw the ball eight times NFC Championship.
I mean you only through the ball eight times, Jimmy
g you know, eight passes. The rest was just run.
When you can run the ball and just make teams
quick because it checks your heart, you just got to
be like man as a guy's four yards three yards
and boom, first down, it just kills the momenttal yes,
(07:24):
the moralize the defense and even.
Speaker 2 (07:25):
When you're the guy and the like, when you're on
offense and a team is running the ball on you, it.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Takes you out of your rhythm. Yep.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
It's like when you're sitting there on the sideline, you're
going over your place for the next goddamn dry We
got the third down, you get ready to the offense first. Yeah,
they just got three yards. Oh we're up six yards? Right,
how the fuck can we get out there? That part
and that's what and that's you know it is. I mean,
(07:52):
when you when you have a big explosion play touchdown,
it's so damn quick. Sometimes you're like, man, we were
just on offense. We got our fuel, let's go right.
But it's funny, it's the game has definitely changed.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
You're right.
Speaker 2 (08:03):
What is the one thing that you what's like the
one bit of advice that you give for the fullback,
like if you're going to be the team, because that's
a that's a badge of honor. Because if you're on
the team and you're a fullback, like you ain't have
no backup. You don't have a backup. You gotta know
a lot of shit. It's like a mentality thing. My fullback,
(08:25):
James Devlin, like the fullback was always like the first
guy in the locker room, fucking smelling salt, swallly squat
and like drinking cement for fucking breakfast, Like that's what.
But that was his job, right he had to show that,
like I'm part of the toughness team, and I am
the toughness team. What's your advice for the fullback? The
(08:47):
young fullback trying to come in and make his his
way on a team.
Speaker 5 (08:52):
I think the biggest thing is walk lightly, but carry
a heavy bat. I didn't to be anyone's friends I said,
we just work together. I'm not your friend. We just
work together. We got to you know, you can buy
yourself some friends. You have to be mean, you have
to be physical. You it fullback to My vice is
like it's yeah, it's some technique to it, but it's like, guys,
(09:16):
do not want to hit and head on when you
see me coming and you see me, you have to
make a decision. My advice to fullbacks if you want
to make this game come back and fullbacks become an
integral part of this game again, you have to be fearless.
You have to run in there, whether it hurts or not,
and say I'm going to win this battle. I'm talking
(09:39):
about cutting the leg when you block, block up and through.
If you're going head to head, when you hit, you dip,
you lift, and you create a new line stre When
you stell mate as a fullback, and you stell mat
and the linebacker step you in a hole, you make
the tailback now stop his feet. You have to say
I'm gonna hit you, I'm gonna stay lord, and I'm
gonna push you out of the way. If you can
(09:59):
push and get create a new line of scrimmage. Now
you give the tail back a two way cut.
Speaker 6 (10:05):
That's what I knew.
Speaker 5 (10:05):
When I played full back, I could see the safety
coming down, and I knew if the safety came down,
he was playing force, trying to knock the linebacker and
make it spill inside. I said, if you know that,
if I could get to his inside shoulder, throw my
head across. Now you have ladanian safety and linebackers playing
air because you created that space. So it's about knowing
(10:27):
your job, attention to details, and play the game physical.
Speaker 6 (10:31):
That's what right, you know what.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
I couldn't agree one thousand percent more. I'm not a fullback,
but I just always hung around fullbacks.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
And I remember when you.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Know, James ended up fucking like having a neck problem,
because that's what you have if you're a and I
would explain to the new fullback, okay, that's this is
going to happen. This is what you have. This has
to happen for you to be a proper fullback. You
have to have neck problems. You have to go in
(11:02):
and literally look like you're you don't care about your body.
You don't like that, and that's what it because you know,
then we'd have some other new fullbacks come in they
try to go with the chess fird, you know what
I mean, I'm like, dude.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Now Reggie Bush talks his iconic highlight runs.
Speaker 7 (11:19):
I think one of those runs was running NonStop for
like two weeks on top ten plays, and so everybody
you know remembered that play, but specifically about you know me.
People thought I put the ball behind my back and
it wasn't a predetermined move.
Speaker 6 (11:36):
It was just I actually had the ball in the
wrong hand.
Speaker 7 (11:39):
So as you know, when you're running down the sideline outside,
you got to have that ball on the outside hand
and so you can stick f him exactly. And I
did not have the ball on the outside hand. I
had it on the inside. And I really when the
ball is in my right hand and I got open field.
That's that's where I'm comforting. That's why I'm really like
getting I'm taking. So you're you're a right hand guy,
(11:59):
right hand you know what's crazy.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
I was always I'm a right handed guy, but I
was always a left ki because when I was a
kid in Pop Warner, I was the four back and
I'd always go to the left.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
So it trained me.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
I always use because I'd always use it to the
outside of the hand because they're always getting in the head.
So I was like an orthodox, but give me a no,
you're good.
Speaker 7 (12:18):
And so what happened to me my senior year in
high school. I broke my wrist. And I actually was
catching a swing a swing route, and when I went
to stiff arm the guy, he was already up on me.
He was coming full speed and knocked my hand backwards
and I broke this bone right here, the navicular scaffold,
which is one of the bones that has like lowest
(12:39):
blood supply. So but obviously I was young enough doctor
put a cast on it. I played my entire football
my senior year with a cast on my left wrist,
I think remember, And so I heard that I wasn't
necessarily comfortable yet back with carrying that ball on my
left hand. So there are a lot of games you
might see when I'm in college when I'm carrying the
ball wrong again going down left side. But I got
(13:01):
in the right hand because I just hadn't got gained
that comfort level back with squeezing it and holding it tight,
especially when you're fighting through traffic. And so again on
this specific play though, when I'm running down the sideline.
Speaker 6 (13:13):
I'm literally trying to outrun the safety.
Speaker 7 (13:15):
And what happened earlier in the game, I had a
touchdown where I actually outran him, same exact spot, almost identical.
And so this second time, now I'm coming around and
I peek out a corner of my eye and I
see his head down and he's just.
Speaker 1 (13:32):
Like last time, I gotta go higher.
Speaker 7 (13:35):
I gotta go higher, exactly, And so he learned his lesson, right,
So now he's going at a higher angle.
Speaker 6 (13:41):
He got his head down, he's digging.
Speaker 7 (13:43):
And so now I after peaking and I see that,
I know I got to put my foot in the
ground because I'm not gonna outrun him, and so I stopped.
And he was close enough to me where if he
actually reached his hand out, he probably could have hit
the ball. And so so naturally, when somebody's that close
to you, it's either you squeeze it or if you're.
Speaker 6 (14:04):
Trying to get busy, you just do something crazy.
Speaker 7 (14:06):
Right, That's what came out, you know, And that's and
I think, you know, when we played the game, a
lot of things and a lot of part of most
of the game is really built on instincts.
Speaker 6 (14:17):
You know what I'm saying and instincts and.
Speaker 7 (14:20):
Vision, and so for me in that moment, it was
all about instincts and vision, and I just my hand
went back, I put my foot in the ground.
Speaker 6 (14:27):
I knew I was gonna stop in reverse. I just
didn't know I was gonna put my hand.
Speaker 7 (14:30):
On the side behind my back like that with the
ball and cut behind him. But and then outrun everyone
and then out.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Everybody next up.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Brandon Bolden on the tight knit running back room.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
What was the legacy of the running backs room?
Speaker 1 (14:45):
I was the one.
Speaker 8 (14:46):
I was the one constant was I've been through everybody.
I was there with Woody, Shane, rid lg Dion Guilessly,
James White, Sony Michelle.
Speaker 6 (14:58):
We had like, uh uh even Jackson.
Speaker 8 (15:02):
You mentioned Stephen Jackson, Tyler Gaffney. We I and I've
seen everybody, remindre Stevens and Damon Harris.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
I was there with everybody.
Speaker 6 (15:12):
Sexy Rexy, Uh I.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
See Damon on CBS. Yeah, Dames, Dames, Dames doing it.
Speaker 8 (15:20):
Dame's got his kid now too, so it's just like
he's hilarious. But the running back room we always since
I first got there, and Woody was kind of the
one who started it. Bro, you don't have to do
none of this ship by yourself. Like, I'll never forget
that conversation me and him had. I was like, what
you mean. He was like, if you don't remember the
fucking plays, bro, look to the sideline, we're helping you.
(15:43):
And it was like preseason. I think that was the
last preseason game they had bought Jeff in because it
was just me. It was me and Jeff, and that's
when we started doing like the two backs and they
called one play and I just knew I had the wheel.
(16:03):
But then I look at Jeff and Jeff was like, no,
I got the wheel. I was like, the fuck it?
We both about to.
Speaker 6 (16:08):
Run the wheel.
Speaker 8 (16:09):
As I'm starting off on my wheel, I just see Shane.
Speaker 1 (16:12):
No you gotta Oh.
Speaker 8 (16:15):
So I'm running the route on the fucking numbers to
the field and Tom threw the fucking ball the other way.
Speaker 6 (16:21):
I was so fucking happy.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
I was like, you know what you had? Did you? No?
And no, I got no clue. But that was the thing.
Speaker 8 (16:29):
And it was like from that point on, we always
we tried to eat together.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
We want to hang out together.
Speaker 6 (16:35):
I want to know you, your mom, your girl, you.
Speaker 8 (16:37):
Got kids, bring the kids over, and we kept that
running back room as tight. Like you remember you you
didn't see one of us without.
Speaker 4 (16:44):
The other one.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Yeah, always together, always now.
Speaker 3 (16:47):
Lashawn McCoy on what makes a great running back?
Speaker 9 (16:51):
The Bills, they still haven't had one thousand yard rusher.
So my thing is, where is your real impact? If
it's a good of a player, soon you leave the
backup of the see ain't thing?
Speaker 4 (17:00):
Nah? How good are you? Really?
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Do you get what I'm saying?
Speaker 6 (17:03):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (17:04):
But what if they let's go, But.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
What if the teams because they had such a dominant back,
they were like running the ball. They had such the
offense was built around the running back.
Speaker 6 (17:17):
Great, great question, and.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
Then all of a sudden they could just couldn't win
the Super Bowl. They couldn't get to the super Bowl.
So they're like, fuck it, we're gonna we're getting rid
of running back. We already had that insane running back.
We want to we gotta we gotta evolve to what
everyone else is that Maybe that someone could say that.
Speaker 9 (17:34):
Sort of coats So I told you that. I don't
know if you heard me. They had Peyton Manning.
Speaker 6 (17:39):
Yeah, So when we go into the game, who who.
Speaker 9 (17:42):
Do you think we trying to stop? You can be
about to pack the line of scrimmage up to stop esmen, James.
Are we gonna stop pay Maine in that passing game?
Speaker 2 (17:51):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Make him one dimensional?
Speaker 6 (17:52):
He stopped the run?
Speaker 9 (17:53):
Noways okay, all right, Well if you think that that's cool,
I just got It's everything comes off the run, whether
you have one or not, I mean depends on I mean,
I hear that. But then like there's some things that
we throw the ball. We just we're throwing the ball.
I personally haven't had a lot of open boxes running
the ball.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
No, you didn't.
Speaker 9 (18:12):
But what I'm saying is if I had a Pagan,
I'm damn sure you know what I'm saying. Yeah, but
no one put No one put Eggar and James in
all time. Great, he's Hall of Famer. You saw the
Hall of Fame backs, right these you want it as
you asked for, So were going into some of these,
these these Hall of Fame.
Speaker 6 (18:28):
Running and James the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
He had a lot of yards though, didn't he He
had a lot of carries too. See that's impressive though
a lot of probably was healthy too. That's the thing
about running backs.
Speaker 9 (18:37):
He had a lot of three hundred yard three hundred carriers.
I've only had one. That's impressive.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
A lot of guys get hurt, and we're seeing it
right now. Guys can't run the ball, Like, what's the
number now, I don't know. They're saying every it's like
three hundred and sixty snaps for running back. They're like,
if they play that or they have those carries, they're
like going to get hurt. That's what the analytics I
don't know. So when you see a guy that can
(19:03):
do it repetitively, like that's why Frank Gore was crazy
to me, Like that dude carried the ball so much.
Speaker 6 (19:08):
Longevity.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Longevity is huge and running back, but.
Speaker 9 (19:11):
There's nobody that blocks Burn and Frank Gore. There's nobody
that plays in.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
The between the tackles. Bro he got good eyes downhill
and he's always leaning forward. I've never seen my better
than him at that now can He makes the right
read always, and he knows how to manipulate blocks the
double teams because they always had the double teams with them.
Speaker 9 (19:30):
You know.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
And he and you'll see a lot of like really
like that's the difference between a pro back and a
college back. College backs can get away with not making
the right lead in the defense. Yeah, they could run
through arm tackles and stuff. When you get to the league,
it's like there's a track that you have to run
because of how the blocking schemes are. And I didn't
(19:51):
know that until I got to the NFL, because I
was like, this guy's gonna be hell o good, we
gotta and then you see that he makes the cut,
you know, three three steps too early.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
The guy sheds off the block, and that's that's one
of the young back.
Speaker 9 (20:02):
The hardest thing is, damn patient, there's a whole man'te
no sell that shit more?
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Yeah, come off his heels, right, they always say come
off his ass?
Speaker 4 (20:10):
Pause.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
I always say, coach a pause.
Speaker 6 (20:12):
Dude, Yeah, I paused a lot of the stuff coach.
Speaker 3 (20:14):
Be saying, coaches saying, Now, Reggie Bush talks about the
original Bush push.
Speaker 2 (20:20):
Hey, we just had Leonard talking about the Bush push.
Did you what's your perspective on that whole thing? My
present is I want to see if it dials up.
I want to see who's who's talking.
Speaker 7 (20:30):
That needed me on that play one hundred percent needed me.
He was going backwards.
Speaker 6 (20:42):
He was going back.
Speaker 7 (20:43):
First of all, all right, let's just when you look
at what Jalen Hurst is doing now, they they're trying
to call it the brotherly brotherly love shove or the
tush push. That's bullshit, all right, it's the bush push, okay,
all right. And it started on accident, all right. It
was started because I was trying to fucking win the
game and I just didn't want to lose. And that's
that relentless pursuit, that relentless mindset, like you know, no
(21:05):
matter what, we we're gonna score this touchdown. And so
before that play, we're in the huddle, it's time out
because everything's going crazy.
Speaker 6 (21:14):
Matt just gets knocked out of bounds.
Speaker 7 (21:16):
First of all, Matt got knocked out of bounds and
fumbled the ball out of bounds. So it was it
was one of those plays where if he gets tackled
in bounds, game over. So he gets knocked out of bounds,
ball goes out, clock stops, even though Notre Dame tried
to keep the clock running. And we get the time
out and we're in the huddle and it's just I
(21:38):
just remember it just being chaos, and I'm just like,
I can't fucking believe we could possibly lose this game
right now, Like I can't believe we're in this dogfight
with Notre Dame. Like, and so I go to I
say to the man, I'm like, what are you gonna do?
And he's like, I'm gonna sneak it. I'm like, fuck,
literally the first thing came in my head.
Speaker 6 (21:55):
I'm like, oh.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Shit, didn't he say like, yeah, dude, he said he
said that. You said like, yeah, man, I think you
got it.
Speaker 6 (22:03):
That's not how I felt.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
I was like, yo, because he was doing some hand
signal things. He said, I got this audible.
Speaker 7 (22:13):
Something like he might have the audible or something right now,
because I don't know if this is going to work.
And so then we break the huddle and all eleven
players are lined up waiting for this QB sneak and I'm.
Speaker 6 (22:27):
Like, man, oh my god. And so Matt hikes the ball.
Speaker 7 (22:31):
He starts getting knocked backwards on a QB sneak. He's
moving backwards. I'm like, oh no, this is happening. I
just shove his ass, push him as hard as I
could bro over the line, and then.
Speaker 6 (22:42):
He kind of like does some little you didn't even
like the head down and like.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
Dude, you gotta have a knack for the end zone.
Speaker 7 (22:52):
I'm so glad that we have the Philadelphia Eagles perfecting
it now, because you see what it's supposed to look
opposed to that's what it's supposed to look like.
Speaker 6 (23:00):
Ours ain't looked like look like a dead fish.
Speaker 3 (23:03):
He was doing one of those moves he learned in
the ballroom dancing class he was taking, You're a wet.
Speaker 6 (23:09):
It was a dead fish move. Here was the.
Speaker 1 (23:11):
Ballroom dead seat that he was taking that year, only.
Speaker 6 (23:15):
He slid up in there.
Speaker 7 (23:16):
But but again he needed that push over that over
that line, and I had I didn't even know it
was illegal at the time.
Speaker 6 (23:27):
I was just like, we got to win this game.
Host
Julian Edelman
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