September 15, 2026 • 24 mins
Macklemore has fired back after being dropped from Ed Sheeran’s tour. Macklemore says New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft organized a boycott with several stadium owners over his “Free Palestine” statements. Macklemore opened for Sheeran in New Jersey’s MetLife Stadium earlier this month where the rapper used the stage to say those two words and extend sympathies to the people of Gaza before he performed his protest song, “Hind’s Hall.” The Israeli American Council then issued a statement asking Sheeran, tour leadership and all venues hosting the tour to remove Macklemore from the tour.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey there, folks. It is Tuesday, September 15th. Ed Sheeran
needs a new opening act. And with that, welcome to
this episode of Amy and TJ. Folks, I'll give you credit.
You saw this coming. The writing was on the wall
immediately for you. But yes, it's finally happened. Macklemore is
off Ed Sheeran's tour.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Well, once you hear from the largest Israeli-American nonprofit organization
making no bones about.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
It and directly.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
asking not only Ed Sheeran, but asking any stadium owner,
anyone who was a part of this tour to stand
up against Macklemore for what he said at the concert
at MetLife, I knew this was over.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
And Robes, how is it that one of the most
influential owners and successful owners in NFL history was right
in the middle of this whole thing? Robes, I wish,
I wish, A different conversation could have been had throughout
all this. It didn't happen. It was one of those things.
(01:07):
He said something. We didn't like it. Now we're going
to shut you down. I know, Rob, is there any
more heated, more passionate debate that goes on in public
other than this Israeli-Palestinian issue? It's just hard to have,
I guess, conversation. reasoned sometimes or sometimes not angry conversations
(01:33):
about this. He stepped in something and the response was
just instant robes that he must be removed. And now
let's have a conversation after all this has taken place.
I don't know. I just, I just, another example robes
of when something like this comes up, we don't seem
to be having an talking to each other.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Right. And I guess the issue is, can you support
the Palestinian people? Can you be upset about what happened
to Palestinian children without being anti-Jewish?
Speaker 1 (02:04):
The answer should be yes, right?
Speaker 3 (02:05):
I would hope it would be.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I would hope you could be somebody who is promoting
peace on both sides, on all sides, and wanting to
draw attention to some of the atrocities that we've all
seen Palestinian families and children face and without being labeled anti-Semitic.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Yeah, I guess, Robes, the issue here, as we'll get into,
it's if you show compassion for Palestinians, then you're in
some way criticizing the Israeli response. You're saying it's their
fault that these people are suffering. You're not putting it
all back on Hamas. That's what the argument is of
(02:45):
something having to do with context. But if you just
say out loud, I don't want another Palestinian child to die.
That is, Robes, what haven't we seen? If you don't
couple that with Hamas is bad and Israeli people are suffering,
that is often deemed anti-Semitic, is it not? Yes.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yes, that is the answer.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
And that's certainly what appears to have taken place. And
Macklemore wasn't backing down at all. Not even a little bit.
Not even after he was removed from the tour. And
he knew very well.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
I mean, he had suffered.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Backlash before by saying what he said on that stage
previously where he said free Palestine and where he let
his feelings known. He has lost opportunities.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
And Robes, he actually didn't say anything on stage at
MetLife that he hasn't said plenty of times before. He
even backed it off, you could argue, compared to some
other things he's done. But given the stage, given the
international star he was opening for, Things took a different turn.
So tell me the date of the concert because you
and I were there that weekend.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
September 4th.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
September 4th. I thought it was 5th for us. Did
we go 4th?
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I thought we went on the 4th, which was the
Friday night.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Do I have my dates correct?
Speaker 1 (03:56):
4th and 5th. Yeah, you got it right. He performed
4th and 5th.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
Correct. Two nights there. We had, this was a Christmas
gift that paid off eight months later. Fine. Butt Robes
got me tickets to Ed Sheeran. Love Ed Sheeran. We
didn't realize Macklemore was opening. We decided we were going
to go. We wanted to see Macklemore. I've seen him
in concert before. Love his shows.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
We tried to time it out to get there when
Macklemore took the stage.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
But?
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Public transit is a nightmare. And the other, we tried
to look at what we could do with a car.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
We're like, how many miles? Did I do the math?
Speaker 1 (04:29):
We could damn near see MetLife. It's like 700.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
It's less than 10 miles from our apartment. And so, yes,
to order a car, it was going to cost $ 900.
That's a true story, people. $ 900 round trip to go
10 miles. And we figured it was going to take
two and a half hours each way. So five hours
in the car, $ 900 to go 10 miles. So we're like, obviously,
(04:52):
we're going to take public transit. Didn't realize it required
three trains where you had to switch, wait for the train,
and then get packed in a way that you cannot imagine.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
So the train took us how long?
Speaker 2 (05:02):
About an hour plus, and then there's a lot of
walking to get to the stadium.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
So it was an hour and a half trip for us.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
I just confirmed it's 7.8 miles from where we sit
to MetLife Stadium.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Isn't that crazy?
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Everywhere else we lived in our lives, 7.8 miles should
take you eight minutes to drive there.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Right?
Speaker 3 (05:20):
Exactly.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
So I planned, I figured mass transit would take about
an hour or so. It ended up taking, honestly, closer
to two.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
Hours just because of all the wait times and all
the packed trains and stuff. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
How much was the car again? I'm just laughing.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
$ 900.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
It was actually $ 875 before tip.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Round trip.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Round trip. You could only do round trip. They wouldn't
let you do one way.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
15 miles it would have been.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
16 miles. $ 900. Okay. Anyway, this is what it's like
in New York sometimes. But hey, all right. So at
that concert, we missed it, or missed at least Macklemore
that night, but didn't realize all the hubbub he had
caused and that things were going to go viral and
the video was made its way around social media. Now,
this is what he had. Do you have it up
in front of you, Robe?
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I do.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
This is what he actually said on stage that kind
of got all of this stuff going.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
A big part of the reason why I wanted to
do this tour in the first place is so I
could stand up in stadiums like this and say two
words that are very near and dear to my heart.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Free Palestine. I said, free Palestine.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I want those words to be loud and clear so
that people all the way in Gaza to the occupied
West Bank know that we have not forgotten about them.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
He made some other comments, remember, about his daughter and
wanting to make sure his child I can grow up
in safety, and he doesn't have to be fearful for
her the way people in Gaza are. Okay, he made
that statement. He performed his protest song as well, and
that was it. Now, people went on social media. They
did take some issue with it, but it really got going, Rob.
(06:48):
It got the attention of the Israeli-American Council. It was
put out a long statement calling on not just Macklemore
to do different, but also wanting Ed Sheeran to kick
him off the tour. They put out a long statement saying,
that the issue wasn't whether Macklemore has a right to
his political views. The question is, this is how they
put it, where the line should be drawn when an
opening act uses a global concert platform to advance a
(07:11):
one-sided political agenda. I guess, Rove, they just took issue
with him not giving some fuller story that they think
should be there.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Yeah, and they also made it clear, and this was
so interesting to me because this is Ed Sheeran's concert.
This is Ed Sheeran's tour of And they made that point.
This was an Ed Sheeran concert, not a political rally,
not a protest, and not an activist event. But if
Ed Sheeran asked Macklemore, his friend of more than a decade,
to be a part of the tour, knowing that Macklemore
(07:42):
had made the comments he'd made before, he was clearly
okay with what Macklemore was choosing to do with his
time on stage with his art.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
And was aware.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
It was no secret, right? And it wasn't just a
comment he made. There were videos that accompanied it. So
this was understood and known, but they called on Sheeran
and all tour venues to not continue to let Ed
Sheeran show up for his tour dates if Macklemore was
going to be on the damn set list, if you will.
Not set list. What do you call it? On the lineup.
(08:14):
Excuse me.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
I was going with roster.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
I wasn't sure what the folks call it in the
concert world.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
So we did hear finally from the promoter yesterday putting
out a statement saying that they were They've been notified
by venues on the upcoming U.S. tour dates that they
will not allow a concert to take place with Macklemore
on the lineup, which would result in the cancellation of
the tour and impact hundreds of thousands of fans. After
discussions with stakeholders, Macklemore will not be performing on the
(08:41):
remaining support dates. So, Rose, Macklemore, and you saw me
frustrated this morning because I was trying to get the
whole thing, the whole transcript. Macklemore put out one of
the longest Instagram statements I've ever seen. And he had
a lot to say and a lot to explain. And
like you said, Robes, he stood by his stance. But
I don't know. He felt like he needed to say
(09:03):
all this. And I don't know how other people will
feel about it, but I know how I feel about it.
But we're going to share in full what his statement
said here.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
I'm not sure how to start this, so I'm going
to speak from the heart and share the truth. Ed
Sheeran and his team have made the decision to remove
me from the Loop Tour. Before I get into it,
I want to say something that should be obvious. In
this moment, I think it matters. I am not a victim.
Ed Sheeran is not a victim. Pink is not a victim.
(09:30):
We have careers, money, opportunities, safety, and audiences around the world.
Whatever consequences any of us face for what we say,
we get to go home to our families.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
And to stop there, but Pink had come out immediately.
She's putting out Two statements now, but she made one
early that was critical of things that Macklemore had said
on stage and things he's done in the past that
I would certainly say went too far. Yes. But she
was critical and that's why he had her name in there.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Yeah, she reposted.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Something that was critical of his, and then she actually
came back and clarified. She said, I've been quiet in
my own words for a week, which you know isn't
like me, so here they are. She said that Macklemore
said things in words I didn't write, and I wouldn't
have chosen all of them. She said the video that
she posted said things that she wouldn't have said. So
she was actually trying to back Macklemore. backpedal a little bit.
(10:22):
And she said, a repost isn't a statement. I'd rather
be disagreed with for what I actually said than hated
for what anybody else wrote. So let me say it.
She just said, I was born a Jew. I didn't
pick it. I've never hidden it. And so she just
talked about how she just had her feelings based on that.
So that's what he was referencing in his statement. Um,
(10:45):
so he goes on to say here in his comments,
the victims are the Palestinian people, the men, women, and
children who have been killed, starved, displaced, and forced to
live through unimaginable violence. More than 20,000 children have been
killed in Gaza alone. People are being killed today and
people will be killed tomorrow. I want to make sure
(11:07):
that as I tell this story, we don't lose sight
of that.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
So he's still sticking to his story. I guess his mission,
so to speak. He's really taken this on.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
And I guess, Robes, up to this point, he hasn't
said anything that's wrong. It's that what he's saying, folks
want the context that the reason these folks are dying
is because Hamas has put the Israeli people and the
Israeli government in a position that they have to defend themselves.
This is the context people want all the time. But
what he's saying is not untrue. If 20,000 kids are dead,
(11:45):
I'm sad about that. Period. Am I anti-Semitic by stopping
my sentence there? It's too much of the debate. I
can't just weep for Palestinian children the same I weep
for Israeli children. I guess just some cooler heads. I
can't get into Palestinians and Jewish folks, folks growing up
(12:06):
in that conflict. I can't ever try to pretend to
relate that pain and that passion. I would like to
talk about it, and I would like to be able
to say to both sides, I'm sorry for what you're
going through, without being labeled by the other side as
being too sympathetic to one side. Isn't it?
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
This is.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
It's hard, man. It is.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
It's deep-rooted, and it's just... This is.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
A tough, tough situation that is exposing what feels like
an impossible conversation to have.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
But we can just... be decent for it i mean
okay let's continue with him here he said ed is
my friend i've known him 13 years we shared late
night studio sessions stages he has this infectious magic about
him that i've grown to love i consider him a
brother and because of that we've had some difficult conversations
this past week the type of talk rooted in love
and respect for one another that still end in a
(12:59):
place of fundamental disagreement man we need to take that
sentence and use it all the time yes folks talks
rooted in love and respect but still end in disagreement Wow.
Nothing I'm writing here is out of spite or because
I want to tear down his character. But as I
told Ed multiple times on the phone, our friendship can't
change my responsibility to tell the truth about what happened.
(13:23):
Last Monday, in the middle of all the media attention
surrounding Pink and what I said at MetLife, Ed told
me that Robert Kraft called him. We were scheduled to
play Gillette Stadium later this month, which is owned by
the Kraft Group. Ed told me that Kraft said I
would not be allowed to perform in his stadium. Ed
also told me that Kraft had rallied some of the
other stadium owners and collectively gave him an ultimatum. If
(13:43):
Macklemore stays on the tour, you will not be allowed
to play in our venues. Wow. And simple as that, bro.
That's the end up. What is Ed supposed to do?
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yes. And I forgot, apologize for forgetting the name of
the Jewish organization. But when they said they were going
to be contacting... The venues and the venues owners, that's
when you thought they know what they're doing. They know
how to shut this down. Ed Sheeran might not have
felt the pressure singularly from this group. But when you
(14:11):
start having now stadium owners say, you can't play in
our stadium, what are.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
You supposed to do?
Speaker 1 (14:17):
They're canceling his tour for him. Yes.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
So Macklemore even acknowledges this as he goes on. He says,
Ed was in a fucked up position.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
He knew it.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
His typical apolitical stance was being challenged in a way
it never had been before. He told me that the
words free Palestine and the image of the Palestinian flag
were hurtful to a lot of people he spoke with.
I told him that if those words were more offensive,
then tens of thousands of Palestinian children being killed by Israel,
(14:45):
then there was a fundamental disconnect between where those people
stood and where I stood. But he couldn't get past
his public facing. Don't take sides.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
And he goes on, I get why people don't. Taking
a side can cost you money, brand deals, sponsorship, festivals,
private shows, relationships, and access. I've lost all of those things,
but there is no neutral position between the oppressor and
the oppressed. When one side has bombs and bottomless financial
and military support from America, refusing to take a side
doesn't leave you in the middle. And that is where
(15:16):
he will lose most people. Oppressed and oppressor. Oppressed and oppressor. Israelis,
Jewish folks here, they're never going to be on board
with that characterization.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
Yes, because they would argue that they have been the oppressed.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
For hundreds, thousands.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
Yes, thousands of years. Historically speaking, yes.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Macklemore continues, what I said at MetLife, I have been
saying on stages around the world for almost three years.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
So why is it an issue now?
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Because now I'm sharing a stage with one of the
biggest artists in the world, in some of the biggest
stadiums in America. At a certain level of exposure, Free
Palestine becomes too much of a risk. If I kept
doing the shows, saying Free Palestine, with Ed implicitly supporting it,
the crowd getting loud and showing undeniable support for Palestinian liberation,
(16:10):
what artist might speak up next? The stage becomes resistance.
Maybe that's why this time it became so important to
silence me.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
The stage became resistance. Look, Robes, Ed, that's the thing.
They put the pressure on Robes. He's one of the top,
maybe five, but certainly top ten streaming artists. I mean,
he just rules Spotify. He's one of the biggest.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Who doesn't like Ed Sheeran?
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Everybody likes him.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
We even talked about it.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
At the concert, I've never seen such a diversity in crowd,
in age, in gender, in ethnicity.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
It was really cool. This is a guy who... who
brings all those folks together. So now if you have.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Somebody opening your act that is dividing people, that's a
tough position to be in.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
And yeah, by not saying anything, he was seen as
supporting what this dude was doing.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Implicit support.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
All right, well, stay with us. We're going to read
the rest of his statement, which includes, includes an important
line about what he thinks has happened to him now
and how we get from that to anti-Semitism. Also, we
want you to hear Robert Kraft's response.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Welcome back, everyone, to Amy and TJ. We continue with
Macklemore's Instagram, lengthy Instagram statement, and he goes on to say,
one of the most effective ways to enforce that silence
has been to weaponize the accusation of anti-Semitism.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
This is what we were just talking about.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Anti-Semitism is real, and that is exactly why the word
matters too much to be used as a shield against
criticism of the Israeli state. When criticizing Israel, opposing Zionism,
or saying free Palestine gets conflated with hatred of Jewish people,
it doesn't protect Jewish people, It protects Israel from accountability.
(18:07):
He goes on to say he hopes it isn't the
end of his relationship with Ed. He said he hopes
13 years of friendship doesn't disappear because of one painful disagreement.
He says his door will always be opening to continue
the conversation. And he talks about cancel culture and all
of that. But I thought this next part was really,
really interesting. He says, I didn't need 10 shows from Ed.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
I needed two.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Two chances to stand in front of 90,000 people and
say the words that somehow became too dangerous to say.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Free Palestine. But if those words cost me the stage
while turning the conversation back to Palestine, then it was
the most successful tour I've ever been on.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Maybe that's how he sees it, Robes. He has more
of an agenda than music. He has.
A way to get, look, people are talking about him
to talk about this. Maybe people are looking into this
a little more or people just hearing this and we're
fighting a little more, right? Does this move the needle
any way, one way or another? Does it help us
have better conversations about it? It doesn't feel that way.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
No, it feels even more divisive is what it feels like.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
He ends by saying the victims are the Palestinian people,
the men, women, and children who have been killed, starved, displaced,
and forced to live through unimaginable violence. More than 20,000
children have been killed in Gaza alone. People are being
killed today and people will be killed tomorrow. I wanted
to make sure that as I tell this story, we
(19:34):
don't lose.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
Sight of that.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Robes, I just want to try to leave space for
somebody that has their beliefs and how convicted they might
be in those beliefs and what's in his heart. It's
just never, ever, ever. And even if people agree with
some of what he's saying and do sympathize with people
and children in Gaza, Robes, you're just not going to
get people on your side if you're yelling that Jews
(19:59):
are oppressors. You're just, that's not going to get you anywhere.
Nobody's going to listen to your next sentence if you
lead with that. He didn't lead with it, but it's
in there. It's in there.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
It's in there. I just checked.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
He has 5.1 million likes.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
On that post right now. So it's certainly garnered a
significant amount of attention.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Okay, and we'll wrap here with Robert Kraft. Of course,
long time New England Patriots owner, very powerful and influential
guy when it comes to not just sports, not just football,
but also just in entertainment. A lot of concerts go
through has been used up there in Boston. Robes, I
appreciated his statement, and then it broke my heart as well.
(20:43):
So we're going to read this to you in full
as well. Robes, you got it for me?
Speaker 2 (20:49):
I do.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
It reads, based on McLemore's recent actions, material shared from
the stage during Ed Sheeran shows in New Jersey, and
a broader history of anti-Semitic rhetoric and imagery that we
believe has been deeply offensive and hurtful to the Jewish community,
We determined that his participation in the September 25th and
26th concerts at Gillette Stadium would cross that line. This
(21:13):
decision is not about diminishing the suffering of innocent Palestinians
or denying anyone the right to advocate on their behalf.
Their pain and loss are real, but that advocacy should
not come at the expense of the Jewish community or
obscure the responsibility of Hamas.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
I agree with McLemore.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Too many lives have been lost and there has been
too much suffering, but only sharing selective information and ignoring
the actions of Hamas is not honest and only advances
more divisiveness and hate. I would welcome the opportunity to
sit down with Macklemore and discuss the facts because ultimately
(21:54):
our goal is the same, peace for all people, an
end to suffering, and an end to all hate.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Last line broke my heart, baby. Because welcome the opportunity
to sit down. Is there any chance we could have
done that ahead of time? Do you instantly, we automatically
cancel you? Okay, and then we'll talk about it.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Yeah, I'm going to cancel you, shame you, punish you.
But now let's talk.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
I get where he's coming. And that part, it actually
felt sincere to me, babe. It felt like he would
sit down, have a conversation. He's talking about things they
agree on. Yes, too many lives have been lost. Like,
if we can get to that place where we agree,
but still publicly, it's a clash. And you got to
take sides. And you got to fight. And you got
to cancel. And it's got to be absolute, one or
(22:41):
the other. I just, I don't know, babe. And it's
too much emotion, maybe. But that's a reasoned, measured response.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
Agreed.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
If any kind of outreach, maybe it did happen. It
didn't seem like it, because I think Macklemore would have
told us if he talked to Robert Kraft, wouldn't he?
Speaker 3 (22:56):
I believe he would have, yes.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
If there was an opportunity to sit down, and maybe
you could have said, we had a discussion, and he
agreed that what happened, and this time, and Gillette is
going to look different, and I made some agreement. But
then after the fact, we all agree, but oh well,
you still gots to go. I thought there was an
opportunity there.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Well, the question is, was the offer real or genuine?
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Which?
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Which? No, he said he welcomes the opportunity. He didn't
say he extended one.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
And there is a difference, and that word choice was specific.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
If I see him in an airport bar.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
I would welcome it if it ever happened, like just
by chance.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Maybe I say, I agree with Macklemore. Too many lives
have been lost. Let's start with what we agree with,
and let's expand until we get to the part we
disagree with. We just never start with where we agree.
We start with where we disagree, and now we're working backwards.
That's just too bad. I read that and thought, man,
that was an opportunity there.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
Well, he welcomes the next one.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
He welcomes the next one.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
All right, folks, that's the update. Macklemore is out on
the Ed Sheeran tour. They're playing Gillette. What is this?
Today is the what?
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Today is the 15th, so in nine days.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
So Ed is in Philly on the 19th. And then
going to Gillette after that. I guess Roe's too bad.
We missed him because that was the last opportunity.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
Damn, I can't. Dang, New Jersey Transit. That's who we're
going to blame.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Okay, well, folks, appreciate you as always. I'm TJ. That's Roe.
We'll talk soon.
Hey there, folks. It is Tuesday, September 15th. Ed Sheeran
needs a new opening act. And with that, welcome to
this episode of Amy and TJ. Folks, I'll give you credit.
You saw this coming. The writing was on the wall
immediately for you. But yes, it's finally happened. Macklemore is
off Ed Sheeran's tour.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Well, once you hear from the largest Israeli-American nonprofit organization
making no bones about.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
It and directly.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
asking not only Ed Sheeran, but asking any stadium owner,
anyone who was a part of this tour to stand
up against Macklemore for what he said at the concert
at MetLife, I knew this was over.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
And Robes, how is it that one of the most
influential owners and successful owners in NFL history was right
in the middle of this whole thing? Robes, I wish,
I wish, A different conversation could have been had throughout
all this. It didn't happen. It was one of those things.
(01:07):
He said something. We didn't like it. Now we're going
to shut you down. I know, Rob, is there any
more heated, more passionate debate that goes on in public
other than this Israeli-Palestinian issue? It's just hard to have,
I guess, conversation. reasoned sometimes or sometimes not angry conversations
(01:33):
about this. He stepped in something and the response was
just instant robes that he must be removed. And now
let's have a conversation after all this has taken place.
I don't know. I just, I just, another example robes
of when something like this comes up, we don't seem
to be having an talking to each other.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Right. And I guess the issue is, can you support
the Palestinian people? Can you be upset about what happened
to Palestinian children without being anti-Jewish?
Speaker 1 (02:04):
The answer should be yes, right?
Speaker 3 (02:05):
I would hope it would be.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I would hope you could be somebody who is promoting
peace on both sides, on all sides, and wanting to
draw attention to some of the atrocities that we've all
seen Palestinian families and children face and without being labeled anti-Semitic.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
Yeah, I guess, Robes, the issue here, as we'll get into,
it's if you show compassion for Palestinians, then you're in
some way criticizing the Israeli response. You're saying it's their
fault that these people are suffering. You're not putting it
all back on Hamas. That's what the argument is of
(02:45):
something having to do with context. But if you just
say out loud, I don't want another Palestinian child to die.
That is, Robes, what haven't we seen? If you don't
couple that with Hamas is bad and Israeli people are suffering,
that is often deemed anti-Semitic, is it not? Yes.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yes, that is the answer.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
And that's certainly what appears to have taken place. And
Macklemore wasn't backing down at all. Not even a little bit.
Not even after he was removed from the tour. And
he knew very well.
Speaker 3 (03:15):
I mean, he had suffered.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Backlash before by saying what he said on that stage
previously where he said free Palestine and where he let
his feelings known. He has lost opportunities.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
And Robes, he actually didn't say anything on stage at
MetLife that he hasn't said plenty of times before. He
even backed it off, you could argue, compared to some
other things he's done. But given the stage, given the
international star he was opening for, Things took a different turn.
So tell me the date of the concert because you
and I were there that weekend.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
September 4th.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
September 4th. I thought it was 5th for us. Did
we go 4th?
Speaker 3 (03:52):
I thought we went on the 4th, which was the
Friday night.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
Do I have my dates correct?
Speaker 1 (03:56):
4th and 5th. Yeah, you got it right. He performed
4th and 5th.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
Correct. Two nights there. We had, this was a Christmas
gift that paid off eight months later. Fine. Butt Robes
got me tickets to Ed Sheeran. Love Ed Sheeran. We
didn't realize Macklemore was opening. We decided we were going
to go. We wanted to see Macklemore. I've seen him
in concert before. Love his shows.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
We tried to time it out to get there when
Macklemore took the stage.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
But?
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Public transit is a nightmare. And the other, we tried
to look at what we could do with a car.
Speaker 3 (04:26):
We're like, how many miles? Did I do the math?
Speaker 1 (04:29):
We could damn near see MetLife. It's like 700.
Speaker 2 (04:31):
It's less than 10 miles from our apartment. And so, yes,
to order a car, it was going to cost $ 900.
That's a true story, people. $ 900 round trip to go
10 miles. And we figured it was going to take
two and a half hours each way. So five hours
in the car, $ 900 to go 10 miles. So we're like, obviously,
(04:52):
we're going to take public transit. Didn't realize it required
three trains where you had to switch, wait for the train,
and then get packed in a way that you cannot imagine.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
So the train took us how long?
Speaker 2 (05:02):
About an hour plus, and then there's a lot of
walking to get to the stadium.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
So it was an hour and a half trip for us.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
I just confirmed it's 7.8 miles from where we sit
to MetLife Stadium.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Isn't that crazy?
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Everywhere else we lived in our lives, 7.8 miles should
take you eight minutes to drive there.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Right?
Speaker 3 (05:20):
Exactly.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
So I planned, I figured mass transit would take about
an hour or so. It ended up taking, honestly, closer
to two.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
Hours just because of all the wait times and all
the packed trains and stuff. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
How much was the car again? I'm just laughing.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
$ 900.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
It was actually $ 875 before tip.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Round trip.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Round trip. You could only do round trip. They wouldn't
let you do one way.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
15 miles it would have been.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
16 miles. $ 900. Okay. Anyway, this is what it's like
in New York sometimes. But hey, all right. So at
that concert, we missed it, or missed at least Macklemore
that night, but didn't realize all the hubbub he had
caused and that things were going to go viral and
the video was made its way around social media. Now,
this is what he had. Do you have it up
in front of you, Robe?
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I do.
Speaker 1 (06:01):
This is what he actually said on stage that kind
of got all of this stuff going.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
A big part of the reason why I wanted to
do this tour in the first place is so I
could stand up in stadiums like this and say two
words that are very near and dear to my heart.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Free Palestine. I said, free Palestine.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I want those words to be loud and clear so
that people all the way in Gaza to the occupied
West Bank know that we have not forgotten about them.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
He made some other comments, remember, about his daughter and
wanting to make sure his child I can grow up
in safety, and he doesn't have to be fearful for
her the way people in Gaza are. Okay, he made
that statement. He performed his protest song as well, and
that was it. Now, people went on social media. They
did take some issue with it, but it really got going, Rob.
(06:48):
It got the attention of the Israeli-American Council. It was
put out a long statement calling on not just Macklemore
to do different, but also wanting Ed Sheeran to kick
him off the tour. They put out a long statement saying,
that the issue wasn't whether Macklemore has a right to
his political views. The question is, this is how they
put it, where the line should be drawn when an
opening act uses a global concert platform to advance a
(07:11):
one-sided political agenda. I guess, Rove, they just took issue
with him not giving some fuller story that they think
should be there.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Yeah, and they also made it clear, and this was
so interesting to me because this is Ed Sheeran's concert.
This is Ed Sheeran's tour of And they made that point.
This was an Ed Sheeran concert, not a political rally,
not a protest, and not an activist event. But if
Ed Sheeran asked Macklemore, his friend of more than a decade,
to be a part of the tour, knowing that Macklemore
(07:42):
had made the comments he'd made before, he was clearly
okay with what Macklemore was choosing to do with his
time on stage with his art.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
And was aware.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
It was no secret, right? And it wasn't just a
comment he made. There were videos that accompanied it. So
this was understood and known, but they called on Sheeran
and all tour venues to not continue to let Ed
Sheeran show up for his tour dates if Macklemore was
going to be on the damn set list, if you will.
Not set list. What do you call it? On the lineup.
(08:14):
Excuse me.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
I was going with roster.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
I wasn't sure what the folks call it in the
concert world.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
So we did hear finally from the promoter yesterday putting
out a statement saying that they were They've been notified
by venues on the upcoming U.S. tour dates that they
will not allow a concert to take place with Macklemore
on the lineup, which would result in the cancellation of
the tour and impact hundreds of thousands of fans. After
discussions with stakeholders, Macklemore will not be performing on the
(08:41):
remaining support dates. So, Rose, Macklemore, and you saw me
frustrated this morning because I was trying to get the
whole thing, the whole transcript. Macklemore put out one of
the longest Instagram statements I've ever seen. And he had
a lot to say and a lot to explain. And
like you said, Robes, he stood by his stance. But
I don't know. He felt like he needed to say
(09:03):
all this. And I don't know how other people will
feel about it, but I know how I feel about it.
But we're going to share in full what his statement
said here.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
I'm not sure how to start this, so I'm going
to speak from the heart and share the truth. Ed
Sheeran and his team have made the decision to remove
me from the Loop Tour. Before I get into it,
I want to say something that should be obvious. In
this moment, I think it matters. I am not a victim.
Ed Sheeran is not a victim. Pink is not a victim.
(09:30):
We have careers, money, opportunities, safety, and audiences around the world.
Whatever consequences any of us face for what we say,
we get to go home to our families.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
And to stop there, but Pink had come out immediately.
She's putting out Two statements now, but she made one
early that was critical of things that Macklemore had said
on stage and things he's done in the past that
I would certainly say went too far. Yes. But she
was critical and that's why he had her name in there.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
Yeah, she reposted.
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Something that was critical of his, and then she actually
came back and clarified. She said, I've been quiet in
my own words for a week, which you know isn't
like me, so here they are. She said that Macklemore
said things in words I didn't write, and I wouldn't
have chosen all of them. She said the video that
she posted said things that she wouldn't have said. So
she was actually trying to back Macklemore. backpedal a little bit.
(10:22):
And she said, a repost isn't a statement. I'd rather
be disagreed with for what I actually said than hated
for what anybody else wrote. So let me say it.
She just said, I was born a Jew. I didn't
pick it. I've never hidden it. And so she just
talked about how she just had her feelings based on that.
So that's what he was referencing in his statement. Um,
(10:45):
so he goes on to say here in his comments,
the victims are the Palestinian people, the men, women, and
children who have been killed, starved, displaced, and forced to
live through unimaginable violence. More than 20,000 children have been
killed in Gaza alone. People are being killed today and
people will be killed tomorrow. I want to make sure
(11:07):
that as I tell this story, we don't lose sight
of that.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
So he's still sticking to his story. I guess his mission,
so to speak. He's really taken this on.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
And I guess, Robes, up to this point, he hasn't
said anything that's wrong. It's that what he's saying, folks
want the context that the reason these folks are dying
is because Hamas has put the Israeli people and the
Israeli government in a position that they have to defend themselves.
This is the context people want all the time. But
what he's saying is not untrue. If 20,000 kids are dead,
(11:45):
I'm sad about that. Period. Am I anti-Semitic by stopping
my sentence there? It's too much of the debate. I
can't just weep for Palestinian children the same I weep
for Israeli children. I guess just some cooler heads. I
can't get into Palestinians and Jewish folks, folks growing up
(12:06):
in that conflict. I can't ever try to pretend to
relate that pain and that passion. I would like to
talk about it, and I would like to be able
to say to both sides, I'm sorry for what you're
going through, without being labeled by the other side as
being too sympathetic to one side. Isn't it?
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
This is.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
It's hard, man. It is.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
It's deep-rooted, and it's just... This is.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
A tough, tough situation that is exposing what feels like
an impossible conversation to have.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
But we can just... be decent for it i mean
okay let's continue with him here he said ed is
my friend i've known him 13 years we shared late
night studio sessions stages he has this infectious magic about
him that i've grown to love i consider him a
brother and because of that we've had some difficult conversations
this past week the type of talk rooted in love
and respect for one another that still end in a
(12:59):
place of fundamental disagreement man we need to take that
sentence and use it all the time yes folks talks
rooted in love and respect but still end in disagreement Wow.
Nothing I'm writing here is out of spite or because
I want to tear down his character. But as I
told Ed multiple times on the phone, our friendship can't
change my responsibility to tell the truth about what happened.
(13:23):
Last Monday, in the middle of all the media attention
surrounding Pink and what I said at MetLife, Ed told
me that Robert Kraft called him. We were scheduled to
play Gillette Stadium later this month, which is owned by
the Kraft Group. Ed told me that Kraft said I
would not be allowed to perform in his stadium. Ed
also told me that Kraft had rallied some of the
other stadium owners and collectively gave him an ultimatum. If
(13:43):
Macklemore stays on the tour, you will not be allowed
to play in our venues. Wow. And simple as that, bro.
That's the end up. What is Ed supposed to do?
Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yes. And I forgot, apologize for forgetting the name of
the Jewish organization. But when they said they were going
to be contacting... The venues and the venues owners, that's
when you thought they know what they're doing. They know
how to shut this down. Ed Sheeran might not have
felt the pressure singularly from this group. But when you
(14:11):
start having now stadium owners say, you can't play in
our stadium, what are.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
You supposed to do?
Speaker 1 (14:17):
They're canceling his tour for him. Yes.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
So Macklemore even acknowledges this as he goes on. He says,
Ed was in a fucked up position.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
He knew it.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
His typical apolitical stance was being challenged in a way
it never had been before. He told me that the
words free Palestine and the image of the Palestinian flag
were hurtful to a lot of people he spoke with.
I told him that if those words were more offensive,
then tens of thousands of Palestinian children being killed by Israel,
(14:45):
then there was a fundamental disconnect between where those people
stood and where I stood. But he couldn't get past
his public facing. Don't take sides.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
And he goes on, I get why people don't. Taking
a side can cost you money, brand deals, sponsorship, festivals,
private shows, relationships, and access. I've lost all of those things,
but there is no neutral position between the oppressor and
the oppressed. When one side has bombs and bottomless financial
and military support from America, refusing to take a side
doesn't leave you in the middle. And that is where
(15:16):
he will lose most people. Oppressed and oppressor. Oppressed and oppressor. Israelis,
Jewish folks here, they're never going to be on board
with that characterization.
Speaker 3 (15:29):
Yes, because they would argue that they have been the oppressed.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
For hundreds, thousands.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
Yes, thousands of years. Historically speaking, yes.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Macklemore continues, what I said at MetLife, I have been
saying on stages around the world for almost three years.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
So why is it an issue now?
Speaker 2 (15:49):
Because now I'm sharing a stage with one of the
biggest artists in the world, in some of the biggest
stadiums in America. At a certain level of exposure, Free
Palestine becomes too much of a risk. If I kept
doing the shows, saying Free Palestine, with Ed implicitly supporting it,
the crowd getting loud and showing undeniable support for Palestinian liberation,
(16:10):
what artist might speak up next? The stage becomes resistance.
Maybe that's why this time it became so important to
silence me.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
The stage became resistance. Look, Robes, Ed, that's the thing.
They put the pressure on Robes. He's one of the top,
maybe five, but certainly top ten streaming artists. I mean,
he just rules Spotify. He's one of the biggest.
Speaker 3 (16:34):
Who doesn't like Ed Sheeran?
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Everybody likes him.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
We even talked about it.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
At the concert, I've never seen such a diversity in crowd,
in age, in gender, in ethnicity.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
It was really cool. This is a guy who... who
brings all those folks together. So now if you have.
Speaker 2 (16:50):
Somebody opening your act that is dividing people, that's a
tough position to be in.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
And yeah, by not saying anything, he was seen as
supporting what this dude was doing.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Implicit support.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
All right, well, stay with us. We're going to read
the rest of his statement, which includes, includes an important
line about what he thinks has happened to him now
and how we get from that to anti-Semitism. Also, we
want you to hear Robert Kraft's response.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Welcome back, everyone, to Amy and TJ. We continue with
Macklemore's Instagram, lengthy Instagram statement, and he goes on to say,
one of the most effective ways to enforce that silence
has been to weaponize the accusation of anti-Semitism.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
This is what we were just talking about.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Anti-Semitism is real, and that is exactly why the word
matters too much to be used as a shield against
criticism of the Israeli state. When criticizing Israel, opposing Zionism,
or saying free Palestine gets conflated with hatred of Jewish people,
it doesn't protect Jewish people, It protects Israel from accountability.
(18:07):
He goes on to say he hopes it isn't the
end of his relationship with Ed. He said he hopes
13 years of friendship doesn't disappear because of one painful disagreement.
He says his door will always be opening to continue
the conversation. And he talks about cancel culture and all
of that. But I thought this next part was really,
really interesting. He says, I didn't need 10 shows from Ed.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
I needed two.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Two chances to stand in front of 90,000 people and
say the words that somehow became too dangerous to say.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
Free Palestine. But if those words cost me the stage
while turning the conversation back to Palestine, then it was
the most successful tour I've ever been on.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Maybe that's how he sees it, Robes. He has more
of an agenda than music. He has.
A way to get, look, people are talking about him
to talk about this. Maybe people are looking into this
a little more or people just hearing this and we're
fighting a little more, right? Does this move the needle
any way, one way or another? Does it help us
have better conversations about it? It doesn't feel that way.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
No, it feels even more divisive is what it feels like.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
He ends by saying the victims are the Palestinian people,
the men, women, and children who have been killed, starved, displaced,
and forced to live through unimaginable violence. More than 20,000
children have been killed in Gaza alone. People are being
killed today and people will be killed tomorrow. I wanted
to make sure that as I tell this story, we
(19:34):
don't lose.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
Sight of that.
Speaker 1 (19:37):
Robes, I just want to try to leave space for
somebody that has their beliefs and how convicted they might
be in those beliefs and what's in his heart. It's
just never, ever, ever. And even if people agree with
some of what he's saying and do sympathize with people
and children in Gaza, Robes, you're just not going to
get people on your side if you're yelling that Jews
(19:59):
are oppressors. You're just, that's not going to get you anywhere.
Nobody's going to listen to your next sentence if you
lead with that. He didn't lead with it, but it's
in there. It's in there.
Speaker 3 (20:09):
It's in there. I just checked.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
He has 5.1 million likes.
Speaker 3 (20:15):
On that post right now. So it's certainly garnered a
significant amount of attention.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
Okay, and we'll wrap here with Robert Kraft. Of course,
long time New England Patriots owner, very powerful and influential
guy when it comes to not just sports, not just football,
but also just in entertainment. A lot of concerts go
through has been used up there in Boston. Robes, I
appreciated his statement, and then it broke my heart as well.
(20:43):
So we're going to read this to you in full
as well. Robes, you got it for me?
Speaker 2 (20:49):
I do.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
It reads, based on McLemore's recent actions, material shared from
the stage during Ed Sheeran shows in New Jersey, and
a broader history of anti-Semitic rhetoric and imagery that we
believe has been deeply offensive and hurtful to the Jewish community,
We determined that his participation in the September 25th and
26th concerts at Gillette Stadium would cross that line. This
(21:13):
decision is not about diminishing the suffering of innocent Palestinians
or denying anyone the right to advocate on their behalf.
Their pain and loss are real, but that advocacy should
not come at the expense of the Jewish community or
obscure the responsibility of Hamas.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
I agree with McLemore.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Too many lives have been lost and there has been
too much suffering, but only sharing selective information and ignoring
the actions of Hamas is not honest and only advances
more divisiveness and hate. I would welcome the opportunity to
sit down with Macklemore and discuss the facts because ultimately
(21:54):
our goal is the same, peace for all people, an
end to suffering, and an end to all hate.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
Last line broke my heart, baby. Because welcome the opportunity
to sit down. Is there any chance we could have
done that ahead of time? Do you instantly, we automatically
cancel you? Okay, and then we'll talk about it.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Yeah, I'm going to cancel you, shame you, punish you.
But now let's talk.
Speaker 1 (22:18):
I get where he's coming. And that part, it actually
felt sincere to me, babe. It felt like he would
sit down, have a conversation. He's talking about things they
agree on. Yes, too many lives have been lost. Like,
if we can get to that place where we agree,
but still publicly, it's a clash. And you got to
take sides. And you got to fight. And you got
to cancel. And it's got to be absolute, one or
(22:41):
the other. I just, I don't know, babe. And it's
too much emotion, maybe. But that's a reasoned, measured response.
Speaker 3 (22:49):
Agreed.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
If any kind of outreach, maybe it did happen. It
didn't seem like it, because I think Macklemore would have
told us if he talked to Robert Kraft, wouldn't he?
Speaker 3 (22:56):
I believe he would have, yes.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
If there was an opportunity to sit down, and maybe
you could have said, we had a discussion, and he
agreed that what happened, and this time, and Gillette is
going to look different, and I made some agreement. But
then after the fact, we all agree, but oh well,
you still gots to go. I thought there was an
opportunity there.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Well, the question is, was the offer real or genuine?
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Which?
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Which? No, he said he welcomes the opportunity. He didn't
say he extended one.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
And there is a difference, and that word choice was specific.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
If I see him in an airport bar.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
I would welcome it if it ever happened, like just
by chance.
Speaker 1 (23:36):
Maybe I say, I agree with Macklemore. Too many lives
have been lost. Let's start with what we agree with,
and let's expand until we get to the part we
disagree with. We just never start with where we agree.
We start with where we disagree, and now we're working backwards.
That's just too bad. I read that and thought, man,
that was an opportunity there.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
Well, he welcomes the next one.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
He welcomes the next one.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
All right, folks, that's the update. Macklemore is out on
the Ed Sheeran tour. They're playing Gillette. What is this?
Today is the what?
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Today is the 15th, so in nine days.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
So Ed is in Philly on the 19th. And then
going to Gillette after that. I guess Roe's too bad.
We missed him because that was the last opportunity.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
Damn, I can't. Dang, New Jersey Transit. That's who we're
going to blame.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Okay, well, folks, appreciate you as always. I'm TJ. That's Roe.
We'll talk soon.
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