May 7, 2026 • 52 mins
On this week's In Service Of Steve Baltin sits down with the superb jazz vocalist Gabrielle Cavassa. After touring for over a year with Grammy winner Joshua Redman Cavassa steps into the spotlight for her Blue Note Records debut, 'Diavola.' In a fascinating and fun conversation they talk pizza, New Orleans, Mardi Gras, Billie Holiday and more.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hey to Steve Boton.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Welcome to Inserms of and this week I'm very honored
to welcome Gabrielle Cavasa, New Orleans based, this incredible jazz singer,
which is released her Blue Note debut Diaflo, co produced
by Joshua Redmond, who she toured with for about a
year as well as the Great Dog.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Was And you know, we talk about what she's learned
working with these great.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Artists as well as songwriting Italy and New Orleans, which
of course leads to soccer, food, touring, jazz Fez Marti
Gras so much and a really really interesting talk about songwriting.
Gabrielle is an incredibly smart person, great singer and a
(00:51):
lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
So I hope you enjoyed this interview with a bunch
of the idea. Thanks. What was your one jazz best show?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Oh, it hasn't happened yet, it's on Friday.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Nice.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Yeah, very excited too good to at least do the
first weekend of jazz Fest and just you know, enjoy
everything that's happening here in New Orleans.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
All right, so how many times have you been, by
the way.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Did jazz Fest as a fan?
Speaker 5 (01:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (01:36):
Well, the first time I went to JazzFest was the
first year that I moved here, which was twenty eighteen.
Was my first jazz fest that I attended, and then
I think probably every year after that, I performed at
least with somebody or I got on stage somehow. Last
(01:57):
year I got to uh headline with Joshua Redman. And
then this year I'm actually not playing at the festival,
so it'll be my first year since twenty nineteen that
I haven't played the festival.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
Yeah, but you kind of have some other stuff going
on this year.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
I do, yeah, and hopefully I get in there next year.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
You know, it's probably good to like mix it up anyway,
and you know, take a break and you know.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
Yeah, But for New Orleans, JazzFest is like, you know,
it's like the big it's the big event every year,
so it's exciting.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Well, I'm sure as a local you stay far the
fuck away from Marty Gras.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
Oh no, that's not true.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
As a local, you go right to the center of
Marty Gras. But there's so many ways to do it,
you know, so you do it however you want.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
But no, I mean everyone.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
While you down on like Bourbon Street, because I was
only there once and it was one of the craziest
times ever.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Yes, it's it's I mean, there's so many ways to
do it. Like I said, like, you know, depending on
where you live in the city, it's a different experience,
but it's everyone embraces the chaos for the most part.
I mean, it's it's a beautiful, beautiful time.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well, I mean it's a great city.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
All The last time I was there, I was there
with the like a press trip, and they fed us
so much. I was so sick for like three days
after because yeah, they were like, okay, I was there
with Hilton to see Alo Black for this thing they
were doing, and literally you every ten minutes.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Yeah, yeah, I'm sort of used to that because like
that's how it is when I visit my family in Italy.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
They just feed you, feed, feed you, feed you.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
And I've never been more sick than my first trip
to Italy. And in New Orleans, it's you know, it's similar.
It's like showing your love through food.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
And yeah, we're gonna start with this, I mean, because
this but it's funny because I remember years ago, right,
Billy Corgan, who I love, He's been a friend forever,
he did an interview with Zaye Love where Zaane asked
him about his success in the nineties and Billy being
a total asshole, which he will readily admit, gave this
(04:16):
really sarcastic answer about like always the right water, the
right chicken potcop chicken pacada, and it kind of became
a joke between us as to what food fuels the record.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
So, for you, who splits between New.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Orleans and Italy, which are two of the greatest food
places in the entire universe, what food fueled this record?
Speaker 4 (04:40):
Well, I had the idea to make the album called
Diavolo while eating Diavla pizza, So quite literally, pizza was
an important part of my record.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Okay, wait for those of us unfamiliar, what exactly is
the ala pizza?
Speaker 4 (05:07):
Diavla pizza is spicy, so it's like a spicier salami,
and uh it's done different ways, but I like it
with like they a lot of times there's peppers and
then like a spicy, a very spicy salami.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Interesting sopt for you is a spicy record?
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Yeah, I mean Diavela is a character that is.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Able to express some of the emotions that I was
uncomfortable expressing one of them being anger. So yeah, she's spicy,
and it's you know, she's able to like hold these polarities.
(05:54):
So it's like Diavola is holding desire and melancholy, optimism
and perfectionism, and also like angel and devil. Yeah, but
so the heat is definitely there, and I also feel
I mean, she's Italian, so.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, spicy.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
This is fascinating though, because I had a great conversation
yesterday with Alana Springsteen.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Do you know her, the country artist?
Speaker 4 (06:25):
No?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Well, we were talking about she has now about coming out.
I hope it heals. But what was interesting was there
was a song on there that called no Man, about
being you know, not being able to be chamed, of
being independent. And I asked her about the fact that
is it easier for you to write about autobiographically in
(06:47):
third person?
Speaker 1 (06:48):
And is Diablo easier sometimes?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Is it sometimes easier to put yourself out there in
a third person character?
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Yeah, this was my first time doing that and I
did fine. I don't know if it's easier, but I
did find it necessary in this situation, and I totally
through this experience understood why people form like alter egos.
You know, like slim shady or something like. I I
feel like I understand that better, like because you can.
(07:19):
It's all you still, but you're just you're wearing a
mask in order to like tell the truth, you know.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
So, first of all, obvious question, will Diavlo now extend
to be an alter ego?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Will we see her like in a graphic.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Comic or in a play or like, you know, she's
important to me so maybe I don't know. I can't
say I will see It's plain.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Why was it easier for you? Do you think to
use this character and tell the truth though?
Speaker 4 (07:55):
Because so many of the things that I was wanted
to talk about were things that I would feel ashamed
of expressing. So you know, vanity, anger, jealousy not attractive qualities,
you know. And I wanted there to be a character
(08:20):
for whom it was okay, a lovable character for whom
it was okay.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
See.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
That's so fascinated me though, because those are all human emotions.
So when you think back on it, once you put
them out there through a character, does it become easier
to admit them in yourself?
Speaker 4 (08:38):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (08:39):
I think so, but not immediately. Yeah, I've sort of
had to accept.
Speaker 4 (08:45):
I think it's so much about you know, girlhood and
womanhood that makes us.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Feel the need to be perfect, and so.
Speaker 4 (09:02):
Trying to accept, yes, trying.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
To accept you know, certain things was hard for me.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Does music make it easier?
Speaker 4 (09:22):
Music is a space for my Yeah, probably, I mean
I've always had music. Even just listening to music, it
connects you so much to like human you know, it
connects you to something other than your own you know,
(09:45):
life and problems. It connects you to something that feels
very deep and powerful. So I sometimes I feel like
emotions are in that you know, they're swirling around and
the mystery of it all know, it's all in there,
and I think that anytime I'm able to tap into that,
(10:07):
it's a helpful in like day to day life.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
It's interesting having talked to you a million songwriters, literally
every damn songwriter who ever lived. Everyone will tell you
that they have no idea where songwriter it comes from
it and it's a form of channeling that the antenna
goes up. So have you found that since you were
a kid, and like when you write your own songs,
do you find that it kind of just again, sometimes
(10:33):
it just comes from nowhere? Or a lot of times
people tell me it's like the subconscious. And you know
what's fascinating is the number of times people tell me
they have no idea what the hell the song is
about until sometimes a year later, sometimes ten years later
or not any Franco's case. Speaking of Orleans, she said
it takes her twenty years to know what the album
is about.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
That's cool. Yeah, I really feel grateful.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
I'm not a you know, I don't feel like I'm
a very prolific songwriter. Like it takes me sometimes a
long time to write things, and so I feel kind
of grateful whenever I.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Have inspiration and yeah, it's it's something you can't you
certainly can't force it.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
I kind of relate to the I think it was
like Michael Angelo who said about like sculpture that you
like inside every rock you have to find the sculpture,
and like I kind of relate to that, because.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
Like maybe your rock is your idea or.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Something, and sometimes things flow out and you don't need
to spend so much time chiseling. Like Bossy Nova for example,
kind of just flowed out. But like Diavolo song was
way more about parsoning through things and rejecting things to finally,
you know, I had the initial idea, but to really
just find the it was frustrating to find the the
(12:13):
art within the concept.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
That's funny though, because I've seen it on both sides.
Neil Diamond was telling me, he's like, sweet Caroline just
came from God. He's like, but when I was writing
Guy and I said, he's like, one of us was
gonna die writing that song. He's like, it was so difficult.
It was either me or the song was not going
to make it.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
So you mentioned bosson No but I love that song,
and we were interviewing Belbo Bell. It's still early in
La but Bell Shiberto a few years ago on a
zoom and you literally described the world that I was
like looking at. So for you, is that like what
does that world mean to you? And did it come easily?
(12:53):
Did you like paint that picture easily?
Speaker 4 (12:56):
Yeah, that song came. I've never had an experience like
that before or after. It came extremely easily. And it's
a song about like escapism. It's a song about some
you know, a fantasy and ultimately choosing you know, the
reality of working towards a dream. But yeah, it literally,
(13:17):
it just really poured out in kind of complete in
a complete form. And maybe it's the effortlessness of bossa
Nova and and how inspired I was by that. And yeah,
I'm not sure that, but that image of relaxation and
(13:39):
rest comes easily.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, you know, Niki once told me, he's like, you
write as a singer, what it is you're longing for.
If you're happy, you write sad songs. If you're sad,
you write happy songs. So was this a time where
you just needed that vacation.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
I needed that vacation. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
I needed to be like relieve some of the pressure.
I needed a break.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Did you get the break or did the song by
the break?
Speaker 3 (14:24):
The song was the break?
Speaker 4 (14:27):
Yeah. So not like I don't take breaks. I feel
like I'm good a relaxing but I don't. I don't
take it often, but when I do, I'm good at it.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Okay, Well, I have been asking people anyway, Yeah, the
Great Escape song, because I was talking to so many
different artists about this, and music is an escape. It
allows you to travel to different places, different times. You know,
I was thinking about it. It's like the only thing
that allows you to travel through time, you hear a
song that you think about when you were like six
years old and it takes you back there. So for you,
(15:02):
what is your great escape song, the one that just
takes you either back in time or out of this world?
Speaker 4 (15:11):
You know. I don't know if it's a particular song,
but my great escape is Billie Holiday. So if I
need to, I use her music now as like a
what's it called, like a great self regulation like I
put if I'm feeling crazy or nervous, I consistently play
(15:34):
Billy Holiday and it calms me down.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
It's my escape. It's like my like she's like my rock.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
And without fail just really centers me and it takes
me to like a place of kind of reminds me
of being a child.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
And also being understood.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
That's interesting. I mean, what is it about her that
you think makes you feel understood?
Speaker 3 (16:07):
I don't know, I've never known.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Which probably part of the appeal.
Speaker 4 (16:13):
Yeah, something about her is just so reassuring to me,
Like and talk about that's interesting what Nick Cave said.
I like that she has a voice that's like so
(16:35):
much emotion in it, So sometimes I feel like she's
carrying a lot of large spectrum of emotion. So like
sometimes she's singing a sad song but she has this,
you know, this lovingness to it, or she's singing a
happy song but it sounds quite sad. And so just
(16:56):
like balancing that those like contradictions, I guess makes me
feel really understood. And she's so effortless, like like as
if it doesn't matter, as if nothing matters.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
And I love that.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
That funny though, because I think whenever you know, it's
not effortless. But that's the way that you tell someone
is great at something when they make it look easy.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Yeah, So here are some other examples for you than
people who and I always find this interesting, people who
make it look effortless, who are great at it. And
it doesn't have to just be in music, but people
you just watch. My favorite story of all time was
there was a dude Jerry Shilling. Do you know who
Jerry is?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Is he his sports?
Speaker 4 (17:43):
No?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
He was part of the Elvis Memphis mafia and people
he knew Elvis, and he managed the Beach Boys for
a while.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Long story short. He told this great story once to
me that he had.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Invited Will Chamberlain to see Elvis play in Vegas and
he was like asking me Elvis as a favor, just
be nice to him. I don't you know, I knew
you don't really follow basketball, but be nice to him.
And Elvis was totally fucking with him, and it was like, dude,
I don't care now. And then in the middle of
the show, Elvis shouted out Wilt and then Will went
(18:16):
backstage after the show and they had this great meeting
and Jerry was like, I didn't even know you knew
who he was. And Elvis goes number one, always looks
out for number one, and I thought that was so
fascinating because.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
You'd learned from great people in every field.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
Well, another person like that for me is there's an
artist that I'm really obsessed with, Tracy Emmon, and I'm
just a huge fan like i've been and also like
the director Luca Guardanino. I've been as inspired by Luca
Guardanino and Tracy Emmon as I have by Billie Holiday.
(19:01):
Like it feels that much aligned with like art that
I want to make. And yeah, I'm especially lately I
feel like I get really inspired sometimes by things that
aren't music at all.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Yeah, because you probably see different aspects of what you do,
you know, so it makes it interesting and it's just
a different youtail.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Actually aspects of what I want to do.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Yeah, all right, So what's a film, for example, that
makes you think of something you want to do?
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Well, Luca go, I have so many. I've been so
into films lately.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
But well, I just actually watched a great film, but
I watched In the Mood for Love, which was incredible,
which has a similar kind of feeling as a lot
of Luca Guarino films, maybe my favorite.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
One being I Am Love, And the feeling of it
is like it makes it feel like we're all in,
like our flaws are inherent, and the messiness of life is.
Speaker 4 (20:19):
Expected, and is like like there there's nothing wrong, Like
it makes me feel so accepting of.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
And that there's beauty even.
Speaker 6 (20:32):
In chaos, betrayal, heartbreak, loneliness, and that these are just
elements of everyone's life and that.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
And and and then and the mundane, and that it's
it's it's okay and it's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Well, as an artist, don't you almost have to feel
that way because that feels so much art. And I'm
not one of those people who, by the way, believes
that you know, you cannot make art when you're happy.
I think that's a terrible, terrible, terrible, you know idea,
because I've talked to a lot of artists who are
very successful, who are happy. But again, there is certainly,
you know, something to be said for great art that
(21:25):
comes from you know, even because even if you're the
happiest person, you've experienced loss, you've experienced betrayal, you know, you've.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Experienced all of that. It's just part of life.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
As I who said, if you haven't died a few
times by if you haven't almost died by a certain age,
you haven't lived.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Yeah. I got a lot of that out of the
way when I was young.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
Well wait, you can't say that and then not tell
me like a story.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
Oh well, I was very reckless in my early adulthood.
And that was sort of before I started taking I
mean I took I always took music seriously. But there
was a when I was twenty one, I moved back
to the US and I had been studying abroad, and
(22:18):
I kind of tried to quit school.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
And was just kind of being.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
A really reckless nomad and.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
And almost died. I feel like a couple of times.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
And at one point I was like looking out at
the ocean, and I was with all of these people
who felt that they had found I don't know, like
the secret of their life, and they were all from
different places in the world, and they had all found
this way that they wanted to live, which was just
(22:57):
sort of travel And.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
Yeah, I guess the key for them was traveled.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
They're like, we're free, you know, because we are We're
we Yeah, we're traveling and we are kind of nomadic.
And I was part of that for a second, and
then I just was looking out.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
I was like, no, there's something else I have to do.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
And I that's when I got really serious about music,
and I moved back because I thought that would be
the best way to do it, and I started singing
like professionally at that point, or more seriously professionally. But yeah,
before that, I was just you know, meeting strangers and
doing things.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
All right, Well, I want to ask you what things?
But it's funny do you find out that having done
that and experience that that too things One do you
kind of feel like you got the wildest out of
the way, and two that you are enjoying music more.
Speaker 4 (24:03):
I'm glad it happened that way. It wasn't with much
like I didn't plan it that way, and I don't
I think, yeah, I'm.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Glad that I experienced like just.
Speaker 4 (24:18):
It's good to have, Like I actually like structure now,
and it takes a lot of like unstructured living for
somebody like me to finally come around to try to
appreciate structure.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
You know, I don't think I enjoy music more. I think.
Speaker 4 (24:39):
I think, yeah, it makes me more aware of the
world and it's fringes and it's corners and and that's
all information that bounces around in my head and heart.
(25:03):
And I imagine it's probably good for art. It's good
to it's good to know what's out there and how
you relate to it.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Absolutely, Okay, Maybe the question is not do you appreciate
music more, but like the situation you're in now, does
it give you a deeper appreciation for now having your
first record coming out on Blue Note and being in
this position where you know, having gotten sort of like
well again, having died multiple nearly died multiple times, which
(25:40):
I've done as well, like you realize like all right, cool,
you did that, you survived it, and now you're in
this place where, like, you know, you get to do
something you love in this structured environment and you enjoy it.
And again, you know, when you like have the somatic
lifestyle or are what crazy shit happens whatever, and then
you get to like fulfill a dura you know of
(26:01):
like playing with Joshua and putting out your own record
on Blue Note, you know, which is so iconic. Do
you feel like like you can sort of It's funny,
Like again, I remember having this conversation with someone when
you know, when you're in your twenties, you kind of
assume everything is just gonna be like the same great
way it was, and then you get older and realize, like, fuck,
(26:24):
that was amazing. I just wish I had known at
the time that, you know, I'm not going to meet
fucking Chuck Berry, little Richard of bo Didley every night
at awards show.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
Right, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:35):
I think like I think when I was young, I
had the feeling that there would be so many nights
like this, there would be so many loves like this,
there would.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Be so many chances and it's not true.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
It's like, actually life changes and there's no more nights
like that, and I can have new nights that are
the best nights of my life now, but they're never
going to be like that.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
It's just always changing.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
It's always different, and I wasn't aware of that. So
I don't look back thinking though those were those were
so much better. I guess I'm glad I did it
because I don't. I don't have regrets about not living
when I was, you know, a really young adult, even
if I kind of did do it dangerously.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
I think I'm more happy. I'm more I have more.
Speaker 4 (27:41):
Gratitudes for the life that I live now because of
more like coming out and getting out of you know,
relationships that were really you know, to holding me back.
There were so many of those relationships. We're really hard,
(28:04):
more so than near death experiences, you know, like getting
through to a place where I feel supported and I'm
strong enough to follow. I don't know, it's more about
building a life where I can try to. Yeah, I
(28:30):
don't know, but well, but yeah, I am grateful for
everything I've experienced.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
I'm grateful to be where I am because.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
It's and I wouldn't be here without everything that's happened
in the past.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
I guess.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
So how do you celebrate release Day, by the way,
which is coming up next week.
Speaker 4 (28:54):
Well, I'm doing an album listening party tomorrow, so it'll
be before the record, which is fun. A gig in
New Orleans also before the record on Friday. But then
on May one, which is when the record comes out,
I'm gonna all be in New York and we'll be
at Birdland for three nights and then just a little
tour on the East Coast and the Midwest from there.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Very cool all right, by the way, speaking of the record,
because of course we go off on tangents, because that's
just the way I do interviews.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
But it is so wonderful, and you know, it's funny.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
Of all the songs, I do think Bossy Nova is
the one I gravitated to mostly, but well because again,
like I said, it paints such an image. However, I
did a book a couple of years ago called Anthems
We Love, where I talked with all these different iconic
songwriters and artists about songs that you know, evolved in
the anthems, and I was very fortunate to speak to
(29:47):
Mary Manila, who have all of.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
These amazing songs shows could it be Magic? So I
have a deep history with that song. So the obvious
first question why that song?
Speaker 4 (29:58):
So that song I totally a tribute to Joshua. We
were doing the where we tour, which of course was
about places in the US, and so when we would
tour and go to Europe or anywhere.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
We would always choose a song from that place.
Speaker 4 (30:19):
So one of our first stops was actually Warsaw, poland
first stops outside of the US, and we couldn't find
a song for Warsaw. Like we were struggling, and for
a lot of places it was easy or just took
some digging, but.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
Finding a Polish song was just tough. So Josh had
the idea to do.
Speaker 4 (30:47):
Well. He was thinking about Chopin's from Warsaw, and that
song could It Be Magic is really based on a
Chopin prelude. So that's why we did that song in Warsaw,
and we loved it so much that it became a
regular part of the repertoire. And it was really just
(31:07):
like we had sort of a different arrangement of it
with Josh's group, and it really grew to be one
of our favorites. And then when it was time to
record my record, he had to convince me to put
it on and we sort of readid the arrangement for
my band, and I'm really glad it's there because it's
also not only is it an epic song and you know,
(31:29):
a beautiful song, but but it's a kind of a
like a memory from my most recent you know, touring
with Josh.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
What's funny that he shows that one though, because in
the when I was talking with Barry about it, he
said that that's his song that will most be remembered
by musicians like him. It's his most musical song.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
It's it is so musical.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
I also love the factor the way that he described
it as a musical orgasm, because the way it so
did you find that singing it?
Speaker 3 (32:02):
That's what my grandma said. When my grandma heard it, she.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
Said, oh my gosh, it's like it's like an orgasm,
and I said, yes, it is. And in our arrangement
that I did with Josh, it kind of has two climaxes,
like it has a first one and then a second.
And I said, well it has two actually, and she
(32:25):
said even better.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Yeah, no, it is that way. It's it's I love
a slow build.
Speaker 4 (32:33):
I love it's so fun to like build that tension
and keep going and keep going. And Josh is so
good at that, Like that's something that he often kind
of creates and sculpts throughout, you know, throughout a show
(32:53):
and also throughout a song or even just a sections.
But he's an amazing like energy.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
You know, channeler. So I learned from the best.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
Well, the record was, as far as I know, it
was co produced by with Josh, En Dawn and Correct Correct. So,
I mean, you know, two I've interviewed both of them
multiple times, two brilliant guys. I mean, for you, what
do you learn being around that? And again, I'm always
of the opinion that, like, you know, even if it's
just cos mosts you learned being around great people.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Yeah you do. I don't know. It's like.
Speaker 4 (33:30):
I think, I guess I'm as I'm stepping out in
band leading again in the past year, I realize all
the things I learned from Josh, you know, which is
a lot, uh just you know, how to I think
I'm learning more.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
Trust in myself.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Because they trust themselves, which is really beautiful to see,
and they trust me and so if I'm the only
one not trusting me, something needs to change, you know.
So I think that's what been one of my biggest
lessons of learning from great artists and great musicians is
(34:15):
just continuing to strengthen that inner, inner trust which makes
all of the best musical decisions.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
And God for.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Well, I've also pat to targeting people just generally, as
you get older, you get more comfortable, you get more
confident in yourself. So do you feel like it's a
combination to you of like this is happening at the
right time where now you're in position to like embrace
these sort of changes and different things and trust your
own distinc I can decide if I want to say,
(35:02):
decisions or instincts. So if you want to trust your
own decisions more.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
Yeah, I do think it has come at the right time.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
And I'm really grateful for that, I think, and that's,
you know, probably not a coincidence.
Speaker 3 (35:18):
I think. I'm I think there's a part of.
Speaker 4 (35:25):
Me that will always be fragile, but I'm I'm I'm living.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
And I'm not, you know, so ashamed. I'm not.
Speaker 4 (35:48):
I'm not a young girl, you know, and I don't
feel like one. And and I think that that's kind
of it's it feels necessary in this dustry to really
be able to stand in your own you know, truth,
to say a cliche and fight for it, and to recognize,
(36:14):
you know, to try to recognize what you're offering.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
And two yeah, just under I.
Speaker 4 (36:22):
Don't know, just it's it's it's helped to it's helped
to age. It really has.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
It's funny that you say industry though, I mean once
you just say in this world in general, I mean,
I think in most industries you have to be able
to you know, and I know that. I mean, I've
never been a young woman having so many female friends
and talking with them about it in different fields.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
Yeah, I mean I've never been in a different industry,
so it sort of is my world. Yeah, but I
think like there is in my personal life at least,
there's so much more places for me to hide, and
I don't I don't feel like I get challenged in
the same way that I do trying to make it
(37:14):
as an artist.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
And you really have to have a lot of nerve,
you know, and a lot of.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Yeah, you have to be able to to stand for
and fight for for what you want. And maybe that
does happen every day in the real world.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
But everything's the real world, you.
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Know, I was gonna say, I will wrap up in
a couple of minutes, but I was going to say,
what I've realized is, you know, I started to notice
this more and more.
Speaker 1 (37:49):
I mean, I've always been kind.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Of aware of you know, you think of all the
greatest artists, right whether you go from Jonie to Miles
to Prince, you know, to Billy Holiday to whoever, every
great artist in history. What made them unique is that
we're the type of person who could say fuck you
and do what they wanted to do. And like, again,
(38:10):
we're Neil Young and you're.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Gonna put out a crappy synth record in the eighties,
You're going to survive it and stilter around and be
like a great artist for fifty years.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (38:21):
Yes, I think I'm learning that. It took me a
second to you know, And that's what diabola is about.
It's like, yeah, you do have to say fuck you sometimes,
and or you won't make or you won't get to
you have to, you know. Yeah, And I think I'm
you know, it's been part of my life to try
(38:43):
to be accommodating, you know, and to be lovely to everyone,
but sometimes for your own health, for your own well being.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
You do have to, especially as an artist. That's like.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
No point in doing it if it's not coming from
you know, your higher calling.
Speaker 1 (39:06):
So you have to make space for that absolutely. So
what was your best fuck you moment?
Speaker 2 (39:13):
Not to say it's an artist, but just as a
person where you were just like, nah, dude, I'm done
with this shit. You know, whether it was throwing a
drink in someone's face or whatever, just that one great
up to this point, fuck you moment.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
I have a really good, like.
Speaker 4 (39:38):
It was really when I was making my first record,
I had a big fuck you moment. And the release
of that record and the finishing of that record coincided
with a breakup that really was fuck you worthy. And
(39:59):
I remember I was on the phone and I had
named the song after him, and it had his name
in it, and he didn't want his name in the title,
which is understandable, but he had already known his name
was in the title for you know, months and months
(40:19):
and months, and we had been breaking up for months
and months and anyway, so I was like, he said,
you know, I don't want Anober fighting. He said, he
doesn't want his name in it, but he had already
gone to be printed. The vinyl was already sent to
the like vinyl press, and I was like, okay, you know,
fuck you.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
I threw the phone down, hung up.
Speaker 4 (40:41):
On him, and I was so angry, and I was
it was the culmination of a relationship. It was a
culmination of It was, you know, the breaking point of
my patients with this particular relationship.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
And I was so like lit up.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
By my anger, and I like started walking pacing around
the house in the door out through like the backyard,
back out the other door. Like I was doing these
large paces, and I like needed to think of a
new title for the record, and I was like so livid,
(41:21):
and I I took a stopping point and I was thinking,
like what can I name the record?
Speaker 3 (41:28):
Or what can I name a song? What can I
name a song?
Speaker 4 (41:30):
And I was like, okay, it was you know, why
didn't he like it? It was supposed to be a
love song. It was supposed to be love song. And
then I was like, okay, that's the title. It was
supposed to be a love song. And so I just
like wrote it down really quick on a piece of
paper and kept pacing until I like calmed down.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
And later I was like I love that song title,
and then that was my fuck you. It wasn't a.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
True like I didn't I didn't throw water in his face.
I didn't have to, you know, or beer in his face.
Like I just made a better art because of because
of the fuck you and like we never and that
was the end of the relationship. But I never had
to really deal with it again, and I was able
(42:17):
to like move on.
Speaker 1 (42:19):
Obvious question, what's the greatest fuck you song?
Speaker 3 (42:23):
M so many?
Speaker 4 (42:25):
The first things that come to my head is like
some recent more recent ones, like I loved Scissor's fuck
You song.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
I love Amy Winehouse fuck Me Pumps.
Speaker 4 (42:37):
That's a fuck you to like some type of girls
she didn't like. But let me think about that harder.
Any beautiful song about heartbreak, there's so many is a
(43:00):
fuck you song, and it's so much like there's like
anytime you can make something beautiful out of a fuck you, Oh,
it's so great.
Speaker 3 (43:19):
So there's like infinite I don't.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Know there all right.
Speaker 2 (43:27):
Lastly, questions one, what's your best jazz best memory? Your
favorite jazz best like show or memory.
Speaker 3 (43:46):
My favorite jazz fest, memory or show. They're sort of
like two.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
I mean that was the first time I saw Irma
Thomas was at jazz Fest.
Speaker 3 (43:57):
And that kind of blew me away.
Speaker 4 (43:59):
I think was my first year at jazz Fest. And
she sang which I know she performed that with the
Rolling Stones too, but she sang her song time is
on my Side, Yes it is, and she is so
cute when she sings that song, and I love how
she sings it.
Speaker 3 (44:20):
I love how she says.
Speaker 4 (44:21):
Time and it's so different than how the Rolling Stones
do it, and you know it's her song, and yeah,
it just blew me away. I just totally love her.
But then performing probably I mean, actually I don't know why
I didn't think of this first. But my last show
(44:41):
with Joshua Redmond, the final show of our tour was
at jazz Fest, and it was so hot and I
was so sweaty. It was more sweaty than I've ever
been performing and it's outside, and I was so emotional
because it was our last show and these guys had
(45:03):
become my family and like Joshua Redmond had totally taken
my career to another level.
Speaker 3 (45:09):
And I was just so.
Speaker 4 (45:13):
Emotional and so I was. It was like a crazy
experience and just seeing my hometown and it was like
it was you know, an opening, uh headlining show at
the Jazz Tent, and it was just so many people
and I was just like overwhelmed and kind of went
into like a time warp and like none of my
(45:37):
senses were working properly, and I just like sag it's fun.
Speaker 1 (45:44):
Cool and your craziest, the craziest favorite Marty Gral moment.
Speaker 4 (45:52):
I mean, my first Marty Gral will always be my
craziest Marty Gral. I took you know, a cocktail of
drugs in the morning and then walked into the quarter
and was just blown away by the people and the
(46:17):
beauty and everyone dancing and you know, people had their
boobs out. It was just the most free celebration of
life I had ever seen. And it's like when it's
your first time, it's like, yeah, you can never never
(46:38):
repeat that.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
I try to repeat it every year. Never can.
Speaker 2 (46:43):
All right, I will wrap up on the album what
do you want to What do you take from the
album when you hear it?
Speaker 3 (46:48):
My album?
Speaker 5 (46:50):
Yeah, it's me.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
I mean, gosh, what I take from it and and
what others will take for it, I imagine is different.
Speaker 3 (47:07):
But for me, I.
Speaker 4 (47:10):
Really was trying to make sense of myself, and so
it's a beautiful record, like a beautiful snapshot of that,
and a recording of of a trying trying to accept
(47:38):
life and myself and trying trying to make you know it.
It's honest, and that was what I wanted it to be.
And so when I hear it, I hear myself trying,
you know, at at something, and.
Speaker 3 (48:01):
That's I'm proud of that. I think that's all all
I can do.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
Let's try, isn't it, Like you say, you imagine what
you and others will take from it are different, But
isn't the point of great art to be honest and
then for people to see themselves in it?
Speaker 3 (48:21):
Yeah, I think that's the gift of honesty.
Speaker 4 (48:24):
Like the more honest you're able to be, the more
potentially relatable it is, because underneath all all of our differences,
I do believe that we're all kind of the same.
Speaker 3 (48:38):
And it's.
Speaker 4 (48:41):
The best way that I have found to access that
is through music. And so the more honest you're able
to be in expressing something, the more others can feel
it because they have the same thing inside of them.
So that's always my hope that I've been able to
(49:03):
truly not lying to myself, not lying to you, tell
you how it is, tell you what it is, express
what it is, and that people can then take that
and do whatever they need to with it.
Speaker 3 (49:18):
But it frees them.
Speaker 4 (49:19):
Because because now they could experience that, it can get
to their heart, you know, it can. It can be
truth for them, which is different than mine, but truth nonetheless.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
Absolutely, So I have to ask, and this will be
the last question I promise, what to use the most
honest album as a fan?
Speaker 3 (49:39):
Mhm?
Speaker 4 (49:45):
I mean, my favorite albums aren't the most honest albums.
Speaker 3 (49:49):
And I think.
Speaker 4 (49:51):
Billie Holliday is so honest and that's something that I love.
Speaker 3 (49:56):
I think.
Speaker 4 (49:59):
Jeff Buckley Grace is an incredibly intimate, honest record. I
think Rosalia's first record, Los Angeles really really moves me
in that way, feels so honest. You know great any
(50:20):
great songwriter. You know James Taylor, Prince, you know DiAngelo.
These are honest people. You know. It's like I just
you know that it's real. It feels so so real,
(50:40):
and we recognize it.
Speaker 3 (50:42):
It's like.
Speaker 4 (50:45):
You never would have thought to say it like that,
but you get it.
Speaker 3 (50:51):
And that's what I love about.
Speaker 5 (50:54):
Music, very cool.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
Anything you want to add that and ask you about that.
We touched on the ship time, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (51:02):
We did.
Speaker 4 (51:03):
Sorry, I feel like you asked like specific questions, like
you know, what's this, like what's your favorite this, or
like it's so hard to choose.
Speaker 2 (51:13):
All right, there's no writer wrong answers, you know, and
no one's asking as a fan.
Speaker 4 (51:19):
Yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, I think we touched.
Speaker 3 (51:24):
On a lot. It's great.
Speaker 1 (51:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (51:26):
So I know you start the tour, as you said,
doing East and Midwest, and then I know you'll be
here in LA later in the year.
Speaker 4 (51:35):
Yes, doing a big West coast tour in the fall,
which I'm excited because, as you know, I'm a California girl.
Speaker 2 (51:46):
Well, well, we'll see you in the fall. And congratulations
again on the record. Great to see as it's
Hey to Steve Boton.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Welcome to Inserms of and this week I'm very honored
to welcome Gabrielle Cavasa, New Orleans based, this incredible jazz singer,
which is released her Blue Note debut Diaflo, co produced
by Joshua Redmond, who she toured with for about a
year as well as the Great Dog.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Was And you know, we talk about what she's learned
working with these great.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Artists as well as songwriting Italy and New Orleans, which
of course leads to soccer, food, touring, jazz Fez Marti
Gras so much and a really really interesting talk about songwriting.
Gabrielle is an incredibly smart person, great singer and a
(00:51):
lot of fun.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
So I hope you enjoyed this interview with a bunch
of the idea. Thanks. What was your one jazz best show?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Oh, it hasn't happened yet, it's on Friday.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Nice.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Yeah, very excited too good to at least do the
first weekend of jazz Fest and just you know, enjoy
everything that's happening here in New Orleans.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
All right, so how many times have you been, by
the way.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Did jazz Fest as a fan?
Speaker 5 (01:32):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (01:36):
Well, the first time I went to JazzFest was the
first year that I moved here, which was twenty eighteen.
Was my first jazz fest that I attended, and then
I think probably every year after that, I performed at
least with somebody or I got on stage somehow. Last
(01:57):
year I got to uh headline with Joshua Redman. And
then this year I'm actually not playing at the festival,
so it'll be my first year since twenty nineteen that
I haven't played the festival.
Speaker 1 (02:12):
Yeah, but you kind of have some other stuff going
on this year.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
I do, yeah, and hopefully I get in there next year.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
You know, it's probably good to like mix it up anyway,
and you know, take a break and you know.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
Yeah, But for New Orleans, JazzFest is like, you know,
it's like the big it's the big event every year,
so it's exciting.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Well, I'm sure as a local you stay far the
fuck away from Marty Gras.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
Oh no, that's not true.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
As a local, you go right to the center of
Marty Gras. But there's so many ways to do it,
you know, so you do it however you want.
Speaker 3 (02:48):
But no, I mean everyone.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
While you down on like Bourbon Street, because I was
only there once and it was one of the craziest
times ever.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Yes, it's it's I mean, there's so many ways to
do it. Like I said, like, you know, depending on
where you live in the city, it's a different experience,
but it's everyone embraces the chaos for the most part.
I mean, it's it's a beautiful, beautiful time.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Well, I mean it's a great city.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
All The last time I was there, I was there
with the like a press trip, and they fed us
so much. I was so sick for like three days
after because yeah, they were like, okay, I was there
with Hilton to see Alo Black for this thing they
were doing, and literally you every ten minutes.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Yeah, yeah, I'm sort of used to that because like
that's how it is when I visit my family in Italy.
Speaker 3 (03:44):
They just feed you, feed, feed you, feed you.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
And I've never been more sick than my first trip
to Italy. And in New Orleans, it's you know, it's similar.
It's like showing your love through food.
Speaker 2 (03:55):
And yeah, we're gonna start with this, I mean, because
this but it's funny because I remember years ago, right,
Billy Corgan, who I love, He's been a friend forever,
he did an interview with Zaye Love where Zaane asked
him about his success in the nineties and Billy being
a total asshole, which he will readily admit, gave this
(04:16):
really sarcastic answer about like always the right water, the
right chicken potcop chicken pacada, and it kind of became
a joke between us as to what food fuels the record.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
So, for you, who splits between New.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Orleans and Italy, which are two of the greatest food
places in the entire universe, what food fueled this record?
Speaker 4 (04:40):
Well, I had the idea to make the album called
Diavolo while eating Diavla pizza, So quite literally, pizza was
an important part of my record.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Okay, wait for those of us unfamiliar, what exactly is
the ala pizza?
Speaker 4 (05:07):
Diavla pizza is spicy, so it's like a spicier salami,
and uh it's done different ways, but I like it
with like they a lot of times there's peppers and
then like a spicy, a very spicy salami.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Interesting sopt for you is a spicy record?
Speaker 3 (05:27):
Yeah, I mean Diavela is a character that is.
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Able to express some of the emotions that I was
uncomfortable expressing one of them being anger. So yeah, she's spicy,
and it's you know, she's able to like hold these polarities.
(05:54):
So it's like Diavola is holding desire and melancholy, optimism
and perfectionism, and also like angel and devil. Yeah, but
so the heat is definitely there, and I also feel
I mean, she's Italian, so.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, spicy.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
This is fascinating though, because I had a great conversation
yesterday with Alana Springsteen.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Do you know her, the country artist?
Speaker 4 (06:25):
No?
Speaker 2 (06:26):
Well, we were talking about she has now about coming out.
I hope it heals. But what was interesting was there
was a song on there that called no Man, about
being you know, not being able to be chamed, of
being independent. And I asked her about the fact that
is it easier for you to write about autobiographically in
(06:47):
third person?
Speaker 1 (06:48):
And is Diablo easier sometimes?
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Is it sometimes easier to put yourself out there in
a third person character?
Speaker 4 (06:57):
Yeah, this was my first time doing that and I
did fine. I don't know if it's easier, but I
did find it necessary in this situation, and I totally
through this experience understood why people form like alter egos.
You know, like slim shady or something like. I I
feel like I understand that better, like because you can.
(07:19):
It's all you still, but you're just you're wearing a
mask in order to like tell the truth, you know.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
So, first of all, obvious question, will Diavlo now extend
to be an alter ego?
Speaker 1 (07:34):
Will we see her like in a graphic.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Comic or in a play or like, you know, she's
important to me so maybe I don't know. I can't
say I will see It's plain.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Why was it easier for you? Do you think to
use this character and tell the truth though?
Speaker 4 (07:55):
Because so many of the things that I was wanted
to talk about were things that I would feel ashamed
of expressing. So you know, vanity, anger, jealousy not attractive qualities,
you know. And I wanted there to be a character
(08:20):
for whom it was okay, a lovable character for whom
it was okay.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
See.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
That's so fascinated me though, because those are all human emotions.
So when you think back on it, once you put
them out there through a character, does it become easier
to admit them in yourself?
Speaker 4 (08:38):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (08:39):
I think so, but not immediately. Yeah, I've sort of
had to accept.
Speaker 4 (08:45):
I think it's so much about you know, girlhood and
womanhood that makes us.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Feel the need to be perfect, and so.
Speaker 4 (09:02):
Trying to accept, yes, trying.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
To accept you know, certain things was hard for me.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Does music make it easier?
Speaker 4 (09:22):
Music is a space for my Yeah, probably, I mean
I've always had music. Even just listening to music, it
connects you so much to like human you know, it
connects you to something other than your own you know,
(09:45):
life and problems. It connects you to something that feels
very deep and powerful. So I sometimes I feel like
emotions are in that you know, they're swirling around and
the mystery of it all know, it's all in there,
and I think that anytime I'm able to tap into that,
(10:07):
it's a helpful in like day to day life.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
It's interesting having talked to you a million songwriters, literally
every damn songwriter who ever lived. Everyone will tell you
that they have no idea where songwriter it comes from
it and it's a form of channeling that the antenna
goes up. So have you found that since you were
a kid, and like when you write your own songs,
do you find that it kind of just again, sometimes
(10:33):
it just comes from nowhere? Or a lot of times
people tell me it's like the subconscious. And you know
what's fascinating is the number of times people tell me
they have no idea what the hell the song is
about until sometimes a year later, sometimes ten years later
or not any Franco's case. Speaking of Orleans, she said
it takes her twenty years to know what the album
is about.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
That's cool. Yeah, I really feel grateful.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
I'm not a you know, I don't feel like I'm
a very prolific songwriter. Like it takes me sometimes a
long time to write things, and so I feel kind
of grateful whenever I.
Speaker 3 (11:19):
Have inspiration and yeah, it's it's something you can't you
certainly can't force it.
Speaker 4 (11:31):
I kind of relate to the I think it was
like Michael Angelo who said about like sculpture that you
like inside every rock you have to find the sculpture,
and like I kind of relate to that, because.
Speaker 3 (11:48):
Like maybe your rock is your idea or.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Something, and sometimes things flow out and you don't need
to spend so much time chiseling. Like Bossy Nova for example,
kind of just flowed out. But like Diavolo song was
way more about parsoning through things and rejecting things to finally,
you know, I had the initial idea, but to really
just find the it was frustrating to find the the
(12:13):
art within the concept.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
That's funny though, because I've seen it on both sides.
Neil Diamond was telling me, he's like, sweet Caroline just
came from God. He's like, but when I was writing
Guy and I said, he's like, one of us was
gonna die writing that song. He's like, it was so difficult.
It was either me or the song was not going
to make it.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
So you mentioned bosson No but I love that song,
and we were interviewing Belbo Bell. It's still early in
La but Bell Shiberto a few years ago on a
zoom and you literally described the world that I was
like looking at. So for you, is that like what
does that world mean to you? And did it come easily?
(12:53):
Did you like paint that picture easily?
Speaker 4 (12:56):
Yeah, that song came. I've never had an experience like
that before or after. It came extremely easily. And it's
a song about like escapism. It's a song about some
you know, a fantasy and ultimately choosing you know, the
reality of working towards a dream. But yeah, it literally,
(13:17):
it just really poured out in kind of complete in
a complete form. And maybe it's the effortlessness of bossa
Nova and and how inspired I was by that. And yeah,
I'm not sure that, but that image of relaxation and
(13:39):
rest comes easily.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, you know, Niki once told me, he's like, you
write as a singer, what it is you're longing for.
If you're happy, you write sad songs. If you're sad,
you write happy songs. So was this a time where
you just needed that vacation.
Speaker 3 (14:10):
I needed that vacation. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
I needed to be like relieve some of the pressure.
I needed a break.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Did you get the break or did the song by
the break?
Speaker 3 (14:24):
The song was the break?
Speaker 4 (14:27):
Yeah. So not like I don't take breaks. I feel
like I'm good a relaxing but I don't. I don't
take it often, but when I do, I'm good at it.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
Okay, Well, I have been asking people anyway, Yeah, the
Great Escape song, because I was talking to so many
different artists about this, and music is an escape. It
allows you to travel to different places, different times. You know,
I was thinking about it. It's like the only thing
that allows you to travel through time, you hear a
song that you think about when you were like six
years old and it takes you back there. So for you,
(15:02):
what is your great escape song, the one that just
takes you either back in time or out of this world?
Speaker 4 (15:11):
You know. I don't know if it's a particular song,
but my great escape is Billie Holiday. So if I
need to, I use her music now as like a
what's it called, like a great self regulation like I
put if I'm feeling crazy or nervous, I consistently play
(15:34):
Billy Holiday and it calms me down.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
It's my escape. It's like my like she's like my rock.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
And without fail just really centers me and it takes
me to like a place of kind of reminds me
of being a child.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
And also being understood.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
That's interesting. I mean, what is it about her that
you think makes you feel understood?
Speaker 3 (16:07):
I don't know, I've never known.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Which probably part of the appeal.
Speaker 4 (16:13):
Yeah, something about her is just so reassuring to me,
Like and talk about that's interesting what Nick Cave said.
I like that she has a voice that's like so
(16:35):
much emotion in it, So sometimes I feel like she's
carrying a lot of large spectrum of emotion. So like
sometimes she's singing a sad song but she has this,
you know, this lovingness to it, or she's singing a
happy song but it sounds quite sad. And so just
(16:56):
like balancing that those like contradictions, I guess makes me
feel really understood. And she's so effortless, like like as
if it doesn't matter, as if nothing matters.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
And I love that.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
That funny though, because I think whenever you know, it's
not effortless. But that's the way that you tell someone
is great at something when they make it look easy.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Yeah, So here are some other examples for you than
people who and I always find this interesting, people who
make it look effortless, who are great at it. And
it doesn't have to just be in music, but people
you just watch. My favorite story of all time was
there was a dude Jerry Shilling. Do you know who
Jerry is?
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Is he his sports?
Speaker 4 (17:43):
No?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
He was part of the Elvis Memphis mafia and people
he knew Elvis, and he managed the Beach Boys for
a while.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Long story short. He told this great story once to
me that he had.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Invited Will Chamberlain to see Elvis play in Vegas and
he was like asking me Elvis as a favor, just
be nice to him. I don't you know, I knew
you don't really follow basketball, but be nice to him.
And Elvis was totally fucking with him, and it was like, dude,
I don't care now. And then in the middle of
the show, Elvis shouted out Wilt and then Will went
(18:16):
backstage after the show and they had this great meeting
and Jerry was like, I didn't even know you knew
who he was. And Elvis goes number one, always looks
out for number one, and I thought that was so
fascinating because.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
You'd learned from great people in every field.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
Well, another person like that for me is there's an
artist that I'm really obsessed with, Tracy Emmon, and I'm
just a huge fan like i've been and also like
the director Luca Guardanino. I've been as inspired by Luca
Guardanino and Tracy Emmon as I have by Billie Holiday.
(19:01):
Like it feels that much aligned with like art that
I want to make. And yeah, I'm especially lately I
feel like I get really inspired sometimes by things that
aren't music at all.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Yeah, because you probably see different aspects of what you do,
you know, so it makes it interesting and it's just
a different youtail.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
Actually aspects of what I want to do.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
Yeah, all right, So what's a film, for example, that
makes you think of something you want to do?
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Well, Luca go, I have so many. I've been so
into films lately.
Speaker 4 (19:41):
But well, I just actually watched a great film, but
I watched In the Mood for Love, which was incredible,
which has a similar kind of feeling as a lot
of Luca Guarino films, maybe my favorite.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
One being I Am Love, And the feeling of it
is like it makes it feel like we're all in,
like our flaws are inherent, and the messiness of life is.
Speaker 4 (20:19):
Expected, and is like like there there's nothing wrong, Like
it makes me feel so accepting of.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
And that there's beauty even.
Speaker 6 (20:32):
In chaos, betrayal, heartbreak, loneliness, and that these are just
elements of everyone's life and that.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
And and and then and the mundane, and that it's
it's it's okay and it's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Well, as an artist, don't you almost have to feel
that way because that feels so much art. And I'm
not one of those people who, by the way, believes
that you know, you cannot make art when you're happy.
I think that's a terrible, terrible, terrible, you know idea,
because I've talked to a lot of artists who are
very successful, who are happy. But again, there is certainly,
you know, something to be said for great art that
(21:25):
comes from you know, even because even if you're the
happiest person, you've experienced loss, you've experienced betrayal, you know, you've.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
Experienced all of that. It's just part of life.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
As I who said, if you haven't died a few
times by if you haven't almost died by a certain age,
you haven't lived.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Yeah. I got a lot of that out of the
way when I was young.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
Well wait, you can't say that and then not tell
me like a story.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
Oh well, I was very reckless in my early adulthood.
And that was sort of before I started taking I
mean I took I always took music seriously. But there
was a when I was twenty one, I moved back
to the US and I had been studying abroad, and
(22:18):
I kind of tried to quit school.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
And was just kind of being.
Speaker 4 (22:24):
A really reckless nomad and.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
And almost died. I feel like a couple of times.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
And at one point I was like looking out at
the ocean, and I was with all of these people
who felt that they had found I don't know, like
the secret of their life, and they were all from
different places in the world, and they had all found
this way that they wanted to live, which was just
(22:57):
sort of travel And.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
Yeah, I guess the key for them was traveled.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
They're like, we're free, you know, because we are We're
we Yeah, we're traveling and we are kind of nomadic.
And I was part of that for a second, and
then I just was looking out.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
I was like, no, there's something else I have to do.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
And I that's when I got really serious about music,
and I moved back because I thought that would be
the best way to do it, and I started singing
like professionally at that point, or more seriously professionally. But yeah,
before that, I was just you know, meeting strangers and
doing things.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
All right, Well, I want to ask you what things?
But it's funny do you find out that having done
that and experience that that too things One do you
kind of feel like you got the wildest out of
the way, and two that you are enjoying music more.
Speaker 4 (24:03):
I'm glad it happened that way. It wasn't with much
like I didn't plan it that way, and I don't
I think, yeah, I'm.
Speaker 3 (24:12):
Glad that I experienced like just.
Speaker 4 (24:18):
It's good to have, Like I actually like structure now,
and it takes a lot of like unstructured living for
somebody like me to finally come around to try to
appreciate structure.
Speaker 3 (24:32):
You know, I don't think I enjoy music more. I think.
Speaker 4 (24:39):
I think, yeah, it makes me more aware of the
world and it's fringes and it's corners and and that's
all information that bounces around in my head and heart.
(25:03):
And I imagine it's probably good for art. It's good
to it's good to know what's out there and how
you relate to it.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Absolutely, Okay, Maybe the question is not do you appreciate
music more, but like the situation you're in now, does
it give you a deeper appreciation for now having your
first record coming out on Blue Note and being in
this position where you know, having gotten sort of like
well again, having died multiple nearly died multiple times, which
(25:40):
I've done as well, like you realize like all right, cool,
you did that, you survived it, and now you're in
this place where, like, you know, you get to do
something you love in this structured environment and you enjoy it.
And again, you know, when you like have the somatic
lifestyle or are what crazy shit happens whatever, and then
you get to like fulfill a dura you know of
(26:01):
like playing with Joshua and putting out your own record
on Blue Note, you know, which is so iconic. Do
you feel like like you can sort of It's funny,
Like again, I remember having this conversation with someone when
you know, when you're in your twenties, you kind of
assume everything is just gonna be like the same great
way it was, and then you get older and realize, like, fuck,
(26:24):
that was amazing. I just wish I had known at
the time that, you know, I'm not going to meet
fucking Chuck Berry, little Richard of bo Didley every night
at awards show.
Speaker 3 (26:32):
Right, Yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:35):
I think like I think when I was young, I
had the feeling that there would be so many nights
like this, there would be so many loves like this,
there would.
Speaker 3 (26:52):
Be so many chances and it's not true.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
It's like, actually life changes and there's no more nights
like that, and I can have new nights that are
the best nights of my life now, but they're never
going to be like that.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
It's just always changing.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
It's always different, and I wasn't aware of that. So
I don't look back thinking though those were those were
so much better. I guess I'm glad I did it
because I don't. I don't have regrets about not living
when I was, you know, a really young adult, even
if I kind of did do it dangerously.
Speaker 3 (27:37):
I think I'm more happy. I'm more I have more.
Speaker 4 (27:41):
Gratitudes for the life that I live now because of
more like coming out and getting out of you know,
relationships that were really you know, to holding me back.
There were so many of those relationships. We're really hard,
(28:04):
more so than near death experiences, you know, like getting
through to a place where I feel supported and I'm
strong enough to follow. I don't know, it's more about
building a life where I can try to. Yeah, I
(28:30):
don't know, but well, but yeah, I am grateful for
everything I've experienced.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
I'm grateful to be where I am because.
Speaker 4 (28:43):
It's and I wouldn't be here without everything that's happened
in the past.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
I guess.
Speaker 1 (28:49):
So how do you celebrate release Day, by the way,
which is coming up next week.
Speaker 4 (28:54):
Well, I'm doing an album listening party tomorrow, so it'll
be before the record, which is fun. A gig in
New Orleans also before the record on Friday. But then
on May one, which is when the record comes out,
I'm gonna all be in New York and we'll be
at Birdland for three nights and then just a little
tour on the East Coast and the Midwest from there.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Very cool all right, by the way, speaking of the record,
because of course we go off on tangents, because that's
just the way I do interviews.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
But it is so wonderful, and you know, it's funny.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
Of all the songs, I do think Bossy Nova is
the one I gravitated to mostly, but well because again,
like I said, it paints such an image. However, I
did a book a couple of years ago called Anthems
We Love, where I talked with all these different iconic
songwriters and artists about songs that you know, evolved in
the anthems, and I was very fortunate to speak to
(29:47):
Mary Manila, who have all of.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
These amazing songs shows could it be Magic? So I
have a deep history with that song. So the obvious
first question why that song?
Speaker 4 (29:58):
So that song I totally a tribute to Joshua. We
were doing the where we tour, which of course was
about places in the US, and so when we would
tour and go to Europe or anywhere.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
We would always choose a song from that place.
Speaker 4 (30:19):
So one of our first stops was actually Warsaw, poland
first stops outside of the US, and we couldn't find
a song for Warsaw. Like we were struggling, and for
a lot of places it was easy or just took
some digging, but.
Speaker 3 (30:36):
Finding a Polish song was just tough. So Josh had
the idea to do.
Speaker 4 (30:47):
Well. He was thinking about Chopin's from Warsaw, and that
song could It Be Magic is really based on a
Chopin prelude. So that's why we did that song in Warsaw,
and we loved it so much that it became a
regular part of the repertoire. And it was really just
(31:07):
like we had sort of a different arrangement of it
with Josh's group, and it really grew to be one
of our favorites. And then when it was time to
record my record, he had to convince me to put
it on and we sort of readid the arrangement for
my band, and I'm really glad it's there because it's
also not only is it an epic song and you know,
(31:29):
a beautiful song, but but it's a kind of a
like a memory from my most recent you know, touring
with Josh.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
What's funny that he shows that one though, because in
the when I was talking with Barry about it, he
said that that's his song that will most be remembered
by musicians like him. It's his most musical song.
Speaker 3 (31:52):
It's it is so musical.
Speaker 4 (31:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
I also love the factor the way that he described
it as a musical orgasm, because the way it so
did you find that singing it?
Speaker 3 (32:02):
That's what my grandma said. When my grandma heard it, she.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
Said, oh my gosh, it's like it's like an orgasm,
and I said, yes, it is. And in our arrangement
that I did with Josh, it kind of has two climaxes,
like it has a first one and then a second.
And I said, well it has two actually, and she
(32:25):
said even better.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
Yeah, no, it is that way. It's it's I love
a slow build.
Speaker 4 (32:33):
I love it's so fun to like build that tension
and keep going and keep going. And Josh is so
good at that, Like that's something that he often kind
of creates and sculpts throughout, you know, throughout a show
(32:53):
and also throughout a song or even just a sections.
But he's an amazing like energy.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
You know, channeler. So I learned from the best.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
Well, the record was, as far as I know, it
was co produced by with Josh, En Dawn and Correct Correct. So,
I mean, you know, two I've interviewed both of them
multiple times, two brilliant guys. I mean, for you, what
do you learn being around that? And again, I'm always
of the opinion that, like, you know, even if it's
just cos mosts you learned being around great people.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Yeah you do. I don't know. It's like.
Speaker 4 (33:30):
I think, I guess I'm as I'm stepping out in
band leading again in the past year, I realize all
the things I learned from Josh, you know, which is
a lot, uh just you know, how to I think
I'm learning more.
Speaker 3 (33:51):
Trust in myself.
Speaker 4 (33:54):
Because they trust themselves, which is really beautiful to see,
and they trust me and so if I'm the only
one not trusting me, something needs to change, you know.
So I think that's what been one of my biggest
lessons of learning from great artists and great musicians is
(34:15):
just continuing to strengthen that inner, inner trust which makes
all of the best musical decisions.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
And God for.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Well, I've also pat to targeting people just generally, as
you get older, you get more comfortable, you get more
confident in yourself. So do you feel like it's a
combination to you of like this is happening at the
right time where now you're in position to like embrace
these sort of changes and different things and trust your
own distinc I can decide if I want to say,
(35:02):
decisions or instincts. So if you want to trust your
own decisions more.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
Yeah, I do think it has come at the right time.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
And I'm really grateful for that, I think, and that's,
you know, probably not a coincidence.
Speaker 3 (35:18):
I think. I'm I think there's a part of.
Speaker 4 (35:25):
Me that will always be fragile, but I'm I'm I'm living.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
And I'm not, you know, so ashamed. I'm not.
Speaker 4 (35:48):
I'm not a young girl, you know, and I don't
feel like one. And and I think that that's kind
of it's it feels necessary in this dustry to really
be able to stand in your own you know, truth,
to say a cliche and fight for it, and to recognize,
(36:14):
you know, to try to recognize what you're offering.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
And two yeah, just under I.
Speaker 4 (36:22):
Don't know, just it's it's it's helped to it's helped
to age. It really has.
Speaker 1 (36:30):
It's funny that you say industry though, I mean once
you just say in this world in general, I mean,
I think in most industries you have to be able
to you know, and I know that. I mean, I've
never been a young woman having so many female friends
and talking with them about it in different fields.
Speaker 4 (36:51):
Yeah, I mean I've never been in a different industry,
so it sort of is my world. Yeah, but I
think like there is in my personal life at least,
there's so much more places for me to hide, and
I don't I don't feel like I get challenged in
the same way that I do trying to make it
(37:14):
as an artist.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
And you really have to have a lot of nerve,
you know, and a lot of.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Yeah, you have to be able to to stand for
and fight for for what you want. And maybe that
does happen every day in the real world.
Speaker 3 (37:38):
But everything's the real world, you.
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Know, I was gonna say, I will wrap up in
a couple of minutes, but I was going to say,
what I've realized is, you know, I started to notice
this more and more.
Speaker 1 (37:49):
I mean, I've always been kind.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Of aware of you know, you think of all the
greatest artists, right whether you go from Jonie to Miles
to Prince, you know, to Billy Holiday to whoever, every
great artist in history. What made them unique is that
we're the type of person who could say fuck you
and do what they wanted to do. And like, again,
(38:10):
we're Neil Young and you're.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
Gonna put out a crappy synth record in the eighties,
You're going to survive it and stilter around and be
like a great artist for fifty years.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (38:21):
Yes, I think I'm learning that. It took me a
second to you know, And that's what diabola is about.
It's like, yeah, you do have to say fuck you sometimes,
and or you won't make or you won't get to
you have to, you know. Yeah, And I think I'm
you know, it's been part of my life to try
(38:43):
to be accommodating, you know, and to be lovely to everyone,
but sometimes for your own health, for your own well being.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
You do have to, especially as an artist. That's like.
Speaker 4 (39:00):
No point in doing it if it's not coming from
you know, your higher calling.
Speaker 1 (39:06):
So you have to make space for that absolutely. So
what was your best fuck you moment?
Speaker 2 (39:13):
Not to say it's an artist, but just as a
person where you were just like, nah, dude, I'm done
with this shit. You know, whether it was throwing a
drink in someone's face or whatever, just that one great
up to this point, fuck you moment.
Speaker 3 (39:32):
I have a really good, like.
Speaker 4 (39:38):
It was really when I was making my first record,
I had a big fuck you moment. And the release
of that record and the finishing of that record coincided
with a breakup that really was fuck you worthy. And
(39:59):
I remember I was on the phone and I had
named the song after him, and it had his name
in it, and he didn't want his name in the title,
which is understandable, but he had already known his name
was in the title for you know, months and months
(40:19):
and months, and we had been breaking up for months
and months and anyway, so I was like, he said,
you know, I don't want Anober fighting. He said, he
doesn't want his name in it, but he had already
gone to be printed. The vinyl was already sent to
the like vinyl press, and I was like, okay, you know,
fuck you.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
I threw the phone down, hung up.
Speaker 4 (40:41):
On him, and I was so angry, and I was
it was the culmination of a relationship. It was a
culmination of It was, you know, the breaking point of
my patients with this particular relationship.
Speaker 3 (40:55):
And I was so like lit up.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
By my anger, and I like started walking pacing around
the house in the door out through like the backyard,
back out the other door. Like I was doing these
large paces, and I like needed to think of a
new title for the record, and I was like so livid,
(41:21):
and I I took a stopping point and I was thinking,
like what can I name the record?
Speaker 3 (41:28):
Or what can I name a song? What can I
name a song?
Speaker 4 (41:30):
And I was like, okay, it was you know, why
didn't he like it? It was supposed to be a
love song. It was supposed to be love song. And
then I was like, okay, that's the title. It was
supposed to be a love song. And so I just
like wrote it down really quick on a piece of
paper and kept pacing until I like calmed down.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
And later I was like I love that song title,
and then that was my fuck you. It wasn't a.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
True like I didn't I didn't throw water in his face.
I didn't have to, you know, or beer in his face.
Like I just made a better art because of because
of the fuck you and like we never and that
was the end of the relationship. But I never had
to really deal with it again, and I was able
(42:17):
to like move on.
Speaker 1 (42:19):
Obvious question, what's the greatest fuck you song?
Speaker 3 (42:23):
M so many?
Speaker 4 (42:25):
The first things that come to my head is like
some recent more recent ones, like I loved Scissor's fuck
You song.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
I love Amy Winehouse fuck Me Pumps.
Speaker 4 (42:37):
That's a fuck you to like some type of girls
she didn't like. But let me think about that harder.
Any beautiful song about heartbreak, there's so many is a
(43:00):
fuck you song, and it's so much like there's like
anytime you can make something beautiful out of a fuck you, Oh,
it's so great.
Speaker 3 (43:19):
So there's like infinite I don't.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Know there all right.
Speaker 2 (43:27):
Lastly, questions one, what's your best jazz best memory? Your
favorite jazz best like show or memory.
Speaker 3 (43:46):
My favorite jazz fest, memory or show. They're sort of
like two.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
I mean that was the first time I saw Irma
Thomas was at jazz Fest.
Speaker 3 (43:57):
And that kind of blew me away.
Speaker 4 (43:59):
I think was my first year at jazz Fest. And
she sang which I know she performed that with the
Rolling Stones too, but she sang her song time is
on my Side, Yes it is, and she is so
cute when she sings that song, and I love how
she sings it.
Speaker 3 (44:20):
I love how she says.
Speaker 4 (44:21):
Time and it's so different than how the Rolling Stones
do it, and you know it's her song, and yeah,
it just blew me away. I just totally love her.
But then performing probably I mean, actually I don't know why
I didn't think of this first. But my last show
(44:41):
with Joshua Redmond, the final show of our tour was
at jazz Fest, and it was so hot and I
was so sweaty. It was more sweaty than I've ever
been performing and it's outside, and I was so emotional
because it was our last show and these guys had
(45:03):
become my family and like Joshua Redmond had totally taken
my career to another level.
Speaker 3 (45:09):
And I was just so.
Speaker 4 (45:13):
Emotional and so I was. It was like a crazy
experience and just seeing my hometown and it was like
it was you know, an opening, uh headlining show at
the Jazz Tent, and it was just so many people
and I was just like overwhelmed and kind of went
into like a time warp and like none of my
(45:37):
senses were working properly, and I just like sag it's fun.
Speaker 1 (45:44):
Cool and your craziest, the craziest favorite Marty Gral moment.
Speaker 4 (45:52):
I mean, my first Marty Gral will always be my
craziest Marty Gral. I took you know, a cocktail of
drugs in the morning and then walked into the quarter
and was just blown away by the people and the
(46:17):
beauty and everyone dancing and you know, people had their
boobs out. It was just the most free celebration of
life I had ever seen. And it's like when it's
your first time, it's like, yeah, you can never never
(46:38):
repeat that.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
I try to repeat it every year. Never can.
Speaker 2 (46:43):
All right, I will wrap up on the album what
do you want to What do you take from the
album when you hear it?
Speaker 3 (46:48):
My album?
Speaker 5 (46:50):
Yeah, it's me.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
I mean, gosh, what I take from it and and
what others will take for it, I imagine is different.
Speaker 3 (47:07):
But for me, I.
Speaker 4 (47:10):
Really was trying to make sense of myself, and so
it's a beautiful record, like a beautiful snapshot of that,
and a recording of of a trying trying to accept
(47:38):
life and myself and trying trying to make you know it.
It's honest, and that was what I wanted it to be.
And so when I hear it, I hear myself trying,
you know, at at something, and.
Speaker 3 (48:01):
That's I'm proud of that. I think that's all all
I can do.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
Let's try, isn't it, Like you say, you imagine what
you and others will take from it are different, But
isn't the point of great art to be honest and
then for people to see themselves in it?
Speaker 3 (48:21):
Yeah, I think that's the gift of honesty.
Speaker 4 (48:24):
Like the more honest you're able to be, the more
potentially relatable it is, because underneath all all of our differences,
I do believe that we're all kind of the same.
Speaker 3 (48:38):
And it's.
Speaker 4 (48:41):
The best way that I have found to access that
is through music. And so the more honest you're able
to be in expressing something, the more others can feel
it because they have the same thing inside of them.
So that's always my hope that I've been able to
(49:03):
truly not lying to myself, not lying to you, tell
you how it is, tell you what it is, express
what it is, and that people can then take that
and do whatever they need to with it.
Speaker 3 (49:18):
But it frees them.
Speaker 4 (49:19):
Because because now they could experience that, it can get
to their heart, you know, it can. It can be
truth for them, which is different than mine, but truth nonetheless.
Speaker 2 (49:33):
Absolutely, So I have to ask, and this will be
the last question I promise, what to use the most
honest album as a fan?
Speaker 3 (49:39):
Mhm?
Speaker 4 (49:45):
I mean, my favorite albums aren't the most honest albums.
Speaker 3 (49:49):
And I think.
Speaker 4 (49:51):
Billie Holliday is so honest and that's something that I love.
Speaker 3 (49:56):
I think.
Speaker 4 (49:59):
Jeff Buckley Grace is an incredibly intimate, honest record. I
think Rosalia's first record, Los Angeles really really moves me
in that way, feels so honest. You know great any
(50:20):
great songwriter. You know James Taylor, Prince, you know DiAngelo.
These are honest people. You know. It's like I just
you know that it's real. It feels so so real,
(50:40):
and we recognize it.
Speaker 3 (50:42):
It's like.
Speaker 4 (50:45):
You never would have thought to say it like that,
but you get it.
Speaker 3 (50:51):
And that's what I love about.
Speaker 5 (50:54):
Music, very cool.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
Anything you want to add that and ask you about that.
We touched on the ship time, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (51:02):
We did.
Speaker 4 (51:03):
Sorry, I feel like you asked like specific questions, like
you know, what's this, like what's your favorite this, or
like it's so hard to choose.
Speaker 2 (51:13):
All right, there's no writer wrong answers, you know, and
no one's asking as a fan.
Speaker 4 (51:19):
Yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, I think we touched.
Speaker 3 (51:24):
On a lot. It's great.
Speaker 1 (51:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (51:26):
So I know you start the tour, as you said,
doing East and Midwest, and then I know you'll be
here in LA later in the year.
Speaker 4 (51:35):
Yes, doing a big West coast tour in the fall,
which I'm excited because, as you know, I'm a California girl.
Speaker 2 (51:46):
Well, well, we'll see you in the fall. And congratulations
again on the record. Great to see as it's
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